May 20, 2019 • 44 mins
Doug tells you why the latest drama from the Lakers reveals exactly who they are: DYSFUNCTIONAL. He also thinks Peyton Manning would be an awesome general manager for the Jets. Plus, Doug talks to FSR Host and NBA Insider Chris Broussard to find out how his twitter beef with Kevin Durant started and where Anthony Davis ultimately ends.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:21):
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Farmers Well, congratulations Lakers. Instead of talking about the warriors
remarkable comeback in the third quarter against the Trailbladger to
take a commanding three games to non lead, instead end
up talking about Toronto's resilience and finding a way to
(01:03):
beat the Bucks too uh to get on the board
and now trail two games to one. In their best
of seven Eastern Conference Finals. Instead of caring about the
actual games or even caring about Frank Vogel, the guy
was hired today instead, well, instead, we're talking about the Lakers.
(01:25):
That's because Magic Johnson and Rob Polinka both spoke essentially
to the media today. Magic Johnson surprise interview with first take,
and then Rob Polinka was introducing Frank Vogel, who people
asked a couple of uncomfortable questions too. If you missed
(01:46):
the blow by blow, here's Magic Johnson on why he
chose to lead the Lakers. People around the Laker office
was telling me Rob was saying things, and Rob Polinka
and I didn't like those things being said behind my
back do I wasn't in the office enough and so
on and all. So I started getting calls from my
friends outside of basketball saying those things. Now will say
(02:10):
it to them outside of basketball now, not just in
the Laker office anymore. Now it's in the media and
so on. He's a people who trust exactly and people
gotta remember something. Being in this business fold for forty years,
I got allies, I got friends everywhere. This is Rob
Polinka's response to the betrayal remarks, I think the most
(02:32):
important thing for me is the two years of getting
to work side by side within are some of the
greatest memories I have in sports and work. Um, he's
an unbelievable person to work with. He fills the room
with joy and vision and truly it's it's it's saddening
and disheartening to think he believes things that are a misperception.
(02:54):
Here's uh Magic on how the Lakers and Genie Buss
made decisions. It's too many people at the table, and
so what happens everybody gets to share their opinion and
there's so much information coming at her that then when
I say, hey, we have to do this, she can't
make a decision because they said, no, don't go the
(03:15):
way Magic go, you should go. So so her love
for those people, in respect for those people often caused
us to not make the right choice or there's no
decision Max, And so I said, listen, you can't run
a corporation like this. You can't have everybody think that
(03:35):
they can have a voice. Here's Rob Polinka on how
they'll go forward without Magic. Jeanie's vision for the front
office is a couple of years ago, she created a
position that didn't exist prior to Irvin coming on board
President of Basketball Operations, and she uh is going to
eliminate that position because it was created entirely for Magic.
(03:57):
No one can really replace what he does, So uh,
that would be that you want my summation. Everything you
heard is everything you think you heard. Magic didn't really
show up at work. Tell him I'm gonna be in
and out. I got a bunch of stuff going on.
Polinka probably talked a little ish on him and said, Hey,
(04:19):
that dude never at work, wants to make all of
the decisions, doesn't actually do the work, so he can
back up why he makes those decisions. And Genie Buss
is completely in over her head so much so that
she's just reaching out to people who she feels like
she knows who she can trust to help her sort
through what is the bull? You know what? And what
(04:41):
is reality? That's it, that's what's really happening. Like again,
let's not I love Magic as a player. Tell me
the thing he's had to invest his time and his
energy in that he's invested his time and his energy
other than showing up and be Magic. And this idea
(05:01):
that well, you know you gotta take Magic's word for
it because he has this vision of what a player is.
He didn't as a coach, he hasn't as an analyst
either time NBC or ESPN. And the biggest reason isn't
because he's a dope. He's not. It's just because he's
just not that into it. Like, look, Magic Johnson spends
five weeks a year on a yacht in Europe. This
(05:25):
is this is this public information. He and his wife
they have a yacht and they travel around Europe and
do everything you've ever dreamed of doing, and have dinner
with everyone you've ever dreamed of having dinner with? Why
because he's Magic Johnson. So do I buy that he
(05:46):
didn't work that hard? Yeah? Of course? Do I buy
that it probably bothered Rob Polinka. He's doing all this
grunt work and that Magic Johnson does all the press conferences,
claims all responsibility, takes none of the blame because he's Magic. Sure,
do I think it got back to Magic? Yeah? By
the way, if Magic was a super loyal laker, then
(06:09):
he wouldn't have done that interview if it wasn't about
Magic Johnson and saving Magic Johnson's name. Whereas think what
you want about the reputation of Plinka. But Polinka answered
the questions and took the high road. He just did.
He didn't know Magic under the bus he could have.
You know, I Magic heard those things because it was true, right, yeah,
(06:34):
I said all of that stuff. The best part about
it is the newest U l A story is, well,
you know, supposedly Magic was c it was beasts blind
Sea Seed on some emails like that's not actually true
because Magic is not a big email guy. That That
pretty much sums it all up, right, You're a president
(06:56):
of basketball operations, then I'm not really an email guy.
What's this whole computer? What's your sign in? Magic? What's
a sign in? Right? But you can't you can't. You
can't have Magic Johnson, who's been told his you know
what doesn't stink for forty years in the city, you
(07:17):
know who had a relationship with the late owner because
they go out together. That was the whole Jerry Bust thing.
Jerry Bust was a playboy and Magic Johnson was a playboy,
and he used to go out together in l A.
And he had the biggest star and the owner hanging
out together. That was the root of their relationship. You
can't go from that place to a magic We really
(07:39):
need you in for the nine o'clock meeting every Monday morning. Yeah,
Maggie Johnson. So I'd love to tell you that there's
more at play here that Polinka is evil and Magic's great,
or Magic's evil and Plink is great, or there's something
like not really. And this, by the way, is why
(08:02):
you gotta be very careful in hiring a Magic Johnson,
because it's not about hiring him, it's about what happens
when you fire him or when he fires himself. Right.
In an effort to prove that he had a better
work ethic than was being perceived, Magic Johnson told the
world in his own words, the reason he was quitting
(08:25):
was it wasn't fun anymore. He couldn't tweet about other
players because the Lakers would get fined. These are things
that he said. Nobody made him say. So do I
think what Magic is saying is accurate? Yeah? I'm sure
He's got tons of friends who heard Rob Polinka talk
a lot of trash. That doesn't make the trash not true.
(08:49):
It doesn't make Rob Polinka look any better for talking
that trash. But you can understand the frustration. Anyone's ever
done group work, You ever done group work at college?
All right, what's the worst thing in the world When
you show up from presentation day and there's the one
usually the young girl with a woman who did She's like, well,
I knew you weren't showing up, So here's the notes
(09:09):
on the presentation, and here's the graph you were supposed
to do, and I did it for you. That's how
Rob Polin could think. He's like, wait, what so you know?
I mean his defense for the zoo Botch trade where
(09:30):
they wanted to make a trade with the l A
Clippers to get a stretch five and the Clippers didn't
even think Zubach was available because he's twenty one making
nothing his money and he's got He's a he was
a starter, a starting caliber player. His defense for giving
away zupatch the Clippers didn't even ask for was, well,
you know, he didn't even play in the playoffs. Yeah,
(09:52):
that's kind of beside the point. Dude. Magic appeared as
a loof as ever, because he's Magic Johnson, Rob Polinka
appeared um to take the high road, and Genie Bus.
Genie Buss is exactly what you thought she was. She's
(10:12):
a woman who has a good business acumen, who has
no idea who to trust, or what to believe or
what to do in running the Lakers, and so she
does what we all do. She trusts her inner circle
people she's known the longest, and therein lies the Lakers dysfunction.
Remember the word fun is interlaced in dysfunction. It's not
(10:36):
fun to live it, to work in it. Hell, have
a lot of fun to cover, I'll tell you that.
Be sure to catch live editions of The Doug Dot
Leap Show week days in noon eastern three pm Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app.
Mike Florio has a story out, says Jets CEO and
chairman Christopher Johnson wants say great strategic thinker to run
(10:57):
in the football operations. He needs someone who can work
with coach Adam Gaze, and one name has come up,
Peyton Manning. Rumors are flying within the league circles the
Jets may make a run at the future Hall of
Fame quarterback who periodically has been linked to NFL management possibilities.
I see it, I think it happens, I thinks should happen.
(11:21):
I think it'd be great. Everyone we've ever talked to
in regards to Peyton Manning says he doesn't wanted to
be a broadcaster. He wants to run a football team. Frankly,
I think he wants to own a football team. And
people thought he could buy the Tennessee Titans at some point,
but with the ties to New York, with that side
(11:42):
of the market, and his ties to Adam Gaatee, and
he didn't just play for Adam Gains and have a
great success late in his career with Adam Gaze as
his offensive coordinator. I got a chance to do sideline
for Fox last football season. The game I did was
the Bears against the Dolphins. That's when brock Oswilder was
a surprise starter. You know, it was in an tendants
(12:02):
Peyton Manning the sheriff as he's known. And look, he
wasn't close with brock Oswalder. They were not friends. They
worked together, but they were not boys. He's close with
Adam Gaze, and Gaze is the interim GM and has
to find somebody who wants to work with And this
makes total sense to me and to too. Someone says, well,
(12:26):
you know what about Donald, this would be a This
would say he believes in Donald. This would give him
unlimited possibilities in terms of what he could do, what
he would want to do with that roster. Granted, you
do have some issues there in terms of the roster
(12:47):
depth and no center, no wide receivers to speak of.
