Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
O neighbor. Glad to have you here. Mariene Callahan, New
York Times bestselling golthor, kind enough to wait through that
long break and be here on the program with me.
I want to remind you also, don't forget my charity
golf event coming up. Eighth annual charity golf tournament coming
up Friday, September the sixth, benefiting my charity work in Africa,
building a great school for kids and vulnerable children. And
(00:24):
you can register to play or sponsor at rivers Promise
dot or in a couple more days to get in there
Riverspromise dot org and click the events tab and I'd
love to see you there my eighth annual charity golf event.
Love to have you there, Friday, September the sixth, coming up,
Just a couple of weeks away, all right, Mariene Callahan,
gracious enough to stick around. Her new book is is
a It is a jaw dropper, and it's called Ask
(00:48):
Not the Kennedy's and the Women They Destroyed. Marie Callahan,
New York Times bestselling author, is on the hotline. Mariene,
thanks for your patience. Let's dive back into this thing. Yeah,
I'm sitting here just in the break, I'm kind of
making a few notes, and you're talking about John F.
Kennedy womanizing on a boat in the Mediterranean when his
(01:09):
wife Jackie is giving steelworth to their first child. He's
out womanizing on a yacht. You're talking about he had
a young aid come in and give oral sex to
one of his aides and while he sat there and
watched him. We're talking. We're not talking a guy who
(01:30):
had like an affair and oh sorry, I messed up
one time. We're talking about not just a womanizer. This
is he's into the how debotress was John F. Kennedy Junior.
It wasn't just a little a steamy affair with Marilyn Monroe.
This is this is pornography stuff.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
I think this is so important, Jimmy, this point that
you have just touched upon. Imagine we learned that it's
sitting us President today had a nineteen year old intern
stuff in the White House and was flying her around
the country, forcing her to perform sex acts or serve
(02:08):
as a sex toy for him, because that's what he
did with Mimi. And there has been some criticism in
quarters that would be expected that this book is just
a rehashing of gossip and innuendo. Not so that is
a way historically to minimize women's stories. No less an
(02:31):
esteemed historian than Robert Dallak, who wrote an incredible jfk
biography called An Unfinished Life, said that Mimi's story was valid, credible,
and true, and that it deserved to be part of
JFK's biography and the way in which future historians evaluate him.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Well, Marien Callahan, I'm trying to think of a polite
way to ask, this was Jack Kennedy. It's almost like
he had some kind of a sexual addiction going on.
This wasn't just a It doesn't sound like he had
a lot of emotional connection to any of these people.
This wasn't like some affair of emotion. This was just
the guy was was he was a horn dog. I guess.
(03:18):
I mean, I don't know how to say that. I mean,
I'm just he just had a sexual addiction going on.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
It wasn't just that, though. I Mean, his psyche was
so complex and you'll see it. I really delve into
it in the book because the main question is always
why what compels someone to behave so cruelly and callously,
especially towards women. One of the things that really bonded Jackie,
who I believe was the only woman JFK ever really
(03:47):
took seriously intellectually and emotionally. They did have a deep bond.
They both had very, very difficult childhoods that were marked
by abuse, by parental abuse and neglect. JFK was a
very sick little boy. He almost died more than once
by the time he was two, and his mother and
(04:10):
father left him alone in hospitals all around this country
while he fought for his life. You know, his father
flying off to have affairs with movie stars, socialites, any
woman in his sight. His mother flying off, leaving her
children to go to Paris for the Catore, anything to
distract herself from the misery that her life was. And
(04:32):
so I think right there, in both the mother and
the father, you see the roots of this complete disdain
for the opposite sex for women. JFK, according to every
woman who ever slept with him, and there were many
famous women who talked about it, did not even like sex.
You know, he would go three minutes. There was no
(04:54):
fun or affection. Jackie even went to a doctor who
she took on as a confidant to ask him for
help in how she could improve her sex life with
her husband. This is while they were in the White House.
I mean, that's how desperate she was.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Well, the voice of Warrey in Callahan the book is
called asked Not at the Kennedy's and women they destroyed.
In the section about Marilyn Monroe, you talk about a
character Kennedy's brother in law, Peter Lawford, and how that
connection to Marilyn Monroe happened, and you used the phrase,
I find it interesting a psycho sexual dynamic for Maryland
(05:33):
that she found compelling. Talked about Lawford and Marilyn Monroe
and that whole relationship. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
So Lawford was married to JFK's sister, Patricia, and he
was a movie star at the time, like sort of
a B movie star, but he was the connect for
JFK and RFK to get to these Hollywood stars, these women,
and Marilyn Monroe was among them. Now she was involved
(06:02):
with Bobby Kennedy and Jack Kennedy at the same time,
and this goes to there was this real sort of
incestuous emotional sexual incestuousness within the Kennedy clan and the
siblings themselves, and many people close to the family remarked
(06:22):
upon this and a side note, and it's covered in
the book. After JFK's assassination, Jackie and Bobby began a
very lengthy affair and it would be, I think today,
considered a trauma bond, but nonetheless it was a little
bit creepy. So with Marilyn, the draw for her with
(06:46):
jack and Bobby was, you know, Marilynd too suffered a
very very abusive, neglectful childhood in which she was shunted
from Foster home to Foster home, molested by stepfathers. She
felt unwanted and unloved and more than anything, wanted to
be considered smart.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Well, I had never heard that Jackie and Bobby had
a trauma bond, if you will, I had never heard that,
but you talked about it in the book It's a bizarre,
crazy world. Let me ask you this, in their final
few moments together, what is it that, first of all,
caused Jackie to want to portray Camelot, which she knew
is a really dysfunctional thing. And why is it that
even people like Barbara Walters in the modern media still
(07:30):
want to protect Camelot. What are they afraid of?
