Annie F. Downs: Books. Podcast talk. Enneagram & Relationships. Gratitude.

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Okay, little food for you. So life. Oh it's pretty bay,
It's pretty beautiful thing that for a little moth kicking

(00:30):
four Happy Thursday. Super pumped about today's episode because Annie F.
Downs is coming on. I got so many requests to
have her on my podcast, and we have so many
mutual friends that I was like, Okay, one day this
is going to happen. And I've had her on the
books for a while. She finally came over. We recorded
this episode and it was just so fun, which is

(00:52):
fitting because Annie is all about the fun. Now that
f is super important Annie Downs, there's another Annie Downs
out there, so you gotta have the f if you're
going to follow her on Instagram. Uh, sort of like
there's another Amy brown out in the world. But she's
like a fairy artist and that's not me. Sometimes you
will get us confused. But I'm at Radio Amy and
she's at Annie F. Downs. And I went to her

(01:14):
Instagram and she conveniently coincidentally had four things listed about
herself number one best selling author, to speaker, three podcaster,
four loud laugher. So Annie is just the coolest and
I feel honored that she came on my podcast and
that I now get to call her friend, and I

(01:36):
just feel like this is one of those episodes you're
really gonna love and something that we're doing a little
bit differently today. Oh which f I I uh, today,
I don't have any like crazy things to do. But
this is our year anniversary, Like we have officially been
doing the podcast for one full year now. We have
Tuesday episodes that run, so that adds a different number

(01:59):
into the mix. But when it comes to our Thursday
Four Things episodes, this is number fifty two. So happy
birthday to Four Things with Amy Brown. I wish I
had something awesome to celebrate with um, but I do
have some awesome things to announce that are coming up,
Like we're gonna do a best of episode towards the

(02:22):
end of the year, picking out four things that you
loved from this last year, like whatever your four favorite
things were, or even even mine. I'm gonna factor in
everybody's opinion. But if you want to go ahead an
email to me, like not just specific interviews, Like obviously
Bob Goff was a huge favorite, so but if you
had one of the things that he shared of all

(02:42):
four things, let's we'll pull that one thing and mix
it in with you know, maybe something fun and awesome
that was from TRICI year would or maybe just a
fun little thing that I shared, or maybe Stevenson coming
on sharing his pancake recipe that was like a favorite
and that was on our very first episode. By the way,
UM so should have had Stevenson come back on and
share an of the recipe, but he's at school, so

(03:02):
not really possible right now while I'm recording this. UM
But I just want to say that I appreciate from
the bottom of my heart, like the community that we've
grown here, the people that listen, the people that rate
and review, all of you listening right now, if you're
taking the time to do that, it just means a lot.
It's what's keeping this going and keeping it growing, and
it's exciting to see what all is happening and what

(03:23):
could happen in the next year, like we're already planning
stuff for and maybe like a little tour next year,
taking this thing on the road, doing something live. I
don't know. There's just a lot of fun stuff. And
I know when I first started this, I was kind
of I'm not really sure where it was going to go,
And sometimes quite honestly, I'm not really sure where what's

(03:44):
happening some episodes, but y'all are cool and you just
roll with it, and that is what I appreciate. And
we see the support, I mean, we see the emails
that come through, um, we see the downloads, We we
see the support with Pimp and Joy and shop a
Spoa in supporting Haiti, and uh, that just that means
a lot, because I don't want to do this podcast

(04:07):
without the impact and spreading joy and hope out there.
And Pimp and Joy is all about the joy, and
a squaw is all about the hope. A squaw means
hope in Haitian creole. And you know a lot of
you are doing Christmas shopping right now, which means the
world to Marry and I. If you're choosing um stuff
that we've got available to you know, send to your

(04:28):
friends and family for Christmas or give to them like
that's really special. Um. And just speaking of Christmas, today's Thursday,
so tomorrow Friday. I've been telling you all the customized
Christmas pullovers, We're going to have a deadline. We were
going to have to cut it off. And if you
want to customize it Tomorrow, Friday, UM, the is the

(04:49):
last day to customize Christmas pullovers your four Things which
they're super cute. We will have stock ones available still
because those are already pre made and we can still
ship those out, but when it comes to customizing, tomorrow's
the cut off for the Christmas polovers, and then we're
getting close to the cut off for the four Things
totes because we see those orders coming into and we

(05:09):
know that y'all want to um give those as guests
to all the girls in your life because they're super
thoughtful and they give back and it's just something really special.
You can fill it with cute things inside, which speaking of,
we got to do the totes as the c m
A swag bags, and Reba uh posted hers on her
Instagram and we got to put corn dogs on her

(05:32):
tote because that's one of her favorite four things, and
we rhyin stoned it. We rhyin stoned Dolly, Reba's and
carries because they were hosting the c m A Awards
and then every other presenter and performer got like a
four Things toe filled with whatever swag c m A
put inside, and then they made a donation to Haiti.
So thank you uh C m as for having us

(05:54):
a part of your awards night and contributing to um Haiti.
We really appreciate that. So Radio Amy dot com. If
you want to access anything shop a splat or Pimp
and Joy or looking to do some Christmas shopping, we
can definitely hook you up with gifts that have meaning
and give back and as always, we just appreciate your support.
UM And I think I mentioned we were going to

(06:17):
do something a little different today than I totally got
sidetracked and that today's the podcast birthday. But oh yeah,
now they're now some people walked out. We can celebrate. Yes,
that's the big birthday shout out. But I what I
was gonna say was that I'm gonna read the email
shout out in the intro today, So there's not going
to be an outro. But other fun things that we
have coming up at the end of the year will

(06:38):
be a best of episode. UM, so I want you
to send me your favorite moments. You can do that
four things with Amy Brown at gmail dot com. Um,
and then we also have a special Joy like Pimp
and Joy episode and honor my mom because my mom
was born on December nineteenth, which happens to be a Thursday,
So that's fun. So we're gonna do something really cool
with that episode and spread some joy. And my sister

(06:59):
is going to be recording it with me, so I
can't wait for y'all to hear that. Um. But let's
get to the email shout out, and then we will
get to my Annie Downs sit down, which I think
y'all are going to enjoy so so much, and I
think she'll definitely be like probably one of your favorites
that could be added into maybe the best of episode,
but or maybe just something where you want to re

(07:19):
listen to it and take some notes or something, or
order some of her books, um, because she's just super awesome.
So here is the shout out. It's from Ashley in Boston. Hey, Amy,
I want to send you a message and tell you
how much I've enjoyed your podcast over the past year.
Your Tricia Yearwood and Bob Goff interviews have been my favorite.
But I love them all. I appreciate all the little

(07:40):
things that I've learned and been introduced to on the show.
I love when you have friends and family Onto. Thanks
for bringing a bright a bright spot in my week.
And I can't wait for all the other episodes to come.
And so actually this this was like just a short
and sweet little one or email that I pulled because, um,
I thought it just been a lot that she's I

(08:01):
can tell she's listened to all the episodes and she
appreciates it, and hopefully you'll appreciate even when I rambled
right a listen, I know that even as intro I
were rambling. But it's just a crazy day here. So um,
I'm gonna go ahead and say goodbye and tell you
thank you for downloading, listening, rating, and reviewing. And uh,

(08:21):
here's Annie first man, Okay, this is exciting. I told
you all that Annie f Downs was going to be
coming on my podcast, and today's the day she's here.
Read the house and we were joking because it's above
my garage that I'm kind of like basically dare basically
this is Armchair Expert Nashville exactly so. And then as

(08:43):
Anna and I are just chit chatting before um, you know,
we started recording, she revealed to me that she's going
to be an extra in the Hallmark Christmas movie that's
being filmed at Dollywood, and I was approached about being
an extra and I couldn't go because of some work conflicts.
But and he's going to be dying. You are going
to be there. I mean we are. You and I

(09:04):
are the center of the Venn diagram of this, of
Dollywood and Hallmark Christmas movies. That is, I was born
in the center of that Venn diagram and I will
live there every day. And so I can't believe this
is happening. I mean, you're you're living it up for me.
I'm gonna watch it and I'm gonna cheer you on
and be like, you're one step closer to being, like,
you know, a cast officially part of it, more than

(09:26):
an extra in the door. I'm about to fall in
love at Christmas, is what I think is going to happen.
And think you do, then I need to work at
the coffee shop. That's right, We'll keep rotating through the storyline.
What if we just became the women who, like we
said to our friends who are listening, every once a year,
you can see us in the background of a movie
and we'll tell you which one. But that's all we're
gonna tell you. And we just I am so content

(09:49):
getting paid in Dollywood tickets and in just being an extra.
I think that's such a tree. I know, it's like
a bucket list thing, like how many years did you
make it as an extra Hallmark movie? Ten? Solid that's
my hope starting. Um, we like to dream big, guys. Yeah,
that's right, that's right. So um, well, any speaking of
like just dreaming big. I I don't know much about

(10:11):
your your early days of you getting into who you
are now and being an author and a speaker and
doing all the fabulous things that you do, and now
that being into like a blog to a podcast to
all the things and people just just adoring you. I
have to say I get um. You know, I wrote
you a little note that listeners request you all the time.

