Episode 164

Song and dance-men Ian Bagg and Matt Fondiler discuss a case centered around the most annoying, and least trustworthy people imaginable: musical theater people. You've been warned.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Sword Scale Rewind is an after show, which means it's meant to be listening

(00:02):
to after listening to Sword and Scalefor your convenience. Each episode number of
rewind corresponds to its counterpart on Swordand Scale. It's not that hard people.
Welcome to Sword and Scale Rewind withyour hosts Matt Fondelier and Ian Bag.

(00:47):
What's up, everybody? Welcome backto Sword and Scale Rewind Episode one
hundred and sixty four. My nameis Matt Fondelier and I am joined by
comedian and co host of the fifthmost popular hockey podcast in Australia. It's
called Enjoy Orange Slices with Jeff andIan. Yeahkid, Ian Bag, thanks

(01:08):
for coming back. Oh we justactually got on the charts in Africa.
Apparently we're apparently number eight on themost popular hockey podcast in Australia. So
we're we're trying, we're building,We're building. Were Wow, it's a
pretty good podcast. Just let youknow. I'll just put it out there.
My buddy grew up with me andhe played in the NHL and I
was in a hockey movie that involveda chimpanzee. So if you ever want

(01:32):
to listen, to a hockey podcast. You will never get more knowledge than
we have. Please tell me whatmovie that was. It's called MVP two
Most Valuable Primate Part two. Todo so, I played old Off Chicken
Dance, the Swedish sensation. That'samazing. Yeah. Um, anyone ever
get murdered on your on your hockeypodcast? Has anybody on the on the

(01:52):
podcast or you know in the NHLin the no, no, no,
no, no no. We didn'thaven't any murder so far as knock on
wood, we've we've are you wellhere on this show, we're a little
bit light on the hockey talk,heavy on the murder, heavy on the
murder. That's right. And ifyou've ever listened to an episode of Sword
and Skill, you know that it'sa show about murder. Sword and Scale

(02:12):
rewind is the show about that show. Yeah, that's what happens. He
discusses it, then we rewind it. That's right. Yeah. And if
you have never listened to this episode, you may want to listen to it.
But if it's been a while,no problem. That's what we're here
to do. Push pause, golisten to it, come back, listen
to us. Now, this isone of my all time favorite Sword and
Scale episodes, and it is alwaysweird to be like, I'm a big

(02:34):
fan of this murder, all right, but there's just something about the way
that this story was told. There'sa lot of shocking surprises. There's audiot
going on here. Even when youthink you understand it, there's some crazy
brutality at the end that to meis kind of unforgivable and unforgettable. It's
really what I meant to say.Well, we'll discuss that when I get

(02:57):
there, because I have questions aboutthat. Okay, Yeah, I talk
to my wife about that, andI didn't really Yeah. I was like,
and she's like, I'm like alot of in depth conversations. You
mentioned before the MIC's heated up thatyour wife was familiar with this story.
This was one that was covered byeight hours or state line date line?
Did it Keith Morrison? She said, oh. And I brought it up
with her and she said, oh, Keith didn't tell me about that,

(03:20):
And I thought, well, therewas he was involved in the murder before
the young man that was murdered.Yes here is it here? Or her?
Is it her? I read itas here, But I see,
I always thought it was her andthen looked German to me, it does
got the double r but I imaginedand an Abbott and Costello who's on first
style of routine where they're saying,you have to go after her. You

(03:45):
mean that woman? No, no, the guy I thought he said her.
That's right hers it him, youknow him. The whole thing happened
the boom. Somebody else is skilled. That's right, exactly. Um,
but this is also an episode aboutthe most evil people in all of the
world. Musical theater people the worst. Do you have any experience not even
not even musical theater underground, notan underground, off to the side,

(04:08):
off off off Broadway in a differentstate, musical theater, community theater people,
if it's got community in it,just walk away, an It doesn't
matter what it is, a community, sports, community, it doesn't matter.
It just means it's gonna be somebodythat isn't good. Yeah. Um,
do you have any experience doing thatyear or do theater? Not community

(04:29):
theater? In high school? Ina little bit, you know, you
know, when I was in NewYork, coops want to acting school and
I just snapped and just but yeah, I YouTube reminds me a lot of
community theater. That's pretty good.Yeah, a lot of people just expressing
themselves that express stay at home.Yeah, I've got no talent, Yeah,
but I got nothing else to do, so I'll do this. Look

(04:50):
at me, look at me,Look at me, Look at me,
look at me, look at me. Now, I never did community theater,
but I did do a ton oftheater when I in high school and
when I was in college. Andstarts with an ends with a home.
I felt like the people that arein this story were people that I just

(05:12):
those people. Yeah, I meanobviously don't specifically know them, but I
think I'm agreeing with you. ButI also think I see them in stand
up too. Yeah, anybody whowants that limelight, who wants that attention.
It's just it's a personality type.And they didn't really ever say that
they were good. Yes. Well, that's one of my favorite clips that
I'll be playing for you is whenthe woman who's writing a book about this

(05:34):
is describing how mediocre of a talentthis guy is, and then also her
she's from that world too, andit reads from that world and it's her
time to shine. Yep. Well, this is a story that takes place
in southern California, more specifically OrangeCounty, gaird Disneyland. The woman who's

(05:54):
writing the book, her name isGlendale, which people who are not from
southern California don't know. But Glendalealso the name of the city in southern
California right where we are. Theywere recording in Glendale. And when I
say we're recording in Glendale, understand, I'm not talking about the woman who's
in this story. That makes thisstory completely different. We're recording insider.

