October 3, 2024 • 40 mins
Greg Cosell from NFL Films joins The Herd talk about Aaron Rodgers this season, the issues with the Eagles, Caleb Williams and more
Colin gives his favorite big bets of the week
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go live in Los Angeles, our number two.
It's the Hurd. Wherever you may be and however you
may be listening. Thanks for making us part of your day. Tonight,
Baker Mayfield, Kirk Cousins Sneaky interesting game Atlanta Tampa Bay
Baseball Playoffs Mets. Later this afternoon, we were talking about
this is that in our business, baseball doesn't feed the family,
(00:49):
so to speak, in our business until the postseason and
the potential now Podras Dodgers will be unbelievable. There's it.
If you live out Easter or Midwest, you may not
know it, but it feels like I felt like San
Francisco Dodgers was a real rivalry. But then San Diego
decided about five years ago, we're gonna go buy a
bunch of stars and some some have worked, some have
not but tatists the batting camp they got I think
(01:14):
from Miami leadoff guy Manny Machado. Uh, they've gone all
in and it's like they're not as wealthy or as
stars studded as the Dodgers, but they're close and they're
red hot, and they made trading deadline moves. And then
Mets Phillies again. You know, everybody talks Yankees, but Mets
Phillies feels intense to me. It feels big. Plus New
(01:36):
York sports has been for so many years, almost a decade, irrelevant,
So like you have to understand when the Patriots wobble
into town and Aaron and the Jets beat them. Literally,
New York get to the Super Bowl talk and I
think the Mets will win today. But I don't know.
If the Mets win today, they have World Series talk.
(01:57):
That's just the way it works. They're so starved in
New York, like Los bigger cities. Chicago is pretty sports starved.
I mean, I mean, Bulls have been bad for a
long time. Bears are the Bears. I mean, it's Northwestern
football is not, you know, moving the meter. And then
all of a sudden you've gotten Los Angeles We've been
(02:18):
very fortunate here where the Dodgers have been great but
only one shortened season title. Rams have a Super Bowl.
You know, Clippers and Lakers are absolutely relevant. Lakers again
in the bubble, won a championship. But it does feel
like New York is sort of sports starved, and I
think it's better in sports when New York is interesting.
I don't think the Giants are bad, but I also
don't think the Jets are good or very good. Mets
(02:42):
Yankees we'll see. And with that Greg Cosel forty five
years at NFL Films Fantasy, you bet it. You want
to get smarter. It is such a crazy week to
week league. You just don't know. Buffalo is on top
of the world. They get blown out. Cannot stop Lamar Jackson,
who will talk about in ten minutes, But I do
(03:04):
want to talk about the Jets. They've got some injuries
here to deal with, mostly on the defensive side. And
the Vikings. So the Vikings right now are They're a
star studded offensive team and a star studied coaching staff.
What will the Jets and Aaron Rodgers see defensively because
they don't have a lot of high profile defenders, Yet
they're getting a lot of pressure on the quarterback. What
(03:26):
are the Vikings do and what will Aaron see defensively?
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Look, obviously Rogers has seen everything colon in his career,
but that doesn't mean you don't do what you do
against him and try to slow down the process. And
the Vikings are a really difficult defense to play against
because what they do, what Brian Fluur does so well,
is he'll line up six or seven along the defensive
front and you have to account for those people. You
(03:52):
can make assumptions about who might come or who might
not come. So they demand that you protect, and usually
they demand that you protect with more than five. So
now you have a back or a tight end that
even if they're not a primary pass protector, they need
to chip, they need to do something to be part
of the protection. So now you're losing an eligible receiver
(04:14):
as a primary route runner. And so what the Vikings
often do is from these six or seven man fronts
is then they'll drop people out. Sometimes they'll rush three,
so you end up with eight in coverage versus maybe
three receivers or four receivers at most. They do this exceptionally. Well,
that's what they did to see j Stroud and the
(04:35):
Texans a few weeks ago. So they are an extremely
difficult defense to play against because they don't necessarily have
great people.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
They will give up yards at times.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
But as you probably know, the Jets last week really
struggled in pass protection. They played the rookie Feshanu from
Penn State at right tackle and he looked stiff.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
He had a really.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Difficult time one on one blocking versus Jonathan Cooper from
the Broncos.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Okay, so Philadelphia is a well run franchise that is
in sort of disarray. Defense hasn't been great for years.
Jalen Hurts was wonderful with Shane Steichen. Now they look lost.
There's multiple reports there's fissures in the Sirianni Jalen Hirts relationship.
Let's just talk Jalen Hurts the quarterback. What is happening?
(05:20):
We know the turnovers have been amped up for the
last year. What are you seeing on film?
Speaker 4 (05:24):
Right?
Speaker 1 (05:25):
What are you seeing?
Speaker 4 (05:26):
Well?
Speaker 3 (05:26):
I think with Jalen and I'm going to just point
out the first play of the game from last week.
They called a very basic play. It's quarterbacking one oh one,
and I think people can probably visualize this if they're
listening on radio. What they called was a mirrored route
combination curl flat to each side and a sit route
(05:48):
right in front of the quarterback over the ball.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
That's a very basic staple concept. There was a throat
to be made.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Jalen is not throwing basic route concepts, okay, so it
becomes very hard for a coach. Kellen Moore is their
new coordinator, and I'm sure a lot of people are
blaming him for their offense. But you have to be
able to make those throws. And I think they're also
searching for an identity. I'm sure Kellen Moore is trying
to figure out how you get the best out of
(06:17):
Jalen Hurts, get him into the game comfortably, which they're
trying to do, and yet at the same time, make
sure that Saquon Barkley is a foundation of what you do.
And my sense is they're still searching for that identity.
But Jalen Hurts has been struggling with basic concepts and
until he really executes those, it becomes difficult.
Speaker 4 (06:38):
All right.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
So Caleb Williams is somebody. Here's the positive on Caleb Williams.
Every week we've seen steps and you know what you
get worried about is when you see a quarterback go up, back,
up back the roller coaster. Now you rarely get Jayden
Daniels where a guy is just excellent. But with Caleb,
I am seeing the accuracy the passer rating so against
(07:02):
the rams. Is there anything with Caleb you saw? I
felt he looked more settled. My take was from the two.
He just felt a little more settled. He had a
run game, That's what I saw.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Yeah, I think the run game's important. I think they
dialed it down a bit. They gave him easier throws.
He did miss some throws that you have to make,
and we'll see if that continues.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I didn't really view him as a scattershot passer at USC,
and he's been a little scattershot, which probably leads me
to believe he's just not a comfortable player. Yet, I
think we have to look at it this.
Speaker 3 (07:37):
Way with all young quarterbacks, Colin, there's a sense now
because so many of them come into the league, they're brands.
We've been talking about these guys for years and years,
seemingly since they're twelve years old.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
So I think a lot of.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
People think these guys come in the league and if
they don't play well right away, it's because the coaching
isn't good.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
It's the reverse.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
These guys have to learn how to play NFL quarterback,
which is different than playing college quarterback. So when Caleb
Williams struggles a bit and has to learn, that's a
perfectly normal thing. That doesn't mean he can't play NFL quarterback.
But it takes time, and so much is involved with
what they're asked to do. You've got to dial it down.
(08:16):
You mentioned Jane Daniels, and he's played exceptionally well, but
when you watch his tape, Colin, they don't ask him
to make a lot of difficult throws. Now, he's made
some that have been absolutely special. There's no question about it.
He's played at a high level. I mean, he's only
missed nineteen throws in four games. Only nineteen in completions.
That's ridiculous. But when you watch the tape, you see
(08:38):
a lot of basic, easy throws by NFL standards, and
that's the right thing to do. You're trying to allow
these quarterbacks to grow into the NFL game, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
Now, I want to go to somebody that's older than
Caleb Williams, has more experienced Justin Fields, he's on his
second team, yep. So in Chicago he was not a
good fourth quarter quarterback. He could be turnover prone. Again,
I felt a lot of times that he didn't see
the field well. So he goes to Pittsburgh, a better
run operation. Arthur Smith obviously a good enough coordinator to
(09:14):
become a head coach in Atlanta. So it's Arthur Smith
and Justin Fields. So what are you seeing with Justin
now in this organization? What is he doing now? He
didn't in Chicago or maybe it was a staff issue.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I think he's somewhat similar in terms of how he plays.
I think he's one of those quarterbacks that he's not
necessarily a natural timing and rhythm player.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
So that's never going to be really his game.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
I'm not sure you can teach someone how to be
really refined like he's never going to become CJ.
Speaker 4 (09:49):
Stroud. That's not going to happen.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
So now what you're relying on is really defining the
reeds and the throats for him very very cleanly, so
that he can feel really comfortable delivering the ball. And
then he does always have that outside of structured dimension
to his game. Yeah, and I mean I in watching
the tape last week, there were not that many throws
from the pocket. You know, I'm talking about real throws.
(10:13):
I'm not just talking about you know, really short throws.
I'm talking about where he drops back and drives the
ball at the intermediate levels.
Speaker 4 (10:20):
You didn't see many of those at all. That's not
really his game.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
So the question becomes, can you become a higher level
quarterback if you can't do that. There's no question he
can make quote unquote plays, but he's not by nature
a timing rhythm guy.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
Okay, two things I want to concentrate on. So Rashi Rice,
we think is out for the year, but they're going
to test him again. So it did feel like to us,
Greg he had gone from kind of an inconsistent talented
kid in the first couple of weeks. You're like, oh,
he's a one Now. I'm not saying Jamar Chase, but
it feels like he's going to be an eighty catch
(10:57):
volume number one. If he's out, based on what you've seen,
what does that do to the Kansas City offense?