(10:33):
It's true, I wasn't. Some some people I have on
they've never been requested. I'm just having them one. I
like you, um and have wanted to have you on,
But also too, it was you know, people whenever I
just throw an note out there, like you know, who
should dive on, it's always like, oh see if you
can get any And really the last month or two

(10:54):
that we've had on the calendar, I've been able to reply,
she's coming, She's coming, No worry, I know we need
to trade these. You need to come on. Sounds fun too,
because when you posted about it, you posted we were
going to be in the same place, and I was like,
is she coming on? That sounds fun? She come I
was like, yes she is, So we'll go trades and
go back. Yeah, I will come on. So how like,
at what age did you know or when did you

(11:15):
feel that tuck on your heart to to get into
what you're doing and explain to people that might not
know everything that you do and when you're all about
like that part of you. Yeah, you know. The funny
thing is Amy is I'm kind of just have one skill.
I just entertain people till they learned something. That's all
I've literally ever been able to do. I used to
teach elementary school, and so that growing up, that's what
I wanted to do. I thought I would be the

(11:35):
teacher who was in the classroom my whole life, Like,
I thought that would be what I would do forever.
And what ended up happening is I was um helping
with lead the youth group at my church and I
started writing I can see you being so good at
that. That That was so fun. I loved. I mean, and
I love teaching too. I taught fourth and fifth grade.
I just loved it. I still love this kids. I'm

(11:57):
friends with a ton of them on Facebook, and I
taught for five year person. So I just have a
hundred and eighty now adults there in their twenties who
were you know, ten year olds when I knew them first,
and I just adore them. But I um, I started
so that the writing really started as like serving the
community I was already in by writing for the youth
group girls. And so this whole thing, this whole career

(12:19):
is of it is very much a okay that sounds fun,
Okay that sounds fun, and just moving into the next thing.
Now I work hard and I'm driven and motivated, so
it's not like I just like fall into the next thing.
But when writing books started into that I wrote my
first book in two thousand and six. When writing books started,
it was purely like, oh, that that would be fun

(12:39):
to try. I love books. One of my grandmothers was
a librarian and the others owned a bookstore, and so
it was just like we didn't watch TV at my house.
I spent my saturdays at the bookstore. I mean, I
just have loved books forever, and so that's really what
got me started. So I started writing in two thousand
and six. Moved to Nashville in two thousand and eight,
just kind of felt the and maybe the best way

(13:00):
put as an invitation from God to like move and
to try something new. And I was single at the
time and in my mid twenties, and I was like, well,
if I'm gonna be poor and and this isn't gonna work,
at least it will just be me who's hungry and
not like a family of people that I'm trying to
care for. And so I moved here in two thousand
and eight and spent the first few years doing all

(13:21):
sorts of jobs when I was trying to get published.
I mean, I worked at local taco. I worked at Yeah,
it was delicious. My kids are so disappointed the local
taco in our neighborhood. I know it's gone. I know,
the old day, the olden days. Um, I know. So
I did that. I worked at nonprofits like the Moco
Club and able that you know really well. I mean
I did all that kind of stuff trying to become

(13:42):
a published author. And it the short version is, um,
the book got picked up by a publisher in two
thousand twelve, and and then the speaking kind of came
along with it because as part of the deal with
the publisher, Yeah, and then they had a bunk on
a bus for a Team Girl to were as part
of the sponsorship the publisher had with the tour. So

(14:04):
I said, will you be the speaker that represents our publisher?
And I was like yeah, So I did that for
two school years where I was gone two thousand twelve
thirteen thirteen fourteen. We did two weekends a month of
this Team Girl tour. And and then as I grew
in my own age and in my own life, my
writing left writing for teenagers and has become where I

(14:27):
write for adult men and women. Now we're um, is
this bothering you? By the way, you're dingling earrings? Yeah?
Hear them. I mean I don't think, but if you're
worried about them, I just come here him a little bit. Um. Sorry,
everyone my to be concerning to um booge with my earrings.
M So, now in twenty nineteen are at our companies

(14:52):
called Downce Books Incorporated. There's really three buckets. So I
still write books. It's my first love. I love writing,
I love what it takes. Have a do tomorrow. Oh
my god, yeah, how are you here right now? Because
I'm an Instagram seven and we're like, yeah, that'll be fun.
Let's get out of the office. So well, when you
now just going through your books like so um, like

(15:13):
people that write specifically for things like sometimes when you're
progressing and you're writing and you're maturing, you're writing and
you're shifting, Like do you ever look back on like
I just remember Jin Hatmaker saying something one time about
some of her early books that I read a long
time ago, and she's shifted a lot um and you know,
some people say it's maybe not their cup of tea.
I I appreciate her her shift and her how forward

(15:37):
she is with it. But I mean, I think she's
even said, I go back and read some of the
early stuff I wrote for women, and I'm like, oh
my gosh, what was I writing? Um? Sometimes I mean
his author that's a that's a vulnerable place. It's a
real problem to know that you have stuff still out
there that maybe and I'm not saying that's the case,
there are things, Well, the thing I have to do

(15:58):
the only way I keep from just going insane about
that kind of stuff is go like, Okay, I wrote
my first book when I was twenty six. Um, I
know that Annie at twenty six was doing the best
she could. She she did not know what Annie at
thirty nine knows. She had not been through what Annie
at thirty nine has been through. And so what I'm
writing today is better. But what I wrote back then

(16:23):
was the best I knew. And so so there is
changing in and some of the things. I think, there
is growth in me as a person. But the upside
of that, that's true for jin, that's true for me,
that's true for anybody who puts out work that gets,
for lack of a better word, memorialized like a book
does because it will not change. Is that if you

(16:43):
take time and read the whole um library, you will
see the growth in the author, and you will see
the author change and and be with you so versus going, oh,
I like this author, I love hat Maker. I'll go
back and start at her first one, but I'll only
read that one. Then you're like, well, that doesn't that's
not the one right now. Well, that would be true
for any of us if we went back and read
your journal from two thousand six, it would be so

(17:05):
different than your journal than twenty nineteen. And so I
just give myself a little bit of like she did
the best she could with what she knew. And so, um,
I'm grateful for the way I have grown and changed.
I'm grateful my writing is better. Um, I'm grateful that
the stories are better. But I I can't punish her
for not um for not knowing what she didn't know.

