July 7, 2024 • 41 mins
Financial stress has a way of seeping into every area of your life, and with the current economic climate, it's important to keep it from impacting your wellbeing.
Personal Wealth Educator from Acumen, Lisa Dudson, joins Tim Beveridge to discuss this and more on The Weekend Collective.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
And welcome back to the Weekend Collective. I'm Tim Beverage.
By the way, gosh, a couple of fantastic hours, No
pressure on my next guest. We had a great interesting
interview on politics with Lockwoodsmith just around the UK election,
but also if he had an interesting take on First
Past the Post and a certain nostalgia for it which
was kind of irresistible the way he described it. But anyway,
(00:58):
you can go and check that out. Go and look
for the Weekend Collective on iHeartRadio. All the show's packaged
up into any little package, and the last hour talking
about the benefits of lifting heavy weights when it comes
to defeating or fending off osteoporosis, and a fascinating discussion
with with Greg Pain from BioSport dot in dot codd
(01:21):
en Zen. But right now it's smart money and my
guest is while she's written a few books, she's a
personal wealth educator from Acumen.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
And it is Lisa Dudson, Lisa High, how are you.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
I'm very good, Thank you, Bonip.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
It is well one would hope, so I guess yeah,
you are you? A winter person.
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Not really. I mean I've just come back. I've you know,
obviously you read to get the violins out, but I've
just come back from six weeks in Greece and Turkey,
so you know, the whole winter things a little bit
more jealousy.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
I just feel a bit a bit hot, a bit
cold here, just because I've been in Greece. You know,
it's all sunny and hot.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
I've got a maide of mind.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
He's just been. He's in Greece right now and sending
me photos and that all looks so it does. I mean,
obviously people make sure they send you the best pecks,
but man, it does look gorgeous in that water and everything.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
I have to say though, the water when we're in
Greece was pretty chilly. The water in Turkey was nice.
But you know, you know, we loved being away, but
also we came home, we thought, and you know, it's
pretty hard to beat in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Oh nice to be home then, yeah, good on you,
Yeah and.
Speaker 4 (02:25):
Really nice, you know. I mean, it's nice scenery overseas,
but I think a lot of people don't look after
the country quite as well as maybe what we do
in New Zealand. So that's a nice thing about being
back home.
Speaker 5 (02:34):
You know.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
The other thing you've been if you've been traveling there,
you've been almost at the peak of sort of summer type.
Well not the peak, but it's fairly hot. Lots of
tourists and.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
I always think that the Yeah, I like.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
To travel on sort of off season now because the
crowds and some of these you know, you see photos
of the Trevy Fountain or something, but you see the
reality versus the brochure, and it's like, you know, I
think they had to close the Trevy Fountain or something.
I'm thinking of a different country obviously.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Bit yeah, I mean honestly that we were in Greecelan
Pantheon at the beginning of May and we were shuffling
with that people, right, yeah, so crazy busy.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Anyway, Well, nice to have in the studio. Do we
need to adjust their conditioning for you?
Speaker 4 (03:16):
I don't know, it's got to ask it out of
it out of the heat.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Can you set it to grease temperature please?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
A nice twenty eight actually I think we were up
to thirty nine. Oh no, that wasn't so pleasant.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
But I'm a winter guy. I like to be able
to just dress for the cold. But anyway, enough of
that now. Actually just sort of leading into the topic,
what was it like being away? And you obviously as
a tourist, you've sort of got your roast tinted glasses
on a little bit from time to time. What was
it like coming back to New Zealand Because we are
pretty down on ourselves right now.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
Yeah, and look at there is a little bit of
that sentimental all around the world. I think, you know,
everyone in Greece and Turkey was talking about the fact that,
you know, the cost of living. I mean Turkey in
particular has had phenomenal inflation and I was actually surprised
to how expense for everything was in Turkey. So, you know,
I think we've we're not on our own talking about
(04:10):
how tough it is out there at the moment, and
that was a common thing that everyone was talking about
while we're away.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
It's interesting because I've spoken to people in Australia and
a lot of the lot of the well, the zeitgeist
in New Zealand as everyone's going on, it's so great
in Australia and everyone's leaving, and yet when you speak
to people who have been living in Australia, they complain
of the same things that we're winging about as well.
It's funny, isn't it that we have this gilded sort
of image of everywhere else, but to hear someone in Australia, oh, mate,
(04:36):
the cost of living has gone up and the interest
rates and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, And I
was like, oh, it's almost a relief.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
And I think also too, human beings always tend to
think the grass is greener on the other side, and
invariably it's not. And you know, that was the thing
we love to be in overseas, but we're also super
glad to be home as well, because there's lots of
great things about being in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Oh that is that's surprisingly refreshing to hear that, Lisa,
good on you. But now look while we're talking about
it though, because at the moment, I mean, where there's
conversations not that we're going to be talking about so
much about the property market, but one of the things
that we're chatting yesterday with Kelvin Davidson from the from
Core Logic about how the saggy economy is you know,
(05:19):
the effect on the property market, but the word saggi
economy and the fact that there are a lot of
people who are struggling.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Because forget tax cuts.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
If Adrian or keeps his cash right up there, that's
doing a hell of a lot more impact on people's
lives than any little tax cut can do. And people
are doing it tough, aren't they.
Speaker 4 (05:39):
Oh? Look absolutely, I mean there's no question. It's just
about everyone you talk to is doing it tough in
some shape or form. You know, what, did I read
the other five hundred thousand, almost five hundred thousand Kiwis
are behind in some kind of debt repayment?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Yeah it was I think, Yeah, it was just under
five hundred thousand people who've defilt they had defaulted on
some debt arrangement.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
Yeah, so that's that's really significant. And that's whether it's
your credit card, or whether it's your more good or
car payments or business loans, you know, could be a
whole range of things. So I don't know how that compares.
I mean, it is high. I don't know how much
higher statistically it was from last year though.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
But you know how they measure that would have been?
How would they get the data on that. Would they
would they get data from for instance, I mean like
your water care bill, if you have missed the payment,
would you suddenly go bing wow?
Speaker 4 (06:25):
And then that's the thing. They probably do some surveys
and then makes a bunch of assumptions, I would imagine,
because it would be quite hard to get that really
accurate data, I would think, But it would be if
you missed a utility payment.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
I missed them all the time, only because I'm so
like disorganized. Well, it's not the biggest bill you get.
