June 21, 2025 • 37 mins
What happens inside a child's brain when they're having a meltdown?
How should we approach their struggles?
Tim Beveridge is joined by Neuroscience Educator Nathan Wallis.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News TALKSB.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Told me.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
I want to see.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
Let's welcome back. Were welcome into the Weekend Collective. This
is the Parents Squad.
Speaker 5 (00:30):
By the way, if you missed any of our previous hours,
we had a Pete Wolf camp and I are in
Gardner on for our panel. You can go check that
out on our website. Look news Talk, said B. Just
look for the Weekend Collective on iHeartRadio and likewise interesting
chat with de Wi Roberts are just about the art
of negotiation and a few good stories there for the
for the one roof radio show. Anyway, right now, as
I say, it's the Parents Squad and joining me is
(00:54):
season euro Science Educator. It's a name that's known to
many many Kiwis or many of many parents around the country.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Nathan Wallace today, Yes you too.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
It looks I.
Speaker 5 (01:07):
Don't know if we're on a zoom meeting you and
I and it looks like is it about foggy out
the back there through your window instead of sitting an
artwork or something.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
No, it's an illusion. It's an illusion. It's a that's
a picture rather than an actual window window.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
It has confused me.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
When you come on, you look like a young Jeene Hackman. Ah, yeah,
that's what Zoom is doing today.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
I have had that one before.
Speaker 5 (01:36):
I think I will go with that someone you know, Yeah, yeah,
the late Jean Heckman. Actually, now I think of it,
isn't that that's right? Because that's why I died recently.
Sitting in a few days apart from his wife was
very mysterious.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Yeah, he has avent sure, I think, and his wife
died and if he wandered around for a week, oh gosh,
had the capacity of.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Like a twelve month old so and then he died.
Speaker 4 (01:58):
Yeah, it was pretty good. I'm actually gosh.
Speaker 5 (02:01):
Hey, we now, we'd love to hear from you if
you've any questions or some stories you'd like to share
on with dealing with meltdowns with your kids. I know
eight one hundred eighty ten eighty or text nine two
nine two. And look, I don't share too much about
my own kids for their own privacy sake, but obviously
every child that's ever ever been well has the capacity
(02:26):
to have the meltdown and be unreasonable, no matter no
matter how wonderful they are in every other aspect of
their lives. But some of it's tied with anxiety. Some
of it's just tied with pubany kids asserting their independence.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yep, some of it's completely natural.
Speaker 5 (02:43):
Yeah, let's start on the anxiety side of things, because.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
It seems to be a word that packs up all
the time, doesn't it? Know, Nathan that I.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Mean, I often do tell stories about my kids, but
the way I get around the privacy issues, I don't
mention which kid it is. It's pretty hard to do this,
you know, like I say a child, So that's not
saying which one it is because it's I'm hard to
do it without you know, pulling on your own experience.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
Well so, yeah, I mean, but okay, just on the
anxiety side of things, how how are we doing with
kids in anxiety?
Speaker 4 (03:17):
Has this generation of kids got more anxiety? And why
is it? Or are we just more aware?
Speaker 1 (03:23):
I mean skyrocketing amounts, you know, hundreds of percent, like
three hundred percent more so it's absolutely there. Are they
pre wired for anxiety? Yes they are, but so were we.
Everybody's pre wide for anxiety. You have to sort of
it's like that's the default mode, and then you've got
to have all these sort of layers on top of
it to calm you down your survival as the prime director.
So that's about being anxious. So then you have all
(03:45):
your needs met and and you calm that. So, I mean,
what I'm saying is that there's no different biology with
these kids. And you know, because generally take thousands of
years to change, so they've got the same genetic predisposition
as us, but they face a very different world. You know,
Like in the space of thirty years, we've gone from
having mainly one parent was a home for the first
(04:09):
five years of life, eighty percent of people lived. Eighty
percent of people lived in the same community as their
extended family, so that there was aunties and grandparents. Grandmothers
didn't work thirty years ago, so you know, we had
a full time grandparent kids. People tended to stay in
one area a whole lot. More so the kids on
knew each other in the neighborhood and the parents knew
each other, and the kids have fear fear of freedom.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Now now most kids are in a childcare center. Before
the age of one.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Only twenty percent of people live in the area of
their extended family. But I'm not trying to depress people
and make people feel guilty. It's just saying the reality is.
The reality is that the rapid change that they've gone through,
they've taken away to the village. They now we find
sixty kids into what used to be a backyard. And yeah,
it's just there's a lot of change for kids to
cope with. And I think it's natural that they get anxiety.
(04:54):
I mean it's added to things by people think it's
like PlayStation and Facebook, and certainly screens and social media
do play a part in that. But I think if
we had I had taken away our grandmothers and you know,
extended family and most of us had in our home
here and until we were like you know, out of
high school. Yeah, yeah, you can't really underestimate how much
(05:15):
those things really add to resilience. I mean, it's not
all doing with Glennoi. There are things we can do
to compensate that. Yeah, this generator of kids are amazing.
Part of that having anxiety is there actually a little
bit more emotional intelligent than we were. They so they
labeled their emotionals. You know, that's what's not all of it,
but some of us there I'm a labeling.
Speaker 5 (05:35):
I'm almost relieved that the conversation hasn't gone straight to
social media and devices and things, because I mean, look,
we've got plenty of problems with addictions to devices.
Speaker 4 (05:47):
But I look at it. Look, I look at my kids,
and look what.
Speaker 5 (05:51):
They don't have Facebook accounts yet they're twelve and forteen
years old. There's no Facebook, there's no Instagram. But I look,
but I look at the way that they and you
know we I've got a limit on our youngest one's time.
I don't know how we managed the older one because
she's on an Apple. I can't control our Apple. That
that's another topical drives me nuts. I low the apple.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
But I noticed that.
Speaker 5 (06:12):
The way that they communicate with their friends using WhatsApp,
I actually am not okay. They're not on TikTok either, Okay,
but I know they just seem to use those those
methods of communicating with their friends in a way that
doesn't actually bother me as much as they seem to
(06:33):
be coping with it.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
Better surprise me, you know.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
Because it's told me that they've come from a house
where you've moderated their screen time.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
They haven't just been free for all. So they've learned those.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
Other things you do when you're not on a screen,
communication skills and stuff. So half of it will be
that you've raised responsible kids that have got boundaries around
their stuff alreally, so they're already using it with boundaries,
And the other.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Half will be that that's the stuff they're letting you see.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
You know, if they really hit full time access to
them run it all the time, and the reality is
they do start delving into your so they wouldn't want
us to see oftentimes.
Speaker 5 (07:08):
Well, I mean I sometimes wonder whether it's the older
generation have had problems with addictions to computers and stuff
because we grew up without it and all of a sudden,
I mean, anyone can get addicted to this ste but
that's getting away from it.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Really, it's all about how it underwarks the sense of reality.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
Like the issue was social media, like you know that
in their research, the issue is with comparison to others
and not knowing the difference between reality and what they
see online. They're forming their vision of reality with what
they're seeing online and that's making up their normal. And
so interestingly, all we have to do is have a
conversation with them as parents. That's that's that you know,
(07:45):
like if you say to your kids, you know, social
media pictures adopted, that's say, you know, people put forward
their best foot, they want their lives to look better
than other people's.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
That's not what real people look like.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
That's taking one hundred four days and put that one ahead,
just letting them know.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
It's the same with pornography. If the parents have a
conversation so you realize that pornography, that's not what real
sex is.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Like, women don't really do that.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
That's you know, made by men. As long as you
have the conversation that tells them is different and it's
not real, it seems really you need to do. It's
the parents that don't talk about it and assume their
kids aren't doing it or avoid the conversation that those
kids get a warped perception of reality and they do
start to believe it's real. And that's what causes the anxiety.
You know, the comparison to others and there's warp sense
(08:28):
of reality.
Speaker 5 (08:30):
So on the anxiety thing there'll be, I mean, it
crops up. Sometimes we look at what previous generations have
gone through in terms of trauma. I mean, I guess
my generation grew up thinking that we're all going to
die in a nuclear explosion. It comes small circle. I mean,
obviously we people will say, well, you know, people went
(08:52):
through the Blitz and kids were sent away from London
and stuff like that. But I sometimes wonder if what
what's missing from those comparisons, as the acknowledgment actually kids
were deeply traumatized by the stuff they went through.
Speaker 4 (09:05):
As if we survived, we did all right. I'm not
sure by that.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Yeah, I mean I said that these generation has got better,
These generation has got more emotionally intelligent, more articulate, you know.
So I think the change is every generation. You see
the teenagers, you know, like there's bloody hieroglyphics on the
side of the pyramids dated seven thousand years old to
say this generation it's going to ruined civilization because they're
also maybe you know, and it's just really what old
(09:32):
people have seen are getting a time they see the
new generation. There's lots of real when you look at
the statistics, there's lots of very positive things about this generation.
