November 22, 2024 • 35 mins
Sixty-one years ago, President John F. Kennedy was assassinated in Dallas, Texas. That tragedy still haunts America today. In 2022, the Biden Administration released more than 13k records on the assassination. More than 3,000 records remain unreleased or are redacted. During President Elect Donald Trump’s campaign, he pledged to release the remaining files. Do you think the remaining JFK assassination files should be released? Tom Samoluk, former Deputy Director of the President John F. Kennedy Assassination Records Review Board joined Dan to discuss a heartbreaking moment in American History.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
It's nine with Dan Ray on WAZ Boston Video.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
We're talking with Tom Samuelon. He is the former deputy
director of the John F. Kennedy Assassination Records and Review Board.
Let's get back to calls and again looking for questions
or we can talk about experiences later after Tom leaves us.
But but your theories or your thoughts or question or
(00:29):
a comment, that's what that's what we're doing right now.
We go to Richard in Boston. Richard, you are next
on Nightside.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Welcome, Oh, good evening, thanks for taking my call. I
came in late, sir. I was wondering if you ever
looked at the person who was the mayor of Dallas,
Earl Cable, and someone said that he caused the MOTIKEI
to change to go in front of the book depository.
And the connection with him was his brother. His brother,
(00:56):
I believe his childs Cable. He was a general assistant
in the CIA and President Kennedy fired him, and many
people thought that that was one of the connections that
maybe the CIA were responsible for killing the president and
this man might have been involved with the assassination with
(01:17):
his brother, the mayor.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Let's see what Tom said If anybody would be able
to give you a response to that would be Tom
Samlike interesting, certainly thought, Tom.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I think that the characterization of the relationship between the
mayor and the CIA official is correct. I do not
think there is any credibility to the theory that the
mayor was involved in any way and in any way
(01:48):
changed the Motorcate route. Although like every aspect Dan, as
you know, of the assassination, they are small. It all
is in dispute and sometimes it's hard to weave our
way through what reality there is in what's fiction. But
I don't I don't think that that's accurate.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Okay, I just thought that because the President Kennedy fired
his brother who was an assistant in the CIA.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
And it's no Richard, you explained it very well and
I had never heard that. But again, that's it's ironic,
and is that there's so many conspiracy theories or that
that has sort of muddied the water over time. Yeah,
it seems to me. But anyway, Richard, thank.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
You for taking my call, and I thank you. It was
a very interesting show. Thank you, thank you for raising it.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Appreciate it. Hi, good night. Let me go next to
Gina in Bridgewater, Gina, you were next time, and I
said with Tom similar K, Deputy Director, I mean that.
Speaker 5 (02:49):
Was just I remember this my mother speaking of it
because she was in the hospital at the time and
she had my brother the next day, meaning tomorrow, and
she named my brother after him, his middle name, the
first name. And I also remember a story that JFK
wanted my dad to be his personal bodyguard many years ago,
(03:12):
and he refused it only because he said he wanted
to have a family and if he did that, he
wouldn't have been able.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
To What did your dad do? You know, we don't
know who your dad was, Gina, But what did your
dad do that? Did he tell that story at family
tables or what? What did your dad remember?
Speaker 6 (03:34):
Somebody did mention that and he wanted him to, probably
because he was in the military years prior and was decent.
My dad was John. He was just a decent person,
that's all.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Did you did your father know former President Kennedy?
Speaker 6 (03:53):
I have no idea.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Okay, all right, well I don't think Tom can comment
on that one, but that's an interesting story from family. Thank you, Gene,
appreciate you call very much. I have a great night.
Let me go to Ron and Newton. Ron, you are
next with Tom Samlik Right ahead, ron.
Speaker 7 (04:09):
Ah, Dan, thanks so much for having this. Tom, just
a quick question on what's what do you think is
the possibility that artificial intelligence and the amazing computation there's
the whole series of courses now the I T and
(04:29):
a whole department could supplement and because these computers can
computate variables, uh you know, the many data sets that
you can put together and also look at different scenarios
much better than we as human beings.
Speaker 8 (04:47):
Uh.
Speaker 7 (04:50):
I completed a course on Saturday on the application to medicine,
which is why I ask that's a great.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
Ca I think it is a great, great question. It
really is the latest chapter in how technology can be
used in criminal investigations. And if you go back to
nineteen sixty three, not only were their mistakes made and
(05:21):
things that would definitely not have been done today. And
if you look at the How Select Committee in the
late seventies, they did certain ballistic testing and other types
of technologic developments. Including Dan, you may recall the stuck
(05:42):
microphone on a Dallas police motorcycles who was in the
who was motor keate? And that turned out to be.
It's been disputed, and once again one of those things
that's in controversy. I think AI will definitely become part
(06:03):
of the JFK assassination story. With AI just everywhere in
the news, and the uses for it are incredible, and
so I think people will will try to apply it
to the JFK assassination investigations.
Speaker 7 (06:23):
As far back as nineteen ninety nine, Intitute of Medicine
published a report on two areas here in all of
the deaths that were occurring. Even then, we had computational
ability using simulation models where we could plug in variables
to the different decision trees and do what they call
(06:45):
it Monte Carlo simulation, looking at maybe one hundred thousand
variables forward and you could come up, you could you
could you could find things out that were outside of
the box in the manner that you would pick.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
We think, I think that holds out a lot of possibilities.
Speaker 7 (07:06):
Thanks Ron, great call, Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Great called Tom. I final question, and I'd say I
promised I would let you go after one more segment
if in your opinion and again this is your opinion,
but it's an opinion that is based on knowledge that
and observations that none of us have had a chance
to look at. If Jack Ruby had not been lurking
in that police garage and had not been able to
(07:32):
successfully kill Oswald, and if Oswald had gotten to his
jail cell that night and it had never been that
had lived for some period of time, do you think
that that we would have gotten the story which was
just a roundabout way of asking, Uh, it appears. It
(07:53):
appears to me that the Ruby aspect of this story,
if you believe that Ruby was just so empathetic towards history,
was that he was empathetic towards Jacqueline Kennedy, and that's
why he was felt compelled to kill Oswald. But if
that moment had not occurred, I truly think that somehow,
(08:16):
some way we would know.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
I think you're probably right, Dan, or at least we
would have a better chance of knowing, if you think
about it. Oswald had defected to the Soviet Union. He
six weeks before the assassination. He had traveled to Mexico City,
visited the Russian and the Cuban embassies. He had had
(08:40):
run ins with the anti Castro Cubans in New Orleans.
He had been in the Marines.
Speaker 9 (08:49):
There is such a.
Speaker 4 (08:52):
Rich history for someone who was only twenty four years
old when he was killed. Just think if he had spoken.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
night Side Studios on WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Well, we're back here, and I hope you heard the
Amber alert, Tom Sam like. That is something that happens,
and you well know that we were not able to
That's something we're obligated to do. Glad we did it.
