June 28, 2024 • 42 mins
Gottlieb and Beyer are in for Dan as they discuss the Lakers drafting Bronny James on the second day of the NBA Draft. Dan and Doug welcome longtime college hoops analyst and NBA Draft analyst Fran Frascilla onto the show to get his thoughts on the NBA Draft. Plus, Doug, Dan and the crew resolve two important sports debates.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
What up? Good morning? TI? Youa Stan Patrick Show Fox
Sports Radio. I'm Doug Gottlieb, my guy Dan Byer alongside,
so too is Jason Stewart. Good morning, Doug morning. It's
this is weird. You're where I grew up, I'm where
you grew up. That's that's what's happened with our lives, right,
(00:27):
not not exactly where you grew up, but in the
the state of of where you matriculated through school. And
I'm actually in the state where I was born, but
not where I'm matriculated through high school, middle school, whatever.
So it's it's a it's a weird, weird switch being
in Wisconsin, you being in California. But still nonetheless, uh,
(00:48):
here we are and we're I don't know, we've There's
a lot of conclusions you can make about the NBA draft.
I think the two day draft. Uh, it's pretty obvious
that somebody is like, hey, what if we did a
two day draft and a bunch of people said can
we make more money? And they're like, yes we can,
(01:09):
will it be good? I don't know if anybody actually
flushed that part out right, Like, that's how that's how
brainstorming works, sort of deal. You throw things up on
the board, you discuss it. You have to be willing
to be told that your idea, while productive, isn't going
to be implemented. I just there was that was not great.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
You know, And let's and let's be honest too, Doug.
They were given a gift with Brownie James. Yes, that's
an absolute gift to have.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Other otherwise otherwise And look, you and I are hoopheads, right,
Like you love golf, don't get me wrong, and of
course you have your Sunday show and your fantasy football
podcast whatever, but you let you love college hoop as
I obviously do. Now I'm a college head coach, right,
But I mean that was with If you take Ronnie
(02:00):
James out of the second round, it becomes solely for
those of us who are absolute diehards, and we wonder, right,
I mean, given an absolute gift and even with that,
that was a tough watch.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Yeah, especially too because Philipowski and Kolik ended up going
in the first two of the first three picks of
the second round, so of names that we would be
familiar with with college basketball, not that there weren't other
college players, but those were the two biggest names that
I felt were still available at that point. They were
off the board within three picks of the second round, starting,
by the way, for those of us on the West Coast,
(02:35):
one o'clock in the afternoon.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Again, like, what part of this was well planned? I
just again, I understand. I deal with people all the
time who have asked us in the TV and radio
industry like why do games start so late? And generally
my argument is always, look, you may say your kid
can't stay up late and watch, but there are programming
(02:58):
people that they spend their entire professional lives figuring out
the math equation too. What is the appropriate tip time
so that when the game concludes, because that's when you
have peak viewing audience, you have the most eyes from
around the country watching this one. I got to know
the math on. I don't really understand what are you
trying to get us to not watch? I understand that
(03:21):
it's the first time you've done it, but who in
their right mind thought that was a good idea? I can't.
I can't imagine a lot of people in the West coast,
where on the West coast, where there's not a lot
of buzz about college hoops, and the only buzz was
about Ronnie James, who did grow up, did play college
basketball and now is a product of the member of
(03:41):
the Los Angeles Lakers. That's the only guy. And it
happened at what three in the afternoon. I just that
one's a tough one for me. Doesn't add up a lot.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
And there was zero buzz because everything was also moved
to the studio, so it was very they weren't at
the Barclay Center like they were the n IP four. Yeah,
it was just odd and I just don't know how
you can continue that momentum, at least in the NFL.
People are hanging out around Detroit, you know, on the
Friday and Saturday and doing NFL sort of things and
(04:12):
wearing their team gear. But this was just, yeah, this
was just odd.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
Well, I mean, look, I am in green Bay, Wisconsin.
Doug Gottlieb Dan Bayer in for Dan and Danetts here
on Dan Patrick cho Fox Sports Radio and for people
who don't know, the NFL Draft next year comes to
Green Bay, and you know the planning in the city.
The plan is there'll be two hundred and fifty thousand
people come into the city and it's a show. There's
(04:38):
concerts planned, there's already a lot of venues down in
Title Town, you know, obviously right there next to lambeau
and I can't imagine the buzz that there's gonna have.
Obviously there'll be the potential there in the spring for weather,
but there's the at Room, which I just got a
chance to see two nights ago, inside of lambeau Field,
(05:00):
where you're already covered. I'm sure they're making all kinds
of contingency plans, but trying to mimic the NFL is
such a mistake. You're just not the NFL. And I
feel like that's what the NBA did where, you know,
so many times the WNBA has been rightfully accused of
why are you trying to compete or compare yourself to
(05:22):
the NBA. You're it's a completely different calculation. The same
would be true for the NBA last night. I think
it's a pretty completely different calculation. But let's get to
the topic to Jore, which just so happens to be
the topic of the day. Bronnie James was drafted by
the Lakers, and I thought, and look, I am not
(05:42):
generally critical of other broadcasters. Having been a broadcaster, I
can tell you that there's a lot of things that
go on that you may not and we can let
you kind of inside the beltway, especially now crossing over
into coaching, I can I can not selling out any friends,
but I can tell you the reality of how things
go and why they go. And Dan, as you and
I have talked about before, you know, a lot of
(06:04):
people are critical, for example of ESPN ABC's halftime show
during the during the NBA Finals, like, well, you just
have some one minute thing like that's because those segments
are sold like they network breaks are different. You don't
have the benefit of cable where Barkley and the inside
of the NBA crew can can vamp for you know,
(06:24):
ten minutes uninterrupted. You don't have that. So there are
some things business wise that people just don't understand. We
can get to the the idea of nepotism, We get
to all this stuff. I thought of ESPN was embarrassing
with the defending the pick. I've never heard anything like this.
(06:45):
The whole thing is a complete debacle. And Bob Myers,
who I like, like, dude, you're sitting there acting like
you're breaking news saying a Rich Paul is calling other
teams telling him, not telling him not to draft Brownie.
If they do, he's going to Australia. Like like, you
have to be able to process that. People are telling
(07:05):
you things that aren't accurate, right, you can't you have
to process that. It was the whole Rich Paul thing
was such a clown show. And we'll get to whether
or not you can he why he would say, we're
not doing a two way, but the multiple teams interested,
they weren't. You worked out for two teams. It was
some sort of leverage play to get the Lakers to
(07:26):
make sure they hired JJ Reddick and they drafted Ronnie James.
And look, you're allowed to draft Ronnie James. You're allowed
to have nepotism. Like again, like we can talk about it,
but just carrying on a charade like he was gonna
go to Australia or somebody else was interested. When the
whole thing, the the part that I would say is
(07:48):
embarrassing for the Lakers is why'd you have to draft him?
No one was gonna draft Ronnie James. Everybody knew who's
going to LA. You can still sign him as an
undrafted free agent. And if the idea is, hey, we
don't want to embarrassing, I'm like, look, the market has spoken.
If you thought the next couple teams was five more picks,
you thought in the next five picks he was going
(08:09):
to get selected, Like, that's fine, but they weren't going
to take him. Everyone knows no one was going to
take him. And yet you do that, you carry on
a charade, and then Adrian Wardenowski woes again, somebody I
have a tremendous amount of respect for. But the defending saying, hey,
nepotism occurs throughout the NBA. True, And we can get
(08:30):
into whether or not there is there's a part of
nepotism that people don't talk about, which is actually a
really good thing. I'll get to that in a moment.
But acting like, well, if nepotism occurs elsewhere, the nepotism
here is fine, Like, no, that's not like two wrongs
don't actually make it right.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
You know, it's funny, Doug. In terms of the threat
that Rich Paul made the it wasn't even a threat.
If you were to look back at the other years
of the NBA, there are a lot of teams that
would draft someone stash them because the player wouldn't come
over from Europe and then be available in the next
two or three years. That actually may be a better
plan for Brownie James's actual pro prospects than to be
(09:06):
an actual threat for other teams to think that they've
be god forbid missing out on a late second round
pick like it was just it was idiotic to think
that that could be a possibility, Like someone's gonna be like, well,
we're not gonna waste pick number fifty four to draft
Bronnie James because we may not get anything out of them.
(09:27):
Hardly anybody gets anything out of second round picks. They're
more failures than there are success rates. And if they
can think that it was an actual threat made it
that much more ridiculous that people are actually taking it seriously.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Yes, yes, I mean you're right, and Okay, so we
can get into a bunch of parts to it. I
want to get into the idea of not doing a
two way contract and we'll explain what that means. A
longtime college hoops analyst and NBA draft expert fran Frascilla
is going to join us upcoming in ten minutes. Fran
(09:59):
knows these guys cold and kind of like the two
of us, like, he's not He's not bound by the
constraints of having to kiss the booty of lebron James.