And I do pay attention to my credit card bill
because that's the one where hello, twenty eight percent or
whatever if you don't pay it twenty yeah.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
But the utilities, though, if you don't pay it on time,
you're often paid a ten percent penalty on it.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
I think I got a four dollar penalty at one stage,
So I was like, that's not very you know, but
it's actually you know what, let's not get distracted by that.
But the thing is financial stress is I think one
of the if not the top of the list for
the most debilitating thing that can affect Okay, I know
(07:13):
there are people who will have health issues and stuff
that can be also very stressful, but in terms of
it's a very common ailment. Oh, you got to have
financial stress, and how to deal with that when the
solution financially is not always immediately apparent. I mean, you've
written books about money and finance and things like that.
(07:36):
I mean, what are your sort of observations on the
best ways to deal with it when you really are
just thinking, gosh, I'm just sweating from week to week.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
Well, yeah, And I guess there is two pop components
that one is the mental head space around it and
that sort of financial stress, and then there's also the
practical side of financial stress. So we look at it
more from the mental perspective. I guess it's just trying
not to let it overwhelm you and recognizing that you
are going through some tough time and not beating yourself
(08:06):
up too much about it, because I think that's one
of the challenges that a lot of people have is
they kind of ready give themselves a good kicking about
the fact that they're in the maybe the meat that
they are that they're in. But a lot of other people,
as we've just heard with that statistic, are in a
bit of a francive pickle as well. So I think
it's you know, you're not on your own, and it's
just kind of going, Okay, well, let's just trying to
work through this, maybe some meditation or mindfulness.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Because I think that the problem with it is is
if you're the way it can be so I can't
think of the word, but it seeps its way into
other aspects.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Of your life.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Absolutely when you're unhappy, So maybe you're you've got less
patience for your kids and your relationship and your grump
and things like that, and it just has this and
you know, I just wonder if if there are any
what are the best ways? I guess maybe with the
question we should ask is what is the worst way
to deal with financial stress? Which is probably to ignore it?
Speaker 4 (08:56):
Yeah, to put your head in the sand. Yeah, absolutely.
And you know, even if you've got problems with the
ID for instance, you know the ID, and I've said
this before on the show, is that they're actually really
good to deal with if you get in some challenges
with anything, you with tax debt or i idid it.
But if you put your head in the sand, then
they conver the complete opposite. And it's the same with
payment plans. I've worked with a couple of friends and
clients over the years who've got themselves behind in payments,
(09:18):
and if they just go and ignore things, it gets
really bad. But if you actually contact those people that
you own money to and say, oh, look, i'm struggling,
how do we work through a bit of a plan,
then you might be surprised about how open people are
to putting a plan together for you. But if you're
going to go down that path too, though, you need
to make sure that you do stick to it and
you communicate. So dealing with things I think does make
(09:39):
a big difference.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Yeah, we'd love to hear from you on one hundred
and eighty ten eighty if you've got any questions for
Lisa and you, or you're struggling with just the load,
financial load and how you're going to get ahead. Problem
shared is a problem halved, as they say. But if
you're seeking some input and I think actually picking up
the phone sometimes on shows like this where it's fairly anonymous,
that sometimes it can be just that first step to
(10:02):
maybe addressing the problem that's grinding your down. I mean,
I've been I'm going to it's certainly not about me
but I've been a singer and a performing artist for
many years, and let me tell you, you go through a
lot of financial stress, and probably some of the financial
stress I feel now it's still an overhang from those
emotions of you know, when you're not sure exactly where
(10:23):
the next gig's coming from and how you're going to
pay for things.
Speaker 4 (10:25):
Well, that's right because you've had an experience that at
times wasn't necessarily great, and so that you tend to
reflect back on that experience that wasn't necessarily great. And
I think you know, when you are facing that stress,
you know, picking up the phone, talking to a friend,
talking to a family member, getting it off your chest.
You know, there's some really great services around New Zealand,
you know, budget free budgeting advisory services. If you work
(10:46):
for a large corporate, they've got, you know, an employee
assistance program that you may be able to tap into
to get some financial help. So there are a lot
of resources out there for you. I think it's just
having that courage to say, look, you know, I am struggling,
and to kind of own it and recognize it and
then say, okay, well what can I actually do to
move forward? And not give yourself a good bit kick
about it.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Well, give us a call on eight hundred and eighty
ten eighty if you've got you may have some advice
for people who are really struggling. Is if you've been
through tough times and you look at a lot of
successful people who and it seems like a trite story
that a lot of them like to point towards hardship
in this, but actually it's true a lot of them
have been through that hardship. And the difference between what
was the difference between single swimm I don't know what
(11:26):
it would have been, but we'd love to hear from
you on eight hundred and eighty ten eighty.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
I would just want to.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Dig into the the IRD because I've I was pleased
to hear you mention the IRD and that they're not
the sort of the bogey man that you know it
used to be, the sort of the ultimate sort of
heartless organization. The tax man is coming for you. But they,
my dealings have been quite surprising over the years in
(11:54):
that if you, especially if you communicate with them, they
are my I mean, look, there'll be people who have
exceptions to it. I thought they're fantastic actually, yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
And I think you know that's you know, my personal
experience and experience you know, obviously working with people over
the twenty five years that I have done, is that
if you communicate politely and fairly, they will do the same. Right,
But if you're going to give them grief because you're
going to remember, the person at the end of the
telephone and customer service is not the person who sets
the tax rates. So if you've put an issue with
how much tax you're paying, then obviously you're going to
(12:24):
have a problem. But you know, if you're just going
I'm behind in my taxes and I'm really struggling, and
you're genuine about it, they will you know, they're not
going to come down on hard, are you, because how
are they going to get their money if they just
come down to hard on you. They're going to genuinely
want to try and put a plan in place to
pick up their taxes. Right, But then you've got to
make sure that you follow that pain and then you
communicate if you're not following that plan, because otherwise if
(12:45):
you don't, then you get yourself into trouble.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
If you have people talking to you about what are
the first bits of advice you give to people who
are struggling to make ends meet that they maybe hadn't anticipated.
