October 5, 2025 • 39 mins
House prices have been flat or are falling, it's hard to miss.
Many owners are trying to quickly sell up - whether it be to fund their retirement, or simply because the rental market just isn't as profitable as it used to be.
Analysts reckon this will mean a lot of younger people finally getting the opportunity to get on the property ladder. But there's one thing keeping a lot of potential buyers hesitant...
Thirty percent of agents say that buyers are concerned property prices will drop further after they've purchased, leading to potential buyers holding off for lower prices.
So how do you deal with the fear of overpaying? How can you be sure you're entering the market at the right time?
Martin Cooper is the Managing Director at Harcourts Cooper & Co and he joined Tim Beveridge for the OneRoof Radio Show.
LISTEN ABOVE
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend collective podcast from News Talks a'b.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
It is time for the one Roof radio show. And
as I say, we want your calls on one hundred
and eighty ten to eighty. What we're going to dig
into before I introduce my my esteemed guest. As we know,
the news around the property market is that house prices
have been flat or they've been falling, and there are
you know, increasing number of investors have been selling up,
(00:31):
whether it's to fund their retirement or simply because the
rental market might not be as profitable as it was.
But it means also younger people are getting the opportunity
to get on the property ladder. And there's one thing
of course that's on look anyone who's ever bought a house. Actually,
maybe not everyone, because they'll be the seasoned buyers who
just sort of go, well, you know, I paid what
(00:52):
I pay and I'll sit on to it for long enough.
But with the first time especially, thirty percent of agents
say that buyers are concerned that property prices will drop
further after they've purchased, eating totential bars holding off on
lower prices. It's called foop. You've heard of fomo fear
of missing out and this is foop, which is fear
(01:14):
of overpaying. Anyway to talk about that and how you
work out what you should be paying? Are you're paying
too much? Does it matter? In the end? He is
managing director at Harcourt's Cooper and co. There's the clue.
He's with us for the one rufradio show Martin drum
roll please, Cooper, how are you going? Very good? So
have you? You must have heard I think what I
(01:35):
mentioned foop to you beforehand? You looked at me like
you hadn't heard that expression. You must have heard. We
know fomo? You have you heard of foop?
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (01:42):
Absolutely?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Oh good, thank goodness.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
No, it's always a concern you're paying too much. Like
you used to take people out buy a house, show
them the first you know, the new to the market,
show the first two or three properties. You'd find the
perfect one because you would listen to what they said
and pick the right one and often hesitation, I can't
buy this one. I've got to look at more. It's
(02:05):
all about, you know, that concern that you're paying too much.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
But the thing, here's the here's the philosophical quandary is
if the market is going to fall further. So let's
say you are pretty sure property prices got further to fall,
but you might have sold a house and you need
to find another one. Does it In a way, I
might almost argue that it could be irrelevant if you
want this house now because this is where the market
(02:31):
act is at, because say in six months, it's going
to be worthless. That house might not be around in
six months. If you want that one, you've just got
to work out how to negotiate for it, don't you.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
Yeah, Well, no one rings the bell when the market's
h at the bottom.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Wouldn't that be helpful?
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Wouldn't it be good ding ding ding by?
Speaker 5 (02:50):
Now?
Speaker 2 (02:50):
You know, ought to be the bell telling bring out
your dad might yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
Or deceased. The States sometimes can be good buying. But
what I would also say that it's.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
A whole topic in itself. Actually i'm writing that down carry.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
What I would say is, if you find a home
you love, and you you know, the average ten you're
in a home in New Zealand is somewhere between eight
and twelve years, so you're going to spend a lot
of time in that home. So if you love it,
and you think, oh, no, I won't buy it, or
the prices might come back. It's a bit of a
(03:28):
gambling thing that there's a home you could love, bring
your family into, enjoy it, and you say no, all
we weight prices will come down. And then of course
if they don't come down, what if they start taking
off and you miss the boat. So I think most
people buy a home because it's emotional. You know, they
get emotionally attached to it. So if you find something
you love and you're going to be there for ten years,
(03:50):
you should just make a decision, make a commitment, go
for it.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Have you seen that play out with buyers when you
know obviously they go to a real estate agent. That is,
I think as soon as you start talking to real
estate agents you are showing a level of commitment that
you've started a process, right. But have you seen people
you know, prevaricate and wait around because they're like, oh,
I'm just not sure if that's the right.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
For a basic example, I had a good friend who
was very interested in buying a property in Queenstown and
he you know, we had the COVID lockdown and the
country was locked up, and he made a profound prediction
that this was the moment he was going to watch
the Queenstown property market crash and he was going to
(04:36):
get in and steal a deal. So he put off
his purchase. And look that that's had phenomenal growth. So
he's missed the boat. You know, the prices have accelerated,
so and now it's regretting remorse. We talk about the
ones he missed.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
Actually I had that. I mean if I was still
co hosting this show with Tim Rocksborough, which has been
a little while since we did that, but he would
be reminding one right now because I looked at Hamilton
as a market back when Hamilton was pretty cheap, and
I literally looked at it and I thought, I mean,
maybe I wasn't ready to buy. Maybe I wasn't maybe
I don't know. And I looked at Hamilton and I thought,
you know what, I bet you Hamilton's going to go gangbusters.
(05:15):
And I watched as Hamilton went gangbusters. I was like saying,
I reckon, this team is going to win. But I
didn't have any money on it.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
I think a lot of people got those stories. Now,
things I might have could have should have purchased. But
as long as you get into the game and make
a decision and get on the property ladder. You're in
the in position.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So I people, I mean, what is it in your
observations with people who are hesitant by was what is
it that gets them over the line? Or is it
just a good real estate agent that gives them good advice?
And obviously, look.
Speaker 4 (05:47):
I think a good agent can help. I would often
ring clients who bought a property, just as the boss
of the company. And I remember ringing one lady and saying, hey,
I just wanted to check in. You bought a home office.
Thank you very much, I owned the company. What was
there anything more we could do? What was your experience like?
(06:08):
And she said to me, well, it was very very good,
thank you, but your salesperson was way too pushy. And
I said, oh really really, I said, tell me how
long we're looking and she said, oh, about three and
a half years. We've been out every been out every weekend.
We missed out on looking out easter we went away
for Easter, but we've been looking every weekend. So I
(06:32):
rang the salesperson. I said, well done, well done for
pushing that laid into property. Because she was a procrastinator
and what was the cause of a procrastination. It's just
something that, yeah, they procrastinate and let the will go by.
They just it just happens. They're cautious people, and I mean,
(06:53):
we're all got a d in our DNA to be cautious.
But some people just have a load of extra caution.
Other people are spontaneous.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Funny thing is, though, that same woman, if she came
to sell the house, she'd probably go straight to you,
because she'd go like, I might go back to those
guys because they were really pushy on the sale, so
they'll do the deal for me.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
She's got the she's got the smart she'd think, I
want someone who's going to sell my property with the
same intensity that they sold this one to me. So yeah, good,
good point.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Happy to help.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
To run my sales meeting Tuesday.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
I'm available. Actually, I think the thing is that at
the heart of it is just getting the best information
to work out that what you're paying is the right price.
And look, we were lucky when we bought ours because
I thought that the vendor we bought from our landlord
and I thought that we had got a very good deal,
(07:50):
So I wasn't at all worried about that. But I
think we were quite lucky because he is willing to
do a deal that we could afford, which is which
is pretty rare. But if it had been a much
more competitive environment, yeah, it's an interesting one to as
to how we would have worked out what a property
was worth, because, for instance, our neighbor it's identical flat.
(08:13):
When they were for sale, I remember saying to my wife, God,
bloody hell, there's no way they're going to sell it
for that, And somebody bought it for that, our neighbor,
and now they've made a truckloading capital game because of
the time of the market.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
Yeah. But yeah, well, I think if you're we talked
to you mentioned earlier about first home buyers. If you're
looking at first home, or you haven't bought for ten
or fifteen, you want to trade up or down, whatever
your circumstance, it is worthwhile to do the research and
have a criteria where you want what you want, you know,
write a checklist and decide, yeah, this is the location
(08:46):
we want, we want three bedrooms, double gart whatever. You'll
figure it out, and then you start to do market
analysis and if you look in the same suburb for
a sustainable period. You know, three or four months, you'll
see what comes on what cells. You can look at them,
go to the open homes, check it out. By the
time you've looked to ten or twelve properties, you have
(09:07):
really good knowledge of what value is and you can
make an informed decision.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Do you mean looked at ten or twelve properties that
you have subsequently watched sell Because it's one thing to
look at ones that are on the market, it's another
thing to see what is you know what the deals were.
Finally we're on particular houses.
Speaker 4 (09:25):
Well, what I mean is start studying the market. Look
at what is sold. As many portals will tell you
what's sold. You can go and search the property history.