And we can, he can. We can go back and
forth as to just how good Bronnie is and can be,
but let's tackle the not even the elephant the room.
(10:21):
The whole reason this took place is the father son element.
Here's Rob Polinka, GM and the Lakers discussing it.
Speaker 4 (10:27):
Bronnie is first and foremost a person of high character,
and second he is a young man that works incredibly hard,
and those are the qualities we look for in drafting
players and adding to our developmental core. The Lakers.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Okay, so high character. I agree. I've never heard anyone
say he's of anything but high character. He works hard, great,
they all do. Like, let's not pretend like there's not
other guys of high character to work hard. Fine. Here's
Polinka on the historic father son connection history.
Speaker 4 (11:00):
Of the NBA. There's never been a father and a
son that have shared an NBA basketball court, and that
feels like something that could be magical, and we know
and have to respect. Of course, that Lebron has a
decision about his opt out, and I'm sure he and
(11:20):
his family and his agent will deliberate what they're going
to do there, And of course he has freedom to
decide whatever's best for him and his family. But if
it worked out that he was on our team next season,
NBA history could be made, and NBA history should be
made in a Lakers uniform.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
It's really really impressive of Rob and rob by the
way as a friend of coaches Son Durham. He's a
good dude, good great family christ and his wife is
just a wonderful lady. But to keep a straight face
when he says, like Lebron James is going somewhere, like
come along, still up in the air, Know what are
(11:58):
we doing? Why? What? Why? Like I understand that there's
the possible, like what are we actually doing?
Speaker 5 (12:11):
What?
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Why? Why carry on some charade of lies? Like it?
Well it listen if he decides and his agent and
his family have decide, if Lebron's coming back history could
be made, Like dude, what.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
Wasn't the message after Night one on how JJ Reddick
was already designing things to Rob Polenka on what they
were gonna do with Dalton connect and this sounds stuff
like that I would write a graduation card to a
high school or college graduate, you know, like like you
talk about like the differences of like and and maybe
(12:52):
Night one was more about selling JJ Reddick as the
head coach sort of thing. But the whole thing is
a sell job. Whether it's Brownie, whether it's Jick. There
was no we're looking at ways to get Bronnie James
involved on the offense and looking at ways to utilize
him on defense. There was none of that. There was
for Dalton Knack, but there was none of that for
Bronnie James.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
I mean, look, I'll give you can I give you
the analysis. I'll be interested to hear what Franz says.
I actually have a player on my team who's played
against Bronnie and he's when he and I last night
had dinner, and I said, like, you know, what was
it like to play against him? He's like, you know,
(13:34):
he's a good defender. He's like, but he doesn't he
doesn't ever take over a game. And you know, looks
as you know, but I don't know if the listeners
note where our studio at Fox Sports Radio is located.
Is down the street from Sherman Oaks Notre Dame. Bronnie's
(13:54):
senior year, Notre Dame beat ci R Canyon four times.
Each time it got worse loaded loaded team, loaded, loaded team.
And you know so too is uh what's the other
school there's there's the whole league is called the Mission League,
and it's become arguably the best high school league in
(14:18):
the country. And I don't think he definitely wasn't one
of the top five players. I don't believe he's one
of the top ten players his senior year. Now, it
was a loaded league, okay, you had at Triman Oaks
Notre Dame, you had four high level Division one players, Okay,
but he wasn't one of the ten best players his
senior year. I understand he had the heart issue and
(14:40):
oh yeah, by the way, like here's kind of comical,
like lait so we he got a pass on the
broadcast for having a heart issue, when traditionally any other player,
if you essentially had a heart attack, no would ever
draft you, even if you had a great season like
(15:01):
he averaged four points a game, and when he got
a chance to start because as a Collier was injured,
like they weren't competitive. So I just he's not a
bad basketball player. This is just way above his level
for where he is currently, and like we're forcing it.
(15:23):
So then you add in the fact that Rich Paul
says he doesn't want to play a two way? Does
he's not gonna do a two way? A two way
allows you to go down to the G League. Like,
so you're just gonna sit on the bench with the
Lakers and the only hoop you're gonna get is in
workouts because once the season starts, they don't practice, Like
(15:43):
Lebron's not practicing forty years old, you're not practicing. Now
You'll be there and every once in a while they
have a practice and they go through some stuff. But
Anthony Davis and Lebron James, those guys aren't practicing. So
how is he actually going to get better? Where is
the developmental plan? There's none. If they want to to
develop him, you you send him to Duquane and he
(16:03):
plays like for one of his best friends. This is
not a developmental plan. This is a side show. And
again you're allowed to. I mean, Rob Polinka said as
much as you pointed out Dan, he said as much
that this is going to be as for historic nature
has nothing to do with basketball, zero, Because if it
had to do with basketball, you can still acquire Bronnie James,
(16:25):
and you could have got another player at fifty five
who actually could help you, maybe a stash him for
the future, but you didn't. So I just I thought
it was an embarrassing night all along. And I do
feel bad for Bronnie, but I think some of this
has been has caused him to be how he is
as a player. You know where his dad sucks up
so much of the oxygen in the room for everything
(16:48):
that Bronnie never tries to take over anything on the court.
Off the court, He's just a great kid who likes
to play basketball. That's awesome. But you're in the business
of winning games, aren't.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
I'll just say this quickly to Doug something to watch. Remember,
lebron changed his number this past year back to twenty three.
The reason, he said at the time was to honor
Bill Russell, who wore six. Well, Bronni wore six in college,
and I wonder, just wonder if when Bronni ends up
being a Laker, if he wears number six. And that
was the reason why Lebron actually did switch to twenty three,
(17:23):
which would mean that the plan probably would have been
and works for how many months, you know, year, a
year and a half to be able to make this done.
Just something to watch.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
It's very interesting and there is something too. There is
something too having the ability to make something you know,
have a vision for it and then make it happen
like that's one of the great things about Lebron you
cannot take away from him. Like he had this whole
vision not just for his career, but for production company,
(17:55):
for his friends, and they've all become very, very successful.
Now his son is in the NBA and is on
his team, like all of those things. But gosh it,
it feels it doesn't feel like it's focused on winning.
I'm Doug Gottlieb, He's Dan Byer in for Dan, and
then nets were broadcasting laugh from the tire rack dot
Com studios. Tyrack dot com what you get their unmatched selection, fast,
(18:18):
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(18:39):
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Speaker 2 (19:35):
Come on to you Stan Patrick Show, It's Fox Sports Radio.
You know I've done a lot of work for a stadium.
They have an over the air channel and of course
they have the app as well, and I was watching
her in the NBA Draft. I've done that show before
and my guy Pat Garrity, who was teammate of mine,
our best player at Notre Dame, of course, is part
(19:55):
of their crew. And I turned it on and Fred
Frascilla was on, and I was like, man, this is
the spot to watch because Fran I respect the hell
out of all these guys that prep for the draft.
But what separates Fran is like he literally knows everything
about every player and has an opinion based upon who
he talks to in the film he watched. So with that,
(20:18):
let's welcome in. Of course, he's been the head coach
at Mexico and Saint John's Manhattan. Longtime college hoops and
NBA draft analyst. Fran Forcilla joins us on the Dan
Patrick Show along with Dan Byrum, Doug gottlieb in Ford
and the Dan Nuts and Franny thanks so much for
joining us. Let's just start it at like top of
the draft. If you were to say, hey, and as
somebody who's covered the international scene back when you were
(20:42):
doing the draft at ESPN, is there is there something
that's changed about international basketball that we had three of
the top six be French players, or is just this
just kind of a one off.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
Oh no, this is not a one off. This has
been This is sixty years in the making. If you
think about it, and you grew up in a basketball family,
your dad knew a lot of these guys. If you
look at Ub Brown and Chuck Dailey and doctor Jack
and Dean Smith and Gukarnaseca in the sixties and by
the way, Red auerback in the fifties as well. In
(21:16):
the summertime, they would go around the world and be
asked to speak in clinics of the Italian Coaches Federation
or something for the state department in Greece, and they
taught the world the game of basketball. And then when
you add in the obviously the Dream Team in ninety
two and the dream of people like Gasaul and Naviitzki
and seeing these NBA players that they can they could
(21:38):
do it too. What simply happened, especially in the last
twenty years, And ironically it's the twenty years I've really
been involved with international basketball. The globe has shrunk, and
the international coaches learned the game from US, and now
they're actually in some ways teaching it back to us.