I apologize for breaking on trend of thought. I'm gonna
let you go in about four or five minutes here,
but I just wanted to, first of all, thank you
(09:28):
very much for your time tonight. Thank you for the
work that you have done. How was it that you
became the deputy director of this of this Assassination Records
Review Board, which I assume has now has in effect
gone out of business, is no longer an active agency.
(09:54):
And I assume I'm correct on that, if I'm not contradict.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
Me, Yeah, Dan, you are correct. The life of the
board sunset if you will. On September thirtieth, nineteen ninety eight,
when the final report was literally handed to President Clinton
in the Oval Office, and he had a tremendous amount
(10:17):
of interest in the assassination Dan. One thing I wanted
to mention just to give your listeners some sense of
what the volume of records that we're talking about. There's
over five million records that are at the National Archives
as part of the JFK Assassination Records Collection, and so
the question may be, well, what are the number of
(10:39):
records that remain. The estimate is, and I don't know exactly,
but it's between three and four thousand documents that haven't
been fully released. So there are many that, as I
was talking about earlier, may have a name or something
that relates to a intelligence gathering or method that we redacted,
(11:03):
that is the Review Board redacted, but I think can
probably be opened up now. There may be about five
hundred documents that have been completely withheld that may not
be exactly accurate, but it's around that. But your head
on the former chairman of the Review Board, Judge John
(11:23):
Tunheim from Minneapolis, and Judge Tunheim agrees that it's time,
it's long past the time the loss that everything should
be released twenty five years after the passage of the
law that created the collection and the Review Board, and
that was twenty seventeen, and that's when President President Trump
(11:44):
said that he would release all the records. That was
just being consistent with blow second opportunity. He has said
that he would do it, and so we'll wait and
see when he is president again on January twentieth.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Well, you know, one of the things that I mean
remember from that era, and I can't tell you whether
it was when the One Commission report was released or whatever,
was the number seventy five stuck in my mind, and
I can I followed it as a you know, as
a young teenager and a high school student and a
you know, an aspiring college student, and I thought that
(12:20):
it was going to be released seventy five years, you know,
everything would be released seventy five years after the assassination,
which whatever that would have put it at, I guess
twenty thirty eight or something like that. I'm doing the
math in my head quickly. And one of the reasons,
and again I don't know that I ever saw this
(12:40):
as a television report, but or I started in a
newspaper that they wanted to make sure that everyone who
was alive at that time, particularly immediate family members, would
probably not still be alive and does anything like that
ring a bell with you in your mind?
Speaker 4 (12:57):
Yes, it does, and that I I don't recall what
the basis of that calculation was relative to the Warren
Commission records, but that would have been superseded by the
law that created the review Board and the collection itself
in nineteen ninety two.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Fair enough, And so it's going to be up to
Donald Trump. And Donald Trump, certainly with his appointments, has
I think pretty much indicated that he's going with a
different type of team this year this presidency. But this
is one that I think everyone in the country would support.
(13:41):
My last question is do you believe that this was
not a matter of a group of people who conspired
to do this, that however it was done, whether it
was the lone gunman or two or three people, that
the real embarrassment was the failure of intelligence, the failure
(14:04):
of someone to pick this up in advance. Do you
think that was the motivation why certain documents above and
above and beyond the reasons that are actually given, it
was a failure of intelligence, and that we did not
want to let the rest of the world know that
our intelligence agencies maybe were not as good as they.
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Claimed, Well, I think that's part of it, Dan, There
were a lot of mistakes. There were a lot of
warning lights, if you will, because Oswald, whatever his role was,
if he had a role, and people differ on that,
but the FBI and the CIA were very aware of Oswald.
(14:44):
They had been cracking him when he defected from the
US and he left the Marines and he first traveled
to Europe and then ended up in the Soviet and
we released documents, the Review Board released documents from nineteen
in sixty of their Trapped eight department. They're tracking him
(15:05):
and his mother is trying to get help to find
out where he is. So that just continued up until
the assassination. That there was FBI and CIA awareness, So
a lot of mistakes made.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
So again my thought, I'm not saying it's a theory,
but my thought is that there was a sense, you know,
there was a sense back in nineteen sixty three of
this superiority not only of our military but of our
intelligence agency. I mean, we were number one in the world,
we had won World War Two and all of that,
(15:41):
and this kind of pierced that belief, if you will.
And so I'm just wondering if at its core it
is not to cover up the actions of Oswald or whomever,
but to cover up our failure to keep an eye
on him and understand where he was.
Speaker 4 (16:00):
And that maybe it's both. Maybe there was a desire
to cover up the failures but also not open any
doors beyond the loan gunman, because it's at the height
of the Cold War, So you may have what you'd
call a dual cover up, the covering up the mistakes
and covering up what may have happened, or a desire
(16:21):
not to learn what may have happened beyond a loan gunman.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Yeah. Boy, it's it's it's the story of it's the
story of our lives, Tom sam luk Uh, and it
is the new story of our generation. And and you
have been there. And when when President Trump does disclose
whatever he's he has promised to disclose, I hope that
they can't you involved in it, and give the credit
(16:47):
to to your agency of which you served as deputy director.
Thank you, my friend, Thank you so much. As all
welcome down. We will we will do this again when
and if Donald Trump, let's let's the world know exactly
as much as he can what happened on that horrible
(17:08):
afternoon sixty one years ago. Today. Thanks Tom Semilak.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
I'll look forward to seeing.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
You perhaps at the Marry and Brett food pantry this spring.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Indeed, thank you Dan.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Thanks Tom, Tom Samuli, great friend. Okay, now, because of
the interruption of the Amber a Lord, a couple of
folks dropped off. Here's what I'd like to do. I
would like to give all of you an opportunity, since
Tom is no longer with us, to tell me what
you think happened. Okay, Now again, I'd just love to
(17:40):
know if you think it was a foreign power, if
you think it was the single gunman Lee Harvey Oswald,
if you think there might have been organized crime involved
in this. Certainly the Ruby involvement brings the whole question
of organized crime into focus. We have thirty minutes left.
(18:01):
This is the sixty first anniversary. I remember as a
student in the nineteen sixties when they remembered the one
hundredth anniversary of the assassination of Lincoln, which would have
(18:22):
been obviously in the spring of nineteen sixty five. Because
Lincoln was assassinated in April of eighteen sixty five, it
won't be too long now before they will be remembering
the one hundredth anniversary of the Kennedy assassination, thirty nine
(18:42):
years from tonight. As I've told you before, I'm a
bit of a numerologist in that regard because it kind
of does put things in context. We are very much
closer to the one hundredth anniversary of the Kennedy assassination
than we are to the actual day and night of
the assassination. So I'd love to hear from you. What
do you think If you are someone who's a student
(19:05):
of it, feel free. We have about twenty twenty six
minutes left before we get to the eleven o'clock news,
and of course then we will go to twentyeth hour.
Just go open the lines up. It's not open lines,
but it's open to any thought that you have six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty six one seven, nine, three, one ten thirty.
(19:26):
We probably will never know. As Tom Sammeluk said, you know,
lost to history. But how sad I truly did believe
that at some point there would have been a deathbed confession.