Speaker 4 (12:56):
Yeah, well, I think it's coming back to the basics,
which is really looking at every single thing that you
spend money on. And this is something I found really
quite interesting because obviously I've looked at so many people's
financial situations over doing this for twenty five years, and
you know, people go, oh, you know, I'm doing it
pretty tough. And then I see the nails, and I
see the new iPhones and you see all these sort
of things that may be important to them, but really,
(13:18):
if you're in a bit of a financial pack or
how important actually are they? So I think it's just
been super realistic and going back and going what other
things I can genuinely cut out. It's not necessarily forever,
but just to get yourself through this tough time.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
Is that one of the mental.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Blocks for people though, because.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
I would say for one of the mental blocks to
people properly planning for their retirement is so they don't
want to know how bad it's looking yep, and what
they're going to have to do. And that would be
the same that you're worried about certain key little things
in your life that you're thinking, but I just couldn't
bear it if I had to give up this simple
pleasure yep, or this, And I think that's a really
(13:57):
understandable human thing You've got to find you suddenly aiming
to metaphorically speaking sleep on a you know, on a plank.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Well, that's right. But then the other side of it
is is going, okay, well, if I don't, you know,
let's let go of this thing that gives me a
bit of pleasure, then where am I going to be financially?
What's the other side of that? So I get this
temporary relief from getting my nails done using the same example,
But then on the other side of you thinking, gosh,
you know, I'm not paying off my credit card, so
just one negate the other. And then the other thing
(14:27):
to think about, too, is that you don't necessarily not
have to do that thing that gives you pleasure for
the rest of your life. You may just say, look,
I'm just going to knock on its head for three
months just to get me through the tough time that
I'm in at the moment.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Yeah, okay, So we'd like to hear from you E
one hundred and eighty ten eighty. If you've got any
questions for Lisa Dudson, she's are you actually do we
describe you as a financial advisor as well? I can't
mean what the rule?
Speaker 4 (14:49):
Yeah, well I am in a financial advisor, but I
don't I'm not a regulated one.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Okay, right, So we're not giving specific financial advice, but
if you if you'd like to have a chat, share
your experience, or if you're seeking some advice on a
problem you want to get on top of, then we'd
love to hear from you on how do you deal
with financial stress without resting ruining your life or seeping into.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Every other area of your life.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Give us a call eight one hundred and eighty ten
eighty in text on nine two nine two, and actually
this hour as well, we're else it going to touch
on you know, there's is there a silver lining to
some of these dark times and opportunities that might present themselves,
and how do you make sure that you're one of
the ones who does it. It's twenty two past five
News Talks.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
He'd be.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Now sunbound myself.
Speaker 5 (15:36):
Heselfvery week content.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Yes, welcome back to smart Money. This is the week
in collective. I'm Tim Beverage. My guest is Lisa Dudson's.
She's a personal wealth educated from acumen. She's how many
books have you written, Lisa hones?
Speaker 4 (16:04):
Seem to you might, oh, that'd be helpful at eight eight,
But that's over twenty years.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Wow, I remembered it was quite some number when you
wrote your first Yep, what's because I would have thought
you'd get it out of your system if you've written,
you know, I guess, yeah, what makes you write?
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Say for it? You've written number two?
Speaker 2 (16:25):
One, it does well, maybe I'll run another and okay, three,
that's fine, But then you go four, five, six, seven, eight.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
Now, there was seemed to be a bit of a
reason why I wrote one, you know, at the time,
and and the first one was actually because I used
to talk to property vistas all the time and teach
them how about how to be property visitas. And then
I kind of got a bit bored telling people the
same thing over and over again, and then kind of thought, well,
why didn't I put this into a manuscript? And then
I put into a manuscript, and then I had a
bright idea one day I thought why didn't I publish it?
So I opened up the Yellow Pages and started ringing,
(16:51):
and I rung Penguin and they said, they said, oh yeah, yes,
Sin just manuscript, and so I sent it and they said, oh,
you know, we're quite keen to publish that, but then
turned it down at the lembit of hour and then
I was like, oh my god. So I went into
morning for about a month about it, and then I thought,
oh no, I'll pick up Yellow Page and I you
know this, this is in the old days, it's twenty
years ago. And then I sort of rang a few
other publishers and then got a contract with Read and
(17:12):
Random House and had to choose between the two, and
then you know, the rest is history. So it kind
of started as a way for me to be more
efficient and not keep repeating myself to all my clients.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
I'm not sure you could invite somebody comes on financial
advice and you go, listen, just here's the book.
Speaker 4 (17:28):
Come back from your well, there's a lot of information
to try and impart right. You know, you're charging people.
So I was trying to be efficient and be cost
effective for my clients, and you know, and I've just had.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
This sort of comic image of like, oh, look, here's
here's the book.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
Well that's not how most people typically decide to write
a book, but it was quite effective.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Okay, now, let's just on the a few people are
suffering from financial stress. What are the proactive steps that
I mean, I'm not saying we're going to come up
with a list of things, but from your experience, what
are the things that can be helpful to people to
start one perceiving their problem in a different way? I
(18:07):
guess yeah, Well.
Speaker 4 (18:08):
It gives me talk to a little bit about the
sort of the mental side of it and how you
approach it, because if you're a bit more positive about it,
I think you're gonna have a better outcome than if
you're very doom and gloom about it. So that probably
would be your first point. The second thing is probably
really around creating some awareness because most people, it's really
quite surprising is how little awareness people have over where
(18:29):
they actually spend their money, but tepicularly in the world
that we live in today, because we just you know,
we se that credit cards. In fact, we don't even
do that now. We use our phones right with payWave,
and so we lose a lot of that awareness that
we had when we did use to use cash.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
There's some app, isn't there is it? I seem to
have some recollection of an app that you could plug
your finances in too, and it would tell you you've
spent In fact, I think I might have had it
but deleted it.
Speaker 4 (18:56):
There's been a few different ones over there.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
You've spent this amount at the supermarket, You've spent this
on at cafes, and it gives.
Speaker 4 (19:04):
You categorizer and some of them have, you know, the
categorized you're spending.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
But then you've got to still to look at it like,
I don't think I like what I read so well.
Speaker 4 (19:12):
And that's the problem right with awarness thing, right, because
you've got to have a bit of a bit of
confidence and a bit of bravery when you do actually
decide that you want to be a little bit more
aware with your money. But that's I think, really what
your first step is is to create that awareness, and
then once you've got that n awenness, you can actually go, well,
am I actually being smart with where I'm spending my money?
