July 17, 2024 • 9 mins
Let's be honest, there's no putting the gennie back in the bottle. Political divisiveness is here to stay. How can we best live with it? Dr. Charles Pemberton with Dimensions Family Therapy joins with some timely advice.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
The problem with Ron just sayingtimonious isthat he needs a personality transplant, and
those are not yet available. Almostall congressmen and women that served with him
and knew him well supported me,some of them surprisingly so because of their
relationship with Ron. Oh aren't yougoing to miss that? Charles Pemberton,
(00:23):
No more little Marco bird brain,Well the sanctimonious. Come on, I'm
not ready to say that it mightall be over just yet. The pendulum
swings. Yeah, but you havea real hot take on this. You
think political divisivensts or divisiveness, let'ssay it, that way is here to
(00:47):
stay. I mean, like youthink it's going to be like this for
the rest of our existence here.Well, well, you and I are
on this planet. Well, soI was listening to an author the other
day and this author said, andI'll try to make this as quick as
possible for our listeners, that humansshare a lot of things with our animal
(01:07):
kingdom. We all have, youknow, we look at maslows a hierarchy
of needs. We all need tohave food and water, we all need
to pro create, we all needto have a power structure. The difference
in humans and most of our animalkingdom is we also need a group or
a tribe, and morality is thatset of rules that allow the tribe to
(01:29):
exist without fighting amongst itself. Well, the problem has been that we when
we lived apart from each other,tribes lived apart. We could make that
work except for skirmishes between the tribes. But we've lived on top of each
other for so long without a moreuniversal set of morality to allow us to
(01:53):
get along. And it's my beliefthat the current social media market, the
current news market where people are gettingtheir information, all of that has made
it easier for us to connect withour existing tribe and stop listening to everyone
(02:21):
else. And if we can't listento everyone else, it's going to be
very, very difficult to form amore universal set of rules that allow all
of us to get along. SoI think we've got a lot of growing
up to do, and as weall know, growing up can be very
(02:45):
painful. The world has shrunk,and it's shrunk because of social media.
But you know, here's the otherthing I'm watching. I'm watching whether they're
a Democrat that's saying, oh,the far right, you know, Hitler
blah blah blah, or I'm watchingthe far right say things like these,
you know, these leftist wackos blahblah blah blah blah. You know,
(03:07):
has anybody sat down and talked tosomebody that they just think they don't agree
with and then discover their humanity?Because I, well, and you know,
and that is the the solution tothis is it's an easy to comprehend
solution. It's a very difficult toimplement solution. It doesn't mean you have
(03:31):
to hang away around people that youjust you know that you're just not gonna
hang around them. You don't likethe same movies, you don't like the
same whatever. Well, and Iwould, I would argue that that is
the point. If we don't startmaking connections with people before we start correcting
(03:53):
people, we are doomed. Andso, yes, it means we need
to hang around people that don't likethe same movies as us. I need
to sit around and talk to peoplethat love rom comms to understand, well,
what is it you like about romcoms. I don't have to tell
them that they're wrong for liking them, but I need to sit down and
(04:16):
be able to have that conversation,and they need to hear that I like
science fiction and hear my side.They don't need to tell me I'm wrong.
But we are in a society wherewe want to correct you're wrong before
we ever make a connection with people. We're with Charles Pemmerton to mention family
(04:40):
therapy. Are we always going tobe this divisive with one another when it
comes to politics, Charles, wewere discussing this just a few minute minutes,
scho Let's continue the discussion. Whenpeople break traditions and or maybe faith
quotions of others, it really bothersthem and it you know, sometimes it
(05:02):
can be unsettling for people. Whatdo you say to both sides when it
comes to that kind of thing.Well, and again, I would go
back to being able to sit downand have a conversation to find out what
was going on and what that personwas thinking, what that person was feeling,
(05:23):
what that person was was needing atthe moment, and not listening again
to correct or listening to lecture,but listening to understand. And you know,
we see those memes across social mediaall the time, you know,
but that is that is one ofthe issues that we have as parents.
(05:46):
We have been taught that because That'sthe way a lot of our parents parented
us. Not that they didn't loveus, not that they didn't do a
good job across the board, butoftentimes they would ask a question, start
a conversation, only to be ableto give a lecture. And I think
we have grown up in that mentality, and now we have people bigger than
(06:11):
our family, be it our politicians, be it our celebrities, be it
our movie stars, be it ourreligious leaders that are tending to do the
same thing. They're not asking questionsfor to know how we feel, what
our needs are, what we're thinking. They're asking questions so that they can
(06:34):
quickly pivot and point out that eitherwe're wrong or how they're right. And
that does not form that connection thatis so vital and is what is needed
today. I'll use another example.People talk about how well we don't feel
like we're connected at all, butyet we can go to our neighbor.