Speaker 4 (11:09):
Well, I think it probably signifies that Kelsey comes back
as that guy.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
Because Kelsey, you can certainly move all around the formation.
He's formation flexible and versatile, so they'll focus on him
a lot more. We saw them take the deep shot
last week to Worthy. We saw them go to Worthy
at the end of the game on a critical third
down that won the game. So I think Worthy, as
a guy who ultimately watching his college tape, I thought
(11:36):
he could be more than just a vertical threat. But again,
he's a rookie, so that may take time. You're seeing
the vertical throw here. I think they need to get
him more involved doing other things than just being a
vertical dimension.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
We'll see how it plays out. I think right now
Mahomes is not necessarily a comfortable player, and maybe it's
because of the receiving corps. We don't know that.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Yeah, but do you remember a few years ago and
Mahomes went through a bad stretch. Yes, you read dialed
them down a bit. You've got him back on track.
That may need to happen again.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Okay, So Davante Adams, I've said before, college furnishes the
NFL with about fifteen good receivers a year. Be careful
about overpaying, Yes, but there are players like Davonte Adams,
especially in this toxic situation with the Jets. If they
go get blown out by Minnesota, this thing could unravel
quickly and he could be the juice outside of Garrett
(12:29):
Wilson that maybe you need. I don't know. It feels
like it would work because Aaron's played with him. So
give me a kind of a breakdown. A lot of
these receivers. You know, Nico Collins, isn't Xavier or Worthy,
isn't Cooper Cup, isn't Pukinakua. They're all different. What does
Davante bring to the table? What dimension would he help
the Saints or the Jets with?
Speaker 3 (12:51):
Well, I think that what DeVante Adams is. And it's
funny because I sort of did a survey this summer
talking to people about the top five receivers in the league,
and he always was in that category in any conversation
I had, So I would say that what he brings
is the fact that he can line up inside, he
can line up outside. He's a really refined route runner,
so he can win one on one.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
That's become the key thing.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
You have to be able to win one on one
because in this league when teams line up in what
we call three by one sets Colin, where there's a
single receiver to the short side of the field.
Speaker 4 (13:23):
That receiver has to.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Be able to win one on one, and the teams
that don't have that guy that really handicaps their offense
quite a bit. DeVante Adams can still do that. He's
not a true vertical dimension although because he's so refined
as a route runner, he can get vertical at times.
But he can win one on one and that's a
critical critical element. You see that all how many throws
(13:47):
do we see now in the league where it's matchup football.
You need a receiver who can do that, and he
can still do that.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
It's hard for if you were a young football fan
twenty three or twenty four, twenty five, it would be
hard to convince you that there was a time, long
periods of time that Washington was a well run, well
oiled football operation and was in control often for long
stretches or stretches anyway, in the NFC, they've been a
mess for years now. You watch them, and I had
(14:14):
said this in the offseason. I picked them to make
the playoffs because I said they flushed the building out
of the toxicity. They brought in really smart people, and
I think it's going to work. I don't think they're
a super Bowl team, but the Cliff Kingsbury Jaden Daniels
fit is really something. The thing that's jumped out to
me is some of these running backs are four or
five yards before they face contact. They're fooling people. They're
(14:36):
schematics in play here. So take our audience. I mean,
he's setting every record for a rookie quarterback. Is it scheme?
Is it talent? Is it Cliff? Is it Jaden? What
is it?
Speaker 4 (14:48):
Well? I think it's a combination.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
But I think that when you watch their tape, you
really see that Kingsbury is doing an unbelievably good job because,
as I said, what you're trying to do with a
young quarterback is you're trying to get him comfortable through
the early part of his season, through the early part
of games.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
So it's how do you call the game.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
You want to give him throws that he can complete passes,
and don't forget you always.
Speaker 4 (15:10):
Have the zone read element with Jane Daniels.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
He's got that extra dimension that forces defenses to have
to line up.
Speaker 4 (15:16):
A certain way.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
And I don't think we can overlook Brian Robinson in
the context of this offense because with that zone read
element and the fact that he's an inside runner, he's
a grinder, he's a sustainer, he's a.
Speaker 4 (15:30):
Hard he gets hard yards.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
It works in the context of this offense because now
jayde and Daniels can stay to use the cliche but
true ahead of the sticks. So it really helps with
your play calling. It helps with what you ask your
quarterback to do. And he has shown Daniels the ability
to make tough throws when he has to, but they're
not overloading him with that. They're sort of helping him
(15:53):
learn the NFL game, and it's been really, really successful.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Okay, I'm going to last two questions. First, we're going
to talk about the least mobile great quarterback in the
league than the most mobile. So Jared Goff goes eighteen
for eighteen, and I've been on sort of the I
feel like I've been part of the community that supports
Jared Goff. I understand he's not flashy, but eighteen for eighteen,
(16:17):
even though the Seahawks are missing multiple top defenders, I
get it, eighteen for eighteen is different and he does
have an elite offensive line. You've always been a fan
of Golf. I like him. I understand they don't get
much off script. But when you watch him, is he
getting better or has he always been underappreciated or do
(16:39):
you see growth that he didn't see with the Rams.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
I would answer that this way.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
I think we're in an era where people now believe
that the way to play quarterback in the NFL and
be good at it is to run around and make plays.
And by the way, that's there's nothing wrong with the
ability to do that, but at what cost. At the
end of the day, you still have to be able.
Colin and I think you would agree. You're a quarterback guy,
you still have to be able to drop back and
(17:07):
deliver the football with instructure to the right receiver at
the right time. If you can't do that at some
kind of meaningful, consistent level, it's really hard to be
a good NFL quarterback. Jared Goff can do that at
a pretty highly consistent level.
Speaker 4 (17:23):
You know him.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
He's a West Coast guy. He's a big kid with
a good arm. He knows where to throw the ball,
and he has an absolutely advanced, refined sense of anticipation.
If people saw the touchdown he threw last week to
Jamison Williams when he delivered the football and where Jamison
Williams was not many quarterbacks would have even thought to
(17:44):
throw the ball to Jamison Williams and then he hit
a dig later in the game, I believe to Tim Patrick.
Another example, Jared Goff really is a master of playing
the position from the pocket and that will never go
out of style in the NFL.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
And finally, another guy I constantly defend a lot of times,
I just look at the data and because you can
be fooled, right, you can look at stuff and think,
you know this. Some players are splash players. You get
two or three great players, but they're not good route
runners like a receiver, and so you gotta be careful
about that. But when I watched Lamar from the pocket
(18:20):
over the last two years, I think he's grown as
a passer and he's electric as a runner, and the
numbers tell you he is a good pocket passer. He's
just maybe not Burrow or Mahomes. There's two of those
guys on the planet. So do you think he gets
enough credit as a passer. How's your view on him?
Speaker 4 (18:44):
I think he's a good passer.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I don't think you could ask him to do let's
say what we just talked about Jared Goff. I don't
think he's Jared Goff in the pocket, but I think
Lamar is a good passer for sure. But I think
their offense and I thought this watching the tape last week.
Of course I see all his games, but it really
struck me again watching the tape last week, Lamar is
truly special and different as a runner. You know, you
(19:09):
can't compare people to him as a runner. He's just
absolutely different. So when you watch their offense, Colin, you
just see all this eye candy, You miss direction, backfield actions,
and you always have to worry about him as a runner.
And now they have the brute force of Henry. It's
a very very difficult offense to play against second level defenders.
(19:30):
Their eyes, they don't know where to put their eyes.
So then what happens a lot because of all this
with the run game is now you can really set
up define reads in the past game and he can
make those throws. So it's a really difficult offense to
play against. My guess is most coaches would still say
that you want to keep him in the pocket just
(19:51):
because there's no one like him outside. But I don't
think they're saying that because he can't throw it. I
think they're saying that because it's the lesser of two
evils ultimately based on everything within their offense.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
And show us the play of the week that includes Lamar.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
Yeah, this to me again, this is by his designs.
This was from last week's game, and this is the
kind of stuff I love when I'm watching tape, Colin,
So let's take a look at It was the touchdown
pass to Justice Hill, and I think that a play
like this just to me when I saw this play,
I mean, like I said, these are the kinds of
plays that get me excited watching tape.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
So we're gonna start here. You're going to see Lamar
is going to be in the gun and they're going
to be in a two by two sets, So two
receivers to each side of the formation. That's what a
two x two set is. So what is Lamar looking
at now? He's looking at two deep safeties and that's
what they expect from the Bills. The Bills are a.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Too high structure defense. So let's talk about the concept here.
What they're actually going to run. They're going to take
Bateman on the outside and he's basically going to run
a post route, and then they're going to take Justice
Hill offset to the same side as Baitman and he's
going to kind of run.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
An angle into a fade.
Speaker 3 (21:03):
It's beautifully done, by the way, But now they add
an element to this because they want to make sure
that that works, so they put Flowers in motion across
the formation. Watch what that does to the second level defenders.
They're all going to bump over with Flowers motion. That's
a critical piece of this play, and you're going to
(21:23):
see that as we start running it that they'll bump
over with the motion. Yep, that's normally a sign that
it's some kind of zone coverage as well, by the way,
So now when you see that, we're going to go
back to the routes. Bateman's post occupies both the corner
and the safety because he takes the corner with him
and he's going to break inside, which then occupies the
(21:44):
safety and then Hill. Now you have the matchup you want.
You've got Hill versus Williams. But keep one thing in mind. Williams,
because he bumped over has inside leverage. Now, so what
Hill does is he chops his feet to make it
seem like he's going to run an angle route or
a Texas route to the inside, and that attacks Williams
(22:05):
and then he runs the fade and this is beautifully,
beautifully done.
