May 3, 2025 • 48 mins
On this edition of the Best Of The Week of the Doug Gottlieb Show:Doug does a postmortem on the Lakers' season and gives the reasons why they lost the series against Minnesota.
Doug welcomes former NBA champion and former player of Gregg Popovich Antonio Daniels onto the show to talk about the legendary coach stepping down and to talk about the NBA Playoffs.
Doug welcomes NFL Media's Draft analyst Lance Zierlein onto the show to talk about Shedeur, Cam Ward and all of the headlines from the draft.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Thanks for listening to the best of the Doug Gottlieb
Show podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday
three to five Eastern twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio.
Find your local station for The Doug Gottlieb Show at
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Doug Gottlieb Show, Fox Sports Radio. Coming to you from
(00:27):
beautiful sunny Green Bay, Wisconsin. Hope you guys are great,
plus uh Los Angeles, California as well. A lot to
get to today as I'm really happy with this show
and happy to be with you, right, happy to be
with you. No, no, no, no, no you no, You're
(00:48):
a special You're a good one. You're great. I'm just okay, no, no,
welcome in so I am. I don't know about you,
but this is a switching time zone sort of thing, right.
Those Laker games can be late at night, and I
don't know what people expected, but the Lakers lose last
(01:09):
night also known as the Timberwolves won last night. It
does feel like the Lakers lost is the is the headline?
Whereas I didn't did Timberwolves win the game, and Jay Stu,
you brought up just a great point, which is like, hey,
wasn't it just a couple months ago or so that
we were like, yeah, they're not going to be they're
(01:30):
not gonna win a championship, but this is for the future.
And then people thought they're gonna win a championship. So
we'll dig into that in a second. Let's see a
little post mortem here. Here's Rob Polinka, GM of the Lakers,
also president of the Lakers. Remember he got a promotion
I think in no small part because he pulled off
the Luca trade. Did they lose in the first round
for Luca trade? Here's Rob Polinka talking about the priority
(01:52):
heading in the offseason.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
When you make a huge trade at the deadline where
you trade your starting center for a point guard, of
course that's going to create significant issues with the roster,
and we saw some of those play out. We know
this off season, you know, one of our primary goals
is going to be to add size in our front
court at the center position, and that's going to just
(02:15):
be part of the equation. We know we have a
lot of work to do on the roster and it'll
look different next year.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
For sure.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah. Again, I think's like it'll look different and the
way it usually works when you're building a team at
the start of the year. And again I can't speak
to running an NBA team. It's far different, but there
are some similarities. Right, an injury here there can change. Hey,
this is what we thought would be. You make a
trade mid season, which I don't think anybody thought they
(02:43):
would make going back before the trade deadline, Like nobody
was saying, hey, you know what's going to happen Luca
to the Lakers. It just wasn't discussed, and so they
did make a change. But I think it's fascinating this
whole Lakers thing, Like, isn't today the day that Nico
Harrison looks like he did the right thing? Isn't it?
(03:11):
It's just sports is amazing on how people get caught
up in the heat of the moment and they just
lose frankly, all their faculties. They just do you know,
they poop and pee themselves all over themselves. They can't
control themselves. Because when Luca and the Lakers were good,
(03:32):
oh my god, this is the biggest heist ever, right,
remember Jason kids, Like some people will compare this to
the Babe Ruth trade. Cool Like yeah, no, not cool
at all, but people were comparing it to that. And
then now you fast forward to we've only had the
Lakers only played four playoff games. Is that right? Five
(03:58):
five playoff games? Yeah, it's four games to one, five
five play five playoff games. In people are like, you know, hey,
Luca's not in great shapin. Boy, he really doesn't play defense,
and maybe Nico Harrison's onto something without playing a game,
without playing one single game in the actual playoffs, the
(04:22):
narrative around Nico Harrison from this guy's the biggest idiot buffoon.
When is Dallas going to get rid of him? To
you know, he might have been onto something, And I
guess that's sports, right, I guess that's sports because we
(04:42):
do the same thing with Lebron James. When he plays well,
you're like, goat, greatest of all time at forty years old.
I've heard several people on television, okay, various levels of
respect ontel, but not on television. They played, they've done something,
(05:04):
whatever say at times, you know, Lebron is still one
of the five best players in the NBA. And again,
in a small sample size, in one game here, one
game there. At forty years old. You can go like,
it's pretty amazing. Okay, I didn't actually watch the game,
but sure, and then last night you see him falter
in the fourth quarter, and suddenly it's the choke. You're like, well,
(05:27):
he's forty, played the whole game, the game before, it's
oh no, no, no. When he doesn't play, well, it's
he's forty. Now, he's always been forty, and you have
to always take it with a grain of salt. But
this is just I don't know, it's a remarkable thing
that happened last night. The turnaround for Niko Harrison without
(05:50):
doing a single thing right. It's like winning a battle
without firing a single shot. Crazy, the turnaround sports. What
are your thoughts on when you're watching the Lakers. I mean,
there's a more basketball centric discussion that I don't think
people necessarily have gotten yet. We'll get to that in
(06:10):
a second, But what are your thoughts on just how
much the world changed spun off its axis with the
Lakers falling again last night to the one.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
Yeah, it was Doug.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
It was kind of like almost a three step process
in my mind in thinking that the Mavericks and the
Lakers would have been better off this season for not
doing the trade in just terms of what Dallas has
and didn't have and what the Lakers didn't have. And
then he had the Mark Williams deal end up falling
(06:42):
apart in him not being acquired.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
So we knew that there was a gaping hole.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
And if you could rewind time, I think for the
short term, both teams would maybe say, all right, MAVs
would be better with Luca, Lakers would better with Anthony Davis.
But then the third step in all of this, Doug
just came to the point of and you touched on
the move, and we heard Rob Polinka off the top.
It's that acquiring Luca as part of this deal was
(07:06):
the long term move and it came at sacrificing one
of Lebron James's final seasons as of trying to win
another title, and that was the most I guess jarring
part of it. But if we go back to early
February and this trade isn't made, I think both teams
are probably in better position. I don't know, standings wise
and seed wise, you wouldn't be able to say that,
(07:28):
but in a better standing and position to succeed in
the playoffs than both Dallas and the Lakers ended up doing.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
No question, No question, it was a fairly impetuous move.
It was like, oh, we've done kind of in cover
of darkness, you know, on a Saturday night. Yeah, it was.
It was weird. It was weird, Like, is that really
how we want it to be done? You couldn't have
just waited to the off season. But I do think
that this pending potential contract extension, you know, is was
(07:57):
the energy behind it. It was just like, we, guys,
we can't sign this guy to a three hundred and
fifteen million dollars, you know, four year guaranteed deal. Can't
can't do it. And here's why. As I told you now,
I'm saying you, Dan Byer, I'm saying you listener, world,
(08:18):
you Nico is not an idiot. I've never understood how
someone can go from building a championship roster last year
to a complete buffoon this year. When the truth is
somewhere in the middle. He took some risk last year,
took some heat last year for some of the moves.
You know, people said Kyrie wouldn't work, or you shouldn't
(08:40):
extend Kyrie. He did it worked, and then Kyrie got hurt.
And Kyrie has had a lot of injuries in his career,
although not an ACL injury like he suffered this year,
but many of the other moves. Gafford coming over, that
was him. PJ. Washington coming over, that was him. Even
(09:00):
hiring Jason Kidd, that was him. Remember, Jason Kidd was
not thought of as a quality game coach in the NBA,
going back to his days in Milwaukee or the nets
he did. They got to an NBA Finals and no
one mentioned any of that. When they trade away Luca,
it was fire this guy. He's an idiot. There's got
(09:21):
to be something done. People in Dallas actually said, and
we had people come on the radio who said, hey,
even if Dallas wins a championship without Luca, this is
still a bad trade, which is the dumbest, dumb, dumb
stuff I've ever heard in my life. But it does
play into what I was getting to produces, which were
so overreactive to the immediate thing and we can't just
(09:44):
catch our breath and have some perspective on some stuff.
And I actually credit Jay Stu because Jay Stu was like,
and Dan, I'll get to you cause you're saying the
right thing as well, Jay Stu we're talking today, is like, hey,
wasn't this a long term move? I don't get he
didn't get when the when the playoff, when the betting
(10:05):
lines came out, Like, I don't explain this one to me,
and I can't except for the power of Lebron James.
And I think that's really it. And Dan's what Dan's
saying is right, which is like, look, truth is, your
teams were built for constructed a certain way. You shouldn't
let it played out and then make this trade in
the offseason. My only pushback that Dan would be I
(10:29):
actually think that was part of the genius with Nico
is he probably looked around the landscape of it and thought,
you know, this won't be perfect, but no one's perfect
in the West. And if I can build this incredible
wall of defenders and just figure out a way to
let Kyrie loose, like we might be able to do
(10:52):
something special winning games based upon our defense, which oh yeah,
by the way, is what Minnesota really has done, right.
They have all these like sized defenders where you can't
mismatch Hunt. But but you're right, I mean, truth is,
you had a team constructed. You completely changed the construction
(11:14):
or the layout of the team. And remember the trade
deadline is after the All Star breaks. This is late
in the year, and what did you expect the outcome
to be? But I think the answer is because Lebron James,
there's never any happy medium. It's either the worst or
the best and nothing in between.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Well, and this deal did come before the All Star Game,
because it was Yeah, but you're much more forgiving of
Nico in all of this because I, in your words,
I was one of the people that said I felt
that the Mavericks fans would rather have Luca on their
team than to have their Luca Mavericks win a championship. Now,
(11:54):
time may heal all wounds. I'm curious on how next year,
in the year after plays. But I still don't think
Nico is off the hook, despite the great moves that
he made the year prior, and we were giving him
his flowers at that point, and we.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
Were, but I don't know if if like there's no.
Speaker 4 (12:17):
Like the addition of Gafford and PJ. Washington last year
were huge, I mean, was it was the reason why
they were able to navigate the West and then they
just didn't have enough against Boston. But like those trade
deadline deals that they did last year were magnificent, and
I think that we gave Dallas the credit at that point,
(12:37):
and then I feel he gave it all back with
this trade. Whereas Polinka and I agree with you in
essence of if you want to say that, Look, Polenka
has made some good moves with Austin Reeves and Dalton
connect who was involved in that Mark Williams deal that
ended up falling apart, and bringing those guys and saying, Okay,
(12:59):
it's made some draft picks, he's done this and that.
