December 15, 2025 • 8 mins
Coach Gottlieb calls an EMERGENCY pod to respond to Fox CFB Analyst Joel Klatt’s viral hot take slander of the NCAA Men’s Basketball Tournament, where his argument is completely asinine, where he has a point, and the biggest reason the Tourney is more popular than ever despite a dip in college hoops popularity as a whole.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hey, what a book of it. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This
is All Ball. One of good special late night.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Frankly in bed chat about what Joel Clatt said, and
you know, obviously by the time when we published this,
it's you know, the morning after, Joel Clatt goes on
somebody else's podcast and says, this is my hottest take ever.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
That the NCAA Tournament is a joke.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And what's amazing about it was he talked about teams
playing you a one and done tournament on a neutral
site at odd times, and then he just described the
college football playoff.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Like he literally described.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
The college fotball playoff.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
They play a one and done tournament on neutral sites
at odd times. You know, by the way, no one
who's ever lost in the NCAA Tournament has ever blamed
the time of day of a game, Joel. So it's
just that one's far afield. It's a basketball game. Guys
play at all times all year, just like at football
ball at times all year.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Anyway.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
But while he actually contradicted his own thought or pointed
out that college football has tried to emulate college basketball,
which if he thinks that makes his point as well,
I don't really get it. I do know the sports
are different. I do know the attrition of a Cinderella
(01:48):
at the college football level. And you know, even if
a Too Lane or James Madison won their game, they're
not going to win two because their team's just too
beat up. And as thin as any college football roster is,
the lower the level, the lower less money, the more
the thinner it's going to be. That's just the reality
of where we are financially. So, you know, I am
(02:16):
I actually think though that the gist of his point
I've made several times over there is a randomness. There
is a randomness too to this tournament, and you don't
always get the best team to win the championship.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
You just you just don't.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
So, you know, I pointed out for for years that
the year that Kentucky won the national championship with John
cal Perry, you know, the two other best teams North Carolina,
Kendall Marshall got hurt. I think they still got to
the Sweet sixteen and lost to Kansas, But kend Of
(03:06):
Marshall was healthy the NBA point guard, and he.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Was awesome in college.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
They go to the Final four and they take on Kentucky,
who they'd lost to, but I think too in the
regular season, and Syracuse that year was really really good
and their center didn't play in the NCAA tournament they lost,
so I think let's think it was the fat mellow year.
So the point is that the best team doesn't always
win sometimes about injuries or matchups or things.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
That go bump in the night.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
And there is a randomness the NCAA tournament, no question,
And there's going to be a bit less randomness, but
still a randomness to a college football playoff. The more
times we have the spiny teams, somebody's quarterbacks going to
get hurt. Something's going to go wrong for a team
that's way better than another team in the first round,
and most like an injury, and that's gonna that's going
(04:00):
to change the tournament and then there'll.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
Be an upset.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
But the point of it being a silly way and
having pool play as the best way, again, he's not wrong.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
It's actually a great idea.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
But I also think he doesn't understand, nor do most
people understand why the NCAA tournament is so popular.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
You know what that is?
Speaker 2 (04:24):
People don't all of a sudden love college basketball at
the end of the season, after liking it and enjoying
it during the regular season.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
No, it's the bracket.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Well, most valuable thing in college athletics is that sixty
fourteen bracket, because now even when you go and get
the bracket and fill it out on your own, you
do realize that that bracket actually contains additional games. But
they find a way to keep the bracket whole. The
(04:54):
brackets easy, easy for people to remember, easy for people
to fill out. It's just enough games, but not so
much that it wears you down. You don't have to
know anything to know how to fill out a bracket.
The whole thing is absolutely frickin perfect, So Joel's not wrong.
Like a better way to decide a champion would be
pool play. Matchups would still be a part of it.
(05:18):
Now you'd have to do point differential whatever. Like we
could argue the NBA is the best way you decide
a true champion, but the NBA injuries often play a
part there too. But if you could be a team
best out of seven, you're a better team. All that said,
I don't think even Joel and many people don't understand
(05:40):
what's really popular about the NCAA tournament.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Do people like the Cinderellas, Yeah. Do they like the favorites, Yeah?
