June 24, 2025 • 31 mins
Dan Woike joins The Herd in studio to talk about the Lakers, Cooper Flagg, the NBA Draft, possible trades, and more
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Dan Woiki I wasn't necessarily a free agent, and it
wasn't the trading deadline, but he's moved to the Athletic
h and he will cover the Lakers. Athletic does great work.
Been a subscriber for a long time like many of you,
and congratulations on that, thank you. So it's interesting Celtics
(00:45):
sold for six billion yep. And I think this has
been a topic on our show. Jason and Ryan can
confirm this I've been saying for years is all these
things are worth way more than you think now that
like Saudi Arabia, money's involved if you let them in,
like live golf through there's a lot of money out there,
not just for the teams but the individual.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
It's a great, big world, colin big world.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
So to me, ten million billion dollars, I'm like when
Balmer paid two people freaked out. I'm like, he bought
it cash, there's no banknotes. He's good. So they don't
have a first round pick. There's limitations on the cap.
I'm going to suggest that, like the Dodgers, the way
to win when Walter's got to them first was actually
(01:27):
R and D and scouting. Yeah, is that the first
moves will not be players but infrastructure.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Yeah, it's going to have to be in the shadows,
I think, right. And it's the type of spending you
may not feel right away as a fan, but it's
the things that, like you, you learn to live and
love over time.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
It's like when you buy a new house, like you
don't want to put a bunch of money into the plumbing, right, like,
but but like when you've got great plumbing, like and
you never have to do with it, it makes life
a lot easier. And I think the Lakers have made
strides this front, Colin. I know they have kind of
that mom and pop reputation because it's it's a family business.
I think over the last few years they they've really
(02:09):
modernized in a lot of ways.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
There's but but they're not all the way there.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
And I think they had to make strategic decisions still
based on kind of sort of the how liquid they.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Were as an organization.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Right where it's like, if you're putting money into you know,
player services, which like they're very good with player services.
They treat their stars and their players incredibly, They treat
their families incredibly.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
That's been true for a long time.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
You know, if you're putting money into that, are you
putting money you know, the same amount of money into
things like advanced scouting or pro personnel And if you're
making you've made choices. Now they don't have to make choices,
right or they certainly have to make fewer. I don't
think anybody expects Mark while they're coming in light money
on fire. But if there's value added you can invest
in that. Will you feel that as a Lakers fan
(02:59):
and September when they take the court and training hit,
maybe not, you know, And I think there is a
notion that like right away it's gonna be like, oh
my god, they've got money now there, you know, I
saw the They're dangerous. Yeah, this, this I think is
more like a generational like this is gonna be piece
(03:19):
by piece over the next ten twenty years. Where now
all of a sudden they have the power of the brand,
right they have, they still have you know, they'll still
have the sort of that mom and pop charm. You know,
like the fact that you know, when Luca Doc just
gets traded to the Lakers, like who's there to like
greet him and his family and the people around him
(03:40):
and his team, it's Genie Buss and Rob Linka, like
hands on, that's still gonna, that's still there.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
But Mark Cuban said he would do day to day
when he sold it, and when people pay ten billion,
they have a tendency to do what they want to do.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
I think I think she's the face of the Lakers
out as a non player, I doubt that. And she's
beloved in the commune. She's a wonderful person. But my
take is they traded Luca without Mark Cuban knowing. Yep.
So I when I hear that, I'm a little bit
of a cynic.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
So I wonder Colin like, And I don't know this
right because nobody from the Lakers is saying anything right, Like,
they have not publicly acknowledged this. The closest that anybody's
come to a statement was a magic Johnson tweet right
like on this and like magic doesn't work for the Lakers.
So I think like nobody from the Lakers is yet,
(04:31):
nobody from the Lakers is publicly acknowledged that this this
deal at all. But I think what we can infer
is we we do know that Genie and Cuban are close,
and we also know that if you're a Genie Buss
and it's important to you that you want this role
to be more than ceremonial. I think, is the person
who's selling the valuable asset, you can do everything you
(04:53):
can to write that in as best as possible. And
I would assume that that's what she has tried to do. Now,
now how that plays out in the league, how that
plays out with the border governors and all those different things,
I'm going to guess that what happened in Dallas was enough.
Like it's not like she's not aware of it. Yeah,
So my guess is that she did her best to
protect herself as much as possible. I think she's so
(05:15):
that so that she will be able to do the
thing she Now, look to your point, is she going
to be the sole decision maker?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Of course that of course not well.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
And also, if you look at Mark Walter's history, he
went and found the best young GM in the league
in low, low payroll Tampa. That was like job one.
So I can see Mark Walter saying, who's Sam Presty
beyond Sam Presty? Sure, I mean, you know, Utah, Danny Ainge.
They got new young ownership. Let's bring in Danny Ainge,
(05:44):
who had played at BYU. I think there's a dilemma
here with the Lakers. JJ Reddick clearly did not trust
the big Jackson Hayes. They need it big, and they're
also unwilling. I'm told to move off Austen Reeves.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
I've told you this very specifically on this start of
the team. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Trust My take is now two things are converging. Yeah,
they're not moving Austin and they're not close to big enough.
I'm watching Chet Holmgren to getting better by the week.
I'm looking at Wembya, I'm looking at the bigs shen Goon.
Not that I think it's becoming a bit of a
point guard league. There's a lot of good skilled bigs
(06:21):
in the West. Sure, I think the small ball Warriors
now feel like they've got a hole.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, I think Colin, they need a center. Yes, right,
they absolutely need a center. I think the the interesting
conversations that are happening around the organization is sort of
like how much you willing to invest in.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
The guy if he's maybe not the right guy? Like
you have this need right like for sure questions?
Speaker 3 (06:48):
So you the question is is like with their limited
assets and that's we're gonna take Reeves off the table
here for a second. But you know they have they
have what they traded for Mark Williams is functionally what
they have. Plus they have a whole bunch of expiring money.
So you can trade don't and connect. You can trade
either a first round pick in twenty thirty one or
twenty thirty two.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Not both. You can do pick swaps.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
The swaps aren't that valuable anymore, especially because you have
Luka Doncic. The expectation is you're going to be pretty good.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Yeah, So.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
You know, the question is is like how much of
that are you willing to put into play for a
player that might be the right guy but might not
be the right guy?
Speaker 2 (07:23):
You know.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Nick Claxton is a name that comes up a lot
around the Lakers when you.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Talk to people around the league. You know Nick Claxton.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
If Nick Claxon was the center of the future for
the Brooklyn Nets, he wouldn't be available, right Like, you know,
there's a reason why they're kind of a little bit in,
a little bit out.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
And I think that's.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
The type of those are the types of decisions that
the Lakers have to make going into this offseason. They
know they need a center clearly, right. They also, I
think don't want to invest in the wrong one because
of what they have, so that they're trying to bridge
this gap. It might have to be a short term solution,
you know, with with the with the hunt for the
(08:03):
long term guy still out there, and that's tough. But
I think the important thing, like if we're talking big
picture with Mark Walter and stuff like that, I know
Lebron James is on the graphic right behind me. He's
stand next to Luka Doocic and Lukadacic. That is the
future of the franchise. And so you were making decisions
not just for one year, you know, or two years
(08:24):
that you have with Lebron James, You're trying to make
decisions for the rest of Lukadocich's career, and you want
to be smart and you want to be deliberate about
those and I think that's going to be kind of
That's the push pull of where they're at as an
organization right now as they hunt for the center, is
do they want to do they push more in on
a guy that might not be the right guy, but
who clearly fills a need. But then now you've created
(08:47):
another hole summer.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Here's what's interesting. I've thought about this. The one team
they should do a deal with who has a surplus
of bigs, it's Dallas. I mean, I think what you
want four bigs? Yeah, it's the one team that has
bigs and would probably you know what they need?
