February 7, 2025 • 11 mins
The new Super Rugby season is just around the corner.
New Super Rugby Pacific CEO Jack Mesley joined Piney to discuss the new season, Fantasy Super Rugby, and the potential of greater player movement.
He told Piney that they view Fantasy Super Rugby as an essential tool to grow engagement with the sport.
“I haven’t seen the numbers but, y’know, we’re expecting a huge number of people to get engaged with it.”
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Super Rugby Pacific now less than a week away.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
Blues look to regather, they kick it, they kick it backwards.
It's gonna go open the line. Blue hates love to
hear these words again. The Blues US Super Rugby champions
for the first time in twenty one years. Day demolish
the change. Send to the final forty one ten.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Yeah that was last year. Can the Blues go back
to back? I guess we can have a more of
a chat about that. Tomorrow. Opening game is Friday Nights,
so less than a week away. The Crusaders up against
the Hurricanes in christ Church. Super Rugby CEO Jack Mesley
is with us on Weekend Sport. Jack, thanks for joining
us one week out from the start of Super Rugby
Pacific for twenty twenty five, your first season as CEO
(00:56):
was about to begin. How are you feeling about six
days out from the new season.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
I'm well, firstly, very excited. I can't wait for it
to kick off, really keen to see it in operation
and work through a week to week cycle.
Speaker 5 (01:11):
It's been a great off.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Season and I think we've achieved a lot to set
twenty twenty five up for success.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
All right, let's talk about a couple of your initiatives.
Fantasy Super Rugby Pacific has been launched. How much engagement
are you hoping to achieve through this?
Speaker 4 (01:27):
Yeah, I mean I think, you know, we think it's
an essential tool and we're hoping for a lot of engagement.
I think we've had some really great responses to our
expressions of interest which we've been capturing over the little
the last few weeks and then going live today. I
haven't seen the latest numbers, but you know, we're expecting
(01:49):
a huge number of people to get engaged with it.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
How big a body of work has this been?
Speaker 5 (01:56):
Yeah, listen, it is a big lift.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
And I threw it at the team pretty late, so
I have been a little apologetic about theness in which
it's arrived to fans, and that was probably, you know,
due to us making the call late. And it's been
a great, a great combined effort. You know, players involved,
you know, the unions involved, and clearly our teams working centrally.
(02:23):
But you know, so it's great to see it live.
As you and I've been chatting off there it's up
and I've been having a really good play with it
today and I'm you know, I'm having a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
Yeah, I have been to slapping players in and out
trying to find the best combination. Are you developing an
app for Fantasy Super Rugby?
Speaker 5 (02:45):
Yeah, I mean this is our this is our play
this year.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
It doesn't have an app. But gamification more broadly is
going to continue to be an important thing for the
competition and and things like apps and you know, features
and benefits that people are already talking about that they
would like to see in the competition and in the
fantasy game. Look at all of those things into the
future and look to see how we can just find
(03:11):
more ways and those ways becoming easier for fans to engage.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And just before we move on, was it always something
that was front of mind for you, Jack when you
came and you said you obviously threw it at your
team a bit late, but was it something you were
always quite keen to have and play for twenty twenty five?
Speaker 4 (03:27):
Yeah, I think pretty early on we uncovered a few
things that we really wanted to focus on. Gamification appeal
to a younger audience was one of the really key ones.
And the other one is we're really keen for fans
to get more involved and learn more about the other
teams in the competition. We're eleven team competition. We've got
(03:50):
clubs from all around the Pacific, and we want a
Crusaders to fan to know more about some of the
great players that are playing for the Reds, for example,
so that when the Reds come down to Christchurch to play,
those fans are ready to engage with another match. So
you know, part of this is all about just giving
people more things to have fun with and play with
(04:12):
and talk to their mates about. Beneath that, there's a
little bit of strategy about how we're increasing the knowledge
and appeal of the other clubs that exist within the competition.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
All right, So let's look a bit wider now, your KPIs,
if we can call them that. I always hate using
those phrase like that in a sporting sense, but you
know what I mean. How much of the success of
your role is going to be judged on attendance at
games and viewers tuning in.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
Yeah, absolutely they will be My KPIs attendance, audience, digital
engagement as well becoming more and more and more important.
