August 19, 2024 • 41 mins
John reacts to the week 2 preseason action and starts with why he feels it was INSANE for Kyle Shanahan to start QB Brock Purdy while all of the other starters sat. Then John states why it is in WR Brandon Aiyuk's best interest to stay in San Fran if he wants to win and why he is betting on the Derek Carr led New Orleans Saints to win the NFC South. Finally, John explains why the combo of Sean Payton and Bo Nix will work for the Denver Broncos.
Later, John answers your questions in this episode's mailbag segment.
7:37 - Why did Kyle start Brock Purdy
13:51 - Where Aiyuk has the best chance to win
18:51 - Saints will win the division
22:20 - Why Sean Payton and bo Nix will work
43:55 - Tom brady did a walk-thru
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
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Speaker 1 (01:38):
Everybody? John Middlecoff three and Out podcast. How are we doing?
It's a beautiful Monday. Well, I'm recording this on a Sunday.
I went out with Colin before the Sunday night football games,
the Niner game the Bronco game, and we talked for
about an hour about football. And then after watching you know,
the first quarter and a half of co Old doing
(02:00):
something kind of crazy with Purdy Edelman on Ayuk, watching
the Saints' first teamers, and then watching bo Nix, I'm like,
you know what, I'm going to do another podcast as well,
and also I want to talk a little bit about
Tom Brady and who was at the game to night.
Him and Burkhart were kind of doing test runs. It's
hard not to get excited because we got one more
(02:22):
week of preseason and then the regular season is about
ten days around the corner and real football is off
and running. Obviously, College football week zeros, this week, week ones,
the following week, the holiday weekend, which is always exciting,
and then then we got real games, which you get
excited for preseason, and then all of a sudden you're
(02:42):
like watching backup quarterback. Actually, I can't, this is not
as fun as it should be, and usually pivot and
go do something else. Well, those days are close to
being over, which excites me. So we'll talk a little
bit about some of the stuff I saw tonight. And yeah,
so you guys know the Drill three and Out podcasts.
If you listen on Collins Feed, make sure you subscribe.
Go check out the YouTube page all of our contents
(03:06):
up there. If you go to Collins you can watch
the YouTube on our podcast as well. From Sunday and
the game Plan will be football podcast all week. We
got a couple interviews I'm gonna do this week for
the following week, maybe a college football preview, a big
gambling preview with my guy Stucky from the Action Network,
(03:26):
on some futures on some college and pro. Maybe we
do some individual props as well, like Offensive Rookie of
the Year Poe Nicks and yeah, it's exciting times. It's
a good time of year. But first on the Niners,
on the Broncos, and on the Saints. I gotta tell
you about my friends. Do you want to go to
one of these games? Do you want to go to
(03:46):
a regular season game? Do you want to go to
a college game? You want to go to a concert?
I just was getting text message last night from a
buddy who was in Atlanta at the Luke Bryan concert.
It looked like at the Brave Stadium. It looked a
lot of fun. They were just jamming out. He was
wearing a Brave jersey on stage. You want to go
to one of these concerts? My friends? My partners in
(04:08):
The official ticketing app of this podcast, game Time, has
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(04:32):
for twenty dollars off. Download the game Time app today.
Last minute tickets, lowest price is guaranteed. Most of you
don't live probably as deep in like forty nine or
Internet land as myself. But there can't be a more
successful coach given he's been to four NFC Championship games
(04:53):
in the last five years, been to multiple Super Bowls,
obviously didn't win them. But every coach besides Andy Reid
basically currently in the NFL, and maybe McVeigh would sign
up for that. And yet Kyle Shanahan is pretty controversial
in Internet Land, and I defend him. I think he's
one of the best coaches. I think his style translates.
(05:16):
He has an offensive philosophy that he can adapt to.
He's proven he can win with multiple quarterbacks now Jimmy
Garoppolo and Brock Party, so he calls the plays, can
coach two quarterbacks who, let's face it, aren't exactly Patrick
Mahomes or Josh Allen talent wise, and because of his
philosophical belief in physical run game, to me, it benefits
(05:38):
the offense or excuse me, the defense, and their defense
is always really physical and John Lynch. Whatever the Steelers
do when it comes to wide receivers, John Lynch is
proving to do that when it comes to safeties. They
have about seven safeties that easily could have played in
the nineties. They want to hit, and they want to
hit hard. But tonight was befuddling. Tonight was head scratcher.
(06:01):
Tonight was I can't defend Kyle on this one. He
rolled out brock Perdy with a bunch of second and
third stringers, a bunch of guys that are not gonna
play against the New York Jets come Week one. A
bunch of guys who are not legitimately not players, I mean,
will not be on the fifty three potentially against the Saints,
(06:22):
who will talk about in a minute. I think we're
gonna have one of the better defense in the league,
and we're rolling out their starters. I'm all for picking
a lane if you want to be a new school
guy and play nobody. I totally get it. The amount
of money that's on the line in this modern day NFL.
You're paying guys guards fifteen to twenty million. Obviously, quarterbacks
(06:45):
make a ton, wide receivers make a ton. Totally get it.
Star pass rushers, it is not worth the risk. The
juice isn't worth the squeeze. You know, I understand it now.
If you want to play in the lane of Andy Reid.
I've been coaching this league for thirty five years. I've
been a head coach since ninety nine, and I play
(07:06):
my guys in the preseason. Totally get it. But you
can't dip your toe in the water. You either got
to jump in the deep end and swim. Andy did it.
I was watching some of the game before I went
golfing on Saturday. Guess what happened. He rolled out mahomes
with who Oh, there's Travis Kelce, Oh there's Rashi Rice.
You know the guys he depended on in their Super
(07:28):
Bowl run, one of the greatest tight ends of all time.
And this other guy if he wouldn't, you know, take
substances and get behind a Lamborghini, would we'd be talking
about being one of the breakout stars in the league.
Probably cann get spend it, but real high end players.
Yet today, when the forty nine ers opened up on Fox,
which felt kind of big at least the pregame, they
(07:49):
got Julian Edelman and Carissa George Kittle walks out in sweats,
Deebo Samuel walks out in sweats in Louis sunglasses, looks
pretty good. Trent Williams is at home doing who knows
what somewhere, even Kyle's like, yeah, I think he's in Houston.
Brandon Ayuk probably at home on Instagram. Christian McCaffrey not
playing in the preseason. What the hell are you doing?
(08:13):
That is insanity to roll out party against one of
the best defenses with Randos, you're gonna you could have
got the guy killed. You almost did. He was getting
pepper at every play and then Perdy's running around trying
to play hero ball. What's going on? How does that
make any sense? Even on the flip side, Dennis Allen,
we're gonna play our guys, Okay, who does Derek roll
(08:36):
out with? I don't know, Chris Olave, Taysom Hill, guys
that he's going to play with in week one. I
don't get it. And this is the reason Kyle Shanahan
like can't get everyone behind him. Every once in a while,
just have one of these hit scratchers, like, what's going
on here? In what world? Does this make any sense?
(08:59):
Are you trying to go? Well, if we pay the
guy sixty million, this is gonna be the squad. Well,
if that's the case, and this is ever gonna be
your squad. Just get ready to draft to the top five,
because that would be an embarrassment. No one would watch.
By week seven or eight, the TVs would be turned
off in the Bay Area and you wouldn't be playing
any preseason games. Trust me, I've seen it. It's called
(09:20):
Jim tom Zula Chip Kelly ratings plummeted. We weren't paying attention.
I do not understand rolling out your starting quarterback, and
I want to call him scrubs because some of these
guys are gonna make the fifty three, but not starters.
When your premium players are in sweats, your quarterback's gotta
(09:40):
be in sweats. And listen, I understand Trent Williams isn't there,
so you're gonna have some random offensive linemen in the game.
But if George Kittle and Deebo Samuel and Christian McCaffrey
can't play, Brock perty should not play the risk in
those six or seven plays when he's scrambling around and
the Saints defensive linemen are chasing him and hitting him,
(10:03):
I thought was absolute insanity. We've gotten back and forth
and talked a lot about like some craziness over the preseason,
like Judawn and Mayo screaming at each other. You know,
I saw on Reddick's trade, which some of it is
like kind of serious but also kind of funny, Like
there was nothing funny about this. This was crazy. This
(10:25):
was legitimately made no sense. This was one of those
where if you were some random coach with no equity,
I mean, people be looking at you side eyed in
the building. I just I can't fathom the decision making
that went behind this to roll out party with that
crew of characters. I don't get it. Julian Edelman said
(10:49):
something interesting before the game. First and foremost said, usually
when you win a Super Bowl, that's when everyone wants
to get paid. In the forty nine ers situation, they
haven't won a Super Bowl and everyone's ready to get paid.