That's I'm fine with saying that. But to have Luca
kind of fall in your lap and then say, okay,
as an organization that's built on stars, all right, we'll
do that deal. Yes, I think every other well I
would assume almost every other GM in the league would
do it. And so that's I'm just not ready to
forgive Nico and Polinka. I just think said, all right,
(13:23):
we'll sacrifice lebron potential championship year. I mean, after all,
we did draft this Sun and in exchange for that,
they get their franchise star for the next decade.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
Yeah, I'm I'm fasted by the way the Lakers go
from here because he's the here's the problem. Okay, the
Lakers lost last night for a myriad of reasons, and
a lot of people want to point to their defense
and rebounding that that's a huge part of it. Right Again,
here's the impetuous nature of the basketball fan. The most
(13:55):
made fun of star in the NBA is oh Dan.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
Byer Rudy Gobert.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Yes, okay, every year it's make fun of Rudy Gobert.
He stinks he's overpaid, you can't play him in big
playoff games, and all the Lakers did, Like this is
the whole thing with like how why are they playing
Maxi Kleeber like Uda Maxi Kleeber played for last year.
It's the same thing that you try and do with
Rudy Gobert. Make him guard out in the court in
(14:24):
space and then make him score in the post because
he has no post moves and you end up winning
that matchup. Three is more than two efficiency as opposed
to inefficients, right, and so that's all he tried to
do and exploit it it It didn't work. But the
issue with it is that though Lebron looks like he
(14:44):
should be a small ball five right, Like Lebron's six'
eight long, arms big, hands two hundred and sixty two
hundred and sixty five pounds strong as an, ox and
he used to be able to guard point guards and
you'd think. Bigs he's never been able to guard. Inside
he is not a good post player offensively or, defensively
(15:05):
as opposed To Draymond, green who's had half the offensive,
career half the, accolades and, like he doesn't look, bad
but it's not like his body looks like A greek
god Like lebron at six foot five, ish he, can
he's just that's what he. Does so but the problem
with The lakers from now until Whenever lebron, decides And
(15:27):
lebron is going to decide when he wants to not play,
again is your two best players are your two wish.
Defenders and that doesn't. Work you, know you can get
away with, one you can't get away with. Two and
last night they had. Three, right their three best offensive
players are their three worst defensive. Players and there's just
no hot in, that and none of them, rebound and
(15:49):
none of them play particularly good. Defense and it will never.
Work it hasn't and it. Won't and that's why you
Know Nico harrison goes defense wins championships is defensive, rebounding.
RIGHT i learned that the hard, way you can play.
Big you can play small for your small guys better.
Rebound you can play, big big guys better, rebound and
(16:11):
the big guys better bill contained the ball, guard the
ball guard the three point, line but you got a,
rebound SO i you, KNOW i think they're forever in that.
Speaker 5 (16:22):
Space this is the best of The done Dot Leaf
show On Fox Sports.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Radio WHAT i put You dog Gott Leave, Show Fox Sports,
radio coming to you from the tyreq dot com. Studios
this is The Doug Gottlieb, Show every, day same, time same.
Channel we've been doing this for a, minute. KIDS i
(16:47):
do feel like this is one of those asked the
coach moments we'll get to in a second where The
New york The New York knicks get a road win
over The Detroit. Pistons we were talking about this last.
Hour you just listen to the. Show Chris purfetts on
the board, today he's on the ones and. Twos he's
A detroit. Guy of, course you Got jay stew and
my main, Guy Dan, byer, who of course you'll hear
(17:10):
throughout the show and on, updates and you'll Hear sunday
as he gets like the greatest job of all time
is watching games and getting to talk about them as they.
Happen so you're like the rest of us Are, sundays you,
know whether you're, inside outside chasing kids around or hanging.
Out and he's, like, YEAH i was, working BUT i
was watching, sports and he loves, sports so that game
(17:31):
last night was. Fun it was. FUN i think it's
interesting how perception and reality don't actually match. Up you'll
have people that go, Like i'm done with THE, NBA
i won't watch THE. Nba it's, like, okay WELL i
watched THE nba BECAUSE i love basketball AND i love
playoffs sports of most every. Kind and do we remember
(17:55):
that the football playoffs many of those games were kind of.
Boring and last Night i'm watching That pistons game with
The knicks And i'm, like this is a hell of
a basketball. Game and Then i'm Watching clippers And. Nuggets i'm,
like this hell of a. Game haven't you guys been into?
It the new into?
Speaker 3 (18:14):
It, Down i'm not into. IT i not. EITHER i
have not been.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
There it does look, cool it does look kind of
unique where they have the wall the. Wall it is weird,
though that a play that a franchise that has traditionally
had some of the worst fans and worst teams in
professional sports has this one area dedicated to like home.
Course it's a great idea that you feel like college
(18:40):
fans should.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
HAVE i feel that that whole area is is. Weird
AND i know The. Forum The forum was redone and
is a great concert. Venue but for for them to
then just build basically a new arena a block away
just SEEMS i don't, know like it's it's funny that
(19:02):
there wasn't like an effort to ever put any more
sports into The.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
Forum that's a great that's a great.
Speaker 3 (19:11):
Point sorry to derail the, topic but.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
No, no it's actually not a bad. Topic the weird
part about it for people who aren't From Los. Angeles,
okay so it's ALL la and Is inglewood technically a,
city like do you? Have they have their own mayor
and voting, body they don't have their own school. DISTRICT
i don't know how it all, works But, INGLEWOOD i,
guess is a city within the city Of Los. Angeles
(19:35):
maybe it's its own. City But inglewood was Called city Of.
Champions so they used to Have Hollywood, park which is
obviously a horse racing, park which now Is Sofi. Stadium
they used to have The forum as a basketball venue
versus The, forum The Fabulous. Forum then it was The
Great Western forum for a long. Time shout out to
Great Western. Bank it's a Great Western bank still. EXISTS
(19:56):
i don't.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
KNOW i don't, know BUT i didn't realize that there
Was Great Western. Bank as someone who grew up in The,
MIDWEST i just thought that they just renamed with The
Great Western. Forum kind of like How staples became so
synonymous with that arena THAT i don't Think staples got
anything from. It like there was. Zero nobody was, like,
Well i'm going to go and get my highlighters now From.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Staples does any does that actually work for?
Speaker 3 (20:18):
ANYTHING i think it does for a little.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
WHILE i, think give, me give me the place that
it works.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
FOR i think that any like, state like for, Example,
staples probably at first people are, like, Oh i'm going
to go To.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
Staples i'm gonna.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
Go, yeah but do you? Go likes if you're going To.
Staples then you see an office deep but you're, like you,
know it's the same.
Speaker 4 (20:36):
THING i think after a while it became so synonymous
with that it runs its. Course but when you're a
new brand trying to get out, THERE i do feel
that there is there is value to.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
It has anybody invested in crypto because Of Crypto?
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Arena, no WHAT i guarantee people went to crypto dot.
Speaker 4 (20:56):
Com i'm, Sorry jason's got his hands out his head
have completely derailed the.
Speaker 3 (21:02):
TOPIC i don't.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
THINK i think it Was, actually, no we don't have.
To this is actually an interesting, topic. Right i'm a marketing,
major a marketing degree from The Spears school Of business
At Oklahoma State, university and it's one of those things
that it actually in the business of, sports it's incredibly
valuable to sell these. Pieces but does it actually does? Anyone?
(21:25):
LIKE i think? That is it still The Target center In?
Minnesota Scott shapiro is going to be texting us at some.
Point our boss is A timberwolves.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
Fan that's that's WHAT i call.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
It but IT'S i think it's still The Target. Center
and so that one makes sense because Though target is,
uh you, know everyone knows The target is not, like
oh my, God, TARGET i didn't know What target. Was
you didn't know it was based In minneapolis until you
heard The target center was In. Minneapolis but HAS i
want you to try and be. Honest is there ever
(21:57):
have you ever gone and shopped anywhere looked anything? Up
not do, people BECAUSE i think you're probably Right dan
and that there's there has to be people who search
these places when they see. It but have you? Personally
has there ever been a venue Like? MetLife have you
ever gone, like, Oh? MetLife you know, What i'm going
to go and turn my is it? Portfolio is? It
(22:19):
what Is? MetLife i don't even? Know is it? Healthcare
has anybody ever actually?
Speaker 6 (22:23):
Here?
Speaker 1 (22:23):
Yeah, yeah has anybody like you know? WHAT i was
going to use some other healthcare, service but the giants Playing,
MetLife so Now i'm going to go and Use.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
MetLife Well i'm pretty.
Speaker 6 (22:34):
Sure i'm pretty. Sure it's a provider for like companies
to give insurance to their. Employees so it's it's like a,
corporate corporate kind of.
Speaker 4 (22:43):
Sponsor i'll say this during The Final fours And Super
bowls when you're Or World series. WHATEVER i just know
during The Final four when there's like a pizza tie
in to The final, four or Like Buffalo Wild wings
has it. Pizza that advertising does work now in the
name brand of constantly Saying crypto dot. Com IF i
(23:05):
wanted to get into, CRYPTO i think the first place
THAT i would probably go Is crypto dot.
Speaker 6 (23:10):
COM i just want to know, why you, know The
Detroit pistons moved To Little Caesars arena down from The
palace Of Auburn hills and they missed the opportunity to
call it The Little Caesar's Pizza.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Palace why would they call it The Pizza Pizza.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Palace Pizza Pizza.
Speaker 6 (23:24):
Palace there you, go, Now Little.
Speaker 4 (23:27):
Caesars even though The palace Of Auburn hills saw some great,
basketball the location wasn't necessarily. Ideal and that's the point
of The forum of if you're now building an arena
a block away next to AN nfl, Stadium and AGAIN i,
UNDERSTAND i, Went i've been to a concert at the
(23:49):
at The, forum but it just seems like that venue
would have been one to save or to try to
refurbish or make new again instead of just going and
building an entirely new.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
One but WELL i.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
WOULD i would tell you a couple of. Things The
forum is owned by THE msg. People YEAH i don't
mean mon sootam, GLUTAMATE i MEAN msg.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
Like james Dolem.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
Garden, yeah, Yeah James. Dolt so they owned, it they
turned to a concert concert, venue whereas into it is
a piece of land that was bought By Steve bohmer
and they they developed it on their. Own so some
of it is like who owns it or. WHATEVER i
would also tell you THAT i think though renovating it
sounds like a really cool idea when it was renovated for,
concerts as you pointed. Out but, two LIKE i you
(24:37):
know they'd have to. RENOVATE i mean they have to
basically go down to the studs to do it for
a for a basketball. Venue also how different basketball venues.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
ARE i also think that the history of The lakers
in that, building for The clippers to take it, over
for The clippers trying to form their own.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Identity would be would be. Cool, yes, WELL.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
I think them separating it and saying, like we're not
going to do something that The lakers did because we've
always been in The lakers. SHADOW i get not wanting
to go. There but like that that, stadium the arena
that they redid In seattle to reconfigure and make ready
for The kraken to go. In, yes basically the roof
was put on, stilts, yeah you, know and they then
(25:17):
they redid the whole. Thing so when you're doing that
sort of work to keep the roof because it was
a protected landmark to be able to go to those,
LENGTHS i just was surprised that maybe similar efforts weren't
made for a place like The. FORUM i get some
places are, just you, know way. Gone there's nothing you
(25:38):
can do about, it and you just have to move
on from the. Facility but it's just funny that The
forum is still standing in a refurbished, way and then
a block down the road there's a brand NEW nba
arena that's going to host The All Star game next,
year and the whole.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Deal well that's part of the thing, though is that they.