Speaker 2 (09:03):
They need another playmaker or.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Because Kyrie is not going to be back, and you
say to yourself, that's where I think you call them
and go listen, Luke and Lebron are playmakers. We don't
need a third. We are desperate for a big. That's
where I think the Austin reeves four blank Lively becomes
a conversation.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
Sure, and I think that would be a conversation except
one nobody I've spoken to her on the NBA thinks
Dallas will make a trade with the Lakers, just unless
they really win that trade, like very on the nose,
have to like that. The fans will not accept another
Nico Harrison rot Plink a deal after the look deal
(09:45):
that makes the Lakers better. Right that that's that that
well has been poisoned. Now we'll see. I think I
think that's a bad way of doing business. If you
can make it, if you can make a good trade,
you make a good trade.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
You should. It doesn't matter with you.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
But there's a I would say healthy skepticism when I
talk to people around the NBA about how a one
to one Lakers Mavericks trade would would actually work.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
But I think.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
I think the thing about you know, Dallas and their
surplus at bigs one, they want to be big too, right,
so that they want to do that. The other part
of this, so Colin, is that when Lucas won, he's
had a really good guard next to him. You know,
the first time he went to the conference finals, he
did it with Jalen Brunson there. Uh, the second time
(10:31):
he did it he did with Kyrie Irving.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
There.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Neither of those players are lockdown defensive stoppers. They're they're
on and off their their they're players that can play
on and off the ball.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
But the West is really deep, really young. Sure new
CBA now.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
I think the other part of it, though, to Colin
you mentioned is like you know, they may they may
be overlapping now with Austin Reeves, Lucadachis and Lebron James,
but like, I don't think the organization is making Luca
Lebron On James decisions, if that makes sense, right, Like,
no one knows how much longer Lebron James is going
to play for and so, and I mean he says
(11:07):
it every time he.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Talks about it's not going to be for much longer.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
And so I think the decisions you're making are You're like,
you're making decisions based on what's best for Lukadacic and
building your team around Lukadacic.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
All right, Finally, we did this yesterday, I said, after
we kind of threw it together at the end at
the end of our premp meeting. It got a lot
of feedback. Apparently I saw it. And so my take
is because of COVID, people dismiss the Lakers champion. My
take is anybody in America that flourished during COVID, Tom
Brady won a Super Bowl, Lebron wont to ring, and
(11:38):
the Dodgers won. All of US doctors, talk show holes, podcasters,
everybody struggled with COVID. Yep, there was you know, government
overreach in some states. I mean there was just things
you couldn't do. If you succeeded in COVID, it doesn't
diminish what you did. It would be one thing. If
the Washington Wizards won the tide les year. Okay, it's
(11:59):
a crazy year. So I ranked the last seven NBA
champs because they're seven different ones, and I think Lebron
and ad were easily the best one in two. Boston's
got a better overall roster, but we still don't trust
Tatum in a big spot. Sure, So anything here and again,
I like the Thunder. They have one score and he
had three bad games in the finals, couldn't hit a three,
(12:20):
and homegrown and JDub disappeared four times. That's not a
legendary team. Defense is great, but that's about thirty percent
of pro basketball. Anything here, bother.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
You bother. No, I wouldn't say I'm bothered. I the
changes that I would make is I would move the
thunder higher because I do sort of believe in like
what they were able to do defensively in the way
they were able to like kind of like impost havoc
on the game. They're balanced their lengths like so good,
(12:50):
so good. So I would probably flip them. I think
you had what Golden State four?
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Oh your nick nick Wright said that he'd flip the
four in the six, and then I.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Would flip five and six.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
I would move Milwaukee down, like if you want to
point to like the weird sort of season, like the
weird season was twenty one. They twenty twenty was a
weird season two, but like having like I was in
the bubble.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
I covered the twenty one playoffs.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
I was at those finals, like it was the first
time any of us were in like a full arena anywhere.
It was like most of those playoffs were played in
half arenas.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
People stuff like that. It was team It was just
a weird you know.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Nis at that point.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
I mean, by the way, these teams are all awesome, right,
that Toronto team was also awesome, like Siakam and like
just figuring it out.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
Kyle Lowry at that time as like a floor general.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
Kawhi was unguardable, absolutely unguardable, and those playoffs hit huge shots.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
That Milwaukee team that was pre injury Yiannis was virtually.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Drew Holliday a younger Drew Holliday was a Middleton was
really good. That's what me kind of like, this is
like one of those things, like anything you say about
any of these teams is going to sound disrespectful at
the bottom of the list because but there in they're
all champions.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
I think that the good argument for the.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Lakers is that team was awesome all year and they
were like and like four and three and like what
Nick said, and he's right, they were awesome. The next year,
Solomon Hill hated and Laker circles on the internet if
he doesn't dive into Lebron James's leg, you know.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Like, be sure to catch live editions of The Herd
Weekdays and Noone Eastern not a em Pacific on Fox
Sports Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app. Hi. This
is Jay.
Speaker 5 (14:30):
I'm the producer of the Paula and Tony Fusco Show.
Usually in these promos they asked you to listen to
the show. I'm here to ask you please don't listen
to the show. The hosts are two absolute morons who
have the dumbest takes on sports imaginable. Don't listen to
the show so it can get Camps.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
What the hell are you doing in our studio? Get him?
Ignore that fool.
Speaker 6 (14:51):
Listen to the Paula and Tony Fusco show on the
iHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
He's still moving.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
By the way, let me throw this act. The KD
trade feels so obvious. I'm looking for a crevice and
it just feels perfect, does.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
It not for for Houston?
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Houston, Like they can't Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:10):
And they didn't give up anything that that that means,
that means a ton of their future, right, Like I
think when you talk to people in league circles, Colin, like,
generally speaking, the thing that people are most afraid of
when it comes to team building is long term money.
And while Dylan Brooks made positive effects on this team
this year, that is a long contract.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Well also a Men Thompson, such a great defender, Dylan
Brooks is less valuable Tarry Easton.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Yeah you know, so, yeah, yeah, I like this trade.
You know, I think obviously the market for Kevin Durant
was really suppressed by Kevin Durant, like you know, kind
of helping dictate where he was going to play. I
think the people I've spoken to in Houston very happy
that they were able to get him.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
It wasn't like a full on chase.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
If it was, they would have put more players into this,
that would have gotten done earlier. But they protected their
assets and I think, like, yeah, they they solved a
hole that they had on their rust. They have a
late game bucket getter now you know, who's one of
the most art and guardable players in league history. And
they're doing it on a team that has a bunch
of young defenders that has offensive hubs.
Speaker 7 (16:19):
I like it.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
But to your point, again, whether it's the Lakers, whether
the Rockets, but it's gonna be the thunder next year.