Though I get Brandon Ayuk, it's time bitess contract, time
to get broken off. And Trent Williams well has a
lot left on his contract. It's not guaranteed, and as
(11:10):
you saw today, his value to the forty nine Ers
clearly went up. But I think Edelman is a good example,
and I think Travis Kelcey is another good example. And
I've been saying this forever. When you win in sports,
your value never ends. You become especially in a big
market in a big city for a powerhouse team, you
(11:30):
become a legend in that franchise, and your value in
terms of ability to earn is forever. Jerry Rice is,
you know, limping around with Brett Farvan commercials now at
fifty five years old. Joe Montana gets paid wherever he
goes Hell. Obviously, Tom Brady won a bunch of Super Bowls.
(11:53):
He got almost four hundred million dollars to colleie football game,
which he never has yet zero prior experience. Fox gave
him three hundred and seventy five million dollars. Fox opened
up tonight with Julian Edelman, who's not going to go
to the Hall of Fame, who didn't break any records yet,
(12:14):
is a three time Super Bowl champion, won a Super
Bowl MVP, and we'll be able to earn off his
name till the moment he's buried because of the name
recognition being synonymous with winning. And Brandon Nyuk clearly knows
that because he told the Patriots to kick rocks, he
didn't want to go to the Browns. Don't really understand
(12:34):
his mindset on going to the Steelers. That would be
a disaster. His best chance to be a star in
the league is to stay on the forty nine Ers.
Because if Brandon Nyuk was currently going through the situation
on a random team, on a team that consistently drafts
in the top ten, do you know what we'd be
doing not talking about Brandon Nyuk. No one would care.
(12:57):
Beside that individual market. This has been one of the
biggest national stories. This guy catches seventy five balls a year.
We're not talking about Randy Moss or tyreek Hill. That's
not the case here. But because he's part of a
winner and a powerhouse franchise, we discuss them and it's
(13:20):
become a big, big national story. I'd be discussing them
no matter what. But it wouldn't be the same if
you put them on the Minnesota Vikings or the Jacksonville Jaguars.
If or he was on the New England Patriots, no
one would care. And I think Edelman is right because
you've seen Kelsey hasn't made as much as he could
(13:41):
playing for the Chiefs, but you know what, he's known
as a legend, three times Super Bowl champion, one of
the great players of all time, synonymous with greatness. See
it all the time in the NBA. Now those guys
get paid, But like these guys that don't win, no
one's gonna care about him once their career is over.
When you have rings and I love when players push
(14:02):
again the ring culture, Well, yeah, that's the whole point
of the sport. That is the reason you play to
try to win a championship. Like most of our businesses
are like, yeah, you can always make more money. We're
doing well, but we could do better. When it comes
to team sports or individuals sports, there is like a
(14:25):
finality to it all. On a given tournament, on a
given season, you win or do you lose? And that's
how we judge you, and that's how you make money
for the rest of your life. Are you a champion
orre you not a champion? And obviously the best chance
for this guy to be a champion is with this team,
and the best chance for this guy to keep winning
(14:47):
is with this team. So I don't know all the
details of this situation. Honestly, I think it's semi embarrassing.
Like I get having crazy back and forth with Nick
Bosa with TJ. Watt with the great players, I mean
the truly great players, the really really good ones, Like
I kind of sided with management on that one. Would
(15:07):
drive me a little nuts. John Lynch had to come
back from vacation and meet with this guy over the summer.
And I like Brandon a you. I like him a lot,
but holy shit, I mean, let's pump the brakes here.
We're not talking about Jerry Rice. So Trent Williams, like,
I get it. I do. First bout Hall of Fame,
one of the best tackles of all time. He wants
(15:28):
to be a pain in the ass and ask for
way more money than you think he's worth. Like that's
part of the game. This is a business. This one
is like, let's get this deal done. Like we all
know you don't want to leave because you had the opportunity.
Called your bluff on that one. I get this negotiating
tactics and getting weird, but like, time to end this thing.
It's time to get the show on the road. Here
(15:49):
on the flip side, I feel pretty good about this take.
I think I'm gonna put a future bet on the
Saints to win the division, partly because of value and
partly because I think they're gonna be pretty goo. Their
defense clearly is good, not really debatable at this time.
Like they were good last year, they're gonna be good
again this year. The question mark with the franchise was offense.
(16:11):
Is their offense good enough? And so far it's like
last year it was not. And then you hire Kubiak's
kid who comes from Kyle, and now the history of
the McVeigh and Kyle guys has been pretty good. This
is not the Belichick tree. When you hire these guys
to be your coordinator, your head coach kind of works
(16:33):
as long as they keep calling plays, I e. Robert
Sola call the defense buddy. To me, this is gonna
come down to their success. Kubiak and Derek and there
were a couple of throws to Night like the difference
why Cousins is a better player than Derek. I'm talking small,
small margins of accuracy. A ball a little behind a
(16:54):
guy on an out route where if it's two feet
toward the sideline, it's an easy completion in a first down.
And in this offense, they're not asking you to be
Patrick Mahomes. Because the Saints I think are gonna be
pretty good running the ball. As they said on the broadcast,
no team is paying their running back room more than
New Orleans Saints. But there were a couple past to night.
(17:16):
One was complete, one was not, where Derek was just
a tick off. The key in this offense is accuracy.
They will scheme guys open. If you're having success running
the football, you're gonna get some pretty layup throws for
NFL quarterbacks. And Derek's making a lot of money to
make those throws. The pressure on him is pretty massive.
(17:40):
Obviously Kubiak, first time play caller, Obviously there's pressure there.
But I'm watching the night like, guys are open, Derek's
got to hit that. And we discussed that kind of
that group of guys that Derek used to be considered
in and then kind of fell out. Like the golf,
the Cousins, the DAC like, they hit those. They don't
do some of the spectacularship but they hit some of
the basics. That's why if your team's good enough, you
(18:02):
can win eleven twelve games with them, and when they
get really good games, they look really good. They also
have some down games, but maybe their defense carries them.
So I like the Saints this year I like them
a lot, but obviously betting on Derek can be a
risky proposition. And tonight, like I'm talking pretty minute details
here of a throw, and that could be the difference
(18:24):
of being nine and eight again and having a good team,
or being ten to seven and win the division, or
being eleven and six. Because I think their defense, it
will not shock me at all off their top five defense.
They definitely have some pieces on offense. A lot of
people talk shit about Taysom Hill. Obviously he's not a quarterback.
He could play for my team any day of the
week and twice on Sundays. Chris Olave pretty good. Alvin
(18:47):
Kamara pretty good. The offensive lineman they drafted in the
first round from Oregon State. Like that guy a lot,
Like he's going to be a player. So the Derek
got a lot of money, did this big free agency tour,
gets a little bit of a pass last year. Persions
on them, pisser, get off the pot, and I think
(19:08):
I'm gonna back them financially. It's gonna be a roller coaster.
Part of the reason we gamble kind of like the
highs and lows. Ready for it, like the value there.
I think the Saints are really really interesting. This year,
Colin and I talked about it. We talked before the game,
and then more and more I think about it. I
bet anyone listening to this, especially if you work in
(19:31):
a partner situation or work very very closely with one
individual in a B to B relationship where that B
to B is a majority of your business, where when
you do not like the people you work with, it
is difficult. I don't care if you're making a lot
of money or you know, trying to create something, it
(19:52):
can be a challenge. It is why it's way easier
in any professional relationship. You don't have to love the guy.
You don't have to go to dinner and hang out
with this family, but there has to be a healthy
amount of respect. And usually when you respect the guy,
if the guy's pretty talented or whoever you're working with,
you end up kind of liking them. Think how many
(20:12):
people you gravitate toward and befriend after you leave college
or your early twenties, whatever you're doing through a work relationship,
you meet a lot of friends that way. I know
some of the people I'm closest with and text all
the time are people I've met through football or radio. Hell,
I mean my podcast crew, James Adam. We text all
(20:35):
the time because you work hand in hand, you work closely.
So Daniel new to the operation just on a group text.
You just you just work together closely, and when you
like the other people, it is much easier to operate.
Sean Payton was never gonna like Russell Wilson, and the
moment he watched them play, he couldn't stand him. And
(20:56):
I understood it because if I don't really respect you,
kind of weirdo, and then I don't think you're very good,
and especially in that situation when you're making all this
money and I go, you ain't worth this at all.
I didn't pay you this. It was destined to fail.
And I understand like former players, they all are biased
toward this. So many of them freaked out. Bullshit the
(21:17):
way they handled the ball. He got paid to eighty
million dollars to hit the door. Give me a break.