Did they came into city Of, champions known for The
lakers and built their own, Arena AND i still think
the window is there for. Them it's closing because my
guess would be that at some point The lakers figure
it out With, Luca but there still is A if
The clippers could ever figure it out and build a consistent,
winner they have a better. Arena they have a better, arena,
(26:18):
sure but it's hard to conceive that they're still like The,
nets where no matter what The nets, do they're not The.
Knicks no matter what The clippers, do they're not The.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
Lakers and outside Of Madison Square, GARDEN i don't know
how many historic places we now have in THE, nba,
RIGHT i, mean like THE tv Gardens bend there. Forever
but it's not The Boston, garden, RIGHT i, mean it's
not The Larry, Bird Kevin, McHale Robert parrish going back
To Celtic city in the whole. Deal, like it's still
(26:48):
a newer. Facility there aren't any places that you can
really do that.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
Anymore has everybody's got a new.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Arena it's The Doug Gottlieb show here On Fox Sports. Radio,
Okay so the last night was played at is it
The Little Caesars arena or The Little Caesar's? Colisseum?
Speaker 6 (27:05):
Uh the Arena little Caesar? Arena.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Okay So Jalen brunson was. Magnificent he hits the game
winning three point. Shot Here's Tom, thibodeau his head, coach
talk About Jayleen brunson's mental.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
Tools that's what makes them so.
Speaker 7 (27:18):
Special and you know we talk, about you, know the
all the intangibles that it's his makeup and oftentimes you,
know that's that's where MISTAKES i think are made in
the draft and things like. That and there's it's easy
to see like how many points of guy scores or
what the physical tools tools, are but when you look
(27:40):
at the mental, tools that's.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
Everything.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Yeah there was a certain radio host who when he
signed as a free agent with The knicks said he
is a force multiplier and he's worth every penny because
remember when he signed with the nixts beer, like, oh
The knicks paid too, much, Right dan only gave, him you,
know it was like fifty something million over three, years
(28:07):
but THEY i can't remember the exact. Number but they
also hired his. Dad and my point is that That
Jalen brunson is a culture. CHANGER i didn't know he
had that level of offensive scoring in his. Bag he's
become way better than EVEN i could have ever thought he.
Was but the point is that you needed you need
(28:31):
somebody to believe in the process that you're tried to embark.
On and you, Know tibbs identified, him got his dad.
There you, know the president is he's a former client
of the. President so he is a, walking talking billboard
in the locker room for what you're building In New.
(28:52):
York and he is a guy that everybody respects in.
Basketball people respect guys that get more of their god
given talent than they. Should he's not super, tall he's
not super. Athletic he's just super tough and unbelievably, skilled unbelievably.
Skilled and you, know at the, TIME i felt LIKE
(29:17):
i was like the lone defender of this, Move, like
what are The knicks? Doing? Now does that mean they're
gonna WIN nba? Championship, no there's an expression in THE
nba where they, say, hey that's great, defense just better.
OFFENSE i thought that's what happened on the last. Play
but you guys have been asking, me and people ask, me,
like don't you double team him? THERE i don't think
(29:38):
so That the spacing is so different in THE, nba
and guys are so, skilled and, remember players don't miss open.
Shots they just. Don't and if you put two on the,
basketball somebody's wide. Open now you could make the case that,
hey he was wide open there because he made an
insane move against Swer thompson that he you, know slipped
(30:01):
and kind of. Slid it was almost out of a.
Movie it was The Michael jordan push off without him
actually pushing, off because it was A Sor thompson who
kind of slipped and got his momentum, going you, know
going that direction towards the. Sideline that's as good a,
shot a good move as you're ever gonna find without
any sort of push, off without any sort of of
(30:23):
potential offensive. FOUL i thought it was amazing prefet as
A pistons, guy as A detroit. Guy can you are
you like? That we should have double teamed. Him he's
the because remember he got The Clutch award for the
most clutch player in THE. NBA i was listening To
Dan patrick earlier today and he's, like, hey he's the
most clutch player in THE. Nba who'd you think was
going to take the? Shot and my point, is, YEAH i,
(30:45):
mean you could have run Two. Adam but if you
run Two, adam you're automatically in. Scramble you're in, scramble
and somebody's going to be wide open for a dunk
or for a, layup and it might well Be Jalen.
Speaker 6 (30:56):
Runson, YEAH i think in that, moment like all you
can do is have the defender on him and just
hope it doesn't get out of. Hand but the point
is you don't want to even give The knicks the
life in that, game and it feels like every last
game in this The pistons just let The knicks come
back into. This, like if you want an answer on
how to Stop Jalen, brunson it's don't Play Asar thompson
(31:18):
only twenty three minutes when he's getting shot clock violations
on him left and, right just playing the more.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Problem the, problem the problem with playing him is right,
now all you can do is kind of play him
in the. Dunker he's really. Effective he's a great, driver great,
athlete but he can't shoot. Yet SO i understand the
thought that you're, like, hey just playing the whole game
shut Down Jalen. Brunson and that's probably the smart way
to look at, it right because.
Speaker 6 (31:43):
Just just late in the game where it feels, like once
again like The pistons had this lead that they cling
on to for the entire for the entire game and
then five minutes left in the fourth quarter and it's
slowly quickly evaporating and everyone knows what's about to, Happen, Like,
yeah this is the best of The Dune Gottli show
On Fox Sports.
Speaker 1 (32:01):
Radio It's Doug Gotlieb, Show Fox Sports radio at the
Lands airlines going to join u S CS Nfl draft
analyst FOR Nfl, media get his thoughts on the, draft
Cam Ward and, Yes Stuart, byer you, were you were In,
(32:22):
la your home state Of, wisconsin put on a great.
Show give me your thoughts on The shador thing on
how it it really took over took over the.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
Draft, YEAH i actually think that there are some parallels
to what happened in THE nba draft last.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Summer not a great draft class at.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
ALL i, mean it Was Zachar rezache that went number
one overall in the, draft and we really didn't pay
much mind to a lot of the players in THE Nba,
draft but we did pay attention To Bronnie, james AND
i felt like that was this. Situation there weren't a
lot of guys headline makers in this. Draft it was
(32:57):
a bad draft. Class something that we've talked about for
weeks on this. Show so then when you have a
player who was really one of the players that you
would to talk, about one of the very select, few
then have the fall that he. DID i think it
naturally then just overtook the entire.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Weekend yeah it, WAS i, mean it was the WHOLE i,
mean it really did overtake the whole. Weekend it was,
like because it didn't happen the first, day it didn't
happen the second, day and they're, like, wow, YEAH i,
mean and then you, Know sunday was left to kind
of clean Up aisle six and what was the biggest?
Storyline it had to be that, one.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
You, know and you're hearing you off the top and
we were even talking in the. BREAKS i think all
of us have like different opinions whatever on The kuiper.
SITUATION i actually think it was a huge win FOR
espn and Whether kuiper was right or, wrong and he
was obviously wrong on the evaluation Of shoud Or, sanders
but he wasn't the only. One but isn't that part
(33:55):
of what Mel kiper? IS i, mean we had a
was it A i feel a draft OR i got
dibbs where we were talking draft, moments and we're still
playing the Mel kuiper cut from thirty years. Ago SO
i think that, obviously, obviously like those misjudgments haven't hurt
his career at. All and SO i actually think that
(34:16):
outside of Shed Or, sanders Mel kuiper was the second
most talked about person at THIS nfl. Draft and If I'M,
ESPN i actually am happy about it because now next
year people are going to, say, well what's mel gonna
say this? Year or who Does mel? Have is he
gonna hit or? Miss AND i think it can you,
know becomes more of a.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Conversation, yeah It's it's a really good way of looking at.
IT i think that the point the difference is when
you take a, guy it's like almost better for. Him
if a guy goes earlier than he. Should then if
he calls out the whole league and basically calls the league, idiots,
(34:54):
sure you, KNOW i don't know what they're, Doing, like, OKAY.
Speaker 4 (34:57):
I always think he's fighting for respect to even after
all these, years because he's not been On he's not
on the other side of the velvet. Rope wasn't a
scout Like Daniel jeremiah not in the front office he's
kind of been THE i don't want to say the
outsider because it doesn't feel. Right but he's not AN
nfl personnel, guy AND i feel that he's maybe there's
(35:18):
like a bit of an insecurity in, that and that
came out even after all of these years of doing.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
It BUT i don't know if that's. IT i really
don't know if that's. It you, know there's a bunch
of different thoughts on what it could. Be, Look i've
worked enough With bell to know he's a as a,
person a gem of a. Guy, sure everybody really likes.
HIM i don't think it's that. INSECURITY i think it's
(35:43):
one of two. Things he just couldn't believe, it or he's,
like you, know one of the Things mel does Is
mel is not an old school personnel, guy right. Doesn't
he doesn't like have out his notebook and go to
college games and grade stuff. Out he talks to people
and he kind of gets can sesstence to views from
people that he, trusts AND i almost feel like this is.
(36:04):
Him Last, YANNA i can't believe all these GUYS i
trust told me something that's not. True It's Doug Gottlieb
show On Fox Sports. Radio let's let's catch up With Lancer,
LINE nfl draft analysts for THE nfl. Media FOR Nfl,
media the one name that kind of overtook all THE
nfl draft was not the number one player taken in Cam. Ward,
(36:24):
instead it Was. Shador what was your eval Of shador
throughout throughout the last couple of years AT, SeeU.
Speaker 5 (36:31):
YEAH i, had you, KNOW i didn't focus as much
on his twenty three. Tape USUALLY i watched two years on.
QUARTERBACKS i watched his touchdowns and his, interceptions and that
was about. IT i watched one game from, there BUT
i thought he was a lot better in twenty, Four
SO i focus was my. Evaluation you. Know, CONVERSELY i
(36:51):
focused most of my evail On quinn yours on twenty
three BECAUSE i know he was hurt from much twenty.
Four in terms Of, shador you, know it was a
pretty it's a pretty easy email to. ME i THOUGHT
i put a bottom of the second round grade on.
