May 2, 2025 • 14 mins
The debut of the Indian Panthers from the men's NBL was always going to be a disaster, according to long-time basketball coach Jeff Green.
The Panthers have been suspended indefinitely after allegations emerged around delayed player payments and treatment.
Green told Jason Pine it was a tough ask to come in at a late stage with no real ties to this country, and to be any chance of surviving, it needed to be planned carefully.
He also has suspicions it was a trans-Tasman back-door listing attempt.
Green told Piney the ill-fated Indian Panthers may have been a Trojan horse to enter the other NBL.
Green says he's basing his allegations on the fact all the Panthers owners are based in Australia.
"You can assume that they were doing similar things to what the Tasmanian Huskies did early on a few years ago when they entered the New Zealand NBL, and then they left and became the Tasmanian Jack Jumpers in the Australian NBL.”
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
So As mentioned, the National Basketball League have handed the
Indian Panthers and immediate and indefinite suspension for the rest
of the twenty twenty five basketball season, and investigation into
serious allegations is ongoing amid claims of lack of payment
and poor treatment of players. During the week, a source
(00:32):
close to the Panthers told News Talks edb that the
team's overseas players were leaning on food banks because they
were short of money. The Panthers, though, say all players
have been paid, while staff and creditors will be fully
paid by the middle of May. Let's bring in longtime
basketball coach Jeff Green, who's seen a lot in his
(00:54):
life and this is just the latest chapter. Jeff, thanks
for taking the time. Who are to chat to us
in general terms? First of all, what have you made
of this whole Indian Panthers situation?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
There was always going to be a disaster right from
the word go, and you know, to have a team
coming at a late stage as Indian Panthers did and
no real ties to New Zealand, et cetera. So it
was always going to be something that had to be
(01:27):
really planned well and carried out, et cetera. But obviously
it was rushed and that's starting to show and the
people behind the scenes haven't stumped up as they promised,
and so you know, it's it's it's been an exercise
(01:49):
that hopefully we never go through again. But to be fair,
you know, the Panthers had a long term game and
it wasn't the New Zealand NBL, but but that sort
of shot their long term plans as well, so they
don't tidy up there.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Act what is their long term plan?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
I suspect the long term plan because all their owners
are based in Australia, so you can assume that they
were doing similar things to what the Tasmanian Huskies did
early on a few years ago when they entered the
New Zealand MBL and then they left and became the
(02:35):
Tasmania jack Jumpers in the Australian MBL. So I think
that's what the Pences were sort of perhaps looking at
longer term to be in the Australian League. But the
fact that they were getting all their players out of
India and they had to be exceptions made you know,
it was just missy and it was too rushed.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Do you think that the New Zealand basketball community were
aware of the problems around the franchise from fairly early
on because they got through what nine games the Panthers.
Do you think there was an awareness about the issues
facing the franchise quite early on in the piece?
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah, absolutely, And you know, right from conception and that's
my point, from conception to actually having something a bit
more solid, every step along the way was always met
with a delay of some sort. And you know, it
(03:37):
was a good example of that was they didn't attend
pre season, the pre season tournament held in Gray Mountain, Westport,
so they didn't attend that, and their excuse was, oh,
we don't have enough, we can't get any visas to
get into the country. Well, you've known about this for
a long long time. Then all of a sudden, there's
(03:59):
no visas for your players to get into the country.
And that could be a valid excuse, absolutely, but they
had known about it the problems.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Then.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Then there was a national camp held by the Indian
national team and that's where all players are met to
be coming from from the national team, So they couldn't
end for the first three games, so you know, they
only had a skeleton. So then they asked whether they
could use some Kiwis for the first three games, and
(04:32):
so the league said, okay, well let's do that. And
then then there was more problems with visas and players
weren't wanting to come out, et cetera, et cetera. So
it was just everything that I thought would go wrong
went wrong, and the excuses kept coming and filing up,
(04:53):
and then all of a sudden, the players out eight
or nine games decided that enough was enough. And I'm
talking about the Kiwi players that they had hired on
and one of the imports, and you know, then some
of the Indian players that were out here also had problems.