(06:15):
Um. So when this episode opens, Mike explains how we're all just narcissistic
creatures. He makes us feel shittyabout our well thanks, yeah, um,
and then just really digging in howterrible theater people are getting out a
clip later like wow, Mike wasI don't think he likes therapy, he

(06:39):
doesn't like he doesn't like people tobegin with, and then he just even
goes the people. Yeah. Um. So I want to tell this I
want to retell this story kind ofin the same way that the main show
does it because I love that forthe first thirty five minutes of the episode,
you don't know what's going on,you know, I mean, I
don't know what your experience was,but when you heard this, did you

(07:00):
think that Sam had killed this womanin his bedroom? And there was all
these things pointing to why he wasthe guy who did it. So I
thought, this is what I honestlythought. I thought that her boyfriend had
killed Sam and had and then hadwritten words on her. I see,
so, but I was confused.But then I was also like he tried

(07:24):
to make it seem like that andhad taken off yes, because I was.
And then and then I thought maybethe dad had something to do with
it. I know, I yeah, that's um and the little pulling back
the curtain a little bit. Whenyou work on these types of episodes,
you sort of understand that no matterwhat character you introduce, everyone listening is

(07:45):
going to assume that that person wasthe killer. It's just the natural way
that you're like playing detective. Whileyou're listening, you're like, well,
obviously the dad had something to dowith it, even though he's like sobbing
on the phone with nine one one, Okay, can we get to the
nine one one call? Did nineone one operators always do that where they
just try to keep you talking eventhough it's about nothing. That's correct.
They do okay, because I wasannoyed as ship with that operator. Well,

(08:09):
can I annoy you again? Him? Play the one? All right?
Do it? Maybe it was alittle bit what's coming on, sir?
Here's a dead body? Are yousure, sir? Did she just
ask him if he's truly seeing adead body? Yes? She did,

(08:35):
I'm sure. Gold. Okay,hold on, just a is it someone
that you know? Sir? Idon't know. Does your son know who
it is? You thought? Doyou know where your son is? Fair
question? Okay, just keep breathingfor me, sir. Okay, where

(08:58):
in the apartment? Issue in thebedroom? Some such activities. The blood
there was blood from her head.I don't know what. Okay, just
staying there, Okay, don't findfunny. I don't know if you gave
head sirs? Is a prank callum? To address your earlier question,

(09:26):
though, Yes, the nine oneone operators will keep you on the line
until the police arrive, so theyjust keep asking random things right and there.
Usually think she understood when he saidthere's a body. Do you think
she understood her She didn't understand.I think it took a little bit of
time for her to understand the severityof what this call really was. So
she's gotten hey, my pizza placehasn't picked up many calls, and then

(09:48):
finally this comes in. She oh, it's real. One of the things
that is sort of a trend inall these sword in Scale episodes are the
nine one one operators because a lotof them are not good at their jobs,
and they are, like I said, they are trying to ask questions
and then they're going to relay thatinformation to the police officers who are on
their way. But most of thetime they come off as like flighty and

(10:13):
not listening properly. There's a lotof them going like, sir, sir,
you need to shut up and youneed to tell me where you are
right now, like they're trying tokeep a handle on the situation. They
do. They also use it somaybe some some evidence will fall into into
the taping of the call. Yeah, that happens all the time for sure.
I mean a lot of times they'llbe a killer who's called nine one

(10:35):
one on themselves and they'll like admitthat they did it, you know,
and then that phone call becomes reallyimportant. Um, But like you,
I also thought the dad had somethingto do with it, even though,
because he was kind of an assholeback to us. So you're like,
oh, so daddy knows what happened, right, But the sad truth,
of course, is that he hasnothing to do with this. Sorry,

(10:56):
sorry daddy, Yeah, sorry,didn't mean to put you in a bed
situation. Yeah. The body foundin his son's bedroom was twenty three year
old Julie Kubuish and excuse me.On her back were were words that said
all yours fuck you, which wefind out later is I guess, a

(11:20):
way to try to deceive police.Further, I don't know where that phrase
came from. The all years part. They didn't really say where it came
from. They didn't get to it. I didn't know. I mean,
he what happens is this guy Danielwho we haven't met yet. He is
deliberately trying to throw police off histracks. But he didn't say where he
comes up with that idea. Yeah, exactly, because it did to me.

(11:46):
Yeah, I don't know. Idon't want to get ahead too far.
Sure, No, let's do it. Okay, So they think that
what's his face, I'm such areporter that he had that the murder victim
had slept with the murderer's girlfriend,right, they don't know if it was
for sure, but it wasn't notconfirmed exactly, which I was just like,

(12:07):
that's a weird way to go withit. Yeah, so maybe that
was a right but going with everythingthat we know about the story, at
the end of the story, hehad already killed the boyfriend, and then
those words all yours, fuck youwere too who who? Right? Because
the person that yours would have alreadybeen dead, um and headless and headless

(12:31):
as well. Yeah, well,you know, let's just tell the whole
ending right now. I just ruinit. I just said I'm not good
at these situations. So, butwhen you're listening to this episode, though,
this guy Sam who left this bodybehind is missing. Now we've already
hinted the fact that he's dead,but the police have no idea, and

(12:52):
they think that this guy, whoit turns out, has once been accused
of murder before, has now struckagain and is on the run, right,
which couldn't be farther from the truth, Which is interesting because we find
out that he's kind of completely donea one eighty as a person. Yeah,

(13:13):
so's he's actually a good guy bythe sounds of it, and he's
trying to become the best thing hecan be. He's trying to be all
he could be joining your army.So this guy Sam, the army should
use this, by the way,they should use this thing. Let people
know you could get killed at home. Join the army. Now. Yeah,

(13:35):
it's a good recruitment video. You'reright. So Sam and Julie were
only friends. They say in thisepisode that Sam was like a big brother
to Julie. He felt protective ofher, she'd sleep on his couch.
This all sounds like classic friend zone. You know, when I hear this