HIM i thought he was the second best quarterback in this,
draft behind Cam, ord who had a high second round
(37:12):
grade to late first round. Grade, now from a projection, standpoint,
obviously you know those guys typically get pushed up a
little bit if you're first and second in the. Class
but you, know from an evaluation, standpoint very average arm,
strength very average off, platform adequate in terms of, timing
extremely accurate, throws a good, accuracy a terrific. Poise in the,
(37:35):
pocket he's got good pocket, maneuverability so he can slide
around the. Pocket he's not the fastest guy outside of the,
pocket but in the pocket he's pretty. Elusive it takes
way too many, sacks holds onto it and plays he
wrote ball way too. Often has the ability to work
all three, levels but needs to work with. Timing he's
a player who's very tough when he's in, there and
(37:55):
he's extremely confident and you, know brash airing and whatever
you want to. SAY i like the up and it's
in the. Pocket he doesn't get easily. Rattled you get
a sense that he's not trying to convince himself that
he's a tough. Quarterback it's just it comes naturally for.
Him so a lot of WHAT i liked about Shud
Door sanders had to do with, intangibles WHICH i don't.
MINIMIZE i think a lot of times when we look
at why a quarterbacks succeeded that we didn't. Expect it
(38:18):
comes down to. INTANGIBLES i think you have to factor that,
in but make a. Mistake he's a game manager who
tries to play like a playmaker a little bit too.
Often so the concern for me was going to be
could he not try to be prime, son you, know
his own brand and quote unquote you, know. Legendary can
can he get a guy that drives the? Ship AND
(38:38):
i had some concerns AND i still do have concerns
about whether or not he can be okay just being
a game.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
Manager and then you factor in the other, parts right
then you factor in how he handled himself with. TEAMS
i mean it's the there were only you, KNOW i
don't know six seven teams that felt like they need
to Starting caliper. Quarterback and if you don't grade out
as one on some people's or you're on the board
(39:05):
line and then you blow off a couple of those
six or, seven you're almost asking for this sort of,
result aren't.
Speaker 5 (39:12):
You, Yeah, now when it comes to me putting a
grade on a, GUY i don't you, know it's all
take the off the field stuff and the you know
that comes Later in terms of my, assessment when on
going TO tv things like that WHENEVER i hear, stories
AND i have to be honest with, YOU i found
out a lot. MORE i expected him to fall out
of day. One i'd heard The giants like Like Jackson,
(39:33):
dart SO i expected The giants and The saints to
be the two teams that try to trade up into
the first round kind of battle each other For Jackson.
Dart that was my. EXPECTATION i Thought schador could go
in there somewhere if maybe The browns traded up for.
Him but, really you, Know i've had him at twenty,
nine twenty four to twenty. One. OH i thought That
steelers at one POINT i thought that was going to
be a, hit and THEN i had some intel late
(39:55):
that it probably was not going to be The. Steelers,
well once that factor that, IN i, thought, man he's
probably going to slide out of the first round because
The steelers are really the only spot pump to. Me
THEN i found out afterwards that to your, Point, doug
he had very few teams to have even interviewed, with
like you just you, know you weren't on his, list
(40:16):
and then you weren't interviewing viewing, him and then you,
know not being able to get, through not being willing
to get through questions about, install questions about you, know
working through the, install working through the whiteboard in terms
of where to go with the, ball where to do?
This he, asked apparently asked one, team, well what are
you going to? Do just around me with weapons and offensive,
(40:36):
line just stuff that you just you, know you're just
there to. Be you, know it's a job. INTERVIEW i,
MEAN i understand the, brash confidence and all that, stuff
BUT i think he was his own worst enemy and
in many, Ways and so what happened was once he
slid out of the you, know really out of the top,
forty you, know the quarterback needy teams you're, drafting a
lot of teams who might have considered drafting him. Didn't
(40:57):
they just didn't have the intel they needed because they
had not been able to get the you, know they
had not been able to have the, meetings figure out
his football, intelligence figure out his you, know they just
get a feel for the person because they hadn't had
to have those opportunities to find out who he. Was,
so you, know once your pass the first two, rounds
(41:18):
you should be on the board for about fourteen, teams
AND i don't think that was the case with schand Nor.
SANDERS i think a lot of teams like we just you,
know a we don't know enough about, him and of
course do you want to deal with everything that potentially
comes with, it which was that you, know each team
had to make their own assessment that was overvalued or
that was a real.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Problem LASER i joined us here in The dug Out
leave show On Fox Sports. Radio, okay let's talk about
some other. Teams The Green Bay packers drafted a wide
receiver in the first, round and obviously the place, erupted, Erupted,
okay but now there's a lot of pressure On Matthew
golden and they had this super deep wide received a.
(42:00):
Room what are your thoughts on The packers.
Speaker 5 (42:02):
Draft, well they have a super deep wide receiver room
with a bunch of guys that have trouble catching the.
Football SO i, mean how deep are you if you
just have a bunch of. Drops that's kind of my.
Concern AND i Had Matthew goland in my last mock,
draft you, know track to The packers and everyone gave
me crap about. It but the fact, is at some
point when you give quarterbacks as much money as you're giving. Them,
(42:24):
now you really have no choice but to make. Sure
we saw it With Lamar. Jackson we've seen him With
Josh allen at different, times and you, know now there's
a question about Is buffalo doing enough For Josh. Allen
now With Stefan diggs, gone you've got, to you, know
you got. To you got to load up with with
some talent for these super expensive. Quarterbacks AND i think
that they what they wanted to do Is Matthew Golden's
(42:46):
basically they're, saying, look we got too many guys who
dropped the ball that are not. Consistent their contracts will
be up in a couple of. Years let's get another
guy in here that that can turn into potentially a,
one even THOUGH i Think golden's more of a. Two,
let's you, know let's SAY i can find a guy
that really meshes With jordan Loves now save Me On,
williams who they drafted in the third. Round you, know
he is a not a good route. Runner he is
(43:08):
not a true wide. Receiver what he is is like
A Cordero patterson type player who you just get the
ball in his. Hands he is a dynamic an incredible,
athlete great, beat super, explosive loose, limb but he's not
really a route, runner so he's kind of a. Specialist
i'm interested to see how The packers utilize, him BUT
(43:28):
i think it's really become what we're Seeing. Dougs teams, understand,
man we're paying fifty and sixty million to these. Quarterbacks
we have to get something out of. Them and that's.
Why you, know that's Why jacksonville moves up and Targets Travis.
Hunter that's Why Brian thomas was the first runner For.
Jacksonville that's why every team that has a young. Quarterback
you look at The bears went tight end and wide
(43:49):
receiver with their first two. Picks all these team with
young quarterbacks and teams with super expensive quarterbacks are, saying
let's make sure we give them the best chance. Possible all, right.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Cam, ward what's his likeli to? SUCCESS i think it's pretty.
Speaker 5 (44:04):
Good he's all about, ball loves football. Always i've always
known that about. Him that's been you, know that was
told to me By scout when he was At Washington.
State he's very serious about. Ball he's a guy who
came up from from the, mud as they, say with
incarnate word zero star. Prospect hungary doesn't take anything for.
Granted he's got a plus plus, arm can fit the
(44:26):
ball in the tight. Windows there's times where his game
reminds me Of Brett barb in terms of the high end,
stuff and then the mistakes that he's willing to make
that really hurts his. Team so there's there's the plus
and the minus in terms of what that's you know
how that. Goes but when you start talking about his
ability to extend plays and make big time throws into
(44:46):
tight windows on all three, levels he's number, One like
he is the, guy and there's no one else in
this draft to really come close to. That his issue
is going to be have to be he has to
eliminate his desire to play that hero. Ball the longer
he's days off, schedule the worst the decision making gets.
Sometimes so that's going to have to be coached out of.
Him i'd like to see him use his legs. More
(45:08):
he tries, to you, know stay in the pocket and
keep passes alive too. Much at some point pull it
down and, go you, know just pull it down and
go and get to the next. Play but he's got.
Talent he can throw our pos's he can he can
throw with some accuracy when his feet are are. Right
AND i like the fact that he's really you got
(45:29):
to put some woe on, him not to go on.
Him in other, words he's going to attack down the.
Field you can dial that back a little. Bit guys
who are super, conservative that's a mindset that you can't,
change you. Know and you'd, Agree, Dog you've been around
sports long enough to know there's some guys that you, know,
man he's going to cut it. Loosen THERE'S i always
say it's like. This you got two people at a blackjack,
(45:50):
table one who's shuffling hips back into their pocket because
they want to minimize the risk with a little. Profit
and then you got the guys that, can you, know
turn it into a twenty or thirty thousand dollars run
because they get hot and they're pressing and they're taking.
Chances Cam ward is a guy who's going to take his.
Chances and there's some negative that comes with, it but
you know, what you can also win at a high
(46:11):
level when you have a quarterback like.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
That Lancerline john against Here Doug Gottlieb, Show Fox Sports.
Radio you were most impressed with which team's.
Speaker 5 (46:18):
DRAFTS i think The bears did a good. Job, Loveland Luther,
BURDEN i mean those. Guys LOVELAND i thought was right
there With Tyler. WARREN i had no problem with him
being the first tight. End Luther burden was high value
at thirty. NINE i, thought other Than Travis, Hunter burden
is actually the best wide receiver in the. Draft Schamar
turner And Ozzie, trapillo guys they got in the second.
(46:40):
ROUND i thought their second round picks worth were really really.
Good they got to kid in the fist Is Off,
frasier who is a lot Like Tarik wooland coming out
OF utsa a couple of years. Ago he has you,
know he's been in college football for six, years but
he just has one year where he really put it all,
together coming from you, know smaller. Schools he's, tall he's,
fast in its tremendous ball. SKILLS i thought. THAT i
(47:02):
thought that The Tampa Bay bucks did a great. Job
The Mecca oak AT, Buca Benjamin, morrison the cornerback out
of A Notre. Dame Jacob, parrish another corner out Of
Kansas state WHO i think is highly underrated as a
third round, pick and they got a couple of rushers
And David walker And Elijah. ROBERTS i thought they did
a really nice job with only having six. PICKS i
(47:22):
thought they came away with a really good. Draft and,
then you, know, HONESTLY i, THINK i think you have
to look at what the forty nine. Ers the forty
nine ers did a pretty good job as well as
The New England. Patriots patriots came away with a very
good defensive tackle who dropped a little bit for, Medicals Josh,
Farmer Kyle williams And Treyvon. Henderson are you kidding? Me
(47:43):
you Get Kyle williams at sixty nine And Traygion henderson
at thirty, eight and then of course you know you
attacked your offensive Line Will. CAMPBELL i don't love the
fact that they had to reach a little bit of
four For Will. Campbell but when you're, desperate you, know
when you're desperate and you don't have a position locked,
up solidified where you don't have to, reach and that's what.
Happens you have to draft a certain. Position it was
(48:05):
not a great year to need, tackle so they really
had no choice but to take a tackle. There you
couldn't wait until second. Round.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Lance awesome stuff, man great balance to analysis before the,
draft during the, draft after the. Draft really appreciate, You
joyce On Fox Sports.
