March 6, 2025 • 39 mins
In recent months there has been a battle between State Auditor Diana DiZoglio and state legislators over efforts to audit the state legislature. Despite an overwhelming number of MA residents, roughly 71%, who approved Question 1 last Fall, which asked if the state auditor should be able to audit the state legislature, Massachusetts House Speaker Ron Mariano opposes the audit and says DiZoglio has turned this into a “political audit”. State Auditor Diana DiZoglio joined us to discuss her efforts to audit the state legislature.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm w b Z
Coustin's new video.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
I'm delighted to be joined by my favorite, one of
my very favorite politicians. Here are elected officials here in Massachusetts,
Massachusetts State Uditor Diana Desauglio, who was in a battle
with the leadership of the Greater General Court about whether
(00:28):
or not Diana Doglio, in her capacity as the Massachusetts
State Auditor, will be allowed to aunit the edge of
the state legislature. Madam Auditor or Diana, how are you tonight?
Speaker 3 (00:41):
I am doing fantastic. It is great to be back
with you, Dan, Thanks so much for the invitation. I
always love coming on.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Oh my pleasure, my pleasure. As they say, I think
that you're one of the most courageous leaders here in Massachusetts,
and I am stunned that the legislative leadership so truculent.
And maybe some in our audience don't remember the genesis
of this confrontation. But let me refresh the their recollection
(01:11):
by asking you a question. Was there a question one
on the Massachusetts ballot last fall dealing with this issue?
Speaker 3 (01:21):
Yes, yes, I'd like to read.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
That to you. It's fairly straightforward and I want people
to understand that the voters of Massachusetts were presented with
a proposed law by initiative petition. The proposed law i'm
quoting now would specify that the state auditor that would
be you, has the authority to audit the legislature that
(01:46):
would be the State House and State Senate up in Massachusetts.
How did that election work out, Madam auditor? What was
the percentage of voters?
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Thanks for asking?
Speaker 4 (02:02):
You know it is.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
It has been quite the quite the last a few years,
a few months, few weeks, few days, a lots happening
up on Beacon Hell, lots of drama and unfortunately little
action on this particular issue on you know that the
(02:26):
voters voted for him.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
I've got a couple of other questions here, okay, and
I know that you have the answers. Okay. President Trump
has been using the word mandate quite a bit based
upon his election in November. Yeah, and he received I believe,
just a little over fifty percent of the vote. He
(02:50):
did win the popular vote and the electoral vote and
the seven you know, so called battleground states. Now, if
at fifty plus percent, that's a mandate. How would you
characterize the vote by the voters of Massachusetts to authorize
(03:10):
you to compel to audit the state legislature. What word
would you use? I certainly think that mandate would be one,
But could we add the adjective overwhelming mandate?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
I would say overwhelming is absolutely the right word.
Speaker 4 (03:30):
Dan.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
You know, we got overwhelming support to get us on
the ballot in the first place. It you know, got
over one hundred thousand signatures, and we worked so hard
to put this on the ballot. Friends, many of you
signed out at your grocery stores. We finally got it
on the ballot. We didn't have the amount of resources
that other ballot questions had. And when we did get
it on the ballot, you came out and you spoke
(03:53):
loud and clear. And that was due to this being
a non partisan issue for people from all political stripes
just said to their state government that they want transparency
and they want accountability. You know, here in Massachusetts, from
as forward thinking as we are, we continue to have
one of the least transparent, if not the least transparent,
(04:15):
according to most good government groups, state legislature and the
entire nation not subject of public records, not subjects to
open meeting laws are any of these you know, transparency
laws that are actually mandated for other entities in this Commonwealth,
such as your cities and towns, who have to follow
these public records laws and open meeting laws. The legislature
(04:36):
exempts itself from so much regarding these matters of transparency
and accountability, and now it's seeking to exempt itself from
a law that was just passed by you, the voters.
You made this law when you went to go vote
in November. Some folks have asked, well, do they have
to approve it in the legislature. No, you went to
(04:57):
go vote on this. It is buying. It is the law,
and they are breaking it right now, willingly and willfully
and defiantly and arrogantly in the face of not just
one party, but in the face of you know, Democrats, Republicans,
(05:17):
unrolled and everyone in between. It is absolutely unacceptable.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Okay, And I just again, I'm trying to do this
as clearly as possible because I want to make sure
that my audience gets activated here and perhaps will encourage
their state legislators. The one hundred and sixty members of
the House of Representative and the forty members of the
State Senate to do the right thing and tell their
(05:42):
leadership that they need to comply with the law. When
did this law? Of course the vote was on November fifth,
or was finalized on November fifth. When did it actually
take effect? Because there was a little bit of a
question over that, but the law is in effect. When
did it take effect? What was the date in January?
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Well, it really took effect in December, because that's what
the law and that's what the constitution and Secretary Galvin's
office has claimed all for all of the years leading
up to this moment in time. But Secretary Galvin did
come out recently when legislative leaders said that they didn't
(06:22):
believe that the law was implemented in December, and that
got pushed forward to January to suit what legislative leaders
believed was the correct time period. So it was in
January that it was officially recognized by the Secretary of
State's office that the law was finally the law, though
(06:42):
late it became law. And now it's been a couple
of months here where we have been waiting and pushing
and we have not been able to get access to folks.
Just basic financial documents is what we're requesting right now
we are able under this law to audit process fees
and procedures. We haven't even been able to get to
(07:03):
a discussion about processes and procedures because we can't get
through the first portion of this audit, which is looking
at basic financials, which is looking at those receipts, those transactions,
and looking at things like state contracts. They refuse to
(07:23):
show us how they're spending your hardened taxpayer dollars, and
that is unacceptable. This is just about transparency. The auditor
in Massachusetts doesn't have any authority to force entities to
do anything. We can't make cuts, we can't get to
the budget. The auditor in Massachusetts is democratically and independently
elected at the ballot through you, the voters. You choose
(07:46):
who your auditor is, and the auditor simply seeks to
shine a light on these dark areas of state government
so that you can see how your tax dollars are
being spent. And for any elected official to be opposing
this to this extent, it is a gross abuse of power.
And my question repeatedly continues to be what are you
(08:08):
hiding to go to these lengths to prevent people from
having access to how their tax dollars are being used.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Yeah, my thought is that that they have circled the
wagons on Beacon Hill. You're a Democrat. I would say
that you're a pretty progressive Democrat, and we agree on
a few issues.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
We just can't we don't we agree on that.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
You know, and I'm being complimentary when I say that,
And you're being stymied, in my opinion, unconstitutionally by the
people who theoretically make laws in Massachusetts. This is a
law that's out of the aheans, it's out of their jurisdiction.
It was an initiative petition passed by the voters. I
think we have made that pretty clear. Have you preceived
(08:56):
any support from other state office holders. I've followed the
story fairly closely. Has the governor stepped in and said
to the legislative leadership, look, this is this, this is
this is inappropriate. This is going to undermine people's faith
in democracy.
Speaker 5 (09:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
No, Unfortunately, we really haven't received any help we did,
you know. See, I'm very thankful there was one. There
was one Democrat, one brave, courageous woman from Plymouth County.