You know, there's certainly been more much you know, they
they smoke less cigarettes, they do less drugs, they delay sex,
they rag school, less. They just made every measure of
you know, delinquent behavior. They do much better than previous generations.
(09:52):
It's actually my generation Generation X, you know, anyone sort
of forty five to sixty.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
We've got the.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
Crap the rules, and they had to comped all the
sex and drunk or the alcohol. So I mean, that's
the reality of just the statistics. But you know that
these kids are I think part of it is like
I said before, that they are more emotionally intelligent, you know,
so they will say this was how I'm feeling, whereas
we were in a courage to say how we were feeling.
You know, when my daughter said to me, when one
(10:21):
of my daughters, there's me and my daughters said to me,
I've got anxiety, I like a normal generational experient, thought
inside my head of bullshit, what do you got to
have anxiety for a sweet, cruisy life? And well, I
knew not to say that out loud, you know, yeah,
(10:43):
I tell if your parenting courses. I knew not to
say it, but in my head I thought not, but
I know, not to discount their feelings. And it cut
a long story short. I actually ended up coming full
circle and realizing, oh, what she describes as anxiety. If
I just described as normal getting ready for the worst thing.
So basically I realized, well, I have anxiety. But I
(11:03):
was a generation that thought to say, don't say you've
got anxiety. It's a weakness. To say you've got something negative,
it's a it is manifesting it. Whereas actually, what I
learned is that when you say you've got anxiety and
you start to do things about it, like I started yoga,
and yeah, things have been so much better since then.
I'm glad that identified it. It wasn't a weakness after all.
It was a strength. And I think this generation is
(11:24):
doing that. So we might see them as weaker because
they're not hardening out, but you know, brand probably they're
not as hard in some ways as the people that
grow up in the depression, But in many ways they're
harder because they, again, to grow up in the depression,
usually have family around them. And you might have had
all that hard stuff going on, but the family is
the number one thing. It's pull I love for you,
it's your connection. That's what it's all about being a human.
(11:46):
What's the point hitting an Xbox I PlayStation in a
flash house? So you know, when both parents a work.
By the time you're won and you're day. Look, word,
you probably around your extend of family and you're quite isolated.
Speaker 5 (11:55):
Yeah, so when you think of I mean, that's touched
on a bunch of things for me because I think
actually these days that we're surrounded by connect with people
in a way with social media and technology, and yet
I think that I think that we, many of us
are lonelier than we've ever been in a way because
the lack of genuine human connection. And are kids So okay,
(12:22):
if we wind it back to what we first talked
about that you know, the fact that there's only you know,
we used to have one parent at home. You know,
when we got home from school, Mum or dad was home.
Let's be honest, it's mostly mum.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
How Look, life is the way it is.
Speaker 5 (12:37):
We now need to incomes generally to begin to afford house.
So we're not winding that back. How what can we do?
Speaker 1 (12:47):
It's difficult to hear that stuff because parents are still
guilty and go oh you know, and they have that
defensive reactional I can't help, but my mind's not to
make them feel bad about it, because you're right, even
we can't do anything about it.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
That's the society that we live in.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
It's just acknowledging it so that we know that there's
anything wrong with our kids.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
They're not particularly weak. They're not a bunch of us.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
It is understandable, you know what they're going through. And
then the next question is, well, how do we compensate
for that, because you any regeneration has to and there
are clear ways of the literature that you can compensate
for that.
Speaker 4 (13:16):
Are okay, give us a clue.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
We basically that everything's so rushed now. The opposite to
being rush to slow everything down. The way your brain works.
The faster you are, the more your stress brain is
aroused to get the frontal cortext, the you know, the
really good brain that's got all the flash stuff out
like empathy and controlling your emotions and higher thought and
all the good stuff. To get that, you've got to
slow down. And so basically that's why meditation is such
(13:40):
a big thing. You know, A mindfulness and schools are
such a big topics. You know, look, thirty years ago,
if you mentioned mindfulness just sounded like a hippie. You know,
it didn't really have anything to do it academic learning,
whereas now we understand that basically you think of your
survival brain as being on a set of scales, you know,
an old fashion set of scales with your learning brain,
you know the front of cortex and your brain's set.
(14:02):
So your survival brain do on a set of scales.
It's the survival brain's aroused. Then you're not going to
get access to their cortex. It's got all the good
stuff and the ability to control your emotions and you know,
all the adult things. So you know, we're basically living
in a state that's arousing our brains see all the
time when you add social media and screens and the
rapid rate of information and change. So by doing something ritualize,
(14:23):
like any sort of form of mindfulness where you stop
and consciously slow down your breath and slow down and
bring yourself into the present moment, really that's a bigger
that's a big answer to mental illness because you know,
to be less simplistic, anxiety is worrying about the future,
depression is worrying about the past, and mindfulness as being
in the present moment. So if you learn to be
(14:45):
in the present moment, you can normally handle any problems
here right now. It's worrying about future problems or overthinking
past ones. So the practice of bringing yourself into a mindfulness,
say of bringing the present moment, sets you up for
good mental health the rest of your life and helps
to compensate for the fact that you're living in such
a world of rapid change.
Speaker 5 (15:03):
Because I think I've found that because of the hours
I do, I'm lucky that I actually am around when
my kids get home. I'll pack them up and things
like that. But the thing that I think was probably
the worst, well not the worst thing, but when I now,
I don't try and do any work if I fucking
avoid it. I make sure that I'm not doing any
work when they get home, because otherwise I'm fifty percent present,
(15:26):
you know, and then they stress, and then you're irritated
because hang on, I just need to do that.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Yeah, I've been there, Yes, having good boundaries around that day. Right,
this is my work time, and I might have to say, right, kids,
our dad's going to do this ray, but I'm going
to be finished at six o'clock and then I'll be
available for an hour and we'll do what you want
to do. I mean, so much of It is about
the type of play that you have with your kids too.
If you let your kids be in charge of the play,
you know, ten minutes of them being in charge, it's
(15:52):
worth two hours of us playing with us, making the
rules and telling them what to do. So it's about
playing well as well use your time.
Speaker 5 (16:01):
It's interesting you're talking about the meditation thing because the
school that my girls go to to a Catholic school.
But this I think it's at the start of the
day or at some stage they have five minutes. I
can't remember the name for it. Somebody who's listening for
they were Bearandeine because I haven't kept it secret. They baridine,
but I can't remember what they call it. But it's
five minutes where it's just quiet time to think about
(16:21):
what they've got to do with their day. And that
I thought, gosh, that sounds really like genius. I think
they there yere.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
I mean in lots of ways, Catholic schools have been
doing mindfulness forever because they've always started the day with
career ands, and that repetitive nature sort of does the
same thing as a mindfulness exercise. It brings you into
that present moment, It ritualizes you into that environment.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
And kind of cop up of NATI schools have always.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Started with you know, fucker tokey and and mehi and stuff,
and that that's the same ritualized things we would start
with our news when I was at my little country school.
That they are the same ritualized routine sort of acts
as us fall and mindfulness. So to sing it because
singing generally flowers down that whole internal you know, especially
the songs that make you sing a score.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
So you yeah.
Speaker 5 (17:10):
I'm making a couple of notes to myself as you're
talking about this actually just but anyway, Hey, look, we'd
love your cause if you've got any questions for Nathan
Wallace and neuroscience educator on you know, if your kids
are a little stressed or anxious, or you're worrying about
how you're handling the whole thing, give us a call
if you've got any suggestions as well on how you
because we want to touch on the meltdown thing before
we this hour as well. It is twenty four past
(17:34):
five News Talks. It'd be the number of OZ eight
hundred and eighty ten eighty text nine to nine two
back in just to take.
Speaker 6 (17:39):
It'll lie nice to meet you to night, you eat,
you go des get up a fussy esities life river song,
You're together.
Speaker 5 (17:52):
Then let's welcome back or welcome into the parents squad.
There's the week in collective Hunton Beverage. And my guest
is Nathan Wallace is a neuroscience educator. Hey, by the way,
when I give a job description, I say neuroscience educator,
there will be people going, what is a neuroscience educator
at Nathan?
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Yeah, Well I'm neuroscience. It's just how your brain works,
and so it's really educating people about how your brain works.
When really I'm a human developmentalist. That's my area of
you know, sort of election in a university, human development.
It's just that that's where neuroscience landed when at first
They have their own department now, but they landed under
human development when a first, because I was in the
department of cognition, so come under me, and I was
(18:29):
ended up being a lead trainer for a neuroscience organization.
But really it's about wrapping together all of the you know,
I'm been a primary school teacher and an early childhood teacher,
and I spent most of my years working in child
therapy so it's really bringing it all to you, you know.