Speaker 5 (48:18):
Radio, yeah you got to appreciate. It
Thanks for listening to the best of the Doug Gottlieb
Show podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday
three to five Eastern twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio.
Find your local station for The Doug Gottlieb Show at
boxsports radio dot com, or stream us live every day
on the iHeartRadio app by searching as r Booming of America.
Doug Gottlieb Show, Fox Sports Radio. Coming to you from
(00:27):
beautiful sunny Green Bay, Wisconsin. Hope you guys are great,
plus uh Los Angeles, California as well. A lot to
get to today as I'm really happy with this show
and happy to be with you, right, happy to be
with you. No, no, no, no, no you no, You're
(00:48):
a special You're a good one. You're great. I'm just okay, no, no,
welcome in so I am. I don't know about you,
but this is a switching time zone sort of thing, right.
Those Laker games can be late at night, and I
don't know what people expected, but the Lakers lose last
(01:09):
night also known as the Timberwolves won last night. It
does feel like the Lakers lost is the is the headline?
Whereas I didn't did Timberwolves win the game, and Jay Stu,
you brought up just a great point, which is like, hey,
wasn't it just a couple months ago or so that
we were like, yeah, they're not going to be they're
(01:30):
not gonna win a championship, but this is for the future.
And then people thought they're gonna win a championship. So
we'll dig into that in a second. Let's see a
little post mortem here. Here's Rob Polinka, GM of the Lakers,
also president of the Lakers. Remember he got a promotion
I think in no small part because he pulled off
the Luca trade. Did they lose in the first round
for Luca trade? Here's Rob Polinka talking about the priority
(01:52):
heading in the offseason.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
When you make a huge trade at the deadline where
you trade your starting center for a point guard, of
course that's going to create significant issues with the roster,
and we saw some of those play out. We know
this off season, you know, one of our primary goals
is going to be to add size in our front
court at the center position, and that's going to just
(02:15):
be part of the equation. We know we have a
lot of work to do on the roster and it'll
look different next year.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
For sure.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah. Again, I think's like it'll look different and the
way it usually works when you're building a team at
the start of the year. And again I can't speak
to running an NBA team. It's far different, but there
are some similarities. Right, an injury here there can change. Hey,
this is what we thought would be. You make a
trade mid season, which I don't think anybody thought they
(02:43):
would make going back before the trade deadline, Like nobody
was saying, hey, you know what's going to happen Luca
to the Lakers. It just wasn't discussed, and so they
did make a change. But I think it's fascinating this
whole Lakers thing, Like, isn't today the day that Nico
Harrison looks like he did the right thing? Isn't it?
(03:11):
It's just sports is amazing on how people get caught
up in the heat of the moment and they just
lose frankly, all their faculties. They just do you know,
they poop and pee themselves all over themselves. They can't
control themselves. Because when Luca and the Lakers were good,
(03:32):
oh my god, this is the biggest heist ever, right,
remember Jason kids, Like some people will compare this to
the Babe Ruth trade. Cool Like yeah, no, not cool
at all, but people were comparing it to that. And
then now you fast forward to we've only had the
Lakers only played four playoff games. Is that right? Five
(03:58):
five playoff games? Yeah, it's four games to one, five
five play five playoff games. In people are like, you know, hey,
Luca's not in great shapin. Boy, he really doesn't play defense,
and maybe Nico Harrison's onto something without playing a game,
without playing one single game in the actual playoffs, the
(04:22):
narrative around Nico Harrison from this guy's the biggest idiot buffoon.
When is Dallas going to get rid of him? To
you know, he might have been onto something, And I
guess that's sports, right, I guess that's sports because we
(04:42):
do the same thing with Lebron James. When he plays well,
you're like, goat, greatest of all time at forty years old.
I've heard several people on television, okay, various levels of
respect ontel, but not on television. They played, they've done something,
(05:04):
whatever say at times, you know, Lebron is still one
of the five best players in the NBA. And again,
in a small sample size, in one game here, one
game there. At forty years old. You can go like,
it's pretty amazing. Okay, I didn't actually watch the game,
but sure, and then last night you see him falter
in the fourth quarter, and suddenly it's the choke. You're like, well,
(05:27):
he's forty, played the whole game, the game before, it's
oh no, no, no. When he doesn't play, well, it's
he's forty. Now, he's always been forty, and you have
to always take it with a grain of salt. But
this is just I don't know, it's a remarkable thing
that happened last night. The turnaround for Niko Harrison without
(05:50):
doing a single thing right. It's like winning a battle
without firing a single shot. Crazy, the turnaround sports. What
are your thoughts on when you're watching the Lakers. I mean,
there's a more basketball centric discussion that I don't think
people necessarily have gotten yet. We'll get to that in
(06:10):
a second, But what are your thoughts on just how
much the world changed spun off its axis with the
Lakers falling again last night to the one.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
Yeah, it was Doug.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
It was kind of like almost a three step process
in my mind in thinking that the Mavericks and the
Lakers would have been better off this season for not
doing the trade in just terms of what Dallas has
and didn't have and what the Lakers didn't have. And
then he had the Mark Williams deal end up falling
(06:42):
apart in him not being acquired.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
So we knew that there was a gaping hole.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
And if you could rewind time, I think for the
short term, both teams would maybe say, all right, MAVs
would be better with Luca, Lakers would better with Anthony Davis.
But then the third step in all of this, Doug
just came to the point of and you touched on
the move, and we heard Rob Polinka off the top.
It's that acquiring Luca as part of this deal was
(07:06):
the long term move and it came at sacrificing one
of Lebron James's final seasons as of trying to win
another title, and that was the most I guess jarring
part of it. But if we go back to early
February and this trade isn't made, I think both teams
are probably in better position. I don't know, standings wise
and seed wise, you wouldn't be able to say that,
(07:28):
but in a better standing and position to succeed in
the playoffs than both Dallas and the Lakers ended up doing.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
No question, No question, it was a fairly impetuous move.
It was like, oh, we've done kind of in cover
of darkness, you know, on a Saturday night. Yeah, it was.
It was weird. It was weird, Like, is that really
how we want it to be done? You couldn't have
just waited to the off season. But I do think
that this pending potential contract extension, you know, is was
(07:57):
the energy behind it. It was just like, we, guys,
we can't sign this guy to a three hundred and
fifteen million dollars, you know, four year guaranteed deal. Can't
can't do it. And here's why. As I told you now,
I'm saying you, Dan Byer, I'm saying you listener, world,
(08:18):
you Nico is not an idiot. I've never understood how
someone can go from building a championship roster last year
to a complete buffoon this year. When the truth is
somewhere in the middle. He took some risk last year,
took some heat last year for some of the moves.
You know, people said Kyrie wouldn't work, or you shouldn't
(08:40):
extend Kyrie. He did it worked, and then Kyrie got hurt.
And Kyrie has had a lot of injuries in his career,
although not an ACL injury like he suffered this year,
but many of the other moves. Gafford coming over, that
was him. PJ. Washington coming over, that was him. Even
(09:00):
hiring Jason Kidd, that was him. Remember, Jason Kidd was
not thought of as a quality game coach in the NBA,
going back to his days in Milwaukee or the nets
he did. They got to an NBA Finals and no
one mentioned any of that. When they trade away Luca,
it was fire this guy. He's an idiot. There's got
(09:21):
to be something done. People in Dallas actually said, and
we had people come on the radio who said, hey,
even if Dallas wins a championship without Luca, this is
still a bad trade, which is the dumbest, dumb, dumb
stuff I've ever heard in my life. But it does
play into what I was getting to produces, which were
so overreactive to the immediate thing and we can't just
(09:44):
catch our breath and have some perspective on some stuff.
And I actually credit Jay Stu because Jay Stu was like,
and Dan, I'll get to you cause you're saying the
right thing as well, Jay Stu we're talking today, is like, hey,
wasn't this a long term move? I don't get he
didn't get when the when the playoff, when the betting
(10:05):
lines came out, Like, I don't explain this one to me,
and I can't except for the power of Lebron James.
And I think that's really it. And Dan's what Dan's
saying is right, which is like, look, truth is, your
teams were built for constructed a certain way. You shouldn't
let it played out and then make this trade in
the offseason. My only pushback that Dan would be I
(10:29):
actually think that was part of the genius with Nico
is he probably looked around the landscape of it and thought,
you know, this won't be perfect, but no one's perfect
in the West. And if I can build this incredible
wall of defenders and just figure out a way to
let Kyrie loose, like we might be able to do
(10:52):
something special winning games based upon our defense, which oh yeah,
by the way, is what Minnesota really has done, right.
They have all these like sized defenders where you can't
mismatch Hunt. But but you're right, I mean, truth is,
you had a team constructed. You completely changed the construction
(11:14):
or the layout of the team. And remember the trade
deadline is after the All Star breaks. This is late
in the year, and what did you expect the outcome
to be? But I think the answer is because Lebron James,
there's never any happy medium. It's either the worst or
the best and nothing in between.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Well, and this deal did come before the All Star Game,
because it was Yeah, but you're much more forgiving of
Nico in all of this because I, in your words,
I was one of the people that said I felt
that the Mavericks fans would rather have Luca on their
team than to have their Luca Mavericks win a championship. Now,
(11:54):
time may heal all wounds. I'm curious on how next year,
in the year after plays. But I still don't think
Nico is off the hook, despite the great moves that
he made the year prior, and we were giving him
his flowers at that point, and we.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
Were, but I don't know if if like there's no.
Speaker 4 (12:17):
Like the addition of Gafford and PJ. Washington last year
were huge, I mean, was it was the reason why
they were able to navigate the West and then they
just didn't have enough against Boston. But like those trade
deadline deals that they did last year were magnificent, and
I think that we gave Dallas the credit at that point,
(12:37):
and then I feel he gave it all back with
this trade. Whereas Polinka and I agree with you in
essence of if you want to say that, Look, Polenka
has made some good moves with Austin Reeves and Dalton
connect who was involved in that Mark Williams deal that
ended up falling apart, and bringing those guys and saying, Okay,
(12:59):
it's made some draft picks, he's done this and that.
That's I'm fine with saying that. But to have Luca
kind of fall in your lap and then say, okay,
as an organization that's built on stars, all right, we'll
do that deal. Yes, I think every other well I
would assume almost every other GM in the league would
do it. And so that's I'm just not ready to
forgive Nico and Polinka. I just think said, all right,
(13:23):
we'll sacrifice lebron potential championship year. I mean, after all,
we did draft this Sun and in exchange for that,
they get their franchise star for the next decade.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
Yeah, I'm I'm fasted by the way the Lakers go
from here because he's the here's the problem. Okay, the
Lakers lost last night for a myriad of reasons, and
a lot of people want to point to their defense
and rebounding that that's a huge part of it. Right Again,
here's the impetuous nature of the basketball fan. The most
(13:55):
made fun of star in the NBA is oh Dan.
