April 11, 2024 • 31 mins
Colin looks at the NBA stars who get all the love for their "highlights" to point out players like Nikola Jokic are the ones who produce real value for teams. He pushes back against those who claim Bill Belichick doesn't get enough credit for the Patriots Dynasty. Plus, 3-time NBA champion Danny Green joins the show to give his thoughts on the Bucks' struggles this season and what could happen if they are eliminated early in the playoffs once again
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin cowher
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go. It's a Thursday. We are live. It's
the Herd wherever you may be and however you may
be listening. Thanks for Megan, hows part of your day.
We got a lot of stuff going on as we
get closer and closer to the NFL Draft. But Jmack,
you have been very much pro Luca. Oh yeah, And
I think he's a great score. His style of platum,
(00:50):
I don't think it's mesmerizing. But I'm watching Luca and
Jokich last night the Denver Minnesota game. Those are really
good teams and I've come to a conclusion now. I
don't know if Luca's gonna win titles, but Dallas right
now is really good and Denver's already got a title.
But it did make me think about something about Luca.
(01:12):
I'm coming around, Oh on Dallas and Luca.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
Well, I just remind everybody a year ago at this time,
nobody believed in the Denver Nuggets. Oh, they hadn't proven anything, Yokich,
He's still got to do it in the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Yeah, so I was thinking about this. I was, you know,
sitting watching NBA late last night, late into the night,
and I saw a clip. You can't give Yo kicch
another MVP. Should have won last year would have been
his third straight. Should win this year? Hear Luca and
my take his Why not? There's only two players in
(01:44):
this league that are unstoppable every single game, Yo Kitchen Luca.
They were both great again last night, high IQ Europeans elite,
unstoppable scores, and unlike the windmill dunk guys, they actually
will age much better. They're not aesthetically pleasing, no high
(02:05):
flying dunks. They stay close to the floor, they move slowly, deliberately.
They are games about angles, thick body types. But the
basketball culture and basketball media loves the spectacular, and we've
had great players who are spectacular, Doctor J Michael Jordan.
(02:26):
But it's this constant promoting of Derrick Rose and Westbrook
and John Wall and John Morant. Guards that can't shoot, Yes,
they can jump, and the fanboys love them. Lob City. Wow,
what did they ever win? What did Westbrook Wall John
Morant show me the playoff wins? The best point guards
(02:49):
in the last fifteen years are guys that don't dunk.
Steph Curry and Chris Paul Smart can elevate others excellent shooters.
That's what I want point guard. These European stars are
not into selling shoes and they're not into the dunk contest.
They are into body angles, analytics, fewer dribbles, getting their
(03:13):
shot and you cannot stop jokicch and Luca and they've
got both ten plus years of elite scoring. I mean
jo kicch that game could last forever. It could last
like Brady into the forties and still be dominant. And
Luca again, he's not gonna get hurt. High fly and
windmill dunks. That's the downside to the highly vertical player players.
(03:35):
They age faster, they crash to the floor more. Where's
Lake Griffin, Where's John Wall, Where's Dwight Howard Russell? Westbrook
off the bench? Steph Curry's thirty six, He's still a
dominant player. Luca is gonna last for fifteen years. You're
gonna get fifteen years. I said this years ago. He
may end up being the first or second leading scorer
in league history. This game's gonna wear well. Yokich's game's
(03:57):
gonna wear well. The high flying dunk test guys, they
age really fast, and they just don't win enough in
the playoffs. Analytics matter, Spacing matters, angles matter. I grew
up in an NBA, and I loved a lot of
those players where it was about verticality and dunk contest.
(04:18):
Years ago, Lebron James just said, I'm not doing the
dunk contest, and I said he shouldn't. It's it's beneath him.
That was the old NBA. That's the seventies, eighties, early
nineties NBA. This NBA is slower, deliberate with its dominance players.
You can't speed Yo kitchup. You can't speed Luca up.
They're gonna do whatever they want to do, and they're
(04:38):
gonna age incredibly well. And you know Kyrie Irving last
night talking about Luca. I've always been a little bit
cooler on Dallas because I don't I don't see them
as a team. Luk or Kyrie. Can you win with
your two stars? Not really defenders. You got to have
some defenders around these guys. But the Mavericks are playing
better defense top five last time I checked, and that
net defensive rating. And Kyrie talk about Luca after the game.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
We knew how especially this year was going to be
just based on our practices, what Luca was doing, showcasing
that all the time, really being more vocal, challenging his teammates,
challenging me, and doing it in his own way. And
I think that's the true sign of MVP. His stats
speak for themselves. He's first in you know, a lot
(05:24):
of different categories. If it's not going to be this year,
it's going to be an eventual future in the near future.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Yeah, yo, Kitchen, Luca. This stuff's going to age. Well,
it's not going away. And one of the things I
love about sports is that it changes. The NFL now
is an offensive league. It's Andy Reid's league. It's not
Bill Belichick's league. The NBA used to be high flying dunks,
electric dynamic mid rain shooters. It's not. It's not it's European.
(05:54):
It's body angles, it's playing at your own pace. It's
Yo Kich and Luca Yok has his title Luca Yesterday.
J Mack. The one team he thinks that can beat
Denver is Dallas, and I don't know if he's wrong.
It's just a different league, and I like the change
in leagues. Baseball now is a faster game. I mean,
it used to be the strikeout was bad news in baseball.
(06:16):
Now it's the ground ball stuff changes. Embrace the change
because it's not going away. So Jared Goff, who I've
always been a fan of, is a number one pick.
The minute he got a good offensive line and a
coach in Detroit and LA with Andrew Whitworth and Sean McVay.
He's been excellent top ten since then. And now he's
(06:36):
a member of a losing franchise Detroit, And you know,
it's I've always had this feeling because I grew up
out West, but then I moved out East and I
liked it, but it was different, and I really noticed
the difference in the fans and the media. It's harsher
(06:57):
and so Jared Goff was recently talking about how the
Lions are now really good, but there's still negativity constantly
with a media in Detroit that covers them.
Speaker 5 (07:08):
I have this thing with our local media where like
they they almost like relish in negativity at times, and
maybe that's what gets clicks and that's what sells, but
it's it's it's no longer what they need to live in. Like, hey, guys,
like we have a good team, We've had success, Like
we can be happy about that. We can celebrate that
(07:30):
and not have to write about how it were constantly
the underdog. And I'm probably overthinking in my head just
because it's the chip on my shoulder and the the competitor.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
By the way, Jared Goff said that from his beach
house in Los Angeles, he's a happy kid. There is
a northern jet stream of negativity. I saw it for
ten years at ESPN. The weather's worse, you're scraping the windshield.