I feel bad for the guy that gets fired, has
two kids and has no money coming in. I feel
zero sympathy for a guy who's not any good anymore
and couldn't cut it, can't hack it. And if you
watch the Steelers the other day and I was playing
golf when the game was going on, and I got
a bunch of DMS like are you're watching this? I
(21:39):
get home and immediately watched it. He's a washed player.
It is what it is. Then you start working with
someone you like, someone you respect, especially in a situation
like Sean, I can mold them it's gonna work. I don't.
I don't have the box score in front of me.
I don't need it. If you watch bo Nicks these
(21:59):
last two play for the Denver Broncos, you go, yeah,
that's what it's kind of supposed to look like. I'm
not saying he's gonna be a Hall of Famer. I'm
not saying he's gonna be a future MVP, but he
definitely has a lot too. I've been watching this stuff
long enough to know, yeah, I like what I'm seeing.
And then I looked at the Offensive Rookie of the
Year odds. Obviously, Caleb is the heavy favorite. He's plus
(22:24):
one thirty five to win the Offensive Rookie of the Year,
which those odds are just crazy. Even if you love
Caleb as a gambler, you couldn't bet them. Jayden Daniels
is almost five to one. Also pretty intriguing, even though
dan Quinn I saw yesterday they did like a schemed run.
What did Jayden do? What have we been talking about?
(22:46):
A lot of talent there. Caleb gotta win from within
the pocket to become a star in the future. Jayden
Daniels has to find a way to get down, slide,
hit the ground, do whatever. Jayden Daniels ran right through tackles,
and dan Quinn's on the side like, get down, get down.
Both of those guys uber talented. I'm watching bo Nicks
(23:06):
and I go I see a lot of talent. I
see an offensive coordinator who's the head coach, who's all in.
They got some wide receivers. I got an offensive coordinator
who schemed a lot of the best offenses in the
history of the league. He's fourteen to one. Fourteen to
one to win the Offensive Rookie of the Year. From a
value standpoint, I don't even think it's debatable, Like, if
(23:29):
you're gonna bet him, you got to drizzle money on
that guy. I don't know. It's a halftime now when
I'm recording this. The moment he played his first preseason game,
he was gonna be the Week one starter after this.
And I understand this isn't about like he's playing backups.
(23:50):
Just watch the guy play. The movements, the accuracy, the
ability to get rid of the ball. Same with Calebs,
same with Jayden. It's not about who you're playing, it's
the attributes. Then it's on the coaches seam Paygnon's making
eighteen million dollars a year. You know all the Bears
coaches making a lot, quarterback coach making nine hundred, g's,
Oven's a coordinator probably making two and a half. Obviously,
(24:11):
dan Quinn's making ten million, Cliff's probably making three or four.
You got to coach these guys up. So it's on
the coaches who get paid premiums to figure it out.
But the talent on those three individuals eye popping. And
if you would have told me that when the preseason started,
I would have thought, obviously, Caleb has the best physical
(24:31):
characteristics in terms of arm and throwing on the run,
Jaden athleticism. I would put bow Knicks right there too,
movement wise, arm strength, like I would have assumed bo
Knick's arm looked a lot on a different level than
those two guys. And I don't see a huge gap.
(24:52):
When you say, does bo Knicks have a good arm,
my first reaction is yes, he does. So if I'm
a Denver Bronco fan, we got rid of the anchor
that is Russell Wilson, and I would say the drama
that comes behind that, because, let's face it, there's a lot.
And as I told Colin, I think what's going to
be the undoing of the Steelers is the drama in
(25:14):
that quarterback room because those guys are so famous. There
was like this famous aura with Russell Wilson that you
just couldn't shake. And for most of his career it
was always someone else's fault. Every offensive coordinator Russell Wilson
has ever had before Sean Payton got fired, every single one,
(25:36):
all of them, Seattle, all of them fired. Nathaniel Hacket
year one fire. You can bring up names, Shit, this
guy's not good enough. Whatever. In my life watching Football
Hall of Fame in their prime, sweet quarterbacks, you know
what happens their assistant coaches they become head coaches. Look
at Rogers, look at Big Ben obviously Tom Manning. Like
(26:00):
their guys move up the ladder. Russell's went the other way,
they always got the finger pointed at them. It was
their fault. Maybe it wasn't, Maybe it wasn't. Maybe Sean
Payton was right. And listen, everyone that talked a bunch
of shit. Last year, when Sean Payton went to him like, hey,
you want to you want to stick around here, change
your guarantees, ninety percent of the media freaked out. I
(26:26):
was like, what what are we talking about? He's asking,
do you want to change it or not? If not,
we're gonna bench you and move on. We're not afraid
to cut you because our owner's worth fifty billion dollars.
We don't give a shit. Here are your options. Welcome
to real life. At one point in time and all
of our lives were presented with a couple options. Professionally,
(26:46):
pick one or the other and listen, you live with it.
And he said, no, okay, see you don't let the
door hit you. It feels like they are going to
have such a more symbiotic and like more normal relationship
because one thing New Orleans always had now Drew Brees
(27:08):
Hall of Famer, but he's like one of the most normal,
high character guys in the league. Everyone loved him, got
along with everyone. I forget the offensive lineman he did
play by play. I think it was a center for
the Saints for a little bit. God, I forget his name.
And he retired like six seven, maybe eight years ago now,
(27:32):
and he started crying in his retirement speech talking about
Drew Brees. So Sean Payton went from that to Russell,
and I had defended Russell like the own office and
all that. It didn't bother me. It's people you can't
get along with. Teammates don't think you're normal. Part of
big a quarterback is being able to be relatable. Even
(27:56):
though you know, Patrick Mahomes he's making ninety million dollars
on and off the field, it always feels like all
his teammates like him. I saw on YouTube Tom Brady
I think started a YouTube page and it's you know, Tom,
I don't know if he's being truly authentic. It's not
about the content. It was just cool, like flying private
jets on these uh sweet yachts and who knows where.
(28:20):
It's just like kind of an insight in Tom's life.
It's like, God, this guy's living good in the back
of like sweet limos that it rolls Royces like this
guy's living like a you know, he's like one of
the kings or princes somewhere. You know, it's it's it
was cool insight. He has been so rich now for
so long, yet everybody till his last day in Tampa
(28:42):
was like, couldn't be any cooler, couldn't be any more normal.
That's why I like I defend Caleb Williams in terms
of the way his teammates talk about him. Didn't like
the painted nails, saying fuck you Utah, Like that's that's
slappy behavior. But usually with that you're like, god, do
the teammate thing. He's kind of a weirdo. It's like
(29:03):
you watch The Hard Knocks, seems like everyone likes him.
If everyone likes you, give yourself a shot. Rock Purdy
pretty polarizing player. You know who loves them? I'll tell
you Fred Warner, Trent Williams, Deebo, Samuel George Kittle kind
of matters. You know why Trey Lance got wally pipped
in the blink of an eye. Teammates didn't believe in him,
and they liked the guy. So when they don't like
(29:25):
you and then they don't believe in you, I think
Pittsburgh's got a major problem on their hands. And I
think Denver is just kind of got kind of got
out of a bad breakup dating someone new, and it's like, God,
life's pretty easy. I don't have to force things. Just
like conversation goes, go out to dinner, not screaming at
each other. It's like this, this is smooth, this is easy.
(29:48):
We've all experienced that in one relationship to another relationship
like this is way easier than that used to be.
It's like, yeah, because that was a toxic relationship. That's
not healthy, that's not not normal, that's not conducive to success.
And bo Nick Champagne's gonna work. Got news for you. Yeah,
(30:09):
I don't really know who's debating that. And I'm not
saying they're gonna make the playoffs this year, though, not
the craziest thing, because you go around the league, you
got like there's some weird quarterback situations. Rogers is forty.
What if he can't really move this year? Deshaun Watson
makes like eight hundred million dollars, what if he kind
of sucks? Joe Burrow, what if he can't stay healthy?
(30:33):
You know where I stood on the Chargers bet, which
I did love three weeks ago, don't love it as
much anymore. You know why their entire team always gets
injured and they're pretty dependent on a couple guys on
defense that are always hurt Khalil Mack and Joey Bosa,
who's literally hurt right now. And their quarterbacks has been
in a boot. So part of like good vibes, you know,
(30:57):
it's an overused term on the internet, like just vibe.
Positive vibes do matter. That doesn't mean you don't have
to work hard. That doesn't mean there are certain things
no matter what you're doing, that boxes you don't have
to check. But like being optimistic and being excited is
pretty healthy. Look at the Chiefs, you know what, They've
(31:17):
had a lot of just good vibes. Winning brings that
for sure. It's hard to have good vibes when you're losing.
You don't meet many like broke people that are smiling
all the time. Like I get it. I'm not acting
like they can go six and ten or six and eleven.
