Best of The Herd

Colin believes there's no way the 49ers can still consider paying Brock Purdy over $50 million per year in his next contract after another second half collapse in a disappointing season for San Francisco. He unveils his top 10 NFL teams after week 17 as the playoff picture starts to become clearer. Plus, 3-time National Champion Urban Meyer joins the show in studio to preview the 2nd round of College Football Playoff games. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd Podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sportsradio dot com,
or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app
by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR. Thanks for listening
to the Herd podcast. Here we go on a loaded

(00:25):
Tuesday in Los Angeles, Urban Meyer talking about the Penn
State game tonight, Ohio State Oregon tomorrow. Nick right in
one hour our Herd hierarchy, probably our final top ten
of the regular season next week. You know you're playing
a bunch of backups live in Los Angeles. It's the
Herd wherever you may be, however you may be listening.

(00:49):
Thanks for making us part of your day. Our last
show of twenty twenty four. As we embark on a
new year, New Year's resolutions. I have one a year.
I keep it to myself. It's usually a personal thing.
I don't know if I can improve, So I'm not
sure what I have this year. Jamak anything out there
you're gonna blurt out about getting.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
Better, Well, I don't need to get better since I'm
great already. Yeah, yeah, started today playing basketball this morning.
I may go to Vegas tonight. Just got an invite
from some friends. Listen, let's get the new year started
right right.

Speaker 1 (01:20):
Start the night in Vegas. Start the year in Vegas.
So I want to start. I'll get to the Detroit Lions.
I'll get to them in about five ten minutes. I want
to talk about Brock Purdy because there's this feeling that now,
even though he has a year left on his rookie deal,
that you have to pay Brock Purty. Now, oh, you
got to get a discount now on this guy. And
I was about two weeks ago. I'm watching all these

(01:43):
drone videos on TikTok, all these guys in New Jersey,
and it's clear that men struggle telling the difference between
drones and small planes and aliens. It's also clear men
have a problem deciphering the difference from like Joe Burrow,
who gets whatever he wants with a bad roster, and

(02:03):
Brock Purty, who's really good in the first half with
one of the great play designers in NFL history, Kyle Shanahan.
I always get left with a feeling it's a lot
of empty calories and empty yards. It's one thing if
you're Borrow and your O linees bad and we don't
love your coach and you're always playing from behind. Brock

(02:26):
Purty has, after Andy Reid and maybe Sean Payton, the
best play designer forget play color, best play designer since
you know, maybe his dad Mike Shanahan. So and you
have the best tight end arguably in football, and two
good receivers and you're at home and the Lions are

(02:47):
missing eight defensive starters. But this league is about second halfs.
The first half is on script. Yes, he's great off
an on script, but when bo Nicks and Justin Herbert met,
like a week ago, remember that game about ten days ago,
fourteen days ago, bo Nicks was really good on script

(03:09):
in the first half. Justin Herbert was great offscript. Because
Justin Herbert's a lot better right now than bo Nicks.
And in the second half this year, the more important half.
Brock Purty has eight touchdowns and ten picks and twelve
total giveaways. He's bad and trailing. In the second half,
he's worse. He has a passer rating below seventy five.

(03:33):
You know, in the non scripted half, with one of
the great play designers of my life. You want to
know it's not random, by the way, you want to
know the top five quarterbacks right now second half passer rating,
Oh what a shock. Josh Allen, Joe Burrow, Lamar Jackson,
Jared Goff and number one pick Baker Mayfield. More talented guys.

(03:53):
There's a connection between the two. Just a big majority
for all these people saying I have to pay brock
Purty year early, if at all. A big chunk of
his yards are after the catch, because Kittle is great
after the catch and deebo is great after the catch.
And the other part is how open everybody is. I

(04:14):
swear to God, has George Kittle ever been covered on
any catch in the last month. He's wide open. So
to me, it's always always empty calories with brock Purty.
You got to watch the games in the second half.
In a tight game, two ugly picks through behind Juwan
Jennings on a big third down. Yes, they miss field

(04:36):
goals of fifty one and fifty eight yards. Why did
they have to kick field goals of fifty one and
fifty eight yards because he missed to Juwan Jennings or
or he doesn't quite have the athletic ability that his
backup Josh Dobbs had to run into the end zone.
I mean, every time he throws the ball over the middle,
you're holding your breath. You're not with Mahomes or Herbert.

(04:59):
I don't fel that way with Josh Allen. I do
with Brock Purdy. I don't feel that way with Jared Goff.
So this idea that he's a fifty million dollar quarterback.
Jimmy Garoppolo won sixty nine percent of his games in
San Francisco, and people, Niner fans, couldn't get him out
of town fast enough. Maybe they were jealous because he
was so handsome. He won sixty nine percent of his games,

(05:22):
he got to Super Bowls. They couldn't get him out
of town fast enough. They blamed him for losing the
Mahomes in the Super Bowl because he missed one deep route.
Perty's went in sixty four percent of his games, it
seems to me. And by the way, he's also hurt again,
and he's been hurt multiple times because he's a smaller athlete.
I thought it was interesting when Josh Dobbs came in,

(05:43):
who's just a remarkable kid. I think he was like
a chemical engineer at Tennessee. You can give him a playbook,
he can memorize it in fifteen minutes. But he ran
for a touchdown because he's a super athletic kid. I
don't think Brock Purty could have run for a touchdown.
Dobb's a faster, more elegant athlete. So the idea that
I've got a pay him fifty million and pay him early.
There is a difference. I'm sorry, guys, but there is

(06:04):
a difference between aliens and a small plane flying over
your house or maybe your neighbor's drone. And there's a
difference between guys who are literally tractors, you know, like
they're pulling a franchise to wins, and guys that are trailers.
They're mostly being pulled. Second half game on the line,

(06:28):
playing with a lead to really ugly picks when he
had to throw it over the middle. And again here
here's Kyle Shannan after on his injury.

Speaker 3 (06:39):
I know everyone when they hear about Brock's elbow and stuff,
just like me, you think of elbow injury from a
couple of years ago, but you know, just talking to doctors,
you just got hit in the right spot, and when
you get hit there, you're just your nerves go and
you can't feel much, but hopefully it'll be all right.

Speaker 1 (06:56):
Then let's sa again. I'm going to get to the
Detroit Lions after the break hierarchy. Top of the hour,
Nick right, Urban Meyer. So let's talk about this whole
thing about what you pay a quarterback, because we've seen
with Dak. If you pay A plus money to a
B to a B plus quarterback, you can't have a
legitimate roster. I mean, look at the Cowboys compared to
the Eagles. How many guys would even start for the

(07:17):
Cowboys on the Eagles, right, Because you've been paying Dak
overpaying him for years and years and years, and so
this stuff, this is a big topic. This stuff's really important.
You can overpay a wide receiver, you know, you pay
him twenty, he's worth fifteen. You start overpaying a quarterback
fifty eight and he's worth thirty three. One of the
reasons Tampa's so good is because they're getting a deal

(07:40):
on Baker Mayfield. They're paying him thirty three million. I
take Baker over Brock thirty in a second, thirty three months.
They're getting a deal it's okay for teams to occasionally
get deals on quarterbacks. Two. Not everybody has to be overpaid.
But a team that is underpaid Tampa with Baker, they've
got a stacked roster. They got good dudes everywhere, d
line wide receiver, two to good running backs. Dallas overpays

(08:03):
their quarterback and they're stuck. So to me, there are
three groups, three clubs for quarterbacks in terms of fifty
million dollars plus. The first club is I'm gonna pay
you what I gotta pay you. Mahomes Lamar, Josh Allen, Herbert,
Stafford Burrough, GoF Love, You're great. I think you can
get to a super Bowl. I'm gonna pay you what

(08:25):
I'm gonna pay you, and I think a lot of
your success is based on you and you being great.
Then there's the fifty million dollar club. We can negotiate.
I'm not offended if you ask for it, but I'm
gonna push back a little. Jalen Hurt, Sam Darnold, Baker,
and Jayden Daniels. Jayden now want a little more time
Baker and Sam. Let's be honest, it's the perfect season.