Speaker 4 (22:09):
And it becomes pitch and catch for Lamar. This is
just great design. That's what they wanted, that's what they
set up.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
And you can really see that when you see this angle,
you can see how he chops his feet, beats Williams
and touchdown.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
Beautifully done.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
This is a really really difficult offense to defend and
to play against.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Good stuff, Greg Cosell, great great work on that. You
see how much movement and all the trickery and illusion
and sleight of hand. I don't think there's an offense
in the league that because of his ability to run,
that's scarier to face for a defensive. Without question, it's
just a lot and Buffalo waved the white flag after
about three quarters. They didn't have any answer. Nine yards
(22:52):
of play for Lamar in the first three quarters. Good
seeing Greg Azoa's NFL films. Greg Cosel, thanks con Alright,
Jay Mac, you know we don't get these. We don't
get these baseball bubbles very often where you have like
these two week stretches where it's all the stars in
one series, Mets, Phillies, Dodgers, Padres. You're gonna have eight, nine,
(23:15):
ten of baseball's best players all on display every night.
Speaker 5 (23:19):
Yeah, this week for sports to go.
Speaker 6 (23:20):
I mean Mahomes on Monday Night football obviously against the Saints,
and then it's baseball every night during the week and
Thursday Night football.
Speaker 5 (23:27):
You know, like it's a great time. October is great.
Speaker 6 (23:30):
I think November slightly gets the edge because of the
NBA College.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
I would say that, but not this October. If we
get Dodgers, Padres, Metts, Phillies, and the Yankees, this is
gonna be one of our greats.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Yeah, nothing against the start of college basketball. I'm taking
the Yankees, Dodgers, and Bryce Harper. One more Herd. The
Herd streams twenty four hours a day, seven days a
week within the iHeartRadio app, Search Herd to listen live
or on demand whenever you like. You know, it's interesting.
So two of the interesting games are tonight Baker Mayfield
playing and Sunday morning Sam Darnold playing, and they came
(24:05):
out of the same draft class. So I was just
talking to a Manuelacho about this. We were talking about
this middle class. So the NFL are these quarterbacks good.
If you ask NFL quarterbacks publicly or privately about Baker,
they will all say, Josh Allen said it on this network,
Baker's got a big time arm. Yeah, Baker's got a
(24:26):
top ten arm arm strength. Baker may not be a
huge guy, Baker can absolutely sling it. He's got a
big time arm. I've always said he reminds me a
little of Gardner Minshew. Got a much better arm than
Gardner Minshew. And if you ask NFL quarterbacks about Sam
Donald privately or publicly, they'll tell you that. And Baker
and Darnald same draft class. No longer. Now they're both
(24:48):
on what they're fourth teams, right, They're not with the
teams that draft them, obviously, But if you ask guys
about Donald, they'll all tell you, Oh, Donald's got a
big arm and he's a great athlete. So like Andy
Dalton was winning, but he didn't have a big arm
and he wasn't great athlete. And Gino Smith's always been
more pocket guy. Though we can move a little. But
the thing about when you think, well, this Baker thing
will run out, No, he's got an elite arm, and
(25:11):
now he's got elite receivers. And Darnold's gotten a really
good arm. I don't think he's as good as Baker,
but he's an elite athlete. So there's a lot of
things Like when I saw the Saints early in the season,
I'm like, this is a bit of a fluke. Derek
Carr's arm is fine and he's not a big time athlete.
That's fine, it's a good story. Andy Dalton, Carolina, it's fine.
(25:32):
Geno Smith good arm. But Baker's arm and Sam's ability
to move I think are elite, but both to come
out they don't succeed to the level they're on a
fourth team. I think both. And so you know a
lot of people, myself included, just you can't unsee some
of the failures. But I think Tampa, I like Atlanta tonight,
(25:56):
but you know a lot of the wise guys like Tampa.
I think Tampa and Baker and Minnesota and Donald I
think they feel real because I do think these guys
are elite talents. They don't move like Lamar and they
don't throw like Josh Allen. A lot of you don't
think you think I love Donald and don't like Baker.
Baker's got a hose man. The guy can throw it.
Can When you give Baker time and let him sit,
(26:18):
he can sling it with the best of them. J
mcklin News.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
Turn on the news. This is the herd Line News.
Speaker 6 (26:27):
Colin. Let's start with your one of your favorite quarterbacks
in the NFC, and that's the.
Speaker 5 (26:33):
Cardinals and Kyler Murray.
Speaker 6 (26:35):
They faced Kyle Shanahan and the Niners this weekend in
a tough matchup, but the Niners head coach says nothing
but great things about Kyler Murray.
Speaker 5 (26:43):
Take a listener.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
He just looks so much more comfortable.
Speaker 7 (26:46):
I thought he looked really good last year when he
came in, you know, just watching their offense, seeing him
in the new scheme for the first time, I think
you got to sit back and watch other guys do it.
And then him coming in, you could tell he really
consciously tried to play within the confines of the offense,
which was different to see just how scheme was before.
And then always when he isn't playing in the confines
(27:07):
of the offense, how he can be his the scariest
guy in the league. So Kyler's always played at pretty
high level and when he's healthy, and he's doing that
right now.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
And they've gotten in better weapons, and what's wrong with
the offense?
Speaker 5 (27:19):
Why did he run last week? I'm watching that, you know,
I was on the Cardinals. I'm like, what the hell's
going on?
Speaker 6 (27:25):
Why is he not running? That's the best weapon that
the Cardinals have. We know Harris is great and Connor's
a very good running back. But Kyler dropping back to
pass and saying I'm gonna scoot for eight nine yards he.
Speaker 5 (27:36):
Can do that like every play. I don't get it.
Speaker 4 (27:40):
I think.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
The word I would use with Kyler as maintenance. There's
a lot of maintenance. That doesn't mean doesn't mean bad guy.
Some people come with maintenance, and I think Kyler can be.
And I've talked to people about this. There's things that
are frustrating sometimes for coaches and coordinators, sometimes for management.
(28:04):
And I think the very best quarterbacks in this league
are stars and they have low maintenance. I've been told,
like Lamar Jackson, there's not a lot of maintenance. Josh Allen,
there's not a lot of maintenance brought Purty Jared Goff,
no maintenance. Mahomes for as big a rock star, not
a lot of maintenance. I think Kyler there's things that
you have to work around his personality. And I've heard
(28:28):
this from multiple people, and it can be frustrating. It
is hard. You see it in entertainment all the time
where somebody's a star, but there's a lot to deal with.
And I do think there's some maintenance stuff here that
I've been told now twice that is stuff you'd rather
not deal with, but you're willing to deal with it
because he's so gifted.
Speaker 6 (28:46):
Wasn't that like a Seinfeld episode where Elaine was talking
about high maintenance low maintenance.
Speaker 5 (28:50):
I feel like it was. That's a good reference by
you because I don't want my quarterback to be high maintenance.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Well, well I don't.
Speaker 5 (28:56):
I don't care how talented you.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
By the way, I heard this about Jay Cutler when
Jay was in the league. There's maintenance. I think Aaron
can be there's a little maintenance. And by the way,
I'm okay with it. But I'm just saying, well, you're
okay with it as long as they're winning well. With
Jay Cutler had got to a point where it just
was more than people were comfortable Rodgers, And that's my
(29:18):
take with Kyler Murray. Okay, they're getting of all these weapons.
If I'm gonna deal with maintenance, then don't. I'm not
saying it's all wins and losses, but you gotta produce
big numbers like I can't see what I saw last weekend.
You getting worked. That was not a good defense. That's
not a good defense. With Washington and Jayden Daniels looked
way more comfortable and productive. Like that was a bad
(29:41):
look for Kyler Murray. That's a bad defense, and you're
not willing to run on a bad defense.
Speaker 6 (29:46):
Potentially good news for Murray is that Warner the number
one graded linebacker in.
Speaker 5 (29:52):
The league so far this season. Did you see his
pick six this past weekend?
Speaker 6 (29:55):
Unbelievable effort. He's hurt, has not practiced yet this Moure.
I'll see what happens today. If he's out that it's
a big win for Kyler Murray.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Fred Warner feels like he's at a different level. I
always felt there was guys like Junior Seau in his prime,
Brian r. Lacker and his prime ray Lewis. You feel
like they're just they're a great linebacker. Everybody's a notch below.
Speaker 5 (30:14):
One is like a faster version of ray Lewis.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
He's got everywhere, great hands, unbelievable range, a sure tackler.
Fred Warner feels like, I mean, he's gonna make the
Hall of Fame, that's a given. But it just that
he's better than other elite linebackers.
Speaker 6 (30:29):
What do you make of this line? The Niners? It
was seven and a half that's gone. Now it's flat set. No.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
I think the Cardinals are the play I think I
don't love it, but I McBride's health. Is he gonna play.
Speaker 5 (30:42):
He did a light practice yesterday, so he is gonna play.
Speaker 6 (30:44):
But I will just say remember the Niners. You know
a lot of injuries, a slow start. This is a
team that can reel off eight nine wins in a
row and heartbeat, and once they get.
Speaker 5 (30:52):
Healthy, just keep an eye on them.
Speaker 6 (30:54):
Next up, Colin, you were impressed by Seattle Monday night
despite the l in Detroit, Geno Smith who for a
rear high three hundred and ninety five yards thirty eight completions,
he was he was pretty damn good.
Speaker 5 (31:05):
Seahawks head coach Mike McDonald was proud of him.
Speaker 8 (31:07):
Take a listen, man, there's a lot of good stuff
on tape, a lot of stuff we obviously need to
you know, fix and make right. So but that's the
case anytime we stepped foot out there and and tow
the line. So that'll be the same mentality. Our guys
could easily gave up on really all three phases, and
they didn't. You can see it in their eyes, and
(31:27):
I think it's a it's a shout out to the
men we have in our locker room and the resilience
they have. And I told them after the I've told
them after the game that's the mentality and the spirit
that we want in our football team that we're gonna
need over.