And then you know longer lead time goals is that
those sort of metrics then drive commercial outcomes, So then
dollars dollars comes into it on a sort of longer
(05:02):
lead time basis. So that's how I will be judged
by by the board and ultimately, you know, that's what
we want success to be for the competition. And you know,
twenty twenty four was a great year. We saw all
of those measures go green on the traffic light system,
and so we're coming off last year with some momentum
and we really want to really want to keep that going.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
When you talk about engagement with fans and with casual
observers as well, we've seen the past week the power
of off field or in this case, off court narratives
within the NBA and the trade which aired the entire
world talking how do you establish similar narratives and similar
interest inside super rugby.
Speaker 4 (05:44):
Yeah, it's been a powerful time, hasn't it. As we've
seen some of the biggest leagues in the world round
out their transfer windows.
Speaker 5 (05:53):
Yeah. I mean we saw it.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
In our off season to a lesser degree, right, we
saw the attention that player movement, be that Arty's move
or even James O'Connor's move fueled interests. You know, our
focus right now is to make sure that we have
those rhythms going for our nineteen weeks, and then what
we need to do is extend the conversation outside those
(06:17):
outside those sort of nineteen weeks of regular season. There
is so much that happens in Super rugby outside the
nineteen week season, but you wouldn't know about it, you know,
So how the Crusaders fill their roster, how they are
looking at MPC and bringing people are All of those
things exist in our competition, but largely are not told.
(06:39):
So in the first instance, we need to make sure
we're doing a better job of that before we look at, well,
what other things that require more fundamental change, you know,
like what we see in other codes overseas. You know,
we need to really make sure that we're making the
most of what we've got first, because those things are
are difficult and involved time and a lot of alignment
(07:03):
between a lot of parties.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yeah, Andy, but I still would like to talk about them.
Would you like to see greater freedom, for example, of
player movement across the different countries involved in Super Rugby?
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Well, I mean people can do that now right now.
The difficulty is that that then comes with national team
eligibility questions. So yeah, I would like to see more movement,
but to get that change and to ensure that eligibility
comes with that, there's.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
A whole lot involved in that. We're really lucky that we.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Involved in the international sport and our competition spans five
different countries. That makes some of the complexities to push
into what you're describing a lot more difficult. But with
that comes to benefits, the fact that we are an
international sport. We want our national teams to do well
(07:56):
and we're an international competition which creates a lot of
benefits as well.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Do you think you have the ability to drive their change?
It seems so obvious. I know a lot of our
listeners will be on the phone straight after they've been
listening to you, Jack saying, you know, why shouldn't will
Jordan play for the Reds and still be eligible for
the All Blacks. Do you believe you have the ability
to drive that change with New Zealand rugby and Rugby Australia.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Well, ultimately, if you're talking about governance, no, I don't
have the ability to make that decision. Clearly, as the sharehold.
The owners of the competition, being New Zealand Rugby and
Rugby Australia, would need to make that competition. What I
can say is from a competition point of view, we
will put all of those things on the table and
look at the pros and commons and benefits of those
(08:39):
things and then recommend that to our owners for them
to then assess, and their assessment will come more broadly.
Speaker 5 (08:46):
My focus is the competition.
Speaker 4 (08:49):
The unions obviously have to look at that broadly and
consider the recommendations that we put forward at a competition level.
You know, in view of the whole Rugby pyramids that
they are managing, so you know, they've got to do
the right thing for community game. They have to do
the right thing for Team in Black, and collectively we're
trying to do the right thing for the competition.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
We're down to eleven teams this year. Would you ideally
like to get back to twelve for twenty twenty six?