They better than the favorites. They like the Cinderellas. Got it.
But that's not the reason that the tournament is popular.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
It's not because every come friends gets a bid, although
I do love the idea of we've got friends getting
bids and if we're going to expand it, which it
probably will. Right, here's a good rule of thumb. You ready, Okay.
If somebody starts an argument with hey, the NBA should
play less games, that argument is suddenly null and void.
(06:19):
Somebody says Major League Baseball should pay less games, that
argument is null and void. If anybody says there'll be
fewer games than the NBA season or the NBA playoffs,
that because it's never going to happen. It's never going
to happen. All of these games are part of the
value buy. For example, for CBS and Turner that paid
(06:45):
all that money. Turner paid eighty percent of the frame.
So the reason the thing hasn't expanded is my guess
CBS and Turner they probably have soul rights and don't
want to increase the fees that much. If at all, well,
probably modestly, because they'll say, hey, these are just two
more games or whatever to put on true TV.
Speaker 3 (07:06):
The point is we're never going back. It's not going
to be less.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
But as the NCAA Tournament expands, the only question that
the committee would really need to be told is how
do we fit all these teams into that same sixty
fourteen bracket? And I think you stack them the way
you have been, you just do it with different seeds anyway,
So Joel's going to take a beating. Everybody's going to
(07:33):
claim to love the NCAA Tournament and love the cinerellas.
The ratings don't actually back that statement up.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
He's not wrong. There is some randomness to.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Choose to how we choose a champion that way, but
there's just as much randomness to college football now. And
if you don't believe me, I give you Ohio State,
who last year was not playing great football when they
lost to Michigan in the Big Ten Championship or no
in the regular season. Last game of the regular season.
(08:05):
They were upset by Michigan, Yet they turned around and
won the College Fall Playoff.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
That just happened.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Oh yeah, by the way, He described two teams playing
on a neutral site in some bizarre time welocome to
the College Wall playoff. Anyway, I hope you enjoyed All Ball.
Continue to download and listen. More great content to come.
I'm Doug Gottliebin.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
This is All Ball.
Hey, what a book of it. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This
is All Ball. One of good special late night.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Frankly in bed chat about what Joel Clatt said, and
you know, obviously by the time when we published this,
it's you know, the morning after, Joel Clatt goes on
somebody else's podcast and says, this is my hottest take ever.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
That the NCAA Tournament is a joke.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
And what's amazing about it was he talked about teams
playing you a one and done tournament on a neutral
site at odd times, and then he just described the
college football playoff.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Like he literally described.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
The college fotball playoff.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
They play a one and done tournament on neutral sites
at odd times. You know, by the way, no one
who's ever lost in the NCAA Tournament has ever blamed
the time of day of a game, Joel. So it's
just that one's far afield. It's a basketball game. Guys
play at all times all year, just like at football
ball at times all year.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Anyway.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
But while he actually contradicted his own thought or pointed
out that college football has tried to emulate college basketball,
which if he thinks that makes his point as well,
I don't really get it. I do know the sports
are different. I do know the attrition of a Cinderella
(01:48):
at the college football level. And you know, even if
a Too Lane or James Madison won their game, they're
not going to win two because their team's just too
beat up. And as thin as any college football roster is,
the lower the level, the lower less money, the more
the thinner it's going to be. That's just the reality
of where we are financially. So, you know, I am
(02:16):
I actually think though that the gist of his point
I've made several times over there is a randomness. There
is a randomness too to this tournament, and you don't
always get the best team to win the championship.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
You just you just don't.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
So, you know, I pointed out for for years that
the year that Kentucky won the national championship with John
cal Perry, you know, the two other best teams North Carolina,
Kendall Marshall got hurt. I think they still got to
the Sweet sixteen and lost to Kansas, But kend Of
(03:06):
Marshall was healthy the NBA point guard, and he.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Was awesome in college.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
They go to the Final four and they take on Kentucky,
who they'd lost to, but I think too in the
regular season, and Syracuse that year was really really good
and their center didn't play in the NCAA tournament they lost,
so I think let's think it was the fat mellow year.