You know, a depth into the lifestyle and not accommodation
(05:18):
wasn't up there, and there wasn't they didn't have any
practice facilities, so you know, it was just a shambles.
So yeah, you wouldn't expect the news on the end
be able to do anything other than throw a suspension
on them for now and see where they they surface.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I think every sporting organization is keen to innovate, aren't they, Jeff?
You know, innovation is key if you want to develop
your sports. So this was an attempt at innovation. Was
it just a just a poor attempt at innovation?
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Yeah, it was. It was a lot of well thought
out plan and well, you know, and the guy responsible
for it was you know, he's done some innovations within
the New zeal NBL in the last couple of years.
(06:13):
But it's all of those sort of innovations. You know,
some are good, some are bad, some are terrible, and
you know, but as you say, you've got to try them,
but you would think that you would try them in
an area that doesn't actually affect the NBL teams, or
(06:34):
you know, fully discuss the proposal with everyone concerned. And
as I understand, these things aren't fully discussed and so
it's just someone with the innovative ideas and said, well,
this will be good, let's put this in. So I
think that's that's where it's wrong. And I think the
NVBL board has to commission they call themselves, has to
(06:57):
take responsibility for them because they're the ones that are
pushing it through.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Do you feel like there's been a degree of accountability
around what's happened here?
Speaker 3 (07:07):
No, I don't think I don't think anyone's been accountable
for it other than I thought part of the general
manager for the Panthers. I thought he fronted up really well.
I thought, you know, there was nothing that was untrue
with what he said, and he admitted some of the mistakes,
(07:28):
et cetera, et cetera. But I think the underlying factor was,
you know, what about the authorities, what have they done
helped the situation, rather than just hey, let's do this
is a good idea, and those ideas just never work.
And even though the Huskies were in as part of
(07:50):
the league a few years ago, it sort of worked.
But their long term goal was as soon as they
got a license, they're always going to go into the
Australian League, and so you know, they went around for
too long. But it's people just don't plan for these
things properly, and like you know, to have people come
(08:11):
from another country, at least Australia is a hot skip
and the jump away from us, you know, but we
can't say that about India. That's a long long way away.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Do you think if this will cause any reputational damage
to the league for overseas players or coaches who are
considering coming down here.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
Yeah, I think so. It's because, like you know, one
of the things that we do rely on, Like you know,
the MBL isn't like the Australian VL's. It's a very
poor cousin to the Australian MBL. There's not as much money,
there's not as much sponsorship, et cetera. So, like you know,
but it is a it is a good destination, particularly
(08:56):
for impwarts that some that are struggling in their careers
and they come down here to rejuvenate their careers. Some
are are injured. I know a few years ago we
had a player from the NBA that was rehabby and
so he wanted to come down here and play, and
(09:17):
so he spent a season down here and he was
just rehabbed. He wasn't one hundred, but being a player
of caliber, he was able to play really good basketball,
but it wasn't up to NBA standard. But yeah, so
we do have a reputation of blooding some Americans and
(09:40):
giving imports and opportunity to further their career because and
it's like that in the coaching ranks Australians that have
come here to coach is enormous and because it's another
line on their CV that they can promote. So you know,
the New Zealand League definitely has a good reputation from overseas,
(10:04):
but it's it's how we hand that as a league
is the problem.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Let's hope that this doesn't do any any major damage
as far as the league's concerned. Now, I guess with
the Panthers suspended, it goes to eleven teams. Do you
think there's a time where there'll be twelve teams again?
But a twelfth New Zealand team? Is there anybody else
who can come in?
Speaker 3 (10:27):
There? Probably is, but it's my concern would be the
current teams. You know, how they're going, like you know,
and you always hear things around the traps, but not
everyone is successful and so like you know, there's a
lot of shoe string budgets out there, and that's not
(10:50):
the fault of the franchises. They can do as much
as they can. But like you know, and we already
know that the Otago owners, the Australian owners have pulled
out from the end of this year. I don't know
here the same thing. The Australian owners are thinking of
(11:10):
plotting plague on their commitment to Taranaki. So you know
that that's two franchises that everyone knows about that that
has been signaled. So, you know, can we get those
franchises up and running and have someone reinvest in them?