(08:46):
Jalen Hurts feels very circumstantial, best o line, unbelievable receivers.
You know MVP when he had Shane Stiket. I like him.
These guys can ask for fifty million. I'm not offended. Negotiate.
And then there's the third club, which is if you
ask for it, I'm hanging up the phone. Brock Purtty's

(09:07):
in that one. Okay, it's nothing personal, but we're not
getting to fifty and we're getting to fifty a year early.
What's the market? Go to the market. So you know,
it's like negotiating for a new car. You can tell
me that Civic is worth one hundred grand, Well we
got we got rustproofing, a sun roof, and the salesman

(09:28):
can tell me, how about the sports package? Okay, I'll
give you fifty one thousand, not one hundred thousand. I'm
walking out of the dealership if you think that Civic
is worth one hundred thousand dollars and it's not. Nobody's
picking on brock Purty. That's another thing. Oh, this is
there when you get to a quarterback because they're paid
so much. Now, I mean like Mahomes signed a four
hundred and fifty million dollar deal. You can make mistakes,

(09:48):
overpaying a little bit for a Mike linebacker, or overpaying
for you know, a tight end a little you're paying
him thirteen, he's probably worth eight. You start overpaying a quarterback,
you get to the fifth sixty million dollar club, not
interested that it got you. There's only one thing that
guarantees you can't win Super Bowls. Only one thing. Paying

(10:10):
a b quarterback a plus money. Even Tom Brad Drew
Brees in his prime took big money for a couple
of years. Sean Payton and Drew Brees had two back
to back mediocre years, restructured his deal, better deal. They
end up in a Super Bowl. Tom Brady was never
the highest paid quarterback. Kirk Cousins was, and Kirk Cousins,
because of that, didn't have the surrounding elements. So yeah,

(10:35):
I'm just I keep watching this thing, and I'm gonna
keep going back. I feel with Brock Purty and certain quarterbacks,
there's a lot of ifs ands and bututs. If this
is healthy, if I have Christian, if I have a
great play designer, if it's not wet, if I lead,
if it's the first half, I can't pay that kind
of money. I can't just won't do it. So and
I'm not. I'm not like old guy yelling at clowns. Here.
I'll pay it. There's like eight guys in the in

(10:57):
the world. I'll pay whatever I gotta pay you. Then
there's another half a dozen guys are close to it
where we can negotiate. But paying them fifty large and
having to pay them early, I'm not doing it. J MC,
I know he's your guy. I know you worship at
the altar of the Broxter.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
Boy after the positive Monday you had coming off the
top rope on brock Purty to start New Year's Eve, Colin,
come on, man.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
Hey, the rest of the show is flowers, rainbows, just
make it sure, and birds chirping. But I have to
address that. It's a serious topic. We all watch the NFL.
It's got the highest ratings by a mile, and it's
all centered around one position. But it's not just centered
around the position. It's centered around what you pay the position.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
He had two bad throws last night on our otherwise
extraordinary night. No Christian McCaffrey, no Brandon au.

Speaker 1 (11:50):
Allians, had no eight defensive starters.

Speaker 2 (11:52):
I just, yeah, I would move off some of those
defensive starters who can't plug a hole to save their life.

Speaker 4 (11:57):
Jamir Gibbs running wild. How about listen?

Speaker 2 (12:00):
I had to give Dan Campbell some credit. Okay, everybody
wanted to sit his guys, the game means nothing. He
plays everybody are people crazy?

Speaker 1 (12:06):
The game means nothing. First of all, this is the
Detroit I'm gonna get into this. The idea that game
didn't mean anything for Detroit. I completely push back on that.
I'll talk about that coming up.

Speaker 5 (12:16):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd Weekdays
and Noone eastern nin am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.

Speaker 6 (12:24):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together We're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You could catch
us weekdays from five to seven pm Eastern two to
four Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and of course the
iHeartRadio App.

Speaker 1 (12:37):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.

Speaker 6 (12:39):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world. We have a lot of fun talking
about the stories behind the stories in the world of
sports and pop culture, stories that well, other shows don't
seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact
that we've been friends for the last twenty years and
still work together. I mean that says something, right, So
check us out. We like to get you involved, to

(12:59):
take your phone calls, chop it up. As they say,
I'd say, the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio,
maybe the most interactive show on planetar. Be sure to
check out Cavino and Rich live on Fox Sports Radio
and the iHeartRadio app from five to seven pm Eastern
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Speaker 1 (13:18):
Media that's Covino and Rich. Here we go our number
two to Tuesday, Urban Meyer Next hour, Nick right in
five minutes, live in Los Angeles. It's the herd wherever
you may be, however you may be listening. Jamack is strong.
It's amazing whenever I can get old Jamack out of

(13:40):
the house. You've got the kids and the pets and
the family. I think I have figured out a way
just to wrestle him psychologically, guilt him into joining his
mentor tonight for a little poffed mentor how about one
little pop tonight?

Speaker 4 (14:00):
Ann gave you a Hall Pass for tonight.

Speaker 1 (14:03):
I'm gonna see Ann Thursday through Sunday night, so I'm
gonna's and weekend.

Speaker 4 (14:08):
You know what, have you seen the movie Hall Pass?

Speaker 3 (14:10):
No?

Speaker 4 (14:11):
You got to see that Owen Owen Wilson, Yeah, and
a couple other guys. It's it's a great movie. You
will laugh out loud some really dirty interpret.

Speaker 1 (14:21):
You're gonna consider maybe going out tonight.

Speaker 4 (14:23):
That or Hall Pass.

Speaker 1 (14:24):
I'll watch the movie for the seventh uber be safe. Okay,
all right here we do it every week at this time,
the herd hierarchy.

Speaker 5 (14:32):
Let us go heard heard hierarchy.

Speaker 2 (14:37):
Time.

Speaker 4 (14:37):
Now go the top ten NFL teams according.

Speaker 1 (14:40):
To College Well number ten. If they beat the Saints,
they can clinch their four straight division title. I've said it.
I like their personnel. Baker Mayfield leads the NFL and
touchdown passes over the last two years since he joined
the Bucks. They're a big play offense with excellent running backs.
Jason Light's a great GM. They've always got talent. They've
had good quarterback play like Brady and Baker. They can

(15:04):
play with anybody. Five and one over their last six games,
blew the Chargers out. That was a real eye opener.
I don't think they can hoist a trophy, but they
could certainly host a playoff game and knock off an
injury riddle Detroit if possible. Bucks at ten, number nine,
I'm gonna go Rams. Their offensive sluggishness in the first

(15:26):
half is hard to explain, but their defense is really
good and young, and it's getting better. They've held opponents
under twenty points in three straight games. Matthew Stafford's having
a very good year over his last seven games of
passer rating a one oh five. They're a little puka
nukua dependent, so I don't think they're a trophy team,
but I have them at nine number eight. I would

(15:48):
put the Chargers at eight because they're quarterbacks younger at
can run, and I think that mobility is the difference
between the two teams, justin Herbert ninety nine passer rating
hyper efficient, reckless, big with mobility. That gives them a
slight edge in my opinion over the Rams. Also, five
of their six losses have come to good teams the

(16:10):
Chiefs a couple of times, Ravens, Buccaneers. They're losing to
the right teams. I have them an eight number seven.
The Packers. I thought the Packers could hoist a trophy.
But they're zero to five against the Lions, the Vikings,
and the Eagles. They're eleven to zero against everybody else.
So they're a bully against average to pretty good teams.
They're not gonna. They're not gonna They're not gonna beat
your Ravens. They're not gonna beat your Chiefs, Bills. That's

(16:32):
not who they are. Six straight games without a giveaway, though,
and I think that's coaching in Matt Lafleur. They have
taken some attempts away from Jordan Love. They don't turn
it over. They're kind of a power run team. I
have the Packers at seven, number six, but you know,
Lamar Jackson's better than Jordan Love in my opinion, so
I have them at six, second largest rushing differential in

(16:54):
a season in league history. They remain a run teams.
A Flowers and Mark Andrews allows them to pass as well.
But number one scoring defense, number one total defense since
week eleven. You know, I love this organization. Kind of
holding your breath on what they look like in the
January playoffs. But the Ravens at six, number five, I

