July 13, 2025 • 14 mins
Around 700 New Zealand soldiers and personnel are in Australia for the largest war-fighting and military training exercise in the Southern Hemisphere.
35-thousand soldiers from 19 nations are taking part in it.
The Defence Force says a key goal for them is to be able to integrate its capabilities into Australian and US relations.
The Government also announced ramping up defence spend earlier this year - but as it stands now, and with tensions abroad - how prepared are we?
Tim Beveridge talks to Senior National Officer Lieutenant Colonel Tim Tuatini for more.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Yes, welcome back. This is Politics Central. By the way,
just a quick note on Winston. You've got to admire
his consistency there on the polls and I think he's
actually got it right that he never likes to comment
on them because he doesn't basically trust them. And there
was a great opportunity for him to actually say, well,
actually doing pretty well, but he just don't care about
the poles, and good on him for that. Actually, I
(00:31):
think he's probably got the right approach for that. Anyway. Now,
about seven hundred New Zealand soldiers and personnel are in
Australia from now until August for the largest warfighting and
military training exercise in the Southern Hemisphere running from July
thirteenth to August for it's called Talisman Saber and thirty
(00:54):
five thousand soldiers from nineteen nations. Thirty five thousand soldiers.
Just said that again, it's a lot of people from
nineteen nations taking part in including a large naval as
it's taking part in it, including advanced data networks, missiles,
autonomous weapons and unmanned machine guns. I understand, the NZDF
(01:15):
is taking some light armored vehicles which are I think
likely vulnerable to the latest killer drones. The Australians are
going to be field testing an uncrewed machine gun double track,
and the Americans are shooting precision missiles and it's deploying
space age data networks. Wow. A bit of a contrast
there with all the infrastructure that's going to be put
into this one. Anyway, the Defense Force set a key
(01:36):
goal for them is to be able to integrate its
capabilities into Australian and US relationships. And of course we've
got the government announced ramping up spending earlier this year.
But as it stands now, how prepared are we? And
we have senior National Officer, Lieutenant Colonel Tim Tuatini joins
US now from Australia. Let me just killed the right
(01:57):
button there, Tim, Good afternoon, Yeah, sure to.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
How are you good?
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Did I get your title right? Singing?
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Most? Certainly? Hey?
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Look I do want to ask overly simplistic question, but
this sounds huge. How how much anticipation and excitement is
there within the military for taking partners exercise?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Look? It is, it is. It is huge, sort of
with sort of my little headquarters team sitting above all
of our fantastic engineers personnel who are involved in the exercise.
We're sitting at the at the high level with the
exercise control. And you know, for us, for us at
(02:41):
our little group, to see the amounts of effort and
just the wind and breadth of the organization and the
coordination that's required to run an exercise like this is amazing.
Certainly for our people that ride at that tactical level.
And I heard you in the introduction folk that that
(03:03):
man man all of our our vehicles and our weapons,
it's extremely exciting for them to be part of a
large activity like this.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
I know it's described it's a it's a bilateral thing
between Australia and the United States with seventeen other countries.
So how do we define our role if it's sort
of like Australia, US and others.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Yeah, so certainly this is this is a large activity. Look,
this is actually the eleventh duration of Colisman Sabers, So
it is a bilateral exercise between the ADF and the US.
We've we've been part of this for a number of
iterations and whilst we have a small component of that,
(03:45):
we actually snap into into our Australian partnerships as you know,
like historically we've always had we've always had an interoperability
and ability to deploy and be part and work with
our you know, what is our most important allied being
Australia And you know that it's historical, but even in
(04:06):
modern times now we have you know, maritime soldiers and
aviators currently serving overseas on operational complements alongside our Australian parts.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
What is the goal of the overall exercise?
Speaker 3 (04:22):
So the Coles and Saber and it is a it's
a bit of a mouthful, but it's it's it's it's
a multi domain operational exercise. So I suppose what does
that mean. So it's a massive exercise as you introduced
with huge numbers, but it focuses on and combat readiness
which is important across the air land, maritime, cyber and
(04:48):
space and those are all domains. So within that there's
a whole of different parts to that. And it's whether
it's live exercises, whether it's virtual exercises that brings a
number of the basin too by that or was a
US native and a number of parts is together to
actually exercise that and look where you know that. I
(05:10):
suppose the plus is a minus is our ability to
work together.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Look, the globe is always full of instability, but it
does feel these days that there is you know, the
sense of global instability is increased. Does that make any
difference to the feeling around and the importance of these
exercises from your point of view?
Speaker 3 (05:29):
Look, I think that's a really good question. We've always
I mean, it's important for New Zealand and our closest partners.
