Ask HTM - Max Car Rental Savings, Fun Money Convos with Partners, & Diversifying with REITs #844 - How to Money

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I am Matt.
Today we're answering your listener questions.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
That is right, it's time to hear from you, our
listeners out there. Joel, you and I we are we're
the purveyors of the podcast here and we're so thankful
for everyone out there who listens to the podcast. We
wouldn't be here if it wasn't for you. We've got
some awesome we would be for some existence. But I
don't know. If we didn't have anyone listening, you wouldn't
be sitting here in a little clubhouse recording a little

(00:45):
podcast for all the folks out there to hopefully better
their their financial situation. But we've got a listener who
has saved the most on a car rentals. We're excited
to kind of talk about what she did and how
to even take it to the next level. Another listener
wants to have some money conversations with a significant other
that are going to be impactful. How to go about
doing that? And we got another one where someone is

(01:07):
interested in diversifying their portfolio, perhaps with reats real estate
and investment trusts, maybe not with reats. Yeah, so we'll
get to that one and more during today's episode.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
On the cardental thing, by the way, well, I just
want to note you could save a lot of money
by doing this, and then there's a really simple solution.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
So we'll get to that in just a minute. Not
just like ten percent.

Speaker 1 (01:25):
No no, no, no, like you can get that bill in half
significan amount.

Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah. Yeah, and this listener's doing it the hard way.
We want to make it easy.

Speaker 1 (01:31):
But Matt, real quick, before we get to all these
great questions, I just wanted to mention, have you ever
gotten like your haircut at you do your own haircutting?
This is a dumb question, but you've heard of people
own hairs get their haircuts and their haircut at a
hair cutting school, right to save money?

Speaker 2 (01:45):
Yeah, I know you're talking about. Okay, same thing with
like a dental hygienist that's in training. Where I grew up,
there's a dental school and so a friend of ours
she was becoming a dental hygienist. And I never I
was in high school, so I didn't really care to
go get my teeth culled, but she was always asking.
Friend never cared to dude, I floss at least once
a day. You don't the brush multiple times a day.

(02:07):
Who has a toothbrush in our office bathroom? And who
brushes their teeth ur in the day. It's all about prevention, baby, No,
you got to get the junk out of there. It's true,
but you haven't been in the dentist in a long time.
It's been a minute.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
Yeah, okay, but not trying to like talk smack about
your your dental hygiene. It's great, sounded like you were.
But the what I was kind of highlight here. I
didn't think about this till the other day, but I've
mentioned this on the show. My wife is studying to
become a marriage and family therapist. She's in her internship year,
and so she has started seeing clients, been doing it
for a couple of months now. It's really fun to see.
But the other thing it made me think of was

(02:38):
like she's at this nonprofit and people can go see
her for a whole lot less money than they would
normally pay a traditional full price therapist.

Speaker 2 (02:46):
Oh so she's like the stylist in training at hygienist
in training.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
That yeah, that's right, by the way, So for everyone
out there, like everybody knows talk therapy is incredibly expensive.
And so if you're like saying I could, totally I could.
I would love to talk to somebody about what's going
on in my life, but man, I can't afford the
one hundred and fifty one hundred and eighty two hundred
bucks an hour or whatever it is, and insurance maybe

(03:11):
doesn't cover your ability to go see someone. Look into
one of these nonprofit therapy centers near you and see
if you might be able to go see someone for
a fraction of that cost. Maybe yeah, a third to
a quarter of the cost.

Speaker 2 (03:22):
So I like it. Yeah, okay, Well, so here's my
question then, because when you go and get yourself a
trainee haircut, you know what the risks are, right, Like,
you are there, maybe even getting a free haircut, but
at the very least paying a discounted rate because you
know that there's a chance they might watch it. So,
I mean, do you think the same dynastics are higher
with your mental health?

Speaker 3 (03:41):
Baby?

Speaker 4 (03:42):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (03:42):
Like, do you think that this? So do the same dynamics?
Are they still in play when it comes do you
think to like going to see an intern? I think so? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (03:51):
I think so. So you've done that, your wife? I
mean Emily, she's top note, well, she's learning a lot,
and these just saying the first couple of months. I
think even seeing an I don't have the experience. Though,
even seeing an intern in month two versus month eleven
of their training, he's gonna be a vast difference.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
So that's the sweet spot. You got to find somebody,
like you want to find the diamond in the rough.
You want to find the crystal veteran intern, but you
want to find somebody who's like up and coming or
they haven't you know, they're not fully light. I don't know.
I guess Emily's licensed at this point. That's why.

Speaker 1 (04:21):
Yet she'll be she used to pass the test after
she graduates intern year, you're not. You're you're being overseen
by a license, all right.

Speaker 2 (04:27):
So basically, you want to see somebody that's like right
before getting licensed. And I don't know, maybe they could
even extend that discounted rate to you. I love the
idea of finding that sweet spot and finding somebody who
I mean, that's like buying low and selling high, right
that's not charging like the absolute full commission rate yet,
but still is somebody who's talented, like you know, like

(04:47):
Emily is where you are able to perhaps get a deal,
but at the same time maybe not stuff for the
consequences of having somebody who doesn't have the experience to
talk you through some of your issues.

Speaker 1 (04:57):
It's like getting the premiere Major League Baseball players before
they enter into free agency. Like those first years are cheap,
and then when you pay full price, you're like, yeah,
I don't want you to play something for another team.
I don't want to pay you are demanding a premium
seven hundred million dollars like the show.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Speaking of okay, well go back to the haircuts thing.
What do you think of my little dudes of Weston's bus. Yeah,
it looks great.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
I've tried to talk my little dude into getting the
same I'll give.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
It to him. No, I convinced him to do it
by like he it was all up in his eyes
and it was getting to be a mess because it's
getting hot and sweaty out there. But I told him that, hey,
I want to give you an army haircut, give you
a soldier haircut. You're marketing it. Well, you got really
excited about that and was all all for it. Yeah,
and it's just an easier haircut to give like, I'm like,
you know, you'd be surprised, Like, well, the short you go,
you see every misstroke of the clippers with the guard.