(17:14):
thought Sam Darnold was amazing. I got him at five.
They're tied for the most takeaways in the league this
year at thirty one. That is the Brian Flores factor.
The fact that Brian Floores isn't front and center for
everybody from the Bears job to the Saints job. This
defense does not have elite personnel, but they're putting up

(17:36):
elite takeaway stacks. That's a Brian Flores factor. By the way,
Sam Donald's the first quarterback in league history to win
fourteen games in his first season with a new team.
Even Tom Brady did not do that. Maybe Donald is
better than Brady. When you think about number four. Number
four Detroit stacked roster offensively, falling apart defensively. But I

(18:00):
mean they have five games this year with forty or
more points and no turnovers. I mean, pretty easy for them.
They're clever, they can play power run. They're getting Montgomery
back four straight games for three plus touchdown passes. I
think we all know the story on them. If they
were healthy, they could win the Super Bowl, but we
don't trust their defense going forward. Number three Philadelphia, They're

(18:22):
eleven to zero when Jalen Hurts and AJ Brown play
the number one total defense. They allow four point eight
yards of play, so that's pretty good in the NFL.
And this day and age, four point eight yards of play.
Their O line and D line combination is the best
in the NFL. They got a great GM and they
got a roster to show for it. Do I worry
about the concussion. I would worry about it if it

(18:43):
was in two weeks. I don't worry about it now.
I have them at number three, Number two the Bills.
The Bills have cut down on given the football away.
They only have eight giveaways and they've only allowed fourteen sacks.
So we always like Buffalo, but we thought, yeah, they'll
beat themselves. Well, they don't beat themselves this year. They
don't turn it over. I don't give you sacks, don't
have a lot of negative plays, and they do it

(19:04):
without a single thousand yard rusher or thousand yard receivers.
So they are still somewhat too reliant on Josh Allen.
But you know what, I like James Cook, I like
Kenkaid Dawson Knox. I like their receiving corps. Coleman's getting better.
I got at two, Number one, same old Chiefs, best
coach best defensive coordinator, best quarterback, and arguably the best

(19:26):
defensive lineman Chris Jones. Let's just say this, it's the
same team we've seen, except I think it's a better
offensive version it always since Tyreek Hill left. It's a
lot of patchwork at receiver. That's so what they've been
for three years now. And now they got Hollywood Brown back.
They wish they had Rashid Rice, but that'll do. And

(19:48):
Worthies become a real player and Travis Kelsey this is
what they do because they play mahomes what they pay him.
And they lost Tyreek Hill. This is the one unit
they've tried to kind of figure out and bring in
a guy for a year and move this guy over there.
But you know what, third team in NFL history to
go six straight games without a without a turnover, So

(20:09):
that's very rare. So you get all the upside and
not a lot of the downside. Best situational team in
football and that's that's not even arguable, although I will
say Detroit on third down and fourth down with Ben Johnson,
you know a coach, You know a team is rolling
when they go to the red zone in a congested area.
Remember Andy read a couple years ago in the Super Bowl.

(20:31):
They in the congested area, sky Moore is wide open.
Like you know, you have a good offensive scheme and
this is what Shanahan does. Does anybody guard George Kittle
or is he just opened by twenty yards on every play?
So let's bring in Nick right Coholes. First things first,
he is now joining US Live. You know last week
you almost complimented me on the on the top ten

(20:53):
anything Bobby you?

Speaker 7 (20:54):
This week?

Speaker 8 (20:56):
Lion's too high. Lions are going to lose to the
Vikings on Sunday, and after they could lose their first
playoff game. Defense is just to it's past the point
of no return.

Speaker 1 (21:08):
And I think I like a.

Speaker 8 (21:11):
Ton of what Dan Campbell has done and has brought
to that organization. He's obviously a very good head coach.
Not taking anything away from him. However, his decision to
play as guys last night was objectively a mistake. You
are now in one of the highest leverage regular season games. Ever,

(21:32):
as far as it's impact on who can win the
Super Bowl, one seed or five seed will be determined
Sunday night in Game two seventy two, and you had
a choice, have my banged up and most important players
have a bye week or have my entire team on
short rest having played Monday night, And he chose the

(21:55):
ladder rather than the former, and I think it's a mistake,
and so I love who they are. Offensively, golf has
been sensational. The running game hasn't really been hurt by
Montgomery being out because Gibbs is so good. I give
them full credit, but that Niners team has struggled to
look like that offensively all year, and Jill Purdy gave

(22:18):
the game away the Niners seam wheres moving the ball
up and down the field. I think Sam Darnold's going
to do the same thing. And then in round one
they'll either be facing the Rams or the Bucks, either.

Speaker 7 (22:31):
Of whom can move the ball. By the way, the
Bucks beating them this year.

Speaker 8 (22:35):
The Rams took them to overtime this year, and that's
when the team was whole and healthy. So I think
Detroit's had an awesome season that unfortunately is going to
end quickly because of all the defensive injuries. And I
think Dan playing the players last night was a big mistake.

Speaker 1 (22:51):
I tend to see myself as an ambassador of goodwill.
Glass half full Colin optimist. Every morning I get labeled
as a mean rock Purty guy. But to me, first
half a script, second half is talent. Rock Purty is
now a bad second half quarterback, and I'm supposed to

(23:13):
pay him early and fifty million. I don't understand it.
What am I seeing that nobody else is. I mean,
you and I were both very hesitant on the Dak deal,
and we're right. I mean, I don't think Perty's as
good as Dak. Now what do you make of this
idea that you have to pay him early?

Speaker 8 (23:33):
No, it's at this point, it'd be insane at this
especially with him, and I understand, we hope, and it
looks like that injury last night is not us very
significant one. But it's a reminder that this is an
undersized player who has suffered, you know, one major injury

(23:54):
in his career, has been banged up a few other
times in a relatively small career sample, and all year long.
Last year you and I said, listen, you can't deny
the production. I do question how much of it is
coaching talent and circumstances, and what would he look like

(24:16):
in a league average situation. And amazingly he got dropped
into a league average situation this year, and now they're
six and ten. He wants this is the third straight
week Colin people act like this was season from hell.

Speaker 7 (24:32):
It wasn't. Didn't start that way.

Speaker 8 (24:34):
They were four and four going into the by After
the buye they beat Tampa, their best win of the year,
they were a game out of first place, and then
the last three weeks, starting with the playoffs on the
line against the Rams, down three fourth quarter infield goal range,
late throws, the game losing pick last week when they'd
already been eliminated from the playoffs, but still he's playing

(24:56):
down five two minute warning on the other side of
the plus side of the fifty chance to go win
the game. Pick last night, leading the game throws, after
playing awesome for the first half, awesome throws a terrible interception,
and then once again fourth quarter down less than seven
chance to win the game or at least go take

(25:17):
the lead, probably too early to.

Speaker 7 (25:19):
Win the game. Pick. He is who we thought he was,
and I think the Niners know it too. So I
don't know that the Niners.

Speaker 8 (25:27):
Are gonna, you know, offer your guys Sam Darnold a
huge deal. I don't know that they're going to spend
a ton of money at the quarterback position. Here's what
I could see them doing, telling Brock Purdy, yet, listen,
you're under contract and you did not have a good
year three, so we're not going to pay you after
year three. And oh, by the way, as it happens,

(25:48):
Kyle Shanahan's long lost love Kirk Cousins is going to
come play for a million bucks as well.

Speaker 7 (25:53):
Don't worry, He's just going to back you up.

Speaker 1 (25:56):
We'll see.

Speaker 8 (25:57):
So yeah, I think the idea of Brock Purty getting
the Tua or Trevor deal, even if he has accomplished
more than both of those players, went out in the
window this past month.

Speaker 1 (26:07):
So I showed this earlier. It's easy to blame Mike McCarthy,
but I showed this earlier. We have a graphic. I said,
if you take the two best rosters in the NFC,
I won't even count the AFC. I'll just go NFC.
And I put the Lions and Eagles best players just offense,
because it's an offensive league, even the Chiefs. At some

(26:29):
point you have to it's hard to make stops. Sure,
And I put it on the screen there and only
two Cowboys would be considered. Zach Martin is now old,
injured and very expensive. I'd pass because the two other
guards are great, and Ceedee Lamb is not omor On
Saint Brown as a slot or AJ Brown is an
X receiver and we're blaming McCarthy. So maybe you could

(26:49):
squeeze in Cede Lamb.

