The Country 16/07/25: Jim Hopkins talks to Jamie Mackay

We get the take of a well-known rural raconteur on water, politics and the politics of water.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Kevin help us. Local body elections are coming up in October.
Jim Hopkins joins us from the Principality of Oamaru. Of
course he's on the Waitaki District Council. Jim, I assume
you're standing again. Is it too early or would it
be rude and presumptuous of me to say vote Hopkins?

Speaker 2 (00:17):
No, nothing, thank you. If you believe it, then you
should say it is the case with everything. Yes, I
am saying again, and hello Jamie, welcome, greeting salutations from
the principality. Yes, yes, Now.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
I want to talk to you today about water politics,
but more importantly the politics of water. Three waters was
we plainly didn't get it right. But as the replacement
is the cure worse than the disease because we're looking
at all these local bodies, especially some of the smaller
ones around the country, the rural ones, and they have
got horrendous double digit rate increases because central government is

(00:55):
kind of lumped water on them without much assistance. Am
I over semplifying that?

Speaker 2 (01:01):
Yes, I think you are. There is truth in that.
But equally, at the moment, councils have the opportunity to
sort of look at how they will deliver supply water
in future. And you suggested the cure was worse than
a disease. In other words, local water done well, which

(01:22):
is the coalition government solution, is worse than three waters,
which was the Nanayamhota's approach. I don't think that's correct.
I think the three waters approach involved nationalization of assets,
essentially just taking them over initially to go into four
companies nationwide and then latterly twelve. The new solution sort

(01:45):
of says, hey, councils, get together, have a chat, talk
to each other and come up with us with solutions
that will work in your area, and look for the
cheapest possible options that are available to you. So it
all sounds very nice and very democratic and very egalitarian.

(02:05):
But the new government is as determined as label was
to actually get some water reforms initiated. And so basically,
if you come up with an idea which you have
to actually then send to Wellington by September this year
and Wellington cancel or the Department of Internal Affairs can say, oh, yes,

(02:27):
that's a wonderful idea, carry on, what terrific three tiers,
or they can say no, we don't like that you
go away and try again. And if in fact a
council goes away, tries again and Department of Internal Affairs
still doesn't like it, then they the department can say, right,
this is what you're going to do.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
Can I just finish on another thing, perhaps politics on
a national scale, Because I know you're a keen observer.
Are you seeing like I am, a renaissance in Winston
Peter's political career and that of his henchman, loyal henchman,
Shane Jones. I just think they're scratching an itch with
a lot of New Zealanders now. And in the latest

(03:08):
Taxpayers Union curier Pole, I note that New Zealand First
beat the Greens and Act and the Greens for the
first time.

Speaker 2 (03:17):
Yes, I noticed that as well. My view is that
in the end First New Zealand First is probably benefiting
as much from Shane Jones' positions on various things as
from Winston's. I noticed that the person on the party
who'd been saying the most in the period immediately before
while that Taxpayers Union poll was being conducted, who was

(03:41):
actually most vocal, was Shane Jones. So the question really
is is he the person who's having a positive effect
in terms of New Zealand First popularity. I think he's
saying things that there is a sort of a silent
majority appetite here.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
Jim Hopkins, thanks for your time. I'm out of time
at that end. Yes, listen, it's got it. I know
you're a busy man. You're about to do a White
Stone cheese tour. Good luck with that one. Great to
catch up. And I guess Shane Jones on his campaign
trail is bad news for snails, lizards, skinks and especially
blind frogs. Indeed, hey Jim, take care mate, Like

Speaker 2 (04:20):
What my mate