Everything's harder and cold weather, and you stay indoors Thanksgiving
to April because it's crappy outside. Go to Miami, Phoenix,
(08:05):
Las Vegas, Los Angeles, Houston, San Diego. If your team's bad,
you bail. You go outside. You have cocktails at four
point thirty, you surf, you do something. The malls. They're
even outdoor malls here. That's the reality of it. You
bail on bad teams now. I do think the advantage
to that northern negativity and intensity and tribalism is it's
(08:28):
kind of combative and it's kind of fun. Like I
think sports talk radio in your Chicago's and Cleveland's Detroit excellent.
Out Here, it's guy talk that teams aren't good. Let's
move on out there. You want to solve the issue
and yell about the issue. So there's a reason it's
called the Bills Mafia and not the Carolina Panthers mafia
or the Arizona Cardinals mafia. You know, studies indicate that
(08:51):
the more time you spend outdoors with nature, you live longer.
So but I will say Jared Goff's point is Detroit
has a history of lou Us and we know about
the lousy weather, and so I think it's a real thing.
I think it is hard when a bad culture suddenly
gets really good. I think Detroit, and I said this
last year, I think they're the younger version of the
(09:12):
forty nine ers stars everywhere. They're just not paid yet
and not quite as old. But I think toe to toe.
The two best rosters easily in the NFC easily are
San Francisco and Detroit. I like Green Bays. It's not
as good as the Lions. A lot of that's the
front office, a lot of that's trades, hitting on draft picks.
(09:33):
But I mean, you know it's funny about Detroit. My
wife's from Michigan. You know you listen to eminem. I
don't think optimism and hope. You know there is a
negativity that exists out there, and I saw it when
I lived out east. I feel it's much more laid
back and positive optimistic out west. Some of that is
because California teams have done well for the last decade,
(09:54):
but I think Jared Goff is onto something. You get
that bad weather, that intensity, you're indoors winner in spring.
You stick with your bad teams, you complain about them,
and and Golf's trying to say, guys, this is early
good team. We're not gonna lose anymore. Like there's gonna
be nothing but wins. And j Mack, I think you
and I both agree. I was hotter on the Lions
(10:14):
than you were, But I do believe that the next
seven to eight years, if you look at their roster,
their youth and the way they're drafting. Detroit's a winning
franchise now, and I mean a consistently winning franchise.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Yeah, seven eight years, maybe a little bit much, But
as someone who roots for a team that has been
steeped in futility for I don't know, three decades, of course,
Dared Goff is right. The Detroit media, all they know
is that the Lions stink. They're a laughing stock. They
can't do anything in the playoffs, so they're gonna be negative.
Like that's not just gonna change overnight. I'm a negative
(10:49):
Jets fan, right, Is there a positive Jets fan anywhere? Like,
there's nothing to be positive about. The team stinks, the
ownership stinks. Prove it to me, and otherwise I'm not
gonna be like positive about the Lion. Yeah, there's nothing
wrong with what goof sitting like.
Speaker 6 (11:03):
He's right.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Yeah, the Northern Jet stream of negativity is a very
real thing in sports.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
And listen, if the media is all chipper and everything's great,
the economy's humming, Like who's paying attention.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
To the media, right, Grievance sells.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
If it bleeds, it leads, you know, negativity death.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
All in the media does not talk about planes landing.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
Stock Market way up. You barely hear that it's all
market getting crushed.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
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Speaker 1 (11:41):
You are now entering the No Bull Zone sponsored by
Credible Great Rage. None of the bowls. So the Dynasty
was that ten part off the Jeff Benedict book, That
ten part documentary we saw in the winter early spring.
I liked it a lot. People said a not very
nice to Belichick. Vince will Fork Great Player, came out
(12:03):
recently and said, I don't think it was very fair
to Bill Belichick. I think it was. And here's why
he got credit. Belichick during the twenty year run more
than Brady did. We didn't call Brady the goat until
the Atlanta Super Bowl. And remember this, who gets credit
after a great dynasty is often what's the more interesting story,
(12:27):
who's nicer to the media. Very few people get both.
Tom Brady now gets much more credit. He left and
still won. He should get more credit he left and
Bill lost, But coaches that rule with an iron fist
may have their moment at the top of the mountain,
(12:47):
but they're not going to age well. They should probably
more often. Think about that. Bill Belichick cultivated, leaned into
a personality that was uncooperative, combative, and arrogant. Don't be
shocked if when you start losing, everybody's not giving you
(13:08):
the warm fuzzies. Bill leaned into uncooperative. Andy Reid is
going to age much more gracefully. He's much more of
a player's coach. He can joke with the media. He
doesn't go out of his way to be uncooperative. Look
at two great forty nine ers, Jerry Rice aging well
(13:30):
graceful too, isn't one was combative? One wasn't. Bobby Knight
and Belichick really sad at the end, sort of right,
you know who it's not sad for the zen Master,
Phil Jackson. Steve Kerr is aging well again. Andy Reid
(13:50):
is aging well. Abrasive, combative, uncooperative. It works when you're
at the top of the mountain. Aaron Rodgers, by the way,
is not aging well. He looks looney tunes people taking
shots to them. He's defensive all the time. You know
who's aging well? Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady got
(14:14):
along with people, so in the end, Belichick got what
he deserved. A lot of credit during his run, as
did Bobby Knight. But if you're lean into things that
are difficult, Brady always took time for the media right,
always took time dumb questions, didn't love him, relentless coverage
(14:38):
of the deflate gait, which remains wildly silly and overrated,
but he took time most of the time to address it.
Bill fought, battled, leaned into arrogant, never ever willing to cooperate. Well,
don't be shocked if it's an ugly final chapter for
the record, that's just not my opinion. Look at the
(15:01):
people that got hired seven openings, build didn't sniff them.
Look again, it does matter when you're going up the ladder.
Just remember, eventually, in sports, you'll go down that ladder too.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
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Speaker 7 (15:19):
Hey, we're Cavino and Rich Fox Sports Radio every day
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never have enough time to get to everything we want
to get to and that's why we have a brand
new podcast called over Promised. You see, we're having so
much fun in our two hour show. We never get
to everything, honestly, because this guy is over promising things
(15:39):
we never have time for. Yeah, you blubber lit lame
and me. Well, you know what it's called over promise.
You should be good at it because you've been over
promising women for years. Well, it's a Cavino and Rich
after show, and we want you to be a part
of it. We're gonna be talking sports, of course, but
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(16:00):
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It's gonna be the best after show podcast of all time.
Speaker 8 (16:10):
There you go, over Promising. Remember you could see on YouTube,
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get your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Uh, the bucks say Giannis is out. Just throw this
out for the regular season. That team is fascinating. And
did you notice this, j Mac, I'm not gonna spend
I'll talk about this later. So we know the Celtics
signed Jalen Brown, Max Steel, and we know they're gonna
sign Tatum here quickly, Max Steel. Just see they signed
(16:44):
Drew Holiday to four years, one hundred and thirty five million,
and they got poor Singis on the books for a
couple of years. So you see what Boston is doing.