(13:56):
story, it sounds like every relationshipI ever had in high school theater,
which was a showmance, which isright. You're trying to go after the
really cute, pretty girl who's thepopular girl, and she can make you
feel like a million bucks, butshe's never gonna be your girl, right,
you know, she's just gonna getyou to do things for her.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Soyou know, I appreciate the nobility of

(14:16):
the storytelling that Sam was like abig brother to this girl. But remember
they were not and Sam and Juliewere not in theater. It was the
other two, right, Well,I think they said that Julie was also
in theater. Oh, I didn'tget that. I didn't hear that.
I didn't. I knew she was, she was helping, she was his
tutor, Sam's tutor, but Ididn't know she was in theater. I

(14:39):
guess, you know, I mightbe kind of I think, finding a
few different things and just drunk inof power and feel like you should be
running the whole show. I'm soobvious, aren't I. There's going to
be a murder on the shoe.Yeah. So let's talk a little bit
though about this previous accusation of fromher. Okay, because you were saying

(15:01):
that you had actually heard of thatpart of the story. I remember.
So it's it's around two thousand andtwo. I moved here two thousand and
one, and I was living ina horrible hotel in Hollywood called the Hollywood
Hotel on I think it was HollywoodBoulevard and I want to say Western okay,

(15:24):
um, And I remember watching allabout these kids. This kid had
been murdered because he had turned hisfriends in on something. They were selling
drugs and kind of thing, andhe turned them in and one of them
had got him to come and theywere all there and they murdered him.
Yeah, and this sounds like thisis the exact same. And the funny

(15:46):
part was I remember this because Iwatched it, and then I got on
a plane and went to New Yorkand filmed another code and I was doing
Laconi a lot of that time.Yeah. Now he doesn't even recognize me
when I say him, murder you. According to there's an article that I
found. According to Los Angeles Countycourt documents, prosecutors believe that her and

(16:06):
seventeen members of the quote Brown Familiagang ambushed a rival gang member in a
Santa Clarita parking lot January two thousandand two. Prosecutors allege that the group
beat nineteen year old Byron Benito withcrowbars and stabbed him thirty three times.
It was us eventually striking a fatalblow by puncturing a lung, And it

(16:30):
looks like had some sort of targetedfor revenge after another member was found slain.
So there's a lot of crazy shitgoing on, and they sort of
gloss over in the episode. Butthis guy Sam, he had a confession,
but then it was thrown out fortechnical reason. It was crazy that
a guy. I was just like, what, Yeah, can you imagine
confessing and still getting away with it? Yeah, or confessing And then they

(16:53):
were like, oh, we didn'tpush record. Yeah, do you mind
taking it back? Can we goback and do the second take of that?
I would be like, no,that was it. Yeah, but
it's not looking good for this guy. Also, they say he's got fully
sleeved tattoo arms. It just soundslike a criminal. Yeah, you know,
yeah, and he's young. Andhe's like, isn't it weird when

(17:17):
you see somebody with expensive tattoos andthey're not at the age of making that
money to be able to throw itaway on expensive tattoos. Yeah, you're
okay, do you have any tattoos? I have one of a red star?
Oh? I was allergic to it, to all the breakage for people
who can't see this, and justrolled down his pants and he's showing me
a tattoo in a very inappropriate Iread read I bent over to show my

(17:41):
red star. It's how am Isupposed to transition from that? If you
can transition from buttle um? Allright, so let's go back to We'll
kind of let up to this murderbecause again, this is a show about
a murder. Okay, um,Sam, who is this supposed killer who's
on the run, had been textingto this girl Julie throughout the previous day,

(18:07):
and earlier in the day mentioned somethingabout helping his friend Dan move some
things. Remember that part people.But as it got later at night,
he starts texting, can you comeover to my place tonight? I'm very
upset. I need to talk nosex, which apparently was part of the
another really weird thing. If they'rejust to me, I think should have

(18:30):
raised her like if they weren't,Like, why would you have to tell
me? Right, you've never toldme this before. Yeah, you would
immediately think that this is not myfriend. But why would you ever feel
good? Why would you ever thinkthat, Oh, texts coming from this
person aren't really from that person.But that is of course the reality of
it. And you know, theshitty part about murder is you can't have

(18:55):
twenty twenty hindsight when you're the victim. M there you go, Oh that
didn't make sense. Already dead,Yeah that's true. Maybe oh man,
my fault, that's true. Itdoesn't work that way. So the detectives
kind of after they are called toinvestigate this dead body. They are what

(19:18):
doing when police do, which isfollow every lead that they can to try
to figure out what the hell's goingon and the yes, and they noticed
there was some bank activity on Sam'sbank card, this guy who was on
the run allegedly, and they foundfour separate cash withdrawals using this guy's card.
But when they check the cameras atthe banks, it wasn't Sam getting

(19:41):
money out. It was a randomteenager. And they did some great detective
work because they saw the card wasused to order pizza. So then they
went to the pizza place to getthe address for where the pizza was dropped
off. Now, I think thiscould have been a major mistake because we
all know the classic pizza prank whereyou or somebody else they could have kicked

(20:03):
down the wrong door, the originalwhat do they call it swatting or swarming?
The original that was the original onewhere yea, what do you do
with pizza places? Not cops?That's right, kids today, I don't
know about that. Yeah, itwas a great trick to play um.
But when police arrived, they justfound this scared teenage boy who had absolutely
no idea what any of this murdererthing was about, and this guy Sam

(20:25):
was still nowhere to be found inLong Beach by the way, just legendary,
humble brag. It's a long beach. There you go. Well,
we then get to what's the firstcommercial break in the episode. When we
get back, we learn finally aboutthis guy Daniel Wasniak, who we don't
know is actually the most important characterin this entire story, one of Sam's