And because I've done this for so many years now,
(19:34):
I know that in the vast majority of cases when
people actually do pay some attention and track where they
spend their money for let's say a month, they will
usually be quite surprised about where they spend their money
because it's twenty dollars here, it's fifty dollars here, and
then they don't realize how much that adds up to
over a period of time.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
It's actually recently I have I don't eat out very much,
and I think I did. We have a bit of
a get together with some of the hosts here who
work overnights and we do a regular monthly lunch. But
it gave me a taste for having and I did
stop and I thought, hang on a minute, so that
cost me X that one I did on Wednesday, and
(20:11):
I went, I, I'm I have to button back on that,
because man, it adds up as soon as you just
do a little bit of analysis. It can be quite
confronting because that piece of plastic that just goes blip.
Speaker 4 (20:22):
Yep, yeah, well that's wrong.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
Pray.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
A lot of my more professional clients who reasonable and
comes maybe spending five teen thousand dollars a year easily
on lunches and lattes and the odd wine after work
and not even talking about dinners out at night, but
just literally buying their lunches and morning teas well.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Actually even and when we don't even need to be
talking about having a flash lunch where you sit down
for a nice meal and have it last one. But
if you are buying a filled roll yep, five times
a week and then you go, yeah, i'll get a
coffee today, I'll get another call.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
Well, there's probably twenty dollars easy, no sweat, Yeah, that's right.
So all those things add up and so then you go, okay,
well is there a smarter way for me to spend
my money? So I think it's looking at them and
go you know, are you going to make can you
make different decisions about where you spend your money? And
then the other side of it is to kind of
look at and where can you create some income. So
(21:13):
I saw something that came through on my Facebook page
of the day that you know, someone was looking to
house Chinese students who were over here for I think
it was only about a month or so, but they
were paying four hundred dollars a week. Now, you know,
you've got to obviously feed them, but it's probably not
a huge amount extra on your family grocery bill, but
that could be a way of raising ony twelve hundred
dollars over a month, which may help with paying off
(21:35):
a credit card bill. And then you may say, well,
you don't necessarily like having other people in your homes,
but then you how do you you know, you just
goint of reconcile the value of that money versus having
someone in your house, and it could be a great
cultural experience too for your kids.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
The other well, the other thing you touched on earlier
at the start of the show is budgeting services. Yeah,
and I would imagine there wouldn't be too many people
involved in budgeting services who who would say, actually, we
had this person and we couldn't save them any money.
Speaker 4 (22:01):
Yeah. Oh, honestly, I've you know, I've been doing this
for twenty five years, what I've been doing and doing
consultations and charging people for it. And I would be
absolutely stunned if I have ever had a client and
the whole time that I've been in business that I
haven't been able to save them my fee of coming
to see me. Because there's always something that you can find, right,
and part of it is is because you know, just
(22:21):
human nature sometimes we don't want to have to look
at some of those things because we go, oh, we
actually really like that, so but you may like it,
but it may not actually be that good for you.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
What a sort of it?
Speaker 2 (22:30):
What are some obvious areas of wastage that people might
find if they went or hang on a minute, I
think she's got a point that I'm not going to have.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
A look at that.
Speaker 4 (22:36):
Oh, I mean, I think food is probably number one.
It's looking at making visual food. Yeah, yeah, and let's
take aways. You know a lot of people, you know busy,
so you know uber eats, you like, I've got lots
of friends who are complaining about their kids spending all
their money on ubeats, you know, and after Nuban eats
you're paying more than what you are even going out.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
And actually well also and actually I think probably because
it's uber eats, people think, oh, it's quite a bargain
driven sort of deal.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
No, because they usually the I think the prices are
usually higher with ub eats than if you went and
picked up takes away and they've got a fee.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Usually well, I wouldn't know because I've never done them.
Because I'm inherently sort of thinking I'll do it myself,
thanks very much.
Speaker 3 (23:13):
Yeah, well there is usually sober.
Speaker 4 (23:15):
So usually well we order some for some friends, some
burgers one night from I don't know where it was,
and they were like thirty dollars each by the time
around burger on uber eats, and I was like, holy moly,
that's expensive, you know, So that's that's not one. I mean,
I think food is a big one, right, So it's lunches, lat's,
you know, you know, takeaways, Uber eats, that's a biggie. Also,
(23:36):
looking sometimes at your clothes, you know, because there are
some great secondhand places out there where you can get
second hand clothes, second hand clothes for your kids, second
hand clothes for yourself. That can save you a bit
of money. There's also quite a bit in nails, facials, massages,
a lot of you know, those sorts of things that
make you feel.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Good, well actually beauty treatments and bety treatments. Yeah yeah,
I mean again, I don't have a hell of a
lot to do with that apart from the old hair cut.
Speaker 4 (24:05):
But yeah, you know, you don't spend a lot of
money on facial.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
It's no regular facial, you can tell.
Speaker 3 (24:08):
I don't spend a lot of money on probably is
it a surprise.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
I mean, so if people went through a simple what
period of time would they look at with their budget,
basically a month or time?
Speaker 4 (24:19):
I think a month is the minimum and if you
can check in and I always think if you can
do it really strictly with the month, So if you
had some sort of notebook or piece of paper that
you wrote down every single set that you spend over
the course of a month, that would give you a
really good understanding. If you could squeeze it sort of
to two months or three months, that would be awesome.
But I think one month is the minimum. And say,
(24:41):
because I've done this exercise with so many people over
the years, they winge and moan, and you know, but
once they actually do it, they actually realize how rewarding
and how helpful it actually is.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
And how does that change? I mean, what does that
lead to in the end if they once they started
addressing that, what's the sort of journey they take? Well,
they just.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
Typically go, gosh, I had no idea of spending that
much money on that, right, So that's really what the
issue is. And then it's going, Okay, now I realize
where I'm spending my money and I've got this financial
stress on the other side of me. How do I
actually reconcile those things? And it's the same when you're
trying to lose weight, you know, the Dietesians always tell
you to write down anything that you eat so you're
not you know, and then you're starting to realize, oh, well,
I'm having three chocolate bars every afternoon, right, And whereas
(25:22):
if you hadn't written it down, you may not have
been aware that you were okneaking in the chocolate bars.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
On the more serious side of things, okay, imagine there'll
be people who have lost their jobs, and we've had
some high profile job losses of course with the news
have people which is just one section of society where
people have lost their jobs are very public. But if
you've got a mortgage, you know the cash rate's still high,
you might have refixed recently, and it's not just a
case of cutting out the lattes.