Speaker 4 (31:40):
The long all.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Yeah, I was. I was really impressed with Seattle. How
many teams could lose four best defensive linemen and compete
with the Detroit team on the road when Jared Gop
was eighteen to eighteen and they just kept coming back
and back and back. I've said this about Pittsburgh, all
say it about Seattle. They may not hoist a trophy,
but the Steers personnel and the Seahawks personnel is elite.
(32:04):
Seattle's got players everywhere.
Speaker 6 (32:07):
McDonald is famous for cooking up interesting defenses. So the Giants,
Malik Neighbors is the I think the biggest name to
watch on the injury. He's hurt off the concussion and
there's a long flight from New York to Seattle. You're
not supposed to fly with concussions. We'll see what happens
with Neighbors if he doesn't play. Comes this is gonnaug
The cornerbacks just press the line, will put eight in
the bottom Witherspoon.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Witherspoon's a great corner anyway.
Speaker 6 (32:30):
I don't see Singletary going off for a buck fifty.
I know it's a big number here, six and a half.
I like the Seahawks are inching toward one of the
better bets. If Neighbors doesn't.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Play, what Seattle's front look like.
Speaker 6 (32:42):
Well, we'll see the injury report today that that's a
big question. But the problem is nobody like Detroit's front
scares you. The great offensive line the running backs do
the Giants Nope, Like.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
I saw Williams armor on Saint Brown, Detroit and the
Giants aren't the same.
Speaker 6 (32:59):
When you see a quarter like Skyler Thompson went to
Seattle and could do nothing against his defense. I don't
think Daniel Jones is that much better, so I think
Seattle's aside here.
Speaker 5 (33:07):
It's a big number. Be careful a lot obviously.
Speaker 6 (33:09):
Final story, Colin is that Denver Broncos defense has been
incredible this year. The only Majors defensive statistical category where
they're not top four his run defense and they're twelve.
If Denver can keep scoring points, they could be a
problem in the AFC.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
Keep an eye on them in the West.
Speaker 6 (33:26):
John Payton says he's not worried about his offense or
his rookie quarterback.
Speaker 9 (33:30):
You're still looking for the perfect picture, the perfect game,
you know. I know this shangrilad doesn't exist, but the execution,
the details still have to get better with younger players,
and that's what we're working on, you know, because I've
said this before. If everyone else can paint the right picture,
(33:51):
then you truly get to evaluate and watch a real
good quarterback.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Boy, he likes him a lot. Yeah, you are really
down on him.
Speaker 5 (34:01):
I wouldn't stop. No, he was one of the great
guests here.
Speaker 6 (34:05):
But last season I just I wonder how much of
this is smoking mirrors for Denver.
Speaker 5 (34:11):
Okay, two weeks ago, Tampa perfect spot.
Speaker 6 (34:13):
Tampa was really beat up Denver Roman last week in
the rain against the Jets.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
It's like, oh, did they played in sun and the
Jets played in right?
Speaker 5 (34:21):
I think that happened.
Speaker 6 (34:22):
Yeah, I just I need to see a little more
from your guy, bo Nicks. I'm trying to look like
I know the defense has been great, but these are
the quarterbacks they faced cal Him Okay in the opener,
Geno Smith.
Speaker 5 (34:33):
Then it was a Field.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
Smith is pretty good, He's good.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
He's good.
Speaker 1 (34:36):
It's pretty good.
Speaker 6 (34:37):
And then it was justin Fields, and then Baker Mayfield,
and then Aaron Rodgers good not awful, No, no, no,
not awful, just good.
Speaker 5 (34:44):
Not awful.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
Aaron Baker and Gino?
Speaker 5 (34:49):
Is Aaron great?
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Aaron's really good.
Speaker 4 (34:51):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Baker and Gino are having tremendous years.
Speaker 6 (34:54):
Time out, time out twenty Aaron Rodgers is do you
say great?
Speaker 5 (34:59):
Was that the word?
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I don't think he's great at this point. I think
he's good.
Speaker 6 (35:03):
Through four weeks, has he been a top ten quarterback
in the league? No, not even close. So they haven't
faced a top ten quarterback unless you have Baker through
four games.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
If your defense has looked good against Geno Baker and
Aaron Rodgers, it's a pretty good defense. I mean, those
are pretty good players.
Speaker 5 (35:17):
Right now, solid and they get the Raiders this weekend.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
And a nice to know Aaron's been reduced to solid.
He's got him in the super Bowl, but with a
solid quarter projection.
Speaker 5 (35:25):
Okay, that's a projection down the road.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Come on, j Mack with the news.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
Herd Line News.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
We got our our big ten bets around the corner.
We're tied by the way, Jmack. Both of us had
winning weeks. The PayPal Debit earns you PayPal debit card.
PayPal debit card earns you five percent back on your
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(36:00):
Bank Corp NA person went to license by MasterCard International Ink.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and newon Easter nin am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app. Colin and j Matt
make their favorite Big ten bets of the week.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Okay, I'm gonna take Oregon minus twenty three and a
half at home against Michigan State. Oregon's the best West
Coast football team at home. Dan Lannings teams twenty five
straight wins at home against unranked opponents. Dylan Gabriel now
is heating up. This dude is completing almost eighty two
percent of his throws. They recruited at a high level
(36:41):
and Michigan State can't move the ball. Second straight game
lost to a top ten opponent. Ohio State ran them
out of the building and their beat up. I'm gonna
take Oregon. They're humming. They may have a little look
ahead to Ohio State, but their offense is now back
to what we thought it was preseason with the alignment
(37:03):
changes on the offensive line. I think the Ducks roll
twenty three points in college is not that big of
a cover, not at all.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
I started zero to three my first week and then
one and two bouncing back.
Speaker 5 (37:13):
What are we doing here?
Speaker 6 (37:14):
We're going first Ucla Penn State over forty six and
a half.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Colin.
Speaker 6 (37:19):
UCLA's bad aggressively Penn State could get to thirty five,
no problem. The question is in garbage time, can UCLA
push it over the total?
Speaker 5 (37:26):
I believe so Penn State will kind of power down.
Speaker 6 (37:28):
The schedule gets a little tougher next week, so I
think this is the easy Penn State victory in the
total goes over forty six.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
And a half. All right, Husky Stadium, all take the
under on Michigan at Washington forty one and a half points.
Michigan cannot pass the ball. It is the worst offense
in the Big Ten, and Washington this year. Last year
they were an offensive led team. This year they're better
on defense. They've been held under twenty points in two
of their last three games, so Washington is not the
(37:56):
Washington of last year. They're at home, it's more defense.
Michigan has only one way to win, keep the score down,
and they haven't unbelievable offensive line or defensive line at Michigan.
I think this game's played between the thirties Huskies Wolverines
under forty one and a half.
Speaker 5 (38:15):
I don't hate that, but I also like Washington.
Speaker 6 (38:18):
Favored by two and a half, I'd have them on
the money line and I'll take the two and a
half as well. Colin is this Michigan's first road game
of the season in October. They've been in the friendly
confines of vann Arbery. Now they go to Washington. I
think the Huskies here get it done. Low scoring game,
Like you said, keep it on this kid Will Rodgers,
the quarterback of the transfer fro Mississippi State. He's been
good quietly, a lot of good quarterbacks in the country.
(38:38):
But I like Washington.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
I'm gonna take USC minus eight. They are playing great football. Michigan,
they were overwhelmed. Minnesota's not Michigan, and they're coming off
a very close, close game with the Wolverines, lost it
emotional game. USC offensively is number one passing offense in
(39:00):
the Big Ten, number one third down offense in the
Big Ten. Everybody watched the Michigan game and they've made
big judgments on what USC is. This game last week
twenty eight nothing second half against Wisconsin. They beat LSU,
and by the way that Michigan game in the second
half they went toe to toe. I think if they
played Michigan again, Michigan had three big runs. You've over
(39:23):
judged USC off that terrible first half against Michigan. They
win and COVERO.
Speaker 5 (39:30):
Okay, we're head to head.
Speaker 6 (39:31):
You know we like in college, you can look to
look ahead spots, sandwich spots. Next week, Uscspenn State. Okay,
that's a massive game.
Speaker 2 (39:39):
Who do you guys have this week?
Speaker 6 (39:40):
Oh, Minnesota, the guy with the rowing the boat stuff.
This is a bad look ahead spot for USC. You
go travel to the Midwest, there's a chance they get
kind of boxed in. You're Minnesota physical team, similar to
what happened in Michigan. You don't think flecking company knows. Hey,
we just got to keep it on the ground and
beat these guys.
Speaker 5 (39:57):
Up at the line of scrimming. Be careful.
Speaker 6 (39:59):
I took the point with the Gophers getting eight in
a look ahead spot for them next week.
Speaker 5 (40:03):
Trojan's Penn State is like an awesome game.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
Oh it's one of the games.
Speaker 5 (40:08):
I mean, there's a lot of good games next week.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
But you know, people are looking at the USC Michigan
game the first half. If you go back and watch
the second half of that game, USC moved the ball.
They moved it on LSU, they moved it on Wisconsin.
USC's offense is number one of the Big ten passing
third down good. It's really really good. By the way,
last two years under Lincoln Riley, the USC offense number
(40:32):
one in college football, and they got that one, but
that Michigan first half because us he has a red
shirt freshman left tackle, a true sophomore right guard, and
Michigan's got the two best defensive linemens arguably in college football.
It took him a half to get the feet under him.