Representative Michelle Badger, Democrat, who struct her guns, and she
she voted for the audit. She was the only Democrat
(09:39):
who did in the House of Representatives. But you know,
most others, unfortunately, all others I should say, who voted
on that issue in my own party voted against it. Now, folks,
I do need to be clear here. The Democratic Party
endorsed this initiative. They endorsed this audit, and so did
(10:05):
the Republican Party. So we had the Republicans and the
Democrats and pretty much all of the you know, working
people out there who just want to know what's going
on and believe in common sense initiatives that are non partisan.
And you know, this is a fairly simple issue to understand.
People went out and they voted for it, you know,
(10:27):
and they voted for it by a very large margin.
As we were just talking about. It's not the Democratic
neighbors and folks that we are talking to out in
our communities that are in opposition to this transparency and
accountability through your state auditor's office. Your state auditor is
(10:48):
a Democrat, you know, And I know that Dan, you
and I sometimes will agree, sometimes we disagree, but we're
always respectful and I appreciate that we need to have
conversations and talk about issue and that's so important. But
what's happening right now is up on Beacon Hill there
just happens to be people who have a D next
(11:08):
to their name and are not acting democratic. They're not
acting conservative or liberal in doing this. They're acting corrupt. Okay,
let's be real about this.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Put a sea. Put a sea after some of their names,
and it's not for conservative or for conscientious. We will
take a very quick break. My guest is the State
Auditor of the Comwalth of Massachusetts, Diana Dezaglio. For those
of you who are not familiar with the state auditor,
it's a very important office, one of the six offices
that are elected statewide in Massachusetts, a so called constitutional office.
(11:42):
Along with the Attorney General, the governor of lieutenant governor,
the Secretary of State, the state auditor UH, and the
state Treasurer and Receiver General. Those are the six offices
that are that are elected statewide. So every person in
Massachusetts who is listening to me, whether you voted for
Diana Desauglio or not, she is your state auditor UH
(12:03):
at this point, at this point in time, she has
served and knows Beacon Hill very well. She was a
legislative aid. She also was elected to the State House
of Representatives uh into the state Senate before she ascended
to the position of state Auditor. When I get back,
I'm going to play a couple of sound bites from
(12:25):
House Speaker Mariano, who was interviewed by John Keller, my
colleague over WBZ Channel four here in Boston, CBS in Boston,
and I want you to react to a couple of
comments that he made, and then we're going to go
to phone calls, and I'm hoping for an outpouring of
listeners who I think they really understand the issue here
(12:48):
on night Side, and I'm going to open the phone
lines up right now six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty and six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Auditor,
the auditored auditored Desauglio is waging a really courageous battle
to make sure that the will of the people as
expressed under ballot Issue one last fall seventy two percent.
(13:12):
That is an overwhelming mandate. She is fighting for it,
and she is dealing with really, now what is an
old boys and an old girls network. So you've got
the battle, but we got a lot of people in
my audience behind you, and you're going to hear from them.
Right after this break. We're coming back on Nice Eye
(13:33):
with auditor to Zaglio.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Now back to Dan Ray Mine from the Window World
night Side Studios on WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
My guest is the State Order of the Carmwealth of Massachusetts,
dian At Dezaglio. She's attempting to audit the legislature. Last weekend,
the House Speaker Ron Mariano appeared with John Keller on
CBS four Boston WBZ Sunday Morning Show, and John Keller
asked him, you know what's going on now? Ron Marianna's
(14:06):
not going to come on this program. I guarantee you
that he come on any ninety once. But this is
what he said when he responded to John Keller's question,
this has cut thirty one A Rob thirty one A.
Speaker 6 (14:22):
Well, it's very inflammatory and it's kind of a nonsensical
response to the activities that happened in the legislative debate.
We have an honest disagreement, an honest difference of opinion.
We think they're constitutional issues involved in the separation of
powers and what she wants to do and what that
(14:44):
ballid question allows her to do, and that's the way
she deals with disagreements. I guess it gets on tweet
whatever it is. I don't know. I don't tweet, but
that's the sure time i've heard that comments.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
He's an up to date guy. In case the speaker's listening,
the proposed law would specify that the state auditor has
the authority to audit the legislature. That seems pretty clear
to me that he kind of goes on the attack here,
but it's a very ineffective comment. This is cut number
(15:26):
thirty two. He essentially is accusing you of politicizing the
imposition of a law approved by seventy two of the
voter's last November. This is hysterical. If he ever loses
his job as Speaker, he could go on the comedy
Circuit's let's listen to cut thirty two. Row.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
Well, the issue that we have is that we don't
want a political lot it. We want to finance a
lot it. And she's turned this into a political lot
for some issues that she's been railing against since she
first to get into the House. So we know it's
it's political. It's so fortunate that people don't read into
(16:12):
this and listens to the things that she says.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I mean, that's that's almost funny. Would you like to refer.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
That's pretty it's pretty insulting, John Not. I mean, I'm
used to it, come on, but it's it's pretty insulting
Dan to the voters of Massachusetts to say, you know
that people don't realize like like seventy two percent, as
though seventy two percent of voters went to the polls
and just had no idea what they were doing, That
(16:43):
they were cognizant enough to fulfill their civic duty and
go vote, but that they couldn't understand the basic language
that said this will grant the state auditor of the
ability to audit. You know, look, I've I've really had
enough gas lighting for the week. I just really have.
(17:05):
You know, I think people forget sometimes when you're in
elected office, you are a human being, and you know,
I have just been looking around this entire week and
just thinking to myself, I mean, the amount of gas lighting,
the amount of scapegoating that has occurred this week, it
is beyond anything I've ever experienced at the State House before.
(17:32):
And that is saying something because I have seen a
lot at the State House over the course up the
last twelve plus year. You know, yeah, it's just been
out of control.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I'm sure that you know that the masthead of the
Washington Post says democracy dies in darkness. I suggest there
was no darker cave in any state house in America
than at the Massachusetts House and Senate.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Here, here's the deal. You know, this
is this is nothing but gaslighting. It's nothing but scapegoating.
We have I continue to use these words, and you know,
I need to be clear about what I mean by this. I,
you know, am fulfilling the will of the voters. You know,
let's talk about when it was political. It was political
(18:24):
when we were campaigning for this, when I campaigned for
a public office and I said, please vote for me,
here's what I want to do. I want to audit
the state legislature and here's what I want to look at.
And when I very transparently told everybody what I wanted
to do, folks are aware. They were aware. Then they
are still aware. I got elected, I started serving as
(18:48):
a state auditor. I then tried to do the audit.
They refused. The Attorney general defended them and said, they
don't need to be audited. She thinks that they shouldn't
have to be audited by the state auditors. Off, she
defended them. And because she defended them and she blocked
my access to court, I had no other choice but
to pursue a ballot initiative. We worked so hard to
(19:09):
get that ballot initiative passed. We were successful. That was political.
That was a campaign. That was a campaign. We told people,
please vote for this ballot question, and we campaigned, and
there were debates, and they were very public debates, and
it was hard to get this passed, but we got
(19:30):
it passed. And now it's the law, the seventy two
percent voter mandated law. And do you know what the
speaker's talking about as being supposedly quote political end quote,
talking about the things that I have been What did
he say railing against? Is that the language that the
(19:52):
speaker used to describe my advocacy? You know, I mean,
please is laying, which is gas lighting, is scapegoating. The
things he's nervous about me viewing that he deems as
being political is literally financial documents and state contracts. We
have been trying to view settlement agreements. Maybe that's what
(20:16):
his concern is. You know, I wonder if the Speaker
has potentially, you know, some of his own issues maybe
with settlement agreements. I think we deserve an answer for that.
