EITM interviews Brad Meltzer

EITM interviews Brad Meltzer

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
I read I Am Jesse Owens.What on the way? I did the
same thing right after. Can Itell you this, Brad about the book.
It may be it may be oneof my favorite in the And I
don't know what number we're up to. I know that the series is ten
years old. I think it's thirtysome odd books. It may be one

(00:22):
of the definitely top five. IAm Jesse Owens is fantastic. It really
is. Yeah, I listen,you know this is now number thirty three
in the series of kids books,which we started with you guys literally first
inter you we ever did. Andthe thing about it is, you can
do all these stories, but someof them just jump out. You know.

(00:44):
It's not me. I just youknow, all I do is relate
the story. His story is sogood and so beyond what I thought it
was going to be. And youknow, I always say that sometimes you
just get the hero for the righttime. And Jesse Owens is like every
lesson is like a lesson that weneed is, you know, for our
kids right now, for our countryright now. It's just right in there.

(01:04):
And I was gonna say, it'seasy to go, well, you
know what, the timing is greatbecause the Olympics are around the corner,
and that makes sense. But you'reright, with everything that's going on and
what his life turns into at theOlympics and with the Olympics is so much
bigger than just he's running track.It's amazing. I learned so much about

(01:26):
him. And I was saying earlier, Brad, I know the name Jesse
Owens, right, I feel likea lot of people know the name Jesse
Owens. I couldn't have really toldyou almost anything about his upbringing, about
his life other than he was thefastest man in the world. But what
a remarkable, unbelievable story. AndI'll tell you this right off the bat.

(01:46):
You know what, one of mylittle favorite things in the book is
him beating Hitler. That's up there, that's up there's no you know what.
I want to give credit to ChrisEliopolis because you always talk about how
these books are are drawn where they'rekids, like they're they're not supposed to

(02:08):
look like adults. They're four kids, and they're drawn through the perspective of
being kids, and so the characters, the real life people are drawn as
children the whole way. I justlove that he's wearing his little tracksuit the
entire time in the book, Like, the drawings are perfect for the book.
You know, Chris, You knoweveryone always says, oh, Brad,

(02:30):
the book, Chris is the secretweapon. The reason kids love the
books is not because of me.It's Chris's art. It has that mixture
of Charlie Brown meets Calvin and Hobbes. And if I want to inspire my
kids, whatever, if I toldmy kids about Amelia Earhart, they're bored,
you know, even Abraham Lincoln they'rebored. But when they see Chris's
art drawn like a kid just likethem, then they're like, wait,

(02:53):
this person's just like me. AndChris's art you can see in some of
the scenes. There's a scene wherehas he puts the camera above the race
and they're looking down at the topof everyone's heads as Jesse takes off,
and I'm like, this is awork of art in a regular kids book
for kids. It's incredible. Howmuch better he's getting as we go?

(03:14):
Hey, can I ask you this? So the book starts out, you
learn that Jesse Owens is the youngestof ten kids. They're living in Oakville,
Alabama, and I mean, andyou go on to learn. But
you mentioned that when he was fiveyears old, he had a bump on
his chest that his mom, bythe way, took off by herself.

(03:37):
But they weren't going to the doctor. Friend well, they would never have
been able to afford to go toa doctor, but they were dirt poor.
They all lived in like a oneroom house. His mom took it
off herself. What was the bump. So here's what's so crazy is is
the editor was like, do wehave to include this part? And I'm
like, we have to because hehas this bump that nobody to this day

(04:00):
knows what it is, whether it'scancer, whether it's a growth, it's
something sticking straight out of his chest. They can't afford a doctor. We
don't show this part in the book. We kind of hide it because it's
obviously for kids. But it says, you know, I remember the tears
in my dad's eyes. His motheris using a knife to cut it out
of his chest by herself, andit's, you know, one of the