(20:48):
neighbors, right, which was anotherdetail that I felt was not exactly clear
first time listening to the episode untilway later they to the fact that their
neighbors. It was a very confusingpart of the story from a question for
Yeah, yeah, remember when thedad's in the apartment. Yes, was
that Dan that came to the door? Oh could have been I wonder if

(21:14):
it was coming back to the scene. Yeah, hey, what's going on?
Yeah? Oh so yeah, thatcould be out who he's talking to
kind of in the background. Ohyeah, that's crazy. Yeah, that's
even creepier. Now, did youtypical singing weirdo? Speaking of typical singing
weirdos, I want to play nowthe first clip of this woman Glendale who's

(21:36):
writing a book about Daniel, andthis is her talking about Daniel kind of
what he was like and how theymet. I actually met Daniel Wazniak almost
exactly ten years from today. Imet him in two thousand and ten.
He seemed just like a musical theateractor, which might not relate to everybody,

(22:02):
but he was happy, go lucky, or at least that was the
persona. He made a lot ofjokes, he liked, you know,
singing randomly. Boy. He wasgregarious, very friendly, very outgoing,

(22:22):
and it seemed to me like mostpeople liked him, at least, you
know what I could see on thesurface, people liked him. Yeah,
that's what I mean. Like,I just feel like you were saying to
you, these people exist in thein the comedy world. Yeah, I
mean I feel very similar to thistype of guy as well. Um,

(22:44):
I think there's a difference though,Right, there's the guy that that has
that personality that you just want tobe around. Sure, there's the guy
that's fake that does all those things. Yeah, and he feels like number
two. I think you're right,which would explain why Mike Budet is very
judge. I gotta play this cliptoo, because again actually comes right after
this description of Daniel too. Comeon, you know the type. It's

(23:07):
always like they're on stage performing.It's a whole personality. I've met a
few of this type of person They'repretty annoying. All the world's a stage
and that sort of thing. It'slike the entire universe was designed for the
performance of their life. Now,I always thought that was what my life

(23:30):
was, but apparently it's not true. This is the performance of my life
of my life. Um, butI wonder, what's up, Mic,
Why don't you like the theater?Why has everything gotta be a horror Mike?
Yeah, I uh, he doesn't. He does say something like,
come on, well, I don'tknow that guy. Yeah, exactly anywhere,

(23:52):
and we're all like yeah, andthen and then some of us are
like, oh, so this womanGlendale was a community theater director in Orange
County I used to be, whichjust makes me think, what musical is
she doing? Right, because shesounds like Harvey Fierstein Young you know what

(24:14):
I mean? Yeah, Well,the musical in this particular episode is a
musical called nine Are you familiar withI'm not. And when I heard it,
I'm like, Nope, I'm notlooking it up. Let me download
you on some info because I dohappen to know a little bit about this
show, because you've done it before. Well I'm not that one, but
I've did a lat theater, solittle film lesson here. There's a movie

(24:36):
called Eight and a half, veryfamous Italian movie made by Federico Fellini.
Oh movie. If you remember thescene in Pulp Fiction where John Travolta and
Uma Thurman are dancing and they doa little v thing over their eyes,
that scene is lifted directly from Eightand a Half. White it's this movie
as well, now, Taranto.The movie Eight and a half is a

(24:57):
very famous movie about a director andall the women in his life and how
they've sort of shaped who he's become. They took this movie and they turned
it into a stage musical called Nine. They just rounded up. It's just
nine women that have God. That'sright. And they actually made another movie
of the stage musical with Daniel dayLewis singing and dancing. It's not worth

(25:19):
your time. It's terrible, butthat's the story of nine. There you
go, just talk you a littlebit about it. It's a musical theater,
though it shouldn't be about nine womenthat shaped his legs. Ye,
should be about nine men that shapeYeah, that's how the industry works.
Yeah, absolutely, it's true.No, no, no, not hate,
that's just truth. I want toplay another clip of Glendale talking about
what a talented actor Daniel. It'snot you know, did Daniel Wazniac have

(25:42):
the greatest singing voice in the world. No? Did he have a nice,
deep, loud voice, yes?Could he hold a tune? Yes?
Was he likable on stage? Yes? Was he a brilliant act?
He was? Okay, I meanif I die and somebody says that about

(26:04):
me, I would be crushed.My soul will forever be crushed. It
was so funny. The whole thingsays so much that first of all,
it's just like, well, youbooked him. Yeah, That's what I'm
thinking when I hear that, I'mlike, you were just saying like she
should have lied and said he wasfantastic he had a great voice, like
that, because it says so muchabout her. Yeah, your ability to

(26:26):
cast a child like I was.And you know, we we wanted to
have a barbecue, but we couldonly get McDonald's. You know what I
mean, Like, that's exactly whatshe's saying, because that's all as we
could afford. Yeah. Also againjust going was he good? No?
Was he loud? Yes? Yeshe was? And isn't that those people?
Oh yeah, those people are alwaysbad, but they're loud. They're

(26:48):
playing. It's a projecting. Yougot to play to the back of the
theater. It's a very small theater. I want to tell them. Um.
So she talks about how she auditionedhim and asked him in this show
nine and she was wanting him toaudition for another musical called bat Boy.
You know, we had another shittything we are doing and we needed another
shitty actor. So I said,why the hell, let's get Dad Yet

(27:12):
it must be available now. BatBoy is pretty good musical. By the
way, there was if you rememberthat music or the supermarket tabloid that says
bat Boy found in cave. Somebodyturned that into a full figured I figured
it wasn't about a kid that wasgetting bats to the baseball players. Bat
Boy. I'm gonna need another woodenone. I'm gonna need another wooden one.