Is there an issue with it? Is it his?
Speaker 2 (20:29):
What what you're talking about is what's called non agreements.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
But now the claim is they haven't they haven't used
them in the House of Representatives recently. That's great to hear.
I hope that's true. Then why then, why buck this audit?
Why why prevent us from verifying what you're saying. Wouldn't
you be proud of your record and able to to
(20:54):
stand on your record and show people the documents. Look,
mistakes happen. We go in in to agencies all the time,
and fine mistakes where folks, you know, genuinely come to
us with heart and hand and say, you know, we
need to make improvements. We totally hear you, you know,
to the auditors in our office. And of course there
(21:16):
are mistakes and agencies because humans and not robots work
in these facilities, right, so there are going to be
clerical errors, There are going to be issues. There are
going to be times when the ball was just dropped
and maybe there isn't even an excuse, but it just
wasn't done, and they own it and they move forward
(21:36):
because it wasn't on purpose, it wasn't malicious. It was just,
you know, a failure, and we're humans sometimes we fail
at things, right, That is the normal h you know
sort of happening when we go into different entities. What's
happening here is we have the most powerful politicians in
(21:59):
the state of Massachusetts turning and looking at the voters
of this commonwealth and saying that they refuse to tell
you how they're spending your tax dollars. It is unacceptable,
it is it is beyond anything I've ever seen, Dan,
And you know, I think I think that you know,
(22:21):
where we need to go from here is is only
to court. They are going to keep stalling. They are
going to keep saying that they will not comply. And
that's why I've been repeatedly asking Attorney General Campbell for
for you know, support in this to enforce the law.
She has refused to enforce the law. But speaking of
(22:43):
gas lighting, you know, and scapegoating. Look, I've had great
respect for our Attorney General on a host of other issues.
We've done work together on a host of other issues.
The reality is is that on this particular issue and
a couple of others this last week, you know my
office is being blamed for the inaction of other agencies. Unacceptable,
(23:06):
and I believe it's tied to this pressure.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Diana, I gotta pause because we're way past our newspakeer.
You want to go to news and are going right
to calls. I think you have made the case overwhelmingly,
just as the vote was overwhelming. I invite either Senate
President Spilka, the designees, or Speaker Mariano to join us
some night for a conversation. I don't think that's going
(23:31):
to be accepted, but I assume you would be more
than happy to appear with either or both of them
here on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
It's Night Side with Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Que Are back with the State Order of the comm
Oth of Massachusetts. Diane. I ended that last hour and
we got a little a little bit of an audio question.
I'm assuming I've not asked you this before, but I'm
assuming that if Speaker Mariano or the Senate President Karen
Spilko would come on the program with you, we could
have a three or four way conversation. I can't believe
(24:06):
that that that you would pass that pass up.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
That oportunity here is that I'll say I made this
offer at the budget hearing today that some tried to
turn into a kangaroo court about the uh, the audit law.
But uh, you know, we got background track. We did
do a budget here today, thankfully for at least a
portion of it. And I will say that I made
(24:30):
the offer today. You know, look, any legislator that wants
to work with our office, we welcome and encourage those conversations.
It is really really disappointing and sad that neither the Speaker,
nor the Senate President you know, nor their you know,
loyalists essentially be any value in working together with the
(24:53):
Auditor's office on really anything, because they are so dead
set in maintaining their power and their control over the membership,
over how they use your tax dollars, over the policies
that they examine or don't examine. This is about control,
This is about power. But I remain willing if they
(25:16):
want to have a sit down. You know, we're probably
not going to agree on a lot regarding this topic,
but we should have a sit down, and we should
work through these things.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
I work.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
You know, it doesn't appear what it's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
We will make the night side program available to them. Uh, Diana,
we got a bunch of phone calls. I got to
get to everybody here. I'm going to ask every to
bee as quick as they can. They can ask a question,
voice their support, but I'm going to ask everybody to
move as quickly as possible. I think everyone understands the
issue one way or the other. Justin is in Malborough.
(25:50):
Justin you were first tonight with the Massachusetts Auditor Diane Desaugli.
Go right ahead, Justin Curve.
Speaker 7 (25:56):
Thank you particularly call you and for keeping my strong
belief that the state ordered is the nicest person in
the Massachusetts government. I really liked Joe Denucci and you're
a wonderful fighter too. And I wanted to give you
(26:16):
one suggestion. You know a wonderful piano player and singer.
I really like when you did when people got sworn in,
you played, you played a song for them. Yeah, I
wanted to tell you if you ever have the time
you talked about being a person, I recommend you going
(26:37):
to piano teachers. They often have a recital for the kids.
If you ever went to one of them and played
and sung when the children and the parents would see
you as like, Wow, she's really a people person and
she's more than just a wonderful number cluncher.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
All right, well that's well. You gotta you gotta know
your numbers. You gotta know the keys to play the title.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Thank thank you. That was an incredibly kind call. Thank
you so much for the encouragement. I I love music,
it is my passion. Contrary to popular opinion, when I
was in the fourth grade, Dan, I did not dream
about becoming an auditor. I know everybody's shocked at that.
(27:22):
I actually put down that I wanted to be a
singer when I was in the fourth grade. And uh,
you know, sometimes I get to live out that dream
as a hobby of mine right now after hours. Sometimes
when I go to events, I get to sing out
the events. But thank you, justin that that's very lovely
and kind of you, and I appreciate the encouragement.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Justin, Thank you very much. I got I got my
phone lines packed, so I'm going to move as quickly
as I can. Thank you, justin, great calls, A great night.
Let me go next to Sandra in Boston. Sandra, you
were on with the state auditor Diana de Zauglio.
Speaker 8 (27:54):
Go right ahead, Sandra, Hi Mistaglio. I did vote for
your audit, and I hope you go looking for some
of the really big problems. Our largest employer in Massachusetts,
which I believe is MGH Brighams. It seems like something's
(28:16):
going on there. And yesterday and hearing down in Washington,
I heard the mayor of Boston say that illegal aliens
were not showing up to their doctor's appointments, and I'm wondering, Wow,
they have doctors, lucky them, because apparently there's the primary
care physician shortage and people are moving around quite a bit.
(28:37):
So does this fall under.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Your Bailey week? Yeah, great question. So what you just
mentioned does not fall under the office i've state auditor.
But I do want to say I really really appreciate
your advocacy for this ballot question and your vote for
this balot question, because here's what we can look at
(28:59):
through this audit. We can look at how your state
tax dollars are spent in our state legislature by these
politicians who are saying, essentially that they don't believe that
you have a right to know how those tax dollars
are being spent, and we can also look at processes
and procedures to try to help make sure that our
(29:21):
elected body, namely the House of Representatives and the Senate,
are able to be at their best in service to
you the taxpayer when they do vote on issues that
may impact some of the concerns that you were discussing.
So I hope that's helpful. I want to thank you
for your support and thanks so much for calling in tonight.
Speaker 8 (29:44):
Well, I think the mayor seems to say that she
didn't have the statistics of how many illegal aliens were
using our services.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
Yeah, she said that there was nothing on that. But
again this is the state auditor or not the not
the City of.
