July 30, 2025 • 36 mins
Longtime Plymouth County District Attorney Tim Cruz has been elected President of the National District Attorneys Association, where he will lead others to address critical issues in the criminal justice system. Dan spoke with Cruz about his new position and a new ruling by the Massachusetts Supreme Court on "emerging adults" and life without parole.
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You can hear NightSide with Dan Rea, Live! Weeknights From 8PM-12AM on WBZ - Boston's News Radio.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
It's Night Side with Dan Ray on w b Z,
Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Well, welcome back everyone. I am delighted to bring back
to the nightside microphones the Plymouth County District Attorney. He's
been there for a few years, I think working on
at least twenty something at this point. District Attorney Tim Cruz,
how are you tonight?
Speaker 3 (00:25):
I'm doing great, Dan, Thanks for having me back.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
You've been da down there for twenty years approximately.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
In November twenty five, wo man, I'll.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Tell you time flies when having fun, that's for sure.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Definitely.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
You had just been elected president of the National District
Attorney's Association, which is really, you know, quite an honor.
Tell us about that organization. I want to learn a
little bit more about what your duties will involve, and
also maybe some of the you're going to. We had
(01:00):
some FaceTime with some of the officials in Washington that
you wouldn't get as a mere district attorney from Plymouth County,
although you certainly should because of your longevity. But tell
us a little bit about this position. It's quite an honor.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
No, you're right, it really is an honor, especially following
the many great leaders that we've had in that role.
This is the seventy fifth year of the National DA's Association,
and like I said, I'm grateful to be able to
follow the disc attorney from San Diego summer. Stephan was
the president prior to me, but you know, before her,
a couple presidents. But John Blog of Messis County did
(01:36):
a tremendous job as a president of the NDAA and
I was able to watch, but John did what other
people did in that role and trying to promote the
NDAA and really what it is. It's a national voice
for prosecutors. And I'm hopeful that as we continue to
work forward in these you know, challenging times that we're
dealing with, they were going to be able to continue
(01:56):
to support We're going to be able to continue to
elevate the work of DA's nation and wide. Can remember
our focus, you know, what are we focusing on as
disc attorneys. We're focusing on victims centered justice, innovation and
public safety and sustainable solutions to the emerging community challenges.
Because disc attorney's offices now are so very different than
they were back when I started out as an assistant
(02:17):
DA more than forty years ago. I often say that
we're not your grandparents DA's office anymore. The things that
we do in the front end, the things that we
do in the back end, and the overall mission to
promote public safety and to make sure that we can
keep people safe and also hold people accountable for their actions.
It's a really fine line that you have to juggle,
I think sometimes understanding that you know what it is
(02:40):
what you're doing. Of course, I become president. I became
president of the NBAA about two weeks back in Kansas
City when I was sworn in. But I'm still the
Plymouth County DA and i still have my duties and
responsibilities here in Plymouth County, and I'm really looking forward
to sharing the work that the people in my office
have done to my fellow Colleaguechusetts have done, you know,
(03:01):
showing here's what we're doing in Massachusetts, here's what's working,
and take take what we have, take what we have
to offer, and we'd also like to get and learn
from you. What are best practices, How can we make
our communities better, How can we make our community safer?
How can we go forward from there? And I think
that when I look at the programs that we have,
you know, whether it be you know, human trafficking issues
(03:22):
or organized retail crime issues, or dealing with drugon danger children,
kids who average child experiences. It's such a large spectrum
of things that we're dealing with now that it really
makes me proud to work with the people in my
office and now continuing to work with the people accrass
the nation.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
It's interesting because obviously in your organization, I think when
we talked today, you said there are some six thousand members,
and you now are the head of six thousand nationwide prosecutors,
which represent about twenty five hundred agencies. Now, different states
have we have district attorneys, uh in our in our
(04:01):
counties here. Other states have county attorneys. So it's each
state is a little different, but the concept is the same.
There are there are chief law enforcement offices. Obviously, each
state has a single attorney general who's elected statewide. I
(04:21):
think in every state. There may be some states. I
think in New Hampshire actually I believe the attorney general
is appointed by Yeah, so I mean different. What people
don't understan What people need to understand is that different
states constitutions apply differently. But when you get to this
group of prosecutors. You're all prosecutors who are responsible for
(04:47):
doing justice. You know, public safety and concern for victims
is forefront I know in your mind, But there are
some district attorneys around the country who have kind of
strayed from what you and I would think of as
the primary role of a district attorney. How cohesive is
your organization? Obviously there are Democrats and Republicans, and I'm
(05:11):
sure that there are some extremes on both ends. But
are most of the people who hold these positions. Are
most of them cut from the same philosophical cloth as
people like you and John Blogert.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Yeah, I think we are in the National DAS Organization.
There are other prostratorial agencies that are out there that
may be a little bit different, but there's certainly not
the NDAA. I think that you know, as navigating your
way through the differences from different states and also dealing
with the different issues and like you said, the different constitutions,
(05:45):
I mean, as being the long Republican disc attorney here
in Massachusetts. I've been navigating similar waters for a long
time and trying to make sure that we can promote
what we're doing. And because I really believe that most
of the DA's that I know anyways, we all have
the same goal. I think we want to promote public safety.
I think we want to keep people safe. I think
(06:06):
that we have some of us have different avenues of
getting there, and I don't always agree with them. I'll
respectfully listen to them, but I think that what I'm
trying to do here with this is once again promote
public safety and promote victims and giving voices to people
who don't normally have them. I think that's really our
job is to stand out there and when we see
(06:27):
something that's not right, say something. Our job is not
to stand back in the shadows and the comfort of
the shadows where perhaps you're going to let some things occur.
I think we have to go out, We have to
say things, and we have to let people understand what
is what we do. And at the NDAA, you know
we're dealing. Our mission is quite simply to provide the
state and local prostitutes with knowledge, skills, and support that
(06:49):
they need to make sure that justice is done and
that public safety rights are protected. And we do that
in a variety of ways, whether it be you know,
through training or publications, We have more than the trainings
and conferences every year through the NDAA. We have technical
assistance for prostitutes across America. We have publications, we have advocacy.
I think, you know, it's really a great cohesive group
(07:11):
of people. And what I've seen anyways in my years
is being on the board of the NBAA, because I've
been the state director, then i was a vice president,
and now I've been the president president elect last year
and now I'm president. I really see a lot of
men and women who are trying to go in the
right direction to keep people safe. And that's why it
really is an honor to be in this role, so
(07:31):
that I can go forward and try to be their
face and go talk to people like you said that
maybe normally I wouldn't be in a position to talk
to talk about, you know, really our congressional priorities and
what can we do to make our job better and make.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
That's also so you have you have some trips coming up.
I'm sure into different parts of the country you're going
to You're going to build up some air miles, that's
for sure. I want to talk about that. I also
want to talk a little bit about a case here
in Massachusetts that I know you're quite concerned about a
very interesting Supreme Court decision of two or three years ago,
(08:08):
which people probably not aware of. And also I want
to get back to what you hope to accomplish. You
as a leader of this organization, are going to have
the opportunity to to interface with the administration. And I
know that there have been some monies that the administration
(08:32):
probably has used a hack saw to cut off, and
maybe scalpel would be better, So we'll get to some
of that, and also phone callers if people would like
to ask my guest, Plymouth County District Attorney and president
now of the National District Attorney's Association, Tim Cruz, a
question or comment. Six one, seven, two, five four ten
(08:52):
thirty six one seven nine three one ten thirties a
Republican district attorney in Massachusetts in a state that an
overwhelmingly democratic state. And I think that is testimony to
the job that he has done for the people of
Plymouth County to be elected and re elected so many times.
Now about to celebrate his twenty fifth year in that office.