Speaker 8 (26:51):
But my take is Ceedee Lamb in over a Monross
Saint Brown. But aside from that, I agree with everything
that you got there. Go ahead, And that's an upstairs problem.
That's a scout problem, that's a general manager problem. Andy
Reid is not beating the Eagles and Lions with that
in an offensive league. Why not keep Mike McCarthy.

Speaker 7 (27:12):
Well, I think your points well taken.

Speaker 8 (27:15):
But the reason I have two significant reasons I wouldn't
keep Mike McCarthy. One is I think tangible, and one
is more kind of intangible. The tangible one is this,
you have to make some type of seismic change, and
it's the only one you can. You just signed the quarterback.
There's only there's really only three major moves a team

(27:38):
can make. One is front office change. Well, in Dallas,
front office is ownership. So that is status quo. Another
is quarterback. Well, in Dallas, they just re signed the
quarterback to the biggest deal in NFL history. This past
offseason hasn't even kicked in yet, so that can't change.

Speaker 7 (27:59):
The other is head coach.

Speaker 8 (28:01):
And I so even if Mike McCarthy is not the
culprits here, it's the only chance they have at really
shaking things up. So I would go try to get
Mike Rabel, who with a quarterback worse than Dak Prescott,
made a conference title game and then after that they
won eleven and five, twelve and five, and he was

(28:22):
the one seed with Ryan Tannehill.

Speaker 7 (28:25):
I would go try to do that.

Speaker 8 (28:26):
The other reason I would move on from McCarthy is
it's very weird how we kind of do the coaching math,
which is, let's say Dak never got hurt, and this
Cowboys team was, right now, a twelve and four team,
you know that was locked into the wildcart, right, and

(28:47):
then they lost their first playoff game. Everyone would say
you have to fire McCarthy because, like and so now
that was the standard going into this year was can't
fall flat on your face in the playoffs, Yeah, because
they were so bad, never even got a chance to
see him in the playoffs. So now it's like the
McCarthy expectation clock has fully reset to where next year,

(29:12):
this year, they're sub five hundred if he keeps his job.
Next year if they go ten and seven and get
the seven of the playoffs. So we're like, hey, Improvement,
definitely keep his job, and we're just back to where
we thought we were this year, like in twenty twenty six.
So I, even if I don't think he's done a
terrible job, I have to change something significant. I can't

(29:34):
change the front office, I can't change the quarterback, so
I might have to change coach.

Speaker 1 (29:38):
So you know that when you and I believe in
something like you for years, believe that the Buffalo Bills
would beat themselves, and America attacks you, it's hard not
to when you're proven right, to just not explode with
joy and remind.

Speaker 8 (29:53):
You, especially when you're a tax for relentlessly called a hater,
called all these things, and then you're just showing proven right.

Speaker 7 (29:59):
Yeah, so go ahead.

Speaker 1 (30:00):
For six years, I was mocked, ridiculed, and it was hurtful,
and I kept saying Sam Darnold can play the Panthers
and the Jets are dysfunctional, and so I'm trying not
to have confirmation bias. But he may be having one
of the great seasons in the last decade. Now, I'm
not denying Kevin O'Connell the receiving crew, but I think

(30:23):
about this, Nick. The Vikings have never gotten a ring,
and it matters. If they were the Packers, you could say, hey,
we know quarterbacks, We'll let him go. We're gonna go
with JJ McCarthy because they got rings and they've proven
they can do that. Vikings don't Super Bowl losers like
the Bills. How do you let Sam leave? How do

(30:45):
you let the greatest year ever for a Vikings quarterback
walk out the door?

Speaker 8 (30:52):
So I at this point, barring a true collapse, and
by collapse, I mean they lose in Week eighteen and
then just look awful in the first playoff game, I
don't think they'll let him leave.

Speaker 7 (31:06):
Now.

Speaker 8 (31:06):
I don't know that they'll do what I'm sure he
would like them to do, which is give him a
real contract. And I don't think he would accept the
Geno or the Baker contract, which leaves us with the
always unfair to the player. But the NFL will never
get rid of it franchise tag to me, we are

(31:27):
we are moving rapidly down that path. Now listen, if
they make the super Bowl, then I think, which by
the way, I think they can do. I think they're
going to be the one seed and they can make
the super Bowl, then we talk long term contract.

Speaker 7 (31:43):
But if this playoff run ends the way I think.

Speaker 8 (31:46):
Vegas thinks it will, which is in either the divisional
round or the conference championship round, I think Sam Darnold
gets franchise tag one year, forty two million dollars. And
you tell JJ McCarthy, hey, it's a good thing we
drafted you at twenty years old because you're still be
young when you finally get to.

Speaker 7 (32:05):
Play, and we figure that out.

Speaker 1 (32:07):
The part that I.

Speaker 7 (32:10):
And I saw you do this yesterday.

Speaker 8 (32:12):
This is what I want to say about Donald and
kind of a media criticism at large. I think NFL
media and I'm included in that, we do the MVP
discussion really poorly, which is we started so early that
by week ten or eleven, it's almost like, hey, here

(32:33):
are the three or four eligible parties for MVP of
the league, and then it's an argument amongst them. Sam
Donald two weeks ago, had the play of his life
to beat Seattle and stepped up in the pocket past
Justin Jefferson a brilliant game to keep Minnesota live for

(32:53):
the one seed. Sam Donald last week played a nearly
perfect game of football, made the one mistake with the pick,
responded immediately with a great drive to keep Minnesota life
for the one seat. If you put his numbers up
to honestly any quarterback in the league, Lamar Jackson included,

(33:14):
it's not like it's a ten to eight round. And
other than Lamar, he compares favorably to just about every
quarterback that we're discussing for this. If they beat Detroit
and the Vikings are fifteen and two and this guy's
numbers are what they are, it is a reasonable take

(33:35):
to say Sam Darnold should be League MVP in the
same vein that, Hey, I still don't know how it happened,
but rich Gannon was a league and it should be
like there are some guys that don't have this, Like,
look at those numbers, and everyone talks about that. You know,
Lamar's having one of the greatest seasons ever, and by
the way, he is, but those numbers are similar and

(33:59):
obviously his numbers are far superior to Josh's.

Speaker 7 (34:02):
So I just I think it's you.

Speaker 8 (34:05):
If you were to all of a sudden, dude, the
Sam Donald should be MVP, people will just say, ah, Colin,
you're a Sam Donald homer, which you, by the way, are. However,
if it were a fair argument, if the Vikings win
fifteen games when they were projected to win six, and
it's because he has forty four hundred yards, thirty eight

(34:26):
touchdowns and is on a heater at the end of
the year, that's got to count for something.

Speaker 1 (34:31):
Yeah, I think you even have to consider that Baltimore
and Buffalo have better rosters than Sam Donald. Sam Donald
has the better receiving corps, but so do. I mean,
let Joe Burrell's got a receiving corps that's remarkable. He
may not make the playoffs, probably won't. So yeah, it's
one of those things where I just know the Bills
not beating Kansas City has been your thing Donald. I

(34:53):
can't quit him, and I will say this well, as
I've aged, it does make me happy. I always feel
like I've been lucky, I've landed with good bosses. I
think it's a shame I think it's really cool that
Baker and Sam and I like Baker, have both landed
with a great offensive mind. And it just shows that
if you keep your head down, you grind, eventually you'll

(35:16):
find your king maker. That's kind of my take.

Speaker 7 (35:18):
Yeah, I think that's very wise words.

Speaker 8 (35:21):
But you did just there maybe accidentally put into the universe.
And I know you like Baker, and I know you
two have you know, you know, come to terms after
what was a rocky beginning of your relationship. You did
just put out into the sports ether the Nightmare Cowherd scenario,
which is Bucks Vikings round one and Bake show.

Speaker 7 (35:44):
Kicks Arnold right out of the playoffs.

Speaker 8 (35:46):
That is a four or five that we could see
in the Vikings lose on Sunday night and Baker is
planting his flag midfield at Tampa and Sam is sad
you don't want to deal with that, and that is
a friend.