But I was naive because anybody who would have been
in a position of any authority at that time I
(19:46):
assume has long since expired. My name's Dan Ray. This
is Nightside doing something in remembrance of President Kennedy's assassination
sixty one years ago tonight. I remember it clearly, and
I remember the day that all well, it was shot
two days later that Sunday morning, back on Nightside right
after this. Now it's just you and me. Tom Samlik,
who was our guest, who again is an extraordinary individual.
(20:13):
He's very, very good, very understated again, Deputy director of
the John F. Kennedy Assassination Records and Review BOK. If
you missed him in the nine o'clock hour that hour
as well as all of our hours, we'll be posted
at Nightside and demand Field free over the weekend to
give a listen to not only the nine o'clock hour,
(20:33):
but the ten o'clock hour coming up at eleven tonight.
We will be going to our twentieth hour, of course,
which we do every Friday night, and we'll see exactly
I have an idea about what we'll be doing in
the twentieth hour, but I'm going to hold off on
that because I want to continue this hour and your
(20:55):
recollections of what happened sixty one years ago on this
very day. It's very date James and Boston. James, you're
next to the night side. Welcome.
Speaker 9 (21:05):
Hey, I was going good, James.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
You go right ahead with Now Tom Samlik has left.
But I'd love to know your recollection or your thoughts.
Speaker 10 (21:14):
Yeah, I know that he's done. I've been listening to
the show. You know, I think the government has something
to do with it. They do whatever the hell they want.
You know, they're supposed to be elected officials like for
the people, by the people, but once they get in
an office, they do whatever the hell they want. So
I mean, I wouldn't put it past like, you know.
Speaker 4 (21:31):
Just.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Use your big words. Yeah big, he's your big words,
by the way. Hold on, James, James, James, James, James, James,
Hold on for a second. I would like everyone to know.
I'm told by my producer Rob that these three children
for whom this amber alert was mentioned, all right, this
you just heard, they have been found a safe and
sound and I'm sure our news department, our news team
(21:56):
is hard at work on that. And stick with us.
We'll have some information coming up at all eleven o'clock.
Go ahead, James, so I did interrupt you, but I
had to get that information out. Go right ahead.
Speaker 9 (22:04):
No, that's that's good, that's good news.
Speaker 10 (22:07):
Well, you know, I I think that, like you know,
he must have angered someone within the government or someone
like there's no not a chance that like this Loane
gunman shot him and then was killed like two days later.
Like that that's logus. And anyone who believes that is you.
Speaker 9 (22:27):
Know, like you know, not in the right mind.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Well that was what the war. That was what the
Warrant Commission, which was the official government agency, concluded, And
then there was a lot of criticism of the Warrant
Commission report over time, just an agreeable amount. And there
was a book you know that that if you're interested
in this, I'm sure that you could find an old
(22:50):
copy of the book. It was called Rush to Judgment
by Mark Lane. UH and the government UH, in all honesty,
tried to diminish the value of his book. There were
a lot of people who are saying, oh, Lane doesn't
know what he's talking about. But in retrospect, I think
a lot of what Lane wrote about in nineteen sixty three,
(23:11):
in nineteen sixty four, in nineteen sixty five actually had
a lot of validity. You know that early on. It's
amazing to think that a president of the United States
could be shot to death on the street of a
major American city in nineteen sixty five, and we have
(23:31):
no clue as to yeah, yeah, nineteen sixty three. Excuse me,
I misspoke in nineteen sixty three, and have absolutely no clue,
definitively as to what happened, how it happened.
Speaker 10 (23:48):
Why it happened, Yeah, not for nothing. For them to
withhold information documents like they're elected officials, they worked for
the people, like we have the right to notice, and
they don't have the right to withhold it, you know.
And if they want to withhold it, then they shouldn't
be in office because it's it's not right.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
I happen to agree with you. I think that we
are now back in the time and you saw much younger, James.
You sound to me like you're I'm all right, yeah.
So what I'm saying is back at the time, the
Cold War was at its height, and there were some
people who thought, well, this must be the Russians who
killed Kennedy. Uh, and it was that was that was no. No,
(24:30):
I'm just telling you that Lee Harvey Oswald had let me, James,
hold on for a second. Just let me, let me
make my statement, and then I want you to react
to it. Okay, I just have a little patience with me.
Lee Harvey Oswald, who many people believe, I think did
fire shots from the school book depository.
Speaker 9 (24:50):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
He was captured that day by a Dallas police officer,
Dallas police officer, after he had had killed another Dallas
police officer. It's an interesting it's an interesting ruing. He
had been in the US Marines, that he defected to
Russia in nineteen fifty nine, and people thought, oh, they
made him a spy or whatever, and that this was
Russia trying to take out President Kennedy height of the
(25:13):
Cold War. There were all sorts of theories going on.
I don't know if you knew that Oswald had defected
to Russia. Maybe you did.
Speaker 11 (25:22):
Yeah, No, I knew that. I actually did like a
lot of reading on it and what not. But I mean,
it's interesting to me that you know, so many years
later that we still don't have a clue. Yeah, and
we really we listened to what we're told, you know,
And that's that's kind of sad because It's like what
(25:44):
we're told is not always the truth, and then we
find out.
Speaker 10 (25:47):
Later the truth was. And then it's like the people
that are responsible for the lives are dead and they
can't You can't prosecute them, you can't, you can't do
anything do them.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
That's true, you know true. I appreciate you calling him
on my break. I gotta get going. I wish I
had a better conversation with you, but thank you for calling,
and thank you for having an interest in something that
happened sixty one years ago today. Thanks James, Thanks good night.
We'll take quick break, coming right back. I got Paul
in Pennsylvania, Ted in Texas. I'll get both of them
(26:18):
in before the eleven o'clock news, I promise. And the
Amber alert situation has been resolved without any injury to
the children and our news team. I'm sure we'll have
more at eleven o'clock. Coming back on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Now, back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
night Side Studios. I'm WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Back to the calls we go. Let me go to
Ted in Texas. Hey, Ded, welcome back. Haven't talked to
you in a while. Go right ahead, Ted, Okay, let's
put ted on hold. I think he's out walking his dog.
Let's go to Paul in Pennsylvania. Paul, you're next on Nightside.
Speaker 9 (26:58):
Go right ahead, all right, Dan, great show. I personally,
I personally think that it was definitely, at least at
the middlemum, a second gunman on the grassian all because
you know yourself, Dad, if somebody pushes you from behind,
you don't fall backwards. And I think, whoever's the next
grassian all shot President Kenny in the throat. And maybe
(27:19):
he even had that filhad shot. I don't you know,
Oswald might have been I don't know. I know the
simplest explorations that Akman's razor and and that's the one
that every pretty much stands by it. But and you
mentioned the Mark White. I couldn't believe you did that
because I was trying to think that what the author
was and when you mentioned Mark White, I must fell over.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
Well, as we said, grape minds sake alike?
Speaker 9 (27:41):
Right right, well do I wouldn't put myself in the
same category as using that. But anyway, you know, it's amazing.
