Managing fear and anxiety in times of global instability

22 June 2025:  With geopolitical tensions escalating around the globe, it’s easy to feel overwhelmed by fear and anxiety of what could eventuate. Hamish Williams and psychotherapist Kyle MacDonald explore how this global instability affects our mental wellbeing, and discuss ways to regulate our emotions in uncertain times.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:08):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talks Ed B
follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
This is the Nutters Club, thanks to New Zealand air
on News Talks Edbadnings.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
Good evening, and welcome to the Nutters Club, the show
that talks about your mental health every Sunday night and
Monday morning and tries to see if we can give
you a bit of help along the way. My name's
Hamish Williams, and a very good evening to you wherever
you might be listening around the country, around the world.

(01:02):
Went to the movies last night, well yesterday afternoon, when
I saw a well I suppose it's a horror movie
about zombies, but it wasn't really about zombies. It's called
twenty eight Years Later. It's a sequel to a long
time ago movie, well long time ago two thousand and
two movie back then called twenty eight Days Later movie

(01:27):
that's a bit of a cult classic set in England
and is as largely regarded as what sort of got
the zombie genre going back again in the post millennium world. Anyway,
it's been away while not quite twenty eight years am
I add, But enough that they have come out with
a long gestating sequel of sorts set in the same world.

(01:49):
And what it was really interesting was that I was
really surprised about what was in the movie. There's a
whole bunch of stuff in there that you would expect,
I don't know, zombies, but you start to understand that
often these kind of movies sometimes are a bit of
a commentary on what's going on in the world that
we live in in the very much the now, and

(02:10):
of course we live in a post Brexit world. So
in the movie, the UK has the zombie virus. The
rest of the world doesn't. They're called it the rage virus.
They have the virus, the rest of the world doesn't,
and they're isolated and they literally have boats that patrol
them to stop anyone from going there. We also live
in a post COVID, post pandemic world. We're back in

(02:32):
two thousand and two. The idea of a virus clearing
our streets and no one walking around was something that
people marveled at in that original film in two thousand
and two. Fast Wall to twenty twenty five, we've all
lived it. We know what that looks like now, not
quite as scary once it's been and gone. But in

(02:53):
the midst of the film there was something which I
don't want to ruin for you, because in all honesty,
I think if you've got the time and can rustle
together the fifteen bucks that it costs to go to
the movies these days, you should definitely go and have
a watch. But in the midst of it, I was
really surprise was it actually challenged our feelings around death,

(03:14):
doom and destruction and actually had a way in which
they talked about how to deal with it with dignity
and with a bit of hope as well. The news
of today would probably be something that's tested everyone's hope
in some way, shape or form. Definitely has mine, And

(03:36):
so tonight on the show, we very much want to
talk about how does fear affect our mental health and
how can external events not out of control affect our
mental health. I know you'll have a lot of feelings
on this one, so let me just be very clear
to let you know straight off the bat, we're a

(03:58):
mental health show, not an international politics show. So in
terms of the politics of it all, let's just kind
of put that to a side. But when we hear
about bombs being dropped, retaliation coming, and you see presidents
of the United States of America saying all the words

(04:19):
that sound as though it could lead to something more.
It would be right that you might have some thoughts
and feelings that come out about that. In fact, I
think it'd be only human in order to help understand
how these things affect our mental health. He's a man
who's here most weeks. He's my psychotherapist. He's your psychotherapist.

(04:42):
He's Carl McDonald, Kyle good evening cure. Do you know
here's the thing, right, I noticed that, regardless of what's
happened in the news today, we're not broadcasting from the bunker,
the z B Bunker.

Speaker 3 (04:53):
No.

Speaker 4 (04:54):
Although it can feel a bit like a big round
here sometimes, all the soundproofing and you know, the security,
we are nowhere different. We are doing exactly the same thing,
exactly the same place.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
In terms of a clinician's understanding and definition of this, Yeah,
do external events like what we've seen play out and
right right before our eyes? Pretty much? Do external events
affect people's mental health in a significant way?

Speaker 4 (05:24):
Yeah, they do, Although I sort of hesitate to even
call it mental health in a way because I think
that one of the things that we have to accept
is that these events are completely real and are unsettling
at the very least and potentially quite frightening. So we
have to acknowledge that we're actually dealing with something that
is distressing. And so then the question isn't should we

(05:48):
or shouldn't we be having feelings? You know, don't get
over it, move on, forget about it, don't worry about it,
because there is something to be concerned about. It's then
about how do we regulate and respond to those feelings
and how do we manage the feelings when they show up.
I mean, I don't know about you, Hamish, but what
are the first memories that I have that I can
think of remembering anything political growing up? Was the you know,

(06:13):
the locker bee bombing. Oh yeah, yeah, and the sort
of the response to Libya as a response, and I,
rightly or wrongly, my what would have been I don't
know about eight year old brain. I think it was
early eighties, seven, eight nine year old. All I heard
in that was you know, potential nuclear war, and I

(06:34):
remember being quite freaked out about that for what was
probably a few days, and then sort of regulating myself.
I probably spoke to one of my parents or something.
I don't really clearly remember what got me out of it.
Maybe it was just that the news moved on. But
I think we always have these things in life that
have the potential to freak us out. Then the question

(06:57):
becomes how do we deal with the freak out.

Speaker 2 (06:59):
It's interesting you bring up Lockerby, because I mean I
remember the original Gulf War, right, you know, Saddam Hussein
and all that, not the S and one, but the
one with Bush senior, not the sequel with Bush Junior.

Speaker 4 (07:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:11):
Yeah, anyway, but I think nine to eleven. You know
when Nan happened. I can tell you right now. I
was still at high school. I think I was in
senior year, so I would have been in seventh form
year thirteen, what would call that now, And we literally
were having parties on the weekend, not to celebrate it,
because we were like, we're probably going to go to
war soon, right, and we should make the most of

(07:34):
this time. Yeah, wow, news flash spoiler alert. Yeah, we
didn't go to war.

Speaker 4 (07:39):
It was a long time ago. I mean I was
just thinking you were at high school. I was in
my third year of psychotherapy training. I just met my
partner Meredith. It's only sort of a few months and
I remember standing in front of the TV drinking coffee
with my flatmate and Meredith drinking, going holy crap.

Speaker 2 (07:56):
Yeah, And I think I think that that's probably the
best response to something like that in so many ways,
because it's a lot to process. But life went on,
so in terms of how we're seeing events play out,
and let's be honest, it gets made a big deal
of and we suddenly start seeing, you know, what the
bombers look like, and they look scary. I'll be honest,

(08:16):
They machines of war, right.

Speaker 4 (08:18):
I'll look to be clear, A lot of what I'm
going to say about fair and anxiety tonight is prefaced
by a reasonably obvious assumption, which is we're in New Zealand.
Now we may have some listeners from around the world.
And if we do, and you've got a different view
on this, and it's more frightening where you are, please
give us a bell. We'd love to hear from you.
Jump on the internet and give us a bell. But

(08:41):
the reality is it is not a direct threat to
us right now. So we are in a privileged position
when it comes to being able to think about this,
I have no doubt. If you're closer, it is very
frightening and very real. But we also have the ability
to choose how we respond to this here in New
Zealand for so far away from it.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
All right, it can be any other thing though, I mean,
if you talk about like, you know, there was another
story on the news tonight about a stabbing and pecoranga
at a night market. You know, I know that there's
been incidents that have happened in Newland more recently, to
the point that you know, my wife isn't particularly happy
when our son says that he's going to go to
the New lind mall.

Speaker 4 (09:18):
Oh occasionally something happens. It's it looks more and we
have the same conversation in our house. We're like, oh,
should the big sure the kids be going? They're unattended.

Speaker 2 (09:25):
And somebody actually said to me, they go, oh, we
never help that. These things in pons and Bill Grill
and I was like, no, that's wrong. Shooting in Pontsenby
last year. Yeah, you know, And as and as tragic
as these things are, and they are tragic because at
the end of the day, there are people who genuinely
are hurt and lose their lives, and we don't want
to minimize that, and we're not. The point is is

(09:46):
that these become big stories, they become what we hear,
they become what we see, and all of a sudden,
it can at times feel a little bit overwhelming. Yeah,
So what I'm interested to talk about tonight you said,
you know you need to be able to regulate the feelings,
and is to find out how how do we do that?
And it's different for everyone. So what I would be

(10:08):
interested tonight to hear from you guys tonight? It's very
much your show. We know that we've got a lot
of people listening here tonight, and I know that a
lot of you will be thinking about the things that
you're hearing on the news. So it'd be great tonight
if we could actually help each other out on this one.
How do you handle your fears and your anxiety when
it comes to things that are external, all things that

(10:30):
are actually just happening in your life. What is it
that you do, What is it that you tell yourself?
What is it that you make sure that you apply?
Could be going for the you know the basics, you know,
I go for a walk orps. You know, I make
sure that I get out of the house. Some people
like to clean, yeah, really obsessive on the cleaning.

Speaker 4 (10:48):
I find vacuum quite comforting actually.

Speaker 2 (10:51):
So what is it, you know, gardening, whatever it is,
I'd like to hear from you when it comes to
managing your fear and anxiety. What works for you. Nothing's
off the table here. We'd just like to know what
that is. Eight hundred and eighty ten eighty is the
number or text us on nine two nine two. But alternatively,

(11:12):
if you're genuinely struggling at the moment with managing your
fear or your anxiety, and it doesn't have to be
about what's happening in the Middle East, it can be
on anything. If you're struggling tonight, then please give us
a call. We'd be really interested to find out how
it's affecting you and what it is that maybe perhaps
you could do differently to try and help manage it.