We're always about a rules based society and rules based
international engagement and how we actually work together. I suppose. Look,
(05:50):
I know certainly at the moment there's a lot more
instability strategically around the world. But essentially for us to
be part of this exercise internally, for our major our
lives who are conducting this, that they do this every
two years. Yeah, it's about focus. But again I think
it's an important part to this as well, where certainly
(06:11):
even at the lowest level, right up to my level,
it's about establishing connections with both the Australians and our
international partners. We train with them regularly, we course with
them regularly, we do a lot of activities with them
and we grow that connection as we go through from
the lowest level right up. And I think that's important
to understand you together, how we look at the international
(06:34):
or have our international view on what's happening in the
world at the moment.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
How desperate are you for you know, we've had some
new funding announced with Judith Collins, and look, from the
cynical point of view, there will be people who are
listening here, Look where that. Here's the Australian's got this
uncrewed machine gun, double track, the precision missiles, the space
age data networks, and we're bringing some light armed vehicles.
How what would you want New Zealanders to understand about this?
And also maybe how desperate are you to convert some
(07:00):
of that funding into new I'm not sure what the
word is equipment, weaponry, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
We actually have a number of I suppose a number
of projects and capabilities that are actually in uh in
planning and part of that with the Minister of Defense
released as it is, I think what we're doing here
it's actually quite it's quite good for our folks and
a number of those capabilities actually are here on the exercise.
(07:29):
So for through exciting to see those It's also good
for us to understand how should we acquire those capabilities
in the future and meding to them in the future,
how we would be able to bring that, I suppose
to this thing, to bring that to the table and
integrate that with with with our partners, particularly Australia. I
(07:51):
tell you what, there's some amazing bit of equipment here.
Got essentially a lot of that you know, is is large,
you know again your introduction, and and that potentially would
not fit with where we see ourselves going and how
we would work with with both Australia and our partners
you know, in the in the end of Pacific area.
(08:14):
But again I think a lot of it's also too
there's an ability for our people to see that, understand
what capability is out there, and then going forward, how
we how we would sort of work to provide our
peace with that we have, you know, like you said,
we have our we have our lab, we have our
roto wing, we have our U A V. We have
a number of other capablies that actually feel very very specific.
(08:38):
I suppose spaces within the larger capability bricks that are
out there exercising so Whilst we are small, we do
punch well above our weight. And I know we are
an extremely trusted partner and we're very used to working
within the Australian Battle Groups, within the Australian Task Groups
and different sort of formations that that we sort of
(09:00):
work with.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Is that actually one of the most important things for
us is, Look, we are always going to be up
against when it comes to competing with the resources of
larger countries. Is that possibly the most important thing for
us to preserve? As you mentioned the word credibility and
being a trusted partner, would that be number one? Really,
because when it comes down to conflict, you've got to
be able to trust the people you're working with.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Yeah, look it is. You know we are we are
a combat ready force and it's essentially these exercises protect
these large ones which where you know, we have the
ability to see other nations, but they also have the
ability to see us. You know, we are a trusted
and respected ally and partner, particularly for Australia, and I
(09:43):
know there's a lot of linkages with the US defense
as well, but it's also our ability to I suppose
interact and as I said earlier, it's about making connections
and even the simplest connections at the sailors, soldier or
aviator level, you know, on the ground as they go
through their careers, as we do our courses and other exercise,
(10:05):
it's actually important we can then sort of talk to
each other understand what we bring to the table.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
How quick is the face of the battles, battle zones
changing we look at from the news headlines that we
see just as the public, you know, the use of drones,
which is more about innovation than big money, isn't it.
How how quickly and how hard is it to keep
up with those changing faces of the way conflicts happen?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
I'm sure that's you know that art is probably the
same across to who you ask, It is very much.
Because the technology is so fast it is really hard
to keep up, and you know, as you sort of
said earlier, it's also very expensive to be at the
forefront of that. So you know, understand, the bigger nations
(10:51):
have the ability to acquire this quick held. But I
think also too for us to see that and understand
where that capablie fits is really important as well. What
I would say is that you know we also now
you know we just need to look at social Media's
a number of you know, New Zealand companies and local
(11:11):
companies that also well forward with technology that some of
the other nations have required as well. So that's that's
quite exciting, I think as well.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Just a couple more questions, how are you going with
We've got quite a few thousand vacancies I think is
that three thousand vacancies in the defense force we're looking
to fill. How are we going? How's that tracking?
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Look, we do have a hole in miss in our
defense force, but we are addressing that right across right
across our services. It does take time understanding that our
training raise ms and our ability to be able to equip.