They're gonna be a bunch of good vibes. But you
remove Russell Wilson, that was just a giant pain in
their ass, not debatable to bow Nicks, who's just like
(31:42):
this young, hungry guy who's pretty talented, and if all
things are equal, same amount of money, I could have
this guy for a million or this guy for a
million in twenty twenty four, Is there one general manager
that today, including the Steelers, that would take Russell Wilson
over bow Nicks. Seeing the guy play a real NFL
game got news for you. There isn't. The Steelers would
(32:05):
trade Russell Wilson for bow Knicks yesterday, So sometimes things
just work out. They took a lot of shit for
that too. Everyone's like, oh, they're gonna take bow Nicks.
That's that's gonna be crazy, you take bow Nicks. It's
like I told Colin this Kenny Pickett, the Steelers drafted
twentieth overall, he's not very talented. Mac Jones not very talented. Historically,
(32:26):
guys like bow Knicks don't go where he went. But
then you watch him play and you go, well, he's
actually pretty talented. Like he has physical skills, the movement,
the size, the arm strength, like he has first round characteristics.
The mac Jones, the Kenny Picketts. I just use those
two guys' examples because one guy went fifteen and one
guy went twenty, and they don't check any of the
(32:48):
first round characteristics. Like Listen, obviously he shouldn't have gone
as far as he did in the draft board. But
like Brock, Purty doesn't have that many tangible first round
character Some of his stuff's intangible read a defense, get
rid of the ball fast. Those guys typically go in
the later rounds. Doesn't mean you can't strike oil with him.
(33:09):
Kirk Cousins, Dak Prescott, Rock Purty. Not every guy needs
to go in the first round, but when you do
draft a first round quarterback, you better fucking be right,
because you're wrong. The forty nine ers got very, very
lucky with the Tray Lance situation. Did They drafted Rock
Purty with the last pick in the draft, and he
became a good player. Because I'm watching the Raiders Cowboys,
(33:32):
which not gonna lie tough watch, the Raiders have a
question at quarterback, clearly. I mean both the guys seem
pretty average to me. But Trey Lance failed in the
NFL and he's currently failing in the NFL. Not because
he doesn't try, not because guys don't like him. He
just doesn't have the capability to like throw change ups.
(33:55):
Everything's really fast. He can't slow himself down. Anyone who's
ever play golf, it's easy on the driving range to
be like slow it down, nice and smooth, and then
you get on the course all of a sudden, muscle
memory starts kicking in and you can't help it. You're
spraying it right left. You're like, what the hell's going on?
Because you're a little more amped up. It's no different
(34:15):
than playing quarterback. You gotta slow it down. And you
watch Trey Lance. Everything's quick, everything's so fast. Fields is
like the better version of him. It's like, take a
deep breath, man, just relax a little bit. And they can't.
It's not because they're not trying. They're not attentive in meetings,
good guys like it's such a hard position to play. Obviously,
(34:38):
if you don't try, none of the effort, you got
no chance. But when you struggle to do a couple
things in the NFL accurately hit basic routes where you
can't throw a fastball and stay in the pocket, like,
that's kind of Russell Wilson's undoing of his career. Can't
(34:58):
play from the pocket, doesn't want does not want to
constantly scrambles around. Earlier in his career when he was
a great athlete, thrived at that because he had these
great physical skills. Those don't exist anymore at thirty five
like they did at twenty six years old. Caleb actually
is Russell Wilson in his prime in Seattle right now.
(35:20):
That's the way he plays. If something's not there right away,
he kind of moves around, scrambles around and makes great
plays and defenders have a hard time catching him because
he's like twenty one twenty two years old, in the
prime of his just movement skills and obviously has a
huge arm. But part of why Russell Wilson in the
prime of his career couldn't quite be on the level
(35:41):
like the Brady Man could. He couldn't dominate within the
pocket consistently. And to me, Kayleb Williams is a good example,
like for him to become the superstar like Patrick Mahomes, Well,
Patrick Mahomes can dominate from him within the pocket, and
he did early in his career. And I'm not putting
that pressure. If Caleb Williams just plays like he's playing
right right now, that could get the Bear's nine ten wins.
(36:03):
It's gonna be a lot of ad libbing, a lot
of wild plays. But for him to consistently be what
he has the capability of being with his physical attributes,
he's gonna have to balance that with playing in the pocket.
And on third and nine, I can't scramble around if
something's there, I gotta sit in that extra second and
throw that dirt and hit the guy on for nine
yards on third and eight. And that, to me, he's
(36:25):
on the coaches to get it out of him. And
like I said, with fields and sometimes certain guys may
he may never have that capability if he just becomes
Russell Wilson, become a Hall of Famer, the prime version,
not this version. That's what's so fascinating about quarterback play now.
I think the one thing that's on display every single
game you watch, even with the backups movement skills, is
(36:48):
a big deal. The day and age of just Eli Manning,
Philip Rivers, the Drew Bledsoe's all the quarterbacks I grew
up on beside, like Steve Young and like Michael Vick.
The statue in the pocket he's kind of dead. I mean,
there aren't even that many left in the NFL. Jared
Goff Obviously, I would say Matt Stafford at this age.
I think Rogers is gonna be that this year. But
(37:10):
most of these guys, when you go through the top quarterbacks,
Mahomes can move, Josh Allen can move, Burrow went healthy
is I'm not comparing the Lamar Jackson movement wise, but
like Montana can move around, no problem obviously, Lamar Kyler,
Jalen Hurts, Party can move, Dak can move. Cousins is
somewhat of a dinosaur that way. Can only play within
(37:32):
the pocket, but if you dominate within the pocket, you
can succeed. Look at Drew Brees's career. He wasn't very tall.
So it's just my favorite subject to talk about. Well,
two coaches and quarterbacks watching the highlights of Kevin Burkhardt,
(37:57):
who's just cool dude. He came on this podcast couple
years ago and I have to hit him up with
the text get him back on before the season or
maybe during the season. And Tom Brady doing their kind
of warm up games. They're gonna be a lot of people.
Just usually with broadcast crews, no one cares like it
just does not matter. You could just put anyone on.
(38:20):
We learned with Monday Night Football, that's not true. I
need a little pizzazz, right, That's why John Madden, John
Gruden like, I need a little star power. ESPN fucked
it up for a minute and then they got Troy
Aikman Joe Buck feels normal again. But most games on Sunday,
like the game handles the broadcast. I know all my
buddies constantly bash most of the broadcasters. The Brady Burkhart
(38:43):
thing was specifically Tom. I mean, we've seen Kevin called
Super Bowl last year, a couple of years ago. I
think maybe they got it this year. Is that I
don't know how it's gonna go because you watch the
YouTube thing of Tom like in Paris with his kids loose.
But I is at the guy that Bill and Gronk
(39:03):
and Julian getting no chance. I'm very fascinated on how
he's gonna bounce it because when Tom's being a guy,
no human has ever met Tom that doesn't like him.
He feels like the most relatable, famous, rich guy like
the history of America. Most of my favorite athletes or
biggest athletes in my life least relatable humans alive. Michael
(39:24):
Jordan not at all, Tiger Woods, no chance, Barry Bonds.
People can stand them, right, I mean, these guys struggle,
which kind of makes sense. How do they have anything
common with anybody? Guys don't even go to the store,
they don't even fill their own gas. It's hard to
relate to just even successful people when you're just living
(39:45):
in a completely different world. Yet Tom could balance that
with his coaches, with his assistant coaches, with his teammates,
with the equipment guy who's great at it. And if
you get that guy, it's impossible to not be a
good broadcaster because his fame. He obviously is well spoken,
but that relatability, it's what made John Madden a rock star.
(40:06):
Even John Gruden had this kind of entertainment aspect to him,
you know, And I don't know. I'm fascinated. I'm a
Tom Brady guy. I'm glad he did it. I think
we're all better off for him attempting this. And it
showed the clip that I saw tonight on the Fox broadcast.
(40:28):
He wasn't actually like on the air, they were just
doing their he's laughing and joking. If he's loose man,
he could be really, really good and I know this
that Week one Cleveland Dallas game would get a lot
of people watching no matter what. I bet they get
a twenty percent bump. I bet it's the highest rated
Week one afternoonslock game in the history of the league.
(40:51):
Because the intrigue of like, we're just gonna hang out
with Tom for three hours, it's what makes the Mannings
like just work. It's like, wait, I just get to
hang out with Peyton and Eli. You're just telling me
paidon Eli hanging out and I just get to watch
the game with him, even though the actual game is
going on another channels. Why they get a couple million
people just to watch that broadcast. It's yeah, it's come
(41:14):
hang out with Peyton and Eli, bullshit about the game.
