April 1, 2025 • 42 mins
In the case of Luigi Mangione, the man accused of murdering United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson last year in New York City, U.S. Attorney General Pam Bondi has directed federal prosecutors to pursue the death penalty. Mangione faces state murder and terrorism charges in New York, along with federal murder and stalking charges. U.S. AG Bondi lifted the moratorium on federal executions back in February of this year. Do you think Luigi Mangione should receive the death penalty if found guilty of murder? What are your thoughts on capital punishment?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's nice eyes undoing Boston's News Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Thanks very much, Dan Watkins. As we head into our fourth.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
And final hour tonight, if you're just joining us, we're
talking about the decision today by Attorney General P. M.
Bondi to seek the death penalty in the federal prosecution
of Luigi Mangoni, the man accused of gunning down United
Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson on December fourth in Midtown, Manhattan
(00:34):
as Thompson was heading to an investors conference. Mangoni is
twenty six years of age, faces federal and state murder
charges for the killing. Do not believe there's a death
penalty in New York State, but there is. The federal
death penalty has been restored. There was a moratorium placed
on it by the Biden administration and that now has
(00:57):
been lifted. So death row inmate it's in federal prisons
could face execution. And last hour of my good friend
Harvey Silverglade made the argument, which is a compelling argument,
that having the death penalty even used in the most
(01:19):
limited forms as I have suggested, meaning that you would
one not only just the prosecution have to prove beyond
a reasonable doubt, but the jury imposing the death penalty
would have to conclude that by the legal standard of
a sintilla of doubt that beyond beyond a scintilla of doubt,
(01:42):
that the individual was guilty of the murder, and then
that they were aggravating circumstances. So if two guys that
get in a fight in the bar room, one guy
pulls on a gun into the heat of passion, fires
the gun, and someone dies, that would not be a
(02:03):
death penalty case under the circumstances that I have laid out.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
But certainly Luigi Minngioni.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
A guy that plotted the death of this guy Brian Thompson,
who is the CEO of United Healthcare, because of Luigi's
problems with insurance carriers. And I don't know if he
had a problem and it would come out a trial
with a company that United health a subsidiary with United Healthcare,
(02:36):
a subsidiary of United Healthcare, he chose it or took
it upon himself. And by the way, I think it's
going to be very interesting in his trial. How did
he know exactly what time Brian Thompson would enter this
hotel or enter this hotel which apparently had several ways
to get in. He must have known, must have had
(02:59):
some level of inside information. In my opinion, that will
have to come on a trial. But I agree with
Pam BONDI if you don't put this guy down, who
do you put down? And I've mentioned other cases, and
I know you've thought of other cases, but I'm just
would love to know my audience what they think. There
are people who have religious objection, I get it. There
(03:20):
are people like Harvey Cilviglate who have a philosophical objection,
which may be based in the Ten Commandments. You know, again,
there's a lot of the philosophy of this in this
country that is based on the Old and the New Testament,
and whether or not people want to accept that fact
(03:41):
or not, that we build our beliefs if we build
them intelligently upon some foundation. And Harvey Silverglade's position is
that if you allow the death penalty to come back,
it's inevitable that there will be someone who will be
executed uh improperly. My attitude is that if you limit
(04:05):
it to the the the very difficult standard beyond a
sintilla of doubt, beyond a cintila or a doubt with
aggravating circumstances, shoot the guy in the back, coward, Luigi,
You're a coward, but for some reason he is also
(04:27):
a bit of a folk hero. So let's go see
what people have to say as we continue along. You're
going to go to Scott in West Virginia. Scott, Welcome
to Knight's. I don't know if I had you on before, Scott.
How are you to Night?
Speaker 3 (04:38):
Hi? Dan? No, you never have from the bottom. Yeah,
and I you know, I've been on a couple of
shows with y way back.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
So you live in West Virginia, you listen.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
To Night But I grew up in Boston, right and
I moved. I'll have that, so there you go.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
I'm sorry you are a talk show host down in
West Virginia.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
I was, Oh, yeah, I was.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
I was.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
I was friends with Larry Glick. He used to put
me on the air, and then my type of.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Yeah, what type of show did you do down there?
If I could ask?
Speaker 3 (05:13):
I did pretty much everything I kind of learned from Larry,
and a lot of politics and that sort of thing.
I spent twenty five years as a private investigator, so
that and I have a degree in radio, TV, film.
But my years of experience in investigative work. That's that's
how I was. I worked in three different stations and
(05:35):
that sort of thing. So when I heard the subject
you were talking about, I'm very opinionated on that.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Yeah, I love to hear that.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Particularly, this is great sort of You've You've laid a
foundation here and I'm just fascinated that it's taken you
this long to call as a first time calling Larry,
we give, we give. People are out of applause, you know,
so congratulations, go right ahead.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Yeah. Well, my problem that I have when I hear
excuses about the death penalty, as I'm sure you can
welly agree, it was what we've heard most of the
time it took my life at least, was that it
does not stop further killing to execute someone. And to me,
(06:19):
that requires a strong belief in the parent normal because
how many prison guards, inmates and the citizens were killed
by escapees. How in hell not executing someone not stop
for their killings? So I come from that point, and
(06:44):
nobody else has ever explained that to me. When they
say that and I questioned it, they did never have
an answer. But I understand the individual you were speaking with,
you know, I can see where he's coming from. But
you're right, Stilla, I agree with that. It's a situation
where when you if you have video and you have witnesses,
(07:08):
you know what happened. Why we we we have scot.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
The case of the Boston bombers here in Boston. One
of them, thankfully is already dead, so he's no longer
a drain on public resources. These are the guys that
came here, came here as refugees from Dakistan. They took
advantage of every program. They're on welfare, they got food stamps,
(07:35):
they went to school, public school here. I think they
were in public housing.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
And yet their gift to us was to kill and name,
you know, a dozen scores of people on Marathon.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
I remember on that case. You know, I grew up
in Walfam, and I remember I got into Walfam at
one point.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Well they were there, they were killed, Well they were capped,
one was captured, the other was killed in actually a watertown. Yeah,
so I mean that's a great case. There's a case
out of Connecticut. There's this family, a doctor's name was Phillips.
They were in Cheshire, Connecticut.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Two two guys came in broke into the home. Uh,
tied the doctor up. He's he was in the cellar
and couldn't you know, couldn't escape. They raped the wife,
They raped their two daughters. They tied the daughters to
a bed. They brought the wife to a local bank
to withdraw money.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
She was able.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
To communicate with a teller that apparently she knew that
they were in trouble. Uh that when they left, the
teller called the police. By time they had gotten back
home and police surrounded the house. These fools figured the
way to escape was light the beds on fire where
the girls were. Uh and and and like you know,
(08:59):
thousands with gasoline and like these two little girls on fire.
And they were caught escaping the house. So there's no
scintilla of doubt about who they were. We have eyewitness testimony.
They're running from the house that they committed murder and
arson in no sentilla doubt, and they're aggravating circumstances. My
(09:20):
attitude is, how quick can we get him in the chair.
Let's let's put him on, let's get rid of them.
But my friend Harvey Silver Like it's a great lawyer, said, institutionally,
you then once you open that door, that there's the
possibility that down the line someone might actually be convicted.
And Harvey pointed out that he had a case where
(09:43):
the defendant, I don't know if you heard last Hour,
he had a twin brother, So we put the twin
brother on the stand, which was a brilliant piece of it.
Sounds like something out of us, a legal novel. But yeah,
that's my position, and I'm kind of sticking to it.
But I have great respe back for Harvey Silverglate because
I know what an ethical and intelligent and courageous individual
(10:06):
he is.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
There are many attorneys out there who are very good,
and in front of a few of them. But I
had a very good friend whose daughter was murdered, and
the prosecutor in Los Angeles, just the way it was
in California, was very reluctant to really press and so
(10:28):
he asked me, as a friend, would I step in
and do an investigation on this? Now there's no question
this was illegal, by the way, and went into her
requirement in strangler at Deak there was no question. Everything
I ever investigated it fit quite well. I spoke with
(10:49):
a couple of the other officers at worked the case.
It didn't matter he had twenty.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
Years, so the prosecutor in Los Angeles chose not to sue.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
Right exactly. Well, yeah, you have to understand what happens. Yes,
I've been through the ringer in LA. That that's just
the way it is. I don't know what else I
can tell you. Let's say it's a different world.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
And I what approximately what year was this?
Speaker 1 (11:20):
I mean, I assume that death penalty has not existed
in statecases in California for a long time.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Well, California still has the still has capital punishment is
just exceptionally rare. It hasn't happened in years. No, this
was Let me see what year would be. I think
it was probably about nineteen eighty four when that happened.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Who was the Who was the DA in Los Angeles
at the time.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
I don't even remember the name anymore, And if I did,
I would say I wouldn't say. Uh, you know. I
did not make good friends with the LAPD or with
any prosecutors. The only police agency I worked closely with
was the l A Sheriff's Department. They were great, but
(12:10):
working with anybody else down there, it was everything you've
ever heard of California. It's pretty much true.