(11:35):
You've got psychotherapist Carle MacDonald here. You've got an amazing audience.
We've got one of the best audiences in the entire
country listening, which will be filled with positive ideas. And
I know that because you've done it so many times before.
So let's get the conversation going. Oh, eight hundred eighty
ten eighty text us on nine two nine two. Managing
fear and Anxiety talk soon here tonight on the Nutters Club.

Speaker 1 (11:59):
This is the Nutters Club thanks to New Zealand on
air on news.

Speaker 2 (12:02):
Dog z'b Welcome back to the Nutters Club. My name's
Tamus Williams. In the Auckland studio with me tonight psychotherapist
car MacDonald and we're talking about fear and anxiety, especially
in the face of some of the international news that's
flying around. Got a tick here from Karen Kyle. Yes, cheers,
very very calmy, sises evening. I don't listen to watch

(12:24):
any news media, right.

Speaker 4 (12:26):
It's one way to deal with it, it is.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
Yeah, But we were talking about this before before we
came on the show. Now because there's a couple of
things here. Sometimes in managing the fear and anxiety, people
just be like, I don't want to know about it,
turning it off, yeah, right, whereas others need to know everything.

Speaker 4 (12:43):
Yeah, I'm the latter. I've got a section on my
bookshelf at home which is filled with books about the
horrors of World War two, because I find history really fascinating,
and in particular the ways in which we can understand
actually more about where we are by looking back, which
probably is not a surprising thing for psychotherapist to say, right,

(13:05):
But the important thing, I think is to know which
one of those two people you are, because generally there
are people who need to stay out of it because
actually they can get too tangled up in it, or
some people like myself who actually I actually find comfort
in understanding it more. Which is not to say that
I endlessly scroll doom scrolling on the old social media
and going over and over the same facts, but I

(13:26):
do like to stay abreast of what's happening because it
helps me think about it. And I think then the
trick is just to have the insight to know which
way you go. And actually also that might change from
day to day. If you're having a really bad day,
maybe it's not the time to deep dive into the news.

Speaker 2 (13:38):
No thyself, Indeed, let's go to the lines. Jared, good
evening to you.

Speaker 3 (13:44):
Good evening, good evening.

Speaker 5 (13:46):
You're just talking about earlier.

Speaker 6 (13:49):
We are in New Zealand, and it's a privilege if
we seek perhaps for the topical events you're talking about,
perhaps if we use the term of goldenlocks so or
perhaps relative to where Urth is right in the solar system.
I used to struggle with a lot of things, and

(14:14):
a big component of that was not having a crystal
ball or trying to use my mind like I think
I have, or you know, looping looping around. And I
have made a lot of big changes through first acceptance
and then the default. Actually most of the time here

(14:40):
with everything is chaos across time, across geography, you know,
this place, it is volatile, life is challenging. I straight
away lean into what as what are the things that
I have external to the fear or the anxiety And

(15:07):
I mean, don't want to sound like a doche but
mostly it's winning. Yeah, there's there's there's challenges and I
fall on my face all the time. But when I
used to have a lot of anxiety and fear, it
was the fear of falling on my face all the time.
And once I accept there's something that I do, I
noticed how good I'd got at getting back up again.
That's pretty much it.

Speaker 4 (15:28):
I really like that because what you're recognizing is two
really sort of simple things when we boil it right
down to brass text, right, which is what what am
I in control of? And what can I do that
gives me a sense of mastery.

Speaker 6 (15:42):
You and nothing else. Yeah, you and nothing else. That's
what you control of.

Speaker 2 (15:47):
And I also like the idea Jared. You know, you're
sort of saying, you know, you've you've you fall down
yourself back up actually, you know, giving yourself a bit
of self praise for actually just keeping on keeping on.
And I think that we're sometimes too hard on ourselves.
I've actually what an achievement that is.

Speaker 6 (16:04):
I used to be someone who I could work very
hard and do something that I was proud of and
if other people were proud of it, or or I
got to pay rise or something that was that was
more significant.

Speaker 7 (16:21):
And then when I was doing.

Speaker 6 (16:23):
Things that were just for myself and I could be
proud of it, I would find a way to always
minimize it or make a simoa. I've been self for sure,
you know, And that would bleed into other things, just
not the specific things that might be career based or

(16:44):
we are skill set naturalized anyway, it's just.

Speaker 8 (16:46):
Like a.

Speaker 6 (16:48):
I don't know, like a little sniffle. Is it just
turns into a really terrible cold because you don't know
what to treat it with.

Speaker 2 (16:55):
Yeah, yeah, now that's that's really good insight. Jared, thank
you very much for kicking off tonight. I think that's
an excellent insight.

Speaker 9 (17:04):
All good.

Speaker 7 (17:04):
Thank you very much.

Speaker 10 (17:05):
You know so well.

Speaker 2 (17:07):
Yeah, and there was to be said there isn't there
just about just being a bit easier on ourselves.

Speaker 4 (17:12):
Yeah, absolutely, and you know, recognizing that actually maybe for
the next few days or weeks we might all be
a bit sort of not quite running out one hundred percent,
a bit distracted and maybe that's okay.

Speaker 2 (17:24):
What do you think how do you deal with your
fear and anxiety all? Like we said before, is it
something that you're actually finding quite tough at the moment.
Want to hear from you either way. Oh, eight hundred
and eighty ten eighty. We'll take a break back in
a moment here tonight on the Nutters Club.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
This is the Nutters Club thanks to New Zealand on
air on news.

Speaker 2 (17:42):
Dog z'b Welcome back to the Nutters Club. We will
go straight back to the lines, but before we do,
we've got to text message year from Mike. Mike says,
a good joint gets rid of fairs and anxiety. Hamish
for the last forty years and still going hard. It
works for me.

Speaker 4 (18:01):
Well, I mean, you know, one of the things we
say on the show is whatever works. The caution, of
course with ken and alcohol is make sure you keep
a handle on it. But of course one of the
recognized uses of medicinal cannabis now is anxiety management. So
you know, it's not that surprising. And you know sometimes

(18:23):
you know, nice glass of wine, nice glass of Scotch
can help too. But again it's about all things in balance. Hey,
mission Recca, and if you are someone who struggled with addiction,
now is not the best time to be picking up
your substance of choice.

Speaker 2 (18:38):
This Texas is most people think like that last caller.
But you two make money out of talking individuals into
thinking they have a problem. It is you who don't
see reality. I don't know how much money you're making
on this car, but either way, look interesting observation. I
would say that for the two hours that we're on

(18:59):
here every week, we come in to actually be able
to try and help people navigate the problem of anything.
We've been asking tonight, the question has been how do
you deal with your fear and anxiety rather than trying
to perpetrate that you have fear and anxiety in the
first place.

Speaker 4 (19:18):
Yeah, last time I checked, people who turned up in
my office were there very voluntarily good.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
Yeah, much like our callers. Yeah, to be fair, we
don't force you to call. In fact, we're very grateful
that you do, because, as we know, we get a
lot of feedback from people telling us that they find
it reasonably helpful.

Speaker 4 (19:34):
Most people are so quite happy to stop coming to
therapy when they don't need to.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
Funnily enough, yeah, well that's a reasonably good sign that
you're being effective at your job, you'd hope.

Speaker 4 (19:42):
And to make me redundant.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
As I said to my clients, let's go to the lines. Susanne,
good evening to you.

Speaker 10 (19:50):
Oh sooner, I'm sorry.

Speaker 11 (19:54):
That's okay, Hello, Susan, Hi, I just want just sure
of our anxiety because what.

Speaker 12 (20:06):
I've heard.

Speaker 13 (20:08):
Watch day.

Speaker 14 (20:10):
Can you under shure me?

Speaker 2 (20:13):
I can understand you just a little bit, Susanne. Just
just speak, speak as clearly as you can. But where
we're all listening, we're all he is.

Speaker 5 (20:21):
Thank you.

Speaker 14 (20:24):
A salas this morning. I also met a strong objext h. Basically,
she is more anything to do with me. I live
and viol day with what she says to me, and
I don't know how she I don't know to do because.

Speaker 2 (20:49):
I'm okay, I'm very sorry to hear that. What I
just just something in case you're just struggling there. My
understanding is that Suzanne has been having some disagreements with
her daughter and is feeling quite anxious about the situation
that it's creating in the relationship. Kyle, what's a good
first step for anyone who's navigating these kind of interpersonal relationships?

(21:13):
Is the technical term I guess they give them. But
it's always a tough one, right.

Speaker 4 (21:16):
It's really tough, And I think one of the challenges,
particularly with family relationships, is to is to keep trying
to actually see it and hear it from the other
person's perspective. Often in families, of course, whatever difficulties we're
having have got a long history, and often that means
that we've got to sometimes got a bit of a

(21:37):
fixed view on what we think has been happening in
the relationship or the ways in which we might have
been upset quite rightly by what's happened, But slowing it
down is generally a good idea, taking the time to
really try and think about what's the truth and what
they're saying and what can I hear and take responsibility for.

Speaker 2 (21:55):
That's a really good point, actually, because I think sometimes
you actually don't know what the other person is thinking,
So be very direct as much as you can without
causing any tension between or greater anxiety I guess between
the two. But just say I'm I'm trying to understand
what it is that that is the real core of

(22:15):
the issue here from your perspective.

Speaker 4 (22:17):
Yeah, and then just listen. You don't have to agree
to be able to hear and understand and validate.

