Colin’s joined by Danny Parkins, host of “Breakfast Ball” on FS1!
They start with Colin sharing commuter stories from their time in Chicago and why they love commuting via train and plane and Colin explains why a business class seat to Europe is his “happy place” (3:30).
They pivot to the NBA and why the Thunder and T-Wolves series will struggle to pull ratings in a league with incredible parity, but Danny counters that long term it will be good for the league and pleads for an earlier tip-off (10:30). They highlight Anthony Edwards lack of shots taken in Game 1, contrasting his lack of assertiveness with past stars like Michael Jordan and the lack of urgency shown by modern players (15:30).
They discuss why NIL money is funneling worldwide basketball talent back into American college basketball and why OKC would be best served using their stockpiled capital in the draft rather than trade it for an established player (26:15).
Colin proposes that Jalen Brunson has a chance to be the most popular Knicks player of all time but Danny argues that Clyde Frazier will retain that title and that Brunson is a “smidge” overrated (33:00).
They discuss the gender disparity embedded in the discourse about the Caitlin Clark vs Angel Reece rivalry, and why if there’s a bit of “hate” in a sports rivalry… it’s a GOOD thing (40:30).
They express their surprise that the NFL didn’t ban the “tush push” since it’s both bad television and will get players hurt (57:00).
Finally, they debate how long it will take for the influence of Ben Johnson’s coaching to show up on the field for Caleb Williams and whether it spells trouble if he struggles early in the season (1:06:15).
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
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All right, let's chop it up for an hour with
Danny Parkins. Former Chicago kid lived his dream on the radio,
left the city to go to FS one because I
talked him into it. That was part of it. And
(01:08):
now I live in Chicago and I just jumped off
the train taking the train from the oglev Center to
a Neetka is pure joy. Nobody bothers you. It's the best.
Now the mornings are a little dicey. But I've so
I've been experimenting, Danny for the first three weeks. I've
been experimenting. I've discovered that Monday is not a bad
(01:28):
traffic day. I'll take a driver Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, or hell,
I'll take the train, and weather screws everything up to
make the drive even worse. Is that kind of the
understanding in Chicago that Monday's the best drive day?
Speaker 3 (01:45):
Oh man? So here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
The Kennedy is just under this like unbelievable construction project
right now. It just makes everything hillacious, like it was
the thing I was most excited to leave Chicago about
because I drove in and you know, I drove myself,
you know, local radio, and drove in and drove out,
and where my radio studio was was nowhere near Ogilvy.
(02:10):
And if I wanted to get home in time to
see my little kids before bed, I needed to get
on the road as fast as possible as opposed to
walking across the loop.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
So you're on it, but just.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
So you know, it can change in a moment's notice,
Like your three week sample size of the halacious Chicago
commute is not enough because the express lanes will be
randomly closed at some point they will do some other
nonsense construction project that, instead of three years, will take seven.
So generally speaking, though, if you feel like you can
(02:42):
do the Metra, the Metra is great because you never
will be bothered. Colin, You're like the most famous person
in Chicago that isn't an athlete. So so like these
people that are commuting to the north shore of Chicago,
they're probably like, is that Colin Coward. No, it couldn't be.
It's probably a banker. And then they'll just go on
(03:03):
with their day. So I promise you will never be bothered.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
No, it's great. I you know, I've never taken the train.
I've had friends in New York that did I mean,
and people all walks alive, kids, college, successful, Wall Street,
and they were always like, yeah, I read on the train.
I listened to a Sam Harris pod today with Jake Tapper.
Those thirty three minutes I got through most of it.
It was like, this is great. So I was like,
(03:27):
I don't know. I always try to find the positive
and stuff. And I was like, you know, I'll listen
to even more podcasts. It's thirty five minutes. I always
said I wrote my first book on a plane every
time I At that time, I was going a lot
from ESPN to LA So I was going to call
the book shots fired from thirty three thousand feet. And
(03:48):
then it's so and at some point something happened in
the country and I was like, no, that's not appropriate
or something. But I've always found planes and trains it's
really you're just really isolated, and I just go, I
just go to work.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Yeah, so I I you know, I'm far in because
there are no trains from the suburbs of New York
that I live in that run as early as we
have to be in for Breakfast Ball. So I go
car in and train out and the train out. You know,
it's great because it's a good excuse to get work done.
It's a good excuse to veg out. Yeah, it's a
(04:22):
good just like it's a good excuse to be selfish.
It's not. There's no quiet cars, so if you need
to make a phone call, you can, But I really
don't like to. Yeah, I like to just kind of
do my thing and make it my me time to decompress,
and yeah, if you can be productive. Airplane productivity is
the best because now there's Wi Fi on planes and
you can text and email and be connected to the world.
(04:44):
But it's also a very easy lie. Oh the know
the life I was done. My phone wasn't working and
you get and you're like, no, no one really expects
you to be connected at thirty three thousand feet for
whatever reason. So the ability to just completely decompress and
unplug from the world is a joyous thing.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
I told my wife we were talking about my happiest place,
like when am my happiest And obviously when I was
a young dad, it would be like hearing my kids laugh,
or being at the beach with my kids and just
seeing your kids have the time of their life at Disney.
When I used to go to Disney, Like, there's just
nothing better than being on a ride with your daughter
and she's screaming and you're laughing and it's bad food.
That's the most fun I've ever had in my life.
(05:23):
But one of my happy places now, I tell my wife,
like once a year in the summer we try to
go to Europe somewhere, and I'm going to visit my
son in a couple of weeks and he's doing some
school in London. And I said, hey, I'll come join you.
We'll go to Copenagan for a couple of days. Let's
just you know. And I made him a promise a
few years ago at least every other year, So you
and I get on a plane and go somewhere around
the world. And so and I told my wife, I said,
(05:44):
you know, getting on a good business seat heading to Europe,
knowing you're getting free wine, a great movie, sleep and
a meal. I'm like, God, that makes me happy. That's
just And I know I don't have to work for
like ten days. And I used to hate vacations when
you started. I didn't like vacations. I didn't want to
(06:06):
be off. And now it's like no love.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Yeah, well, once you're established and you feel like you
can take it, you know. And now, in a weird way,
I've started over because I've transitioned into this new career,
this new profile, trying to build a national profile and
all those things. But yeah, beginning in radio, I would
never take off, or if I took off for my
job in Kansas City. I would fill in in Chicago
(06:32):
for them on Christmas, Like I would come home and
work Black Friday, work Christmas Eve, Christmas Day on the
Chicago stations just to get the reps because I was
so excited to be on, you know, in the big
city and in my hometown. And then when you get
the first job in Chicago, you feel like you can't
take off. But then when you get like good ratings
and success and drive time, then you know it wasn't
(06:53):
as big of a deal to take off. And now
it's easy because they don't let you take off. We
do so many shows, it was unbelievable. We did a
Thanksgiving show, we did a Christmas Eve show.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
We're working Memorial Day, we worked New Year's Day.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
So it's funny, like the cycle of these jobs, it
starts over again. But I'm with you. But the I
don't love flying, but the act of flying too somewhere
is the is the greatest because it's the beginning. It's
like limitless by like the flight to Vegas when I
was a young single and it's like I have five
(07:31):
hundred dollars and anything's yes. But the flight to Vegas
in my twenties was like the happiest of my entire
life other than my kids obviously.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah, those things that you're supposed to all. That's why
I feel about Europe. I'm like, I got ten days here,
and that can unplug really quickly. When I know I
don't work. If I take a three day I take
a lot of three day weekends in the summer, you
never really unplugged.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
If something happened, I write it down, I want, I
want it for the show on Monday. But so I'll
get to my happy place pretty quick.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
It was two be true. Number one is the NBA
got seventy six billion dollars. They're good. Number two. Number
two Hockey Baseball MLS and the NBA regular seasons will
never matter as much as they used to because there's
just too much content. We're all distracted. Young people don't
(08:19):
watch as much television. And I was looking at the
game last night between the t Wolves and OKC, and
I was thinking, oh, yeah, this isn't gonna work. This
is not going to pull a number the Knicks Pacers will.
But I was watching Minnesota OKAC and I'm like, this
is Adam Silver's want this is the league he wants.
He doesn't want stack teams. He inherited that league from
David Stern. He heard. He's a very if not idealistic,
(08:42):
he's kind of a he's very pro employee, like he
listens to his employees. David Stern could bulldoze you. This
is what I'm gonna do. He had two or three
agents and five or six owners. He was close to Silver.
Is more about the collaborative and the fabric of the league.
But he also inherited a very successful league from Stern.
Stern ended up trying to kind of save the league.
(09:04):
So David was like, Nike, Jordan, Magic Bird, big Markets,
that's what we're gonna do. So it's a different time.
But I look at I think this is now the
NBA with a new CABA that Adam Silver wanted. But
I watched two things can be true. I watched Minnesota
and Oklahoma City. I don't I think that will get
a dreadful national number. Am I wrong?
Speaker 3 (09:27):
I don't think you're wrong. But I also don't care.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Like I'm not a television executive, I'm not in business
with Like I'm not in business with the NBA.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
I you know, I don't care.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
I think that we should be talking about it on
our shows because I think sports fans will watch it.
Will they watch it at the exact same clip as
the Eastern Conference Finals. No, obviously not market size, relevance,
people know New York, all of those sort of things.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
That that's all fine.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
I have a lot of thoughts on last night's game,
the Thunder, the discourse, but we can start with your
premise about the league that Adam Silver wants.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
This is a historic time for the NBA.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
This will be the first time ever that there are
seven different champions in seven years, no back to backs,
but last seven years, seven different organizations will have won
the NBA title. And so I looked it up. Heyday
of the NBA, everyone says, is you know Bird, Magic, Jordan,
Kobe Shack Lakers right nineteen eighty through the early two thousands.
(10:35):
If you go from the nineteen eighty NBA Finals when
Magic Johnson came in and played center and replaced Kareem
maybe the most famous game of his career through just
before the first the Dwayne Wade Shack Heat title. Twenty
six years nineteen eighty to two thousand and five, seven
different teams won a championship. So the heyday of the
(10:56):
NBA twenty five, twenty six years, seven champions now seven
champions in seven years. Dynasties are good for sports. They
make people care. You love them, you hate them, you
have opinions. They are good for national ratings. But I
do think that in the long run, even if there
is a five percent dip of ten percent dip in ratings,
(11:17):
I do think long term this will be good for
the NBA because there will be some belief that I
think they will legitimately be able to sell of anybody
can win.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Listen to this. I just got this from our Goldie,
our producer just sent me this. Te Wolves under game
one down twenty four percent from last year, least watch
game one conference finals since twenty twenty one.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
There you go, Okay, fine, like small markets people that
not everybody knows yet, but also a blowout, like let's
see how that goes over the course of over the
course of time. Also, this is a you're a media observer, Okay,
I understand why the Western Conference Finals have to start
later than the Eastern Conference finals, but when it ends
(12:01):
up being Oklahoma City in Minnesota, does it have to
be eight thirty Eastern, Right.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Am I crazy?
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Like the Eastern Conference finals will start at eight pm Eastern,
and if it was, if it was, if it was
Lakers Warriors, I get why they need every minute possible
to try to pack the building and respect the people
leaving work on the West Coast. But and I know
that these things are predetermined ahead of time. Eastern Conference
teams are going to start eight Western Conference games were
going to start eight thirty.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
But when it's two teams in the Central time.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Zone that game ends after eleven pm Eastern on a
school night, that can't help. That can't help what you're
talking about with the ratings. So I wish that they
had a little bit more flexibility, flexibility when it comes
to skate. You know.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
The other thing I thought about last night is that
I don't know how many shots Ant took. It was
like thirteen or something. He didn't shoot thirteen and he's
a great player. But this is the difference how great
Michael Jordan was. Jordan last night, probably in a losing cause,
if he played for Minnesota would have taken thirty nine shots.
(13:11):
Is that Michael never had a game that I can remember,
a big one, even the flu game where you're like,
Michael took thirteen shots his generation. Michael didn't care. Michael
was going to go down. Michael's the most relentlessly competitive
person I've ever seen. I mean in Magic Bird, everybody
Lebron Steph, it doesn't matter. Is that Jason Tatum. There
(13:33):
are times I'm like, is he on the floor?
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Last night?