You have a running back making a little bit too
much money, but you have a quarterback under club control,
and you might have had the best guy in the
draft over the each of the last three years. As
some good things there and as much as today we're
pointing out that Magic Johnson didn't work hard enough to
(13:10):
be a good president of football basketball operations with the
l A Lakers. That's not who Peyton Manning is. Like
Peyton Manning is, he's a workaholic, Like was he born
tall enough? And did he have a good arm? Like? Yeah,
But he had to overcome a lack of arm strength
and lack of mobility and be a football genius in
(13:33):
order to become one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time.
Like pay Manning was infamous for not letting backups take
reps in practice, let alone waving off the punt team
when he like he wants to be in charge he
wants the ball. He wants to do the research, like
(13:54):
he wants this thing. This isn't He's not Magic Johnson
with Cookie taking five weeks and going into the Mediterranean
on a on a yacht. You can't get ahold of
me receiving no compensation in return. In the two years
since he's been retired, he's traveled the most to every
trading camp just to learn and absorb. Still has his
(14:17):
family's football camp. Oh yeah, by the way, I think,
isn't that his son is playing quarterback down in high school?
When that, yeah, one of the one of their sons
is now playing quarterback, Arch playing quarterback in high school.
So like you sit there and you're like, what are
we doing here? Arch is son a Cooper. Okay, Cooper
(14:41):
is a funny one. Cooper is the funny one. Peyton
is the good one, and he lies the little brother
who it just happens to have two super Bowl rings
in the bidiest media market and among the things that
the Manning family likes, they love the medium, Mark, they
love the media has been really good to them, and
(15:02):
they've been really good to the media. And being in
New York would make a ton of sense. Ton of sense.
I hope it happens. I think it'd be a great
move for the Jets. I think it would work, and
I think it would would be all that he ever wants.
The only question would be would would Payton ever be
able to get ownership, which is what I've what everyone's
(15:24):
always thought that he wanted. He wants to own a
piece m But then, look, there's just different types of stars.
Magic was a superstar. Magic was had a brilliant vision
for how to play basketball, but he was more like
an artist, whereas Peyton Manning was more like a nerd
(15:44):
who found ways he could read a d could sit
there and process and read a defense and throw the
ball at the exact right spot at the exact right time,
based upon the wind, the pitch of the field, how
his arm felt, all of these things like he was
a perfectionist, but based upon levels of preparation right. Magic's
(16:08):
whole thing was I'm Magic Johnson, no explanation, whereas Peyton
Mannings sole Matt By the way, Magic Johnson was famous.
One of the reasons that pat Riley supposedly never won
a championship with the Knicks or with the Heat was
because he famously practiced too long and too hard. Magic
(16:28):
Johnson was the guy who supposedly, supposedly was the one
guy able to tell pat Riley, we ain't practiced anymore. Look,
he could just show up and do it. He just
figured out a way to get it done. He had
feel he didn't need to prep That's on who Peyton
Manning was. Matter of fact, one of the reasons Peyton
(16:50):
Manning struggled in the playoffs was because at some level,
when you get into the playoffs, you can't prep for stuff.
You just gotta make plays on your own. Which is
why Magic was so great in impromptu situations and just
got a role with it. But in the role of
president of football operations, running a football team, evaluating your
(17:11):
team's town, the rest of the leagu's town, trying to
be ahead of the curve in the type of personnel
you get, and and evaluating college town, I think the
home run because that's all he's ever done and all
he's ever wanted. Be sure to catch live edition so
the Doug dot Leaps show week days in noon eastern
(17:33):
three pm Pacific. Bill Orm covers the Lakers for the
Athletic Bill. How would you describe today in the laker Land, Uh,
surreal like most days and Lakers Land lately, it's it's
it's surreal, um to see. You know. Obviously today was
going to be a big day. Like you said, we
haven't heard from Rob Pelinka or anyone in Lakers management
for that matter, since Magic Johnson stepped down, and so
(17:55):
today was gonna be today that we were gonna get
some answers. Well we got answers all right, but we
got him from Magic at what six six am? But
the big time, I mean it was a um, I mean,
that was that was a heck of a thing to
wake up to to hear going off the cuff and
basically confirming all the whispers that have been out there
about Rob Polinka, at least at least from his standpoint.
I think what was interesting about it is obviously, um
(18:17):
those whispers had been out there, and obviously Rob Polinka's
reputation proceeds him, but it's all up to this point
kind of always been in the shadows and it's unacknowledged
and it's not something it was like come out and
actually said publicly for Matthew Johnson to call Rob Polinka
a backstabber on national television and say that was a
big part of the reason that he stepped down. And
then there wasn't a trust with with with leadership for
(18:39):
him to be able to make decisions and fire the
coach when he wanted to and all that. I mean,
we knew this was dysfunctional, we knew there was disarray,
But to then have Magic come out and say, yeah,
everything you guys have been saying it's been completely right
was mind mind bending. And then of course you then
have Frank Vogel and Rob Lincoln you know, stride out
and I want to talk about how great Frank Vogel is,
(18:59):
and he very well be great. He may to end
up being a great coach for the Lakers, but it
wasn't really fair to him to put him through the
press conference that he had today where you know, they're
trying to talk about Frank Bogo what he's going to
do for these young players and Lebron James, and then
have um, Rob Lincoln finally sit there and answer the
questions that we've been waiting to ask for six weeks. Yeah,
now that that that part was that was had to
(19:20):
be had to be weird. Um, there's a lot here
kind of unpack, Bill orm joining us covers the Lakers
for the Athletic. If I were to say, and I
started the show saying like, oh, here's the basic rundown.
Magic didn't work hard. Um was you know, was busy
being Magic Johnson and thought that was kind of be
kind of enough, and everybody knew he was gonna be bad,
but wanted to make decisions. At the end, Polinka got
(19:43):
ticked because he's like this dude's never around and he's
talking about stuff. He doesn't know what he's talking about
because he's not doing the work, and that got out
and that would lead to the dysfunction. And then you
got you know, Jennie Buss who's in massively overhead, but
instead of getting basketball people, she doesn't actually us the
basketball people because she doesn't know what's what. So she
falls back on the people she's worked with hand hand
(20:05):
the most the last ten to fifteen years. And those
are the those are the other people that have spots
at the table that rubbed Magic the wrong way, right
that that kind of kind of appears to be all
on the up and up. No, yeah, I think I
think you pretty much got it. I mean, and and
the thing that that that to your point is, yes,
this was a Magic versus Polinka day, but man, he
(20:26):
bust created this to two and a half years ago
when she did the necessary thing, clean house in the
front office, tried to start over, and like you said,
had an opportunity to go out and find like great
basketball people who have done this and succeeded elsewhere. And
I keep coming back to this, and you know, I'm
sure people are tired of me saying it, but that
was kind of the critical moment for the Lakers to
(20:46):
get it right. And instead she leaned on She leaned
on familiar people, people who were comfortable to her. And
this is what you get. You hire an inexperienced president
of basketball operations, give him the biggest possible job. You um,
give him the keys to the car when he is
already driving a lot of other cars simultaneously, and of course,
of course it goes off, goes off the tracks. But
(21:08):
to Genie Buss, this is what you get. Yeah, this
is this is what you get. Um. But Magic did
this for to save Magic, just to supposedly save face
with Magic Johnson, right, like this whole idea of him
being a loyal Lakers total if If that's what a
loyal Laker is, I'd hate to see what it dis
loyal laker is. Yeah, I mean Magic definitely is putting
(21:30):
Magic ahead of of the Lakers here. Um, and you know,
I think I think you're spot on. I mean, obviously,
if if his if his goal was what was good
for the Lakers, he would swallow his pride here and
not and and and let let everyone else do the talking.
And and you know the way he went out that
kind of did that right, Like, I love the Lakers.
The Lakers are gonna be just fine. I got them
to this place. Uh, not gonna saying about Rob Polinka,
(21:53):
but um, everything, everything's great. You know, wouldn't answer the
question about Rob Polinka the Knight the Knight quit if
he left it there, you know, then it kind of
just a question. Well that was weird. But now he's
come out and basically confirmed everyone's worst fears, which is
totally destabilizing to the Lakers, who, if anything, needs some
some stabilization at this point. And instead Magic Johnson you know,
(22:14):
comes out clears, you know, clear, clear as clears the
air from his standpoint, but it only makes the Lakers
look worse as they are going into again. I mean,
every summer feels like the biggest summer ever for the Lakers,
but here they are with a thirty five year old
Raw James and no real traction moving forward. It's the
biggest summer ever. And you have Magic Johnson, arguably the
greatest Laker of all time, telling you the people who
(22:36):
are running this thing are bozos. So enjoy that. Yeah,
does feel that There's there's also one other element which
hasn't been brought up, which I thought, you know, Polinka
is Kobe's guy. There's a little of Magic versus Kobe
here too. There definitely is that's that's that's that's absolutely
there as a subplot. And and don't and listen. I
know Kobe operates in the Shadows and has Granity Studios,
(23:00):
the and the Punees and and you know whatever, whatever
his other projects are, the Lakers are still one of
his projects. He is still very much, um a a
factor here. The relationship he has with Rob Polinka. They
consider each other best friends. Jeannie considers that Kobe, um,
you know, you know what a sudden figure of the
(23:20):
best friend as well. Um. She leaned very heavily on
him when the time came to fire Mitch and Jim
uh two years ago and to hire Magic Johnson, so
um he is he's still a factor here. And when
it comes down to you know, which Laker grade do
you want in your corner going forward? Certainly does seem
like there was only the room for one and and
(23:42):
and in an effort to point the fingers elsewhere. I
think Magic told us all we actually needed to know.