Speaker 3 (14:01):
Byer Rudy Gobert.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Yes, okay, every year it's make fun of Rudy Gobert.
He stinks he's overpaid, you can't play him in big
playoff games, and all the Lakers did, Like this is
the whole thing with like how why are they playing
Maxi Kleeber like Uda Maxi Kleeber played for last year.
It's the same thing that you try and do with
Rudy Gobert. Make him guard out in the court in
(14:24):
space and then make him score in the post because
he has no post moves and you end up winning
that matchup. Three is more than two efficiency as opposed
to inefficients, right, and so that's all he tried to
do and exploit it it It didn't work. But the
issue with it is that though Lebron looks like he
(14:44):
should be a small ball five right, Like Lebron's six'
eight long, arms big, hands two hundred and sixty two
hundred and sixty five pounds strong as an, ox and
he used to be able to guard point guards and
you'd think. Bigs he's never been able to guard. Inside
he is not a good post player offensively or, defensively
(15:05):
as opposed To Draymond, green who's had half the offensive,
career half the, accolades and, like he doesn't look, bad
but it's not like his body looks like A greek
god Like lebron at six foot five, ish he, can
he's just that's what he. Does so but the problem
with The lakers from now until Whenever lebron, decides And
(15:27):
lebron is going to decide when he wants to not play,
again is your two best players are your two wish.
Defenders and that doesn't. Work you, know you can get
away with, one you can't get away with. Two and
last night they had. Three, right their three best offensive
players are their three worst defensive. Players and there's just
no hot in, that and none of them, rebound and
(15:49):
none of them play particularly good. Defense and it will never.
Work it hasn't and it. Won't and that's why you
Know Nico harrison goes defense wins championships is defensive, rebounding.
RIGHT i learned that the hard, way you can play.
Big you can play small for your small guys better.
Rebound you can play, big big guys better, rebound and
(16:11):
the big guys better bill contained the ball, guard the
ball guard the three point, line but you got a,
rebound SO i you, KNOW i think they're forever in that.
Speaker 5 (16:22):
Space this is the best of The done Dot Leaf
show On Fox Sports.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Radio WHAT i put You dog Gott Leave, Show Fox Sports,
radio coming to you from the tyreq dot com. Studios
this is The Doug Gottlieb, Show every, day same, time same.
Channel we've been doing this for a, minute. KIDS i
(16:47):
do feel like this is one of those asked the
coach moments we'll get to in a second where The
New york The New York knicks get a road win
over The Detroit. Pistons we were talking about this last.
Hour you just listen to the. Show Chris purfetts on
the board, today he's on the ones and. Twos he's
A detroit. Guy of, course you Got jay stew and
my main, Guy Dan, byer, who of course you'll hear
(17:10):
throughout the show and on, updates and you'll Hear sunday
as he gets like the greatest job of all time
is watching games and getting to talk about them as they.
Happen so you're like the rest of us Are, sundays you,
know whether you're, inside outside chasing kids around or hanging.
Out and he's, like, YEAH i was, working BUT i
was watching, sports and he loves, sports so that game
(17:31):
last night was. Fun it was. FUN i think it's
interesting how perception and reality don't actually match. Up you'll
have people that go, Like i'm done with THE, NBA
i won't watch THE. Nba it's, like, okay WELL i
watched THE nba BECAUSE i love basketball AND i love
playoffs sports of most every. Kind and do we remember
(17:55):
that the football playoffs many of those games were kind of.
Boring and last Night i'm watching That pistons game with
The knicks And i'm, like this is a hell of
a basketball. Game and Then i'm Watching clippers And. Nuggets i'm,
like this hell of a. Game haven't you guys been into?
It the new into?
Speaker 3 (18:14):
It, Down i'm not into. IT i not. EITHER i
have not been.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
There it does look, cool it does look kind of
unique where they have the wall the. Wall it is weird,
though that a play that a franchise that has traditionally
had some of the worst fans and worst teams in
professional sports has this one area dedicated to like home.
Course it's a great idea that you feel like college
(18:40):
fans should.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
HAVE i feel that that whole area is is. Weird
AND i know The. Forum The forum was redone and
is a great concert. Venue but for for them to
then just build basically a new arena a block away
just SEEMS i don't, know like it's it's funny that
(19:02):
there wasn't like an effort to ever put any more
sports into The.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
Forum that's a great that's a great.
Speaker 3 (19:11):
Point sorry to derail the, topic but.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
No, no it's actually not a bad. Topic the weird
part about it for people who aren't From Los. Angeles,
okay so it's ALL la and Is inglewood technically a,
city like do you? Have they have their own mayor
and voting, body they don't have their own school. DISTRICT
i don't know how it all, works But, INGLEWOOD i,
guess is a city within the city Of Los. Angeles
(19:35):
maybe it's its own. City But inglewood was Called city Of.
Champions so they used to Have Hollywood, park which is
obviously a horse racing, park which now Is Sofi. Stadium
they used to have The forum as a basketball venue
versus The, forum The Fabulous. Forum then it was The
Great Western forum for a long. Time shout out to
Great Western. Bank it's a Great Western bank still. EXISTS
(19:56):
i don't.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
KNOW i don't, know BUT i didn't realize that there
Was Great Western. Bank as someone who grew up in The,
MIDWEST i just thought that they just renamed with The
Great Western. Forum kind of like How staples became so
synonymous with that arena THAT i don't Think staples got
anything from. It like there was. Zero nobody was, like,
Well i'm going to go and get my highlighters now From.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Staples does any does that actually work for?
Speaker 3 (20:18):
ANYTHING i think it does for a little.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
WHILE i, think give, me give me the place that
it works.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
FOR i think that any like, state like for, Example,
staples probably at first people are, like, Oh i'm going
to go To.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
Staples i'm gonna.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
Go, yeah but do you? Go likes if you're going To.
Staples then you see an office deep but you're, like you,
know it's the same.
Speaker 4 (20:36):
THING i think after a while it became so synonymous
with that it runs its. Course but when you're a
new brand trying to get out, THERE i do feel
that there is there is value to.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
It has anybody invested in crypto because Of Crypto?
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Arena, no WHAT i guarantee people went to crypto dot.
Speaker 4 (20:56):
Com i'm, Sorry jason's got his hands out his head
have completely derailed the.
Speaker 3 (21:02):
TOPIC i don't.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
THINK i think it Was, actually, no we don't have.
To this is actually an interesting, topic. Right i'm a marketing,
major a marketing degree from The Spears school Of business
At Oklahoma State, university and it's one of those things
that it actually in the business of, sports it's incredibly
valuable to sell these. Pieces but does it actually does? Anyone?
(21:25):
LIKE i think? That is it still The Target center In?
Minnesota Scott shapiro is going to be texting us at some.
Point our boss is A timberwolves.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
Fan that's that's WHAT i call.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
It but IT'S i think it's still The Target. Center
and so that one makes sense because Though target is,
uh you, know everyone knows The target is not, like
oh my, God, TARGET i didn't know What target. Was
you didn't know it was based In minneapolis until you
heard The target center was In. Minneapolis but HAS i
want you to try and be. Honest is there ever
(21:57):
have you ever gone and shopped anywhere looked anything? Up
not do, people BECAUSE i think you're probably Right dan
and that there's there has to be people who search
these places when they see. It but have you? Personally
has there ever been a venue Like? MetLife have you
ever gone, like, Oh? MetLife you know, What i'm going
to go and turn my is it? Portfolio is? It
(22:19):
what Is? MetLife i don't even? Know is it? Healthcare
has anybody ever actually?
Speaker 6 (22:23):
Here?
Speaker 1 (22:23):
Yeah, yeah has anybody like you know? WHAT i was
going to use some other healthcare, service but the giants Playing,
MetLife so Now i'm going to go and Use.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
MetLife Well i'm pretty.
Speaker 6 (22:34):
Sure i'm pretty. Sure it's a provider for like companies
to give insurance to their. Employees so it's it's like a,
corporate corporate kind of.
Speaker 4 (22:43):
Sponsor i'll say this during The Final fours And Super
bowls when you're Or World series. WHATEVER i just know
during The Final four when there's like a pizza tie
in to The final, four or Like Buffalo Wild wings
has it. Pizza that advertising does work now in the
name brand of constantly Saying crypto dot. Com IF i
(23:05):
wanted to get into, CRYPTO i think the first place
THAT i would probably go Is crypto dot.
Speaker 6 (23:10):
COM i just want to know, why you, know The
Detroit pistons moved To Little Caesars arena down from The
palace Of Auburn hills and they missed the opportunity to
call it The Little Caesar's Pizza.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Palace why would they call it The Pizza Pizza.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Palace Pizza Pizza.
Speaker 6 (23:24):
Palace there you, go, Now Little.
Speaker 4 (23:27):
Caesars even though The palace Of Auburn hills saw some great,
basketball the location wasn't necessarily. Ideal and that's the point
of The forum of if you're now building an arena
a block away next to AN nfl, Stadium and AGAIN i,
UNDERSTAND i, Went i've been to a concert at the
(23:49):
at The, forum but it just seems like that venue
would have been one to save or to try to
refurbish or make new again instead of just going and
building an entirely new.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
One but WELL i.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
WOULD i would tell you a couple of. Things The
forum is owned by THE msg. People YEAH i don't
mean mon sootam, GLUTAMATE i MEAN msg.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
Like james Dolem.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
Garden, yeah, Yeah James. Dolt so they owned, it they
turned to a concert concert, venue whereas into it is
a piece of land that was bought By Steve bohmer
and they they developed it on their. Own so some
of it is like who owns it or. WHATEVER i
would also tell you THAT i think though renovating it
sounds like a really cool idea when it was renovated for,
concerts as you pointed. Out but, two LIKE i you
(24:37):
know they'd have to. RENOVATE i mean they have to
basically go down to the studs to do it for
a for a basketball. Venue also how different basketball venues.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
ARE i also think that the history of The lakers
in that, building for The clippers to take it, over
for The clippers trying to form their own.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Identity would be would be. Cool, yes, WELL.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
I think them separating it and saying, like we're not
going to do something that The lakers did because we've
always been in The lakers. SHADOW i get not wanting
to go. There but like that that, stadium the arena
that they redid In seattle to reconfigure and make ready
for The kraken to go. In, yes basically the roof
was put on, stilts, yeah you, know and they then
(25:17):
they redid the whole. Thing so when you're doing that
sort of work to keep the roof because it was
a protected landmark to be able to go to those,
LENGTHS i just was surprised that maybe similar efforts weren't
made for a place like The. FORUM i get some
places are, just you, know way. Gone there's nothing you
(25:38):
can do about, it and you just have to move
on from the. Facility but it's just funny that The
forum is still standing in a refurbished, way and then
a block down the road there's a brand NEW nba
arena that's going to host The All Star game next,
year and the whole.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Deal well that's part of the thing, though is that they.