So and Otago has been a great example over the years.
(11:35):
In some years out the next and that sort of thing.
So they're in and out. So you know, and all
franchises struggle, like you know, even the most successful ones.
It's still it's still a grind. And the Saints is
one of our premiere franchises, you know, And I've known
(11:56):
Nick Mills for many many years of my days in
the Heart Valley, and you know, I know that everyone
struggles and it's a it's an everyday event. But you know,
it's not just to the teams that are successful. It's
also the bottom teams that find it really.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Hard interesting times, I mean, because the other things, it's
a good comp and it's introducing young players. You look
at a guy like Jackson Ball in Hawk's Bay. What
the kid's only sixteen, seventeen years old. He's getting minutes
and lighting it up. So it's actually for what it is,
still a pretty good league, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Oh yeah, without doubt and like, you know, I remember
when they bought in the Rapid League. You know, I thought,
oh my gosh, this is one of those innovations that
I thought it was absolutely crazy and it added extra
financial weight on the franchises. But the concept has really
(12:56):
worked out and people like Jackson Ball would never have
got that opportunity to play in the Big League if
they didn't play Rapid League first and water talent, and
exactly right, Hayden Jones is another one from Nelson that
wouldn't have got those opportunities. But that two kids that
will be part of the Tour Blecks in years to
(13:20):
come for a long long time, and they got that
sort of stance through the Rapid League. So that through
that innovation, I think that innovation has been great. You know,
it could be tidied up, but you know, our league
is a good league for some of our keys in
like you look at all our Tour Blecks, they've all
played in the New zeal NBA at some stage in
(13:42):
their career and they've gone on and someone like Shay
Eely coming back from Melbourne, you know, he's been such
a start in the Australian League and you know, one
of the top point guards, one of the top defensive
guards in the in the Australian league, and he's now
back home playing in the Saints. So, like you know,
(14:03):
that's the sort of thing. So the league is very good.
The league is very good, without doubt.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Jeff. Great to get your insight. Thank you so much
for joining us today. I really appreciate it. And let's
hope that things go on and upward trajectory from.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Here not a prob anytime.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
No, thanks for chatting to u, Jeff. Jeff Green. There
a highly experienced basketball personality in New Zealand around for
a while. He's seen it all. Some very sensible thoughts there,
I thought from Jeff Green.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live
to News Talk zed B weekends from midday, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine
from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
So As mentioned, the National Basketball League have handed the
Indian Panthers and immediate and indefinite suspension for the rest
of the twenty twenty five basketball season, and investigation into
serious allegations is ongoing amid claims of lack of payment
and poor treatment of players. During the week, a source
(00:32):
close to the Panthers told News Talks edb that the
team's overseas players were leaning on food banks because they
were short of money. The Panthers, though, say all players
have been paid, while staff and creditors will be fully
paid by the middle of May. Let's bring in longtime
basketball coach Jeff Green, who's seen a lot in his
(00:54):
life and this is just the latest chapter. Jeff, thanks
for taking the time. Who are to chat to us
in general terms? First of all, what have you made
of this whole Indian Panthers situation?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
There was always going to be a disaster right from
the word go, and you know, to have a team
coming at a late stage as Indian Panthers did and
no real ties to New Zealand, et cetera. So it
was always going to be something that had to be
(01:27):
really planned well and carried out, et cetera. But obviously
it was rushed and that's starting to show and the
people behind the scenes haven't stumped up as they promised,
and so you know, it's it's it's been an exercise
(01:49):
that hopefully we never go through again. But to be fair,
you know, the Panthers had a long term game and
it wasn't the New Zealand NBL, but but that sort
of shot their long term plans as well, so they
don't tidy up there.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Act what is their long term plan?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
I suspect the long term plan because all their owners
are based in Australia, so you can assume that they
were doing similar things to what the Tasmanian Huskies did
early on a few years ago when they entered the
New Zealand MBL and then they left and became the
(02:35):
Tasmania jack Jumpers in the Australian MBL. So I think
that's what the Pences were sort of perhaps looking at
longer term to be in the Australian League. But the
fact that they were getting all their players out of
India and they had to be exceptions made you know,
it was just missy and it was too rushed.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Do you think that the New Zealand basketball community were
aware of the problems around the franchise from fairly early
on because they got through what nine games the Panthers.