I'd be in and out. I'd be in it out.
That's I'd be. I'd be in and out Bill orm
joining us in the Doug Otlic Show. Okay, now here's
the big question. I know Lebron was there curiously kind
of shooting around in the in the in the in
the episode, Lebron James like, uh, I don't want attention,
(24:03):
but I kind of want attention. But I'm not going
to answer questions. What does Lebron think of the Frank
Vogel higher. We'd love to know. I mean, this guy
is incredible. I mean we have not heard from Lebron
sins he shut it down for the season, didn't do
an exit interview, not through any faults of his own. Really, obviously,
Magic Johnson upstaged him and his exit interview that night
of the last game was canceled. But we haven't heard
(24:24):
from Lebron other than you know, cryptic or or not
so cryptic um Instagram post saying that he's not at
odds with the organization. But obviously what he said on
his show on HBO a couple of weeks ago made
it clear that there were some hurt feelings. UM. And
this is your most important asset, This is the most
important the piece of the organization right now, and you
don't only want to make him happy, but you want
(24:46):
to make him feel empowered and committed and bought in
and and that there is UM again traction moving forward.
And I don't think the Frank Vogel higher happens without
some level of approval. But at the same time, we
know who his guy was in this process. We know
who Lebron expected to be coaching him next season, and
(25:06):
it was ty Lou and Frank Vogo was probably gonna
be part of that as an assistant or have that.
There was definitely a movement in that direction, but for
but for Lebron's guy to basically look at the Lakers
and say, no, I don't want any of that. You
guys are too are are are too disrespectful? Two nuts
Um has to color the way Lebron looks at this
team and this organization. You know, he kind of dipped
his toe in today, like you said, by coming to
(25:27):
Frank Vogel's introductory press confidence. But there was no there
was no walking pass the media and giving us thumbs
up and saying that he was he he loved Frank.
He didn't stop buying give Frank Vogol a hugs that
we saw at least. So if you know, that question
is going to linger until we hear from Lebron or
Lebron Um comes out and said something. But you know,
you go back to last year. Lebron was used to
(25:50):
give Luke Walton that vote of confidence that everyone was
looking for all seasons long. He kept saying, you know,
early in early in training camp, when it was what's
your relationship with Luke Walton, like he's like, well, the
same as any of his relationship with view with somebody
they've only known for two weeks. I don't know yet,
asked me later, asked me later. And Luke Walton never
had that buy in from his best player, And so
I look at Frank Vogel and Lebron. I mean, Lebron
(26:11):
needs Frank Vogel needs Lebron's buying that Lebron really needs
Frank Vogel. There's only a few years left here, so
I don't think Lebron can play that game again. I
don't think he can do the whole le will wait
and see because there's really no replacing the coach this time.
I mean, I know Jason kids there, I know the
coach killer reputation. But they've got to break this cycle.
They've got they've got to break this cycle and find
something that is at least going to work or that
they're going to stick with, because as it is, they
(26:33):
are just they're in the process of wasting, you know,
the final years of you know, one of the greatest
players of all times, if not the greatest player. It's
it's unbelievable. Bill, I got like thirty seconds for you.
Who do they think they're going to get I mean
I think I think I think they think they have
a real shot at kauai um And and Kyrie. Those
(26:53):
those are the guys who I think that they feel
like they have the best chance at Swaying. I don't
see Kauai at all. I don't. I don't see how
you could sit in a room with Steve Bomber and
what is and what the Clippers organization has to offer,
the way they are structured, and then look at the
Lakers and choose and choose the purple and gold over
what they're they're building across town. If he wants to
come to l A, I mean to me, the Clippers
(27:13):
are just far and away the safer, smarter choice. Bill
orm from the Athletic Follow him on Twitter at Bill
or um O. R A M. What a day, get
back to writing. Thanks for joining us. Thank you. Fox
Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.
Catch all of our shows at Fox sports Radio dot
com and within the I Heart Radio apps. Search f
(27:36):
s R to listen live the ever steady Chris Brussardo.
I thought ever steady Chris Broussard, who is now in
a Twitter beef with Kevin Durant. You don't really think
that k D should haven't there should be an asterisk
by the two championship with k D s You're there?
Uh No, I don't. I Look, he was the finals
M v P and deservedly so. Both years, he's obviously
(27:59):
their best. Later, I've never said he was their most
important player. I always thought that was Steph, but he
is their best player. Um So, I don't think you
take away from the championships he won. However, it does
for those you know. And like I said, I've talked
to players around the league and in his cancer said
(28:20):
it on the record on our show the a couple
of few weeks ago that players around the league do
nobody disrespects his game, but they do look at those
championships kind of like, you know, a lot of guys
could have went there and got those, or anybody could
have went there and got those. So for those that
take that view, it can't help but diminish him a
(28:44):
little bit. It doesn't mean he's not the best player
in the world. Uh yeah, actually does it actually does.
Here here's what happened. Uh, end of the season, people
are like, well, why is Kevin rant like moving ball
so much? Moving the ball so much? And then the
start of the start of the Clippers series, you're like,
why isn't he shooting more? And he's like, oh, oh
(29:06):
you don't like okay, fine, I'm Kevin Durant. And then
he goes on a run like we had never seen.
It was like load a charge up the death Star
and I'm gonna start blowing up planets. And that's exactly
what he did. And he's single handedly carried them when
Steph wasn't playing that well, and when Clay wasn't playing
that well, and Draymond was playing well, but Draymond's not
really a score right, and and then and they lost
(29:28):
to Marcus Cousins, and all of a sudden, he's averaging
forty a night, shooting a good percentage, and then he
tweaks his calf and they survive a couple of games
that Houston beat up on. Portland's not that good anyway,
and they're like, well, you know he's he's not that good.
They do they played better, They played better. I heard
they played better without him, they played better with It
doesn't it doesn't mean he's not a great player. I'll
(29:52):
give you an example. I think if Lebron James had
gone to Golden State three years ago instead of Kevin Durant,
they will win championships just like they did with k
D because their talent would be so overwhelming. But Stephan
Clay would become glorified spot up shooters. Lebron would have
the ball most of the time and they would play
(30:12):
much differently. And if Lebron was in k D, shoes
got hurt and they went back to playing like they
are now, like they did before k D, or in
this case Lebron had joined them, people could be saying
the same thing. You know, having played, it's not just
about talent. It's about the chemistry, the trust, the system,
(30:33):
the ball movement, player movement, and so on and so forth.
And you can make an argument. I'm not saying definitively
they're better without these, but it's up, it's on the table.
All the numbers suggest they are. And if they go
ahead and run through my Milwaukee or whoever comes out
of the East, then I think that's the legitimate discussion
(30:54):
that I mean, if James Harden went there, now, would
they be better? Necessarily, they'd be more challenges. What would
they be better because Harden would take away from somebody else,
like look, I would There's there's a bunch of different left.
I think one of the there's there's a couple of things.
I think one of the things that missed people misunderstand
is the team is constructed in a way in which
(31:17):
it benefits it benefits Steph. Right, that's a big thing,
and I actually think k D helps that more than
anybody realizes. Like, Steph is a point guard technically, but
he's just as much the point guard as Draymond is,
and just as much the point guard as k D is,
right like and honestly, Andreaodala can bring the ball up
and it's a pretty a depth passor He's not what
the other three are, but he's a pretty good pastor.
(31:39):
The team's construction is built in a way in which
it helps helps Steph. I don't I don't necessarily agree
because before when Mark Jackson was coaching the team, step
did play more like today's point guards and dominated the ball.
His numbers were great and down they write. But what
(32:01):
happened is Steve Kerr put in the perfect offensive system
for staff play and all and and Draymond for that matter.
And uh so, I'm just saying, like step it, Steph
could play like the rest of these point guards, and
like you said, it probably wouldn't win like he is now. Well, look,
he's Some guys are great with the ball in their hands.
(32:23):
Some guys are great moving without the basketball. He's this
rare case where he's good with either and he's unbelievable
with him. But but it allows them to have because
there have been games NBA Finals games in the past
two years where he doesn't shoot the ball well. Uh,
Western Conference Finals games where he doesn't shoot the ball well.
Kevin Durant allows them to go through these ups and
(32:44):
downs with Steph and survived that which we're normally normally
they would they would not. I guess here's the question.
Does any of this change? First? Does Katie come back
sooner than he would have because they're so successful without
him because of how people are talking? No, I I
think actually this just gives him more patience. I don't. Look,
(33:08):
I don't I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't come back,
uh at all. If they keep rolling, like if you're
if they sweet Portland's and he came back before the
finals started and they lose game one, Now maybe they
were have lost Game one with or without k D.
