July 3, 2025 • 9 mins
We talk carbon credits, forestry, farming and footy with a former All Blacks captain who still has nightmares about the French rugby team!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Once let to go before Raiser Robertson's first test of
twenty twenty five. He is a bloke who would have
played about a foody with Raiser Robertson. Former All Black
captain Tane Randall and I'm going to talk to you,
Tane about farming, footy and forestry because you've got a
bit of a serious background in forestry. Let's before we
(00:20):
get onto the footy, talk to me about forestry and
carbon farming. Where do you sit? Because you were into
it early doors.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, So I actually worked overseas for a while, so
when the emissions market started in Europe as when I
first started for a trading company in London, I was trading.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
We ended up training oil, but were also the missions.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Market grew massively and so by the end when I left,
if you're buying oil, you're also buying essentially European carbon credits.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
So you know, we but enough to be dangerous.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
And we came back to New Zealand two thousand and
nine and that was when the sort of carbon market
was sort of just really sort of starting in New
zeal two ten. Up got involved quite heavily up until
sort of the twenty twelve thirteen when the first cutoff
period for pre nineteen ninety forestry, all those registrations work
(01:12):
to be done, so heavily involved up more in the north.
I spent a week bit of time down in the
West Rowellyan of Southland. But essentially, yeah, more more and
more about advisory around how the scheme works. I knew
how it sort of worked globally, and then we a
bit of education helping people understand how it sort of
worked New Zealand's perspective and how more important, how to
(01:34):
apply it to their their landholding.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Now I know you've got farming interest in hawks by
I'm assuming it's in hawks by, sheep and beef. How
does the carbon farming or the forestry versus sheep and
beef work in your mind? Have we got it right?
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Controversial? Thanks Mack. I think it's getting better, you know.
And so essentially the market really checked off in too
and twelve in New Zealand. So it's only a twelve centing.
You know, for a lot of arts, that's smoking mirrors,
that's PAF and whatever else. But for commodity trading, that
sort of stuff overseen, It's existed for a long time,
very sophisticated for New Zealand. That was one of our
(02:13):
first really internationally traded commodities which we could do with
pretty transparent pricing, with futures markets and stuff. I've been
a big fan of it because more than anything, no
farmers are up in arms about it and whole on,
but the only people who can benefit it are landholders farmers.
(02:33):
Nowhere else in New Zealand can actually grow carbon credits.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
But there's plenty of places we've been.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Sorry, Tane, there's plenty of places on your farm surely
where you can plant trees and get the carbon credits.
I'm talking about the blanket planting of farms. That's what
I don't like. And I know examples of where arable land,
good arable land has been planted into trees. It's just
not right.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I completely agree. And we were you know, we're in
Hawks Bay. The east coast of New Zealand grows pretty
good pine.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
We've had we've seen some.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Big, big, sometime historic blocks going into pines and it's
it's what the companies who are doing that. There are
one rotation, one generation the short term, you know, but
what they do put in pines and they'll they'll cut
and run. Really, they'll take the first Sonali called averaging
first eight sixteen to eighteen years carbon and then they
don't care about the next hundred plus years.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
And that's that that really got away on us.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
And I really against that from another perspective, from just
a farmer's most who were I'm in Hawks Bay right,
so some really good land. But since most farms I'm
guessing around twenty twenty five percent of the land most
farmers don't want to go on there, makes perfect reason
to be putting into some sort of foreigner natives, pine, African,
(03:51):
red whatever else. And it does you know, for that
the poorer quality parts of the land, you do earn
more from a carbon perspected than you would ever do
from a farming perspective. But I've always thought, you know,
any farmer should have some sort of forestry, commercial or
(04:11):
long term as part of your portfolio, especially in Hawk's Bay,
where you don't just get big flat blocks of vand
you've got some you know, you've got some nice flat stuff,
but are rolling quite a bit a bit of rough stuff.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
It's the rough stuff which here I from a.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Strategic perspective, is the best stuff we should have in
forest where these companies have gone out and bought just
fantastic nice rolling land or flat and blanket planted and
it's just really poor. And I'd be feeling the government
going some way in terms of stopping that. We land
(04:47):
class six plus now to do that, and you can't
do whole blanket plantings, which I think is long over due.