USC can, this is a really good USC offense. Our
(40:53):
three next,
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
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dot com, or stream us live every day on the
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go live in Los Angeles, our number two.
It's the Hurd. Wherever you may be and however you
may be listening. Thanks for making us part of your day. Tonight,
Baker Mayfield, Kirk Cousins Sneaky interesting game Atlanta Tampa Bay
Baseball Playoffs Mets. Later this afternoon, we were talking about
this is that in our business, baseball doesn't feed the family,
(00:49):
so to speak, in our business until the postseason and
the potential now Podras Dodgers will be unbelievable. There's it.
If you live out Easter or Midwest, you may not
know it, but it feels like I felt like San
Francisco Dodgers was a real rivalry. But then San Diego
decided about five years ago, we're gonna go buy a
bunch of stars and some some have worked, some have
not but tatists the batting camp they got I think
(01:14):
from Miami leadoff guy Manny Machado. Uh, they've gone all
in and it's like they're not as wealthy or as
stars studded as the Dodgers, but they're close and they're
red hot, and they made trading deadline moves. And then
Mets Phillies again. You know, everybody talks Yankees, but Mets
Phillies feels intense to me. It feels big. Plus New
(01:36):
York sports has been for so many years, almost a decade, irrelevant,
So like you have to understand when the Patriots wobble
into town and Aaron and the Jets beat them. Literally,
New York get to the Super Bowl talk and I
think the Mets will win today. But I don't know.
If the Mets win today, they have World Series talk.
(01:57):
That's just the way it works. They're so starved in
New York, like Los bigger cities. Chicago is pretty sports starved.
I mean, I mean, Bulls have been bad for a
long time. Bears are the Bears. I mean, it's Northwestern
football is not, you know, moving the meter. And then
all of a sudden you've gotten Los Angeles We've been
(02:18):
very fortunate here where the Dodgers have been great but
only one shortened season title. Rams have a Super Bowl.
You know, Clippers and Lakers are absolutely relevant. Lakers again
in the bubble, won a championship. But it does feel
like New York is sort of sports starved, and I
think it's better in sports when New York is interesting.
I don't think the Giants are bad, but I also
don't think the Jets are good or very good. Mets
(02:42):
Yankees we'll see. And with that Greg Cosel forty five
years at NFL Films Fantasy, you bet it. You want
to get smarter. It is such a crazy week to
week league. You just don't know. Buffalo is on top
of the world. They get blown out. Cannot stop Lamar Jackson,
who will talk about in ten minutes, But I do
(03:04):
want to talk about the Jets. They've got some injuries
here to deal with, mostly on the defensive side. And
the Vikings. So the Vikings right now are They're a
star studded offensive team and a star studied coaching staff.
What will the Jets and Aaron Rodgers see defensively because
they don't have a lot of high profile defenders, Yet
they're getting a lot of pressure on the quarterback. What
(03:26):
are the Vikings do and what will Aaron see defensively?
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Look, obviously Rogers has seen everything colon in his career,
but that doesn't mean you don't do what you do
against him and try to slow down the process. And
the Vikings are a really difficult defense to play against
because what they do, what Brian Fluur does so well,
is he'll line up six or seven along the defensive
front and you have to account for those people. You
(03:52):
can make assumptions about who might come or who might
not come. So they demand that you protect, and usually
they demand that you protect with more than five. So
now you have a back or a tight end that
even if they're not a primary pass protector, they need
to chip, they need to do something to be part
of the protection. So now you're losing an eligible receiver
(04:14):
as a primary route runner. And so what the Vikings
often do is from these six or seven man fronts
is then they'll drop people out. Sometimes they'll rush three,
so you end up with eight in coverage versus maybe
three receivers or four receivers at most. They do this exceptionally. Well,
that's what they did to see j Stroud and the
(04:35):
Texans a few weeks ago. So they are an extremely
difficult defense to play against because they don't necessarily have
great people.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
They will give up yards at times.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
But as you probably know, the Jets last week really
struggled in pass protection. They played the rookie Feshanu from
Penn State at right tackle and he looked stiff.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
He had a really.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Difficult time one on one blocking versus Jonathan Cooper from
the Broncos.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Okay, so Philadelphia is a well run franchise that is
in sort of disarray. Defense hasn't been great for years.
Jalen Hurts was wonderful with Shane Steichen. Now they look lost.
There's multiple reports there's fissures in the Sirianni Jalen Hirts relationship.
Let's just talk Jalen Hurts the quarterback. What is happening?
(05:20):
We know the turnovers have been amped up for the
last year. What are you seeing on film?
Speaker 4 (05:24):
Right?
Speaker 1 (05:25):
What are you seeing?
Speaker 4 (05:26):
Well?
Speaker 3 (05:26):
I think with Jalen and I'm going to just point
out the first play of the game from last week.
They called a very basic play. It's quarterbacking one oh one,
and I think people can probably visualize this if they're
listening on radio. What they called was a mirrored route
combination curl flat to each side and a sit route
(05:48):
right in front of the quarterback over the ball.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
That's a very basic staple concept. There was a throat
to be made.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
Jalen is not throwing basic route concepts, okay, so it
becomes very hard for a coach. Kellen Moore is their
new coordinator, and I'm sure a lot of people are
blaming him for their offense. But you have to be
able to make those throws. And I think they're also
searching for an identity. I'm sure Kellen Moore is trying
to figure out how you get the best out of
(06:17):
Jalen Hurts, get him into the game comfortably, which they're
trying to do, and yet at the same time, make
sure that Saquon Barkley is a foundation of what you do.
And my sense is they're still searching for that identity.
But Jalen Hurts has been struggling with basic concepts and
until he really executes those, it becomes difficult.
Speaker 4 (06:38):
All right.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
So Caleb Williams is somebody. Here's the positive on Caleb Williams.
Every week we've seen steps and you know what you
get worried about is when you see a quarterback go up, back,
up back the roller coaster. Now you rarely get Jayden
Daniels where a guy is just excellent. But with Caleb,
I am seeing the accuracy the passer rating so against
(07:02):
the rams. Is there anything with Caleb you saw? I
felt he looked more settled. My take was from the two.
He just felt a little more settled. He had a
run game, That's what I saw.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Yeah, I think the run game's important. I think they
dialed it down a bit. They gave him easier throws.
He did miss some throws that you have to make,
and we'll see if that continues.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I didn't really view him as a scattershot passer at USC,
and he's been a little scattershot, which probably leads me
to believe he's just not a comfortable player. Yet, I
think we have to look at it this.
Speaker 3 (07:37):
Way with all young quarterbacks, Colin, there's a sense now
because so many of them come into the league, they're brands.
We've been talking about these guys for years and years,
seemingly since they're twelve years old.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
So I think a lot of.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
People think these guys come in the league and if
they don't play well right away, it's because the coaching
isn't good.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
It's the reverse.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
These guys have to learn how to play NFL quarterback,
which is different than playing college quarterback. So when Caleb
Williams struggles a bit and has to learn, that's a
perfectly normal thing. That doesn't mean he can't play NFL quarterback.
But it takes time, and so much is involved with
what they're asked to do. You've got to dial it down.
(08:16):
You mentioned Jane Daniels, and he's played exceptionally well, but
when you watch his tape, Colin, they don't ask him
to make a lot of difficult throws. Now, he's made
some that have been absolutely special. There's no question about it.
He's played at a high level. I mean, he's only
missed nineteen throws in four games. Only nineteen in completions.
That's ridiculous. But when you watch the tape, you see
(08:38):
a lot of basic, easy throws by NFL standards, and
that's the right thing to do. You're trying to allow
these quarterbacks to grow into the NFL game, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
Now, I want to go to somebody that's older than
Caleb Williams, has more experienced Justin Fields, he's on his
second team, yep. So in Chicago he was not a
good fourth quarter quarterback. He could be turnover prone. Again,
I felt a lot of times that he didn't see
the field well. So he goes to Pittsburgh, a better
run operation. Arthur Smith obviously a good enough coordinator to
(09:14):
become a head coach in Atlanta. So it's Arthur Smith
and Justin Fields. So what are you seeing with Justin
now in this organization? What is he doing now? He
didn't in Chicago or maybe it was a staff issue.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I think he's somewhat similar in terms of how he plays.
I think he's one of those quarterbacks that he's not
necessarily a natural timing and rhythm player.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
So that's never going to be really his game.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
I'm not sure you can teach someone how to be
really refined like he's never going to become CJ.
Speaker 4 (09:49):
Stroud. That's not going to happen.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
So now what you're relying on is really defining the
reeds and the throats for him very very cleanly, so
that he can feel really comfortable delivering the ball. And
then he does always have that outside of structured dimension
to his game. Yeah, and I mean I in watching
the tape last week, there were not that many throws
from the pocket. You know, I'm talking about real throws.
(10:13):
I'm not just talking about you know, really short throws.
I'm talking about where he drops back and drives the
ball at the intermediate levels.
Speaker 4 (10:20):
You didn't see many of those at all. That's not
really his game.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
So the question becomes, can you become a higher level
quarterback if you can't do that. There's no question he
can make quote unquote plays, but he's not by nature
a timing rhythm guy.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
Okay, two things I want to concentrate on. So Rashi Rice,
we think is out for the year, but they're going
to test him again. So it did feel like to us,
Greg he had gone from kind of an inconsistent talented
kid in the first couple of weeks. You're like, oh,
he's a one Now. I'm not saying Jamar Chase, but
it feels like he's going to be an eighty catch
(10:57):
volume number one. If he's out, based on what you've seen,
what does that do to the Kansas City offense?
Speaker 4 (11:09):
Well, I think it probably signifies that Kelsey comes back
as that guy.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
Because Kelsey, you can certainly move all around the formation.