If you watch what is happening in the NBA, ten
of the top eleven teams have no bench.
Speaker 6 (17:04):
Just the way.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
In fact, let me look this up.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
Let me look this up.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Ten of the bottom eleven bench scoring teams. Ten of
the eleven lousiest benches are playoff teams. You see what's
happening in the league. Now, spend your big money up top.
Spend it up top for the good teams. Do not
use the draft as a lottery hoping to win power Ball.
(17:30):
That's for the bad teams. Build your stars, big money,
pay all of them. Don't worry about your bench. And
when you get that late first round pick in the draft.
As a good team, draft a three or four year
college player that can come in lower ceiling and just
an adult. Christian Brown can adult at Kansas three years.
(17:54):
So what happens to Houston. They're buying lottery tickets. OKC
is buying lottery. They're looking for ceiling guys. Denver get
me a college guy. Miami Heat they get the UCLA kid,
three to four year player. So what you're doing now,
because there's almost no chance once you get past like
the thirteenth pick, to get a megastar in the NBA,
(18:15):
it's very rare, but it is interesting. What the Celtics
are doing is what Denver is doing, which is pay
your stars, don't worry about the bench. Go get an
older college player, lower ceiling that can come in mature
and can play.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
But you could argue the Celtics use the draft. Tatum
is homegrown, Brown is homegrown, and on Denver. Jokich and
Murray were both drafted by Denver. See, you've got to
hit on your high draft pick right, and then you
supplement them.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
We'll bring in saying there's two different models in the NBA.
The bad teams use the draft. They're taking flyers on
mega talents that they hope develop the successful. Good playoff
teams use the draft middle lower to go get experienced
college guys who were grown ups. They get out of
(19:06):
the development game. Rick Buker recently talked about how veteran
teams are going to start looking for older guys.
Speaker 9 (19:13):
If you're drafting and you're saying, this guy's going to
be part of our rotation, I think you're going to
see teams taking players that have spent more years in
college as a result, because you're asking a guy to
play a role and to play without the ball, and
the only guys that are capable of doing that are
guys that have been in college for a while and
had to go through the process, had to at some
(19:34):
point in their career. The reason they stayed in college,
they played, they were in college a number of years
before they went to the NBA is because they weren't
a star right from the beginning, so they know how
to play a role. They have that experience.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
It's just interesting. There's two models now, and the Boston
model is going to be I think it's going to
be the Denver model. Ten of the eleven bottom benches,
those are the playoff teams. Those are the good teams.
They don't care about beat. I don't care about it anymore.
They look at the Celtics now in Denver will look
at the draft as diversifying their portfolio. Houston, San Antonio
(20:11):
look at it as buying a powerball ticket. Look at
the bench scoring here. You know, it's like the good
teams don't have a bench. They're not worried about it.
They're just gonna draft guys that can play and make
him good. Now, they're not gonna worry about because guys
come out of the draft they're nineteen. Like the Warriors,
by the way, tried this. They tried it with Wiseman.
(20:34):
He couldn't play with the veteran players. So what do
they do. They go get Chris Paul. They draft guys
that can come in and play Kaminga. I like Kaminga,
but he doesn't feel like I don't trust Kaminga at
all in the playoffs. He's just not refined enough. And
that's with a good staff, smart coaches in Golden State.
Well some NFL stuff.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Next, be sure to catch live editions of The Herd
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Speaker 1 (21:00):
Danny Green fifteen years three, NBA championships. What's interesting he
got holding with the Spurs, the Raptors and the Lakers
closet to inside the game room with Danny Green, smart guy,
always love him. On the show. You know we talked
about that is that sometimes when you get a star
and you're not in a glamorous market like at Milwaukee,
and you may win, but you're like, we got to
(21:22):
make this move because players won't choose us. We got
to go trade for them. And I thought the Dame
Giannis thing would be better. The analytics tell you it's
not great. Are you surprised that Damon Giannis Danny has
not been a perfect fit. No.
Speaker 6 (21:43):
I think this year, I think a lot of people
expected better. But it's just the first year. Mind you.
There's been a lot of changes. There's been a lot
of injuries, guys coming and going. During the trade deadline,
they picked up different people. I don't think that they
don't fit. I just don't think that the defensive side
is producing the way they expect it. Yeah, and that's
the dude to the lack of Drew and the pieces
they've gotten around. You know, letting Drew go change your defense,
(22:06):
letting certain people go change your defense. So you know,
Jay Crowd is a guy that's had injuries. They don't
have a bunch of three and D guys. And now
Malie Beasley's been shooting the hell out of the ball. Defensively,
he's had to carry a load in that starting group
of guarding the perimeter because obviously they're a little bit smaller.
You know, Dame is not not the greatest, he's not terrible,
but he's just smaller. They have a smaller you know,
(22:27):
front court or back court with him, and then Pat
Bev he's a defender too, but he's smaller. So I
think that's where their weaknesses are. It's not the offense. Obviously,
the Dame can Scoreiannis, score Brooks and shoots it well.
They have good shooters around them. But defensively is where
they lack a lot of the discipline. And then with
the coaching change, you know that that mix things a
little bit harder. You know, mid season, you got it
(22:47):
thirty and thirteen, you have coaching change, probably change up
a whole offense trying to figure each other out. I
think it just needs more time. So I'm not that shocked,
but also think you have to you have to get
a little bit a great more grace period because of
the things that have happened this year with them.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
So I was saying to start the show that there
was a time my favorite first player was Doctor J
and we all loved Michael and it was the spectacular.
But analytics now are not about dunks and the spectacular.
They're about different things. The league's getting more European two
And by the way, when you play below the rim,
(23:22):
you age more gracefully. You start high flying, you crash
to the floor. John Wall, Dwight Howard, Blake, Griffin, Russell Westbrook,
Steph's thirty six looks like he could play forever. Luca
and Jokic, to me, those guys looked like they could
shoot those jumpers until they were forty four years old.
So I look at Luca and I look at the
(23:42):
European players, and I look at Jokic, and it's not
as aesthetically pleasing. It's not the NBA I grew up with.
I love it, but I look at those teams. Do
you see what's happening to the league where these guys
that kind of play more deliberately below the rim, analytics
superstars not that optically they're not jumping, high flying guys.
(24:06):
Do you see the change the NBA is moving to
more European and that Luka and Jokic maybe our magic
and Bird the next ten years.
Speaker 6 (24:18):
Yeah, I see it, But I also think it's never
gonna go like completely away from the American type of
basketball style of play. I guess you would say, quote
unquote of the athleticism. You still have guys like Anthony Edwards.
You still have guys like John Morant. Those guys are
still it is maybe if they can adapt an adjustment.