(27:36):
This is aluminum. You're shilling batBoy. I would pay so much
money for that. What's the goodnow? That's all right, a little
bit did people like him? Kind? It's just crazy. So he's apparently
starring in all these musicals opposite hisfiancee, Rachel Buffett, and she's subscribed

(28:00):
right off the bat as being abit snobbish, and we kind of find
out that she's maybe a little bitof a mastermind herself. Um. They
do give a little background that shewas acting in the character department at Disneyland.
She was an Alice also Wonderland MaximumVelocity. Yes. Um, But
this whole bat Boy musical thing wasnot to be because Daniel got arrested.

(28:26):
Oh can I go back to her? Yeah? Please, seventy five percent
of the women in musical theater orher? Right. I'm gonna get guys
to do things for me, yeah, or not even guys. I'm gonna
get anybody that thinks I'm attractive todo things for me. I'll tell you
what, if I was an attractivegirl, I'd probably do the same thing.
If I was a hot girl,my career would be on fire.

(28:47):
Yeah, I would be. I'dbe sleeping with the oldest executive out there.
I wouldn't even sleep. I wasjust being so close that we almost
left again, it's perfect. It'sa perfect plan. So hot girls,
he was your talent for evil,not good. Believe it or not,
Daniel was arrested for a bank scheme. They just arrested him because they found

(29:08):
that kid with the credit card hehanded him over, right, right.
They didn't even know that there wasthis murder happening, you know, just
a couple days before. And itwas a little sloppy right on Daniel's part.
Yes, like I didn't really figureout where he got this kid.
Yeah, I agree, that wasn'treally that clear. And then he just

(29:30):
kind of paid somebody to help getmonth out for him. It was just
like riding down the street and said, hey, that kid needs four hundred
bucks or something that It was weird, right, And the other thing was
like, well, who doesn't knowyou shouldn't do that? Right like that,
there's video cameras everywhere. Yeah,yeah, exactly, some old man

(29:52):
just sitting up there with a supereight. Yeah. Um, but the
cops know at least a little littlebit more of the story, which is
that they do know about there's amurder as well. Um, so there's
this scene in the interrogation room thatI want to play for you where by
the way, it is a scene. It really does seem like a scene.

(30:12):
Yeah, Daniel is showcasing his incredibleacting ability. Um so here he
is talking his way out of what'sgoing on. Action came down and said
it helped me. I went upstairsand yes, I saw the God damn
by is that much lying here?So we're gonna hear the truth that is
the truth, and tell us whathappened. How did that play out?

(30:34):
And what did you do when yougot up there? How did your DNA
get on her? What's that?Because that was right? Okay, So
how did your DNA get on herthat I don't DNA doesn't just full off.
I don't know. I didn't doanything. So a shooter. He's

(30:56):
got this whole story that Daniel's tellingthe police that his buddy Sam came up
to him and was like, Ijust killed somebody. I don't know what
to do, And Daniel was like, whoa pump the brakes. Let me
try to help you, and youknow, I'm gonna help you clean up
this mess. And that was sortof what his original story to police was.
And there must have been that musthave been like this wasn't cleaned up

(31:18):
that. Yeah, you're arrested likethat. It was so bad. Yeah.
So the investigators take like a break, and Daniel calls up his fiancee
and tells her in very explicit terms, don't get rid of the evidence or
hang on to the evidence. AndRachel knows that this line's being recorded because

(31:40):
she's thinking at least three percent clearlyhere And so do you think he he
knew as well? I don't.I just think he's a fucking idiot.
I mean, he just was soI just he just seems like such a
buffoon. Was he a good actor? No? Was he a good writer?
No? Yeah? Was he loud? He was? Which he isn't
that thing. He definitely is.Even what he says it was like to

(32:04):
talk to God, damn it exactly. It really is showcasing his acting talents
for a nineteen thirties film, right, Oh that's right, one of the
first talkies. Oh it's kind tomake crazy. God damn it, it
got away. Say, um,how did my danna get honor? You
tell me? You know the police? Yeah, it's crazy. Uh So,

(32:27):
after he makes his phone call,he then goes back into the police
room. The police room, theinterrogation room, and he just straights up,
straight up admits what he did.Now investigators are not expecting to hear
what he's about to say. Well, they didn't. They had him there
for an hour. They must havebeen shocked, like that was the easiest

(32:49):
case they've ever had a break.Yeah, well, here's the confession right
here. He said, you wantto talk to me, what's going on?
I'm crazy and I did it.He gay one, I killed Julie
and I killed him. Boom boomshows over, good night. Yeah,
thanks guys, thanks for listening.Also not very well acted. I'm crazy,

(33:12):
I'm crazy and I did it.The most he's loud, but when
he's crazy, he's quiet. Yeah, his instincts are just totally wrong.
Now we find out that Sam toldthis guy or sees me, Daniel told
this guy Sam that he needed helpmoving, He needed help loading some stuff,
and had lured him to this theater, and when he asked Sam to

(33:36):
pick something up, Daniel pulled outa gun and shot him in the back
of the head twice. He tookhis phone, he took his wallet,
but he left the body in theattic of this theater, which it was
pointed out, was still in useat the time, there was like a
children's performance. Shot him while therewas a kids show going on right now.
He left the body behind, talkedto his fiance say about what happened,

(34:00):
and then the two of them goon stage and perform a musical that
night at different city. I don'tknow if you remember the best performance of
his life. That's right, accordingto Glendale. Now, after the show
concluded, he returned to his apartment, and that's when he started texting Julie,

