Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Pleasure to welcome Jim Bokel back to the program, CEO
of the Plaid Institute and inveterate tax hawk. Good morning, James,
morning Gary. Okay, we did the math. The bond issues
on the City of Omaha ballot total three hundred and
thirty three million, four hundred thousand dollars. That is, that's
(00:20):
just the maintenance stuff. And then I want to get
a little bit in a couple of minutes here in
the in the Good lab district thing, because that's separate.
Do you have any problem with these, with these bond
issues for streets basically infrastructure stuff and police and fire.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Well, I think it's important to have certainly meaningful voter
conversations about right the capital projects in our community and
how we finance them. In construction of projects like this
new roads, street preservation, improving our convention center, et cetera.
They are vital to the safety and growth of our community,
(00:53):
and so no, I don't have a problem with them.
The next step for voters is to take a look
at whether these are going to cause the tax increase,
and if you look on the ballot and listen to
city officials, there will be no levy increase associated with these.
So that's good.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Yeah, that's what the mayor says. Well, the reason I
invited you on is because Tim had a great idea
on an email yesterday. He said, you know, any chance
of having somebody like Jim vocalon to give an opinion
on the pros and cons of the City of Omaha
bond issues. The mayor says, don't worry, it's not going
to raise your bill, and giving people the idea this
(01:32):
is never going to cost anything, and then they threaten
if you don't pass it, your tax bill is going
to go up for sure. So what's the truth here.
I think it is true that the bond issues by
themselves do not increase property taxes.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Right, These do not because it does not require the
voters to approve the levee beyond the current levee for
the City of Omaha. And the positive side of bonds
that they're effective ways to finance long term capital projects.
If you look at the new Road bond issue, federal
money coming in and so there's a city match, so
that's generally a good thing.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Okay, there are six of those now. This other one
a special City of Omaha election establishing a Good Life
District Economic development program. What's your view on that one.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Well, this is going to come down to, once again,
if voters in that geographic area of a good Life
district want to pay more in sales taxes to finance
the development of a retail area. And I don't necessarily
have an opinion on that. It's becoming a more popular
way to finance geographic developments in the community, and voters
(02:40):
have to decide if they want to establish these districts
and pay more in sales taxes to support this.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
This is a very, very complex financial formula that a
lot of people don't understand. But at the end of
the day, what you're essentially saying is we are willing
to give up some sales taxes now with the understanding
that with broader development, more sales tax will come in.
It's a little risky. It's not unheard of, it's not illegal,
(03:08):
it's not a moral but it's a risk. It's a
big gambling risk with tax money. And in particular, when
we're talking about these Good Life districts, Kansas cities use
star bonds to do this. They say, look, the developer
is going to get all the money to build this
all right, and we're not going to get the sales
(03:29):
tax revenue from it until after all the bills are paid.
So when they start talking about a billion, two billion
dollar development, that's two billion dollars of sales tax that
will be paid before the city gets any of it
for schools, for streets, for street lights, for parks, or
any of the other things that communities spend money on.
And I think the fine people of Gretna need to
(03:51):
be aware of that before they agree to give up
a lot of sales future and sales tax revenue for
the Good Life district out by the interstate.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
And the flip side of that is revenue also that
sales tax revenue could be utilized to lower your property
taxes exactly.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
So I mean, I just think people need to know
that now. I believe you'd like to see the developers
have it absolutely in the game. It's like the Millwork
Commons deal we talked about in the five o'clock hour.
I think that is an excellent public private partnership. It's
a one hundred million dollar deal. We're going to provide
ten million in tiff financing for that. The developers are
responsible for the other ninety million because the developers are
(04:27):
going to win on this, They're going to profit. They'll say, well,
if we don't get more TIFF money, we won't do it. Well,
then let's find something else to do with the land.
But the notion, and this is not making developers into boogeyman,
but they need to be far more financially invested in
these projects. And if they won't tell you how much,
then that's a problem. That means it ain't much. And
(04:48):
they'll say, well, how do they make money. They make
money on the maintenance fees, on the marketing fees, on
the rental all that other business. It's it's not a
bad thing, but people need to have their eyes wide open.