I mean, there's a ton of good basketball as me
playing in the Western Conference.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
It's gonna be hard.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
Yeah, keep your eye in Dallas when all those dudes
get healthy. That's a big front line that in Cooper
Flag is going to give you nineteen as a rookie.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
They're gonna need somebody to pass the basketball and Reeves
all right, we'll see, we'll see.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Sometimes you got to call the X.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I like it.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
I know it ended poorly, but you got to get
on the phone with the X and say, listen, I apologize,
Let's run it back. I'll pick up the check.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Let's run it back. You haven't met my wife. Don't
like those calls.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Great stuff. James Kiki at the Athletic, John Middle tough
with the news.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
No, no, it.
Speaker 4 (17:04):
Is the headline news speaking of ending poorly the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
They've brought in Aaron Rodgers down a one year deal this.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
Offseason, but it sounds like this might be his last ride.
In a recent TV appearance, Rogers said that he's pretty
sure that this is it while discussing his future in
the NFL.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
What do you think, Colin?
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Yeah, I thought he would retire. I thought once Minnesota
didn't come to fruition, I wouldn't have taken this gig
because I don't think. I think we look at the
Jets as dysfunctional. I look at the Steelers as offensively dysfunctional,
not culturally. So I don't think it's a I mean,
they lost, I don't. This is a team that has
a really good that center from West Virginia Fraser. They've
(17:47):
got an anchor and that's good at Aaron's feet. But
they can't get the old line right even though they've
drafted it. So I just I don't know. I just
don't I don't see it ending well.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:59):
My question with Aaron is if this doesn't go well
and he gets injured and he doesn't play that many
games will remember the great times with the Packers.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
He'll be a first bout Hall of Famer. Can he
add anything? You know?
Speaker 4 (18:09):
Montana went to Kansas City, lill Cherry on top, took
the Chiefs to the AFC champions Game. If he were
to get this team to double digit wins and win
all game, it'd be a nice little oh.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Fantastic if you would forget come. What would happen if
he does that is you look at the Jets and go, well,
I mean, look at far if he went to Minnesota
and flourished. If he goes to the Steelers and makes
the playoffs and wins a game, it is very much
the far journey where he succeeded everywhere except the totally
dysfunctional New York Jets.
Speaker 4 (18:39):
If you could give me eighty percent of that Minnesota
farv season, Oh, such a good team, sign me up.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
That was so entertaining that version. We didn't see that
coming with far.
Speaker 4 (18:50):
Most people thought he was shot and he was incredible
that year. They got to sneak up on some people.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
This Steeler team. I don't think this is gonna be
sneaking up on anybody.
Speaker 4 (18:59):
Another story here that despite being the number one overall pick,
cam Ward hasn't gotten the type of hype and recognition
that most top guys typically get. One NFL analyst made
a lofty comp for the rookie, comparing him to none
other than Patrick Mahomes, saying some of his stylistic standpoint,
cam has a lot of things that look very similar
(19:20):
to the way that Mahomes likes to play the game.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
You know, I've heard this criticism and I laugh at this.
So people have said he was a no star recruit. Okay,
look at the best quarterbacks in the league. Josh Allen
had to beg to get Like was it a junior
college scholarship. Aaron went to junior college. Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson,
his coach said, I'm going to start Mike Glennon. Dak
(19:43):
was a fourth rounder, Brady's a sixth rounder. Perty's a
seventh rounder. Mahomes had a losing record in college. Burl
had to transfer. Show me tell me the quarterback in
the NFL that was a high school American and an
unbelievable dominant college player all the way through number one pick.
(20:03):
Most of the journeys, Big Ben went to Miami of Ohio,
not Ohio State. Drew Brees goes to Purdue. Most of
the great quarterbacks they had that Michael Jordan chip because
they were overlooked at one point in their career.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
To me, it matters the least with quarterback position. I
think at other positions. You know, you like your wide receiver.
Stafford's an outlier. Yeah, you know Julio Jones with wide
receivers number one recruit, number one.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
Esswise, but Stafford was and Peyton Manning was. Those are
total outliers. Baker Mayfield was a walk on. Joe Burrow was.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Laughed at at Ohio State. Cam Ward started at incarnate word.
No one can point that school.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Out on him.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Mat I don't even know where that's at.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Where is that I think it's in Texas.
Speaker 4 (20:42):
I do think though the comp for Patrick Mahomes, obviously,
most people are not going to have his accomplishments, but
his style of play.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Watch eighteen year olds play basketball. They're chucking threes. They
copied Steph Curry.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
Most quarterbacks now run around and make plays that they
play like.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
The days of playing like Peyton Manning or Carson palm
Over are done.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
I think there's I'm trying to think of the last.
I guess CJ. Stroud is a classic pocket thrower. His
comp was golf. But those are like the last two,
like high first round picks that are absolutely pocket guys
because Burrel moves very well.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
And I would say gop CJ can move. He just does.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
He does.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
Cough is truly now, with Cousins being old, the only
guy who cannot move it all.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Even Stafford at his a little bit, a little bit.
He moves up athlete for sure.
Speaker 5 (21:27):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Speaking of quarterbacks, how about arch Man.
Speaker 4 (21:30):
After sitting behind Quinn Yours for the last couple of years,
arch is finally getting a shot at being the full
time starter at the University of Texas. Although he has
a ton of hype behind him, including opening as the
favorite to win the Heisman, Steve Spurrier, the old ball coach,
is questioning if his performance will match the hype they've got.
Speaker 6 (21:49):
Arch Manning already went in the Heisman two. And my
question is, if he was this good, how come they
let Quinn Ower's play all the time last year. If
he was yeah, you know, and he was a seventh
front thing, you don't have toast the coach. Sark. Yeah,
you have come, you play that one instead of this one.
Hopefully we thought he was better in that one. Yeah,
(22:12):
and then why you played one guy and not the other.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Well, I will say this in support of Sark. When
you're Texas and you're recruiting five star quarterbacks Arch Manning
and and and Quin yours, there is some politics with it.
You make promises to guys. In the nil world, Arch
wasn't quite ready, Quinn was ready. Arch is better long term.
(22:38):
But if you didn't give Quinn the starts and the
guarantees privately, he made transfer. So I think the nil world,
I think us. He's got this situation going on with
they have a five star high school kid, average guy
in house, but you got to give the in house
guy some guarantees or he'll transfer, and the one legitimate
quarterback in camp. So I defend Sark and arch Manning
(23:02):
is Yours had more experience. He was capable of playing
if you didn't give him some certainties. With Arch Manning,
he may have just said I'm out of here.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
In the previous year, Washington in the Final four, they
were a couple of yards away from winning that game,
so they had just had a successful seat.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
But yours also won a bunch of games.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
Yet, So there are a lot of variables here. Manning
unique family to be able to handle this. They're playing
a long view. The hype We're gonna find out right away.
Texas Ohio State I no.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Week one.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
I'm pretty sure there's gonna be a lot of eyeballs
on that game. I think we have never had. He's
much more like a basketball prospect than a college player
because Johnny Manziel, Tim Tebow Camp, these guys play, and
then the hype Caleb, and then the hype builds.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
This guy hasn't really played, and his hype, I mean.