Speaker 4 (09:17):
Yeah, there's lots of benefits you know in having an
even number of teams. Clearly it brings some efficiency to
the drawer and things like that. I don't think we've seen,
you know, how good this eleven team structure can be,
so we'll be looking at it throughout the year. I
don't think there is an obvious, an obvious solution that
(09:39):
is within grasp for a twelve team right now. But
having said that, you know, we're very lucky that we
do have, you know, some longer term opportunities that we're
going to look at as well.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And I know twenty twenty five is your focus, but
have you thought short in fact more medium term mid
range for example, what's your five year vision for Super Rugby.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
Yeah, I mean, we're not probably going that far out
just yet. You know, our intention and our sort of
you know, three years sort of arizon is making sure
that our competition is the best rugby competition in the world,
and we're going to do that by making sure we've
got the most compelling product on the field, that we're
really strengthening our fan engagement offering for fans, and that
(10:30):
we're driving commercial value back back into our back into
our competition so that we can invest in it and
make those first two kind of things work. In terms
of competition design, we don't have a firm view on
those things yet. In terms of you know, let's say
in twenty twenty eight. We want the competition to look
(10:51):
like X, Y and Z. We're setting ourselves up to
make sure that we have a view of expansion into
the future, but we also want to be ready for
any opportunities that might come our way, and so we
need to sort of remain agile and open to opportunities.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Is all right? Well, we're just about at the start
line for twenty twenty five, Jack, exciting time for you
and your organization and for the teams and fans of
Super Rugby Pacific as well. Appreciate you having a chat
to us. I know need to go back and work
out how to get Ardie Savia Hoskins, a Tutu n
Peter Larkeye into my fantasy team.
Speaker 5 (11:23):
Well, I wish you'd a best of luck with that.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
I was actually, you know, I was just trying to
go through the hookers.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
My goodness is and good hooker. Is there any advice
for me on on hookers?
Speaker 4 (11:33):
Well?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
I would have some. Maybe we should take this offline
so that the advice doesn't go far and wide, although
that might be a good thing. Jack, great to chat.
Thanks for taking the time, Thanks very much.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Talk to you soon, yep, talk soon.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
Jack, Thanks indeed, Jack Measley, CEO of Super Rugby Pacific.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live
to News Talk zed B weekends from midday, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Super Rugby Pacific now less than a week away.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
Blues look to regather, they kick it, they kick it backwards.
It's gonna go open the line. Blue hates love to
hear these words again. The Blues US Super Rugby champions
for the first time in twenty one years. Day demolish
the change. Send to the final forty one ten.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Yeah that was last year. Can the Blues go back
to back? I guess we can have a more of
a chat about that. Tomorrow. Opening game is Friday Nights,
so less than a week away. The Crusaders up against
the Hurricanes in christ Church. Super Rugby CEO Jack Mesley
is with us on Weekend Sport. Jack, thanks for joining
us one week out from the start of Super Rugby
Pacific for twenty twenty five, your first season as CEO
(00:56):
was about to begin. How are you feeling about six
days out from the new season.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
I'm well, firstly, very excited. I can't wait for it
to kick off, really keen to see it in operation
and work through a week to week cycle.
Speaker 5 (01:11):
It's been a great off.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Season and I think we've achieved a lot to set
twenty twenty five up for success.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
All right, let's talk about a couple of your initiatives.
Fantasy Super Rugby Pacific has been launched. How much engagement
are you hoping to achieve through this?
Speaker 4 (01:27):
Yeah, I mean I think, you know, we think it's
an essential tool and we're hoping for a lot of engagement.
I think we've had some really great responses to our
expressions of interest which we've been capturing over the little
the last few weeks and then going live today. I
haven't seen the latest numbers, but you know, we're expecting
(01:49):
a huge number of people to get engaged with it.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
How big a body of work has this been?
Speaker 5 (01:56):
Yeah, listen, it is a big lift.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
And I threw it at the team pretty late, so
I have been a little apologetic about theness in which
it's arrived to fans, and that was probably, you know,
due to us making the call late. And it's been
a great, a great combined effort. You know, players involved,
you know, the unions involved, and clearly our teams working centrally.