Speaker 2 (22:24):
I like that, it's not It doesn't need to have consensus,
doesn't have to be right and wrong. Let's keep going
on the lines. Jack, good evening to.

Speaker 10 (22:31):
You, good evening.

Speaker 3 (22:33):
How's it going.

Speaker 2 (22:34):
Yeah, good good to your voice.

Speaker 15 (22:36):
Yeah, thank you. I've always been must know if you guys,
never caught it. But just a couple of things. To
my point, I've always put myself in a position job
wise like security and not where I can control the situation,
where I can direct which way the whole situation goes.
I've always, what's some words, I've always felt that I've

(22:59):
needed to be able to direct the situation in a
way that as what's.

Speaker 3 (23:03):
In my control. Last year I made the trip overseas
to Ukraine and just took efforts over there in humanitarian capacity.
But when I came back a couple of months later,
I was struggling majorly everyday noises, anxiety from planes, from hammers,
from cars backfiring. You know, it was just my mind

(23:26):
was still wired to that zone, like every noise is
a bad noise, and my way of hamming that anxiety
was dealing if it had on. I went to the
local airport, which is Wellington. I sat out there with
two or three bears and spent the whole day there
just listening to her playing noises, getting myself back into hey,

(23:49):
this is a normal situation, this is something I am
within control. I am in control of. I can leave
any time. I'm choosing to be here and expose myself
to it. And that's something I was doing quite regularly
with various noises saying outside building sites of the nail
gun and hammer noises and wood dropping just get used
to everyday noises again, And that's the way I personally

(24:13):
found an anxiety at least over something that had quite
a strong grip over me.

Speaker 15 (24:18):
If that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (24:22):
I'm not sure if it's the best way of doing it,
but it's what worked for me. And obviously everyone has
different fears, some of them you can't face front on,
but something like that I found the exposure therapy was
absolutely amazing just to get rid of the anxiety around
some things.

Speaker 2 (24:41):
Well, Carl, I mean, it's one it's one way of
doing things right, But you know, is there any kind
of caution that you should be taking an exposure theory
or you know, therapy or is the way that Jack
did it? You know, pretty on point?

Speaker 8 (24:53):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (24:53):
Look, I mean I think it sounds like you, you know,
you really thought about it, Jack, And obviously the proof
is in the pudding, right, it worked for you, and
it is, as you say, a particular kind of approach
called exposure therapy. I mean, I guess the caution I
would give people listening is, and it sounds like you
did manage to achieve this yourself, is we have to
make sure that we don't hit overwhelm because actually then

(25:14):
we can move into being retraumatized. So you know, probably
going and you know, working on a plane and standing
right next to the jet engine or you know, whatever
it might be that would be too freaky is not
the place to start. But it's a really solid theory
and if you can put it into practice, it does
work that we gradually expose ourselves to the thing that
frightens us in a safe way and in a manageable way.

Speaker 2 (25:38):
Jack, thanks very much for the call tonight. That's I
really appreciate your insight into what worked for you, and
also thanks for going and doing your work that you
did over there for the people in the Ukraine. Top effort.

Speaker 3 (25:49):
Yeah, that was just a small part in the big picture.
But I'm also not too sure if you guys know,
But Mikey was also talking about this last night on
this show, anxiety and how people get rid Abestria, but
what they do daily I think I guess things people
mentioned was fishing, that sort of thing that was quite

(26:11):
a big point of a show. I'm not sure how
many listeners that it was a really good show last
night around it in the early.

Speaker 2 (26:20):
Morning thanks to the insight. Yeah, I mean fishing outdoor
time in the sun. It's all the stuff that we
know has a direct positive impact on your mental health. Gardening,
yeah huge.

Speaker 4 (26:34):
I'm not much of a fisherman, but I have a
couple of mate to dig into it, and it's really
just mindfulness. Yeah, actually with the occasionally a bit of
fish murder checked down on the side, but a lot
of the time, of course, you just sitting there looking
at your line in the water and having a yarn.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
Well, this is this is this is me in sailing.
It's just why I like being out on the water.
It's it's nice, it's calming, you know, especially when you.

Speaker 4 (26:56):
Just but it also requires your attention in a particular
kind of way, right.

Speaker 2 (26:59):
And it requires your attention in such ways that you
have to be so on point that you actually can't
think about anything else. Yeah, and then therefore, you know,
you're giving yourself mental relief from any other things that
might be rattling around. Anyway, Let's take a break and
we come back. More of your text and calls here
tonight on Another's Club.

Speaker 1 (27:18):
This is the Nutters Club thanks to New Zealand on
air on news dogs'd be.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
Hey, welcome back to the show. We'll go straight back
to the lines. I'll be good evening.

Speaker 7 (27:27):
To you, will you, Kyle?

Speaker 2 (27:30):
How are you very good?

Speaker 9 (27:33):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (27:34):
Well you we pleased to know. I put my nuts
from jacket in to get dry cleaned. Oh finally, We'll
be worrying for wee while. But I'm very proud to
wear it because people come up to me and say,
where can I buy one of them?

Speaker 2 (27:56):
Maybe we need to get an online store gown. Carl
Doig can buy them.

Speaker 7 (28:02):
You've got to earn them.

Speaker 4 (28:04):
Limited edition, he says, it's a limited.

Speaker 7 (28:06):
Edition, but I've got when my wife is alive. She
gave me a good saying which I paid on the
wall and it said this was in two ty and
twenty Live for Today for tomorra Is follows to.

Speaker 2 (28:28):
Nobody, say that again, Albi.

Speaker 7 (28:33):
Live for Today for tomorra Is probles to nobody.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
I love it. Yeah, yeah, that's really great.

Speaker 7 (28:44):
I think so. And it's it's honestly in a big
red pay right across the wall.

Speaker 2 (28:53):
Yeah, yeah, no, I think we should take a lot
of that, because you know, we can be so we
can be so fearful of the future, you know, we
can we can still be so affected by the past,
but really just living in the present, in the moment
and being able to find those occasions where we can
be grateful for what we have, even if it's just
the small things in life. That's what's going to actually

(29:15):
help get us through. And Kyl's nodding emphatically on this aim.

Speaker 5 (29:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (29:20):
And the other thing is you must have a plan
for tomorrow, a plan to get up, a plan to
exer size, a plan what to eat. I'll go across
the roads Chewy too swimming pool and I have a
good work out over there, and I'm fit of seventy

(29:44):
one and I'm proud of your fit. You know.

Speaker 2 (29:50):
Well, I don't think there's anything wrong with being fit
and seventy one lbing. If anything, I think that should
be a goal for all of us.

Speaker 4 (29:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (29:58):
Yeah, I'm a very closely looked after boy hospital, you know,
at not Sony so they call it, But they really
keep an eye on me in the past, so obvious

(30:21):
silly shings. Love, I'm glad you alive and check you.

Speaker 2 (30:27):
Yeah, well that's that's the way I'll be. And to
be honest, it's like, if you keep an eye on
your health, and that includes your mental health, and I
know you do, you're actually going to have a lot more,
not only years on the planet living, but they're going
to be good ones in terms of the happiness and
the good experiences that you can have. Because that is,

(30:48):
honestly why we want to have this conversation tonight, is
to make sure that we don't let these things, our
fears or anxieties, become overwhelming that they actually rob us
of being able to live our life. Thanks the call,
I'll be always good to talk to you. It's good
to Dave. Dave, good evening to you.

Speaker 8 (31:07):
Yes, good wight to you, good good readers evening. I apologize,
that's right, fiddness. Yes, business is not a goal. It
should become a lifestyle.

Speaker 2 (31:16):
I would suggest, Yeah, I think that's a suggestion.

Speaker 8 (31:20):
A proxy ATV two to what I'm wanting. Anyhow, my
question I hadn't did as a question is regarding COVID
nineteen and government control and stall the figure and anxiety,
whether it's influenza that idly was an over reaction, ruinous
to the economy, small business, et cetera. I wonder whether

(31:42):
we've learned anything post COVID.

Speaker 2 (31:44):
It's a good question. It's a good question, Dave, because
actually I was reflecting on that today you know, when
I was I was watching all of the news flowing
out and you know, quickly turning on, turning on the
TV and watching the US President standing there, and it
did feel a bit covid ESQ.

Speaker 16 (32:04):
You know.

Speaker 2 (32:05):
Look, you know, and brought back some moments from that.
What I would say, Dave, because you've asked the question,
I'll give you an answer.

Speaker 8 (32:12):
You know.

Speaker 2 (32:13):
One of the things that we found doing this show,
at least was that what was able to really be
a great antidote to the fear and anxiety was to
talk about it. And when we actually had people calling up,
they were asking just some sometimes really basic questions, and
we were able to be able to give the really
basic answers. And I think that ultimately, fear and anxiety

(32:37):
really can flourish in isolation and also with the people
who would wind people up for whatever reason. But I
think ultimately we're better to talk it out like we've
been talking tonight, and address the fears and a dress
the anxieties and then find a way to be able
to manage them.

Speaker 8 (32:58):
Perhaps, but it's a little late for small businesses who
really went to the wall and others who suffered greatly
of the family is not being able to get together.

Speaker 2 (33:10):
Yeah, I agree. I agree, Dave, But you know, we're
not a we're not a business show, and we're not
a politics show. We're talking about people's mental health tonight,
and I don't I'm not saying that you don't have
valid issues here, but what what I would say is
that we're trying to figure out how to be able
to keep the way that we think about situations really clear,
so that whether you're you're a small business owner, whether

(33:33):
you're you know, you're you're in a family, or whether
or not you're a decision maker you're you know, you're
a government leader, appointed leader, that you're able to actually
make those clear decisions when you're actually in a situation
that at times can be quite tough.