Speaker 5 (12:17):
And I got out of there and well, and you know,
they just got rid of a prosecutor out there, gascon
who was who was insane.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
As far as I'm concerned, that they finally have a
prosecutor who actually is the role of a prosecutor, no
doubt exactly.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
Sure, yeah, yeah, it's actually unbelievable to work through that system.
And sometimes well, look, I had a few people went
after myself and my partner trying to kill us, and
it was pretty incredible. And I'll tell you one story
that was so wild. At the time, I asked said, look,
(13:00):
I need to have a concealed wemensperman. La was the
only county that pretty much denied that. Every now and again,
you're going to carry no matter what they say. But no,
they wouldn't let me have it. But they already knew
and they wanted me to come into court and get testimony,
which because these guys took off in front of me,
they would have added some years to the case. And
(13:23):
I said, sure, I want my concealed webster. I want it,
and they said no, no, okay, you can't. And they
already they had targeted me. They knew that they had
targeted me and my family.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
And by the way, I think I think that California
outlawed capital punishment in nineteen seventy two.
Speaker 3 (13:51):
No, not really, they're looking at it.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
I'm looking at it right now.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
On April twenty fourth, nineteen seventy two, capital punks.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
It was not allowed.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Oh, not allowed. No, but I know they has a
break on it.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
But no, no, no, it was outlawed. It's unconstitutional.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Okay, okay, uh, it's not allowed to be carried out
in the state of California due to a standing two
thousand and six federal court order against the practice and
at two twenty nineteen moratorium on executions ordered by Governor
Gavin Newsom.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
Yeah, I'll have to do a little bit more research
on hear.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Yeah, I'm working current.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
All right, I gotta run. I gotta run, Scott. I
hope you call more off and enjoyed the conversation.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Thank you. Hey, all right, guy, talk to you soon.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
Let me get one more in here before the break.
Gotta go to Paul in Southy. Paul, you were next
on Nightsigger right ahead.
Speaker 6 (14:44):
I dans I missed Hoby Silvis Glade. But anyway, I
believe that he didn't support the death penalty.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
But you do, yes, correct?
Speaker 6 (14:53):
Correct? Yeah, Okay, I think the best thing for people
is to spend the rest of your life in tre
and I think losing your freedom and being locked up.
I have a comfortable apartment, but I wouldn't want to
be second my apartment all day. I want to be
out and joining the nice weather.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Understand, what do you? Let me ask you this?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
What do you do if someone kills someone and while
in custody, you know, serving their life sentence. They kill
a prison guard, Yeah, well they killed well they kill
another inmate.
Speaker 6 (15:27):
Well, yes, exactly what. They have nothing to lose when
they do that. And it's sad that they would take
the life of a of a god.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
But does that change Does that change your mind?
Speaker 3 (15:40):
No?
Speaker 6 (15:40):
Because my brother did was doing a life in a
day in the prison system, okay, and he thought the
worst thing in the world. He'd rather have died than
staying there another day.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
What was your brother convicted of?
Speaker 7 (15:53):
If I could ask, Paul, I will tell you he
killed his They were separated his wife at a Plymouth
nursing home about thirty years ago, where he stabbed thirteen
times for the five inch buck knife and one flight
down in the elevator.
Speaker 6 (16:12):
She died in the chair in the lobby. But he
he had nightmas of that every day of the whole
twenty eight years that he stayed in Norfolk. And that
was worse than that's worse than the death penalty. To
have to live that over all the time took the
toll on him. He died at the age of sixty three.
(16:33):
Back in back to twenty twenty. Yeah, you know, was.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
That the first crime that he had committed?
Speaker 6 (16:41):
No, no, no, oh, yes, that was the only way. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
that was the only crime that he committed. But what
I'm trying to say, moving your freedom then, so.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
I said, let me just understand it.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
So he all of a sudden murdered his wife in
a fit of rage, I assume, but hate before that,
had never been in.
Speaker 8 (16:59):
Trouble with the law, not to that extent, well.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Obviously, but had he had prior.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
You know, experiences in court, yes, but not to that level.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
No, understand.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
But that's what happens, is that that in some cases,
I mean, in some cases that someone just loses their
mind and kills and other cases the person starts off,
you know, at a lower level and moves on up.
But yeah, so you know, I'm sorry that you had
to experience that. I kind of imagine what it would
(17:34):
be like to see someone in your family, a sibling,
go through that.
Speaker 9 (17:40):
Well.
Speaker 6 (17:40):
I took care of him for the whole twenty eight years.
I mean I sent them fifty dollars every month, faithfully.
I did that because he was still my brother, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Yeah, that was his canteen money.
Speaker 6 (17:52):
That was his canteen money. He's the only one he
depended on was me. But then if my brother wasn't
didn't do what he did, I'd probably align with you,
but i'd be I'm afraid that we throw on my
brother under the bus if I aligned what you believe.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
No, no, yeah, no, no, no, no. You have every
right to your your point of view.
Speaker 6 (18:14):
Here is just to make you a bad person, Dan,
I'm not saying that I.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
Did, of course not.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Nor does it make you a bad person to disagree
with me. Absolutely not.
Speaker 6 (18:22):
Those guys that did that to the two girls and
the and the mother of those two girls in Connecticut
that way, Yeah, yeah, they deserve the death penalty story,
But he was still my brother.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
But I understee it but but you look like anything
else when you talk about you know, when when people
will say, well, you're opposed to death, and what happens
if someone does that to your to your mother or
to your father, Well, that's that's an unfair way to
argue the case, because obviously all of us would have
the reaction. You know, if if someone had murdered your
(18:55):
brother in prison, I suspect you would want the you
would want the death penalty for the guy who ward
of your brother.
Speaker 6 (19:00):
Correct, absolutely, absolutely, So that's.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
All I'm saying. Okay, all right, thank you, Paul, Thank
you much, my friend. Appreciate you listen and appreciate you
taking the.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Time to call.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
Have a great probably to talk to you back.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
Absolutely, good night. Let me keep rolling here. I'm going
to get Laurie from Idaho in here real quickly. I'm
interested in what Laurie thinks about this. Laurie, you were
next on nice side your thoughts.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Hi there, Hi there, Well, I am com Hi there.
I'm completely with you on you know, I don't I'm
not offended by the death penalty when it's warranted, and
in cases, in certain cases it is warranted, I think,
but in this most recent case with the United Healthcare guy.
I think it needs to send a message. You've got
all these tonks who do copycat things. They've grown up
(19:43):
on video games with this stuff that I don't know
normal or what I mean. Clearly it's not someone who's
clearly normal health life, mentally health lives. But you need
it needs to be a statement. You know, they've got
to know that they can't get away with it. If
you do this kind of stuff, you're going to be
sitting on death row.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Well, I look, you know they talk about, well, killing
doesn't prevent you know, death penal, an event you know,
is not a deterrent. Well, it's certainly a deterrent for
the person who committed the crime. And I think you're
arguing that there is a deterrent effect to it, and
that people might say, hey, you know, I think maybe not.
(20:22):
And you know, particularly when when you talk about contract murders,
when when somebody convinces somebody pays somebody ten thousand dollars
to kill someone, it's a contract murder.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
I mean, that's well it is.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
And if this guy wasn't you know, mentally disabled, or
he wasn't on drugs at the time, and they all
think they can get away with it. Well, you get
one or two of those younger guys who pulled this stuff,
maybe the copycats aren't going to do it.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Well, this guy, I'm sure, thought he had gotten away
with it. He had got out of the city, he
had planned his escape, he planned his hit on the guy.
I still think he had some information. We'll see if
that comes out in court. I mean, either that he
just was really lucky and he's sitting there waiting for
this guy and whoa, the guy turns the corner in
it and that's the moment that he acts. But I
had my suspicion once it was a while.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Yeah, I think he was charming and he probably chatted
up some people and he got you know, which is
just beyond meditated. So sure, but I think it's set
an example. You know, he should be absolutely exposed. I mean,
he'll be in jail forever, with appeals forever, which they
could limit the appeals, but I can't do that.