And if Tom and those guys are just kind of
loose and having a good time, now their job's a
little different, right, They're not calling every individual play, so
it's not the same thing. But if he can kind
of strike that balance of like just being a guy's
guy and then giving his knowledge and giving his relatability,
(41:39):
there's a skill that is obviously unique to him given
his stature. I think it's going to be a major success.
The volume,
The volume Ben Hungary versus in college football. Well, we
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Speaker 1 (01:38):
Everybody? John Middlecoff three and Out podcast. How are we doing?
It's a beautiful Monday. Well, I'm recording this on a Sunday.
I went out with Colin before the Sunday night football games,
the Niner game the Bronco game, and we talked for
about an hour about football. And then after watching you know,
the first quarter and a half of co Old doing
(02:00):
something kind of crazy with Purdy Edelman on Ayuk, watching
the Saints' first teamers, and then watching bo Nix, I'm like,
you know what, I'm going to do another podcast as well,
and also I want to talk a little bit about
Tom Brady and who was at the game to night.
Him and Burkhart were kind of doing test runs. It's
hard not to get excited because we got one more
(02:22):
week of preseason and then the regular season is about
ten days around the corner and real football is off
and running. Obviously, College football week zeros, this week, week ones,
the following week, the holiday weekend, which is always exciting,
and then then we got real games, which you get
excited for preseason, and then all of a sudden you're
(02:42):
like watching backup quarterback. Actually, I can't, this is not
as fun as it should be, and usually pivot and
go do something else. Well, those days are close to
being over, which excites me. So we'll talk a little
bit about some of the stuff I saw tonight. And yeah,
so you guys know the Drill three and Out podcasts.
If you listen on Collins Feed, make sure you subscribe.
Go check out the YouTube page all of our contents
(03:06):
up there. If you go to Collins you can watch
the YouTube on our podcast as well. From Sunday and
the game Plan will be football podcast all week. We
got a couple interviews I'm gonna do this week for
the following week, maybe a college football preview, a big
gambling preview with my guy Stucky from the Action Network,
(03:26):
on some futures on some college and pro. Maybe we
do some individual props as well, like Offensive Rookie of
the Year Poe Nicks and yeah, it's exciting times. It's
a good time of year. But first on the Niners,
on the Broncos, and on the Saints. I gotta tell
you about my friends. Do you want to go to
one of these games? Do you want to go to
(03:46):
a regular season game? Do you want to go to
a college game? You want to go to a concert?
I just was getting text message last night from a
buddy who was in Atlanta at the Luke Bryan concert.
It looked like at the Brave Stadium. It looked a
lot of fun. They were just jamming out. He was
wearing a Brave jersey on stage. You want to go
to one of these concerts? My friends? My partners in
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The official ticketing app of this podcast, game Time, has
you covered. Just download the game Time app. It's really
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(04:32):
for twenty dollars off. Download the game Time app today.
Last minute tickets, lowest price is guaranteed. Most of you
don't live probably as deep in like forty nine or
Internet land as myself. But there can't be a more
successful coach given he's been to four NFC Championship games
(04:53):
in the last five years, been to multiple Super Bowls,
obviously didn't win them. But every coach besides Andy Reid
basically currently in the NFL, and maybe McVeigh would sign
up for that. And yet Kyle Shanahan is pretty controversial
in Internet Land, and I defend him. I think he's
one of the best coaches. I think his style translates.
(05:16):
He has an offensive philosophy that he can adapt to.
He's proven he can win with multiple quarterbacks now Jimmy
Garoppolo and Brock Party, so he calls the plays, can
coach two quarterbacks who, let's face it, aren't exactly Patrick
Mahomes or Josh Allen talent wise, and because of his
philosophical belief in physical run game, to me, it benefits
(05:38):
the offense or excuse me, the defense, and their defense
is always really physical and John Lynch. Whatever the Steelers
do when it comes to wide receivers, John Lynch is
proving to do that when it comes to safeties. They
have about seven safeties that easily could have played in
the nineties. They want to hit, and they want to
hit hard. But tonight was befuddling. Tonight was head scratcher.
(06:01):
Tonight was I can't defend Kyle on this one. He
rolled out brock Perdy with a bunch of second and
third stringers, a bunch of guys that are not gonna
play against the New York Jets come Week one. A
bunch of guys who are not legitimately not players, I mean,
will not be on the fifty three potentially against the Saints,
(06:22):
who will talk about in a minute. I think we're
gonna have one of the better defense in the league,
and we're rolling out their starters. I'm all for picking
a lane if you want to be a new school
guy and play nobody. I totally get it. The amount
of money that's on the line in this modern day NFL.
You're paying guys guards fifteen to twenty million. Obviously, quarterbacks
(06:45):
make a ton, wide receivers make a ton. Totally get it.
Star pass rushers, it is not worth the risk. The
juice isn't worth the squeeze. You know, I understand it now.
If you want to play in the lane of Andy Reid.
I've been coaching this league for thirty five years. I've
been a head coach since ninety nine, and I play
(07:06):
my guys in the preseason. Totally get it. But you
can't dip your toe in the water. You either got
to jump in the deep end and swim. Andy did it.
I was watching some of the game before I went
golfing on Saturday. Guess what happened. He rolled out mahomes
with who Oh, there's Travis Kelce, Oh there's Rashi Rice.
You know the guys he depended on in their Super
(07:28):
Bowl run, one of the greatest tight ends of all time.
And this other guy if he wouldn't, you know, take
substances and get behind a Lamborghini, would we'd be talking
about being one of the breakout stars in the league.
Probably cann get spend it, but real high end players.
Yet today, when the forty nine ers opened up on Fox,
which felt kind of big at least the pregame, they
(07:49):
got Julian Edelman and Carissa George Kittle walks out in sweats,
Deebo Samuel walks out in sweats in Louis sunglasses, looks
pretty good. Trent Williams is at home doing who knows
what somewhere, even Kyle's like, yeah, I think he's in Houston.
Brandon Ayuk probably at home on Instagram. Christian McCaffrey not
playing in the preseason. What the hell are you doing?
(08:13):
That is insanity to roll out party against one of
the best defenses with Randos, you're gonna you could have
got the guy killed. You almost did. He was getting
pepper at every play and then Perdy's running around trying
to play hero ball. What's going on? How does that
make any sense? Even on the flip side, Dennis Allen,
we're gonna play our guys, Okay, who does Derek roll
(08:36):
out with? I don't know, Chris Olave, Taysom Hill, guys
that he's going to play with in week one. I
don't get it. And this is the reason Kyle Shanahan
like can't get everyone behind him. Every once in a while,
just have one of these hit scratchers, like, what's going
on here? In what world? Does this make any sense?
(08:59):
Are you trying to go? Well, if we pay the
guy sixty million, this is gonna be the squad. Well,
if that's the case, and this is ever gonna be
your squad. Just get ready to draft to the top five,
because that would be an embarrassment. No one would watch.
By week seven or eight, the TVs would be turned
off in the Bay Area and you wouldn't be playing
any preseason games. Trust me, I've seen it. It's called
(09:20):
Jim tom Zula Chip Kelly ratings plummeted. We weren't paying attention.
I do not understand rolling out your starting quarterback, and
I want to call him scrubs because some of these
guys are gonna make the fifty three, but not starters.
When your premium players are in sweats, your quarterback's gotta
(09:40):
be in sweats. And listen, I understand Trent Williams isn't there,
so you're gonna have some random offensive linemen in the game.
But if George Kittle and Deebo Samuel and Christian McCaffrey
can't play, Brock perty should not play the risk in
those six or seven plays when he's scrambling around and
the Saints defensive linemen are chasing him and hitting him,
(10:03):
I thought was absolute insanity. We've gotten back and forth
and talked a lot about like some craziness over the preseason,
like Judawn and Mayo screaming at each other. You know,
I saw on Reddick's trade, which some of it is
like kind of serious but also kind of funny, Like
there was nothing funny about this. This was crazy. This
(10:25):
was legitimately made no sense. This was one of those
where if you were some random coach with no equity,
I mean, people be looking at you side eyed in
the building. I just I can't fathom the decision making
that went behind this to roll out party with that
crew of characters. I don't get it. Julian Edelman said
(10:49):
something interesting before the game. First and foremost said, usually
when you win a Super Bowl, that's when everyone wants
to get paid. In the forty nine ers situation, they
haven't won a Super Bowl and everyone's ready to get paid.