(34:21):
saying, you know, pretending tobe Sam because he had his phone.
And the only reason he's texting Juliebecause Julie happens to make the most
random thing and checks on her friend, Hey how are you. Yes,
she says, hey, how areyou, and the killer, using the
victim's phone, drops his own name. He goes, oh, not much,

(34:44):
just hanging out with Dan, helpingDan. Oh no, no,
no, no, is there isthere an undo? Yeah? That is
one of the most bone headed movesof this entire st just replied to all.
Now because he did that, Now, he's automatically made it so that
she knows too much, right,and he's extra dumb because it's not like

(35:07):
the police don't find all of thesetexts afterward anyway. He's just he's so
dumb. But he's also got ataste for murder. That's right now.
Dan says in his confession that hetold the story to his fiance and then
she got sleepy and went to bed, and that's when he snuck out and
committed this horrible Let's reenact that.Let's reenact that. Who do you want

(35:29):
to play? I'll be Rachel,all right? Heynight. So you were
like, that was the performance ofa life. I something I have to
tell you. I murdered I'm misterhere today. Wait, you murdered him.
I shot him in the back ofthe head while we were moving something.

(35:51):
He didn't help well enough, andI shot him in the back of
the nap. Well, I'm exhaustedjust hearing that. I'm gonna go take
a nap. You got to sleep. I'm right to kill somebody else.
Wait, n scene. Wow,that's exactly how it would do. So
Dan says, of course, allthe stuff about Rachel being asleep. But

(36:13):
Glendale, the woman who's writing thebook, she is suggesting that Rachel was
definitely involved with all of this textingthat LRD this poor girl to her death.
I'll do my impression with Glendale.He liked, attacked everyone. She're
the American Texter, and July'd attackedDan on the other hand, what are
they a good Texter? No?Did he text? Yes, he texted

(36:37):
in all caps, very loudly,very loudly. Now we get to a
scene that's just described by Boudet,which I thought was a pretty chilling scene,
which is this idea of Dan meetingJuliet at the door and be like,
oh, hey, Sam contacted metoo, Let's go in and help
him together. And then once thatdoor was closed behind her, it was

(36:58):
game over. Are you sure notgonna be sex? That's what you must
have said. And Dan allegedly gotnervous and went into the bathroom for like
a minute to try to cool hisnerves, and then he kind of did
the same thing he did to Sam, which is he said, hey,
look at that, what's that?And then as soon as she turned around,
she's dead. I don't understand,like he must, how he would

(37:21):
have been able to do that toboth of them with a gun, Like
yeah, without people hearing it orsomething, you know something, it's very
weird, Like I don't. Idon't know. You must have snuck on
him somehow, right. It doesn'tseem like it was as easy as he
made it sound. I feel likethey died in a bad way, Like
he pulled the gun on him andthen he said get on your knees and
shot him in the head. Yeah. Yeah, which is I know,

(37:44):
horrible the thing to think, butto me it seems correct rather than what
he says. It's also weird thatyou mentioned that because a lot of times
in these true crime cases, peopleare calling nine one one to report gunshots,
and that doesn't happen in this story. I didn't even think of that.
Yeah, so it's sharing a kid'splay a gunshot. It is sort
of strange that all these things arehappening. I didn't even think of that.

(38:06):
Like the Wiggles was great, butthat gunshot really Yeah, that was
seemed weird. An act too,wasn't it though it was in a it
was on a military compound. Yeahthat I think that's right. I got
a little confused with some of thatstorytelling. I do believe that that was
part of it as well. Butreturning to the murder of Julie, there

(38:29):
was, of course this idea thathe staged it to look like a sexual
assault, and I thought he wasstaged something like that, so he must
have slept pretty nasty all around.I would think, well, I figure
out what you how was she?I'm just mumbled it. I figured out
how I got his DNA on her? Well, exactly, that's what I
was going to say. That's theonly they don't ever say in this episode

(38:51):
that he raped her, But thereis this allusion to the fact that there's
DNA on her. I didn't eventhink about that. How did you get
a DNA on her? Yeah,He's like I was standing over the body
with my deck outcoming on her.That's not how DNA works. I apologize.
This is a filthy episode. Itis to way too inappropriate. Speaking

(39:13):
of inappropriate, here's the really reallyfucked up part of the episode, which
is the body that was in theattic needs to be disposed of, and
so Dan decides to take the bodyapart, one limb at a time,
and then take the remains to likea nature preserve and throw them out,
try to let the animals take careof it. So he decapitates the body,
takes off either one or both arms. It was a little unclear to

(39:37):
me. Didn't want to google thatpicture. But what do you think of
this guy's plan? It's so bizarre. It's so bizarre that because he's crying
when they're asking him questions. Anyway, he's crazy. I can't imagine being
able to butcher somebody. Yeah,and what they always say is that it

(40:00):
takes a lot longer than you thinkit's going to Oh I didn't know they
say that. Yeah, I thinkRachel helped. Oh you think she was
there? Oh that's even don't youlike? Yeah, I don't see why
not have an extra pair of handslike that, do you know? Yeah,
well, they have a thing thathas alibi for why she wasn't there
during the murder. But it's inthe addict of the theater, right,

(40:22):
Ye? How is there blood nutsseeping through some place? Like that's a
lot of blood coming out of something. Yeah, especially if they're starting to
get dismembered and stuff. That's yeah. More, And it's not like immediate,
it's a couple it's a day afterwardsor something. Yeah. Yeah,
let alone the smell all that,and then he just he put the head
in the backpack or something like hewas taking it out one piece at a

(40:43):
time, yep, and didn't getvery far. Yeah. I mean,
I guess the idea of letting theanimals take care of it, and that's
not the worst idea, but yeah, just five feet from the main drag
of that was the mistake. It's, uh, well, it's obviously committed
by a crazy person, so Idon't know if it's a crazy person or