Speaker 1 (23:44):
It is very basketball.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
If he lives up to the hype, he he might
be the greatest prospect in the history of the sport.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Just give it.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
How much he can handle mentally and obviously physically well,
I mean.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Just just think if a bad team drafted him. Just
think of the merch I mean, and Reggie Bush sold
merch but I mean not that you would draft him
because of that. But this kid will be like a
Kaitlin Clark. He will fundament mentally change how you're marketed,
how you're viewed, your ticket prices. I mean, arch Manning
could be that kind of player where he is going
to change things beyond winning and losing. He'll change merchandise
(24:18):
gate everything.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
If he's really good, and obviously their team has been
really good, I think University of Texas with the Manning brand,
oh has a chance to do like NFL television numbers,
who's going to miss any of their games?
Speaker 2 (24:30):
Arch Manning is going to be money.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
I think when's the last time college football had a
game one and two to open the season?
Speaker 2 (24:37):
Doesn't get any better?
Speaker 1 (24:38):
I don't even remember.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
It as good as it gets.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
I mean, that is a I mean, I'd argue that
three best players in the country will be Jeremiah Smith,
the receiver Ohio State Caleb Downs, who I think is unbelievable,
and if arch Manning's great, arch Manning the three best
players in the country to play in the game could.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
Be a letdown. To him.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
You know, Higo State, it's gonna be pretty good, So
it's gonna be a lot of pressure.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Arch Manning, you.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Know, he got he got thrown in that Georgia game.
Tough situation. Felt a little overwhelmed coming out of the
bullpen in that situation when they yank yours in that
game for a little bit.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
But uh, I mean, this is as good as it gets.
Speaker 4 (25:17):
Week one, Ohio State, the defending chance against arch Manning.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I would imagine Peyton.
Speaker 4 (25:21):
And Eli and Cooper and the whole the whole game
will be there, sit in front and center.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Wow. John Middlecoff for the news.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
Herd Line News. Be sure to catch live editions of
The Herd weekdays and noon Eastern. Not a em Pacific.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
NBA Draft tomorrow. It is a rich draft. Couple of dookies,
interesting player at Arizona, a couple of Rutgers guys. Rutter
didn't make the tournament. Rutgers did not make the tournament,
and their number two draft pick does not want to
interview with team. So he's kind of kind of trying
to control all things going in which I don't love
Cooper Flag's a dominant one, just does everything well. Brian Scalabrini,
(26:08):
a former Celtic Celtic broadcaster, on what he sees with
Cooper Flag.
Speaker 7 (26:13):
Lebron has scored fifty thousand points, doesn't have a go
to shot. I'm not sure he has a go to shot.
It's just a basketball player that makes things happen. Lebron's
a freak of nature. Defensively, He's a freak of nature. Defensively,
Lebron can run point. He can run point six eight
point guards six eight point guard like he trends like that.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Yeah, I've never been a big believer that you have
to have a go to shot. Kareem did mostly because
in his era he didn't have the ball in his hands.
He wasn't a playmaker, he wasn't a shot creator for others,
and so when they dumped the ball downloaded Kareem, it's
often late in the shot clock and you got to
get a basket. So, you know, I don't you know,
(26:55):
when he was at UCLA, he was you know, younger version,
he'd run the floor. But the truth use is bigs usually,
especially back in the seventies and eighties, overwhelmingly and early nineties,
you sat in the paint and waited to get the
ball dumb to you late. Here's Nick right on the
Cooper Flag Lebron comp.
Speaker 8 (27:15):
He will be only two weeks older, two weeks older
than Lebron was when Lebron entered the league and Lebron
skipped college. He turns nineteen nineteen in December of his
rookie year. So the fact that Cooper Flag does basically
everything pretty well is to me a brilliant place to start.
(27:39):
He'll figure out a couple things.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
He does great, big brand, domestic star, March Madness, Duke.
I think he's good for the NBA. I mean, I
think that's I don't think market size matter, but I
do think brand matters. Yankees, Dodgers, it's not just New
York in LA. It's that they're they're big brands. I
mean the Atlanta Braves and the Cubs. If the Cubs
(28:02):
get into the playoffs. Yeah, part of its Chicago, part
of it's the brand Atlanta. And I just think a
Duke basketball player who we watched a ton. I mean,
he's the most watched college basketball player this year. So
it'll be fun tomorrow. It's it's last year, I wasn't
even looking forward to the draft.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
I said this.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Last year, the w NBA draft had seven or eight
players I had seen play. The NBA draft was very international,
a couple of guys from France. I'm not somebody that's
you know, watching a lot of that, like International league
YouTube stuff, so I didn't have much familiarity with it.
But I think this is when I'll watch This will
be an interesting draft.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
You know, I see Bobby Hurley sometimes at a gym
in Scottsdale, and there's something powerful about that Duke brand.
You know, you just you just see that that color.
I mean, what it did for Zion, what it did
for a lot of the guys over the coach k Era,
it's pretty.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
The Cooper flag this year was fun. It was fun
to watch him play.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
So and I my first sportscasting job. I was lucky
enough to get a job in Las Vegas, and after
a couple of years, the Rebels had Larry Johnson, Stacy Augman,
Greg Anthony Tark two in the towel. So it was
the running Rebels and it really was a stacked team.
Stacy Augman. Yet, like you know, Anderson Hunt didn't become
an NBA guy. But he had a lot of NBA
size and length, and they played those duke teams and
(29:22):
the first year they played him in the final four
in the championship in Denver. I was at that game,
and they took him apart. Georgia Tech had a team
with Kenny Anderson and Dennis Scott. I remember that. And
UNLV was a machine the following year, and Bobby Hurley
was there. The following year, Duke had Grant Hill as
a freshman, remember that, and un LV came in as
(29:46):
a massive favorite and they knocked him off because Grant
Hill was so good. I still think he's the most
talented guy. I think Grant Hill's the best duke he
I've ever seen. Now, Christian Layton was a better college player,
Grant was a better talent. I think Cooper fle has
a chance to be their best player.
Speaker 4 (30:03):
Ever, I think Grant I mean those Sprite commercials when
he got to the NBA, like him and Kobe were
about to take over for Michael and then he just
had injuries.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
It derailed his career. Grant was pretty special.
Speaker 4 (30:13):
If Cooper Flag can be as good as Grant Hill
was before the injuries, it's gonna be.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
I mean, I don't know how the Dallas Mavericks.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
Ended up with the number one overall. Pick some shadiness
going on there, but they should feel pretty lucky.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Yeah, the you know you mentioned Bobby Hurley. I had
Skrzyzewsky on a month ago and I asked him, in
all year years of coaching, was there ever a player?
I mean he was there? How many years? Was he
almost there? Forty years? All year years at Duke? What's
the one player that ended up? You knew he was good?
He was better? And he said, Bobby Hurley, he goes.
I can remember watching in games and turning to an
assistant and he's like he is he you know, the
(30:50):
Hurley family. He's like, he's better than I thought he was.
Bobby Hurley was such a unique and then he went
to Sacramento and there's that if you remember, got an
accident there, really bad accident and really scary. Almost I
almost took his life.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
If I recall walking by him a couple of times.
Speaker 4 (31:05):
You just he doesn't quite the intensity of his brother,
but there is an intensity to that family. You know,
just at any moment, you gotta just be ready.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
Yeah, all right, good stuff today. John and I will
be back tomorrow. We'll have our surprises in the NFC.
We did him in the AFC. Get ready, chiefs fans, Hey,
there's nothing wrong with being a wild card team. You're
still in the dance, right, Get him up.
