Outward: Slate's LGBTQ podcast
Outward, Slate's queer podcast, is a whip-smart monthly salon in which hosts and guests deepen the audience’s understanding of queer culture and politics, delight them with unexpected perspectives, and invite listeners into a colorful conversation about the issues animating LGBTQ communities.
Episodes
December 17, 2025 • 31 mins
As When We All Get to Heaven wraps up, Christina sits down with series host Lynne Gerber and producer Siri Colum. They discuss how the church has changed, the value of fleeting queer spaces, and what a decade or more spent working on this story has meant to—and taught—them.
Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outwa...
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December 10, 2025 • 52 mins
In the final episode of When We All Get to Heaven, we catch up on what’s happened in the many years between the emergence of effective treatment for AIDS in the late ‘90s and the fall of 2025, when we recorded this episode. We linger on a moment back in June 1999, when Jim was still pastor and called on the church to remember that AIDS wasn’t over. Because—advances notwithstanding—it still isn’t over.
For more on Gilbert Baker ...
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December 3, 2025 • 53 mins
In 1996 everything changed. With the introduction of antiretroviral medications called the “AIDS cocktail,” people started getting better – some dramatically – and surviving AIDS became a real possibility. In the wake of these changes, MCC found itself taking stock of what they lost to AIDS and using what they learned to address larger social issues– from medical marijuana to homelessness. Sometimes these political stances felt her...
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November 26, 2025 • 60 mins
In 1995 Rev. Jim Mitulski became HIV positive -- what's known as seroconversion. It was 14 years into the epidemic and people knew what HIV/AIDS was, how you got it, and how you could prevent it. And when Jim got sick, he got very sick. What was it like to become ill so publicly? How would the church and the community respond? And what could Jim possibly preach about on his first Sunday back?
“My Soul Doth Magnify” is from Camille...
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November 19, 2025 • 49 mins
Scott and Bruce were the hottest couple in church. Scott, a hula dancer, seemed destined for Bruce, the hunky “lumbersexual,” and the church delighted when they got together. Their brief love affair sparkled before Bruce got sick and died. Their story is one of multiple “dress rehearsals”– when friends, family and lovers went through AIDS with their loved ones wondering who would be next and sometimes knowing it might be you.
You...
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November 16, 2025 • 30 mins
The Sunday after Magic Johnson announced his HIV-status, Jim Mitulski preached a sermon on being tired of people dying. We’re sharing it as an interlude, a pause, and an immersion into one moment in AIDS’ bleak midwinter.
For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/interlude.
In the sermon Rev. Mitulski refers to ARC. That means AIDS-Related Complex, a diagnostic category meant to indicate an earl...
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November 12, 2025 • 63 mins
San Francisco’s gay/lesbian community in the 1980s wasn’t just facing an AIDS crisis, they also struggled against ongoing anti-gay violence. In 1989, in the midst of a campaign to legally establish anti-gay violence as a hate crime, MCC San Francisco made headlines when their AIDS minister was attacked in her home. The city, the police department, and the LGBTQ community rallied around the church and the minister. And when they fi...
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November 5, 2025 • 56 mins
When Rev. Ron Russell Coons got diagnosed with AIDS he thought a lot about what healing meant when death was certain. He pursued it in his strained and broken family relationships and he preached about it from the pulpit. Though he knew, without a doubt, that he would die from AIDS, Ron claimed that he believed in and had experienced healing. What does healing mean when everybody knows it can’t mean survival? Maybe healing is one’s...
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October 29, 2025 • 50 mins
As MCC grew as a denomination, they tried to figure out if and how to relate to other churches. Would any befriend a queer church? And if so, would that friendship help other churches shift their perspective on homosexuality? These questions got harder as AIDS numbers grew—it made people more afraid yet friendship more vital. But sometimes friendship emerges in the most unlikely of places. Like when a children’s choir visited an AI...
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October 22, 2025 • 46 mins
In the late ‘80s, two MCC San Francisco ministers wrote an article called “We Are the Church Alive, the Church with AIDS.” We wanted to know how a gay/lesbian church came to call itself “a church with AIDS.” The answers lie in the years before our audio archive begins. So we started asking people. We explore two stories in what’s likely a more complicated shift. One story is about a pair of religion geeks who learned to make queer ...