You can say, look a great suburbs forest Hill on
the north Shore. If that's the area you've got kids
going to school there, go and get the data and
drive around and look at what's sold, what price it's
(09:47):
gone for. Start going to the listings that are coming up.
Have a good look through, keep the broches, the flyers,
keep a portfolio of your property portfolio. By the time
you've looked through ten or twelve properties, you are in
a pretty good position to know when the next one
comes up what the price. You can become in that
(10:08):
moment in time, a bit of a property expert.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
So long as you stick to I guess with yes,
particular section of the market. Because the problem would be, say,
I remember, I used to love looking at beech oven
properties before we brought where we are. But if I
would look, you look at a property and get a
sense for its value, and then you'd go somewhere, maybe
a slightly different location where you wouldn't necessarily feel that
there was much of a difference. But it's oh, you're
(10:33):
in a different suburb now the prices are different, you know,
so you'd have to how specific do you need to
be with your search?
Speaker 4 (10:38):
Oh you've got to be careful of that is different
school zones affect the value. And also you might be
like Remuers renowned as an expensive suburb. So someone is
looking at that suburban getting an idea of prices there,
and then they just happen to randomly go and look
at a property in Coatsville or your rural property, and
they're thinking, remy were of values and then they go
(11:00):
and assess their evaluation sort of onboard computer on another suburb.
They could be caught out and pay too much. So yeah,
it'd have to be mindful. If you're flip flopping from
many different suburbs, you're going to have to do research
on each one.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
So we want your cause on this because a couple
of questions. And in fact, I look, I'll make a
note to ask Martin something he won't give me an
answer to because it involves making a prediction. But it's fun.
But we want to hear from you on eight hundred
and eighty ten eighty How did you work out? Because
I mean about you know, obviously one hundreds of a
thousand people out there who bought and sold houses millions
(11:35):
maybe I don't know, and how to describe that statistic accurately?
But how did you work out? How did you deal
with being comfortable that you were paying the right amount?
Was it? Because well, simply you were an auction and
you really wanted the property, You had a budget and
guess what it reached your number? No one else out
but you, And that's how you've found out what it
(11:55):
was worth? Or did you buy by private treaty? And
how did you work out that what you were asking
for versus what sorry, what you wanted to pay versus
what the vendor was asking when did you work out
that that was the time to buy? What was it
that made it the perfect time for you? I eight
one hundred and eighty ten to eighty text nine nine two.
(12:16):
But at the core of the question, at the start
mat which is where I asked for your prediction or
your your judgment on this, And I would guess right
now that because you've been a guy who's been in
the business for a while, in a way, I'm not
sure if you ruminate on this much about where the
markets act in terms of peaks and troughs, because you
simply somebody wants to sell your house. You want to
(12:37):
have an understanding of it. Well, where do you think
the market's at right now in terms of peaks and troughs?
Do you think we've sort of maybe sort of leveled out?
Do you think what do you think? What are your
reckons happening? I know it's a cruel question.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
Look, I have to say my position with a whole
lot of a large team, I have to always be
a cheerleader, optimistic and positive. So I think we're well
behind a surgeons and property values. We're in an Auckland market.
We've had three, So we're behind. What do you mean
we're behind.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
We're overdue for one.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Overdue, yeah, yeah, and all the indicators of things that
make a difference, the interest rates, you know, we should
get official cash rates should if it doesn't go, God
help us, it should come down in the next round
or this week or this week coming possibly another one
in November. So that's going to help. Also the rural sector,
(13:37):
like we've seen the hardwket's figures right across New Zealand.
They're going well down in the south. You know, they've
got that what the farmer's getting on the dairy prices
improve the mood. But Auckland's been a blen slow to respond.
So we've had three years in the dold rooms. I
think it's going to be a good year ahead for
twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Because doesn't normally doesn't where is Auckland and the rest
of the country in terms of leading tree And it's
like it used to be that Auckland would go and
then the rest of the country would sort of be
like hopping up on the water skis and it would
get up a little bit later.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
Looks faintly. I think we should have a meeting the
whole city should go into Atu square. We should all say, okay,
stop moaning, stop groaning, we live in a beautiful place.
Start spending some money, start taking some action. The whole
market's procrastinating and it needs to wake up. So the
(14:35):
official cash rate, the interest rate reduction should help where
election year next year, so there should be some more offerings.
The current government really needs to get the mood of
Auckland more optimistic, get away from the pessimistic side of things,
so that they feel that there's a future of brightness about.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
So we need a few Is that to do with
not just the real estate market, but just to do
with more good news that percolates through in all areas
of society, not just you know, just real estate, but
retail and other other goodness. Every story is about government
policy is starting to make a difference in X, Y
and Z.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Yeah. Look, we had some glorious times with sub three
percent interest rates. They were absolutely fantastic. A lot of
us got lured into a false sense that it's going
to be like that forever, the low interest rates, so
we were spending money. Then boom, they went up rapidly,
didn't they. And if most people had a mortgage, and
a lot of young people were loaded up with big
(15:35):
mortgages and they've got something under three percent that goes
up to six to seven percent, So the household incomes
diminished substantially. And it's real caution. Don't do the holiday,
don't upgrade the kitchen, don't buy the new car. Everyone
just hesitates. It's like when you're driving along a roadway
and it's right out in front of it, it's all
green lights. Just power on, keep going. As soon as
(15:58):
the light turns amber, there's uncertainty. It's hesitation. People take
their foot off there. So what do I do? What
do I do? And we've got a whole lot of
procrastinator's one point seven million people in Auckland, And you
know little chats if you go I went to my
granddaughter's football, you know, soccer, and on the sideline, I've
got an architect telling me how quiet it is. And
(16:19):
I got a car dealer said yeah, we're not selling enough.
And I've got a building construction guy saying, oh, I
got job's been canceled. So you have this festival and
then you go home and think, shit, he's quiet, he's
not doing stuff. If we all just got on and
did stuff, we'd be off again. And it's not far away.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
The architect would say, I would do stuff if somebody
walked in the door to get me to do stuff,
I guess, and that's that.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
Yeah. But he won't be doing his own spending. He
won't be up great. He will be sitting on his hands,
being a bit cautious. So it's almost like there is
a blockage. You know, there is a build up, and
once it starts, it'll kick off again.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Okay, we want to know what you reckon, not just
where the market's at, but how did you decide that
now was the time to buy? When was it just
the fact that it was the perfect house and you
just couldn't let it go? Or do you just sort
of think I've done my research that Martin's talking about.
You maybe looked at ten or twelve hourses or whatever,
because I only just looked at one that was the
one I was living in. So I'm not a good example.
(17:15):
I can't add any benefit of experience. I was very
lucky twenty five and a half past four oh eight
hundred and eighty ten eighty back in the mow.
Speaker 5 (17:23):
You skill tell you you can go, yes, So welcome
back to the One Roof radio show.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
We're talking about food over paint, but it's really tied into,
you know, working out what the market's worth and how
do you work out that now is the perfect time
to buy? Taking your calls eight hundred eighty ten eighty
with our guest Martin Cooper. He's managing director at Harcourts,
Cooper and Co. And Dallas.
Speaker 4 (17:54):
Gooday, yeah, hi guys.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
I just want to reiterate what you said, Martin, just
it's an emotional thing. When I bought this house, I
went to an open home and out here in the
sunshine pouring in the windows, and it just felt right,
you know, it just felt right. And then of course
it was like, oh what about the price? The price,
(18:18):
the price, you know. So I went to see a
real estate agent friend of mine who worked for another company,
so he was kind of objective and he said, and
I said, well, should I try and haggle get five
hundred dollars off here or he said no, buy it.
He said, if you like it, you can afford it,
just buy it. And now I look back and I
(18:39):
just thank him. This guy since passed on, you know,
which just shows your life as you know, part with
his buy You know, life is so short, and but
I often thank him in my mind for saying that,
because it was a good decision. Just yeah, just buy it.
Don't haggle over five hundred dollars.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
How did you? How did you haggle over it?
Speaker 6 (19:02):
Well, after he said that, I didn't haggle. I just
I just paid the agreed the asking price. And and
and you know what that asking price was.
Speaker 2 (19:15):
You shouldn't have told us straight away. I was going
to ask you for the year in the city. Okay,
what year was it?
Speaker 6 (19:23):
Nineteen twenty eleven?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Eleven? God's that is cheapest chrips, isn't it. Yeah?
Speaker 4 (19:28):
What part of the country you and Dallas?
Speaker 6 (19:30):
Oh, I'm the ranger ticking in Martin. So it's cheap,
cheap housing down here.
Speaker 5 (19:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (19:35):
Well what it is? Not good though? You just your
mate told you to go for it, and you've enjoyed
it because and you've had you've you've had a good
time in that property. It's been good for you and
your family.
Speaker 6 (19:47):
Yeah, it's been great. It was obvious to you. On
my own I haven't spent a pinion except just the water.