He's formation flexible and versatile, so they'll focus on him
a lot more. We saw them take the deep shot
last week to Worthy. We saw them go to Worthy
at the end of the game on a critical third
down that won the game. So I think Worthy, as
a guy who ultimately watching his college tape, I thought
(11:36):
he could be more than just a vertical threat. But again,
he's a rookie, so that may take time. You're seeing
the vertical throw here. I think they need to get
him more involved doing other things than just being a
vertical dimension.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
We'll see how it plays out. I think right now
Mahomes is not necessarily a comfortable player, and maybe it's
because of the receiving corps. We don't know that.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Yeah, but do you remember a few years ago and
Mahomes went through a bad stretch. Yes, you read dialed
them down a bit. You've got him back on track.
That may need to happen again.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Okay, So Davante Adams, I've said before, college furnishes the
NFL with about fifteen good receivers a year. Be careful
about overpaying, Yes, but there are players like Davonte Adams,
especially in this toxic situation with the Jets. If they
go get blown out by Minnesota, this thing could unravel
quickly and he could be the juice outside of Garrett
(12:29):
Wilson that maybe you need. I don't know. It feels
like it would work because Aaron's played with him. So
give me a kind of a breakdown. A lot of
these receivers. You know, Nico Collins, isn't Xavier or Worthy,
isn't Cooper Cup, isn't Pukinakua. They're all different. What does
Davante bring to the table? What dimension would he help
the Saints or the Jets with?
Speaker 3 (12:51):
Well, I think that what DeVante Adams is. And it's
funny because I sort of did a survey this summer
talking to people about the top five receivers in the league,
and he always was in that category in any conversation
I had, So I would say that what he brings
is the fact that he can line up inside, he
can line up outside. He's a really refined route runner,
so he can win one on one.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
That's become the key thing.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
You have to be able to win one on one
because in this league when teams line up in what
we call three by one sets Colin, where there's a
single receiver to the short side of the field.
Speaker 4 (13:23):
That receiver has to.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Be able to win one on one, and the teams
that don't have that guy that really handicaps their offense
quite a bit. DeVante Adams can still do that. He's
not a true vertical dimension although because he's so refined
as a route runner, he can get vertical at times.
But he can win one on one and that's a
critical critical element. You see that all how many throws
(13:47):
do we see now in the league where it's matchup football.
You need a receiver who can do that, and he
can still do that.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
It's hard for if you were a young football fan
twenty three or twenty four, twenty five, it would be
hard to convince you that there was a time, long
periods of time that Washington was a well run, well
oiled football operation and was in control often for long
stretches or stretches anyway, in the NFC, they've been a
mess for years now. You watch them, and I had
(14:14):
said this in the offseason. I picked them to make
the playoffs because I said they flushed the building out
of the toxicity. They brought in really smart people, and
I think it's going to work. I don't think they're
a super Bowl team, but the Cliff Kingsbury Jaden Daniels
fit is really something. The thing that's jumped out to
me is some of these running backs are four or
five yards before they face contact. They're fooling people. They're
(14:36):
schematics in play here. So take our audience. I mean,
he's setting every record for a rookie quarterback. Is it scheme?
Is it talent? Is it Cliff? Is it Jaden? What
is it?
Speaker 4 (14:48):
Well? I think it's a combination.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
But I think that when you watch their tape, you
really see that Kingsbury is doing an unbelievably good job because,
as I said, what you're trying to do with a
young quarterback is you're trying to get him comfortable through
the early part of his season, through the early part
of games.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
So it's how do you call the game.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
You want to give him throws that he can complete passes,
and don't forget you always.
Speaker 4 (15:10):
Have the zone read element with Jane Daniels.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
He's got that extra dimension that forces defenses to have
to line up.
Speaker 4 (15:16):
A certain way.
Speaker 3 (15:17):
And I don't think we can overlook Brian Robinson in
the context of this offense because with that zone read
element and the fact that he's an inside runner, he's
a grinder, he's a sustainer, he's a.
Speaker 4 (15:30):
Hard he gets hard yards.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
It works in the context of this offense because now
jayde and Daniels can stay to use the cliche but
true ahead of the sticks. So it really helps with
your play calling. It helps with what you ask your
quarterback to do. And he has shown Daniels the ability
to make tough throws when he has to, but they're
not overloading him with that. They're sort of helping him
(15:53):
learn the NFL game, and it's been really, really successful.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Okay, I'm going to last two questions. First, we're going
to talk about the least mobile great quarterback in the
league than the most mobile. So Jared Goff goes eighteen
for eighteen, and I've been on sort of the I
feel like I've been part of the community that supports
Jared Goff. I understand he's not flashy, but eighteen for eighteen,
(16:17):
even though the Seahawks are missing multiple top defenders, I
get it, eighteen for eighteen is different and he does
have an elite offensive line. You've always been a fan
of Golf. I like him. I understand they don't get
much off script. But when you watch him, is he
getting better or has he always been underappreciated or do
(16:39):
you see growth that he didn't see with the Rams.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
I would answer that this way.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
I think we're in an era where people now believe
that the way to play quarterback in the NFL and
be good at it is to run around and make plays.
And by the way, that's there's nothing wrong with the
ability to do that, but at what cost. At the
end of the day, you still have to be able.
Colin and I think you would agree. You're a quarterback guy,
you still have to be able to drop back and
(17:07):
deliver the football with instructure to the right receiver at
the right time. If you can't do that at some
kind of meaningful, consistent level, it's really hard to be
a good NFL quarterback. Jared Goff can do that at
a pretty highly consistent level.
Speaker 4 (17:23):
You know him.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
He's a West Coast guy. He's a big kid with
a good arm. He knows where to throw the ball,
and he has an absolutely advanced, refined sense of anticipation.
If people saw the touchdown he threw last week to
Jamison Williams when he delivered the football and where Jamison
Williams was not many quarterbacks would have even thought to
(17:44):
throw the ball to Jamison Williams and then he hit
a dig later in the game, I believe to Tim Patrick.
Another example, Jared Goff really is a master of playing
the position from the pocket and that will never go
out of style in the NFL.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
And finally, another guy I constantly defend a lot of times,
I just look at the data and because you can
be fooled, right, you can look at stuff and think,
you know this. Some players are splash players. You get
two or three great players, but they're not good route
runners like a receiver, and so you gotta be careful
about that. But when I watched Lamar from the pocket
(18:20):
over the last two years, I think he's grown as
a passer and he's electric as a runner, and the
numbers tell you he is a good pocket passer. He's
just maybe not Burrow or Mahomes. There's two of those
guys on the planet. So do you think he gets
enough credit as a passer. How's your view on him?
Speaker 4 (18:44):
I think he's a good passer.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
I don't think you could ask him to do let's
say what we just talked about Jared Goff. I don't
think he's Jared Goff in the pocket, but I think
Lamar is a good passer for sure. But I think
their offense and I thought this watching the tape last week.
Of course I see all his games, but it really
struck me again watching the tape last week, Lamar is
truly special and different as a runner. You know, you
(19:09):
can't compare people to him as a runner. He's just
absolutely different. So when you watch their offense, Colin, you
just see all this eye candy, You miss direction, backfield actions,
and you always have to worry about him as a runner.
And now they have the brute force of Henry. It's
a very very difficult offense to play against second level defenders.
(19:30):
Their eyes, they don't know where to put their eyes.
So then what happens a lot because of all this
with the run game is now you can really set
up define reads in the past game and he can
make those throws. So it's a really difficult offense to
play against. My guess is most coaches would still say
that you want to keep him in the pocket just
(19:51):
because there's no one like him outside. But I don't
think they're saying that because he can't throw it. I
think they're saying that because it's the lesser of two
evils ultimately based on everything within their offense.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
And show us the play of the week that includes Lamar.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
Yeah, this to me again, this is by his designs.
This was from last week's game, and this is the
kind of stuff I love when I'm watching tape, Colin,
So let's take a look at It was the touchdown
pass to Justice Hill, and I think that a play
like this just to me when I saw this play,
I mean, like I said, these are the kinds of
plays that get me excited watching tape.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
So we're gonna start here. You're going to see Lamar
is going to be in the gun and they're going
to be in a two by two sets, So two
receivers to each side of the formation. That's what a
two x two set is. So what is Lamar looking
at now? He's looking at two deep safeties and that's
what they expect from the Bills. The Bills are a.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
Too high structure defense. So let's talk about the concept here.
What they're actually going to run. They're going to take
Bateman on the outside and he's basically going to run
a post route, and then they're going to take Justice
Hill offset to the same side as Baitman and he's
going to kind of run.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
An angle into a fade.
Speaker 3 (21:03):
It's beautifully done, by the way, But now they add
an element to this because they want to make sure
that that works, so they put Flowers in motion across
the formation. Watch what that does to the second level defenders.
They're all going to bump over with Flowers motion. That's
a critical piece of this play, and you're going to
(21:23):
see that as we start running it that they'll bump
over with the motion. Yep, that's normally a sign that
it's some kind of zone coverage as well, by the way,
So now when you see that, we're going to go
back to the routes. Bateman's post occupies both the corner
and the safety because he takes the corner with him
and he's going to break inside, which then occupies the
(21:44):
safety and then Hill. Now you have the matchup you want.
You've got Hill versus Williams. But keep one thing in mind. Williams,
because he bumped over has inside leverage. Now, so what
Hill does is he chops his feet to make it
seem like he's going to run an angle route or
a Texas route to the inside, and that attacks Williams
(22:05):
and then he runs the fade and this is beautifully,
beautifully done.