Speaker 2 (13:36):
In the second half, I'm like, is aunt playing? Is
that everybody's rich in the league. It's a much more
you know, collaborative. I mean, Michael Jordan had no problem saying, hey,
Republicans buy shoes. Who I'm not talking politics. You'd be
hard to say that today is a professional athlete. You'd
(13:57):
get just destroyed by the collective, the media collective. But
that's the difference. When people haven't seen Michael play. I
always say that Michael never had a game or a
moment where you went, is Michael on the floor. I mean,
I remember a game against Utah in the finals. I
remember a game against Phoenix in the finals. He took
(14:18):
a jumper from the angle. It hit backboard and floor,
It didn't hit rim. It was a terrible shot. They
had games against Utah where he was like seven for
thirty three. But there is something about everybody being rich
and everybody has the same for agents and they all
like each other that there isn't there is that there
is a real sense there's tomorrow. Don't expand your energy.
(14:43):
And I watched Minnesota the second half and I'm like, oh,
they're done tonight. They're done tonight. They were clearly done early.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
Listen.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
I will give Anthony Edwards.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
He went back to the locker room with the ankle injury,
and I don't know how much pain he was in.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Yeah, like I maybe right.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
But here's the thing about last night's game. I was
appalled at some of the discourse of SGA's a foul merchants.
The Thunder aren't watchable. I don't like their brand of basketball.
I know he was just announced as the MVP, but
he hadn't won the MVP yet. He has no finals appearances,
(15:24):
he has no rings. If people are already sick of
the Thunder and you're an actual basketball fan, the next
ten years of your basketball viewing are going to be miserable.
They're the youngest playoff team in the league. They're younger
than the Pistons. Their oldest starter is twenty seven years old,
(15:44):
Shay is twenty six, Jalen Williams and chet are twenty
three each, and Sam Presty's the best executive in the sport.
Their coach was a finalist for Coach of the Year
after winning it last year, and they have every draft
pick for the next decade. And people are SGA's a merchant.
They talk about him like he's James Harden. He drives
to the rim more than any player in the league.
(16:07):
Not this year, not these playoffs. For five straight years,
Shay Guiltess Alexander has led the NBA in drives to
the basket.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Minnesota took fifty one threes last night.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Oklahoma City took twenty one, and the free throw discrepancy
was five and people were like, oh, the refs are
in it for small market Oklahoma City and zero time
MVP Sga. No, that's how he plays, and so like
that game was a blowout and got hurt.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
There was no reason to watch the fourth quarter of
the game. The ratings were down.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Okay, fine, but man, I don't understand how people all
year can be like, yeah, don't play defense, like the
collective league, the league doesn't play defense, and all they
do is shoot threes. And now you have a young,
up and coming, historically great defense team with a guy
who scores from everywhere on the floor, and you're like,
I hate that too, because is anybody satisfied? Well, we
(17:08):
have to bring Michael Jordan back from his fishing boat
to plays that the only way people will not complain
during an NBA game.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
It drives me insane.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
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Speaker 2 (18:43):
Let me throw a theory at you. I talked about
it on my show today. I think you'll like this.
So I talked about it, okay, for like as you
can do on our show for four minutes, I can
talk about it with you for ten. So one of
the things I love about sports. I think you know
this theories, cultural changes, trying to see them as they're
happening in real time. Right, So take out the last
(19:04):
two Zach Edie made the All Rookie team. Okay, three
years ago, it's like, can't play just a college guy?
Why was everybody so wrong?
Speaker 3 (19:16):
A year ago?
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Mark Fus like, if he can't play NBA, it's an
NBA problem. But Danny Hurley's like, you can't tell me
he's not an NBA player. He's the hardest guy I've
ever done a game prep for. There's no way we're
gonna stop him. Mark fu said, all my years at Gonzaga,
hardest player to defend. We have nobody in the program.
And then he hits uh the Yukon team that had
(19:43):
two guys make the All Rookie team, the big in Portland,
and then a Donovan Oh god cling yes, clan my bad.
And then the kid from San Antonio, Stephen Castle. So
two things have happened in the last two years of
college basketball. Zachy's dominance translated to the NBA, and that
(20:06):
Yukon team that crushed people even in the tournament really
was full of excellent NBA players. Why do I say
that because for the previous twenty years, guys like Doug
McDermott one Player of the year and we're at best
rotational players. So why is this happening? NIL has saved
(20:29):
college basketball. So NIL is keeping guys like Zach Edie
NBA guys in one more year, or they choose college
over G league or international. A story today that Real
Madrid and Barcelona's amateur teams and this Spain has all
the great European young players. They're thinking of folding the
(20:49):
league because American NIL money is taking all the European
kids over here. So what is happening? So this European
system that was so we were so enamored with, Oh no, no,
those kids are not going to play college. The G
leaguers are going to play college. What does it do?
First two rounds this year? March Madness highest in thirty
(21:11):
two years. The quality was much better. Houston, Florida, Yukon. Well,
those are NBA players, So we went through about a
twenty year cycle kind of at the end of Grant
Hill and those kind of guys Larry Johnson and all
that stuff, Right, those are if you dominated college, you're
going to be a good pro and no moment about
twenty five thirty years you're like Jim or Furdette, Doug McDermott,
(21:32):
Tyler Hansborough. You could dominate college and be a rotational player,
and I think it hurt the quality of the game.
But between that Barcelona story, between the ratings and Zach
Edy and the Yukon guys, what you're seeing now is
college basketball is a rebirth that when you're watching it
in March and a guy is dominating. So long story,
(21:58):
what does this mean? What does this mean? Okac? They
have stockpiled all these draft picks and we always assumed, okay,
see Danny was going to use those picks to get
a Yannis. Don't give those picks up. The draft now
is going to be like this year's draft. You're like, oh,
there's like seven domestic players in the top ten and
(22:18):
they're all really really good. Is that the idea that
you give out your picks for Yannis if you don't
like Okac? Now, with all those picks, these are going
to be NBA players coming out of college. Now they
can play almost immediately.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
Yeah, I think it's a great point.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
And the guy who accumulated the picks happens to have
a better record in both eras of what you're talking
about of nailing the picks. So like Sam Presty, everybody
has misses, but he has fewer than most. Like he
traded for Sga but on his rookie like as she
(23:01):
was just available and he traded for him, he sniped him,
he traded. This is not a college player, not a
young player, so not a perfect example like Alex Caruso
wins them Game seven. Alex Caruso was on the Lakers,
they offered him three years, twenty one million dollars. The
(23:22):
Bulls offered him three for thirty seven and restricted free agency,
and the Lakers are like, no, we'd rather have Taylor
Horton Tucker, So he went to Chicago. Then the Bulls
trade Alex Caruso to Sam Presty for Josh Gitty. Josh Gitty,
nice player, pulls up the stat sheet, fun young, high
upside guy. Not saying anything bad about Josh Gitty, But
(23:46):
Alex Caruso clearly is a championship pedigree player, elite defensive player.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
And Sam Presty has approximately three hundred and twenty.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Seven extra draft picks and the Bulls couldn't get one
of them in that trade for Alex Caruso.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
I read that trade and I was like, oh, that's funny.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
They got Josh Giddy, but like, what's the draft pick?
Speaker 3 (24:07):
And it never came Like so Sam Resty is just
great at this.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
He's great at it, And I agree with you, they
will keep a lot of those assets. You can only
have twelve guys on a team. And like they traded
Josh Giddy because there wasn't a spot for him right,
Like they had too many good young backcourt players that
were cheap. That's not a problem most teams have. So
I don't think he'll use every draft pick, you know,
(24:36):
but he can. He can. He can go out and
get any player he wants whenever he decides to cash
his chips in. I don't think it'll be for Giannis,
but I think it'll be for cheap waiver because they
want guys on their rookie deal who they can sign
to second contracts because free agents aren't historically going to
choose Oklahoma City. And he can just say, oh, we're
(24:59):
what's the one thing We're not a lead at three
point shooting? Who's the best three and D guy in
the NBA on a rookie contract. I want him, and
he can go get him like that. That's what I
don't think people completely understand about what Oklahoma Like. If
Oklahoma City said we want Giannis, they would win. If
Oklahoma City said we want Durant, they would win. If
(25:21):
fill in the blank superstar becomes disgruntled and they get
If the Mavericks were like, we're gonna hold a bidding
more for Luka Doncic and Sam Presty's like I want him,
they would win. They have more assets than everybody in
the league and it isn't particularly close. So I don't
know how he'll use the poker chips, but I know
(25:42):
that he's more likely than not going to be right.
He will prioritize young, cheap labor. And to your point,
he's not going to trade as many of the draft
picks as people think because he's excellent at drafting.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Yeah, the you know, I was thinking about this the
other day, as the is when people listen to this game,
one of the next will be over, and I thought,
I think Jalen Brunson has a chance to be the
most popular nick ever. So I'll explain the interesting that's
that's a thought. Any kid under thirty five didn't see
(26:14):
Walt Fraser play or Earl Monroe play. Eliminate those players.
The young, the young demographic which loves the NBA didn't
watch him play. Patrick Ewing's a center. They don't sell shoes,
they don't become coaches. They're just looked at as genetically
unique human beings. The greatest of all of them, Kareem
(26:34):
Abdul Jabbar was stoic, never a broadcaster, never really a coach,
didn't get opportunities. They don't become the most popular player.
Shack is a complete outlier because he's a big personality.
But Barkley is still the star of that show. And
then you say, well, Bernard King, nice guy. Injuries cut
short a great career. Carmelo Anthony never really delivered in
(26:55):
the postseason. Brunson is relatable. He's the size of the
average fan Villanova, soe you have found him in college?
He was he was an East Coast star at Villanova.
A lot of Villanova people in New York and big
Eiast fans in New York. Right, Oh yeah, he's totally reliant, relatable,
(27:16):
like he's he's a great clutch shot maker, which say
what you want that is, you know, fourth corner drives
make quarterbacks, and shot makers make Jordan. And the other
thing is the NBA now is moving into a time
(27:38):
you can't stack a roster, and so it's not a
coincidence the four best players on the four best teams
are all guards because if you don't have a stacked
roster and you have a collection of B to B
plus players, the point guard will control tempo and touches
for everybody and pace. The league is going to become
a pace, tempo point guard league. It's not gonna be
(28:01):
buying the best wings in centers. You can't anymore. You're
just not gonna have that anymore. Boston's gonna unravel here
in the next year, I mean, or at least move
off many of their players. Is that when you look
at Ewing, is a center nobody saw won't play if
you're under thirty seven years old. Bernard King injuries, Carmelo
Anthony never won. Brunson is going to be the most
(28:24):
popular Nick within thirty years. Okay, I mean, I'm not
a New York Knicks historian. Uh, it strikes me as
unlikely that he's gonna be more popular, because if you're
just saying, like, no one under thirty seven remembers Clyde Frasier,
it's like, okay, but there are a lot of people
(28:45):
over thirty seven, and he won two titles.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
He's on the All NBA team at fifty, he's on
the All NBA team at seventy five. In terms of
you know, he's one of the greats in the history
of the league, and he's on their broadcasts like Clyde Frasier,
how he dresses, how he presents himself, like Knicks fans
who are young know who Clyde Frazer.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Okay, so I want to stop you there. Jerry West
was the logo built Laker championships and magic was more popular.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
That's okay, But do you think that do you think
that the Knicks are going to win the title?
Speaker 2 (29:25):
I think the Knicks under Brunson are going to be
a regular conference finals team with chances to get to
the finals. New York sports outside of the Yankees, historically
have been so uneven and so inconsistent. I mean, two
of the worst franchises in pro sports historically historically are
the Mets and the Jets, and so so you don't.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
I mean, as the Knicks unite the city like New
York basketball, right, Like it's take a lot of pride.
The best point guards come from New York and Rucker
Park and all of the college and AAU teams and
all all of the New York basketball royalty stuff, which
I love and eat up. I'm like, there's a lot
about it in my book, like I'm all for all
of the history of New York basketball. I don't think
(30:11):
you can be the most popular Nick if you didn't
win a title. And I don't think they're gonna win
a title. I think Oklahoma City would wax them. And
this is a I guess, a hot take. Jalen Brunson
has become a Smedge overrated, a Smedge overrated because he
is crazy likable. Everything you said is true. He won
(30:33):
the Clutch Player of the Year. Yes, but when I'm
watching the games and I'm staying up late and I'm
watching all of the game, yes, I don't know how
sustainable this is. He's on it. He doesn't pass either
you or Carmelow. Okay, that that is true, so maybe
(30:53):
he fits right in. But like he listen, he hits
every clutch shot. He's totally unafraid. I get why he's
a fan fait, I get why he's loved. He deserved
clutch Player of the Year. He's a beloved nick. No
doubt about all of it. It's totally earned. The guy
is not afraid of any moment. He's tough as hell.