Speaker 5 (25:47):
What is.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
What is the first step you should I guess you should.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
Talk to your bank, absolutely, talk to your bank, talk
to your mortage advisor, and then go okay, right, I'm
just not going to be able to pay my mortgage
this month, and you know, get a bit of a
break on your mortgage if you can. So that's the
that's the first thing that you've really got to be
doing again. It's all this stuff about being proactive, because
I think as soon as you get onto it, the
better off you're going to be.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Has there been it?
Speaker 2 (26:13):
I remember my Donkeys years ago that you could read
the property press and there was always a section at
the back well. At one particular time it must have
been in an earlier crash, but there were a lot
of mortgage sales the black and white pages. And I
think from chatting to people in the property sector as well,
in which you've been heavily involved as well, that there
(26:33):
has been a change of culture even that we will
never see those days of those chapters of mortgage sales
because the banks, it's just the institutions seem to approach
it from a more I don't know, this is the
last thing they want to do. I wonder if in
days gone by, maybe twenty or thirty years ago, mortgage
b sales happened more frequently simply because the attitude of
(26:57):
the bank, the culture of banking is. Is there a
difference now being a bit too sunbeam and rainbows sort
of optimistic about the way that the banks treat these
things well.
Speaker 4 (27:07):
I mean I don't necessarily know because they still are
morgs Stales happening, but I think there is differently. You know,
these banks today have departments that deal with financial hardship.
So the banks don't want to They want to try
and make it work for you. And this is the
same when I was saying with the IAD before. You know,
if you're proactive and you sit down and go, I'm
(27:28):
in this, you know, financial challenge, how do we work
through it? They will do their best because they don't
want to tip you out of their you know, out
of your home. It's the last thing I want to do.
But again, you can't just ring them after the third
month that you've not paid your more, because you've got
to do it as soon as you possibly can.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Okay, look, we take a quick break and come back
in a moment. It's a twenty three twenty three minutes
to six. Gosh, time flies already. We're with Lisa Dudson
talking about financial stress. How have you dealt with it?
Speaker 3 (27:56):
With it? Have you any lessons you like it?
Speaker 2 (27:58):
In part to us that might be useful for people
who are doing it tough. Right now, this is NEWSTALKSB.
It's O eight hundred and eighty ten eighty and the
time is twenty Hamman. I almost read that time for
a second, twenty three minutes to six.
Speaker 5 (28:12):
Please please please don't true, please please please don't bring
me years.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
We just us and welcome back to the Weekend Collective.
This is smart money. My guest is Lisa Dudson, Personal wealth,
educated from acumen. Now, actually we're going to shift the
topic as well, because there are two sides to There
are two sides Lisa.
Speaker 3 (28:40):
Of course to win.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
There's a bit of a downturn, and that in fact,
I know that unless I do something about this myself,
I'll be kicking myself in a couple of years time again.
But of course, in tough times, there are other opportunities
to be had, aren't they.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
Oh, look absolutely, I mean, now's a great time to
be looking at, you know, the property market, because the
property markets really in a bit of a lull at
the moment. I mean, I think some people tend to
think that it's you know, has further to fall, and
maybe that might be on the short term, but I
think Every commentator that I tend to talk to is
pretty positive about the future. But that future probably starts
(29:15):
next year rather than this year.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
What do you think I mean, how I mean this
is reckons It does have.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
The idea. It does feel like it might be soft
for a while.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
Should I say because we've got the government saying we
want to Well, it's not because of them, it's because,
you know, it's expensive to borrow in comparison to what
people have got accustomed to two or three years ago,
and there are people struggling, there are people who need
to sell. How long do you see that sort of
(29:49):
the current situation persisting for, you.
Speaker 4 (29:52):
Know, looking into my very hazy crystal ball, I would
think that as soon as we are start sing industrates
come down, that will be quite a fundamental change. Obviously,
firstly from the perspective that you you're starting to pay
less for your money. You've i mean for a lot
of people who got fixed rates that you've obviously got
to come to the end of your current rate to
(30:12):
be able to take advantage of that. But then also
sentiment changes, and I think that's the challenge we have
at the moment, is that when everyone we're in the
middle of the winter. We're in the middle of winter
with the economy as well as the weather, so everyone
around you is often talking about losing your jobs, and
things are tough, so you get a bit kind of
drowned in it, and that's all that you see. Whereas
let's imagine we get to the end of the year
(30:34):
and interstrates start coming down, some is out, you know,
sunshining every day, and then people will start feeling a
lot more positive, and that has a bit of a
it becomes a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy. So
I think, you know, we're not far away from that.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
It does have I do have a sense that with
property that we're a little bit like a herd, of course,
and there are many who who sort of run in
a different path to the herd, and those people probably
sometimes do quite well because the interest rates drops all
of a sudden, Whe's like, oh, you know, put the
heads up and think about getting in to it, and
all of a sudden. I wouldn't say there's going to
(31:06):
be a stampede or anything, but we have seen those
moments in the proper mines of way, of course.
Speaker 4 (31:10):
So look, you know, a lot of my friends of
mine and people I know that are successful investors have
all been buying right now if they can get the money,
they're buying right because I think that's never going to
be cheaper than what it is right now. You know,
Back in October sort of into twenty twenty one, I
was saying to everyone who listened to me, is like,
don't buy. We're in a bubble. The prices are too crazy,
and we had the whole sort of fom I think
(31:32):
going on the fear of missing out. So everyone was
going gangbusters and going into property paying silly, silly prices.
And then obviously the thing you know that started it
peeked out and it has dropped it a twenty odd
percent since then, so you know, but it's that herd mentality, right,
and people are saying, to my least, you're wrong. It's
still got lots to go. Everything's happening, and I'm like,
it's getting to out of control. And it's the same
(31:52):
thing in reverse now. Right, everyone's thinking very doom and gloom.
But I think it's actually the time to be seriously
looking at buying.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
For that.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
It's interesting for people who actually are looking to sell
simply because they want to well they want to upsize,
downsize or whatever. But buying and selling it, I guess
the buying and selling in the same market is never
such a problem, but it does.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Is it a tricky sort of.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Climate to negotiate it if you're getting out to get
into something else.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
And it was funny because a conversation with a friend
came to mind recently and that an investment property and
they were thinking about selling it because they go, you know,
seven percent interest rates. It's costing us X dollars you know,
per month extra than what we thought it was going
to cost to keep this rental property. So we've got
negative cash flow on it. And I'm like, okay, well
why did you go into the property? Okay, we went
with the property for the long term. Okay, So now
(32:42):
it's not long term, is it. You know, you're taking
a short term view. So if you think about the
long term. So let's say that you sell that investing property,
you take a bit of a hit on it, and
then you're saving yourself a bit of a bit of
that negative cash flow. But then in twelve months time
or two years time, when the market's gone up again,
you're buying in and paying fifty thousand dollars more so,
how does that compare to the money you're paying to
(33:03):
top that place up? Right now?