(09:15):
We'll be back on nights side. The numbers is always
six one seven, two, five, four, ten, thirty six, one, seven, nine, three, one,
ten thirty. I've over the years got to know district
attorneys very well here in Massachusetts, John Blodgett, Bill Della Hunt,
Dan Conley, Joe Early out in Worcester. And I think
that for the most part, Massachusetts has some district attorneys
(09:39):
who who do look at it in a similar fashion,
and that is to prosecute the guilty uh and also
try to help victims recover. There are some district attorneys
around the country who do not, in my opinion, embody
those ideals, but focus on the positive. And if you'd
(10:02):
like to ask a question or make a comment, you
are more than welcome. You have the numbers. My name's
Dan Ray, and this is Nightside on WBZ Boston's news radio.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
You're on Night Side with Dan Ray on w b
Z Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
All right, back with District of Plymouth County District Attorney
Tim Cruz. Let's talk about you as the head of
the National District Attorney's Association. You're a Republican, and there's
a Republican in the White House and a Republican Attorney General.
And I know that there's concern about some programs that
(10:38):
really are intended to help victims that you're going to
be advocating for. How much. How do you intend to
approach this with the administration.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
Well, we're working on that now and I think that
you know, we have an executive working group where the
National das will meet every year that hopefully twice a
year with the NAG the National Association of Attorney General
as well as with the Department of Justice, and generally
last year when I was at the Attorney General showed
up and we're trying to have a sit down with
the Attorney General of the people that may and the
(11:09):
powers that may be down there in Washington, d C.
Regarding some of the things that are important to us.
And one of the things is public service loan forgiveness,
which is really important because it's so difficult nowadays, especially
where individuals, you know, young men and women who work
for us can go out and make some real money
and other places not going to the public sector, and
(11:30):
the loan forgiveness program is really something that we can
keep people in for an extended period of time. They
can also work down their debt while they're working for us,
So it's important I think that right now that program
is still active and payments is still being made documented,
but we have to make sure, because this hearing is
going on now in DC, we have to make sure
that the prosecutor's loan forgiveness is not thrown out or
(11:53):
taken away because of the fact that makes a real
difference in people keep people safe and having lawyers in
the court room who are going to get paid less moneys,
but they're also going to be in a position where
they can have that loan taken down. So I think
that's really important because we are having and striving to
deal with retention and recruitment, not just in Plymouth County
(12:14):
or it not just in the comwell from Massachusetts. We're
having retention and recruitment problems for prosecutors across America. And
as a result of that, also we're trying to get
the appropriate support from bipin US and support for getting
involved with the Higher Act. Higher Act is the Higher
Prosecutors Act is the helping improve recruitment and retention efforts
for Higher and what it is is providing federal assistant
(12:37):
to local prosecutors officers and insisting hiring, retaining, and the
training of prosecutor and staff. So we're finalizing some Senate
sponsors right now down in DC, and we're hopeful that
we're going to be able to have that introduced prior
to August. So those are That's one of the really
big things that we're dealing with right now across the
country is trying to keep our lawyers on board because
(12:58):
many times, and it's not usual, a young lawyer will
come in, they'll stay for two or three years, they'll
get some good experience, they'll be really good lawyers in
the courtroom, and then of course, you know, life goes on,
you need to make more money. This is something that
we're hopeful that if we are allowed to keep it,
and I'm hopeful they're going to be able to convince
the administration for us to keep it. If we can
do that, I think it'll be a positive thing keeping
(13:20):
young lawyers so that they can do their job. And
it's a job that they love too. When you talk
to a lot of these young men and women, when
they leave, they don't want to leave, they want to stay,
they want to do good. They want to make sure
that they're doing the right thing. And I think that's
really important. That's probably our top priority through the NBA
right now.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
But a lot of those young prosecutors who learn to
know their way around the courtroom when they're leaving, they're
leaving in many cases to become defense lawyers because they
have known what the pressing control side of the street,
and now they have that knowledge as defense lawyers. And
nothing wrong with being a defense lawyer, nothing wrong with
(13:59):
being a but when you switch teams, it's as opposed
to play offense, you're playing defense, and it's the same game,
but you're kind of playing for the other team, and
you you basically as a as a prosecutor's office, you
are training young lawyers to really become defense lawyers because
(14:20):
there's no private practice for prosecutors defense ironically something to
think about.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Yeah, no it is, and you know what it's not.
It's happened before that somebody would have left on a
Friday and on Monday. They may be working for either
a firm or they may have their own firm at
that time, but they just started up on Monday. So
I understand that going in we all understand that. I
think all our das here in the comwell and across
America understand that that's always going to happen. But there
(14:50):
are some men and women that really love the job
and really want to make a difference, and they are
making a difference, but they don't they can't sacrifice everything,
and what nominal help they can get through the public
sect for loan forgiveness is something that really can we
can stretch to keep them for a little bit longer
period of time. So I think that, you know, I'm
hopeful that we're going to be able to get that done.
(15:11):
We have other, you know, priorities also that we're going
to be talking about down in DC when we do
have that meeting whenever that may occur, And like I said,
we're going to go down there and we are really
a nonpartisan group going down there talking about how this
affects prosecutors across America. And I think that people done
in DC right now, I believe really are on the
(15:33):
side of law enforcement and public safety, and I'm hopeful
that we're going to be successful in making make sure
we can salvage the PSFL.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
Yeah, I want to pivot off that point. We've got
to go for breaking news, but when we get back,
I want to talk to you one about a case
here in Massachusetts, wis I know you're not happy about
nor am I happy about the Madness decision, the State
Supreme Court decision of a couple of years ago. And
(16:00):
I also want to ask you whether or not you
think that the atmospherics on crime and punishment have changed
in the last year or two. In the wake of
the George Floyd murder back in twenty twenty, the country
shifted and had great empathy and antagonism, empathy for people
(16:25):
who were being arrested. We saw some pretty ugly scenes
across the country in the wake of the Floyd murder,
and that is something that troubled everyone, in my opinion,
And I'd like to know if maybe things have changed
a little bit, if the atmospherics have changed a little
bit here across the country, and if maybe in view
(16:47):
of what happened in New York City on Monday, we're
an off duty police officer was gunned down by a
guy who drove across the country. Obviously, with all sorts
of issues, you have these incidents that just seemed to
occurring that people are appalled by the Walmart incident in
Travis City, Michigan, over the weekend I'm just wondering if
(17:07):
you feel that the the atmosphere, the legal atmosphere of
this country is changing, and I want and I want
to also talk about the Madness case here in Massachusetts,
so and invite our callers. They are more than welcome.
This is an opportunity for you to talk directly, folks,
to a district attorney, a very influential district attorney who
has even become more influential as the president of the
(17:30):
National District Attorney's Association. Six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty seven eighty one nine three one ten thirty.
Back right after the news at the bottom of the hour.
Speaker 1 (17:40):
You're on Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm w b
Z Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
So our numbers are six one, seven two, five four,
ten thirty and six one, seven, nine three one ten thirty.
I might have slipped the seven eight one in there.
Please don't call that six one seven nine three one
ten thirty sou District Attorney Tim Cruse. Is it your
sense that maybe the when I say political atmosphere, I'm
(18:07):
really not talking about Republican or Democrat. I'm talking about
kind of the political slash legal atmosphere that people had
great sympathy and they had understanding for excesses in terms
of what happened in twenty twenty in reaction to the
George Floyd murder by that police officer who, as far
(18:29):
as I'm concerned, you know, should spend the rest of
his life in jail. But that's my own personal comment
on that one or in prison? Do you appeel? I
just have a sense things are changing here, particularly in
view of what happened to the young police officer yesterday
and what happened out in Minnesota or rather than Michigan
on Saturday, where civilians interceded and stopped this guy who
(18:53):
had stabbed eleven people. Now the guy was crazy, I
don't think there's any question about that, but it still
takes some courage for civilians to stand up and say
stop it, drop the knife. And there was one guy
who had a gun. By the way, you were deployed
at the guy. Do you think the atmosphere is changing?