So the point is that the best team doesn't always
win sometimes about injuries or matchups or things.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
That go bump in the night.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
And there is a randomness the NCAA tournament, no question,
And there's going to be a bit less randomness, but
still a randomness to a college football playoff. The more
times we have the spiny teams, somebody's quarterbacks going to
get hurt. Something's going to go wrong for a team
that's way better than another team in the first round,
and most like an injury, and that's gonna that's going
(04:00):
to change the tournament and then there'll.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
Be an upset.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
But the point of it being a silly way and
having pool play as the best way, again, he's not wrong.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
It's actually a great idea.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
But I also think he doesn't understand, nor do most
people understand why the NCAA tournament is so popular.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
You know what that is?
Speaker 2 (04:24):
People don't all of a sudden love college basketball at
the end of the season, after liking it and enjoying
it during the regular season.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
No, it's the bracket.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Well, most valuable thing in college athletics is that sixty
fourteen bracket, because now even when you go and get
the bracket and fill it out on your own, you
do realize that that bracket actually contains additional games. But
they find a way to keep the bracket whole. The
(04:54):
brackets easy, easy for people to remember, easy for people
to fill out. It's just enough games, but not so
much that it wears you down. You don't have to
know anything to know how to fill out a bracket.
The whole thing is absolutely frickin perfect, So Joel's not wrong.
Like a better way to decide a champion would be
pool play. Matchups would still be a part of it.
(05:18):
Now you'd have to do point differential whatever. Like we
could argue the NBA is the best way you decide
a true champion, but the NBA injuries often play a
part there too. But if you could be a team
best out of seven, you're a better team. All that said,
I don't think even Joel and many people don't understand
(05:40):
what's really popular about the NCAA tournament.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Do people like the Cinderellas, Yeah. Do they like the favorites, Yeah?
They better than the favorites. They like the Cinderellas. Got it.
But that's not the reason that the tournament is popular.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
It's not because every come friends gets a bid, although
I do love the idea of we've got friends getting
bids and if we're going to expand it, which it
probably will. Right, here's a good rule of thumb. You ready, Okay.
If somebody starts an argument with hey, the NBA should
play less games, that argument is suddenly null and void.
(06:19):
Somebody says Major League Baseball should pay less games, that
argument is null and void. If anybody says there'll be
fewer games than the NBA season or the NBA playoffs,
that because it's never going to happen. It's never going
to happen. All of these games are part of the
value buy. For example, for CBS and Turner that paid
(06:45):
all that money. Turner paid eighty percent of the frame.
So the reason the thing hasn't expanded is my guess
CBS and Turner they probably have soul rights and don't
want to increase the fees that much. If at all, well,
probably modestly, because they'll say, hey, these are just two
more games or whatever to put on true TV.
Speaker 3 (07:06):
The point is we're never going back. It's not going
to be less.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
But as the NCAA Tournament expands, the only question that
the committee would really need to be told is how
do we fit all these teams into that same sixty
fourteen bracket? And I think you stack them the way
you have been, you just do it with different seeds anyway,
So Joel's going to take a beating. Everybody's going to
(07:33):
claim to love the NCAA Tournament and love the cinerellas.
The ratings don't actually back that statement up.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
He's not wrong. There is some randomness to.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Choose to how we choose a champion that way, but
there's just as much randomness to college football now. And
if you don't believe me, I give you Ohio State,
who last year was not playing great football when they
lost to Michigan in the Big Ten Championship or no
in the regular season. Last game of the regular season.
(08:05):
They were upset by Michigan, Yet they turned around and
won the College Fall Playoff.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
That just happened.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Oh yeah, by the way, He described two teams playing
on a neutral site in some bizarre time welocome to
the College Wall playoff. Anyway, I hope you enjoyed All Ball.
Continue to download and listen. More great content to come.
I'm Doug Gottliebin.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
This is All Ball.
Host
Doug Gottlieb
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