But I think the focus and there's some very good
people focus on preparing our sailors, our aviators and our
(11:53):
soldiers to be an effective force. And I think, you know,
we have some really strong teams that are able to
integrate and so at that front end we're sort of
moving there. Yeah. I think the training, the training pipeline
is very effective. It's just it just takes time. It's
really hard to do it quickly and to do it
properly to make sure we've got good people. It said.
(12:15):
We're quite lucky. We have a lot of good people
coming in at the at the at the front door,
and then we're able to train them up and utilize
them and being exercises like.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
This great stuff. Look, imagine there's a little bit of
secrecy around how this all unfolds in the next few weeks.
But what's your role?
Speaker 3 (12:32):
So I'm actually in exercise controls. I'm the senior New
Zealand officer here within the actual controlling identity that controls
right across the top of the top of the exercise.
So each of that, each of the military elements you
have their own command structure, but I still above that,
(12:54):
I suppose for in a simple term, I have the
ability to support real time provide information both up and down,
and also talk back to New Zealand and to the
actual people that run exercise.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
Gosh, I'd love to find out more about that, but
I think I think we'll better wrap it up there. Hey, Tim,
I really appreciate your time this afternoon, and best of
luck for the exercises.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
No, I thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Cheers. That is lift tenant Lieutenant Colonel Tim to a teen.
He is the scene in the National Officer and that exercise. Look,
as he's mentioned, of course, it's it's not the first
time it's happened. It's got quite a grand name, hasn't it,
Talisman Saber. But thirty five thousand soldiers nineteen nations taking
part in this exercise. Actually, we're looking for your feedback
(13:37):
on this as well, because when I you know, you
talk to people like Tim and you hear the involvement.
And to me, I think one of the biggest parts
of these exercises for our forces is we're never going
to compete with that weaponry, and it's all about the
competency of our soldiers and the relationships that they forge
with our allies. So I think these exercises must be
hugely valuable. So we take your cause on that as well.
(13:59):
But also the chat we had with Winston and look,
New Zealand First have done well in the polls. He
brushes it off, of course, because he doesn't talk about Poles,
but he's cracking on Winston. How important is he? Do
you think to New Zealand First's success? Give us a
call on O eight hundred and eighty ten eighty and
then any other reaction. You've got to those interviews. We'd
(14:21):
love to hear from you. It is twenty one minutes
for the lines are open. You can text on nine
two ninety two. Of course, we'll be back in just
a moment. Week Collective News Talk SEDB.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
For more from the weekend collective, listen live to News
Talk SEDB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Yes, welcome back. This is Politics Central. By the way,
just a quick note on Winston. You've got to admire
his consistency there on the polls and I think he's
actually got it right that he never likes to comment
on them because he doesn't basically trust them. And there
was a great opportunity for him to actually say, well,
actually doing pretty well, but he just don't care about
the poles, and good on him for that. Actually, I
(00:31):
think he's probably got the right approach for that. Anyway. Now,
about seven hundred New Zealand soldiers and personnel are in
Australia from now until August for the largest warfighting and
military training exercise in the Southern Hemisphere running from July
thirteenth to August for it's called Talisman Saber and thirty
(00:54):
five thousand soldiers from nineteen nations. Thirty five thousand soldiers.
Just said that again, it's a lot of people from
nineteen nations taking part in including a large naval as
it's taking part in it, including advanced data networks, missiles,
autonomous weapons and unmanned machine guns. I understand, the NZDF
(01:15):
is taking some light armored vehicles which are I think
likely vulnerable to the latest killer drones. The Australians are
going to be field testing an uncrewed machine gun double track,
and the Americans are shooting precision missiles and it's deploying
space age data networks. Wow. A bit of a contrast
there with all the infrastructure that's going to be put
into this one. Anyway, the Defense Force set a key
(01:36):
goal for them is to be able to integrate its
capabilities into Australian and US relationships. And of course we've
got the government announced ramping up spending earlier this year.
But as it stands now, how prepared are we? And
we have senior National Officer, Lieutenant Colonel Tim Tuatini joins
US now from Australia. Let me just killed the right
(01:57):
button there, Tim, Good afternoon, Yeah, sure to.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
How are you good?
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Did I get your title right? Singing?
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Most? Certainly? Hey?
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Look I do want to ask overly simplistic question, but
this sounds huge. How how much anticipation and excitement is
there within the military for taking partners exercise?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Look? It is, it is. It is huge, sort of
with sort of my little headquarters team sitting above all
of our fantastic engineers personnel who are involved in the exercise.