But yeah, at the same time, you know, the forestry
all has historically been a big part of New Zealand
economy and I don't know who to believe, but the
forestry is still probably only about the same sort of
(05:10):
planting hectas it was in twenty seventeen. So when you
look at the stats, maybe sometimes you get a bit
more emotional than what virtual data data seems to think.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
All right, let's move on from forestry, just to wrap
at tane Randall with this former all Black Captain farming
farming and then foody. So are you getting your hands
dirty on the sheep and beef farm taine? You're getting
on the hand piece.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Not even close. The closer I get, the more sort
of things go wrong. Now we've got some family interests,
so we've bought some forest middle in the north farm
and we've got beef some sheep. Interesting in farming in
Hawk's Bay. Everyone seems to be having a good time
at the moment, which is quite good because everyone was
crying a bit last year. And as I'd say, the
(05:55):
more I get involved, the more things go wrong. But
take your teen interest, keen interest, and yeah's where we've
been pretty heavy spits in Hawk's Bay. We seem to
be pretty happy with how the weather is, how the
pricing is, the you know, Apple's going.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Pretty well as well.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
So I don't know what it's like for you guys
down south, but where I came at the moment.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Yeah, I know down here, and you're a bit like me.
I'm a George Street farmer. I know you know the
needing well, so yeah, the closer I get, the more
trouble for the farm. Anyhow, let me finish on the footy. France.
You can never ever underestimate France, and you probably still
have nightmares about France Tane Randall after nineteen ninety nine.
But how do you see this game going?
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Well, I'm I'm really excited. Okay, the Frends are coming
over pretty disrespectful. You know, it's the top of the world.
Table clash top to of the top three teams in
the world heavyweight's best of three. You know, pretty disrespectful
what they've done, the teams of sending their beatim over.
But I know it won't actually be that at it.
(07:00):
But from an interest perspective, I was, we'll see how
we go, you know, But it was really having seen
the team that raised it announced. Yes, I haven't been
this excited about the potential or you know, the potential
all back team for a long while, the loose forward tree.
I think finally we've got a good bali Savia on
(07:20):
the open side. Really happy of that two po by
massive risk putting them at six, putting having big locks
or you know, small locks, transferring things you can do
the same side, same deal at blind side. Hasn't always worked,
and of course Leo Willie, but what I like about them,
for the first time for a long while, we'll actually
have a balanced.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Loose forward trio. I was looking at it.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
You know, when you pick the team, you've got to
pick the best team, the best combination and having a
big strong blind side, having ball playing high work rate
number eight and you know Savia on the open side,
first time since really the cano Reid McCaw loose fortune
that I feel like we've going to balance loose Ford
trio issue have had over the last number of years
(08:03):
is that you know, with Sam Caine and Ardie Savia,
two fantastic players, both if you look at them, both
started open, so they're both open sides. But the coaches,
rather than you know, making a hard decision and choosing
the best for loose Ford combination, have just picked the
best players and.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
Put them in the team.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
And that's not necessarily, I believe, the best thing to do.
So I'm really excited to see how this Loose for
Trayer goes. It might be a failure, but at least
I think from a combination perspective, they've got the right intent.
But the other one wh's is you know Ricky Yuani
on the way I could not agree more. Yeah, he's
a strike winger. He's a strike player. He's not all
(08:43):
center's right. If you talk about roles in the AP playing,
you know, if you're a rock, you got to be
talk catch lineup. If you're a wing, you got to
be fast, and he's that. If you're a center, you've
got to be able to read defense and you've got
to be able to pass the ball to your wingers.
Those are the two key roles I see as a
as a center. You know, talk about the best midfielders
we've had, you know, Conrad Smith, Joe Stany, Frank Barnes, what, Yeah,
(09:07):
they were all fantastic athletes, but their stability was the
fact that when it came to defense, they read defenses.
It's quite complicated the midst that they read defenses really well.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
That's not riki Wan. He's a great estivity. He's a
very good.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Tackler, but from a system defense, he's not great. And
you know, as we all know his while he's a
fantastic runner, his distribution is not great.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
And if New.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Zealand has really key advantages over the rest of the
world with historically had strike wingers, we want our wingers
to get the ball, not the center's running with her.
And so those two things makes me really excited about
this weekend.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Hey, Tane Randall, I could check to you all day,
haven't got all day. Great to talk forestry, farming and
footy with you.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
Cool mate. Cheers, have a good day.