(05:45):
It's I'm still learning, man, while like I've okay, I'm
sure we've. I don't know if folks have heard us
talk about this before, but cutting your own hair literally
something I've done since I was like a little over
ten years old. Yeah, and I just think about all
the money I've saved over literally over decades. But then
if I can get better at it, man, the ability
to continue to multiply that by six moving forward.

Speaker 1 (06:06):
Maybe past six, maybe I'll sign my family up for
haircuts at your place too. I might charge you only
at the intern rate. Okay, all right, I'll take it.
Let's move on, Matt. Let's mention the beer we're having
on this episode. This is called bike Tour. We like biking,
so of course we're probably gonna like this beer. Well,
we have our thoughts on this. Hell's Lagger by Creature
Comforts at the end of the episode. Yeah, but let's
move on to questions. If you have a money question,

(06:28):
we'd love to hear from you. Just record a voice
memo on your phone of you asking the question, send
it our way howdomoneypod at gmail dot com or go
to how to money dot com slash ask for the
simple instructions. Matt, let's get to the first one. This
one's about doing regular money check ins.

Speaker 3 (06:43):
Hey, Matt and Joel, this is Ben from Seattle. Love
the podcast and really enjoy all the interviews you do
with folks on the show and leve all the great
information you're sharing. My question today is I know you've
talked before about a year in review or annual meeting
you have with your partners. I'm in a stage of
life right now where I've been working for a few
years and pretty comfortable with my savings for retirement and

(07:07):
other goals. And then my partner is graduating dental school,
so she'll start working here shortly, and once we have
a feel for her income, we want to sit down
and have a meeting to review our financial goals for
the next year. One of the things I'm wondering is
what kind of questions do you ask during that meeting
or go over or topics you discuss, and then any
other tips to make it like the most effective meeting

(07:29):
and maybe fun so it's enjoyable. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks.

Speaker 2 (07:35):
Ooh, Matt. What Ben said is why he's about to
graduate from.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
Dental school, speaking of getting your teeth cleaned before she graduates, Ben,
I'd like to make an appointment. Okay, So Ben, first off,
I love that you asked, like right there at the end,
you talked about making these conversations enjoyable.

Speaker 2 (07:51):
This is so key. This is so clutch because the
more arduous the task is, the more likely you are
to avoid it. And I think that's particularly true for
folks who feel like that they aren't well versed in money.
It becomes this chore something you avoid doing all together.
And so I think there are a lot of ways
to tackle this right, to make it a little more fun.
And the first thing that comes to mind is I

(08:12):
would call it something different, you know, make it make
it catchy, make it a little funny. We're talking about
marketing and branding, but put it on the calendar. And
this actually makes me think of Joel. So every morning
we have a standing meeting. Uh And originally when I
created it called it the morning huddle because that's like
what businesses do, like the scrum. I don't know like
software developers, they get like scrum and get together. I

(08:33):
don't even know what that means, rugby turn. I just yeah,
but it's a way for them to all kind of
pile in together or something.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
I don't even though I've never worked for a software
it's like it's like a pile up in football.

Speaker 2 (08:42):
But yeah. But similarly, I was like, oh, it's like
a huddle. So it's a way for you and me
to kind of talk about stuff that we're going to
discuss on an upcoming episode. Business stuff, behind the scenes,
blah blah blah whatever. But at some point you called it,
I'm pretty sure as you you called it a hey,
let's let's do our cuddle session. And I thought, well,
that's that's funny. It's on the calendar. I just change
it from morning huddle, it's morning cuddle, and it's this

(09:04):
repeating event makes it sound sweeter. It's just more fun.
We don't actually cuddle. Our wives had some questions about it,
because it's a shared calendar that we share with our
wives as well, But I feel like that's just a
clear way to I don't know, words matter. What you
call things matter, And instead of calling it the annual
year in budget meeting, it can be like, hey, let's
let's talk about what we want to do with our money.
Right In this way you can kind of build the

(09:25):
hype and make it more just a little more positive
than negative. Yeah, But then as far as the actual meeting,
I think what that could look like is even getting
away to like cabin in the woods if you're down
with that, right, Like if you're hiking and you're hammicking,
but with a fairly important money conversation thrown in, Well,
that sounds a whole lot more fun to me than again,
the very businesslike meeting. Were you to address it that way.

Speaker 1 (09:48):
You want it to be instead of like business time
in the hard sense, you wanted to be business time
in the was that the concords part of the concord
sense right to be a little like fun Lucy goosey. Yeah,
it's the whole Mary Poppins thing, this spoonful of sugar,
Matt like it helps the medicine go down. And she
was spot on whatever that was sixty years ago when
they made that movie. And I think the same is

(10:10):
just eminently true for everything we want to get accomplished
in our lives, especially in regards to money, the easier
we can make it in terms of automation, the better
we can market it, the more likely we are to
follow through. And of course bring some craft beer along
to that meeting as well. Right, it's like, yeah, you
open a bottle of something that you enjoy, have that
conversation in a more down to earth way, and I

(10:32):
think you're more likely to make progress. You're more likely
to actually get the thing done. Next, I'd say to
let your life goals influence your money goals. It's more
fun to talk about hosts and dreams than it is
to allocate dollars and cents and to talk about whether
or not we're going to cut the streaming budget this
year or something like that. And that is of course
a necessity that has to be part of the conversation.

(10:53):
But if you let the dollars flow in the direction
of your biggest goals, that makes this conversation a heck
of a lot more fun, which we love. So it
helps you step back and take the forest, not just
the trees approach. Right, It's easier than in the future
or later on in the conversation to slash your smartphone budget.

(11:13):
Maybe say, all right, we're going to delay our upgrade
cycles this year, or to say, listen, we are finally
going to make that switch to one of those lower
cost nba os because we're paying Verizon way too much
money and guess what we're worth. It's worth the trade
off because of that other bigger goal we just talked about.
It's going to help us get there quicker.

Speaker 2 (11:27):
Right.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
It just means that you've got bigger fish to fry,
and so that those smaller potatoes. You're more willing to
make sacrifices and trade offs in those regards. So it's
easier to say no then to I don't know, expanding
your clothing budget if you're saving up for a down
payment in two years, if that's a top notch priority.
Most of the time, though, if you come come at
me and you say, hey, listen, are you willing to

(11:48):
produce your craft beer budget, I'd be like, heck no.
But if someone offered me something better in return, of course,
I'm willing to cut back on my craft.