(33:30):
But if they lose it with him, then it becomes
this huge and and and not Katie's fault, but it
becomes this huge story of are they were they better
without him? Do they need him? Did they disrupt the chemistry?
And so on and so forth, So if I were them,
and and that also puts k D in a in
an awkward position because it could look like he disrupted
(33:56):
them when in actuality that may not be the case
at all. And he has nothing to get, you know,
like if he comes back and there they sweet Portland
and he comes back, he really doesn't have as much
to gain, whereas you kind of let it play out
and if he's needed, you know, if they lose the
first game, then he can come back and there's no
negatives to it. There's no talk about they didn't need him,
(34:19):
they're better without him and all that. So I actually
think it could give them more patience with him. Uh,
coming back to Gotlip Show here on Fox Sports Tradio.
That is the voice of Chris Brussard. All right, Uh,
what do you think of what the Lakers did? First?
Let's start with what Magic did today. What was your reaction? Well, look,
(34:42):
I mean you gotta give him props, I guess for
speaking his mind. And I think he felt like, Look,
there's a lot of mystery out there, there's a lot
of there are a lot of questions and he cleared
stuff up now the time. And I don't think was
a coincidence, right, he knew Rob Selika was gonna talk
today and and so Magic preempted that. Um so you
(35:03):
give him credit for that. But in Magic's talking and
I think he's sincere. I just think he may not
have thoughted through. You know, he he wants to help
the Lakers and recruit to the Lakers. This did not
help them at all because it makes them look like
the type of franchise you do not want to join.
And obviously people were looking from the outside in seeing
(35:27):
all their dysfunction. But now it was confirmed by the
face of the franchise forever, not just right now, but
he's always been the face of the franchise since he
joined them. So I think that that is a problem.
And you know, Doug, these Wlayers today are a lot
more sophisticated than in the past. They look at the
(35:48):
organization's leadership, hierarchy, infrastructure in considering whether or not they
want to go there. Certainly their agents inform them of
everything and advise them. And if a lot of these
agents aren't fans of Rob Pelinka, uh, and they want
to use that against him, look this, this guy turned
(36:10):
on Magic. How are you gonna be able to trust?
You know? That could be a problem. Uh So I
think it makes a little tougher on them to recruit.
I do. I agree it makes him tougher to recruit.
I would also point out though, that you know, Magic,
all Magic trying to do today was help Magic, And
I don't think he actually helped Magic. I think, you know, no,
(36:32):
I did. I did feel like, and I want to
hear your point, but I did feel like, you know,
like when he left, everybody was like Magic was the pride.
He wasn't doing anything. But when he explains, I told Jeanie, look,
I got these other businesses. Don't expect me in the
office every day or every other day for that matter. Um,
(36:53):
And then he talked about how he wanted to get
rid of Luke Walton and you got Tim Harris involved,
you know, obviously not a basketball guy. It it makes
it look like Magic wasn't as big of a problem
as a lot of people fought. At least in my opinion,
I agree, but again, in an effort to save his
(37:13):
in an effort to to give you the truth, here's
the truth of what happened. You end up hurting the Lakers,
end up looking like a guy who's super insecure, right,
Like he admitted he wasn't in the building. He admitted
he wasn't essentially wasn't working all that hard. He wanted
to make all these decisions, but he didn't actually have
to want to do the work to understand what the
(37:34):
decisions were. I mean, that's just that's just kind of
the way you see it, right, Like, I mean, I
I I understand that it irked him that Rob Polinka
was probably talking ish behind his back, But you could
also understand that Rob Polink is probably like this guy
gets to make the decisions. He's never here. How does
he know what he's talking about? As he know if
(37:55):
Luke is or isn't a good coach, if he's never here,
that's that's a that's a problem. So I and and
the the other point you made, which is the best one,
which is like if if if Magic really really wanted
to help the Lakers get players and revive their historical greatness,
(38:16):
then what Magic should have done with saying, you know what,
I was the problem. I had to step away there
great now. But by instead talking about all the dysfunction
within the place. Now, anybody who who didn't believe it
knows it's true. Nobody gets along and there's too many
people that are not basketball people making decisions. Yeah, that's undeniable. There,
You're right. I mean again, a sophisticated free agent is
(38:37):
gonna look that. You know, the Clippers, one of their
biggest selling points is their structure, their leadership structure. I'd
say the same thing about Brooklyn the Knicks, even though
they have a new front office with I think is
doing a good job. You know people, Yeah, people looking
at the owner now, and I'm no players are considering that.
(38:57):
So yeah, I mean it didn't help the Lakers at all.
And again, I I don't think Magic thought it through.
Maybe he did, uh and just purposely, you know, throw
the team under the bus, But I don't think he
did that perfectly. But to your point, that could be
in effect of it all. Okay, so what is Lebron thinking?
(39:18):
And then Lebron did a weird thing, right, Like, he
shows up at the press conference and he takes a
couple of shots, doesn't answer any questions, doesn't give any support,
just kind of they're just kind of a wallflower there. Yeah,
what does Lebron think of the higher and all this
other nonsense. Well, look, from from all my talking to people,
the bottom line is Lebron just wants to be in
(39:39):
l A with the Lakers at least, you know, I know,
you know a year or two ago when he was
looking at where he might go, he just felt, you know,
the Clippers brand wasn't a Lebron James brand, so to speak. Yeah,
I think you know what I mean. Um, So, if
you're gonna be in l A, the place to be
is with the Lakers. So he's not looking to leave.
(40:01):
For all you know air audience reasons people know about,
He's not looking to leave. So from what I'm told
is his attitude is let's make the best of it.
And I do think, and I've said this before, if
he if he buys in, I mean, look who the
blade the Warriors are playing in the conference championship. You know,
(40:22):
the Lakers could be that good even if they don't
make many moves in the off season or get that
big name free agent. So if you know, and I
do think he respects, he generally respects Rank Vogel. I'm
told that from the battles that they had in you
know Miami and Indiana when Vogel was the head coach.
So I just think Lebron has to have the right
(40:43):
attitude regardless of who the coaches, and I think if
he does, especially if k D leaves Golden State, then
I think they have to feel like they having a
decent chance, a good chance to make a deep playoff run,
if not more I took when Gail Benson erected the
Jackie McMullan report actually said that jack and mullan report
was wrong. I took that to mean Pelicans are open
(41:06):
for business, right like your Lakers. Will probably had to
pay a little bit more to get him, but I
took it. I took it to mean that they're they're
open for business to move Anthony Davis, that nothing has
changed landing Zion Williamson, maybe even energized it more so
to move him. Where do you think a d ends up? Well,
what I'm told is this that and I think we
(41:29):
both understand if the Lakers, if it's a tie between
the Knick's offer and the Lakers offer Boston offer, whoever
they're sending into the Eastern Conference. But I'm told that
Alvin Gentry really likes the Lakers players, Um lines o ball,
he he thinks lines o ball, Drew Holiday, uh Zion Kuzma, Ingram.
(41:55):
You know, a group like that could be not only
good offensively and we know that the specialty, but also
defensively UM in certain situations. So I think that's something
to consider. But who I think it all boils down
to this, what do they think of r J Barrett?
Because if they if you have if you really like
(42:16):
r J. Barrett and you have the opportunity to pair
him with Zion, a great friend, his roommate, you know,
you got the whole Duke connections for storyline, then I
think that's gonna be tough to be um. But the
latest players are challenging, and they did see one of them,
Julius Rams to go there and have a great season
or good season. Um, And let me throw this into
(42:38):
Doug Brooklyn, I'm told is really making a hard push
for a D or will if they can get if
they can get Kyrie Irving to commit to them. You
know under the the guys that a D goes there
as well and would stay long term, then they'll try
to get him. D'Angelo Russell, Jared Allen, some of their
(43:01):
draft picks. They'll try to do it. I don't think they.
You know, none of those players are as good as
maybe an R. J. Barrett or as sexy as an R. J.
Barrett is, or maybe even the Lakers package. But Brooklyn
is trying to get into this as well. Awesome, awesome stuff.
Um do you think the Bucks win their series? I do,
I do, and I think they if Katy is not back,
(43:24):
I think they give Golden they posed some problems. I
still would pick Golden State. But it's interesting because you heard,
you know, Jeff Van Gundy Mark Jackson on the broadcast
say they think Milwaukee would be the definitive favorite over
Golden State. And then there are those that think Golden
State is the prohibitive favorite even without k D if
(43:46):
they whoever they face in the East. So I think
it's gonna be interesting. But I do think Milwaukee wins
this series. Now, if Toronto can solve the honest or
you know, he don't expect you get twelve points, but
if they make him struggling and getting maybe eighteen or
nineteen points and when, then you might feel like, Okay,
they figured something out with Janice, And I think you'd
(44:09):
have to think they might have a good chance to
win this series, but right now, yeah, I'm definitely thinking Milwaukee,
Chris Brussary. You can check them out on The Odd Couple,
which is and starts an hour after our shows the
seven o'clock Eastern four o'clock Pacific, along with Rob Parker's
outstanding three hour radio show. Check it out followed on
Twitter or at Fox Sports Radio dot com as well.