Though I get Brandon Ayuk, it's time bitess contract, time
to get broken off. And Trent Williams well has a
lot left on his contract. It's not guaranteed, and as
(11:10):
you saw today, his value to the forty nine Ers
clearly went up. But I think Edelman is a good example,
and I think Travis Kelcey is another good example. And
I've been saying this forever. When you win in sports,
your value never ends. You become especially in a big
market in a big city for a powerhouse team, you
(11:30):
become a legend in that franchise, and your value in
terms of ability to earn is forever. Jerry Rice is,
you know, limping around with Brett Farvan commercials now at
fifty five years old. Joe Montana gets paid wherever he
goes Hell. Obviously, Tom Brady won a bunch of Super Bowls.
(11:53):
He got almost four hundred million dollars to colleie football game,
which he never has yet zero prior experience. Fox gave
him three hundred and seventy five million dollars. Fox opened
up tonight with Julian Edelman, who's not going to go
to the Hall of Fame, who didn't break any records yet,
(12:14):
is a three time Super Bowl champion, won a Super
Bowl MVP, and we'll be able to earn off his
name till the moment he's buried because of the name
recognition being synonymous with winning. And Brandon Nyuk clearly knows
that because he told the Patriots to kick rocks, he
didn't want to go to the Browns. Don't really understand
(12:34):
his mindset on going to the Steelers. That would be
a disaster. His best chance to be a star in
the league is to stay on the forty nine Ers.
Because if Brandon Nyuk was currently going through the situation
on a random team, on a team that consistently drafts
in the top ten, do you know what we'd be
doing not talking about Brandon Nyuk. No one would care.
(12:57):
Beside that individual market. This has been one of the
biggest national stories. This guy catches seventy five balls a year.
We're not talking about Randy Moss or tyreek Hill. That's
not the case here. But because he's part of a
winner and a powerhouse franchise, we discuss them and it's
(13:20):
become a big, big national story. I'd be discussing them
no matter what. But it wouldn't be the same if
you put them on the Minnesota Vikings or the Jacksonville Jaguars.
If or he was on the New England Patriots, no
one would care. And I think Edelman is right because
you've seen Kelsey hasn't made as much as he could
(13:41):
playing for the Chiefs, but you know what, he's known
as a legend, three times Super Bowl champion, one of
the great players of all time, synonymous with greatness. See
it all the time in the NBA. Now those guys
get paid, But like these guys that don't win, no
one's gonna care about him once their career is over.
When you have rings and I love when players push
(14:02):
again the ring culture, Well, yeah, that's the whole point
of the sport. That is the reason you play to
try to win a championship. Like most of our businesses
are like, yeah, you can always make more money. We're
doing well, but we could do better. When it comes
to team sports or individuals sports, there is like a
(14:25):
finality to it all. On a given tournament, on a
given season, you win or do you lose? And that's
how we judge you, and that's how you make money
for the rest of your life. Are you a champion
orre you not a champion? And obviously the best chance
for this guy to be a champion is with this team,
and the best chance for this guy to keep winning
(14:47):
is with this team. So I don't know all the
details of this situation. Honestly, I think it's semi embarrassing.
Like I get having crazy back and forth with Nick
Bosa with TJ. Watt with the great players, I mean
the truly great players, the really really good ones, Like
I kind of sided with management on that one. Would
(15:07):
drive me a little nuts. John Lynch had to come
back from vacation and meet with this guy over the summer.
And I like Brandon a you. I like him a lot,
but holy shit, I mean, let's pump the brakes here.
We're not talking about Jerry Rice. So Trent Williams, like,
I get it. I do. First bout Hall of Fame,
one of the best tackles of all time. He wants
(15:28):
to be a pain in the ass and ask for
way more money than you think he's worth. Like that's
part of the game. This is a business. This one
is like, let's get this deal done. Like we all
know you don't want to leave because you had the opportunity.
Called your bluff on that one. I get this negotiating
tactics and getting weird, but like, time to end this thing.
It's time to get the show on the road. Here
(15:49):
on the flip side, I feel pretty good about this take.
I think I'm gonna put a future bet on the
Saints to win the division, partly because of value and
partly because I think they're gonna be pretty goo. Their
defense clearly is good, not really debatable at this time.
Like they were good last year, they're gonna be good
again this year. The question mark with the franchise was offense.
(16:11):
Is their offense good enough? And so far it's like
last year it was not. And then you hire Kubiak's
kid who comes from Kyle, and now the history of
the McVeigh and Kyle guys has been pretty good. This
is not the Belichick tree. When you hire these guys
to be your coordinator, your head coach kind of works
(16:33):
as long as they keep calling plays, I e. Robert
Sola call the defense buddy. To me, this is gonna
come down to their success. Kubiak and Derek and there
were a couple of throws to Night like the difference
why Cousins is a better player than Derek. I'm talking small,
small margins of accuracy. A ball a little behind a
(16:54):
guy on an out route where if it's two feet
toward the sideline, it's an easy completion in a first down.
And in this offense, they're not asking you to be
Patrick Mahomes. Because the Saints I think are gonna be
pretty good running the ball. As they said on the broadcast,
no team is paying their running back room more than
New Orleans Saints. But there were a couple past to night.
(17:16):
One was complete, one was not, where Derek was just
a tick off. The key in this offense is accuracy.
They will scheme guys open. If you're having success running
the football, you're gonna get some pretty layup throws for
NFL quarterbacks. And Derek's making a lot of money to
make those throws. The pressure on him is pretty massive.
(17:40):
Obviously Kubiak, first time play caller, Obviously there's pressure there.
But I'm watching the night like, guys are open, Derek's
got to hit that. And we discussed that kind of
that group of guys that Derek used to be considered
in and then kind of fell out. Like the golf,
the Cousins, the DAC like, they hit those. They don't
do some of the spectacularship but they hit some of
the basics. That's why if your team's good enough, you
(18:02):
can win eleven twelve games with them, and when they
get really good games, they look really good. They also
have some down games, but maybe their defense carries them.
So I like the Saints this year I like them
a lot, but obviously betting on Derek can be a
risky proposition. And tonight, like I'm talking pretty minute details
here of a throw, and that could be the difference
(18:24):
of being nine and eight again and having a good team,
or being ten to seven and win the division, or
being eleven and six. Because I think their defense, it
will not shock me at all off their top five defense.
They definitely have some pieces on offense. A lot of
people talk shit about Taysom Hill. Obviously he's not a quarterback.
He could play for my team any day of the
week and twice on Sundays. Chris Olave pretty good. Alvin
(18:47):
Kamara pretty good. The offensive lineman they drafted in the
first round from Oregon State. Like that guy a lot,
Like he's going to be a player. So the Derek
got a lot of money, did this big free agency tour,
gets a little bit of a pass last year. Persions
on them, pisser, get off the pot, and I think
(19:08):
I'm gonna back them financially. It's gonna be a roller coaster.
Part of the reason we gamble kind of like the
highs and lows. Ready for it, like the value there.
I think the Saints are really really interesting. This year,
Colin and I talked about it. We talked before the game,
and then more and more I think about it. I
bet anyone listening to this, especially if you work in
(19:31):
a partner situation or work very very closely with one
individual in a B to B relationship where that B
to B is a majority of your business, where when
you do not like the people you work with, it
is difficult. I don't care if you're making a lot
of money or you know, trying to create something, it
(19:52):
can be a challenge. It is why it's way easier
in any professional relationship. You don't have to love the guy.
You don't have to go to dinner and hang out
with this family, but there has to be a healthy
amount of respect. And usually when you respect the guy,
if the guy's pretty talented or whoever you're working with,
you end up kind of liking them. Think how many
(20:12):
people you gravitate toward and befriend after you leave college
or your early twenties, whatever you're doing through a work relationship,
you meet a lot of friends that way. I know
some of the people I'm closest with and text all
the time are people I've met through football or radio. Hell,
I mean my podcast crew, James Adam. We text all
(20:35):
the time because you work hand in hand, you work closely.
So Daniel new to the operation just on a group text.
You just you just work together closely, and when you
like the other people, it is much easier to operate.
Sean Payton was never gonna like Russell Wilson, and the
moment he watched them play, he couldn't stand him. And
(20:56):
I understood it because if I don't really respect you,
kind of weirdo, and then I don't think you're very good,
and especially in that situation when you're making all this
money and I go, you ain't worth this at all.
I didn't pay you this. It was destined to fail.
And I understand like former players, they all are biased
toward this. So many of them freaked out. Bullshit the
(21:17):
way they handled the ball. He got paid to eighty
million dollars to hit the door. Give me a break.
I feel bad for the guy that gets fired, has
two kids and has no money coming in. I feel
zero sympathy for a guy who's not any good anymore
and couldn't cut it, can't hack it. And if you
watch the Steelers the other day and I was playing
golf when the game was going on, and I got
a bunch of DMS like are you're watching this? I
(21:39):
get home and immediately watched it. He's a washed player.