The shower just needed new pipe from the street. But
that's the only thing I've spent money on this whole time.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
And I think, actually, Dallas, that there's something you've you've
touched on, whether it be deliberately inadvertently, that if you've
done your numbers you could afford the mortgage you wanted
to live in that house. Then the sort of equation
around whether you maybe pay over a few hundred bucks
over sort of was irrelevant to you in the end,
because you were like, I'm here for good.
Speaker 6 (20:25):
Yeah, I mean I look back now, one hundred and
eighty nine thousand, and here I was, you know, worried
about five hundred or thousand more. You know, after if
you're in the house for a period of time, it
becomes irrelevant almost, you know that what you pay way
back then it's you know, it's it's what it's worth
to you, isn't it. It's what the house is worth
(20:46):
to you.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
How long had you how long had you looked for?
Speaker 6 (20:51):
Well, i'd not too long, actually not too long, but
just came up. And the thing is about regrets too.
You know, if I hadn't gone for this house, someone
else would be here now, yeah, and you know I
might still be looking for the thing. And you know
I have.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Been raining on the day and there wasn't sunlight streaming
through into the living.
Speaker 6 (21:13):
Yeah that's true, but I went to couple over homes
here I didn't just yeah, so.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
Yeah, no, good good stuff mate, Yeah, Now if it
feels right, do it and good on you.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
Yeah, good good stuff. A nice to hear from your buddy.
Cheers and let's go to Matt get a.
Speaker 7 (21:30):
Good eight fellas. I'm actually ringing from Australia and I
was listening in all as. I'd say this to you,
be careful what you wish for over there, because over
here it's a mess. It's just a mess. It's I'm
glad that your young people can still afford maybe to
buy a home. My house I bought. It's like Devonport
(21:52):
in Auckland and it's a place called Balmain. It's right
near Sydney Harbor. Mate. My house cost me four times
my salary with my wife. For my two daughters, now
it would cost them. We worked it out the other day.
They're both nurses, nineteen times their salary. So what I'm
saying to you is we've got huge shortages here. We
(22:15):
can't get essential workers in parts of Sydney because they
can't afford to live there. D with the same perth
is crazy. Certainly, it's absolutely nuts. It's unsustainable. I remember
the deal was, if you've worked hard, maybe you study hard,
you've got yourself a profession or a trade or whatever.
(22:36):
You got into the market, you got in if you
wanted to get in. Now, unless your parents own something,
you've got no chance, your Buckley's chance of getting in.
So I would say to the Kiwi, don't look. Everyone
wants their house value to go up, but not like
over here.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
Mate.
Speaker 7 (22:54):
It's it's really sad, and it's causing social disconnection and
social breakdown and kind of little wars between the generations
and all sorts of stuff.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
It's interesting to hear that perspective. Interesting to hear that perspective,
mat because a lot of the time, most of the
discussion around Australia is it's the Promised Land and everyone's
so much happy when they go there. But I've actually
met someone who's come the other direction from Australia, and
she was talking about how ridiculous property prices were in
Australia and she was so thrilled to be in New
(23:26):
Zealand and I mean that had a pretty healthy budget
to buy something and got something fantastic here. But she
she sort of also echoed what you were saying. What's
your response to it, Martin? Just as a.
Speaker 7 (23:37):
Thousand Right, I grew up in Sydney. Look, I always
talk about a home, not a house or an investment. Right,
you move, I've been owned. I've owned min set twenty
five years. You move in, you're bringing up a family. Yeah,
look the rollercoaster ride of property. But really, if you're
not moving, yeah, if you're just paying the mortgage, look
(24:00):
the good times will come. But in Sydney maybe I
don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Would you move? Would you would you move? Would you
move somewhere else? To get it?
Speaker 7 (24:11):
I move to New Zealand tomorrow. I would move to
New Zealand tomorrow. One because I'm a rugby fan, but.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
Two and a new stalk be listener obviously, so good
on you.
Speaker 7 (24:20):
Yeah. I just want to get out, mate. I never
thought i'd say this. It's not the lucky country anymore.
Not if you don't have parents.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Well, yeah, and a house, okay.
Speaker 7 (24:30):
Get I would get out. And there's a lot of
young people are doing. They're leaving.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Hey, thanks for your call mate, Thanks for your call mate,
and thanks for tuning in. It's actually it's interesting to
hear a perspective because I get sick of this polishing
the turn of Australia all the time, as if it's
the as if everything's so bloody wonderful.
Speaker 4 (24:46):
The Texas, the text over there, the stamp duties, Matt,
the north Shore, it's a great place to live. Come over,
come over, will we'll get your settled into New Zealand.
There's a lot of people thinking it's fantastic we're selling homes.
They're here, they're putting this stuff on storage, they're going
off to Australia. But they've still got a g the job,
they still got to get the kids to schools. And
(25:08):
everything costs quite a bit, all the relocations. So it's
not everything that glistens. Isn't always gold. I'd agree with that.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
So, I mean, what's if you are dealing with. I've
got a friend of mine who's looking to buy. They're
looking to get their first home in christ Church and
he's a bit nervous about the property market going up
and stuff like that. I mean, that's the first there
does seem to be a bit more buzz in that
part of the country. Actually, Actually, what's your take on
(25:39):
christ Church versus you know, because a lot of the
headlines are christ Church is rock and rolling in a
great place. It's got topie, got the new stadium, there's
a lot of positive news stories.
Speaker 4 (25:50):
Yeah, and christ Church never had the acceleration of prices,
you know, after the earthquake there was so many rebuilds happening.
There was a good supply of housing stock coming onto
the market, so it never took off at the levels
like Queenstown did and Auckland prices did so. But so
it's had a steady, steady market and people are very parochial.
(26:14):
They're enjoying it. They're proud of their city again. So
it's going well. And it's you know, our hardcourt's offices
in the christ Chich region. We've got a slower vibe
here in Auckland. They're charging along, but you know, the
prices aren't extreme. So for your friend who's going down,
(26:35):
they weren't about them going up by four percent in
the last few months, he should get down there, make
a commitment, put a stake in the ground and get something.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
Actually that is we might dig into that as well,
because I think that the if you're moving to a
new city that you might not be familiar. I mean,
you ask someone who's lived in christ It's for thirty years,
they'll tell you exactly which suburbs they don't want to
live in and what the ones they do want to
live in. Same with anyone who's living in any town,
they'd be everyone's got an idea of it. But moving
to a different city and getting the hang of where
(27:04):
you want to start looking because I mean there's a
lot of choice, isn't there.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Look, you know you might strike it lucky, like your
purchase was good. You rented a place, you loved it,
the landlord sold it to you. You know, it's a got
easy fit into a property, way too easy. Yeah, yeah,
I reckon if you're moving cities, you should look at
a three to six months rental, get to know the place.
Prices might accelerate a bit over that time, but then
you get a chance to get a feel for the
(27:31):
place where suits you. Do you want to be near
the ocean? Do you want to be CBD? You know,
figure it all out. Don't just rush into the first
thing that comes up. I think when you're moving cities,
moving locations, a bit more caution is a valuable asset.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Yeah, look, we're going to take a moment and we'll
be back into this moment. We love your cause as well.
How did you work out that now was the perfect
time to buy? I don't like the word perfect, to
be honest, but it's a fun way to phrase the question.
I don't think there's anything such a thing as perfection.
You make a decision to do it. But when what
was it that helped you work out that what you
were looking to pay for a property wasn't too much
(28:05):
and you decided, you know what, this is the one
for me. How did you work it out? And how
do you avoid paying overpaying if maybe there's a bit
of pressure from the seller that they want a bit
more money and you don't think so. That so ties
into the art of negotiation. But we'll explore that a
bit more with Martin Koper. He's managing director at Harwarts,
Cooper and Co. Back in the moment, oh eight, one
hundred eighty ten eighty twenty one to five.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
Watch me, you'll see the watch.
Speaker 6 (28:41):
Second.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Yes, welcome back. This is the one radio show My
guess is Martin Cooper from Harwarts, Cooper and co I
talking about finding that perfect moment to buy or do
you just need to get over yourself? Actually, Actually, to
be honest, Martin, to be blunt when it comes to
making a decision, you must be tempted with some buys.
Just say, look, do you like the house, what's your budget?
You've got the money to do it. Do you sort
(29:08):
of feel like? I don't mean telling them off, because
that's not good to sell, but you know, there's that
sort of thing. It's like, what else are you looking for?
This is what you want. It looks like you're within
the ballpark. Don't worry about three months from now, just
you know, get into it.