Speaker 2 (33:05):
Is it that people just get There'll be people who
just I'm just so over absolutely subsidized in this bloody
property and it's it's is it going to go up?
And they're starting to lose faith in it and they're
just knack it emotionally and they're sick of they just run.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Out, you know.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
And it's a really strong impulse for people, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
Yeah? Absolutely? And again it's that all that negativity around you,
and then everyone sees it's like the TEXTI driver right.
Everyone says, oh, you know, shouldn't be buying property right now?
And then you look at you all this money going
out of your bank out every month, and you're going, oh, gosh,
maybe I should sell. But then again, because I've been
doing this for such a long time, I would almost
say to spend. Every single person I know that has
sold the ever ende property in these situations has later
(33:45):
regretted it.
Speaker 3 (33:46):
Well, it is a little bit locking in your locking.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
Your losses as well.
Speaker 3 (33:52):
It is that.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Always simple, simplistic.
Speaker 4 (33:55):
Now, now all these things are simplistic really, because you're
really going to look at your own personal circumstances. Now,
if it's a matter of you don't like it's a
bit tough, but you don't really like that negative cash
every month, that's a bit different from you can't afford
you seriously cannot afford that negative casual every month. So
they're two slightly different situations, right, because.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Look, if I was an expert, i'd be sitting where
you are probably. But the one thing I get the
sense is that if you can, if you can hold
onto the property. Now, you should hold property, if you
should hold onto it, if you are an investor, if
you can, because when it turns around, it'll.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
You'll catch up.
Speaker 4 (34:33):
Yeah, that's right. And look, there's you know, there's always
downturns and where you know, we can look in lots
of different analysis over the years about share markets and
property markets and all sorts of different types of investment
markets and you'll find that there's always peaks and drops.
But if you hold for that long term, you know,
it's very very rare that you won't do well. But
the things with property, though, is long term. I perceive
(34:53):
I always think it's ten years plus yeah, it's not
under ten years. It's over ten years. And I'm always
encouraging people that I'm dealing with to be thinking at
least ten years.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Is that Do you think that that's because so many
of those headline in the boom sort of time, we're
all about, oh.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Well, the property flippers.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Of course we never read about the property flippers who
bought just before it turned to custard and flipped it
for a massive loss. But let's put that to one side.
But there's so many stories about, oh, only bought it
four years ago. It's we're worth another three hundred thousand.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
It's so unhelpful.
Speaker 4 (35:25):
Yeah, yeah, and we've all got that. We've all got,
you know, buying zero. She is she is at certain
price or testa she is at certain.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
Prices down those few years ago.
Speaker 4 (35:33):
Yeah, that's right. So but if you know, it's all
about timing sometimes and sometimes you kind of luck out
of wee. And look, I've got a friend of mine's
a very been a very successful trader over the long term,
but he's had a couple of doozies in the last
couple of years. You know, he's got it wrong. So
you know, that's the thing with most things in life.
And it's not all sunshine and roses.
Speaker 2 (35:50):
No, it's just that people like to talk about the
sunshine and roses and they leave out the crappy stories.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
Yeah, that's right. So I think a lot of these
things come back to looking at your personal circumstances, what
are you trying to achieve, and thinking about context and
also been read careful about listening sometimes to your friends
and family because often they don't know much about anything.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
What are the sort of properties that people right now?
I mean you've talked about property investors. If they can
they're getting in. Is there a type of property in
general that people are going for that is the most
appealing sort of investment? And I guess you're going to
say it depends what you want. Do you want the yield?
Do you want the yield from the investment, or do
you want to even though you can't tell the taxman
(36:33):
you buy it with the intensive capital gains because technically
you have to pay tax on that that they can
improve your intention. But let's be honest, most long term
people are holding because well, I mean they're looking maybe
that they get on top of it and get the yield,
but also eventually it's going to be worth a lot.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
Yeah, that's right. And look, I think again there's pros
and cons are different types of property because like there's
some advantages to new bills. For instance, you know their
exempt from the DTIs, you know, less deposit year, low maintenance,
you know, quite good cash flow on them because consistent
cashlo because you don't have that maintenance issue. But then
you know, and they're quite good for more passive investors.
(37:10):
But if you've got the time and I'm talking about
some serious amount of time to actually loan to be
a property investor, you know, like for instance, training friends
of mine might look at fifty houses before they buy
buy one, all.
Speaker 3 (37:20):
Right, they just go out and go, right, there's one.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
And they've often spent years learning about that market, right,
So there's a lot of time and effort that goes
into it. So let's say you buy something and you
buy it quite well, and then you've got to go
and get a trades team together and renovate it and
make sure that you renovate it well so you don't
have any issues, but you don't overspend because then you
overcapitalize and then with a bit of ac because you've
bought well, you've done all that research, you've bought well,
(37:45):
you've renovated, well, then you might have an upside with
the revaluation.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
So somebody has decided they're going to buy an investment property,
Now how I mean, where would their starting point for
homework be?
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Do you think?
Speaker 4 (37:57):
I always think for the most part, you're better off
trying to find something that's kind of local to you,
because it's all very well saying okay, you're an Aukland,
you can buy a house is cheaper Dunedin, but you've
got to get on a plane and be able to
get down to Dunedin and do that research. I mean, yes,
you can do a lot of stuff online, but nothing
beats on.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
The paper, whether people just look on paper or whether
it's best to you know, focus on a market. You
one or two markets, you think you'll have a hunch
about them, then go do you?
Speaker 5 (38:22):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (38:23):
And I think it's just you know, these property investment
groups out there, there's heaps and heaps of stuff online
that you can go and have a look at. It's
just doing that research. Joining your local property investors association
is fantastic, so you know, there's it's just trying to
build up that knowledge like anything new that you're learning,
it's just it's building up that skill in education.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
Fantastic. Look, we'll be back in a moment. This is
Smart Money with Lisa Dudson. I'm Tim Beveridge. That is
just gone nine minutes to sex News Talk to Welcome
back to the show. I'm Tim Beveradge. This is Smart Money.