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October 15, 2025 • 58 mins
Why would an out queer person in the Gay Liberation Days of the 1970s go to church? What church would they go to? And why would they stay? In the 1960s, and ‘70s, the separation between God and gays was not as vast as it seemed. Rev. Troy Perry started the first Metropolitan Community Church in his Los Angeles living room. Tired of flying to LA every week, a Navy veteran started the second one in a San Francisco gay bar. And the Me...
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October 15, 2025 • 31 mins
As Outward proudly presents the 10-episode series When We All Get to Heaven, from Eureka Street Productions, Christina and Bryan had the privilege of sitting down with series host Lynne Gerber. Lynne explains how 1,200 cassette tapes became a wealth of archival audio that infuses this series with so much vitality, joy, and shared mourning of queer churches during a devastating epidemic.
Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for w...
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October 15, 2025 • 26 mins
In 1993, more than 10 years into the AIDS epidemic, the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco (MCC-SF) tries to remember all they’ve lost. We think about remembering too after encountering an archive of 1,200 cassette recordings of this queer church’s services during the height of the epidemic. Whether you’re a regular church goer or would never step into one, we invite you to spend time with this LGBTQ+ San Francisco chur...
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October 10, 2025 • 1 min
When We All Get to Heaven tells the story of one of the first LGBTQ-positive churches, the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco (MCC-SF), and how it faced the personal, social, and political trials of the AIDS epidemic, including the deaths of hundreds of its members. This 10-episode series uses historical tapes rescued from the church to bring listeners into the heart of a community struggling to live while struggling wi...
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September 3, 2025 • 26 mins
Trans rights and access to health care have been under attack on the state level for years, but the second Trump administration and the Supreme Court have accelerated a chilling effect at clinics across the country.
Guest: Grace Byron, author of “The Grim State of Trans Health Care” and “The Bureaucratic Nightmares of Being Trans Under Trump” for the New Yorker.
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August 6, 2025 • 63 mins
Outward is going on a little summer break, in the meantime we’re leaving you with a delightfully queer episode of Slate’s Hit Parade with Chris Molanphy called Mighty Real. This is part two—catch part one in our previous episode.
Little Richard was rock ‘n’ roll’s flamboyant architect. Lesley Gore sang that no one owned her. Sylvester was a gender-fluid icon who helped define disco. Freddie Mercury made rock operatic, and George...
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July 23, 2025 • 60 mins
Outward is going on a little summer break, in the meantime we’re leaving you with a delightfully queer episode of Slate’s Hit Parade with Chris Molanphy:
Little Richard was rock ‘n’ roll’s flamboyant architect. Lesley Gore sang that no one owned her. Sylvester was a gender-fluid icon who helped define disco. Freddie Mercury made rock operatic, and George Michael demanded freedom.
What all of these LGBTQ artists had in common was ...
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July 9, 2025 • 41 mins
This week, Bryan is joined by theologian, activist, and ballroom historian Michael Roberson to discuss his new book, Ballroom: A History, A Movement, A Celebration. Roberson traces the rich legacy of the ballroom scene—from its origins in resistance and survival, to its role in shaping public health responses during the height of the AIDS crisis and beyond, to its ongoing significance as a spiritual and communal refuge for Black an...
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June 25, 2025 • 52 mins
In this episode of Outward, Bryan talks with Slate legal reporter Mark Joseph Stern about a federal judge’s sweeping and controversial ruling in United States v. Skrmetti, which could have massive consequences for access to gender-affirming care. Then, Christina sits down with Congresswoman Becca Balint to talk about what it means to advocate for trans rights inside a Congress where culture war rhetoric, and policy, are escalating ...
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June 11, 2025 • 47 mins
This week, Bryan talks with Christina about her new piece for Slate The Conservative Wave Is Having a Very Unexpected Effect on Pride which covers the power and politics of small-town Pride. Then, in the second half, they're joined by Van Knapp, co-founder of Canyon County Pride in Idaho, to talk about building queer joy in unlikely places.
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