(41:04):
just an arrogant idiot. Well,he definitely falls into both of those camps.
Ignorance and arrogance are a horrible wayto go. Oh, what I
was going to say before this womanGlendale mentions this idea that when somebody plans
for murder, they also plan foran investigation, so they often leave false
clues, which I thought was it'skind of like stating the obvious, but

(41:25):
I liked I never really thought ofit that way, that if you are
going to try to commit something horrible, you do understand that there's a consequence
to it as well. And sowhat year did this happen? This happened
in two thousand and ten. Here'sone of my problems. How does she
not finished this fucking book? Yeah, well now it's now it's a blog

(41:46):
now, Yeah, she's a blogcalled Daniel's My Friend, which did that
part? I don't. I don'tknow if we've gotten too far on that
part. We've arrived, We've arrivedthere, because that's that annoyed me.
Yeah, and she just seemed whenshe says, well, I as I
went to the you know, Iwhen I called where it is and he's
at the Orange Council. I wentand started talking to him and start I'm

(42:08):
like, oh, if anybody seesan opportunity, it's you, lady,
like you're It's just like it wasgross, definitely capitalizing. Don't kill me
Glendale because you're probably listen to thisand Glendale. Yeah. Yeah, I
like how she explained that she reintroducedherself. It was just curious how he
was doing. Hello, Daniel,do you remember me? I was the

(42:29):
director that booked you, even thoughyou shit. Yeah, I'm glad you
never asked me what you thought ofmy performance? Yeah? Um and uh.
Ultimately we learned that money was theactual motivator. And Daniel had to
fight about this with my wife.Oh really, yeah, well she'll I

(42:49):
briefly give the scenario and then youtell me where the talking. So the
idea was that Daniel and Rachel wereplanning on getting married, which is obviously
very expensive, and they needed moneyfor the honeymoon, and they were going
into crazy debt, so they startedasking people all over the place for money,
and somehow, little do they knowhow weddings happen, people bring you

(43:12):
gifts. Daniel somehow knows that thisguy Sam has sixty thousand dollars saved up
in his bank account, and that'ssort of how he hatches this plan.
And there's allegedly an affair going ontoo. I think it's all the affair.
I think the money's bullshit, becausehow is he going to get the
sixty thousand dollars? That's right.You can't just have that little kid pull
it out four dollars at a time. It's not going to happen. So

(43:34):
I called my wife. Well that'swhat they say. I'm like, I
say, bullshit. It was definitelythe affair, and that's why he killed
him. And he probably would havegot less time for saying it was a
passion passion killing, right, Yeah, well the whole d heading. Yeah.
I don't know if he's gonna getless time, but he would what
a crime of passion isn't. Don'tyou get what if you necessarily get a

(43:58):
reduction, But it's certainly can helpa little bit, I think, and
I think people look at you alittle different. Yeah, that's true.
Right. That guy was fuking mywoman that I was marrying, and that's
why what not like with both parts. That guy was wuking my woman.
But he had sixty thousand dollars.Yeah, so I was fine with that
if as long as we could killhim. And it's also has pointed out
in this episode weird that he's tryingto get money to pay for the celebration

(44:24):
that he's going to have with thewoman that he knows is having an affair
like this is not a great foundationfor it's not there's nothing about this relationship
that is good. Now, thisguy got arrested at his bachelor party,
which if you were one of thatguy's friends, that had to be the
most epic bachelor party you've ever beento before. As the donkey's leaving him

(44:46):
come to yeah, exactly, AndI was wondering, do you have any
good bachelor party stories? Uh?No, I don't think I say anything.
I don't think I've ever been toa bachelor party. Really. Yeah,
Trent's my buddy. Trents wasn't.We had to strip her up in
Edmonton with that, so she wasshe was a little rough. So you
know she's a Canadian stripper. Canadianstrippers huh yeah, wear gloves. They're

(45:09):
more polite, more polite. I'mabout to get questions asked about japenance grind
Dan you um so getting to thewrap up of the story here. Sorry,
people listening, We've got to getwrapped up to them. Oh no,
I'm just trying to look at mynotes here. But I think it
kind of circles back to what wewere talking about earlier, which is they

(45:31):
never explicitly say that they did havean affair, but they also never denied
it either. I think this iswhen we asked people. I want to
ask the people and have them reachout to us. Can I do that?
Am allowed to do that? Oh? Yeah, sure? We have.
We have phone numbers for everybody episode. I want to know. I
want to know if they think thatI'm right where it was about him sleeping

(45:52):
with his woman, yeah, orwhether it was actually about the money.
I think you've convinced me though,especially with this angle of how is he
ever going to get that money,right, There's just no way. It's
just like no, what he didhe get a checkbook? Like they didn't.
There's just they didn't say anything thatthey were with any way that he
was going to get that money.I wonder too if it isn't sort of

(46:14):
a strategy to help this girl,Rachel kind of get away with it a
little bit. If it's I thinkshe did it, well, not that
she did it, but as theysay in this episode, she gets arrested
really just for lying to authorities.She's arrested for. She spends like thirty
two months in jail, so justshy of three years and she's already out
back on the market. Buzz.That's right. But if she was really

(46:37):
the one texting and or as yousay, possibly helping to pull this body
apart, she should absolutely Yeah.So I wonder though if having an affair,
the line of we had an affairdoesn't draw her more into these events,
And so it's like a legal strategyfor them to not say anything about

(47:00):
or about more. They'd say moreabout money, right, And it's just
a way that they have like proofof things that have to do with money.
You know, when your client isguilty of a crime. You're trying
to like find a way to getthem lesser punishing. They say, follow
the money, And if you followthe money, there wasn't much money.
Yeah, and with the plan hehad going on, there wasn't gonna be