I do?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
I think, you know, back because that was also during
the course of COVID too, which was just a different
time period, especially when when COVID first came down, the
rest were down significantly because nobody knew really what the
disease was. And I think other than other than the
most serious crimes, there are a lot of people were
(19:32):
getting away with things, which I think exacerbated the feeling.
Back then, people felt that they could do what they want.
It was a feeling of some instance of lawlessness. They
could do, go into a store, take what they wanted.
It didn't really matter. And now I think you see
that changing, and I think the pendulum is what I
referred to it as, is coming back a little bit.
I think, you know, we live in that world of pendulum.
(19:53):
We're goes back and forth, each way left and right,
and sometimes it's in the middle. I think it's going back.
But I truly believe people just want to be safe.
People want to be left alone. I think every day,
like all these terrible cases you're talking about, there's always
going to be these individuals, whether they're lone wolves or not,
who are out there conducting themselves in a harmful way
to other people. And people are looking at that. And
(20:15):
I think the more and more people nowadays, in my opinion,
they want to be safe. They look at a bad
situation and they're wondering why many times why isn't somebody
doing something about that? Where is the leadership amongst us
right now? Where is the persons in change who are
going to stop these things? And that's why I think
what we've seen, like in the National das and also
(20:36):
the maths days and organized retail stuff task forces where
we're going after individuals who are walking into stores, people
who are not necessarily from this country, walking into usually
it's the Saphoras and other makeup places where they can
get small items there are a lot of money and
steal and walk out and be held unaccountable. That to
me just doesn't work, and so we've got to task force. Now.
(20:58):
We've been incredibly successful the last year or so, so
much that individuals realize now that if they come to
our county, if we catch you, we're going to prosecute you.
And I don't care if it cost me ten thousand
dollars to prosecute a one thousand dollar case. You need
to understand if you do that, we will hold you accountable.
I'm a firm believer in broken windows. I think that
it works, and I think that if you go after
(21:19):
the small group of individuals who are committing the vast
material of the crime, you will watch your numbers go down.
It's just common sense. I've seen it time and time
again going that way.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Well, I agree with you, and some of the days
that I mentioned earlier, whether the Democrats or Republicans have
always been on the same page as you have been.
But you know, we had Rachel Rollins, the US attorney
here at a list of crimes that she says she's
not going to prosecute it. I think one of them
was up to nine hundred dollars of theft. So if
you owned a small madego somewhere in the city of
(21:49):
Boston and people were walking in walking out with a
couple of one hundred bucks of stuff five or six
times a day, they went your profit margin, you out
of business pretty soon. And that seemed to me At
that point, I said, where are we going with this? Now?
There's a case in Massachusetts on a more serious basis
that I want to get to. But I also want
(22:10):
to incorporate some callers for us. So let's take a call.
We will get to the Matters case, I promise, because
that's one that has been under the radar screen and
it's one that you feel very strongly about. Let me
go to Vincent in Brockton. Vincent, you're on with Plymouth
County District Attorney Tim Cruz. Go ahead, Vincent, good evening.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Hi, Hi, A really quick question.
Speaker 4 (22:40):
What advice will you give to somebody who wants to
go to a law school and the follies?
Speaker 3 (22:46):
What advice wight you to somebody who wants to go
to law school in the forties? I would say, if,
if you, if you, It's gonna be a lot of work,
and I think it would be an incredible challenge. But
I think you can definitely do it if you're interested
in doing that, if you really want to make a
different I can't think of a better role in today's
community than a lawyer who has the opportunity to go
(23:06):
to court and to file paperwork, petitions, whatever it may be,
stand up on behalf of individuals maybe accused the crimes,
or prosecute people who haveviolated the laws. I think that
there's a great opportunity. You got to take the LFAT
I get to get into a law school, and then
after that it would take either three years or four
years if you go night. But if you really have
that feeling, I think the fact that you have if
(23:27):
you're forty years old. I think that should be irrelevant.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
Tim, what Rother, Victor Vincent. Let me ask you this
question if I could. What sort of a career are
you in right now? And what prompts your interest in law.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
School education right now?
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Are you a teacher?
Speaker 3 (23:49):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (23:50):
Okay? Have you investigated any of the law schools in
Massachusetts that might be able to work with you?
Speaker 4 (24:00):
Yes, New England and Law and you must law.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Those. Look, every one of those law schools, those both
you mentioned are well accredited.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
And there are people coming out of law schools. One
law school that I think is uh, is exceptional. It's
it's up in John Blodgett's neck of the woods, up
in and over the Massachusetts School of Law. Now that's
a bit of a haul from Brockton, that's for sure.
So you want to find a law school that geographically works.
(24:33):
But any certified law school, Uh, if you apply yourself,
you will learn enough and take a good you know,
l s, a t review course, you know, so you'll
you'll have you'll you'll know going in what it's like,
and then take Tim. My advice to anyone coming out
of law school is take the best bar review course
(24:55):
you can you can take because oftentimes you learn some
of the practical things of the bar exam in the
bar review course that you never got in three or
four years of law school.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Am I right or wrong on that, mister, You're absolutely right.
I mean it's really important to make sure you learn
as much as you can. I agree with the bar
review courses and when you take the bar I tell
the young men and women who come to my office
if they're going to be working in our office too,
don't work during that time period you're going to get
you most likely you graduated in May. The first barer
(25:27):
exam after that is July. Just focus on that because
you don't want to take it again. You want to
do it one time, make it one and done, and
do it in that fashion. And I think if you
focus on it, I think you can do it. There's
a lot of good people out there. And also you
know the New England school laws a great school. Suffered
school laws a great school They both have night programs
that you can also probably acclimate us to what you're doing.
(25:48):
What you're doing to work during the day or teacher
during the day and go to school at night. I've
had young kids in my office who weren't lawyers, but
they would going to law school at night. They would
work for me during the day and go to It
was a grind for them. Let you know what they
did it And I think you're turning into real good lawyers.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
And Vincent, the only advice I'd give you. I went
to law school a long time ago, Boston University Law School,
and I did it the traditional way of basically working
part time but going full time during the day and
getting it over with in three years. And it was
a grind. But think about the geography, how far you'll
have to go, and if there's a law school that
(26:26):
is closer to you. It doesn't matter whether you go
to Harvard, BCBU, Suffolk, Northeastern, New England School of Law,
you Mass down in Dartmouth, our Mass School of Law
up in and Over. You get a good legal education
and you'll have you can pass the bar. Believe me,
you can pass the bar as long as you get
(26:47):
three or four or four years of law school. And
who knows, maybe you're in Brockton. Someday you may be
applying for a job in the District Attorney Cruiser's office.
Not too long for that.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Okay, good many you guys, Thank.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
You, thanks, thank you. That's a great question.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
Thank really yeah, really, good night, good night.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
I hope you. I hope you follow your dream. Vincent,
I thank you.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
Thank God.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
All right, Uh, Tim, We're gonna take a quick break.
I got some other calls. I do want to get
to the matters case as well. You know it really well,
and I want the public to understand that as well,
because unfortunately we are now leading in this uh this
surrender if you will to interesting philosophical theories which are
(27:33):
founded in as you say, emerging science. Six one seven, two,
five four ten thirty or six one seven, nine three
one ten thirty. My name is Dan Ray. I'm talking
the honor of talking with the Plymouth County District Attorney,
Tim Cruz, but who is also now the president of
the National Association of District Attorneys, the National District Attorneys Association.
(27:56):
He is the number one guy in that person in
that organization. We'll be back on night side if you
have a question, and that question from Vincent was a
good one, But if you have any question, there's no
such thing as a dumb question in my mind, when
you're talking about legal issues. Back in Nightside after.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
This Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Right we are talking with Plymouth County DA Tim Cruise.
Let me get one more quick call in here for you, Tim,
and then we're going to go to the madness case quickly.
Jason and Waltham. Jason next on Nightside with Plymouth County
DA District Attorney Tim Cruse, who is now the National
District Attorney's Association President.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Go ahead, Jason, Yes, Dan, thank you for having me.
Speaker 4 (28:42):
And I don't know if you remember me and.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Sheriff.
Speaker 4 (28:46):
Yes, still haven't got in thet but I'm still trying,
and I'm I'm glad i've called in today.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Where were you trying? Where are you trying to get in? Jason?
I know that you're you're a young conservative, you told me,
and you're trying to get.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
In touch with whom so im get in touch with
sheriff uh, the Norfolk Sheriff Department. I had a meeting
with the ABS six, but he hasn't followed back yet.
I'm gonna give him a few times another. They got
a recovery first coming up. I will be attending to
that to volunteer and hopefully I could have a side
(29:18):
conversation with him or somebody, but I'm okay.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
So you were looking just I don't want to catch
the distric attorney. I want him to understand you're recovering
alcoholic or an attic. Did you have a recovery program?
Speaker 4 (29:34):
No, So basically I went off the wrong part when
I came to America at twelve years old. I went
in trouble in an out job, but now run a
successful real estate business. I just wanted to give back
to those inmates because I understand whether yet in some
of the issue they have is financial literacy.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
They don't have that.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
The result back to the thing with Okay, let me
let me introduce you to two district attorney Cruise Tim.
I've talked to this on one two or three times
and he sounds like the real deal to me, and
he's trying to help people who are working back into
the system. I don't know. Are you working full time, Jason.
Speaker 4 (30:12):
No, I'm not so right now I'm running my success,
my rested business. But I'm a gentleman that we just
called in previously by asking that lawyer. So I've been
trying to help people so much that I'm willing to
go back to law school myself. I'm in a financial
situation where I don't have to work. I will pay
it for the low school out of pocket, but I
feel like that doesn't not open enough for me. So
I'm gonna go back to school, get back credentials, and
(30:34):
force my way into the courtroom and represent those individuals
because I've been let me.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Do this, Let me do this, Jason, Jason, let me
do this. And I'm going to ask him, Tim, could
I have Rob give you this fellow's number. He is
somebody who seems to me to be somebody who's really
trying to give back on a positive way. I want
to I don't want to, uh let you go without
talking about the madness case. Could you have somebody in
(31:01):
your office reach out to him and maybe guide him
a little bit?
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Yeah? Sure, And we have you know, our Sharp Downaway
has great re entry programs dealing with individuals who the
people who are in custody are going to get released again,
and a lot of them they need educational help, they
need parenting help, they need dragging out cahol help, and
and I think those are things that if we want
to keep people from recinibating again. We need to make
sure that we continue to help them when they get
(31:26):
back on the real world, so they get a great idea.
Pant his efforts.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Okay, Jason, leave your daytime phone number, uh, and Rob
will give it to the DA and he'll have somebody
from his office talk to you and try to guide
you both geographically, to get you to some group, some
office that you can be of assistance to and maybe
even give you a little bit of advice of going
to law school.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
Okay, it sounds good.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
I didn't get just to ask my question by next time, though,
Thank you so much, and I'll hold on.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Please hold on. Do you want to ask the DA
a quick question? Is that what you're looking to do?
Speaker 3 (31:58):
Yeah? I wanted to ask that quo quick question.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
So, just like the gentleman before, I want to go
back to law school, right, and there's a I'm willing
to pay for outside my out of pocket. I have
the financial resources. But the thing is, though, how do
I go about getting myself into a position. And I
hear everything about the probably defenders quit they don't they
don't make enough money. I understand all that, but also
(32:23):
I want to help those individuals because I've been in
the situation myself where I had a public defender, I
hired him by my ears to another public defender, have
them have him take a plea, do me a favor,
I have him take a plea, so this could so
this mad client could get away. So basically those trading
inmates trading clients. So I hid that and the Syney
(32:44):
several times in Georgia, even in Massachusetts. So I want
to get in the court room and stop that kind
of nasense because most people who get in public defenders
they don't know any better. They don't go to the
law library. They're in their place.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
Is a huge question that you just asked the I
think that again, in view of what I'm trying to
do here, can we have I just want to have
someone from his office contact you and get a conversation
going privately. I think it could be more effective that way.
Speaker 4 (33:12):
I think you I appreciated that.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
Hooto. Okay, Tim, you'll be able to get someone to
talk to him in the next day yourself. Great, Okay,
let's talk about the Madus case. I know it's tied
on time here, but I know there's something you feel deeply.
Speaker 3 (33:23):
About well, the Madus case came down in twenty twenty four,
and just summing it up quickly that the four to
three decision from the Supreme Judicial Court determined that life
without parole sentences are unconstitutional as applied to emerging adults.
That's the individuals from the ages of eighteen and twenty
at the time of the crime. Now eighteen nineteen and
(33:44):
twenty in Massachusetts, you are an adult. You are in
the majority. And the SJAC made this determination, made this
bright line distinction that if you followed in those three
years eighteen nineteen or twenty that you are going to
get a parole hearing regarding the first reharmicide, which is
either premeditated or extremely cruelty and atrocity or felony murder.
(34:06):
And that's notwithstanding the fact that the books, the log
is written by the legislature for years and years and
years says that if you're convicted the first few homicide,
you won't it's life without parole. And so now, when
Madis came down, approximately two hundred and thirty eight cases
I believe it was across the state were reopened. I
started getting phone calls from victims across Punt of cod
(34:28):
we had twenty eight cases of our own, said, what
are you talking about? You told us these people were
never getting out again, and now they've moved the goalposts,
and now they're going to have hearings after they do
you know, fifteen or twenty years, whatever the time period
may be. These individuals are going to have court appointed lawyers,
they're going to have court appointed psychiatrists, they're going to
have couot appointed social workers, and they're going to have
(34:49):
individuals that are going going to go in front of
the prole board. And as I sit here now, they're
all going to get out. We've had cases already done
my way, I think, not just my li Across the
state the twenty one out of twenty four Manis hearings,
individuals are getting released. You know, they maybe go to
halfway houses, initiate or whatever, but they're not staying in jail.
(35:09):
And there's nothing more frustrating to victims across the Commonwealth
of Massachusetts who were told that the people that did
the most heinous act of their family, the people that
destroyed their lives, killed their kids, killed their parents, whoever
it may be, that they're now going to be walking
the streets with them again, notwithstanding the fact that they
did it premeditated or they did it with extreme cruelty atrocity.
(35:32):
And I find that shocking. And it's funny that you
know they refer the sac referred to contemporary standards of decency.
And my questions are, you know, is it decent to
continue to put these families through countless parole hearings. Is
it decent to give them court appointed council of regarding
these all these different issues that are going on. Is
(35:53):
it decent to individuals who were told that they can
go to bed with their eyes closed at night instead
I've been dealing with victims as other das have regarding
what's going on, because now the SJAC case is morphed
through the pro Bowl hearing and people are being released.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
And Tim, let me do this, Tim, if I can,
I got to break for news. Can you hang with
me for one segment into the next hour because you're feeling,
you feel so strongly in this. I can't let you
go without giving people an opportunity to call. Would you
do that?
Speaker 3 (36:26):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (36:27):
The DA will stay with us. That's my imposition. I
should have taken this up earlier. We'll get to the newscast.
If you're on the line and you want to talk
about the maddest case and the implications there are, we'll
go over it again, and we'll keep them for one segment,
coming back on Night's side, right after the ten
It's Night Side with Dan Ray on w b Z,
Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Well, welcome back everyone. I am delighted to bring back
to the nightside microphones the Plymouth County District Attorney. He's
been there for a few years, I think working on
at least twenty something at this point. District Attorney Tim Cruz,
how are you tonight?
Speaker 3 (00:25):
I'm doing great, Dan, Thanks for having me back.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
You've been da down there for twenty years approximately.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
In November twenty five, wo man, I'll.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Tell you time flies when having fun, that's for sure.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
Definitely.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
You had just been elected president of the National District
Attorney's Association, which is really, you know, quite an honor.
Tell us about that organization. I want to learn a
little bit more about what your duties will involve, and
also maybe some of the you're going to. We had
(01:00):
some FaceTime with some of the officials in Washington that
you wouldn't get as a mere district attorney from Plymouth County,
although you certainly should because of your longevity. But tell
us a little bit about this position. It's quite an honor.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
No, you're right, it really is an honor, especially following
the many great leaders that we've had in that role.
This is the seventy fifth year of the National DA's Association,
and like I said, I'm grateful to be able to
follow the disc attorney from San Diego summer. Stephan was
the president prior to me, but you know, before her,
a couple presidents. But John Blog of Messis County did
(01:36):
a tremendous job as a president of the NDAA and
I was able to watch, but John did what other
people did in that role and trying to promote the
NDAA and really what it is. It's a national voice
for prosecutors. And I'm hopeful that as we continue to
work forward in these you know, challenging times that we're
dealing with, they were going to be able to continue
(01:56):
to support We're going to be able to continue to
elevate the work of DA's nation and wide. Can remember
our focus, you know, what are we focusing on as
disc attorneys. We're focusing on victims centered justice, innovation and
public safety and sustainable solutions to the emerging community challenges.
Because disc attorney's offices now are so very different than
they were back when I started out as an assistant
(02:17):
DA more than forty years ago. I often say that
we're not your grandparents DA's office anymore. The things that
we do in the front end, the things that we
do in the back end, and the overall mission to
promote public safety and to make sure that we can
keep people safe and also hold people accountable for their actions.
It's a really fine line that you have to juggle,
I think sometimes understanding that you know what it is
(02:40):
what you're doing. Of course, I become president. I became
president of the NBAA about two weeks back in Kansas
City when I was sworn in. But I'm still the
Plymouth County DA and i still have my duties and
responsibilities here in Plymouth County, and I'm really looking forward
to sharing the work that the people in my office
have done to my fellow Colleaguechusetts have done, you know,
(03:01):
showing here's what we're doing in Massachusetts, here's what's working,
and take take what we have, take what we have
to offer, and we'd also like to get and learn
from you. What are best practices, How can we make
our communities better, How can we make our community safer?
How can we go forward from there? And I think
that when I look at the programs that we have,
you know, whether it be you know, human trafficking issues
(03:22):
or organized retail crime issues, or dealing with drugon danger children,
kids who average child experiences. It's such a large spectrum
of things that we're dealing with now that it really
makes me proud to work with the people in my
office and now continuing to work with the people accrass
the nation.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
It's interesting because obviously in your organization, I think when
we talked today, you said there are some six thousand members,
and you now are the head of six thousand nationwide prosecutors,
which represent about twenty five hundred agencies. Now, different states
have we have district attorneys, uh in our in our
(04:01):
counties here. Other states have county attorneys. So it's each
state is a little different, but the concept is the same.
There are there are chief law enforcement offices. Obviously, each
state has a single attorney general who's elected statewide. I
(04:21):
think in every state. There may be some states. I
think in New Hampshire actually I believe the attorney general
is appointed by Yeah, so I mean different. What people
don't understan What people need to understand is that different
states constitutions apply differently. But when you get to this
group of prosecutors. You're all prosecutors who are responsible for
(04:47):
doing justice. You know, public safety and concern for victims
is forefront I know in your mind, But there are
some district attorneys around the country who have kind of
strayed from what you and I would think of as
the primary role of a district attorney. How cohesive is
your organization? Obviously there are Democrats and Republicans, and I'm
(05:11):
sure that there are some extremes on both ends. But
are most of the people who hold these positions. Are
most of them cut from the same philosophical cloth as
people like you and John Blogert.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Yeah, I think we are in the National DAS Organization.
There are other prostratorial agencies that are out there that
may be a little bit different, but there's certainly not
the NDAA. I think that you know, as navigating your
way through the differences from different states and also dealing
with the different issues and like you said, the different constitutions,
(05:45):
I mean, as being the long Republican disc attorney here
in Massachusetts. I've been navigating similar waters for a long
time and trying to make sure that we can promote
what we're doing. And because I really believe that most
of the DA's that I know anyways, we all have
the same goal. I think we want to promote public safety.
I think we want to keep people safe. I think
(06:06):
that we have some of us have different avenues of
getting there, and I don't always agree with them. I'll
respectfully listen to them, but I think that what I'm
trying to do here with this is once again promote
public safety and promote victims and giving voices to people
who don't normally have them. I think that's really our
job is to stand out there and when we see
(06:27):
something that's not right, say something. Our job is not
to stand back in the shadows and the comfort of
the shadows where perhaps you're going to let some things occur.
I think we have to go out, We have to
say things, and we have to let people understand what
is what we do. And at the NDAA, you know
we're dealing. Our mission is quite simply to provide the
state and local prostitutes with knowledge, skills, and support that
(06:49):
they need to make sure that justice is done and
that public safety rights are protected. And we do that
in a variety of ways, whether it be you know,
through training or publications, We have more than the trainings
and conferences every year through the NDAA. We have technical
assistance for prostitutes across America. We have publications, we have advocacy.
I think, you know, it's really a great cohesive group
(07:11):
of people. And what I've seen anyways in my years
is being on the board of the NBAA, because I've
been the state director, then i was a vice president,
and now I've been the president president elect last year
and now I'm president. I really see a lot of
men and women who are trying to go in the
right direction to keep people safe. And that's why it
really is an honor to be in this role, so
(07:31):
that I can go forward and try to be their
face and go talk to people like you said that
maybe normally I wouldn't be in a position to talk
to talk about, you know, really our congressional priorities and
what can we do to make our job better and make.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
That's also so you have you have some trips coming up.
I'm sure into different parts of the country you're going
to You're going to build up some air miles, that's
for sure. I want to talk about that. I also
want to talk a little bit about a case here
in Massachusetts that I know you're quite concerned about a
very interesting Supreme Court decision of two or three years ago,
(08:08):
which people probably not aware of. And also I want
to get back to what you hope to accomplish. You
as a leader of this organization, are going to have
the opportunity to to interface with the administration. And I
know that there have been some monies that the administration
(08:32):
probably has used a hack saw to cut off, and
maybe scalpel would be better, So we'll get to some
of that, and also phone callers if people would like
to ask my guest, Plymouth County District Attorney and president
now of the National District Attorney's Association, Tim Cruz, a
question or comment. Six one, seven, two, five four ten
(08:52):
thirty six one seven nine three one ten thirties a
Republican district attorney in Massachusetts in a state that an
overwhelmingly democratic state. And I think that is testimony to
the job that he has done for the people of
Plymouth County to be elected and re elected so many times.
Now about to celebrate his twenty fifth year in that office.
(09:15):
We'll be back on nights side. The numbers is always
six one seven, two, five, four, ten, thirty six, one, seven, nine, three, one,
ten thirty. I've over the years got to know district
attorneys very well here in Massachusetts, John Blodgett, Bill Della Hunt,
Dan Conley, Joe Early out in Worcester. And I think
that for the most part, Massachusetts has some district attorneys
(09:39):
who who do look at it in a similar fashion,
and that is to prosecute the guilty uh and also
try to help victims recover. There are some district attorneys
around the country who do not, in my opinion, embody
those ideals, but focus on the positive. And if you'd
(10:02):
like to ask a question or make a comment, you
are more than welcome. You have the numbers. My name's
Dan Ray, and this is Nightside on WBZ Boston's news radio.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
You're on Night Side with Dan Ray on w b
Z Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
All right, back with District of Plymouth County District Attorney
Tim Cruz. Let's talk about you as the head of
the National District Attorney's Association. You're a Republican, and there's
a Republican in the White House and a Republican Attorney General.
And I know that there's concern about some programs that
(10:38):
really are intended to help victims that you're going to
be advocating for. How much. How do you intend to
approach this with the administration.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
Well, we're working on that now and I think that
you know, we have an executive working group where the
National das will meet every year that hopefully twice a
year with the NAG the National Association of Attorney General
as well as with the Department of Justice, and generally
last year when I was at the Attorney General showed
up and we're trying to have a sit down with
the Attorney General of the people that may and the
(11:09):
powers that may be down there in Washington, d C.
Regarding some of the things that are important to us.
And one of the things is public service loan forgiveness,
which is really important because it's so difficult nowadays, especially
where individuals, you know, young men and women who work
for us can go out and make some real money
and other places not going to the public sector, and
(11:30):
the loan forgiveness program is really something that we can
keep people in for an extended period of time. They
can also work down their debt while they're working for us,
So it's important I think that right now that program
is still active and payments is still being made documented,
but we have to make sure, because this hearing is
going on now in DC, we have to make sure
that the prosecutor's loan forgiveness is not thrown out or
(11:53):
taken away because of the fact that makes a real
difference in people keep people safe and having lawyers in
the court room who are going to get paid less moneys,
but they're also going to be in a position where
they can have that loan taken down. So I think
that's really important because we are having and striving to
deal with retention and recruitment, not just in Plymouth County
(12:14):
or it not just in the comwell from Massachusetts. We're
having retention and recruitment problems for prosecutors across America. And
as a result of that, also we're trying to get
the appropriate support from bipin US and support for getting
involved with the Higher Act. Higher Act is the Higher
Prosecutors Act is the helping improve recruitment and retention efforts
for Higher and what it is is providing federal assistant
(12:37):
to local prosecutors officers and insisting hiring, retaining, and the
training of prosecutor and staff. So we're finalizing some Senate
sponsors right now down in DC, and we're hopeful that
we're going to be able to have that introduced prior
to August. So those are That's one of the really
big things that we're dealing with right now across the
country is trying to keep our lawyers on board because
(12:58):
many times, and it's not usual, a young lawyer will
come in, they'll stay for two or three years, they'll
get some good experience, they'll be really good lawyers in
the courtroom, and then of course, you know, life goes on,
you need to make more money. This is something that
we're hopeful that if we are allowed to keep it,
and I'm hopeful they're going to be able to convince
the administration for us to keep it. If we can
do that, I think it'll be a positive thing keeping
(13:20):
young lawyers so that they can do their job. And
it's a job that they love too. When you talk
to a lot of these young men and women, when
they leave, they don't want to leave, they want to stay,
they want to do good. They want to make sure
that they're doing the right thing. And I think that's
really important. That's probably our top priority through the NBA
right now.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
But a lot of those young prosecutors who learn to
know their way around the courtroom when they're leaving, they're
leaving in many cases to become defense lawyers because they
have known what the pressing control side of the street,
and now they have that knowledge as defense lawyers. And
nothing wrong with being a defense lawyer, nothing wrong with
(13:59):
being a but when you switch teams, it's as opposed
to play offense, you're playing defense, and it's the same game,
but you're kind of playing for the other team, and
you you basically as a as a prosecutor's office, you
are training young lawyers to really become defense lawyers because
(14:20):
there's no private practice for prosecutors defense ironically something to
think about.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Yeah, no it is, and you know what it's not.
It's happened before that somebody would have left on a
Friday and on Monday. They may be working for either
a firm or they may have their own firm at
that time, but they just started up on Monday. So
I understand that going in we all understand that. I
think all our das here in the comwell and across
America understand that that's always going to happen. But there
(14:50):
are some men and women that really love the job
and really want to make a difference, and they are
making a difference, but they don't they can't sacrifice everything,
and what nominal help they can get through the public
sect for loan forgiveness is something that really can we
can stretch to keep them for a little bit longer
period of time. So I think that, you know, I'm
hopeful that we're going to be able to get that done.
(15:11):
We have other, you know, priorities also that we're going
to be talking about down in DC when we do
have that meeting whenever that may occur, And like I said,
we're going to go down there and we are really
a nonpartisan group going down there talking about how this
affects prosecutors across America. And I think that people done
in DC right now, I believe really are on the
(15:33):
side of law enforcement and public safety, and I'm hopeful
that we're going to be successful in making make sure
we can salvage the PSFL.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
Yeah, I want to pivot off that point. We've got
to go for breaking news, but when we get back,
I want to talk to you one about a case
here in Massachusetts, wis I know you're not happy about
nor am I happy about the Madness decision, the State
Supreme Court decision of a couple of years ago. And
(16:00):
I also want to ask you whether or not you
think that the atmospherics on crime and punishment have changed
in the last year or two. In the wake of
the George Floyd murder back in twenty twenty, the country
shifted and had great empathy and antagonism, empathy for people
(16:25):
who were being arrested. We saw some pretty ugly scenes
across the country in the wake of the Floyd murder,
and that is something that troubled everyone, in my opinion,
And I'd like to know if maybe things have changed
a little bit, if the atmospherics have changed a little
bit here across the country, and if maybe in view
(16:47):
of what happened in New York City on Monday, we're
an off duty police officer was gunned down by a
guy who drove across the country. Obviously, with all sorts
of issues, you have these incidents that just seemed to
occurring that people are appalled by the Walmart incident in
Travis City, Michigan, over the weekend I'm just wondering if
(17:07):
you feel that the the atmosphere, the legal atmosphere of
this country is changing, and I want and I want
to also talk about the Madness case here in Massachusetts,
so and invite our callers. They are more than welcome.
This is an opportunity for you to talk directly, folks,
to a district attorney, a very influential district attorney who
has even become more influential as the president of the
(17:30):
National District Attorney's Association. Six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty seven eighty one nine three one ten thirty.
Back right after the news at the bottom of the hour.
Speaker 1 (17:40):
You're on Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm w b
Z Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
So our numbers are six one, seven two, five four,
ten thirty and six one, seven, nine three one ten thirty.
I might have slipped the seven eight one in there.
Please don't call that six one seven nine three one
ten thirty sou District Attorney Tim Cruse. Is it your
sense that maybe the when I say political atmosphere, I'm
(18:07):
really not talking about Republican or Democrat. I'm talking about
kind of the political slash legal atmosphere that people had
great sympathy and they had understanding for excesses in terms
of what happened in twenty twenty in reaction to the
George Floyd murder by that police officer who, as far
(18:29):
as I'm concerned, you know, should spend the rest of
his life in jail. But that's my own personal comment
on that one or in prison? Do you appeel? I
just have a sense things are changing here, particularly in
view of what happened to the young police officer yesterday
and what happened out in Minnesota or rather than Michigan
on Saturday, where civilians interceded and stopped this guy who
(18:53):
had stabbed eleven people. Now the guy was crazy, I
don't think there's any question about that, but it still
takes some courage for civilians to stand up and say
stop it, drop the knife. And there was one guy
who had a gun. By the way, you were deployed
at the guy. Do you think the atmosphere is changing?
I do?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
I think, you know, back because that was also during
the course of COVID too, which was just a different
time period, especially when when COVID first came down, the
rest were down significantly because nobody knew really what the
disease was. And I think other than other than the
most serious crimes, there are a lot of people were
(19:32):
getting away with things, which I think exacerbated the feeling.
Back then, people felt that they could do what they want.
It was a feeling of some instance of lawlessness. They
could do, go into a store, take what they wanted.
It didn't really matter. And now I think you see
that changing, and I think the pendulum is what I
referred to it as, is coming back a little bit.
I think, you know, we live in that world of pendulum.
(19:53):
We're goes back and forth, each way left and right,
and sometimes it's in the middle. I think it's going back.
But I truly believe people just want to be safe.
People want to be left alone. I think every day,
like all these terrible cases you're talking about, there's always
going to be these individuals, whether they're lone wolves or not,
who are out there conducting themselves in a harmful way
to other people. And people are looking at that. And
(20:15):
I think the more and more people nowadays, in my opinion,
they want to be safe. They look at a bad
situation and they're wondering why many times why isn't somebody
doing something about that? Where is the leadership amongst us
right now? Where is the persons in change who are
going to stop these things? And that's why I think
what we've seen, like in the National das and also
(20:36):
the maths days and organized retail stuff task forces where
we're going after individuals who are walking into stores, people
who are not necessarily from this country, walking into usually
it's the Saphoras and other makeup places where they can
get small items there are a lot of money and
steal and walk out and be held unaccountable. That to
me just doesn't work, and so we've got to task force. Now.
(20:58):
We've been incredibly successful the last year or so, so
much that individuals realize now that if they come to
our county, if we catch you, we're going to prosecute you.
And I don't care if it cost me ten thousand
dollars to prosecute a one thousand dollar case. You need
to understand if you do that, we will hold you accountable.
I'm a firm believer in broken windows. I think that
it works, and I think that if you go after
(21:19):
the small group of individuals who are committing the vast
material of the crime, you will watch your numbers go down.
It's just common sense. I've seen it time and time
again going that way.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Well, I agree with you, and some of the days
that I mentioned earlier, whether the Democrats or Republicans have
always been on the same page as you have been.
But you know, we had Rachel Rollins, the US attorney
here at a list of crimes that she says she's
not going to prosecute it. I think one of them
was up to nine hundred dollars of theft. So if
you owned a small madego somewhere in the city of
(21:49):
Boston and people were walking in walking out with a
couple of one hundred bucks of stuff five or six
times a day, they went your profit margin, you out
of business pretty soon. And that seemed to me At
that point, I said, where are we going with this? Now?
There's a case in Massachusetts on a more serious basis
that I want to get to. But I also want
(22:10):
to incorporate some callers for us. So let's take a call.
We will get to the Matters case, I promise, because
that's one that has been under the radar screen and
it's one that you feel very strongly about. Let me
go to Vincent in Brockton. Vincent, you're on with Plymouth
County District Attorney Tim Cruz. Go ahead, Vincent, good evening.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Hi, Hi, A really quick question.
Speaker 4 (22:40):
What advice will you give to somebody who wants to
go to a law school and the follies?
Speaker 3 (22:46):
What advice wight you to somebody who wants to go
to law school in the forties? I would say, if,
if you, if you, It's gonna be a lot of work,
and I think it would be an incredible challenge. But
I think you can definitely do it if you're interested
in doing that, if you really want to make a
different I can't think of a better role in today's
community than a lawyer who has the opportunity to go
(23:06):
to court and to file paperwork, petitions, whatever it may be,
stand up on behalf of individuals maybe accused the crimes,
or prosecute people who haveviolated the laws. I think that
there's a great opportunity. You got to take the LFAT
I get to get into a law school, and then
after that it would take either three years or four
years if you go night. But if you really have
that feeling, I think the fact that you have if
(23:27):
you're forty years old. I think that should be irrelevant.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
Tim, what Rother, Victor Vincent. Let me ask you this
question if I could. What sort of a career are
you in right now? And what prompts your interest in law.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
School education right now?
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Are you a teacher?
Speaker 3 (23:49):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (23:50):
Okay? Have you investigated any of the law schools in
Massachusetts that might be able to work with you?
Speaker 4 (24:00):
Yes, New England and Law and you must law.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Those. Look, every one of those law schools, those both
you mentioned are well accredited.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
And there are people coming out of law schools. One
law school that I think is uh, is exceptional. It's
it's up in John Blodgett's neck of the woods, up
in and over the Massachusetts School of Law. Now that's
a bit of a haul from Brockton, that's for sure.
So you want to find a law school that geographically works.
(24:33):
But any certified law school, Uh, if you apply yourself,
you will learn enough and take a good you know,
l s, a t review course, you know, so you'll
you'll have you'll you'll know going in what it's like,
and then take Tim. My advice to anyone coming out
of law school is take the best bar review course
(24:55):
you can you can take because oftentimes you learn some
of the practical things of the bar exam in the
bar review course that you never got in three or
four years of law school.
Speaker 3 (25:06):
Am I right or wrong on that, mister, You're absolutely right.
I mean it's really important to make sure you learn
as much as you can. I agree with the bar
review courses and when you take the bar I tell
the young men and women who come to my office
if they're going to be working in our office too,
don't work during that time period you're going to get
you most likely you graduated in May. The first barer
(25:27):
exam after that is July. Just focus on that because
you don't want to take it again. You want to
do it one time, make it one and done, and
do it in that fashion. And I think if you
focus on it, I think you can do it. There's
a lot of good people out there. And also you
know the New England school laws a great school. Suffered
school laws a great school They both have night programs
that you can also probably acclimate us to what you're doing.
(25:48):
What you're doing to work during the day or teacher
during the day and go to school at night. I've
had young kids in my office who weren't lawyers, but
they would going to law school at night. They would
work for me during the day and go to It
was a grind for them. Let you know what they
did it And I think you're turning into real good lawyers.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
And Vincent, the only advice I'd give you. I went
to law school a long time ago, Boston University Law School,
and I did it the traditional way of basically working
part time but going full time during the day and
getting it over with in three years. And it was
a grind. But think about the geography, how far you'll
have to go, and if there's a law school that
(26:26):
is closer to you. It doesn't matter whether you go
to Harvard, BCBU, Suffolk, Northeastern, New England School of Law,
you Mass down in Dartmouth, our Mass School of Law
up in and Over. You get a good legal education
and you'll have you can pass the bar. Believe me,
you can pass the bar as long as you get
(26:47):
three or four or four years of law school. And
who knows, maybe you're in Brockton. Someday you may be
applying for a job in the District Attorney Cruiser's office.
Not too long for that.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Okay, good many you guys, Thank.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
You, thanks, thank you. That's a great question.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
Thank really yeah, really, good night, good night.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
I hope you. I hope you follow your dream. Vincent,
I thank you.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
Thank God.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
All right, Uh, Tim, We're gonna take a quick break.
I got some other calls. I do want to get
to the matters case as well. You know it really well,
and I want the public to understand that as well,
because unfortunately we are now leading in this uh this
surrender if you will to interesting philosophical theories which are
(27:33):
founded in as you say, emerging science. Six one seven, two,
five four ten thirty or six one seven, nine three
one ten thirty. My name is Dan Ray. I'm talking
the honor of talking with the Plymouth County District Attorney,
Tim Cruz, but who is also now the president of
the National Association of District Attorneys, the National District Attorneys Association.
(27:56):
He is the number one guy in that person in
that organization. We'll be back on night side if you
have a question, and that question from Vincent was a
good one, But if you have any question, there's no
such thing as a dumb question in my mind, when
you're talking about legal issues. Back in Nightside after.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
This Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
Right we are talking with Plymouth County DA Tim Cruise.
Let me get one more quick call in here for you, Tim,
and then we're going to go to the madness case quickly.
Jason and Waltham. Jason next on Nightside with Plymouth County
DA District Attorney Tim Cruse, who is now the National
District Attorney's Association President.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Go ahead, Jason, Yes, Dan, thank you for having me.
Speaker 4 (28:42):
And I don't know if you remember me and.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Sheriff.
Speaker 4 (28:46):
Yes, still haven't got in thet but I'm still trying,
and I'm I'm glad i've called in today.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Where were you trying? Where are you trying to get in? Jason?
I know that you're you're a young conservative, you told me,
and you're trying to get.
Speaker 4 (28:58):
In touch with whom so im get in touch with
sheriff uh, the Norfolk Sheriff Department. I had a meeting
with the ABS six, but he hasn't followed back yet.
I'm gonna give him a few times another. They got
a recovery first coming up. I will be attending to
that to volunteer and hopefully I could have a side
(29:18):
conversation with him or somebody, but I'm okay.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
So you were looking just I don't want to catch
the distric attorney. I want him to understand you're recovering
alcoholic or an attic. Did you have a recovery program?
Speaker 4 (29:34):
No, So basically I went off the wrong part when
I came to America at twelve years old. I went
in trouble in an out job, but now run a
successful real estate business. I just wanted to give back
to those inmates because I understand whether yet in some
of the issue they have is financial literacy.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
They don't have that.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
The result back to the thing with Okay, let me
let me introduce you to two district attorney Cruise Tim.
I've talked to this on one two or three times
and he sounds like the real deal to me, and
he's trying to help people who are working back into
the system. I don't know. Are you working full time, Jason.
Speaker 4 (30:12):
No, I'm not so right now I'm running my success,
my rested business. But I'm a gentleman that we just
called in previously by asking that lawyer. So I've been
trying to help people so much that I'm willing to
go back to law school myself. I'm in a financial
situation where I don't have to work. I will pay
it for the low school out of pocket, but I
feel like that doesn't not open enough for me. So
I'm gonna go back to school, get back credentials, and
(30:34):
force my way into the courtroom and represent those individuals
because I've been let me.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Do this, Let me do this, Jason, Jason, let me
do this. And I'm going to ask him, Tim, could
I have Rob give you this fellow's number. He is
somebody who seems to me to be somebody who's really
trying to give back on a positive way. I want
to I don't want to, uh let you go without
talking about the madness case. Could you have somebody in
(31:01):
your office reach out to him and maybe guide him
a little bit?
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Yeah? Sure, And we have you know, our Sharp Downaway
has great re entry programs dealing with individuals who the
people who are in custody are going to get released again,
and a lot of them they need educational help, they
need parenting help, they need dragging out cahol help, and
and I think those are things that if we want
to keep people from recinibating again. We need to make
sure that we continue to help them when they get
(31:26):
back on the real world, so they get a great idea.
Pant his efforts.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Okay, Jason, leave your daytime phone number, uh, and Rob
will give it to the DA and he'll have somebody
from his office talk to you and try to guide
you both geographically, to get you to some group, some
office that you can be of assistance to and maybe
even give you a little bit of advice of going
to law school.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
Okay, it sounds good.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
I didn't get just to ask my question by next time, though,
Thank you so much, and I'll hold on.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Please hold on. Do you want to ask the DA
a quick question? Is that what you're looking to do?
Speaker 3 (31:58):
Yeah? I wanted to ask that quo quick question.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
So, just like the gentleman before, I want to go
back to law school, right, and there's a I'm willing
to pay for outside my out of pocket. I have
the financial resources. But the thing is, though, how do
I go about getting myself into a position. And I
hear everything about the probably defenders quit they don't they
don't make enough money. I understand all that, but also
(32:23):
I want to help those individuals because I've been in
the situation myself where I had a public defender, I
hired him by my ears to another public defender, have
them have him take a plea, do me a favor,
I have him take a plea, so this could so
this mad client could get away. So basically those trading
inmates trading clients. So I hid that and the Syney
(32:44):
several times in Georgia, even in Massachusetts. So I want
to get in the court room and stop that kind
of nasense because most people who get in public defenders
they don't know any better. They don't go to the
law library. They're in their place.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
Is a huge question that you just asked the I
think that again, in view of what I'm trying to
do here, can we have I just want to have
someone from his office contact you and get a conversation
going privately. I think it could be more effective that way.
Speaker 4 (33:12):
I think you I appreciated that.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
Hooto. Okay, Tim, you'll be able to get someone to
talk to him in the next day yourself. Great, Okay,
let's talk about the Madus case. I know it's tied
on time here, but I know there's something you feel deeply.
Speaker 3 (33:23):
About well, the Madus case came down in twenty twenty four,
and just summing it up quickly that the four to
three decision from the Supreme Judicial Court determined that life
without parole sentences are unconstitutional as applied to emerging adults.
That's the individuals from the ages of eighteen and twenty
at the time of the crime. Now eighteen nineteen and
(33:44):
twenty in Massachusetts, you are an adult. You are in
the majority. And the SJAC made this determination, made this
bright line distinction that if you followed in those three
years eighteen nineteen or twenty that you are going to
get a parole hearing regarding the first reharmicide, which is
either premeditated or extremely cruelty and atrocity or felony murder.
(34:06):
And that's notwithstanding the fact that the books, the log
is written by the legislature for years and years and
years says that if you're convicted the first few homicide,
you won't it's life without parole. And so now, when
Madis came down, approximately two hundred and thirty eight cases
I believe it was across the state were reopened. I
started getting phone calls from victims across Punt of cod
(34:28):
we had twenty eight cases of our own, said, what
are you talking about? You told us these people were
never getting out again, and now they've moved the goalposts,
and now they're going to have hearings after they do
you know, fifteen or twenty years, whatever the time period
may be. These individuals are going to have court appointed lawyers,
they're going to have court appointed psychiatrists, they're going to
have couot appointed social workers, and they're going to have
(34:49):
individuals that are going going to go in front of
the prole board. And as I sit here now, they're
all going to get out. We've had cases already done
my way, I think, not just my li Across the
state the twenty one out of twenty four Manis hearings,
individuals are getting released. You know, they maybe go to
halfway houses, initiate or whatever, but they're not staying in jail.
(35:09):
And there's nothing more frustrating to victims across the Commonwealth
of Massachusetts who were told that the people that did
the most heinous act of their family, the people that
destroyed their lives, killed their kids, killed their parents, whoever
it may be, that they're now going to be walking
the streets with them again, notwithstanding the fact that they
did it premeditated or they did it with extreme cruelty atrocity.
(35:32):
And I find that shocking. And it's funny that you
know they refer the sac referred to contemporary standards of decency.
And my questions are, you know, is it decent to
continue to put these families through countless parole hearings. Is
it decent to give them court appointed council of regarding
these all these different issues that are going on. Is
(35:53):
it decent to individuals who were told that they can
go to bed with their eyes closed at night instead
I've been dealing with victims as other das have regarding
what's going on, because now the SJAC case is morphed
through the pro Bowl hearing and people are being released.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
And Tim, let me do this, Tim, if I can,
I got to break for news. Can you hang with
me for one segment into the next hour because you're feeling,
you feel so strongly in this. I can't let you
go without giving people an opportunity to call. Would you
do that?
Speaker 3 (36:26):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (36:27):
The DA will stay with us. That's my imposition. I
should have taken this up earlier. We'll get to the newscast.
If you're on the line and you want to talk
about the maddest case and the implications there are, we'll
go over it again, and we'll keep them for one segment,
coming back on Night's side, right after the ten
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