Speaker 9 (21:26):
It's the voids.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
And in this.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
Case, this guy's going to have marriage proposals. I mean,
he he has a fan base out there, so he's.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
Going to live.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
A different life from most prisoners. I mean, it's it's
almost like with the kid in Boston, the Boston bomber
number two. They did put his picture was it was
you'll know this more than I was. It put on
the front of Vanity Fair or something with his tossled hair,
and they made him look like a rock star.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Don't read Vanity Fair.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Well, I forget which magazine it was. Someone will know which.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
I don't want to misidentify the magazine, but it was
you know his his.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
Oh yeah, they made him look sexy really seriously.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Yeah, but I think I'm not sure what it was,
so I don't want to but but I I think
it was a magazine like a Vanity Field that normally
wouldn't get it.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
I was it was, I remember seeing it.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
But I don't buy them.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
I see them in the stands of the grocery.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
H I don't buy it.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
But they could limit the appeals, though, I wish they
could not have it drag out so long so that
you know, well, you're going to be dead in less
than three years.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Yeah, well, I think that the and and again I
changed my view on the death penalty. I contracted my
view substantially. When I say there is a standard in
the law, just as there's a standard of beyond.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
A reasonable doubt.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Okay, when I say beyond a satilla of doubt, that's
like no doubt, no doubt. And then when you add
on top of that an additional layer of aggravating circumstances,
you could pretty much now there's there's there's not many crimes,
you know, high profile, even murders that that you fit
(23:05):
with that. I mean someone like a Jeffrey Dahmer where
you find skulls in his refrigerator.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Okay, no, I'm serious, you.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Know, or or the guy that the clown literally the
clown uh in Chicago who had I don't know, twenty
three kids buried in his basement or something. You have
some of these these deranged, insane people who are yeah,
well the guy down the who murdered the allegedly murdered
(23:35):
the he hasn't been convicted yet, uh in Long Island,
down down on whatever the beach is down there a
long Unfortunately, there's there's more of these as possible. Look
at the guy out where you are who murdered, allegedly
murdered the four roommates.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
What was that all about?
Speaker 1 (23:52):
I mean, your people can say, hey, Look, that guy
has to have been insane to have done what he did.
I suspect anyone who kills someone is insane, but when
when they fit in that category of premeditation and deliberation. Uh,
And it's beyond a sintilla of doubt. There's there's no
question who the guy is. We talked about even Harvey.
We were talking last hour, who I respect immensely. We
(24:15):
were talking about Timothy McVeigh, the guy that hit the building,
took the building down in Oklahoma City. I've stood where
that building is and looked at it. He dropped all
his appeals, he dropped all.
Speaker 4 (24:28):
His can give him a great amount of respect for.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Well, you know, I mean in view of I think
it was what one hundred and sixty people who he
killed that day. I mean terrible yeah, so so yeah.
I mean I just think that as a society, there
comes upoint in time where the society has to say,
this is beyond the pale. And as they say, Harvey
stood in the position that once you open that door,
(24:51):
you let that genie out of the bottle, however constricted,
you're going to be still, you know, beyond a beyond
a scintilla of doubt and substantially aggravating circumstances, and I
think that Luigi Mangioni fits in that Category's.
Speaker 4 (25:10):
I respect Harvey. I respect him. It's institutional, it's not emotional,
it's not religious, it's institutional, and I respect that. But
for all the ones that can get rid of if
there's one mistake, which is a horrible thing to say,
but if there's one mistake, that's bad. But apparently it
won't even we won't even tell her that much. And
that's I actually respect him for that.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well, here's the deal. You know, for years and years
and years, the innocence projects searched for a mistake and
they have not. Well now I think they have finally
come up with a case that they would argue was
a mistake. But it's not as if you can go
back into this country when people will get lynched and
(25:47):
they were lynch mobs, and you know that, I would
think that, yeah, they probably were mistakes in the nineteen twenties,
in the nineteen thirties, in the nineteen forties, and some
of them might have been racial mistakes, and yeah, you know,
and and maybe there was there were you know, individuals,
minority individuals, who were wrongfully identified. You certainly know people
(26:09):
have served time in prison for substantial periods of time
who were actually in the case that I work with,
you do you do? Yeah? Where they where they were
intentionally framed by the FBI corrupt FBI agent. So yeah,
that's it's a human situation.
Speaker 7 (26:26):
But Man Luigi process has given them plenty.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
Of time now to get it figured out. I wish
it weren't quite as long a time, but yeah, I
don't know. Something like that, something like this case with
the United health Care And.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
The other thing is that what the left does is,
for example, that they're now saying in Maryland, there was
some guy who was thrown into this situation with the
Trent de Agua gang out of Venezuela, and if there's
a mistake, and I think the administration is now saying
there's some sort of administrative mistake that's insane, get him
out of there, if you have to see the Marines
and to get him.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
Out and bring him back home to family.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
You know, correct if the information is real.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Yeah, I mean there was there were things early they
said there was some then zuel and soccer player, and
there was some barber out of California.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Well, you could be both things.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
You could be a Venzuelan soccer player and a member
of Trone Daguro, however the hell you pronounce it, or
you could be a barber. But if the if these
were not people who were not gang members, they were
not members of this gang, get them out of there,
get them out of there, bring them back home, and
and they should be compensated for the experience they went through.
Whether it's in the case of Joe Silvadie and Peter Lamoni,
(27:37):
thirty or thirty three years, these guys one week down there,
they should get it. They should be compensated for that,
in my opinion anyway.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
But then again, you need all the information because one
of these things the gangs do is infiltrate into places
and pretend that they're I don't know, I don't know,
I don't know. And if you're not here legally, if
if you come in yep, against you know, then you
should just be out period and then come you know,
come back when you when you do that right away
and come on in.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Yeah, but I do think that it might be you
have I think at some point you just can't say, well,
we made a mistake, and unfortunately he's now in El
Salvador and there's nothing we can do. Wait a second,
hold on. All right, hey, Laurie, I got a run.
We got you in before the break, and as always
have one a little longer than I.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
Should, but always enjoy the conversation.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
We'll talk, okay, all right, good night, Thank you, good night.
Here comes the news at the bottom of the air.
I got a couple of open lines here, so come on,
fill him up. Let's go six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty, six, one, seven, nine, three thirty. I got
Jamie and Wooster, I got Dave and San Antonio, and
I got room for.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Three of you. Let's fill him up.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Coming back on Night's Side, death penalty for Luigi MANGIONI.
For me, it's an easy call. I don't have any
conscience qualm about this one at all. I'd love to
hear from you. Coming back on Nightside.
Speaker 10 (28:54):
It's Night Side with Dan Ray on.
Speaker 4 (28:57):
Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
By the way, I want to correct myself. Scott from
West Virginia was correct. I misread what's going on in California.
California voters rejected two initiatives to repeal the death penalty
by popular vote in twenty twelve and twenty sixteen, and
the voters in California narrowly adopted in twenty sixteen another
(29:23):
proposal to expedite its appeal process. On August twenty six,
twenty twenty one, the California State Supreme Court upheld the
state's death penalty rules, though as of twenty twenty four,
executions have yet to resume. So death penalty is on
the books in California, but Governor Newsom has ordered a moratorium,
(29:50):
and should the moratorium end and the freeze conclude, executions
could resume under the current state law. So I misread that,
and California had a history. They carried out seven hundred
and nine execute executions from seventeen seventy eight to nineteen
seventy two, which was in when California did strike down
(30:13):
the state's capital punishment law, and of course that was
followed quickly there after or around that same time Furman
versus Georgia would impose a nationwide band and it was restored.
First execution post Firman carried out in nineteen ninety two,
(30:35):
and since that time there have been thirteen executions, yet
hundreds have been sentenced. The last execution took place in
California in two thousand and six. All right, let's get
back to the calls. Okay, going to next Dave in
San Antonio, Texas. Dave, go right ahead, sir.
Speaker 9 (30:54):
How you doing Dan?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
I'm doing great, Dave. What's your thought on this?
Speaker 9 (30:58):
Well? I think that uh, your friend's logic is uh,
it's it's extreme logic. And you can look at like
a policeman goes up to a confrontation, a man's pointing
of a rifle right ahead of a young lady, defenseless,
(31:20):
young lady. He's not shooting yet, what do you do?
You come up, you know, your car, and you look
at you see what do you do? Your shoot?
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (31:33):
That that that's not that. That is not the state
conducting an execution. That is an officer of the law
seeing someone's life in danger, and he has to make
a very difficult decision.
Speaker 9 (31:48):
So very difficult decision, that's what it is. And very
difficult decisions are made all the time in this world,
and sometimes they're wrong. But uh, there is no that
does not give any that's no argument against putting to
(32:11):
death all of these murderers that do murder people and
hurt people's.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
Well again, Yeah, as they say, I'm arguing I think
a limited death penalty by saying that when there is
no people get convicted beyond a reasonable doubt. So you
can have you know, you could have a doubt in
the case as long as it's.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
You know, it's it's, it's, it's, it's.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
It's not beyond a reasonable doubt. Is the standard to
convict that there's there's no reasonable doubt you might have
the vacuum. Well, I'm really not completely sure. I'm saying
beyond the scintilla of doubt, and that's a legal standard
that means there's no question. Abe Lincoln was the sixteenth
President of the United States. That is a fact that's
beyond a scintilla of doubt. And then also aggravating circumstances.