See thanks so much. All right, Doug, you need something
Thanks for listening to the best of the Doug Gottlieb
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Put their experience in a play at Farmers dot Com.
Farmers Well, congratulations Lakers. Instead of talking about the warriors
remarkable comeback in the third quarter against the Trailbladger to
take a commanding three games to non lead, instead end
up talking about Toronto's resilience and finding a way to
(01:03):
beat the Bucks too uh to get on the board
and now trail two games to one. In their best
of seven Eastern Conference Finals. Instead of caring about the
actual games or even caring about Frank Vogel, the guy
was hired today instead, well, instead, we're talking about the Lakers.
(01:25):
That's because Magic Johnson and Rob Polinka both spoke essentially
to the media today. Magic Johnson surprise interview with first take,
and then Rob Polinka was introducing Frank Vogel, who people
asked a couple of uncomfortable questions too. If you missed
(01:46):
the blow by blow, here's Magic Johnson on why he
chose to lead the Lakers. People around the Laker office
was telling me Rob was saying things, and Rob Polinka
and I didn't like those things being said behind my
back do I wasn't in the office enough and so
on and all. So I started getting calls from my
friends outside of basketball saying those things. Now will say
(02:10):
it to them outside of basketball now, not just in
the Laker office anymore. Now it's in the media and
so on. He's a people who trust exactly and people
gotta remember something. Being in this business fold for forty years,
I got allies, I got friends everywhere. This is Rob
Polinka's response to the betrayal remarks, I think the most
(02:32):
important thing for me is the two years of getting
to work side by side within are some of the
greatest memories I have in sports and work. Um, he's
an unbelievable person to work with. He fills the room
with joy and vision and truly it's it's it's saddening
and disheartening to think he believes things that are a misperception.
(02:54):
Here's uh Magic on how the Lakers and Genie Buss
made decisions. It's too many people at the table, and
so what happens everybody gets to share their opinion and
there's so much information coming at her that then when
I say, hey, we have to do this, she can't
make a decision because they said, no, don't go the
(03:15):
way Magic go, you should go. So so her love
for those people, in respect for those people often caused
us to not make the right choice or there's no
decision Max, And so I said, listen, you can't run
a corporation like this. You can't have everybody think that
(03:35):
they can have a voice. Here's Rob Polinka on how
they'll go forward without Magic. Jeanie's vision for the front
office is a couple of years ago, she created a
position that didn't exist prior to Irvin coming on board
President of Basketball Operations, and she uh is going to
eliminate that position because it was created entirely for Magic.
(03:57):
No one can really replace what he does, So uh,
that would be that you want my summation. Everything you
heard is everything you think you heard. Magic didn't really
show up at work. Tell him I'm gonna be in
and out. I got a bunch of stuff going on.
Polinka probably talked a little ish on him and said, Hey,
(04:19):
that dude never at work, wants to make all of
the decisions, doesn't actually do the work, so he can
back up why he makes those decisions. And Genie Buss
is completely in over her head so much so that
she's just reaching out to people who she feels like
she knows who she can trust to help her sort
through what is the bull? You know what? And what
(04:41):
is reality? That's it, that's what's really happening. Like again,
let's not I love Magic as a player. Tell me
the thing he's had to invest his time and his
energy in that he's invested his time and his energy
other than showing up and be Magic. And this idea
(05:01):
that well, you know you gotta take Magic's word for
it because he has this vision of what a player is.
He didn't as a coach, he hasn't as an analyst
either time NBC or ESPN. And the biggest reason isn't
because he's a dope. He's not. It's just because he's
just not that into it. Like, look, Magic Johnson spends
five weeks a year on a yacht in Europe. This
(05:25):
is this is this public information. He and his wife
they have a yacht and they travel around Europe and
do everything you've ever dreamed of doing, and have dinner
with everyone you've ever dreamed of having dinner with? Why
because he's Magic Johnson. So do I buy that he
(05:46):
didn't work that hard? Yeah? Of course? Do I buy
that it probably bothered Rob Polinka. He's doing all this
grunt work and that Magic Johnson does all the press conferences,
claims all responsibility, takes none of the blame because he's Magic. Sure,
do I think it got back to Magic? Yeah? By
the way, if Magic was a super loyal laker, then
(06:09):
he wouldn't have done that interview if it wasn't about
Magic Johnson and saving Magic Johnson's name. Whereas think what
you want about the reputation of Plinka. But Polinka answered
the questions and took the high road. He just did.
He didn't know Magic under the bus he could have.
You know, I Magic heard those things because it was true, right, yeah,
(06:34):
I said all of that stuff. The best part about
it is the newest U l A story is, well,
you know, supposedly Magic was c it was beasts blind
Sea Seed on some emails like that's not actually true
because Magic is not a big email guy. That That
pretty much sums it all up, right, You're a president
(06:56):
of basketball operations, then I'm not really an email guy.
What's this whole computer? What's your sign in? Magic? What's
a sign in? Right? But you can't you can't. You
can't have Magic Johnson, who's been told his you know
what doesn't stink for forty years in the city, you
(07:17):
know who had a relationship with the late owner because
they go out together. That was the whole Jerry Bust thing.
Jerry Bust was a playboy and Magic Johnson was a playboy,
and he used to go out together in l A.
And he had the biggest star and the owner hanging
out together. That was the root of their relationship. You
can't go from that place to a magic We really
(07:39):
need you in for the nine o'clock meeting every Monday morning. Yeah,
Maggie Johnson. So I'd love to tell you that there's
more at play here that Polinka is evil and Magic's great,
or Magic's evil and Plink is great, or there's something
like not really. And this, by the way, is why
(08:02):
you gotta be very careful in hiring a Magic Johnson,
because it's not about hiring him, it's about what happens
when you fire him or when he fires himself. Right.
In an effort to prove that he had a better
work ethic than was being perceived, Magic Johnson told the
world in his own words, the reason he was quitting
(08:25):
was it wasn't fun anymore. He couldn't tweet about other
players because the Lakers would get fined. These are things
that he said. Nobody made him say. So do I
think what Magic is saying is accurate? Yeah? I'm sure
He's got tons of friends who heard Rob Polinka talk
a lot of trash. That doesn't make the trash not true.
(08:49):
It doesn't make Rob Polinka look any better for talking
that trash. But you can understand the frustration. Anyone's ever
done group work, You ever done group work at college?
All right, what's the worst thing in the world When
you show up from presentation day and there's the one
usually the young girl with a woman who did She's like, well,
I knew you weren't showing up, So here's the notes
(09:09):
on the presentation, and here's the graph you were supposed
to do, and I did it for you. That's how
Rob Polin could think. He's like, wait, what so you know?
I mean his defense for the zoo Botch trade where
(09:30):
they wanted to make a trade with the l A
Clippers to get a stretch five and the Clippers didn't
even think Zubach was available because he's twenty one making
nothing his money and he's got He's a he was
a starter, a starting caliber player. His defense for giving
away zupatch the Clippers didn't even ask for was, well,
you know, he didn't even play in the playoffs. Yeah,
(09:52):
that's kind of beside the point. Dude. Magic appeared as
a loof as ever, because he's Magic Johnson, Rob Polinka
appeared um to take the high road, and Genie Bus.
Genie Buss is exactly what you thought she was. She's
(10:12):
a woman who has a good business acumen, who has
no idea who to trust, or what to believe or
what to do in running the Lakers, and so she
does what we all do. She trusts her inner circle
people she's known the longest, and therein lies the Lakers dysfunction.
Remember the word fun is interlaced in dysfunction. It's not
(10:36):
fun to live it, to work in it. Hell, have
a lot of fun to cover, I'll tell you that.
Be sure to catch live editions of The Doug Dot
Leap Show week days in noon eastern three pm Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app.
Mike Florio has a story out, says Jets CEO and
chairman Christopher Johnson wants say great strategic thinker to run
(10:57):
in the football operations. He needs someone who can work
with coach Adam Gaze, and one name has come up,
Peyton Manning. Rumors are flying within the league circles the
Jets may make a run at the future Hall of
Fame quarterback who periodically has been linked to NFL management possibilities.
I see it, I think it happens, I thinks should happen.
(11:21):
I think it'd be great. Everyone we've ever talked to
in regards to Peyton Manning says he doesn't wanted to
be a broadcaster. He wants to run a football team. Frankly,
I think he wants to own a football team. And
people thought he could buy the Tennessee Titans at some point,
but with the ties to New York, with that side
(11:42):
of the market, and his ties to Adam Gaatee, and
he didn't just play for Adam Gains and have a
great success late in his career with Adam Gaze as
his offensive coordinator. I got a chance to do sideline
for Fox last football season. The game I did was
the Bears against the Dolphins. That's when brock Oswilder was
a surprise starter. You know, it was in an tendants
(12:02):
Peyton Manning the sheriff as he's known. And look, he
wasn't close with brock Oswalder. They were not friends. They
worked together, but they were not boys. He's close with
Adam Gaze, and Gaze is the interim GM and has
to find somebody who wants to work with And this
makes total sense to me and to too. Someone says, well,
(12:26):
you know what about Donald, this would be a This
would say he believes in Donald. This would give him
unlimited possibilities in terms of what he could do, what
he would want to do with that roster. Granted, you
do have some issues there in terms of the roster
(12:47):
depth and no center, no wide receivers to speak of.