Speaker 4 (29:23):
Years ago, Waiketta University did a survey on major spending
big ticket items, they'll be a home or you expensive items,
and they the survey said eighty five percent of people
couldn't make that major buying decision by themselves. So I
just assume from there, I'll just say one hundred percent
can't make They need influencing, they need assistance. So and look,
(29:47):
we're real estate salespeople. It's our job to encourage, to
push to manifest these people getting into property and hey,
I'd often say I'll give you ten years time, I'll
give you money back, guarantee you enjoy living in this
and I'm sure you do a k out of it.
So just get on, don't miss out. You love it,
(30:08):
it feels right, make a commitment. Procrastination is a painful
thing and it's an expensive thing too. Quite often.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
Actually, somebody said that Ossie call them, And this is
a text that Ossie Caller needs to be played on
every media as an ad for New Zealand, including every
young person I know who is heading to Australia, mostly
to Melbourne Sydney because of the quote opportunity, high pay
and affordable property. Well, they are having a laugh on that. God.
I remember looking at Paran back when I was doing
my shows. There was a house in Paran for two
(30:37):
twenty and I remember thinking it was one of those
you know, the ones that lived next door with they're
sort of a single dwelling. I don't know, eighty or
ninety screen out Melbourne, Paran and Melbourne and it was
two hundred and twenty thousand. I was like, oh, that's pricey.
A few years later it's like about a million, and
I was.
Speaker 4 (30:53):
Like, oh, I missed the vote on that one.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
I must well give you a bit of a bouquet here, Martin.
Somebody said, Martin, you spoke at a conference in Auckland recently.
You're amazing. Thanks. There you go, there's just a little
bit fan mail for you.
Speaker 4 (31:06):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Can you, Tim, can you ask your guests as to
what they think about hazard maps and the impact on
buying a property. Please?
Speaker 4 (31:14):
Oh, yes, the hazard maps. They are a big concern
for buyers. You know, when that big flood came through
in twenty.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Oh, this is what might happen in one hundred years
sort of thing.
Speaker 4 (31:25):
Yeah, that's you know, coastal properties have where someone's predicted
the coastline might be, you know, with coastal erosion, the
inability to get insurance on those properties potentially, and so yes,
but you know, we live in a pretty woke world
of everything's got to have a warning even it's got
to have red cones or orange cones around it. So
(31:48):
sometimes you just can hear so much negative news, so
many reasons not to. You can get advised by your
third party advisors don't do it. You know, it's a Again,
there's a lot of people that kills sales that didn't
necessarily need to be killed.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Yeah, hey, there was something we're going to touch on
which we haven't really left much time from afraid, but
cleaning your financial act up. Yeah before well, I don't
know if you can clean your act up your financial history,
but if you're for borrowing, because the banks can see everything,
and they'll be certain flags for banks where they might
be like, these are your spending habits, so we see
in the last couple of years. I don't know having it.
(32:30):
Are there particular things that borrowers can do or should
do to make sure that they've got the best prospect
of success with a lender.
Speaker 4 (32:39):
Oh yeah, you've got to you've got to do a
financial fitness exercise. If you want to go get a property,
there's so many hoops you've got to jump through to
get the funding from the bank. So I recommend get
a mortgage broker and just have a deep and meaningful meeting.
Lay all your cards on the table. This is my income,
(33:00):
This is my Netflix subscription set up, this is my
car payments are credit cards. Go through everything and you
need It's just like you go to the doctor for
a checkup, go to your mortgage broker for a checkup,
how my place financially, What do I need to do
to improve my financial profile to get the maximum amount
and the best deal to get into the property ladder.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
The more I've heard, the more I've talked about real
estate over the last whatever how many years I've been
doing it is, the more in vogue. It seems to
be that it's almost a no brainer that if you can,
you should get a mortgage broker rather than just go
to your bank. And how what a great service they.
Speaker 4 (33:36):
The banks make a fortune and we're all beholding to them.
You look at the interest rates, we're all paying their
rate above the official cash rate. So sure I could
buy shears in a bank maybe and make me feel
happier get dividends because I'm always the one borrowing the money.
But so I would not go to the bank if
(33:59):
I was the first time buyer on my own. Just say,
I've had I've had an A and Z savings accounts
I was at school, and expect any favors. The bank
people are coached. They are there to get as much
money from the client as they can. So if you
get a mortgage broker on your team to go out
and hunt around all the different banks and get you
the best deal. It's their pros at it. They do
(34:22):
it every day, so it's your first time. Don't don't,
don't be bewildered by the banks. Get in with a
broker and get the best deal.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
Yeah right, we're going to be back in a minute
with the one roof property of the week. It's next
eleven minutes to five news talks. He'd be.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
The one roof property of the week on the Weekend Collective.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Okay, the one roof property of the week. I think lotto,
I don't know matter how much lotto is, And so
if you won lotto you could buy this property. I
think it is. And look, it's one of those Queenstown properties.
You go and look at it and you just imagine
how life would be if you had, if you could
afford a property like this, because it is quite gorgeous.
It's it's one todd lane in Lake Hayes, Queenstown, three bedrooms,
(35:06):
three bathrooms. It's very equitable, isn't it. The house is
I think the clue is in the house square meterridge,
so it's four hundred and thirty seven square meters and
the land is four and a half thousand square meters,
so there's a bit of land there. It's within this
state called Bendermere Estate above Lake Hayes. Architecturally, yes, it's gorgeous,
(35:27):
lots of schist and stone and it's as you would
want it to be. It's wrapped in rich modified African hardwood,
which is apparently chosen for STUI durability, probably responsible for
some of its prices. And I don't know anyway, it's
five years old, so it's not brand new. It's been
worn in, worn in. I don't think you'd ever used
(35:47):
that on a real estate ad. Martin. It's seven point
nine million.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
Martin Cooper gets down there and make a purchase if
you can afford it. One Todd Lane, Lake Hays, Brenda
Meir State. Beautiful sort of gated estate and quality properties
in that location. So have a look on that one roof,
have a look on the one roof site, and just
even if it's for an inspirational dream, if you.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Just actually I reckon going route around houses like this.
If you're looking to renovate, okay, you might not want
the African hardwood, but new builds you can get the
truckloads of good ideas to how you want your stairs
to look and to you know, bathrooms and the balance
of stone and all that sort of stuff. It's a
good way to pinch ideas, isn't.
Speaker 4 (36:32):
It brilliant way to pinch ideas. You know. And in
a full open home, if someone's looking to get internal
design interior design ideas, the other buyer doesn't know that
they're there for that reason, they think it's another buyer.
Creates a bit of competition. So the more you have
it at open home, it's like a busy retail shop.
You think, she there's a lot of action here. Well
that brendamere State. Look at it the mountain views. Yeah,
(36:57):
just incredible opportunity for someone in global terms. We had
a caller on from Sydney saying it's overpriced there, But
how good of value is that? It's seven mil when
you look at the location.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Let's pretend, let's let's be fair, it's eight mil. Really
it's seven point nine.
Speaker 4 (37:14):
Well I was sorry about that. I just all I
saw was the seven Actually, what is.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
It that stands out for you when you look at
a house? What are the things when you walk into
a spectacular house? What is it about this one that
grabs you because obviously the mountains around that area of
the part of the country. To me, it's the view
from the living room with the lovely big, you know,
comfortable couches with the spectacular windows looking out to sort
of out door area. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:42):
I love this one. The dark wood finish and the
timber and the concrete and the schist rock and all
the views because dark internal decoor, they sort you sort
of drawn to the outside. All the views, it's sort
of they just pop out at you. So this one
and it feels like cozy, it feels warm, it feels homely,
and you're just the internal fireplace with that central otago
(38:08):
rock is magnificent and it flows outdoors.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
Does it look like it? Do you reckon? I've got
a question because I think I probably like this. It's
going to have gorgeous decore anyway, Do you think it's
been staged because one of the beds in the photo
looks like it's a bit more lumpy than you would
think for the.
Speaker 4 (38:26):
Look at home of that value. Putting a couple of
hundred thousand of furniture into it's probably going to be standard.
And that's the thing you reach up to buy a
home at that value, and then you've got to you've
got to buy the furniture to match to have it
looking pristine, So you need a little bit more on top.
But yeah, I think that's very tempting.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Are you going to be hodding on a plane gown
of a look at it? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (38:51):
Well, I've got an apartment in Queenstown.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
Oh ok, yeah.
Speaker 4 (38:54):
My kids said to me, they're adults. I said I
might buy a nice house because I grew up in Queenstown.
And you know, they said, well, you'll keep the apartment,
won't you. Nah.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
I don't worry about the kids. Hey, Martin, great to
see if you want to catch up with Martin Harcourts,
Cooper and co. And we'll look forward to next time.
Thanks for coming in.
Speaker 4 (39:10):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
Sarah Chapman's with us next. How do you navigate letting
your kids make a few more decisions in their life
until they go on that flotilla to Gaza? Thanks so.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk zed Be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Weekend collective podcast from News Talks a'b.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
It is time for the one Roof radio show. And
as I say, we want your calls on one hundred
and eighty ten to eighty. What we're going to dig
into before I introduce my my esteemed guest. As we know,
the news around the property market is that house prices
have been flat or they've been falling, and there are
you know, increasing number of investors have been selling up,
(00:31):
whether it's to fund their retirement or simply because the
rental market might not be as profitable as it was.