I think President Trump, what a good thing is with
with Bobby Kenny Junior I know that he'll push, you know,
President Trump to release that. And they should also get
what happened with Malcolm X, would happened with Martin Luther K,
and what happened that RFK Senior. They should get all
(28:03):
four of those who released everything. I don't see what
why they're holding and had a lot of people. And
for as bad as the sixties were, people forget there's
not maybe forty years ago. You know, John Lennon got assassinated.
A few months later, Ronald Reagan almost passed away, but
President Ackley and then the Pope got shot and you
know that was that was within five months, not five
(28:25):
five years. So but I hope, damn they get to
the bottom of it, and I hope President Trump keeps
his word. And there are some people that I don't
know if you release said it or not. There's some
people that said that President Trump's even to release the
that uh ed afl with that Jeffrey Epstein, you know
he does and he doesn't. But right now you know
it's JFK.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
It was.
Speaker 9 (28:45):
It was sixty one years ago, like you mentioned, and
there's there's no reason in the world but we American
people can't hear the truth of what happened. That's crazy.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
I think that. Look, we have a case up here
in Boston where a bunch of guys utilized services at
a brothel and they're having debates over whether or not
their name should be made public here and in a
state Supreme Court case. You can you'll see that one. Look,
(29:16):
I think that all of this, all of this r
F K, Martin, Luther King, Malcolm X, the Epstein file,
everything should be out there for the world to see.
At this opinion.
Speaker 9 (29:28):
You know what, you know what you're you're you're you're
a Bostoner. But I remember that case years ago. You
remember what that uh what they call that woman, that
babysitter that shook that baby to death. They had an
aid for.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Your name. Your name was Louise Woodworth.
Speaker 9 (29:44):
She was from England and they had some guy they had.
If there's an aid for that, there's a it's not
a baby. There are something else.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
It's called the it's called shaken baby syndrome.
Speaker 9 (29:55):
No, but the name. They called her, a state caller,
a baby stir. They called her something else. There's some
it's some some fancy worth. You never heard of me
called babies there anymore. But they you know, those people
in England actually.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Thought she was she was if you're I'm just trying
to answer your questions fast and furious. Here she was
a nanny. Okay, So she was someone who was living
in the home with his family.
Speaker 11 (30:19):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
And the parents doctors. But I don't want to get off.
I know a lot about that case. But that's frue.
Speaker 9 (30:25):
But which which which surprised me, Dan was the people
in England said they were fully prosecutor because they weren't.
They were Irish, And I thought that was most despicable
thing those people ever said over there.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
No, the parents were not Irish.
Speaker 9 (30:40):
No, but they the prosecutor. And Massachusetts wasn't that woman?
Was that woman?
Speaker 2 (30:45):
You know?
Speaker 9 (30:46):
I thought you was on They found her guilty and everything.
But I tell what you're saying that I wanted. This
is my president, Kenny's family, and I should have.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
I hate to do this to you, man, but I've
gone full minutes with you, and I got others they
got to grab. Okay, thank you, buddy, by appreciate. Let
me try ted in Texas one more time. Ted, we've
strived once, we missed. You're back right.
Speaker 9 (31:04):
Ahead, Okay, I'm back. How are you.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Tight on time, buddy? You go right ahead.
Speaker 8 (31:10):
Okay, I'm gonna come. I'm gonna keep it short. I
hope you and your family are well. So I think
we can I think we can all agree that when
President Kennedy was shot, it was a loss of innocence
for the entire country. But if you look back over history,
you know, my dad, my grandpa, you know, fought in
(31:31):
World War One and World War Two respectively. You look
back to you know, Arts, Duke, Friends, Ferdinand of Austria,
what started you.
Speaker 12 (31:40):
Know, World War One?
Speaker 8 (31:42):
These terrible, terrible acts and uh, you know, none of
us know what really happened, but it was horrific and
it really changed our country forever. It was, you know,
just very very tragic. But whether you were a report, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
It was, it was. It was a marker. I mean,
we had come out of World War Two as the
country we were the most superior. We were at the
superior superpower of the world. Russia was moving up when
they when they you know, challenge us with Sputnik and
all of that. And then we we got into the
space race and landed the people in the moon. But
on November twenty second, nineteen sixty three. Our veneer of
(32:23):
invincibility was shattered.
Speaker 8 (32:26):
I totally agree, totally great. And you and I grew
up in the same neighborhood at the exact same time,
and I think we totally agree and it's just tragic.
Speaker 12 (32:37):
So we'll talk.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
I missed talking to you. Come on back, We'll call you.
Speaker 8 (32:41):
I've been a busy guy, man, I'm working, working, working,
I'm trying to make it all happen in Texas and
down and Chatham and got my numbers.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
I know exactly who this is, my family, I know
exactly who that is.
Speaker 8 (32:53):
You need there, everybody, Doc, you, Ted, Thrank, you, Thanks
all right.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
I got to go to Jean and Walpole. Geen you
next on nights. I want to get you in here
under the wire. Go ahead, Gene.
Speaker 12 (33:04):
Uh Man. I don't know. I just got out of work.
I don't know if this is this has been talked
about before, but there's a d v D out and
it's called the Men That Killed Kennedy. I think it
was put out by the History Channel at one time.
I've had it on had it on VHF, but I
got it on d v D now and it's it's
(33:24):
it's really really really interesting.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
I'm not familiar with that, but but there is, there
are all of these theories. Uh again we the theories
never would have you know, been propagated. Uh if if
we had understood uh the truth shortly thereafter.
Speaker 12 (33:44):
You know, yeah, well if you if you could see
that that uh that d v d uh it was,
it would put a lot of ideas in your head though.
And it's really really interesting. The men that killed Kennedy.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
And all right, I've got.
Speaker 9 (34:04):
On e bay Okay, I've.
Speaker 12 (34:07):
Got okay, I thank you. I think you'll like it.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Killed Kennedy. Thank you very much, appreciate it. Jeane, thank
you how much? Good night? What's what's the time? Rob?
Here we go, okay, Jim Man less than a minute.
What do you want to add? Jim, go right ahead.
Speaker 13 (34:27):
I want to make some Hey Dan uh okay, there.
I think there was a huge contract out on the
guy and there are a lot of people looking to
do it, and all of a sudden it be you know,
the window opened up and they all did it at
the same time. So that's why it's a big mess
and nobody can figure out what happened because.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
So it's like side gangs deciding to rub the same
bank at the same.
Speaker 13 (34:51):
Time, and all of a sudden the opportunity presents itself.
But it was probably a big contract, so a lot
of people were wanting it.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
You know.
Speaker 13 (35:00):
That's what I think.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
That's the theory. That's an interesting theory. Cop. No one
can dispute that one. We'll see what happens. I hope
that that when he becomes president again, President Trump, one
of the first things he does is make everything open.
Let you know, let's let the sunshine in the greatest disinfectant.
Speaker 13 (35:16):
Okay, Thanksgiving, Merry Christmas to you, to you.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Right, Well, we'll talk before Christmas. We may not talk
before Thanksgiving. I'm actually off next week, Jim, so we'll no.