Some of them said their careers may not last as
(24:39):
long like a Dirk because they shoot the one legged fade,
which you don't have to be athletic to do. But
they're great players and I see them adapting to justin.
But yes, I have seen that the league has changed
some and going in that direction. Those guys are crafty.
They're pros at fifteen sixteen years old, so they have
really good fundamentals. They have really good touch, they have
high IQ. There's some smart, smarter, probably smarter than with
(25:00):
the American players for sure, because they've been doing it
so long and they have to be smarter, crafty because
they're not as athletic. Yeah, but I still see a
lot of that American style play happening because we have
so many dynamic superstars, so many guys that can do
not only be athletic, but can score too under the
rim and do this at Anthony Everards and John Morant,
those guys, I can still see them shakee SGA. I
(25:22):
see those guys still be able to score and adapted
adjustment when their athleticism isn't as high as it was
when they're younger. They'll blake. People say Blaker, but he
developed a jumper mid range, he shot some threes, and
in Detroit you play a different style of game. So
I can see guys adapt and adjusted as they get older.
But you know, people love that. The reason why they
sell out of tickets. People love to watch those type
(25:43):
of things. People want to see those type of things.
They want to see the athleticism, they want to see
the dunks, they want to see the fast breaks. Why
they change, you know, the take foul rule, the you know,
stopping the break for rule, because they want to see
more fast breaks and more points and more threes. So yeah,
I can't see as completely getting away from it.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Yeah, I've said I don't think the Lakers could beat Denver,
but I could argue they may match up better with
them than anybody, not name the Celtics. They're long. Leb
Ad at least makes Jokic work. He's such a dominating
defensive player, and he's been healthy now for a year
and a half. Lebron in any big series can take
(26:19):
over a game and create shots, and then they have
enough guys Austin Reeves, d Lo can hit a jumper.
I don't know if they can beat Denver. I look
at Denver and they don't have much of a bench.
Most good teams in this league don't they pay their
big guys up front. Yeah, do you think anybody in
the West, Like I think Okac is just too young?
(26:40):
I watched Minnesota last night, and I'm like, they kind
of match up with him. Is there a team that
you think forces Denver six or seven games or potentially
could beat him?
Speaker 6 (26:51):
I said, one on one, I agree with you. I
think Anthony Davis is the best one on one matchup
for jokicch And even then, Jokic kind of yeah, plays
pretty well against the Lakers. There's no one on one
match up for him in the league that you can
you know that that's going to stop him. I think
the best matchup you said Minnesota last night, but they
still are missing call Anthony Towns. Yeah. I think with
those two bigs, it gives Jokic the best look, and
(27:12):
I think they're the only team in the West that
gives him the best matchup.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (27:15):
Now, Lakers, they have good pieces. I don't think they
have that second big that they need to because Ad
is better playing away from the ball, off the ball,
a weak side having to guard Jokic and the gardener
Aaron Gordon a cutter a lot, but block shots on
the weak side. But he doesn't have that because they
have Jackson Hayes. But I don't know if that's enough. Yeah,
you know, the best times when we were able to
face them or play them all with Lakers, when we
(27:35):
had Jabelle McGee, Dwight Howard, we had multiple bigs that
we could throw at him and you know, play the
two big game to where two defensive bigs can make
it hard for him. The only team that I see
that that kind of immulates that is the Minnesota Timberwolves.
When they have Carlton Towns healthy. They need to get
him back sooner than later if they want to make
a good run in the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
I think Ifanis gets bounced early in the playoffs, he'll grumble.
I think Jalen Brunch better than I ever thought he
would be. I think Golden State would make a run
and move off all their young bigs. They give up
draft picks, Kaminga, they give up anything they're gonna keep,
probably Draymond's staff and pods if they can. But they'll
(28:14):
move off a lot. If let's say you were Yannis
and here come the Knicks, here come the Warriors, would
just stay in the East, which is weaker because I
do think if Milwaukee gets bounced, I mean Jannie is
moving through some coaches here, they don't have a lot
of draft picks. Boston looks like they're much better equipped
for the future. So is okay seeing Denver? If you
(28:36):
were a Yannis and you were unhappy, is there a place?
Because Brunson's better than I thought he would ever be.
I'm not social sure. I think New York and Yannis
makes sense.
Speaker 6 (28:45):
No, I think it makes more sense than Golden State.
They're a little bit younger. That have said us in
the East as more as wide open. The West is tough. Man.
If I'm one of those guys, I would not try
to say. I mean, some guys love the challenge. 'annest
is not getting a younger He has the issues with
the calf, the knee, and his ailments are coming along,
so when he's younger, it maybe different. Like I want
(29:07):
all the smoke. I want to get to the West
and play in the West Coast teams and try to
beat those guys. But he's already won with Milwaukee. He's
proven that he's a champion and done it with his
group in his city. So he's done what he's supposed
to do when he was in the city Milwaukee. He's
able to do that now figure out what he wants
to do and what's the best for him without the
city holding it against him. And I do think the
best place for him in the East would probably be
in the New York Knicks, honestly, But then you'd have
(29:29):
to let go of some guys. They can keep Jalen
og and him, you have to get rid of the
Julius Randall, Mitch Robinson, Hartstein, like, there's a lot of
pieces that you have to probably move in that deal.
That you don't want to get rid of because they
have a lot of great pieces there in New York.
But yeah, that would probably be the best fit for
him in the East.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Finally, Wemby again better than I thought. Another European played
against older players, so he walks into this league gets
really good, like Luca and Yokich. You know Luca was
by his twentieth game in this league, You're like, oh,
we got an elite scorer. Is Wemby better than you
thought he would be at this age? And at this time.
Speaker 6 (30:08):
I think, yes, all the people you just mentioned are
a lot better. I thought I knew jaylen Brunson was good.
I didn't think he'd be great, and I thought, you
know that, you know, the New York bright lights would
make it different. But Wemby, I think he has proven
a lot of people wrong because nobody expected this. A
lot of people thought Bobo. A lot of people thought
he was too tall and not agile enough to guard,
to pick and roll. But he's able to do it all.
He's able to guard, he's able to protect the rim,
(30:30):
he's able to shoot threes, play from the high post,
and to do it in such a short stint Man
is impressive. So it's this rookie year still and the
best is yet to come. So, yeah, he's exceeded my expectation.
He's way better than I expected him to be. And
I can't wait to see, you know, what his ceiling
is or what he gets to in the next couple
of years. He's probably gonna be the face of the league. Yeah,
the next three years or so.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Inside the green room with Danny Green. Three rings, three
different teams, fifteen years in the league. Good luck to you,
congrats and your success with your paw man.