That's the only concern I have about some of these
these texts.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Regardless if Jim, if it's a bond issue or a
good life district, voters need to make their best assessment
by understanding what the direct costs and potentially offsets to
property taxes are in relation to the benefit of the
district or the capital project as it relates to these
city bonds.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
People of Kansas City were confronted with this in the
spring because the chiefs and royals wanted two billion dollars
in Jackson County sales taxes to fix up their stadiums.
In the case of the Royals to build a new
one downtown, the case of the Chiefs to add eight
hundred million dollars of ra Arehead stadium. The Chiefs were
going to get all of the money that the new
(05:41):
stadiums generate, except for sales taxes, which would go towards
paying off the bonds, which means the fine people of
Jackson County would not see any of that sales tax
revenue until after everything was paid for. And it was
forty freaking years. Okay, that's how long it was going
to take to pay that off based on the three
(06:02):
quarter of ascent sales tax or whatever the case may be.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
So Jim Bokel, as a guy who's business that is
to analyze these financial issues economic issues in our state,
you're saying, basically, just buyer, beware, know what you're voting for.
You're not necessarily opposed. Just know all of the ins
and outs before you vote one way or the other.
On the good life.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
You need on the good life absolutely. And then one
final thing that I think is important too, it's great
that we're having these ballot initiatives here in the fall election.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
We'd like to see.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
The Platt insuit going forward is we've got to move
these school bond issues to the fall and mandate that
so we have the most amount of people, absolutely, because
those impact how much your property taxes you're.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
Paying maybe for a down the road, but you might
want to comment future on what's happening with communities and
the LB thirty four lids, because a lot of communities
in the state of Nebraska are jacking up their levees
right now as an advance against this. You might talk
about what's happening in a later day.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
I would love to do that, all right.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Great to see a Jim always Sea boy
Pleasure to welcome Jim Bokel back to the program, CEO
of the Plaid Institute and inveterate tax hawk. Good morning, James,
morning Gary. Okay, we did the math. The bond issues
on the City of Omaha ballot total three hundred and
thirty three million, four hundred thousand dollars. That is, that's
(00:20):
just the maintenance stuff. And then I want to get
a little bit in a couple of minutes here in
the in the Good lab district thing, because that's separate.
Do you have any problem with these, with these bond
issues for streets basically infrastructure stuff and police and fire.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Well, I think it's important to have certainly meaningful voter
conversations about right the capital projects in our community and
how we finance them. In construction of projects like this
new roads, street preservation, improving our convention center, et cetera.
They are vital to the safety and growth of our community,
(00:53):
and so no, I don't have a problem with them.
The next step for voters is to take a look
at whether these are going to cause the tax increase,
and if you look on the ballot and listen to
city officials, there will be no levy increase associated with these.
So that's good.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Yeah, that's what the mayor says. Well, the reason I
invited you on is because Tim had a great idea
on an email yesterday. He said, you know, any chance
of having somebody like Jim vocalon to give an opinion
on the pros and cons of the City of Omaha
bond issues. The mayor says, don't worry, it's not going
to raise your bill, and giving people the idea this
(01:32):
is never going to cost anything, and then they threaten
if you don't pass it, your tax bill is going
to go up for sure. So what's the truth here.
I think it is true that the bond issues by
themselves do not increase property taxes.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Right, These do not because it does not require the
voters to approve the levee beyond the current levee for
the City of Omaha. And the positive side of bonds
that they're effective ways to finance long term capital projects.