Speaker 8 (33:48):
Yes, I instill history too, and I hope we have
learned learned a lot, not only the government, but are
we as a people. I hope as she doesn't repeat
in their regard.

Speaker 2 (33:58):
Yeah, well that could that makes three of us. Dave
begs for the call.

Speaker 4 (34:04):
Yeah, because one of the one of the things that's
really interesting too about history is that the only way
that a lot of times these things actually make sense
is in retrospect. That's why history is so wonderful to read,
because actually when we look back at events, often they
make a lot of sense ten, fifteen years later or
five years later, because we now know what we didn't

(34:26):
know then. And I mean, I genuinely hope that in
a week's time we look back on the last couple
of days and think, oh, thank goodness for that, because actually,
when you're in it, it is frightening, and fear can
pass quite quickly when the circumstances changed.

Speaker 2 (34:44):
Because fear and anxiety can be a lot about things
that haven't happened.

Speaker 4 (34:48):
Yeah, well, anxiety, by definition is fear of something that
is not happening. So in the absence of a threat,
something in our mind has caused us to have a
fear response.

Speaker 2 (34:58):
We're going to continue talking about this. Would welcome you
calls oh eight one hundred and eighty, ten eighty, or
you can text us on nine two nine two. How
do you regulate your feelings when it comes to fear
and anxiety? What is it that you do and how
can you best keep external external events from affecting your

(35:20):
mental health? What works for you? But alternatively, if it's
not working for you, if you haven't found that thing,
and give us a call because we'd like to hear
from you tonight and see if we can't help you
figure out what might be some of the options that
you could think of. And who knows, probably the audience
and then all you listening will have better ideas than us,
So text us on nineteen nine, two oh eight hundred
and eighty ten eighty back soon here tonight on the

(35:41):
Nutters Club.

Speaker 1 (35:42):
This is the Nutters Club thanks to New Zealand on
air on News Dogs.

Speaker 2 (35:46):
That'd be welcome back to the show. Welcome your calls
on eight hundred to eighty ten eighty. Let's go to
the lines. Good evening to you, John.

Speaker 17 (35:55):
Yeah, even to both of you. Mainly a question to Carl.
When somebody's got a significant traumatic brain injury from an accident,
we are a mean ill or are they excellent damage? Cow?
How do you determine the difference?

Speaker 4 (36:14):
Yeah, that's a really good question because it is a
bit of a blurry line. But first of all, let
me say that, you know, if someone has had a
traumatic brain injury TBI as some people refer to it,
you know, hopefully as part of that process they've received
what we call a neuropsychological assessment, which is really just
a flashway of saying that they've had a whole bunch

(36:36):
of tests by an expert that can tell them what
their deficits or their difficulties might be as a result
of the brain injury.

Speaker 3 (36:44):
I mean.

Speaker 4 (36:45):
One of the most common ones, of course, is what
we see when people when you stop suddenly your brain
hits the front of your skull and then it bounces
backwards and then bounces far on that sort of forward axis.
And when you damage the what we call the prefrontal
lobes the front of the brain, that can make people
more impulsive, and it can sometimes make them a bit
socially inappropriate all you know, like sometimes they won't appear drunk,

(37:08):
they might behave in ways that sort of are like
people have behaved when they're really drunk, and that's not
a mental illness, that's because of their brain injury. Now,
where it gets complicated, of course, is that sometimes people
find as a result of the deficits of their physical injury,
it might actually cause them to feel down or anxious,
particularly if they have memory difficulties. So really it's about

(37:30):
getting as much information from a specialist as possible, and
making sure that they're getting the right kind of input
from somebody who is a specialist too.

Speaker 2 (37:39):
How do you do any work in the prison myself?

Speaker 4 (37:42):
No, No, I don't do any work in prisons.

Speaker 17 (37:46):
Because the other question. If you're a judge sitting on
the bench and a guy sudden or a femalees got
into trouble, right, they've been locked out. And if the
lawyer said mister X's brain injured, mister why is mentally ill? Yeah,

(38:07):
I think the judge them both as equal, wouldn't.

Speaker 4 (38:09):
They Well, I'm not a lawyer, so I'd hesitate to
give legal advice. But I mean, really, the only defense
that's available in New Zealand is not guilty by virtue
of insanity, which is a very high threshold. Basically someone
has to not know what's going on in.

Speaker 17 (38:28):
Reality really of that level. Car It was just that
I'm just learning about another case and they have I
think the prisons have a forensic nurse that supposed to
be does a lot of diagnosis, but.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (38:46):
Yeah, so corrections have forensic psychological services, which are news
practitioners and clinical psychologists who can assess and see people
while they're in prison. So, yeah, that's true.

Speaker 17 (38:56):
As there many neuropsychiatrists around the country these days, Well, you.

Speaker 4 (39:01):
Won't be surprised to hear me say there's not enough.

Speaker 17 (39:05):
I know that, I knew gil knew there are many
years ago.

Speaker 4 (39:10):
Look, acc would be the people to talk to because
they obviously administer a lot of these people who get
these injuries that are often a result of an accident,
and so often a lot of this work is done
under acc so they would have a sense of how
many there are, but there is often waiting lists. That
unfortunately is very much the case.

Speaker 17 (39:28):
Yeah, dead, It's still a very complete topic and issue
from a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (39:34):
It is, and it's actually something we have talked about
from time to time on the show. We probably need
to talk about again because actually there are a lot
of people who live with some degree of brain injury,
and of course one of the ways a lot of
people have become more aware of it these days is
those annoying interruptions some people might say to the odd
game of rugby union where people are getting pulled off left,

(39:55):
right and center. But of course that's now about trying
to protect people from brain injuries as a result.

Speaker 17 (40:00):
Of rugby you're talking to one at present anyway, and
I've got to be a home peabo me in a
car and all the rest of it. But it's the
subject that I'm still interested in it because when you've
had it yourself, you understand it's more, or your family

(40:22):
probably understand it's more than you do. And I'm trying
to help a couple of people and at times it's
not easy.

Speaker 2 (40:32):
No, John, let me ask you, since you had your accident,
have you noticed any major changes for yourself, and if so,
what have been the major changes that have stuck out
for you?

Speaker 17 (40:44):
Oh, I used to have a really sharp brain on
my head if you want to put through that all at.

Speaker 2 (40:50):
That, sure, yep.

Speaker 17 (40:53):
And the my intellect is not damaged, but it's all
the cognitive fits for the intellect, right, if you can
understand that. Yep, that's for most of the damages. I
used to be disabled skin structurestance. The accident was nineteen
ninety one. I was I got waked on the right

(41:13):
side of the head, so I've been a bit like
a stroke victim. So I had to tell people. I
had to train my leg how to work, and I
couldn't I couldn't walk war, and I had to teach
myself to walk like a stick man because those your

(41:37):
brain telling your feet what to do. That was damaged.
And then I went to Burwood pain Clinic many years
ago and they put me in the physiopoul I couldn't
move because of the and it you think your nuts
or what and how's going on here? So it's a

(41:58):
very fine I found. It's a very fine tolerance of
can I do it? Sound to do it? And all
sorts of things that my worst when I was going
to the need and driving to the neat not down
central South ond have I stopped at the squirt back
road with PAA Clinton. I didn't know whether I'd been

(42:20):
to the need and where was I going? And I
could only I had to look at the watch and
if it was the morning, I'm going to the need,
all right. I used to lose my Karen and Vicago
and I'd have to do a bridge search to find it.
And then I went to bo Repair, so I knew
anyway and asked can I keep losing?

Speaker 2 (42:42):
And that's that sharp mind thing. But I can tell
talking to tonight that your mind is really has been
very sharp. Thanks for the call. We are going to
head to New Sport and weather.

Speaker 1 (42:55):
This is the Nutters Club. Thanks to New Zealand on
News Talks, it'd be.

Speaker 2 (42:59):
Welcome back to the Nutters Club. We are now starting
a new week, but last week, of course, yesterday, we
were at the last part of yesterday talking at length
about a lot of the international news that's coming out
the situation as you would have heard there in the
news bulletin regarding Israel Iran. It comes hot on the

(43:23):
heels of what's going on between Russia Ukraine. But then
we start sort of feeling that there may be tensions
and other parts of the world. And that's not to
say that we don't have our own problems and issues
going on back here in New Zealand. Sometimes gets a
bit overwhelming and at times it can feel as though
our fears and anxieties can actually start to get a

(43:45):
little bit the better of us. And so tonight what
we wanted to do was talk about how do we
regulate the feelings that come sometimes with the fear and
anxiety around us. What do we do that works for us.
It had a few suggestions from people, a lot of
folk just saying that they try to control what they

(44:05):
can and take gratitude and little things, but also too
talking about actually addressing the anxiety, what's the cause of it?
Why do I feel that way? And being able to
confront those fears and anxieties also too. I mean, we
just had the dimension of fishing, which I thought was great.
I mean anything outside, being outside, just going for a

(44:30):
walk down to the dairy, that'll be better. And then
you buy the newspaper and you read the headlines and go,
oh my god, no not quite. What I'm saying though,
is get outside. But a movement helps immensely. So tonight
we want to keep talking about that. And I've got
your calls coming through, so you going to come to
you very very shortly. Kle. You know, you gave us

(44:52):
a really good definition of what's happening when it comes
to fear and anxiety at the start of the show.
But let's roll through it again. So in terms of
how fear and anxiety affect our mental health, what are
we talking about?