(33:03):
I'm looking at this kid, Lewis Luigi Mangione, a child
of privilege, who decided to shoot a guy in the
back in midtown Manhattan last December fourth. See you, I
consider that to be an aggravating circumstance, just by by
virtue of the way in which the murder was was
(33:23):
carried out. Yeah, I assume you agree with me on
that one.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
I do, yes, good, all right, that's all.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
I as long as I got you on my side,
that's all.
Speaker 9 (33:37):
I just feel that that that logical argument is heartless
to humanity because I believe a preposterous majority of us
agree that those vicious people should be.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
I mean, Jeffrey Dama, he killed a whole bunch of people,
and I think he was wasn't he the cannibal?
Speaker 2 (33:59):
And then you had the guy what was his name?
Speaker 1 (34:02):
Lacy, the clown in Illinois, the clown killer who killed
twenty kids. He had him buried in his basement.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
Yeah yeah, oh.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
I mean you know, John Wayne Gacy was the kids?
Was the guy's name? If I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 9 (34:20):
We have a serial killer here in Texas who's got
one hundred naches on his gun?
Speaker 2 (34:26):
Really and he is he is? He in prison?
Speaker 9 (34:30):
I don't think he's alive now, but he was. He
had one hundred notches on his gun.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
And was he executed?
Speaker 9 (34:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Yeah, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
John Wayne Gacy was an American serial killer and sex
offender who raped, tortured, and murdered at least thirty three
young men and boys in Norwood Park township near Chicago.
He became known as the Killer Clown due to his
public performances as a clown prior to the discovery.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Of the Clown of the Crimes.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Yeah, let me tell you there's some weird dudes out there, Dave.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
I hate to do this to you, but I'm up
in my break.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
I gotta let you go. Thank you, my friend. Appreciate it.
Speaker 9 (35:03):
Good night, Bob, very much.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
Right night, Good night.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Okay, we got Jeff and Marblehead and Jamie coming up.
We got a little room for you if you'd like
to join the conversation. We'll finish it off between now
and midnight. Coming back on Night Side. I think it's
been an interesting conversation and I hope you agree. Any
conversation that makes me think, and every time I talk
with Harvey Silverglate, I have to think, uh, makes it
a good night for me. I hope it's been a
good night for you. Back on Nightside after this, you're
(35:30):
on Night Side with Dan Ray.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
I'm WAZ Boston's News Radio.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
Let's keep Rowland here. We're gonna go next to Jamie
and Worcester. Jamie, I appreciate your patience. You next on Nightside, Jamie,
go right.
Speaker 11 (35:42):
Ahead, yeah, I one in agreement with Lee, Jim and Joni.
Uh pull the push by body for Joni's execution. But
what a puzzle me is shouldn't have a hierarchy lists
of people that committed crimes that are worse before him,
(36:05):
like the Marathon bomber or something like that.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
I'm the Marathon bomber is on death row, and I
think that once his appeals are exhausted, and I'd like
to see them exhausted quickly, I think he should go
be able to join his brother. And wherever the hell
his brother is. I think there's a whole bunch of people.
I talk about the doctor in Connecticut who was his family.
(36:29):
He was at home with his wife and two daughters.
These two lifelong criminals broke into the house to rob them.
They tied the girls up in a bed, and they
raped the wife, and they put the husband downstairs. They
didn't kill him, but they incapacitated him, tied him up.
After they raped the wife, they took her to a
(36:52):
bank to make a withdrawal. She somehow communicated with one
of the tellers that she needed some help. The teller
knew who she was. I was to tell her when
she left, called the police. She got home and all
of a sudden, the killers looked out the window. They
realized the police were outside.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
So these.
Speaker 1 (37:10):
I don't want to say the word of the radio
because I might get in trouble. But these sobs delved
the children's bed with gasoline. It was in Chesshire, Connecticut.
Lit the house on fire by lighting the beds on fire.
Killed the girls obviously, and they put caught running from
the house. I mean, what's the you know, no question,
it's beyond us until her of doubt. And they're aggravating circumstances.
(37:35):
They are the posted post a man post the boys
for the death penalty.
Speaker 11 (37:40):
Well yeah, because I'm just saying like, if you gotta
do it, you gonna start like cramp it down on
the death penalty. Because it's death penally is dragged on
every case forever. There should be a hierarchy of you know,
people on that list, Like give me the top ten
people that deserved the can and go from the top down.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
You know what I'm saying, Well.
Speaker 1 (38:04):
Again I'm giving you, you know Luigioni here, Luigi Maggioni,
the Boston bomber, the surviving Boston bomber.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
These guys in.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Knnecticut, and I'm sure there are plenty of others who
engage in murders that there's.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
No question, there's no scintilla.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Of doubt about their guilt and their aggravating circumstances. You
need both under my sir, under my theory or my formula.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
You need both.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
Okay, and then you say nice knowing you we'll see
in the next life. Right, all right, Jamie, thanks much, man,
We'll talk soon.
Speaker 11 (38:46):
Okay, Okay, yeah, thank you, have a good night.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Thank you for your time. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Jeff in Marblehead, Jeff, you're gonna wrap us up tonight,
A right ahead, Jeff.
Speaker 10 (38:54):
Okay, So I want to go back to your comments
on the people that end up in ol South and
what I think is happening. It shouldn't be there, probably,
and I one they think the Trump people admitted it
shouldn't be here, and you were saying if necessarily sending
the Marines. I think a call from Trump to the
president of.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Oh, yeah, you don't need them. I was using that
tongue in cheek a little bit. I think the President
of Al Salvador met with the Secretary of State and
I believe Al Salvador is getting a hunk of money,
uh to confine these guys, which is fine. They got
this beautiful, big prison down there. And I suspect that
(39:35):
if they said, hey, look we made a mistake and
we sent a couple of people down who are not
members of the gang, would you release them? I don't
think the president of El Salvador would be posted that
for a second, do you It.
Speaker 8 (39:48):
Would take a simple call. But my point I'm going
to make if I don't think Trump will ever make
a call like that. You know, one of the objections
I have to the Trump administration is they will never
admit their run. You know, good companies, good people.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
You know John F.
Speaker 10 (40:03):
Penny, when the Bay of Pigs was a disaster, Yes,
I'm responsible a disaster. It won't happen again. Ronald Reagan,
you know, yes we you know, I have to acknowledge
we did send arms for hostages and Iran, and you know.
Speaker 8 (40:17):
It won't happen again. And you Frump and its people
never seem to do that. You know, look at the
similar thing with the meaning that you know included the
Atlantic magazine and was done online. You know, just I'd
just loved to see one person that works in the
corn administration say.
Speaker 10 (40:34):
Yeah, we screwed up. It's not going to happen again,
instead of you know, oh, we didn't discuss things were
that sensitive, and well I do.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
I do.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
I do think the only one that comes to mind,
and I agree with you, there's a lot of people.
I firmly believe that when I goof up, as I
just told you, I goofed up and misread something on
the death penalty in California.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
I think that.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
By acknowledging that you actually gain credibility. And I think
that I believe that the Mike Waltz, the National Security advisor.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
Whose whose phone it was, the.
Speaker 1 (41:10):
One that that I think set up the call the
signal gave call of the signal call, I think he
admitted uh and and said it was his mistake.
Speaker 10 (41:19):
So well he did right after attacking the Atlantic journalist
is a low life.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
And yeah, no I'm not look, I think I'm not defend. Yeah,
he had not his fault.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
It would be like if all of a sudden you
called me and it's like you know you you know, yeah, No,
I'm with you on that one. And I think that
I think i'd like to see more politicians has has
a little.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Elizabeth Warren, ever ever said she's wrong on anything that
you can think of.
Speaker 8 (41:49):
I'm probably not.
Speaker 2 (41:51):
And yeah, right, brus of a feather, I.
Speaker 8 (41:54):
Don't think Biden joined the club.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
Yeah, hey, Jeff, I hate to do this to you,
but I'm out of time, so I gotta let you go.
But thank you and I enjoyed the conversation. I hope
you call more often. Okay, thank you very much. I'm
done for the night. All dogs, Rob Brooks, thank you, Marita,
thank you, All dogs, all cats, all pets go to heaven.
That's Mike Pal Charlie Rays, who passed fifteen years ago
in February. That's where all your pets are who had passed.
(42:18):
They loved you and you love them. I do believe
you'll see them again. Hope to see again the Moore
Night on Night's side. Have a great Wednesday everyone. I
will be on Facebook Night s Out with Dan Ray
in a couple of minutes and I'll review the show.