(04:21):
hardest moments in his life and hegets through it. But I'm like,
you have to show this for kids, for adults, for anyone to just
realize what this family goes through whatthe level of poverty that they're coming from
is. And you know, tome, it's an incredible moment that I'm
like, why have I never heardthis about Jesse Owens? Why have I

(04:43):
never heard this about his family?And it's just one of those things that
gets lost in the footnotes of history. I'm like, we got to put
it in the book, and tothis day we don't know what that was
because they have no doctors. Youneed a doctor to know what it is.
These guys were like, I mean, imagine you have some growth on
your chest and your mom's like,hey, young Elliott, let me grab
me the peary knife. I'm gonnacut it off of you. You'd be

(05:03):
like, what are you kiddy?You call child services? You know,
you'd be like, but this iswhat saves them, This is what takes
care of him is his He hashis mother and he is his father,
and he has his family, andthey have nothing, and they build everything
they have out of nothing. Andyou know, it said one of the
details in the book is that hisChristmas tree. Every year his father money's

(05:24):
so tight that they can't afford aChristmas tree. His dad gets a free
one after hauling away all the onesthat haven't been sold, which means every
year they don't celebrate Christmas on Christmas. They celebrate the next day. Their
dad works on Christmas, and thenhe hauls away all the trees. They
give him a free, old usedone and he brings it back and they

(05:44):
decorate it with three pieces of hismom's jewelry and their tatted clothing, which
means Jesse Owens grows up where hisornaments are socks on the Christmas tree,
right Like, I mean, evenyou're just like the level of poverty that
they're in. And again, thisis a book. I know it's easy
to say about, you know,running in race, but it's truly about

(06:05):
race and how much being being blackin the South back then, even when
they moved to Ohio, what beingblack means. And the sad part is
is, you know, it's fornot just Jesse Owens and his family,
but thousands and thousands of others.And I need my son to hear that
story. I need my daughter tohear that story and to just know how

(06:27):
hard it is for so many peoplethat have lives different than their own.
That the books are, you know, if they're anything, they're empathy machines,
right, And that's all we're tryingto do is show you that.
But you talk about like just goingback five years old, go back to
him getting that lump cut off ofhis chest. They talk about it was
just a couple of days later,he's back working in the fields with his
dad, and and at that moment, you want to go like, oh

(06:49):
my god, here's a five yearold kid. Like you said, his
mom is essentially just hatched him upin the middle of the of their little
one room house. Five days laterhe's out in the field. But he
talks about working in the fields withhis dad was one of the great things
because he gave him time with hisdad and it was just time to be
there and talk with his dad.I also like, that's where you learn

(07:12):
his dad also was a fast guy. His dad loved running, and like
they weren't going out and going todo anything, so his dad would set
up like these weekly races for allthe other people that were working in the
fields or couldn't do anything. Whatan unbelievable story, right, And you
know the two things that I loveabout that is in the fields he gets
his moment where his dad just giveshim advice. You know, my dad

(07:34):
teaches them no matter how much otherpeople have, never envy them. That's
a lesson we all need. Andyou can see, you know, it's
one thing to say it to yourkids. When you read the book,
you see it. They have nothing. But dad can't become a runner.
I can't join a college. Hehas no education, he could barely get
a job. But he's watching hisdad running these homemade races. He's the

(07:56):
fastest in their county. And allJesse Owens wants to be is just like
his dad. I mean, it'sall I mean, it's just it's the
American dream. There it is.And what I love is, he says,
you know, for running is whathe loves about is you can do
it all by yourself. It doesn'trequire money, just your own strength and
your determination. And I will neverlook at running the same way again.