Speaker 13 (45:05):
Yees?

Speaker 4 (45:05):
So, I mean, it is frightening. And one of the
things that fear does, of course, is it draws our
attention to the threat, which in this case, of course,
the threat is not flying overhead. New Zealand's we find
it in the news, we find it in the you know,
and the stories about what's happening. And so one of
the things to be really aware of is that if

(45:27):
we feel like we can't stop watching, we can't stop looking,
that that can be fear having grabbed our attention, and
that may not be helpful. Like we talked about, some
people find that they want to understand more that that
helps them reassure themselves. Some people want to sort of
chune it out. But if you feel yourself drawn to
it or doom scrolling on any of your social media platforms,

(45:47):
then that can be a pretty good time to put
down the phone, have a break, Like you say, go outside,
touch them grass, go for a walk, peek cat. But
I think universally, you know, one of the things we
often talk about the show, and we haven't touched on
it very strongly yet, but I just want to put
it out there is I think one of the things
that's most helpful is that community that we talk about

(46:07):
community and connection. You know, we could be frightened, but
being frightened with others is much much easier than being
frightened on our own.

Speaker 18 (46:15):
Well.

Speaker 2 (46:15):
I think it makes you feel as though if you
are actually feeling fearful of something, is that it's not
happening in isolation. And I'm not saying that you want
to all sort of get around sitting around have a
crying circle. It's not what I'm talking about. But it's
just that, actually it's not irrational. And I'll tell you
right now, if you're feeling if you are feeling afraid
about what's happening in the world, well, yeah, I can

(46:36):
completely understand why. I think that's actually a reasonably normal response.
But when you actually look at in the context of well,
I love in New Zealand, I'm a long way away
from start physically where rockets can come. Yeah, that's reassuring.
Second of all, reasonably self sufficient in terms of the basics.
So we're talking about food production, energy production, and not

(47:00):
to mention there is my belief and you might have
a different but generally five point five million of pretty
good people.

Speaker 4 (47:08):
And to bring to zoom in even closer, actually the
odds are that today Monday, nothing very much has changed
in your life. The same things will need to happen,
probably pretty much in the same order. So probably a
pretty good idea to do those things. Yeah, a little
bit of routine that kind of keeps things.

Speaker 2 (47:25):
As they are. Absolutely, Okay, we're going to come to
the calls in just a moment. I'll read a text
message first. This one just says, I struggle with health
anxiety and can't stop worrying about death. Lately, conspiracy theories
and anti vaccine content has really been affecting me and
making things worse. I've started counseling, but the anxiety is

(47:47):
still overwhelming and is having a serious impact on my life.
Great that you've started the counseling. Yeah, but it sounds
like perhaps a little bit more support might be needed
in that space there, coal Yeah.

Speaker 4 (47:58):
Look, potentially, I mean, if you find that the anxiety
is still already bothering you, there is absolutely a place
for medication. Most of the front lines sort of antidepressants ya, stale, Praam, prozac,
that sort of labels people recognize are also often effective
for anxiety as well, So that may be worth looking at.
But you know, I think often one of the things
to to recognize is that anxiety of death is often

(48:21):
about how do we actually stay present to the moment
and live, and so really working on getting your attention
to where you are as I'm sure you are doing,
and your counseling is often a hard task but really
beneficial if you can do.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
It all right, Thanks very much for that. Cal Let's
go straight back to the lines, Grant, good morning to.

Speaker 5 (48:40):
You, Hey, Hay Jane, guys, first time call for your show,
which is quite right, well welcome, yeah, yeah, no, no,
thank you. And there's mister Richie. There's you're all crusture,
mister Richie. Chie.

Speaker 19 (48:58):
And then.

Speaker 12 (49:00):
How do you get through it? Right? Is I've had
some pretty out of the days, you know, and we
loved and years even and sort of come to the
conclusion that, yeah, you do what you can, but you know,
good for anybody else if you know, good for yourself.
So like what you see wrong in others is actually

(49:23):
what you want to fix within yourself, right, And so
what you do is you acronym right, and you just
go on into the big time, you know, And that
is through higher education, the lead in what I say, God,
whatever that believe in God today, I may expire, right,

(49:46):
And so the best you can be for you today,
because then that helps other people, right, And I guess
that's why a lot of people go towards religion because
one person did change the world. One person did make
a difference or did they or is it a group
of people and they decided that disc I was going

(50:08):
to pay for it and we're going to you know,
like side bar and that's why that and this religious thing, right,
you know, it's easily fixed. It's absolutely easily firks this religion.

Speaker 1 (50:22):
Right.

Speaker 2 (50:23):
Well, look, I mean if it works for you, Graham,
and I agree with what you're saying there about you know,
being being the best it can be.

Speaker 20 (50:30):
You know, yeah, yeah, well how can you how can
you help anybody else if you can't help yourself, if
you don't know how to help yourself, how did you
possibly think you could help anybody out when you wish
to do this? And is it a selfish thing to
make you feel there or do you actually want to
help that person? And because I've been like an outside

(50:53):
you know, I'm one to people and and I've seen
things from the outside, there's been places where it shouldn't
have been. Then had to observe and to survive, which
we all have. One of the greatest things in my
life was my mother, you said, finding a book called

(51:14):
book listen and learn. I think that's what we have
to do. Then it past makes our future or is
it story the future our past repeated? You know, like
you know why, it's the circle right, But you can't
handle zero right, so I don't still reality you as

(51:37):
more because you can't handle zero. Because of the handle
zero complete, it becomes as one.

Speaker 2 (51:44):
Yeah, and grant, I just want sorry to want to
say that is the idea of looking after yourself. You know,
you can't help others unless you look after yourself. Where
that kind of fits into what we're talking about. That
community piece is to say, well, you know, when when
you're not doing so well, someone else can give you
a bit of support then too.

Speaker 4 (52:05):
Yeah, absolutely, and and you know so that helps great,
But I mean community helps better. I genuinely believe that.
I mean, yes, we why well because we heard animals
we need other people, and of course we all have
to do things to look after ourselves. But actually I
don't think. I just don't think we're wired to spend

(52:25):
a lot of time on our own. I mean we
see that that solitary confinements consider torture. We just don't
do well with isolation, and we know that isolation tracks
with a whole bunch of negative health outcomes, including depression
and anxiety. So one of the best things that you
can do if you're struggling, or if you're really stuck
in your head or you can't get your eyeballs off
the distressing news around the world is give someone a bell,

(52:48):
go for a walk, go for a coffee, go visit someone,
or invite someone over, or just take the dog for
a walk around the block and say get ad to
some neighbors.

Speaker 2 (52:57):
Grant, thanks for the call, and thanks very much for
being a first time caller. Looking in soon. All right,
we are going to take a break. When we come back,
I've got David and Aleck on the line. I've got
a couple of lines three now, so if you want
to jump on there, you're most welcome. Oh eight, one
hundred and eighty teen eighty is the number, or flick
us a text if you want on nine two nine two.

(53:17):
We're back talking about how we manage anxiety and fear.
Here tonight on the Nudders Club.

Speaker 1 (53:23):
This is the Nutters Club, thanks to New Zealand on News.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
Dogs be welcome back to the Nudders Club. Let's go
straight back to the calls David, good morning to you.

Speaker 19 (53:35):
I'm just him. Well, yeah, I am first August my
free in tune sixty. My friend Alistair turned sixty, so
I gave that three is them from that and a

(53:58):
shape of them.

Speaker 2 (54:03):
Sorry, David, we're just we're just going to have to
put you back on hold.

Speaker 3 (54:06):
There.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
We're just your reception as getting a bit patchy, and
there we'll we bring you back in the mind if
we can get that reception issues sorted there, And thanks
for the call. Either way, I'll just quickly go to
a couple of text messages. Texts says Hi Hamish, I
got rid of my television three years ago. All my
fears and anxiety went out the door with the TV.

(54:30):
I think there's a lot to be said for that.

Speaker 4 (54:31):
I know a few people who haven't had TVs for
years actually, and they would say the same thing that.
Of course, the thing is now is that we carry
around televisions in our pockets, don't we.

Speaker 2 (54:39):
What madness he speaking of? You talking about the smartphone?

Speaker 6 (54:44):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (54:44):
Yeah, yeah, okay, so it does make it a bit
harder to avoid.

Speaker 2 (54:46):
But all right, apparently we got David back. David, have
we got you back?

Speaker 4 (54:49):
Now?

Speaker 1 (54:50):
Well?

Speaker 19 (54:51):
Yeah, Yeah, it's David. So yeah, so in August, so
there's a phone going on this. I'm staying at my
friend's place. But alistairs and heated sixty last year in August,
and I bought three weekly planners. They were noted note

(55:13):
planners for the weekly planners for the week and they
will cause ones. There were only ten dollars on a
clearance sale bonus and yeah, and so I bought three
of them. I've got one myself and gave one to
another friend and one to him. But I've I hadn't
even used it until yesterday. I was thinking I'm going

(55:35):
to use it today. And I've just started writing in
it now and I've just written I'll go to sleep
at two o'clock in the morning, listened to about an
hour of Roman chervis if he's on this morning. And
then I'm going to clean my room. I always clean
my room. This is how I deal with anxiety. I'll
cleaned my room. And if I'm a hoard, I've got

(55:58):
a lot of stuff, so I actually make an effort
to do something at least and then sort out my things,
look for things, things out, and do my washing at
least once a week or two. I'm keeping my clothes
always clean. I always like clean clothes. I've got lots

(56:18):
of clothes. I always keep them clean and wash all
the sheets, and wash lots of sheets at once so
that I can let they can last two weeks. So
that's good. So and Alista lets me use his washing machine.
He's really kind to me. And I have meals here
sometimes and at home, and then I just go to

(56:42):
a cafe, have food at a cafe and coffee and
just sort of just try to keep busy. And I
think that's the main thing, is just not preoccupy yourself
with your problems, but just enjoy your life and do
things and keep busy and don't worry about tomorrow. Just

(57:02):
worry about today and then now and stay in the now.