Do you think there was an awareness about the issues
facing the franchise quite early on in the piece?
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah, absolutely, And you know, right from conception and that's
my point, from conception to actually having something a bit
more solid, every step along the way was always met
with a delay of some sort. And you know, it
(03:37):
was a good example of that was they didn't attend
pre season, the pre season tournament held in Gray Mountain, Westport,
so they didn't attend that, and their excuse was, oh,
we don't have enough, we can't get any visas to
get into the country. Well, you've known about this for
a long long time. Then all of a sudden, there's
(03:59):
no visas for your players to get into the country.
And that could be a valid excuse, absolutely, but they
had known about it the problems.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Then.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Then there was a national camp held by the Indian
national team and that's where all players are met to
be coming from from the national team, So they couldn't
end for the first three games, so you know, they
only had a skeleton. So then they asked whether they
could use some Kiwis for the first three games, and
(04:32):
so the league said, okay, well let's do that. And
then then there was more problems with visas and players
weren't wanting to come out, et cetera, et cetera. So
it was just everything that I thought would go wrong
went wrong, and the excuses kept coming and filing up,
(04:53):
and then all of a sudden, the players out eight
or nine games decided that enough was enough. And I'm
talking about the Kiwi players that they had hired on
and one of the imports, and you know, then some
of the Indian players that were out here also had problems.
You know, a depth into the lifestyle and not accommodation
(05:18):
wasn't up there, and there wasn't they didn't have any
practice facilities, so you know, it was just a shambles.
So yeah, you wouldn't expect the news on the end
be able to do anything other than throw a suspension
on them for now and see where they they surface.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I think every sporting organization is keen to innovate, aren't they, Jeff?
You know, innovation is key if you want to develop
your sports. So this was an attempt at innovation. Was
it just a just a poor attempt at innovation?
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Yeah, it was. It was a lot of well thought
out plan and well, you know, and the guy responsible
for it was you know, he's done some innovations within
the New zeal NBL in the last couple of years.
(06:13):
But it's all of those sort of innovations. You know,
some are good, some are bad, some are terrible, and
you know, but as you say, you've got to try them,
but you would think that you would try them in
an area that doesn't actually affect the NBL teams, or
(06:34):
you know, fully discuss the proposal with everyone concerned. And
as I understand, these things aren't fully discussed and so
it's just someone with the innovative ideas and said, well,
this will be good, let's put this in. So I
think that's that's where it's wrong. And I think the
NVBL board has to commission they call themselves, has to
(06:57):
take responsibility for them because they're the ones that are
pushing it through.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Do you feel like there's been a degree of accountability
around what's happened here?
Speaker 3 (07:07):
No, I don't think I don't think anyone's been accountable
for it other than I thought part of the general
manager for the Panthers. I thought he fronted up really well.
I thought, you know, there was nothing that was untrue
with what he said, and he admitted some of the mistakes,
(07:28):
et cetera, et cetera. But I think the underlying factor was,
you know, what about the authorities, what have they done
helped the situation, rather than just hey, let's do this
is a good idea, and those ideas just never work.
And even though the Huskies were in as part of
(07:50):
the league a few years ago, it sort of worked.