All of that is true. But yeah, he got Karl
(31:16):
Anthony Towns and mckel bridges and I'm watching the ends
of some of these games and he's like, well, Jalen Brunson,
he just took the last ten shots of the game,
except for one that Josh Hart got on an offensive
rebound on a miss by Jalen Brunson.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
It just doesn't.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
Strike me as a formula to win a championship. I
can't think of one where it's like one guy just
shoots every single time, no one is his peer at
the end of the game, and they're going to win
a title. It's exciting. It reminds They remind me a
lot of one of my favorite teams ever, the twenty
(31:54):
ten to twenty twelve Derreck Rose era Bulls right like
Tibbs is coach the now Derek Rose even more local
than Jalen Brunson, Chicago born and raised, like state championships
in high school, the whole thing. But like right, the
Bulls drafted Derek Rose, the Knicks trade for Brunson, So
it's not complete apples to apples, but it's it's close enough.
(32:17):
Best player is a ball dominant guard, team oriented. Those
Bulls teams were better defensively than this next team. But
I know the Knicks fans say, with Mitchell Robinson healthy,
they're actually an elite defensive team, even though they never
have been. But it's same coach, really hard nosed team,
beloved point guard who you ride or died with him,
(32:39):
and Derek Ross was unbelievable, youngest MVP in the history
of the league. They were the one seed and then
the only problem was he had to play Lebron James,
and so when he played Lebron, it was like, oh,
they won, game won, and then they lose in five.
And I think that's what's gonna happen to the Knicks.
Maybe not until they face the Thunder in the NBA Finals,
and so he'll advance a little further than those Bulls
(33:00):
teams did. But I don't think you can win an
NBA Championship this way. I just don't And I think
that you can't be the most popular nick of all
time if you don't put a banner up in Madison
Square Garden.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Well, I'm just more optimistic than you.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Perhaps you are, you are, I mean, I think they
would get crushed by the well I think. I think, yeah,
I think the thunder are going to win this championship
and people are somehow going to say that they hate them.
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
That's what I think is happening here. So I'm going
to throw this at you. There are some genetic and
gender realities that seem unfair to me. You're driving on
the freeway. You're driving on the freeway. Be totally honest.
If a skinny guy is in a car eating he's
got burgers, you're thinking to yourself, that guy's on the go,
he doesn't have time to stop. That guy is a hustler,
(33:50):
he is making things happen. A heavyset guy in a
car is eating burgers, You're like, and I am too. Oh, really,
you can't even drive without eating. I mean, give me
a break, Like, what, Well, you can't. You can't pull over?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
You have to. It's a.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
It's a we have no idea about those two people.
That is how people view Wait, we're all watists at times.
Gender gender.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
I'm not saying no to your premise, you Colin, I can't.
I love your analogies. Go ahead, here's whatever. There's a
gender reality. Men can hate each other.
Speaker 2 (34:26):
Jordan still holds a grudge against Isaiah. Somehow it makes
him more likable. Men can taunt, can trash talk. If
Angel Reese appears to hate Caitlin Clark, it becomes a
race topic. It is outrageous, It is unfair, and I'm
like time out. Women athletes can hate rifles too.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
It's not to me.
Speaker 2 (34:54):
I'm like, is it race?
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Well? I hate?
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Is it used to be a commodity? Like you loved
when the writer cup we hated the years. Now everybody's rich,
but the Caitlyn Clark Angel Reese rivalry. One got the
best of the other in college the junior year. The
other one got the best the senior year. One goes Midwest,
small city, one goes big city. One gets more press.
(35:21):
I just I look at it and I think it
doesn't bother me that Angel Reese doesn't like Caitlin like
like by the way Caitlyn's game is fun and flashy.
Angels a rebounder like she probably got a little built
in animosity. She won't get the press.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
I think it's the worst story in sports media. I
hate the discourse around it. I think I think it's
I think it brings out the worst in everybody. I
really do think it's it's just show a lot of
people are showing their ass on this story. Of course,
what you just said is correct. I one of my
things to trope. It's a cliche.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
I've just I like the turn of phrase that I created.
Less hate in the world, more hate in sports.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Yeah, sports hate is good. It is objectively good. Now
when it leads to like fights in the stands, Okay, fine,
someone took it too far, but that doesn't mean that
it is a bad thing. Trash talk, rivalries, bulletin board material, lobbying,
shots in the press, hard fouls, stare downs, the occasional fight.
Speaker 3 (36:31):
Those things are good.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
They're good for ratings, they're good for business, they're good
for fan interest, they're good for jersey sales. They are good.
It is good for the WNBA for there to be
sports hate, yes, for there to be rivalry, yes, it
is a good thing that is so objectively obviously true
that I can't believe anyone even dares to deny it.
(36:54):
I do think the bird magic stuff is a little
ridiculous because Burden Magic, in terms of talents, were kind
of equals. Yes, yes, this is more like Michael Jordan
and Bill Lambier. You know they were rivals, but yeah,
(37:15):
but they're not really the same type of player, right.
They hated each other, they had great moments, but they
were not like no one was like, you know, who
carried the NBA to popularity, Michael Jordan and Bill Lambier.
It was not not how we just got Caitlyn Clark
is the phenomenon, She's the comments and like that. Does
(37:36):
that spur jealousy, no doubt. Are there interesting racial components
to that story that.
Speaker 3 (37:46):
I think are fair to be discussed.
Speaker 1 (37:48):
For a league that has had great players white and
black before Caitlyn Clark, why haven't they caught on in
the same type of way? Like I think that there
is like fair conversations to be had there. But a
hard foul by Angel Reese in a basketball game that
like didn't even result in a fight, It resulted in
(38:11):
she said the F word, Like, what the hell is
the matter with people? Not like I mean, it's it's embarrassing,
Like and the we don't need to name the names.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
Everyone knows. The discourse of.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
You know who's going like you're talking about people's wives
and you're making it personal and then you're bringing all
these just shut up, shut up. It's just so it's
so beneath the industry to like take the discourse of online.
You are amazing at not being too online. I give
(38:45):
you a ton of credit for it. Nick Nick right,
it's amazing how he doesn't read his mentions. I still
am addicted to my phone. I still read my mentions.
I have gotten much much, much much and much better
about not letting it bother me and not responding. But
it is so very clear that way too many people
in our industry formulate their opinions based on the algorithm
(39:10):
that they see on X And it's just complete horseshit.
Like I don't believe that people that go to that
basketball game left being like, you know what, that was
a race war a basketball Like, you know, I'm not
like I it's crazy and I'm not the biggest WNBA fan.
(39:33):
I'm not claiming to have WNBA bona fides, or like
watching for years, or like going ten deep on all
the rosters. So people like Parkins, I don't give a
shit about your WNBA takes. That's fine. I just know
sports and narratives that is a good thing for business,
and people taking their online commentary that is designed to
(39:56):
divide us and then making it actually like in form
their sports opinions on television when they are multi millionaire
former professional athletes. They don't even realize what they're doing.
But it's just very embarrassing if I really do find
it embarrassing.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Yeah, it's my take. My take on Caitlin Clark and
Angel Reese from the beginning is the league was growing,
but she's Taylor Swift and tennis shoes. She's not doesn't
have to be the best player in the league. Taylor
Swift doesn't have the best voice. Adele does like like
she doesn't have the best voice. There's some there's some
(40:33):
visceral connection between young women, middle aged women and Taylor
Swift that I can't explain. I'm usually good at listening
to music or watching sports and going that's a superstar.
I didn't see it with Taylor Swift. There's been Lady Gaga,
I connected, there have been, there have been a lot
of artists. Adele the first time. Yeah, when I heard
(40:55):
Katy Perry, I was but like Adele. When I heard
Adele was like, holy shit, what is that? That's Lady
Gaga did that to me. I remember Garth Brooks years
and years ago, hearing him and going it was like
new country. It wasn't like you know, old and my
dog and my porch. It was like cool country. And
I'm like Shanaiah Twain. I'm usually pretty good at spotting
(41:15):
stuff and going bang the Taylor Swift up. I can't
even explain it. Now, she's got she got a nice voice,
she's really smart, but I can't explain it. Caitlin Clark's
not that hard to explain. Holy shit, she's taking shots
that NBA players wouldn't take. She I said, she's Steph
Curry plus Jason Kidd, the sixty foot passes, the thirty
(41:38):
foot bombs. You're like half the NBA would not make
those plays. She's a comment because it doesn't look like
anything else.
Speaker 3 (41:48):
Right, of course, if a player in five years started
dunking like Anthony Edwards, like we'd.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
Be like, oh my god, right, so bull because we
haven't seen it in the in the WNBA, right, So yeah,
I think that part of it is also very obvious.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
She's the Steph curization.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
Of basketball has hit women's basketball in a way and
at a moment. And you and I have talked about
this months ago now, like listen, part of this is ESPN,
which the world is changing, Cable is changing, fine, it
is still the behemoth of sports television. They promote the
(42:31):
shit out of it. Yeah that helps, Like real talented analysts,
real talented broadcasters. Real they're not on ESPN News like
they're in good time slots on good networks on ABC
on ESPN in primetime on weeknights with a real pregame
(42:52):
show and a real postgame show and a real play
by play guy, and they do a good job on
college hoops and so they I think they're invested in
it and it's a cyclical thing and they hit this
phenomenon like the fact that that game there was a
blowout outrated Yankees Red Sox. That matters, like that, that matters,
(43:16):
and so I just yeah, I mean, all the respect
in the world to her talent, all the respect in
the world to like people who have been WNBA fans
for forever and have been like now get to say
I told you so. But I just I wish our
media colleagues realized a little bit better that they were
(43:36):
being played by the algorithm. Because they're all athletes. They
can't possibly be offended by that foul. They can't. It's
it's impossible that a bunch of football players are were
so offended by that foul that they had to make
this big of a deal out of it. So I
just eventually they'll need to talk about the bad basketball.
(44:00):
And I think for some people it's just easier to
culture war everything, and I think it's unfortunate.
Speaker 2 (44:09):
Hey, so we all make mistakes, but owning up to
them is the right thing to do. So, you know
Degree cool Rush deodorant right, Well, last year they changed
the formula and it did not go over well with
their fans. So Degrees the whole thing is it turns
up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up
the effort, and good thing it does, because cool Rush
fans really turned up the effort to bring the original
(44:29):
formula back. One guy even started an online petition and
Degree listened they admitted they ft up. They're bringing back
the original cool Rush scent. They're bringing it back and
it's exactly how you remember it, cool, crisp and fresh.
It's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for
under four dollars. There's a reason that's been the number
one men's anti perspirant for the last decade. It's the
same reason why people were not happy when it changed.
(44:50):
So if you've never tried it, it might be a
good time to see what the fuss is about. Head
to your local Walmart Target and try the og degree
cool Rush for yourself. So I am. I was surprised
(45:10):
by the result on the tush push vote. So I
was surprised. So I've stated before that two things matter
to the NFL in no particular order, entertainment and safety.
Put them in the order you want. This breaks. Yeah,
I think I think your order is correct, and this
(45:32):
violates both. It's ugly television and it looks like it's
going to get somebody hurt. And Cam Chancellor used to
jump over kicking teams to block kicks. There was no
data that people were getting hurt, but the NFL is, like,
you know, it looks kind of dangerous. We're going to
ban it now. Kickoffs there's data, there's more concussions. They've
(45:55):
changed it, the horse callar tackle, there's data it's hurting players.
But Cam Chancellor jumping over the lines, there was no
data that players were just falling to the ground. They didn't.
They just thought in this day and age, it looks
like people can get hurt. So that's my thing. With
a tush push. It's bad TV, but it does look
(46:16):
like kind of it's not really healthy. I contend it
passed for one reason, and it's the same reason. Sometimes
you'll be flying through TikTok and somebody will catch your attention.
Tony Robbins is the first in our lifetime that did
it regularly. He could captivate you with a rant, I'm
(46:36):
gonna make you a better person. You're like, who's this
guy on late night infomercials with fran Tarkenton like forty
years ago, and he's made an industry of it now.
There's copycats everywhere, but there are these people that are
highly performative. Gordon Ramsey, you know Tony Robbins, and there
aren't all walks of life to some degree. You and
I do that for a living. There are politicians that
(46:57):
are very performative, and I think Jason Kelsey's the reason
it stayed. I think he's kind of a Midwest grinder,
salt of the earth, huge brand, totally respected. Owners in
this league have listened to players for a long time.