(21:58):
So it's come circle, it's not stopping, and you're going
to see pretty shortly, I think in the near future
that instead of twenty percent of the NBA being born
outside of the United States, it's probably going to go higher.
And for example, this is just one more thing on France.
When you look at the immigrant when you look at
the immigration from the former French colonies in Africa to
(22:21):
the country, you're talking about kids that look like they
and I say this respectfully having grown up in New
York City among a lot of African American players, that's
what it looks like now when you look at these
French kids, they look like they come from Detroit and Chicago,
and they're athletic, they're big, they're long, they're coachable, and
we're seeing that impact on the NBA.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Dan, let me just kind of back up with France
saying and kind of make this more of a discussion.
Fran Yeah, I played in France twenty man, I'm getting old,
not like twenty two years ago. And the reason that
I liked playing there the most was of the of
the European styles and obviously FEBA basketball is different. It
(23:04):
was the most like America because you had you had athleticism,
the coaches let you play. It was much more free
flowing than how you know, how they were playing when
I played in Russia or even when I played uh
in Israel. And then you add in the athleticism. But
but the other part too, it is like we are.
It's not just that we're not teaching our kids enough.
(23:27):
The bouncing around from school to school in high school
and the bouncing around to aau, the bouncing around in college,
you don't. It kills the developmental process. Whereas and again
you're the expert more in European basketball. Most of those kids,
and I know Alex Sar came over here and played
(23:47):
ote and developed a great deal. But previously that their
junior programs, you don't bounce around, and so you can
build a kid up and have him understand the entire
game because he's coached by the same people and in
the same system for multiple years.
Speaker 5 (24:02):
Well that's very true, Doug. You know, keep in mind,
we have three hundred and fifty million people in America
and we love our sports. We certainly love our basketball,
and you notice we have a lot of basketball experts
in America, anybody who wants to be a basketball expert
and say they are one. So and it's a democratic process, right,
I mean, everybody's got a freedom to be a basketball expert. Well,
(24:24):
in a country like let's just say Serbia, for example,
with eight million people, when you grow up in certain
parts of Serbia, you basically taught well most of Serbia,
actually you taught the game the same way. And it's
based on the things that we remember. You know, I
remember earlier in my career. Your dad certainly could probably
have filled you in on this. Just the game of
(24:45):
basketball starts with the foundation of fundamentals. And I used
to tell my guys, don't get bored. If you're getting better,
we're going to do these same girls every day. And
that's how they approach it in places like Lithuania and
France and Serbia. And I would say this, it's not
that the coaching is better, because we have great coaches
in our country in the United States, but the way
(25:07):
they teach the game is very much like the way
we saw the game taught by people like you know,
you B. Brown and Dean Smith and others, and we
get away from it sometimes because of AAU and all
the games they play. But this has been coming. It's
not stopping, and it's I think it's great for I
(25:27):
think it's great for the game because as much as
I don't want to be the ugly American and I'm not,
I just enjoy the fact that the globe is shrunk,
and you know, you get a chance to even the
styles of player back to what we remember like growing
up with ball movement and flow, and you know, it's beautiful.
I think it's great.
Speaker 3 (25:47):
One more on this, but just more of a bigger
picture thing. You said, this has been developing in France
for a long time. I felt that the NBA changed
with Dirk? Is that the point? Am I off on that?
Like it felt like when Herk comes to the NBA, now,
all of a sudden, for the next decade, everybody's trying
to find their next Dirk.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Am I correct in that assessment?
Speaker 5 (26:07):
Yeah? You know what, Dan, there was a I would
say this The whole thing on international hoops changed in
about two thousand and four, and it probably coincided with
us being a disaster in it in Athens, Greece when
our when our Olympic team was horrible, but what's what's
happened is the Uh, there's more resources put in by
(26:32):
the NBA to international basketball scouting. It really wasn't that
way prior to about two thousand and four. And so
to your point, there's so many more Dirks coming up
coming down the pipe. Dirk and pow Dassol I mentioned,
and before that, you know Marshall Ownus and the handful
of guys that came over from Europe before two thousand. Uh,
(26:56):
there's they they were anomalies. But the way international scouting
has gone, every NBA team's got number of international scouts
around the globe. There are no more surprises. And when
I say no more surprises, there's no more. There's not.
You're gonna know about Dirk very early in his career now,
and so that's I think that's cool. One other thing too, France.
(27:19):
I might have said this earlier, but you know, France
because of that immigration I talked about, And it's true
in Canada, by the way, you know, I said, I
said ten years ago that Toronto would have the best
high school basketball in North America in part because a
lot of the kids in Detroit, Chicago, New York, they
leave at at the age of fourteen or fifteen, they
go to prep school. But when you look at what
(27:40):
Shay Gilders, Alexander and Andrew Wiggins and the them Hearts,
and you know, so many guys coming up through that system.
You're talking about people in the for the most part,
who you know, immigrated from the Caribbean from Africa, and
so they they've got the DNA to be good and
now they're you know, there's some great coaches in Canada,
(28:01):
second generation players who have now gone back to Toronto and
other places and are teaching the game and so you know, hey,
now I would say this guys, Canada, I think will
provide us a great level of competition in the Olympics.
When you look at this starting backcoorde of Gildess, Alexander
and Jamal Murray, I mean that's as good as back
quarter as should probably find anywhere.
Speaker 2 (28:21):
Yeah, the gta's a greater Toronto area continues to just
pump out talented player after talented player. Frankfurt Shill is
our guest, longtime college basket yannists of course NBA Draft
analyst as well on with Dan Byrom Doug Got leave
us to Dan Patrick show, Fox Sports Radio Ronnie James
the prospect, how would you evaluate him?
Speaker 5 (28:44):
Well, I'm up to minds, so let me be let
me be honest. First of all, I think anybody who
knows basketball knows that his name wasn't James. He would
not have been a top six and pick. That's clear.
I mean, he was the third best guard on that
team at USC A team was a little bit dysfunctional.
Just I don't know what that even to do with
anything other than it just wasn't you know. They lost
(29:04):
him obleife. That didn't help him over the last few years.
But so Bron, he's got a ways to go. He's
a good athlete, he's undersized for him for a two guard.
He doesn't really have point guard skills, and we know
that in my opinion, that he would not have been drafted. Now,
having said that, I love the fact that the Lakers
took him at fifty five. Well, Lebron has been you know,
(29:28):
for twenty years in icon He's done everything the right way,
seems to be a great family man, loves his kids. Doug,
you know, you know how you and I are about
our kids, and so more power to him. You know,
fifty five is a tough spot for anybody to make
an NBA roster. Did it mean one guy didn't get drafted? Okay,
(29:49):
I get it, But actually there were only fifty eight
picks and not sixty this year because of two picks
taken away from teams. So at the end of the day,
we know what's going to happen. He's going to the
G League and on a random Tuesday night in February,
when the Pistons come to town, they're gonna call Bronnie up.
He's gonna get into the game in the second quarter,
(30:11):
h and Lebron's gonna be on the court with him.
They're gonna make history. It's gonna be cool. And then
more than likely he'll go back to Southway South Bay
Lakers and marinate there and try to develop into an
NBA player. So I have no real problem with it.
The anti Antett, the Kuombo brothers have three world titles
(30:34):
between the three of them, and only one of them
is an NBA player, So.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
I get it. But here here's my question. Is it
actually the best thing for Bronnie? Like why not send
them to Ducaine for a year? Like and I know
these decisions already made, but like, why not send them
to do kne for a year, let him play and
give him a chance. Like I just don't think this
is the gives him the best opportunity to have sustained
success other than being kind of a side show. Like
(31:01):
you said on a Tuesday night when the Pistons come
to town.
Speaker 5 (31:04):
Well, I would say this. Keep in mind that Lebron's
clock is ticking. So you know, best thing for Bronnie
would have been to go back to USC and try
to become an all packed I almost said Pack twelve
Big ten player, but that wouldn't have helped the situation
with Lebron saying many many times through the years that
he wanted to play with Bronnie. So I think that's why.
(31:26):
By the way, when I saw Lebron play against the
Nuggets in Game five that eliminated the Lakers, I couldn't
believe how good he still is. You know, I was
there at the game, and I think he's got two
more great years. But I think this is more about
Lebron wanting to play with Bronnie now as opposed to
waiting and sending him to Australia or keeping him in college.
(31:48):
That wouldn't do any good if eventually Lebron decides to retire,
and so again fifty to fifth pick. I don't want
to say it's a throwaway pick, but it's kind of
a reward for what Lebron's done for, you know, the
Lakers here the last few years, winning the title during
the COVID year, and then what he's meant to the game,
and the fact that he wants to and listen, the
(32:10):
league is run by the NBA superstars who are co
their partners with the owners, and it's run by the agents.