(02:23):
But you know, so it's great to see it live.
As you and I've been chatting off there it's up
and I've been having a really good play with it
today and I'm you know, I'm having a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
Yeah, I have been to slapping players in and out
trying to find the best combination. Are you developing an
app for Fantasy Super Rugby?
Speaker 5 (02:45):
Yeah, I mean this is our this is our play
this year.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
It doesn't have an app. But gamification more broadly is
going to continue to be an important thing for the
competition and and things like apps and you know, features
and benefits that people are already talking about that they
would like to see in the competition and in the
fantasy game. Look at all of those things into the
future and look to see how we can just find
(03:11):
more ways and those ways becoming easier for fans to engage.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And just before we move on, was it always something
that was front of mind for you, Jack when you
came and you said you obviously threw it at your
team a bit late, but was it something you were
always quite keen to have and play for twenty twenty five?
Speaker 4 (03:27):
Yeah, I think pretty early on we uncovered a few
things that we really wanted to focus on. Gamification appeal
to a younger audience was one of the really key ones.
And the other one is we're really keen for fans
to get more involved and learn more about the other
teams in the competition. We're eleven team competition. We've got
(03:50):
clubs from all around the Pacific, and we want a
Crusaders to fan to know more about some of the
great players that are playing for the Reds, for example,
so that when the Reds come down to Christchurch to play,
those fans are ready to engage with another match. So
you know, part of this is all about just giving
people more things to have fun with and play with
(04:12):
and talk to their mates about. Beneath that, there's a
little bit of strategy about how we're increasing the knowledge
and appeal of the other clubs that exist within the competition.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
All right, So let's look a bit wider now, your KPIs,
if we can call them that. I always hate using
those phrase like that in a sporting sense, but you
know what I mean. How much of the success of
your role is going to be judged on attendance at
games and viewers tuning in.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
Yeah, absolutely they will be My KPIs attendance, audience, digital
engagement as well becoming more and more and more important.
And then you know longer lead time goals is that
those sort of metrics then drive commercial outcomes, So then
dollars dollars comes into it on a sort of longer
(05:02):
lead time basis. So that's how I will be judged
by by the board and ultimately, you know, that's what
we want success to be for the competition. And you know,
twenty twenty four was a great year. We saw all
of those measures go green on the traffic light system,
and so we're coming off last year with some momentum
and we really want to really want to keep that going.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
When you talk about engagement with fans and with casual
observers as well, we've seen the past week the power
of off field or in this case, off court narratives
within the NBA and the trade which aired the entire
world talking how do you establish similar narratives and similar
interest inside super rugby.
Speaker 4 (05:44):
Yeah, it's been a powerful time, hasn't it. As we've
seen some of the biggest leagues in the world round
out their transfer windows.
Speaker 5 (05:53):
Yeah. I mean we saw it.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
In our off season to a lesser degree, right, we
saw the attention that player movement, be that Arty's move
or even James O'Connor's move fueled interests. You know, our
focus right now is to make sure that we have
those rhythms going for our nineteen weeks, and then what
we need to do is extend the conversation outside those
(06:17):
outside those sort of nineteen weeks of regular season. There
is so much that happens in Super rugby outside the
nineteen week season, but you wouldn't know about it, you know,
So how the Crusaders fill their roster, how they are
looking at MPC and bringing people are All of those
things exist in our competition, but largely are not told.
(06:39):
So in the first instance, we need to make sure
we're doing a better job of that before we look at, well,
what other things that require more fundamental change, you know,
like what we see in other codes overseas. You know,
we need to really make sure that we're making the
most of what we've got first, because those things are
are difficult and involved time and a lot of alignment
(07:03):
between a lot of parties.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yeah, Andy, but I still would like to talk about them.
Would you like to see greater freedom, for example, of
player movement across the different countries involved in Super Rugby?
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Well, I mean people can do that now right now.