Speaker 2 (57:06):
Yeap wisdomly a David. And I think what I'm really
taking away from there is being able to just make
a plan and know what you need. And it sounds
to me like you very much know what you need.

Speaker 19 (57:18):
Yes, And I'm going to use this weekly planner from
now on. It's been since August last year that I've
bought them, but I said I'm going to use this
for yearly. Now I've already readen down. I'm going to
go to sleep at two o'clock. Then I'm going to
right down, go to the cafe when I wake up
at about ten o'clock or nine o'clock depending who for
two actually get eight hours sleep the two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight,

(57:42):
nine ten, and then then go home and clean my
room and tied it up. Even if it's just half
an hour, it's doing something.

Speaker 2 (57:53):
You know, absolutely absolutely.

Speaker 19 (57:55):
Thanks very much, hay Miss and Kyle, and have a
good morning.

Speaker 2 (57:59):
Too, David. Thanks for the call by.

Speaker 9 (58:03):
You.

Speaker 2 (58:03):
Sounds like another phone called oncewer there too. That's stressful. Yeah,
he's very good under pressure, though, I thought.

Speaker 4 (58:09):
Look, I completely agree, and again, do what's in front
of you that's tidy in your room. I spent the
afternoon yesterday amying the lawns and doing cutting hedges and stuff.
And actually I hate starting. I always feel better when
I finish.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
Right, Okay, Yeah, I do lists, So I do lists,
and I've kind of got a few different lists. But
I have my little paper list which is on my
work desk getting at home, and that's the things which
I have to get through, actually written down on a
piece of paper. I've got all kinds of other lists too,
you know, big planning things and what's going on. But

(58:44):
then it's just these other things that I need to
get through, and I feel so much better when I've
got it there and that little piece of paper. I
may not get it through it all today, but I'll
carry that little piece of paper around with me.

Speaker 7 (58:55):
You know.

Speaker 2 (58:55):
Sometimes takes me a couple of days to work my
way through the list nice, but it's just good to
have it there. And in that way, you kind of
feel like it's not flying all around your head. You've
got it right there in front of you. It feels
a lot calmer. Right, how are we going for time?
I'll read another text message. This one's from Chrissy. Chrissy says, Hi,
Hamish and Kyle. When I heard about America's bombings, I

(59:18):
had a profound reaction. The fear I experienced brought back
memories of when my brother Thought fought in Vietnam, something
I've never thought about since he came home, traumatized and
feeling undervalued by the government of that time. He moved
to Wales and he died there about age seventy. So
this is the other thing, too, right, is that we're

(59:38):
not in charge of the stories which we're going to
get presented in life and the way in which they
come around. But they can bring back memories of other things.
And I mean some people call it, you know, they
trigger memories, but they can. And sometimes that could be
really inadvertent, you know, like I mean, nobody would would
ever have guessed that that was going to happen today,

(59:59):
and that you know, and probably even Chrissy that we
wouldn't have guessed that she might have that reaction. But
when that sort of stuff happens and we do have
those memories come back, when we get confirms hunted with
stories not of our making and external, what's some of
the ways that we can go about being able to
address that so that that doesn't sort of completely upend us.

Speaker 4 (01:00:18):
Well, assuming and it doesn't sound like it is, that
it's not an actual trauma flashback or trauma re experiencing memory.
I think it can be useful actually just to make
a little bit of space for it, to allow the
feelings the sadness or you know, the missing of someone,
because yes, it's something that's been triggered, but actually we've
been reminded of someone we care about and that's loss, right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
Yeah, And I think that's probably the point, isn't it.
It's like, you know, if you have those kind of
close associations and perhaps could I say the thing is
is not to you know, you've you've brought up some
of the really traumatic parts there, but actually then to
think about the good things about your brother, you know,
the good memories that you've got you had with them.

(01:01:02):
And I think also too as time has passed, Yes,
the government of the day was not particularly or acknowledging
our of our Vietnam Vietnam veterans. However, I would like
to like to think that the majority of people would
have a very different attitude today. And so for that,
I'll just say, on behalf of us, thanks very much
for your brother for going and doing what he did. Right.

(01:01:26):
We are going to take a break when we come back.
I've got Alec and Paul on the line. Got a
couple of other calls too, so we're going to take
our break, come back, get straight back into those here
tonight on the Nudders Club.

Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
This is the Nutters Club, thanks to New Zealand on News.

Speaker 2 (01:01:43):
Dogs'd be okay, thank you very much for your calls
coming in thick and fast. Let's go straight back to them. Alec,
good morning to.

Speaker 21 (01:01:51):
You of the morning of trying to be his brief
as you've got a few.

Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
Calls on, take your time, take your time, you know,
just wanted.

Speaker 21 (01:02:00):
To divide that anxiety and fear in it. It's we're
a my life for a long time, but I can't
hit some underline psycho. Of course he's along with it
a bit of depression and abandonment. But I was wondering,
like I was on a list for fifteen years to
see someone about it, and I never got to see anybody.
But I was thinking it's a bit of a shortfall

(01:02:21):
of the pop politics not not be able to cater
for the intergenerational trauma that carries on in it. I
think it's still not been looked there they seriously, it's
just the status crow out there in my world and
how your world. Probably it's got those issues. And I

(01:02:42):
think Warrington, you might be two psychologists or something for
the whole of an England.

Speaker 2 (01:02:45):
Health department when it comes to being on waiting lists.
You know definitely that that is that is a tough
position to be in. That said, however, there are some
very good services out there. Advocacy New Zealand is one
which is really good one to go. So what we
have found in the past, alk you know, with a

(01:03:07):
lot of calls to the show who have had similar
experiences to you, is that when you get an advocate,
and by the way, these people do it for nothing.
They volunteer their time when you when you get an
advocate to help navigate the process. Sometimes when health health
organizations know that there's somebody else watching, they tend to

(01:03:30):
unfortunately it has to get to this point, but they
sometimes act a little differently. And definitely we've we've had
a lot of success with people that we've recommended this
in the past.

Speaker 4 (01:03:41):
What was the name the supporting the words again, well,
the easiest way to find an advocate is if you
just if you look up the Health and Disability Advocacy
Service and their website is actually just Advocacy dot org
dot NZ. But I mean, how much is absolutely right?

(01:04:02):
I mean that's there's not okay to.

Speaker 21 (01:04:07):
You then have to go under I mean to health
do you I guess if you've got anxiety.

Speaker 4 (01:04:10):
Or for you no, I wouldn't say so no, No,
I mean you sound well and I mean I think
the thing is the Mental Health Act these days is
used very sparingly.

Speaker 21 (01:04:18):
Already stuck under it fullsto so psychosis.

Speaker 11 (01:04:22):
Okay, yeah, I can't get off.

Speaker 4 (01:04:25):
But they shouldn't change your eligibility to talk to someone.
Quite the opposite.

Speaker 7 (01:04:32):
Yeah, thanks for.

Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
Your tom no worries, I like all the best here
and thank you for calling jeers both go well. Yeah,
I mean the point is is that that the system
does have flaws in it. People do fall through the cracks,
and there isn't enough people. There isn't enough people.

Speaker 4 (01:04:50):
Therapists, psychologists, psychiatrists. But it is important to keep pushing
and asking for what you need.

Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
Yeah. So I think you just keep finding your way
that you that you move forward.

Speaker 4 (01:05:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:05:03):
So please have a look at them seeing if you
can have a chat to those folk, because they are
genuinely there to help and they're very good at what
they do and we've recommended people to them before and
had good outcomes.

Speaker 4 (01:05:15):
And the other thing that they may want to look
into as well, of course, as peer support services, which
if you are engaged in mental health services there, if
you're under the Acting, you should be able to also
access a peer support worker and they may help you
be able to navigate some of these things too.

Speaker 2 (01:05:30):
Good luck to thanks for the call, which is good
morning to you.

Speaker 18 (01:05:34):
Hi, Hi, Tamus, and car very good. Mine probably goes
back to my childhood trauma and the blurring of boundaries
and responsibilities because one of the things that I've found
in my journey is.

Speaker 7 (01:05:55):
World events.

Speaker 18 (01:05:59):
Irrationally, I link them to the state of my own
progress in my journey, which been an active journey moving forward,
and as the world is starting to collapse at the
moment with what we see in the middle least, I'm

(01:06:19):
kind of relating that to my own journey and thinking, Gee,
if I failed my journey, it's all going to break out.

Speaker 9 (01:06:27):
You know.

Speaker 18 (01:06:28):
It's kind of a link like that, and it's a
rest I know, but it's very real and it's quite scary.
And I guess maybe some aggrandized ideas that were formed
in my childhood has something to do with the fact

(01:06:48):
that I think I can influence world events. But yeah,
it's just it's I don't know if other people have
ever felt that kind of connection to the outside world.