That's who runs the NBA. That's that's it, and so
rich Paul Lebron having the juice to do it, they're
doing it. And like I said, it may not be
in Brownie's best interest, but I don't have a real
problem with the fact that it's going to make everybody
(32:32):
in the James family happy.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
I was going to say, how does Zach Edie transition,
because now there seems to be expectations now that he's
a top ten pick.
Speaker 2 (32:41):
Who's who's that Zach in Memphis?
Speaker 5 (32:45):
I have to tell you that is the biggest mystery
I think I know basketball. I have no idea how
this is going to work out statistically, analytically, from a
size standpoint, from a fact that I think he's the
best NBA excuse me, the best college basketball center. I
don't know, Doug, maybe in twenty five years. When you
(33:07):
look at it, I mean he's the last time somebody
won back to back Masmith Awards was Ralph Sampson. So
I don't know about you, Doug, but to me, he's
the best college center in the last twenty five years,
if not further. And yet I'm not sure he's going
to how he's going to play in the NBA because
of the different style. I would say this, I would
assume the Memphis Grizzlies had long discussions and including with
(33:31):
their coach Taylor Jenkins, about look, he's going to be
available at nine, and how are we going to play him,
and what's going to be our strategy with him? Is
he going to be a backup center, play him against
second unit pig guys. I would think that they are
smart enough to have had many discussions about figuring out
(33:52):
how to play this guy. And I think one thing
he will do if you played through him, he's getting
a lot of people in foul trouble.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
And he will get intell trouble himself. I guess is
the other problem.
Speaker 5 (34:02):
Well, well that's the question. That's the question. And I
don't think we know how he's good again, even on
the defensive.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
Then that's all. That's that's I mean, I don't know
where you put him on defense, considering he didn't leave
the paint uh in college.
Speaker 5 (34:18):
But he's Doug. He's one of the biggest human beings
you ever see. There are plays in the championship game
where guys drove to the basket and they pretty much
said that I think I'm not gonna go all the way.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
The next level. They they they go over and around
a little bit differently and the angles are different. But
I'm with you. It's a mystery, like nine is so high?
And Dan, I thought you asked the question perfectly, Like
now you've got expectations and I get nine. You know,
how do you how do you play him? Camp? Do
you play them with John Morant? Like that? That part
doesn't make sense to me at all. Friendy, You're the
(34:51):
best man. Love the work with stadium. Thanks so much
for joining us, yere on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 5 (34:56):
My pleasure dog see Dan, all.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
Right, that's Frank for Schill Long Time Hoops analyst with
ESPN and this week with Stadium Sports UH Sliding into
the Weekend is brought to you by our partners with
Kings Hawaiian who wants you to get together with friends
and family to enjoy the weekend, making every Sunday a
Slider Sunday, which is Sunday. Just you know, Dan, we
(35:19):
have we call family Dinner at my house. My entire
team comes over. If you have a family member in town,
they have to come over. Brother, sister, girlfriend, potential girlfriend.
They off to come over. And we're gonna have slider Sundays.
This this Sunday. Are you gonna make slider? Are you
gonna make slider Sundays at my house? Is it next Sunday?
Is that? Is that? Is that where I'm looking at
with the clock? Is that? Yeah? I think? I think so.
(35:41):
I'm Doug Golli, He's Dan byer In for Dan and
the Dan Nets. But we're gonna resolve the most popular
sports debate of all time. Say we did there right?
Bring it to what else is being discussed in the
media that's up coming next.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am. Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Doug Gottlieb, Dan Byron for Dan Dannett's Fox Sports Radio
iHeartRadio app Alte you producer Jason Sewer alongside. So last
night there was a debate and presidential debate. But we
don't need to editorialize on what we saw or maybe
what we avoided watching on CNN. But we did think,
(36:33):
or at least Jason, you and Dan thought, listen, let's
do what the greatest sports debates of all time? This is.
Speaker 3 (36:41):
This is a little bit on the heels of what
we did on your show that airs on Fox Sports Radio,
and we did it yesterday. We drafted our favorite stupid
debates that happened on sports talk radio or amongst friends,
so kind of the cream of the crop of debates.
Now what we will do is find out where what
side where you stand on these stupid debates, because there
(37:03):
are a bunch of them, and we'll do this throughout
the show. Okay, by the way, big thanks to Corey
who politely reminded me that Bill Russell's number six is retired,
so my Bronnie James theory can go out the window.
And by politely he wrote, you both can't be this stupid.
I was a completely completely forgot about it, didn't even remember.
(37:29):
So I am sorry for sullying the reputation. Sorry Dan Patrick,
sorry Paully, sorry Seton, But I was that stupid onto
debates of debates of debates, Doug, the biggest debate that
actually was brought up yesterday was your pick of Jordan
versus Lebron. Now where do you stand on Jordan versus Lebron.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
I'm a Jordan guy. I don't actually think it's all
together all that close because I believe that we've lost
track of first, first and foremost. I don't do the
Bill Russell, even Kareem. I definitely don't do Wilt Chamberlain
or Jerry West. And it's not because they weren't all
(38:19):
great players. I don't think by the way Wilt stacks up,
and some of that is my dad was not a
Wilt fans. What was not a winning basketball player anyway.
Point is I wasn't alive really to watch, you know,
Bill Russell play, when I saw Kareem play with the Lakers,
like he was a shell of his former self. So
I go from eighty on right eighty on sure, and
(38:40):
I think that somehow Magic and Bird have been lost
in this debate. Like Maggi, John's the best point guard
ever played basketball, period stop, and he he and Bird
completely dominated the league for a decade in many people's estimation,
the golden era of the NBA before became the Jordan's League.
But I'm a Jordan guy. He was an un league
blonde ball defender. Obviously a remarkable score, but it was
(39:04):
in the ways in which his game evolved from being
the best driver and mid range player too eventually became
a great jump shooter later in his career and in
between and then late in his career he was an
unbelievable post player as well. I love the way Lebron
plays in many ways in terms of getting his teammates
involved and making him better. But basketball, and I coached basketball,
(39:28):
played professional collegiate basketball. The best player is just a
force of will guy that finds a way to win.
And once Jordan figured out how to win games, no
one could stop him. I'm a Michael Jordan guy.
Speaker 3 (39:40):
All right, mister President, your time is Jason Stewart. Where
do you lie on Jordan versus Lebron.
Speaker 1 (39:45):
I'm Jordan for all the same reasons.
Speaker 5 (39:47):
Jordan.
Speaker 3 (39:47):
Okay, I'm gonna say Lebron on this one, Joel Jordan
versus Lebron Joel Elliot or his team technical producer Jordan
for two reasons, and they're kind of the saying, sorry, Joel,
we're out of time against Bird, Magic versus Bird. In
our debate here, I'm thinking, Doug, you're going with Magic,
(40:08):
considering what you just said.
Speaker 2 (40:10):
No, who do you like? Ooh, You're going with Larry Bird?
Larry Bird, Larry Bird. I mean people forgetting them. Larry
Bird came to Celtics, I think they'd won twenty nine games.
They won sixty after his first year, and anyone who thinks, well, well,
Larry Bird wasn't athletic enough to play in this era.
(40:30):
Take Luca don Chik and grow him a couple of inches,
make him into an incredible rebounder, and you have Larry Bird.
Larry Bird is better than Luca. Luca is the best
offensive player in the league. I think he'd be Okay,
I'm I'm a Bird guy, obviously, though he didn't pass
(40:51):
as as he wasn't as flashy. Norty lead the league
and assist but he was a great passer. He was
an unbelievable rebounder, a remarkable score. I also think his
game would evolve you more with a three point shot.
It was just a bird guy. I don't know. I mean,
you had to choose bird magic. I grew up in
southern California. Everybody lusted over magic. You know magic. It
(41:13):
took him half his crew to learn how to shoot.
I'm a bird guy. I think only injury derailed that.
Injury and the lenbiased thing kind of derailed that train
from winning more titles.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
Larry Bird Overmat Jason Stewart, Magic Johnson. That's your all
time favorite player, right, Yes, Yes, I'm gonna go with
Doug on this. In Bird Joel, you get the final,
say Burder Magic, it's magic. He beat him in college,
he beat him in the pro. All right, the first two.
There are many more debates we need to settle coming
up later in the Dan Patrick Show.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
Oh I love that. And now here's the only thing, Dan,
if you're going to moderate, you're not supposed to take
a side you moderate. I'm just I'm just trying to
figure this thing out. That's fair point, all right. Coming
up next on the Dan Patrick Show. Did the NFL
ticket do anything wrong in a ballistic society? We'll discuss
next on The Dan Patrick Show.