You have a running back making a little bit too
much money, but you have a quarterback under club control,
and you might have had the best guy in the
draft over the each of the last three years. As
some good things there and as much as today we're
pointing out that Magic Johnson didn't work hard enough to
(13:10):
be a good president of football basketball operations with the
l A Lakers. That's not who Peyton Manning is. Like
Peyton Manning is, he's a workaholic, Like was he born
tall enough? And did he have a good arm? Like? Yeah,
But he had to overcome a lack of arm strength
and lack of mobility and be a football genius in
(13:33):
order to become one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time.
Like pay Manning was infamous for not letting backups take
reps in practice, let alone waving off the punt team
when he like he wants to be in charge he
wants the ball. He wants to do the research, like
(13:54):
he wants this thing. This isn't He's not Magic Johnson
with Cookie taking five weeks and going into the Mediterranean
on a on a yacht. You can't get ahold of
me receiving no compensation in return. In the two years
since he's been retired, he's traveled the most to every
trading camp just to learn and absorb. Still has his
(14:17):
family's football camp. Oh yeah, by the way, I think,
isn't that his son is playing quarterback down in high school?
When that, yeah, one of the one of their sons
is now playing quarterback, Arch playing quarterback in high school.
So like you sit there and you're like, what are
we doing here? Arch is son a Cooper. Okay, Cooper
(14:41):
is a funny one. Cooper is the funny one. Peyton
is the good one, and he lies the little brother
who it just happens to have two super Bowl rings
in the bidiest media market and among the things that
the Manning family likes, they love the medium, Mark, they
love the media has been really good to them, and
(15:02):
they've been really good to the media. And being in
New York would make a ton of sense. Ton of sense.
I hope it happens. I think it'd be a great
move for the Jets. I think it would work, and
I think it would would be all that he ever wants.
The only question would be would would Payton ever be
able to get ownership, which is what I've what everyone's
(15:24):
always thought that he wanted. He wants to own a
piece m But then, look, there's just different types of stars.
Magic was a superstar. Magic was had a brilliant vision
for how to play basketball, but he was more like
an artist, whereas Peyton Manning was more like a nerd
(15:44):
who found ways he could read a d could sit
there and process and read a defense and throw the
ball at the exact right spot at the exact right time,
based upon the wind, the pitch of the field, how
his arm felt, all of these things like he was
a perfectionist, but based upon levels of preparation right. Magic's
(16:08):
whole thing was I'm Magic Johnson, no explanation, whereas Peyton
Mannings sole Matt By the way, Magic Johnson was famous.
One of the reasons that pat Riley supposedly never won
a championship with the Knicks or with the Heat was
because he famously practiced too long and too hard. Magic
(16:28):
Johnson was the guy who supposedly, supposedly was the one
guy able to tell pat Riley, we ain't practiced anymore. Look,
he could just show up and do it. He just
figured out a way to get it done. He had
feel he didn't need to prep That's on who Peyton
Manning was. Matter of fact, one of the reasons Peyton
(16:50):
Manning struggled in the playoffs was because at some level,
when you get into the playoffs, you can't prep for stuff.
You just gotta make plays on your own. Which is
why Magic was so great in impromptu situations and just
got a role with it. But in the role of
president of football operations, running a football team, evaluating your
(17:11):
team's town, the rest of the leagu's town, trying to
be ahead of the curve in the type of personnel
you get, and and evaluating college town, I think the
home run because that's all he's ever done and all
he's ever wanted. Be sure to catch live edition so
the Doug dot Leaps show week days in noon eastern
(17:33):
three pm Pacific. Bill Orm covers the Lakers for the
Athletic Bill. How would you describe today in the laker Land, Uh,
surreal like most days and Lakers Land lately, it's it's
it's surreal, um to see. You know. Obviously today was
going to be a big day. Like you said, we
haven't heard from Rob Pelinka or anyone in Lakers management
for that matter, since Magic Johnson stepped down, and so
(17:55):
today was gonna be today that we were gonna get
some answers. Well we got answers all right, but we
got him from Magic at what six six am? But
the big time, I mean it was a um, I mean,
that was that was a heck of a thing to
wake up to to hear going off the cuff and
basically confirming all the whispers that have been out there
about Rob Polinka, at least at least from his standpoint.
I think what was interesting about it is obviously, um
(18:17):
those whispers had been out there, and obviously Rob Polinka's
reputation proceeds him, but it's all up to this point
kind of always been in the shadows and it's unacknowledged
and it's not something it was like come out and
actually said publicly for Matthew Johnson to call Rob Polinka
a backstabber on national television and say that was a
big part of the reason that he stepped down. And
then there wasn't a trust with with with leadership for
(18:39):
him to be able to make decisions and fire the
coach when he wanted to and all that. I mean,
we knew this was dysfunctional, we knew there was disarray,
But to then have Magic come out and say, yeah,
everything you guys have been saying it's been completely right
was mind mind bending. And then of course you then
have Frank Vogel and Rob Lincoln you know, stride out
and I want to talk about how great Frank Vogel is,
(18:59):
and he very well be great. He may to end
up being a great coach for the Lakers, but it
wasn't really fair to him to put him through the
press conference that he had today where you know, they're
trying to talk about Frank Bogo what he's going to
do for these young players and Lebron James, and then
have um, Rob Lincoln finally sit there and answer the
questions that we've been waiting to ask for six weeks. Yeah,
now that that that part was that was had to
(19:20):
be had to be weird. Um, there's a lot here
kind of unpack, Bill orm joining us covers the Lakers
for the Athletic. If I were to say, and I
started the show saying like, oh, here's the basic rundown.
Magic didn't work hard. Um was you know, was busy
being Magic Johnson and thought that was kind of be
kind of enough, and everybody knew he was gonna be bad,
but wanted to make decisions. At the end, Polinka got
(19:43):
ticked because he's like this dude's never around and he's
talking about stuff. He doesn't know what he's talking about
because he's not doing the work, and that got out
and that would lead to the dysfunction. And then you
got you know, Jennie Buss who's in massively overhead, but
instead of getting basketball people, she doesn't actually us the
basketball people because she doesn't know what's what. So she
falls back on the people she's worked with hand hand
(20:05):
the most the last ten to fifteen years. And those
are the those are the other people that have spots
at the table that rubbed Magic the wrong way, right
that that kind of kind of appears to be all
on the up and up. No, yeah, I think I
think you pretty much got it. I mean, and and
the thing that that that to your point is, yes,
this was a Magic versus Polinka day, but man, he
(20:26):
bust created this to two and a half years ago
when she did the necessary thing, clean house in the
front office, tried to start over, and like you said,
had an opportunity to go out and find like great
basketball people who have done this and succeeded elsewhere. And
I keep coming back to this, and you know, I'm
sure people are tired of me saying it, but that
was kind of the critical moment for the Lakers to
(20:46):
get it right. And instead she leaned on She leaned
on familiar people, people who were comfortable to her. And
this is what you get. You hire an inexperienced president
of basketball operations, give him the biggest possible job. You um,
give him the keys to the car when he is
already driving a lot of other cars simultaneously, and of course,
of course it goes off, goes off the tracks. But
(21:08):
to Genie Buss, this is what you get. Yeah, this
is this is what you get. Um. But Magic did
this for to save Magic, just to supposedly save face
with Magic Johnson, right, like this whole idea of him
being a loyal Lakers total if If that's what a
loyal Laker is, I'd hate to see what it dis
loyal laker is. Yeah, I mean Magic definitely is putting
(21:30):
Magic ahead of of the Lakers here. Um, and you know,
I think I think you're spot on. I mean, obviously,
if if his if his goal was what was good
for the Lakers, he would swallow his pride here and
not and and and let let everyone else do the talking.
And and you know the way he went out that
kind of did that right, Like, I love the Lakers.
The Lakers are gonna be just fine. I got them
to this place. Uh, not gonna saying about Rob Polinka,
(21:53):
but um, everything, everything's great. You know, wouldn't answer the
question about Rob Polinka the Knight the Knight quit if
he left it there, you know, then it kind of
just a question. Well that was weird. But now he's
come out and basically confirmed everyone's worst fears, which is
totally destabilizing to the Lakers, who, if anything, needs some
some stabilization at this point. And instead Magic Johnson you know,
(22:14):
comes out clears, you know, clear, clear as clears the
air from his standpoint, but it only makes the Lakers
look worse as they are going into again. I mean,
every summer feels like the biggest summer ever for the Lakers,
but here they are with a thirty five year old
Raw James and no real traction moving forward. It's the
biggest summer ever. And you have Magic Johnson, arguably the
greatest Laker of all time, telling you the people who
(22:36):
are running this thing are bozos. So enjoy that. Yeah,
does feel that There's there's also one other element which
hasn't been brought up, which I thought, you know, Polinka
is Kobe's guy. There's a little of Magic versus Kobe
here too. There definitely is that's that's that's that's absolutely
there as a subplot. And and don't and listen. I
know Kobe operates in the Shadows and has Granity Studios,
(23:00):
the and the Punees and and you know whatever, whatever
his other projects are, the Lakers are still one of
his projects. He is still very much, um a a
factor here. The relationship he has with Rob Polinka. They
consider each other best friends. Jeannie considers that Kobe, um,
you know, you know what a sudden figure of the
(23:20):
best friend as well. Um. She leaned very heavily on
him when the time came to fire Mitch and Jim
uh two years ago and to hire Magic Johnson, so
um he is he's still a factor here. And when
it comes down to you know, which Laker grade do
you want in your corner going forward? Certainly does seem
like there was only the room for one and and
(23:42):
and in an effort to point the fingers elsewhere. I
think Magic told us all we actually needed to know.