It is what it is. Then you start working with
someone you like, someone you respect, especially in a situation
like Sean, I can mold them it's gonna work. I don't.
I don't have the box score in front of me.
I don't need it. If you watch bo Nicks these
(21:59):
last two play for the Denver Broncos, you go, yeah,
that's what it's kind of supposed to look like. I'm
not saying he's gonna be a Hall of Famer. I'm
not saying he's gonna be a future MVP, but he
definitely has a lot too. I've been watching this stuff
long enough to know, yeah, I like what I'm seeing.
And then I looked at the Offensive Rookie of the
Year odds. Obviously, Caleb is the heavy favorite. He's plus
(22:24):
one thirty five to win the Offensive Rookie of the Year,
which those odds are just crazy. Even if you love
Caleb as a gambler, you couldn't bet them. Jayden Daniels
is almost five to one. Also pretty intriguing, even though
dan Quinn I saw yesterday they did like a schemed run.
What did Jayden do? What have we been talking about?
(22:46):
A lot of talent there. Caleb gotta win from within
the pocket to become a star in the future. Jayden
Daniels has to find a way to get down, slide,
hit the ground, do whatever. Jayden Daniels ran right through tackles,
and dan Quinn's on the side like, get down, get down.
Both of those guys uber talented. I'm watching bo Nicks
(23:06):
and I go I see a lot of talent. I
see an offensive coordinator who's the head coach, who's all in.
They got some wide receivers. I got an offensive coordinator
who schemed a lot of the best offenses in the
history of the league. He's fourteen to one. Fourteen to
one to win the Offensive Rookie of the Year. From a
value standpoint, I don't even think it's debatable, Like, if
(23:29):
you're gonna bet him, you got to drizzle money on
that guy. I don't know. It's a halftime now when
I'm recording this. The moment he played his first preseason game,
he was gonna be the Week one starter after this.
And I understand this isn't about like he's playing backups.
(23:50):
Just watch the guy play. The movements, the accuracy, the
ability to get rid of the ball. Same with Calebs,
same with Jayden. It's not about who you're playing, it's
the attributes. Then it's on the coaches seam Paygnon's making
eighteen million dollars a year. You know all the Bears
coaches making a lot, quarterback coach making nine hundred, g's,
Oven's a coordinator probably making two and a half. Obviously,
(24:11):
dan Quinn's making ten million, Cliff's probably making three or four.
You got to coach these guys up. So it's on
the coaches who get paid premiums to figure it out.
But the talent on those three individuals eye popping. And
if you would have told me that when the preseason started,
I would have thought, obviously, Caleb has the best physical
(24:31):
characteristics in terms of arm and throwing on the run,
Jaden athleticism. I would put bow Knicks right there too,
movement wise, arm strength, like I would have assumed bo
Knick's arm looked a lot on a different level than
those two guys. And I don't see a huge gap.
(24:52):
When you say, does bo Knicks have a good arm,
my first reaction is yes, he does. So if I'm
a Denver Bronco fan, we got rid of the anchor
that is Russell Wilson, and I would say the drama
that comes behind that, because, let's face it, there's a lot.
And as I told Colin, I think what's going to
be the undoing of the Steelers is the drama in
(25:14):
that quarterback room because those guys are so famous. There
was like this famous aura with Russell Wilson that you
just couldn't shake. And for most of his career it
was always someone else's fault. Every offensive coordinator Russell Wilson
has ever had before Sean Payton got fired, every single one,
(25:36):
all of them, Seattle, all of them fired. Nathaniel Hacket
year one fire. You can bring up names, Shit, this
guy's not good enough. Whatever. In my life watching Football
Hall of Fame in their prime, sweet quarterbacks, you know
what happens their assistant coaches they become head coaches. Look
at Rogers, look at Big Ben obviously Tom Manning. Like
(26:00):
their guys move up the ladder. Russell's went the other way,
they always got the finger pointed at them. It was
their fault. Maybe it wasn't, Maybe it wasn't. Maybe Sean
Payton was right. And listen, everyone that talked a bunch
of shit. Last year, when Sean Payton went to him like, hey,
you want to you want to stick around here, change
your guarantees, ninety percent of the media freaked out. I
(26:26):
was like, what what are we talking about? He's asking,
do you want to change it or not? If not,
we're gonna bench you and move on. We're not afraid
to cut you because our owner's worth fifty billion dollars.
We don't give a shit. Here are your options. Welcome
to real life. At one point in time and all
of our lives were presented with a couple options. Professionally,
(26:46):
pick one or the other and listen, you live with it.
And he said, no, okay, see you don't let the
door hit you. It feels like they are going to
have such a more symbiotic and like more normal relationship
because one thing New Orleans always had now Drew Brees
(27:08):
Hall of Famer, but he's like one of the most normal,
high character guys in the league. Everyone loved him, got
along with everyone. I forget the offensive lineman he did
play by play. I think it was a center for
the Saints for a little bit. God, I forget his name.
And he retired like six seven, maybe eight years ago now,
(27:32):
and he started crying in his retirement speech talking about
Drew Brees. So Sean Payton went from that to Russell,
and I had defended Russell like the own office and
all that. It didn't bother me. It's people you can't
get along with. Teammates don't think you're normal. Part of
big a quarterback is being able to be relatable. Even
(27:56):
though you know, Patrick Mahomes he's making ninety million dollars
on and off the field, it always feels like all
his teammates like him. I saw on YouTube Tom Brady
I think started a YouTube page and it's you know, Tom,
I don't know if he's being truly authentic. It's not
about the content. It was just cool, like flying private
jets on these uh sweet yachts and who knows where.
(28:20):
It's just like kind of an insight in Tom's life.
It's like, God, this guy's living good in the back
of like sweet limos that it rolls Royces like this
guy's living like a you know, he's like one of
the kings or princes somewhere. You know, it's it's it
was cool insight. He has been so rich now for
so long, yet everybody till his last day in Tampa
(28:42):
was like, couldn't be any cooler, couldn't be any more normal.
That's why I like I defend Caleb Williams in terms
of the way his teammates talk about him. Didn't like
the painted nails, saying fuck you Utah, Like that's that's
slappy behavior. But usually with that you're like, god, do
the teammate thing. He's kind of a weirdo. It's like
(29:03):
you watch The Hard Knocks, seems like everyone likes him.
If everyone likes you, give yourself a shot. Rock Purdy
pretty polarizing player. You know who loves them? I'll tell
you Fred Warner, Trent Williams, Deebo, Samuel George Kittle kind
of matters. You know why Trey Lance got wally pipped
in the blink of an eye. Teammates didn't believe in him,
and they liked the guy. So when they don't like
(29:25):
you and then they don't believe in you, I think
Pittsburgh's got a major problem on their hands. And I
think Denver is just kind of got kind of got
out of a bad breakup dating someone new, and it's like, God,
life's pretty easy. I don't have to force things. Just
like conversation goes, go out to dinner, not screaming at
each other. It's like this, this is smooth, this is easy.
(29:48):
We've all experienced that in one relationship to another relationship
like this is way easier than that used to be.
It's like, yeah, because that was a toxic relationship. That's
not healthy, that's not not normal, that's not conducive to success.
And bo Nick Champagne's gonna work. Got news for you. Yeah,
(30:09):
I don't really know who's debating that. And I'm not
saying they're gonna make the playoffs this year, though, not
the craziest thing, because you go around the league, you
got like there's some weird quarterback situations. Rogers is forty.
What if he can't really move this year? Deshaun Watson
makes like eight hundred million dollars, what if he kind
of sucks? Joe Burrow, what if he can't stay healthy?
(30:33):
You know where I stood on the Chargers bet, which
I did love three weeks ago, don't love it as
much anymore. You know why their entire team always gets
injured and they're pretty dependent on a couple guys on
defense that are always hurt Khalil Mack and Joey Bosa,
who's literally hurt right now. And their quarterbacks has been
in a boot. So part of like good vibes, you know,
(30:57):
it's an overused term on the internet, like just vibe.
Positive vibes do matter. That doesn't mean you don't have
to work hard. That doesn't mean there are certain things
no matter what you're doing, that boxes you don't have
to check. But like being optimistic and being excited is
pretty healthy. Look at the Chiefs, you know what, They've
(31:17):
had a lot of just good vibes. Winning brings that
for sure. It's hard to have good vibes when you're losing.
You don't meet many like broke people that are smiling
all the time. Like I get it. I'm not acting
like they can go six and ten or six and eleven.