Once let to go before Raiser Robertson's first test of
twenty twenty five. He is a bloke who would have
played about a foody with Raiser Robertson. Former All Black
captain Tane Randall and I'm going to talk to you,
Tane about farming, footy and forestry because you've got a
bit of a serious background in forestry. Let's before we
(00:20):
get onto the footy, talk to me about forestry and
carbon farming. Where do you sit? Because you were into
it early doors.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, So I actually worked overseas for a while, so
when the emissions market started in Europe as when I
first started for a trading company in London, I was trading.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
We ended up training oil, but were also the missions.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Market grew massively and so by the end when I left,
if you're buying oil, you're also buying essentially European carbon credits.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
So you know, we but enough to be dangerous.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
And we came back to New Zealand two thousand and
nine and that was when the sort of carbon market
was sort of just really sort of starting in New
zeal two ten. Up got involved quite heavily up until
sort of the twenty twelve thirteen when the first cutoff
period for pre nineteen ninety forestry, all those registrations work
(01:12):
to be done, so heavily involved up more in the north.
I spent a week bit of time down in the
West Rowellyan of Southland. But essentially, yeah, more more and
more about advisory around how the scheme works. I knew
how it sort of worked globally, and then we a
bit of education helping people understand how it sort of
worked New Zealand's perspective and how more important, how to
(01:34):
apply it to their their landholding.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Now I know you've got farming interest in hawks by
I'm assuming it's in hawks by, sheep and beef. How
does the carbon farming or the forestry versus sheep and
beef work in your mind? Have we got it right?
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Controversial? Thanks Mack. I think it's getting better, you know.
And so essentially the market really checked off in too
and twelve in New Zealand. So it's only a twelve centing.
You know, for a lot of arts, that's smoking mirrors,
that's PAF and whatever else. But for commodity trading, that
sort of stuff overseen, It's existed for a long time,
very sophisticated for New Zealand. That was one of our
(02:13):
first really internationally traded commodities which we could do with
pretty transparent pricing, with futures markets and stuff. I've been
a big fan of it because more than anything, no
farmers are up in arms about it and whole on,
but the only people who can benefit it are landholders farmers.
(02:33):
Nowhere else in New Zealand can actually grow carbon credits.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
But there's plenty of places we've been.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Sorry, Tane, there's plenty of places on your farm surely
where you can plant trees and get the carbon credits.
I'm talking about the blanket planting of farms. That's what
I don't like. And I know examples of where arable land,
good arable land has been planted into trees. It's just
not right.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I completely agree. And we were you know, we're in
Hawks Bay. The east coast of New Zealand grows pretty
good pine.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
We've had we've seen some.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Big, big, sometime historic blocks going into pines and it's
it's what the companies who are doing that. There are
one rotation, one generation the short term, you know, but
what they do put in pines and they'll they'll cut
and run. Really, they'll take the first Sonali called averaging
first eight sixteen to eighteen years carbon and then they
don't care about the next hundred plus years.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
And that's that that really got away on us.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
And I really against that from another perspective, from just
a farmer's most who were I'm in Hawks Bay right,
so some really good land. But since most farms I'm
guessing around twenty twenty five percent of the land most
farmers don't want to go on there, makes perfect reason
to be putting into some sort of foreigner natives, pine, African,
(03:51):
red whatever else. And it does you know, for that
the poorer quality parts of the land, you do earn
more from a carbon perspected than you would ever do
from a farming perspective. But I've always thought, you know,
any farmer should have some sort of forestry, commercial or
(04:11):
long term as part of your portfolio, especially in Hawk's Bay,
where you don't just get big flat blocks of vand
you've got some you know, you've got some nice flat stuff,
but are rolling quite a bit a bit of rough stuff.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
It's the rough stuff which here I from a.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Strategic perspective, is the best stuff we should have in
forest where these companies have gone out and bought just
fantastic nice rolling land or flat and blanket planted and
it's just really poor. And I'd be feeling the government
going some way in terms of stopping that. We land
(04:47):
class six plus now to do that, and you can't
do whole blanket plantings, which I think is long over due.