But it means also younger people are getting the opportunity
to get on the property ladder. And there's one thing
of course that's on look anyone who's ever bought a house. Actually,
maybe not everyone, because they'll be the seasoned buyers who
just sort of go, well, you know, I paid what
(00:52):
I pay and I'll sit on to it for long enough.
But with the first time especially, thirty percent of agents
say that buyers are concerned that property prices will drop
further after they've purchased, eating totential bars holding off on
lower prices. It's called foop. You've heard of fomo fear
of missing out and this is foop, which is fear
(01:14):
of overpaying. Anyway to talk about that and how you
work out what you should be paying? Are you're paying
too much? Does it matter? In the end? He is
managing director at Harcourt's Cooper and co. There's the clue.
He's with us for the one rufradio show Martin drum
roll please, Cooper, how are you going? Very good? So
have you? You must have heard I think what I
(01:35):
mentioned foop to you beforehand? You looked at me like
you hadn't heard that expression. You must have heard. We
know fomo? You have you heard of foop?
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (01:42):
Absolutely?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Oh good, thank goodness.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
No, it's always a concern you're paying too much. Like
you used to take people out buy a house, show
them the first you know, the new to the market,
show the first two or three properties. You'd find the
perfect one because you would listen to what they said
and pick the right one and often hesitation, I can't
buy this one. I've got to look at more. It's
(02:05):
all about, you know, that concern that you're paying too much.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
But the thing, here's the here's the philosophical quandary is
if the market is going to fall further. So let's
say you are pretty sure property prices got further to fall,
but you might have sold a house and you need
to find another one. Does it In a way, I
might almost argue that it could be irrelevant if you
want this house now because this is where the market
(02:31):
act is at, because say in six months, it's going
to be worthless. That house might not be around in
six months. If you want that one, you've just got
to work out how to negotiate for it, don't you.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
Yeah, Well, no one rings the bell when the market's
h at the bottom.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Wouldn't that be helpful?
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Wouldn't it be good ding ding ding by?
Speaker 5 (02:50):
Now?
Speaker 2 (02:50):
You know, ought to be the bell telling bring out
your dad might yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
Or deceased. The States sometimes can be good buying. But
what I would also say that it's.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
A whole topic in itself. Actually i'm writing that down carry.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
What I would say is, if you find a home
you love, and you you know, the average ten you're
in a home in New Zealand is somewhere between eight
and twelve years, so you're going to spend a lot
of time in that home. So if you love it,
and you think, oh, no, I won't buy it, or
the prices might come back. It's a bit of a
(03:28):
gambling thing that there's a home you could love, bring
your family into, enjoy it, and you say no, all
we weight prices will come down. And then of course
if they don't come down, what if they start taking
off and you miss the boat. So I think most
people buy a home because it's emotional. You know, they
get emotionally attached to it. So if you find something
you love and you're going to be there for ten years,
(03:50):
you should just make a decision, make a commitment, go
for it.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Have you seen that play out with buyers when you
know obviously they go to a real estate agent. That is,
I think as soon as you start talking to real
estate agents you are showing a level of commitment that
you've started a process, right. But have you seen people
you know, prevaricate and wait around because they're like, oh,
I'm just not sure if that's the right.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
For a basic example, I had a good friend who
was very interested in buying a property in Queenstown and
he you know, we had the COVID lockdown and the
country was locked up, and he made a profound prediction
that this was the moment he was going to watch
the Queenstown property market crash and he was going to
(04:36):
get in and steal a deal. So he put off
his purchase. And look that that's had phenomenal growth. So
he's missed the boat. You know, the prices have accelerated,
so and now it's regretting remorse. We talk about the
ones he missed.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
Actually I had that. I mean if I was still
co hosting this show with Tim Rocksborough, which has been
a little while since we did that, but he would
be reminding one right now because I looked at Hamilton
as a market back when Hamilton was pretty cheap, and
I literally looked at it and I thought, I mean,
maybe I wasn't ready to buy. Maybe I wasn't maybe
I don't know. And I looked at Hamilton and I thought,
you know what, I bet you Hamilton's going to go gangbusters.
(05:15):
And I watched as Hamilton went gangbusters. I was like saying,
I reckon, this team is going to win. But I
didn't have any money on it.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
I think a lot of people got those stories. Now,
things I might have could have should have purchased. But
as long as you get into the game and make
a decision and get on the property ladder. You're in
the in position.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
So I people, I mean, what is it in your
observations with people who are hesitant by was what is
it that gets them over the line? Or is it
just a good real estate agent that gives them good advice?
And obviously, look.
Speaker 4 (05:47):
I think a good agent can help. I would often
ring clients who bought a property, just as the boss
of the company. And I remember ringing one lady and saying, hey,
I just wanted to check in. You bought a home office.
Thank you very much, I owned the company. What was
there anything more we could do? What was your experience like?
(06:08):
And she said to me, well, it was very very good,
thank you, but your salesperson was way too pushy. And
I said, oh really really, I said, tell me how
long we're looking and she said, oh, about three and
a half years. We've been out every been out every weekend.
We missed out on looking out easter we went away
for Easter, but we've been looking every weekend. So I
(06:32):
rang the salesperson. I said, well done, well done for
pushing that laid into property. Because she was a procrastinator
and what was the cause of a procrastination. It's just
something that, yeah, they procrastinate and let the will go by.
They just it just happens. They're cautious people, and I mean,
(06:53):
we're all got a d in our DNA to be cautious.
But some people just have a load of extra caution.
Other people are spontaneous.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Funny thing is, though, that same woman, if she came
to sell the house, she'd probably go straight to you,
because she'd go like, I might go back to those
guys because they were really pushy on the sale, so
they'll do the deal for me.
Speaker 4 (07:12):
She's got the she's got the smart she'd think, I
want someone who's going to sell my property with the
same intensity that they sold this one to me. So yeah, good,
good point.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Happy to help.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
To run my sales meeting Tuesday.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
I'm available. Actually, I think the thing is that at
the heart of it is just getting the best information
to work out that what you're paying is the right price.
And look, we were lucky when we bought ours because
I thought that the vendor we bought from our landlord
and I thought that we had got a very good deal,
(07:50):
So I wasn't at all worried about that. But I
think we were quite lucky because he is willing to
do a deal that we could afford, which is which
is pretty rare. But if it had been a much
more competitive environment, yeah, it's an interesting one to as
to how we would have worked out what a property
was worth, because, for instance, our neighbor it's identical flat.
(08:13):
When they were for sale, I remember saying to my wife, God,
bloody hell, there's no way they're going to sell it
for that, And somebody bought it for that, our neighbor,
and now they've made a truckloading capital game because of
the time of the market.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
Yeah. But yeah, well, I think if you're we talked
to you mentioned earlier about first home buyers. If you're
looking at first home, or you haven't bought for ten
or fifteen, you want to trade up or down, whatever
your circumstance, it is worthwhile to do the research and
have a criteria where you want what you want, you know,
write a checklist and decide, yeah, this is the location
(08:46):
we want, we want three bedrooms, double gart whatever. You'll
figure it out, and then you start to do market
analysis and if you look in the same suburb for
a sustainable period. You know, three or four months, you'll
see what comes on what cells. You can look at them,
go to the open homes, check it out. By the
time you've looked to ten or twelve properties, you have
(09:07):
really good knowledge of what value is and you can
make an informed decision.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Do you mean looked at ten or twelve properties that
you have subsequently watched sell Because it's one thing to
look at ones that are on the market, it's another
thing to see what is you know what the deals were.
Finally we're on particular houses.
Speaker 4 (09:25):
Well, what I mean is start studying the market. Look
at what is sold. As many portals will tell you
what's sold. You can go and search the property history.
You can say, look a great suburbs forest Hill on
the north Shore. If that's the area you've got kids
going to school there, go and get the data and
drive around and look at what's sold, what price it's
(09:47):
gone for. Start going to the listings that are coming up.
Have a good look through, keep the broches, the flyers,
keep a portfolio of your property portfolio. By the time
you've looked through ten or twelve properties, you are in
a pretty good position to know when the next one
comes up what the price. You can become in that
(10:08):
moment in time, a bit of a property expert.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
So long as you stick to I guess with yes,
particular section of the market. Because the problem would be, say,
I remember, I used to love looking at beech oven
properties before we brought where we are. But if I
would look, you look at a property and get a
sense for its value, and then you'd go somewhere, maybe
a slightly different location where you wouldn't necessarily feel that
there was much of a difference. But it's oh, you're
(10:33):
in a different suburb now the prices are different, you know,
so you'd have to how specific do you need to
be with your search?