I'd be in and out. I'd be in it out.
That's I'd be. I'd be in and out Bill orm
joining us in the Doug Otlic Show. Okay, now here's
the big question. I know Lebron was there curiously kind
of shooting around in the in the in the in
the episode, Lebron James like, uh, I don't want attention,
(24:03):
but I kind of want attention. But I'm not going
to answer questions. What does Lebron think of the Frank
Vogel higher. We'd love to know. I mean, this guy
is incredible. I mean we have not heard from Lebron
sins he shut it down for the season, didn't do
an exit interview, not through any faults of his own. Really, obviously,
Magic Johnson upstaged him and his exit interview that night
of the last game was canceled. But we haven't heard
(24:24):
from Lebron other than you know, cryptic or or not
so cryptic um Instagram post saying that he's not at
odds with the organization. But obviously what he said on
his show on HBO a couple of weeks ago made
it clear that there were some hurt feelings. UM. And
this is your most important asset, This is the most
important the piece of the organization right now, and you
don't only want to make him happy, but you want
(24:46):
to make him feel empowered and committed and bought in
and and that there is UM again traction moving forward.
And I don't think the Frank Vogel higher happens without
some level of approval. But at the same time, we
know who his guy was in this process. We know
who Lebron expected to be coaching him next season, and
(25:06):
it was ty Lou and Frank Vogo was probably gonna
be part of that as an assistant or have that.
There was definitely a movement in that direction, but for
but for Lebron's guy to basically look at the Lakers
and say, no, I don't want any of that. You
guys are too are are are too disrespectful? Two nuts
Um has to color the way Lebron looks at this
team and this organization. You know, he kind of dipped
his toe in today, like you said, by coming to
(25:27):
Frank Vogel's introductory press confidence. But there was no there
was no walking pass the media and giving us thumbs
up and saying that he was he he loved Frank.
He didn't stop buying give Frank Vogol a hugs that
we saw at least. So if you know, that question
is going to linger until we hear from Lebron or
Lebron Um comes out and said something. But you know,
you go back to last year. Lebron was used to
(25:50):
give Luke Walton that vote of confidence that everyone was
looking for all seasons long. He kept saying, you know,
early in early in training camp, when it was what's
your relationship with Luke Walton, like he's like, well, the
same as any of his relationship with view with somebody
they've only known for two weeks. I don't know yet,
asked me later, asked me later. And Luke Walton never
had that buy in from his best player, And so
I look at Frank Vogel and Lebron. I mean, Lebron
(26:11):
needs Frank Vogel needs Lebron's buying that Lebron really needs
Frank Vogel. There's only a few years left here, so
I don't think Lebron can play that game again. I
don't think he can do the whole le will wait
and see because there's really no replacing the coach this time.
I mean, I know Jason kids there, I know the
coach killer reputation. But they've got to break this cycle.
They've got they've got to break this cycle and find
something that is at least going to work or that
they're going to stick with, because as it is, they
(26:33):
are just they're in the process of wasting, you know,
the final years of you know, one of the greatest
players of all times, if not the greatest player. It's
it's unbelievable. Bill, I got like thirty seconds for you.
Who do they think they're going to get I mean
I think I think I think they think they have
a real shot at kauai um And and Kyrie. Those
(26:53):
those are the guys who I think that they feel
like they have the best chance at Swaying. I don't
see Kauai at all. I don't. I don't see how
you could sit in a room with Steve Bomber and
what is and what the Clippers organization has to offer,
the way they are structured, and then look at the
Lakers and choose and choose the purple and gold over
what they're they're building across town. If he wants to
come to l A, I mean to me, the Clippers
(27:13):
are just far and away the safer, smarter choice. Bill
orm from the Athletic Follow him on Twitter at Bill
or um O. R A M. What a day, get
back to writing. Thanks for joining us. Thank you. Fox
Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.
Catch all of our shows at Fox sports Radio dot
com and within the I Heart Radio apps. Search f
(27:36):
s R to listen live the ever steady Chris Brussardo.
I thought ever steady Chris Broussard, who is now in
a Twitter beef with Kevin Durant. You don't really think
that k D should haven't there should be an asterisk
by the two championship with k D s You're there?
Uh No, I don't. I Look, he was the finals
M v P and deservedly so. Both years, he's obviously
(27:59):
their best. Later, I've never said he was their most
important player. I always thought that was Steph, but he
is their best player. Um So, I don't think you
take away from the championships he won. However, it does
for those you know. And like I said, I've talked
to players around the league and in his cancer said
(28:20):
it on the record on our show the a couple
of few weeks ago that players around the league do
nobody disrespects his game, but they do look at those
championships kind of like, you know, a lot of guys
could have went there and got those, or anybody could
have went there and got those. So for those that
take that view, it can't help but diminish him a
(28:44):
little bit. It doesn't mean he's not the best player
in the world. Uh yeah, actually does it actually does.
Here here's what happened. Uh, end of the season, people
are like, well, why is Kevin rant like moving ball
so much? Moving the ball so much? And then the
start of the start of the Clippers series, you're like,
why isn't he shooting more? And he's like, oh, oh
(29:06):
you don't like okay, fine, I'm Kevin Durant. And then
he goes on a run like we had never seen.
It was like load a charge up the death Star
and I'm gonna start blowing up planets. And that's exactly
what he did. And he's single handedly carried them when
Steph wasn't playing that well, and when Clay wasn't playing
that well, and Draymond was playing well, but Draymond's not
really a score right, and and then and they lost
(29:28):
to Marcus Cousins, and all of a sudden, he's averaging
forty a night, shooting a good percentage, and then he
tweaks his calf and they survive a couple of games
that Houston beat up on. Portland's not that good anyway,
and they're like, well, you know he's he's not that good.
They do they played better, They played better. I heard
they played better without him, they played better with It
doesn't it doesn't mean he's not a great player. I'll
(29:52):
give you an example. I think if Lebron James had
gone to Golden State three years ago instead of Kevin Durant,
they will win championships just like they did with k
D because their talent would be so overwhelming. But Stephan
Clay would become glorified spot up shooters. Lebron would have
the ball most of the time and they would play
(30:12):
much differently. And if Lebron was in k D, shoes
got hurt and they went back to playing like they
are now, like they did before k D, or in
this case Lebron had joined them, people could be saying
the same thing. You know, having played, it's not just
about talent. It's about the chemistry, the trust, the system,
(30:33):
the ball movement, player movement, and so on and so forth.
And you can make an argument. I'm not saying definitively
they're better without these, but it's up, it's on the table.
All the numbers suggest they are. And if they go
ahead and run through my Milwaukee or whoever comes out
of the East, then I think that's the legitimate discussion
(30:54):
that I mean, if James Harden went there, now, would
they be better? Necessarily, they'd be more challenges. What would
they be better because Harden would take away from somebody else,
like look, I would There's there's a bunch of different left.
I think one of the there's there's a couple of things.
I think one of the things that missed people misunderstand
is the team is constructed in a way in which
(31:17):
it benefits it benefits Steph. Right, that's a big thing,
and I actually think k D helps that more than
anybody realizes. Like, Steph is a point guard technically, but
he's just as much the point guard as Draymond is,
and just as much the point guard as k D is,
right like and honestly, Andreaodala can bring the ball up
and it's a pretty a depth passor He's not what
the other three are, but he's a pretty good pastor.
(31:39):
The team's construction is built in a way in which
it helps helps Steph. I don't I don't necessarily agree
because before when Mark Jackson was coaching the team, step
did play more like today's point guards and dominated the ball.
His numbers were great and down they write. But what
(32:01):
happened is Steve Kerr put in the perfect offensive system
for staff play and all and and Draymond for that matter.
And uh so, I'm just saying, like step it, Steph
could play like the rest of these point guards, and
like you said, it probably wouldn't win like he is now. Well, look,
he's Some guys are great with the ball in their hands.
(32:23):
Some guys are great moving without the basketball. He's this
rare case where he's good with either and he's unbelievable
with him. But but it allows them to have because
there have been games NBA Finals games in the past
two years where he doesn't shoot the ball well. Uh,
Western Conference Finals games where he doesn't shoot the ball well.
Kevin Durant allows them to go through these ups and
(32:44):
downs with Steph and survived that which we're normally normally
they would they would not. I guess here's the question.
Does any of this change? First? Does Katie come back
sooner than he would have because they're so successful without
him because of how people are talking? No, I I
think actually this just gives him more patience. I don't. Look,
(33:08):
I don't I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't come back,
uh at all. If they keep rolling, like if you're
if they sweet Portland's and he came back before the
finals started and they lose game one, Now maybe they
were have lost Game one with or without k D.