And I've been a foster parent and I was foster
at myself, So it's really coming from lots of different
angles of just understanding how to put that research, especially
(18:51):
from neuroscience and how the brain works and practice to
my parenting better and easier and better outcomes when.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
It comes to the meltdowns, and look, that can come
from a bunch of reasons, and as long as I
don't end up having a meltdown on my own, because
that's the thing as a parent sometimes you can just
get bloody annoyed.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
I was going to push about buttons more.
Speaker 5 (19:14):
I think my favorite technique though I remember there was
there was a meltdown going on. There might have been
been in a couple of meltdowns going on, and I actually,
in fact it ended up turning into they think they
ended up laughing, but there was it was a serious meltdown,
and I said, right, that's that, I'm going off. I'm
taking myself off to my room and remove myself because
actually I really did need to smart. God I'm bloody annoyed, right.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah, yeah, that's a really smart thing to do, you know,
because I'm that's when you don't do that and you
stay and you're parenting from your own emotional state. You're basically,
you know, parenting from your own to your old self,
and that's not going to help.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
So I think it was a smart move to it. Right,
I'm going to a room.
Speaker 5 (19:53):
Oh good, good, because because there's that sort of I mean,
you've been through it as a parent. I guess other
times when you want to say, hey, listen, excuse me,
what did you just say? And you challenge them on something.
But there's a point where I'm trying to you know,
I like to think I'm quite good at it, but
I'm probably lousy at it of thinking, okay, tell you what,
(20:14):
I'm just going to ignore, you know, I don't know,
take my I want to use a really unpleasant analogy. Yeah,
but just take your foot off of someone's throat. Just
don't be pushing them on every bit of bad behavior.
There's a point where you sort of have to is
there a sort of point where you're going to step
(20:36):
away and go, okay, we're going to address this before
the end of the day is out, but now is
not the time.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Oh. I think that's really smart there, and you do
have to monitor that thing about how negative you've been,
because you know, at the end of the day you
have said eighty percent negative things to them and only
twenty percent positive, and of course you're not going to
have a good relationship and you're not going to have
good behavior. So it has been being aware of not
being on their case all the time. It's so much
easier to to point out the things that they're doing well.
(21:01):
And that sounds a bit soft, but you know, the
research shows and over again that if they keep slamming
the lounge door and you keep saying, don't stand the door,
don't stand the door, and they keep slamming the door,
whereas when they close it and nice to go, oh,
thank you for showing the door, knights and quietly, that
really does increase the behavior whole lot more So I.
Speaker 4 (21:20):
Try sarcastic when you say it, Yeah, I know, but
I will.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Find sounds like cast I mean, telling them what to
do instead of what not to do is actually way
more effective of getting them to do what you want anyway,
So you do, you know, and there's it's a way
of avoiding being negative, but it isn't It is a dance,
isn't it like you know about when do you do that?
When do you challenge? I think what you said about
how you'll you know, you'll think about it and come
back to it later, because I'm often thinking is it
(21:46):
a pattern?
Speaker 2 (21:47):
I don't need to get on top of everything?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
If the kids just if it's a one off, maybe
I can just let a slide because of you know,
but I can calm down later and I'm not reacting
from my emotions and think is there something I want
to address with them? And how do I want to
address it? There's way more chance that you'll be in
your own front for quarter by then too, because you're
not responding emotionally to the moment. I think I'm in
the moment. That's when we we respond with our thinking,
(22:12):
just respond from our own emotions. That's often when you
hear your own mother orther's voice come sailing out the
amount and it's not really often your best parenting. So
if you can stepping away from it and thinking about
it and just taking a second to calm down, well
you going to your own well take that lot.
Speaker 5 (22:27):
That probably paints me in a better light than I
deserve at times at appearent because there are times when
it's just like this, you know, the basic things you
keep on saying, can you just take put your dishes
in the rusher?
Speaker 4 (22:36):
Or do this or this and and after aways. So God,
I'm sick of saying this.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
And you have bad days as well, like every parent does.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
This reality. We're sometimes grouchy and snappy and were you know,
sound my parents from the eighteen forties. But it's what
you do most of the time that matters. Really, you know,
we are human as well, So I think, don't beat
ourselves up about not doing the perfect parenting all the time.
Speaker 4 (22:59):
Well, I guess as long as you're.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
Trying if you slip into that and their parents who
have you know who find that they're constantly correcting their
kids because they're you know, their kids are not picking
up on But how resilientire kids when it comes to
because I would imagine they just tune out in the end,
don't they, Or.
Speaker 4 (23:14):
If you're constantly on their back for things.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
I mean, it does depend on the context.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
So if you've got a parent that has always criticizing
you and doesn't display any love, doesn't seem proud of you,
it has usually serious consequences for it. For who you are.
But this is a parent that is loving and spends
time with them and tells them that they love them.
And then there's also a bit critical, and that's a
very different thing. They just learned to think, God, that's
you know, daddy is just a bit critical. So it's
not really the criticism. It's more that does the criticism
(23:42):
come on top of a loving relationship, because if it does,
then you're probably fine. Yeah, it becomes instead of a
loving relationship. And they just find our dad to be
critical and distant, then that is a problem.
Speaker 5 (23:51):
So if they know that dads and they call Mum
or Dad are in their corner, then you've got a
bit more of it. They can tolerate a bit more
corrective advice.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Yeah, And I think when we do lose it, I
mean I would just make sure I would own it
with my kids, and I had no worries about apologizing.
You know, when I swore at them or something and
lost my rag and you know, it wasn't a good parenting.
It was my parents, you know, coming out of my mouth.
I'd come back into the rum afterwards and go, oh, well,
clearly I lost it. There was that was on me.
Speaker 5 (24:21):
I actually think that that's a major because there are
some parents who would never want to admit they're wrong,
and that to me, that's look, I'm.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Not as you do, not as you say. What you know,
if you want kids to admit that they're wrong, you
know you have they're to see you doing that, and
sometimes you clearly are wrong. When you're just sworn at
your kids, it's hard to justify that as being, you know,
a good parenting strategy. So I think it's a strength
when they become what we call about we're talking about
in the literature is rupture and repair as the academic stuff,
(24:49):
which is rupture as when you're leashi of shit. Repare
is when you go back and do something to fix it.
And as kids have rupture and repair, rupture and repair,
those kids are have to be emotionally intelligent and resilient
and the good outcomes the kauds they up go to
jail and mental illness and addiction and stuff are the
ones that have rupture, rupture, rupture.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
So that repair part is a really important part of it.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
You know, to go in and say you don't have
to fix it what happened, It might just be you know,
like I said, going in and saying, oh, well, I
lost the plot.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
Then see if I hate the idea that we ever
compile a list of advice, But if you were going
to put a list of things about how to avoid,
you know, kids having anxiety and resentment and things like that,
I would have put that just about at the top one.
It was that because if you there's saying admitting when
mum or dad is wrong, I got that wrong. Sorry
about that, honey, I love you.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Yeah, absolutely, Yeah. Parents are worried that they're geting away
some sort of power, but you're not. I think you're
actually increasing your power in many ways because you're having
a sort of relationship. I'm showing the kids what to
do when they If you want your kids to your
front up and say and repair what they've damaged, because
they will damage things, they will have mountdowns their children.
Is heart break down a child.
Speaker 4 (25:58):
You know we have?
Speaker 1 (25:59):
I mean it is we have.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
I mean we've still got our child brain.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
You have your limbic system, your emotional brain for the
rest of your So I think you've always got that
two year old and they're ready to have a set
or to that and that too year old, that o
limbic system doesn't care about the future. It only cares
about right now, and it doesn't care about consequences, or
it doesn't even think. It only cares about feeling. He's
about feeling, and it feels about what feels good right now.
(26:23):
It's just that we have a frontal cortex that regulates
that behavior and thinks about consequences and thinks about impact
on other people. Whereas being a child, that Olympic system
is just on full rant without the you know, it's
like the exhilarators on four with the no brains. It is.
Speaker 4 (26:38):
I'm almost relieved to hear you say that. Actually, Nathan,
thank you for that. Let's take some calls Ruth, Hello,
Hi there, how's it going good things?
Speaker 7 (26:49):
Yeah, my son has recently been knocked out playing rugby
and it's quite early days, but I was warned that
one of one of the symptoms could be that he
has an inability to cope with normal every day to
day situation, just gets more easily overwhelmed and that can
(27:13):
end up in irritability or maybe even a meltdown. And
he's he's not normally susceptible to meltdown. So I'm just
wondering how I'm going to cope with that.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
Right.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Has he had a mountdown so he's had a head
of hendry at Rugby and now you're worried about him
being concussed, that's right?
Speaker 4 (27:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
And has he displayed those behaviors yet or are you
just sort of worried about.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Them likely to come.