Speaker 4 (10:38):
Oh you've got to be careful of that is different
school zones affect the value. And also you might be
like Remuers renowned as an expensive suburb. So someone is
looking at that suburban getting an idea of prices there,
and then they just happen to randomly go and look
at a property in Coatsville or your rural property, and
they're thinking, remy were of values and then they go
(11:00):
and assess their evaluation sort of onboard computer on another suburb.
They could be caught out and pay too much. So yeah,
it'd have to be mindful. If you're flip flopping from
many different suburbs, you're going to have to do research
on each one.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
So we want your cause on this because a couple
of questions. And in fact, I look, I'll make a
note to ask Martin something he won't give me an
answer to because it involves making a prediction. But it's fun.
But we want to hear from you on eight hundred
and eighty ten eighty How did you work out? Because
I mean about you know, obviously one hundreds of a
thousand people out there who bought and sold houses millions
(11:35):
maybe I don't know, and how to describe that statistic accurately?
But how did you work out? How did you deal
with being comfortable that you were paying the right amount?
Was it? Because well, simply you were an auction and
you really wanted the property, You had a budget and
guess what it reached your number? No one else out
but you, And that's how you've found out what it
(11:55):
was worth? Or did you buy by private treaty? And
how did you work out that what you were asking
for versus what sorry, what you wanted to pay versus
what the vendor was asking when did you work out
that that was the time to buy? What was it
that made it the perfect time for you? I eight
one hundred and eighty ten to eighty text nine nine two.
(12:16):
But at the core of the question, at the start
mat which is where I asked for your prediction or
your your judgment on this, And I would guess right
now that because you've been a guy who's been in
the business for a while, in a way, I'm not
sure if you ruminate on this much about where the
markets act in terms of peaks and troughs, because you
simply somebody wants to sell your house. You want to
(12:37):
have an understanding of it. Well, where do you think
the market's at right now in terms of peaks and troughs?
Do you think we've sort of maybe sort of leveled out?
Do you think what do you think? What are your
reckons happening? I know it's a cruel question.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
Look, I have to say my position with a whole
lot of a large team, I have to always be
a cheerleader, optimistic and positive. So I think we're well
behind a surgeons and property values. We're in an Auckland market.
We've had three, So we're behind. What do you mean
we're behind.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
We're overdue for one.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Overdue, yeah, yeah, and all the indicators of things that
make a difference, the interest rates, you know, we should
get official cash rates should if it doesn't go, God
help us, it should come down in the next round
or this week or this week coming possibly another one
in November. So that's going to help. Also the rural sector,
(13:37):
like we've seen the hardwket's figures right across New Zealand.
They're going well down in the south. You know, they've
got that what the farmer's getting on the dairy prices
improve the mood. But Auckland's been a blen slow to respond.
So we've had three years in the dold rooms. I
think it's going to be a good year ahead for
twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Because doesn't normally doesn't where is Auckland and the rest
of the country in terms of leading tree And it's
like it used to be that Auckland would go and
then the rest of the country would sort of be
like hopping up on the water skis and it would
get up a little bit later.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
Looks faintly. I think we should have a meeting the
whole city should go into Atu square. We should all say, okay,
stop moaning, stop groaning, we live in a beautiful place.
Start spending some money, start taking some action. The whole
market's procrastinating and it needs to wake up. So the
(14:35):
official cash rate, the interest rate reduction should help where
election year next year, so there should be some more offerings.
The current government really needs to get the mood of
Auckland more optimistic, get away from the pessimistic side of things,
so that they feel that there's a future of brightness about.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
So we need a few Is that to do with
not just the real estate market, but just to do
with more good news that percolates through in all areas
of society, not just you know, just real estate, but
retail and other other goodness. Every story is about government
policy is starting to make a difference in X, Y
and Z.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Yeah. Look, we had some glorious times with sub three
percent interest rates. They were absolutely fantastic. A lot of
us got lured into a false sense that it's going
to be like that forever, the low interest rates, so
we were spending money. Then boom, they went up rapidly,
didn't they. And if most people had a mortgage, and
a lot of young people were loaded up with big
(15:35):
mortgages and they've got something under three percent that goes
up to six to seven percent, So the household incomes
diminished substantially. And it's real caution. Don't do the holiday,
don't upgrade the kitchen, don't buy the new car. Everyone
just hesitates. It's like when you're driving along a roadway
and it's right out in front of it, it's all
green lights. Just power on, keep going. As soon as
(15:58):
the light turns amber, there's uncertainty. It's hesitation. People take
their foot off there. So what do I do? What
do I do? And we've got a whole lot of
procrastinator's one point seven million people in Auckland, And you
know little chats if you go I went to my
granddaughter's football, you know, soccer, and on the sideline, I've
got an architect telling me how quiet it is. And
(16:19):
I got a car dealer said yeah, we're not selling enough.
And I've got a building construction guy saying, oh, I
got job's been canceled. So you have this festival and
then you go home and think, shit, he's quiet, he's
not doing stuff. If we all just got on and
did stuff, we'd be off again. And it's not far away.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
The architect would say, I would do stuff if somebody
walked in the door to get me to do stuff,
I guess, and that's that.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
Yeah. But he won't be doing his own spending. He
won't be up great. He will be sitting on his hands,
being a bit cautious. So it's almost like there is
a blockage. You know, there is a build up, and
once it starts, it'll kick off again.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Okay, we want to know what you reckon, not just
where the market's at, but how did you decide that
now was the time to buy? When was it just
the fact that it was the perfect house and you
just couldn't let it go? Or do you just sort
of think I've done my research that Martin's talking about.
You maybe looked at ten or twelve hourses or whatever,
because I only just looked at one that was the
one I was living in. So I'm not a good example.
(17:15):
I can't add any benefit of experience. I was very
lucky twenty five and a half past four oh eight
hundred and eighty ten eighty back in the mow.
Speaker 5 (17:23):
You skill tell you you can go, yes, So welcome
back to the One Roof radio show.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
We're talking about food over paint, but it's really tied into,
you know, working out what the market's worth and how
do you work out that now is the perfect time
to buy? Taking your calls eight hundred eighty ten eighty
with our guest Martin Cooper. He's managing director at Harcourts,
Cooper and Co. And Dallas.
Speaker 4 (17:54):
Gooday, yeah, hi guys.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
I just want to reiterate what you said, Martin, just
it's an emotional thing. When I bought this house, I
went to an open home and out here in the
sunshine pouring in the windows, and it just felt right,
you know, it just felt right. And then of course
it was like, oh what about the price? The price,
(18:18):
the price, you know. So I went to see a
real estate agent friend of mine who worked for another company,
so he was kind of objective and he said, and
I said, well, should I try and haggle get five
hundred dollars off here or he said no, buy it.
He said, if you like it, you can afford it,
just buy it. And now I look back and I
(18:39):
just thank him. This guy since passed on, you know,
which just shows your life as you know, part with
his buy You know, life is so short, and but
I often thank him in my mind for saying that,
because it was a good decision. Just yeah, just buy it.
Don't haggle over five hundred dollars.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
How did you? How did you haggle over it?
Speaker 6 (19:02):
Well, after he said that, I didn't haggle. I just
I just paid the agreed the asking price. And and
and you know what that asking price was.
Speaker 2 (19:15):
You shouldn't have told us straight away. I was going
to ask you for the year in the city. Okay,
what year was it?
Speaker 6 (19:23):
Nineteen twenty eleven?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Eleven? God's that is cheapest chrips, isn't it. Yeah?
Speaker 4 (19:28):
What part of the country you and Dallas?
Speaker 6 (19:30):
Oh, I'm the ranger ticking in Martin. So it's cheap,
cheap housing down here.
Speaker 5 (19:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (19:35):
Well what it is? Not good though? You just your
mate told you to go for it, and you've enjoyed
it because and you've had you've you've had a good
time in that property. It's been good for you and
your family.
Speaker 6 (19:47):
Yeah, it's been great. It was obvious to you. On
my own I haven't spent a pinion except just the water.
The shower just needed new pipe from the street. But
that's the only thing I've spent money on this whole time.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
And I think, actually, Dallas, that there's something you've you've
touched on, whether it be deliberately inadvertently, that if you've
done your numbers you could afford the mortgage you wanted
to live in that house. Then the sort of equation
around whether you maybe pay over a few hundred bucks
over sort of was irrelevant to you in the end,
because you were like, I'm here for good.
Speaker 6 (20:25):
Yeah, I mean I look back now, one hundred and
eighty nine thousand, and here I was, you know, worried
about five hundred or thousand more. You know, after if
you're in the house for a period of time, it
becomes irrelevant almost, you know that what you pay way
back then it's you know, it's it's what it's worth
to you, isn't it. It's what the house is worth
(20:46):
to you.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
How long had you how long had you looked for?