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Dan Woiki I wasn't necessarily a free agent, and it
wasn't the trading deadline, but he's moved to the Athletic
h and he will cover the Lakers. Athletic does great work.
Been a subscriber for a long time like many of you,
and congratulations on that, thank you. So it's interesting Celtics
(00:45):
sold for six billion yep. And I think this has
been a topic on our show. Jason and Ryan can
confirm this I've been saying for years is all these
things are worth way more than you think now that
like Saudi Arabia, money's involved if you let them in,
like live golf through there's a lot of money out there,
not just for the teams but the individual.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
It's a great, big world, colin big world.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
So to me, ten million billion dollars, I'm like when
Balmer paid two people freaked out. I'm like, he bought
it cash, there's no banknotes. He's good. So they don't
have a first round pick. There's limitations on the cap.
I'm going to suggest that, like the Dodgers, the way
to win when Walter's got to them first was actually
(01:27):
R and D and scouting. Yeah, is that the first
moves will not be players but infrastructure.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Yeah, it's going to have to be in the shadows,
I think, right. And it's the type of spending you
may not feel right away as a fan, but it's
the things that, like you, you learn to live and
love over time.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
It's like when you buy a new house, like you
don't want to put a bunch of money into the plumbing, right, like,
but but like when you've got great plumbing, like and
you never have to do with it, it makes life
a lot easier. And I think the Lakers have made
strides this front, Colin. I know they have kind of
that mom and pop reputation because it's it's a family business.
I think over the last few years they they've really
(02:09):
modernized in a lot of ways.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
There's but but they're not all the way there.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
And I think they had to make strategic decisions still
based on kind of sort of the how liquid they.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Were as an organization.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Right where it's like, if you're putting money into you know,
player services, which like they're very good with player services.
They treat their stars and their players incredibly, They treat
their families incredibly.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
That's been true for a long time.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
You know, if you're putting money into that, are you
putting money you know, the same amount of money into
things like advanced scouting or pro personnel And if you're
making you've made choices. Now they don't have to make choices,
right or they certainly have to make fewer. I don't
think anybody expects Mark while they're coming in light money
on fire. But if there's value added you can invest
in that. Will you feel that as a Lakers fan
(02:59):
and September when they take the court and training hit,
maybe not, you know, And I think there is a
notion that like right away it's gonna be like, oh
my god, they've got money now there, you know, I
saw the They're dangerous. Yeah, this, this I think is
more like a generational like this is gonna be piece
(03:19):
by piece over the next ten twenty years. Where now
all of a sudden they have the power of the brand,
right they have, they still have you know, they'll still
have the sort of that mom and pop charm. You know,
like the fact that you know, when Luca Doc just
gets traded to the Lakers, like who's there to like
greet him and his family and the people around him
(03:40):
and his team, it's Genie Buss and Rob Linka, like
hands on, that's still gonna, that's still there.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
But Mark Cuban said he would do day to day
when he sold it, and when people pay ten billion,
they have a tendency to do what they want to do.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
I think I think she's the face of the Lakers
out as a non player, I doubt that. And she's
beloved in the commune. She's a wonderful person. But my
take is they traded Luca without Mark Cuban knowing. Yep.
So I when I hear that, I'm a little bit
of a cynic.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
So I wonder Colin like, And I don't know this
right because nobody from the Lakers is saying anything right, Like,
they have not publicly acknowledged this. The closest that anybody's
come to a statement was a magic Johnson tweet right
like on this and like magic doesn't work for the Lakers.
So I think like nobody from the Lakers is yet,
(04:31):
nobody from the Lakers is publicly acknowledged that this this
deal at all. But I think what we can infer
is we we do know that Genie and Cuban are close,
and we also know that if you're a Genie Buss
and it's important to you that you want this role
to be more than ceremonial. I think, is the person
who's selling the valuable asset, you can do everything you
(04:53):
can to write that in as best as possible. And
I would assume that that's what she has tried to do. Now,
now how that plays out in the league, how that
plays out with the border governors and all those different things,
I'm going to guess that what happened in Dallas was enough.
Like it's not like she's not aware of it. Yeah,
So my guess is that she did her best to
protect herself as much as possible. I think she's so
(05:15):
that so that she will be able to do the
thing she Now, look to your point, is she going
to be the sole decision maker?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Of course that of course not well.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
And also, if you look at Mark Walter's history, he
went and found the best young GM in the league
in low, low payroll Tampa. That was like job one.
So I can see Mark Walter saying, who's Sam Presty
beyond Sam Presty? Sure, I mean, you know, Utah, Danny Ainge.
They got new young ownership. Let's bring in Danny Ainge,
(05:44):
who had played at BYU. I think there's a dilemma
here with the Lakers. JJ Reddick clearly did not trust
the big Jackson Hayes. They need it big, and they're
also unwilling. I'm told to move off Austen Reeves.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
I've told you this very specifically on this start of
the team. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Trust My take is now two things are converging. Yeah,
they're not moving Austin and they're not close to big enough.
I'm watching Chet Holmgren to getting better by the week.
I'm looking at Wembya, I'm looking at the bigs shen Goon.
Not that I think it's becoming a bit of a
point guard league. There's a lot of good skilled bigs
(06:21):
in the West. Sure, I think the small ball Warriors
now feel like they've got a hole.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, I think Colin, they need a center. Yes, right,
they absolutely need a center. I think the the interesting
conversations that are happening around the organization is sort of
like how much you willing to invest in.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
The guy if he's maybe not the right guy? Like
you have this need right like for sure questions?
Speaker 3 (06:48):
So you the question is is like with their limited
assets and that's we're gonna take Reeves off the table
here for a second. But you know they have they
have what they traded for Mark Williams is functionally what
they have. Plus they have a whole bunch of expiring money.
So you can trade don't and connect. You can trade
either a first round pick in twenty thirty one or
twenty thirty two.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Not both. You can do pick swaps.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
The swaps aren't that valuable anymore, especially because you have
Luka Doncic. The expectation is you're going to be pretty good.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Yeah, So.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
You know, the question is is like how much of
that are you willing to put into play for a
player that might be the right guy but might not
be the right guy?
Speaker 2 (07:23):
You know.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Nick Claxton is a name that comes up a lot
around the Lakers when you.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Talk to people around the league. You know Nick Claxton.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
If Nick Claxon was the center of the future for
the Brooklyn Nets, he wouldn't be available, right Like, you know,
there's a reason why they're kind of a little bit in,
a little bit out.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
And I think that's.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
The type of those are the types of decisions that
the Lakers have to make going into this offseason. They
know they need a center clearly, right. They also, I
think don't want to invest in the wrong one because
of what they have, so that they're trying to bridge
this gap. It might have to be a short term solution,
you know, with with the with the hunt for the
(08:03):
long term guy still out there, and that's tough. But
I think the important thing, like if we're talking big
picture with Mark Walter and stuff like that, I know
Lebron James is on the graphic right behind me. He's
stand next to Luka Doocic and Lukadacic. That is the
future of the franchise. And so you were making decisions
not just for one year, you know, or two years
(08:24):
that you have with Lebron James, You're trying to make
decisions for the rest of Lukadocich's career, and you want
to be smart and you want to be deliberate about
those and I think that's going to be kind of
That's the push pull of where they're at as an
organization right now as they hunt for the center, is
do they want to do they push more in on
a guy that might not be the right guy, but
who clearly fills a need. But then now you've created
(08:47):
another hole summer.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Here's what's interesting. I've thought about this. The one team
they should do a deal with who has a surplus
of bigs, it's Dallas. I mean, I think what you
want four bigs? Yeah, it's the one team that has
bigs and would probably you know what they need?