But their long term goal was as soon as they
got a license, they're always going to go into the
Australian League, and so you know, they went around for
too long. But it's people just don't plan for these
things properly, and like you know, to have people come
(08:11):
from another country, at least Australia is a hot skip
and the jump away from us, you know, but we
can't say that about India. That's a long long way away.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Do you think if this will cause any reputational damage
to the league for overseas players or coaches who are
considering coming down here.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
Yeah, I think so. It's because, like you know, one
of the things that we do rely on, Like you know,
the MBL isn't like the Australian VL's. It's a very
poor cousin to the Australian MBL. There's not as much money,
there's not as much sponsorship, et cetera. So, like you know,
but it is a it is a good destination, particularly
(08:56):
for impwarts that some that are struggling in their careers
and they come down here to rejuvenate their careers. Some
are are injured. I know a few years ago we
had a player from the NBA that was rehabby and
so he wanted to come down here and play, and
(09:17):
so he spent a season down here and he was
just rehabbed. He wasn't one hundred, but being a player
of caliber, he was able to play really good basketball,
but it wasn't up to NBA standard. But yeah, so
we do have a reputation of blooding some Americans and
(09:40):
giving imports and opportunity to further their career because and
it's like that in the coaching ranks Australians that have
come here to coach is enormous and because it's another
line on their CV that they can promote. So you know,
the New Zealand League definitely has a good reputation from overseas,
(10:04):
but it's it's how we hand that as a league
is the problem.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Let's hope that this doesn't do any any major damage
as far as the league's concerned. Now, I guess with
the Panthers suspended, it goes to eleven teams. Do you
think there's a time where there'll be twelve teams again?
But a twelfth New Zealand team? Is there anybody else
who can come in?
Speaker 3 (10:27):
There? Probably is, but it's my concern would be the
current teams. You know, how they're going, like you know,
and you always hear things around the traps, but not
everyone is successful and so like you know, there's a
lot of shoe string budgets out there, and that's not
(10:50):
the fault of the franchises. They can do as much
as they can. But like you know, and we already
know that the Otago owners, the Australian owners have pulled
out from the end of this year. I don't know
here the same thing. The Australian owners are thinking of
(11:10):
plotting plague on their commitment to Taranaki. So you know
that that's two franchises that everyone knows about that that
has been signaled. So, you know, can we get those
franchises up and running and have someone reinvest in them?
So and Otago has been a great example over the years.
(11:35):
In some years out the next and that sort of thing.
So they're in and out. So you know, and all
franchises struggle, like you know, even the most successful ones.
It's still it's still a grind. And the Saints is
one of our premiere franchises, you know, And I've known
(11:56):
Nick Mills for many many years of my days in
the Heart Valley, and you know, I know that everyone
struggles and it's a it's an everyday event. But you know,
it's not just to the teams that are successful. It's
also the bottom teams that find it really.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Hard interesting times, I mean, because the other things, it's
a good comp and it's introducing young players. You look
at a guy like Jackson Ball in Hawk's Bay. What
the kid's only sixteen, seventeen years old. He's getting minutes
and lighting it up. So it's actually for what it is,
still a pretty good league, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Oh yeah, without doubt and like, you know, I remember
when they bought in the Rapid League. You know, I thought,
oh my gosh, this is one of those innovations that
I thought it was absolutely crazy and it added extra
financial weight on the franchises. But the concept has really
(12:56):
worked out and people like Jackson Ball would never have
got that opportunity to play in the Big League if
they didn't play Rapid League first and water talent, and
exactly right, Hayden Jones is another one from Nelson that
wouldn't have got those opportunities. But that two kids that
will be part of the Tour Blecks in years to
(13:20):
come for a long long time, and they got that
sort of stance through the Rapid League. So that through
that innovation, I think that innovation has been great. You know,
it could be tidied up, but you know, our league
is a good league for some of our keys in
like you look at all our Tour Blecks, they've all
played in the New zeal NBA at some stage in
(13:42):
their career and they've gone on and someone like Shay
Eely coming back from Melbourne, you know, he's been such
a start in the Australian League and you know, one
of the top point guards, one of the top defensive
guards in the in the Australian league, and he's now
back home playing in the Saints. So, like you know,
(14:03):
that's the sort of thing. So the league is very good.
The league is very good, without doubt.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Jeff. Great to get your insight. Thank you so much
for joining us today. I really appreciate it. And let's
hope that things go on and upward trajectory from.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Here not a prob anytime.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
No, thanks for chatting to u, Jeff. Jeff Green. There
a highly experienced basketball personality in New Zealand around for
a while. He's seen it all. Some very sensible thoughts there,
I thought from Jeff Green.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live
to News Talk zed B weekends from midday, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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