We had a good show tonight. Thanks everyone,
It's nice eyes undoing Boston's News Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Thanks very much, Dan Watkins. As we head into our fourth.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
And final hour tonight, if you're just joining us, we're
talking about the decision today by Attorney General P. M.
Bondi to seek the death penalty in the federal prosecution
of Luigi Mangoni, the man accused of gunning down United
Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson on December fourth in Midtown, Manhattan
(00:34):
as Thompson was heading to an investors conference. Mangoni is
twenty six years of age, faces federal and state murder
charges for the killing. Do not believe there's a death
penalty in New York State, but there is. The federal
death penalty has been restored. There was a moratorium placed
on it by the Biden administration and that now has
(00:57):
been lifted. So death row inmate it's in federal prisons
could face execution. And last hour of my good friend
Harvey Silverglade made the argument, which is a compelling argument,
that having the death penalty even used in the most
(01:19):
limited forms as I have suggested, meaning that you would
one not only just the prosecution have to prove beyond
a reasonable doubt, but the jury imposing the death penalty
would have to conclude that by the legal standard of
a sintilla of doubt that beyond beyond a scintilla of doubt,
(01:42):
that the individual was guilty of the murder, and then
that they were aggravating circumstances. So if two guys that
get in a fight in the bar room, one guy
pulls on a gun into the heat of passion, fires
the gun, and someone dies, that would not be a
(02:03):
death penalty case under the circumstances that I have laid out.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
But certainly Luigi Minngioni.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
A guy that plotted the death of this guy Brian Thompson,
who is the CEO of United Healthcare, because of Luigi's
problems with insurance carriers. And I don't know if he
had a problem and it would come out a trial
with a company that United health a subsidiary with United Healthcare,
(02:36):
a subsidiary of United Healthcare, he chose it or took
it upon himself. And by the way, I think it's
going to be very interesting in his trial. How did
he know exactly what time Brian Thompson would enter this
hotel or enter this hotel which apparently had several ways
to get in. He must have known, must have had
(02:59):
some level of inside information. In my opinion, that will
have to come on a trial. But I agree with
Pam BONDI if you don't put this guy down, who
do you put down? And I've mentioned other cases, and
I know you've thought of other cases, but I'm just
would love to know my audience what they think. There
are people who have religious objection, I get it. There
(03:20):
are people like Harvey Cilviglate who have a philosophical objection,
which may be based in the Ten Commandments. You know, again,
there's a lot of the philosophy of this in this
country that is based on the Old and the New Testament,
and whether or not people want to accept that fact
(03:41):
or not, that we build our beliefs if we build
them intelligently upon some foundation. And Harvey Silverglade's position is
that if you allow the death penalty to come back,
it's inevitable that there will be someone who will be
executed uh improperly. My attitude is that if you limit
(04:05):
it to the the the very difficult standard beyond a
sintilla of doubt, beyond a cintila or a doubt with
aggravating circumstances, shoot the guy in the back, coward, Luigi,
You're a coward, but for some reason he is also
(04:27):
a bit of a folk hero. So let's go see
what people have to say as we continue along. You're
going to go to Scott in West Virginia. Scott, Welcome
to Knight's. I don't know if I had you on before, Scott.
How are you to Night?
Speaker 3 (04:38):
Hi? Dan? No, you never have from the bottom. Yeah,
and I you know, I've been on a couple of
shows with y way back.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
So you live in West Virginia, you listen.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
To Night But I grew up in Boston, right and
I moved. I'll have that, so there you go.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
I'm sorry you are a talk show host down in
West Virginia.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
I was, Oh, yeah, I was.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
I was.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
I was friends with Larry Glick. He used to put
me on the air, and then my type of.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Yeah, what type of show did you do down there?
If I could ask?
Speaker 3 (05:13):
I did pretty much everything I kind of learned from Larry,
and a lot of politics and that sort of thing.
I spent twenty five years as a private investigator, so
that and I have a degree in radio, TV, film.
But my years of experience in investigative work. That's that's
how I was. I worked in three different stations and
(05:35):
that sort of thing. So when I heard the subject
you were talking about, I'm very opinionated on that.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Yeah, I love to hear that.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Particularly, this is great sort of You've You've laid a
foundation here and I'm just fascinated that it's taken you
this long to call as a first time calling Larry,
we give, we give. People are out of applause, you know,
so congratulations, go right ahead.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Yeah. Well, my problem that I have when I hear
excuses about the death penalty, as I'm sure you can
welly agree, it was what we've heard most of the
time it took my life at least, was that it
does not stop further killing to execute someone. And to me,
(06:19):
that requires a strong belief in the parent normal because
how many prison guards, inmates and the citizens were killed
by escapees. How in hell not executing someone not stop
for their killings? So I come from that point, and
(06:44):
nobody else has ever explained that to me. When they
say that and I questioned it, they did never have
an answer. But I understand the individual you were speaking with,
you know, I can see where he's coming from. But
you're right, Stilla, I agree with that. It's a situation
where when you if you have video and you have witnesses,
(07:08):
you know what happened. Why we we we have scot.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
The case of the Boston bombers here in Boston. One
of them, thankfully is already dead, so he's no longer
a drain on public resources. These are the guys that
came here, came here as refugees from Dakistan. They took
advantage of every program. They're on welfare, they got food stamps,
(07:35):
they went to school, public school here. I think they
were in public housing.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
And yet their gift to us was to kill and name,
you know, a dozen scores of people on Marathon.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
I remember on that case. You know, I grew up
in Walfam, and I remember I got into Walfam at
one point.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Well they were there, they were killed, Well they were capped,
one was captured, the other was killed in actually a watertown. Yeah,
so I mean that's a great case. There's a case
out of Connecticut. There's this family, a doctor's name was Phillips.
They were in Cheshire, Connecticut.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Two two guys came in broke into the home. Uh,
tied the doctor up. He's he was in the cellar
and couldn't you know, couldn't escape. They raped the wife,
They raped their two daughters. They tied the daughters to
a bed. They brought the wife to a local bank
to withdraw money.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
She was able.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
To communicate with a teller that apparently she knew that
they were in trouble. Uh that when they left, the
teller called the police. By time they had gotten back
home and police surrounded the house. These fools figured the
way to escape was light the beds on fire where
the girls were. Uh and and and like you know,
(08:59):
thousands with gasoline and like these two little girls on fire.
And they were caught escaping the house. So there's no
scintilla of doubt about who they were. We have eyewitness testimony.
They're running from the house that they committed murder and
arson in no sentilla doubt, and they're aggravating circumstances. My
(09:20):
attitude is, how quick can we get him in the chair.
Let's let's put him on, let's get rid of them.
But my friend Harvey Silver Like it's a great lawyer, said, institutionally,
you then once you open that door, that there's the
possibility that down the line someone might actually be convicted.
And Harvey pointed out that he had a case where
(09:43):
the defendant, I don't know if you heard last Hour,
he had a twin brother, So we put the twin
brother on the stand, which was a brilliant piece of it.
Sounds like something out of us, a legal novel. But yeah,
that's my position, and I'm kind of sticking to it.
But I have great respe back for Harvey Silverglate because
I know what an ethical and intelligent and courageous individual
(10:06):
he is.
Speaker 3 (10:08):
There are many attorneys out there who are very good,
and in front of a few of them. But I
had a very good friend whose daughter was murdered, and
the prosecutor in Los Angeles, just the way it was
in California, was very reluctant to really press and so
(10:28):
he asked me, as a friend, would I step in
and do an investigation on this? Now there's no question
this was illegal, by the way, and went into her
requirement in strangler at Deak there was no question. Everything
I ever investigated it fit quite well. I spoke with
(10:49):
a couple of the other officers at worked the case.
It didn't matter he had twenty.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
Years, so the prosecutor in Los Angeles chose not to sue.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
Right exactly. Well, yeah, you have to understand what happens. Yes,
I've been through the ringer in LA. That that's just
the way it is. I don't know what else I
can tell you. Let's say it's a different world.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
And I what approximately what year was this?
Speaker 1 (11:20):
I mean, I assume that death penalty has not existed
in statecases in California for a long time.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Well, California still has the still has capital punishment is
just exceptionally rare. It hasn't happened in years. No, this
was Let me see what year would be. I think
it was probably about nineteen eighty four when that happened.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Who was the Who was the DA in Los Angeles
at the time.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
I don't even remember the name anymore, And if I did,
I would say I wouldn't say. Uh, you know. I
did not make good friends with the LAPD or with
any prosecutors. The only police agency I worked closely with
was the l A Sheriff's Department. They were great, but
(12:10):
working with anybody else down there, it was everything you've
ever heard of California. It's pretty much true.