(06:55):
We have a really good conversation withour neighbor. And our neighbor may be
on the other side of the politicalfence than us, but we're still going
to loan them a tool, andwe're still going to have a drink with
them and we're still going to Butyet we talk about the other side in
a group and we have nothing todo with them. We've got to make
those connections. Well, there arepeople and let's I guess the elephant in
(07:18):
the room is human sexuality right nowthat don't agree with maybe the different types
of sexuality and or transitional phases thatsome people are going through. And you
know, I'm not quite sure thata third grader needs to start learning of
these kinds of lessons in school too. That kind of seems to infringe on
(07:40):
the shapes of the shapes of ayoung mind a little bit too early,
you know. I mean, youknow, in fairness, but you know,
a lot of people are just notgoing to have that kind of conversation
with each other in you were exactly, and that would be a great example
of a conversation that is very difficultto have. A professional who works with
(08:01):
individuals, I have my own questionsand I need to be able to sit
down with other professionals, other peoplein the field that may share my ideas,
but more importantly, sit down withprofessionals that don't share my ideas and
what I believe, so that Ican see the whole picture. And those
(08:24):
are difficult. I mean, it'sdifficult to get two therapists in the room
that are on the other side ofan idea and just listen to each other.
You think that would be easy.We're no different. We want to
prove our point as well, butwe try, you know, we have
to fall back on that need tolisten to understand, and so it is
difficult. That's why I said it'san easy concept to understand. Oh,
(08:50):
I have to sit and talk topeople and make a connection, but it
is all it seems impossible at timesto actually carry it out. It's the
same with your children. They dosomething that you just think is really stupid
or really dangerous, and you wantto scold them, but you can't lose
your connection with your child over punishment. You have to maintain a connection with
(09:16):
them because you love them, butalso because you want that relationship and you
want them to be able to listento you, to hear the correction.
Appreciate your time, Charles, Thanksso much. Charl Pemberton, Dementia Family Therapy,
The problem with Ron just sayingtimonious isthat he needs a personality transplant, and
those are not yet available. Almostall congressmen and women that served with him
and knew him well supported me,some of them surprisingly so because of their
relationship with Ron. Oh aren't yougoing to miss that? Charles Pemberton,
(00:23):
No more little Marco bird brain,Well the sanctimonious. Come on, I'm
not ready to say that it mightall be over just yet. The pendulum
swings. Yeah, but you havea real hot take on this. You
think political divisivensts or divisiveness, let'ssay it, that way is here to
(00:47):
stay. I mean, like youthink it's going to be like this for
the rest of our existence here.Well, well, you and I are
on this planet. Well, soI was listening to an author the other
day and this author said, andI'll try to make this as quick as
possible for our listeners, that humansshare a lot of things with our animal
(01:07):
kingdom. We all have, youknow, we look at maslows a hierarchy
of needs. We all need tohave food and water, we all need
to pro create, we all needto have a power structure. The difference
in humans and most of our animalkingdom is we also need a group or
a tribe, and morality is thatset of rules that allow the tribe to
(01:29):
exist without fighting amongst itself. Well, the problem has been that we when
we lived apart from each other,tribes lived apart. We could make that
work except for skirmishes between the tribes. But we've lived on top of each
other for so long without a moreuniversal set of morality to allow us to
(01:53):
get along. And it's my beliefthat the current social media market, the
current news market where people are gettingtheir information, all of that has made
it easier for us to connect withour existing tribe and stop listening to everyone
(02:21):
else. And if we can't listento everyone else, it's going to be
very, very difficult to form amore universal set of rules that allow all
of us to get along. SoI think we've got a lot of growing
up to do, and as weall know, growing up can be very
(02:45):
painful. The world has shrunk,and it's shrunk because of social media.