Speaker 13 (35:26):
You get in here, all right, see a little.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Later, man, Thank you very much. All right, here comes
the eleven o'clock news. We have the twentieth hour coming back,
and I have a specific question for all of you
in the twentieth hour back on nights out after this
It's nine with Dan Ray on WAZ Boston Video.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
We're talking with Tom Samuelon. He is the former deputy
director of the John F. Kennedy Assassination Records and Review Board.
Let's get back to calls and again looking for questions
or we can talk about experiences later after Tom leaves us.
But but your theories or your thoughts or question or
(00:29):
a comment, that's what that's what we're doing right now.
We go to Richard in Boston. Richard, you are next
on Nightside.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Welcome, Oh, good evening, thanks for taking my call. I
came in late, sir. I was wondering if you ever
looked at the person who was the mayor of Dallas,
Earl Cable, and someone said that he caused the MOTIKEI
to change to go in front of the book depository.
And the connection with him was his brother. His brother,
(00:56):
I believe his childs Cable. He was a general assistant
in the CIA and President Kennedy fired him, and many
people thought that that was one of the connections that
maybe the CIA were responsible for killing the president and
this man might have been involved with the assassination with
(01:17):
his brother, the mayor.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Let's see what Tom said If anybody would be able
to give you a response to that would be Tom
Samlike interesting, certainly thought, Tom.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I think that the characterization of the relationship between the
mayor and the CIA official is correct. I do not
think there is any credibility to the theory that the
mayor was involved in any way and in any way
(01:48):
changed the Motorcate route. Although like every aspect Dan, as
you know, of the assassination, they are small. It all
is in dispute and sometimes it's hard to weave our
way through what reality there is in what's fiction. But
I don't I don't think that that's accurate.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Okay, I just thought that because the President Kennedy fired
his brother who was an assistant in the CIA.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
And it's no Richard, you explained it very well and
I had never heard that. But again, that's it's ironic,
and is that there's so many conspiracy theories or that
that has sort of muddied the water over time. Yeah,
it seems to me. But anyway, Richard, thank.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
You for taking my call, and I thank you. It was
a very interesting show. Thank you, thank you for raising it.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Appreciate it. Hi, good night. Let me go next to
Gina in Bridgewater, Gina, you were next time, and I
said with Tom similar K, Deputy Director, I mean that.
Speaker 5 (02:49):
Was just I remember this my mother speaking of it
because she was in the hospital at the time and
she had my brother the next day, meaning tomorrow, and
she named my brother after him, his middle name, the
first name. And I also remember a story that JFK
wanted my dad to be his personal bodyguard many years ago,
(03:12):
and he refused it only because he said he wanted
to have a family and if he did that, he
wouldn't have been able.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
To What did your dad do? You know, we don't
know who your dad was, Gina, But what did your
dad do that? Did he tell that story at family
tables or what? What did your dad remember?
Speaker 6 (03:34):
Somebody did mention that and he wanted him to, probably
because he was in the military years prior and was decent.
My dad was John. He was just a decent person,
that's all.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Did you did your father know former President Kennedy?
Speaker 6 (03:53):
I have no idea.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Okay, all right, well I don't think Tom can comment
on that one, but that's an interesting story from family. Thank you, Gene,
appreciate you call very much. I have a great night.
Let me go to Ron and Newton. Ron, you are
next with Tom Samlik Right ahead, ron.
Speaker 7 (04:09):
Ah, Dan, thanks so much for having this. Tom, just
a quick question on what's what do you think is
the possibility that artificial intelligence and the amazing computation there's
the whole series of courses now the I T and
(04:29):
a whole department could supplement and because these computers can
computate variables, uh you know, the many data sets that
you can put together and also look at different scenarios
much better than we as human beings.
Speaker 8 (04:47):
Uh.
Speaker 7 (04:50):
I completed a course on Saturday on the application to medicine,
which is why I ask that's a great.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
Ca I think it is a great, great question. It
really is the latest chapter in how technology can be
used in criminal investigations. And if you go back to
nineteen sixty three, not only were their mistakes made and
(05:21):
things that would definitely not have been done today. And
if you look at the How Select Committee in the
late seventies, they did certain ballistic testing and other types
of technologic developments. Including Dan, you may recall the stuck
(05:42):
microphone on a Dallas police motorcycles who was in the
who was motor keate? And that turned out to be.
It's been disputed, and once again one of those things
that's in controversy. I think AI will definitely become part
(06:03):
of the JFK assassination story. With AI just everywhere in
the news, and the uses for it are incredible, and
so I think people will will try to apply it
to the JFK assassination investigations.
Speaker 7 (06:23):
As far back as nineteen ninety nine, Intitute of Medicine
published a report on two areas here in all of
the deaths that were occurring. Even then, we had computational
ability using simulation models where we could plug in variables
to the different decision trees and do what they call
(06:45):
it Monte Carlo simulation, looking at maybe one hundred thousand
variables forward and you could come up, you could you
could you could find things out that were outside of
the box in the manner that you would pick.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
We think, I think that holds out a lot of possibilities.
Speaker 7 (07:06):
Thanks Ron, great call, Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Great called Tom. I final question, and I'd say I
promised I would let you go after one more segment
if in your opinion and again this is your opinion,
but it's an opinion that is based on knowledge that
and observations that none of us have had a chance
to look at. If Jack Ruby had not been lurking
in that police garage and had not been able to
(07:32):
successfully kill Oswald, and if Oswald had gotten to his
jail cell that night and it had never been that
had lived for some period of time, do you think
that that we would have gotten the story which was
just a roundabout way of asking, Uh, it appears. It
(07:53):
appears to me that the Ruby aspect of this story,
if you believe that Ruby was just so empathetic towards history,
was that he was empathetic towards Jacqueline Kennedy, and that's
why he was felt compelled to kill Oswald. But if
that moment had not occurred, I truly think that somehow,
(08:16):
some way we would know.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
I think you're probably right, Dan, or at least we
would have a better chance of knowing, if you think
about it. Oswald had defected to the Soviet Union. He
six weeks before the assassination. He had traveled to Mexico City,
visited the Russian and the Cuban embassies. He had had
(08:40):
run ins with the anti Castro Cubans in New Orleans.
He had been in the Marines.
Speaker 9 (08:49):
There is such a.
Speaker 4 (08:52):
Rich history for someone who was only twenty four years
old when he was killed. Just think if he had spoken.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
night Side Studios on WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Well, we're back here, and I hope you heard the
Amber alert, Tom Sam like. That is something that happens,
and you well know that we were not able to
That's something we're obligated to do. Glad we did it.
I apologize for breaking on trend of thought. I'm gonna
let you go in about four or five minutes here,
but I just wanted to, first of all, thank you
(09:28):
very much for your time tonight. Thank you for the
work that you have done. How was it that you
became the deputy director of this of this Assassination Records
Review Board, which I assume has now has in effect
gone out of business, is no longer an active agency.