Speaker 7 (27:40):
At the moment. It's only run on day three, so right,
we just we're hoping that we can manage it. And
but at the moment, he's at home resting, so we
have actually hasn't had to deal with a normal school
day yet in normal traveling group environments. For the over stimulation,
(28:02):
we've basically just tried to keep the stimulation really low
a few days.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
Oh, that's really wise.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
I mean, I think you're going to be fine because
you're acknowledging what's happening, and you know that he's going
to be easily overwhelmed. So you are having a low
stimulus environment, and I think you're ready for it. You know,
if he does lose the plot over you cooking and
the wrong thing for Tea, you're not going to make
a drama about it because you're going to understand that
his brain stressed and so he's more likely to fall
into that emotional brain all the time. So I think
(28:29):
just the fact that you're even ringing, the fact that
you've taken him off school, and the fact that you're
thinking about how to cope with that, means that he's
going to be fine because you know what to expect.
Speaker 7 (28:39):
Right, Oh, that's good news.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
How old is he Rose? Did you say?
Speaker 7 (28:43):
He's just about seventeen?
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Okay, Yeah, it's so susceptible to you telling him.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
Like you know, people are a combination of the stories
that they hold about themselves, and so you know what
I'm saying is if you tell him, if he does, say,
lose the plot and has an emotional meltdown, when you
come back to him and say something like, oh look mate,
I'm not worrying about this. I think your brains under
a long streets. It's about a concussion. Usually you're such
a polite, respectful, you know young man, and you're always
(29:12):
so considerate of other people that this was out a character.
So you know, I think it's just down to the
head injury. Then you have a kid that thinks yeah, yeah, yeah,
they will be here you tell them. Yeah, So when
you tell the point out that No, you're normally so
you know, respectful, and then that's who they will be
because that's who you're telling them they are.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
So it's when they do just play that behavior. Yeah,
don't make it sound like the normal.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
I mean you're not going to. But just for other pearents,
you know, don't.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
Be Oh, you're always like this, and you're always so
arrogant and you're always so you know, actually they will
always be so arrogant.
Speaker 1 (29:45):
It's always will be so agg today.
Speaker 7 (29:47):
M Well, they are teenagers. You've got to give them that.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Yeah, yeah, that's right way around it.
Speaker 4 (29:52):
Good on your ruth. Thank you for your call. Thank
you very much.
Speaker 5 (29:57):
Actually it's funny, you know, and that there's the I
mean as a reminder as well. I think if you
realize what your kids have gone through with their day
and they're feeling about lousy and you, it does if
you can understand why they're feeling like that to me,
I mean, it's actually with any relationship, you know that
all of a sudden, it's like, actually, there's a reason
this person's baying like that because they're feeling X, Y
(30:18):
and Z. Mind you I mean, you know, not that
we're all perfect in Saints all the time, but it
doesn't hurt.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Yeah, And sometimes we are just annoying adhd as A
can't remember just being annoying, just wanting to be annoying,
you know, I start annoyed, so the more everyone else
to be annoyed as well. Sometimes sometimes there's shit.
Speaker 5 (30:41):
I love that you knew you were doing it. It's like, anyway,
we could I quick break. We'll be back with Nathan
Wallace in a moment. If you'd like to give us
a call. We'd love to hear from your eight hundred
and eighty ten eighty dealing with meltdowns and anxiety, twenty
six news talks.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
You'd be that's welcome back to the Weekend Collector.
Speaker 5 (31:03):
This the Parents Squad as the Stings is raising your child,
but I think sometimes we're raising parents as well at
the same time.
Speaker 4 (31:08):
And let's take some more calls. So is it hello?
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Hi there?
Speaker 4 (31:12):
What was the name of Nathan Nathan Wallace?
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Wallace? Have you written a book, Nathan.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Yeah, that hasn't been published yet, so they should come
out on each year. I've got about three different books
for publishers.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Wow, wonderful news flash.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Well, I'm much more of a talker than I'm a writer,
so it's taken me a long time to get around
to write the box, but it's finally happened.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
You got to scoop out of them.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Are you going to be in the line to buy one?
Speaker 1 (31:38):
There? Is it?
Speaker 3 (31:40):
Well, I'm going to make great gifts. Wouldn't they.
Speaker 4 (31:47):
Excellent? Is that what you're just calling forward? See if
he's got a book?
Speaker 1 (31:50):
No?
Speaker 4 (31:50):
No, no, no, no no.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
Now that's scenario you explained where the parenting is their
bad and the children getting collected or criticized and there
never any love and perfection or no communication, et cetera.
Well that was what my childhood was like, and so
(32:16):
I've studied it quite a lot because it's very analytical.
So now once the horse has bolted, the results of
this is all kinds of different outcomes like anorexia, drug addiction, smoking, alcohol.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
All those risks.
Speaker 4 (32:41):
How did you deal with this?
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Is it?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Well?
Speaker 3 (32:44):
Just let me finish. So if these things are happening
to your child, then they're going to at some point
hopefully reach out for help. Because she hit the wall.
And so for me, I turned to Christian to the church. Yeah,
(33:07):
that's the enormous healing and support.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
I think you have the nail right in the head.
You know, it is about getting that support, isn't it.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
It's about our community else. Yeah, those negative experiences, and
you need positive experiences as well because a lot of
you when when a child grows up with that sort
of negative environment, they might have parents that aren't providing that,
but the fact that all they need is like one
grandparent to someone that does provide value.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
For them, and that can find really foster resilience.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
It's when the child's got no one at all the
values them that's really at least that all those negative
outcometry talking about.
Speaker 5 (33:43):
And it just tells one person, doesn't it who they
have that connection with it that can make called.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
That's right, just one person that makes them feel valued
and and you know worthy then and it validates there
as a person. And this really helps them to grow
that frontal cortex, whereas if they're just proved as bad
all the time, they don't, so they are set to
put all those rusks. The last guest was talking about
addiction and soological problems.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
Thanks for your course, is that?
Speaker 5 (34:08):
Sorry, we've got times running a bit short now, but
just quick, I hate to say, just quickly. But you know,
we are in a time of an environment, Nathan. But
you know you touched on ADHD and things like that,
and you know we are well, we have more science
in terms of diagnosing people with whatever particular way they're white,
their minds are wired. Is there a point where I mean,
(34:31):
there are various levels of ADHD, I guess, should everyone
be diagnosed if they've got it? Or is there a
point where it's it's not helpful because I remember reading
something we're hearing someone talking about it that if it
becomes a way of defining yourself, it's not helpful.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Yeah, I mean, there's going to be there's no real
answer to that. There's going to be a whole spectrum
of answers to it. You know, there's always been people
that have a genetic predisposition of something that we now
called ADHD. Even when I was a kid, that was
called hyperactivity. It wasn't called AD but it wasn't called that,
and it was an adult. For all of primary school
it was called hyperactivity. For all of the early childhood,
it was called being a little shit, but it was
(35:13):
the same. It was the famed personality it was and
there's always been people that have you know, they're on
their spectrum. But if they're grow up and nurturing, loving
environments where you know, a lot of that will not
go to the surface. So, you know, I think that
if the child uses ADHD as an excuse to not
be accountable for their behavior and not play attention, and
(35:34):
it can be a negative thing. But that's not what
happened most of the time. Most of the stories I
hear are people are having trouble focusing their attention.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Which is a big thing.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
It's not you know, it's been erratic and all over
the show, and you can't achieve anything at school. You
can't really access that frontal cortex. You're really inhibited. So
there's not just medication, because you know there's meditation.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
There's lots of different approaches.
Speaker 5 (35:56):
But yeah, I think I'm understanding that maybe you know
that you are a little different, and the relief of
knowing that there is a reason itself.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
Yeah, I was just curious with my ADHD. I just
think it's just I don't think it's a disorder. I
think it's just my personality and that's the way they
want to classify it. Yeah, but I don't think there's
anything wrong. It just means this is the way I operate,
which is not compliant and do as I'm told. You
don't want all human beings to be compliant and digitil so.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Very well behaved today, Nathan. Hey, by the way, for years,
have you got a title for these books that are
coming out?
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I still working on that.
Speaker 1 (36:38):
I think I'm gonna I think I'm gonna call one
of them dance speak, because I'm just sort of trying
to be blunt, and so if I start call it
dance speak, you know mums can read it as well.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
But that's an excuse to be blunt and not have
to be too warm on cluffe right, dads want to blunt.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
I like.
Speaker 5 (36:52):
The sound of it already. Well it's good, Susan got
that out of you. You've got three books on the way,
so why why why one when three will do?
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Uh?
Speaker 4 (37:01):
Hey, mate, thanks so much for your time this afternoon.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Cheers, m good you two.
Speaker 5 (37:06):
That is Nathan Wallace and we'll be keeping our eye
up for that bill, whyon't we anyway, We'll be back
to rap Sport with Christopher Eve in just a moment.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
It's coming up to ten to six for more from
the Weekend Collective. Listen live to news Talk zed Be
weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News TALKSB.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Told me.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
I want to see.