Did they came into city Of, champions known for The
lakers and built their own, Arena AND i still think
the window is there for. Them it's closing because my
guess would be that at some point The lakers figure
it out With, Luca but there still is A if
The clippers could ever figure it out and build a consistent,
winner they have a better. Arena they have a better, arena,
(26:18):
sure but it's hard to conceive that they're still like The,
nets where no matter what The nets, do they're not The.
Knicks no matter what The clippers, do they're not The.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
Lakers and outside Of Madison Square, GARDEN i don't know
how many historic places we now have in THE, nba,
RIGHT i, mean like THE tv Gardens bend there. Forever
but it's not The Boston, garden, RIGHT i, mean it's
not The Larry, Bird Kevin, McHale Robert parrish going back
To Celtic city in the whole. Deal, like it's still
(26:48):
a newer. Facility there aren't any places that you can
really do that.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
Anymore has everybody's got a new.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Arena it's The Doug Gottlieb show here On Fox Sports. Radio,
Okay so the last night was played at is it
The Little Caesars arena or The Little Caesar's? Colisseum?
Speaker 6 (27:05):
Uh the Arena little Caesar? Arena.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Okay So Jalen brunson was. Magnificent he hits the game
winning three point. Shot Here's Tom, thibodeau his head, coach
talk About Jayleen brunson's mental.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
Tools that's what makes them so.
Speaker 7 (27:18):
Special and you know we talk, about you, know the
all the intangibles that it's his makeup and oftentimes you,
know that's that's where MISTAKES i think are made in
the draft and things like. That and there's it's easy
to see like how many points of guy scores or
what the physical tools tools, are but when you look
(27:40):
at the mental, tools that's.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
Everything.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Yeah there was a certain radio host who when he
signed as a free agent with The knicks said he
is a force multiplier and he's worth every penny because
remember when he signed with the nixts beer, like, oh
The knicks paid too, much, Right dan only gave, him you,
know it was like fifty something million over three, years
(28:07):
but THEY i can't remember the exact. Number but they
also hired his. Dad and my point is that That
Jalen brunson is a culture. CHANGER i didn't know he
had that level of offensive scoring in his. Bag he's
become way better than EVEN i could have ever thought he.
Was but the point is that you needed you need
(28:31):
somebody to believe in the process that you're tried to embark.
On and you, Know tibbs identified, him got his dad.
There you, know the president is he's a former client
of the. President so he is a, walking talking billboard
in the locker room for what you're building In New.
(28:52):
York and he is a guy that everybody respects in.
Basketball people respect guys that get more of their god
given talent than they. Should he's not super, tall he's
not super. Athletic he's just super tough and unbelievably, skilled unbelievably.
Skilled and you, know at the, TIME i felt LIKE
(29:17):
i was like the lone defender of this, Move, like
what are The knicks? Doing? Now does that mean they're
gonna WIN nba? Championship, no there's an expression in THE
nba where they, say, hey that's great, defense just better.
OFFENSE i thought that's what happened on the last. Play
but you guys have been asking, me and people ask, me,
like don't you double team him? THERE i don't think
(29:38):
so That the spacing is so different in THE, nba
and guys are so, skilled and, remember players don't miss open.
Shots they just. Don't and if you put two on the,
basketball somebody's wide. Open now you could make the case that,
hey he was wide open there because he made an
insane move against Swer thompson that he you, know slipped
(30:01):
and kind of. Slid it was almost out of a.
Movie it was The Michael jordan push off without him
actually pushing, off because it was A Sor thompson who
kind of slipped and got his momentum, going you, know
going that direction towards the. Sideline that's as good a,
shot a good move as you're ever gonna find without
any sort of push, off without any sort of of
(30:23):
potential offensive. FOUL i thought it was amazing prefet as
A pistons, guy as A detroit. Guy can you are
you like? That we should have double teamed. Him he's
the because remember he got The Clutch award for the
most clutch player in THE. NBA i was listening To
Dan patrick earlier today and he's, like, hey he's the
most clutch player in THE. Nba who'd you think was
going to take the? Shot and my point, is, YEAH i,
(30:45):
mean you could have run Two. Adam but if you
run Two, adam you're automatically in. Scramble you're in, scramble
and somebody's going to be wide open for a dunk
or for a, layup and it might well Be Jalen.
Speaker 6 (30:56):
Runson, YEAH i think in that, moment like all you
can do is have the defender on him and just
hope it doesn't get out of. Hand but the point
is you don't want to even give The knicks the
life in that, game and it feels like every last
game in this The pistons just let The knicks come
back into. This, like if you want an answer on
how to Stop Jalen, brunson it's don't Play Asar thompson
(31:18):
only twenty three minutes when he's getting shot clock violations
on him left and, right just playing the more.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Problem the, problem the problem with playing him is right,
now all you can do is kind of play him
in the. Dunker he's really. Effective he's a great, driver great,
athlete but he can't shoot. Yet SO i understand the
thought that you're, like, hey just playing the whole game
shut Down Jalen. Brunson and that's probably the smart way
to look at, it right because.
Speaker 6 (31:43):
Just just late in the game where it feels, like once
again like The pistons had this lead that they cling
on to for the entire for the entire game and
then five minutes left in the fourth quarter and it's
slowly quickly evaporating and everyone knows what's about to, Happen, Like,
yeah this is the best of The Dune Gottli show
On Fox Sports.
Speaker 1 (32:01):
Radio It's Doug Gotlieb, Show Fox Sports radio at the
Lands airlines going to join u S CS Nfl draft
analyst FOR Nfl, media get his thoughts on the, draft
Cam Ward and, Yes Stuart, byer you, were you were In,
(32:22):
la your home state Of, wisconsin put on a great.
Show give me your thoughts on The shador thing on
how it it really took over took over the.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
Draft, YEAH i actually think that there are some parallels
to what happened in THE nba draft last.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Summer not a great draft class at.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
ALL i, mean it Was Zachar rezache that went number
one overall in the, draft and we really didn't pay
much mind to a lot of the players in THE Nba,
draft but we did pay attention To Bronnie, james AND
i felt like that was this. Situation there weren't a
lot of guys headline makers in this. Draft it was
(32:57):
a bad draft. Class something that we've talked about for
weeks on this. Show so then when you have a
player who was really one of the players that you
would to talk, about one of the very select, few
then have the fall that he. DID i think it
naturally then just overtook the entire.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Weekend yeah it, WAS i, mean it was the WHOLE i,
mean it really did overtake the whole. Weekend it was,
like because it didn't happen the first, day it didn't
happen the second, day and they're, like, wow, YEAH i,
mean and then you, Know sunday was left to kind
of clean Up aisle six and what was the biggest?
Storyline it had to be that, one.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
You, know and you're hearing you off the top and
we were even talking in the. BREAKS i think all
of us have like different opinions whatever on The kuiper.
SITUATION i actually think it was a huge win FOR
espn and Whether kuiper was right or, wrong and he
was obviously wrong on the evaluation Of shoud Or, sanders
but he wasn't the only. One but isn't that part
(33:55):
of what Mel kiper? IS i, mean we had a
was it A i feel a draft OR i got
dibbs where we were talking draft, moments and we're still
playing the Mel kuiper cut from thirty years. Ago SO
i think that, obviously, obviously like those misjudgments haven't hurt
his career at. All and SO i actually think that
(34:16):
outside of Shed Or, sanders Mel kuiper was the second
most talked about person at THIS nfl. Draft and If I'M,
ESPN i actually am happy about it because now next
year people are going to, say, well what's mel gonna
say this? Year or who Does mel? Have is he
gonna hit or? Miss AND i think it can you,
know becomes more of a.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Conversation, yeah It's it's a really good way of looking at.
IT i think that the point the difference is when
you take a, guy it's like almost better for. Him
if a guy goes earlier than he. Should then if
he calls out the whole league and basically calls the league, idiots,
(34:54):
sure you, KNOW i don't know what they're, Doing, like, OKAY.
Speaker 4 (34:57):
I always think he's fighting for respect to even after
all these, years because he's not been On he's not
on the other side of the velvet. Rope wasn't a
scout Like Daniel jeremiah not in the front office he's
kind of been THE i don't want to say the
outsider because it doesn't feel. Right but he's not AN
nfl personnel, guy AND i feel that he's maybe there's
(35:18):
like a bit of an insecurity in, that and that
came out even after all of these years of doing.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
It BUT i don't know if that's. IT i really
don't know if that's. It you, know there's a bunch
of different thoughts on what it could. Be, Look i've
worked enough With bell to know he's a as a,
person a gem of a. Guy, sure everybody really likes.
HIM i don't think it's that. INSECURITY i think it's
(35:43):
one of two. Things he just couldn't believe, it or he's,
like you, know one of the Things mel does Is
mel is not an old school personnel, guy right. Doesn't
he doesn't like have out his notebook and go to
college games and grade stuff. Out he talks to people
and he kind of gets can sesstence to views from
people that he, trusts AND i almost feel like this is.
(36:04):
Him Last, YANNA i can't believe all these GUYS i
trust told me something that's not. True It's Doug Gottlieb
show On Fox Sports. Radio let's let's catch up With Lancer,
LINE nfl draft analysts for THE nfl. Media FOR Nfl,
media the one name that kind of overtook all THE
nfl draft was not the number one player taken in Cam. Ward,
(36:24):
instead it Was. Shador what was your eval Of shador
throughout throughout the last couple of years AT, SeeU.
Speaker 5 (36:31):
YEAH i, had you, KNOW i didn't focus as much
on his twenty three. Tape USUALLY i watched two years on.
QUARTERBACKS i watched his touchdowns and his, interceptions and that
was about. IT i watched one game from, there BUT
i thought he was a lot better in twenty, Four
SO i focus was my. Evaluation you. Know, CONVERSELY i
(36:51):
focused most of my evail On quinn yours on twenty
three BECAUSE i know he was hurt from much twenty.
Four in terms Of, shador you, know it was a
pretty it's a pretty easy email to. ME i THOUGHT
i put a bottom of the second round grade on.