Speaker 2 (11:54):
Beer and have a conversation about you. And that's yeah,
And that's what it sounds like, Ben, that you're wanting
to do is have these kind of conversations Yeah, when
you have these goals, when you have a why behind
saying no to certain expenses that other folks think are normal,
well you're gonna find that it's far less difficult to
you know, take the road less traveled. And if you,
like you said j if you start with like the
nitty greedy stuff like okay, we've got to cut our
Hulu subscription, you're going to miss out on some of

(12:16):
those most important comers.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
It feels like you're starting the conversation from a point
of austerity at that point, as opposed to like an
informed reason to get to make that cut, Because yeah,
you might easily be like, who cares about Hulu?

Speaker 2 (12:27):
I don't need Hulu in my life. But if it.

Speaker 1 (12:29):
Starts with like we have to eradicate seven ninety nine
a month, like you know, start from the other.

Speaker 2 (12:33):
Side first, Yeah, exactly, and not that there's no place
for a questioning those expenses, but just don't start there.
And it makes me think about how, like one of
the earliest episodes we did was The Why Behind Your Money,
and we kind of ripped off Frederick Nietzsche when we
tackled that topic because he's got that line where he
who has a why can endure or can bear almost
any how, that's when all of a sudden, Halu subscription

(12:55):
becomes very unimportant, next to say saving up for a
downplaint payment like you mentioned bil or Hey, we want.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
To bring our first child in the end of the
world and it's going to cost this, this and this. Okay, cool,
It makes it way more exciting to cut back on
the things that you care about less exactly.

Speaker 2 (13:10):
But then the next thing that we would recommend for
you to do is look to the past. We're talking
about reviewing your expenses, reviewing your income over the past
twelve months, and you want to ask yourself, like, are
we on track to reach the goals that we've set out,
Like actually look at your expenses and figure out if
any part of your budget, if any of that's gotten
out of control. And so maybe that means you need

(13:30):
to update your budget. Maybe it means you need to
either find ways to boost your income, maybe buckle down
a bit more, maybe hit up your favorite restaurant a
little less often. Basically, you just want to shine a
spotlight on what it is that went right over the
past twelve months and what it is that didn't and
find ways to remedy the things that didn't quite align
with maybe what you said at the beginning of the
year that you wanted to do, and in fact somehow

(13:51):
you kind of got a little derailed. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Yeah, the past is going to be indicative of the future,
or at least it's going to you're right, like highlight
the things, the changes that you can or should make.
And by the way, Ben, you're you're very wise getting
married to an almost dentists. Dentist, that's a that's a
lucrative career, and dentists seem to have more autonomy than
others in the medical profession too, which is great. And
you said your wife she's almost done with dental school,

(14:14):
which rocks, And that means you're about to stop forking
over money for her schooling. And maybe that means you're
gonna have a chunk of student loan debt to pay
off as well. But you're also going to have a
lot more income in the near future too, and I'm
sure in vast access to what that student loan payment's
going to be. That is one of the most important
items to address too, right, because especially when we're talking

(14:34):
about big jolts to lifestyle or budget. Those are inflection
points that need more time, attention and discussion. So I
would start to talk about when our income increases, when
we do hit new levels in our income, what's the
top priority going to be. Do we want to max
out this in that retirement account first and save more
for the down payment on a home, or do we

(14:54):
have a car that's on death's door and we need
to start budgeting ahead for that. But I think if
you don't, if you even constructed a plan for where
you want that money to go, the likely scenario is
it's going to get incorporated into your budget. Everything's just
going to inflate a little bit and you're kind of
look back six months later and be like, where did
all that extra in come? Do?

Speaker 2 (15:10):
I think that's a regular experience for a lot of people. Yeah,
there are some other things I think that are worth
covering every year. And a metric worth discussing is your
net worth? How's that looking? Because it's certainly it's not
like a perfect indicator of your financial health. The stock
market's got down years, of course, but with the combination
of your savings rate plus market returns and what it
is that we've been seeing, especially over the past year,

(15:32):
it should be going at fairly regularly. And then also too,
I guess you know, as you are reviewing the past
year and looking at some of the different expenses and
what it is the different purchases that move the needle
the most for you, which one of those were duds?
Which ones do you think? Man, we spend a lot
of money on that, but it didn't Actually, I feel
very dissatisfied with that massive purchase, and I think that
that can help you to spend more mindfully moving forward

(15:55):
as well. And of course it's a good idea to
cover some of the boring stuff as well. Maybe take
a look at whether or not you need a will
in place, your beneficiaries on your different investment accounts, take
a look at insurance and your coverage amounts. Those they
don't often change year to year, but it's just worth
taking a look at them to make sure that they're
still accurate. And you might find, for instance, that your
term life maybe that you know, maybe the needs that

(16:17):
you have there are increasing now that you're both working,
now that you've got just a higher expectation as to
what it is that the other person is bringing in.
And it doesn't take long before you get used to that,
and so you might want to go ahead and get
it and let's say another term policy in place, another
thing to consider. Yeah, I agree ultimately. I would say though,
like going back to the very first thing, Joe that
you said though, like setting those goals like because that
is going to basically drive the ship and we can

(16:38):
link to It's been a minute since we've mentioned this,
but the Money Mission Statement that we created is a
simple PDF. But that might help you Bin and you
and your partner to start having a conversation as to
what it is that you want your life to look
like as you're essentially stepping back and kind of designing,
like you're putting pen to paper and you're thinking through
what do we want our life to look like?

Speaker 4 (16:56):
That.

Speaker 2 (16:56):
It's a PDF that will link to in the show
notes for this episode.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
Good questions to proud you get you thinking and get
you talking together about some of those larger goals that
you do have, so that you feel like you're pointing
in the same direction together, which is powerful because you're
on the same team after all. I think sometimes Matt,
it can feel like even Mary couples, I feel like
they're not on the same team. Maybe they're at odds,
and I think doing something like that together, an exercise
like that together, can help, I don't know, put you

(17:21):
back on the same page and heading in the same
direction again. All Right, We've got more to get to
on this episode, including a novel way to buy a
rental property. We'll get to that and more right after this.