Speaker 2 (09:03):
They need another playmaker or.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Because Kyrie is not going to be back, and you
say to yourself, that's where I think you call them
and go listen, Luke and Lebron are playmakers. We don't
need a third. We are desperate for a big. That's
where I think the Austin reeves four blank Lively becomes
a conversation.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
Sure, and I think that would be a conversation except
one nobody I've spoken to her on the NBA thinks
Dallas will make a trade with the Lakers, just unless
they really win that trade, like very on the nose,
have to like that. The fans will not accept another
Nico Harrison rot Plink a deal after the look deal
(09:45):
that makes the Lakers better. Right that that's that that
well has been poisoned. Now we'll see. I think I
think that's a bad way of doing business. If you
can make it, if you can make a good trade,
you make a good trade.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
You should. It doesn't matter with you.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
But there's a I would say healthy skepticism when I
talk to people around the NBA about how a one
to one Lakers Mavericks trade would would actually work.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
But I think.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
I think the thing about you know, Dallas and their
surplus at bigs one, they want to be big too, right,
so that they want to do that. The other part
of this, so Colin, is that when Lucas won, he's
had a really good guard next to him. You know,
the first time he went to the conference finals, he
did it with Jalen Brunson there. Uh, the second time
(10:31):
he did it he did with Kyrie Irving.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
There.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Neither of those players are lockdown defensive stoppers. They're they're
on and off their their they're players that can play
on and off the ball.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
But the West is really deep, really young. Sure new
CBA now.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
I think the other part of it, though, to Colin
you mentioned is like you know, they may they may
be overlapping now with Austin Reeves, Lucadachis and Lebron James,
but like, I don't think the organization is making Luca
Lebron On James decisions, if that makes sense, right, Like,
no one knows how much longer Lebron James is going
to play for and so, and I mean he says
(11:07):
it every time he.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Talks about it's not going to be for much longer.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
And so I think the decisions you're making are You're like,
you're making decisions based on what's best for Lukadacic and
building your team around Lukadacic.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
All right, Finally, we did this yesterday, I said, after
we kind of threw it together at the end at
the end of our premp meeting. It got a lot
of feedback. Apparently I saw it. And so my take
is because of COVID, people dismiss the Lakers champion. My
take is anybody in America that flourished during COVID, Tom
Brady won a Super Bowl, Lebron wont to ring, and
(11:38):
the Dodgers won. All of US doctors, talk show holes, podcasters,
everybody struggled with COVID. Yep, there was you know, government
overreach in some states. I mean there was just things
you couldn't do. If you succeeded in COVID, it doesn't
diminish what you did. It would be one thing. If
the Washington Wizards won the tide les year. Okay, it's
(11:59):
a crazy year. So I ranked the last seven NBA
champs because they're seven different ones, and I think Lebron
and ad were easily the best one in two. Boston's
got a better overall roster, but we still don't trust
Tatum in a big spot. Sure, So anything here and again,
I like the Thunder. They have one score and he
had three bad games in the finals, couldn't hit a three,
(12:20):
and homegrown and JDub disappeared four times. That's not a
legendary team. Defense is great, but that's about thirty percent
of pro basketball. Anything here, bother.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
You bother. No, I wouldn't say I'm bothered. I the
changes that I would make is I would move the
thunder higher because I do sort of believe in like
what they were able to do defensively in the way
they were able to like kind of like impost havoc
on the game. They're balanced their lengths like so good,
(12:50):
so good. So I would probably flip them. I think
you had what Golden State four?
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Oh your nick nick Wright said that he'd flip the
four in the six, and then I.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Would flip five and six.
Speaker 3 (13:00):
I would move Milwaukee down, like if you want to
point to like the weird sort of season, like the
weird season was twenty one. They twenty twenty was a
weird season two, but like having like I was in
the bubble.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
I covered the twenty one playoffs.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
I was at those finals, like it was the first
time any of us were in like a full arena anywhere.
It was like most of those playoffs were played in
half arenas.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
People stuff like that. It was team It was just
a weird you know.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Nis at that point.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
I mean, by the way, these teams are all awesome, right,
that Toronto team was also awesome, like Siakam and like
just figuring it out.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
Kyle Lowry at that time as like a floor general.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
Kawhi was unguardable, absolutely unguardable, and those playoffs hit huge shots.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
That Milwaukee team that was pre injury Yiannis was virtually.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Drew Holliday a younger Drew Holliday was a Middleton was
really good. That's what me kind of like, this is
like one of those things, like anything you say about
any of these teams is going to sound disrespectful at
the bottom of the list because but there in they're
all champions.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
I think that the good argument for the.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Lakers is that team was awesome all year and they
were like and like four and three and like what
Nick said, and he's right, they were awesome. The next year,
Solomon Hill hated and Laker circles on the internet if
he doesn't dive into Lebron James's leg, you know.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Like, be sure to catch live editions of The Herd
Weekdays and Noone Eastern not a em Pacific on Fox
Sports Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app. Hi. This
is Jay.
Speaker 5 (14:30):
I'm the producer of the Paula and Tony Fusco Show.
Usually in these promos they asked you to listen to
the show. I'm here to ask you please don't listen
to the show. The hosts are two absolute morons who
have the dumbest takes on sports imaginable. Don't listen to
the show so it can get Camps.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
What the hell are you doing in our studio? Get him?
Ignore that fool.
Speaker 6 (14:51):
Listen to the Paula and Tony Fusco show on the
iHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
He's still moving.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
By the way, let me throw this act. The KD
trade feels so obvious. I'm looking for a crevice and
it just feels perfect, does.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
It not for for Houston?
Speaker 1 (15:08):
Houston, Like they can't Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:10):
And they didn't give up anything that that that means,
that means a ton of their future, right, Like I
think when you talk to people in league circles, Colin, like,
generally speaking, the thing that people are most afraid of
when it comes to team building is long term money.
And while Dylan Brooks made positive effects on this team
this year, that is a long contract.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Well also a Men Thompson, such a great defender, Dylan
Brooks is less valuable Tarry Easton.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Yeah you know, so, yeah, yeah, I like this trade.
You know, I think obviously the market for Kevin Durant
was really suppressed by Kevin Durant, like you know, kind
of helping dictate where he was going to play. I
think the people I've spoken to in Houston very happy
that they were able to get him.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
It wasn't like a full on chase.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
If it was, they would have put more players into this,
that would have gotten done earlier. But they protected their
assets and I think, like, yeah, they they solved a
hole that they had on their rust. They have a
late game bucket getter now you know, who's one of
the most art and guardable players in league history. And
they're doing it on a team that has a bunch
of young defenders that has offensive hubs.
Speaker 7 (16:19):
I like it.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
But to your point, again, whether it's the Lakers, whether
the Rockets, but it's gonna be the thunder next year.