(33:30):
But if they lose it with him, then it becomes
this huge and and and not Katie's fault, but it
becomes this huge story of are they were they better
without him? Do they need him? Did they disrupt the chemistry?
And so on and so forth, So if I were them,
and and that also puts k D in a in
an awkward position because it could look like he disrupted
(33:56):
them when in actuality that may not be the case
at all. And he has nothing to get, you know,
like if he comes back and there they sweet Portland
and he comes back, he really doesn't have as much
to gain, whereas you kind of let it play out
and if he's needed, you know, if they lose the
first game, then he can come back and there's no
negatives to it. There's no talk about they didn't need him,
(34:19):
they're better without him and all that. So I actually
think it could give them more patience with him. Uh,
coming back to Gotlip Show here on Fox Sports Tradio.
That is the voice of Chris Brussard. All right, Uh,
what do you think of what the Lakers did? First?
Let's start with what Magic did today. What was your reaction? Well, look,
(34:42):
I mean you gotta give him props, I guess for
speaking his mind. And I think he felt like, Look,
there's a lot of mystery out there, there's a lot
of there are a lot of questions and he cleared
stuff up now the time. And I don't think was
a coincidence, right, he knew Rob Selika was gonna talk
today and and so Magic preempted that. Um so you
(35:03):
give him credit for that. But in Magic's talking and
I think he's sincere. I just think he may not
have thoughted through. You know, he he wants to help
the Lakers and recruit to the Lakers. This did not
help them at all because it makes them look like
the type of franchise you do not want to join.
And obviously people were looking from the outside in seeing
(35:27):
all their dysfunction. But now it was confirmed by the
face of the franchise forever, not just right now, but
he's always been the face of the franchise since he
joined them. So I think that that is a problem.
And you know, Doug, these Wlayers today are a lot
more sophisticated than in the past. They look at the
(35:48):
organization's leadership, hierarchy, infrastructure in considering whether or not they
want to go there. Certainly their agents inform them of
everything and advise them. And if a lot of these
agents aren't fans of Rob Pelinka, uh, and they want
to use that against him, look this, this guy turned
(36:10):
on Magic. How are you gonna be able to trust?
You know? That could be a problem. Uh So I
think it makes a little tougher on them to recruit.
I do. I agree it makes him tougher to recruit.
I would also point out though, that you know, Magic,
all Magic trying to do today was help Magic, And
I don't think he actually helped Magic. I think, you know, no,
(36:32):
I did. I did feel like, and I want to
hear your point, but I did feel like, you know,
like when he left, everybody was like Magic was the pride.
He wasn't doing anything. But when he explains, I told Jeanie, look,
I got these other businesses. Don't expect me in the
office every day or every other day for that matter. Um,
(36:53):
And then he talked about how he wanted to get
rid of Luke Walton and you got Tim Harris involved,
you know, obviously not a basketball guy. It it makes
it look like Magic wasn't as big of a problem
as a lot of people fought. At least in my opinion,
I agree, but again, in an effort to save his
(37:13):
in an effort to to give you the truth, here's
the truth of what happened. You end up hurting the Lakers,
end up looking like a guy who's super insecure, right,
Like he admitted he wasn't in the building. He admitted
he wasn't essentially wasn't working all that hard. He wanted
to make all these decisions, but he didn't actually have
to want to do the work to understand what the
(37:34):
decisions were. I mean, that's just that's just kind of
the way you see it, right, Like, I mean, I
I I understand that it irked him that Rob Polinka
was probably talking ish behind his back, But you could
also understand that Rob Polink is probably like this guy
gets to make the decisions. He's never here. How does
he know what he's talking about? As he know if
(37:55):
Luke is or isn't a good coach, if he's never here,
that's that's a that's a problem. So I and and
the the other point you made, which is the best one,
which is like if if if Magic really really wanted
to help the Lakers get players and revive their historical greatness,
(38:16):
then what Magic should have done with saying, you know what,
I was the problem. I had to step away there
great now. But by instead talking about all the dysfunction
within the place. Now, anybody who who didn't believe it
knows it's true. Nobody gets along and there's too many
people that are not basketball people making decisions. Yeah, that's undeniable. There,
You're right. I mean again, a sophisticated free agent is
(38:37):
gonna look that. You know, the Clippers, one of their
biggest selling points is their structure, their leadership structure. I'd
say the same thing about Brooklyn the Knicks, even though
they have a new front office with I think is
doing a good job. You know people, Yeah, people looking
at the owner now, and I'm no players are considering that.
(38:57):
So yeah, I mean it didn't help the Lakers at all.
And again, I I don't think Magic thought it through.
Maybe he did, uh and just purposely, you know, throw
the team under the bus, But I don't think he
did that perfectly. But to your point, that could be
in effect of it all. Okay, so what is Lebron thinking?
(39:18):
And then Lebron did a weird thing, right, Like, he
shows up at the press conference and he takes a
couple of shots, doesn't answer any questions, doesn't give any support,
just kind of they're just kind of a wallflower there. Yeah,
what does Lebron think of the higher and all this
other nonsense. Well, look, from from all my talking to people,
the bottom line is Lebron just wants to be in
(39:39):
l A with the Lakers at least, you know, I know,
you know a year or two ago when he was
looking at where he might go, he just felt, you know,
the Clippers brand wasn't a Lebron James brand, so to speak. Yeah,
I think you know what I mean. Um, So, if
you're gonna be in l A, the place to be
is with the Lakers. So he's not looking to leave.
(40:01):
For all you know air audience reasons people know about,
He's not looking to leave. So from what I'm told
is his attitude is let's make the best of it.
And I do think, and I've said this before, if
he if he buys in, I mean, look who the
blade the Warriors are playing in the conference championship. You know,
(40:22):
the Lakers could be that good even if they don't
make many moves in the off season or get that
big name free agent. So if you know, and I
do think he respects, he generally respects Rank Vogel. I'm
told that from the battles that they had in you
know Miami and Indiana when Vogel was the head coach.
So I just think Lebron has to have the right
(40:43):
attitude regardless of who the coaches, and I think if
he does, especially if k D leaves Golden State, then
I think they have to feel like they having a
decent chance, a good chance to make a deep playoff run,
if not more I took when Gail Benson erected the
Jackie McMullan report actually said that jack and mullan report
was wrong. I took that to mean Pelicans are open
(41:06):
for business, right like your Lakers. Will probably had to
pay a little bit more to get him, but I
took it. I took it to mean that they're they're
open for business to move Anthony Davis, that nothing has
changed landing Zion Williamson, maybe even energized it more so
to move him. Where do you think a d ends up? Well,
what I'm told is this that and I think we
(41:29):
both understand if the Lakers, if it's a tie between
the Knick's offer and the Lakers offer Boston offer, whoever
they're sending into the Eastern Conference. But I'm told that
Alvin Gentry really likes the Lakers players, Um lines o ball,
he he thinks lines o ball, Drew Holiday, uh Zion Kuzma, Ingram.
(41:55):
You know, a group like that could be not only
good offensively and we know that the specialty, but also
defensively UM in certain situations. So I think that's something
to consider. But who I think it all boils down
to this, what do they think of r J Barrett?
Because if they if you have if you really like
(42:16):
r J. Barrett and you have the opportunity to pair
him with Zion, a great friend, his roommate, you know,
you got the whole Duke connections for storyline, then I
think that's gonna be tough to be um. But the
latest players are challenging, and they did see one of them,
Julius Rams to go there and have a great season
or good season. Um, And let me throw this into
(42:38):
Doug Brooklyn, I'm told is really making a hard push
for a D or will if they can get if
they can get Kyrie Irving to commit to them. You
know under the the guys that a D goes there
as well and would stay long term, then they'll try
to get him. D'Angelo Russell, Jared Allen, some of their
(43:01):
draft picks. They'll try to do it. I don't think they.
You know, none of those players are as good as
maybe an R. J. Barrett or as sexy as an R. J.
Barrett is, or maybe even the Lakers package. But Brooklyn
is trying to get into this as well. Awesome, awesome stuff.
Um do you think the Bucks win their series? I do,
I do, and I think they if Katy is not back,
(43:24):
I think they give Golden they posed some problems. I
still would pick Golden State. But it's interesting because you heard,
you know, Jeff Van Gundy Mark Jackson on the broadcast
say they think Milwaukee would be the definitive favorite over
Golden State. And then there are those that think Golden
State is the prohibitive favorite even without k D if
(43:46):
they whoever they face in the East. So I think
it's gonna be interesting. But I do think Milwaukee wins
this series. Now, if Toronto can solve the honest or
you know, he don't expect you get twelve points, but
if they make him struggling and getting maybe eighteen or
nineteen points and when, then you might feel like, Okay,
they figured something out with Janice, And I think you'd
(44:09):
have to think they might have a good chance to
win this series, but right now, yeah, I'm definitely thinking Milwaukee,
Chris Brussary. You can check them out on The Odd Couple,
which is and starts an hour after our shows the
seven o'clock Eastern four o'clock Pacific, along with Rob Parker's
outstanding three hour radio show. Check it out followed on
Twitter or at Fox Sports Radio dot com as well.
See thanks so much. All right, Doug, you need something
Host
Doug Gottlieb
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