We're sitting at the at the high level with the
exercise control. And you know, for us, for us at
(02:41):
our little group, to see the amounts of effort and
just the wind and breadth of the organization and the
coordination that's required to run an exercise like this is amazing.
Certainly for our people that ride at that tactical level.
And I heard you in the introduction folk that that
(03:03):
man man all of our our vehicles and our weapons,
it's extremely exciting for them to be part of a
large activity like this.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
I know it's described it's a it's a bilateral thing
between Australia and the United States with seventeen other countries.
So how do we define our role if it's sort
of like Australia, US and others.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Yeah, so certainly this is this is a large activity. Look,
this is actually the eleventh duration of Colisman Sabers, So
it is a bilateral exercise between the ADF and the US.
We've we've been part of this for a number of
iterations and whilst we have a small component of that,
(03:45):
we actually snap into into our Australian partnerships as you know,
like historically we've always had we've always had an interoperability
and ability to deploy and be part and work with
our you know, what is our most important allied being
Australia And you know that it's historical, but even in
(04:06):
modern times now we have you know, maritime soldiers and
aviators currently serving overseas on operational complements alongside our Australian parts.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
What is the goal of the overall exercise?
Speaker 3 (04:22):
So the Coles and Saber and it is a it's
a bit of a mouthful, but it's it's it's it's
a multi domain operational exercise. So I suppose what does
that mean. So it's a massive exercise as you introduced
with huge numbers, but it focuses on and combat readiness
which is important across the air land, maritime, cyber and
(04:48):
space and those are all domains. So within that there's
a whole of different parts to that. And it's whether
it's live exercises, whether it's virtual exercises that brings a
number of the basin too by that or was a
US native and a number of parts is together to
actually exercise that and look where you know that. I
(05:10):
suppose the plus is a minus is our ability to
work together.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Look, the globe is always full of instability, but it
does feel these days that there is you know, the
sense of global instability is increased. Does that make any
difference to the feeling around and the importance of these
exercises from your point of view?
Speaker 3 (05:29):
Look, I think that's a really good question. We've always
I mean, it's important for New Zealand and our closest partners.
We're always about a rules based society and rules based
international engagement and how we actually work together. I suppose. Look,
(05:50):
I know certainly at the moment there's a lot more
instability strategically around the world. But essentially for us to
be part of this exercise internally, for our major our
lives who are conducting this, that they do this every
two years. Yeah, it's about focus. But again I think
it's an important part to this as well, where certainly
(06:11):
even at the lowest level, right up to my level,
it's about establishing connections with both the Australians and our
international partners. We train with them regularly, we course with
them regularly, we do a lot of activities with them
and we grow that connection as we go through from
the lowest level right up. And I think that's important
to understand you together, how we look at the international
(06:34):
or have our international view on what's happening in the
world at the moment.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
How desperate are you for you know, we've had some
new funding announced with Judith Collins, and look, from the
cynical point of view, there will be people who are
listening here, Look where that. Here's the Australian's got this
uncrewed machine gun, double track, the precision missiles, the space
age data networks, and we're bringing some light armed vehicles.
How what would you want New Zealanders to understand about this?
And also maybe how desperate are you to convert some
(07:00):
of that funding into new I'm not sure what the
word is equipment, weaponry, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
We actually have a number of I suppose a number
of projects and capabilities that are actually in uh in
planning and part of that with the Minister of Defense
released as it is, I think what we're doing here
it's actually quite it's quite good for our folks and
a number of those capabilities actually are here on the exercise.
(07:29):
So for through exciting to see those It's also good
for us to understand how should we acquire those capabilities
in the future and meding to them in the future,
how we would be able to bring that, I suppose
to this thing, to bring that to the table and
integrate that with with with our partners, particularly Australia. I
(07:51):
tell you what, there's some amazing bit of equipment here.
Got essentially a lot of that you know, is is large,
you know again your introduction, and and that potentially would
not fit with where we see ourselves going and how
we would work with with both Australia and our partners
you know, in the in the end of Pacific area.
(08:14):
But again I think a lot of it's also too
there's an ability for our people to see that, understand
what capability is out there, and then going forward, how
we how we would sort of work to provide our
peace with that we have, you know, like you said,
we have our we have our lab, we have our
roto wing, we have our U A V. We have
a number of other capablies that actually feel very very specific.