(09:54):
And I assume I'm correct on that, if I'm not contradict.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
Me, Yeah, Dan, you are correct. The life of the
board sunset if you will. On September thirtieth, nineteen ninety eight,
when the final report was literally handed to President Clinton
in the Oval Office, and he had a tremendous amount
(10:17):
of interest in the assassination Dan. One thing I wanted
to mention just to give your listeners some sense of
what the volume of records that we're talking about. There's
over five million records that are at the National Archives
as part of the JFK Assassination Records Collection, and so
the question may be, well, what are the number of
(10:39):
records that remain. The estimate is, and I don't know exactly,
but it's between three and four thousand documents that haven't
been fully released. So there are many that, as I
was talking about earlier, may have a name or something
that relates to a intelligence gathering or method that we redacted,
(11:03):
that is the Review Board redacted, but I think can
probably be opened up now. There may be about five
hundred documents that have been completely withheld that may not
be exactly accurate, but it's around that. But your head
on the former chairman of the Review Board, Judge John
(11:23):
Tunheim from Minneapolis, and Judge Tunheim agrees that it's time,
it's long past the time the loss that everything should
be released twenty five years after the passage of the
law that created the collection and the Review Board, and
that was twenty seventeen, and that's when President President Trump
(11:44):
said that he would release all the records. That was
just being consistent with blow second opportunity. He has said
that he would do it, and so we'll wait and
see when he is president again on January twentieth.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Well, you know, one of the things that I mean
remember from that era, and I can't tell you whether
it was when the One Commission report was released or whatever,
was the number seventy five stuck in my mind, and
I can I followed it as a you know, as
a young teenager and a high school student and a
you know, an aspiring college student, and I thought that
(12:20):
it was going to be released seventy five years, you know,
everything would be released seventy five years after the assassination,
which whatever that would have put it at, I guess
twenty thirty eight or something like that. I'm doing the
math in my head quickly. And one of the reasons,
and again I don't know that I ever saw this
(12:40):
as a television report, but or I started in a
newspaper that they wanted to make sure that everyone who
was alive at that time, particularly immediate family members, would
probably not still be alive and does anything like that
ring a bell with you in your mind?
Speaker 4 (12:57):
Yes, it does, and that I I don't recall what
the basis of that calculation was relative to the Warren
Commission records, but that would have been superseded by the
law that created the review Board and the collection itself
in nineteen ninety two.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Fair enough, And so it's going to be up to
Donald Trump. And Donald Trump, certainly with his appointments, has
I think pretty much indicated that he's going with a
different type of team this year this presidency. But this
is one that I think everyone in the country would support.
(13:41):
My last question is do you believe that this was
not a matter of a group of people who conspired
to do this, that however it was done, whether it
was the lone gunman or two or three people, that
the real embarrassment was the failure of intelligence, the failure
(14:04):
of someone to pick this up in advance. Do you
think that was the motivation why certain documents above and
above and beyond the reasons that are actually given, it
was a failure of intelligence, and that we did not
want to let the rest of the world know that
our intelligence agencies maybe were not as good as they.
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Claimed, Well, I think that's part of it, Dan, There
were a lot of mistakes. There were a lot of
warning lights, if you will, because Oswald, whatever his role was,
if he had a role, and people differ on that,
but the FBI and the CIA were very aware of Oswald.
(14:44):
They had been cracking him when he defected from the
US and he left the Marines and he first traveled
to Europe and then ended up in the Soviet and
we released documents, the Review Board released documents from nineteen
in sixty of their Trapped eight department. They're tracking him
(15:05):
and his mother is trying to get help to find
out where he is. So that just continued up until
the assassination. That there was FBI and CIA awareness, So
a lot of mistakes made.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
So again my thought, I'm not saying it's a theory,
but my thought is that there was a sense, you know,
there was a sense back in nineteen sixty three of
this superiority not only of our military but of our
intelligence agency. I mean, we were number one in the world,
we had won World War Two and all of that,
(15:41):
and this kind of pierced that belief, if you will.
And so I'm just wondering if at its core it
is not to cover up the actions of Oswald or whomever,
but to cover up our failure to keep an eye
on him and understand where he was.
Speaker 4 (16:00):
And that maybe it's both. Maybe there was a desire
to cover up the failures but also not open any
doors beyond the loan gunman, because it's at the height
of the Cold War, So you may have what you'd
call a dual cover up, the covering up the mistakes
and covering up what may have happened, or a desire
(16:21):
not to learn what may have happened beyond a loan gunman.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Yeah. Boy, it's it's it's the story of it's the
story of our lives, Tom sam luk Uh, and it
is the new story of our generation. And and you
have been there. And when when President Trump does disclose
whatever he's he has promised to disclose, I hope that
they can't you involved in it, and give the credit
(16:47):
to to your agency of which you served as deputy director.
Thank you, my friend, Thank you so much. As all
welcome down. We will we will do this again when
and if Donald Trump, let's let's the world know exactly
as much as he can what happened on that horrible
(17:08):
afternoon sixty one years ago. Today. Thanks Tom Semilak.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
I'll look forward to seeing.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
You perhaps at the Marry and Brett food pantry this spring.
Speaker 4 (17:17):
Indeed, thank you Dan.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Thanks Tom, Tom Samuli, great friend. Okay, now, because of
the interruption of the Amber a Lord, a couple of
folks dropped off. Here's what I'd like to do. I
would like to give all of you an opportunity, since
Tom is no longer with us, to tell me what
you think happened. Okay, Now again, I'd just love to
(17:40):
know if you think it was a foreign power, if
you think it was the single gunman Lee Harvey Oswald,
if you think there might have been organized crime involved
in this. Certainly the Ruby involvement brings the whole question
of organized crime into focus. We have thirty minutes left.
(18:01):
This is the sixty first anniversary. I remember as a
student in the nineteen sixties when they remembered the one
hundredth anniversary of the assassination of Lincoln, which would have
(18:22):
been obviously in the spring of nineteen sixty five. Because
Lincoln was assassinated in April of eighteen sixty five, it
won't be too long now before they will be remembering
the one hundredth anniversary of the Kennedy assassination, thirty nine
(18:42):
years from tonight. As I've told you before, I'm a
bit of a numerologist in that regard because it kind
of does put things in context. We are very much
closer to the one hundredth anniversary of the Kennedy assassination
than we are to the actual day and night of
the assassination. So I'd love to hear from you. What
do you think If you are someone who's a student
(19:05):
of it, feel free. We have about twenty twenty six
minutes left before we get to the eleven o'clock news,
and of course then we will go to twentyeth hour.
Just go open the lines up. It's not open lines,
but it's open to any thought that you have six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty six one seven, nine, three, one ten thirty.
(19:26):
We probably will never know. As Tom Sammeluk said, you know,
lost to history. But how sad I truly did believe
that at some point there would have been a deathbed confession.
But I was naive because anybody who would have been
in a position of any authority at that time I
(19:46):
assume has long since expired. My name's Dan Ray. This
is Nightside doing something in remembrance of President Kennedy's assassination
sixty one years ago tonight. I remember it clearly, and
I remember the day that all well, it was shot
two days later that Sunday morning, back on Nightside right
after this. Now it's just you and me. Tom Samlik,
who was our guest, who again is an extraordinary individual.