Speaker 4 (22:09):
And it becomes pitch and catch for Lamar. This is
just great design. That's what they wanted, that's what they
set up.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
And you can really see that when you see this angle,
you can see how he chops his feet, beats Williams
and touchdown.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
Beautifully done.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
This is a really really difficult offense to defend and
to play against.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Good stuff, Greg Cosell, great great work on that. You
see how much movement and all the trickery and illusion
and sleight of hand. I don't think there's an offense
in the league that because of his ability to run,
that's scarier to face for a defensive. Without question, it's
just a lot and Buffalo waved the white flag after
about three quarters. They didn't have any answer. Nine yards
(22:52):
of play for Lamar in the first three quarters. Good
seeing Greg Azoa's NFL films. Greg Cosel, thanks con Alright,
Jay Mac, you know we don't get these. We don't
get these baseball bubbles very often where you have like
these two week stretches where it's all the stars in
one series, Mets, Phillies, Dodgers, Padres. You're gonna have eight, nine,
(23:15):
ten of baseball's best players all on display every night.
Speaker 5 (23:19):
Yeah, this week for sports to go.
Speaker 6 (23:20):
I mean Mahomes on Monday Night football obviously against the Saints,
and then it's baseball every night during the week and
Thursday Night football.
Speaker 5 (23:27):
You know, like it's a great time. October is great.
Speaker 6 (23:30):
I think November slightly gets the edge because of the
NBA College.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
I would say that, but not this October. If we
get Dodgers, Padres, Metts, Phillies, and the Yankees, this is
gonna be one of our greats.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Yeah, nothing against the start of college basketball. I'm taking
the Yankees, Dodgers, and Bryce Harper. One more Herd. The
Herd streams twenty four hours a day, seven days a
week within the iHeartRadio app, Search Herd to listen live
or on demand whenever you like. You know, it's interesting.
So two of the interesting games are tonight Baker Mayfield
playing and Sunday morning Sam Darnold playing, and they came
(24:05):
out of the same draft class. So I was just
talking to a Manuelacho about this. We were talking about
this middle class. So the NFL are these quarterbacks good.
If you ask NFL quarterbacks publicly or privately about Baker,
they will all say, Josh Allen said it on this network,
Baker's got a big time arm. Yeah, Baker's got a
(24:26):
top ten arm arm strength. Baker may not be a
huge guy, Baker can absolutely sling it. He's got a
big time arm. I've always said he reminds me a
little of Gardner Minshew. Got a much better arm than
Gardner Minshew. And if you ask NFL quarterbacks about Sam
Donald privately or publicly, they'll tell you that. And Baker
and Darnald same draft class. No longer. Now they're both
(24:48):
on what they're fourth teams, right, They're not with the
teams that draft them, obviously, But if you ask guys
about Donald, they'll all tell you, Oh, Donald's got a
big arm and he's a great athlete. So like Andy
Dalton was winning, but he didn't have a big arm
and he wasn't great athlete. And Gino Smith's always been
more pocket guy. Though we can move a little. But
the thing about when you think, well, this Baker thing
will run out, No, he's got an elite arm, and
(25:11):
now he's got elite receivers. And Darnold's gotten a really
good arm. I don't think he's as good as Baker,
but he's an elite athlete. So there's a lot of
things Like when I saw the Saints early in the season,
I'm like, this is a bit of a fluke. Derek
Carr's arm is fine and he's not a big time athlete.
That's fine, it's a good story. Andy Dalton, Carolina, it's fine.
(25:32):
Geno Smith good arm. But Baker's arm and Sam's ability
to move I think are elite, but both to come
out they don't succeed to the level they're on a
fourth team. I think both. And so you know a
lot of people, myself included, just you can't unsee some
of the failures. But I think Tampa, I like Atlanta tonight,
(25:56):
but you know a lot of the wise guys like Tampa.
I think Tampa and Baker and Minnesota and Donald I
think they feel real because I do think these guys
are elite talents. They don't move like Lamar and they
don't throw like Josh Allen. A lot of you don't
think you think I love Donald and don't like Baker.
Baker's got a hose man. The guy can throw it.
Can When you give Baker time and let him sit,
(26:18):
he can sling it with the best of them. J
mcklin News.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
Turn on the news. This is the herd Line News.
Speaker 6 (26:27):
Colin. Let's start with your one of your favorite quarterbacks
in the NFC, and that's the.
Speaker 5 (26:33):
Cardinals and Kyler Murray.
Speaker 6 (26:35):
They faced Kyle Shanahan and the Niners this weekend in
a tough matchup, but the Niners head coach says nothing
but great things about Kyler Murray.
Speaker 5 (26:43):
Take a listener.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
He just looks so much more comfortable.
Speaker 7 (26:46):
I thought he looked really good last year when he
came in, you know, just watching their offense, seeing him
in the new scheme for the first time, I think
you got to sit back and watch other guys do it.
And then him coming in, you could tell he really
consciously tried to play within the confines of the offense,
which was different to see just how scheme was before.
And then always when he isn't playing in the confines
(27:07):
of the offense, how he can be his the scariest
guy in the league. So Kyler's always played at pretty
high level and when he's healthy, and he's doing that
right now.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
And they've gotten in better weapons, and what's wrong with
the offense?
Speaker 5 (27:19):
Why did he run last week? I'm watching that, you know,
I was on the Cardinals. I'm like, what the hell's
going on?
Speaker 6 (27:25):
Why is he not running? That's the best weapon that
the Cardinals have. We know Harris is great and Connor's
a very good running back. But Kyler dropping back to
pass and saying I'm gonna scoot for eight nine yards he.
Speaker 5 (27:36):
Can do that like every play. I don't get it.
Speaker 4 (27:40):
I think.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
The word I would use with Kyler as maintenance. There's
a lot of maintenance. That doesn't mean doesn't mean bad guy.
Some people come with maintenance, and I think Kyler can be.
And I've talked to people about this. There's things that
are frustrating sometimes for coaches and coordinators, sometimes for management.
(28:04):
And I think the very best quarterbacks in this league
are stars and they have low maintenance. I've been told,
like Lamar Jackson, there's not a lot of maintenance. Josh Allen,
there's not a lot of maintenance brought Purty Jared Goff,
no maintenance. Mahomes for as big a rock star, not
a lot of maintenance. I think Kyler there's things that
you have to work around his personality. And I've heard
(28:28):
this from multiple people, and it can be frustrating. It
is hard. You see it in entertainment all the time
where somebody's a star, but there's a lot to deal with.
And I do think there's some maintenance stuff here that
I've been told now twice that is stuff you'd rather
not deal with, but you're willing to deal with it
because he's so gifted.
Speaker 6 (28:46):
Wasn't that like a Seinfeld episode where Elaine was talking
about high maintenance low maintenance.
Speaker 5 (28:50):
I feel like it was. That's a good reference by
you because I don't want my quarterback to be high maintenance.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Well, well I don't.
Speaker 5 (28:56):
I don't care how talented you.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
By the way, I heard this about Jay Cutler when
Jay was in the league. There's maintenance. I think Aaron
can be there's a little maintenance. And by the way,
I'm okay with it. But I'm just saying, well, you're
okay with it as long as they're winning well. With
Jay Cutler had got to a point where it just
was more than people were comfortable Rodgers, And that's my
(29:18):
take with Kyler Murray. Okay, they're getting of all these weapons.
If I'm gonna deal with maintenance, then don't. I'm not
saying it's all wins and losses, but you gotta produce
big numbers like I can't see what I saw last weekend.
You getting worked. That was not a good defense. That's
not a good defense. With Washington and Jayden Daniels looked
way more comfortable and productive. Like that was a bad
(29:41):
look for Kyler Murray. That's a bad defense, and you're
not willing to run on a bad defense.
Speaker 6 (29:46):
Potentially good news for Murray is that Warner the number
one graded linebacker in.
Speaker 5 (29:52):
The league so far this season. Did you see his
pick six this past weekend?
Speaker 6 (29:55):
Unbelievable effort. He's hurt, has not practiced yet this Moure.
I'll see what happens today. If he's out that it's
a big win for Kyler Murray.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Fred Warner feels like he's at a different level. I
always felt there was guys like Junior Seau in his prime,
Brian r. Lacker and his prime ray Lewis. You feel
like they're just they're a great linebacker. Everybody's a notch below.
Speaker 5 (30:14):
One is like a faster version of ray Lewis.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
He's got everywhere, great hands, unbelievable range, a sure tackler.
Fred Warner feels like, I mean, he's gonna make the
Hall of Fame, that's a given. But it just that
he's better than other elite linebackers.
Speaker 6 (30:29):
What do you make of this line? The Niners? It
was seven and a half that's gone. Now it's flat set. No.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
I think the Cardinals are the play I think I
don't love it, but I McBride's health. Is he gonna play.
Speaker 5 (30:42):
He did a light practice yesterday, so he is gonna play.
Speaker 6 (30:44):
But I will just say remember the Niners. You know
a lot of injuries, a slow start. This is a
team that can reel off eight nine wins in a
row and heartbeat, and once they get.
Speaker 5 (30:52):
Healthy, just keep an eye on them.
Speaker 6 (30:54):
Next up, Colin, you were impressed by Seattle Monday night
despite the l in Detroit, Geno Smith who for a
rear high three hundred and ninety five yards thirty eight completions,
he was he was pretty damn good.
Speaker 5 (31:05):
Seahawks head coach Mike McDonald was proud of him.
Speaker 8 (31:07):
Take a listen, man, there's a lot of good stuff
on tape, a lot of stuff we obviously need to
you know, fix and make right. So but that's the
case anytime we stepped foot out there and and tow
the line. So that'll be the same mentality. Our guys
could easily gave up on really all three phases, and
they didn't. You can see it in their eyes, and
(31:27):
I think it's a it's a shout out to the
men we have in our locker room and the resilience
they have. And I told them after the I've told
them after the game that's the mentality and the spirit
that we want in our football team that we're gonna
need over.