We've only got a couple of minutes left, Lisa, And
actually it's a shame we went on are while we
(39:02):
were chatting just about now. Somebody something in text about
is it a good time to buy shares at the moment?
Very very open open question. Is it depends what shares?
Speaker 3 (39:11):
I guess.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
And but we were talking about our chat that I've
had with Martin Haores and that it used to be
the key we discussion on shares that I should buy
X company ABC or this or that, And it seems
that most of the people know what they're talking about, saying, look,
go with a good fund. They're always going to be
hit on you their amount of money they spend on
researchers and either that or just go to the races.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
Like that. Isn't it for picking your own stocks? Unless
your one on Buffett, Well.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
That's right, and I think, look, I do meet some
people that do okay picking their own stops, but that's
lack a part time job that they have, right, and
so they spend a lot of time on that. But
I think for the average investa far better off going
to a fund manager. I think one of the barriers
is people go, oh, well, I've got to pay for them,
but it's like, yeah, you've got to be looking at
what do you actually get in return? And you know,
we because I have another company called Satin Advice, and
you know, we outsource a lot of our research of
(39:59):
our funds, and we spent a fortune on that. And
they're let alone the money that the company that we
get all our research from, how much time benefit that
they spend keeping on top of the market. So there's
a there's a lot of work that goes into trying
to figure out not only when you buy, but when
you sell. And like we were talking about before, you know,
the price of shares can actually change super quick.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
Yeah, and if if you get caught out then I've
been caught out by that before. Just fun story, but
won't share that with you. We've only got about thirty
seconds together. But I people want to check out your work.
Speaker 4 (40:27):
It's acumen acumen dot co dot insid.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Acumen dot co dot inziend gosh, time flies.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
Thanks so much, Lisa, very welcome.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Yeah, and how did you manage to miss getting a
town in grease?
Speaker 4 (40:38):
Well?
Speaker 2 (40:41):
Sorry, I was just killing twenty seconds with an insult
you forel bit about just killing hey. Thanks, thanks so
much for coming, and thanks my producer, Tyra Roberts. I'll
actually I'm away for a couple of weeks, so we'll
catch you Weekend up the next and enjoy the rest.
Speaker 3 (40:59):
Of your evening and catch you soon.
Speaker 5 (41:05):
Awesome.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to news
Talks it Be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
And welcome back to the Weekend Collective. I'm Tim Beverage.
By the way, gosh, a couple of fantastic hours, No
pressure on my next guest. We had a great interesting
interview on politics with Lockwoodsmith just around the UK election,
but also if he had an interesting take on First
Past the Post and a certain nostalgia for it which
was kind of irresistible the way he described it. But anyway,
(00:58):
you can go and check that out. Go and look
for the Weekend Collective on iHeartRadio. All the show's packaged
up into any little package, and the last hour talking
about the benefits of lifting heavy weights when it comes
to defeating or fending off osteoporosis, and a fascinating discussion
with with Greg Pain from BioSport dot in dot codd
(01:21):
en Zen. But right now it's smart money and my
guest is while she's written a few books, she's a
personal wealth educator from Acumen.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
And it is Lisa Dudson, Lisa High, how are you.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
I'm very good, Thank you, Bonip.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
It is well one would hope, so I guess yeah,
you are you? A winter person.
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Not really. I mean I've just come back. I've you know,
obviously you read to get the violins out, but I've
just come back from six weeks in Greece and Turkey,
so you know, the whole winter things a little bit
more jealousy.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
I just feel a bit a bit hot, a bit
cold here, just because I've been in Greece. You know,
it's all sunny and hot.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
I've got a maide of mind.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
He's just been. He's in Greece right now and sending
me photos and that all looks so it does. I mean,
obviously people make sure they send you the best pecks,
but man, it does look gorgeous in that water and everything.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
I have to say though, the water when we're in
Greece was pretty chilly. The water in Turkey was nice.
But you know, you know, we loved being away, but
also we came home, we thought, and you know, it's
pretty hard to beat in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Oh nice to be home then, yeah, good on you,
Yeah and.
Speaker 4 (02:25):
Really nice, you know. I mean, it's nice scenery overseas,
but I think a lot of people don't look after
the country quite as well as maybe what we do
in New Zealand. So that's a nice thing about being
back home.
Speaker 5 (02:34):
You know.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
The other thing you've been if you've been traveling there,
you've been almost at the peak of sort of summer type.
Well not the peak, but it's fairly hot. Lots of
tourists and.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
I always think that the Yeah, I like.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
To travel on sort of off season now because the
crowds and some of these you know, you see photos
of the Trevy Fountain or something, but you see the
reality versus the brochure, and it's like, you know, I
think they had to close the Trevy Fountain or something.
I'm thinking of a different country obviously.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Bit yeah, I mean honestly that we were in Greecelan
Pantheon at the beginning of May and we were shuffling
with that people, right, yeah, so crazy busy.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Anyway, Well, nice to have in the studio. Do we
need to adjust their conditioning for you?
Speaker 4 (03:16):
I don't know, it's got to ask it out of
it out of the heat.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Can you set it to grease temperature please?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
A nice twenty eight actually I think we were up
to thirty nine. Oh no, that wasn't so pleasant.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
But I'm a winter guy. I like to be able
to just dress for the cold. But anyway, enough of
that now. Actually just sort of leading into the topic,
what was it like being away? And you obviously as
a tourist, you've sort of got your roast tinted glasses
on a little bit from time to time. What was
it like coming back to New Zealand Because we are
pretty down on ourselves right now.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
Yeah, and look at there is a little bit of
that sentimental all around the world. I think, you know,
everyone in Greece and Turkey was talking about the fact that,
you know, the cost of living. I mean Turkey in
particular has had phenomenal inflation and I was actually surprised
to how expense for everything was in Turkey. So, you know,
I think we've we're not on our own talking about
(04:10):
how tough it is out there at the moment, and
that was a common thing that everyone was talking about
while we're away.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
It's interesting because I've spoken to people in Australia and
a lot of the lot of the well, the zeitgeist
in New Zealand as everyone's going on, it's so great
in Australia and everyone's leaving, and yet when you speak
to people who have been living in Australia, they complain
of the same things that we're winging about as well.