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
What up? Good morning? TI? Youa Stan Patrick Show Fox
Sports Radio. I'm Doug Gottlieb, my guy Dan Byer alongside,
so too is Jason Stewart. Good morning, Doug morning. It's
this is weird. You're where I grew up, I'm where
you grew up. That's that's what's happened with our lives, right,
(00:27):
not not exactly where you grew up, but in the
the state of of where you matriculated through school. And
I'm actually in the state where I was born, but
not where I'm matriculated through high school, middle school, whatever.
So it's it's a it's a weird, weird switch being
in Wisconsin, you being in California. But still nonetheless, uh,
(00:48):
here we are and we're I don't know, we've There's
a lot of conclusions you can make about the NBA draft.
I think the two day draft. Uh, it's pretty obvious
that somebody is like, hey, what if we did a
two day draft and a bunch of people said can
we make more money? And they're like, yes we can,
(01:09):
will it be good? I don't know if anybody actually
flushed that part out right, Like, that's how that's how
brainstorming works, sort of deal. You throw things up on
the board, you discuss it. You have to be willing
to be told that your idea, while productive, isn't going
to be implemented. I just there was that was not great.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
You know, And let's and let's be honest too, Doug.
They were given a gift with Brownie James. Yes, that's
an absolute gift to have.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Other otherwise otherwise And look, you and I are hoopheads, right,
Like you love golf, don't get me wrong, and of
course you have your Sunday show and your fantasy football
podcast whatever, but you let you love college hoop as
I obviously do. Now I'm a college head coach, right,
But I mean that was with If you take Ronnie
(02:00):
James out of the second round, it becomes solely for
those of us who are absolute diehards, and we wonder, right,
I mean, given an absolute gift and even with that,
that was a tough watch.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Yeah, especially too because Philipowski and Kolik ended up going
in the first two of the first three picks of
the second round, so of names that we would be
familiar with with college basketball, not that there weren't other
college players, but those were the two biggest names that
I felt were still available at that point. They were
off the board within three picks of the second round, starting,
by the way, for those of us on the West Coast,
(02:35):
one o'clock in the afternoon.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Again, like, what part of this was well planned? I
just again, I understand. I deal with people all the
time who have asked us in the TV and radio
industry like why do games start so late? And generally
my argument is always, look, you may say your kid
can't stay up late and watch, but there are programming
(02:58):
people that they spend their entire professional lives figuring out
the math equation too. What is the appropriate tip time
so that when the game concludes, because that's when you
have peak viewing audience, you have the most eyes from
around the country watching this one. I got to know
the math on. I don't really understand what are you
trying to get us to not watch? I understand that
(03:21):
it's the first time you've done it, but who in
their right mind thought that was a good idea? I can't.
I can't imagine a lot of people in the West coast,
where on the West coast, where there's not a lot
of buzz about college hoops, and the only buzz was
about Ronnie James, who did grow up, did play college
basketball and now is a product of the member of
(03:41):
the Los Angeles Lakers. That's the only guy. And it
happened at what three in the afternoon. I just that
one's a tough one for me. Doesn't add up a lot.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
And there was zero buzz because everything was also moved
to the studio, so it was very they weren't at
the Barclay Center like they were the n IP four. Yeah,
it was just odd and I just don't know how
you can continue that momentum, at least in the NFL.
People are hanging out around Detroit, you know, on the
Friday and Saturday and doing NFL sort of things and
(04:12):
wearing their team gear. But this was just, yeah, this
was just odd.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
Well, I mean, look, I am in green Bay, Wisconsin.
Doug Gottlieb Dan Bayer in for Dan and Danetts here
on Dan Patrick cho Fox Sports Radio and for people
who don't know, the NFL Draft next year comes to
Green Bay, and you know the planning in the city.
The plan is there'll be two hundred and fifty thousand
people come into the city and it's a show. There's
(04:38):
concerts planned, there's already a lot of venues down in
Title Town, you know, obviously right there next to lambeau
and I can't imagine the buzz that there's gonna have.
Obviously there'll be the potential there in the spring for weather,
but there's the at Room, which I just got a
chance to see two nights ago, inside of lambeau Field,
(05:00):
where you're already covered. I'm sure they're making all kinds
of contingency plans, but trying to mimic the NFL is
such a mistake. You're just not the NFL. And I
feel like that's what the NBA did where, you know,
so many times the WNBA has been rightfully accused of
why are you trying to compete or compare yourself to
(05:22):
the NBA. You're it's a completely different calculation. The same
would be true for the NBA last night. I think
it's a pretty completely different calculation. But let's get to
the topic to Jore, which just so happens to be
the topic of the day. Bronnie James was drafted by
the Lakers, and I thought, and look, I am not
(05:42):
generally critical of other broadcasters. Having been a broadcaster, I
can tell you that there's a lot of things that
go on that you may not and we can let
you kind of inside the beltway, especially now crossing over
into coaching, I can I can not selling out any friends,
but I can tell you the reality of how things
go and why they go. And Dan, as you and
I have talked about before, you know, a lot of
(06:04):
people are critical, for example of ESPN ABC's halftime show
during the during the NBA Finals, like, well, you just
have some one minute thing like that's because those segments
are sold like they network breaks are different. You don't
have the benefit of cable where Barkley and the inside
of the NBA crew can can vamp for you know,
(06:24):
ten minutes uninterrupted. You don't have that. So there are
some things business wise that people just don't understand. We
can get to the the idea of nepotism, We get
to all this stuff. I thought of ESPN was embarrassing
with the defending the pick. I've never heard anything like this.
(06:45):
The whole thing is a complete debacle. And Bob Myers,
who I like, like, dude, you're sitting there acting like
you're breaking news saying a Rich Paul is calling other
teams telling him, not telling him not to draft Brownie.
If they do, he's going to Australia. Like like, you
have to be able to process that. People are telling
(07:05):
you things that aren't accurate, right, you can't you have
to process that. It was the whole Rich Paul thing
was such a clown show. And we'll get to whether
or not you can he why he would say, we're
not doing a two way, but the multiple teams interested,
they weren't. You worked out for two teams. It was
some sort of leverage play to get the Lakers to
(07:26):
make sure they hired JJ Reddick and they drafted Ronnie James.
And look, you're allowed to draft Ronnie James. You're allowed
to have nepotism. Like again, like we can talk about it,
but just carrying on a charade like he was gonna
go to Australia or somebody else was interested. When the
whole thing, the the part that I would say is
(07:48):
embarrassing for the Lakers is why'd you have to draft him?
No one was gonna draft Ronnie James. Everybody knew who's
going to LA. You can still sign him as an
undrafted free agent. And if the idea is, hey, we
don't want to embarrassing, I'm like, look, the market has spoken.
If you thought the next couple teams was five more picks,
you thought in the next five picks he was going
(08:09):
to get selected, Like, that's fine, but they weren't going
to take him. Everyone knows no one was going to
take him. And yet you do that, you carry on
a charade, and then Adrian Wardenowski woes again, somebody I
have a tremendous amount of respect for. But the defending saying, hey,
nepotism occurs throughout the NBA. True, And we can get
(08:30):
into whether or not there is there's a part of
nepotism that people don't talk about, which is actually a
really good thing. I'll get to that in a moment.
But acting like, well, if nepotism occurs elsewhere, the nepotism
here is fine, Like, no, that's not like two wrongs
don't actually make it right.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
You know, it's funny, Doug. In terms of the threat
that Rich Paul made the it wasn't even a threat.
If you were to look back at the other years
of the NBA, there are a lot of teams that
would draft someone stash them because the player wouldn't come
over from Europe and then be available in the next
two or three years. That actually may be a better
plan for Brownie James's actual pro prospects than to be
(09:06):
an actual threat for other teams to think that they've
be god forbid missing out on a late second round
pick like it was just it was idiotic to think
that that could be a possibility, Like someone's gonna be like, well,
we're not gonna waste pick number fifty four to draft
Bronnie James because we may not get anything out of them.
(09:27):
Hardly anybody gets anything out of second round picks. They're
more failures than there are success rates. And if they
can think that it was an actual threat made it
that much more ridiculous that people are actually taking it seriously.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Yes, yes, I mean you're right, and Okay, so we
can get into a bunch of parts to it. I
want to get into the idea of not doing a
two way contract and we'll explain what that means. A
longtime college hoops analyst and NBA draft expert fran Frascilla
is going to join us upcoming in ten minutes. Fran
(09:59):
knows these guys cold and kind of like the two
of us, like, he's not He's not bound by the
constraints of having to kiss the booty of lebron James.
And we can, he can. We can go back and
forth as to just how good Bronnie is and can be,
but let's tackle the not even the elephant the room.
(10:21):
The whole reason this took place is the father son element.