Speaker 8 (29:57):
Austor, but Mass General them. It both gets benefits from
both the state and the city.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
We do we do audit I think it's important to say, Dan,
just as you know a response here, we do audit
Mass Health and we do audit public benefit programs, and
we also make sure that there's not waste, fraud and
abuse in any of those healthcare services from anyone who
(30:26):
is not supposed to be collecting those benefits. We have
a Bureau of Special Investigations actually that does look into
healthcare related matters. So if people are not living in
the state of Massachusetts, and they are living outside of
the state of Massachusetts, or if they are not entitled
to receive benefits, they do not, you know, go unnoticed
(30:46):
and undetected. We've identified and uncovered millions and millions and
millions in fraud and reported that back to our agency
so that they can go and recover those moneies and
folks who are committing the fraud can be held accountable
when it comes to these healthcare services. So yes, thank
(31:07):
you so much. I appreciate you asking the question, Sandrew.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Thank you much. I got to keep rolling here, talk
to you soon. Okay, let's keep rolling. We'll give get
more phone calls right after this break. I'll get everybody
in Dennis and Lowell, Paul and North Edinborough, Paul and Needham, Stephen,
North Edinborough, or rather in Attimborough. We'll get you all in.
I promise, tight questions, tight comments. Hope you support it,
but whatever your point of view is always welcome. Coming
(31:32):
back on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
night Side Studios on WBZ NewsRadio.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
My guess is the Massachusetts State Auditor, Diana Dezaglio. Voters
last fall, in a initiative petition by a vote of
seventy two percent, instructed the commonwealth and approved this proposed
law to specify the state Auditor as the authority to
audit the legislature. Lature is basically ducking at every turn.
(32:04):
I hope you support the auditor, and I hope you
call your state rep and let them know that it
is time to open up the books. Let's go next
to Paul and Need and Paul were getting tight on time.
But it gets you, gonna get you interest.
Speaker 9 (32:18):
Me auditor, auditor on these non disclosure agreement payments, What
account or accounts is this money taken from UH to
pay these people off to keep them quiet? What account
or accounts is the money coming from an Alison off
the ear?
Speaker 6 (32:36):
Thank you?
Speaker 3 (32:37):
Okay, thanks, yes, thank you so much. Great question, that's.
Speaker 2 (32:41):
What you'd like to find out, But go ahead.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
Yeah, So there there's a settlement and judgment fund in
the Commonwealth that can help to address these these settlement agreements,
whether they have non disclosure language or not. The issue
is that there has been very lax oversight through the
course of the last several years, probably even longer. We
did a report recently that you know, focused on about
(33:07):
forty forty ish million dollars worth of settlement agreements, with
a significant chunk of that including non disclosure language, confidentiality language.
And you know, these are tax dollars. We want to
make sure that people aren't being silenced about potential abuse
in state government, things like harassment, you know, any sort
(33:30):
of issues that could be occurring, potential corruption. Their tax dollars.
They shouldn't be used to pay for covering up and
hiding illegal or unethical behaviors. But the thing is PAB
is that they can also be used in state agencies
that can be paid and they can be paid for
out of those state agencies with little or no oversight
(33:54):
at all, where we don't even know that they have
been given out because they are not being filed correctly
with the Comptroller's office. Now, the legislature, as we've been
talking about, exempts itself from quite a lot, and you know,
they're not reporting these things publicly to where we can
see what's going on like others are required to by law,
(34:20):
So we can't see where they're taking the money from
and how they are funding these agreements. Now, again I've
said this many many times. Settlement agreements are very common
in the private sector and in the public sector to
make sure that disagreements between employers and employees are able
(34:40):
to be settled outside of a costly court battle. And
a lot of folks do engage in those settlement agreements willingly,
and it's a way forward for folks to move on
from their employment and to allow for that separation to
occur again and without costly litigation. The issue comes is
(35:03):
where the issue comes is where there isn't any accountability,
there's no oversight, and they can be abused and you
can see, you know, hundreds of thousands or even millions
of our tax dollars being spent without really understanding why
those tax dollars got spent that way. And when they
include the non disclosure agreement, that's where you know, the
(35:26):
real challenges exist, where you know, we just don't know
why the tax dollars were even spent and what they
could be hiding. So it is concerning. We do know
that the House of Representatives gave out at least thirty
three non disclosure agreements in recent years, but we don't
know what they were for entirely. We don't know, you know,
(35:48):
how much money was spent on them, and what level
of oversight was provided, or you know, how it was paid,
how they were paid for. So those are the types
of questions that vote deserve answers to, and those are
the types of questions that other state agencies and departments
had to answer. We did just audit the Governor's office.
(36:09):
We audited you know, lots of state agencies across the
board in our comprehensive review of these agreements, and we
produced a report. Yet the legislature holds themselves above the
law and they say they don't have to participate in
the same type of audit that all these other entities
just participated in regarding those NDAs, those non disclosure agreements.
(36:31):
So again they're breaking the law and needs to change.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
I want to get one more call in. People have
been very patient. Unfortunately I got to get to everyone
to go to Steven Attleborough. Steve, you got about a
minute with the state audit or what can you do
with it?
Speaker 4 (36:44):
Diane Dan thanks for taking my call. Diane, you are
on top of your game. The question I have to
ask you, does the MBTA fall under your purview?
Speaker 3 (36:54):
It does, And we actually just released another audit report
this week on the keys contract. Check it out. It's
up on my website mass dot gov forward slash auditor.
Speaker 4 (37:06):
I will and the question I have as really quickly
is you know, I noticed that they're asking on their
job application site they're looking for another DEI director. Now,
if I'm not mistaken, DEI is now companies or federal
companies that push or promote or sell DEI is now
(37:30):
kind of sort of not a good thing to do.
And yet the MBTA is asking if you go onto
their job site.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Yeah, you know what, you vote, But Steve, you've opened
up a can of worms with thirty seconds left. It's
really not fair, uh, to go there with this. It
takes a little way from the focus of the hours.
So you and I can discuss this. I would suggest
maybe we'll get someone from the MTA on here, the MBTA,
because I don't know that's within the purview of Dianda Zauglia.
Speaker 4 (37:59):
Okay, Well, if the NBCA got six million dollars in
federal funding, there's some of that money going to I understand.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
I'm not going to debate you're here, but the next
time you call, we can we can debate it. Okay,
thank you.
Speaker 3 (38:13):
Very much, thank you, thanks so much for calling in. Thanks,
thanks Canon. That's the last call here. I want to
make sure I thank everybody for calling in today.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
Absolutely and unfortunately we went able to get the Dennis
and Lowell of Paul and Elbroo. I apologize, Dennis and Loll.
Speaker 3 (38:28):
I know Dennis and Loll Dennis, Hi.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I okay, please, I'm Diana, Madame monitor. Keep up the fight.
My audience is behind you and uh and it's so
important you. You are a genuine profile encouraging and there
should be an award from the Kennedy Library at a minimum.
Thank you so much tonight for being here tonight, my friend.
Speaker 3 (38:51):
Okay, and thanks so much, Thanks so much for having
me on. Thanks so much, everybody, Keep up the good fight.
Call the Attorney General ask her to enforce the law.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Yeah, call you state repsent state senators as well. Auditor Diane.