(08:20):
I'm like, oh my god,right, it's the It's the perfect sport
for the poorest family. The fatherhas nothing, he has nothing, but
boy, these guys can run.So when they finally moved to Cleveland.
At his junior high school, hemeets a coach by the name of Charles
Riley and Riley kind of takes himlike, obviously can see there's something special
going on, is it true?At fifteen years old, Jesse Owens runs

(08:43):
a one hundred yard dash on thesidewalk that is only a half a second
off of the world record time.And this is they don't even put him
on a track, right, Andwhat Coach Riley does is like, you
know, the best part at whatI love about him. It's the first
white man that he really knows,right, and he teaches them how to

(09:05):
be a better runner. Right.And it's a time when so many treated
black people differently, but they treateach other equally and they teach each other
how to be better men. Andyou know Riley, Coach Riley says,
he says, oh, you'll comeafter school and I'll teach you how to
run faster. And Jesse Owens islike, I have like ten jobs.
I can't afford this. I haveto work. He's like, fine,

(09:26):
I'll meet you early in the morningbefore the sun is up. Like for
one kid. He's taking a chanceon one young black kid. And when
he times him that day, heruns it in eleven seconds, and the
next day he makes him do itagain because He's like, the watch has
to be wrong. There's no waythis little kid, that fifteen is running
it like a half second, shythe world record, and he runs it
at eleven seconds. The next dayhe realizes, I have one of the

(09:50):
fastest kids on the entire planet thatI'm lucky enough to coach. Here,
where did Jesse Owens go to college? You know? So this is my
favorite part of it? Bo canI can I nail it? Please?
Were you a dick on purpose toOhio State? So no, it's not,
No, it's not that. Sohe goes to Ohio State. Of

(10:11):
course I go. I went toMichigan and I wasn't. I'm not trying
to be a jerk to him,obviously. Ohio State makes him the first
black captain of any varsity team.Full love for that. What is important
this has nothing to do with OhioState is but also they make him live
in a dorm without white people.He has to live in the black only
dorm, right, you know,completely ridiculous, no, unfair, And

(10:33):
it's not to be jerk to OhioState. It's to show kids, like
listen, just because he runs fastdoesn't mean like we sing Kumbaya and he
gets the gold medal and beats Hitler. Like this story's complicated, race is
complicated, and it's still complicated.Right he goes to the restaurant of the
movie theater. He's the captain ofthe team and the star, and they
still won't let him get into themovie. The part that I love most

(10:54):
in the book, though, ishis best racing is not at Ohio State.
It's not even against Hitler. Hissingle best day of racing to this
day is when he runs in annArbor, Michigan, and I loved it
and I love it. The onlyrecords, the only record that Jesse Owen
still has to this day is whenhe goes to ann Arbor And I'm just

(11:18):
like, oh, if you thinkthis is not going in the book,
everyone has a nugast coming hey,So I don't I don't want to rush
through it. But like, obviouslywe get to the Olympics and he makes
the Olympic team, and he's goingto go be in the Olympics and we're
gonna have to introduce Hitler and theNazis in a in a children's book?

(11:41):
Was that? Was? That?Was that a rough process to go through,
you know, the first time weever had to do it, we
did. I am Anne Frank,right, And when we did that,
I'm like, how do we dothat? My editorship, When I said
I want to do a kid's bookabout an Frank and the Holocaust, my
editor should have said, like laughingout of the office, and it says
she said to me, you knowor at this. You know, we

(12:03):
thought back then, a couple ofyears ago was the height of anti Semitism.
We have to do it. Andwhat we did was I was I
was actually very intimidated about it.I'm like, even as a Jewish person,
I'm like, how do I dealwith Hitler and Nazis and the Holocaust
in a way that little kids canread it? So we went to the
Holocaust Museum in d C. Andwe talked to their experts there. We
talked to people how to explain it. And you know, with these books,

(12:26):
when I'm out of my league andI know I am in this.
You know, I'm a white guywriting about Jesse Owens. And then I
got to explain you know, Hitlerand the Nazis. I go get help.
I found the best people on theplanet who know how to relay this
to little kids. And I say, help me do this in a way
that kids won't be scared, butthey'll be inspired. And they also are
not going to get a whitewashed version. And you know, to me,
it's important to say that, youknow, the track and field team,