Here's Rob Polinka, GM and the Lakers discussing it.
Speaker 4 (10:27):
Bronnie is first and foremost a person of high character,
and second he is a young man that works incredibly hard,
and those are the qualities we look for in drafting
players and adding to our developmental core. The Lakers.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Okay, so high character. I agree. I've never heard anyone
say he's of anything but high character. He works hard, great,
they all do. Like, let's not pretend like there's not
other guys of high character to work hard. Fine. Here's
Polinka on the historic father son connection history.
Speaker 4 (11:00):
Of the NBA. There's never been a father and a
son that have shared an NBA basketball court, and that
feels like something that could be magical, and we know
and have to respect. Of course, that Lebron has a
decision about his opt out, and I'm sure he and
(11:20):
his family and his agent will deliberate what they're going
to do there, And of course he has freedom to
decide whatever's best for him and his family. But if
it worked out that he was on our team next season,
NBA history could be made, and NBA history should be
made in a Lakers uniform.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
It's really really impressive of Rob and rob by the
way as a friend of coaches Son Durham. He's a
good dude, good great family christ and his wife is
just a wonderful lady. But to keep a straight face
when he says, like Lebron James is going somewhere, like
come along, still up in the air, Know what are
(11:58):
we doing? Why? What? Why? Like I understand that there's
the possible, like what are we actually doing?
Speaker 5 (12:11):
What?
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Why? Why carry on some charade of lies? Like it?
Well it listen if he decides and his agent and
his family have decide, if Lebron's coming back history could
be made, Like dude, what.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
Wasn't the message after Night one on how JJ Reddick
was already designing things to Rob Polenka on what they
were gonna do with Dalton connect and this sounds stuff
like that I would write a graduation card to a
high school or college graduate, you know, like like you
talk about like the differences of like and and maybe
(12:52):
Night one was more about selling JJ Reddick as the
head coach sort of thing. But the whole thing is
a sell job. Whether it's Brownie, whether it's Jick. There
was no we're looking at ways to get Bronnie James
involved on the offense and looking at ways to utilize
him on defense. There was none of that. There was
for Dalton Knack, but there was none of that for
Bronnie James.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
I mean, look, I'll give you can I give you
the analysis. I'll be interested to hear what Franz says.
I actually have a player on my team who's played
against Bronnie and he's when he and I last night
had dinner, and I said, like, you know, what was
it like to play against him? He's like, you know,
(13:34):
he's a good defender. He's like, but he doesn't he
doesn't ever take over a game. And you know, looks
as you know, but I don't know if the listeners
note where our studio at Fox Sports Radio is located.
Is down the street from Sherman Oaks Notre Dame. Bronnie's
(13:54):
senior year, Notre Dame beat ci R Canyon four times.
Each time it got worse loaded loaded team, loaded, loaded team.
And you know so too is uh what's the other
school there's there's the whole league is called the Mission League,
and it's become arguably the best high school league in
(14:18):
the country. And I don't think he definitely wasn't one
of the top five players. I don't believe he's one
of the top ten players his senior year. Now, it
was a loaded league, okay, you had at Triman Oaks
Notre Dame, you had four high level Division one players, Okay,
but he wasn't one of the ten best players his
senior year. I understand he had the heart issue and
(14:40):
oh yeah, by the way, like here's kind of comical,
like lait so we he got a pass on the
broadcast for having a heart issue, when traditionally any other player,
if you essentially had a heart attack, no would ever
draft you, even if you had a great season like
(15:01):
he averaged four points a game, and when he got
a chance to start because as a Collier was injured,
like they weren't competitive. So I just he's not a
bad basketball player. This is just way above his level
for where he is currently, and like we're forcing it.
(15:23):
So then you add in the fact that Rich Paul
says he doesn't want to play a two way? Does
he's not gonna do a two way? A two way
allows you to go down to the G League. Like,
so you're just gonna sit on the bench with the
Lakers and the only hoop you're gonna get is in
workouts because once the season starts, they don't practice, Like
(15:43):
Lebron's not practicing forty years old, you're not practicing. Now
You'll be there and every once in a while they
have a practice and they go through some stuff. But
Anthony Davis and Lebron James, those guys aren't practicing. So
how is he actually going to get better? Where is
the developmental plan? There's none. If they want to to
develop him, you you send him to Duquane and he
(16:03):
plays like for one of his best friends. This is
not a developmental plan. This is a side show. And
again you're allowed to. I mean, Rob Polinka said as
much as you pointed out Dan, he said as much
that this is going to be as for historic nature
has nothing to do with basketball, zero, Because if it
had to do with basketball, you can still acquire Bronnie James,
(16:25):
and you could have got another player at fifty five
who actually could help you, maybe a stash him for
the future, but you didn't. So I just I thought
it was an embarrassing night all along. And I do
feel bad for Bronnie, but I think some of this
has been has caused him to be how he is
as a player. You know where his dad sucks up
so much of the oxygen in the room for everything
(16:48):
that Bronnie never tries to take over anything on the court.
Off the court, He's just a great kid who likes
to play basketball. That's awesome. But you're in the business
of winning games, aren't.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
I'll just say this quickly to Doug something to watch. Remember,
lebron changed his number this past year back to twenty three.
The reason, he said at the time was to honor
Bill Russell, who wore six. Well, Bronni wore six in college,
and I wonder, just wonder if when Bronni ends up
being a Laker, if he wears number six. And that
was the reason why Lebron actually did switch to twenty three,
(17:23):
which would mean that the plan probably would have been
and works for how many months, you know, year, a
year and a half to be able to make this done.
Just something to watch.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
It's very interesting and there is something too. There is
something too having the ability to make something you know,
have a vision for it and then make it happen
like that's one of the great things about Lebron you
cannot take away from him. Like he had this whole
vision not just for his career, but for production company,
(17:55):
for his friends, and they've all become very, very successful.
Now his son is in the NBA and is on
his team, like all of those things. But gosh it,
it feels it doesn't feel like it's focused on winning.
I'm Doug Gottlieb, He's Dan Byer in for Dan, and
then nets were broadcasting laugh from the tire rack dot
Com studios. Tyrack dot com what you get their unmatched selection, fast,
(18:18):
free shipping, free road has to protection. It's the way
that tire buying should be. You need to hear the
details regarding a strange story with Kyle Philipowski, a Duke
Starr who was drafted yesterday in the second rout. Why
might he have slipped in the draft? Oh you're gonna
like this one, or maybe you're not. It's a little uncomfortable.
(18:39):
It's next to the Dan Patrick Show.
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What is up on Game?
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Speaker 2 (19:35):
Come on to you Stan Patrick Show, It's Fox Sports Radio.
You know I've done a lot of work for a stadium.
They have an over the air channel and of course
they have the app as well, and I was watching
her in the NBA Draft. I've done that show before
and my guy Pat Garrity, who was teammate of mine,
our best player at Notre Dame, of course, is part
(19:55):
of their crew. And I turned it on and Fred
Frascilla was on, and I was like, man, this is
the spot to watch because Fran I respect the hell
out of all these guys that prep for the draft.
But what separates Fran is like he literally knows everything
about every player and has an opinion based upon who
he talks to in the film he watched. So with that,
(20:18):
let's welcome in. Of course, he's been the head coach
at Mexico and Saint John's Manhattan. Longtime college hoops and
NBA draft analyst. Fran Forcilla joins us on the Dan
Patrick Show along with Dan Byrum, Doug gottlieb in Ford
and the Dan Nuts and Franny thanks so much for
joining us. Let's just start it at like top of
the draft. If you were to say, hey, and as
somebody who's covered the international scene back when you were
(20:42):
doing the draft at ESPN, is there is there something
that's changed about international basketball that we had three of
the top six be French players, or is just this
just kind of a one off.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
Oh no, this is not a one off. This has
been This is sixty years in the making. If you
think about it, and you grew up in a basketball family,
your dad knew a lot of these guys. If you
look at Ub Brown and Chuck Dailey and doctor Jack
and Dean Smith and Gukarnaseca in the sixties and by
the way, Red auerback in the fifties as well. In
(21:16):
the summertime, they would go around the world and be
asked to speak in clinics of the Italian Coaches Federation
or something for the state department in Greece, and they
taught the world the game of basketball. And then when
you add in the obviously the Dream Team in ninety
two and the dream of people like Gasaul and Naviitzki
and seeing these NBA players that they can they could
(21:38):
do it too. What simply happened, especially in the last
twenty years, And ironically it's the twenty years I've really
been involved with international basketball. The globe has shrunk, and
the international coaches learned the game from US, and now
they're actually in some ways teaching it back to us.