Speaker 2 (17:38):
All right, buddy, we are back to the break. We've
got plenty more to get to during our episode today,
including we'll talk about how you can pay the least
amount possible on your car insurance. But first, let's hear
from a listener who is trying to get into real estate.

Speaker 5 (17:52):
Hi, joll them, Matt. My name is Kip and I've
been listening to you guys for a while now. Your
friendship is just gold and I really really enjoy seeing that.
I'm contacting you guys because I got a question about
some real estate, and in particular of the episode that
you guys did with Alten and the real estate fire scenario.

(18:13):
Right now, I'm a highly invested in the market and
the market has been good to me, and I'm looking
to diversify a bed and I've got my down payment
money saved up and I'm ready to go, but I
just can't find a property with the seven percent interest
rates that's going to give me enough positive cash flow
forward to make sense. And so, like I said, the

(18:33):
money's been sitting in the Hiio savings and right now
and because of that, you know, I tenn five percent.
But I do feel like I've missed out a lot
of the market of this last year. But you know,
when you're saving, that's just what you gotta do. And
being that, I don't think that rates going to be
going down anytime soon, and the market's at it all

(18:55):
time hot. What I'm wondering, and I like some input
from you guys, is if I want to be the
first fight a bit into real estates, so I just
go ahead and buy some rates now, or or would
you guys just wait it out till something changed with
rape or we get some kind of some kind of
down on the state market. Guys, could I really appreciate
any advice that you give, And thanks to ask guys.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
Take care, Kip, thanks for the kind words. Man and
Matt Little does he know this friendship thing? It's all
shtick we've been that's true. I'm putting this on we
don't even like each other, never talked to each other
in real life.

Speaker 2 (19:28):
That's right. Our families actually don't know each other. That's
a whole fabricate, it's all made up. This is one
elaborate ruse we've got going on now.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Just kidding, of course, And yeah, hopefully that's one of
the things that that shines for, especially in an era
mat where like friendships are lacking, relationships are feel disconnected.

Speaker 2 (19:44):
I don't know, true, it's the loneliness epidemic.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
Yeah, it's it's real, and like we've got lots of
other friends too, but it's it's kind of fun to
I don't know, just be friends who are creating something together.

Speaker 2 (19:54):
And that's true. Yeah, but let's get to let's get
to Kip's actual he was that was just a little
side comment and Kip, yeah, we pre you mentioning that.
But yeah, seven percent mortgage rates not helping out the
real estate market today. The stock market, I'll say, that's
been good to all of us recently. And you are
writing and what you said about saving you are going
to miss out on returns sometimes. But if the market,

(20:16):
let's just say the stock market took a fifteen percent
dip well, you feel like a genius by saving, by
keeping that money liquid within a savings account and avoiding
the worst of it, you're not seeing your principal amount declined.
There it's going to be impossible to predict what the
market is going to do within shorter time frames, and
all you can do is just base your decision on
wisdom and history. What it is that historical market returns

(20:38):
have been. And hopefully you're maximizing returns with a portion
of your nest egg that you don't need anytime soon,
which is great, But it would be unwise to try
to maximize those returns by investing those dollars that you're
hoping to deploy. Of course, that could leave you then
without sufficient funds to put down when the right house
comes along. It could prevent you from being able to
pull the trigger on a great property. Yeah, you're exactly right.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
You feel like a loser when you've got money in
savings and the market it's just crushing. But you feel
like a brilliant person when the market is dramatically dropping
and you've got more money in savings. But let's talk
about first whether or not Kip needs to diversify. I
don't necessarily think he has to. You certainly can. But
I don't see any problem with folks who are only

(21:21):
investing in the stock market, right. I think that approach
approach in and of itself, can be diversified enough. Real estate, Yes,
it can add more diversity, but because of the part
time job nature of it, most folks are going to
choose to avoid investing in real estate, and those folks
are still going to be well prepared for retirement. If
they're dollar cost averaging, we can weak out a decent

(21:43):
percentage of their paycheck. Real estate has been good to
you and to me, Matt, and we think that with
the right long term mindset and financial preparation that it
can be good to others too. Just don't think that
you need to build a mini real estate empire in
order to achieve financial security. It's really about what I
want to and gaining the knowledge and then implementing that

(22:05):
in a slow but sure strategy. But you don't have
to do it in order to get to retinacial independence.
A lot of folks have done it in the stock
market all and there's a ton of four to one
k millionaires people that have only invested in their four
one k and guess what, they reached retirement status with
plenty without having to dabbled in real estate at all.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
Yeah, And Kip specifically mentioned our conversation with Alan Corey,
and it can be difficult to hear someone talking about
real estate like that when you are crazy passionate about it,
and Alan obviously is, and like he's yeah, he's a
self He's a self professing real estate maximalist, like that
is all that he cares about pretty much during our
conversation with him, I think he even like we even

(22:42):
talked about not investing in the market because it's like,
why would I do that when I have the ability
to see outside returns within real estate? But Alan is
a very special individual, Like he's a unique individual. He's
got essentially like an unfair advantage given his profession being
a realtor, being an investor, being someone who like eats
and breathes the stuff. He's got like a special set
of skills that allows him to essentially outperform when not

(23:05):
taken well, not everybody else could do that. But Kip,
I'm I'm glad you mentioned the diversification part of it, Joel,
because I feel like, what's funny is like I actually
kind of did the opposite thing several years ago. Essentially,
I didn't feel quite comfortable with the amount of real
estate that I had, how much wealth I had tied
up in real estate, and so that meant that I
pretty much like overnight, like once I had that realization,

(23:25):
like I just stopped looking at real estate, which I
will say it's harder to actually do that in practice
because you get in the habit of like scouring Zillow
and redfit and seeing what deals are out there, but
the ability to then try to funnel as many dollars
into the market. I just honestly, I felt like I
didn't have enough stock market exposure at that point in time.
But so much of that comes down to what it
is that you are interested in pursuing. And that's one