HIM i thought he was the second best quarterback in this,
draft behind Cam, ord who had a high second round
(37:12):
grade to late first round. Grade, now from a projection, standpoint,
obviously you know those guys typically get pushed up a
little bit if you're first and second in the. Class
but you, know from an evaluation, standpoint very average arm,
strength very average off, platform adequate in terms of, timing
extremely accurate, throws a good, accuracy a terrific. Poise in the,
(37:35):
pocket he's got good pocket, maneuverability so he can slide
around the. Pocket he's not the fastest guy outside of the,
pocket but in the pocket he's pretty. Elusive it takes
way too many, sacks holds onto it and plays he
wrote ball way too. Often has the ability to work
all three, levels but needs to work with. Timing he's
a player who's very tough when he's in, there and
(37:55):
he's extremely confident and you, know brash airing and whatever
you want to. SAY i like the up and it's
in the. Pocket he doesn't get easily. Rattled you get
a sense that he's not trying to convince himself that
he's a tough. Quarterback it's just it comes naturally for.
Him so a lot of WHAT i liked about Shud
Door sanders had to do with, intangibles WHICH i don't.
MINIMIZE i think a lot of times when we look
at why a quarterbacks succeeded that we didn't. Expect it
(38:18):
comes down to. INTANGIBLES i think you have to factor that,
in but make a. Mistake he's a game manager who
tries to play like a playmaker a little bit too.
Often so the concern for me was going to be
could he not try to be prime, son you, know
his own brand and quote unquote you, know. Legendary can
can he get a guy that drives the? Ship AND
(38:38):
i had some concerns AND i still do have concerns
about whether or not he can be okay just being
a game.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
Manager and then you factor in the other, parts right
then you factor in how he handled himself with. TEAMS
i mean it's the there were only you, KNOW i
don't know six seven teams that felt like they need
to Starting caliper. Quarterback and if you don't grade out
as one on some people's or you're on the board
(39:05):
line and then you blow off a couple of those
six or, seven you're almost asking for this sort of,
result aren't.
Speaker 5 (39:12):
You, Yeah, now when it comes to me putting a
grade on a, GUY i don't you, know it's all
take the off the field stuff and the you know
that comes Later in terms of my, assessment when on
going TO tv things like that WHENEVER i hear, stories
AND i have to be honest with, YOU i found
out a lot. MORE i expected him to fall out
of day. One i'd heard The giants like Like Jackson,
(39:33):
dart SO i expected The giants and The saints to
be the two teams that try to trade up into
the first round kind of battle each other For Jackson.
Dart that was my. EXPECTATION i Thought schador could go
in there somewhere if maybe The browns traded up for.
Him but, really you, Know i've had him at twenty,
nine twenty four to twenty. One. OH i thought That
steelers at one POINT i thought that was going to
be a, hit and THEN i had some intel late
(39:55):
that it probably was not going to be The. Steelers,
well once that factor that, IN i, thought, man he's
probably going to slide out of the first round because
The steelers are really the only spot pump to. Me
THEN i found out afterwards that to your, Point, doug
he had very few teams to have even interviewed, with
like you just you, know you weren't on his, list
(40:16):
and then you weren't interviewing viewing, him and then you,
know not being able to get, through not being willing
to get through questions about, install questions about you, know
working through the, install working through the whiteboard in terms
of where to go with the, ball where to do?
This he, asked apparently asked one, team, well what are
you going to? Do just around me with weapons and offensive,
(40:36):
line just stuff that you just you, know you're just
there to. Be you, know it's a job. INTERVIEW i,
MEAN i understand the, brash confidence and all that, stuff
BUT i think he was his own worst enemy and
in many, Ways and so what happened was once he
slid out of the you, know really out of the top,
forty you, know the quarterback needy teams you're, drafting a
lot of teams who might have considered drafting him. Didn't
(40:57):
they just didn't have the intel they needed because they
had not been able to get the you, know they
had not been able to have the, meetings figure out
his football, intelligence figure out his you, know they just
get a feel for the person because they hadn't had
to have those opportunities to find out who he. Was,
so you, know once your pass the first two, rounds
(41:18):
you should be on the board for about fourteen, teams
AND i don't think that was the case with schand Nor.
SANDERS i think a lot of teams like we just you,
know a we don't know enough about, him and of
course do you want to deal with everything that potentially
comes with, it which was that you, know each team
had to make their own assessment that was overvalued or
that was a real.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Problem LASER i joined us here in The dug Out
leave show On Fox Sports. Radio, okay let's talk about
some other. Teams The Green Bay packers drafted a wide
receiver in the first, round and obviously the place, erupted, Erupted,
okay but now there's a lot of pressure On Matthew
golden and they had this super deep wide received a.
(42:00):
Room what are your thoughts on The packers.
Speaker 5 (42:02):
Draft, well they have a super deep wide receiver room
with a bunch of guys that have trouble catching the.
Football SO i, mean how deep are you if you
just have a bunch of. Drops that's kind of my.
Concern AND i Had Matthew goland in my last mock,
draft you, know track to The packers and everyone gave
me crap about. It but the fact, is at some
point when you give quarterbacks as much money as you're giving. Them,
(42:24):
now you really have no choice but to make. Sure
we saw it With Lamar. Jackson we've seen him With
Josh allen at different, times and you, know now there's
a question about Is buffalo doing enough For Josh. Allen
now With Stefan diggs, gone you've got, to you, know
you got. To you got to load up with with
some talent for these super expensive. Quarterbacks AND i think
that they what they wanted to do Is Matthew Golden's
(42:46):
basically they're, saying, look we got too many guys who
dropped the ball that are not. Consistent their contracts will
be up in a couple of. Years let's get another
guy in here that that can turn into potentially a,
one even THOUGH i Think golden's more of a. Two,
let's you, know let's SAY i can find a guy
that really meshes With jordan Loves now save Me On,
williams who they drafted in the third. Round you, know
he is a not a good route. Runner he is
(43:08):
not a true wide. Receiver what he is is like
A Cordero patterson type player who you just get the
ball in his. Hands he is a dynamic an incredible,
athlete great, beat super, explosive loose, limb but he's not
really a route, runner so he's kind of a. Specialist
i'm interested to see how The packers utilize, him BUT
(43:28):
i think it's really become what we're Seeing. Dougs teams, understand,
man we're paying fifty and sixty million to these. Quarterbacks
we have to get something out of. Them and that's.
Why you, know that's Why jacksonville moves up and Targets Travis.
Hunter that's Why Brian thomas was the first runner For.
Jacksonville that's why every team that has a young. Quarterback
you look at The bears went tight end and wide
(43:49):
receiver with their first two. Picks all these team with
young quarterbacks and teams with super expensive quarterbacks are, saying
let's make sure we give them the best chance. Possible all, right.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Cam, ward what's his likeli to? SUCCESS i think it's pretty.
Speaker 5 (44:04):
Good he's all about, ball loves football. Always i've always
known that about. Him that's been you, know that was
told to me By scout when he was At Washington.
State he's very serious about. Ball he's a guy who
came up from from the, mud as they, say with
incarnate word zero star. Prospect hungary doesn't take anything for.
Granted he's got a plus plus, arm can fit the
(44:26):
ball in the tight. Windows there's times where his game
reminds me Of Brett barb in terms of the high end,
stuff and then the mistakes that he's willing to make
that really hurts his. Team so there's there's the plus
and the minus in terms of what that's you know
how that. Goes but when you start talking about his
ability to extend plays and make big time throws into
(44:46):
tight windows on all three, levels he's number, One like
he is the, guy and there's no one else in
this draft to really come close to. That his issue
is going to be have to be he has to
eliminate his desire to play that hero. Ball the longer
he's days off, schedule the worst the decision making gets.
Sometimes so that's going to have to be coached out of.
Him i'd like to see him use his legs. More
(45:08):
he tries, to you, know stay in the pocket and
keep passes alive too. Much at some point pull it
down and, go you, know just pull it down and
go and get to the next. Play but he's got.
Talent he can throw our pos's he can he can
throw with some accuracy when his feet are are. Right
AND i like the fact that he's really you got
(45:29):
to put some woe on, him not to go on.
Him in other, words he's going to attack down the.
Field you can dial that back a little. Bit guys
who are super, conservative that's a mindset that you can't,
change you. Know and you'd, Agree, Dog you've been around
sports long enough to know there's some guys that you, know,
man he's going to cut it. Loosen THERE'S i always
say it's like. This you got two people at a blackjack,
(45:50):
table one who's shuffling hips back into their pocket because
they want to minimize the risk with a little. Profit
and then you got the guys that, can you, know
turn it into a twenty or thirty thousand dollars run
because they get hot and they're pressing and they're taking.
Chances Cam ward is a guy who's going to take his.
Chances and there's some negative that comes with, it but
you know, what you can also win at a high
(46:11):
level when you have a quarterback like.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
That Lancerline john against Here Doug Gottlieb, Show Fox Sports.
Radio you were most impressed with which team's.
Speaker 5 (46:18):
DRAFTS i think The bears did a good. Job, Loveland Luther,
BURDEN i mean those. Guys LOVELAND i thought was right
there With Tyler. WARREN i had no problem with him
being the first tight. End Luther burden was high value
at thirty. NINE i, thought other Than Travis, Hunter burden
is actually the best wide receiver in the. Draft Schamar
turner And Ozzie, trapillo guys they got in the second.
(46:40):
ROUND i thought their second round picks worth were really really.
Good they got to kid in the fist Is Off,
frasier who is a lot Like Tarik wooland coming out
OF utsa a couple of years. Ago he has you,
know he's been in college football for six, years but
he just has one year where he really put it all,
together coming from you, know smaller. Schools he's, tall he's,
fast in its tremendous ball. SKILLS i thought. THAT i
(47:02):
thought that The Tampa Bay bucks did a great. Job
The Mecca oak AT, Buca Benjamin, morrison the cornerback out
of A Notre. Dame Jacob, parrish another corner out Of
Kansas state WHO i think is highly underrated as a
third round, pick and they got a couple of rushers
And David walker And Elijah. ROBERTS i thought they did
a really nice job with only having six. PICKS i
(47:22):
thought they came away with a really good. Draft and,
then you, know, HONESTLY i, THINK i think you have
to look at what the forty nine. Ers the forty
nine ers did a pretty good job as well as
The New England. Patriots patriots came away with a very
good defensive tackle who dropped a little bit for, Medicals Josh,
Farmer Kyle williams And Treyvon. Henderson are you kidding? Me
(47:43):
you Get Kyle williams at sixty nine And Traygion henderson
at thirty, eight and then of course you know you
attacked your offensive Line Will. CAMPBELL i don't love the
fact that they had to reach a little bit of
four For Will. Campbell but when you're, desperate you, know
when you're desperate and you don't have a position locked,
up solidified where you don't have to, reach and that's what.
Happens you have to draft a certain. Position it was
(48:05):
not a great year to need, tackle so they really
had no choice but to take a tackle. There you
couldn't wait until second. Round.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Lance awesome stuff, man great balance to analysis before the,
draft during the, draft after the. Draft really appreciate, You
joyce On Fox Sports.
Speaker 5 (48:18):
Radio, yeah you got to appreciate. It
Host
Doug Gottlieb
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