They do. They listen to the players, and there are
certain players they really like. They like the tough guys
(47:19):
in the trenches. And I think he got reportedly got
in front of the owners and he sold them on it,
and I think he flipped about four of them. And
I think he was he was an influencer. He had
the ability to literally galvanize these guys on them because
you know, ten, we're not going to ban it. Ten
(47:39):
were absolutely and like anything else, Danny, there's a third
of the league just sitting there thinking, I don't know,
what's Jerry doing, what's Kronky doing, what's Craft doing. I
think Kelsey's the reason it stays.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
I think that that's totally reasonable, and I'm sure there
will be reporting from the meetings on the vote that
might very well indicate that you're right. I would only
quibble a little bit with your phrasing of like it
passed the vote was to ban it, and they needed
twenty four votes to ban it, and twenty two voted
to ban it. Right right, majority of the league. The
(48:15):
majority of the league did. They just didn't get the
super majority that they needed. Right. Well over fifty percent
wanted it gone, they just didn't get to the seventy
five percent threshold. I think that some of the discourse
around this because there isn't data yet on players.
Speaker 3 (48:31):
I agree with you, it looks like it, but there
is not data on it.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
Jason Delci actually before he came into a lot before it,
had spoken to how much it did feel like it
beat him up, So you know, I think he was
doing the Eagles as solid there. Frankly, to me, the
only argument that should matter is that it's bad television.
That's the only argument that should matter. They banned the
shift in baseball not because it was bad strategy to
(48:59):
deploy a shift, because they didn't want to see Kyle
Schwarber come to the plate rip a ball that would
be a double and instead it's an out. So they
banned it. In the NBA, they're like, you know, it's
not great if you can just stand there in the
lane for ten seconds and clog up everything, three second violation.
(49:23):
They banned it for the good of the game, for
the good of the sport, for the good of the flow,
for the good of offense, for the watch ability of
the product.
Speaker 3 (49:30):
We do this all the time in sports.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
And I know that Eagles fans took it personally because
they were the best at and they created it. But
I thought what aj Brown said just yesterday was the
right thing. He's like, I'm not concerned about it. It's
a yard. Do we really think that the biggest offensive
line in the NFL, with the strongest quarterback in the NFL,
with the best running back in the NFL is all
of a sudden not going to win the Super Bowl
(49:55):
because their gimmicky rugby play now has to just be
an old school quarterback sneak that.
Speaker 3 (50:01):
Oh yeah, by the way, tom Brady was.
Speaker 1 (50:03):
Excellent at Like, if Tom Brady can sneak for a yard,
not a great athlete compared to Jalen ERTs. I think
Jalen Hurts would be just fine without the tush push.
So I thought that Philly fans should go the other
way with this. Yeah, we created something, and now you
said we're too good at it, and we won a
super Bowl and you're gonna ban it. Yeah, that's on you.
(50:26):
We'll win a super Bowl without it, and just like
and like take it as like a source of pride. Instead,
they got very defensive and you're trying to take away
our play and you're making this just about you. I'm like,
I swear to you if it was the Bears who
invented it, I'd be like, that's stupid. It's a dull.
In the in the NFC Championship game, a referee had
to get on a loud speaker and be like, if
(50:48):
you jump over the line of scrimmage one more time,
I'm just gonna award them a touchdown.
Speaker 3 (50:53):
That is dumb.
Speaker 1 (50:55):
And then with the Bills did it in the ANFC
Championship game, the spot of the ball. We have four
hundred HD cameras and everyone's like, where's the ball? We
couldn't tell because there's twenty people swarming to it. So
I just I think it's just objectively uninteresting and I
(51:15):
don't like the whole point of sports is that it's unpredictable,
that you don't know what's coming. If every time you
get in that formation, and I know Philly fencer, like, well,
one time we faked out of it. Okay, If ninety
nine percent of the time you get in that formation,
the exact same thing happens, it's not good television. That
(51:37):
should be enough reason for it to be banned. But
you know whatever, Okay, So you know, I just I
was passionate about it because I thought it was a
you're a good arguer, You tell me what we think
about this. What is to stop someone from doing it?
First and ten from the thirty. Just take the guy
(52:01):
in the in the world who has the strongest legs,
make him your backup quarterback, put him under center, second
and seven, third and four, fourth and two, first and ten,
second and eight, third and five, fourth and two, first
(52:25):
and ten, and just rugby their way down the field. Well,
it probably won't happen, but normally slippery slope arguments suck.
But I honestly do think that if you allow something
like this to like really gain steam and everybody starts
working on it, like the next iteration of the tush push,
everyone's gonna be like, oh, that's taking it too far. Well,
(52:47):
then you got to outlaw it. Now.
Speaker 2 (52:48):
Yeah, I think it's such a it's such a beating
in your offensive lineman. I don't think you would do
that unless I think it used. The scarcity of it
is really valuable for even the team that's successful, because
it's just beating the hell out of your offensive line.
I could see that happening in crappy weather. Saquon Barkley
(53:09):
gets hurt and you've got to burn five plays that
I can see happening. But it is. It is a
beat down. It's like the wildcat. The wildcat sounded great,
but if you have a good quarterback, it would piss
him off if you kept snapping to the full back
like it wasn't good for the room. Right, I could
(53:33):
see Drew bledsoell, okay, what's the point?
Speaker 1 (53:36):
Right? They stink. As soon as he heard the aj
Brown quote of being like, yeah, I don't care, it's
just one yard, he was immediately like a typical receiver.
He just wants a fade. He just wants a fade
from the one yard line to get more touchdowns. He
hates that the balls never going to him. But yeah,
I mean, I I think eventually someone will get hurt,
(53:59):
or too many teams will do it, h and this
will be up for a vote again. In a year
or two or three, and it'll it'll get banned. But
you know, we got we got another year of rugby
on zero point five percent of our plays in the NFL. Okay,
So I.
Speaker 2 (54:13):
Want to end with this, So you would and I
would admit this too. I've moved around the country. People
know that generally when I move around the country, the
only sports team that I tend to. It's hard because
I love football so much. When I lived in Tampa,
I was kind of a Bucks fan. I grew up
in the Northwest. I was a Seahawks fan. I live
in Los Angeles. I'm a Ram and Charger fan. I
(54:34):
try not to be a Homer on the air, but
it's it's I know people in the front office. I
have contacts there. Now I moved to Chicago, I've already
got connections with the Bears, right, So I'm talking to
people and so and you grew up here, So I
under I've always understood that Bill Simmons loves the Celtics,
You're gonna love your teams. I get it right, like
like in the audience understands that you're still objective. But
I said this this week on the show on FS one.
(54:56):
I said, I'm gonna take five quarterbacks that we that
we would, We're not gonna I'm not going to take
a Justin Herbert overrated, Jalen Hurts underrated. I'm not going
to take guys on the fringe. I'm going to take
Andrew Luck, Jadeen Daniels, Joe Burrow. Who else did I take?
Speaker 1 (55:14):
C J.
Speaker 2 (55:15):
Stroud? I took somebody else. I took five of them,
And I said, and I didn't take Mahomes. I took
Lamar Jackson. So I said, let's get Mahomes Allen out. Okay,
they're like historically great, like, So I took five guys
that none of us are going to argue they're all great.
How long once they had a competent coach did it
take for you to go, oh shit? There as a
(55:37):
franchise guy?
Speaker 1 (55:38):
So C J.
Speaker 2 (55:39):
Stroud did not throw an interception until week six, pretty
obvious he was different. Lamar Jackson won six of US
verse seven, and by the second game you were wondering
if he was even faster than Michael Vick. He was electric.
Joe Burrow weeks two and three is throwing for three
hundred and fifty yards behind and absolutely atrocious offs of
(56:00):
line with a coach nobody liked Jaden Daniels Week's two,
three and four. He's completing like twenty eight of thirty one.
You're like, okay, this is a cheat code. What is
going on? And Joe and So I went down and
through all of them. So now I bring you to
Caleb Williams. So yeah again, golf with Jeff Fisher Goff
(56:22):
with McVeigh by. Week two, he's throwing for three hundred
and fifty yards. You're like, oh, Jared Goff can play. Yeah,
he's he's beating Mahomes in a shootout on Monday Night football.
You're like, you know, pretty early in his career. You're like, oh, yeah, this,
this dude can play. So first week so my take
is good, not great, is hard to spot, real deal
(56:48):
and sucks jumps off the page. So week one, Caleb
Williams faces Brian Flore is at home perfect weather. Let's
say he struggles. Ryan Flores has been punitive to young
quarterbacks and Caleb Williams is bad. What is your take?
Speaker 1 (57:13):
I won't be handling you well. I'll tell you that
I won't be handling well. He needs to be very
good right away. Hey, here's the thing. Obviously, I watched
every down of the Bears last year and have for
my entire life. He is good. He's good. Now. It
(57:40):
was not easy, it was not always pretty, but I
trust my eye test. Here. If you get sacked sixty
eight times and still have better than a three to
one touchdown the interception ratio, and your play caller got
fired nine games in your season, and then you fire
(58:02):
your coach and you had controversy, and you lost on
a Hail Mary, and you had all of that hype
and that scrutiny, and the guy who was drafted behind
you is having a historic rookie year and goes all
the way to the NFC Championship game, and you get
your ass kicked and you play all seventeen games and
like you're still standing at.
Speaker 2 (58:21):
The end of it.
Speaker 1 (58:23):
You don't suck like like bat you said, like good bad,
it's a little He's not bad, right, He's not bad.
I'm not worried about bad. It's I still think the
guy's ceiling can be MVP of the league. Okay, Like
I still think greatness is very likely an outcome here.
(58:44):
But yeah, Week one, Minnesota, Monday Night foot we too,
bet Don gets his ole team. Yeah, yeah, I mean no,
I will say this. I will say this. It seems
like forty percent of the years in the last like decade,
the Bears have opened with the packers. I know that's
not actually accurate, but it feels that way. That's the
(59:06):
absolute worst. Any Bears fan will tell you Bear's Packers.
It just is like a different thing. All of our
families have some packers people in it, like, and for
me it was extreme. My dad's entire family was from Wisconsin.
Like you just you're in weddings with these people, you
work with these people, your neighbors with these people. Like
(59:26):
my old radio station signal like reaches far into Wisconsin,
like you could hear it in Milwaukee. So like it's
just like Bear's Packers Week one is too stressful, there's
too many grand Like I can handle Bears Vikings week one.
I can handle Bears Lions Week one, Bear's Packers. If
Caleb Williams would come out week one and get out
(59:46):
played by Jordan Love and they would lose and he'd
throw like two picks, that's just like Sky's falling type stuff.
So I think I can handle Bears Vikings on Monday
Night Football Week one. But if he's terrible, I'm not
gonna be handling you. Well I'm not. It's gonna be
(01:00:08):
tough to be neutral. I'll be totally honest with you.
That's gonna be unfortunate. Yeah, but he's great. Oh deep
dish beets on TV for everybody.
Speaker 2 (01:00:15):
No, I saw that first game and I went, oh, god, Flores,
what a nightmare. Flores just eats.
Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
Yeah, it's not a great spot. But but again, like,
but it can go the other way. Put up thirty,
put up thirty. We never mentioned Shane Waldron's name in
Chicago ever again, you know what I mean, Like, wasted
rookie year? Why did you hire Eve? Why didn't you
blow it all up and start fresh with Kate? Like
(01:00:43):
put up thirty week one and all of your sins
are forgiven and we're good. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:00:47):
You know the airthing, Danny, that that wasn't true years ago.
There's so many good young offensive coaches now in the
NFL that it used to be if your first coach
didn't work, you were screwed. But like Gino Darnold Baker
to ahead Brian Flores then he was a pro bowler,
Gobb's first year was not only unremarkable, it was unrecognizable.
(01:01:09):
So the truth is now there are multiple examples. Sam
Darnold's a totally different player. It used to be there
were like four or five offensive guys that were next level,
Like every other staff has the next Ben Johnson or
an offensive coach. So I mean, god, look at I mean,
you go to the AFC alone, it's like, oh, there's
(01:01:29):
Andy Reid, and oh there's Sean Payton, and there's Jim
Harbaugh in this and Chip Kelly in the same division.
You have those four coaches on staff. So I think
we've gotten to a point where if you have a
Mulligan season, it just I mean, nobody remembers Goff's first
season he was oh and seven. I think it just disappears.
Speaker 1 (01:01:50):
Listen. I mean in Jacksonville, Trevor Lawrence showed enough through
multiple failed coaches that they still gave them a quarter
of a billion dollar contract. They hit on Ryan Thomas
last year, they draft Travis Hunter. This year, they hire
Liam Cohen to be their coach, who was a big
part of Baker Mayfield's success in Tampa, being as consistently
great on offense as they've been like he's in your five,
(01:02:14):
Like does Trevor Lawrence enraged me? And way too many
fumbles and rinzone interception then yet no doubt, Like I
think that like selling stock on, Trevor Lawrence has been
totally reasonable, Like his career is not over right, you
know it's his career is not over If if Liam
Cohen could do that with Baker, it's definitely on the
(01:02:36):
board that Trevor Lawrence turns this thing around, yeah and
rips off five, six, seven really good years and changes
the complete narrative his career. But now listen, I think
it's still much more likely than not that Caleb Williams
is great than he is mediocre.