Speaker 1 (36:01):
I can hear the cough coming, the chest congestion coming.
I'm a little sick for that.

Speaker 9 (36:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:07):
Absolutely, make first things first, good seeing you, buddy, that
would you know? I Baker Mayfield somebody asked him recently
about me, and he said, we're frenemies. Is that I
offered him a job at my company. I said, I
think you'd be a great podcaster. I told you, I
think he could be one of the great college football
guys of all time. I think he's really, really talented.
And I am happy because I feel I've had the
good fortune over thirty years of doing this as I've

(36:29):
not always had great bosses, but I've had a couple
of really good ones. And there's only so much you
can do justin Herbert, There's only so much you can
do on just sheer talent. You eventually need a kingmaker.
You eventually need somebody that can get you to a
place that you can't get by yourself, because none of
us can get there. So it does make me happy
that Baker go great GM in Tampa. Mike Evans really

(36:55):
good running game. I mean, they've got like three running
backs I like. And it's like Baker and Sam are
both proving keep your head down, grind at it, keep
working your butt off. You will eventually get a great boss.
You will eventually get one.

Speaker 4 (37:10):
I mean that's crazy.

Speaker 2 (37:11):
So Baker basically at the option of the a podcaster
or one of the top three quarterbacks in the NFC,
and he decided to be like a good quarterback. I mean, honestly,
you look at the NFC, he's up there. Oh there's
no I mean, like everybody loves Jared Goff.

Speaker 5 (37:24):
I get it.

Speaker 4 (37:25):
If we switch golf and Baker.

Speaker 2 (37:27):
That Baker goes to the Lions, that Golf goes to well, no, no,
they're they're I mean it's Jalen Hurts in the NFC
is Jayden Daniels.

Speaker 1 (37:35):
I think. I think golf is less reckless and a
better so it's a prettier deep ball. But Bake I
said this when I was criticizing Baker. Oh yeah, he's
one of the twenty best quarterbacks in the world, even
it is low point.

Speaker 4 (37:47):
Well, that's not saying much.

Speaker 1 (37:48):
I mean, well, by the way, Aaron Rodgers is about
eighteenth right now, and the Jets are going to bring
him Backarris.

Speaker 4 (37:54):
Colin eighteenth, Dak or Aaron Rodgers next year?

Speaker 5 (37:58):
Who you got?

Speaker 1 (37:59):
Well, I don't have to pay Aaron as much, so
I would take Aaron for me.

Speaker 4 (38:03):
You're paying with the headaches.

Speaker 1 (38:05):
Yeah, but I call the nonsense. There's no nonsense with Dak.
He's getting hurt a lot, and every time he gets
hurt and comes out he's less of a player. Listen,
I've come to terms with Aaron.

Speaker 4 (38:17):
Are you a Brock Party or Aaron Rodgers next year?

Speaker 1 (38:22):
Because well, Brock Purty is free, so I take Brock.
I mean, if you're.

Speaker 4 (38:26):
Free, I'm long. He's not free for long man. You know,
big year for Brock. He's in a contract year, so
were you?

Speaker 1 (38:32):
Souch.

Speaker 4 (38:33):
Let's get a lot of interesting stuff happening.

Speaker 1 (38:35):
I'm being franchise tagged.

Speaker 5 (38:36):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in noon eastern non a em Pacific on Fox Sports
Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
I've called him the Bill Parcells of college football. I've
always said it's much more difficult to rebuild quickly at
multiple places than to build a great power. That's nothing
against Nick Saban or any coach that's done that, but
Urban Meyer, Bowling, Green, Utah, Florida obviously, and Ohio State.
So what a pleasure to have US Sports kind of
the voice of college football with Joel Klatt and others.

(39:08):
So let's just Nick Saban said this week he goes
you Buckeye fans got to get therapy on Michigan and
I looked at it. Ohio State's forty four and four
against everybody else in one and four against Michigan. Is
it fair to say right now and it's been reversed
Michigan's in the Buckeyes head a little bit.

Speaker 9 (39:28):
It's very fair.

Speaker 10 (39:30):
Obviously, it's happened in the last four years after a
dominant run, and it's got to get you know, it's
got to get changed. And I hear people say that
there's too much emphasis on the game, and that's you know,
I grew up in right outside Cleveland, Ohio the game.
I grew up in the ten year War with Bow
and Woody. So that's the way it is that Ohio

(39:50):
State and it will never change. So when someone says
they need to back off that game, I'm like, they
don't have to back up off the game.

Speaker 9 (39:56):
Just gonna win that game.

Speaker 10 (39:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (39:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:58):
People say that when they lose it. When they win it,
nobody says that. I think Oregon's the fastest team in
college football, But in my life I don't remember a
mediocre to below average defensive team winning a Natty. I
think it comes down to I love the Texas defense,
the Buckeye defense. Penn State's defense, Notre Dames defense. I

(40:20):
don't and I love Oregon and I said they're gonna
Oregon's gonna beat them. I said this before the season.
They're gonna be Ohio State at Opson. They're going to
lose in a rematch. I just question Oregon's defense. They'll score,
but I watched Penn State do it. I watched the
Ohio State, I watched Boise State. What do you make
of Oregon's defense is a personnel issue.

Speaker 10 (40:40):
Why I love their coordinator, toash To Lapois was actually
all my staff one time, and I think he's one
of the great motivators. I love their defensive line. But
you know what they got exposed against Penn State. I'm
actually going to talk on the Big Ten Network about
that briefly, that the Q run game exposed them in
Ohio State's not done a lot of Q run game.
If I'm watching that, Chip Kelly and that staff watching

(41:02):
what Penn State did with a non dual threat player
and Drew Aller, they ripped them up and down the
field a little bit with the Q run game. And
then Pribila came in playing the Q run game. It's
an equalizer, it's where you read a defender for it's
spread option. So you're going to read a defensive end
and you put you know, you people have to make
judgments and you equate numbers. You can't load the box

(41:23):
because you're always reading one defender. And they did that
with Drew Aller, drewe Eller. Will Howard's an excellent runner,
so I would anticipate I would see some of that.
Going back to Oregon's defense, though, I got a little
more confidence Oregon's defense. You watch them in some of
those games. They had ten sax agons Washington. The defensive
line plays with great effort. I really admire their coordinator.

(41:45):
I think they'll play better in this game against a
hot state.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
Listen, there are times when as a college coach, even
when you were at Florida or Ohio State, there are
times as a college coach you look across and say, listen,
they're going to be able to do this on us, right,
Like if you face a bammer Georgia, they're gonna get
a sack or two. Honest, they got NFL dudes. I
look at Oregon's offense and I'm like, you, just guys,
we're gonna give up some plays. How do you stop

(42:09):
Oregon because they score on everybody.

Speaker 9 (42:11):
Yeah, I got theory on that.

Speaker 10 (42:13):
And what happened is when you play a soft schedule
like Ohio State's schedule was awful the beginning first three games,
the fifty point favorites, I think in every game. And
then what happens is during the during the course of practice,
you go against something called a scout team and here
you are the defensive back of Ohio State. You're playing
the schedule they played, which was I mean, you didn't

(42:33):
see any juice at all, Allison. Your line up against Oregon,
and that is the fastest group of receivers, you know
them in Ohio State. Those are the two best groups
of receivers, and they were on them. I watched the
game and it looked like the you know, o High
State was in quicksand those are fast corners. They were shocked.
Here's the good thing. I don't think they'll be shocked
because they faced them. And I don't know if coach
Day has done this, but I made a comment earlier

(42:55):
on this too that I would there would be no
scout team if I was getting ready to play Oregon.
The Coroners are not going to go against the scout
team receiver. Right, you're going to go against the Jeremiah
and Mecca. You're going to be going against dudes the
entire time, because what happens, you get shocked and the
game is on you so fast if you're not prepared
for the speed. They played them once, and I would

(43:16):
anticipate in practice they're going against good on good to
getting ready for this game so.

Speaker 1 (43:20):
Your entire career. I can go back to Alex Smith
and Chris Leak into t bow. I think we tend to.
I'm guilty of this. We just think quarterbacks are the
same every Saturday or Sunday. But the truth is college kids,
as they're growing, a confidence is a big part. And
I thought Will Howard lost it against Michigan. I just
lost it. And then I watch him, you know, against Tennessee,

(43:44):
and I'm like, Okay, this is the kid that I
thought could get drafted. What is Will Howard? I'man not
forget the NFL, but what do you like about Will Howard?
Because if they do get into a shootout, which he
did before, tell me the things you see as a coach.

Speaker 10 (43:58):
I liked everything about Will Howard. I like athletic quarterback
and gets you out of trouble what she does. He's
had big scrambles and he makes plays with his legs
as well. Here's the best thing about Will Howard is
surrounding cast. Yeah, one of the best I've ever seen
on a football field. And the offense line I'm not
including them. I'm talking the offensive skill. The offense lines
has three major injuries. Yeah, but you're looking at those

(44:21):
two tailbacks, You're looking at three, maybe four receivers that
are all high draft picks. That's the best thing Will
Howard's got going is he's got to be a distributor
and he does not have to be the game winner.
And that's I've had quarterbacks that thrive in those kinds
of situations when you have to go put it on
your shoulders. You know, there's not many quarterbacks can do that.

Speaker 1 (44:41):
You know. I've said on the show before, it's hard
to win a Super Bowl with a shaky old line.
And you can't win a World Series with a bad bullpen.
You can't, but I think a bullpen seventh, eight to
ninth inning, you're facing the best hitters in the world.
You got to have closers and o lines. Not when
you're trailing when you're leading, and you can't close the door.

(45:02):
Ohio State's on line to me, is the weakness of
the team. For the record, I think it's the weakness
of Georgia. So I eliminate Georgia because they're on a backup.
They can't win the Natty in my opinion. Are you
concerned at Ohio State if they get into a great
game against the great team and they need an eight
minute drive, they don't have the offensive line to do it.

Speaker 10 (45:24):
I'm very concerned because I think you're right as we
made it to the final game, final two games well
when I was at Florida and Ohio State, and it
is it's a line of scrimmage game because a lot
of time, skill the gates itself.

Speaker 9 (45:36):
You know, you have great skill on both sides. So
what's going to win?

Speaker 10 (45:38):
Can you get four yards for five yards a snap?
And like you said, can you close out a game
or you get a first down when you need to
and that's all offensive line driven. I would say I'd
be very alarmed. They played their best they did against
Penn State. They had a ten or twelve play drive, yep,
six minute drive started the one yard line that was
the best offensive four minute drill I may be ever seen.

Speaker 9 (45:59):
And then seth mc off when the center goes down. Yep.
When I got that text, almost fell out of the trail,
like what happened?

Speaker 7 (46:04):
Because you lose your.

Speaker 9 (46:05):
Center at that point of the season.

Speaker 10 (46:06):
And they played not very well a couple of games,
but they played excellent against Tennessee. So I am concerned.
I would be more concerned if they didn't have the
best skill in America.

Speaker 1 (46:17):
I want to talk Notre Dame in Georgia. So there's
this sense for a long time because Brian Kelly won
early and then they go play a natty against Baman
and get rolled. But the last two times he played them,
they went toe to toe with Georgia. I like him.
This game is that I think sometimes maybe it's because
the academic of the austere Notre Dame view that we
don't think of Notre Dame as elite recruiters. We think

(46:38):
of Ohio State. I think Notre Dame is more in
the Michigan recruiting, but I think Ohio State, Georgia, Texas, Bama, LSU.
It's a whole different ballgame, whole different ballgame. Oregon's buying
their guys. They're kind of in that space. But I
think when I watched Notre Dame play, I'm like, they
got a lot of dudes, and I think they match
up with Georgia. And I think in our mind, where

(46:58):
like George's got better players, I'm not sure they do.
I don't know. You're looking at me like I'm nuts.

Speaker 9 (47:04):
No, I agree with you.

Speaker 10 (47:06):
I think imagine getting hit in the face by North
Illinois and picking that team off the mat. You know,
Marcus Freeman and his staff did that in the leadership
of that team, did it. I counted him out when
I saw that. You know, Notre Dame's done. How do
you regroup from that kind of a loss?

Speaker 9 (47:21):
They have?

Speaker 10 (47:22):
And I've studied them actually the last couple of weeks
at home, I just would watch their videotape. I think
their toe to toe with Georgia. I think I agree
with you. Georgia's offensive line is not the typical Kirby
smart It's a week dominant offensive line. They're playing a
backup quarterback. I think this is going to be I
think this is going to be wherever as ball last
is going to win this thing.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
Yeah, I always used to think you know, it's cold weather,
small town isolated academics are hard. I think Marcus, I
think Brian Kelly in the end when he was in
his coaching prime, and I think Marcus has done a
tremendous If you meet Marcus, you can see why he's
a good recruiter. Yeah, I think the sport's a young
man's game, and I think Marcus is one of those
guys that he's he's putting seventeen hour days. He'll beat

(48:01):
you on the recruiting.

Speaker 9 (48:02):
Then the recruiting. I used to coach there for six years.

Speaker 10 (48:05):
I remember Davy and I would always plan my recruiting
visit around because I recruited the South for Notre Dame.
And if you heard the two words lake effect, do
not bring a kid from the South.

Speaker 9 (48:17):
Don't do it.

Speaker 10 (48:18):
And then if you've got caught, I would get those cars.
You had real nice cars, and I turn up to
ninety degrees. We'd have a jacket in their form. So
recruiting at Notre Dame. But it's not you know, that's
old school now. It's just how much I think recruiting is.
Notre Dame is a great education, but we're gonna pay
you this are you going to go? So, yeah, I
think it's a different world than it was. All Right,

(48:40):
I'm not a huge quin you Weres fan. He's probably
a Sunday player Archs Manning.

Speaker 1 (48:45):
So I mean, listen, we know this. Joe Burrow was
a Buckeye, then he's not. Like here's the problem with
college football now. In the NFL, you have a starter
and then you have a backup, and everybody gets it.
In college, Ohio State has to have two five star,
four star guys. You can't just not as a season expense.
So you got arch Manning and the royalty in America
of the Manning name, and then you got Quinn yours.

(49:07):
I think this is a harder balance than you think.
To have arch Manning behind you, I would be I
would be like, you know, Peyton's coming to practice. What
if Quinn you were scuffs? What if they trail at half?
What if you see him lose his confidence? Is that
a harder balance than we all recognize.

Speaker 10 (49:25):
It's a it's a really hard balance. But I would
actually tell our quarterbacks that you're no different to me,
even though you are an offense guarter or tailback. You're
struggling the other guy especially if deserves a right to play,
you'll play.

Speaker 2 (49:36):
You know.

Speaker 10 (49:37):
Nick Saban did that on the I believe at halftime.
It won the National Championship with many quarterback change. So
I've had quarterbacks say I don't like the look of
the I had Chris Leek and he people said he's
looking over his shoulder table and I said, yes, so
was the receiver, so is the middle linebacker. I mean
that's if you were really good players, you have a
good day or someone's going to come in and get

(49:58):
a few snaps. So I'm sure Sark has had that
conversation probably hundreds of times.

Speaker 9 (50:03):
This fall.

Speaker 10 (50:04):
To me, it's so much on the player. Can the
player handle the fact that arch might come in the game.
And I don't know that, we're gonna have to find out.

Speaker 1 (50:11):
So Penn State crushes SMU, Yeah, and they're looking up
at the next game. They could play George and Notre
Dame and and James Franklin puts in the film and
these guys are all like, yeah, they got a good
running back. You can't fool the players.

Speaker 9 (50:25):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (50:26):
I I think Boise State, now, Boise State is not
built to play from behind. They get after the quarterback,
They protect their quarterback, they run the football. Boise State's
got pros. I don't know, how do you, as a
coach convince your team. It's easy to convince, Hey, here
comes Tennessee, here comes Notre Dame Georgian. That's a different ballgame.

(50:48):
How do you convince Boise State Penn State players? Is
that a struggle? That's a real struggle. It's the locker room.
You know.

Speaker 10 (50:57):
If I have grown ass man as players, I'm having
meetings with them. They have to you know, if coaches
up there, I mean, what is it week fourteen? If
I'm still having to do a sales job on my team,
it's probably not a great team. I don't have great leaders.
I would anticipate that's not the case. I'll say this
about genty is that we were there. Yeah, and the
post contact yards is what would be alarming to me.

(51:18):
I would make a videotape of him running against some
team for sixty yards where he's untouched. I would make
a thirty play highlight tape of post I think he's
the best post contact runner I've seen in several years
in college.

Speaker 1 (51:31):
You know, the Michigan State walker was like that.

Speaker 9 (51:33):
Yeah, he gets stronger as he gets hit.

Speaker 10 (51:35):
Yeah, and we witnessed it, and I would make a
twenty five play highlight tape. I'd be running that through
the facility and make sure the defense sees it over
and over you and you better get him down because
he's going to get yards after the hit.

Speaker 9 (51:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (51:47):
Go back to that Penn State Ohio State game. Now,
Will Howard fumbled near the goal line. I thought that
really hurt the momentum of Penn State. But I think
that edge rusher Carter could be one of the five
or six best players in college ball. Penn State because
Michigan and Ohio State, they just take all the oxygen
out of the room. Penn State is one of those

(52:09):
unique programs that we overlook and it's a top ten program.
Go back to your days facing them. I don't know.
I look at their talent and maybe it's not Texas
or Ohio State, but there's pros everywhere on that everywhere. Yeah,
I go back to our games.

Speaker 10 (52:26):
We had some we were down and I want to say,
two scores twice in the fourth quarter against him in
twenty seventeen and eighteen. I think James Franklin has done
a hell of a job industry doesn't get the credit
he deserves. The fan base, the support is second to
none at state college. So yeah, I never looked at
Penn State any differently than the upper echelon teams.

Speaker 9 (52:47):
Maybe others have. I never did because I walked out there.

Speaker 10 (52:49):
And there's Saquon Barkley, you know, tase McSorley, there's the
like you said, the defensive players they've had. So no,
I've never I've always looked at them as a top five,
top seven program.

Speaker 1 (52:58):
Okay, now we got to get serious. Okay, he gets serious. Okay,
So yeah, the world so years ago, I think it
was McCaffrey and Leonard Fournett. You're in second tier bowls
and they're like I said at the time, when it
comes to running backs, if you've given me three or
four years and you sit out of the Liberty Bowl,
I get it. Okay, we're not talking to Natty. So

(53:21):
do you agree with that premise running backs were the
last players in the NFL? In college football? You can
take a shot, you can hit him in the head,
you can hit him anywhere. It's the last player available.
If it's a second tier bowl, I'd let him sit.

Speaker 9 (53:35):
Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 10 (53:36):
I mean that that did not compute Denzel Ward the
first time. This really happened Denzel Ward at first time
him great player, great kid. I mean, I loved his family.
We were like this he comes in. No, I think
his coach came into me and said, I think Denzel
Ward is going to sit out the Cotton Bowl. I'm like,
I've never heard that before. This is before that all
started happening, and I was like, sit out? Why would

(53:58):
he sit out and get right for the NFL Draft.
That was the first time and that just did not
you know, I use the word compute, like, what do
you mean you're going to sit out on your teammates?

Speaker 9 (54:08):
Et cetera, et cetera.

Speaker 10 (54:09):
Cam Ward played one happened left when I heard that.
I think I told you earlier to me that. Someone said, coach,
what are your thoughts on that? I'm thinking that's that's
like saying the world is square. I don't know what
do you say to your like did he go in
and change at halftime? Did he get in a car
and leave? Did he walk out? I didn't see what happened? Yeah,
and they lost?

Speaker 1 (54:30):
Does it matter more because he's a quarterback?

Speaker 10 (54:32):
Sure, of course that's the number one position, But I'm
just wondering, what do you how that? How do you
you know, you walk in after the game and you just,
you know, you got people play their hearts out. And
I'm not criticizing cam Wore because I don't know the
whole situation, but someone asked me how I feel about that, Like,
I don't what do you say to your teammates? You
just maybe maybe the attitude. It's just a second rate

(54:54):
Bowl game. I've never looked at anytime you keeping score.
You're trying to win that damn game.

Speaker 9 (55:00):
I don't know. I just I got really mixed feelings
on that.

Speaker 1 (55:03):
So I am a fan of the transfer portal and
the NIL, but things need guardrails, Okay, I'm okay with that.
I think it's hard to figure out the transfer portal
because you have to be on the academic calendar and
it gets in the way.

Speaker 10 (55:18):
It's right after That's the first time I've heard academics
in a long time. That's great, So it's a weird.

Speaker 1 (55:24):
The NIL. I'm gonna propose this is that listen, Oregon's
got Phil Knight and Texas has two billionaire donors that
we just say, listen, you get eighteen million, that's the top.
We know Purdues got three and a half to five.
Ohio State's going to have eighteen. But even the NFL
has a salary cap. We're just going to say, eighteen

(55:45):
is what you can do. Is that reasonable or do
you not like that?

Speaker 9 (55:48):
I think is very reasonable, and I think there's logically
you have to.

Speaker 10 (55:53):
Have some kind of guardrails, some kind of system set up.
I'm going to tell you this. I don't think there's
any chance though, because that would mean that the upper
echelon schools are gonna have to give up power. If
you're a house state Alabama, Georgia, you know, Oregon, the
teams with this ridiculous amount of money, you're the power
player right now in college forth. If you imagine sitting
in a room and say, okay, we're going to back

(56:14):
you guys down and make this more equal. Like the NFL.
The NFL, you got thirty two teams and they're all
working together under the same guidelines. College college football is
like this.

Speaker 9 (56:24):
You got teams that are, you know, twenty million dollars salary.

Speaker 10 (56:30):
You're black guy, spent twenty twenty in and you have
teams that can't do that, Why would those teams ever
lower and raise the others?

Speaker 9 (56:36):
Right now? I don't see that happening.

Speaker 10 (56:39):
I keep hearing that. I just I've sat in those
meetings in the SEC. You think the SEC cares about
the Big twelve. No, I'll answer that question. I send
those meetings.

Speaker 9 (56:47):
They don't. They care about the SEC. I send in
the Big ten meetings. You think the Big ten is.

Speaker 10 (56:52):
Really concerned about what happens in the ACC. No, They're
concerned about making sure their programs thrive in the Big ten.
So you need and you need more equal footing. I
don't know if I see that happening called logically, yeah,
but I don't see that happening.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
Now it's going to go to a fourteen to a
sixteen team playoff. I thought the media, I thought everybody
overreacted to the first round. Listen, March madness. It's you get,
you blowouts and you get if you get a couple
of good Thursday games opening weekend, you feel great? Would
you expand it? Are you okay with because there's a
lot of discussions that they're going to fourteen? Uh, there's
also the Mountain West may not get a Bye, we're

(57:33):
going to see changes. It's the first year lighting up.
Everybody of the twelve teams playoff. What bothers you the most?
What do you I don't like that Penn State's got
an easier route than Oregon. That's not fair Oregon when
undefeated won the conference championship and I got Ohio State
is my first game.

Speaker 10 (57:51):
Yeah, I think there's gonna be Like you said, this
is the first year. There were some mistakes made. Get
used to blowouts. They're gonna happen all the time. I
think basketball is a little bit easier for an upset
than college football, just the masses of the humanity on
the bigger teams, So there's going to be some adapt adapting.
The biggest issue I didn't like is the fact that

(58:14):
there are blowout games. But I don't know how you
get away from that. I agree with you all, so
there's got to be rewards. When I saw Penn State's path,
they're double digit favorite, you know, and then you can
see Ohio State and not a Ohig State. I'm not
worried about how State, but you're the team that won it.
Like you said, Oregon, they had a more difficult path
than Penn State and that does not equate.

Speaker 1 (58:35):
Yeah, hey, would you be James Franklin suggested Nick Saban
could be college football's commissioner, And for years on this
show we said, how can you be an eight billion
dollar annual business and have no commissioner? I think they
need a strong voice to unify people. Why wouldn't you
do it? You don't have to recruit. It's just a big,
strong guy that knows you have a big personality, you

(58:57):
have strident beliefs. Why wouldn't you do it?

Speaker 9 (58:59):
Why would I? Nick Sable? You know I'm voting for Nick.

Speaker 1 (59:03):
Why wouldn't you do it?

Speaker 9 (59:04):
No interest at all?

Speaker 1 (59:05):
You know, I just none none.

Speaker 8 (59:07):
I I just.

Speaker 10 (59:09):
When you're a commissioner of a conference, that's let me
put it this way. So imagine the NFL and they say, okay, Roger,
we're gonna now put the USFL in with the NFL.

Speaker 9 (59:19):
You guys are all gonna be together.

Speaker 10 (59:20):
And then, uh, you know, and that's what college sports,
college football right now. Not everybody's not the same, right,
they're not operating in the same guidelines. It's it's and it'll.

Speaker 9 (59:29):
Never be that way.

Speaker 10 (59:30):
You take in Ohio State, you take the wolver Range.
You take Georgia and then you you're mixing. So I'm
not gonna use names because I want teams to get
mad here. But they're they're not the same, not right.
So this person has to lower their level, and this
person has raised to get any any type of equilibrium
in a that's not going to happen.

Speaker 9 (59:48):
Colin, So a commissioner would take you know, I don't.
I don't know.

Speaker 10 (59:52):
I again, I I just because I've sat in those meetings.
You got the haves and you got the have nots.
The haves would have to give up power. Do you
really see that happening?

Speaker 9 (01:00:01):
I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:00:02):
Hey, So and Belichick, So I know you and Belichick
are tight. So I think the coaching's fine. My take
has always been that Bill could barely tolerate Robert Kraft.
The idea he's going to have to deal with a
volleyball coach. I'm like, give me a break that Bill's

(01:00:23):
gonna come in there. And Mike Lombardi, who I know
is another kind of gruff guy. These guys are strident,
strong opinion guys, and all of a sudden, it's like, hey,
you're gonna go to the You're gonna go to the
tennis manch today and support the athletic program.

Speaker 9 (01:00:35):
Give me a break.

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
So I think Bill will just get worn out by
the nonsense of college sports. The coaching's fine, the recruitings
find the players come to you. They're collected. Now, you know, Belichick,
did you call him and warn him about some of
the stuff he's gonna have to deal with?

Speaker 9 (01:00:51):
No, but I think five years ago I would have
cost it. Don't do it.

Speaker 10 (01:00:55):
You're not going to wake up at six in the
morning and go meet with the social studies teacher in
high school and to ask about the oh brother and
then go into the get the transcript and figure out
how he's doing in the geology class and all this,
and then you have to go to a basketball practice
and basketball game that night. But you don't have to
do that. You know how many times the coaches were
I heard this. I didn't realize this. We're out on

(01:01:17):
the road in December.

Speaker 9 (01:01:18):
None.

Speaker 10 (01:01:19):
You don't recruit anymore of the month of December. That
used to be when you would fly in that private
jet and he'd be in four to five states in
one day. The way we used to recruit. Finish it
at a basketball game, and then you'd be watching your
computer getting ready for bowl game.

Speaker 9 (01:01:32):
It's not that way anymore now. It is simply they.

Speaker 10 (01:01:35):
Come visit you, you find out what the number is,
and you pay the number. So, Coach Belichick, I you
coach it. Why don't you do it again? If I
could take recruiting on, why don't you coach again?

Speaker 9 (01:01:44):
Because I'm a Fox big noon man. They knew I
got a great job here.

Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
Hey, John Peyton was at Fox and now he's coaching
the Fron Company. You don't have to coach any you
have the recruit anymore.

Speaker 10 (01:01:54):
Let's go back to Bill Belichick. You'll figure it out,
and I can't wait to watch it. He's seventy two
and I'm not a math major, but that's only three
years away from seventy five.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
So you know it's so when you guys are together,
I would be I would love to hear this. I
should wire you next time. You go talk to him,
and I'll give you some questions. So obviously you asked
Bill stuff and you're interested, and then he asked you stuff.
Is give me something? You asked Bill a little bit

(01:02:26):
of his wisdom because you guys are well, I mean
he's give me something that Bill said in a fishing
trip or something, and you were like, well, that's smart.

Speaker 9 (01:02:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:02:33):
I would go visit the Patriots very often, and he'd
come every year, started at Gainesville, Florida, and would visit
with us, and he had the greatest locker room I
have ever witnessed. I would go watch practice, you know,
Tom Brady willing to get ess, you know, Mike Rabel,
Rodney Harrison, you know. He had that locker room. And
I remember I would actually sat with Tom Brady and

(01:02:54):
Rabel and I because I was having some issues at
Florida lockermission.

Speaker 9 (01:02:57):
I remember that and I was like, how in the
hell do you guys do this?

Speaker 10 (01:03:00):
And those players said to me, it's our job to
make sure nothing ever gets to Bill Belichick's desk.

Speaker 9 (01:03:08):
That was how strong his locker room was.

Speaker 10 (01:03:09):
And I would meet with my leaders and use that
as examples. And he got better as time war on,
and he would always ask me about the spread offense.

Speaker 9 (01:03:17):
I was back in the Alex I got a phone.
I remember Bill Belichick called.

Speaker 10 (01:03:21):
Me when I took the Florida job and he said, Hi,
this is Bill Belichick, and I said, I thought that
was one of my boys, Mester.

Speaker 9 (01:03:26):
I said, well, this is Pete Rose.

Speaker 5 (01:03:27):
How you doing?

Speaker 10 (01:03:29):
And he came down and Josh McDaniels back in the
day and they started running some of our Alex simithspread
offense stuff. So he wanted to talk football. I wanted
to talk locker room. I was amazed at how he
did it at the Patriots.

Speaker 9 (01:03:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:03:42):
Those Patriot teams were no non.

Speaker 10 (01:03:43):
Incredible, the best locker rooms I've ever witnessed. What was
the best locker room you ever had? I would say
the fourteen national champion Buck Ice. You know, when you're
down your third stream quarterback, who are your leaders? Joshua Perry,
Curtis Grant, Jeff Hireman. We had just seen edible leaders
and here you took a third string quarterback and had
one of the greatest runs ever because everybody just you know,

(01:04:05):
Joey Bosa, Zeke Elliott, Mike Thomas.

Speaker 1 (01:04:09):
Did you ever have a game and witness didn't have
you much of Florida Ohio State? You went in and
you knew you didn't have as good as players, but
you couldn't tell the players. Did you ever have a
game and you came out of it and you thought
we shouldn't have won that game.

Speaker 10 (01:04:24):
Sure, back in the LSU days, LSU the best talent man.
People forget what Les Miles had down there. I mean
they had about a four to five year run. But
I'd grabbed my line coach every time when I saw
LSU come out, Tyson, Now, hell in the hell are
you going to block those guys?

Speaker 9 (01:04:38):
Third defensive line? Was that good?

Speaker 1 (01:04:40):
How about ed Orgeron's Joe Brow team.

Speaker 9 (01:04:43):
Never coached against him, but they looked the party.

Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
That's the most talented college team I've ever seen.

Speaker 10 (01:04:48):
Yeah, yeah, I've had a couple of those where I'd
look across and so, how in the hell, But just
you change your game plan. You know, you got to
get the ball off fast, you gotta attack this. We
felt that way actually in the National Championship against Ohio
State when I was a Florida Get the ball out here,
don't play in here, get the ball out here, And
that's what we did.

Speaker 1 (01:05:05):
Yeah, that's good stuff. I can't believe you wouldn't. Would
you take a call? Would you take a call? Look
a really good program says, hey, listen, a lot of
money down here in blank.

Speaker 9 (01:05:17):
This wasn't on the rundown you got, you're not gonna
get away.

Speaker 1 (01:05:21):
You look fantastic. I mean, what's golf?

Speaker 10 (01:05:24):
Just said Grandkid number six? Why Peyton two days ago?
So we're life is good man?

Speaker 9 (01:05:30):
All right? You golfing? A lot? Yeah, not very good?
A lot.

Speaker 1 (01:05:34):
Who's good?

Speaker 7 (01:05:35):
Good?

Speaker 1 (01:05:35):
Gotti, Scheffler, nobody else is good? The great Urban Meyer.
We take a break back after this live in La
the Herd.