(17:28):
Now that being said, there's also authors who pulled books
and go, we can't publish that anymore because it's so
different than what I believe now, so it has to stop.
And I didn't know that. Yeah. Um. There's a guy
named Joshua Harris that has a book called A Kiss
Dating Goodbye. They kind of ruined a bunch of people's
teenage lives Evangelical Christians. Yeah, and he's pulled it in

(17:49):
the last few years. He's had people can google and
read all about what's going on with him right now.
But he's had a real shift in his faith. But um,
but he has stopped publishing that book because he feels
like it is more damaging than helpful. Oh wow, I
had no idea but I'm pretty sure that's circulated through
my entire church, or sure it did all of us.
Anybody who was reading in the nineties and was trying

(18:09):
to date was reading that. And um, as far as
I knew, especially, I mean, you know, so so you
can't get put stuff pulled. I don't feel that way
about my work. Um. I feel like it shows that
there's growth. But I'm grateful that it shows growth because
that's truthful. Yeah, So what what book? What's due tomorrow?
And is that coming out? It's not coming out until

(18:31):
January one, because this is the trick. No one wants
to release around the election next fall. So you're gonna
see a real gap or a real dip in releases
October November compared to what we saw this year, um,
and what you'll see the next year, because it is hard.
There's gonna be so much noise already that it is

(18:53):
hard for a book to get what it deserves as
far as to give it a chance, you know, to
get it to get in the right hands. And so
a lot of people are releasing early. You'll see my
my forecast for is you'll see a bigger push of
books in August in September and January February, whereas this
year October, I mean October is a kill or month

(19:14):
for books. They always release tons. So what you will
see release next fall are really famous authors and then
some people who are newer probably that that will fit
in that space, that aren't trying to get national media
or aren't trying, unless it's a Obama releases a book
or someone like that that's like, well, no, yes, we're
all gonna listen anyway, it's fine. So that's why it's

(19:36):
so long from now. And do you are you? Do
you are you saying anything about what it's about? Yeah,
I'll tell you and I'll tell you amy. Um, we
don't totally know the title yet. I have one working
in my heart, but I feel like it could get
me in trouble if I I mean, i'll if I
just announce it. But um, the idea is what keeps
happening to me because my podcast is called That Sounds
Fun is people want to talk about fun with me,

(19:59):
and they want me to be the judge of their
fun and they want me to be their coach. They
want to know that what they are already doing is fun.
Do you think this and here's what I do for fun,
And they tell me, and then they wait, and I go, Yep,
that sounds fun. Yeah, you're right, they're probably fun for you.
Great super And then but then I go, but have
you ever thought about doing that in a costume? Or
have you ever thought about doing that in Virginia? Or

(20:21):
have you know? Like and they go, yeah, you can
tell that they want. But the thing we're looking for amy,
when we're looking for fun is we feel like we've
lost something that we can't tangibly get our get a
word around of knowing what it is. And we all
feel that a little bit, that feeling of like something's
missing and it's not just like and God fills that whole.
That's not what I'm saying. I think even faith people

(20:43):
can go, why am I so nostalgic about stuff? Why
am I so sentimental? Sometimes? And and I think there's
a bigger thing that we've lost and and that we've
lost and and I don't know if we find it,
but fun is our gateway to it. And so the
book is about how I'll do you um pick up
the crumbs that we're experiencing to figure out what you've

(21:04):
really lost. Oh wow, okay, and then navigate some fun. Yeah,
that's right. Now that's some fun. So now that we've
met and more friends, like I can just like you
can move my fun. Yes, texting and he is that
fun for you? I'm like, yeah, I mean the answer
is always and when you make it, yes, but you
make it more fun. But you do it, you do
it already because I know. I mean, we share one

(21:26):
billion friends and are all of our friends are people.
And this may be a privilege point of view, I'm
aware that we are people who make time for each
other and who do fun things together and think of
each other when it's time to do fun things, and
and I just think that's I think intrinsically are our

(21:46):
greater friend group here in Nashville are people who value
having fun as a part of like this, Like Nicole
Clawson is who comes to my mind, galleon whatever, but
she's yeah, she's her epitome of fun. Yes, she is
about cultivating environments where people have a better time than

(22:06):
they thought they were going to have. So she's the
person that when she invites you to a party, you
don't go, Well, let me see if my other friends
are gonna be there. You go. Yeah, I'm gonna go
because a probably someone will be there. But be I
know that Nicole has created something that's going to make
me feel like maybe this thing isn't as lost as
I thought it was. And every time it's true, every
time it's true with her, and and so I yes,

(22:29):
I will help you, but I also think you already
do it because I know. I know, I see your family,
I see your friends. I know I could use a
little bit of work, But that's encouraging. Every time you know,
I have someone on, I feel like, you know, whether
it's for somebody else listening or literally for me myself.
I take away that like, oh yeah, you know what.
Sometimes I do get lost in like the luck of
all and it's just I feel stuck and like not

(22:51):
I'm not even trying to cultivate fun and memories. And
you almost have to choose it. That's it, that's what
you for. For some personality types, you have to choose
to sit down and do the work because the fund
comes naturally. For some people, you have to choose to
search out fun because you're looking for fun all the time,
right exactly. But I do know the majority of my

(23:13):
friends need a reminder that fun is valuable, that it's
not a waste of time, it's very valuable and it
actually teaches you something about yourself and about the world.
And so that's what we're trying to do with this
book is kind of go like, hey, this is why
it matters so much is because you've never been to Eden,
but you know it's lost. We've never been in the garden,

(23:34):
but we know it's gone, and we and we are
actually always looking for it, and so how do we
find that even in a busy life. I love that
I feel like we're for me A big thing is
always joy and that's just something that has organically, um
come into play and that that we've we've run with
because it just it just happened and for a number

(23:54):
of reasons. But it's there. And that's something that you
see a lot of people trying to chase is like
are actively choose us? But I like this approach of
like being um intentional on choosing fun. Yeah, And I
think the the interesting thing about what I know of
watching Pimp and Joy and your story is that y'all

(24:15):
chose in the middle of suffering, we will smile. We
will not force ourselves to choose one or the other.
And a lot of times what we do to each
other and to ourselves is if I'm sad, I can
only be sad, and if I laugh, I'm doing something wrong.
Or if if I feel sad but I don't want
to feel sad, I will just go to Disneyland and
I will ride and and and I will not look back.

(24:37):
Or I'll drink too much, or I'll text too late
at night to someone I shouldn't text. I will feel
better because I can't feel this anymore. And I actually
think the most fun has had when you allow them
both to exist. When you go like, yeah, there's sadness
in my life. I mean sitting here with you. I
mean their sadness in my life. Also there is great
joy in my life. And so I will let them coexist,

(24:58):
and I will lean on finding the fun because the
sadness finds me. Sadness is going to find us, heartbreak
is gonna find us. We get to be the ones
who go, Okay, I'm gonna hold that in one hand.
I won't pretend like that's not true, but I will.
I will chase the fund because I've got to have both. Well, gosh,
I'm looking forward to January. You don't have to wait
that long. I'll get it to you sooner than that,

(25:19):
so you can tell me what to fix. Send me
the one with all the grammatical so just to you know,
we like what we talked about how you got into writing.
And then that led to the other things which in
the next thing, I want to talk about your podcast
and as you mentioned that, which is called that sounds
fun um with Annie f Downs and I think, but
I would like to know of your books this next

(25:42):
one sounds the most fun but it's not out yet,
So of your books that you've written, like which is
your like if someone is just now hearing about you,
which is the one they need to go buy right now? Um?
And that you would recommend? And then your favorite book,
like of all time not all time, okay, um, the
one that people respond to the most, the one that
has been bought the most, the one that exists in
targeting all the places. Is a Hundred Days to Brave.

(26:04):
That seems to be the one that people feel like
is well, it's a gorgeous cover and which I had
nothing to do with. I'm like, please judge this book
by its cover. But um, It is literally a hundred
days where if you do anything for a hundred days,
it will change your life. But if you will do
a hundred little brave things in your life, what keeps
happening is the people who finish the book. Their life

(26:26):
is totally different, and they go like, I had no idea.
I mean, I can't tell you how many emails I
get where people go, I had no idea my husband
was going to lose his job on day fifty four,
but I finished and we're gonna be okay. Or I
had no idea I was going to fall in love
on day ten, or that my cousin was going to
get sick on the day. I mean, people go like,
I didn't know what God had for me in those

(26:47):
hundred days, but I knew I had to finish. So
that's the one I would say is kind of the
gateway drug to the others. It's the one that people like, um,
remember God is the one that's most recently out about
whether God's really kind or not. Because I felt like
my life didn't look like he was treating me very well,
and I couldn't understand how the Bible said he was kind,
but I wasn't getting what I wanted, which is a

(27:07):
booge thing to say, but it's it was a real
sadness for me. Um. Okay, my, So those are the
two I would say of the the collection. Um and
then yeah, they're all there. They're on Amazon, there at bookstores.
You're here Nashville. Parnassis will get them all for you.
They have a couple of them. And um, and yeah
they're available everywhere. Uh. My favorite book of all time

(27:29):
is a fiction, a novel from Katherine Marshall called Christie.
Have you ever read it? It is about Christie is
an elementary school teacher in rural Appalachia, and it is
and it is actually the story of Katherine Marshall's mother,
um As I mean, she was a school teacher who

(27:50):
left a big city and took a train into uh
pretty much like Kid's Cove Townsend, East Tennessee, like kind
of near Gatlinburg, kind of near Dolly Dolly Severe Vilain,
so that area and she taught school there and it's
why I became a teacher. I just thought, I have
never connected with a novel like that before. I've never

(28:10):
I love that people group. I love um people, the
apple Achian people. I just think that's uh, they're scotch Irish.
I have a lot of connections with Ireland and Scotland
and and so I just always loved that people group
and so that book and the at the TV show afterwards.
But that book changed my life. I've read it front
to back. I'm not exaggerating, no less than fifty times,

(28:31):
and it is. It is just my very favorite. So
I would recommend people reading it just if you need
a fun novels, something different. We love a good book recommendation,
And then what are you reading? Are you reading anything interesting?
Right now? I'm reading Awful Beautiful Life. Yes, I've heard
of it, but I haven't ready. So she was on
my podcast last week and I got about halfway through
by the time we interviewed, and so I'm finishing it.