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Here? Great double question? Very quickly. Jackie, I think, in
the aftermath, wanted to make sure that her husband's presidency,
which was not marked by high achievement, was remembered as substantial.
And she also wanted to memorialize their marriage, which many
in the press corps thought was transactional and that Jackie
(07:55):
was an idiot for not knowing what her husband was
up to. Not true. She knew that that marriage was
memorialized as a true love. As to why the media
today is still shying away, only they can answer, Only
they can answer. I personally think it's shameful. I think
we are all adults. We are well past the time
(08:17):
for a true reckoning with the Kennedy family. If we
can throw Harvey Weinstein in prison, and we can castigate
the likes of Bill Cosby and Bill Clinton what have you,
we are more than ready to deal with the monsters
within the Kennedy family.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Mariene Callahan, I really appreciate your time. The book is
available anywhere I find books are sold, and if they
don't sell it, they're not a fine bookseller. It's called
ask Not by Marreene Callahan everybody pick up a copy
of this thing. Marine. It's a pleasure. And congrats on
the book, and I look forward to conversing future.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Thanks Jimmy, me too.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
You got a Mariene Callahan New York Times bestseller. The
name of the book is called Ask Not. And I
thought I was familiar with the book already in the topic.
And I did not know until I read the extras
of the book that John F. Kennedy Junior almost crashed
his airplane into a commercial airline in American Airlines on
the night he crashed his plane. I also did not
(09:12):
know until just now that that trauma bond between Jackie
and Bobby they had a little Yeah, you got to
get the book. It's called Ask Not. The Kennedy's and
the women they destroyed. Everybody stand back. I got one
more segment of the Today's show Lakey on the radio
six hundred case col Jimmy Lakey to be precise. I'll
(09:34):
be back
O neighbor. Glad to have you here. Mariene Callahan, New
York Times bestselling golthor, kind enough to wait through that
long break and be here on the program with me.
I want to remind you also, don't forget my charity
golf event coming up. Eighth annual charity golf tournament coming
up Friday, September the sixth, benefiting my charity work in Africa,
building a great school for kids and vulnerable children. And
(00:24):
you can register to play or sponsor at rivers Promise
dot or in a couple more days to get in there
Riverspromise dot org and click the events tab and I'd
love to see you there my eighth annual charity golf event.
Love to have you there, Friday, September the sixth, coming up,
Just a couple of weeks away, all right, Mariene Callahan,
gracious enough to stick around. Her new book is is
a It is a jaw dropper, and it's called Ask
(00:48):
Not the Kennedy's and the Women They Destroyed. Marie Callahan,
New York Times bestselling author, is on the hotline. Mariene,
thanks for your patience. Let's dive back into this thing. Yeah,
I'm sitting here just in the break, I'm kind of
making a few notes, and you're talking about John F.
Kennedy womanizing on a boat in the Mediterranean when his
(01:09):
wife Jackie is giving steelworth to their first child. He's
out womanizing on a yacht. You're talking about he had
a young aid come in and give oral sex to
one of his aides and while he sat there and
watched him. We're talking. We're not talking a guy who
(01:30):
had like an affair and oh sorry, I messed up
one time. We're talking about not just a womanizer. This
is he's into the how debotress was John F. Kennedy Junior.
It wasn't just a little a steamy affair with Marilyn Monroe.
This is this is pornography stuff.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
I think this is so important, Jimmy, this point that
you have just touched upon. Imagine we learned that it's
sitting us President today had a nineteen year old intern
stuff in the White House and was flying her around
the country, forcing her to perform sex acts or serve
(02:08):
as a sex toy for him, because that's what he
did with Mimi. And there has been some criticism in
quarters that would be expected that this book is just
a rehashing of gossip and innuendo. Not so that is
a way historically to minimize women's stories. No less an
(02:31):
esteemed historian than Robert Dallak, who wrote an incredible jfk
biography called An Unfinished Life, said that Mimi's story was valid, credible,
and true, and that it deserved to be part of
JFK's biography and the way in which future historians evaluate him.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Well, Marien Callahan, I'm trying to think of a polite
way to ask, this was Jack Kennedy. It's almost like
he had some kind of a sexual addiction going on.
This wasn't just a It doesn't sound like he had
a lot of emotional connection to any of these people.