But you know, here's the otherthing I'm watching. I'm watching whether they're
a Democrat that's saying, oh,the far right, you know, Hitler
blah blah blah, or I'm watchingthe far right say things like these,
you know, these leftist wackos blahblah blah blah blah. You know,
(03:07):
has anybody sat down and talked tosomebody that they just think they don't agree
with and then discover their humanity?Because I, well, and you know,
and that is the the solution tothis is it's an easy to comprehend
solution. It's a very difficult toimplement solution. It doesn't mean you have
(03:31):
to hang away around people that youjust you know that you're just not gonna
hang around them. You don't likethe same movies, you don't like the
same whatever. Well, and Iwould, I would argue that that is
the point. If we don't startmaking connections with people before we start correcting
(03:53):
people, we are doomed. Andso, yes, it means we need
to hang around people that don't likethe same movies as us. I need
to sit around and talk to peoplethat love rom comms to understand, well,
what is it you like about romcoms. I don't have to tell
them that they're wrong for liking them, but I need to sit down and
(04:16):
be able to have that conversation,and they need to hear that I like
science fiction and hear my side.They don't need to tell me I'm wrong.
But we are in a society wherewe want to correct you're wrong before
we ever make a connection with people. We're with Charles Pemmerton to mention family
(04:40):
therapy. Are we always going tobe this divisive with one another when it
comes to politics, Charles, wewere discussing this just a few minute minutes,
scho Let's continue the discussion. Whenpeople break traditions and or maybe faith
quotions of others, it really bothersthem and it you know, sometimes it
(05:02):
can be unsettling for people. Whatdo you say to both sides when it
comes to that kind of thing.Well, and again, I would go
back to being able to sit downand have a conversation to find out what
was going on and what that personwas thinking, what that person was feeling,
(05:23):
what that person was was needing atthe moment, and not listening again
to correct or listening to lecture,but listening to understand. And you know,
we see those memes across social mediaall the time, you know,
but that is that is one ofthe issues that we have as parents.
(05:46):
We have been taught that because That'sthe way a lot of our parents parented
us. Not that they didn't loveus, not that they didn't do a
good job across the board, butoftentimes they would ask a question, start
a conversation, only to be ableto give a lecture. And I think
we have grown up in that mentality, and now we have people bigger than
(06:11):
our family, be it our politicians, be it our celebrities, be it
our movie stars, be it ourreligious leaders that are tending to do the
same thing. They're not asking questionsfor to know how we feel, what
our needs are, what we're thinking. They're asking questions so that they can
(06:34):
quickly pivot and point out that eitherwe're wrong or how they're right. And
that does not form that connection thatis so vital and is what is needed
today. I'll use another example.People talk about how well we don't feel
like we're connected at all, butyet we can go to our neighbor.
(06:55):
We have a really good conversation withour neighbor. And our neighbor may be
on the other side of the politicalfence than us, but we're still going
to loan them a tool, andwe're still going to have a drink with
them and we're still going to Butyet we talk about the other side in
a group and we have nothing todo with them. We've got to make
those connections. Well, there arepeople and let's I guess the elephant in
(07:18):
the room is human sexuality right nowthat don't agree with maybe the different types
of sexuality and or transitional phases thatsome people are going through. And you
know, I'm not quite sure thata third grader needs to start learning of
these kinds of lessons in school too. That kind of seems to infringe on
(07:40):
the shapes of the shapes of ayoung mind a little bit too early,
you know. I mean, youknow, in fairness, but you know,
a lot of people are just notgoing to have that kind of conversation
with each other in you were exactly, and that would be a great example
of a conversation that is very difficultto have. A professional who works with
(08:01):
individuals, I have my own questionsand I need to be able to sit
down with other professionals, other peoplein the field that may share my ideas,
but more importantly, sit down withprofessionals that don't share my ideas and
what I believe, so that Ican see the whole picture. And those
(08:24):
are difficult. I mean, it'sdifficult to get two therapists in the room
that are on the other side ofan idea and just listen to each other.
You think that would be easy.We're no different. We want to
prove our point as well, butwe try, you know, we have
to fall back on that need tolisten to understand, and so it is
difficult. That's why I said it'san easy concept to understand. Oh,
(08:50):
I have to sit and talk topeople and make a connection, but it
is all it seems impossible at timesto actually carry it out. It's the
same with your children. They dosomething that you just think is really stupid
or really dangerous, and you wantto scold them, but you can't lose
your connection with your child over punishment. You have to maintain a connection with
(09:16):
them because you love them, butalso because you want that relationship and you
want them to be able to listento you, to hear the correction.
Appreciate your time, Charles, Thanksso much. Charl Pemberton, Dementia Family Therapy,
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