This is ugly Thanks Diana. We'll talk soon.
Speaker 3 (39:06):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
Good night. When we get back, we're going to talk
about village and has it overreached a little bit I
think that I think it has We'll be back on
Night SAT after this
It's Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm w b Z
Coustin's new video.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
I'm delighted to be joined by my favorite, one of
my very favorite politicians. Here are elected officials here in Massachusetts,
Massachusetts State Uditor Diana Desauglio, who was in a battle
with the leadership of the Greater General Court about whether
(00:28):
or not Diana Doglio, in her capacity as the Massachusetts
State Auditor, will be allowed to aunit the edge of
the state legislature. Madam Auditor or Diana, how are you tonight?
Speaker 3 (00:41):
I am doing fantastic. It is great to be back
with you, Dan, Thanks so much for the invitation. I
always love coming on.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Oh my pleasure, my pleasure. As they say, I think
that you're one of the most courageous leaders here in Massachusetts,
and I am stunned that the legislative leadership so truculent.
And maybe some in our audience don't remember the genesis
of this confrontation. But let me refresh the their recollection
(01:11):
by asking you a question. Was there a question one
on the Massachusetts ballot last fall dealing with this issue?
Speaker 3 (01:21):
Yes, yes, I'd like to read.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
That to you. It's fairly straightforward and I want people
to understand that the voters of Massachusetts were presented with
a proposed law by initiative petition. The proposed law i'm
quoting now would specify that the state auditor that would
be you, has the authority to audit the legislature that
(01:46):
would be the State House and State Senate up in Massachusetts.
How did that election work out, Madam auditor? What was
the percentage of voters?
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Thanks for asking?
Speaker 4 (02:02):
You know it is.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
It has been quite the quite the last a few years,
a few months, few weeks, few days, a lots happening
up on Beacon Hell, lots of drama and unfortunately little
action on this particular issue on you know that the
(02:26):
voters voted for him.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
I've got a couple of other questions here, okay, and
I know that you have the answers. Okay. President Trump
has been using the word mandate quite a bit based
upon his election in November. Yeah, and he received I believe,
just a little over fifty percent of the vote. He
(02:50):
did win the popular vote and the electoral vote and
the seven you know, so called battleground states. Now, if
at fifty plus percent, that's a mandate. How would you
characterize the vote by the voters of Massachusetts to authorize
(03:10):
you to compel to audit the state legislature. What word
would you use? I certainly think that mandate would be one,
But could we add the adjective overwhelming mandate?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
I would say overwhelming is absolutely the right word.
Speaker 4 (03:30):
Dan.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
You know, we got overwhelming support to get us on
the ballot in the first place. It you know, got
over one hundred thousand signatures, and we worked so hard
to put this on the ballot. Friends, many of you
signed out at your grocery stores. We finally got it
on the ballot. We didn't have the amount of resources
that other ballot questions had. And when we did get
it on the ballot, you came out and you spoke
(03:53):
loud and clear. And that was due to this being
a non partisan issue for people from all political stripes
just said to their state government that they want transparency
and they want accountability. You know, here in Massachusetts, from
as forward thinking as we are, we continue to have
one of the least transparent, if not the least transparent,
(04:15):
according to most good government groups, state legislature and the
entire nation not subject of public records, not subjects to
open meeting laws are any of these you know, transparency
laws that are actually mandated for other entities in this Commonwealth,
such as your cities and towns, who have to follow
these public records laws and open meeting laws. The legislature
(04:36):
exempts itself from so much regarding these matters of transparency
and accountability, and now it's seeking to exempt itself from
a law that was just passed by you, the voters.
You made this law when you went to go vote
in November. Some folks have asked, well, do they have
to approve it in the legislature. No, you went to
(04:57):
go vote on this. It is buying. It is the law,
and they are breaking it right now, willingly and willfully
and defiantly and arrogantly in the face of not just
one party, but in the face of you know, Democrats, Republicans,
(05:17):
unrolled and everyone in between. It is absolutely unacceptable.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Okay, And I just again, I'm trying to do this
as clearly as possible because I want to make sure
that my audience gets activated here and perhaps will encourage
their state legislators. The one hundred and sixty members of
the House of Representative and the forty members of the
State Senate to do the right thing and tell their
(05:42):
leadership that they need to comply with the law. When
did this law? Of course the vote was on November fifth,
or was finalized on November fifth. When did it actually
take effect? Because there was a little bit of a
question over that, but the law is in effect. When
did it take effect? What was the date in January?
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Well, it really took effect in December, because that's what
the law and that's what the constitution and Secretary Galvin's
office has claimed all for all of the years leading
up to this moment in time. But Secretary Galvin did
come out recently when legislative leaders said that they didn't
(06:22):
believe that the law was implemented in December, and that
got pushed forward to January to suit what legislative leaders
believed was the correct time period. So it was in
January that it was officially recognized by the Secretary of
State's office that the law was finally the law, though
(06:42):
late it became law. And now it's been a couple
of months here where we have been waiting and pushing
and we have not been able to get access to folks.
Just basic financial documents is what we're requesting right now
we are able under this law to audit process fees
and procedures. We haven't even been able to get to
(07:03):
a discussion about processes and procedures because we can't get
through the first portion of this audit, which is looking
at basic financials, which is looking at those receipts, those transactions,
and looking at things like state contracts. They refuse to
(07:23):
show us how they're spending your hardened taxpayer dollars, and
that is unacceptable. This is just about transparency. The auditor
in Massachusetts doesn't have any authority to force entities to
do anything. We can't make cuts, we can't get to
the budget. The auditor in Massachusetts is democratically and independently
elected at the ballot through you, the voters. You choose
(07:46):
who your auditor is, and the auditor simply seeks to
shine a light on these dark areas of state government
so that you can see how your tax dollars are
being spent. And for any elected official to be opposing
this to this extent, it is a gross abuse of power.
And my question repeatedly continues to be what are you
(08:08):
hiding to go to these lengths to prevent people from
having access to how their tax dollars are being used.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Yeah, my thought is that that they have circled the
wagons on Beacon Hill. You're a Democrat. I would say
that you're a pretty progressive Democrat, and we agree on
a few issues.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
We just can't we don't we agree on that.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
You know, and I'm being complimentary when I say that,
And you're being stymied, in my opinion, unconstitutionally by the
people who theoretically make laws in Massachusetts. This is a
law that's out of the aheans, it's out of their jurisdiction.
It was an initiative petition passed by the voters. I
think we have made that pretty clear. Have you preceived
(08:56):
any support from other state office holders. I've followed the
story fairly closely. Has the governor stepped in and said
to the legislative leadership, look, this is this, this is
this is inappropriate. This is going to undermine people's faith
in democracy.
Speaker 5 (09:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
No, Unfortunately, we really haven't received any help we did,
you know. See, I'm very thankful there was one. There
was one Democrat, one brave, courageous woman from Plymouth County.
Representative Michelle Badger, Democrat, who struct her guns, and she
she voted for the audit. She was the only Democrat
(09:39):
who did in the House of Representatives. But you know,
most others, unfortunately, all others I should say, who voted
on that issue in my own party voted against it. Now, folks,
I do need to be clear here. The Democratic Party
endorsed this initiative. They endorsed this audit, and so did
(10:05):
the Republican Party. So we had the Republicans and the
Democrats and pretty much all of the you know, working
people out there who just want to know what's going
on and believe in common sense initiatives that are non partisan.