But yeah, at the same time, you know, the forestry
all has historically been a big part of New Zealand
economy and I don't know who to believe, but the
forestry is still probably only about the same sort of
(05:10):
planting hectas it was in twenty seventeen. So when you
look at the stats, maybe sometimes you get a bit
more emotional than what virtual data data seems to think.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
All right, let's move on from forestry, just to wrap
at tane Randall with this former all Black Captain farming
farming and then foody. So are you getting your hands
dirty on the sheep and beef farm taine? You're getting
on the hand piece.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Not even close. The closer I get, the more sort
of things go wrong. Now we've got some family interests,
so we've bought some forest middle in the north farm
and we've got beef some sheep. Interesting in farming in
Hawk's Bay. Everyone seems to be having a good time
at the moment, which is quite good because everyone was
crying a bit last year. And as I'd say, the
(05:55):
more I get involved, the more things go wrong. But
take your teen interest, keen interest, and yeah's where we've
been pretty heavy spits in Hawk's Bay. We seem to
be pretty happy with how the weather is, how the
pricing is, the you know, Apple's going.
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Pretty well as well.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
So I don't know what it's like for you guys
down south, but where I came at the moment.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Yeah, I know down here, and you're a bit like me.
I'm a George Street farmer. I know you know the
needing well, so yeah, the closer I get, the more
trouble for the farm. Anyhow, let me finish on the footy. France.
You can never ever underestimate France, and you probably still
have nightmares about France Tane Randall after nineteen ninety nine.
But how do you see this game going?
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Well, I'm I'm really excited. Okay, the Frends are coming
over pretty disrespectful. You know, it's the top of the world.
Table clash top to of the top three teams in
the world heavyweight's best of three. You know, pretty disrespectful
what they've done, the teams of sending their beatim over.
But I know it won't actually be that at it.
(07:00):
But from an interest perspective, I was, we'll see how
we go, you know, But it was really having seen
the team that raised it announced. Yes, I haven't been
this excited about the potential or you know, the potential
all back team for a long while, the loose forward tree.
I think finally we've got a good bali Savia on
(07:20):
the open side. Really happy of that two po by
massive risk putting them at six, putting having big locks
or you know, small locks, transferring things you can do
the same side, same deal at blind side. Hasn't always worked,
and of course Leo Willie, but what I like about them,
for the first time for a long while, we'll actually
have a balanced.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Loose forward trio. I was looking at it.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
You know, when you pick the team, you've got to
pick the best team, the best combination and having a
big strong blind side, having ball playing high work rate
number eight and you know Savia on the open side,
first time since really the cano Reid McCaw loose fortune
that I feel like we've going to balance loose Ford
trio issue have had over the last number of years
(08:03):
is that you know, with Sam Caine and Ardie Savia,
two fantastic players, both if you look at them, both
started open, so they're both open sides. But the coaches,
rather than you know, making a hard decision and choosing
the best for loose Ford combination, have just picked the
best players and.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
Put them in the team.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
And that's not necessarily, I believe, the best thing to do.
So I'm really excited to see how this Loose for
Trayer goes. It might be a failure, but at least
I think from a combination perspective, they've got the right intent.
But the other one wh's is you know Ricky Yuani
on the way I could not agree more. Yeah, he's
a strike winger. He's a strike player. He's not all
(08:43):
center's right. If you talk about roles in the AP playing,
you know, if you're a rock, you got to be
talk catch lineup. If you're a wing, you got to
be fast, and he's that. If you're a center, you've
got to be able to read defense and you've got
to be able to pass the ball to your wingers.
Those are the two key roles I see as a
as a center. You know, talk about the best midfielders
we've had, you know, Conrad Smith, Joe Stany, Frank Barnes, what, Yeah,
(09:07):
they were all fantastic athletes, but their stability was the
fact that when it came to defense, they read defenses.
It's quite complicated the midst that they read defenses really well.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
That's not riki Wan. He's a great estivity. He's a
very good.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Tackler, but from a system defense, he's not great. And
you know, as we all know his while he's a
fantastic runner, his distribution is not great.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
And if New.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Zealand has really key advantages over the rest of the
world with historically had strike wingers, we want our wingers
to get the ball, not the center's running with her.
And so those two things makes me really excited about
this weekend.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Hey, Tane Randall, I could check to you all day,
haven't got all day. Great to talk forestry, farming and
footy with you.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
Cool mate. Cheers, have a good day.
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