(23:48):
aspect of investing in real estate that you can't overlook.
It does take a lot of time, and the part
time nature of managing your own properties is something that
you need to make sure that you are well aware
of that getting yourself into yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:02):
I mean that is one of the biggest drawbacks, right
because investing in the market incredibly passive dollar cost out.
You don't even have to really think about it once
you've got it set up. But with real estate, you're
going to be forced to think about it, and you're
gonna want to think about it proactively so that that
investment does well, because without regular maintenance and attention to
the property and to your tenants, like it won't do

(24:24):
all that well. Your sweat equity, your elbow grease is
going to be a big part of your ability to
make that investment succeed. And Kip also points out a
real problem with the real estate market right now. Matt
he mentions the lack of affordability. It's tough for want
to be primary homeowners, but it's also an issue for investors, right.
And so if you invest in the stock market and
we experienced a ten percent pull back, no harm, no foul, right,
But we've got a long time price in and you're

(24:45):
not like relying on that investment to produce income. But
if you buy an expensive home at a high rate
and the housing market experiences a correction or rents recede
as they have been in many markets around the country recently,
and you are banking on twenty five hundred dollars a
month in rent from that property, and now it's running
for twenty two fifty. Well, that impacts your cash flow, right,
and the rewards can be big, of course, but that

(25:06):
financial risk that you occur is bigger in real estate too.

Speaker 2 (25:09):
Yeah, so what is it that Kip should do? Should
you wait? And that's going to be a hard question
to answer because I do see some influencers saying that, hey,
in twenty thirty, right, six years from now, you're going
to be thrilled that you bought a house back in
twenty twenty four. I do think that's likely true. But simultaneously,
home prizes have had a massive run up over the
past few years. Are they likely going to increase had

(25:30):
a similar clip over the next few years, I would
be surprised if they did. They're probably not going to
do that. I think we could see a price plateau
as the housing market normalizes. And it's not that you
can't find a deal that makes sense. It's just going
to be a whole lot harder though, given the current
market conditions. And yeah, what's to do in the meantime though,
because you know, you can't dollar cost average into real estate, unless, however,

(25:53):
you opt for reats like you mentioned. I think that
could be a reasonable choice because you're going to avoid
the part time a portion of investing in real estate.
But again, at the same time, you're going to miss
out on some of the reasons that owning physical property,
the reasons that make that even more beneficial as well.
And so personally, I didn't like if I didn't own
and I think a lot of folks might say, well, yeah,

(26:13):
Matt juwel y'all, you know you have actual physical real estate.
That's why you don't recommend reads. I personally don't think
I would actually invest in reads either. If yeah, I don't,
I truly don't think I would. I think I would
rather just play it safe and simple, just invest in
the S and p FI funded all the way, just
like I currently am. It's just that the deals that
we came across, given the interest rate environment that we
were in five to twelve years ago, the pricing environment too,

(26:37):
it made all the sense in the world at that
point in time. And yeah, like Kip is realizing it,
it does not seem like it makes as much sense
these days.

Speaker 1 (26:44):
Yeah, I mean, you and I were valuists, and so
what a real estate If someone came to me and said, hey,
I want to show you this property for one hundred
thousand dollars, and it was gonna the rent on the
property was likely going to be fourteen hundred dollars. I'd
be like, Uh, great, let's do this.

Speaker 2 (26:58):
When can we close?

Speaker 1 (26:59):
But the economics currently don't make sense for most want
to be investors, especially people just starting out. It's really
hard to find a deal where it was just so
much easier to find a reasonable deal that made sense
and could cash flow with solid upside six eight, ten
years ago. So it's a tougher environment. You're write, Matt,
and I don't know. I would tell Kip you got

(27:19):
the cash on hand, keep looking for deals, don't hesitate
to make offers, and follow through if you find a
good one. But also don't feel like you have to
write if nothing great comes along.

Speaker 2 (27:28):
I would not.

Speaker 1 (27:29):
I think patience is key as a real estate investor
waiting for the right deal, especially if it's your first deal.
There's a real estate investor I follow Matt and he's
so incredibly patient, and he's like, I'm constantly making offers.
He hasn't done a deal in like two or three years,
but he's always looking and always ready to pounce, and
he's at the ready like a gun slinger from the

(27:49):
old Wild West or something like that. Right, he's ready
to go when given the chance. But I think that
patience pays off in spades. It's better to get no
deal than to get a bad deal.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
Totally. But all right, let's hear from our next listener, Joel.
This is a listener who is trying to figure out
what to do with her mortgage.

Speaker 4 (28:04):
Hi, guys, this is Becky from Pennsylvania. Thanks for answering
my question and for all the wonderful resources you provide.
I have three options I could go with my money
for the next year, and I'm not sure which way
to go. The number one thing I wanted to do
was to pay off my thirty thousand dollars mortgage and
have that wonderful feeling of being debt free. However, it

(28:27):
is low interest at three point one two five percent.
The second thing I could do is save my money
in a high ye savings account at four point one
two five percent. Would be nice to just save money
and collect interest. The third option is to do a
home renovation, and that would be nice to have done.
Can you tell me why I should keep my mortgage.

Speaker 1 (28:49):
Thanks guys, Well, Matt, can we tell her why she
should keep her mortgage? I got to say, I love
the Becky's done her homework on this. She's come up
with three options. She really thought through this, right, And Becky,
that shines through in your question that you have you've
really Yeah, you've given this some thought over a period
of time, and yeah, you just you feel like you're
at a crossroads, maybe at a little bit of a conundrum,

(29:10):
and we'll do our best offer, like some pros and
cons of each of those potential decisions that you threw out.

Speaker 2 (29:14):
Yeah, and specifically, Becky said that she's got her money
saved in a high yield savings account. By the way,
because I would say, if you were with one of
the big banks getting paid next to nothing, that would
obviously be a real problem. But Becky, you made it
sound like that the number one most exciting option for
you is to pay off that mortgage. You quoted it,
called it the wonderful feeling of being totally debt free,

(29:36):
and it certainly sounds lovely. And while it's not like
that there is a massive post tax gap between what
you would earn there in your savings account, and then
the debt that you'd be paying off. That being said,
not paying it off gives you options.

Speaker 1 (29:48):
Basically, Hey, the income you make from that high yield
savings account, you're gonna be taxed on it, and so yeah,
you're okay, cool, five percent.

Speaker 2 (29:56):
That's great.