(28:53):
Do you try to read everybody you have on UM?
I can't always just can't. It's just it's too much.
I mean, well, for one, between work and kids and husband,
all the different things. But also Netflix likes just tell
the Truth. Yes, it's so like or Amazon Prime coming
out with like Jack Ryan just recently came back season two,

(29:16):
and then you know, then HBO had succession and then
it's like all the things I and the problem is
when we read the people and I try to read.
I try to read something out of every book before
I interview someone. But but that is if I'm reading
their book because I'm interviewing them, it's it's work. It's
not fun. And if we do that and edit our
own podcast and listen to them, you know, do the edit,

(29:37):
listen through, I could work seventeen or eighten hours a
day and I just can't. Can't live like that. Yeah,
So I would say my since becoming a mom the
last two years, my reading has gone way down. Um,
sleeping is more important. Sleep is very important. So it's
like working out, just staying mentally sane so that I'm

(29:57):
not a complete crazy person. Um, but I do think
that reading would be Um, it is encouraging to hear
uh someone else. Like a lot of people that are
really busy, have a lot going on, but they still
can read, you know, a couple of books a month.
And I'm like, okay, I could. If they're doing that,
I could at least start reading something. I mean, I

(30:19):
don't want to or honestly, what what I do, um
dig into it. I'm opening up something as a parenting
book or a book on adoption, and it's just like, not,
it's not the feel good like, oh, I can't put
it down. Um, but the awful, beautiful life. I started
because of the podcast, but then I wanted to finish
it because I just felt she's from Austin. I'm from Austin.

(30:41):
I knew some people that were close to her situation,
and she just it was a beautiful paints a beautiful
picture of how she you. She was experiencing such grief
and shock and came out on the other side because
of faith and um she uses four words or her
ef words. She's got some efforts, she said. I but
you would think at that time she's probably dropping like yeah, effort,

(31:04):
but she's like, no, actually, I mean it was my
faith and my family and my friends and the different
things that got her through it. And aren't you grateful
when people right through that stuff for us, Yes, because
it's just like a roadmap if we when we need it. Yeah.
If you'll haven't heard that podcast, I guess since this
one's airing a week after she was on, she's on
last Up and go to last week's listen to it.

(31:25):
Uh tragic situation. She lost her husband committed suicide, and
she had three kids, and she was left with like,
I think, like million dollars worth of debt. You are
lying to my face. No, he so that's why he
decided he was He had swindled money. Um or asked
friends for loans and businesses for loans and thought told

(31:47):
them he was investing it, and he wasn't. And they
had this lavish like lavish lifestyle, Like my sister would
go to their Christmas parties. And in the book, chapter one,
she talks about the Christmas parties, and I think, is
she was like trying to pay in a picture of
just how awesome lavish their life was. Like the governor
would be there and then like you know, normal people,
My sister is there because they knew him through young life.

(32:08):
And my sister said, is like the party of the year.
She couldn't wait to go. She was going to see
and yeah, I mean, but it was all she didn't realize.
It was all like how her husband was paying for it.
She never she thought he's really good at his job.
But yeah, so anyway, but she she made it through
and now she's um sitting down with her was lovely

(32:29):
and she's made it through the other side. And so
it is you think you're in the darkest hour of
your life, but you can push through persevere. Yeah, that's
one of the things when I heard that. You know,
we talked about Armache Expert, but I heard him live
in Nashville a couple of weeknds ago, and someone said
he did questions from the audience, and someone said, how
do you get through a hard season in your life?
And he said, you never get on a roller coaster

(32:51):
and think this is gonna last forever. He said, you
know every good thing and you have to remember the
bad things into That's a good analogy. I thought so too.
I thought, man, that is so he's like even like
threw his hands up. He's like, you're screaming and you're
having the best time, but you're never like I'm so
glad I get to do this for the rest of
my life. He's like, you know, it ends, and and
so it's just always so generous to me of women

(33:13):
like her who write books like that that say, hey,
this was the darkest and I will tell you the
truth so that you know, so that you have some
roadmap that I didn't have. I just think, man, what
a generous thing to do for the rest of us.
Yeah wow, Um, well, and thank you for sharing, like
in your books and for sharing those with with my listeners,

(33:33):
because I know they appreciate that and sometimes they do
come to me for book recommendations and lately I'm like, well,
how about um the connected child? Yeah, yeah, well I
don't really have kids. Thanks so much, David. Second, the

(33:58):
second thing I want us to talk about is your podcast.
You mentioned briefly and the last thing that it's called
that sounds fun. I mean, don't you love podcasting. Yes,
it's been about a year for me so in being
in radio for Yeah, you've been doing it. But it's
so different. I love it is super different. It's very

(34:18):
different in that, um, the interviews are more and the
people that I get to sit down with, um, well,
my podcast the content is so diverse, Like I can
talk about a lot of different things, so that's fun.
My guests are fun, and then I get to sit
down with them for longer periods of time. On radio,
your interviews are five minutes depending on the guest, fifteen

(34:39):
minutes if you're Garth Brooks. You know, it's just it's
and then they're gone and the radio interviews exactly, and
it's like, Okay, why are they here? Will they have
an album out? So we're talking about that we don't
dig a little, and sometimes that bothers me. I had
an offer for someone on a TV show and it
would have been really cool, but the PR person said,

(34:59):
they have other interviews that day and we can give
them to you for fifteen minutes. And I was like,
that's just it would be cool to say that name
was on the show, but that we don't get to
be friends at all in fifteen minutes over the radio
when I'm one of nine phoners, you know. And I
was like that just in my spot. But so I
think that's what makes radio so challenge. Like I watch
you on, I'm like, man, you are so good at

(35:19):
this because you have to do and I get an hour,
we get an hour today, I get an hour on
my show radio. Y'all get seven minutes. Yeah maybe yeah yeah.
And then sometimes if they are in a group, you
can tell, and Bobby started to kind of sometimes he
just weren't in a place now or he's in a
place now where he can kind of be like we'll
pass yause and not to be rude, but then it's
it's just not compelling content for listeners sometimes because what

(35:42):
are they listening to? Like us to be like you
kind of be a robot real quick and talk about
your core points of what you need to get out
for your which I get it, everybody has to do it,
but when they are in a radio tour, they're just
like boom boom boom, and doesn't there's not that connection.
And he's like, I'd rather play a game. Yeah that's
not like yeah, So, um, what tell us about your
podcast and what kind of guests you have on and

(36:04):
what content you cover, and um, also want to hear
about your I don't know is it announced, what's happening
next year? I don't know what's happening next year? You
told me you're doing something next year. We won't say
it yet. You can't say it. We can't say it.
We're not tighting. We're not saying it about Dollywood. No,
not Dollywood. Something that's happening in two And I said
I'm doing that too. Oh yeah, yeah, I'm sorry. Sorry, sorry,
Now I'm with you. I was like, come on talking

(36:28):
cod yes, okay, So let me start by saying how
the show started? So, um in the reason I ever
did a podcast is there was an author named Ted
Decker who his PR people came to me and said
will you interview him? And I was like, well, yeah,
but I don't have anywhere to release it. I have
a blog. At the time, I was an author and
a speaker, but I didn't have a podcast. I listened
to them, but I didn't have one, and she said, um,
well have you ever thought about starting a podcast? And

(36:49):
I'm not kidding you mayby I said that sounds fun.
And then when I was like, that sounds fun, it's available, Okay,
let's do it. So that's really why it started. Now
we are two times a week Mondays and Thursdays, and
it is. It is one of the most joyful things
I'm getting to do right now. I love all buckets
of my job. I love the writing, I love the speaking. Um,
but but doing the podcast just feels like, I mean,

(37:10):
you know how it is. We record this today and
then then all our friends who listen get it in
their ears really quickly. They're getting real time conversations with
with you because they know what you care about based
on who's sitting on the other side. And so really,
what they're doing every time they're showing up is they're going,
I believe in Amy, and I want to be friends
with Amy, and so I'm gonna listen to these conversations
Amy has and so they grow with you and they're

(37:32):
friends with you, which I think is so sweet and
um so I've loved that. So my guests are literally
there's only two rules. It's someone I am friends with
or someone I want to be friends with. Because I'm
not good like you and Bobby, I can't interview strangers.
I think that's very challenging. I'm like, so what else
do you like about Nashville? You know, like a little horrible.