(21:58):
So it's come circle, it's not stopping, and you're going
to see pretty shortly, I think in the near future
that instead of twenty percent of the NBA being born
outside of the United States, it's probably going to go higher.
And for example, this is just one more thing on France.
When you look at the immigrant when you look at
the immigration from the former French colonies in Africa to
(22:21):
the country, you're talking about kids that look like they
and I say this respectfully having grown up in New
York City among a lot of African American players, that's
what it looks like now when you look at these
French kids, they look like they come from Detroit and Chicago,
and they're athletic, they're big, they're long, they're coachable, and
we're seeing that impact on the NBA.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
Dan, let me just kind of back up with France
saying and kind of make this more of a discussion.
Fran Yeah, I played in France twenty man, I'm getting old,
not like twenty two years ago. And the reason that
I liked playing there the most was of the of
the European styles and obviously FEBA basketball is different. It
(23:04):
was the most like America because you had you had athleticism,
the coaches let you play. It was much more free
flowing than how you know, how they were playing when
I played in Russia or even when I played uh
in Israel. And then you add in the athleticism. But
but the other part too, it is like we are.
It's not just that we're not teaching our kids enough.
(23:27):
The bouncing around from school to school in high school
and the bouncing around to aau, the bouncing around in college,
you don't. It kills the developmental process. Whereas and again
you're the expert more in European basketball. Most of those kids,
and I know Alex Sar came over here and played
(23:47):
ote and developed a great deal. But previously that their
junior programs, you don't bounce around, and so you can
build a kid up and have him understand the entire
game because he's coached by the same people and in
the same system for multiple years.
Speaker 5 (24:02):
Well that's very true, Doug. You know, keep in mind,
we have three hundred and fifty million people in America
and we love our sports. We certainly love our basketball,
and you notice we have a lot of basketball experts
in America, anybody who wants to be a basketball expert
and say they are one. So and it's a democratic process, right,
I mean, everybody's got a freedom to be a basketball expert. Well,
(24:24):
in a country like let's just say Serbia, for example,
with eight million people, when you grow up in certain
parts of Serbia, you basically taught well most of Serbia,
actually you taught the game the same way. And it's
based on the things that we remember. You know, I
remember earlier in my career. Your dad certainly could probably
have filled you in on this. Just the game of
(24:45):
basketball starts with the foundation of fundamentals. And I used
to tell my guys, don't get bored. If you're getting better,
we're going to do these same girls every day. And
that's how they approach it in places like Lithuania and
France and Serbia. And I would say this, it's not
that the coaching is better, because we have great coaches
in our country in the United States, but the way
(25:07):
they teach the game is very much like the way
we saw the game taught by people like you know,
you B. Brown and Dean Smith and others, and we
get away from it sometimes because of AAU and all
the games they play. But this has been coming. It's
not stopping, and it's I think it's great for I
(25:27):
think it's great for the game because as much as
I don't want to be the ugly American and I'm not,
I just enjoy the fact that the globe is shrunk,
and you know, you get a chance to even the
styles of player back to what we remember like growing
up with ball movement and flow, and you know, it's beautiful.
I think it's great.
Speaker 3 (25:47):
One more on this, but just more of a bigger
picture thing. You said, this has been developing in France
for a long time. I felt that the NBA changed
with Dirk? Is that the point? Am I off on that?
Like it felt like when Herk comes to the NBA, now,
all of a sudden, for the next decade, everybody's trying
to find their next Dirk.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Am I correct in that assessment?
Speaker 5 (26:07):
Yeah? You know what, Dan, there was a I would
say this The whole thing on international hoops changed in
about two thousand and four, and it probably coincided with
us being a disaster in it in Athens, Greece when
our when our Olympic team was horrible, but what's what's
happened is the Uh, there's more resources put in by
(26:32):
the NBA to international basketball scouting. It really wasn't that
way prior to about two thousand and four. And so
to your point, there's so many more Dirks coming up
coming down the pipe. Dirk and pow Dassol I mentioned,
and before that, you know Marshall Ownus and the handful
of guys that came over from Europe before two thousand. Uh,
(26:56):
there's they they were anomalies. But the way international scouting
has gone, every NBA team's got number of international scouts
around the globe. There are no more surprises. And when
I say no more surprises, there's no more. There's not.
You're gonna know about Dirk very early in his career now,
and so that's I think that's cool. One other thing too, France.
(27:19):
I might have said this earlier, but you know, France
because of that immigration I talked about, And it's true
in Canada, by the way, you know, I said, I
said ten years ago that Toronto would have the best
high school basketball in North America in part because a
lot of the kids in Detroit, Chicago, New York, they
leave at at the age of fourteen or fifteen, they
go to prep school. But when you look at what
(27:40):
Shay Gilders, Alexander and Andrew Wiggins and the them Hearts,
and you know, so many guys coming up through that system.
You're talking about people in the for the most part,
who you know, immigrated from the Caribbean from Africa, and
so they they've got the DNA to be good and
now they're you know, there's some great coaches in Canada,
(28:01):
second generation players who have now gone back to Toronto and
other places and are teaching the game and so you know, hey,
now I would say this guys, Canada, I think will
provide us a great level of competition in the Olympics.
When you look at this starting backcoorde of Gildess, Alexander
and Jamal Murray, I mean that's as good as back
quarter as should probably find anywhere.
Speaker 2 (28:21):
Yeah, the gta's a greater Toronto area continues to just
pump out talented player after talented player. Frankfurt Shill is
our guest, longtime college basket yannists of course NBA Draft
analyst as well on with Dan Byrom Doug Got leave
us to Dan Patrick show, Fox Sports Radio Ronnie James
the prospect, how would you evaluate him?
Speaker 5 (28:44):
Well, I'm up to minds, so let me be let
me be honest. First of all, I think anybody who
knows basketball knows that his name wasn't James. He would
not have been a top six and pick. That's clear.
I mean, he was the third best guard on that
team at USC A team was a little bit dysfunctional.
Just I don't know what that even to do with
anything other than it just wasn't you know. They lost
(29:04):
him obleife. That didn't help him over the last few years.
But so Bron, he's got a ways to go. He's
a good athlete, he's undersized for him for a two guard.
He doesn't really have point guard skills, and we know
that in my opinion, that he would not have been drafted. Now,
having said that, I love the fact that the Lakers
took him at fifty five. Well, Lebron has been you know,
(29:28):
for twenty years in icon He's done everything the right way,
seems to be a great family man, loves his kids. Doug,
you know, you know how you and I are about
our kids, and so more power to him. You know,
fifty five is a tough spot for anybody to make
an NBA roster. Did it mean one guy didn't get drafted? Okay,
(29:49):
I get it, But actually there were only fifty eight
picks and not sixty this year because of two picks
taken away from teams. So at the end of the day,
we know what's going to happen. He's going to the
G League and on a random Tuesday night in February,
when the Pistons come to town, they're gonna call Bronnie up.
He's gonna get into the game in the second quarter,
(30:11):
h and Lebron's gonna be on the court with him.
They're gonna make history. It's gonna be cool. And then
more than likely he'll go back to Southway South Bay
Lakers and marinate there and try to develop into an
NBA player. So I have no real problem with it.
The anti Antett, the Kuombo brothers have three world titles
(30:34):
between the three of them, and only one of them
is an NBA player, So.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
I get it. But here here's my question. Is it
actually the best thing for Bronnie? Like why not send
them to Ducaine for a year? Like and I know
these decisions already made, but like, why not send them
to do kne for a year, let him play and
give him a chance. Like I just don't think this
is the gives him the best opportunity to have sustained
success other than being kind of a side show. Like
(31:01):
you said on a Tuesday night when the Pistons come
to town.
Speaker 5 (31:04):
Well, I would say this. Keep in mind that Lebron's
clock is ticking. So you know, best thing for Bronnie
would have been to go back to USC and try
to become an all packed I almost said Pack twelve
Big ten player, but that wouldn't have helped the situation
with Lebron saying many many times through the years that
he wanted to play with Bronnie. So I think that's why.
(31:26):
By the way, when I saw Lebron play against the
Nuggets in Game five that eliminated the Lakers, I couldn't
believe how good he still is. You know, I was
there at the game, and I think he's got two
more great years. But I think this is more about
Lebron wanting to play with Bronnie now as opposed to
waiting and sending him to Australia or keeping him in college.
(31:48):
That wouldn't do any good if eventually Lebron decides to retire,
and so again fifty to fifth pick. I don't want
to say it's a throwaway pick, but it's kind of
a reward for what Lebron's done for, you know, the
Lakers here the last few years, winning the title during
the COVID year, and then what he's meant to the game,
and the fact that he wants to and listen, the
(32:10):
league is run by the NBA superstars who are co
their partners with the owners, and it's run by the agents.