Speaker 1 (29:56):
Well, when you're taxed on the earning to that five percent,
it's not quite five percent relie the day.

Speaker 2 (30:00):
Yeah. Yeah. But I guess what I'm trying to highlight here, though,
is the fact that having some liquid savings on hand,
especially there within a high yield savings account like that,
it's incredibly underrated and you might not know what it
is that you need it for now, although it does
sound like you do know what you want to use
it for, possibly a renovation, but you might end up
changing your mind. But while that debt free feeling would
be incredibly nice, you're already headed in that direction already,

(30:23):
and I would say maybe just just hold off a
bit longer, especially to considering the fact that if you've
worked that balance down to I think she said thirty
thousand dollars, the majority of what she's paying with you
when it comes to her mortgage payments, she's paying to herself,
and so there isn't a high amount of that payment
that is going towards interest, that's going look at the statements. Yeah,
that's go into the bank. That money is going towards

(30:44):
equity within your actual property.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
Yeah, so it's truly a personal decision. I think paying
off your mortgage, even if it is attached to an
incredibly low rate, is less egregious. Right when you're closing
in on your retirement years, If you pay that off
like laser focused, and you're avoiding investments because in your
in your late twenties or early thirties or something like that,
it's a different ballgame.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
But yeah, there's a lot of time that money is
not compounding where you're getting a headstart on your investments
as opposed to eliminating something that's yeah, provides you with
a little more piece of it.

Speaker 1 (31:14):
There's just so many more financial goals you're trying to
achieve in those earlier decades that you just don't want
to prioritize something that should be a low priority. And
I'm not sure how old you are, Becky, but I
would allow your age to be at least a partial
influence on this. Consciously paying off your mortgage in your sixties,
even if it's not the most optimized thing to do,
can provide the peace of mind that you mentioned, and
it can help protect your wealth by increasing your cash flow.

(31:36):
So that is something worth taking into consideration. And again
it's a personal choice. I think you can go either
way here, but just want to throw that out there,
that age should be at least part of yours. I
think it's also a lot of advisors are now saying
to older Americans, don't pay off your mortgage early. Actually
retain that flexibility. So I do think that things have changed,
but I do think it's at least more advisable still
later on in life than it is those early investing years.

Speaker 2 (31:59):
Yeah, and then again, just at the very end of
Becky's question, she mentioned renovating her home, and you know,
I'm not sure of how big of a renovation she's considering.
I'm not sure how much it's going to cost, Becky,
but hopefully your current stash of cash is going to
be enough to pull it off, because I think you
would end up putting yourself up the creek without a
paddle if you paid off that low interest mortgage with

(32:20):
all of your available cash. And then you found yourself
in a position where that renovation, where it's a high
priority and you haven't been able to save up enough
in order to pay for it with cash. Again, I
think a lot of times, the paidoff mortgage, it's sort
of like a default goal that folks have when I
don't know, maybe when you haven't given it a whole
lot of thought as to what, in this case, what
you want your space to look like. And I don't know,

(32:42):
in my mind, the renovation and creating something that you're
really excited about that's just so much more empowering and
so much more encouraging, and something that is going to
I don't know, cause you to maybe even cut back
in other areas of life. Maybe that's going to cause
you to go out there and earn a little bit more,
maybe earn another bonus, like hit a higher sales amount,
the kind of thing that gets you fired up to
really chase after this goal of reniventing your home, if

(33:03):
that's the goal of yours that you've set for yourself.

Speaker 1 (33:06):
You kind of mentioned this map, but I have an
example from a friend who recently paid for a house
in cash, and they were renovating that house and it
turns out the renovations cost more than they thought, and
then what they have to do. They had to borrow
money at a higher interest rate because they bought this
house a couple of years ago, and if they had
financed the home and not not like I love the
idea of a paidoff mortgage, Like, I'm not trying to

(33:26):
hate on that, I'm just saying that if they had
thought about it a little bit longer on the front end,
they might have realized, Hey, we might need some extra cushion.
The cash that we have on hand isn't going to
be able to pay for this renovation that we're talking about.
And so if Becky were to pay off this mortgage
and then realize I'm going through it the rento, but
I don't have enough cash to pay for it, She's
going to have to finance the renovations at a much
higher cost, pulling out a helock or something from that

(33:49):
home instead. And so this is where you'd be potentially
short sighted to pay out that mortgage, because if that
renovation becomes a higher priority, I could see it costing
more and you having to finance it in far worse
ways than that current low interest rate.

Speaker 2 (34:01):
Primary morg. Yeah, she's gonna have worse terms, she's gonna
have a worse rate, And as long as she's not
frittering away her savings where she's allowing that cash to
burn a hole in her pocket, I think keeping it
around for potential renovation needs right. Keeping that mortgage intact,
I think that makes the most sense, and that debt
payoff it will feel good when you finally get there,
and it's not gonna be long either, considering where your

(34:23):
your mortgage balance stands. But I think rushing it it's
going to acap all of your cash, is going to
leave you ill liquid, putting you in an overall worse
financial position personally. That's the path I would say, And
you might be able to basically do all the above.

Speaker 1 (34:35):
Right, keep the mortgage. That's awesome. I mean no debt
is like awesome, awesome, but like it's more relatively awesome
in the alternatives. Keep that thing around, you might be
able to do the renovation with cash on hand, pay
off that mortgage in short order, and have no debt
in a few years, have a renovated at home, and
be saving up cash with that increased cash flow too.
So I think this is a situation where you can

(34:57):
have it all, Becky.

Speaker 2 (34:58):
That's what we're rooting for for you. All Right.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
We've got more to get to on this episode, including yeah,
how to save a bundle of money on a rental car.

Speaker 2 (35:05):
We'll talk about that and more right after this. All right,
but we are back and it is now time for
the Facebook Question of the week. This one is from
Katie and she writes, I'm reshopping my insurance coverage in
my current company. State Farm is promoting their drive Safe

(35:28):
and Save program where their app monitors your driving habits.
They claim that you can only receive a discount with
potential savings of one and twenty five to two hundred
and fifty bucks every six months. The potential privacy implications
and the idea of Big Brother watching is a little
off putting. What are your experiences with these types of
programs and do you think it's worth it? Jill? I

(35:50):
know you think it's worth it because this is something
that you've done.