Speaker 5 (12:17):
And I got out of there and well, and you know,
they just got rid of a prosecutor out there, gascon
who was who was insane.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
As far as I'm concerned, that they finally have a
prosecutor who actually is the role of a prosecutor, no
doubt exactly.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
Sure, yeah, yeah, it's actually unbelievable to work through that system.
And sometimes well, look, I had a few people went
after myself and my partner trying to kill us, and
it was pretty incredible. And I'll tell you one story
that was so wild. At the time, I asked said, look,
(13:00):
I need to have a concealed wemensperman. La was the
only county that pretty much denied that. Every now and again,
you're going to carry no matter what they say. But no,
they wouldn't let me have it. But they already knew
and they wanted me to come into court and get testimony,
which because these guys took off in front of me,
they would have added some years to the case. And
(13:23):
I said, sure, I want my concealed webster. I want it,
and they said no, no, okay, you can't. And they
already they had targeted me. They knew that they had
targeted me and my family.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
And by the way, I think I think that California
outlawed capital punishment in nineteen seventy two.
Speaker 3 (13:51):
No, not really, they're looking at it.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
I'm looking at it right now.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
On April twenty fourth, nineteen seventy two, capital punks.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
It was not allowed.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Oh, not allowed. No, but I know they has a
break on it.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
But no, no, no, it was outlawed. It's unconstitutional.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Okay, okay, uh, it's not allowed to be carried out
in the state of California due to a standing two
thousand and six federal court order against the practice and
at two twenty nineteen moratorium on executions ordered by Governor
Gavin Newsom.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
Yeah, I'll have to do a little bit more research
on hear.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Yeah, I'm working current.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
All right, I gotta run. I gotta run, Scott. I
hope you call more off and enjoyed the conversation.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Thank you. Hey, all right, guy, talk to you soon.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
Let me get one more in here before the break.
Gotta go to Paul in Southy. Paul, you were next
on Nightsigger right ahead.
Speaker 6 (14:44):
I dans I missed Hoby Silvis Glade. But anyway, I
believe that he didn't support the death penalty.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
But you do, yes, correct?
Speaker 6 (14:53):
Correct? Yeah, Okay, I think the best thing for people
is to spend the rest of your life in tre
and I think losing your freedom and being locked up.
I have a comfortable apartment, but I wouldn't want to
be second my apartment all day. I want to be
out and joining the nice weather.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Understand, what do you? Let me ask you this?
Speaker 1 (15:12):
What do you do if someone kills someone and while
in custody, you know, serving their life sentence. They kill
a prison guard, Yeah, well they killed well they kill
another inmate.
Speaker 6 (15:27):
Well, yes, exactly what. They have nothing to lose when
they do that. And it's sad that they would take
the life of a of a god.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
But does that change Does that change your mind?
Speaker 3 (15:40):
No?
Speaker 6 (15:40):
Because my brother did was doing a life in a
day in the prison system, okay, and he thought the
worst thing in the world. He'd rather have died than
staying there another day.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
What was your brother convicted of?
Speaker 7 (15:53):
If I could ask, Paul, I will tell you he
killed his They were separated his wife at a Plymouth
nursing home about thirty years ago, where he stabbed thirteen
times for the five inch buck knife and one flight
down in the elevator.
Speaker 6 (16:12):
She died in the chair in the lobby. But he
he had nightmas of that every day of the whole
twenty eight years that he stayed in Norfolk. And that
was worse than that's worse than the death penalty. To
have to live that over all the time took the
toll on him. He died at the age of sixty three.
(16:33):
Back in back to twenty twenty. Yeah, you know, was.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
That the first crime that he had committed?
Speaker 6 (16:41):
No, no, no, oh, yes, that was the only way. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
that was the only crime that he committed. But what
I'm trying to say, moving your freedom then, so.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
I said, let me just understand it.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
So he all of a sudden murdered his wife in
a fit of rage, I assume, but hate before that,
had never been in.
Speaker 8 (16:59):
Trouble with the law, not to that extent, well.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Obviously, but had he had prior.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
You know, experiences in court, yes, but not to that level.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
No, understand.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
But that's what happens, is that that in some cases,
I mean, in some cases that someone just loses their
mind and kills and other cases the person starts off,
you know, at a lower level and moves on up.
But yeah, so you know, I'm sorry that you had
to experience that. I kind of imagine what it would
(17:34):
be like to see someone in your family, a sibling,
go through that.
Speaker 9 (17:40):
Well.
Speaker 6 (17:40):
I took care of him for the whole twenty eight years.
I mean I sent them fifty dollars every month, faithfully.
I did that because he was still my brother, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Yeah, that was his canteen money.
Speaker 6 (17:52):
That was his canteen money. He's the only one he
depended on was me. But then if my brother wasn't
didn't do what he did, I'd probably align with you,
but i'd be I'm afraid that we throw on my
brother under the bus if I aligned what you believe.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
No, no, yeah, no, no, no, no. You have every
right to your your point of view.
Speaker 6 (18:14):
Here is just to make you a bad person, Dan,
I'm not saying that I.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
Did, of course not.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Nor does it make you a bad person to disagree
with me. Absolutely not.
Speaker 6 (18:22):
Those guys that did that to the two girls and
the and the mother of those two girls in Connecticut
that way, Yeah, yeah, they deserve the death penalty story,
But he was still my brother.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
But I understee it but but you look like anything
else when you talk about you know, when when people
will say, well, you're opposed to death, and what happens
if someone does that to your to your mother or
to your father, Well, that's that's an unfair way to
argue the case, because obviously all of us would have
the reaction. You know, if if someone had murdered your
(18:55):
brother in prison, I suspect you would want the you
would want the death penalty for the guy who ward
of your brother.
Speaker 6 (19:00):
Correct, absolutely, absolutely, So that's.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
All I'm saying. Okay, all right, thank you, Paul, Thank
you much, my friend. Appreciate you listen and appreciate you
taking the.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Time to call.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
Have a great probably to talk to you back.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
Absolutely, good night. Let me keep rolling here. I'm going
to get Laurie from Idaho in here real quickly. I'm
interested in what Laurie thinks about this. Laurie, you were
next on nice side your thoughts.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Hi there, Hi there, Well, I am com Hi there.
I'm completely with you on you know, I don't I'm
not offended by the death penalty when it's warranted, and
in cases, in certain cases it is warranted, I think,
but in this most recent case with the United Healthcare guy.
I think it needs to send a message. You've got
all these tonks who do copycat things. They've grown up
(19:43):
on video games with this stuff that I don't know
normal or what I mean. Clearly it's not someone who's
clearly normal health life, mentally health lives. But you need
it needs to be a statement. You know, they've got
to know that they can't get away with it. If
you do this kind of stuff, you're going to be
sitting on death row.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Well, I look, you know they talk about, well, killing
doesn't prevent you know, death penal, an event you know,
is not a deterrent. Well, it's certainly a deterrent for
the person who committed the crime. And I think you're
arguing that there is a deterrent effect to it, and
that people might say, hey, you know, I think maybe not.
(20:22):
And you know, particularly when when you talk about contract murders,
when when somebody convinces somebody pays somebody ten thousand dollars
to kill someone, it's a contract murder.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
I mean, that's well it is.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
And if this guy wasn't you know, mentally disabled, or
he wasn't on drugs at the time, and they all
think they can get away with it. Well, you get
one or two of those younger guys who pulled this stuff,
maybe the copycats aren't going to do it.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Well, this guy, I'm sure, thought he had gotten away
with it. He had got out of the city, he
had planned his escape, he planned his hit on the guy.
I still think he had some information. We'll see if
that comes out in court. I mean, either that he
just was really lucky and he's sitting there waiting for
this guy and whoa, the guy turns the corner in
it and that's the moment that he acts. But I
had my suspicion once it was a while.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Yeah, I think he was charming and he probably chatted
up some people and he got you know, which is
just beyond meditated. So sure, but I think it's set
an example. You know, he should be absolutely exposed. I mean,
he'll be in jail forever, with appeals forever, which they
could limit the appeals, but I can't do that.