That's who runs the NBA. That's that's it, and so
rich Paul Lebron having the juice to do it, they're
doing it. And like I said, it may not be
in Brownie's best interest, but I don't have a real
problem with the fact that it's going to make everybody
(32:32):
in the James family happy.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
I was going to say, how does Zach Edie transition,
because now there seems to be expectations now that he's
a top ten pick.
Speaker 2 (32:41):
Who's who's that Zach in Memphis?
Speaker 5 (32:45):
I have to tell you that is the biggest mystery
I think I know basketball. I have no idea how
this is going to work out statistically, analytically, from a
size standpoint, from a fact that I think he's the
best NBA excuse me, the best college basketball center. I
don't know, Doug, maybe in twenty five years. When you
(33:07):
look at it, I mean he's the last time somebody
won back to back Masmith Awards was Ralph Sampson. So
I don't know about you, Doug, but to me, he's
the best college center in the last twenty five years,
if not further. And yet I'm not sure he's going
to how he's going to play in the NBA because
of the different style. I would say this, I would
assume the Memphis Grizzlies had long discussions and including with
(33:31):
their coach Taylor Jenkins, about look, he's going to be
available at nine, and how are we going to play him,
and what's going to be our strategy with him? Is
he going to be a backup center, play him against
second unit pig guys. I would think that they are
smart enough to have had many discussions about figuring out
(33:52):
how to play this guy. And I think one thing
he will do if you played through him, he's getting
a lot of people in foul trouble.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
And he will get intell trouble himself. I guess is
the other problem.
Speaker 5 (34:02):
Well, well that's the question. That's the question. And I
don't think we know how he's good again, even on
the defensive.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
Then that's all. That's that's I mean, I don't know
where you put him on defense, considering he didn't leave
the paint uh in college.
Speaker 5 (34:18):
But he's Doug. He's one of the biggest human beings
you ever see. There are plays in the championship game
where guys drove to the basket and they pretty much
said that I think I'm not gonna go all the way.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
The next level. They they they go over and around
a little bit differently and the angles are different. But
I'm with you. It's a mystery, like nine is so high?
And Dan, I thought you asked the question perfectly, Like
now you've got expectations and I get nine. You know,
how do you how do you play him? Camp? Do
you play them with John Morant? Like that? That part
doesn't make sense to me at all. Friendy, You're the
(34:51):
best man. Love the work with stadium. Thanks so much
for joining us, yere on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 5 (34:56):
My pleasure dog see Dan, all.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
Right, that's Frank for Schill Long Time Hoops analyst with
ESPN and this week with Stadium Sports UH Sliding into
the Weekend is brought to you by our partners with
Kings Hawaiian who wants you to get together with friends
and family to enjoy the weekend, making every Sunday a
Slider Sunday, which is Sunday. Just you know, Dan, we
(35:19):
have we call family Dinner at my house. My entire
team comes over. If you have a family member in town,
they have to come over. Brother, sister, girlfriend, potential girlfriend.
They off to come over. And we're gonna have slider Sundays.
This this Sunday. Are you gonna make slider? Are you
gonna make slider Sundays at my house? Is it next Sunday?
Is that? Is that? Is that where I'm looking at
with the clock? Is that? Yeah? I think? I think so.
(35:41):
I'm Doug Golli, He's Dan byer In for Dan and
the Dan Nets. But we're gonna resolve the most popular
sports debate of all time. Say we did there right?
Bring it to what else is being discussed in the
media that's up coming next.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am. Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Doug Gottlieb, Dan Byron for Dan Dannett's Fox Sports Radio
iHeartRadio app Alte you producer Jason Sewer alongside. So last
night there was a debate and presidential debate. But we
don't need to editorialize on what we saw or maybe
what we avoided watching on CNN. But we did think,
(36:33):
or at least Jason, you and Dan thought, listen, let's
do what the greatest sports debates of all time? This is.
Speaker 3 (36:41):
This is a little bit on the heels of what
we did on your show that airs on Fox Sports Radio,
and we did it yesterday. We drafted our favorite stupid
debates that happened on sports talk radio or amongst friends,
so kind of the cream of the crop of debates.
Now what we will do is find out where what
side where you stand on these stupid debates, because there
(37:03):
are a bunch of them, and we'll do this throughout
the show. Okay, by the way, big thanks to Corey
who politely reminded me that Bill Russell's number six is retired,
so my Bronnie James theory can go out the window.
And by politely he wrote, you both can't be this stupid.
I was a completely completely forgot about it, didn't even remember.
(37:29):
So I am sorry for sullying the reputation. Sorry Dan Patrick,
sorry Paully, sorry Seton, But I was that stupid onto
debates of debates of debates, Doug, the biggest debate that
actually was brought up yesterday was your pick of Jordan
versus Lebron. Now where do you stand on Jordan versus Lebron.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
I'm a Jordan guy. I don't actually think it's all
together all that close because I believe that we've lost
track of first, first and foremost. I don't do the
Bill Russell, even Kareem. I definitely don't do Wilt Chamberlain
or Jerry West. And it's not because they weren't all
(38:19):
great players. I don't think by the way Wilt stacks up,
and some of that is my dad was not a
Wilt fans. What was not a winning basketball player anyway.
Point is I wasn't alive really to watch, you know,
Bill Russell play, when I saw Kareem play with the Lakers,
like he was a shell of his former self. So
I go from eighty on right eighty on sure, and
(38:40):
I think that somehow Magic and Bird have been lost
in this debate. Like Maggi, John's the best point guard
ever played basketball, period stop, and he he and Bird
completely dominated the league for a decade in many people's estimation,
the golden era of the NBA before became the Jordan's League.
But I'm a Jordan guy. He was an un league
blonde ball defender. Obviously a remarkable score, but it was
(39:04):
in the ways in which his game evolved from being
the best driver and mid range player too eventually became
a great jump shooter later in his career and in
between and then late in his career he was an
unbelievable post player as well. I love the way Lebron
plays in many ways in terms of getting his teammates
involved and making him better. But basketball, and I coached basketball,
(39:28):
played professional collegiate basketball. The best player is just a
force of will guy that finds a way to win.
And once Jordan figured out how to win games, no
one could stop him. I'm a Michael Jordan guy.
Speaker 3 (39:40):
All right, mister President, your time is Jason Stewart. Where
do you lie on Jordan versus Lebron.
Speaker 1 (39:45):
I'm Jordan for all the same reasons.
Speaker 5 (39:47):
Jordan.
Speaker 3 (39:47):
Okay, I'm gonna say Lebron on this one, Joel Jordan
versus Lebron Joel Elliot or his team technical producer Jordan
for two reasons, and they're kind of the saying, sorry, Joel,
we're out of time against Bird, Magic versus Bird. In
our debate here, I'm thinking, Doug, you're going with Magic,
(40:08):
considering what you just said.
Speaker 2 (40:10):
No, who do you like? Ooh, You're going with Larry Bird?
Larry Bird, Larry Bird. I mean people forgetting them. Larry
Bird came to Celtics, I think they'd won twenty nine games.
They won sixty after his first year, and anyone who thinks, well, well,
Larry Bird wasn't athletic enough to play in this era.
(40:30):
Take Luca don Chik and grow him a couple of inches,
make him into an incredible rebounder, and you have Larry Bird.
Larry Bird is better than Luca. Luca is the best
offensive player in the league. I think he'd be Okay,
I'm I'm a Bird guy, obviously, though he didn't pass
(40:51):
as as he wasn't as flashy. Norty lead the league
and assist but he was a great passer. He was
an unbelievable rebounder, a remarkable score. I also think his
game would evolve you more with a three point shot.
It was just a bird guy. I don't know. I mean,
you had to choose bird magic. I grew up in
southern California. Everybody lusted over magic. You know magic. It
(41:13):
took him half his crew to learn how to shoot.
I'm a bird guy. I think only injury derailed that.
Injury and the lenbiased thing kind of derailed that train
from winning more titles.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
Larry Bird Overmat Jason Stewart, Magic Johnson. That's your all
time favorite player, right, Yes, Yes, I'm gonna go with
Doug on this. In Bird Joel, you get the final,
say Burder Magic, it's magic. He beat him in college,
he beat him in the pro. All right, the first two.
There are many more debates we need to settle coming
up later in the Dan Patrick Show.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
Oh I love that. And now here's the only thing, Dan,
if you're going to moderate, you're not supposed to take
a side you moderate. I'm just I'm just trying to
figure this thing out. That's fair point, all right. Coming
up next on the Dan Patrick Show. Did the NFL
ticket do anything wrong in a ballistic society? We'll discuss
next on The Dan Patrick Show.
Host
Doug Gottlieb
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Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!