And you know, this is a fairly simple issue to understand.
People went out and they voted for it, you know,
(10:27):
and they voted for it by a very large margin.
As we were just talking about. It's not the Democratic
neighbors and folks that we are talking to out in
our communities that are in opposition to this transparency and
accountability through your state auditor's office. Your state auditor is
(10:48):
a Democrat, you know, And I know that Dan, you
and I sometimes will agree, sometimes we disagree, but we're
always respectful and I appreciate that we need to have
conversations and talk about issue and that's so important. But
what's happening right now is up on Beacon Hill there
just happens to be people who have a D next
(11:08):
to their name and are not acting democratic. They're not
acting conservative or liberal in doing this. They're acting corrupt. Okay,
let's be real about this.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Put a sea. Put a sea after some of their names,
and it's not for conservative or for conscientious. We will
take a very quick break. My guest is the State
Auditor of the Comwalth of Massachusetts, Diana Dezaglio. For those
of you who are not familiar with the state auditor,
it's a very important office, one of the six offices
that are elected statewide in Massachusetts, a so called constitutional office.
(11:42):
Along with the Attorney General, the governor of lieutenant governor,
the Secretary of State, the state auditor UH, and the
state Treasurer and Receiver General. Those are the six offices
that are that are elected statewide. So every person in
Massachusetts who is listening to me, whether you voted for
Diana Desauglio or not, she is your state auditor UH
(12:03):
at this point, at this point in time, she has
served and knows Beacon Hill very well. She was a
legislative aid. She also was elected to the State House
of Representatives uh into the state Senate before she ascended
to the position of state Auditor. When I get back,
I'm going to play a couple of sound bites from
(12:25):
House Speaker Mariano, who was interviewed by John Keller, my
colleague over WBZ Channel four here in Boston, CBS in Boston,
and I want you to react to a couple of
comments that he made, and then we're going to go
to phone calls, and I'm hoping for an outpouring of
listeners who I think they really understand the issue here
(12:48):
on night Side, and I'm going to open the phone
lines up right now six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty and six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Auditor,
the auditored auditored Desauglio is waging a really courageous battle
to make sure that the will of the people as
expressed under ballot Issue one last fall seventy two percent.
(13:12):
That is an overwhelming mandate. She is fighting for it,
and she is dealing with really, now what is an
old boys and an old girls network. So you've got
the battle, but we got a lot of people in
my audience behind you, and you're going to hear from them.
Right after this break. We're coming back on Nice Eye
(13:33):
with auditor to Zaglio.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Now back to Dan Ray Mine from the Window World
night Side Studios on WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
My guest is the State Order of the Carmwealth of Massachusetts,
dian At Dezaglio. She's attempting to audit the legislature. Last weekend,
the House Speaker Ron Mariano appeared with John Keller on
CBS four Boston WBZ Sunday Morning Show, and John Keller
asked him, you know what's going on now? Ron Marianna's
(14:06):
not going to come on this program. I guarantee you
that he come on any ninety once. But this is
what he said when he responded to John Keller's question,
this has cut thirty one A Rob thirty one A.
Speaker 6 (14:22):
Well, it's very inflammatory and it's kind of a nonsensical
response to the activities that happened in the legislative debate.
We have an honest disagreement, an honest difference of opinion.
We think they're constitutional issues involved in the separation of
powers and what she wants to do and what that
(14:44):
ballid question allows her to do, and that's the way
she deals with disagreements. I guess it gets on tweet
whatever it is. I don't know. I don't tweet, but
that's the sure time i've heard that comments.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
He's an up to date guy. In case the speaker's listening,
the proposed law would specify that the state auditor has
the authority to audit the legislature. That seems pretty clear
to me that he kind of goes on the attack here,
but it's a very ineffective comment. This is cut number
(15:26):
thirty two. He essentially is accusing you of politicizing the
imposition of a law approved by seventy two of the
voter's last November. This is hysterical. If he ever loses
his job as Speaker, he could go on the comedy
Circuit's let's listen to cut thirty two. Row.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
Well, the issue that we have is that we don't
want a political lot it. We want to finance a
lot it. And she's turned this into a political lot
for some issues that she's been railing against since she
first to get into the House. So we know it's
it's political. It's so fortunate that people don't read into
(16:12):
this and listens to the things that she says.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I mean, that's that's almost funny. Would you like to refer.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
That's pretty it's pretty insulting, John Not. I mean, I'm
used to it, come on, but it's it's pretty insulting
Dan to the voters of Massachusetts to say, you know
that people don't realize like like seventy two percent, as
though seventy two percent of voters went to the polls
and just had no idea what they were doing, That
(16:43):
they were cognizant enough to fulfill their civic duty and
go vote, but that they couldn't understand the basic language
that said this will grant the state auditor of the
ability to audit. You know, look, I've I've really had
enough gas lighting for the week. I just really have.
(17:05):
You know, I think people forget sometimes when you're in
elected office, you are a human being, and you know,
I have just been looking around this entire week and
just thinking to myself, I mean, the amount of gas lighting,
the amount of scapegoating that has occurred this week, it
is beyond anything I've ever experienced at the State House before.
(17:32):
And that is saying something because I have seen a
lot at the State House over the course up the
last twelve plus year. You know, yeah, it's just been
out of control.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I'm sure that you know that the masthead of the
Washington Post says democracy dies in darkness. I suggest there
was no darker cave in any state house in America
than at the Massachusetts House and Senate.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Here, here's the deal. You know, this
is this is nothing but gaslighting. It's nothing but scapegoating.
We have I continue to use these words, and you know,
I need to be clear about what I mean by this. I,
you know, am fulfilling the will of the voters. You know,
let's talk about when it was political. It was political
(18:24):
when we were campaigning for this, when I campaigned for
a public office and I said, please vote for me,
here's what I want to do. I want to audit
the state legislature and here's what I want to look at.
And when I very transparently told everybody what I wanted
to do, folks are aware. They were aware. Then they
are still aware. I got elected, I started serving as
(18:48):
a state auditor. I then tried to do the audit.
They refused. The Attorney general defended them and said, they
don't need to be audited. She thinks that they shouldn't
have to be audited by the state auditors. Off, she
defended them. And because she defended them and she blocked
my access to court, I had no other choice but
to pursue a ballot initiative. We worked so hard to
(19:09):
get that ballot initiative passed. We were successful. That was political.
That was a campaign. That was a campaign. We told people,
please vote for this ballot question, and we campaigned, and
there were debates, and they were very public debates, and
it was hard to get this passed, but we got
(19:30):
it passed. And now it's the law, the seventy two
percent voter mandated law. And do you know what the
speaker's talking about as being supposedly quote political end quote,
talking about the things that I have been What did
he say railing against? Is that the language that the
(19:52):
speaker used to describe my advocacy? You know, I mean,
please is laying, which is gas lighting, is scapegoating. The
things he's nervous about me viewing that he deems as
being political is literally financial documents and state contracts. We
have been trying to view settlement agreements. Maybe that's what
(20:16):
his concern is. You know, I wonder if the Speaker
has potentially, you know, some of his own issues maybe
with settlement agreements. I think we deserve an answer for that.