The difficulty is that that then comes with national team
eligibility questions. So yeah, I would like to see more movement,
but to get that change and to ensure that eligibility
comes with that, there's.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
A whole lot involved in that. We're really lucky that we.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Involved in the international sport and our competition spans five
different countries. That makes some of the complexities to push
into what you're describing a lot more difficult. But with
that comes to benefits, the fact that we are an
international sport. We want our national teams to do well
(07:56):
and we're an international competition which creates a lot of
benefits as well.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Do you think you have the ability to drive their change?
It seems so obvious. I know a lot of our
listeners will be on the phone straight after they've been
listening to you, Jack saying, you know, why shouldn't will
Jordan play for the Reds and still be eligible for
the All Blacks. Do you believe you have the ability
to drive that change with New Zealand rugby and Rugby Australia.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Well, ultimately, if you're talking about governance, no, I don't
have the ability to make that decision. Clearly, as the sharehold.
The owners of the competition, being New Zealand Rugby and
Rugby Australia, would need to make that competition. What I
can say is from a competition point of view, we
will put all of those things on the table and
look at the pros and commons and benefits of those
(08:39):
things and then recommend that to our owners for them
to then assess, and their assessment will come more broadly.
Speaker 5 (08:46):
My focus is the competition.
Speaker 4 (08:49):
The unions obviously have to look at that broadly and
consider the recommendations that we put forward at a competition level.
You know, in view of the whole Rugby pyramids that
they are managing, so you know, they've got to do
the right thing for community game. They have to do
the right thing for Team in Black, and collectively we're
trying to do the right thing for the competition.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
We're down to eleven teams this year. Would you ideally
like to get back to twelve for twenty twenty six?
Speaker 4 (09:17):
Yeah, there's lots of benefits you know in having an
even number of teams. Clearly it brings some efficiency to
the drawer and things like that. I don't think we've seen,
you know, how good this eleven team structure can be,
so we'll be looking at it throughout the year. I
don't think there is an obvious, an obvious solution that
(09:39):
is within grasp for a twelve team right now. But
having said that, you know, we're very lucky that we
do have, you know, some longer term opportunities that we're
going to look at as well.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And I know twenty twenty five is your focus, but
have you thought short in fact more medium term mid
range for example, what's your five year vision for Super Rugby.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
Yeah, I mean, we're not probably going that far out
just yet. You know, our intention and our sort of
you know, three years sort of arizon is making sure
that our competition is the best rugby competition in the world,
and we're going to do that by making sure we've
got the most compelling product on the field, that we're
really strengthening our fan engagement offering for fans, and that
(10:30):
we're driving commercial value back back into our back into
our competition so that we can invest in it and
make those first two kind of things work. In terms
of competition design, we don't have a firm view on
those things yet. In terms of you know, let's say
in twenty twenty eight. We want the competition to look
(10:51):
like X, Y and Z. We're setting ourselves up to
make sure that we have a view of expansion into
the future, but we also want to be ready for
any opportunities that might come our way, and so we
need to sort of remain agile and open to opportunities.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Is all right? Well, we're just about at the start
line for twenty twenty five, Jack, exciting time for you
and your organization and for the teams and fans of
Super Rugby Pacific as well. Appreciate you having a chat
to us. I know need to go back and work
out how to get Ardie Savia Hoskins, a Tutu n
Peter Larkeye into my fantasy team.
Speaker 5 (11:23):
Well, I wish you'd a best of luck with that.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
I was actually, you know, I was just trying to
go through the hookers.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
My goodness is and good hooker. Is there any advice
for me on on hookers?
Speaker 4 (11:33):
Well?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
I would have some. Maybe we should take this offline
so that the advice doesn't go far and wide, although
that might be a good thing. Jack, great to chat.
Thanks for taking the time, Thanks very much.
Speaker 5 (11:43):
Talk to you soon, yep, talk soon.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
Jack, Thanks indeed, Jack Measley, CEO of Super Rugby Pacific.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live
to News Talk zed B weekends from midday, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
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