I mean, there's a ton of good basketball as me
playing in the Western Conference.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
It's gonna be hard.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
Yeah, keep your eye in Dallas when all those dudes
get healthy. That's a big front line that in Cooper
Flag is going to give you nineteen as a rookie.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
They're gonna need somebody to pass the basketball and Reeves
all right, we'll see, we'll see.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Sometimes you got to call the X.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I like it.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
I know it ended poorly, but you got to get
on the phone with the X and say, listen, I apologize,
Let's run it back. I'll pick up the check.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Let's run it back. You haven't met my wife. Don't
like those calls.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Great stuff. James Kiki at the Athletic, John Middle tough
with the news.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
No, no, it.
Speaker 4 (17:04):
Is the headline news speaking of ending poorly the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
They've brought in Aaron Rodgers down a one year deal this.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
Offseason, but it sounds like this might be his last ride.
In a recent TV appearance, Rogers said that he's pretty
sure that this is it while discussing his future in
the NFL.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
What do you think, Colin?
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Yeah, I thought he would retire. I thought once Minnesota
didn't come to fruition, I wouldn't have taken this gig
because I don't think. I think we look at the
Jets as dysfunctional. I look at the Steelers as offensively dysfunctional,
not culturally. So I don't think it's a I mean,
they lost, I don't. This is a team that has
a really good that center from West Virginia Fraser. They've
(17:47):
got an anchor and that's good at Aaron's feet. But
they can't get the old line right even though they've
drafted it. So I just I don't know. I just
don't I don't see it ending well.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:59):
My question with Aaron is if this doesn't go well
and he gets injured and he doesn't play that many
games will remember the great times with the Packers.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
He'll be a first bout Hall of Famer. Can he
add anything? You know?
Speaker 4 (18:09):
Montana went to Kansas City, lill Cherry on top, took
the Chiefs to the AFC champions Game. If he were
to get this team to double digit wins and win
all game, it'd be a nice little oh.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Fantastic if you would forget come. What would happen if
he does that is you look at the Jets and go, well,
I mean, look at far if he went to Minnesota
and flourished. If he goes to the Steelers and makes
the playoffs and wins a game, it is very much
the far journey where he succeeded everywhere except the totally
dysfunctional New York Jets.
Speaker 4 (18:39):
If you could give me eighty percent of that Minnesota
farv season, Oh, such a good team, sign me up.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
That was so entertaining that version. We didn't see that
coming with far.
Speaker 4 (18:50):
Most people thought he was shot and he was incredible
that year. They got to sneak up on some people.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
This Steeler team. I don't think this is gonna be
sneaking up on anybody.
Speaker 4 (18:59):
Another story here that despite being the number one overall pick,
cam Ward hasn't gotten the type of hype and recognition
that most top guys typically get. One NFL analyst made
a lofty comp for the rookie, comparing him to none
other than Patrick Mahomes, saying some of his stylistic standpoint,
cam has a lot of things that look very similar
(19:20):
to the way that Mahomes likes to play the game.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
You know, I've heard this criticism and I laugh at this.
So people have said he was a no star recruit. Okay,
look at the best quarterbacks in the league. Josh Allen
had to beg to get Like was it a junior
college scholarship. Aaron went to junior college. Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson,
his coach said, I'm going to start Mike Glennon. Dak
(19:43):
was a fourth rounder, Brady's a sixth rounder. Perty's a
seventh rounder. Mahomes had a losing record in college. Burl
had to transfer. Show me tell me the quarterback in
the NFL that was a high school American and an
unbelievable dominant college player all the way through number one pick.
(20:03):
Most of the journeys, Big Ben went to Miami of Ohio,
not Ohio State. Drew Brees goes to Purdue. Most of
the great quarterbacks they had that Michael Jordan chip because
they were overlooked at one point in their career.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
To me, it matters the least with quarterback position. I
think at other positions. You know, you like your wide receiver.
Stafford's an outlier. Yeah, you know Julio Jones with wide
receivers number one recruit, number one.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
Esswise, but Stafford was and Peyton Manning was. Those are
total outliers. Baker Mayfield was a walk on. Joe Burrow was.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Laughed at at Ohio State. Cam Ward started at incarnate word.
No one can point that school.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Out on him.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Mat I don't even know where that's at.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Where is that I think it's in Texas.
Speaker 4 (20:42):
I do think though the comp for Patrick Mahomes, obviously,
most people are not going to have his accomplishments, but
his style of play.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
Watch eighteen year olds play basketball. They're chucking threes. They
copied Steph Curry.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
Most quarterbacks now run around and make plays that they
play like.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
The days of playing like Peyton Manning or Carson palm
Over are done.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
I think there's I'm trying to think of the last.
I guess CJ. Stroud is a classic pocket thrower. His
comp was golf. But those are like the last two,
like high first round picks that are absolutely pocket guys
because Burrel moves very well.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
And I would say gop CJ can move. He just does.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
He does.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
Cough is truly now, with Cousins being old, the only
guy who cannot move it all.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Even Stafford at his a little bit, a little bit.
He moves up athlete for sure.
Speaker 5 (21:27):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Speaking of quarterbacks, how about arch Man.
Speaker 4 (21:30):
After sitting behind Quinn Yours for the last couple of years,
arch is finally getting a shot at being the full
time starter at the University of Texas. Although he has
a ton of hype behind him, including opening as the
favorite to win the Heisman, Steve Spurrier, the old ball coach,
is questioning if his performance will match the hype they've got.
Speaker 6 (21:49):
Arch Manning already went in the Heisman two. And my
question is, if he was this good, how come they
let Quinn Ower's play all the time last year. If
he was yeah, you know, and he was a seventh
front thing, you don't have toast the coach. Sark. Yeah,
you have come, you play that one instead of this one.
Hopefully we thought he was better in that one. Yeah,
(22:12):
and then why you played one guy and not the other.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Well, I will say this in support of Sark. When
you're Texas and you're recruiting five star quarterbacks Arch Manning
and and and Quin yours, there is some politics with it.
You make promises to guys. In the nil world, Arch
wasn't quite ready, Quinn was ready. Arch is better long term.
(22:38):
But if you didn't give Quinn the starts and the
guarantees privately, he made transfer. So I think the nil world,
I think us. He's got this situation going on with
they have a five star high school kid, average guy
in house, but you got to give the in house
guy some guarantees or he'll transfer, and the one legitimate
quarterback in camp. So I defend Sark and arch Manning
(23:02):
is Yours had more experience. He was capable of playing
if you didn't give him some certainties. With Arch Manning,
he may have just said I'm out of here.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
In the previous year, Washington in the Final four, they
were a couple of yards away from winning that game,
so they had just had a successful seat.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
But yours also won a bunch of games.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
Yet, So there are a lot of variables here. Manning
unique family to be able to handle this. They're playing
a long view. The hype We're gonna find out right away.
Texas Ohio State I no.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Week one.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
I'm pretty sure there's gonna be a lot of eyeballs
on that game. I think we have never had. He's
much more like a basketball prospect than a college player
because Johnny Manziel, Tim Tebow Camp, these guys play, and
then the hype Caleb, and then the hype builds.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
This guy hasn't really played, and his hype, I mean.
Speaker 1 (23:44):
It is very basketball.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
If he lives up to the hype, he he might
be the greatest prospect in the history of the sport.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Just give it.