(37:53):
But if it's a friend or someone I want to
be friends with, I've got all the questions because I've
talked their live on lives on social media and I
know what's kind and what they're about. And so those
are the two rules. So we have because my job
is faith based in a lot of ways, we have
a lot of faith people who come on and talk
about their new books or their new albums or whatever
they're working on. Um. We also I have had chefs

(38:15):
from Food Network because I loved their one guy who
won Food Network UM Spring Baking Championship, and I tweeted him,
you're so smart because you want then you become friends
with these amazing cooked totally. How do you become friends
with Daniel Walker? Through the IF gathering and through like
she was already friends with Angie Smith and UM but

(38:38):
then Angie brought her to IF and I met her
there and maybe four or five years ago now and
she's just become one of my dearest friends in the world.
She's been. She and Hill came on the same day, right,
so we recorded the same day? Yeah, yeah, I think
we're originally situed on the phone and then you know,
then I got a note She's like, well, actually I'm
going to be staying with Hillary and I just heard
she's coming up there to hear it. So I was like, okay,

(39:01):
let's all just so they were like like a swinging door,
m or a volving door. But uh yeah, I just
didn't know how that worked out. I thought, that's right,
isn't that easy? You're just like tweet people and be like, yes,
you're fun. I'm like, I'm not going to be the
one who says no for them. They can they can
say no to me. I'm a grown woman. I can
handle Listen. I'm single at thirty nine. I've been rejected

(39:21):
or tam or two. I can handle a person I
do not know on the other side of Twitter not
responding to my ask for them to be on the podcast.
But then sometimes they do say yes, and it's so
fun and and so we have athletes we have we
spend in February, we do couples the whole month, which
is really fun to get to hear um, like we

(39:42):
had both a husband and a wife. Kaylee and Russell
Dickerson came on and just hearing how do you have
a marriage where the husband is a shooting star and
just doing incredible stuff and country music and you're with him,
So where's the how do we both serve each other?
And where's where Kaylie dreams held? And and it's just
beautiful And so we saw all sorts of different couples

(40:04):
that month. Um, we'll do that every February. It's a
good ideally fun. And then in June we did this
last summer, we did any summer where we talked about
the indiogram all the whole month of June, and we
did it because people keep asking me what they keep requesting.
They have names they request years included. They have names
they request, but they also request multiple times people said, well,

(40:25):
you just have friends on that are not famous, Well
you have something, and I was like, I mean, sure,
I have a ton of those friends, but when you
see the name pop up, you're not going to know
who that is or click on it, and so when
you know when it shows up in your app or whatever.
So that I thought, well, what if we talked about
the angiogram, but everyone who came on my show nobody
knew who they were, and so the one So I'd

(40:47):
have a female one and a male one, a female too,
and a male to a female three and mail three
that were not that have no public life at all.
They were What was public was their number. Now that's right.
All they're known by as their number in their first name.
I didn't even tag them on Instagram I did. I
did nothing to let them to turn them into a
public thing. I just said, here are to humans, and
they are this. They identify as this number. So we

(41:08):
do that in June, will do it again in June
of will do any summer and do the same thing.
Where we have a different set of people come on
and talk about what it feels like to be their number.
So I mean it just as various whoever comes to mind.
We try to be real thoughtful that we reflect the
Kingdom of God well, so that we are diverse in
um race, but I diverse and ability. We're trying to

(41:30):
have and find some people who either are disabled themselves
in one way or another or are raising disabled children
just to kind of go like, hey, that's a voice
where you don't hear a lot and so um. So
that's what we try to do is just have a
bunch of different people on that I My goal is
always that if it was you and me and the
listener sitting at a table and the listener and I

(41:52):
are already friends, that I was introducing you that went
that I could get up and leave the table and
y'all let's have something to talk about, and and that
y'all would feel the listener would feel like, well, Amy's
my friend now too. If she turns with strends with
me right like right now, all my listeners are friends
with me for a long time, they're totally friends with
you right now. And that's the thing, like they've already
gone on and they're like, what is her handle too?

(42:15):
I was just I was just looking at your I
reposted your my bad You're bad that you posted a
long time ago. But it's one of our favorite pictures
because you took it to the grocery store. It's your
four things tote and shocker. The first thing on there
is laughing laughing. Second thing is Nashville. Third thing is inniogram,
which the next thing we're gonna talk about with you
is intiagram um because you know way more about it

(42:36):
than I do. And then the last thing is soccer
because you are obsessed with so I love it. I
think it's a great sport. And did you play soccer?
I did. I got up playing it and then I've
just been a super fan ever since. Yeah, I think
it's very very into soccer. Yeah, I'm very into encouraging
the rest of Nashville to be into soccer. So I'm
probably the loudest trumpet you here because I'm trying to

(42:57):
get everybody to play their trumpet pro soccer team and
the team next year. Yeah, my kids took soccer at
the y. I'm stay last year for the host time. Well,
took soccer. They played on a team. I never played soccer,
so I don't know much about it at all. But
it was their first organized sports situation ever. And they
didn't play in Haiti. I mean they came in hat
you would think, being Haitian they played a soccer game
in Haiti. I thought. I thought everybody played in Haiti. No.

(43:19):
At the orphanage, they just really didn't have a much
room to run around. There wasn't like official. I mean
they'd kick the ball, but there was no so they
don't understand the concept of the game. And so Stevenson
would sometimes get the ball but then start kicking it
towards you wrong into the field, and I'm like no,
But as a parent, you're also still proud, like he's
kicking the ball. Yeah, that's exactly in the ball. Who

(43:39):
cares if it's the wrong way? Um? And so yeah,
I need to get more into soccer because they both
really enjoyed it. Yeah good, Maybe I need to take
it to them to like again, let's go to a
game next year. It's really fun and like get them. Yeah,
it's really fun. And the fun thing about what you're
getting to watch right now because they're five, he's nine.
He's he looks five. A lot of people he's five.

(44:00):
He's nine, and my daughter's twelfth. Okay, so the fun
thing that will start happening even now is they're turning,
kicking the wrong way and whatever is. As you see
them start playing better and playing more, you will see
their minds start creating plays that you will see play out,
and it'll just blow your mind once you start, like,
you'll go, oh, he sees them moving into position and

(44:20):
he's passing on purpose to an empty spot because he
knows his teammate's going there. And then they score, and
you lose your mind because you know that your kid
is the one who saw the play before it happened.
It'll get really fun. Okay, I can't wait. Well, we'll
see if they stick with this. So they're like, what
are we gonna play soccer again? I'm like, guys, we're
trying to just get the school thing down. Like right now,
we're just between learning English and just catching them up

(44:41):
to their gray level. There's not a lot of time
for extracurricular activities. Although you were mentioning earlier that you
didn't watch TV as a kid, You just read a
lot well, we watch. We can watch on Thursday nights,
and we could watch a little bit on the weekends.
We just didn't watch Monday through Thursday. So I know,
I feel like I might need to implement that rule.
Like my I let my kids watch. They have TV
time right before bed every night, but they probably help, say,

(45:05):
I bet it helps with their English to hear all
that conversational I mean, if I didn't know English, i'd
I would wish my parents would let me watch more
TV so I could, because I do think my daughter.
I hear her use words sometimes and I'm like, where
where did you hear that word? It means a good word,
It's it's expanded her vocabulary, but it's not one that
I have ever really used. And I'll be like, you
learned that at school? She's like, no, I saw it