(20:13):
He's very, very good, very understated again, Deputy director of
the John F. Kennedy Assassination Records and Review BOK. If
you missed him in the nine o'clock hour that hour
as well as all of our hours, we'll be posted
at Nightside and demand Field free over the weekend to
give a listen to not only the nine o'clock hour,
(20:33):
but the ten o'clock hour coming up at eleven tonight.
We will be going to our twentieth hour, of course,
which we do every Friday night, and we'll see exactly
I have an idea about what we'll be doing in
the twentieth hour, but I'm going to hold off on
that because I want to continue this hour and your
(20:55):
recollections of what happened sixty one years ago on this
very day. It's very date James and Boston. James, you're
next to the night side. Welcome.
Speaker 9 (21:05):
Hey, I was going good, James.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
You go right ahead with Now Tom Samlik has left.
But I'd love to know your recollection or your thoughts.
Speaker 10 (21:14):
Yeah, I know that he's done. I've been listening to
the show. You know, I think the government has something
to do with it. They do whatever the hell they want.
You know, they're supposed to be elected officials like for
the people, by the people, but once they get in
an office, they do whatever the hell they want. So
I mean, I wouldn't put it past like, you know.
Speaker 4 (21:31):
Just.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Use your big words. Yeah big, he's your big words,
by the way. Hold on, James, James, James, James, James, James,
Hold on for a second. I would like everyone to know.
I'm told by my producer Rob that these three children
for whom this amber alert was mentioned, all right, this
you just heard, they have been found a safe and
sound and I'm sure our news department, our news team
(21:56):
is hard at work on that. And stick with us.
We'll have some information coming up at all eleven o'clock.
Go ahead, James, so I did interrupt you, but I
had to get that information out. Go right ahead.
Speaker 9 (22:04):
No, that's that's good, that's good news.
Speaker 10 (22:07):
Well, you know, I I think that, like you know,
he must have angered someone within the government or someone
like there's no not a chance that like this Loane
gunman shot him and then was killed like two days later.
Like that that's logus. And anyone who believes that is you.
Speaker 9 (22:27):
Know, like you know, not in the right mind.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Well that was what the war. That was what the
Warrant Commission, which was the official government agency, concluded, And
then there was a lot of criticism of the Warrant
Commission report over time, just an agreeable amount. And there
was a book you know that that if you're interested
in this, I'm sure that you could find an old
(22:50):
copy of the book. It was called Rush to Judgment
by Mark Lane. UH and the government UH, in all honesty,
tried to diminish the value of his book. There were
a lot of people who are saying, oh, Lane doesn't
know what he's talking about. But in retrospect, I think
a lot of what Lane wrote about in nineteen sixty three,
(23:11):
in nineteen sixty four, in nineteen sixty five actually had
a lot of validity. You know that early on. It's
amazing to think that a president of the United States
could be shot to death on the street of a
major American city in nineteen sixty five, and we have
(23:31):
no clue as to yeah, yeah, nineteen sixty three. Excuse me,
I misspoke in nineteen sixty three, and have absolutely no clue,
definitively as to what happened, how it happened.
Speaker 10 (23:48):
Why it happened, Yeah, not for nothing. For them to
withhold information documents like they're elected officials, they worked for
the people, like we have the right to notice, and
they don't have the right to withhold it, you know.
And if they want to withhold it, then they shouldn't
be in office because it's it's not right.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
I happen to agree with you. I think that we
are now back in the time and you saw much younger, James.
You sound to me like you're I'm all right, yeah.
So what I'm saying is back at the time, the
Cold War was at its height, and there were some
people who thought, well, this must be the Russians who
killed Kennedy. Uh, and it was that was that was no. No,
(24:30):
I'm just telling you that Lee Harvey Oswald had let me, James,
hold on for a second. Just let me, let me
make my statement, and then I want you to react
to it. Okay, I just have a little patience with me.
Lee Harvey Oswald, who many people believe, I think did
fire shots from the school book depository.
Speaker 9 (24:50):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
He was captured that day by a Dallas police officer,
Dallas police officer, after he had had killed another Dallas
police officer. It's an interesting it's an interesting ruing. He
had been in the US Marines, that he defected to
Russia in nineteen fifty nine, and people thought, oh, they
made him a spy or whatever, and that this was
Russia trying to take out President Kennedy height of the
(25:13):
Cold War. There were all sorts of theories going on.
I don't know if you knew that Oswald had defected
to Russia. Maybe you did.
Speaker 11 (25:22):
Yeah, No, I knew that. I actually did like a
lot of reading on it and what not. But I mean,
it's interesting to me that you know, so many years
later that we still don't have a clue. Yeah, and
we really we listened to what we're told, you know,
And that's that's kind of sad because It's like what
(25:44):
we're told is not always the truth, and then we
find out.
Speaker 10 (25:47):
Later the truth was. And then it's like the people
that are responsible for the lives are dead and they
can't You can't prosecute them, you can't, you can't do
anything do them.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
That's true, you know true. I appreciate you calling him
on my break. I gotta get going. I wish I
had a better conversation with you, but thank you for calling,
and thank you for having an interest in something that
happened sixty one years ago today. Thanks James, Thanks good night.
We'll take quick break, coming right back. I got Paul
in Pennsylvania, Ted in Texas. I'll get both of them
(26:18):
in before the eleven o'clock news, I promise. And the
Amber alert situation has been resolved without any injury to
the children and our news team. I'm sure we'll have
more at eleven o'clock. Coming back on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Now, back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
night Side Studios. I'm WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Back to the calls we go. Let me go to
Ted in Texas. Hey, Ded, welcome back. Haven't talked to
you in a while. Go right ahead, Ted, Okay, let's
put ted on hold. I think he's out walking his dog.
Let's go to Paul in Pennsylvania. Paul, you're next on Nightside.
Speaker 9 (26:58):
Go right ahead, all right, Dan, great show. I personally,
I personally think that it was definitely, at least at
the middlemum, a second gunman on the grassian all because
you know yourself, Dad, if somebody pushes you from behind,
you don't fall backwards. And I think, whoever's the next
grassian all shot President Kenny in the throat. And maybe
(27:19):
he even had that filhad shot. I don't you know,
Oswald might have been I don't know. I know the
simplest explorations that Akman's razor and and that's the one
that every pretty much stands by it. But and you
mentioned the Mark White. I couldn't believe you did that
because I was trying to think that what the author
was and when you mentioned Mark White, I must fell over.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
Well, as we said, grape minds sake alike?
Speaker 9 (27:41):
Right right, well do I wouldn't put myself in the
same category as using that. But anyway, you know, it's amazing.
I think President Trump, what a good thing is with
with Bobby Kenny Junior I know that he'll push, you know,
President Trump to release that. And they should also get
what happened with Malcolm X, would happened with Martin Luther K,
and what happened that RFK Senior. They should get all
(28:03):
four of those who released everything. I don't see what
why they're holding and had a lot of people. And
for as bad as the sixties were, people forget there's
not maybe forty years ago. You know, John Lennon got assassinated.