Speaker 6 (31:01):
Thank you man, catch me inside the green room. I
appreciate you guys, all right,
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three eastern nine am to
noon Pacific. Find your local station for The Herd at
Fox Sportsradio dot com, or stream us live every day
on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin cowher
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go. It's a Thursday. We are live. It's
the Herd wherever you may be and however you may
be listening. Thanks for Megan, hows part of your day.
We got a lot of stuff going on as we
get closer and closer to the NFL Draft. But Jmack,
you have been very much pro Luca. Oh yeah, And
I think he's a great score. His style of platum,
(00:50):
I don't think it's mesmerizing. But I'm watching Luca and
Jokich last night the Denver Minnesota game. Those are really
good teams and I've come to a conclusion now. I
don't know if Luca's gonna win titles, but Dallas right
now is really good and Denver's already got a title.
But it did make me think about something about Luca.
(01:12):
I'm coming around, Oh on Dallas and Luca.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
Well, I just remind everybody a year ago at this time,
nobody believed in the Denver Nuggets. Oh, they hadn't proven anything, Yokich,
He's still got to do it in the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Yeah, so I was thinking about this. I was, you know,
sitting watching NBA late last night, late into the night,
and I saw a clip. You can't give Yo kicch
another MVP. Should have won last year would have been
his third straight. Should win this year? Hear Luca and
my take his Why not? There's only two players in
(01:44):
this league that are unstoppable every single game, Yo Kitchen Luca.
They were both great again last night, high IQ Europeans elite,
unstoppable scores, and unlike the windmill dunk guys, they actually
will age much better. They're not aesthetically pleasing, no high
(02:05):
flying dunks. They stay close to the floor, they move slowly, deliberately.
They are games about angles, thick body types. But the
basketball culture and basketball media loves the spectacular, and we've
had great players who are spectacular, Doctor J Michael Jordan.
(02:26):
But it's this constant promoting of Derrick Rose and Westbrook
and John Wall and John Morant. Guards that can't shoot, Yes,
they can jump, and the fanboys love them. Lob City. Wow,
what did they ever win? What did Westbrook Wall John
Morant show me the playoff wins? The best point guards
(02:49):
in the last fifteen years are guys that don't dunk.
Steph Curry and Chris Paul Smart can elevate others excellent shooters.
That's what I want point guard. These European stars are
not into selling shoes and they're not into the dunk contest.
They are into body angles, analytics, fewer dribbles, getting their
(03:13):
shot and you cannot stop jokicch and Luca and they've
got both ten plus years of elite scoring. I mean
jo kicch that game could last forever. It could last
like Brady into the forties and still be dominant. And
Luca again, he's not gonna get hurt. High fly and
windmill dunks. That's the downside to the highly vertical player players.
(03:35):
They age faster, they crash to the floor more. Where's
Lake Griffin, Where's John Wall, Where's Dwight Howard Russell? Westbrook
off the bench? Steph Curry's thirty six, He's still a
dominant player. Luca is gonna last for fifteen years. You're
gonna get fifteen years. I said this years ago. He
may end up being the first or second leading scorer
in league history. This game's gonna wear well. Yokich's game's
(03:57):
gonna wear well. The high flying dunk test guys, they
age really fast, and they just don't win enough in
the playoffs. Analytics matter, Spacing matters, angles matter. I grew
up in an NBA, and I loved a lot of
those players where it was about verticality and dunk contest.
(04:18):
Years ago, Lebron James just said, I'm not doing the
dunk contest, and I said he shouldn't. It's it's beneath him.
That was the old NBA. That's the seventies, eighties, early
nineties NBA. This NBA is slower, deliberate with its dominance players.
You can't speed Yo kitchup. You can't speed Luca up.
They're gonna do whatever they want to do, and they're
(04:38):
gonna age incredibly well. And you know Kyrie Irving last
night talking about Luca. I've always been a little bit
cooler on Dallas because I don't I don't see them
as a team. Luk or Kyrie. Can you win with
your two stars? Not really defenders. You got to have
some defenders around these guys. But the Mavericks are playing
better defense top five last time I checked, and that
net defensive rating. And Kyrie talk about Luca after the game.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
We knew how especially this year was going to be
just based on our practices, what Luca was doing, showcasing
that all the time, really being more vocal, challenging his teammates,
challenging me, and doing it in his own way. And
I think that's the true sign of MVP. His stats
speak for themselves. He's first in you know, a lot
(05:24):
of different categories. If it's not going to be this year,
it's going to be an eventual future in the near future.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Yeah, yo, Kitchen, Luca. This stuff's going to age. Well,
it's not going away. And one of the things I
love about sports is that it changes. The NFL now
is an offensive league. It's Andy Reid's league. It's not
Bill Belichick's league. The NBA used to be high flying dunks,
electric dynamic mid rain shooters. It's not. It's not it's European.
(05:54):
It's body angles, it's playing at your own pace. It's
Yo Kich and Luca Yok has his title Luca Yesterday.
J Mack. The one team he thinks that can beat
Denver is Dallas, and I don't know if he's wrong.
It's just a different league, and I like the change
in leagues. Baseball now is a faster game. I mean,
it used to be the strikeout was bad news in baseball.
(06:16):
Now it's the ground ball stuff changes. Embrace the change
because it's not going away. So Jared Goff, who I've
always been a fan of, is a number one pick.
The minute he got a good offensive line and a
coach in Detroit and LA with Andrew Whitworth and Sean McVay.
He's been excellent top ten since then. And now he's
(06:36):
a member of a losing franchise Detroit, And you know,
it's I've always had this feeling because I grew up
out West, but then I moved out East and I
liked it, but it was different, and I really noticed
the difference in the fans and the media. It's harsher
(06:57):
and so Jared Goff was recently talking about how the
Lions are now really good, but there's still negativity constantly
with a media in Detroit that covers them.
Speaker 5 (07:08):
I have this thing with our local media where like
they they almost like relish in negativity at times, and
maybe that's what gets clicks and that's what sells, but
it's it's it's no longer what they need to live in. Like, hey, guys,
like we have a good team, We've had success, Like
we can be happy about that. We can celebrate that
(07:30):
and not have to write about how it were constantly
the underdog. And I'm probably overthinking in my head just
because it's the chip on my shoulder and the the competitor.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
By the way, Jared Goff said that from his beach
house in Los Angeles, he's a happy kid. There is
a northern jet stream of negativity. I saw it for
ten years at ESPN. The weather's worse, you're scraping the windshield.
Everything's harder and cold weather, and you stay indoors Thanksgiving
to April because it's crappy outside. Go to Miami, Phoenix,
(08:05):
Las Vegas, Los Angeles, Houston, San Diego. If your team's bad,
you bail. You go outside. You have cocktails at four
point thirty, you surf, you do something. The malls. They're
even outdoor malls here. That's the reality of it. You
bail on bad teams now. I do think the advantage
to that northern negativity and intensity and tribalism is it's
(08:28):
kind of combative and it's kind of fun. Like I
think sports talk radio in your Chicago's and Cleveland's Detroit excellent.