(45:25):
on you know whatever I was watching. It's one of
the reasons learning another language immersion is better than just
learning it in school is because if you watch people talk,
it changes how you understand a word, and so you're
doing it, you're teaching them. How how many times have
you been to Haiti? Only once? This once? I went
once with Lisa Harper. We went to Napoli love her.
Oh did you go to My Life Speaks? Yes? Yeah,

(45:46):
oh well so yeah, I was just texting with Mary,
my partner for the Four Things and all this stuff, um,
because I was like, Haiti is just in a lot
of turmoil right now. So we're texting about getting somebody
from in. Mike Wilson's in Nashville right now, So I thought, well,
maybe Mike can come on. Maybe wonderful. Oh my gosh, yeah,

(46:07):
just amazing. I actually met him through Hillary Scott because
she did He did Hillary's wedding and so I met
him at Hillary's wedding, I don't know, nine years ago maybe,
and have just been I have watched them be so
faithful to serve where where they feel called to serve
over the last ten years that I've been watching. They've
been doing it longer than that. But it's just I

(46:27):
think really, really highly of the wilf You had him
on your podcast, No, I should, totally. He's fine. He's
so fun, he's fun. It's just smart and he serves. Yeah, yeah,
you're right, happening just you know, sorting it out. That
sounds fun. With Mike Wilson's kind dollar booking fee, that's right,
that's right, right now, make sure he's over there. No,
he really is a good one. He's great. Um, you

(46:49):
know obviously could I think could share like a lot
and time. Haitie was really hot temperature wise. Oh yeah,
I was a miserable and your feet swell in your hands,
and I got food poisoning. You didn't. And in the
middle of the night I was the only person awake.
I couldn't find any water. I mean, it was about

(47:11):
as it was about as if I would rather be
dying than this. Yeah. I had those moments when I've
been like sick in America and heard of my own home. Okay,
So I got home and I go to like a
natural path in Franklin, and I went and got tested
right away. I was like, I was so sick because

(47:31):
I got home like two days later after um the
food poisoning. And she's like, you have twelve parasites. She
was like, I bet like five or from whatever you
ate and seven or that you spent an entire night
on the floor of a Haitian bathroom. It's like, yeah, probably,
So what did she The next morning? Lisa Harper was like,

(47:51):
you look terrible. I was like, I have not slept
right things. What did you do to get rid of
your parasites? I took some of the natural path stuff. Um,
I think it's called parasite, Yeah, something like that that
says parasite. And then I did some calonics I did
like sweat beds did, like all the things. Yeah, I'm

(48:15):
so appreciative for Western medicine. I think it works, and
I think it's miraculous what God has shown people to
create medicine. I also want to look at the earth
first and want to look at natural things first of
what's already been provided for us, and so all that
kind of stuff is my first stop. And then if
if I can't get better, I'm so grateful for doctors

(48:35):
and what they can do. But I'm a natural. I
might need to get your I need to find a
natural or I've been wanting to find all the tests
done and see where I am. Do you get your
like hormone levels tested or anything or does she do
anything with hormones? No? Not, I mean yes, we talk
about my hormones and she tests form, but not with

(48:57):
like they don't do blood kind of stuff. Like they
don't they don't draw blood and do those kind of
testing done, like food sensitivity testing. Oh yeah, girl, I'm
a weirdo. I got like a dairy allergy. I don't
eat dairy. I know that you love Daniel Walker's dairy
free rance and made me cry the first time I
ate it because I had dairy for six years. Up.

(49:20):
Do you love her stuff too? Yeah? You do? Yeah,
yeah I do. Yeah. Do you have a favorite recipe
you're working on right now with her? Um? Well, just
her whatever chocolate chip real deal chocolate chip cookies and
all the kids love them. So there's her ministrony soup
is my go to of that genre of soup. And
then she has like a roasted chicken and vegetable that

(49:40):
you can get online. The minister is only in her cookbook. Um,
eat what you love, but the roasted vegetable and leftover
chicken one is so good is online and it is. Yeah,
you have to share it. I'll have to try that
one for sure. Um well yeah. And then she's do
you remember you're like her podcast episodes? Because I'm not
thinking of people are listening and there are friends. And

(50:01):
then shoot, I heard Daniel Walker and Amy's because I
will say that when she was on your podcast. It's
it's different when people are still. You hear some stuff again,
you hear some stuff that is new. So if you
liked someone and we had a really good response with
her being on, then they should go check out. Um,
you're uh the podcast that Daniel did with you, But

(50:23):
it's like, um, it's on the fly. So I'm like,
do you know what episode number that is? Um? You
know the funny thing, I was just at lunch with
a couple of friends before I got to your house,
and they were we were talking about a different interview
I'm doing, and and one of the guys said, Um,
are you going to ask a question that's never been
asked before? And I was like, that's never our goal here, Like,

(50:44):
my goal is never that. Can I ask Amy Brown
the thing that no one's asked before? What I do
want to have is a conversation no one's had before.
But we can ask all the same questions. You and
I can ask Daniel the exact same questions, but the
order we asked them and the parts that stand out
to each of our hearts is going to be so different.
So even if Daniel came to us both with five
questions and was like this is all I answer. It's

(51:05):
still two totally different conversations, and so the pressure is
off of us as a podcast. So it's like, I'm
not trying to have I'm not going to ask a
question probably that someone hasn't heard their favorite author, chef, musician,
that they haven't heard them ask. But my hope is
that by the end of the conversation they go, I've
never heard that before. I've never heard that conversation before,

(51:27):
and they haven't because you and I have never done
this before. But when you come on my show, it'll
be the exact same two humans, but we'll have lived
more days and we'll have different things. And so I
just love and when I come on yours, it's probably
gonna be way more fun saying I'm having a great time.
It's gonna equal at best. Um, but I just think
there's that's one of the best things about us sharing
friends and podcast episodes. Existing with different host is like,

(51:50):
because Jamie Ivy, it happens a lot with you and
me and Jamie Ivy and Jin where we'll all have
the same guest and I'm like, yeah, that matters. That's great.
That's why I want to encourage people to go listen
to yours and hear her on there because I know
that it's different. I've listened, and but such a release
of that pressure, like, yeah, we're not trying to create something.
You're not trying to bamboos on me with a question

(52:10):
that no one's ever asked before, Like no, I'm just
trying to ask her what I want to know. Well.
And then as a listed podcast listener, because I listen
to podcasts like I'm not gonna not Actually, when I
enjoy somebody on a podcast, I go seek them out
from every interview they've done and yeah, again I hear
little tidbits that I know that I heard, but you'read
the whole conversation so different. And I keep listening and

(52:31):
find them on the next send him on the next exactly.
So I love that. I think that's fun. Boom. So
which Jamie Ivy you've done hers? That's another good one.
Where are we both have done? Um? Happy Hour Live?
It's just so fun, which leads to we're both taking
our shows on the road. Mine's not. I'm sure yours
is way more organized and probably totally booked. Mine still

(52:52):
like in the work um, we're thinking of doing like
it'll be like a weekend wherever we go, and it's
four cities in the year of Friday night, four things
live events, and then on Saturday doing like a brunch
and burn which is in a squad that we've been
doing where Aaron Opria, she's a trainer, she like travels
with us and we do like a workout in a brunch,

(53:14):
So it's like a weekend. The two totally separate events,
so maybe you can go to one or both or whatever. Um,
that's brilliant, podcast one being bigger, the workout being smaller.
But yeah, so I don't that's brilliant. We are going
to do one night events and we're gonna go do

(53:36):
um just a live podcast in the city. Uh there,
I'm we don't know the exact cities yet. We will
when the book comes out in twenty one. At the
beginning of twenty one, we'll spend a big chunk of
that spring going to as many cities as we can
because I want to have fun with my friends, and
so we we are throwing big parties in twenty one.

(53:57):
It'll be a party in every city that has a
podcast a match to it, so it'll be like, Okay, Austin.
We're coming to do a book launch party and there's
gonna be a live podcast with a guest. But this
is a party, So you bring your confetti popper because
I'm bringing mind. Like, we're gonna have a great time.
The ones in are gonna be um getting to some
cities that I've really wanted to see and people that
I'm like, I really need to get out to Portland.