Speaker 1 (35:53):
Yeah, most of our Facebook audience did not does not
agree with me on this one. I love this question,
especially since I I literally just went through this with
my company, Liberty Mutual. I was able to knock fifteen
percent off my rate, which is pretty good, resultant in
a couple hundred dollars savings over the course of a year.
The thing that annoyed me, Matt, I got a score
of eighty nine, and ninety qualified you for the higher

(36:15):
higher savings.

Speaker 2 (36:16):
So how many folks do you think at the eighty nine?

Speaker 1 (36:18):
Yeah, I guarantee, I'm guessing they give the ninety out
to ninety plus out to almost nobody.

Speaker 2 (36:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
So it's just it's one of those things where you
know it's it feels like it's slightly rigged, but I
did get a discount and it's not insignificant, so it's
at least worth considering whether or not you want them
to monitor you're driving. There are other tactics. Of course,
drive less if you can. That's an easy way to
save money. Most insurance companies, if you drive less than
seventy five hundred miles a year, they won't charge you

(36:45):
as much. Ask for all the discounts. I would literally
pester your surance agents or the person on the customer
service line to death about what discounts they offer you.
I said literally, that didn't really mean literally there, but
increase your deductible self insure more. Those are always to
save on insurance too. But I'd be willing and I
was willing to allow my insurance company to track my

(37:05):
driving too. But I also realize it's not for everyone. Again,
most of the people in the Facebook group disagree with.

Speaker 2 (37:10):
Me on this.

Speaker 1 (37:11):
They are not willing to give over that data their
privacy to insurance companies.

Speaker 2 (37:15):
It's a relatively new practice, but the different insurance companies
they're still figuring out what to do with the information
that they're collecting, and some of the companies out there
are selling it. I get how that turns a lot
of people off personally. This is something I've done too.
It's been I don't know how many years ago it was.
I did it like maybe five years ago, and I
can't remember. This is with a different insurance provider. I
just remember being like, oh, I got to accelerate really
slowly as well. It changes your driving like everything. But

(37:38):
the one thing to keep in mind is that the
data that they're collecting, it could be used against you
if you are involved in an accident, So just keep
that in mind. We've all got different things that we're
willing to do. We've got different lines that we're willing
or not willing to cross in order to save money.
I feel like this this could be a quasi frugal
or cheap Are you willing to be spied upon in
order to save a buck? But a couple things worth

(38:00):
mentioning here. Most of the time, you're only signing up
to have your driving track for a finite amount of time.
We're typically talking about ninety days and then plus most
insurance companies they're only going to lower your rate. They
at least claim, and I don't you know, we'll see
where the everything lands on this, but they claim that
you will not have your rate raised if you're driving

(38:20):
is an awesome yea. So I don't know, you can
take that with a grain of assault. That's what they're saying.
That's what they're claiming, and that's you know, I guess
you could be a part of a class action lawsuit
if it comes out that, in fact.

Speaker 1 (38:29):
They use this to raise your rates because they had
the data on you when you said you did it
five years ago, I just did it recently. A lot
more information has come out over the past five years
about what insurance companies are doing with this data, and
so I get maybe the knee jerk like, oh, heck no, no,
I'll let them monitor my driving response. I'm I'm just
willing to trade off some of that privacy for the
same needs to come along with it. But I also

(38:49):
understand and respect someone's decision if they say they're not
willing to do that, So everyone's.

Speaker 2 (38:54):
Got yeah, it's it's a personal decision. But like simultaneously,
I don't know, maybe I'm just predisposed to allowing myself
to be tryed. Like I honestly don't really care because
I think a lot of folks are imagining some sort
of worst case scenario of like into the world like
post apocalyptic and like the big state is going to
come after you because they know where it is that
you eat or something like that. But like, like truly

(39:14):
in my like the worst case of Smith movie Enemy
of the State something, Yeah, Like what's most likely gonna
happen is you're just gonna get more targeted ads. And
I'm like, Okay, I don't care if I get targeted
a pair of running shoes that maybe I was already
going to buy, like oh it turns out there on sale.
Actually appreciate that as a post, like it's a very
it's like child's play. It's very PG rated as opposed
to like some like hardcore crackdown, where like they know

(39:35):
all of your goings abouts. I think it's also what
you do during the day.

Speaker 1 (39:39):
Yeah, I think it's also worth mentioning that people should
probably only sign up for this if they feel like
they fall into the grandma driver category, right, Like, uh,
I think it made sense for me because I don't
drive very much. I walk, I bike almost everywhere, so
we we yes, we drive the car, but we drive
so little, and we don't have some sort of like
daily regular commute or anything like that. If you you

(40:00):
aren't a cautious driver, right, if you frequently drive late
at night, if you break hard, don't do this, Like,
don't sign up for this. I just knew that I
fit the parameters where it made more sense for me.
I think other people, Matt, who are driving all the
time and feel like they maybe are a less cautious driver, like,
they probably shouldn't sign up for this thing. One They're
probably not going to save money and then so then
it becomes not worth it. And then on top of that,

(40:22):
you're talking about the potential for some of your privacy
to be violated. If you're not going to save any
money in the process, it's definitely not worth it, right,
And so I will say too, I mentioned this, but
you might find that being tracked makes you a safer driver.
I found that I was paying more attention while being tracked.
My driving habits improved nice. And by the way, I
deleted the app right after the ninety days were over,
So mine was being tracked to be an app, not

(40:42):
a device that goes in your car. And so I was.

Speaker 2 (40:45):
Like, I feel the device after ninety days, you can
just like stomp on.

Speaker 1 (40:47):
It, that's right, And so I deleted the app because
I was one it was I felt like it was
sucking more battery life off the phone. But two, I
was like, yeah, I turned this off, this feature off,
but I don't know if they're still trying to at
least collect this data. And I don't want any pardon it.
So I just didn't even want the insurance app on
my phone anymore.