Speaker 4 (31:40):
The long all.
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Yeah, I was. I was really impressed with Seattle. How
many teams could lose four best defensive linemen and compete
with the Detroit team on the road when Jared Gop
was eighteen to eighteen and they just kept coming back
and back and back. I've said this about Pittsburgh, all
say it about Seattle. They may not hoist a trophy,
but the Steers personnel and the Seahawks personnel is elite.
(32:04):
Seattle's got players everywhere.
Speaker 6 (32:07):
McDonald is famous for cooking up interesting defenses. So the Giants,
Malik Neighbors is the I think the biggest name to
watch on the injury. He's hurt off the concussion and
there's a long flight from New York to Seattle. You're
not supposed to fly with concussions. We'll see what happens
with Neighbors if he doesn't play. Comes this is gonnaug
The cornerbacks just press the line, will put eight in
the bottom Witherspoon.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Witherspoon's a great corner anyway.
Speaker 6 (32:30):
I don't see Singletary going off for a buck fifty.
I know it's a big number here, six and a half.
I like the Seahawks are inching toward one of the
better bets. If Neighbors doesn't.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Play, what Seattle's front look like.
Speaker 6 (32:42):
Well, we'll see the injury report today that that's a
big question. But the problem is nobody like Detroit's front
scares you. The great offensive line the running backs do
the Giants Nope, Like.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
I saw Williams armor on Saint Brown, Detroit and the
Giants aren't the same.
Speaker 6 (32:59):
When you see a quarter like Skyler Thompson went to
Seattle and could do nothing against his defense. I don't
think Daniel Jones is that much better, so I think
Seattle's aside here.
Speaker 5 (33:07):
It's a big number. Be careful a lot obviously.
Speaker 6 (33:09):
Final story, Colin is that Denver Broncos defense has been
incredible this year. The only Majors defensive statistical category where
they're not top four his run defense and they're twelve.
If Denver can keep scoring points, they could be a
problem in the AFC.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
Keep an eye on them in the West.
Speaker 6 (33:26):
John Payton says he's not worried about his offense or
his rookie quarterback.
Speaker 9 (33:30):
You're still looking for the perfect picture, the perfect game,
you know. I know this shangrilad doesn't exist, but the execution,
the details still have to get better with younger players,
and that's what we're working on, you know, because I've
said this before. If everyone else can paint the right picture,
(33:51):
then you truly get to evaluate and watch a real
good quarterback.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Boy, he likes him a lot. Yeah, you are really
down on him.
Speaker 5 (34:01):
I wouldn't stop. No, he was one of the great
guests here.
Speaker 6 (34:05):
But last season I just I wonder how much of
this is smoking mirrors for Denver.
Speaker 5 (34:11):
Okay, two weeks ago, Tampa perfect spot.
Speaker 6 (34:13):
Tampa was really beat up Denver Roman last week in
the rain against the Jets.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
It's like, oh, did they played in sun and the
Jets played in right?
Speaker 5 (34:21):
I think that happened.
Speaker 6 (34:22):
Yeah, I just I need to see a little more
from your guy, bo Nicks. I'm trying to look like
I know the defense has been great, but these are
the quarterbacks they faced cal Him Okay in the opener,
Geno Smith.
Speaker 5 (34:33):
Then it was a Field.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
Smith is pretty good, He's good.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
He's good.
Speaker 1 (34:36):
It's pretty good.
Speaker 6 (34:37):
And then it was justin Fields, and then Baker Mayfield,
and then Aaron Rodgers good not awful, No, no, no,
not awful, just good.
Speaker 5 (34:44):
Not awful.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
Aaron Baker and Gino?
Speaker 5 (34:49):
Is Aaron great?
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Aaron's really good.
Speaker 4 (34:51):
Right now?
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Baker and Gino are having tremendous years.
Speaker 6 (34:54):
Time out, time out twenty Aaron Rodgers is do you
say great?
Speaker 5 (34:59):
Was that the word?
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I don't think he's great at this point. I think
he's good.
Speaker 6 (35:03):
Through four weeks, has he been a top ten quarterback
in the league? No, not even close. So they haven't
faced a top ten quarterback unless you have Baker through
four games.
Speaker 1 (35:10):
If your defense has looked good against Geno Baker and
Aaron Rodgers, it's a pretty good defense. I mean, those
are pretty good players.
Speaker 5 (35:17):
Right now, solid and they get the Raiders this weekend.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
And a nice to know Aaron's been reduced to solid.
He's got him in the super Bowl, but with a
solid quarter projection.
Speaker 5 (35:25):
Okay, that's a projection down the road.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Come on, j Mack with the news.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
Herd Line News.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
We got our our big ten bets around the corner.
We're tied by the way, Jmack. Both of us had
winning weeks. The PayPal Debit earns you PayPal debit card.
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(36:00):
Bank Corp NA person went to license by MasterCard International Ink.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and newon Easter nin am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app. Colin and j Matt
make their favorite Big ten bets of the week.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Okay, I'm gonna take Oregon minus twenty three and a
half at home against Michigan State. Oregon's the best West
Coast football team at home. Dan Lannings teams twenty five
straight wins at home against unranked opponents. Dylan Gabriel now
is heating up. This dude is completing almost eighty two
percent of his throws. They recruited at a high level
(36:41):
and Michigan State can't move the ball. Second straight game
lost to a top ten opponent. Ohio State ran them
out of the building and their beat up. I'm gonna
take Oregon. They're humming. They may have a little look
ahead to Ohio State, but their offense is now back
to what we thought it was preseason with the alignment
(37:03):
changes on the offensive line. I think the Ducks roll
twenty three points in college is not that big of
a cover, not at all.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
I started zero to three my first week and then
one and two bouncing back.
Speaker 5 (37:13):
What are we doing here?
Speaker 6 (37:14):
We're going first Ucla Penn State over forty six and
a half.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Colin.
Speaker 6 (37:19):
UCLA's bad aggressively Penn State could get to thirty five,
no problem. The question is in garbage time, can UCLA
push it over the total?
Speaker 5 (37:26):
I believe so Penn State will kind of power down.
Speaker 6 (37:28):
The schedule gets a little tougher next week, so I
think this is the easy Penn State victory in the
total goes over forty six.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
And a half. All right, Husky Stadium, all take the
under on Michigan at Washington forty one and a half points.
Michigan cannot pass the ball. It is the worst offense
in the Big Ten, and Washington this year. Last year
they were an offensive led team. This year they're better
on defense. They've been held under twenty points in two
of their last three games, so Washington is not the
(37:56):
Washington of last year. They're at home, it's more defense.
Michigan has only one way to win, keep the score down,
and they haven't unbelievable offensive line or defensive line at Michigan.
I think this game's played between the thirties Huskies Wolverines
under forty one and a half.
Speaker 5 (38:15):
I don't hate that, but I also like Washington.
Speaker 6 (38:18):
Favored by two and a half, I'd have them on
the money line and I'll take the two and a
half as well. Colin is this Michigan's first road game
of the season in October. They've been in the friendly
confines of vann Arbery. Now they go to Washington. I
think the Huskies here get it done. Low scoring game,
Like you said, keep it on this kid Will Rodgers,
the quarterback of the transfer fro Mississippi State. He's been
good quietly, a lot of good quarterbacks in the country.
(38:38):
But I like Washington.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
I'm gonna take USC minus eight. They are playing great football. Michigan,
they were overwhelmed. Minnesota's not Michigan, and they're coming off
a very close, close game with the Wolverines, lost it
emotional game. USC offensively is number one passing offense in
(39:00):
the Big Ten, number one third down offense in the
Big Ten. Everybody watched the Michigan game and they've made
big judgments on what USC is. This game last week
twenty eight nothing second half against Wisconsin. They beat LSU,
and by the way that Michigan game in the second
half they went toe to toe. I think if they
played Michigan again, Michigan had three big runs. You've over
(39:23):
judged USC off that terrible first half against Michigan. They
win and COVERO.
Speaker 5 (39:30):
Okay, we're head to head.
Speaker 6 (39:31):
You know we like in college, you can look to
look ahead spots, sandwich spots. Next week, Uscspenn State. Okay,
that's a massive game.
Speaker 2 (39:39):
Who do you guys have this week?
Speaker 6 (39:40):
Oh, Minnesota, the guy with the rowing the boat stuff.
This is a bad look ahead spot for USC. You
go travel to the Midwest, there's a chance they get
kind of boxed in. You're Minnesota physical team, similar to
what happened in Michigan. You don't think flecking company knows. Hey,
we just got to keep it on the ground and
beat these guys.
Speaker 5 (39:57):
Up at the line of scrimming. Be careful.
Speaker 6 (39:59):
I took the point with the Gophers getting eight in
a look ahead spot for them next week.
Speaker 5 (40:03):
Trojan's Penn State is like an awesome game.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
Oh it's one of the games.
Speaker 5 (40:08):
I mean, there's a lot of good games next week.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
But you know, people are looking at the USC Michigan
game the first half. If you go back and watch
the second half of that game, USC moved the ball.
They moved it on LSU, they moved it on Wisconsin.
USC's offense is number one of the Big ten passing
third down good. It's really really good. By the way,
last two years under Lincoln Riley, the USC offense number
(40:32):
one in college football, and they got that one, but
that Michigan first half because us he has a red
shirt freshman left tackle, a true sophomore right guard, and
Michigan's got the two best defensive linemens arguably in college football.
It took him a half to get the feet under him.
USC can, this is a really good USC offense. Our
(40:53):
three next,
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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