A few months later, Ronald Reagan almost passed away, but
President Ackley and then the Pope got shot and you
know that was that was within five months, not five
(28:25):
five years. So but I hope, damn they get to
the bottom of it, and I hope President Trump keeps
his word. And there are some people that I don't
know if you release said it or not. There's some
people that said that President Trump's even to release the
that uh ed afl with that Jeffrey Epstein, you know
he does and he doesn't. But right now you know
it's JFK.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
It was.
Speaker 9 (28:45):
It was sixty one years ago, like you mentioned, and
there's there's no reason in the world but we American
people can't hear the truth of what happened. That's crazy.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
I think that. Look, we have a case up here
in Boston where a bunch of guys utilized services at
a brothel and they're having debates over whether or not
their name should be made public here and in a
state Supreme Court case. You can you'll see that one. Look,
(29:16):
I think that all of this, all of this r
F K, Martin, Luther King, Malcolm X, the Epstein file,
everything should be out there for the world to see.
At this opinion.
Speaker 9 (29:28):
You know what, you know what you're you're you're you're
a Bostoner. But I remember that case years ago. You
remember what that uh what they call that woman, that
babysitter that shook that baby to death. They had an
aid for.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Your name. Your name was Louise Woodworth.
Speaker 9 (29:44):
She was from England and they had some guy they had.
If there's an aid for that, there's a it's not
a baby. There are something else.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
It's called the it's called shaken baby syndrome.
Speaker 9 (29:55):
No, but the name. They called her, a state caller,
a baby stir. They called her something else. There's some
it's some some fancy worth. You never heard of me
called babies there anymore. But they you know, those people
in England actually.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
Thought she was she was if you're I'm just trying
to answer your questions fast and furious. Here she was
a nanny. Okay, So she was someone who was living
in the home with his family.
Speaker 11 (30:19):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
And the parents doctors. But I don't want to get off.
I know a lot about that case. But that's frue.
Speaker 9 (30:25):
But which which which surprised me, Dan was the people
in England said they were fully prosecutor because they weren't.
They were Irish, And I thought that was most despicable
thing those people ever said over there.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
No, the parents were not Irish.
Speaker 9 (30:40):
No, but they the prosecutor. And Massachusetts wasn't that woman?
Was that woman?
Speaker 2 (30:45):
You know?
Speaker 9 (30:46):
I thought you was on They found her guilty and everything.
But I tell what you're saying that I wanted. This
is my president, Kenny's family, and I should have.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
I hate to do this to you, man, but I've
gone full minutes with you, and I got others they
got to grab. Okay, thank you, buddy, by appreciate. Let
me try ted in Texas one more time. Ted, we've
strived once, we missed. You're back right.
Speaker 9 (31:04):
Ahead, Okay, I'm back. How are you.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Tight on time, buddy? You go right ahead.
Speaker 8 (31:10):
Okay, I'm gonna come. I'm gonna keep it short. I
hope you and your family are well. So I think
we can I think we can all agree that when
President Kennedy was shot, it was a loss of innocence
for the entire country. But if you look back over history,
you know, my dad, my grandpa, you know, fought in
(31:31):
World War One and World War Two respectively. You look
back to you know, Arts, Duke, Friends, Ferdinand of Austria,
what started you.
Speaker 12 (31:40):
Know, World War One?
Speaker 8 (31:42):
These terrible, terrible acts and uh, you know, none of
us know what really happened, but it was horrific and
it really changed our country forever. It was, you know,
just very very tragic. But whether you were a report, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
It was, it was. It was a marker. I mean,
we had come out of World War Two as the
country we were the most superior. We were at the
superior superpower of the world. Russia was moving up when
they when they you know, challenge us with Sputnik and
all of that. And then we we got into the
space race and landed the people in the moon. But
on November twenty second, nineteen sixty three. Our veneer of
(32:23):
invincibility was shattered.
Speaker 8 (32:26):
I totally agree, totally great. And you and I grew
up in the same neighborhood at the exact same time,
and I think we totally agree and it's just tragic.
Speaker 12 (32:37):
So we'll talk.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
I missed talking to you. Come on back, We'll call you.
Speaker 8 (32:41):
I've been a busy guy, man, I'm working, working, working,
I'm trying to make it all happen in Texas and
down and Chatham and got my numbers.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
I know exactly who this is, my family, I know
exactly who that is.
Speaker 8 (32:53):
You need there, everybody, Doc, you, Ted, Thrank, you, Thanks
all right.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
I got to go to Jean and Walpole. Geen you
next on nights. I want to get you in here
under the wire. Go ahead, Gene.
Speaker 12 (33:04):
Uh Man. I don't know. I just got out of work.
I don't know if this is this has been talked
about before, but there's a d v D out and
it's called the Men That Killed Kennedy. I think it
was put out by the History Channel at one time.
I've had it on had it on VHF, but I
got it on d v D now and it's it's
(33:24):
it's really really really interesting.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
I'm not familiar with that, but but there is, there
are all of these theories. Uh again we the theories
never would have you know, been propagated. Uh if if
we had understood uh the truth shortly thereafter.
Speaker 12 (33:44):
You know, yeah, well if you if you could see
that that uh that d v d uh it was,
it would put a lot of ideas in your head though.
And it's really really interesting. The men that killed Kennedy.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
And all right, I've got.
Speaker 9 (34:04):
On e bay Okay, I've.
Speaker 12 (34:07):
Got okay, I thank you. I think you'll like it.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Killed Kennedy. Thank you very much, appreciate it. Jeane, thank
you how much? Good night? What's what's the time? Rob?
Here we go, okay, Jim Man less than a minute.
What do you want to add? Jim, go right ahead.
Speaker 13 (34:27):
I want to make some Hey Dan uh okay, there.
I think there was a huge contract out on the
guy and there are a lot of people looking to
do it, and all of a sudden it be you know,
the window opened up and they all did it at
the same time. So that's why it's a big mess
and nobody can figure out what happened because.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
So it's like side gangs deciding to rub the same
bank at the same.
Speaker 13 (34:51):
Time, and all of a sudden the opportunity presents itself.
But it was probably a big contract, so a lot
of people were wanting it.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
You know.
Speaker 13 (35:00):
That's what I think.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
That's the theory. That's an interesting theory. Cop. No one
can dispute that one. We'll see what happens. I hope
that that when he becomes president again, President Trump, one
of the first things he does is make everything open.
Let you know, let's let the sunshine in the greatest disinfectant.
Speaker 13 (35:16):
Okay, Thanksgiving, Merry Christmas to you, to you.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Right, Well, we'll talk before Christmas. We may not talk
before Thanksgiving. I'm actually off next week, Jim, so we'll no.
Speaker 13 (35:26):
You get in here, all right, see a little.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Later, man, Thank you very much. All right, here comes
the eleven o'clock news. We have the twentieth hour coming back,
and I have a specific question for all of you
in the twentieth hour back on nights out after this
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