Speaker 9 (21:26):
It's the voids.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
And in this.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
Case, this guy's going to have marriage proposals. I mean,
he he has a fan base out there, so he's.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
Going to live.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
A different life from most prisoners. I mean, it's it's
almost like with the kid in Boston, the Boston bomber
number two. They did put his picture was it was
you'll know this more than I was. It put on
the front of Vanity Fair or something with his tossled hair,
and they made him look like a rock star.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Don't read Vanity Fair.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Well, I forget which magazine it was. Someone will know which.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
I don't want to misidentify the magazine, but it was
you know his his.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
Oh yeah, they made him look sexy really seriously.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Yeah, but I think I'm not sure what it was,
so I don't want to but but I I think
it was a magazine like a Vanity Field that normally
wouldn't get it.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
I was it was, I remember seeing it.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
But I don't buy them.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
I see them in the stands of the grocery.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
H I don't buy it.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
But they could limit the appeals, though, I wish they
could not have it drag out so long so that
you know, well, you're going to be dead in less
than three years.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Yeah, well, I think that the and and again I
changed my view on the death penalty. I contracted my
view substantially. When I say there is a standard in
the law, just as there's a standard of beyond.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
A reasonable doubt.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Okay, when I say beyond a satilla of doubt, that's
like no doubt, no doubt. And then when you add
on top of that an additional layer of aggravating circumstances,
you could pretty much now there's there's there's not many crimes,
you know, high profile, even murders that that you fit
(23:05):
with that. I mean someone like a Jeffrey Dahmer where
you find skulls in his refrigerator.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Okay, no, I'm serious, you.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Know, or or the guy that the clown literally the
clown uh in Chicago who had I don't know, twenty
three kids buried in his basement or something. You have
some of these these deranged, insane people who are yeah,
well the guy down the who murdered the allegedly murdered
(23:35):
the he hasn't been convicted yet, uh in Long Island,
down down on whatever the beach is down there a
long Unfortunately, there's there's more of these as possible. Look
at the guy out where you are who murdered, allegedly
murdered the four roommates.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
What was that all about?
Speaker 1 (23:52):
I mean, your people can say, hey, Look, that guy
has to have been insane to have done what he did.
I suspect anyone who kills someone is insane, but when
when they fit in that category of premeditation and deliberation. Uh,
And it's beyond a sintilla of doubt. There's there's no
question who the guy is. We talked about even Harvey.
We were talking last hour, who I respect immensely. We
(24:15):
were talking about Timothy McVeigh, the guy that hit the building,
took the building down in Oklahoma City. I've stood where
that building is and looked at it. He dropped all
his appeals, he dropped all.
Speaker 4 (24:28):
His can give him a great amount of respect for.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Well, you know, I mean in view of I think
it was what one hundred and sixty people who he
killed that day. I mean terrible yeah, so so yeah.
I mean I just think that as a society, there
comes upoint in time where the society has to say,
this is beyond the pale. And as they say, Harvey
stood in the position that once you open that door,
(24:51):
you let that genie out of the bottle, however constricted,
you're going to be still, you know, beyond a beyond
a scintilla of doubt and substantially aggravating circumstances, and I
think that Luigi Mangioni fits in that Category's.
Speaker 4 (25:10):
I respect Harvey. I respect him. It's institutional, it's not emotional,
it's not religious, it's institutional, and I respect that. But
for all the ones that can get rid of if
there's one mistake, which is a horrible thing to say,
but if there's one mistake, that's bad. But apparently it
won't even we won't even tell her that much. And
that's I actually respect him for that.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well, here's the deal. You know, for years and years
and years, the innocence projects searched for a mistake and
they have not. Well now I think they have finally
come up with a case that they would argue was
a mistake. But it's not as if you can go
back into this country when people will get lynched and
(25:47):
they were lynch mobs, and you know that, I would
think that, yeah, they probably were mistakes in the nineteen twenties,
in the nineteen thirties, in the nineteen forties, and some
of them might have been racial mistakes, and yeah, you know,
and and maybe there was there were you know, individuals,
minority individuals, who were wrongfully identified. You certainly know people
(26:09):
have served time in prison for substantial periods of time
who were actually in the case that I work with,
you do you do? Yeah? Where they where they were
intentionally framed by the FBI corrupt FBI agent. So yeah,
that's it's a human situation.
Speaker 7 (26:26):
But Man Luigi process has given them plenty.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
Of time now to get it figured out. I wish
it weren't quite as long a time, but yeah, I
don't know. Something like that, something like this case with
the United health Care And.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
The other thing is that what the left does is,
for example, that they're now saying in Maryland, there was
some guy who was thrown into this situation with the
Trent de Agua gang out of Venezuela, and if there's
a mistake, and I think the administration is now saying
there's some sort of administrative mistake that's insane, get him
out of there, if you have to see the Marines
and to get him.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
Out and bring him back home to family.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
You know, correct if the information is real.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Yeah, I mean there was there were things early they
said there was some then zuel and soccer player, and
there was some barber out of California.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Well, you could be both things.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
You could be a Venzuelan soccer player and a member
of Trone Daguro, however the hell you pronounce it, or
you could be a barber. But if the if these
were not people who were not gang members, they were
not members of this gang, get them out of there,
get them out of there, bring them back home, and
and they should be compensated for the experience they went through.
Whether it's in the case of Joe Silvadie and Peter Lamoni,
(27:37):
thirty or thirty three years, these guys one week down there,
they should get it. They should be compensated for that,
in my opinion anyway.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
But then again, you need all the information because one
of these things the gangs do is infiltrate into places
and pretend that they're I don't know, I don't know,
I don't know. And if you're not here legally, if
if you come in yep, against you know, then you
should just be out period and then come you know,
come back when you when you do that right away
and come on in.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Yeah, but I do think that it might be you
have I think at some point you just can't say, well,
we made a mistake, and unfortunately he's now in El
Salvador and there's nothing we can do. Wait a second,
hold on. All right, hey, Laurie, I got a run.
We got you in before the break, and as always
have one a little longer than I.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
Should, but always enjoy the conversation.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
We'll talk, okay, all right, good night, Thank you, good night.
Here comes the news at the bottom of the air.
I got a couple of open lines here, so come on,
fill him up. Let's go six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty, six, one, seven, nine, three thirty. I got
Jamie and Wooster, I got Dave and San Antonio, and
I got room for.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Three of you. Let's fill him up.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Coming back on Night's Side, death penalty for Luigi MANGIONI.
For me, it's an easy call. I don't have any
conscience qualm about this one at all. I'd love to
hear from you. Coming back on Nightside.
Speaker 10 (28:54):
It's Night Side with Dan Ray on.
Speaker 4 (28:57):
Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
By the way, I want to correct myself. Scott from
West Virginia was correct. I misread what's going on in California.
California voters rejected two initiatives to repeal the death penalty
by popular vote in twenty twelve and twenty sixteen, and
the voters in California narrowly adopted in twenty sixteen another
(29:23):
proposal to expedite its appeal process. On August twenty six,
twenty twenty one, the California State Supreme Court upheld the
state's death penalty rules, though as of twenty twenty four,
executions have yet to resume. So death penalty is on
the books in California, but Governor Newsom has ordered a moratorium,
(29:50):
and should the moratorium end and the freeze conclude, executions
could resume under the current state law. So I misread that,
and California had a history. They carried out seven hundred
and nine execute executions from seventeen seventy eight to nineteen
seventy two, which was in when California did strike down
(30:13):
the state's capital punishment law, and of course that was
followed quickly there after or around that same time Furman
versus Georgia would impose a nationwide band and it was restored.
First execution post Firman carried out in nineteen ninety two,
(30:35):
and since that time there have been thirteen executions, yet
hundreds have been sentenced. The last execution took place in
California in two thousand and six. All right, let's get
back to the calls. Okay, going to next Dave in
San Antonio, Texas. Dave, go right ahead, sir.
Speaker 9 (30:54):
How you doing Dan?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
I'm doing great, Dave. What's your thought on this?
Speaker 9 (30:58):
Well? I think that uh, your friend's logic is uh,
it's it's extreme logic. And you can look at like
a policeman goes up to a confrontation, a man's pointing
of a rifle right ahead of a young lady, defenseless,
(31:20):
young lady. He's not shooting yet, what do you do?
You come up, you know, your car, and you look
at you see what do you do? Your shoot?
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (31:33):
That that that's not that. That is not the state
conducting an execution. That is an officer of the law
seeing someone's life in danger, and he has to make
a very difficult decision.
Speaker 9 (31:48):
So very difficult decision, that's what it is. And very
difficult decisions are made all the time in this world,
and sometimes they're wrong. But uh, there is no that
does not give any that's no argument against putting to
(32:11):
death all of these murderers that do murder people and
hurt people's.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
Well again, Yeah, as they say, I'm arguing I think
a limited death penalty by saying that when there is
no people get convicted beyond a reasonable doubt. So you
can have you know, you could have a doubt in
the case as long as it's.
Speaker 2 (32:36):
You know, it's it's, it's, it's, it's.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
It's not beyond a reasonable doubt. Is the standard to
convict that there's there's no reasonable doubt you might have
the vacuum. Well, I'm really not completely sure. I'm saying
beyond the scintilla of doubt, and that's a legal standard
that means there's no question. Abe Lincoln was the sixteenth
President of the United States. That is a fact that's
beyond a scintilla of doubt. And then also aggravating circumstances.
(33:03):
I'm looking at this kid, Lewis Luigi Mangione, a child
of privilege, who decided to shoot a guy in the
back in midtown Manhattan last December fourth. See you, I
consider that to be an aggravating circumstance, just by by
virtue of the way in which the murder was was
(33:23):
carried out. Yeah, I assume you agree with me on
that one.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
I do, yes, good, all right, that's all.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
I as long as I got you on my side,
that's all.
Speaker 9 (33:37):
I just feel that that that logical argument is heartless
to humanity because I believe a preposterous majority of us
agree that those vicious people should be.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
I mean, Jeffrey Dama, he killed a whole bunch of people,
and I think he was wasn't he the cannibal?
Speaker 2 (33:59):
And then you had the guy what was his name?
Speaker 1 (34:02):
Lacy, the clown in Illinois, the clown killer who killed
twenty kids. He had him buried in his basement.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
Yeah yeah, oh.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
I mean you know, John Wayne Gacy was the kids?
Was the guy's name? If I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 9 (34:20):
We have a serial killer here in Texas who's got
one hundred naches on his gun?
Speaker 2 (34:26):
Really and he is he is? He in prison?
Speaker 9 (34:30):
I don't think he's alive now, but he was. He
had one hundred notches on his gun.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
And was he executed?
Speaker 9 (34:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Yeah, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
John Wayne Gacy was an American serial killer and sex
offender who raped, tortured, and murdered at least thirty three
young men and boys in Norwood Park township near Chicago.
He became known as the Killer Clown due to his
public performances as a clown prior to the discovery.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Of the Clown of the Crimes.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Yeah, let me tell you there's some weird dudes out there, Dave.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
I hate to do this to you, but I'm up
in my break.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
I gotta let you go. Thank you, my friend. Appreciate it.
Speaker 9 (35:03):
Good night, Bob, very much.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
Right night, Good night.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Okay, we got Jeff and Marblehead and Jamie coming up.
We got a little room for you if you'd like
to join the conversation. We'll finish it off between now
and midnight. Coming back on Night Side. I think it's
been an interesting conversation and I hope you agree. Any
conversation that makes me think, and every time I talk
with Harvey Silverglate, I have to think, uh, makes it
a good night for me. I hope it's been a
good night for you. Back on Nightside after this, you're
(35:30):
on Night Side with Dan Ray.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
I'm WAZ Boston's News Radio.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
Let's keep Rowland here. We're gonna go next to Jamie
and Worcester. Jamie, I appreciate your patience. You next on Nightside, Jamie,
go right.
Speaker 11 (35:42):
Ahead, yeah, I one in agreement with Lee, Jim and Joni.
Uh pull the push by body for Joni's execution. But
what a puzzle me is shouldn't have a hierarchy lists
of people that committed crimes that are worse before him,
(36:05):
like the Marathon bomber or something like that.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
I'm the Marathon bomber is on death row, and I
think that once his appeals are exhausted, and I'd like
to see them exhausted quickly, I think he should go
be able to join his brother. And wherever the hell
his brother is. I think there's a whole bunch of people.
I talk about the doctor in Connecticut who was his family.
(36:29):
He was at home with his wife and two daughters.
These two lifelong criminals broke into the house to rob them.
They tied the girls up in a bed, and they
raped the wife, and they put the husband downstairs. They
didn't kill him, but they incapacitated him, tied him up.
After they raped the wife, they took her to a
(36:52):
bank to make a withdrawal. She somehow communicated with one
of the tellers that she needed some help. The teller
knew who she was. I was to tell her when
she left, called the police. She got home and all
of a sudden, the killers looked out the window. They
realized the police were outside.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
So these.
Speaker 1 (37:10):
I don't want to say the word of the radio
because I might get in trouble. But these sobs delved
the children's bed with gasoline. It was in Chesshire, Connecticut.
Lit the house on fire by lighting the beds on fire.
Killed the girls obviously, and they put caught running from
the house. I mean, what's the you know, no question,
it's beyond us until her of doubt. And they're aggravating circumstances.
(37:35):
They are the posted post a man post the boys
for the death penalty.
Speaker 11 (37:40):
Well yeah, because I'm just saying like, if you gotta
do it, you gonna start like cramp it down on
the death penalty. Because it's death penally is dragged on
every case forever. There should be a hierarchy of you know,
people on that list, Like give me the top ten
people that deserved the can and go from the top down.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
You know what I'm saying, Well.
Speaker 1 (38:04):
Again I'm giving you, you know Luigioni here, Luigi Maggioni,
the Boston bomber, the surviving Boston bomber.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
These guys in.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Knnecticut, and I'm sure there are plenty of others who
engage in murders that there's.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
No question, there's no scintilla.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Of doubt about their guilt and their aggravating circumstances. You
need both under my sir, under my theory or my formula.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
You need both.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
Okay, and then you say nice knowing you we'll see
in the next life. Right, all right, Jamie, thanks much, man,
We'll talk soon.
Speaker 11 (38:46):
Okay, Okay, yeah, thank you, have a good night.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Thank you for your time. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Jeff in Marblehead, Jeff, you're gonna wrap us up tonight,
A right ahead, Jeff.
Speaker 10 (38:54):
Okay, So I want to go back to your comments
on the people that end up in ol South and
what I think is happening. It shouldn't be there, probably,
and I one they think the Trump people admitted it
shouldn't be here, and you were saying if necessarily sending
the Marines. I think a call from Trump to the
president of.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Oh, yeah, you don't need them. I was using that
tongue in cheek a little bit. I think the President
of Al Salvador met with the Secretary of State and
I believe Al Salvador is getting a hunk of money,
uh to confine these guys, which is fine. They got
this beautiful, big prison down there. And I suspect that
(39:35):
if they said, hey, look we made a mistake and
we sent a couple of people down who are not
members of the gang, would you release them? I don't
think the president of El Salvador would be posted that
for a second, do you It.
Speaker 8 (39:48):
Would take a simple call. But my point I'm going
to make if I don't think Trump will ever make
a call like that. You know, one of the objections
I have to the Trump administration is they will never
admit their run. You know, good companies, good people.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
You know John F.
Speaker 10 (40:03):
Penny, when the Bay of Pigs was a disaster, Yes,
I'm responsible a disaster. It won't happen again. Ronald Reagan,
you know, yes we you know, I have to acknowledge
we did send arms for hostages and Iran, and you know.
Speaker 8 (40:17):
It won't happen again. And you Frump and its people
never seem to do that. You know, look at the
similar thing with the meaning that you know included the
Atlantic magazine and was done online. You know, just I'd
just loved to see one person that works in the
corn administration say.
Speaker 10 (40:34):
Yeah, we screwed up. It's not going to happen again,
instead of you know, oh, we didn't discuss things were
that sensitive, and well I do.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
I do.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
I do think the only one that comes to mind,
and I agree with you, there's a lot of people.
I firmly believe that when I goof up, as I
just told you, I goofed up and misread something on
the death penalty in California.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
I think that.
Speaker 1 (40:56):
By acknowledging that you actually gain credibility. And I think
that I believe that the Mike Waltz, the National Security advisor.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
Whose whose phone it was, the.
Speaker 1 (41:10):
One that that I think set up the call the
signal gave call of the signal call, I think he
admitted uh and and said it was his mistake.
Speaker 10 (41:19):
So well he did right after attacking the Atlantic journalist
is a low life.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
And yeah, no I'm not look, I think I'm not defend. Yeah,
he had not his fault.
Speaker 1 (41:34):
It would be like if all of a sudden you
called me and it's like you know you you know, yeah, No,
I'm with you on that one. And I think that
I think i'd like to see more politicians has has
a little.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Elizabeth Warren, ever ever said she's wrong on anything that
you can think of.
Speaker 8 (41:49):
I'm probably not.
Speaker 2 (41:51):
And yeah, right, brus of a feather, I.
Speaker 8 (41:54):
Don't think Biden joined the club.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
Yeah, hey, Jeff, I hate to do this to you,
but I'm out of time, so I gotta let you go.
But thank you and I enjoyed the conversation. I hope
you call more often. Okay, thank you very much. I'm
done for the night. All dogs, Rob Brooks, thank you, Marita,
thank you, All dogs, all cats, all pets go to heaven.
That's Mike Pal Charlie Rays, who passed fifteen years ago
in February. That's where all your pets are who had passed.
(42:18):
They loved you and you love them. I do believe
you'll see them again. Hope to see again the Moore
Night on Night's side. Have a great Wednesday everyone. I
will be on Facebook Night s Out with Dan Ray
in a couple of minutes and I'll review the show.
We had a good show tonight. Thanks everyone,
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