Speaker 2 (41:05):
Yeah, Angel, you said you mentioned like all the other
things that you can do to get your ear rate
downe as well, don't forget just by shopping around and
going with like a local insurance provider. Going to a
site like Trusted Choice is a great way to find
a local independent agent as well. Yeah, and they can
trust aside from all the bigs out there that you
hear here 's talk about. Yeah with the great thing
about going with an independent insurance agent is they can
shop with a bunch of different insurance companies on your

(41:26):
behalf instead of you individually going each one. So yes,
that can be a great path to take, all right, Matt.

Speaker 1 (41:31):
Let's mention one comment real quick from Rebecca that she
left in the Facebook group this past week. She said,
I wanted to share a money win in case it
helps anyone who is traveling this summer. We are taking
a ten day road trip in a couple of weeks.
I've booked rental car back in February for nine hundred
and sixty five dollars. Throughout the month of May, I've
continued to check the prices almost daily and have been
able to cancel and rebook multiple times for a lower price.

(41:53):
Yesterday I got it down to four hundred and eighty
five dollars. She says it pays to revisit your bookings,
especially rental booking, since they usually have a generous cancelation
policy up to a few days before your trip.

Speaker 2 (42:04):
I am all about this way to go, Rebecca. This
is an awesome way to save a ton of money.
And by the way, I just appreciate folks sharing their
money wins with the rest of the how to money
community there in the Facebook group. That being said, checking
it daily sounds like a lot, though, and this is
coming from somebody who manually enters his all of his
expenses at Excel. Something about going to a site every

(42:26):
day to see if I can find a lower rate
does not sound like something that I would be into
as much. And to that, I would say, maybe let
technology help you out with that. There's a cool site
called autoslash dot com. They'll actually do that on your
behalf for free. The way that they get paid I
think they get paid a small commission, so you don't
pay anything to them, but they get paid a small
commission from the insurance company, from the car rental company.

(42:49):
Were you to book through autoslash. So yeah, what's key though,
like you said, is to book a refundable rental car
because you might be able to save a few bucks
on the rental car site if you book non refundable
but it's not worth it, because if you do that,
you're gonna lose the chance to save a much bigger
chunk of change later on down the road. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:08):
Yeah, that's that's like a cheap, not frugal to book
the to book the non refundable to save twenty bucks
now when you might be able to save hundreds later
if you had gone for the refundable reservation. It's amazing
how much money you can save on this line item
of your vacation budget. But Matt, most people book it,
they forget about it. They don't do anything else. Set
a reminder on your calendar or sign up at autoslash
dot com. Do one of the two right, do something

(43:29):
either go manual or goo technology driven. I don't care,
but make sure you reshop that price, especially as you
get closer to your trip. The same can be true
of hotel reservations too, Matt. I mean, when Emil and
I went to New York class Fall, I had booked
directly with the hotel. I read shot with them, because
the day before we went, I saw that the price
a dropped and it's like an ad on the actual

(43:50):
website of the hotel. No, I just like looked up
the same date, so I was curious, what does.

Speaker 2 (43:53):
It cost now?

Speaker 1 (43:54):
It was more of a curiosity thing, and I realized
it's cheaper. So I messaged them and they're like, oh, yeah, sure,
no problem, refunded you the price difference.

Speaker 2 (44:01):
And so you know.

Speaker 1 (44:02):
Southwest has a similar refund policy where if you pay
cash for the trip, well you get you get a
credit in Southwest dollars essentially for future use.

Speaker 2 (44:12):
You can cancel up to like or depending on the ticket,
you can actually get get it refunded as cash or
however it is that you paid for. Yeah, so I mean,
which is really cool.

Speaker 1 (44:19):
You can cancel up like ten minutes before before the flight,
which is kind of crazy, but yeah, but these are
the kind of things.

Speaker 2 (44:25):
Anybody once you go ahead make up your mind. So
whether or not even you know, scnce flight or not.

Speaker 1 (44:29):
Who's canceling twelve minutes before, I don't know. But I
do think re shopping travel accommodations is a smart thing
to do, and when we're talking about the high cost
of travel these days, this is at least one way
to save. And on the rental card thing, you can
make it automatic and you can save save Big Box
really that's right.

Speaker 2 (44:44):
Yeah. And by the way, this only reinforces why you
should join the how to Money Facebook group. These are
the kind of tips that are being posted every single
day folks when they're sharing their different wins. And so
if you have not yet looked it up, but you
are active over there on Facebook, check it out and
Joel as quickly head back to the beer because you
and I enjoyed a bike tour Hell's. It's a Hell's logger.

(45:06):
This is my Creature Comforts brewing. What your thoughts? All right?
So this was light and clean, golden refreshing, I would say,
little malty, a little bready. Uh yeah. That wasn't like
a bright, citrusy kind of refreshing. It was like, I
don't know, like like a clean drinking Hell's Lagger tasted
like amber waves map And I'm pretty sure you only

(45:26):
pick this up because it says bike tour and is
Creature Comforts, yeah, which I will say we had their
What was the other beer that we had? Oh my gosh,
it was like that it was a German pills or
some kind of pills ner that was made with like
a New Zealand hop This one was that good? This
didn't like that one had something really really special. H
This one was really good, but didn't have that extra
little special that we were maybe expecting since it was

(45:48):
also a part of the Curious Collection. But still glad
you can know I got to enjoy it. Sure, get
a Germany one of these, and anytime there's a bike
affiliated beer, I will grab it.

Speaker 1 (45:56):
Yeah, including the og fat tire.

Speaker 2 (45:59):
That's right, that one. In a long time I knew Belgium,
it's true. But uh, all right enough, I was gonna
ask you about Germany and travel. But let's go ahead
and end this episode. You can find notes up on
the website at howdomoney dot com. And if you happen
to just stumble upon this episode of How to Money,
make sure you hit subscribe. That way you don't miss
the next episode. We're actually talking about how you can
pay as little as possible for a new vehicle. On Wednesday,

(46:21):
we're talking to the guys over at car Edge and
looking forward to that conversation.

Speaker 1 (46:25):
A lot of years of experience amongst those two. In true,
it's gonna be a fun combo. So all right, Matt,
that's gonna do it for this one. Until next time,
Best friends, and best friends out

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Ask HTM - Max Car Rental Savings, Fun Money Convos with Partners, & Diversifying with REITs #844

Episode Transcript

Hosts And Creators

Joel Larsgaard

Matthew Altmix

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