Speaker 2 (01:02:52):
Danny Parkins FS one love him on the volume stops
by about once twice a month. As Alas this was great,
Thanks buddy, Yeah, this was fun.
Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
Thanks going anytime the volume
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
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All right, let's chop it up for an hour with
Danny Parkins. Former Chicago kid lived his dream on the radio,
left the city to go to FS one because I
talked him into it. That was part of it. And
(01:08):
now I live in Chicago and I just jumped off
the train taking the train from the oglev Center to
a Neetka is pure joy. Nobody bothers you. It's the best.
Now the mornings are a little dicey. But I've so
I've been experimenting, Danny for the first three weeks. I've
been experimenting. I've discovered that Monday is not a bad
(01:28):
traffic day. I'll take a driver Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, or hell,
I'll take the train, and weather screws everything up to
make the drive even worse. Is that kind of the
understanding in Chicago that Monday's the best drive day?
Speaker 3 (01:45):
Oh man? So here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
The Kennedy is just under this like unbelievable construction project
right now. It just makes everything hillacious, like it was
the thing I was most excited to leave Chicago about
because I drove in and you know, I drove myself,
you know, local radio, and drove in and drove out,
and where my radio studio was was nowhere near Ogilvy.
(02:10):
And if I wanted to get home in time to
see my little kids before bed, I needed to get
on the road as fast as possible as opposed to
walking across the loop.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
So you're on it, but just.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
So you know, it can change in a moment's notice,
Like your three week sample size of the halacious Chicago
commute is not enough because the express lanes will be
randomly closed at some point they will do some other
nonsense construction project that, instead of three years, will take seven.
So generally speaking, though, if you feel like you can
(02:42):
do the Metra, the Metra is great because you never
will be bothered. Colin, You're like the most famous person
in Chicago that isn't an athlete. So so like these
people that are commuting to the north shore of Chicago,
they're probably like, is that Colin Coward. No, it couldn't be.
It's probably a banker. And then they'll just go on
(03:03):
with their day. So I promise you will never be bothered.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
No, it's great. I you know, I've never taken the train.
I've had friends in New York that did I mean,
and people all walks alive, kids, college, successful, Wall Street,
and they were always like, yeah, I read on the train.
I listened to a Sam Harris pod today with Jake Tapper.
Those thirty three minutes I got through most of it.
It was like, this is great. So I was like,
(03:27):
I don't know. I always try to find the positive
and stuff. And I was like, you know, I'll listen
to even more podcasts. It's thirty five minutes. I always
said I wrote my first book on a plane every
time I At that time, I was going a lot
from ESPN to LA So I was going to call
the book shots fired from thirty three thousand feet. And
(03:48):
then it's so and at some point something happened in
the country and I was like, no, that's not appropriate
or something. But I've always found planes and trains it's
really you're just really isolated, and I just go, I
just go to work.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Yeah, so I I you know, I'm far in because
there are no trains from the suburbs of New York
that I live in that run as early as we
have to be in for Breakfast Ball. So I go
car in and train out and the train out. You know,
it's great because it's a good excuse to get work done.
It's a good excuse to veg out. Yeah, it's a
(04:22):
good just like it's a good excuse to be selfish.
It's not. There's no quiet cars, so if you need
to make a phone call, you can, But I really
don't like to. Yeah, I like to just kind of
do my thing and make it my me time to decompress,
and yeah, if you can be productive. Airplane productivity is
the best because now there's Wi Fi on planes and
you can text and email and be connected to the world.
(04:44):
But it's also a very easy lie. Oh the know
the life I was done. My phone wasn't working and
you get and you're like, no, no one really expects
you to be connected at thirty three thousand feet for
whatever reason. So the ability to just completely decompress and
unplug from the world is a joyous thing.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
I told my wife we were talking about my happiest place,
like when am my happiest And obviously when I was
a young dad, it would be like hearing my kids laugh,
or being at the beach with my kids and just
seeing your kids have the time of their life at Disney.
When I used to go to Disney, Like, there's just
nothing better than being on a ride with your daughter
and she's screaming and you're laughing and it's bad food.
That's the most fun I've ever had in my life.
(05:23):
But one of my happy places now, I tell my wife,
like once a year in the summer we try to
go to Europe somewhere, and I'm going to visit my
son in a couple of weeks and he's doing some
school in London. And I said, hey, I'll come join you.
We'll go to Copenagan for a couple of days. Let's
just you know. And I made him a promise a
few years ago at least every other year, So you
and I get on a plane and go somewhere around
the world. And so and I told my wife, I said,
(05:44):
you know, getting on a good business seat heading to Europe,
knowing you're getting free wine, a great movie, sleep and
a meal. I'm like, God, that makes me happy. That's
just And I know I don't have to work for
like ten days. And I used to hate vacations when
you started. I didn't like vacations. I didn't want to
(06:06):
be off. And now it's like no love.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Yeah, well, once you're established and you feel like you
can take it, you know. And now, in a weird way,
I've started over because I've transitioned into this new career,
this new profile, trying to build a national profile and
all those things. But yeah, beginning in radio, I would
never take off, or if I took off for my
job in Kansas City. I would fill in in Chicago
(06:32):
for them on Christmas, Like I would come home and
work Black Friday, work Christmas Eve, Christmas Day on the
Chicago stations just to get the reps because I was
so excited to be on, you know, in the big
city and in my hometown. And then when you get
the first job in Chicago, you feel like you can't
take off. But then when you get like good ratings
and success and drive time, then you know it wasn't
(06:53):
as big of a deal to take off. And now
it's easy because they don't let you take off. We
do so many shows, it was unbelievable. We did a
Thanksgiving show, we did a Christmas Eve show.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
We're working Memorial Day, we worked New Year's Day.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
So it's funny, like the cycle of these jobs, it
starts over again. But I'm with you. But the I
don't love flying, but the act of flying too somewhere
is the is the greatest because it's the beginning. It's
like limitless by like the flight to Vegas when I
was a young single and it's like I have five
(07:31):
hundred dollars and anything's yes. But the flight to Vegas
in my twenties was like the happiest of my entire
life other than my kids obviously.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Yeah, those things that you're supposed to all. That's why
I feel about Europe. I'm like, I got ten days here,
and that can unplug really quickly. When I know I
don't work. If I take a three day I take
a lot of three day weekends in the summer, you
never really unplugged.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
If something happened, I write it down, I want, I
want it for the show on Monday. But so I'll
get to my happy place pretty quick.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
It was two be true. Number one is the NBA
got seventy six billion dollars. They're good. Number two. Number
two Hockey Baseball MLS and the NBA regular seasons will
never matter as much as they used to because there's
just too much content. We're all distracted. Young people don't
(08:19):
watch as much television. And I was looking at the
game last night between the t Wolves and OKC, and
I was thinking, oh, yeah, this isn't gonna work. This
is not going to pull a number the Knicks Pacers will.
But I was watching Minnesota OKAC and I'm like, this
is Adam Silver's want this is the league he wants.
He doesn't want stack teams. He inherited that league from
David Stern. He heard. He's a very if not idealistic,
(08:42):
he's kind of a he's very pro employee, like he
listens to his employees. David Stern could bulldoze you. This
is what I'm gonna do. He had two or three
agents and five or six owners. He was close to Silver.
Is more about the collaborative and the fabric of the league.
But he also inherited a very successful league from Stern.
Stern ended up trying to kind of save the league.
(09:04):
So David was like, Nike, Jordan, Magic Bird, big Markets,
that's what we're gonna do. So it's a different time.
But I look at I think this is now the
NBA with a new CABA that Adam Silver wanted. But
I watched two things can be true. I watched Minnesota
and Oklahoma City. I don't I think that will get
a dreadful national number. Am I wrong?
Speaker 3 (09:27):
I don't think you're wrong. But I also don't care.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Like I'm not a television executive, I'm not in business
with Like I'm not in business with the NBA.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
I you know, I don't care.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
I think that we should be talking about it on
our shows because I think sports fans will watch it.
Will they watch it at the exact same clip as
the Eastern Conference Finals. No, obviously not market size, relevance,
people know New York, all of those sort of things.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
That that's all fine.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
I have a lot of thoughts on last night's game,
the Thunder, the discourse, but we can start with your
premise about the league that Adam Silver wants.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
This is a historic time for the NBA.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
This will be the first time ever that there are
seven different champions in seven years, no back to backs,
but last seven years, seven different organizations will have won
the NBA title. And so I looked it up. Heyday
of the NBA, everyone says, is you know Bird, Magic, Jordan,
Kobe Shack Lakers right nineteen eighty through the early two thousands.
(10:35):
If you go from the nineteen eighty NBA Finals when
Magic Johnson came in and played center and replaced Kareem
maybe the most famous game of his career through just
before the first the Dwayne Wade Shack Heat title. Twenty
six years nineteen eighty to two thousand and five, seven
different teams won a championship. So the heyday of the
(10:56):
NBA twenty five, twenty six years, seven champions now seven
champions in seven years. Dynasties are good for sports. They
make people care. You love them, you hate them, you
have opinions. They are good for national ratings. But I
do think that in the long run, even if there
is a five percent dip of ten percent dip in ratings,
(11:17):
I do think long term this will be good for
the NBA because there will be some belief that I
think they will legitimately be able to sell of anybody
can win.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Listen to this. I just got this from our Goldie,
our producer just sent me this. Te Wolves under game
one down twenty four percent from last year, least watch
game one conference finals since twenty twenty one.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
There you go, Okay, fine, like small markets people that
not everybody knows yet, but also a blowout, like let's
see how that goes over the course of over the
course of time. Also, this is a you're a media observer, Okay,
I understand why the Western Conference Finals have to start
later than the Eastern Conference finals, but when it ends
(12:01):
up being Oklahoma City in Minnesota, does it have to
be eight thirty Eastern, Right.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Am I crazy?
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Like the Eastern Conference finals will start at eight pm Eastern,
and if it was, if it was, if it was
Lakers Warriors, I get why they need every minute possible
to try to pack the building and respect the people
leaving work on the West Coast. But and I know
that these things are predetermined ahead of time. Eastern Conference
teams are going to start eight Western Conference games were
going to start eight thirty.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
But when it's two teams in the Central time.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Zone that game ends after eleven pm Eastern on a
school night, that can't help. That can't help what you're
talking about with the ratings. So I wish that they
had a little bit more flexibility, flexibility when it comes
to skate. You know.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
The other thing I thought about last night is that
I don't know how many shots Ant took. It was
like thirteen or something. He didn't shoot thirteen and he's
a great player. But this is the difference how great
Michael Jordan was. Jordan last night, probably in a losing cause,
if he played for Minnesota would have taken thirty nine shots.
(13:11):
Is that Michael never had a game that I can remember,
a big one, even the flu game where you're like,
Michael took thirteen shots his generation. Michael didn't care. Michael
was going to go down. Michael's the most relentlessly competitive
person I've ever seen. I mean in Magic Bird, everybody
Lebron Steph, it doesn't matter. Is that Jason Tatum. There
(13:33):
are times I'm like, is he on the floor?
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Last night?
Speaker 2 (13:36):
In the second half, I'm like, is aunt playing? Is
that everybody's rich in the league. It's a much more
you know, collaborative. I mean, Michael Jordan had no problem saying, hey,
Republicans buy shoes. Who I'm not talking politics. You'd be
hard to say that today is a professional athlete. You'd
(13:57):
get just destroyed by the collective, the media collective. But
that's the difference. When people haven't seen Michael play. I
always say that Michael never had a game or a
moment where you went, is Michael on the floor. I mean,
I remember a game against Utah in the finals. I
remember a game against Phoenix in the finals. He took
(14:18):
a jumper from the angle. It hit backboard and floor,
It didn't hit rim. It was a terrible shot. They
had games against Utah where he was like seven for
thirty three. But there is something about everybody being rich
and everybody has the same for agents and they all
like each other that there isn't there is that there
is a real sense there's tomorrow. Don't expand your energy.
(14:43):
And I watched Minnesota the second half and I'm like, oh,
they're done tonight. They're done tonight. They were clearly done early.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
Listen.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
I will give Anthony Edwards.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
He went back to the locker room with the ankle injury,
and I don't know how much pain he was in.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Yeah, like I maybe right.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
But here's the thing about last night's game. I was
appalled at some of the discourse of SGA's a foul merchants.
The Thunder aren't watchable. I don't like their brand of basketball.
I know he was just announced as the MVP, but
he hadn't won the MVP yet. He has no finals appearances,
(15:24):
he has no rings. If people are already sick of
the Thunder and you're an actual basketball fan, the next
ten years of your basketball viewing are going to be miserable.
They're the youngest playoff team in the league. They're younger
than the Pistons. Their oldest starter is twenty seven years old,
(15:44):
Shay is twenty six, Jalen Williams and chet are twenty
three each, and Sam Presty's the best executive in the sport.
Their coach was a finalist for Coach of the Year
after winning it last year, and they have every draft
pick for the next decade. And people are SGA's a merchant.
They talk about him like he's James Harden. He drives
to the rim more than any player in the league.
(16:07):
Not this year, not these playoffs. For five straight years,
Shay Guiltess Alexander has led the NBA in drives to
the basket.
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Minnesota took fifty one threes last night.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Oklahoma City took twenty one, and the free throw discrepancy
was five and people were like, oh, the refs are
in it for small market Oklahoma City and zero time
MVP Sga. No, that's how he plays, and so like
that game was a blowout and got hurt.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
There was no reason to watch the fourth quarter of
the game. The ratings were down.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Okay, fine, but man, I don't understand how people all
year can be like, yeah, don't play defense, like the
collective league, the league doesn't play defense, and all they
do is shoot threes. And now you have a young,
up and coming, historically great defense team with a guy
who scores from everywhere on the floor, and you're like,
I hate that too, because is anybody satisfied? Well, we
(17:08):
have to bring Michael Jordan back from his fishing boat
to plays that the only way people will not complain
during an NBA game.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
It drives me insane.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
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Speaker 2 (18:43):
Let me throw a theory at you. I talked about
it on my show today. I think you'll like this.
So I talked about it, okay, for like as you
can do on our show for four minutes, I can
talk about it with you for ten. So one of
the things I love about sports. I think you know
this theories, cultural changes, trying to see them as they're
happening in real time. Right, So take out the last
(19:04):
two Zach Edie made the All Rookie team. Okay, three
years ago, it's like, can't play just a college guy?
Why was everybody so wrong?
Speaker 3 (19:16):
A year ago?
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Mark Fus like, if he can't play NBA, it's an
NBA problem. But Danny Hurley's like, you can't tell me
he's not an NBA player. He's the hardest guy I've
ever done a game prep for. There's no way we're
gonna stop him. Mark fu said, all my years at Gonzaga,
hardest player to defend. We have nobody in the program.
And then he hits uh the Yukon team that had
(19:43):
two guys make the All Rookie team, the big in Portland,
and then a Donovan Oh god cling yes, clan my bad.
And then the kid from San Antonio, Stephen Castle. So
two things have happened in the last two years of
college basketball. Zachy's dominance translated to the NBA, and that
(20:06):
Yukon team that crushed people even in the tournament really
was full of excellent NBA players. Why do I say
that because for the previous twenty years, guys like Doug
McDermott one Player of the year and we're at best
rotational players. So why is this happening? NIL has saved
(20:29):
college basketball. So NIL is keeping guys like Zach Edie
NBA guys in one more year, or they choose college
over G league or international. A story today that Real
Madrid and Barcelona's amateur teams and this Spain has all
the great European young players. They're thinking of folding the
(20:49):
league because American NIL money is taking all the European
kids over here. So what is happening? So this European
system that was so we were so enamored with, Oh no, no,
those kids are not going to play college. The G
leaguers are going to play college. What does it do?
First two rounds this year? March Madness highest in thirty
(21:11):
two years. The quality was much better. Houston, Florida, Yukon. Well,
those are NBA players, So we went through about a
twenty year cycle kind of at the end of Grant
Hill and those kind of guys Larry Johnson and all
that stuff, Right, those are if you dominated college, you're
going to be a good pro and no moment about
twenty five thirty years you're like Jim or Furdette, Doug McDermott,
(21:32):
Tyler Hansborough. You could dominate college and be a rotational player,
and I think it hurt the quality of the game.
But between that Barcelona story, between the ratings and Zach
Edy and the Yukon guys, what you're seeing now is
college basketball is a rebirth that when you're watching it
in March and a guy is dominating. So long story,
(21:58):
what does this mean? What does this mean? Okac? They
have stockpiled all these draft picks and we always assumed, okay,
see Danny was going to use those picks to get
a Yannis. Don't give those picks up. The draft now
is going to be like this year's draft. You're like, oh,
there's like seven domestic players in the top ten and
(22:18):
they're all really really good. Is that the idea that
you give out your picks for Yannis if you don't
like Okac? Now, with all those picks, these are going
to be NBA players coming out of college. Now they
can play almost immediately.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
Yeah, I think it's a great point.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
And the guy who accumulated the picks happens to have
a better record in both eras of what you're talking
about of nailing the picks. So like Sam Presty, everybody
has misses, but he has fewer than most. Like he
traded for Sga but on his rookie like as she
(23:01):
was just available and he traded for him, he sniped him,
he traded. This is not a college player, not a
young player, so not a perfect example like Alex Caruso
wins them Game seven. Alex Caruso was on the Lakers,
they offered him three years, twenty one million dollars. The
(23:22):
Bulls offered him three for thirty seven and restricted free agency,
and the Lakers are like, no, we'd rather have Taylor
Horton Tucker, So he went to Chicago. Then the Bulls
trade Alex Caruso to Sam Presty for Josh Gitty. Josh Gitty,
nice player, pulls up the stat sheet, fun young, high
upside guy. Not saying anything bad about Josh Gitty, But
(23:46):
Alex Caruso clearly is a championship pedigree player, elite defensive player.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
And Sam Presty has approximately three hundred and twenty.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Seven extra draft picks and the Bulls couldn't get one
of them in that trade for Alex Caruso.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
I read that trade and I was like, oh, that's funny.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
They got Josh Giddy, but like, what's the draft pick?
Speaker 3 (24:07):
And it never came Like so Sam Resty is just
great at this.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
He's great at it, And I agree with you, they
will keep a lot of those assets. You can only
have twelve guys on a team. And like they traded
Josh Giddy because there wasn't a spot for him right,
Like they had too many good young backcourt players that
were cheap. That's not a problem most teams have. So
I don't think he'll use every draft pick, you know,
(24:36):
but he can. He can. He can go out and
get any player he wants whenever he decides to cash
his chips in. I don't think it'll be for Giannis,
but I think it'll be for cheap waiver because they
want guys on their rookie deal who they can sign
to second contracts because free agents aren't historically going to
choose Oklahoma City. And he can just say, oh, we're
(24:59):
what's the one thing We're not a lead at three
point shooting? Who's the best three and D guy in
the NBA on a rookie contract. I want him, and
he can go get him like that. That's what I
don't think people completely understand about what Oklahoma Like. If
Oklahoma City said we want Giannis, they would win. If
Oklahoma City said we want Durant, they would win. If
(25:21):
fill in the blank superstar becomes disgruntled and they get
If the Mavericks were like, we're gonna hold a bidding
more for Luka Doncic and Sam Presty's like I want him,
they would win. They have more assets than everybody in
the league and it isn't particularly close. So I don't
know how he'll use the poker chips, but I know
(25:42):
that he's more likely than not going to be right.
He will prioritize young, cheap labor. And to your point,
he's not going to trade as many of the draft
picks as people think because he's excellent at drafting.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Yeah, the you know, I was thinking about this the
other day, as the is when people listen to this game,
one of the next will be over, and I thought,
I think Jalen Brunson has a chance to be the
most popular nick ever. So I'll explain the interesting that's
that's a thought. Any kid under thirty five didn't see
(26:14):
Walt Fraser play or Earl Monroe play. Eliminate those players.
The young, the young demographic which loves the NBA didn't
watch him play. Patrick Ewing's a center. They don't sell shoes,
they don't become coaches. They're just looked at as genetically
unique human beings. The greatest of all of them, Kareem
(26:34):
Abdul Jabbar was stoic, never a broadcaster, never really a coach,
didn't get opportunities. They don't become the most popular player.
Shack is a complete outlier because he's a big personality.
But Barkley is still the star of that show. And
then you say, well, Bernard King, nice guy. Injuries cut
short a great career. Carmelo Anthony never really delivered in
(26:55):
the postseason. Brunson is relatable. He's the size of the
average fan Villanova, soe you have found him in college?
He was he was an East Coast star at Villanova.
A lot of Villanova people in New York and big
Eiast fans in New York. Right, Oh yeah, he's totally reliant, relatable,
(27:16):
like he's he's a great clutch shot maker, which say
what you want that is, you know, fourth corner drives
make quarterbacks, and shot makers make Jordan. And the other
thing is the NBA now is moving into a time
(27:38):
you can't stack a roster, and so it's not a
coincidence the four best players on the four best teams
are all guards because if you don't have a stacked
roster and you have a collection of B to B
plus players, the point guard will control tempo and touches
for everybody and pace. The league is going to become
a pace, tempo point guard league. It's not gonna be
(28:01):
buying the best wings in centers. You can't anymore. You're
just not gonna have that anymore. Boston's gonna unravel here
in the next year, I mean, or at least move
off many of their players. Is that when you look
at Ewing, is a center nobody saw won't play if
you're under thirty seven years old. Bernard King injuries, Carmelo
Anthony never won. Brunson is going to be the most
(28:24):
popular Nick within thirty years. Okay, I mean, I'm not
a New York Knicks historian. Uh, it strikes me as
unlikely that he's gonna be more popular, because if you're
just saying, like, no one under thirty seven remembers Clyde Frasier,
it's like, okay, but there are a lot of people
(28:45):
over thirty seven, and he won two titles.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
He's on the All NBA team at fifty, he's on
the All NBA team at seventy five. In terms of
you know, he's one of the greats in the history
of the league, and he's on their broadcasts like Clyde Frasier,
how he dresses, how he presents himself, like Knicks fans
who are young know who Clyde Frazer.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Okay, so I want to stop you there. Jerry West
was the logo built Laker championships and magic was more popular.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
That's okay, But do you think that do you think
that the Knicks are going to win the title?
Speaker 2 (29:25):
I think the Knicks under Brunson are going to be
a regular conference finals team with chances to get to
the finals. New York sports outside of the Yankees, historically
have been so uneven and so inconsistent. I mean, two
of the worst franchises in pro sports historically historically are
the Mets and the Jets, and so so you don't.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
I mean, as the Knicks unite the city like New
York basketball, right, Like it's take a lot of pride.
The best point guards come from New York and Rucker
Park and all of the college and AAU teams and
all all of the New York basketball royalty stuff, which
I love and eat up. I'm like, there's a lot
about it in my book, like I'm all for all
of the history of New York basketball. I don't think
(30:11):
you can be the most popular Nick if you didn't
win a title. And I don't think they're gonna win
a title. I think Oklahoma City would wax them. And
this is a I guess, a hot take. Jalen Brunson
has become a Smedge overrated, a Smedge overrated because he
is crazy likable. Everything you said is true. He won
(30:33):
the Clutch Player of the Year. Yes, but when I'm
watching the games and I'm staying up late and I'm
watching all of the game, yes, I don't know how
sustainable this is. He's on it. He doesn't pass either
you or Carmelow. Okay, that that is true, so maybe
(30:53):
he fits right in. But like he listen, he hits
every clutch shot. He's totally unafraid. I get why he's
a fan fait, I get why he's loved. He deserved
clutch Player of the Year. He's a beloved nick. No
doubt about all of it. It's totally earned. The guy
is not afraid of any moment. He's tough as hell.
All of that is true. But yeah, he got Karl
(31:16):
Anthony Towns and mckel bridges and I'm watching the ends
of some of these games and he's like, well, Jalen Brunson,
he just took the last ten shots of the game,
except for one that Josh Hart got on an offensive
rebound on a miss by Jalen Brunson.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
It just doesn't.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
Strike me as a formula to win a championship. I
can't think of one where it's like one guy just
shoots every single time, no one is his peer at
the end of the game, and they're going to win
a title. It's exciting. It reminds They remind me a
lot of one of my favorite teams ever, the twenty
(31:54):
ten to twenty twelve Derreck Rose era Bulls right like
Tibbs is coach the now Derek Rose even more local
than Jalen Brunson, Chicago born and raised, like state championships
in high school, the whole thing. But like right, the
Bulls drafted Derek Rose, the Knicks trade for Brunson, So
it's not complete apples to apples, but it's it's close enough.
(32:17):
Best player is a ball dominant guard, team oriented. Those
Bulls teams were better defensively than this next team. But
I know the Knicks fans say, with Mitchell Robinson healthy,
they're actually an elite defensive team, even though they never
have been. But it's same coach, really hard nosed team,
beloved point guard who you ride or died with him,
(32:39):
and Derek Ross was unbelievable, youngest MVP in the history
of the league. They were the one seed and then
the only problem was he had to play Lebron James,
and so when he played Lebron, it was like, oh,
they won, game won, and then they lose in five.
And I think that's what's gonna happen to the Knicks.
Maybe not until they face the Thunder in the NBA Finals,
and so he'll advance a little further than those Bulls
(33:00):
teams did. But I don't think you can win an
NBA Championship this way. I just don't And I think
that you can't be the most popular nick of all
time if you don't put a banner up in Madison
Square Garden.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Well, I'm just more optimistic than you.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Perhaps you are, you are, I mean, I think they
would get crushed by the well I think. I think, yeah,
I think the thunder are going to win this championship
and people are somehow going to say that they hate them.
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
That's what I think is happening here. So I'm going
to throw this at you. There are some genetic and
gender realities that seem unfair to me. You're driving on
the freeway. You're driving on the freeway. Be totally honest.
If a skinny guy is in a car eating he's
got burgers, you're thinking to yourself, that guy's on the go,
he doesn't have time to stop. That guy is a hustler,
(33:50):
he is making things happen. A heavyset guy in a
car is eating burgers, You're like, and I am too. Oh, really,
you can't even drive without eating. I mean, give me
a break, Like, what, Well, you can't. You can't pull over?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
You have to. It's a.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
It's a we have no idea about those two people.
That is how people view Wait, we're all watists at times.
Gender gender.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
I'm not saying no to your premise, you Colin, I can't.
I love your analogies. Go ahead, here's whatever. There's a
gender reality. Men can hate each other.
Speaker 2 (34:26):
Jordan still holds a grudge against Isaiah. Somehow it makes
him more likable. Men can taunt, can trash talk. If
Angel Reese appears to hate Caitlin Clark, it becomes a
race topic. It is outrageous, It is unfair, and I'm
like time out. Women athletes can hate rifles too.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
It's not to me.
Speaker 2 (34:54):
I'm like, is it race?
Speaker 1 (34:56):
Well? I hate?
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Is it used to be a commodity? Like you loved
when the writer cup we hated the years. Now everybody's rich,
but the Caitlyn Clark Angel Reese rivalry. One got the
best of the other in college the junior year. The
other one got the best the senior year. One goes Midwest,
small city, one goes big city. One gets more press.
(35:21):
I just I look at it and I think it
doesn't bother me that Angel Reese doesn't like Caitlin like
like by the way Caitlyn's game is fun and flashy.
Angels a rebounder like she probably got a little built
in animosity. She won't get the press.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
I think it's the worst story in sports media. I
hate the discourse around it. I think I think it's
I think it brings out the worst in everybody. I
really do think it's it's just show a lot of
people are showing their ass on this story. Of course,
what you just said is correct. I one of my
things to trope. It's a cliche.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
I've just I like the turn of phrase that I created.
Less hate in the world, more hate in sports.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Yeah, sports hate is good. It is objectively good. Now
when it leads to like fights in the stands, Okay, fine,
someone took it too far, but that doesn't mean that
it is a bad thing. Trash talk, rivalries, bulletin board material, lobbying,
shots in the press, hard fouls, stare downs, the occasional fight.
Speaker 3 (36:31):
Those things are good.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
They're good for ratings, they're good for business, they're good
for fan interest, they're good for jersey sales. They are good.
It is good for the WNBA for there to be
sports hate, yes, for there to be rivalry, yes, it
is a good thing that is so objectively obviously true
that I can't believe anyone even dares to deny it.
(36:54):
I do think the bird magic stuff is a little
ridiculous because Burden Magic, in terms of talents, were kind
of equals. Yes, yes, this is more like Michael Jordan
and Bill Lambier. You know they were rivals, but yeah,
(37:15):
but they're not really the same type of player, right.
They hated each other, they had great moments, but they
were not like no one was like, you know, who
carried the NBA to popularity, Michael Jordan and Bill Lambier.
It was not not how we just got Caitlyn Clark
is the phenomenon, She's the comments and like that. Does
(37:36):
that spur jealousy, no doubt. Are there interesting racial components
to that story that.
Speaker 3 (37:46):
I think are fair to be discussed.
Speaker 1 (37:48):
For a league that has had great players white and
black before Caitlyn Clark, why haven't they caught on in
the same type of way? Like I think that there
is like fair conversations to be had there. But a
hard foul by Angel Reese in a basketball game that
like didn't even result in a fight, It resulted in
(38:11):
she said the F word, Like, what the hell is
the matter with people? Not like I mean, it's it's embarrassing,
Like and the we don't need to name the names.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
Everyone knows. The discourse of.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
You know who's going like you're talking about people's wives
and you're making it personal and then you're bringing all
these just shut up, shut up. It's just so it's
so beneath the industry to like take the discourse of online.
You are amazing at not being too online. I give
(38:45):
you a ton of credit for it. Nick Nick right,
it's amazing how he doesn't read his mentions. I still
am addicted to my phone. I still read my mentions.
I have gotten much much, much much and much better
about not letting it bother me and not responding. But
it is so very clear that way too many people
in our industry formulate their opinions based on the algorithm
(39:10):
that they see on X And it's just complete horseshit.
Like I don't believe that people that go to that
basketball game left being like, you know what, that was
a race war a basketball Like, you know, I'm not
like I it's crazy and I'm not the biggest WNBA fan.
(39:33):
I'm not claiming to have WNBA bona fides, or like
watching for years, or like going ten deep on all
the rosters. So people like Parkins, I don't give a
shit about your WNBA takes. That's fine. I just know
sports and narratives that is a good thing for business,
and people taking their online commentary that is designed to
(39:56):
divide us and then making it actually like in form
their sports opinions on television when they are multi millionaire
former professional athletes. They don't even realize what they're doing.
But it's just very embarrassing if I really do find
it embarrassing.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Yeah, it's my take. My take on Caitlin Clark and
Angel Reese from the beginning is the league was growing,
but she's Taylor Swift and tennis shoes. She's not doesn't
have to be the best player in the league. Taylor
Swift doesn't have the best voice. Adele does like like
she doesn't have the best voice. There's some there's some
(40:33):
visceral connection between young women, middle aged women and Taylor
Swift that I can't explain. I'm usually good at listening
to music or watching sports and going that's a superstar.
I didn't see it with Taylor Swift. There's been Lady Gaga,
I connected, there have been, there have been a lot
of artists. Adele the first time. Yeah, when I heard
(40:55):
Katy Perry, I was but like Adele. When I heard
Adele was like, holy shit, what is that? That's Lady
Gaga did that to me. I remember Garth Brooks years
and years ago, hearing him and going it was like
new country. It wasn't like you know, old and my
dog and my porch. It was like cool country. And
I'm like Shanaiah Twain. I'm usually pretty good at spotting
(41:15):
stuff and going bang the Taylor Swift up. I can't
even explain it. Now, she's got she got a nice voice,
she's really smart, but I can't explain it. Caitlin Clark's
not that hard to explain. Holy shit, she's taking shots
that NBA players wouldn't take. She I said, she's Steph
Curry plus Jason Kidd, the sixty foot passes, the thirty
(41:38):
foot bombs. You're like half the NBA would not make
those plays. She's a comment because it doesn't look like
anything else.
Speaker 3 (41:48):
Right, of course, if a player in five years started
dunking like Anthony Edwards, like we'd.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
Be like, oh my god, right, so bull because we
haven't seen it in the in the WNBA, right, So yeah,
I think that part of it is also very obvious.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
She's the Steph curization.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
Of basketball has hit women's basketball in a way and
at a moment. And you and I have talked about
this months ago now, like listen, part of this is ESPN,
which the world is changing, Cable is changing, fine, it
is still the behemoth of sports television. They promote the
(42:31):
shit out of it. Yeah that helps, Like real talented analysts,
real talented broadcasters. Real they're not on ESPN News like
they're in good time slots on good networks on ABC
on ESPN in primetime on weeknights with a real pregame
(42:52):
show and a real postgame show and a real play
by play guy, and they do a good job on
college hoops and so they I think they're invested in
it and it's a cyclical thing and they hit this
phenomenon like the fact that that game there was a
blowout outrated Yankees Red Sox. That matters, like that, that matters,
(43:16):
and so I just yeah, I mean, all the respect
in the world to her talent, all the respect in
the world to like people who have been WNBA fans
for forever and have been like now get to say
I told you so. But I just I wish our
media colleagues realized a little bit better that they were
(43:36):
being played by the algorithm. Because they're all athletes. They
can't possibly be offended by that foul. They can't. It's
it's impossible that a bunch of football players are were
so offended by that foul that they had to make
this big of a deal out of it. So I
just eventually they'll need to talk about the bad basketball.
(44:00):
And I think for some people it's just easier to
culture war everything, and I think it's unfortunate.
Speaker 2 (44:09):
Hey, so we all make mistakes, but owning up to
them is the right thing to do. So, you know
Degree cool Rush deodorant right, Well, last year they changed
the formula and it did not go over well with
their fans. So Degrees the whole thing is it turns
up the sweat and odor protection when you turn up
the effort, and good thing it does, because cool Rush
fans really turned up the effort to bring the original
(44:29):
formula back. One guy even started an online petition and
Degree listened they admitted they ft up. They're bringing back
the original cool Rush scent. They're bringing it back and
it's exactly how you remember it, cool, crisp and fresh.
It's back in Walmart, Target and other stores now for
under four dollars. There's a reason that's been the number
one men's anti perspirant for the last decade. It's the
same reason why people were not happy when it changed.
(44:50):
So if you've never tried it, it might be a
good time to see what the fuss is about. Head
to your local Walmart Target and try the og degree
cool Rush for yourself. So I am. I was surprised
(45:10):
by the result on the tush push vote. So I
was surprised. So I've stated before that two things matter
to the NFL in no particular order, entertainment and safety.
Put them in the order you want. This breaks. Yeah,
I think I think your order is correct, and this
(45:32):
violates both. It's ugly television and it looks like it's
going to get somebody hurt. And Cam Chancellor used to
jump over kicking teams to block kicks. There was no
data that people were getting hurt, but the NFL is, like,
you know, it looks kind of dangerous. We're going to
ban it now. Kickoffs there's data, there's more concussions. They've
(45:55):
changed it, the horse callar tackle, there's data it's hurting players.
But Cam Chancellor jumping over the lines, there was no
data that players were just falling to the ground. They didn't.
They just thought in this day and age, it looks
like people can get hurt. So that's my thing. With
a tush push. It's bad TV, but it does look
(46:16):
like kind of it's not really healthy. I contend it
passed for one reason, and it's the same reason. Sometimes
you'll be flying through TikTok and somebody will catch your attention.
Tony Robbins is the first in our lifetime that did
it regularly. He could captivate you with a rant, I'm
(46:36):
gonna make you a better person. You're like, who's this
guy on late night infomercials with fran Tarkenton like forty
years ago, and he's made an industry of it now.
There's copycats everywhere, but there are these people that are
highly performative. Gordon Ramsey, you know Tony Robbins, and there
aren't all walks of life to some degree. You and
I do that for a living. There are politicians that
(46:57):
are very performative, and I think Jason Kelsey's the reason
it stayed. I think he's kind of a Midwest grinder,
salt of the earth, huge brand, totally respected. Owners in
this league have listened to players for a long time.
They do. They listen to the players, and there are
certain players they really like. They like the tough guys
(47:19):
in the trenches. And I think he got reportedly got
in front of the owners and he sold them on it,
and I think he flipped about four of them. And
I think he was he was an influencer. He had
the ability to literally galvanize these guys on them because
you know, ten, we're not going to ban it. Ten
(47:39):
were absolutely and like anything else, Danny, there's a third
of the league just sitting there thinking, I don't know,
what's Jerry doing, what's Kronky doing, what's Craft doing. I
think Kelsey's the reason it stays.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
I think that that's totally reasonable, and I'm sure there
will be reporting from the meetings on the vote that
might very well indicate that you're right. I would only
quibble a little bit with your phrasing of like it
passed the vote was to ban it, and they needed
twenty four votes to ban it, and twenty two voted
to ban it. Right right, majority of the league. The
(48:15):
majority of the league did. They just didn't get the
super majority that they needed. Right. Well over fifty percent
wanted it gone, they just didn't get to the seventy
five percent threshold. I think that some of the discourse
around this because there isn't data yet on players.
Speaker 3 (48:31):
I agree with you, it looks like it, but there
is not data on it.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
Jason Delci actually before he came into a lot before it,
had spoken to how much it did feel like it
beat him up, So you know, I think he was
doing the Eagles as solid there. Frankly, to me, the
only argument that should matter is that it's bad television.
That's the only argument that should matter. They banned the
shift in baseball not because it was bad strategy to
(48:59):
deploy a shift, because they didn't want to see Kyle
Schwarber come to the plate rip a ball that would
be a double and instead it's an out. So they
banned it. In the NBA, they're like, you know, it's
not great if you can just stand there in the
lane for ten seconds and clog up everything, three second violation.
(49:23):
They banned it for the good of the game, for
the good of the sport, for the good of the flow,
for the good of offense, for the watch ability of
the product.
Speaker 3 (49:30):
We do this all the time in sports.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
And I know that Eagles fans took it personally because
they were the best at and they created it. But
I thought what aj Brown said just yesterday was the
right thing. He's like, I'm not concerned about it. It's
a yard. Do we really think that the biggest offensive
line in the NFL, with the strongest quarterback in the NFL,
with the best running back in the NFL is all
of a sudden not going to win the Super Bowl
(49:55):
because their gimmicky rugby play now has to just be
an old school quarterback sneak that.
Speaker 3 (50:01):
Oh yeah, by the way, tom Brady was.
Speaker 1 (50:03):
Excellent at Like, if Tom Brady can sneak for a yard,
not a great athlete compared to Jalen ERTs. I think
Jalen Hurts would be just fine without the tush push.
So I thought that Philly fans should go the other
way with this. Yeah, we created something, and now you
said we're too good at it, and we won a
super Bowl and you're gonna ban it. Yeah, that's on you.
(50:26):
We'll win a super Bowl without it, and just like
and like take it as like a source of pride. Instead,
they got very defensive and you're trying to take away
our play and you're making this just about you. I'm like,
I swear to you if it was the Bears who
invented it, I'd be like, that's stupid. It's a dull.
In the in the NFC Championship game, a referee had
to get on a loud speaker and be like, if
(50:48):
you jump over the line of scrimmage one more time,
I'm just gonna award them a touchdown.
Speaker 3 (50:53):
That is dumb.
Speaker 1 (50:55):
And then with the Bills did it in the ANFC
Championship game, the spot of the ball. We have four
hundred HD cameras and everyone's like, where's the ball? We
couldn't tell because there's twenty people swarming to it. So
I just I think it's just objectively uninteresting and I
(51:15):
don't like the whole point of sports is that it's unpredictable,
that you don't know what's coming. If every time you
get in that formation, and I know Philly fencer, like, well,
one time we faked out of it. Okay, If ninety
nine percent of the time you get in that formation,
the exact same thing happens, it's not good television. That
(51:37):
should be enough reason for it to be banned. But
you know whatever, Okay, So you know, I just I
was passionate about it because I thought it was a
you're a good arguer, You tell me what we think
about this. What is to stop someone from doing it?
First and ten from the thirty. Just take the guy
(52:01):
in the in the world who has the strongest legs,
make him your backup quarterback, put him under center, second
and seven, third and four, fourth and two, first and ten,
second and eight, third and five, fourth and two, first
(52:25):
and ten, and just rugby their way down the field. Well,
it probably won't happen, but normally slippery slope arguments suck.
But I honestly do think that if you allow something
like this to like really gain steam and everybody starts
working on it, like the next iteration of the tush push,
everyone's gonna be like, oh, that's taking it too far. Well,
(52:47):
then you got to outlaw it. Now.
Speaker 2 (52:48):
Yeah, I think it's such a it's such a beating
in your offensive lineman. I don't think you would do
that unless I think it used. The scarcity of it
is really valuable for even the team that's successful, because
it's just beating the hell out of your offensive line.
I could see that happening in crappy weather. Saquon Barkley
(53:09):
gets hurt and you've got to burn five plays that
I can see happening. But it is. It is a
beat down. It's like the wildcat. The wildcat sounded great,
but if you have a good quarterback, it would piss
him off if you kept snapping to the full back
like it wasn't good for the room. Right, I could
(53:33):
see Drew bledsoell, okay, what's the point?
Speaker 1 (53:36):
Right? They stink. As soon as he heard the aj
Brown quote of being like, yeah, I don't care, it's
just one yard, he was immediately like a typical receiver.
He just wants a fade. He just wants a fade
from the one yard line to get more touchdowns. He
hates that the balls never going to him. But yeah,
I mean, I I think eventually someone will get hurt,
(53:59):
or too many teams will do it, h and this
will be up for a vote again. In a year
or two or three, and it'll it'll get banned. But
you know, we got we got another year of rugby
on zero point five percent of our plays in the NFL. Okay,
So I.
Speaker 2 (54:13):
Want to end with this, So you would and I
would admit this too. I've moved around the country. People
know that generally when I move around the country, the
only sports team that I tend to. It's hard because
I love football so much. When I lived in Tampa,
I was kind of a Bucks fan. I grew up
in the Northwest. I was a Seahawks fan. I live
in Los Angeles. I'm a Ram and Charger fan. I
(54:34):
try not to be a Homer on the air, but
it's it's I know people in the front office. I
have contacts there. Now I moved to Chicago, I've already
got connections with the Bears, right, So I'm talking to
people and so and you grew up here, So I
under I've always understood that Bill Simmons loves the Celtics,
You're gonna love your teams. I get it right, like
like in the audience understands that you're still objective. But
I said this this week on the show on FS one.
(54:56):
I said, I'm gonna take five quarterbacks that we that
we would, We're not gonna I'm not going to take
a Justin Herbert overrated, Jalen Hurts underrated. I'm not going
to take guys on the fringe. I'm going to take
Andrew Luck, Jadeen Daniels, Joe Burrow. Who else did I take?
Speaker 1 (55:14):
C J.
Speaker 2 (55:15):
Stroud? I took somebody else. I took five of them,
And I said, and I didn't take Mahomes. I took
Lamar Jackson. So I said, let's get Mahomes Allen out. Okay,
they're like historically great, like, So I took five guys
that none of us are going to argue they're all great.
How long once they had a competent coach did it
take for you to go, oh shit? There as a
(55:37):
franchise guy?
Speaker 1 (55:38):
So C J.
Speaker 2 (55:39):
Stroud did not throw an interception until week six, pretty
obvious he was different. Lamar Jackson won six of US
verse seven, and by the second game you were wondering
if he was even faster than Michael Vick. He was electric.
Joe Burrow weeks two and three is throwing for three
hundred and fifty yards behind and absolutely atrocious offs of
(56:00):
line with a coach nobody liked Jaden Daniels Week's two,
three and four. He's completing like twenty eight of thirty one.
You're like, okay, this is a cheat code. What is
going on? And Joe and So I went down and
through all of them. So now I bring you to
Caleb Williams. So yeah again, golf with Jeff Fisher Goff
(56:22):
with McVeigh by. Week two, he's throwing for three hundred
and fifty yards. You're like, oh, Jared Goff can play. Yeah,
he's he's beating Mahomes in a shootout on Monday Night football.
You're like, you know, pretty early in his career. You're like, oh, yeah, this,
this dude can play. So first week so my take
is good, not great, is hard to spot, real deal
(56:48):
and sucks jumps off the page. So week one, Caleb
Williams faces Brian Flore is at home perfect weather. Let's
say he struggles. Ryan Flores has been punitive to young
quarterbacks and Caleb Williams is bad. What is your take?
Speaker 1 (57:13):
I won't be handling you well. I'll tell you that
I won't be handling well. He needs to be very
good right away. Hey, here's the thing. Obviously, I watched
every down of the Bears last year and have for
my entire life. He is good. He's good. Now. It
(57:40):
was not easy, it was not always pretty, but I
trust my eye test. Here. If you get sacked sixty
eight times and still have better than a three to
one touchdown the interception ratio, and your play caller got
fired nine games in your season, and then you fire
(58:02):
your coach and you had controversy, and you lost on
a Hail Mary, and you had all of that hype
and that scrutiny, and the guy who was drafted behind
you is having a historic rookie year and goes all
the way to the NFC Championship game, and you get
your ass kicked and you play all seventeen games and
like you're still standing at.
Speaker 2 (58:21):
The end of it.
Speaker 1 (58:23):
You don't suck like like bat you said, like good bad,
it's a little He's not bad, right, He's not bad.
I'm not worried about bad. It's I still think the
guy's ceiling can be MVP of the league. Okay, Like
I still think greatness is very likely an outcome here.
(58:44):
But yeah, Week one, Minnesota, Monday Night foot we too,
bet Don gets his ole team. Yeah, yeah, I mean no,
I will say this. I will say this. It seems
like forty percent of the years in the last like decade,
the Bears have opened with the packers. I know that's
not actually accurate, but it feels that way. That's the
(59:06):
absolute worst. Any Bears fan will tell you Bear's Packers.
It just is like a different thing. All of our
families have some packers people in it, like, and for
me it was extreme. My dad's entire family was from Wisconsin.
Like you just you're in weddings with these people, you
work with these people, your neighbors with these people. Like
(59:26):
my old radio station signal like reaches far into Wisconsin,
like you could hear it in Milwaukee. So like it's
just like Bear's Packers Week one is too stressful, there's
too many grand Like I can handle Bears Vikings week one.
I can handle Bears Lions Week one, Bear's Packers. If
Caleb Williams would come out week one and get out
(59:46):
played by Jordan Love and they would lose and he'd
throw like two picks, that's just like Sky's falling type stuff.
So I think I can handle Bears Vikings on Monday
Night Football Week one. But if he's terrible, I'm not
gonna be handling you. Well I'm not. It's gonna be
(01:00:08):
tough to be neutral. I'll be totally honest with you.
That's gonna be unfortunate. Yeah, but he's great. Oh deep
dish beets on TV for everybody.
Speaker 2 (01:00:15):
No, I saw that first game and I went, oh, god, Flores,
what a nightmare. Flores just eats.
Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
Yeah, it's not a great spot. But but again, like,
but it can go the other way. Put up thirty,
put up thirty. We never mentioned Shane Waldron's name in
Chicago ever again, you know what I mean, Like, wasted
rookie year? Why did you hire Eve? Why didn't you
blow it all up and start fresh with Kate? Like
(01:00:43):
put up thirty week one and all of your sins
are forgiven and we're good. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:00:47):
You know the airthing, Danny, that that wasn't true years ago.
There's so many good young offensive coaches now in the
NFL that it used to be if your first coach
didn't work, you were screwed. But like Gino Darnold Baker
to ahead Brian Flores then he was a pro bowler,
Gobb's first year was not only unremarkable, it was unrecognizable.
(01:01:09):
So the truth is now there are multiple examples. Sam
Darnold's a totally different player. It used to be there
were like four or five offensive guys that were next level,
Like every other staff has the next Ben Johnson or
an offensive coach. So I mean, god, look at I mean,
you go to the AFC alone, it's like, oh, there's
(01:01:29):
Andy Reid, and oh there's Sean Payton, and there's Jim
Harbaugh in this and Chip Kelly in the same division.
You have those four coaches on staff. So I think
we've gotten to a point where if you have a
Mulligan season, it just I mean, nobody remembers Goff's first
season he was oh and seven. I think it just disappears.
Speaker 1 (01:01:50):
Listen. I mean in Jacksonville, Trevor Lawrence showed enough through
multiple failed coaches that they still gave them a quarter
of a billion dollar contract. They hit on Ryan Thomas
last year, they draft Travis Hunter. This year, they hire
Liam Cohen to be their coach, who was a big
part of Baker Mayfield's success in Tampa, being as consistently
great on offense as they've been like he's in your five,
(01:02:14):
Like does Trevor Lawrence enraged me? And way too many
fumbles and rinzone interception then yet no doubt, Like I
think that like selling stock on, Trevor Lawrence has been
totally reasonable, Like his career is not over right, you
know it's his career is not over If if Liam
Cohen could do that with Baker, it's definitely on the
(01:02:36):
board that Trevor Lawrence turns this thing around, yeah and
rips off five, six, seven really good years and changes
the complete narrative his career. But now listen, I think
it's still much more likely than not that Caleb Williams
is great than he is mediocre.
Speaker 2 (01:02:52):
Danny Parkins FS one love him on the volume stops
by about once twice a month. As Alas this was great,
Thanks buddy, Yeah, this was fun.
Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
Thanks going anytime the volume
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Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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