Is there an issue with it? Is it his?
Speaker 2 (20:29):
What what you're talking about is what's called non agreements.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
But now the claim is they haven't they haven't used
them in the House of Representatives recently. That's great to hear.
I hope that's true. Then why then, why buck this audit?
Why why prevent us from verifying what you're saying. Wouldn't
you be proud of your record and able to to
(20:54):
stand on your record and show people the documents. Look,
mistakes happen. We go in in to agencies all the time,
and fine mistakes where folks, you know, genuinely come to
us with heart and hand and say, you know, we
need to make improvements. We totally hear you, you know,
to the auditors in our office. And of course there
(21:16):
are mistakes and agencies because humans and not robots work
in these facilities, right, so there are going to be
clerical errors, There are going to be issues. There are
going to be times when the ball was just dropped
and maybe there isn't even an excuse, but it just
wasn't done, and they own it and they move forward
(21:36):
because it wasn't on purpose, it wasn't malicious. It was just,
you know, a failure, and we're humans sometimes we fail
at things, right, That is the normal h you know
sort of happening when we go into different entities. What's
happening here is we have the most powerful politicians in
(21:59):
the state of Massachusetts turning and looking at the voters
of this commonwealth and saying that they refuse to tell
you how they're spending your tax dollars. It is unacceptable,
it is it is beyond anything I've ever seen, Dan,
And you know, I think I think that you know,
(22:21):
where we need to go from here is is only
to court. They are going to keep stalling. They are
going to keep saying that they will not comply. And
that's why I've been repeatedly asking Attorney General Campbell for
for you know, support in this to enforce the law.
She has refused to enforce the law. But speaking of
(22:43):
gas lighting, you know, and scapegoating. Look, I've had great
respect for our Attorney General on a host of other issues.
We've done work together on a host of other issues.
The reality is is that on this particular issue and
a couple of others this last week, you know my
office is being blamed for the inaction of other agencies. Unacceptable,
(23:06):
and I believe it's tied to this pressure.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Diana, I gotta pause because we're way past our newspakeer.
You want to go to news and are going right
to calls. I think you have made the case overwhelmingly,
just as the vote was overwhelming. I invite either Senate
President Spilka, the designees, or Speaker Mariano to join us
some night for a conversation. I don't think that's going
(23:31):
to be accepted, but I assume you would be more
than happy to appear with either or both of them
here on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
It's Night Side with Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Que Are back with the State Order of the comm
Oth of Massachusetts. Diane. I ended that last hour and
we got a little a little bit of an audio question.
I'm assuming I've not asked you this before, but I'm
assuming that if Speaker Mariano or the Senate President Karen
Spilko would come on the program with you, we could
have a three or four way conversation. I can't believe
(24:06):
that that that you would pass that pass up.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
That oportunity here is that I'll say I made this
offer at the budget hearing today that some tried to
turn into a kangaroo court about the uh, the audit law.
But uh, you know, we got background track. We did
do a budget here today, thankfully for at least a
portion of it. And I will say that I made
(24:30):
the offer today. You know, look, any legislator that wants
to work with our office, we welcome and encourage those conversations.
It is really really disappointing and sad that neither the Speaker,
nor the Senate President you know, nor their you know,
loyalists essentially be any value in working together with the
(24:53):
Auditor's office on really anything, because they are so dead
set in maintaining their power and their control over the membership,
over how they use your tax dollars, over the policies
that they examine or don't examine. This is about control,
This is about power. But I remain willing if they
(25:16):
want to have a sit down. You know, we're probably
not going to agree on a lot regarding this topic,
but we should have a sit down, and we should
work through these things.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
I work.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
You know, it doesn't appear what it's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
We will make the night side program available to them. Uh, Diana,
we got a bunch of phone calls. I got to
get to everybody here. I'm going to ask every to
bee as quick as they can. They can ask a question,
voice their support, but I'm going to ask everybody to
move as quickly as possible. I think everyone understands the
issue one way or the other. Justin is in Malborough.
(25:50):
Justin you were first tonight with the Massachusetts Auditor Diane Desaugli.
Go right ahead, Justin Curve.
Speaker 7 (25:56):
Thank you particularly call you and for keeping my strong
belief that the state ordered is the nicest person in
the Massachusetts government. I really liked Joe Denucci and you're
a wonderful fighter too. And I wanted to give you
(26:16):
one suggestion. You know a wonderful piano player and singer.
I really like when you did when people got sworn in,
you played, you played a song for them. Yeah, I
wanted to tell you if you ever have the time
you talked about being a person, I recommend you going
(26:37):
to piano teachers. They often have a recital for the kids.
If you ever went to one of them and played
and sung when the children and the parents would see
you as like, Wow, she's really a people person and
she's more than just a wonderful number cluncher.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
All right, well that's well. You gotta you gotta know
your numbers. You gotta know the keys to play the title.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Thank thank you. That was an incredibly kind call. Thank
you so much for the encouragement. I I love music,
it is my passion. Contrary to popular opinion, when I
was in the fourth grade, Dan, I did not dream
about becoming an auditor. I know everybody's shocked at that.
(27:22):
I actually put down that I wanted to be a
singer when I was in the fourth grade. And uh,
you know, sometimes I get to live out that dream
as a hobby of mine right now after hours. Sometimes
when I go to events, I get to sing out
the events. But thank you, justin that that's very lovely
and kind of you, and I appreciate the encouragement.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Justin, Thank you very much. I got I got my
phone lines packed, so I'm going to move as quickly
as I can. Thank you, justin, great calls, A great night.
Let me go next to Sandra in Boston. Sandra, you
were on with the state auditor Diana de Zauglio.
Speaker 8 (27:54):
Go right ahead, Sandra, Hi Mistaglio. I did vote for
your audit, and I hope you go looking for some
of the really big problems. Our largest employer in Massachusetts,
which I believe is MGH Brighams. It seems like something's
(28:16):
going on there. And yesterday and hearing down in Washington,
I heard the mayor of Boston say that illegal aliens
were not showing up to their doctor's appointments, and I'm wondering, Wow,
they have doctors, lucky them, because apparently there's the primary
care physician shortage and people are moving around quite a bit.
(28:37):
So does this fall under.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Your Bailey week? Yeah, great question. So what you just
mentioned does not fall under the office i've state auditor.
But I do want to say I really really appreciate
your advocacy for this ballot question and your vote for
this balot question, because here's what we can look at
(28:59):
through this audit. We can look at how your state
tax dollars are spent in our state legislature by these
politicians who are saying, essentially that they don't believe that
you have a right to know how those tax dollars
are being spent, and we can also look at processes
and procedures to try to help make sure that our
(29:21):
elected body, namely the House of Representatives and the Senate,
are able to be at their best in service to
you the taxpayer when they do vote on issues that
may impact some of the concerns that you were discussing.
So I hope that's helpful. I want to thank you
for your support and thanks so much for calling in tonight.
Speaker 8 (29:44):
Well, I think the mayor seems to say that she
didn't have the statistics of how many illegal aliens were
using our services.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
Yeah, she said that there was nothing on that. But
again this is the state auditor or not the not
the City of.