Out Here, it's guy talk that teams aren't good. Let's
move on out there. You want to solve the issue
and yell about the issue. So there's a reason it's
called the Bills Mafia and not the Carolina Panthers mafia
or the Arizona Cardinals mafia. You know, studies indicate that
(08:51):
the more time you spend outdoors with nature, you live longer.
So but I will say Jared Goff's point is Detroit
has a history of lou Us and we know about
the lousy weather, and so I think it's a real thing.
I think it is hard when a bad culture suddenly
gets really good. I think Detroit, and I said this
last year, I think they're the younger version of the
(09:12):
forty nine ers stars everywhere. They're just not paid yet
and not quite as old. But I think toe to toe.
The two best rosters easily in the NFC easily are
San Francisco and Detroit. I like Green Bays. It's not
as good as the Lions. A lot of that's the
front office, a lot of that's trades, hitting on draft picks.
(09:33):
But I mean, you know it's funny about Detroit. My
wife's from Michigan. You know you listen to eminem. I
don't think optimism and hope. You know there is a
negativity that exists out there, and I saw it when
I lived out east. I feel it's much more laid
back and positive optimistic out west. Some of that is
because California teams have done well for the last decade,
(09:54):
but I think Jared Goff is onto something. You get
that bad weather, that intensity, you're indoors winner in spring.
You stick with your bad teams, you complain about them,
and and Golf's trying to say, guys, this is early
good team. We're not gonna lose anymore. Like there's gonna
be nothing but wins. And j Mack, I think you
and I both agree. I was hotter on the Lions
(10:14):
than you were, But I do believe that the next
seven to eight years, if you look at their roster,
their youth and the way they're drafting. Detroit's a winning
franchise now, and I mean a consistently winning franchise.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Yeah, seven eight years, maybe a little bit much, But
as someone who roots for a team that has been
steeped in futility for I don't know, three decades, of course,
Dared Goff is right. The Detroit media, all they know
is that the Lions stink. They're a laughing stock. They
can't do anything in the playoffs, so they're gonna be negative.
Like that's not just gonna change overnight. I'm a negative
(10:49):
Jets fan, right, Is there a positive Jets fan anywhere? Like,
there's nothing to be positive about. The team stinks, the
ownership stinks. Prove it to me, and otherwise I'm not
gonna be like positive about the Lion. Yeah, there's nothing
wrong with what goof sitting like.
Speaker 6 (11:03):
He's right.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Yeah, the Northern Jet stream of negativity is a very
real thing in sports.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
And listen, if the media is all chipper and everything's great,
the economy's humming, Like who's paying attention.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
To the media, right, Grievance sells.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
If it bleeds, it leads, you know, negativity death.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
All in the media does not talk about planes landing.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
Stock Market way up. You barely hear that it's all
market getting crushed.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noone Eastern non am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (11:41):
You are now entering the No Bull Zone sponsored by
Credible Great Rage. None of the bowls. So the Dynasty
was that ten part off the Jeff Benedict book, That
ten part documentary we saw in the winter early spring.
I liked it a lot. People said a not very
nice to Belichick. Vince will Fork Great Player, came out
(12:03):
recently and said, I don't think it was very fair
to Bill Belichick. I think it was. And here's why
he got credit. Belichick during the twenty year run more
than Brady did. We didn't call Brady the goat until
the Atlanta Super Bowl. And remember this, who gets credit
after a great dynasty is often what's the more interesting story,
(12:27):
who's nicer to the media. Very few people get both.
Tom Brady now gets much more credit. He left and
still won. He should get more credit he left and
Bill lost, But coaches that rule with an iron fist
may have their moment at the top of the mountain,
(12:47):
but they're not going to age well. They should probably
more often. Think about that. Bill Belichick cultivated, leaned into
a personality that was uncooperative, combative, and arrogant. Don't be
shocked if when you start losing, everybody's not giving you
(13:08):
the warm fuzzies. Bill leaned into uncooperative. Andy Reid is
going to age much more gracefully. He's much more of
a player's coach. He can joke with the media. He
doesn't go out of his way to be uncooperative. Look
at two great forty nine ers, Jerry Rice aging well
(13:30):
graceful too, isn't one was combative? One wasn't. Bobby Knight
and Belichick really sad at the end, sort of right,
you know who it's not sad for the zen Master,
Phil Jackson. Steve Kerr is aging well again. Andy Reid
(13:50):
is aging well. Abrasive, combative, uncooperative. It works when you're
at the top of the mountain. Aaron Rodgers, by the way,
is not aging well. He looks looney tunes people taking
shots to them. He's defensive all the time. You know
who's aging well? Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady got
(14:14):
along with people, so in the end, Belichick got what
he deserved. A lot of credit during his run, as
did Bobby Knight. But if you're lean into things that
are difficult, Brady always took time for the media right,
always took time dumb questions, didn't love him, relentless coverage
(14:38):
of the deflate gait, which remains wildly silly and overrated,
but he took time most of the time to address it.
Bill fought, battled, leaned into arrogant, never ever willing to cooperate. Well,
don't be shocked if it's an ugly final chapter for
the record, that's just not my opinion. Look at the
(15:01):
people that got hired seven openings, build didn't sniff them.
Look again, it does matter when you're going up the ladder.
Just remember, eventually, in sports, you'll go down that ladder too.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noone Eastern, not a im Pacific.
Speaker 7 (15:19):
Hey, we're Cavino and Rich Fox Sports Radio every day
five to seven pm Eastern. But here's the thing, we
never have enough time to get to everything we want
to get to and that's why we have a brand
new podcast called over Promised. You see, we're having so
much fun in our two hour show. We never get
to everything, honestly, because this guy is over promising things
(15:39):
we never have time for. Yeah, you blubber lit lame
and me. Well, you know what it's called over promise.
You should be good at it because you've been over
promising women for years. Well, it's a Cavino and Rich
after show, and we want you to be a part
of it. We're gonna be talking sports, of course, but
we're also gonna talk life and relationships. And if Rich
and I are arguing about something or we didn't have
enough time, it will continue on our after show called Promised. Well,
(16:00):
if you don't get enough Covino and Rich, make sure
you check out over Promised and also Uncensored by the way,
so maybe we'll go at it even a little harder.
It's gonna be the best after show podcast of all time.
Speaker 8 (16:10):
There you go, over Promising. Remember you could see on YouTube,
but definitely join us. Listen Over Promised with Cavino and
Rich on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Uh, the bucks say Giannis is out. Just throw this
out for the regular season. That team is fascinating. And
did you notice this, j Mac, I'm not gonna spend
I'll talk about this later. So we know the Celtics
signed Jalen Brown, Max Steel, and we know they're gonna
sign Tatum here quickly, Max Steel. Just see they signed
(16:44):
Drew Holiday to four years, one hundred and thirty five million,
and they got poor Singis on the books for a
couple of years. So you see what Boston is doing.
If you watch what is happening in the NBA, ten
of the top eleven teams have no bench.
Speaker 6 (17:04):
Just the way.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
In fact, let me look this up.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
Let me look this up.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
Ten of the bottom eleven bench scoring teams. Ten of
the eleven lousiest benches are playoff teams. You see what's
happening in the league. Now, spend your big money up top.
Spend it up top for the good teams. Do not
use the draft as a lottery hoping to win power Ball.
(17:30):
That's for the bad teams. Build your stars, big money,
pay all of them. Don't worry about your bench. And
when you get that late first round pick in the draft.
As a good team, draft a three or four year
college player that can come in lower ceiling and just
an adult. Christian Brown can adult at Kansas three years.
(17:54):
So what happens to Houston. They're buying lottery tickets. OKC
is buying lottery. They're looking for ceiling guys. Denver get
me a college guy. Miami Heat they get the UCLA kid,
three to four year player. So what you're doing now,
because there's almost no chance once you get past like
the thirteenth pick, to get a megastar in the NBA,
(18:15):
it's very rare, but it is interesting. What the Celtics
are doing is what Denver is doing, which is pay
your stars, don't worry about the bench. Go get an
older college player, lower ceiling that can come in mature
and can play.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
But you could argue the Celtics use the draft. Tatum
is homegrown, Brown is homegrown, and on Denver. Jokich and
Murray were both drafted by Denver. See, you've got to
hit on your high draft pick right, and then you
supplement them.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
We'll bring in saying there's two different models in the NBA.
The bad teams use the draft. They're taking flyers on
mega talents that they hope develop the successful. Good playoff
teams use the draft middle lower to go get experienced
college guys who were grown ups. They get out of
(19:06):
the development game. Rick Buker recently talked about how veteran
teams are going to start looking for older guys.
Speaker 9 (19:13):
If you're drafting and you're saying, this guy's going to
be part of our rotation, I think you're going to
see teams taking players that have spent more years in
college as a result, because you're asking a guy to
play a role and to play without the ball, and
the only guys that are capable of doing that are
guys that have been in college for a while and
had to go through the process, had to at some
(19:34):
point in their career. The reason they stayed in college,
they played, they were in college a number of years
before they went to the NBA is because they weren't
a star right from the beginning, so they know how
to play a role. They have that experience.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
It's just interesting. There's two models now, and the Boston
model is going to be I think it's going to
be the Denver model. Ten of the eleven bottom benches,
those are the playoff teams. Those are the good teams.
They don't care about beat. I don't care about it anymore.
They look at the Celtics now in Denver will look
at the draft as diversifying their portfolio. Houston, San Antonio
(20:11):
look at it as buying a powerball ticket. Look at
the bench scoring here. You know, it's like the good
teams don't have a bench. They're not worried about it.
They're just gonna draft guys that can play and make
him good. Now, they're not gonna worry about because guys
come out of the draft they're nineteen. Like the Warriors,
by the way, tried this. They tried it with Wiseman.
(20:34):
He couldn't play with the veteran players. So what do
they do. They go get Chris Paul. They draft guys
that can come in and play Kaminga. I like Kaminga,
but he doesn't feel like I don't trust Kaminga at
all in the playoffs. He's just not refined enough. And
that's with a good staff, smart coaches in Golden State.
Well some NFL stuff.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Next, be sure to catch live editions of The Herd
Weekdays and Noon Easter not a Empacific.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Danny Green fifteen years three, NBA championships. What's interesting he
got holding with the Spurs, the Raptors and the Lakers
closet to inside the game room with Danny Green, smart guy,
always love him. On the show. You know we talked
about that is that sometimes when you get a star
and you're not in a glamorous market like at Milwaukee,
and you may win, but you're like, we got to
(21:22):
make this move because players won't choose us. We got
to go trade for them. And I thought the Dame
Giannis thing would be better. The analytics tell you it's
not great. Are you surprised that Damon Giannis Danny has
not been a perfect fit. No.
Speaker 6 (21:43):
I think this year, I think a lot of people
expected better. But it's just the first year. Mind you.
There's been a lot of changes. There's been a lot
of injuries, guys coming and going. During the trade deadline,
they picked up different people. I don't think that they
don't fit. I just don't think that the defensive side
is producing the way they expect it. Yeah, and that's
the dude to the lack of Drew and the pieces
they've gotten around. You know, letting Drew go change your defense,
(22:06):
letting certain people go change your defense. So you know,
Jay Crowd is a guy that's had injuries. They don't
have a bunch of three and D guys. And now
Malie Beasley's been shooting the hell out of the ball. Defensively,
he's had to carry a load in that starting group
of guarding the perimeter because obviously they're a little bit smaller.
You know, Dame is not not the greatest, he's not terrible,
but he's just smaller. They have a smaller you know,
(22:27):
front court or back court with him, and then Pat
Bev he's a defender too, but he's smaller. So I
think that's where their weaknesses are. It's not the offense. Obviously,
the Dame can Scoreiannis, score Brooks and shoots it well.
They have good shooters around them. But defensively is where
they lack a lot of the discipline. And then with
the coaching change, you know that that mix things a
little bit harder. You know, mid season, you got it
(22:47):
thirty and thirteen, you have coaching change, probably change up
a whole offense trying to figure each other out. I
think it just needs more time. So I'm not that shocked,
but also think you have to you have to get
a little bit a great more grace period because of
the things that have happened this year with them.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
So I was saying to start the show that there
was a time my favorite first player was Doctor J
and we all loved Michael and it was the spectacular.
But analytics now are not about dunks and the spectacular.
They're about different things. The league's getting more European two
And by the way, when you play below the rim,
(23:22):
you age more gracefully. You start high flying, you crash
to the floor. John Wall, Dwight Howard, Blake, Griffin, Russell Westbrook,
Steph's thirty six looks like he could play forever. Luca
and Jokic, to me, those guys looked like they could
shoot those jumpers until they were forty four years old.
So I look at Luca and I look at the
(23:42):
European players, and I look at Jokic, and it's not
as aesthetically pleasing. It's not the NBA I grew up with.
I love it, but I look at those teams. Do
you see what's happening to the league where these guys
that kind of play more deliberately below the rim, analytics
superstars not that optically they're not jumping, high flying guys.
(24:06):
Do you see the change the NBA is moving to
more European and that Luka and Jokic maybe our magic
and Bird the next ten years.
Speaker 6 (24:18):
Yeah, I see it, But I also think it's never
gonna go like completely away from the American type of
basketball style of play. I guess you would say, quote
unquote of the athleticism. You still have guys like Anthony Edwards.
You still have guys like John Morant. Those guys are
still it is maybe if they can adapt an adjustment.
Some of them said their careers may not last as
(24:39):
long like a Dirk because they shoot the one legged fade,
which you don't have to be athletic to do. But
they're great players and I see them adapting to justin.
But yes, I have seen that the league has changed
some and going in that direction. Those guys are crafty.
They're pros at fifteen sixteen years old, so they have
really good fundamentals. They have really good touch, they have
high IQ. There's some smart, smarter, probably smarter than with
(25:00):
the American players for sure, because they've been doing it
so long and they have to be smarter, crafty because
they're not as athletic. Yeah, but I still see a
lot of that American style play happening because we have
so many dynamic superstars, so many guys that can do
not only be athletic, but can score too under the
rim and do this at Anthony Everards and John Morant,
those guys, I can still see them shakee SGA. I
(25:22):
see those guys still be able to score and adapted
adjustment when their athleticism isn't as high as it was
when they're younger. They'll blake. People say Blaker, but he
developed a jumper mid range, he shot some threes, and
in Detroit you play a different style of game. So
I can see guys adapt and adjusted as they get older.
But you know, people love that. The reason why they
sell out of tickets. People love to watch those type
(25:43):
of things. People want to see those type of things.
They want to see the athleticism, they want to see
the dunks, they want to see the fast breaks. Why
they change, you know, the take foul rule, the you know,
stopping the break for rule, because they want to see
more fast breaks and more points and more threes. So yeah,
I can't see as completely getting away from it.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Yeah, I've said I don't think the Lakers could beat Denver,
but I could argue they may match up better with
them than anybody, not name the Celtics. They're long. Leb
Ad at least makes Jokic work. He's such a dominating
defensive player, and he's been healthy now for a year
and a half. Lebron in any big series can take
(26:19):
over a game and create shots, and then they have
enough guys Austin Reeves, d Lo can hit a jumper.
I don't know if they can beat Denver. I look
at Denver and they don't have much of a bench.
Most good teams in this league don't they pay their
big guys up front. Yeah, do you think anybody in
the West, Like I think Okac is just too young?
(26:40):
I watched Minnesota last night, and I'm like, they kind
of match up with him. Is there a team that
you think forces Denver six or seven games or potentially
could beat him?
Speaker 6 (26:51):
I said, one on one, I agree with you. I
think Anthony Davis is the best one on one matchup
for jokicch And even then, Jokic kind of yeah, plays
pretty well against the Lakers. There's no one on one
match up for him in the league that you can
you know that that's going to stop him. I think
the best matchup you said Minnesota last night, but they
still are missing call Anthony Towns. Yeah. I think with
those two bigs, it gives Jokic the best look, and
(27:12):
I think they're the only team in the West that
gives him the best matchup.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (27:15):
Now, Lakers, they have good pieces. I don't think they
have that second big that they need to because Ad
is better playing away from the ball, off the ball,
a weak side having to guard Jokic and the gardener
Aaron Gordon a cutter a lot, but block shots on
the weak side. But he doesn't have that because they
have Jackson Hayes. But I don't know if that's enough. Yeah,
you know, the best times when we were able to
face them or play them all with Lakers, when we
(27:35):
had Jabelle McGee, Dwight Howard, we had multiple bigs that
we could throw at him and you know, play the
two big game to where two defensive bigs can make
it hard for him. The only team that I see
that that kind of immulates that is the Minnesota Timberwolves.
When they have Carlton Towns healthy. They need to get
him back sooner than later if they want to make
a good run in the playoffs.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
I think Ifanis gets bounced early in the playoffs, he'll grumble.
I think Jalen Brunch better than I ever thought he
would be. I think Golden State would make a run
and move off all their young bigs. They give up
draft picks, Kaminga, they give up anything they're gonna keep,
probably Draymond's staff and pods if they can. But they'll
(28:14):
move off a lot. If let's say you were Yannis
and here come the Knicks, here come the Warriors, would
just stay in the East, which is weaker because I
do think if Milwaukee gets bounced, I mean Jannie is
moving through some coaches here, they don't have a lot
of draft picks. Boston looks like they're much better equipped
for the future. So is okay seeing Denver? If you
(28:36):
were a Yannis and you were unhappy, is there a place?
Because Brunson's better than I thought he would ever be.
I'm not social sure. I think New York and Yannis
makes sense.
Speaker 6 (28:45):
No, I think it makes more sense than Golden State.
They're a little bit younger. That have said us in
the East as more as wide open. The West is tough. Man.
If I'm one of those guys, I would not try
to say. I mean, some guys love the challenge. 'annest
is not getting a younger He has the issues with
the calf, the knee, and his ailments are coming along,
so when he's younger, it maybe different. Like I want
(29:07):
all the smoke. I want to get to the West
and play in the West Coast teams and try to
beat those guys. But he's already won with Milwaukee. He's
proven that he's a champion and done it with his
group in his city. So he's done what he's supposed
to do when he was in the city Milwaukee. He's
able to do that now figure out what he wants
to do and what's the best for him without the
city holding it against him. And I do think the
best place for him in the East would probably be
in the New York Knicks, honestly, But then you'd have
(29:29):
to let go of some guys. They can keep Jalen
og and him, you have to get rid of the
Julius Randall, Mitch Robinson, Hartstein, like, there's a lot of
pieces that you have to probably move in that deal.
That you don't want to get rid of because they
have a lot of great pieces there in New York.
But yeah, that would probably be the best fit for
him in the East.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Finally, Wemby again better than I thought. Another European played
against older players, so he walks into this league gets
really good, like Luca and Yokich. You know Luca was
by his twentieth game in this league, You're like, oh,
we got an elite scorer. Is Wemby better than you
thought he would be at this age? And at this time.
Speaker 6 (30:08):
I think, yes, all the people you just mentioned are
a lot better. I thought I knew jaylen Brunson was good.
I didn't think he'd be great, and I thought, you
know that, you know, the New York bright lights would
make it different. But Wemby, I think he has proven
a lot of people wrong because nobody expected this. A
lot of people thought Bobo. A lot of people thought
he was too tall and not agile enough to guard,
to pick and roll. But he's able to do it all.
He's able to guard, he's able to protect the rim,
(30:30):
he's able to shoot threes, play from the high post,
and to do it in such a short stint Man
is impressive. So it's this rookie year still and the
best is yet to come. So, yeah, he's exceeded my expectation.
He's way better than I expected him to be. And
I can't wait to see, you know, what his ceiling
is or what he gets to in the next couple
of years. He's probably gonna be the face of the league. Yeah,
the next three years or so.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Inside the green room with Danny Green. Three rings, three
different teams, fifteen years in the league. Good luck to you,
congrats and your success with your paw man.
Speaker 6 (31:01):
Thank you man, catch me inside the green room. I
appreciate you guys, all right,
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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