(08:38):
I suppose spaces within the larger capability bricks that are
out there exercising so Whilst we are small, we do
punch well above our weight. And I know we are
an extremely trusted partner and we're very used to working
within the Australian Battle Groups, within the Australian Task Groups
and different sort of formations that that we sort of
(09:00):
work with.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Is that actually one of the most important things for
us is, Look, we are always going to be up
against when it comes to competing with the resources of
larger countries. Is that possibly the most important thing for
us to preserve? As you mentioned the word credibility and
being a trusted partner, would that be number one? Really,
because when it comes down to conflict, you've got to
be able to trust the people you're working with.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Yeah, look it is. You know we are we are
a combat ready force and it's essentially these exercises protect
these large ones which where you know, we have the
ability to see other nations, but they also have the
ability to see us. You know, we are a trusted
and respected ally and partner, particularly for Australia, and I
(09:43):
know there's a lot of linkages with the US defense
as well, but it's also our ability to I suppose
interact and as I said earlier, it's about making connections
and even the simplest connections at the sailors, soldier or
aviator level, you know, on the ground as they go
through their careers, as we do our courses and other exercise,
(10:05):
it's actually important we can then sort of talk to
each other understand what we bring to the table.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
How quick is the face of the battles, battle zones
changing we look at from the news headlines that we
see just as the public, you know, the use of drones,
which is more about innovation than big money, isn't it.
How how quickly and how hard is it to keep
up with those changing faces of the way conflicts happen?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
I'm sure that's you know that art is probably the
same across to who you ask, It is very much.
Because the technology is so fast it is really hard
to keep up, and you know, as you sort of
said earlier, it's also very expensive to be at the
forefront of that. So you know, understand, the bigger nations
(10:51):
have the ability to acquire this quick held. But I
think also too for us to see that and understand
where that capablie fits is really important as well. What
I would say is that you know we also now
you know we just need to look at social Media's
a number of you know, New Zealand companies and local
(11:11):
companies that also well forward with technology that some of
the other nations have required as well. So that's that's
quite exciting, I think as well.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Just a couple more questions, how are you going with
We've got quite a few thousand vacancies I think is
that three thousand vacancies in the defense force we're looking
to fill. How are we going? How's that tracking?
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Look, we do have a hole in miss in our
defense force, but we are addressing that right across right
across our services. It does take time understanding that our
training raise ms and our ability to be able to equip.
But I think the focus and there's some very good
people focus on preparing our sailors, our aviators and our
(11:53):
soldiers to be an effective force. And I think, you know,
we have some really strong teams that are able to
integrate and so at that front end we're sort of
moving there. Yeah. I think the training, the training pipeline
is very effective. It's just it just takes time. It's
really hard to do it quickly and to do it
properly to make sure we've got good people. It said.
(12:15):
We're quite lucky. We have a lot of good people
coming in at the at the at the front door,
and then we're able to train them up and utilize
them and being exercises like.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
This great stuff. Look, imagine there's a little bit of
secrecy around how this all unfolds in the next few weeks.
But what's your role?
Speaker 3 (12:32):
So I'm actually in exercise controls. I'm the senior New
Zealand officer here within the actual controlling identity that controls
right across the top of the top of the exercise.
So each of that, each of the military elements you
have their own command structure, but I still above that,
(12:54):
I suppose for in a simple term, I have the
ability to support real time provide information both up and down,
and also talk back to New Zealand and to the
actual people that run exercise.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
Gosh, I'd love to find out more about that, but
I think I think we'll better wrap it up there. Hey, Tim,
I really appreciate your time this afternoon, and best of
luck for the exercises.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
No, I thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Cheers. That is lift tenant Lieutenant Colonel Tim to a teen.
He is the scene in the National Officer and that exercise. Look,
as he's mentioned, of course, it's it's not the first
time it's happened. It's got quite a grand name, hasn't it,
Talisman Saber. But thirty five thousand soldiers nineteen nations taking
part in this exercise. Actually, we're looking for your feedback
(13:37):
on this as well, because when I you know, you
talk to people like Tim and you hear the involvement.
And to me, I think one of the biggest parts
of these exercises for our forces is we're never going
to compete with that weaponry, and it's all about the
competency of our soldiers and the relationships that they forge
with our allies. So I think these exercises must be
hugely valuable. So we take your cause on that as well.
(13:59):
But also the chat we had with Winston and look,
New Zealand First have done well in the polls. He
brushes it off, of course, because he doesn't talk about Poles,
but he's cracking on Winston. How important is he? Do
you think to New Zealand First's success? Give us a
call on O eight hundred and eighty ten eighty and
then any other reaction. You've got to those interviews. We'd
(14:21):
love to hear from you. It is twenty one minutes
for the lines are open. You can text on nine
two ninety two. Of course, we'll be back in just
a moment. Week Collective News Talk SEDB.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
For more from the weekend collective, listen live to News
Talk SEDB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.