(47:22):
much money. He was just usingthose credit cards to make it seem like
he was still alive. Yeah.So right, there's that too. Yeah,
I mean, I think you're right. I think it was probably more
of a crime of passion that heplanned. It seems like it makes more
sense that way. I got onemore clip to play. No, please,

(47:42):
I didn't. I just why didn'the kill her too, Rachel?
I think because he loved her evenafter all this. Okay, but I'm
just a romantic, you know,you are a romantic youse Like He's like,
I'm will murder somebody, but Ilove you forever, and I don't
like murder everybody. Well I feelbad for Julie. Yeah, well of

(48:06):
course. I mean there's always somebodyin these events that you know, and
that's not so much I feel.You know, Julie doesn't know what's going
on, but her family's just amass I guarantee is. Yeah, it's
terrible. Um. This last clipthat I want to play is between Daniel
and Rachel, these two actors.He's in jail, she's not, and
it sounds this is before she gotarrested, right it must be, Yeah,

(48:29):
this is the call that It justsounds so scripted and weird, stilted
line readings. But then Daniel startshysterically sobbing in the middle of it,
the worst crying. Now, Ifelt like it was very loud. You
a good crier? No, buthe was loud. Let's let's play.

(48:49):
He was a dry, loud crier. All right, let's play. I
really because I thought it was theonly way I could take care of you.
Because I was a failure. I'msorry. I couldn't be the man
that you needed. Okay, Somaybe why do you leave your family?

(49:10):
Then? My resome is I almostreached the point where I almost killed them?
Could you almost reach the point whereyou killed me? No? Never,
I promise you were my only light. You're never gonna see me again.
Maybe you're gonna see me again.I'm gonna come you all the time.

(49:38):
What a bad cray. I dolove you very much. You are
so insane and so stupid, ButI know, in your quitted little mind
you were doing it. I don'twant it to be happy with me and

(50:00):
I wait, you for it up? Oh was there? Okay? I
love you. I'll be like,oh yeah. She should have said,
look, man, you're in prison, you gotta fucking quick crying like a

(50:22):
bench, that's what she should havesaid. Yeah, Oh my god.
When I hear her talk, Ijust feel like she's definitely guilty right lay
way more. It really does feellike a thing that she scripted and wrote,
but doesn't make sense because he wasshe was fucking what's his face?

(50:44):
So you think she would have theguy that was killed killed Daniel, right,
Yeah, to be with the otherguy, but somehow he's tricked her
into thinking she should stay with him. It's so weird. Yeah, I
personally feel like the sobbing crying stuff. To me, it sounds real,
And even though it sounds so overthe top crazy, there's a part of

(51:07):
it that feels really real to me, Like I have a weird little radar
that kind of goes off when I'mhere. Really it's not very well calibrated.
I'm wrong a lot, but Idefinitely felt funny. I definitely felt
like it's broken, but I Ihave this gift, I have this thing
I listened to. It never works, but I don't really have any proof

(51:28):
of it. He's obviously a nutjob, but I just there's something about
the way he's saying, like we'llnever see each other again. It just
feels real to me in that moment. But I don't know. My wife
showed me a picture of him.Oh yeah, And I didn't think he
was a bad looking man. Washe a bad looking man, no,
Nazi loud. Was he gorgeous?Not so much, But I thought he

(51:50):
could he couldn't meet another because italmost seemed like, if you leave me,
I'll never get somebody again. Yeah. Well, they even say in
I think Glendale is the one whosays that she thinks that if Daniel had
never met Rachel, none of thiswould have ever happened because he was just
this nice, gregarious guy. Butshe sort of, because he was trying

(52:14):
to be the strong man, shewas able to kind of make him manipulate,
you know, manipulate him a certainway. Glendale said, if they
had never met, Matt Boy wouldbe still on stage right now. Yes,
my book is almost finished. Hervoice is crazy. Yeah, it
really is. They finished this thing, right, and then I'll tell you

(52:36):
something. Yeah, so they soughtthe death penalty for Daniel and they got
it, but there's never any executionsin California, so he's likely just going
to die of old age on deathrow. Though I do remember that the
chances are he'll die of old agebefore he gets to death penalty. I'm
like, what else, there's noother like, you just say he's gonna

(53:00):
die of old age. You don'tsay chances are. Chances are he's gonna
slip on something, and that right, that's true. I did like,
though, the last words of thisepisode, which is that now he's surrounded
by the worst of the worst andthey're not acting, but he'll fit right
in. I thought that was apretty chill way to end that episode,
because just like all the jerks inthis show, he's a fucking creep.

(53:22):
He's a creep. Michael Boudet knowshow to put words together. He sure
does. Thank you, Mike Buday, by the way for letting us do
this ship. Yeah, thank youman, thank you. I do enjoy
talking about the murder with you.Ian. It's fun. It is fun.
I'm sorry, I'm so loud andgregarious. Well we do it.
Yeah, you feel safe? Yeah? Why'd you lock the door? Why

(53:42):
did you lock the door? Wellthat's our show, folks. Thanks again
for listening. We're gonna be backnext week with another great episode. Yeah,
and thanks again to Ian. Bythe way, you're on social media,
people can follow you. Yeah,you can follow me, but only
if you're gonna be nice. Don'tbe a dick. I'm a sur bag
on Twitter, ian Bag on Instagram? What else I follow? I like

(54:02):
looking at videos on TikTok, butI don't do many Tiktoksah. Just go
to itanbag dot com for all youreaton bag needs. Perfect. Well again,
thanks everyone for listening, and asalways, don't be a douchebag.
Don't be a douche sort scale weWant is a production of incongruity media.

(54:27):
If you enjoyed the show, leaveus a five star rating at a glowing
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