(54:18):
I haven't been West Coast in a while. And so okay,
we'll just go out and we'll get a venue and
we'll pick a date and and it's not going to
be complicated. That's the beautiful thing about these is we
don't need eighteen other things. You know, y'all are gonna
do a show and then you're gonna have a workout
in a brunch. I don't need a bunch of bells
and whistles. Everyone that wants to come wants to see
this and wants to see us doing an interview like

(54:40):
this in in person, and they want to see their
friend Danny, and I want to see them, and so
that is what we're gonna do. So we're gonna do maybe.
I think the goal is in to do um, like
maybe five or six, and it'll just be a Friday
night or Thursday night and we'll do five or six
of those, and then in twenty one it will be
more like yeah, so yeah, that's the big bright So yeah, okay,

(55:04):
so um, let's get onto the next thing. And I
think we're going to tackle Instagram because I'm just curious
how you got so into it and your thoughts. Um,
So we'll do that next. Okay, third thing, Iniagram. Now
I am as long as I've been hearing about the intagram.

(55:26):
My sister has been into it for years. I will
say that I haven't fully committed two um the whole
thing because here's the problem. I'm going to really figure
out my number. And I've even had um so, I've
done the test, I've had aniogram, like actual experts expert

(55:47):
into it, like listen to me and my husband and
tell us our numbers, and I'm just like, I don't
really think that's my number. I don't know, but is
that my number? Me disagreeing with the number that I
was signed. I don't know. But because it's just it's hard.
And then my sister, she's really into it and has
read all the books and done all the things. So

(56:08):
then she um of course has her opinions on my number.
And you know that's another thing. How do you feel
about people having opinions about your number not allowed? I
think that's I think that's really if it's your sister.
But if it's your sister, since when do we get
to stop our sisters from doing anything in our lives.
So if you've listened to my podcast before, UM, then
we have covered the Instagram and I've had Instagram expert

(56:29):
on Intagram Hunter do you know Hunter Mowgli. Yeah, okay,
so that's who instagrammed me. Is that what you call it? Um?
But he's come on before to like really talk about
what it is, and basically it's the numbers are one
through nine, and it's what you're better. You're doing great? Okay,
thank you. Yeah. So it's what it's a it's a
it's not a personality type really, it's more of there

(56:52):
are nine different ways that you see the world that
we all see the world. And one expert that I
really like, named Beth McCord says, it's like nine different
out of glasses that you put on that so your
glasses may be a different shade of the world than
my glasses. And the thing that I like about the
Instagram now, I'm a big fan of strength Finders. I
love strength Finders too. I think that's really helpful. I
think Myers Briggs is really helpful when it comes to

(57:13):
personalities and work environment kind of things and how anybody
that works for you do those works with you. Okay,
we UM want when we are hiring someone new, we
want to know their Instagram number as best they can
self identify UM. And we want to know their strength Finders,
and we want to know their Myers Briggs because because
there's some things we really need and things we really

(57:35):
don't need, it doesn't mean the person is a good person.
It just means that we don't need what they're offering,
were not the rep fit for them, and so that
kind of helps as we're interviewing and shaping who's joining
the team. UM. So, of those nine different types of
the thing the Instagram that I have found most helpful
and one of the reasons I enjoy encouraging people to
spend some time learning about the Instagram is I have

(57:55):
it is very helpful and identifying the motives behind why
you do what you do, and that has been because
like we could all be in a restaurant there, the
restaurant could be full, and the fire alarm goes off,
and we all respond the same. We all run out.
We run out for nine different reasons, right like we
run out in nine different directions. We do nine different

(58:17):
things when we hear the same alarm. And while I
might run out because I don't want to get burned
because I'm super scared and i don't want anything to
hurt me because I'm self identify as a seven and
we kind of our problem our core issues. We fear pain,
and so I'm getting because I don't want to get burned.
But maybe A nine is getting out because they they

(58:39):
it's just not peaceful in there anymore. And they're gonna
keep running because they can't be where there's where there's
so much chaos. But if three is going to run
out because they don't want to burn their clothes because
their clothes were expensive, you know, I'm just making I mean,
I'm making this up and I'm stereotyping already like it.
You know what I'm thinking in my head right now
is you said something earlier. I think in the first
thing you said, like you are really good at people

(59:00):
things entertaining until they learned something that's yes, and like
you're telling a very entertaining story that is actually helping
me understand better where I'm like, okay, yeah, that's a
great way to put it. It's like we're all hearing
the same exact alarm, but there's gonna be nine different reactions.
And the reason we can't type other people is I
can't tell you why you ran out of that restaurant,

(59:21):
and you can't tell me why right now that the
restaurant you can go. I saw you right out that restaurant.
You made really fast. I bet your three. I saw
you right nowt that restaurant, and then you stopped and
help somebody. I bet your a two, right right right.
It's like, no, you can't know the motivation behind why
I do what I do. And so that's the reason
typing other people is a problem and going. And it's
also a reason when someone goes um and I'm bad

(59:43):
about this, but when someone goes I I had a
hard time turning in my book because every chapter wasn't perfect.
I go classic one and then they go, well, yeah
I am a one, but I wish you wouldn't do
that because of whatever you know. And so we also
even when you know someone's number, that always helps. So
one of the people I just say lunch with is
a nine and um, and we we laughed about who

(01:00:07):
was paying for lunch, and the girl behind the counter said, um,
to the nine, you should stand up for yourself and
I was like, that's probably three. But I was like,
I don't need to. I don't need to mess with that.
You know, like my there's a version of me wants
to go classic nine, letting me decide who pays, you know,

(01:00:27):
and um. And so I just think that that's why
it's helpful in my personal life. And I know this
is I think, I think you love on site two right,
packing that up in my life. In the last seven years,
I am trending towards emotional health in a better way
than I ever have before. And and that is because
of counseling and on site in the Instagram. The Instagram

(01:00:49):
showed me why I do what I do when I
always just thought, why do you always do this? How
come every time? I mean, Amy, I was in a
dating relationship and I got freaked out and instead of
telling him, I was freaked out. I got on a
plane and I flew to Florida and didn't tell anybody.
Like that's extreme, and that's what got me into counseling.

(01:01:11):
But like I always did something like that. I always
instead of saying when I was scared, I just ran away,
instead of going like, yeah, we should have a hard
conversation that may end up with us ending this. Instead,
I flew away, Like I didn't have words for why
I did that until the angiogram helped me understand that

(01:01:32):
there is this in a thing in me that wants
to run from that, and a healthy seven. A healthy
Annie is one who can be in a confrontational relationship
or a confrontational experience and not run away. So there's
growth in me when I stay. I maybe could have
learned that language without the indiogram, but man, the instagram

(01:01:52):
was such a fast track for me of how to
pursue my own emotional and spiritual health because I do
it with God too, and so it has taught me
so much about me. I had a guy on my
podcast recently named John Mark Comber, and he talked about
this at the beginning. But I do think the instagram
is probably being overly monetized now, and it's overly you

(01:02:13):
run out of the restaurant because of this, and and
this is the eight songs that you want on your
wedding playlist because you're a four. You know, like if
you follow antagram and coffee on Instagram total, there's probably
a little too much of that, And we're stereotyping a
little too much because it is so much deeper and
more profound than that. And so one of the things
John Marty said that I really resonated with iss. He said,

(01:02:33):
maybe for three as years, it's a really good spiritual
discipline to bring into your life, to learn it, to
learn yourself, and to walk toward healing. After three to
five years, it either becomes this like kitchy thing or
you need to go real deep into it and really
in like become an expert a scholar of it. And

(01:02:55):
I'm not into doing that. I don't want to do that.
So for me as far, I do feel like I
have gained everything I can gain from the amount of
learning I'm willing to do around the aniogram for now.
So my job now is to say to other people,
go learn yourself, Go read the road back to you,
Go do some studying, sit with some experts. That's what
I need to do. I need to read the road
back to you. Well, just get it and read. At

(01:03:16):
the start of each chapter, there are there's a checklist
of like here are the here are some things about
this number. And their checklist is really robust and it's
really helpful, and so I wonder if that would help you,
just to see that checklist. But but again, I would
never be the person who says you have to study
the Instagram to be a healthy person. I don't think

(01:03:37):
that's true. And you have to know your number and
tell everybody. In fact, John Mark, one of the things
he said is that the you know, a few generations ago,
when people are already using the Instagram, like um Jesuit
priests and such, they wouldn't tell anybody their antagram. Remember,
it was like so sacred to them, Like man, now
we like put it in our Instagram by like him