Speaker 6 (20:51):
Well, i'd not too long, actually not too long, but
just came up. And the thing is about regrets too.
You know, if I hadn't gone for this house, someone
else would be here now, yeah, and you know I
might still be looking for the thing. And you know
I have.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Been raining on the day and there wasn't sunlight streaming
through into the living.
Speaker 6 (21:13):
Yeah that's true, but I went to couple over homes
here I didn't just yeah, so.
Speaker 4 (21:18):
Yeah, no, good good stuff mate, Yeah, Now if it
feels right, do it and good on you.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
Yeah, good good stuff. A nice to hear from your buddy.
Cheers and let's go to Matt get a.
Speaker 7 (21:30):
Good eight fellas. I'm actually ringing from Australia and I
was listening in all as. I'd say this to you,
be careful what you wish for over there, because over
here it's a mess. It's just a mess. It's I'm
glad that your young people can still afford maybe to
buy a home. My house I bought. It's like Devonport
(21:52):
in Auckland and it's a place called Balmain. It's right
near Sydney Harbor. Mate. My house cost me four times
my salary with my wife. For my two daughters, now
it would cost them. We worked it out the other day.
They're both nurses, nineteen times their salary. So what I'm
saying to you is we've got huge shortages here. We
(22:15):
can't get essential workers in parts of Sydney because they
can't afford to live there. D with the same perth
is crazy. Certainly, it's absolutely nuts. It's unsustainable. I remember
the deal was, if you've worked hard, maybe you study hard,
you've got yourself a profession or a trade or whatever.
(22:36):
You got into the market, you got in if you
wanted to get in. Now, unless your parents own something,
you've got no chance, your Buckley's chance of getting in.
So I would say to the Kiwi, don't look. Everyone
wants their house value to go up, but not like
over here.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
Mate.
Speaker 7 (22:54):
It's it's really sad, and it's causing social disconnection and
social breakdown and kind of little wars between the generations
and all sorts of stuff.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
It's interesting to hear that perspective. Interesting to hear that perspective,
mat because a lot of the time, most of the
discussion around Australia is it's the Promised Land and everyone's
so much happy when they go there. But I've actually
met someone who's come the other direction from Australia, and
she was talking about how ridiculous property prices were in
Australia and she was so thrilled to be in New
(23:26):
Zealand and I mean that had a pretty healthy budget
to buy something and got something fantastic here. But she
she sort of also echoed what you were saying. What's
your response to it, Martin? Just as a.
Speaker 7 (23:37):
Thousand Right, I grew up in Sydney. Look, I always
talk about a home, not a house or an investment. Right,
you move, I've been owned. I've owned min set twenty
five years. You move in, you're bringing up a family. Yeah,
look the rollercoaster ride of property. But really, if you're
not moving, yeah, if you're just paying the mortgage, look
(24:00):
the good times will come. But in Sydney maybe I
don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Would you move? Would you would you move? Would you
move somewhere else? To get it?
Speaker 7 (24:11):
I move to New Zealand tomorrow. I would move to
New Zealand tomorrow. One because I'm a rugby fan, but.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
Two and a new stalk be listener obviously, so good
on you.
Speaker 7 (24:20):
Yeah. I just want to get out, mate. I never
thought i'd say this. It's not the lucky country anymore.
Not if you don't have parents.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Well, yeah, and a house, okay.
Speaker 7 (24:30):
Get I would get out. And there's a lot of
young people are doing. They're leaving.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Hey, thanks for your call mate, Thanks for your call mate,
and thanks for tuning in. It's actually it's interesting to
hear a perspective because I get sick of this polishing
the turn of Australia all the time, as if it's
the as if everything's so bloody wonderful.
Speaker 4 (24:46):
The Texas, the text over there, the stamp duties, Matt,
the north Shore, it's a great place to live. Come over,
come over, will we'll get your settled into New Zealand.
There's a lot of people thinking it's fantastic we're selling homes.
They're here, they're putting this stuff on storage, they're going
off to Australia. But they've still got a g the job,
they still got to get the kids to schools. And
(25:08):
everything costs quite a bit, all the relocations. So it's
not everything that glistens. Isn't always gold. I'd agree with that.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
So, I mean, what's if you are dealing with. I've
got a friend of mine who's looking to buy. They're
looking to get their first home in christ Church and
he's a bit nervous about the property market going up
and stuff like that. I mean, that's the first there
does seem to be a bit more buzz in that
part of the country. Actually, Actually, what's your take on
(25:39):
christ Church versus you know, because a lot of the
headlines are christ Church is rock and rolling in a
great place. It's got topie, got the new stadium, there's
a lot of positive news stories.
Speaker 4 (25:50):
Yeah, and christ Church never had the acceleration of prices,
you know, after the earthquake there was so many rebuilds happening.
There was a good supply of housing stock coming onto
the market, so it never took off at the levels
like Queenstown did and Auckland prices did so. But so
it's had a steady, steady market and people are very parochial.
(26:14):
They're enjoying it. They're proud of their city again. So
it's going well. And it's you know, our hardcourt's offices
in the christ Chich region. We've got a slower vibe
here in Auckland. They're charging along, but you know, the
prices aren't extreme. So for your friend who's going down,
(26:35):
they weren't about them going up by four percent in
the last few months, he should get down there, make
a commitment, put a stake in the ground and get something.
Speaker 2 (26:43):
Actually that is we might dig into that as well,
because I think that the if you're moving to a
new city that you might not be familiar. I mean,
you ask someone who's lived in christ It's for thirty years,
they'll tell you exactly which suburbs they don't want to
live in and what the ones they do want to
live in. Same with anyone who's living in any town,
they'd be everyone's got an idea of it. But moving
to a different city and getting the hang of where
(27:04):
you want to start looking because I mean there's a
lot of choice, isn't there.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (27:09):
Look, you know you might strike it lucky, like your
purchase was good. You rented a place, you loved it,
the landlord sold it to you. You know, it's a got
easy fit into a property, way too easy. Yeah, yeah,
I reckon if you're moving cities, you should look at
a three to six months rental, get to know the place.
Prices might accelerate a bit over that time, but then
you get a chance to get a feel for the
(27:31):
place where suits you. Do you want to be near
the ocean? Do you want to be CBD? You know,
figure it all out. Don't just rush into the first
thing that comes up. I think when you're moving cities,
moving locations, a bit more caution is a valuable asset.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Yeah, look, we're going to take a moment and we'll
be back into this moment. We love your cause as well.
How did you work out that now was the perfect
time to buy? I don't like the word perfect, to
be honest, but it's a fun way to phrase the question.
I don't think there's anything such a thing as perfection.
You make a decision to do it. But when what
was it that helped you work out that what you
were looking to pay for a property wasn't too much
(28:05):
and you decided, you know what, this is the one
for me. How did you work it out? And how
do you avoid paying overpaying if maybe there's a bit
of pressure from the seller that they want a bit
more money and you don't think so. That so ties
into the art of negotiation. But we'll explore that a
bit more with Martin Koper. He's managing director at Harwarts,
Cooper and Co. Back in the moment, oh eight, one
hundred eighty ten eighty twenty one to five.
Speaker 3 (28:27):
Watch me, you'll see the watch.
Speaker 6 (28:41):
Second.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Yes, welcome back. This is the one radio show My
guess is Martin Cooper from Harwarts, Cooper and co I
talking about finding that perfect moment to buy or do
you just need to get over yourself? Actually, Actually, to
be honest, Martin, to be blunt when it comes to
making a decision, you must be tempted with some buys.
Just say, look, do you like the house, what's your budget?
You've got the money to do it. Do you sort
(29:08):
of feel like? I don't mean telling them off, because
that's not good to sell, but you know, there's that
sort of thing. It's like, what else are you looking for?
This is what you want. It looks like you're within
the ballpark. Don't worry about three months from now, just
you know, get into it.
Speaker 4 (29:23):
Years ago, Waiketta University did a survey on major spending
big ticket items, they'll be a home or you expensive items,
and they the survey said eighty five percent of people
couldn't make that major buying decision by themselves. So I
just assume from there, I'll just say one hundred percent
can't make They need influencing, they need assistance. So and look,
(29:47):
we're real estate salespeople. It's our job to encourage, to
push to manifest these people getting into property and hey,
I'd often say I'll give you ten years time, I'll
give you money back, guarantee you enjoy living in this
and I'm sure you do a k out of it.
So just get on, don't miss out. You love it,
(30:08):
it feels right, make a commitment. Procrastination is a painful
thing and it's an expensive thing too. Quite often.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
Actually, somebody said that Ossie call them, And this is
a text that Ossie Caller needs to be played on
every media as an ad for New Zealand, including every
young person I know who is heading to Australia, mostly
to Melbourne Sydney because of the quote opportunity, high pay
and affordable property. Well, they are having a laugh on that. God.