Speaker 4 (00:27):
Let's welcome back. Were welcome into the Weekend Collective. This
is the Parents Squad.
Speaker 5 (00:30):
By the way, if you missed any of our previous hours,
we had a Pete Wolf camp and I are in
Gardner on for our panel. You can go check that
out on our website. Look news Talk, said B. Just
look for the Weekend Collective on iHeartRadio and likewise interesting
chat with de Wi Roberts are just about the art
of negotiation and a few good stories there for the
for the one roof radio show. Anyway, right now, as
I say, it's the Parents Squad and joining me is
(00:54):
season euro Science Educator. It's a name that's known to
many many Kiwis or many of many parents around the country.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Nathan Wallace today, Yes you too.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
It looks I.
Speaker 5 (01:07):
Don't know if we're on a zoom meeting you and
I and it looks like is it about foggy out
the back there through your window instead of sitting an
artwork or something.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
No, it's an illusion. It's an illusion. It's a that's
a picture rather than an actual window window.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
It has confused me.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
When you come on, you look like a young Jeene Hackman. Ah, yeah,
that's what Zoom is doing today.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
I have had that one before.
Speaker 5 (01:36):
I think I will go with that someone you know, Yeah, yeah,
the late Jean Heckman. Actually, now I think of it,
isn't that that's right? Because that's why I died recently.
Sitting in a few days apart from his wife was
very mysterious.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Yeah, he has avent sure, I think, and his wife
died and if he wandered around for a week, oh gosh,
had the capacity of.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Like a twelve month old so and then he died.
Speaker 4 (01:58):
Yeah, it was pretty good. I'm actually gosh.
Speaker 5 (02:01):
Hey, we now, we'd love to hear from you if
you've any questions or some stories you'd like to share
on with dealing with meltdowns with your kids. I know
eight one hundred eighty ten eighty or text nine two
nine two. And look, I don't share too much about
my own kids for their own privacy sake, but obviously
every child that's ever ever been well has the capacity
(02:26):
to have the meltdown and be unreasonable, no matter no
matter how wonderful they are in every other aspect of
their lives. But some of it's tied with anxiety. Some
of it's just tied with pubany kids asserting their independence.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yep, some of it's completely natural.
Speaker 5 (02:43):
Yeah, let's start on the anxiety side of things, because.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
It seems to be a word that packs up all
the time, doesn't it? Know, Nathan that I.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Mean, I often do tell stories about my kids, but
the way I get around the privacy issues, I don't
mention which kid it is. It's pretty hard to do this,
you know, like I say a child, So that's not
saying which one it is because it's I'm hard to
do it without you know, pulling on your own experience.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
Well so, yeah, I mean, but okay, just on the
anxiety side of things, how how are we doing with
kids in anxiety?
Speaker 4 (03:17):
Has this generation of kids got more anxiety? And why
is it? Or are we just more aware?
Speaker 1 (03:23):
I mean skyrocketing amounts, you know, hundreds of percent, like
three hundred percent more so it's absolutely there. Are they
pre wired for anxiety? Yes they are, but so were we.
Everybody's pre wide for anxiety. You have to sort of
it's like that's the default mode, and then you've got
to have all these sort of layers on top of
it to calm you down your survival as the prime director.
So that's about being anxious. So then you have all
(03:45):
your needs met and and you calm that. So, I mean,
what I'm saying is that there's no different biology with
these kids. And you know, because generally take thousands of
years to change, so they've got the same genetic predisposition
as us, but they face a very different world. You know,
Like in the space of thirty years, we've gone from
having mainly one parent was a home for the first
(04:09):
five years of life, eighty percent of people lived. Eighty
percent of people lived in the same community as their
extended family, so that there was aunties and grandparents. Grandmothers
didn't work thirty years ago, so you know, we had
a full time grandparent kids. People tended to stay in
one area a whole lot. More so the kids on
knew each other in the neighborhood and the parents knew
each other, and the kids have fear fear of freedom.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Now now most kids are in a childcare center. Before
the age of one.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Only twenty percent of people live in the area of
their extended family. But I'm not trying to depress people
and make people feel guilty. It's just saying the reality is.
The reality is that the rapid change that they've gone through,
they've taken away to the village. They now we find
sixty kids into what used to be a backyard. And yeah,
it's just there's a lot of change for kids to
cope with. And I think it's natural that they get anxiety.
(04:54):
I mean it's added to things by people think it's
like PlayStation and Facebook, and certainly screens and social media
do play a part in that. But I think if
we had I had taken away our grandmothers and you know,
extended family and most of us had in our home
here and until we were like you know, out of
high school. Yeah, yeah, you can't really underestimate how much
(05:15):
those things really add to resilience. I mean, it's not
all doing with Glennoi. There are things we can do
to compensate that. Yeah, this generator of kids are amazing.
Part of that having anxiety is there actually a little
bit more emotional intelligent than we were. They so they
labeled their emotionals. You know, that's what's not all of it,
but some of us there I'm a labeling.
Speaker 5 (05:35):
I'm almost relieved that the conversation hasn't gone straight to
social media and devices and things, because I mean, look,
we've got plenty of problems with addictions to devices.
Speaker 4 (05:47):
But I look at it. Look, I look at my kids,
and look what.
Speaker 5 (05:51):
They don't have Facebook accounts yet they're twelve and forteen
years old. There's no Facebook, there's no Instagram. But I look,
but I look at the way that they and you
know we I've got a limit on our youngest one's time.
I don't know how we managed the older one because
she's on an Apple. I can't control our Apple. That
that's another topical drives me nuts. I low the apple.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
But I noticed that.
Speaker 5 (06:12):
The way that they communicate with their friends using WhatsApp,
I actually am not okay. They're not on TikTok either, Okay,
but I know they just seem to use those those
methods of communicating with their friends in a way that
doesn't actually bother me as much as they seem to
(06:33):
be coping with it.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
Better surprise me, you know.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
Because it's told me that they've come from a house
where you've moderated their screen time.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
They haven't just been free for all. So they've learned those.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
Other things you do when you're not on a screen,
communication skills and stuff. So half of it will be
that you've raised responsible kids that have got boundaries around
their stuff alreally, so they're already using it with boundaries,
And the other.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Half will be that that's the stuff they're letting you see.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
You know, if they really hit full time access to
them run it all the time, and the reality is
they do start delving into your so they wouldn't want
us to see oftentimes.
Speaker 5 (07:08):
Well, I mean I sometimes wonder whether it's the older
generation have had problems with addictions to computers and stuff
because we grew up without it and all of a sudden,
I mean, anyone can get addicted to this ste but
that's getting away from it.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Really, it's all about how it underwarks the sense of reality.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
Like the issue was social media, like you know that
in their research, the issue is with comparison to others
and not knowing the difference between reality and what they
see online. They're forming their vision of reality with what
they're seeing online and that's making up their normal. And
so interestingly, all we have to do is have a
conversation with them as parents. That's that's that you know,
(07:45):
like if you say to your kids, you know, social
media pictures adopted, that's say, you know, people put forward
their best foot, they want their lives to look better
than other people's.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
That's not what real people look like.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
That's taking one hundred four days and put that one ahead,
just letting them know.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
It's the same with pornography. If the parents have a
conversation so you realize that pornography, that's not what real
sex is.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Like, women don't really do that.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
That's you know, made by men. As long as you
have the conversation that tells them is different and it's
not real, it seems really you need to do. It's
the parents that don't talk about it and assume their
kids aren't doing it or avoid the conversation that those
kids get a warped perception of reality and they do
start to believe it's real. And that's what causes the anxiety.
You know, the comparison to others and there's warp sense
(08:28):
of reality.
Speaker 5 (08:30):
So on the anxiety thing there'll be, I mean, it
crops up. Sometimes we look at what previous generations have
gone through in terms of trauma. I mean, I guess
my generation grew up thinking that we're all going to
die in a nuclear explosion. It comes small circle. I mean,
obviously we people will say, well, you know, people went
(08:52):
through the Blitz and kids were sent away from London
and stuff like that. But I sometimes wonder if what
what's missing from those comparisons, as the acknowledgment actually kids
were deeply traumatized by the stuff they went through.
Speaker 4 (09:05):
As if we survived, we did all right. I'm not
sure by that.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Yeah, I mean I said that these generation has got better,
These generation has got more emotionally intelligent, more articulate, you know.
So I think the change is every generation. You see
the teenagers, you know, like there's bloody hieroglyphics on the
side of the pyramids dated seven thousand years old to
say this generation it's going to ruined civilization because they're
also maybe you know, and it's just really what old
(09:32):
people have seen are getting a time they see the
new generation. There's lots of real when you look at
the statistics, there's lots of very positive things about this generation.
You know, there's certainly been more much you know, they
they smoke less cigarettes, they do less drugs, they delay sex,
they rag school, less. They just made every measure of
you know, delinquent behavior. They do much better than previous generations.