If you look at the new Road bond issue, federal
money coming in and so there's a city match, so
that's generally a good thing.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Okay, there are six of those now. This other one
a special City of Omaha election establishing a Good Life
District Economic development program. What's your view on that one.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
Well, this is going to come down to, once again,
if voters in that geographic area of a good Life
district want to pay more in sales taxes to finance
the development of a retail area. And I don't necessarily
have an opinion on that. It's becoming a more popular
way to finance geographic developments in the community, and voters
(02:40):
have to decide if they want to establish these districts
and pay more in sales taxes to support this.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
This is a very, very complex financial formula that a
lot of people don't understand. But at the end of
the day, what you're essentially saying is we are willing
to give up some sales taxes now with the understanding
that with broader development, more sales tax will come in.
It's a little risky. It's not unheard of, it's not illegal,
(03:08):
it's not a moral but it's a risk. It's a
big gambling risk with tax money. And in particular, when
we're talking about these Good Life districts, Kansas cities use
star bonds to do this. They say, look, the developer
is going to get all the money to build this
all right, and we're not going to get the sales
(03:29):
tax revenue from it until after all the bills are paid.
So when they start talking about a billion, two billion
dollar development, that's two billion dollars of sales tax that
will be paid before the city gets any of it
for schools, for streets, for street lights, for parks, or
any of the other things that communities spend money on.
And I think the fine people of Gretna need to
(03:51):
be aware of that before they agree to give up
a lot of sales future and sales tax revenue for
the Good Life district out by the interstate.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
And the flip side of that is revenue also that
sales tax revenue could be utilized to lower your property
taxes exactly.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
So I mean, I just think people need to know
that now. I believe you'd like to see the developers
have it absolutely in the game. It's like the Millwork
Commons deal we talked about in the five o'clock hour.
I think that is an excellent public private partnership. It's
a one hundred million dollar deal. We're going to provide
ten million in tiff financing for that. The developers are
responsible for the other ninety million because the developers are
(04:27):
going to win on this, They're going to profit. They'll say, well,
if we don't get more TIFF money, we won't do it. Well,
then let's find something else to do with the land.
But the notion, and this is not making developers into boogeyman,
but they need to be far more financially invested in
these projects. And if they won't tell you how much,
then that's a problem. That means it ain't much. And
(04:48):
they'll say, well, how do they make money. They make
money on the maintenance fees, on the marketing fees, on
the rental all that other business. It's it's not a
bad thing, but people need to have their eyes wide open.
That's the only concern I have about some of these
these texts.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Regardless if Jim, if it's a bond issue or a
good life district, voters need to make their best assessment
by understanding what the direct costs and potentially offsets to
property taxes are in relation to the benefit of the
district or the capital project as it relates to these
city bonds.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
People of Kansas City were confronted with this in the
spring because the chiefs and royals wanted two billion dollars
in Jackson County sales taxes to fix up their stadiums.
In the case of the Royals to build a new
one downtown, the case of the Chiefs to add eight
hundred million dollars of ra Arehead stadium. The Chiefs were
going to get all of the money that the new
(05:41):
stadiums generate, except for sales taxes, which would go towards
paying off the bonds, which means the fine people of
Jackson County would not see any of that sales tax
revenue until after everything was paid for. And it was
forty freaking years. Okay, that's how long it was going
to take to pay that off based on the three
(06:02):
quarter of ascent sales tax or whatever the case may be.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
So Jim Bokel, as a guy who's business that is
to analyze these financial issues economic issues in our state,
you're saying, basically, just buyer, beware, know what you're voting for.
You're not necessarily opposed. Just know all of the ins
and outs before you vote one way or the other.
On the good life.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
You need on the good life absolutely. And then one
final thing that I think is important too, it's great
that we're having these ballot initiatives here in the fall election.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
We'd like to see.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
The Platt insuit going forward is we've got to move
these school bond issues to the fall and mandate that
so we have the most amount of people, absolutely, because
those impact how much your property taxes you're.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
Paying maybe for a down the road, but you might
want to comment future on what's happening with communities and
the LB thirty four lids, because a lot of communities
in the state of Nebraska are jacking up their levees
right now as an advance against this. You might talk
about what's happening in a later day.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
I would love to do that, all right.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Great to see a Jim always Sea boy
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