Speaker 8 (29:57):
Austor, but Mass General them. It both gets benefits from
both the state and the city.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
We do we do audit I think it's important to say, Dan,
just as you know a response here, we do audit
Mass Health and we do audit public benefit programs, and
we also make sure that there's not waste, fraud and
abuse in any of those healthcare services from anyone who
(30:26):
is not supposed to be collecting those benefits. We have
a Bureau of Special Investigations actually that does look into
healthcare related matters. So if people are not living in
the state of Massachusetts, and they are living outside of
the state of Massachusetts, or if they are not entitled
to receive benefits, they do not, you know, go unnoticed
(30:46):
and undetected. We've identified and uncovered millions and millions and
millions in fraud and reported that back to our agency
so that they can go and recover those moneies and
folks who are committing the fraud can be held accountable
when it comes to these healthcare services. So yes, thank
(31:07):
you so much. I appreciate you asking the question, Sandrew.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
Thank you much. I got to keep rolling here, talk
to you soon. Okay, let's keep rolling. We'll give get
more phone calls right after this break. I'll get everybody
in Dennis and Lowell, Paul and North Edinborough, Paul and Needham, Stephen,
North Edinborough, or rather in Attimborough. We'll get you all in.
I promise, tight questions, tight comments. Hope you support it,
but whatever your point of view is always welcome. Coming
(31:32):
back on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
night Side Studios on WBZ NewsRadio.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
My guess is the Massachusetts State Auditor, Diana Dezaglio. Voters
last fall, in a initiative petition by a vote of
seventy two percent, instructed the commonwealth and approved this proposed
law to specify the state Auditor as the authority to
audit the legislature. Lature is basically ducking at every turn.
(32:04):
I hope you support the auditor, and I hope you
call your state rep and let them know that it
is time to open up the books. Let's go next
to Paul and Need and Paul were getting tight on time.
But it gets you, gonna get you interest.
Speaker 9 (32:18):
Me auditor, auditor on these non disclosure agreement payments, What
account or accounts is this money taken from UH to
pay these people off to keep them quiet? What account
or accounts is the money coming from an Alison off
the ear?
Speaker 6 (32:36):
Thank you?
Speaker 3 (32:37):
Okay, thanks, yes, thank you so much. Great question, that's.
Speaker 2 (32:41):
What you'd like to find out, But go ahead.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
Yeah, So there there's a settlement and judgment fund in
the Commonwealth that can help to address these these settlement agreements,
whether they have non disclosure language or not. The issue
is that there has been very lax oversight through the
course of the last several years, probably even longer. We
did a report recently that you know, focused on about
(33:07):
forty forty ish million dollars worth of settlement agreements, with
a significant chunk of that including non disclosure language, confidentiality language.
And you know, these are tax dollars. We want to
make sure that people aren't being silenced about potential abuse
in state government, things like harassment, you know, any sort
(33:30):
of issues that could be occurring, potential corruption. Their tax dollars.
They shouldn't be used to pay for covering up and
hiding illegal or unethical behaviors. But the thing is PAB
is that they can also be used in state agencies
that can be paid and they can be paid for
out of those state agencies with little or no oversight
(33:54):
at all, where we don't even know that they have
been given out because they are not being filed correctly
with the Comptroller's office. Now, the legislature, as we've been
talking about, exempts itself from quite a lot, and you know,
they're not reporting these things publicly to where we can
see what's going on like others are required to by law,
(34:20):
So we can't see where they're taking the money from
and how they are funding these agreements. Now, again I've
said this many many times. Settlement agreements are very common
in the private sector and in the public sector to
make sure that disagreements between employers and employees are able
(34:40):
to be settled outside of a costly court battle. And
a lot of folks do engage in those settlement agreements willingly,
and it's a way forward for folks to move on
from their employment and to allow for that separation to
occur again and without costly litigation. The issue comes is
(35:03):
where the issue comes is where there isn't any accountability,
there's no oversight, and they can be abused and you
can see, you know, hundreds of thousands or even millions
of our tax dollars being spent without really understanding why
those tax dollars got spent that way. And when they
include the non disclosure agreement, that's where you know, the
(35:26):
real challenges exist, where you know, we just don't know
why the tax dollars were even spent and what they
could be hiding. So it is concerning. We do know
that the House of Representatives gave out at least thirty
three non disclosure agreements in recent years, but we don't
know what they were for entirely. We don't know, you know,
(35:48):
how much money was spent on them, and what level
of oversight was provided, or you know, how it was paid,
how they were paid for. So those are the types
of questions that vote deserve answers to, and those are
the types of questions that other state agencies and departments
had to answer. We did just audit the Governor's office.
(36:09):
We audited you know, lots of state agencies across the
board in our comprehensive review of these agreements, and we
produced a report. Yet the legislature holds themselves above the
law and they say they don't have to participate in
the same type of audit that all these other entities
just participated in regarding those NDAs, those non disclosure agreements.
(36:31):
So again they're breaking the law and needs to change.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
I want to get one more call in. People have
been very patient. Unfortunately I got to get to everyone
to go to Steven Attleborough. Steve, you got about a
minute with the state audit or what can you do
with it?
Speaker 4 (36:44):
Diane Dan thanks for taking my call. Diane, you are
on top of your game. The question I have to
ask you, does the MBTA fall under your purview?
Speaker 3 (36:54):
It does, And we actually just released another audit report
this week on the keys contract. Check it out. It's
up on my website mass dot gov forward slash auditor.
Speaker 4 (37:06):
I will and the question I have as really quickly
is you know, I noticed that they're asking on their
job application site they're looking for another DEI director. Now,
if I'm not mistaken, DEI is now companies or federal
companies that push or promote or sell DEI is now
(37:30):
kind of sort of not a good thing to do.
And yet the MBTA is asking if you go onto
their job site.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Yeah, you know what, you vote, But Steve, you've opened
up a can of worms with thirty seconds left. It's
really not fair, uh, to go there with this. It
takes a little way from the focus of the hours.
So you and I can discuss this. I would suggest
maybe we'll get someone from the MTA on here, the MBTA,
because I don't know that's within the purview of Dianda Zauglia.
Speaker 4 (37:59):
Okay, Well, if the NBCA got six million dollars in
federal funding, there's some of that money going to I understand.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
I'm not going to debate you're here, but the next
time you call, we can we can debate it. Okay,
thank you.
Speaker 3 (38:13):
Very much, thank you, thanks so much for calling in. Thanks,
thanks Canon. That's the last call here. I want to
make sure I thank everybody for calling in today.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
Absolutely and unfortunately we went able to get the Dennis
and Lowell of Paul and Elbroo. I apologize, Dennis and Loll.
Speaker 3 (38:28):
I know Dennis and Loll Dennis, Hi.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I okay, please, I'm Diana, Madame monitor. Keep up the fight.
My audience is behind you and uh and it's so
important you. You are a genuine profile encouraging and there
should be an award from the Kennedy Library at a minimum.
Thank you so much tonight for being here tonight, my friend.
Speaker 3 (38:51):
Okay, and thanks so much, Thanks so much for having
me on. Thanks so much, everybody, Keep up the good fight.
Call the Attorney General ask her to enforce the law.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Yeah, call you state repsent state senators as well. Auditor Diane.
This is ugly Thanks Diana. We'll talk soon.
Speaker 3 (39:06):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
Good night. When we get back, we're going to talk
about village and has it overreached a little bit I
think that I think it has We'll be back on
Night SAT after this
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