(09:52):
It's actually my generation Generation X, you know, anyone sort
of forty five to sixty.
Speaker 4 (09:57):
We've got the.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
Crap the rules, and they had to comped all the
sex and drunk or the alcohol. So I mean, that's
the reality of just the statistics. But you know that
these kids are I think part of it is like
I said before, that they are more emotionally intelligent, you know,
so they will say this was how I'm feeling, whereas
we were in a courage to say how we were feeling.
You know, when my daughter said to me, when one
(10:21):
of my daughters, there's me and my daughters said to me,
I've got anxiety, I like a normal generational experient, thought
inside my head of bullshit, what do you got to
have anxiety for a sweet, cruisy life? And well, I
knew not to say that out loud, you know, yeah,
(10:43):
I tell if your parenting courses. I knew not to
say it, but in my head I thought not, but
I know, not to discount their feelings. And it cut
a long story short. I actually ended up coming full
circle and realizing, oh, what she describes as anxiety. If
I just described as normal getting ready for the worst thing.
So basically I realized, well, I have anxiety. But I
(11:03):
was a generation that thought to say, don't say you've
got anxiety. It's a weakness. To say you've got something negative,
it's a it is manifesting it. Whereas actually, what I
learned is that when you say you've got anxiety and
you start to do things about it, like I started yoga,
and yeah, things have been so much better since then.
I'm glad that identified it. It wasn't a weakness after all.
It was a strength. And I think this generation is
(11:24):
doing that. So we might see them as weaker because
they're not hardening out, but you know, brand probably they're
not as hard in some ways as the people that
grow up in the depression, But in many ways they're
harder because they, again, to grow up in the depression,
usually have family around them. And you might have had
all that hard stuff going on, but the family is
the number one thing. It's pull I love for you,
it's your connection. That's what it's all about being a human.
(11:46):
What's the point hitting an Xbox I PlayStation in a
flash house? So you know, when both parents a work.
By the time you're won and you're day. Look, word,
you probably around your extend of family and you're quite isolated.
Speaker 5 (11:55):
Yeah, so when you think of I mean, that's touched
on a bunch of things for me because I think
actually these days that we're surrounded by connect with people
in a way with social media and technology, and yet
I think that I think that we, many of us
are lonelier than we've ever been in a way because
the lack of genuine human connection. And are kids So okay,
(12:22):
if we wind it back to what we first talked
about that you know, the fact that there's only you know,
we used to have one parent at home. You know,
when we got home from school, Mum or dad was home.
Let's be honest, it's mostly mum.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
How Look, life is the way it is.
Speaker 5 (12:37):
We now need to incomes generally to begin to afford house.
So we're not winding that back. How what can we do?
Speaker 1 (12:47):
It's difficult to hear that stuff because parents are still
guilty and go oh you know, and they have that
defensive reactional I can't help, but my mind's not to
make them feel bad about it, because you're right, even
we can't do anything about it.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
That's the society that we live in.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
It's just acknowledging it so that we know that there's
anything wrong with our kids.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
They're not particularly weak. They're not a bunch of us.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
It is understandable, you know what they're going through. And
then the next question is, well, how do we compensate
for that, because you any regeneration has to and there
are clear ways of the literature that you can compensate
for that.
Speaker 4 (13:16):
Are okay, give us a clue.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
We basically that everything's so rushed now. The opposite to
being rush to slow everything down. The way your brain works.
The faster you are, the more your stress brain is
aroused to get the frontal cortext, the you know, the
really good brain that's got all the flash stuff out
like empathy and controlling your emotions and higher thought and
all the good stuff. To get that, you've got to
slow down. And so basically that's why meditation is such
(13:40):
a big thing. You know, A mindfulness and schools are
such a big topics. You know, look, thirty years ago,
if you mentioned mindfulness just sounded like a hippie. You know,
it didn't really have anything to do it academic learning,
whereas now we understand that basically you think of your
survival brain as being on a set of scales, you know,
an old fashion set of scales with your learning brain,
you know the front of cortex and your brain's set.
(14:02):
So your survival brain do on a set of scales.
It's the survival brain's aroused. Then you're not going to
get access to their cortex. It's got all the good
stuff and the ability to control your emotions and you know,
all the adult things. So you know, we're basically living
in a state that's arousing our brains see all the
time when you add social media and screens and the
rapid rate of information and change. So by doing something ritualize,
(14:23):
like any sort of form of mindfulness where you stop
and consciously slow down your breath and slow down and
bring yourself into the present moment, really that's a bigger
that's a big answer to mental illness because you know,
to be less simplistic, anxiety is worrying about the future,
depression is worrying about the past, and mindfulness as being
in the present moment. So if you learn to be
(14:45):
in the present moment, you can normally handle any problems
here right now. It's worrying about future problems or overthinking
past ones. So the practice of bringing yourself into a mindfulness,
say of bringing the present moment, sets you up for
good mental health the rest of your life and helps
to compensate for the fact that you're living in such
a world of rapid change.
Speaker 5 (15:03):
Because I think I've found that because of the hours
I do, I'm lucky that I actually am around when
my kids get home. I'll pack them up and things
like that. But the thing that I think was probably
the worst, well not the worst thing, but when I now,
I don't try and do any work if I fucking
avoid it. I make sure that I'm not doing any
work when they get home, because otherwise I'm fifty percent present,
(15:26):
you know, and then they stress, and then you're irritated
because hang on, I just need to do that.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Yeah, I've been there, Yes, having good boundaries around that day. Right,
this is my work time, and I might have to say, right, kids,
our dad's going to do this ray, but I'm going
to be finished at six o'clock and then I'll be
available for an hour and we'll do what you want
to do. I mean, so much of It is about
the type of play that you have with your kids too.
If you let your kids be in charge of the play,
you know, ten minutes of them being in charge, it's
(15:52):
worth two hours of us playing with us, making the
rules and telling them what to do. So it's about
playing well as well use your time.
Speaker 5 (16:01):
It's interesting you're talking about the meditation thing because the
school that my girls go to to a Catholic school.
But this I think it's at the start of the
day or at some stage they have five minutes. I
can't remember the name for it. Somebody who's listening for
they were Bearandeine because I haven't kept it secret. They baridine,
but I can't remember what they call it. But it's
five minutes where it's just quiet time to think about
(16:21):
what they've got to do with their day. And that
I thought, gosh, that sounds really like genius. I think
they there yere.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
I mean in lots of ways, Catholic schools have been
doing mindfulness forever because they've always started the day with
career ands, and that repetitive nature sort of does the
same thing as a mindfulness exercise. It brings you into
that present moment, It ritualizes you into that environment.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
And kind of cop up of NATI schools have always.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Started with you know, fucker tokey and and mehi and stuff,
and that that's the same ritualized things we would start
with our news when I was at my little country school.
That they are the same ritualized routine sort of acts
as us fall and mindfulness. So to sing it because
singing generally flowers down that whole internal you know, especially
the songs that make you sing a score.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
So you yeah.
Speaker 5 (17:10):
I'm making a couple of notes to myself as you're
talking about this actually just but anyway, Hey, look, we'd
love your cause if you've got any questions for Nathan
Wallace and neuroscience educator on you know, if your kids
are a little stressed or anxious, or you're worrying about
how you're handling the whole thing, give us a call
if you've got any suggestions as well on how you
because we want to touch on the meltdown thing before
we this hour as well. It is twenty four past
(17:34):
five News Talks. It'd be the number of OZ eight
hundred and eighty ten eighty text nine to nine two
back in just to take.
Speaker 6 (17:39):
It'll lie nice to meet you to night, you eat,
you go des get up a fussy esities life river song,
You're together.
Speaker 5 (17:52):
Then let's welcome back or welcome into the parents squad.
There's the week in collective Hunton Beverage. And my guest
is Nathan Wallace is a neuroscience educator. Hey, by the way,
when I give a job description, I say neuroscience educator,
there will be people going, what is a neuroscience educator
at Nathan?
Speaker 1 (18:08):
Yeah, Well I'm neuroscience. It's just how your brain works,
and so it's really educating people about how your brain works.
When really I'm a human developmentalist. That's my area of
you know, sort of election in a university, human development.
It's just that that's where neuroscience landed when at first
They have their own department now, but they landed under
human development when a first, because I was in the
department of cognition, so come under me, and I was
(18:29):
ended up being a lead trainer for a neuroscience organization.
But really it's about wrapping together all of the you know,
I'm been a primary school teacher and an early childhood teacher,
and I spent most of my years working in child
therapy so it's really bringing it all to you, you know.
And I've been a foster parent and I was foster
at myself, So it's really coming from lots of different
angles of just understanding how to put that research, especially
(18:51):
from neuroscience and how the brain works and practice to
my parenting better and easier and better outcomes when.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
It comes to the meltdowns, and look, that can come
from a bunch of reasons, and as long as I
don't end up having a meltdown on my own, because
that's the thing as a parent sometimes you can just
get bloody annoyed.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
I was going to push about buttons more.
Speaker 5 (19:14):
I think my favorite technique though I remember there was
there was a meltdown going on. There might have been
been in a couple of meltdowns going on, and I actually,
in fact it ended up turning into they think they
ended up laughing, but there was it was a serious meltdown,
and I said, right, that's that, I'm going off. I'm
taking myself off to my room and remove myself because
actually I really did need to smart. God I'm bloody annoyed, right.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah, yeah, that's a really smart thing to do, you know,
because I'm that's when you don't do that and you
stay and you're parenting from your own emotional state. You're basically,
you know, parenting from your own to your old self,
and that's not going to help.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
So I think it was a smart move to it. Right,
I'm going to a room.
Speaker 5 (19:53):
Oh good, good, because because there's that sort of I mean,
you've been through it as a parent. I guess other
times when you want to say, hey, listen, excuse me,
what did you just say? And you challenge them on something.
But there's a point where I'm trying to you know,
I like to think I'm quite good at it, but
I'm probably lousy at it of thinking, okay, tell you what,
(20:14):
I'm just going to ignore, you know, I don't know,
take my I want to use a really unpleasant analogy. Yeah,
but just take your foot off of someone's throat. Just
don't be pushing them on every bit of bad behavior.
There's a point where you sort of have to is
there a sort of point where you're going to step
(20:36):
away and go, okay, we're going to address this before
the end of the day is out, but now is
not the time.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Oh. I think that's really smart there, and you do
have to monitor that thing about how negative you've been,
because you know, at the end of the day you
have said eighty percent negative things to them and only
twenty percent positive, and of course you're not going to
have a good relationship and you're not going to have
good behavior. So it has been being aware of not
being on their case all the time. It's so much
easier to to point out the things that they're doing well.
(21:01):
And that sounds a bit soft, but you know, the
research shows and over again that if they keep slamming
the lounge door and you keep saying, don't stand the door,
don't stand the door, and they keep slamming the door,
whereas when they close it and nice to go, oh,
thank you for showing the door, knights and quietly, that
really does increase the behavior whole lot more So I.
Speaker 4 (21:20):
Try sarcastic when you say it, Yeah, I know, but
I will.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Find sounds like cast I mean, telling them what to
do instead of what not to do is actually way
more effective of getting them to do what you want anyway,
So you do, you know, and there's it's a way
of avoiding being negative, but it isn't It is a dance,
isn't it like you know about when do you do that?
When do you challenge? I think what you said about
how you'll you know, you'll think about it and come
back to it later, because I'm often thinking is it
(21:46):
a pattern?
Speaker 2 (21:47):
I don't need to get on top of everything?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
If the kids just if it's a one off, maybe
I can just let a slide because of you know,
but I can calm down later and I'm not reacting
from my emotions and think is there something I want
to address with them? And how do I want to
address it? There's way more chance that you'll be in
your own front for quarter by then too, because you're
not responding emotionally to the moment. I think I'm in
the moment. That's when we we respond with our thinking,
(22:12):
just respond from our own emotions. That's often when you
hear your own mother orther's voice come sailing out the
amount and it's not really often your best parenting. So
if you can stepping away from it and thinking about
it and just taking a second to calm down, well
you going to your own well take that lot.
Speaker 5 (22:27):
That probably paints me in a better light than I
deserve at times at appearent because there are times when
it's just like this, you know, the basic things you
keep on saying, can you just take put your dishes
in the rusher?
Speaker 4 (22:36):
Or do this or this and and after aways. So God,
I'm sick of saying this.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
And you have bad days as well, like every parent does.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
This reality. We're sometimes grouchy and snappy and were you know,
sound my parents from the eighteen forties. But it's what
you do most of the time that matters. Really, you know,
we are human as well, So I think, don't beat
ourselves up about not doing the perfect parenting all the time.
Speaker 4 (22:59):
Well, I guess as long as you're.
Speaker 5 (23:00):
Trying if you slip into that and their parents who
have you know who find that they're constantly correcting their
kids because they're you know, their kids are not picking
up on But how resilientire kids when it comes to
because I would imagine they just tune out in the end,
don't they, Or.
Speaker 4 (23:14):
If you're constantly on their back for things.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
I mean, it does depend on the context.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
So if you've got a parent that has always criticizing
you and doesn't display any love, doesn't seem proud of you,
it has usually serious consequences for it. For who you are.
But this is a parent that is loving and spends
time with them and tells them that they love them.
And then there's also a bit critical, and that's a
very different thing. They just learned to think, God, that's
you know, daddy is just a bit critical. So it's
not really the criticism. It's more that does the criticism
(23:42):
come on top of a loving relationship, because if it does,
then you're probably fine. Yeah, it becomes instead of a
loving relationship. And they just find our dad to be
critical and distant, then that is a problem.
Speaker 5 (23:51):
So if they know that dads and they call Mum
or Dad are in their corner, then you've got a
bit more of it. They can tolerate a bit more
corrective advice.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Yeah, And I think when we do lose it, I
mean I would just make sure I would own it
with my kids, and I had no worries about apologizing.
You know, when I swore at them or something and
lost my rag and you know, it wasn't a good parenting.
It was my parents, you know, coming out of my mouth.
I'd come back into the rum afterwards and go, oh, well,
clearly I lost it. There was that was on me.
Speaker 5 (24:21):
I actually think that that's a major because there are
some parents who would never want to admit they're wrong,
and that to me, that's look, I'm.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Not as you do, not as you say. What you know,
if you want kids to admit that they're wrong, you
know you have they're to see you doing that, and
sometimes you clearly are wrong. When you're just sworn at
your kids, it's hard to justify that as being, you know,
a good parenting strategy. So I think it's a strength
when they become what we call about we're talking about
in the literature is rupture and repair as the academic stuff,
(24:49):
which is rupture as when you're leashi of shit. Repare
is when you go back and do something to fix it.
And as kids have rupture and repair, rupture and repair,
those kids are have to be emotionally intelligent and resilient
and the good outcomes the kauds they up go to
jail and mental illness and addiction and stuff are the
ones that have rupture, rupture, rupture.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
So that repair part is a really important part of it.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
You know, to go in and say you don't have
to fix it what happened, It might just be you know,
like I said, going in and saying, oh, well, I
lost the plot.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
Then see if I hate the idea that we ever
compile a list of advice, But if you were going
to put a list of things about how to avoid,
you know, kids having anxiety and resentment and things like that,
I would have put that just about at the top one.
It was that because if you there's saying admitting when
mum or dad is wrong, I got that wrong. Sorry
about that, honey, I love you.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Yeah, absolutely, Yeah. Parents are worried that they're geting away
some sort of power, but you're not. I think you're
actually increasing your power in many ways because you're having
a sort of relationship. I'm showing the kids what to
do when they If you want your kids to your
front up and say and repair what they've damaged, because
they will damage things, they will have mountdowns their children.
Is heart break down a child.
Speaker 4 (25:58):
You know we have?
Speaker 1 (25:59):
I mean it is we have.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
I mean we've still got our child brain.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
You have your limbic system, your emotional brain for the
rest of your So I think you've always got that
two year old and they're ready to have a set
or to that and that too year old, that o
limbic system doesn't care about the future. It only cares
about right now, and it doesn't care about consequences, or
it doesn't even think. It only cares about feeling. He's
about feeling, and it feels about what feels good right now.
(26:23):
It's just that we have a frontal cortex that regulates
that behavior and thinks about consequences and thinks about impact
on other people. Whereas being a child, that Olympic system
is just on full rant without the you know, it's
like the exhilarators on four with the no brains. It is.
Speaker 4 (26:38):
I'm almost relieved to hear you say that. Actually, Nathan,
thank you for that. Let's take some calls Ruth, Hello,
Hi there, how's it going good things?
Speaker 7 (26:49):
Yeah, my son has recently been knocked out playing rugby
and it's quite early days, but I was warned that
one of one of the symptoms could be that he
has an inability to cope with normal every day to
day situation, just gets more easily overwhelmed and that can
(27:13):
end up in irritability or maybe even a meltdown. And
he's he's not normally susceptible to meltdown. So I'm just
wondering how I'm going to cope with that.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
Right.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Has he had a mountdown so he's had a head
of hendry at Rugby and now you're worried about him
being concussed, that's right?
Speaker 4 (27:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
And has he displayed those behaviors yet or are you
just sort of worried about.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Them likely to come.
Speaker 7 (27:40):
At the moment. It's only run on day three, so right,
we just we're hoping that we can manage it. And
but at the moment, he's at home resting, so we
have actually hasn't had to deal with a normal school
day yet in normal traveling group environments. For the over stimulation,
(28:02):
we've basically just tried to keep the stimulation really low
a few days.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
Oh, that's really wise.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
I mean, I think you're going to be fine because
you're acknowledging what's happening, and you know that he's going
to be easily overwhelmed. So you are having a low
stimulus environment, and I think you're ready for it. You know,
if he does lose the plot over you cooking and
the wrong thing for Tea, you're not going to make
a drama about it because you're going to understand that
his brain stressed and so he's more likely to fall
into that emotional brain all the time. So I think
(28:29):
just the fact that you're even ringing, the fact that
you've taken him off school, and the fact that you're
thinking about how to cope with that, means that he's
going to be fine because you know what to expect.
Speaker 7 (28:39):
Right, Oh, that's good news.
Speaker 4 (28:40):
How old is he Rose? Did you say?
Speaker 7 (28:43):
He's just about seventeen?
Speaker 2 (28:46):
Okay, Yeah, it's so susceptible to you telling him.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
Like you know, people are a combination of the stories
that they hold about themselves, and so you know what
I'm saying is if you tell him, if he does, say,
lose the plot and has an emotional meltdown, when you
come back to him and say something like, oh look mate,
I'm not worrying about this. I think your brains under
a long streets. It's about a concussion. Usually you're such
a polite, respectful, you know young man, and you're always
(29:12):
so considerate of other people that this was out a character.
So you know, I think it's just down to the
head injury. Then you have a kid that thinks yeah, yeah, yeah,
they will be here you tell them. Yeah, So when
you tell the point out that No, you're normally so
you know, respectful, and then that's who they will be
because that's who you're telling them they are.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
So it's when they do just play that behavior. Yeah,
don't make it sound like the normal.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
I mean you're not going to. But just for other pearents,
you know, don't.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
Be Oh, you're always like this, and you're always so
arrogant and you're always so you know, actually they will
always be so arrogant.
Speaker 1 (29:45):
It's always will be so agg today.
Speaker 7 (29:47):
M Well, they are teenagers. You've got to give them that.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
Yeah, yeah, that's right way around it.
Speaker 4 (29:52):
Good on your ruth. Thank you for your call. Thank
you very much.
Speaker 5 (29:57):
Actually it's funny, you know, and that there's the I
mean as a reminder as well. I think if you
realize what your kids have gone through with their day
and they're feeling about lousy and you, it does if
you can understand why they're feeling like that to me,
I mean, it's actually with any relationship, you know that
all of a sudden, it's like, actually, there's a reason
this person's baying like that because they're feeling X, Y
(30:18):
and Z. Mind you I mean, you know, not that
we're all perfect in Saints all the time, but it
doesn't hurt.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Yeah, And sometimes we are just annoying adhd as A
can't remember just being annoying, just wanting to be annoying,
you know, I start annoyed, so the more everyone else
to be annoyed as well. Sometimes sometimes there's shit.
Speaker 5 (30:41):
I love that you knew you were doing it. It's like, anyway,
we could I quick break. We'll be back with Nathan
Wallace in a moment. If you'd like to give us
a call. We'd love to hear from your eight hundred
and eighty ten eighty dealing with meltdowns and anxiety, twenty
six news talks.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
You'd be that's welcome back to the Weekend Collector.
Speaker 5 (31:03):
This the Parents Squad as the Stings is raising your child,
but I think sometimes we're raising parents as well at
the same time.
Speaker 4 (31:08):
And let's take some more calls. So is it hello?
Speaker 3 (31:11):
Hi there?
Speaker 4 (31:12):
What was the name of Nathan Nathan Wallace?
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Wallace? Have you written a book, Nathan.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Yeah, that hasn't been published yet, so they should come
out on each year. I've got about three different books
for publishers.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Wow, wonderful news flash.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
Well, I'm much more of a talker than I'm a writer,
so it's taken me a long time to get around
to write the box, but it's finally happened.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
You got to scoop out of them.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Are you going to be in the line to buy one?
Speaker 1 (31:38):
There? Is it?
Speaker 3 (31:40):
Well, I'm going to make great gifts. Wouldn't they.
Speaker 4 (31:47):
Excellent? Is that what you're just calling forward? See if
he's got a book?
Speaker 1 (31:50):
No?
Speaker 4 (31:50):
No, no, no, no no.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
Now that's scenario you explained where the parenting is their
bad and the children getting collected or criticized and there
never any love and perfection or no communication, et cetera.
Well that was what my childhood was like, and so
(32:16):
I've studied it quite a lot because it's very analytical.
So now once the horse has bolted, the results of
this is all kinds of different outcomes like anorexia, drug addiction, smoking, alcohol.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
All those risks.
Speaker 4 (32:41):
How did you deal with this?
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Is it?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Well?
Speaker 3 (32:44):
Just let me finish. So if these things are happening
to your child, then they're going to at some point
hopefully reach out for help. Because she hit the wall.
And so for me, I turned to Christian to the church. Yeah,
(33:07):
that's the enormous healing and support.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
I think you have the nail right in the head.
You know, it is about getting that support, isn't it.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
It's about our community else. Yeah, those negative experiences, and
you need positive experiences as well because a lot of
you when when a child grows up with that sort
of negative environment, they might have parents that aren't providing that,
but the fact that all they need is like one
grandparent to someone that does provide value.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
For them, and that can find really foster resilience.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
It's when the child's got no one at all the
values them that's really at least that all those negative
outcometry talking about.
Speaker 5 (33:43):
And it just tells one person, doesn't it who they
have that connection with it that can make called.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
That's right, just one person that makes them feel valued
and and you know worthy then and it validates there
as a person. And this really helps them to grow
that frontal cortex, whereas if they're just proved as bad
all the time, they don't, so they are set to
put all those rusks. The last guest was talking about
addiction and soological problems.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
Thanks for your course, is that?
Speaker 5 (34:08):
Sorry, we've got times running a bit short now, but
just quick, I hate to say, just quickly. But you know,
we are in a time of an environment, Nathan. But
you know you touched on ADHD and things like that,
and you know we are well, we have more science
in terms of diagnosing people with whatever particular way they're white,
their minds are wired. Is there a point where I mean,
(34:31):
there are various levels of ADHD, I guess, should everyone
be diagnosed if they've got it? Or is there a
point where it's it's not helpful because I remember reading
something we're hearing someone talking about it that if it
becomes a way of defining yourself, it's not helpful.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
Yeah, I mean, there's going to be there's no real
answer to that. There's going to be a whole spectrum
of answers to it. You know, there's always been people
that have a genetic predisposition of something that we now
called ADHD. Even when I was a kid, that was
called hyperactivity. It wasn't called AD but it wasn't called that,
and it was an adult. For all of primary school
it was called hyperactivity. For all of the early childhood,
it was called being a little shit, but it was
(35:13):
the same. It was the famed personality it was and
there's always been people that have you know, they're on
their spectrum. But if they're grow up and nurturing, loving
environments where you know, a lot of that will not
go to the surface. So, you know, I think that
if the child uses ADHD as an excuse to not
be accountable for their behavior and not play attention, and
(35:34):
it can be a negative thing. But that's not what
happened most of the time. Most of the stories I
hear are people are having trouble focusing their attention.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Which is a big thing.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
It's not you know, it's been erratic and all over
the show, and you can't achieve anything at school. You
can't really access that frontal cortex. You're really inhibited. So
there's not just medication, because you know there's meditation.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
There's lots of different approaches.
Speaker 5 (35:56):
But yeah, I think I'm understanding that maybe you know
that you are a little different, and the relief of
knowing that there is a reason itself.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
Yeah, I was just curious with my ADHD. I just
think it's just I don't think it's a disorder. I
think it's just my personality and that's the way they
want to classify it. Yeah, but I don't think there's
anything wrong. It just means this is the way I operate,
which is not compliant and do as I'm told. You
don't want all human beings to be compliant and digitil so.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Very well behaved today, Nathan. Hey, by the way, for years,
have you got a title for these books that are
coming out?
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I still working on that.
Speaker 1 (36:38):
I think I'm gonna I think I'm gonna call one
of them dance speak, because I'm just sort of trying
to be blunt, and so if I start call it
dance speak, you know mums can read it as well.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
But that's an excuse to be blunt and not have
to be too warm on cluffe right, dads want to blunt.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
I like.
Speaker 5 (36:52):
The sound of it already. Well it's good, Susan got
that out of you. You've got three books on the way,
so why why why one when three will do?
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Uh?
Speaker 4 (37:01):
Hey, mate, thanks so much for your time this afternoon.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Cheers, m good you two.
Speaker 5 (37:06):
That is Nathan Wallace and we'll be keeping our eye
up for that bill, whyon't we anyway, We'll be back
to rap Sport with Christopher Eve in just a moment.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
It's coming up to ten to six for more from
the Weekend Collective. Listen live to news Talk zed Be
weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
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