They're gonna be a bunch of good vibes. But you
remove Russell Wilson, that was just a giant pain in
their ass, not debatable to bow Nicks, who's just like
(31:42):
this young, hungry guy who's pretty talented, and if all
things are equal, same amount of money, I could have
this guy for a million or this guy for a
million in twenty twenty four, Is there one general manager
that today, including the Steelers, that would take Russell Wilson
over bow Nicks. Seeing the guy play a real NFL
game got news for you. There isn't. The Steelers would
(32:05):
trade Russell Wilson for bow Knicks yesterday, So sometimes things
just work out. They took a lot of shit for
that too. Everyone's like, oh, they're gonna take bow Nicks.
That's that's gonna be crazy, you take bow Nicks. It's
like I told Colin this Kenny Pickett, the Steelers drafted
twentieth overall, he's not very talented. Mac Jones not very talented. Historically,
(32:26):
guys like bow Knicks don't go where he went. But
then you watch him play and you go, well, he's
actually pretty talented. Like he has physical skills, the movement,
the size, the arm strength, like he has first round characteristics.
The mac Jones, the Kenny Picketts. I just use those
two guys' examples because one guy went fifteen and one
guy went twenty, and they don't check any of the
(32:48):
first round characteristics. Like Listen, obviously he shouldn't have gone
as far as he did in the draft board. But
like Brock, Purty doesn't have that many tangible first round
character Some of his stuff's intangible read a defense, get
rid of the ball fast. Those guys typically go in
the later rounds. Doesn't mean you can't strike oil with him.
(33:09):
Kirk Cousins, Dak Prescott, Rock Purty. Not every guy needs
to go in the first round, but when you do
draft a first round quarterback, you better fucking be right,
because you're wrong. The forty nine ers got very, very
lucky with the Tray Lance situation. Did They drafted Rock
Purty with the last pick in the draft, and he
became a good player. Because I'm watching the Raiders Cowboys,
(33:32):
which not gonna lie tough watch, the Raiders have a
question at quarterback, clearly. I mean both the guys seem
pretty average to me. But Trey Lance failed in the
NFL and he's currently failing in the NFL. Not because
he doesn't try, not because guys don't like him. He
just doesn't have the capability to like throw change ups.
(33:55):
Everything's really fast. He can't slow himself down. Anyone who's
ever play golf, it's easy on the driving range to
be like slow it down, nice and smooth, and then
you get on the course all of a sudden, muscle
memory starts kicking in and you can't help it. You're
spraying it right left. You're like, what the hell's going on?
Because you're a little more amped up. It's no different
(34:15):
than playing quarterback. You gotta slow it down. And you
watch Trey Lance. Everything's quick, everything's so fast. Fields is
like the better version of him. It's like, take a
deep breath, man, just relax a little bit. And they can't.
It's not because they're not trying. They're not attentive in meetings,
good guys like it's such a hard position to play. Obviously,
(34:38):
if you don't try, none of the effort, you got
no chance. But when you struggle to do a couple
things in the NFL accurately hit basic routes where you
can't throw a fastball and stay in the pocket, like,
that's kind of Russell Wilson's undoing of his career. Can't
(34:58):
play from the pocket, doesn't want does not want to
constantly scrambles around. Earlier in his career when he was
a great athlete, thrived at that because he had these
great physical skills. Those don't exist anymore at thirty five
like they did at twenty six years old. Caleb actually
is Russell Wilson in his prime in Seattle right now.
(35:20):
That's the way he plays. If something's not there right away,
he kind of moves around, scrambles around and makes great
plays and defenders have a hard time catching him because
he's like twenty one twenty two years old, in the
prime of his just movement skills and obviously has a
huge arm. But part of why Russell Wilson in the
prime of his career couldn't quite be on the level
(35:41):
like the Brady Man could. He couldn't dominate within the
pocket consistently. And to me, Kayleb Williams is a good example,
like for him to become the superstar like Patrick Mahomes, Well,
Patrick Mahomes can dominate from him within the pocket, and
he did early in his career. And I'm not putting
that pressure. If Caleb Williams just plays like he's playing
right right now, that could get the Bear's nine ten wins.
(36:03):
It's gonna be a lot of ad libbing, a lot
of wild plays. But for him to consistently be what
he has the capability of being with his physical attributes,
he's gonna have to balance that with playing in the pocket.
And on third and nine, I can't scramble around if
something's there, I gotta sit in that extra second and
throw that dirt and hit the guy on for nine
yards on third and eight. And that, to me, he's
(36:25):
on the coaches to get it out of him. And
like I said, with fields and sometimes certain guys may
he may never have that capability if he just becomes
Russell Wilson, become a Hall of Famer, the prime version,
not this version. That's what's so fascinating about quarterback play now.
I think the one thing that's on display every single
game you watch, even with the backups movement skills, is
(36:48):
a big deal. The day and age of just Eli Manning,
Philip Rivers, the Drew Bledsoe's all the quarterbacks I grew
up on beside, like Steve Young and like Michael Vick.
The statue in the pocket he's kind of dead. I mean,
there aren't even that many left in the NFL. Jared
Goff Obviously, I would say Matt Stafford at this age.
I think Rogers is gonna be that this year. But
(37:10):
most of these guys, when you go through the top quarterbacks,
Mahomes can move, Josh Allen can move, Burrow went healthy
is I'm not comparing the Lamar Jackson movement wise, but
like Montana can move around, no problem obviously, Lamar Kyler,
Jalen Hurts, Party can move, Dak can move. Cousins is
somewhat of a dinosaur that way. Can only play within
(37:32):
the pocket, but if you dominate within the pocket, you
can succeed. Look at Drew Brees's career. He wasn't very tall.
So it's just my favorite subject to talk about. Well,
two coaches and quarterbacks watching the highlights of Kevin Burkhardt,
(37:57):
who's just cool dude. He came on this podcast couple
years ago and I have to hit him up with
the text get him back on before the season or
maybe during the season. And Tom Brady doing their kind
of warm up games. They're gonna be a lot of people.
Just usually with broadcast crews, no one cares like it
just does not matter. You could just put anyone on.
(38:20):
We learned with Monday Night Football, that's not true. I
need a little pizzazz, right, That's why John Madden, John
Gruden like, I need a little star power. ESPN fucked
it up for a minute and then they got Troy
Aikman Joe Buck feels normal again. But most games on Sunday,
like the game handles the broadcast. I know all my
buddies constantly bash most of the broadcasters. The Brady Burkhart
(38:43):
thing was specifically Tom. I mean, we've seen Kevin called
Super Bowl last year, a couple of years ago. I
think maybe they got it this year. Is that I
don't know how it's gonna go because you watch the
YouTube thing of Tom like in Paris with his kids loose.
But I is at the guy that Bill and Gronk
(39:03):
and Julian getting no chance. I'm very fascinated on how
he's gonna bounce it because when Tom's being a guy,
no human has ever met Tom that doesn't like him.
He feels like the most relatable, famous, rich guy like
the history of America. Most of my favorite athletes or
biggest athletes in my life least relatable humans alive. Michael
(39:24):
Jordan not at all, Tiger Woods, no chance, Barry Bonds.
People can stand them, right, I mean, these guys struggle,
which kind of makes sense. How do they have anything
common with anybody? Guys don't even go to the store,
they don't even fill their own gas. It's hard to
relate to just even successful people when you're just living
(39:45):
in a completely different world. Yet Tom could balance that
with his coaches, with his assistant coaches, with his teammates,
with the equipment guy who's great at it. And if
you get that guy, it's impossible to not be a
good broadcaster because his fame. He obviously is well spoken,
but that relatability, it's what made John Madden a rock star.
(40:06):
Even John Gruden had this kind of entertainment aspect to him,
you know, And I don't know. I'm fascinated. I'm a
Tom Brady guy. I'm glad he did it. I think
we're all better off for him attempting this. And it
showed the clip that I saw tonight on the Fox broadcast.
(40:28):
He wasn't actually like on the air, they were just
doing their he's laughing and joking. If he's loose man,
he could be really, really good and I know this
that Week one Cleveland Dallas game would get a lot
of people watching no matter what. I bet they get
a twenty percent bump. I bet it's the highest rated
Week one afternoonslock game in the history of the league.
(40:51):
Because the intrigue of like, we're just gonna hang out
with Tom for three hours, it's what makes the Mannings
like just work. It's like, wait, I just get to
hang out with Peyton and Eli. You're just telling me
paidon Eli hanging out and I just get to watch
the game with him, even though the actual game is
going on another channels. Why they get a couple million
people just to watch that broadcast. It's yeah, it's come
(41:14):
hang out with Peyton and Eli, bullshit about the game.
And if Tom and those guys are just kind of
loose and having a good time, now their job's a
little different, right, They're not calling every individual play, so
it's not the same thing. But if he can kind
of strike that balance of like just being a guy's
guy and then giving his knowledge and giving his relatability,
(41:39):
there's a skill that is obviously unique to him given
his stature. I think it's going to be a major success.
The volume,
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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