Speaker 4 (01:07:08):
I think lots of people have, because actually, what you're
describing is what happens sometimes when we get incredibly strong
and intense feelings. Is they can distort how we think.
What I like, though, is that you're describing really clear
insight into observing that and noticing that that's what's happening,
which is absolutely the first step. I think the trick

(01:07:28):
has been. I think you probably know this from all
the work you've done on yourself over the years. Is
actually it's about focusing on the feelings, not the thoughts,
So finding some ways to regulate the intensity of the
feelings and trying to not get lost too deeply in
the thoughts.

Speaker 7 (01:07:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 18 (01:07:46):
One of the difficulties is that I have far too
much alone time. That's been yeah, kind of the ongoing
isolation since the COVID lockdowns, and the world's a bit
of a scary place anyway from me.

Speaker 4 (01:08:00):
So it does make it hard to it bounds around
inside your own head when you're on your own name.

Speaker 18 (01:08:06):
Yeah, and you can it's good for a while. I
like my alone time. When I have too much of it,
it becomes rumination rather than processing, and I have the
need to have connections, which I don't have. But I

(01:08:26):
think connections would keep me level and keep me up
and running. But I just for the first time in
my life, I find I just don't have any connections whatsoever,
and that makes it very difficult to keep on an
even keel.

Speaker 4 (01:08:44):
Yeah, of course it does, and it does. It's not
a snapy fingers and solve the problem type problem either, right,
But one of the things you can do is make
sure that as much as possible, you're pushing yourself to
at least get out of the house and get out
into the world.

Speaker 2 (01:08:58):
Even Yeah, I'm trying to.

Speaker 4 (01:09:01):
Pop down the shops and get a loaf of bread,
even though you might not lead a loaf of bread,
you know, actually interact with the world.

Speaker 9 (01:09:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 18 (01:09:09):
Yeah, I've been trying to do that as a strategy,
to try and get down, walk down to the local
shops one today and go to town once a week. Yeah,
but it's slow work, and it's hard work, and I'm
older now, so yeah, you know, there's other issues, and

(01:09:34):
COVID didn't help, but I think it instilled a fair
probably not just in me, but in many of us
that really hasn't subsided properly.

Speaker 2 (01:09:47):
We'll just keep ed it, Paul, I think that's the
most important thing. And you know, as you kind of
get more comfortable with what you're doing, you might find
that you're able to have more frequency. But either way,
you know, just go well, and I think what you're doing,
actually you're doing really well. That's that's the main thing.
You know, you know what you need, you're focusing on it,

(01:10:07):
you've got a plan, you're doing it. It sounds to
me like you're on the right path. And maybe maybe
you could just think about what else you could increase
around it, just to be able to see if you
can break a little bit of that isolation down just
a bit more.

Speaker 18 (01:10:21):
Yeah, I'm planning to go to the Musicians Club on
first Friday every month.

Speaker 2 (01:10:29):
So oh great, do you play?

Speaker 18 (01:10:34):
Yeah? I do? I play the ukulele and guitar.

Speaker 2 (01:10:36):
Ah, well, do you go? Fantastic? How long you been
playing the old yuke for? I mean, I have heard
the ukulele is known as the happiest sounding instrument in
the world.

Speaker 18 (01:10:47):
I love the ukulele. I started off learning a guitar
when I was very young, and I'm seventy three now,
but about four, no, about six or seven years ago,
I taught myself the ukulele, which wasn't too difficult because once.

Speaker 7 (01:11:05):
You mastered a guitar.

Speaker 18 (01:11:07):
It just somehow is easier and they are in any
easy instrument to play too, and they do. So they
do go well with Look at.

Speaker 2 (01:11:17):
Have you got the Have you got a ukulele in
the house pool?

Speaker 18 (01:11:21):
Yeah, I'll tell you I got two.

Speaker 2 (01:11:23):
I'll tell you what if you call us back. If
you call us back in the last five minutes of
the show, you could play us out. You could play
us a bit of ukulele live on the radio.

Speaker 18 (01:11:33):
Yeah, I'll do that.

Speaker 2 (01:11:34):
I'll tell you what can we make that happen? In
chats I'm looking at the producers getting getting thumbs up.

Speaker 9 (01:11:39):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:11:39):
Okay, Paul, you're on. You've got about ten to fifteen
minutes to go and practice and get yourself up to speed,
and then we'll have a live broadcast of Paul on
the ukulele right across the country. How does that sound
pools get on you?

Speaker 7 (01:11:55):
All?

Speaker 6 (01:11:55):
Right?

Speaker 16 (01:11:55):
Well, well we're going to take an AIRD break now.

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
Yeah you got You've got about fifteen minutes to get
yourself ready, okay, go, well, yeah, thank you, there we go.

Speaker 4 (01:12:06):
That's a nuts idea, amish.

Speaker 2 (01:12:08):
I mean, god, I like a bit of ukulele, so
do I. So why not you know, reminds me of
a story once I was on the back blocks of
Kentucky Jeweling Banjo's It all went really bad on a
River Trap, But years later they made a movie. Anyway,
enough said, less of deliverance and more of bad breaks
back soon here tonight on the Nutters Club.

Speaker 1 (01:12:29):
It's overnight talk on News Talks.

Speaker 2 (01:12:31):
EDB Welcome back to the Nutters Club. Got a text
message here from Harvey. Harvey's a new Plymouth and he
says he's I'm seventy three and I play ukulele too,
Go Paul. I've been asked if I will read the
I've had quite a lengthy text messures that came in Mandarin.

Speaker 4 (01:12:52):
Okay, how's your Mandarin?

Speaker 2 (01:12:54):
Non existent? Okay? However it does turn into English at
the end. It just says I like to meet with
a friend or go for a walk. I am all
booked to stay with my family and grandkids in England,
which I'm looking forward to. But for obvious reasons, I'm
feeling anxious.

Speaker 4 (01:13:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:13:11):
I have been reading so many art but the first
two thirds of the messages and Mandarin, I suppose I
could can I copy and paste it and put into
a translator.

Speaker 4 (01:13:21):
I think you're about to find out.

Speaker 2 (01:13:22):
Oh, who knows, I could have probably the best text
piche I ever had. Yeah, and I wouldn't even know
Sandy's text and to say, hi, guys, I suffered for
a good ten to fifteen years. I live alone and
don't make friends well, and have not have not family.
I have a fear of making new friends, and so
just stay home, keep busy on my lifestyle block. I've

(01:13:43):
not self esteem and can go days or weeks without
having contact with people. I have my animals, thank goodness.
Otherwise I would struggle to find a reason to get
up in the morning. Thanks your program, Sandy, So look
at and of itself. Yeah, is that a problem?

Speaker 4 (01:14:00):
Well, I mean it's up to the person to judge.
But what I hear is, you know she's talking about
low self estee for instance. I mean one of the
things that these these thinking patterns can become cyclical. Right,
So I don't feel good about myself, so I don't
seek out connections in the world, and then I don't
have connections in the world because I'm not a good person.

(01:14:22):
Right and down we go on that spiral. Gotcha, I
think you know we talk about it a lot on
the show. I think it's really important to find a
way to start challenging those things. And it can be
as small as making those micro connections with people at
the supermarket or at the gas station, or it can
be really challenging yourself to get in contact with the

(01:14:42):
Citizens Advice Bureau and maybe talk to them about meetup
groups or coffee groups, or you know, if there are
activities that you do, like the ukulele, where do people
come together and play the ukulele, Because often it doesn't
have to be big, deep, meaningful conversations. It can just
be a shared project or a shared interest, and every
little bit helps.

Speaker 2 (01:15:03):
I read about things every week where people are doing
stuff I think, and especially around music. More i've read
I think in the last week things have jumped out
at me have been the rise of community choirs. Oh yeah,
I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:15:16):
Singing together is really good for the brain. Really yeah.
It's actually one of those things where when you look
at sorry this is I'll be brief, but when you
look at organized religion, it's one of the things that
jumps out about over the years that organized religion knows
really well is when people sing together, they feel good
and they feel connected with each other. So you think

(01:15:36):
about hymns right right in church. It just seems to
really help the way our brain works to do it
in groups.

Speaker 2 (01:15:43):
There you go. And the other one I just read
about the other day is the surge in young people
that are wanting to learn how to play organs like
town hall organs and church organs, big guys, the big ones,
the Big Berth is in fact, actually that's the name
of the the organ in Dunedin town Hall is Big Bertha.
And also now church bells, so coming in you know

(01:16:05):
which which you know how to ding?

Speaker 4 (01:16:07):
That's not a simple as just pulling on a bit
of rope.

Speaker 2 (01:16:09):
No, no, so very few things in this world as
simple as pulling on a bit of rope. Calm, But sailing,
I hear is about that simple. We'll see it on
the boat lane. Peter, good morning to you.

Speaker 10 (01:16:24):
Good morning. Look, if it wasn't for World War One,
if it wasn't for World War one, I don't know
what would you know? I had dreamed two weeks ago
and I hopped on the time machine. You know one

(01:16:44):
of those time machines.

Speaker 2 (01:16:45):
I know them well, Delorian one, oh.

Speaker 10 (01:16:49):
Well, subtype machine or not can't We explained in my
dream what it was. But I just dropped into this
machine and it took me back. It taught me back
nineteen forty five, World War One, and I spoke to
the soldier. I see look the soldiers. I see the soldier.
I'm in the Look. I just come to the time machine.

(01:17:10):
Twenty five. Did oh, Look we're in a major war.

Speaker 2 (01:17:18):
Wuber one.

Speaker 10 (01:17:18):
I see to a rook mate, coming coming. Yeah, two
twenty five is a bigger war in what it was
in two thousand and well in World War One? He said,
what do you mean? I see if you could, if
there was there were a time machine never existed in
the World War One, Come and come and check out

(01:17:39):
two and twenty five.