This wasn't like some affair of emotion. This was just
the guy was was he was a horn dog. I guess.
(03:18):
I mean, I don't know how to say that. I mean,
I'm just he just had a sexual addiction going on.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
It wasn't just that, though. I Mean, his psyche was
so complex and you'll see it. I really delve into
it in the book because the main question is always
why what compels someone to behave so cruelly and callously,
especially towards women. One of the things that really bonded Jackie,
who I believe was the only woman JFK ever really
(03:47):
took seriously intellectually and emotionally. They did have a deep bond.
They both had very, very difficult childhoods that were marked
by abuse, by parental abuse and neglect. JFK was a
very sick little boy. He almost died more than once
by the time he was two, and his mother and
(04:10):
father left him alone in hospitals all around this country
while he fought for his life. You know, his father
flying off to have affairs with movie stars, socialites, any
woman in his sight. His mother flying off, leaving her
children to go to Paris for the Catore, anything to
distract herself from the misery that her life was. And
(04:32):
so I think right there, in both the mother and
the father, you see the roots of this complete disdain
for the opposite sex for women. JFK, according to every
woman who ever slept with him, and there were many
famous women who talked about it, did not even like sex.
You know, he would go three minutes. There was no
(04:54):
fun or affection. Jackie even went to a doctor who
she took on as a confidant to ask him for
help in how she could improve her sex life with
her husband. This is while they were in the White House.
I mean, that's how desperate she was.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Well, the voice of Warrey in Callahan the book is
called asked Not at the Kennedy's and women they destroyed.
In the section about Marilyn Monroe, you talk about a
character Kennedy's brother in law, Peter Lawford, and how that
connection to Marilyn Monroe happened, and you used the phrase,
I find it interesting a psycho sexual dynamic for Maryland
(05:33):
that she found compelling. Talked about Lawford and Marilyn Monroe
and that whole relationship. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
So Lawford was married to JFK's sister, Patricia, and he
was a movie star at the time, like sort of
a B movie star, but he was the connect for
JFK and RFK to get to these Hollywood stars, these women,
and Marilyn Monroe was among them. Now she was involved
(06:02):
with Bobby Kennedy and Jack Kennedy at the same time,
and this goes to there was this real sort of
incestuous emotional sexual incestuousness within the Kennedy clan and the
siblings themselves, and many people close to the family remarked
(06:22):
upon this and a side note, and it's covered in
the book. After JFK's assassination, Jackie and Bobby began a
very lengthy affair and it would be, I think today,
considered a trauma bond, but nonetheless it was a little
bit creepy. So with Marilyn, the draw for her with
(06:46):
jack and Bobby was, you know, Marilynd too suffered a
very very abusive, neglectful childhood in which she was shunted
from Foster home to Foster home, molested by stepfathers. She
felt unwanted and unloved and more than anything, wanted to
be considered smart.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Well, I had never heard that Jackie and Bobby had
a trauma bond, if you will, I had never heard that,
but you talked about it in the book It's a bizarre,
crazy world. Let me ask you this, in their final
few moments together, what is it that, first of all,
caused Jackie to want to portray Camelot, which she knew
is a really dysfunctional thing. And why is it that
even people like Barbara Walters in the modern media still
(07:30):
want to protect Camelot. What are they afraid of?
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Here? Great double question? Very quickly. Jackie, I think, in
the aftermath, wanted to make sure that her husband's presidency,
which was not marked by high achievement, was remembered as substantial.
And she also wanted to memorialize their marriage, which many
in the press corps thought was transactional and that Jackie
(07:55):
was an idiot for not knowing what her husband was
up to. Not true. She knew that that marriage was
memorialized as a true love. As to why the media
today is still shying away, only they can answer, Only
they can answer. I personally think it's shameful. I think
we are all adults. We are well past the time
(08:17):
for a true reckoning with the Kennedy family. If we
can throw Harvey Weinstein in prison, and we can castigate
the likes of Bill Cosby and Bill Clinton what have you,
we are more than ready to deal with the monsters
within the Kennedy family.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Mariene Callahan, I really appreciate your time. The book is
available anywhere I find books are sold, and if they
don't sell it, they're not a fine bookseller. It's called
ask Not by Marreene Callahan everybody pick up a copy
of this thing. Marine. It's a pleasure. And congrats on
the book, and I look forward to conversing future.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Thanks Jimmy, me too.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
You got a Mariene Callahan New York Times bestseller. The
name of the book is called Ask Not. And I
thought I was familiar with the book already in the topic.
And I did not know until I read the extras
of the book that John F. Kennedy Junior almost crashed
his airplane into a commercial airline in American Airlines on
the night he crashed his plane. I also did not
(09:12):
know until just now that that trauma bond between Jackie
and Bobby they had a little Yeah, you got to
get the book. It's called Ask Not. The Kennedy's and
the women they destroyed. Everybody stand back. I got one
more segment of the Today's show Lakey on the radio
six hundred case col Jimmy Lakey to be precise. I'll
(09:34):
be back
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