Speaker 4 (23:52):
How much he can handle mentally and obviously physically well,
I mean.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Just just think if a bad team drafted him. Just
think of the merch I mean, and Reggie Bush sold
merch but I mean not that you would draft him
because of that. But this kid will be like a
Kaitlin Clark. He will fundament mentally change how you're marketed,
how you're viewed, your ticket prices. I mean, arch Manning
could be that kind of player where he is going
to change things beyond winning and losing. He'll change merchandise
(24:18):
gate everything.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
If he's really good, and obviously their team has been
really good, I think University of Texas with the Manning brand,
oh has a chance to do like NFL television numbers,
who's going to miss any of their games?
Speaker 2 (24:30):
Arch Manning is going to be money.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
I think when's the last time college football had a
game one and two to open the season?
Speaker 2 (24:37):
Doesn't get any better?
Speaker 1 (24:38):
I don't even remember.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
It as good as it gets.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
I mean, that is a I mean, I'd argue that
three best players in the country will be Jeremiah Smith,
the receiver Ohio State Caleb Downs, who I think is unbelievable,
and if arch Manning's great, arch Manning the three best
players in the country to play in the game could.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
Be a letdown. To him.
Speaker 4 (25:00):
You know, Higo State, it's gonna be pretty good, So
it's gonna be a lot of pressure.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Arch Manning, you.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Know, he got he got thrown in that Georgia game.
Tough situation. Felt a little overwhelmed coming out of the
bullpen in that situation when they yank yours in that
game for a little bit.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
But uh, I mean, this is as good as it gets.
Speaker 4 (25:17):
Week one, Ohio State, the defending chance against arch Manning.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I would imagine Peyton.
Speaker 4 (25:21):
And Eli and Cooper and the whole the whole game
will be there, sit in front and center.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Wow. John Middlecoff for the news.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
Herd Line News. Be sure to catch live editions of
The Herd weekdays and noon Eastern. Not a em Pacific.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
NBA Draft tomorrow. It is a rich draft. Couple of dookies,
interesting player at Arizona, a couple of Rutgers guys. Rutter
didn't make the tournament. Rutgers did not make the tournament,
and their number two draft pick does not want to
interview with team. So he's kind of kind of trying
to control all things going in which I don't love
Cooper Flag's a dominant one, just does everything well. Brian Scalabrini,
(26:08):
a former Celtic Celtic broadcaster, on what he sees with
Cooper Flag.
Speaker 7 (26:13):
Lebron has scored fifty thousand points, doesn't have a go
to shot. I'm not sure he has a go to shot.
It's just a basketball player that makes things happen. Lebron's
a freak of nature. Defensively, He's a freak of nature. Defensively,
Lebron can run point. He can run point six eight
point guards six eight point guard like he trends like that.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Yeah, I've never been a big believer that you have
to have a go to shot. Kareem did mostly because
in his era he didn't have the ball in his hands.
He wasn't a playmaker, he wasn't a shot creator for others,
and so when they dumped the ball downloaded Kareem, it's
often late in the shot clock and you got to
get a basket. So, you know, I don't you know,
(26:55):
when he was at UCLA, he was you know, younger version,
he'd run the floor. But the truth use is bigs usually,
especially back in the seventies and eighties, overwhelmingly and early nineties,
you sat in the paint and waited to get the
ball dumb to you late. Here's Nick right on the
Cooper Flag Lebron comp.
Speaker 8 (27:15):
He will be only two weeks older, two weeks older
than Lebron was when Lebron entered the league and Lebron
skipped college. He turns nineteen nineteen in December of his
rookie year. So the fact that Cooper Flag does basically
everything pretty well is to me a brilliant place to start.
(27:39):
He'll figure out a couple things.
Speaker 1 (27:41):
He does great, big brand, domestic star, March Madness, Duke.
I think he's good for the NBA. I mean, I
think that's I don't think market size matter, but I
do think brand matters. Yankees, Dodgers, it's not just New
York in LA. It's that they're they're big brands. I
mean the Atlanta Braves and the Cubs. If the Cubs
(28:02):
get into the playoffs. Yeah, part of its Chicago, part
of it's the brand Atlanta. And I just think a
Duke basketball player who we watched a ton. I mean,
he's the most watched college basketball player this year. So
it'll be fun tomorrow. It's it's last year, I wasn't
even looking forward to the draft.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
I said this.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Last year, the w NBA draft had seven or eight
players I had seen play. The NBA draft was very international,
a couple of guys from France. I'm not somebody that's
you know, watching a lot of that, like International league
YouTube stuff, so I didn't have much familiarity with it.
But I think this is when I'll watch This will
be an interesting draft.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
You know, I see Bobby Hurley sometimes at a gym
in Scottsdale, and there's something powerful about that Duke brand.
You know, you just you just see that that color.
I mean, what it did for Zion, what it did
for a lot of the guys over the coach k Era,
it's pretty.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
The Cooper flag this year was fun. It was fun
to watch him play.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
So and I my first sportscasting job. I was lucky
enough to get a job in Las Vegas, and after
a couple of years, the Rebels had Larry Johnson, Stacy Augman,
Greg Anthony Tark two in the towel. So it was
the running Rebels and it really was a stacked team.
Stacy Augman. Yet, like you know, Anderson Hunt didn't become
an NBA guy. But he had a lot of NBA
size and length, and they played those duke teams and
(29:22):
the first year they played him in the final four
in the championship in Denver. I was at that game,
and they took him apart. Georgia Tech had a team
with Kenny Anderson and Dennis Scott. I remember that. And
UNLV was a machine the following year, and Bobby Hurley
was there. The following year, Duke had Grant Hill as
a freshman, remember that, and un LV came in as
(29:46):
a massive favorite and they knocked him off because Grant
Hill was so good. I still think he's the most
talented guy. I think Grant Hill's the best duke he
I've ever seen. Now, Christian Layton was a better college player,
Grant was a better talent. I think Cooper fle has
a chance to be their best player.
Speaker 4 (30:03):
Ever, I think Grant I mean those Sprite commercials when
he got to the NBA, like him and Kobe were
about to take over for Michael and then he just
had injuries.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
It derailed his career. Grant was pretty special.
Speaker 4 (30:13):
If Cooper Flag can be as good as Grant Hill
was before the injuries, it's gonna be.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
I mean, I don't know how the Dallas Mavericks.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
Ended up with the number one overall. Pick some shadiness
going on there, but they should feel pretty lucky.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Yeah, the you know you mentioned Bobby Hurley. I had
Skrzyzewsky on a month ago and I asked him, in
all year years of coaching, was there ever a player?
I mean he was there? How many years? Was he
almost there? Forty years? All year years at Duke? What's
the one player that ended up? You knew he was good?
He was better? And he said, Bobby Hurley, he goes.
I can remember watching in games and turning to an
assistant and he's like he is he you know, the
(30:50):
Hurley family. He's like, he's better than I thought he was.
Bobby Hurley was such a unique and then he went
to Sacramento and there's that if you remember, got an
accident there, really bad accident and really scary. Almost I
almost took his life.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
If I recall walking by him a couple of times.
Speaker 4 (31:05):
You just he doesn't quite the intensity of his brother,
but there is an intensity to that family. You know,
just at any moment, you gotta just be ready.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
Yeah, all right, good stuff today. John and I will
be back tomorrow. We'll have our surprises in the NFC.
We did him in the AFC. Get ready, chiefs fans, Hey,
there's nothing wrong with being a wild card team. You're
still in the dance, right, Get him up.
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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