(01:03:58):
have a seven. Yeah, totally, And sometimes I like that.
By other times people are like like I had a
pretty hard friend conversation with another woman over coffee a
couple of weeks ago, and when we sat down, she said,
I know you're a seven, and this is hard for you,
and I want to be like, I'm okay, I'm here,
you know, I want to be like I don't want
I don't want people doing that. I don't I don't

(01:04:20):
necessarily conceive like this is how you feel right now
because but then again, with man it is helpful for me.
Like when I'm interested in and talking with et cetera too,
I go like, okay, when if, if me and this
two are gonna work, I need to listen with different
ears than seven years. And there's a lot of other

(01:04:41):
things I want to learn about him and that I'm
learning about him, but his twuness is an important thing
I'm learning about him. Or if it's a six and
I'm going, okay, I need to I need to know
some inclinations of sixes. But while I'm getting to know
him and getting to know all sorts of stuff about him,
how he handles the world through that pair of glasses,

(01:05:02):
I was dating a five and he would disappear for
days and not speak to me, and I was panicking.
And then I was like as as we when we
would have conversations, it would be like, yeah, I just
had to think about some stuff for a minute. I'm like,
oh that we're just built so different where I'm going
to like bang on the door of your cave until

(01:05:23):
you come out, and you're asking for two days in
your cave to think and and so it is so
helpful mostly mostly mostly for your own spiritual emotional growth.
It's secondarily helpful in relationship. Yeah, i'd say similar, different,
but it's kind of when you understand someone's love language
that you're in a relationship with, if you understand what

(01:05:44):
they need from you, and then why they're maybe doing
to you what and you're like, why this happening? Then
why do you keep washing my car? I don't care,
you know, And it's like, oh, I's like, why haven't
you noticed that I washed exactly, that's my house. He's
like acts. But when I do things for his to

(01:06:06):
receive his acts of service as well. So when I
do little things like make him coffee, it's like the
biggest thing in the world. If he massages my shoulders,
thank you, finally get it. You washed my car, But
all need as a shoulder rub. That's right, And so
to me, angiogram fits beautifully in that exact conversation of like,

(01:06:26):
here's one more thing after you learn yourself and you
get healthy around your own number as it is as
helpful as it is for you. UM, then use it
to love other people better, and use it to know
other people and put in the same category as learning
their love languages, and learning their strengths, and learning what
they how they take their coffee, and learning how they

(01:06:48):
what happens when they don't get enough sleep, all the
things you learn when you fall in love with a
friend or a partner. UM. One of those things can
be the any or if you have a coworker or
to oh yeah, knowing how my my full time employee,
knowing the glasses she wears and to work every day
helps me so much because she says, I'll ask a
question and and she will give me an answer, and

(01:07:11):
then two hours later she'll have a different answer. I
was like, well, I already did it based on what
you said the first time. But part of it is
that she needs more. She needs permission to have time
to give an answer, and I was wanting to answer
right away. So she was giving me her first answer,
but it wasn't her best answer. And so now we know.
And so now now I know if I that I
would love her opinion on things, and I need to

(01:07:32):
ask two hours before or the day before. I really
need to know. She can make great decisions on the fly.
But um, but it is more helpful and healthy for
her if I give her time. And so as a boss,
I want my people to feel like I am choosing
their health over my immediate needs. And and where they
both meet is the best place right where where they
can my employees can be really healthy, but I can

(01:07:54):
also we can also get everything done it needs to
get done. It helps for me to know their strength,
to know their love, anguages, to know there Yeah, and
so if any room sounds intriguing, like any said, she
has all last June kind of summer people on there,
each number, and then she's going to do it again.

(01:08:15):
So but I mean, you've got time to go. I
know people always I love giving people podcasts to go
back and listen to. You. You know you're something, You're
just like I need a good podcast. As soon as
are you listening to the New Deli parton It's America yet, Amy,
It's so good. As soon as an episode ends, I
want something else. And so when you when they finished
listening to this, you're giving them like a handful of
other things. Boom. Okay, next thing, can we talk about

(01:08:35):
what you're grateful for? Quick? Okay, that's going Okay, gratitude time.
Just four things that Annie is thankful for. Okay. I
am so thankful. Um, I am so thankful for my job.

(01:08:59):
It is the hardest thing I've ever done. You probably
feel this way too. It's I can't assume that, but
I would think it's very hard and very lovely and rewarding.
And and on days where I feel like I wish
I wasn't having to work, I wish that I could
just stay in my bed. Are days that I've tried
to think back to about ten years ago, and this
is all I wanted to do, and I wondered if

(01:09:19):
it would ever happen. So I'm really thankful for my job.
I am super thankful for my counselor. I see her tomorrow.
I get a haircut and a council appointment. Tomorrow. Feels
like everything's going to get right, put in its right place.
I know right. The books do tomorrow, I'll turn it
in by one o'clock and then it's a haircut and
accouncil of appointment. Um. I just I thank god for her,

(01:09:42):
that the Lord lined us up when I flew away
on that plane, and and that the Lord just made
a way for me to find a counselor who taught
teaches me and taught me about the mystery of God
and the mystery of life. I needed right answers for everything.
And she often reminds me, you know what if we
don't know, what do we do if we don't get
to know that? And that has healed me to be

(01:10:04):
able to ask more questions. And I thought I was
allowed to ask. I am so thankful Um for my friends,
kids I called my many BFFs, h and Halloween just passed,
and just being being a woman who's single with no
children yet and I want to be married with kids.
And it is just such a gift that my friends
share their kids with me, that they let me to

(01:10:26):
two of the families. There's about six families and me
that are kind of spent a lot of time together
and to it because there's another Annie in our group.
Dave Barnes's wife is also named Anny. Um. They called
me Annie downs like a double name. Like two of
the kids. The rest of the kids call me crazy Annie.
And two families call me Annie Downs. And I just
got a video two days ago of two of the
kids going. The mom just said, Okay, tell her what

(01:10:47):
you're telling me, and the little five year old boy says,
any Downs, I love you, any Towns, I love you,
and I like you just like I. I have not
been a good enough person, or a kind enough person,
or a brave enough person to get that kind of love.
And and so I just recognize what a gift it
is when anybody chooses to love you, even after they
know you. What a gift. What a gift. And so

(01:11:11):
I'm so grateful for them. And um, my fourth thing
is I just had the lunch I was just telling about.
I had breakfast burrito, and I love Mexican food for breakfast.
What a joy. I'm so grateful that people figured out
that you could put eggs and potatoes and avocado and
black beans together. Right. I just was so so happy.

(01:11:32):
I just love breakfast Mexican food. So I'm thankful for you,
and I'm thankful to be here and the work you do.
That's fifth one. I figured that was a too easy
of an answer that everyone probably says that, but I
from a distance, I've watched you actually nobody's Well, let
me tell you what I think is true. From a distance,
I have watched you love our greater community. I've watched

(01:11:56):
you love Nashville and care about Nashville very well. But
obviously you all are national, and I'm sure people from
other cities feel that too. But but up close, I've
watched you love our friends really well, even when you
were doing the hard work of healing and adopting and
all the things. I just think you, Um, you seem
to love really well, and so I'm grateful for you
and how you model that for me and my other friends.

(01:12:17):
Thank you, I mean, I would say that if we
weren't recording, I really I believe, Okay, and that's really nice. UM,
And I just I I'm thankful to have you on.
And then thankful for our little gratitude segment that we
try to do because it's just really important and I
think it also we learn a little bit more like
that you love UM. Next can Foo for breakfasts just

(01:12:39):
the best? What a surprise, I know, who knew we
got to do that? When I was little and we
ate tacos for dinner. No one ever told me that
Texas did that for breakfast. Yeah, born and raised Texan
right here, right, you've always known breakfast tacos. We didn't
do that in Georgia a little. My dad would go
find us some, Um Teresa, Yeah see I didn't even know.
Nowturday Mornings swip it up. So yeah, well, thank you

(01:13:03):
for taking the time to come on. I know that
you are super busy, but for you, finally, my people
are going to be happy. I got her on and
I had you verbally commit recorded wise that you have
to copy on mine. Done. I cannot wait and um yeah,
well until well, I mean hopefully I'll see you maybe somewhere.
But for listeners, you're hearing Annie here now, and the

(01:13:23):
next time you'll hear us again on a podcast will
be on um Annie's podcast, So um, I can't wait
for that. Okay's

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Annie F. Downs: Books. Podcast talk. Enneagram & Relationships. Gratitude.