Speaker 2 (01:17:41):
Look.

Speaker 10 (01:17:42):
I don't want to say this, but it's all in vain.
It's it's worse. Come to twenty twenty five in experience
what we're going through. Come up on the time up
in the time machine and went back and woke up.

Speaker 2 (01:17:57):
Wow, there you go. That's quite a nineteen stream paint it.

Speaker 10 (01:18:04):
Yeah, you know that's what I see in my dream.
Come come, I'm on the time machine. Come there have
looked in twenty twenty five book he's all fighting in vain.
It's a lot worse for war, That's what I've seen.

Speaker 2 (01:18:18):
Yeah, I mean, I take your point, and so much
as you know, I think war in general, everyone loses.
You know, wars ultimately end up in death. I'm not
going to say death and destruction. But because you know,
to be fair, you can you can rebuild buildings and bridges.
It's a lot harder to do that with people, and

(01:18:39):
it just leaves behind so many, so many sad stories,
and so many people that you know aren't there sitting
at the at the dinner table. That to me is
the reality of war.

Speaker 4 (01:18:51):
And it's the people who have the least power often
suffer the most.

Speaker 2 (01:18:55):
Yeah. Yeah, that's the big one. So, you know, I
think that it's it's hard to say that that, you know,
wars are in vain. I suppose that at times they've
they've they've had outcomes. It's definitely been repercussion as a
big history MANU, you'd notice yourself, Carl.

Speaker 4 (01:19:11):
Yeah, what's easy to look back at pass wars and
think that they were just or that they made sense
because we get to look at where they got to.
But I'm sure that if you were living in the
UK in nineteen forty you were probably feeling like none
of it made any sense and you had no idea
what was going to happen.

Speaker 2 (01:19:27):
The solace that I take from it, where my fear
and anxiety manages to keep itself in check, is that
I just have this innate belief that people find a
way forward.

Speaker 4 (01:19:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:19:37):
Yeah, you know, it may not seem clear at the moment,
but ultimately I like to think that people do the
right thing, we find a way forward, We find a
way too, for lack of a better word, survive.

Speaker 7 (01:19:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:19:50):
I have a slightly different version of that, which is
that I often think some of the best periods of
history have often come after large conflicts. So yeah, you know,
nineteen fifties and nineteen sixties and much of the West
was massive prosperity, you know, building of welfare states, lots
of equality, and that all came the back of World
War Two.

Speaker 2 (01:20:10):
We have these horrible experiences and go off and we
thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:20:13):
Then we're sort of correct and we go back the
other way.

Speaker 2 (01:20:15):
So we go, no, thank you, that was horrible, don't
do that anymore. Let's do something different, and away we go.
All right, we're going to take a break when we
come back, Gayleen, and with any luck we may have
Paul live on the ukulele. All that still to come
here tonight on the Another's Club.

Speaker 1 (01:20:33):
This is the Nutters Club. Thanks to New Zealand there
on news Dogs.

Speaker 2 (01:20:36):
It'd be welcome back to the Nutterers Club. Let's go
straight back to the lines. Gayleen, good morning to you.

Speaker 13 (01:20:48):
Gosh, You've been talking about so many things, and I
have only been listening for the last twenty minutes or
half now, but I just wanted to say, like I
suppose my everything sort of went down, spiraling down for
various reasons about the time COVID actually, but and I

(01:21:09):
went through the depression.

Speaker 5 (01:21:10):
I've got reciss.

Speaker 13 (01:21:11):
Leg and in some there and that, and then I
was playing well, not playing round with polls, but trying
to get the right scripts from the doctors, et cetera.
And do you know, I've sort of stopped. I'm still
got another appointment and I've still got to get some more,
but the restless legs stopped, and then I've got this
huge Now, I've got this huge anxiety about things, and

(01:21:35):
I just like I went for about six months or
so where I just would shut the curtains and I
wouldn't talk to people, I didn't do anything. I didn't
clean up, and I sort of what triggered me to
ring you was the fact that of the person I
didn't catch the name, but he was saying that you've

(01:21:56):
got to help yourself before you help others. And I
can say that I was the other way because when
I reached out to help someone that needed it, and
I'm not just meaning like just a one off thing,
but reaching out and saying okay, no, and I'll come
and help you back in a couple of days, and

(01:22:17):
it's a neighbor, and it was just something that was needed,
and that's what helped me bring me out. So I
was hopeless up to that point, and I can honestly
sort of stay that almost that week where I know
that I made a difference and I know that I

(01:22:40):
used to be so strong and everything, and that made
me start to realize that I don't have to be
I don't have to be out of control or not
in control, and I can slowly work it. And that
was only about four weeks ago, but even two weeks
after that, I went down to a volunteer group that

(01:23:03):
they was in topol and they had a like a
event thing that we're all the volunteers and everybody could
go there and you could go and see how you
could help or how you could be helpful. And it
was immensely helpful. And but yeah, it was great and

(01:23:24):
they had a lot of people. But because of the
way I sort of seemed to get organized, I got
there in the last half hour. But never mind, I
still got there, and I got some pamphlets on how
I can help.

Speaker 5 (01:23:37):
Others as well.

Speaker 13 (01:23:38):
And I haven't done it yet, but I just wanted
to say, you know, I found it different. I found
by helping someone else and just putting aside my issues,
it started to make me feel stronger and realized that
I am I used to be strong and I can
be strong again. Yeah, that was.

Speaker 4 (01:24:01):
A really great point that you make. And actually what
we often talk about this idea was with mental health
that actually contributing is often incredibly useful because what it
does do is obviously it does good because we're doing
something good. But it often it's easier to do good
things for others than it is to do them for ourselves. Often,

(01:24:23):
and you know that sense of generosity you're feeling connected
comes along with the contributing, and it often also helps
us to make comparisons to also start to feel some
gratitude for the things that we might have missed in
our life too. So there's lots of upsides to it,
and I think it sounds like a really great plan.
Tell you what, why don't you give us a call
back in a week or two once you have made

(01:24:46):
a decision and decided what you're going to go along
to and give it a try and let us know
how it goes.

Speaker 5 (01:24:52):
You No, thank you for that.

Speaker 13 (01:24:53):
Yeah, And I do hope you know, people struggling and
I know how hard it is, and I just you know,
I just hope that they have their strength to just
you to realize that it is better on the other
side if you can. And I know it's us your
seat and done. My god, I know you know that.

Speaker 2 (01:25:12):
Yeah, all the best, go well, go lean, thank you,
thank you. It look just to just to echo there.
What she's saying is that it can sound easy when
we're just sitting here behind the microphones and you're listening
at home, and you go, ah, just give us a go, ah,
just give that a go. But ultimately you've got to
start somewhere and even if it's just if you're feeling,

(01:25:34):
you know, a bit isolated. And I've heard a few
of you say that tonight about people saying that that's
where they feel. Start small. Yeah, make it to the
mailbox and then make it to the first lamp post
down the street, and then make it to the second,
make it to the corner.

Speaker 4 (01:25:52):
You know, just anything you can do is better than nothing.

Speaker 2 (01:25:54):
That's it. That is it. And you were just saying,
you know, like when you're doing your gardening, you know
you'd like it when you when you know you don't
want to start, but you're happy when you're finished.

Speaker 4 (01:26:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:26:04):
And sometimes it's that's the thing, isn't it. It's the
fear and the anxiety gets in the way of us
just sometimes wanting to do the things to be able
to find that motivation we know it's going.

Speaker 4 (01:26:14):
To be good for us. Yes, we're difficult creatures, honestly.

Speaker 2 (01:26:20):
Yeah, I know, we get in our own bloody way.

Speaker 4 (01:26:22):
We do all the time.

Speaker 2 (01:26:23):
Too much.

Speaker 4 (01:26:24):
What have we learned tonight, Kyle, Well, I think we've
learned that a lot of people are feeling anxiety for
one reason or another. That's probably always true actually, whenever
we talk about it on anxiety on the show, we
always get plenty of calls. But I think it's also
true that everything that's going on in the world at
the moment does sharpen one's focus on anxiety, and it's

(01:26:45):
really important to actually just recognize we probably all have
the things we know to do when we feel that way.
Now this week, today, it's a really good time to
do them.

Speaker 2 (01:26:56):
I think that's beautifully put. Thank you very much. All right,
let's go back now. I did promise. I did promise
that that Paul would come back onto the show seventy
three years old old. He's a ukulele player, and I
was thinking it would be great if we could have
him play us out on the show. Paul, are you there?

Speaker 9 (01:27:19):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:27:20):
Okay, have you got the ukulele at the ready?

Speaker 8 (01:27:23):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (01:27:25):
What's what song you in a play for us? Paul,
sounds fantastic, Go for it, all right.

Speaker 9 (01:28:09):
My God day to Motive Hock, Tomoral Motive Hockey.

Speaker 16 (01:28:47):
Thanks very much the psychotherapist, Colm and Donald. We having
been on the show tonight.

Speaker 4 (01:28:50):
My pleasure.

Speaker 16 (01:28:55):
Enter app chases Borrow, Thanks very much to is it
Bafal leading us in the building.

Speaker 2 (01:29:12):
Any zeal on air for playing the bills. Most of all,
thank you to you and to Paul, our ukulele player.

Speaker 1 (01:29:24):
This is the Nutters Club, thanks to New Zealand on
air on News Talks EDB. For more from News Talks EDB,
listen live on air or online, and keep our shows
with you wherever you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio