3 & Out - Extend Ryan Poles, Training camp reports, Jeffery Simmons goes off

John dives into the 2023 trade that the Chicago Bears made with the Panthers and how it's been the gift that keeps on giving for the Bear and he gives his thoughts on if Ryan Poles should be getting an extension based on this trade alone. Next, John talks about how the media reads too much into training camp dust-ups and if anything should be made out of the "conversations" the Rodgers and Wilson have been having at Jets training camp. 

Later, John answers your questions during this episode's mailbag segment.

7:05 - Give Ryan Poles an extension

19:53 - Training camp reports

27:18 - Jeffery Simmons gets upset at a radio host

29:37 - Tyson Bagent talks his off-season

39:03 - Mailbag

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Episode Transcript

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Speaker 2 (02:00):
What is happening everybody, John Middlecough That would be me
three and out Podcasts. That would be this little old podcast.
You're listening to appreciate everyone who is hopefully you're doing good,
doing well out there in the real world. We're gonna
talk a little football because I talked about it a
little bit yesterday when I started recording the mail Bag,

(02:23):
because the story already broke. After I recorded the podcast,
DJ Moore signed this big extension, and then today I
started kind of googling just to remember exactly what the
trade was between the Bears and the Panthers, and I'm
gonna go out on a limb and think it has
a chance to be one of the greatest trades in

(02:44):
the history of professional sports, not the NFL, all of sports.
So I want to go over a little bit of that.
It's not even over yet. It's crazy what the Bears
have now because of that trade. Ryan Pouls I'm not
saying he should, but maybe he should get an extension
right now strictly based on the trade. Some things that

(03:07):
bother me in training camp, with the reports and the
things that go viral. I won't want to touch on that.
And then I saw a couple of clips yesterday, one
from Titan's training camp with Jeffrey Simmons and another with
Tyson Badget, the backup quarterback from Division fifteen who played
a little last year for the Bears, just had some
incredible audio moments and we got to play it today

(03:32):
on the show. And then of course the Middlecoff mail
Bag at John Middlecoff Fire in the mail Bag. Appreciate
everyone who has try to bang out your questions over
the next couple of weeks. Also subscribe to the podcast
if you listen on Collins YouTube, all of our content
is up there. And yeah, we'll just keep banging out
football podcasts. Have a guest coming on a contract negotiator

(03:52):
from the NFL for Friday to just basically do contract
for dummies to try to hammer out some questions in
regards to the way contracts work. But before we dive
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price is guaranteed. I would say Ryan Poll's tenure early
on was rocky. He made a trade that was pretty
embarrassing when he traded for Chase Claypool. But I don't
care who you look at. It could be Bill Walsh,

(05:19):
Bill Parcells, Bill Belichick. Everyone makes bad moves, obviously when
you don't have a you know, a long resume on
the job as the boss and you're new to a job,
A move early on in your career that's bad is magnified.
Right when Belichick would make shitty moves in twenty sixteen,

(05:40):
no one cares. It's like, well, I have won four
Super Bowls and plan I went a couple more and
we'll see in three more AFC Championship games. Right. So
Ryan Poles, I would say, has to quote dumb and
Dumber totally redeemed himself because I think there's a chance
that the Bears trade with the Carolina pay answers will

(06:01):
go down as the greatest transaction in the history of
American sports. I looked at it today. It is insane
and it got me thinking because yesterday, when I was
recording the podcast, I had already recorded the main part
of the podcast. When were starting the mailbag, news broke
about DJ Moore getting a massive extension. I mean, the
dude had ninety six catches, thirteen hundred plus yards and

(06:23):
eight touchdowns with I mean multiple different quarterbacks, most of
could not throw very well. What DJ Moore is a
stud he was part of the deal. And listen, anytime
you make a trade, even if it's for a great
player or a big draft day trade, there's luck involved.
I mean, let's face it, there is luck involved in

(06:45):
most transactions. I heard a story when I was in
Tahoe about Joe Lacup, the owner of the Warriors. Well,
he accumulated his wealth in the investing venture capital world,
and he was partners with some guys and they were
one of the first big investors into a little company
called Google. And at the time Google, I don't know

(07:08):
if they were quite a company based out of a garage,
but they were closer to that than what they are now.
And they were not some can't miss home run. And
from my understanding, that transaction netted them well over half
a billion dollars and the investment a couple million dollars.

(07:29):
Whatever it was, it's an all timer. And even when
you hear these stories, like even if you believe in
what you're doing, it's hard to think about the best
best case scenario. And I think when you look at
the Chicago Bears, it was an easy trade for them
to make because they were essentially getting three first round picks.

(07:50):
They were swapping to nine, they were getting the following
year's first round pick, and they were getting DJ Moore,
which Ryan Pohle said we valued as a first round pick,
which I would agree with him because when they traded
for him, now, they gave him an extension, he was
already under his second contract, so he was a cost
controlled player. I mean, they just gave a guy an extension.
He has two more years on his deal, so they're

(08:11):
getting out ahead of it. They also received two second
round picks won that first year and then another one
coming in twenty twenty five. But if you look at
it from the Carolina standpoint, they traded for Bryce Young,
that's their asset. They got Bryce Young, who I've heard
is having a pretty solid camp, and listen, I'm not
trying to act like he's got no shot, but if

(08:33):
you watch him his rookie year, the size. Even if
you think he can get better at playing and they
do a better job coaching around him, it's just hard
to envision a guy five to nine. You know, Bucks
seventy five got if you weighed in at two hundred
at the combine, I think that was minimum fifteen pounds
of fake weight. So I'll give him one to eighty
four to be some high end, top fifteen player. But

(08:58):
the Chicago Bears now officially with extending DJ Moore. Here
is what they netted from that trade when they traded
back to nine. They actually then did another trade with
the Philadelphia Eagles just from nine to ten and selected
the guy clearly they would have taken at nine, and
they got a fourth round pick, which they used this year.

(09:19):
They drafted Darnell Wright, who started seventeen games for them
at right tackle. I'm not acting like he's the next
Lane Johnson, but based on his rookieyear is pretty good.
And anytime you get a starting tackle that's a win.
Well obviously because of They also had a second round
pick last year, which they traded up a couple spots

(09:44):
and got Tyreek Stevenson, who started sixteen games for them,
across from their All Pro Pro Bowl corner Jalen Johnson.
So they got a starting tackle and a starting corner.
That's just year one. Then, because the Panthers couldn't have
any worse, it led them to get Caleb Williams. And
let's remove the corner, the right tackle and Dj Moore.

(10:08):
There is not a team in the history of football NFL, AFL, UFL, XFL, USFLL,
any European leagues who would trade Caleb Williams for Bryce Young.
The Panthers obviously last year would have taken Caleb Williams

(10:28):
if he had been eligible to come out. We all
said it two years ago. If Caleb Williams could have
been in that draft, he would have been number one overall.
Bick so they got an inferior player if it was
just one to one, But the Bears already accumulated right tackle,
starting corner, Dj Moore, and now Caleb Williams. But because
of that trade with the Eagles going back one spot,

(10:50):
they had an extra twenty twenty four fourth round pick,
and they took a punter. Who listen, anytime you draft
a kicker or punter, great unknown because a lot of
undrafted guys at those positions come on to be great players.
This guy was the right guy winner, So who knows.
But if they get their starting punter, their starting quarterback,

(11:11):
starting right tackle, starting left corner or right corner, depending
on the day which angle you're at, and DJ Moore.
But we're not done yet. We're not done. The trade
is not over. They still have a twenty twenty five
second round pick coming. I think if most of us

(11:31):
were being objective, no bias, right, not a Panther fan,
not a Panther hater, not betting on it or whatever,
if we say, where are the Panthers this season most
likely to be? Drafting one through ten, eleven through twenty,
or twenty one through thirty two, I think if we
did a poll, like one of those political polls, but

(11:55):
one that actual people that you know participated in, I
think the overwhelming majority of people would pick in the
top ten. So if you're drafting in the top ten,
that means your second round pick is usually pretty good.
I was watching Giants hard knocks the other night. I
guess last night. Well, part of sucking and having a

(12:17):
top ten pick means you draft high in the other rounds.
So it's a great benefit. Because now, granted they use
their second round pick to get Brian Burns pick thirty nine,
but they had another second round pick. I have to
go look up where it came from. But my point
is when you stink. This is why I've always defended
when good teams have a rough year or two drafting.

(12:40):
You do know it's difficult drafting pick twenty eight, which
also means you're drafting at the end of every round,
so you are getting the shittiest player in theory in
each round. It is difficult. It is way easier to
be drafting seventh and then carry over through the rounds.
You should have a good draft. If you don't, that's

(13:01):
on you. It's why once you're good and you have
good drafts like Veach like, you get extra credit cause
you're not exactly swimming in the deep end on that
most of the talent is off the board by the
time your selection comes around. So listen, there's luck involved
in this. Even though based on what they were getting,

(13:22):
it was so much they had to say yes, I
would say this could not have gone any better, and
it could not be going that much better. If Kayleb
Williams becomes a top ten quarterback, I would say regardless
of these other players, you could argue it's one of
the great trades ever. If Darnel Wright is their right
tackle for the next eight nine years, If Dj Moore

(13:46):
continues to produce as he's been producing his entire career
with random quarterbacks, if Tyreek Stevenson continues to just start
at corner one of the most important positions on the field,
If the dude they draft in the fourth round is
just their hunter, and if they get anything out of
this twenty twenty five second round, I don't see how
it's humanly possible to do more in a trade. I

(14:10):
think this will easily go down as the greatest trade,
not in NFL history, in American history. Maybe there have
been more transcendent trades. Babe ruth Right was once traded,
Joe Montana was traded. Bigger individual names at the time
were traded, but just in terms of a totality of

(14:33):
what you accumulated for the number one overall pick. Ryan
pol should get an extension off this alone. He really should.
I mean, I don't know how it gets any better
from from a general manager. I really don't. If I
was an owner, I would extend them right now, just
based on looking at the information we have, based on

(14:55):
the trade, and that's gotta be one. And David Tapper, listen,
he's in the invested in world, he's all time stock trader.
You're not gonna win them all. But it's tough when
you swing and whiff on something like this. This one
is gonna be hard to shake. It's easy to go. Well,
it's water under the bridge, you know it's it's sunk

(15:16):
cost Not sunk costs are all the same, right, not
not sunk costs are all equal. It's one thing. If
you walk in you're like, God, I bought a bunch
of chicken from Costco. It's all rotten. Whatever he's spent
fifty bucks, remodel your whole house, have the roof leak
and ruin your entire floor. A little different. I would say,

(15:39):
they don't parallel each other, and I would put this
under one of those disastrous sunk costs. One thing that
drives me nuts are hamp reports that gain a lot

(15:59):
of and listen. I'm not anti all these reporters at practice.
I've done it forever, tweeting about what's going on. It
is entertaining and it's fun. Where I do have a
gripe is the things we pick and choose, and I
understand the way social media works. There was a video
yesterday of Aaron Rodgers and Garrett Wilson on the field

(16:22):
which what looked like after a team drill, and they were,
you know, Garrett Wilson was kind of screaming out of
and Rodgers was giving it back and everyone's like, what
does this mean? Sometimes it happens when a coach I saw,
was it George Pickens the other day? This is probably
before Pats came on, was getting into it with a
position coach. You know what this is called guys football,

(16:47):
It's called football to me. Controversial things in training camp
are like what's going on with Matt Judon or they
had to tell him to leave the practice field. That's
a problem. Coaches yelling at players, players yelling at coaches,
players yelling at each other is called training camp. So

(17:10):
I saw this like, nothing is dumber to me than
making a big deal about people getting it into it
on the sideline during practice, it's really hot. You're grinding
it out. Especially in I would say most levels of football,
high school, college, bro the offense is typically slow. It's

(17:34):
usually not on the same page where the defense has
a massive advantage, so your offense gets frustrated. Like I said,
welcome to the sport. Here's another one. And I saw
this because probably a disproportioned amount of things that I
follow are content creators for the forty nine ers. And

(17:55):
this was a big, big deal last year because people
are like, are we sure brock Perty should be us starter?
Give Trey Lance a shot. Turned out, Trey Lance was
never even to win the second string quarterback, But every
interception that happened in practice, you would have felt like
it was a fourth quarter of a playoff game. It's like, guys,
you do realize that interceptions for starting quarterbacks established starting

(18:20):
quarterbacks are completely irrelevant. It's kind of like spring training
in baseball when you see starters give up a lot
of home runs. In Arizona, it happens a lot. Partly
the ball flies here, but the other thing is sometimes
the starter after the game would be like you gave
it four home runs? Like, yeah, I was only throwing fastballs.
I was just working on my fastball location, and I

(18:43):
see this with Brock pretty throw some picks. It's like, well, yeah,
he could check the ball down every single play in practice, McCaffrey,
or work on his timing and push the ball down
the field. And in July, if you're gonna throw some interceptions,
and this goes for a Dak Prescott, a Kirk Cousins,

(19:04):
you name it. No one really nitpicks like a Mahomes
if he throws picks in practice, or even Josh Allen
or Lamar at this point. But there is the group
of other guys. Derek Carr, if you are a one
hundred percent lock starter week one interceptions in training camp,
do not Matt Nobody cares. Now. If you just threw

(19:27):
a pick every single play, you couldn't function as a team.
There was one stretch. Might have been Jimmy Garoppolo's might
have been the year they went to the Super Bowl
in twenty and nine nineteen. It could have been twenty
one at lose track of time. Might have been after
that twenty one. Well, I think he threw four straight
interceptions in practice and two of them were pick sixes

(19:48):
and do you know what happened? Jimmy Garoppolo is starting quarterback?
And when the dust Hittle, do you know what happened?
Forty nine ers were in the playoffs. And I just think, listen,
practice is about working on things, developing, timing. It's no
different than spring training with the pitchers. You should not
be perfect in practice. And like I said, it's well documented.

(20:10):
I saw Jim Harbaugh talking about this the other day.
It's pretty well established. Defenses are way ahead of offenses
in high level college football and definitely in the NFL. Now,
I just some of the stuff that gets made a
big deal is pretty laughable. Now. I did see a
couple of clips throughout the last twenty four to forty

(20:32):
eight hours that I thought just were incredible. And one
thing I miss in sports this usually happen a lot
in baseball is their managers would throw some legendary tie rates.
Remember how McCrae has one, Lesorda has a bunch, Leland
has some good ones. They don't really exist anymore, and
I missed that, And it's kind of sad. The NBA

(20:54):
used to have huge personalities with their coaches and they
used to just get in a lot of tussles with
the press, and it's kind of it doesn't happen as
much anymore now it's more over social media. And I
get being a player if you were young and seeing
just like overweight radio host. Well, let's just go to this.

(21:14):
This is Tennessee Titans and Jeffrey Simmons, who I was.
I was texting with the buddy on the staff. He's like,
it is stupid. How good this guy is. When he
tries on a given play, we have no shot to stop.
I mean, he's one of the best defensive linemen in
the league. And to put this in context, I can't.
I don't follow Tennessee radio. I don't know what was tweeted. Honestly,

(21:37):
I don't care. This was just incredible.

Speaker 1 (21:41):
Well, Jeff, do you want to sit down. We can
talk whatever you want to talk, Jeff. We'll deal with
that later. Roger McCreary sitting down with us here on
one oh four five is on, Jeff. I mean we're
on the air right now. Social media, I'm right here, Jeff.
We can talk anytime you want to. Unbelievable. We gotta

(22:04):
make that happen. Well, we'll deal with that later on
Roger McCreary sitting down with us here on one O
four to five to zone. Jeff, if you want to
sit down and talk about this, we can talk about this.
I'm talking to you right here, Jeff. We tried to
talk to you last week. I'm being rude to Roger.
Will deal with you later. Roger, what's going on.

Speaker 3 (22:26):
It's good.

Speaker 4 (22:26):
Don't get I don't get it.

Speaker 1 (22:29):
How was the day of practice? First patted practice?

Speaker 2 (22:31):
I mean his teammates sitting down, he is taking collateral. Uh,
just friendly fire everywhere, just just a disaster. You got
the radio host and listen. I have been in this situation.
I would guess that that radio station has the Titans games.

(22:53):
When I worked at in the Bay Area, we had
the Raiders games. So if you were being critical and
stuff during training camp, they set you up right there
like we were right on the field. And social media
probably then fourteen fifteen sixteen kind of range was a
little different than it is now. It's probably way more

(23:13):
powerful now, but it could be a little awkward. But
I do appreciate, like I'm a sucker for a good
radio host and a player that know each other through
the the airwaves, the podcast waves, social media seeing each
other in person and just kind of screaming it out.

(23:33):
And I saw that Jeffrey Simmons has apologized said that
it was out of character, and I guess they hashed
it out. I just I want more of that. I
missed that. Some of my greatest memories as a young
sports fan were just was mayhem. I mean, one of
the most legendary clips of all time is Jim Rome

(23:56):
with Chris Everett or Jim Everett, and he kept calling
him Chris Eft and Jim Everett, who clearly was a
big m effort, basically picked up Jim Roman slammed into
the ground. But I just think we need more of that,
we really do. I thought I was gonna have that,
actually the combine when day Ball got on the the
elevator with me, but we didn't even say a word.

(24:18):
I was I was buckled up, I was ready. I
was like, I'm gonna get it right now. Not physically,
but I thought he was gonna be pissed, which is right.
I said what I said, which was factual. And by
the way, Dave Ball looks fantastic right now, I mean fantasy.
He's got to be on ozembic. He claimed pilates, but
you I just can't lose that much weight. And listen,

(24:38):
I'm not anti ozemic or whatever. I'm someone who's you know,
battles a little bit, trying to eat a little healthy
so props a dayball. He really looks just he looks great.
But this might have been one of the best things
I've ever heard last year, Like the overwhelming majority one
hundred percent of sports fans, unless you went to shit

(25:00):
Ippard College or worked in as an NFL scout currently,
you had never heard of this human Tyson Badge. And
he ended up playing, and he actually started the game
beat the Raiders, which I'm pretty sure did in Josh
McDaniels because he got fired the next day. But this
is a player who I don't know much about because

(25:20):
he's you know, he's not one of those guys you
watched through college. He just learned about him when he
got to the NFL and he was asked about competing
kind of for a backup job and gave one of
the greatest answers of all time.

Speaker 4 (25:32):
Yeah, you know, I didn't really think too much about it.
I was too busy grinding my absolute face off in
the offseason. But whatever they were going to do. You know,
that's completely up to them. I can't control that, but yeah,
I was just excited to come back. Whoever was going
to be in the QB room was going to be
in the QB room. I was nothing was going to
change on my end though, But yeah, I mean, like

(25:53):
you said, it feels good to know that they have
some you know that they have confidence in me, and
that you know that they like I was able to
do last year and hopefully they're being able to see
the strides that I've made in the off season and
going into year.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
Two was the hardest brinding your face off thing that
you did.

Speaker 4 (26:09):
June nineteenth, shout out to my one of my best friends,
Derek Gallagher one mile Burbie broad jump, hour and seven minutes.
Let's go a mile Burbie broad jump. Burbie broad jump
one mile. I don't know. I ate a lot after that.

(26:31):
After that, I went to Betty's shout out to Sheppardsound,
West Virginia, to Betty's restaurant. I think I just got
six eggs and bacon with some toasts. I might not
be getting better necessarily at football when I'm doing a
workout like that. However, just the mental edge that it
gives me finding out, you know, what I can endure
versus what the next man can endure in a sense,

(26:53):
gives me a little mental edge. When I show up
to things like this and people start complaining about our schedule,
I can kind of have somewhere in the back of
my head that I've done things far worse than this
that I can handless really kind of anything that's thrown
at me and be able to just keep the main
thing the main thing, let it flow off the shoulders,
and just kind of, you know, react to what happens next.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
One thing I think I'm going to attempt to do
because I get asked a like what do you do?
And I used to try to like give a long spiel,
like you know, I used to work in radio. Now
I'm in the podcast business, and they're like, what would
you sell? I'm like, now I host podcasts, and over
the last couple of years, you just get more secure.
You're like, I'm a podcast, right. I just say that.

(27:35):
I think when someone asked me what I do for
a living, I'm just gonna say, grind my face off.
I can't even imagine doing a mile of Burpie Rod jumps.
He said he did it in an hour. And there's
a guy who's in the NFL. I wonder if you
took just a random guy like me, you know, mid

(27:58):
late thirties, decent goes to gym, how long I could
it would take me to accomplish that? How many times
I would throw up? If I would even be able
to move? If it took an NFL athlete of Burpie
Ron jobs an hour, do you think what would be
the over under for just a random non professional athlete

(28:21):
who just goes to the gym in decent shape to
accomplish that hour and a half two? I can't even
fathom the pain you would feel in your legs, Your
heart might explode, you wouldn't be able to breathe. And
like you said, does it help me a football? Like?

(28:41):
Not directly, it doesn't help me read a defense or
make a better throw, but mentally and I totally agree,
that feels like something that Seal Team six would do,
or you would have to do for Seal Team six
to even give you a shot to be on the squad.
Where would you even think about that? Where would someone

(29:02):
come up? We're gonna go a mile burpie broad jumps,
and obviously a burpie is just down and up essentially,
and uh, I think you kind of had a push
up or not. But in the broad jump, I'm speechless,
I really am. I think that's that's one of the

(29:22):
greatest achievements of non like actual sports, like not like
a golfer or tennis or football, rugby or whatever, like
a real sport, just a CrossFit type workout I've ever
heard of. I truly believe that that is a remarkable accomplishment.
Other than that, we're gonna have Jake Rosenberg, who used

(29:48):
to be one of Howie's right hand men, on the
pod tomorrow. We're just gonna we're gonna call it contracts
for Dummies, because I, like most of you, get really
confused with dead money cap bonuses. Like how it all works.
It's very simple. In baseball and basketball, it's like, hey,
we just sign Hi two hundred million dollars. He gets

(30:10):
forty million dollars a year. We signed him to do
a three year, one hundred million dollars deal. In baseball,
he can opt out it for two years. This year
he makes twenty five, Next year he makes thirty five.
And like I follow that last year he makes thirty
if he opts in football, you just never truly know
what's going on. So we will discuss that. And other
than that, I did see something crazy yesterday on Instagram.

(30:31):
You know sometimes you're scrolling Instagram. It's crazy that their algorithms,
how they work. Right. I'll get something with a dog,
it'll make me laugh or cry. Then I'll get some
highlight package from you know, nineteen ninety six of Barry Sanders,
which I'll just be glued to for like four minutes.
And then I'll get like Joe Rogan discussing drumsticks the

(30:52):
ice cream, and I had never seen this, and it
really made me question myself, is that someone took one
of those drumsticks, which I would say, over under drumsticks
I've had in my life, probably closer to one hundred
than it is fifty. They left it out all night, right,
if you leave ice cream, I'm mad enough to admit,

(31:14):
as you know, a struggling, skinny, fat guy. I've ordered
ice cream on door Dash before. I don't want to
go to cold Stone or Basket Robbins or whatever. And
you almost have to do the express to even give
yourself a chance is the ultimate lazy move to hope
it's not too melted and you don't have to put
it into the freezer for extra ten to fifteen minutes
because it kind of melted. But ice cream melts means

(31:34):
that's what happens. But these people, or this guy ran
an experiment. He left a drumstick out all night. Actually
it was twenty four hours, and you know how the
nuts are on the chocolate on top of the cone,
and he cut it and the ice cream hadn't melted.
And I guess on the drumstick box, to consider something

(31:57):
ice cream, it has to have like ten percent of
milk fat or whatever. And they don't even consider an
ice cream. And I started thinking to myself, Holy moly,
how bad all the drumsticks I've eaten. I mean, my
parents used to get them for us when we were kids.
You go to sleepovers, someone have like two boxes of drumsticks,
you like three your buddies, and you just you'd cash

(32:18):
both boxes by nine o'clock at night. Turns out I was,
I was telling Maria. Then it really got me thinking,
remember those anyone that is kind of similar to my age,
the lunch a bulls, which are basically Charcouteri for little kids.
But then they also created the pizza one. You know,
the pizza that they give you like three four little pizzas.

(32:39):
They give you some pepperoni, some cheese, and some sauce.
I mean, I can't even imagine what was in those things.
And I used to house those in like sixth seventh
grade all the time. But keep your head on a
swivel when you're eating. Man. Okay, let's dive into a

(33:04):
little thing that we like to call the middle cough
mail bag at John Middlecoff. At John Middlecoff is the
Instagram handle fire in those dms. Get your question answered
here on the show, really really easier to do. Start
with Chris, John, Stick to your gut and don't do

(33:26):
the big bet on the Chargers to make the playoffs
at plus one ten or whatever it is. You will
regret it if it doesn't hit. If Herbert gets injured,
the bet is dead. If you're gonna go to do
some future bets, it has to be high odds. I
won the Bucks plus eight point fifty to win the

(33:46):
division last year, and they are plus three twenty five
this year. Obviously, the Falcons can win it, but the
real odds are much better than the implied odds of
them winning it. If you want lower odds, the Bills
are plus one sixty five to win the division, a
much better bet than the Chargers. Well, the Chargers. Part

(34:09):
of it is my admiration for old Jim Harbaugh. I
loved the Bills, and I looked before I read that question.
Two bets that I like a lot are over ten
and a half wins for the Bills plus one point thirty.
So if you bet five grand, you'd win eleven to

(34:32):
five for them to win the division. On DraftKings Promo
co John, it's actually plus one point eighty. So if
I bet five thousand dollars on them to win the
AFC East, which they have done a lot, I think
four straight years. I think the Patriots in twenty eighteen

(34:54):
when they played the Chiefs had won the division ten
straight years. So we've seen in this division one team
with the best quarterback dominate it plus one eighty. If
I bet five thousand dollars on that, it would pay
fourteen k You're right, I mean, there are some risk
involved with Jim Harbaugh in the sense of the roster,
but I just believe in what I've seen out of

(35:16):
the guy. But you could argue the Bills a little
bit of a safer bet. I want to do larger
bets on something I feel good about. Chargers definitely has
some risk in it. I think the Bills a lot
lower risk. But when you use the example of if
Herbert goes down, well, I can say the same thing
for Josh Allen. You could say the same thing if

(35:37):
you took the Ravens to win the division and Lamar
goes down obviously last year with the Bengals, So you
just got to keep your fingers crossed with a star quarterback.
You know, if Patrick Mahomes went down, are the Chiefs
winning that division? I don't think they would. With Carson
Wentz question for the mailbag, I agree with you about

(35:59):
Tua not deserving to be paid like the rest of
the top quarterbacks in the league. He definitely is not
on that level. However, you said that if Tua was
to hit the open market, there wouldn't be teams bitting
against them. Maybe not a lot of teams, but definitely
a few. I personally think teams like Seattle would be

(36:20):
a great spot for Tua. It would get him out
of the AFC and back to the West Coast. He
would have to go to Snowy. He wouldn't have to
go to snowy road playoff games as often. And I
think the cast of characters that Seattle has on offense,
it would be exciting. We've seen two would be able
to get the ball to playmakers, something I think Gino

(36:42):
can lack. You've said that Dak can get hot and
go on a run and the Cowboys could have a
chance at the Super Bowl. Why couldn't Tua. Well, I
think Dak's is a better player. I've seen Dak in
high leverage games against good teams in November and December
and play well. I saw him play awesome outside against
the Eagles late in the season last year. We have

(37:05):
seen Dak excel late in the season. Now he's older.
I just think Dak, just by every metric, is just better.
He's bigger, better arm. Not that Dak has a great arm.
You could argue they're similar arms. He's definitely more mobile.
I just think he's a better player now. I never
said that no one would want him. My point is,

(37:28):
who's bitting against them at that price? Right? If you
go to CarMax right now, and you find I don't
know two people want the same car. Well, if one
guy's willing to pay seventy grand and the other guys
be like, hey, I'll give you a fifty grand. Like,
there's a big difference, right, that's a large percentage from

(37:51):
seventy to fifty. That's my point is like our teams,
teams would be lined up, Seattle would give him one
hundred and eighty or seventy million dollars guaranteed. I don't know, man,
you're telling me. John Schneider, who pounded the table, think
of the quarterbacks John Schneider likes. I actually disagree with

(38:12):
that one. He loved Russell Wilson. Well, Russell Wilson had
a big arm and it was really mobile. He wanted
a trade with the Browns. Remember when he offered Russell
Wilson and Russell refused because he wanted Josh Allen. John
Schneider had an affinity for Drew Locke in the trade.

(38:34):
Why Drew Lock's got a big arm. He's not the
caliber of players those other guys, But look at the
type Geno Smith has a big arm. I don't think
two was John Schneider's type player at all. And the
other thing is Mike McDonald being a defensive guy, would
he go does to a scare me if I'm game

(38:55):
playing against because that's how he would look at it
in the evaluation. So again not saying no team would
be interested in him. He's a starting quarterback in the
NFL and there's value there, but Seattle, I would not
have them near the top. I hope you're doing well.
Thanks for providing us with content on a regular basis.
Wanted to get your opinion regarding who you think the

(39:16):
favorite for the awards next year, specifically Coach of the Year.
Well who won it last year, Stefanski. Coach of the
Year can be a little bit of a challenge because
it's either a team that you think is gonna suck
that then is good day Ball a couple of years ago,
or a team like the Browns who made the playoffs

(39:38):
with Joe Flacco. So to me, you can never guess
in that scenario when something weird happens and the team
maintains being good, like if Josh Allen missed two months
and the Bills still won eleven games, McDermott would get it,
but you can't foresee that gambling before the season. So

(39:58):
I would argue your best bet would be to pick
a team who no one thinks gonna be that good,
like the Saints. What if the Saints won twelve games
this year. I'm not saying they will, I'm just giving
a hypothetical, like Dennis Allen have a pretty good chance,
or if the Arizona Cardinals won ten. I think you
have to look at a team that people don't think
is gonna be in the playoff mix or be in
the playoffs, and go, what if this team's in the playoffs?

(40:22):
Offensive Player of the Year, MVP, Rookie of the Year,
comeback Player of the year. I would say player, comeback
player of the year. If Rogers is solid, he's gonna
get it tearing his achilles Like to me, it's got
him written all over it, even more than Joe Burrow,
because Rogers missed the entire I mean, played three or
four or five snaps whatever it was the other ones.

(40:45):
I mean it's the MVP. Your best bet is typically
a quarterback, right, so mahomes Lamar or Josh Allen probably
the safest bets. Maybe Jalen Hurts. I mean they're pretty
loaded on offense. If he were to throw thirty five
touchdowns or account for forty, maybe throw thirty run for
another ten in order. I think Dave Canalis, I don't

(41:10):
think the Panthers are gonna win enough games for him
to get the award. For Canalis to get it, I
think they would have to win probably. I think it's
hard for a coach. I'd have to look at the
recent winners. But if you went eight to nine, which
would be an unreal season for the Panthers, I don't
think you can win it at eight and nine, even
though he would be worthy of it. But I think

(41:31):
they're more likely to win like six games Justin Jefferson
Player of the Year, Herbert MVP, Knicks Rookie of the Year,
don't hate it. I think Caleb has a pretty good
chance as well, and Darnold is a sleeper. I think
it's gonna be very, very difficult for Rogers not to
win it if he plays seventeen games. But I like

(41:55):
where your heads up. Out of the twenty twenty four
quarterback first round picks, which one do you think, if any,
will be bus which one do you think will be stars? Well,
I think The easy way to go is it's gonna
be hard for Caleb to not be good, right. He

(42:15):
is very talented and they have a lot of offensive weapons.
I would say when you look at Jayden Daniels, you
go a little I mean not. He was a one
year wonder. He had Malikue Neighbors, who I mean might
be a star in the NFL. His other wide receiver
was drafted in the early twenties right to the Jags.

(42:37):
So he had two guys go in the top twenty
five picks, one guy go in the top six who
you know easily could have been the fourth pick. His
defensive coach as a head coach, so he's very reliant
on his offensive coordinator. In the offensive coordinator's Cliff Kingsbury.
So you just go, I think could get weird Drake May.

(43:00):
I think there are gonna be some growing pains this
year in Washington, just natural transition of kind of starting over. Obviously,
Drake May would be an easy guy to pick to
just fail the organization. Defensive head coach who's only been
coaching for three or four years, not much talent on
the roster. The offensive line could be awful like that

(43:22):
could just be a very very rough couple of years.
And for every Alex Smith who can be really shitty,
shitty shitty and then all of a sudden resurrected his career,
most guys get just wiped out and just turn into
a backup Pennix. I mean, it's just a bizarre situation, right,

(43:43):
how long does he sit? When does he actually play?
Does he end up starting for the Falcons or is
he on another team one day? Who knows? Obviously Bo
Nick's having Sean Payton is a huge huge advantage, and
JJ McCarthy having Kevin O'Connell's a huge huge advantage. Beside,
like the the ultra talented guys where you just go,

(44:05):
it's gonna be hard for this guy to fail. And
like we've already discussed the Bears roster for a team
drafting number one. I mean they didn't even have the
number one pick, but the way they ended up having it,
obviously it's a unique situation because of the trade. I
think you just try to bet. If you go I
like the offensive play caller who's also the head coach,
you just bet on that, and you bet against the

(44:26):
defensive coaches. I think if you just followed that formula,
you'd be right a lot more than you're wrong. Pickleball
is the CrossFit of sports. I've never played pickleball in
my life, and I mentioned this on the podcast the
other day. My natural inclination is just to talk a

(44:49):
little shit. It's just my natural inclination. Clearly, people like it.
It's an enjoyable activity. I'll say this about CrossFit. I
had never done CrossFit in my life until I moved
to Arizona and I started going to this place because
a couple buddies had recommended it to me, and I
haven't been in like six months, and they're mad at me.
I get text like you better be showing up, and

(45:10):
I'm gonna show up. I think I'm gonna get back
into it during football season because my workout's done by
seven am and I have the rest of the data to,
you know, grind my face off. Crossfits is hard. Like CrossFit,
you could make fun of it, and people that take
it very very seriously on social media. I understand, you know,

(45:31):
the pushback or the sarcastic remarks on the other side.
Whenever I did it, I felt incredible the rest of
the day, Like it works to me. Pick a Ball
Fat Guy's tennis. During Hard Knocks, it seemed like Maleik
Neighbors was unhappy being selected by the Giants. If Neighbors

(45:56):
isn't spectacular, do you see day Ball and Joe Shane
getting fired. I do wonder if he would have reacted
like that with any team selecting him. It didn't feel
like Neighbors was some big jump up and celebrate the
moment he got the call. But I do agree when

(46:16):
you just watched the video of him getting the call,
he wasn't overjoyed. He wasn't doing cartwheels in the in
the green room with the other players. I do think
as the night went on, he did the FaceTime with
the entire group. You see this if you haven't watched
the last episode of Hard Knocks Giants, he definitely looked happier.

(46:38):
I think he'll be fine. I mean he's he's an
excellent prospect. I mean he's an elite player. Like that's
that's a good pick. The last episode, and I've said this,
the Hard Knocks was fantastic when it was announced they
were doing it. I'm sure like most people thought, like,
I'm not watching this stupid. I thought that's one of
the better NFL programming by HBO i've ever seen. I

(47:05):
think their problem is gonna be I've said this over
and over, like, they actually have some solid players on
the roster, and their defense could be pretty good. But
we saw them with somewhat of a similar situation a
couple of years ago. They were very, very dependent on Saquon. Now,
in theory, their old line should be better and you
should be able to manipulate the running back spot. But

(47:27):
like the this isn't an opinion. This is just based
on watching the owner. If this team goes six or
seven wins, even if they show some progress, one, that'll
clearly Daniel Jones won't be good enough, which I think
we already acknowledge. And two, you go, well, did the
Eagles just win eleven games and Saquon had twelve hundred
yards and fifteen touchdowns rushing and catching. It's gonna look

(47:50):
pretty bad. And that's not a fan take, that's not
a podcaster take. That's literally what the owner said. I
don't think I'll be able to sleep at night with
one on the Eagles and now the dudes on the Eagles.
So I think the Giants are gonna be a fascinating story.
Like I said, Dave Ball looks great physically, looks fantastic.

(48:11):
Props to him for losing all the olbis. Looks like
he's lost fifty pounds. Looks fantastic. He's calling the plays too,
So anytime you do the shift play caller, like they
yanked it away from Kafka, he took it, there's no
one to point the finger at, like you got rid
of Wink. You're calling the plays now. No one's expecting
you to win eleven games. But like I would say,

(48:33):
anything less than eight, people just start questioning what's going
on here. Listen to your recent take on Perty and
his expected big payday next year. I have to disagree
with you a little. I think the Niners can drive
a hard bargain with him. While Perty is a great player,
he is not elite. How many NFL teams would pay

(48:54):
top dollar for Perty, which would greatly impact their salary
cap when they do not have an offensive system like
San Francisco. Purty is great because of the tools at
his disposal. He would be foolish to think he can
be the highest paid player. I never say he's gonna
be the highest paid player. I say he's gonna get
a lot of money. That might look like Tua Jordan Love,

(49:16):
But if you're sitting in party shoes, you go wait,
I'm throwing thirty touchdowns a year. I'm helping us win
playoff games. Tua can't dream of winning a playoff game.
How am I not gonna get more than him? Because
we just had this argument with Tua, like who they
been against? Well, these NFL teams say is Pam and
the difference is I think the Dolphins were kind of stuck.
Kyle Shanahan loves brock Purty, loves brock Purty. Do I

(49:40):
think he should get Joe Burrow money? Of course not.
But he's gonna end up getting a lot. It's just
a fact. Now, how they build that, how they structure it.
I'm no cap guru, but he's not getting the Daniel
Jones contract and he doesn't deserve it. Like he's better
than all, He's better than Tua, he's better than too.

(50:01):
He just out played Jordan Love in the second half
of a playoff game. That who knows what if the
Packers win that thing and they're in the They're in
the fucking super Bowl. So like he's got a lot
going for him in the argument of like, listen, I
actually think he's gonna be pretty team friendly because of Kyle,
a little like a way lesser version of how Mahomes

(50:25):
worked his contract. But he's gonna get a lot of
money and because of what he produces for them, he
deserves it, like they gave Jimmy Garoppolo a lot of
money once upon a time and until Jimmy completely lost
his confidence. You watched the Receiver show. I was watching
it last night. You don't want to watch it late
at night because it's hard to turn off and DeVante

(50:45):
is like flipping flipping out and pissed off. Don't totally
blame him though, Like I do understand the comment it's
not about winning or losing, it's about greatness. Like that
that one had to rub some people the wrong way internally.
Clearly they had like a knockdown, drag out meeting with
the team. I'm a DeVante guy, but Jimmy Garoppolo, the

(51:08):
version we see now is like a shot fighter if golf,
this would be the Yips. Anyone that's watched the Simone
Biles Netflix documentary, it be the twisties in gymnastics. I'd
never heard of twisties. I guess that's when you get
a metal block. And like when she bowed out of
the Olympics a couple of years ago, she just like

(51:28):
her mind and her body weren't on the same page,
which has happened to any human in any sport. You
lose your confidence. Happens to me and golf all the time.
Differences of in golf like Okay, I'm just gonna hit
this ball out of bounds whatever. In gymnastics, if you
get the twisties, like you could land on your head
and break your neck and die. I watched that, I
was like, damn, this is pretty crazy. Twisties are no yips.

(51:50):
You're just like I'm just not gonna score well twisties.
It's like I could get seriously injured and it's crazy.
But Jimmy definitely has the version gymnastics twisties because it
was watching the slow motion highlights. I mean, I watched
some of those games live last year, Like this is
a joke. What is the balls weren't even remotely close.

(52:13):
Guys wide open airmailing them. It was bad. This from
Vince Love the Top five Stadium Vibes. I'm a Bears fan,
but I have to say Lamba is incredible. Also, four
of the five are in the Midwest. No coastal elites
I could have. I mean, Philly when they're good's pretty awesome. Obviously,

(52:33):
New England for twenty years was pretty special. A lot
of people firing in. You clearly haven't been to ford Field. Well,
ford Field was kind of irrelevant for thirty years. You
guys are on a heater now. I think that's pretty high.
I don't know if you would consider Detroit coastal elitists,
but New York definitely not So Fi, definitely not San Francisco,

(52:54):
definitely not Seattle has a claim when they're good. I
really think it has to do with the area and
more to do with the venue. One thing they all
had in common, or most of them. Minnesota was an
outlier was the old decrepit stadiums because Candlestick was elite.

(53:15):
The Coliseum when the Raiders were there, if they were decent,
was awesome. It has to do with like, there's no
there's nothing else to do. No one wants to eat
these shitty hot dogs because they're terrible. There's the concourse,
you can't even move. It's all about football, and there's
something special about that. The Bills have that, the Chiefs
have that Cleveland has that. Lambeau clearly has that. But

(53:38):
Lamba also, like I said, they really benefit like they
have been awesome since nineteen ninety three or four, I
mean thirty plus years, they've been good. Obviously they've had
bad seasons, but for the most part, for thirty plus years,
people just pick them to make the playoffs. Even use

(53:59):
the Chiefs' example. Before Andy got there, they were a disaster.
When Andy got the job, they had the number one
overall pick. Do you think Seattle can build a future
with Sam Howell or drafting the future as a better move?
I think I saw on the old X channel, as

(54:19):
my mother calls it, that he's been all over the
map in training camp. So I again, that's just a
tweet that I saw that he's been very inaccurate. I
would say probably not, I would be stunned, but hell,
crazier things have happened. I'm not saying he's gonna be this,
but Kurt Warner is bagging groceries and now he's in

(54:41):
the Hall of Fame with a couple MVPs in a
Super Bowl. So you just you just never know. I
would doubt it, though I would I would doubt it
working out. I'm a longtime Steelers fan, and I'm tired
of winning nine to ten games every single season. But
our co such toughness of the organization and style of

(55:01):
our plays, do not let us have a bad year
to get a new quarterback. I also think Russ and
fields are not the answer. If you were the GM
of the Steelers, what would you do? Side note? Why
do you think big Ben is not mentioned with the greats?
He had two Super Bowls and it was a gunslinger
in his prime. I think the media doesn't really like him,

(55:22):
you know. I think that's part of it. I think
the media doesn't like him. I think I think that's
a huge reason. I think he's just not well liked.
But big Ben in his prime was as good as
a guy like. He had like a three or four
year stretch in his mid to late twenties, maybe even

(55:42):
early thirties where it was like this is this elite, Yes,
this guy can go toe to toe with anybody. I
don't think there's much you can do right now if
you're the GM. I think you just let this season
play out and if you win eight games, Let's say
I think you would have to entertain, like, is this
the year trade a couple first round picks and move
up and draft a quarterback because I mean, both those

(56:06):
guys contracts are over, so Russell Wilson and Justin Fields,
which is good if it goes bad, they're not in
a contract. I don't know, there's nothing you can do today.
I think one thing you do this offseason, and I
know John Schneider did this a couple of years ago,
is you do the full court press on evaluating the quarterbacks,

(56:28):
your meetings and discussions with your scouts in Latrobe, because
they're all there for the first couple weeks. Is every
single scout on our college scout sees every quarterback that
we have drafted in the top one hundred live. You
have to see a quarterback. You could argue, if you

(56:48):
have a quarterback that is draftable in your area, you
must see them alive. Obviously, you go to practice, you
scout them. You have to go to a game live.
And I would have my national scout, my in house
like pro or director of player personnel. After about September
that we get a gauge of like who the top

(57:10):
six seven quarterbacks are in this class. He tries to
get out and see all those guys, so I would
go full court press. It doesn't mean it's going to
lead to one of those guys, but my effort on
evaluating this class would be it couldn't be any stronger.
We're putting full court press. Doesn't mean we're not evaluating

(57:31):
all the other players. And when you go to games,
you know you can cross check other players. But our
effort on these quarterbacks is all in all of our
chips the middle of the table in our evaluation process
this fall. So when the season ends, whether we're good
or bad, I mean, like you said, you're never going
to be bad. But whether we win eight nine and

(57:51):
now we finally miss the playoffs for the first time
and we're drafting seventeenth, maybe this is the year we
go from seventeenth to six and we trade our first
a second and another first and a player or something.
We get aggressive because we got to be in position
and we got to feel good about the class. Right.
So by the time the combine everything, we know these

(58:13):
guys so well that that would be my task to
my crew, and I want constant updates when you go
into these schools, any information you're hearing, like, we're following
these guys, we couldn't fall him any closer. Longtime San
Diego native and Charger fan, do you think the Chargers

(58:35):
can make the playoffs? Also, considering Harbaugh is going to
be the coach for some years now, how high do
you think the ceiling is for the Chargers? But last,
but not least, considering the so called weak wide receiver room,
do you think Brendan Rice could potentially make the team
and become a constant target for Herbert. I think he's
got the potential to be a smaller DK metcalf.

Speaker 1 (58:59):
Uh uh.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
One thing DK had or has is elite speed. You know,
if it was if you were scouting a baseball player,
he'd be plus plus plus, Like, it doesn't get any better.
His top end straight line speed might not be Tyreek Hill,
but it's better and basically everybody else and Brendan Rice

(59:20):
is not that. Can brand and Rice make your team?
I'm waffling now. One of the dm rs in my
head a little bit, and I was. I was on
Gottlieb Show yesterday and he's a Charger guy, and he
thought I was a little crazy. Their back end of
their corners a little bit of a question mark linebacking group,
not great. Their d linemen have a long history of

(59:44):
getting injured. The wide receiver corps gives me less anxiety
because I've seen hardball be very successful with a good
offensive line, a good quarterback and run the ball. And
when you can do that, average wide receivers get open. Defensively,
how good are they gonna be? And I always just
lean back. His defenses are always good. They're always good.

(01:00:08):
He hires Mentor, who came with him from Michigan, who
was in Baltimore, who was like basically Mike McDonald. Mike
McDonald also did the same thing Mentor did, went to Jim,
came back to John. This guy did the same thing,
went to John, went to Jim. Now stay with Jim.
So he like cross pollinates all these guys. Greg Roman

(01:00:29):
starts with Jim, goes to John, back with Jim. Like,
all these coaches have been successful. So I wouldn't bet
my life's savings on it. But like I said, I
don't think it's a bad bet picking the charges to
make the playoffs. Why can't they be the Pittsburgh Steelers
of twenty twenty four nine to ten wins be the
seventh seed. I'm not saying they're gonna win thirteen games here,

(01:00:51):
but could they go nine and eight or ten and
seven and be the seventh seed. I think that is
a very very real possibility, very real. Wouldn't shock me
at all. If I end up not putting money on
it and they do it, be kicking myself. This is
from Donovan. Somebody, with college football on the edge of

(01:01:12):
really booming as a sport, is there anywhere to invest
into it like you would the stock market? Thanks for
your time. I don't think there is. I guess you
can invest in the networks corporations that broadcast the games,
but there's so much other stuff under the umbrella not

(01:01:34):
stock market advice would not recommend doing that. Colin is
adamant that these venture capitalists are going to get involved
with college football if it ever goes kind of separates
from the NCAA, because let's face it, it doesn't make
that much sense as they keep growing and making all
the money to fund everything else, and because of rules

(01:01:56):
like Title nine, they're forced to pay and listen, a
lot of men sports don't make money either to pay
for all, these sports don't make any money, so why
wouldn't they just go independent like the NFL and keep
all the money for themselves, for the coaches, obviously in
the players, and stop sharing it with like women's tennis
and men's soccer, which feels inevitable at the rate in

(01:02:17):
which they were going because the money is growing exponentially.
And when that happens, who knows, maybe it becomes under
some crazy like in IPOs one day. If it does,
I think a lot of people would invest, but I
would push back a little bit. Like college football has
been popular for a long time now, and I would
say their popularity this last decade has really solidified them

(01:02:40):
as the number two sport in America in terms of viewers.
Now it could only it's probably only going to grow
because of the twelve team playoff, because of gambling, because
of the consolidation of all the top teams playing each
other in the you know, adding these teams at the conference.
I'd say fifty to fifty chants one day. There's some

(01:03:00):
way to invest in college football as it's a public
company on the stock market. I don't exactly know how
the logistics of that would work, but you could definitely
foresee a road, but I think right now the only
way technically would be to like be a booster of
a program, but you don't get any money back. You know,
they give you tickets to the games and take care

(01:03:21):
of you during the Bowl week, But to my knowledge,
there is no way to invest

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
The volume