I remember looking at Paran back when I was doing
my shows. There was a house in Paran for two
(30:37):
twenty and I remember thinking it was one of those
you know, the ones that lived next door with they're
sort of a single dwelling. I don't know, eighty or
ninety screen out Melbourne, Paran and Melbourne and it was
two hundred and twenty thousand. I was like, oh, that's pricey.
A few years later it's like about a million, and
I was.
Speaker 4 (30:53):
Like, oh, I missed the vote on that one.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
I must well give you a bit of a bouquet here, Martin.
Somebody said, Martin, you spoke at a conference in Auckland recently.
You're amazing. Thanks. There you go, there's just a little
bit fan mail for you.
Speaker 4 (31:06):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Can you, Tim, can you ask your guests as to
what they think about hazard maps and the impact on
buying a property. Please?
Speaker 4 (31:14):
Oh, yes, the hazard maps. They are a big concern
for buyers. You know, when that big flood came through
in twenty.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Oh, this is what might happen in one hundred years
sort of thing.
Speaker 4 (31:25):
Yeah, that's you know, coastal properties have where someone's predicted
the coastline might be, you know, with coastal erosion, the
inability to get insurance on those properties potentially, and so yes,
but you know, we live in a pretty woke world
of everything's got to have a warning even it's got
to have red cones or orange cones around it. So
(31:48):
sometimes you just can hear so much negative news, so
many reasons not to. You can get advised by your
third party advisors don't do it. You know, it's a Again,
there's a lot of people that kills sales that didn't
necessarily need to be killed.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Yeah, hey, there was something we're going to touch on
which we haven't really left much time from afraid, but
cleaning your financial act up. Yeah before well, I don't
know if you can clean your act up your financial history,
but if you're for borrowing, because the banks can see everything,
and they'll be certain flags for banks where they might
be like, these are your spending habits, so we see
in the last couple of years. I don't know having it.
(32:30):
Are there particular things that borrowers can do or should
do to make sure that they've got the best prospect
of success with a lender.
Speaker 4 (32:39):
Oh yeah, you've got to you've got to do a
financial fitness exercise. If you want to go get a property,
there's so many hoops you've got to jump through to
get the funding from the bank. So I recommend get
a mortgage broker and just have a deep and meaningful meeting.
Lay all your cards on the table. This is my income,
(33:00):
This is my Netflix subscription set up, this is my
car payments are credit cards. Go through everything and you
need It's just like you go to the doctor for
a checkup, go to your mortgage broker for a checkup,
how my place financially, What do I need to do
to improve my financial profile to get the maximum amount
and the best deal to get into the property ladder.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
The more I've heard, the more I've talked about real
estate over the last whatever how many years I've been
doing it is, the more in vogue. It seems to
be that it's almost a no brainer that if you can,
you should get a mortgage broker rather than just go
to your bank. And how what a great service they.
Speaker 4 (33:36):
The banks make a fortune and we're all beholding to them.
You look at the interest rates, we're all paying their
rate above the official cash rate. So sure I could
buy shears in a bank maybe and make me feel
happier get dividends because I'm always the one borrowing the money.
But so I would not go to the bank if
(33:59):
I was the first time buyer on my own. Just say,
I've had I've had an A and Z savings accounts
I was at school, and expect any favors. The bank
people are coached. They are there to get as much
money from the client as they can. So if you
get a mortgage broker on your team to go out
and hunt around all the different banks and get you
the best deal. It's their pros at it. They do
(34:22):
it every day, so it's your first time. Don't don't,
don't be bewildered by the banks. Get in with a
broker and get the best deal.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
Yeah right, we're going to be back in a minute
with the one roof property of the week. It's next
eleven minutes to five news talks. He'd be.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
The one roof property of the week on the Weekend Collective.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Okay, the one roof property of the week. I think lotto,
I don't know matter how much lotto is, And so
if you won lotto you could buy this property. I
think it is. And look, it's one of those Queenstown properties.
You go and look at it and you just imagine
how life would be if you had, if you could
afford a property like this, because it is quite gorgeous.
It's it's one todd lane in Lake Hayes, Queenstown, three bedrooms,
(35:06):
three bathrooms. It's very equitable, isn't it. The house is
I think the clue is in the house square meterridge,
so it's four hundred and thirty seven square meters and
the land is four and a half thousand square meters,
so there's a bit of land there. It's within this
state called Bendermere Estate above Lake Hayes. Architecturally, yes, it's gorgeous,
(35:27):
lots of schist and stone and it's as you would
want it to be. It's wrapped in rich modified African hardwood,
which is apparently chosen for STUI durability, probably responsible for
some of its prices. And I don't know anyway, it's
five years old, so it's not brand new. It's been
worn in, worn in. I don't think you'd ever used
(35:47):
that on a real estate ad. Martin. It's seven point
nine million.
Speaker 4 (35:52):
Martin Cooper gets down there and make a purchase if
you can afford it. One Todd Lane, Lake Hays, Brenda
Meir State. Beautiful sort of gated estate and quality properties
in that location. So have a look on that one roof,
have a look on the one roof site, and just
even if it's for an inspirational dream, if you.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Just actually I reckon going route around houses like this.
If you're looking to renovate, okay, you might not want
the African hardwood, but new builds you can get the
truckloads of good ideas to how you want your stairs
to look and to you know, bathrooms and the balance
of stone and all that sort of stuff. It's a
good way to pinch ideas, isn't.
Speaker 4 (36:32):
It brilliant way to pinch ideas. You know. And in
a full open home, if someone's looking to get internal
design interior design ideas, the other buyer doesn't know that
they're there for that reason, they think it's another buyer.
Creates a bit of competition. So the more you have
it at open home, it's like a busy retail shop.
You think, she there's a lot of action here. Well
that brendamere State. Look at it the mountain views. Yeah,
(36:57):
just incredible opportunity for someone in global terms. We had
a caller on from Sydney saying it's overpriced there, But
how good of value is that? It's seven mil when
you look at the location.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Let's pretend, let's let's be fair, it's eight mil. Really
it's seven point nine.
Speaker 4 (37:14):
Well I was sorry about that. I just all I
saw was the seven Actually, what is.
Speaker 2 (37:22):
It that stands out for you when you look at
a house? What are the things when you walk into
a spectacular house? What is it about this one that
grabs you because obviously the mountains around that area of
the part of the country. To me, it's the view
from the living room with the lovely big, you know,
comfortable couches with the spectacular windows looking out to sort
of out door area. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:42):
I love this one. The dark wood finish and the
timber and the concrete and the schist rock and all
the views because dark internal decoor, they sort you sort
of drawn to the outside. All the views, it's sort
of they just pop out at you. So this one
and it feels like cozy, it feels warm, it feels homely,
and you're just the internal fireplace with that central otago
(38:08):
rock is magnificent and it flows outdoors.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
Does it look like it? Do you reckon? I've got
a question because I think I probably like this. It's
going to have gorgeous decore anyway, Do you think it's
been staged because one of the beds in the photo
looks like it's a bit more lumpy than you would
think for the.
Speaker 4 (38:26):
Look at home of that value. Putting a couple of
hundred thousand of furniture into it's probably going to be standard.
And that's the thing you reach up to buy a
home at that value, and then you've got to you've
got to buy the furniture to match to have it
looking pristine, So you need a little bit more on top.
But yeah, I think that's very tempting.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Are you going to be hodding on a plane gown
of a look at it? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (38:51):
Well, I've got an apartment in Queenstown.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
Oh ok, yeah.
Speaker 4 (38:54):
My kids said to me, they're adults. I said I
might buy a nice house because I grew up in Queenstown.
And you know, they said, well, you'll keep the apartment,
won't you. Nah.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
I don't worry about the kids. Hey, Martin, great to
see if you want to catch up with Martin Harcourts,
Cooper and co. And we'll look forward to next time.
Thanks for coming in.
Speaker 4 (39:10):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
Sarah Chapman's with us next. How do you navigate letting
your kids make a few more decisions in their life
until they go on that flotilla to Gaza? Thanks so.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk zed Be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Cardiac Cowboys
The heart was always off-limits to surgeons. Cutting into it spelled instant death for the patient. That is, until a ragtag group of doctors scattered across the Midwest and Texas decided to throw out the rule book. Working in makeshift laboratories and home garages, using medical devices made from scavenged machine parts and beer tubes, these men and women invented the field of open heart surgery. Odds are, someone you know is alive because of them. So why has history left them behind? Presented by Chris Pine, CARDIAC COWBOYS tells the gripping true story behind the birth of heart surgery, and the young, Greatest Generation doctors who made it happen. For years, they competed and feuded, racing to be the first, the best, and the most prolific. Some appeared on the cover of Time Magazine, operated on kings and advised presidents. Others ended up disgraced, penniless, and convicted of felonies. Together, they ignited a revolution in medicine, and changed the world.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.