(12:50):
so many people on there were likehim, They were poor black Southerners,
and that Adolf Hitler hated them becauseof their skin color. You know,
the German journalist one't even use JesseOwens' name right, that they thought they're
win was guaranteed. And you youknow, little details like that make kids
understand, like they won't even callhim by his name. He's less than
and he's a thing. And obviouslyit's intimidating, but man, you got

(13:15):
it. You can't do the JesseOwens story without doing the Hitler story.
So they and and so Hitler's overseeingthe Olympics. He's there to watch the
you know, his his his Olympicssquad and who have been trained. They're
gonna beat the crap out of everyonein every event. And along comes Jesse
Owens and really shoves it up Hitler'sass. And there's a there's a there's

(13:37):
a very and this part I feellike is known historically, but it is
addressed in the book that Hitler won'tshake jesse Owen's hand at all. Yeah,
you know, Jesse Owens is oneof those stories where it has been
morphed over time. Everyone says,oh, Hitler when he won turned away

(13:58):
and turned his back. That neverhad Hitler just stares them, but they
never invite him to shake Hitler's hand. And all the other athletes that when
the gold, you better believe theygo up and shake his hand, and
it's a It's the greatest few toHitler of all time. The only thing
that gets better is that Jesse Owensdoesn't stop winning. And the great part
to me is not when he wins, and you know in the running races,

(14:22):
winning the gold and you know,he tying the world record in the
one hundred meter dash, it's hegoes for the long jump. And this,
to me is the best moment.And I did not know this moment
at all personally, and I sawthe movies, knew the stuff like that,
you know, But he's the bestGerman in the long jump? Is
this guy Karl loves long and he'sthe Hitler in hit size. Is this

(14:46):
is the Aryan race, you know, superiority. This is like the white,
blonde, blue eyed, handsome guywho's there to stomp on Jesse Owens.
And this guy is the best longjumper they've got and they know that.
You know, he sets a newOlympic record, and you know the
guy should have been Jesse Owens' rival. He should have been his enemy.

(15:07):
And when Jesse Owens jumps farther thananybody, Luzz goes up to him and
you think it like in a movie, he'd like spit on him or sue
something terrible. He puts his handon his shoulder, He congratulates him,
and Jesse Owens puts his arm aroundhim. And that's the greatest f you
because Adolph Hitler, they both knowHitler's watching. The crowd is watching,

(15:31):
and that's the whole point. Andin that moment when this German and this
black American have their arms around eachother, the crowd explodes, right.
And it's my favorite line, andI am Jesse Owens. He says sports
is about more than ability, it'sabout more than winning and losing, that
its best sports is about character.And I wrote that line just for my

(15:52):
son. I wrote. I waslike, this is the line you love
sports so much or watch all thisstuff he watches overpaid athletes, But it
is not about winning and losing Jonas, It's about character and I want my
kid to have that list. Iwant my daughter to have that list.
I want everyone to know. That'swhat Jesse Owen stands for. Is that
ability not just to give the feyou to Adolf Hitler, which is great,

(16:14):
but to show what it is tobe a good human being. So
then Jesse Owens gets to come backto the US. There's a huge ticker
tape parade for him. He getsto ride the service elevator at the at
the hotel, there's a there's avery famous quote and you put it up
on I believe I saw it wason your Instagram page, Brad, where
you posted a quote for Jesse Owensthat says, although I wasn't invited to

(16:37):
shake hands with Hitler, I wasn'tinvited to the White House to shake hands
with the President either. You know, I didn't know that quote when I
wrote the book. I would haveput it in the book. And my
friend was actually had just happened tobe in Norway at Lillly Hammer this past
weekend and he knew the book wascoming out, and he's dud, did

(17:00):
you see this quote? And Iwas like, I've never that is the
most amazing, incredible quote I've everheard about Jesse Owens, which I never
knew, and they had at theLily Hummer Olympic Museum. It's heartbreaking,
and it was That's what I said, race is complicated. One of the
other most important details you just mentionedis the guy wins all the gold medals,
he comes back, America celebrates him. Look where the best we beat

(17:22):
Hitler, where the greatest America isthe greatest country on earth. And when
they bring him to the Waldorf forstory, it's to celebrate them. They
make them ride in the freight elevator. Again. Another detail that they said,
do we need to put that inthe book? And I was like,
we are not doing this book withoutputting it. Every book, the
kid's book. When you know it'sso easy to write a Jesse Owens kids
book and give you the whitewashed version. I need my kids to know that

(17:44):
they were still treating them like garbage. You don't win the race and solve
racism. It's complicated, and Iwant my kids to know that not just
because it's a great story, butbecause it's like we still have to keep
fighting. It's still the story thatwe do all the time as we hold
it up for a day and we'relike racism s beat, but it's never
like you've got to keep pushing forward. And I need my kids to know

(18:04):
that too. And I love thefact that today in Berlin, Germany is
a Jesse Owens Boulevard and a schoolnamed after him. Isn't that amazing?
That's that's amazing, Like I lovethat, right, Adolf Hitler is like
in the garbage can of history,and I love the fact that Germany's like
he's the guy, man, He'sstill the guy. Why is it?

(18:25):
I can't wrap my head around likeyou would like, like we've all watched
it. I love the Olympics,right, I love watching the Olympics.
I can't wait for it to start. But why is it in my head?
I can't wrap my head around liketurning on the Olympics. And obviously
it was different back then where AdolphHitler is sitting there watching over the Olympics
as well, these are my gamesthat are taking place here I sit.

(18:48):
I can't wrap my head around thatyeah, it's again complicated moment, right
America is like we're gonna you know, we're gonna boycott, right, They're
like, we got to boycott this. We can't do this and saydlk Hitler.
We know it's going on. Butthey're also like, if we boycott,
then it looks like we quit.So what's the right answer? Do
we look like we quit and givehim the moral win where which is exactly

(19:10):
what he wants. You know,he wants us to not compete. And
again, it's so easy for usto sit back and judge right now,
but it's hard. It's a hardthing, like you want to go back
and and you know, to thisday, like listen, do I wish
we didn't give Hitler any extra attention? Of course, but boy do I
love the way gave him the middlefinger of Jesse Owens. I love the

(19:32):
fact that he had to eat thatwhile watching and everyone's cheering Jesse Owen's name.
You know, when they cheered hisname, they couldn't say his name
in the way that we say theAmericans is Joszy Owens, Like they can't
pronounce it correctly. They don't evenknow because the reporters won't say his name,
and they love him so much thatthis crowd of you know, thousands
of Germans are cheering for him andnot Hitler. And to me, I'll

(19:55):
take that any day. That's avictory, not again for America or Americans
superiority, but just to show thatHitler's whole thesis is so messed up and
is so twisted and wrong, andhere's the man who's proving it to the
entire world that's watching. So brag. Can I ask you this. I
was talking to the boys yesterday,telling him that you were going to be
on We were talking about Jesse Owensin the book, and if you were

(20:18):
to ask me at any point andsomebody said in you know for Nation Sports,
right, greatest Olympic moment of alltime, everybody in my house,
maybe because we're a hockey family,immediately goes to Miracle on Ice. And
a lot of people will say that, do I have that wrong? Is
Jesse Owens at those games bigger thanMiracle on Ice? I think it just

(20:41):
depends when you're watching, right,I mean, Miracle on Ice is it's
spectacular because we're at the height ofthe Cold War, right again, it
just takes on something that's bigger thansports itself. It's not. Yes,
it's great to win, and we'vewon lots of gold medals, but we're
not winning just the gold medal there. We're proving that in the Cold War
where better. And I guess thatthat's a good one. But I don't

(21:03):
know. Man punching Adolf Hitler inthe mount is I don't know how you
beat it. I mean, youknow, on Captain America number one,
these two Jews and this is youknow, Captain America number one came out
before we were committed to like,you know, winning the war and beating
Hitler and doing all that stuff.And the cover of Captain America number one

(21:23):
is Captain America punching Adolf Hitler inthe face. Like that's how subtle Jews
wore back then. They were justlike, let's just have him punch him
in the face. Like Superman's thereto like stand for good and he fights
in the war effort. You seehim bending tank German tanks and then and
and you know, Simon and Leeare just like, now, let's just

(21:45):
punch him in the face. Andthat's what Jesse Owens is doing. I
mean, yes, it's great.Well, you know, it's great to
win the hockey match, but punchingHitler, man, that's that's a plus
stuff. Captain America. All right, a couple of things real quickly.
I know that you've already announced thenext ones on the way. Uh,
we'll be Stephen Hawking and Sally Ride. I have a question, though,

(22:07):
did anyone guess who you and ChrisElliopolis were texting about with the secret of
the one that hasn't been announced yet. Nope, no one's guessed it.
One person guessed it, well,one person did guess it. One only
one usually on like on my Instagram, one person will guess it on my
Facebook, and then we'll guess it. Only one person on all the accounts
guessed it correctly. And you said, I'm trying to remember exactly what the

(22:30):
what the what the DM was?I said, if you, I said,
whoever guesses it first correctly, becauseusually a lot of people guess it.
I said, if you guessed itcorrectly, I'll DM you and tell
you you got it right. AndI did, and I went back and
forth with the guy who got itright. So what happened was is for
anyone who's listening now, so outof context. I text Chris Eliopolis and

(22:52):
basically a text that says, Ican't wait for you to draw this next
one. It's so good it maykill you. And he literally like it
is going to kill me. I'mlike, it's going to be worth it.
And and you know, it's somany styles, in so many different
ways that he has to draw,and only one person guessed it correctly.
When will the rest of us learnit? I'm going to text you as
soon as we hang out. No, I don't like I don't like that.

(23:15):
You know I'm not good with secrets, Brad, you know I'm not
good with secrets. It's so good, all right, text me to tell
you. I'm gonna text you.And not only I'm gonna I text you,
I'm going to text you the coverof it because you're going to crap
your pants. It's so bananas.It's so bananas, that's all I'm going
to say. Wow, Like it'shim, it's him pushing so obviously in
his style and in his beautiful youknow what all the order people change the

(23:37):
world books are, but it's him. Just you'll see I can't even describe
it. And and and it physicallymay just kill him if he dies.
That's what's going to be a causeof death. Pause of death is going
to be drawing this friggin book.Okay, last couple of things I have
for Brad Meltzer and I'm going togo quick. You ready, I'm ready.
So, like we we had talkedabout, and you did the graduation

(24:00):
speech at the University of Michigan andyour your son was graduating and there was
the whole debate as to whether youwere stealing the spotlight from him, and
on and on and on, andit was great and it was awesome,
and you brought Desmond Howard out andthe speech. If anybody hasn't watched the
speech, you did such a beautifuljob. It's twenty minutes. It's definitely
worth worth watching. And the bringingout, bringing out whatever happens at the

(24:23):
end for people that haven't seen it, is that being turned into something?
Is that is that being turned intoa book or something like that. Yeah,
so listen, I find words fora living. I will never find
the ways to describe speaking in frontof seventy thousand people at Michigan commencement and

(24:44):
given a speech that designed for onemy kid in the fourteenth row who got
there at eight in the morning soI could see him. And so what
you can't see when you watch itis like, you know, so the
answer is to answer your question,yes, we're Mike. We got offers
from two different publishers who are nowmaking a kid's book from it and an
adult book from it because people wegot so many people who are writing us
asking for the transcript of it.They were like, we want the transcript

(25:06):
of this speech, so we're makingan all time graduation book. Will probably
strip the Michigan stuff out of it, but it's about the four types of
magic, and her magic really doesexist magic. It's fantastic. But what
I will say is that the finaleof the speech, and again I won't
ruin the ending because obviously there isa magic trick that's taking place during it,
but you can when you watch mesay it. What's so crazy is

(25:30):
that you know some things you don'tyou don't have the memory for it until
after it happens, when you digestit. And one of the things that's
happening in that moment is when Iannounced the big finale at the end,
I had I actually physically shifted myway forward because seventy thousand people exploded in
screaming there, and I thought Iwas going to get knocked on my rear

(25:53):
end. I was like, Iwas like standing in a hurricane. And
then when I do the finale,finale, that gets even bigger. You
can see that I'm screaming into themicrophone, and it's not because I'm trying
to be a good hype man forwho's coming, but it's because I physically
can barely hear myself, and Ihave access to three jumbotrons. Like it

(26:15):
is a roar like I've never heardin my life. And it was so
awesome and so amazing at the end, and I could see my kid in
the crowd. And when we getto the ending, I remember the whole
you know we have the protesters arecoming down the field. Eight minutes before
I start, the whole thing isgoing crappy, and I'm like, oh
my gosh, it's all going bad. And eight minutes right before I go

(26:38):
on, you know, the protestersmarching down the field. The president of
the University of Michigan looks at meand he's like, man, why aren't
they stopping. I'm like, whyare you asking me? You're the president
of the university. I'm like you, and it's all going badly. Like
I'm like, oh my gosh,they're going to march to the stage.
It's going to be a disaster.And Elliott, it's like they get pushed

(26:59):
back to the you know, eightyyards away. They take them into the
end zone. They don't there's nofight. They just make them stand the
endzone. Let them protest appropriately.It's all good. The clouds part,
the sun comes through the clouds.Right before I go on, my sister
in the audience takes a picture ofthe clouds and says, Mom and Dad
are looking out for you right nowbecause everything, Oh God, I'll send

(27:22):
you the picture that she takes ofthe sky like she's photographing God like and
I and all the dominoes are goingterribly and then it's like all the dominoes
get picked up and they all startfalling the correct way, and it becomes
one of the most truly amazing momentsof my entire life. And I give
this speech that's maybe one of myfavorite things I've ever written. And I

(27:44):
don't know how it's gonna be excited. You know, I don't know anything.
I'm just like trying to see ifI can get the words out because
of the protesters everything that's going on, and all I'm doing during the speech
is staring at my kid, andit's my son who never had a high
school graduation and suddenly gets to havethis graduation and to watch the crowd,
you know, react, and thething that they reacted to. It wasn't
the cheering at the end. Itwasn't the the Michigan stuff or yelling goblue,

(28:08):
or that we won the national championship. But it was this moment where
I talk about empathy and that crueltyand venom are so common in today's society,
but cruelty and venom on proof ofstrength. There's signs of weakness and
petty insecurity. And I knew whereall the kind of I thought. I
knew where all the applause lines were. I knew when I made jokes about

(28:29):
my rejection letters. You made thatjoke before I think it's gonna work.
I know where all the jokes are. But when I say the words about
the world needs more empathy right now, the crowd bursts into applause, and
I'm like, and I try totalk over it, and I can usually
talk over the crowd, you kindof like can serve a big crowd,
and even at one like that,and I couldn't. They won't let me
go. And I'm like, whatwas that? In my mind as I'm

(28:52):
giving the speech, like what wasthat? My wife said to me,
you tapped into a vein you didn'tknow was there. And it's just the
world is starving for empathy right now. And the line that I love,
my favorite line in the speech,it says, we really want to shock
the world on leash your kindness.And the place went to that as and
I realized, oh my gosh,we're starving for it right now. We

(29:12):
need that kindness empathy right now.So it was just one of those truly
moments I'll never find the right wordsfor, so my next question will seem
really stupid. Then I was inHarris Teeter over the weekend brand and I
was in the cereal aisle and Iwas walking down the aisle and I took

(29:36):
a picture with a box of fruitloops. Why is two can holding?
I am Amelia Earhart by the way, greatest transition you've ever made. So
can we stop for a moment?So we are on the cover of Fruit
Loops. And I'm not talking aboutlike you know, there's sometimes like a
little kid holding a book at thetop o two Can to cant Sam is

(30:02):
literally holding up I'm Amelia Heart,one of the books that we were,
the first book in the series.And by the way, when these things
happen, you know, you alwaysthink like, oh, you know,
Brad, you made it happen.I had no idea what was happening until
a month before it happened. Andthe publisher's like, hey, I wanted
to surprise you because we didn't knowif this was really going to be the
final cover. Here's the final artwork, and my email pops up and two

(30:23):
can Sam's holding my book and I'mlike, oh, that's funny, and
they're like, no, no,that's the cover of Fruit Loops from now
on for the next like two months. And I'm like, this is truly
of all the things I've been able, unlucky enough and stupid enough to stumble
into in my life, Of allthe things, if I went back in
time to my seven year old self, who used to literally watch cartoons and

(30:45):
who's reading material was simply the backpanel of a cereal box in nineteen seventy
seven. I would have died ifI saw that today, Like if they
said, here's you know, youwent to the White House, you did
this, you got to meet thisperson, blah blah blah, you give
the commencement address in Michigan. Mymy younger self would be like, so
what you're on and hanging with twocan Sam? Boom? I dropped dead

(31:07):
right there. That's the call ofdeath. Cause of death is too can
Sam the first too? Can Sam? Murder of all times? And by
the way, the other thing,that's awesome. And I'm sure you know
this. Of course you know this. The when I so I told you
I was talking to the kids aboutyou being on today, they were like,

(31:27):
oh, dude, make sure Bradknows he's in the Boys. Oh
that was good too, that wasa good trip. So this one didn't
that. So so my sons lovethe Boys. It's their favorite show.
Oh, it's like, it's agreat show. They love the show.
And one of my buddies who wentto Michigan is the you know, the

(31:48):
great Eric Krimkey is the is theguy who runs the Boys. He's he's
literally the brainchild, the genius behindit. And last year. My kids
are like, this is my favoriteshow that's ever existed. They're losing their
minds. And I'm like, andI'm such a like a jerk dad that
I'm like, I got to impressmy kids. All the books nothing,
they don't get whatever. I calledEric, I'm like, Eric, dude,

(32:09):
you gotta do me a solid,can you you know? And he's
like, my kids love the Boys. He's like, oh, I got
a great idea. I'm taking careof it a year. It takes me
a year. I know about it. I can't say a word. And
he text me right before, hetexted me a couple of months ago,
and he's like, and he justtexted me. He says it's in.
I'm like what He's like, you'llsee. And I'm watching The Boys with

(32:30):
my boys, and all of asudden it comes on and my kids almost
fall. That's the death of Theirsis the Boys minus two can't sam their's
is the Boy's like they are literallyit's the first time they I think ever.
I took him to the real StarWars to see Star Wars being filmed.
That was I think the one firsttime they were ever impressed. I
took him on the real Millennium Falconlike on the soundstage we sat in the

(32:54):
chair like, but this was likea close second. It was like lost
their minds. And they were littlekids, so they weren't really impressed back
then, but this one they werelike, how'd you do it? How
did it happen? Who do youknow? Like they were just like tell
me about it. So, yes, if you have teenage kids, it's
the only thing they're less impressed by. Two Ken Sam, all right,

(33:16):
I am Jesse Owens is out andavailable now, part of the Ordinary People,
Change the World series. Brad goodtalking to you. Please text me
that cover. I have to seeit. I love you. It's coming
right now. All right, myfriend, I'll talk to you soon.