It's funny, isn't it that we have this gilded sort
of image of everywhere else, but to hear someone in Australia, oh, mate,
(04:36):
the cost of living has gone up and the interest
rates and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, And I
was like, oh, it's almost a relief.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
And I think also too, human beings always tend to
think the grass is greener on the other side, and
invariably it's not. And you know, that was the thing
we love to be in overseas, but we're also super
glad to be home as well, because there's lots of
great things about being in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Oh that is that's surprisingly refreshing to hear that, Lisa,
good on you. But now look while we're talking about
it though, because at the moment, I mean, where there's
conversations not that we're going to be talking about so
much about the property market, but one of the things
that we're chatting yesterday with Kelvin Davidson from the from
Core Logic about how the saggy economy is you know,
(05:19):
the effect on the property market, but the word saggi
economy and the fact that there are a lot of
people who are struggling.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Because forget tax cuts.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
If Adrian or keeps his cash right up there, that's
doing a hell of a lot more impact on people's
lives than any little tax cut can do. And people
are doing it tough, aren't they.
Speaker 4 (05:39):
Oh? Look absolutely, I mean there's no question. It's just
about everyone you talk to is doing it tough in
some shape or form. You know, what, did I read
the other five hundred thousand, almost five hundred thousand Kiwis
are behind in some kind of debt repayment?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Yeah it was I think, Yeah, it was just under
five hundred thousand people who've defilt they had defaulted on
some debt arrangement.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
Yeah, so that's that's really significant. And that's whether it's
your credit card, or whether it's your more good or
car payments or business loans, you know, could be a
whole range of things. So I don't know how that compares.
I mean, it is high. I don't know how much
higher statistically it was from last year though.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
But you know how they measure that would have been?
How would they get the data on that. Would they
would they get data from for instance, I mean like
your water care bill, if you have missed the payment,
would you suddenly go bing wow?
Speaker 4 (06:25):
And then that's the thing. They probably do some surveys
and then makes a bunch of assumptions, I would imagine,
because it would be quite hard to get that really
accurate data, I would think, But it would be if
you missed a utility payment.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
I missed them all the time, only because I'm so
like disorganized. Well, it's not the biggest bill you get.
And I do pay attention to my credit card bill
because that's the one where hello, twenty eight percent or
whatever if you don't pay it twenty yeah.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
But the utilities, though, if you don't pay it on time,
you're often paid a ten percent penalty on it.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
I think I got a four dollar penalty at one stage,
So I was like, that's not very you know, but
it's actually you know what, let's not get distracted by that.
But the thing is financial stress is I think one
of the if not the top of the list for
the most debilitating thing that can affect Okay, I know
(07:13):
there are people who will have health issues and stuff
that can be also very stressful, but in terms of
it's a very common ailment. Oh, you got to have
financial stress, and how to deal with that when the
solution financially is not always immediately apparent. I mean, you've
written books about money and finance and things like that.
(07:36):
I mean, what are your sort of observations on the
best ways to deal with it when you really are
just thinking, gosh, I'm just sweating from week to week.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
Well, yeah, And I guess there is two pop components
that one is the mental head space around it and
that sort of financial stress, and then there's also the
practical side of financial stress. So we look at it
more from the mental perspective. I guess it's just trying
not to let it overwhelm you and recognizing that you
are going through some tough time and not beating yourself
(08:06):
up too much about it, because I think that's one
of the challenges that a lot of people have is
they kind of ready give themselves a good kicking about
the fact that they're in the maybe the meat that
they are that they're in. But a lot of other people,
as we've just heard with that statistic, are in a
bit of a francive pickle as well. So I think
it's you know, you're not on your own, and it's
just kind of going, Okay, well, let's just trying to
work through this, maybe some meditation or mindfulness.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Because I think that the problem with it is is
if you're the way it can be so I can't
think of the word, but it seeps its way into
other aspects.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Of your life.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Absolutely when you're unhappy, So maybe you're you've got less
patience for your kids and your relationship and your grump
and things like that, and it just has this and
you know, I just wonder if if there are any
what are the best ways? I guess maybe with the
question we should ask is what is the worst way
to deal with financial stress? Which is probably to ignore it?
Speaker 4 (08:56):
Yeah, to put your head in the sand. Yeah, absolutely.
And you know, even if you've got problems with the
ID for instance, you know the ID, and I've said
this before on the show, is that they're actually really
good to deal with if you get in some challenges
with anything, you with tax debt or i idid it.
But if you put your head in the sand, then
they conver the complete opposite. And it's the same with
payment plans. I've worked with a couple of friends and
clients over the years who've got themselves behind in payments,
(09:18):
and if they just go and ignore things, it gets
really bad. But if you actually contact those people that
you own money to and say, oh, look, i'm struggling,
how do we work through a bit of a plan,
then you might be surprised about how open people are
to putting a plan together for you. But if you're
going to go down that path too, though, you need
to make sure that you do stick to it and
you communicate. So dealing with things I think does make
(09:39):
a big difference.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Yeah, we'd love to hear from you on one hundred
and eighty ten eighty if you've got any questions for
Lisa and you, or you're struggling with just the load,
financial load and how you're going to get ahead. Problem
shared is a problem halved, as they say. But if
you're seeking some input and I think actually picking up
the phone sometimes on shows like this where it's fairly anonymous,
that sometimes it can be just that first step to
(10:02):
maybe addressing the problem that's grinding your down. I mean,
I've been I'm going to it's certainly not about me
but I've been a singer and a performing artist for
many years, and let me tell you, you go through a
lot of financial stress, and probably some of the financial
stress I feel now it's still an overhang from those
emotions of you know, when you're not sure exactly where
(10:23):
the next gig's coming from and how you're going to
pay for things.
Speaker 4 (10:25):
Well, that's right because you've had an experience that at
times wasn't necessarily great, and so that you tend to
reflect back on that experience that wasn't necessarily great. And
I think you know, when you are facing that stress,
you know, picking up the phone, talking to a friend,
talking to a family member, getting it off your chest.
You know, there's some really great services around New Zealand,
you know, budget free budgeting advisory services. If you work
(10:46):
for a large corporate, they've got, you know, an employee
assistance program that you may be able to tap into
to get some financial help. So there are a lot
of resources out there for you. I think it's just
having that courage to say, look, you know, I am struggling,
and to kind of own it and recognize it and
then say, okay, well what can I actually do to
move forward? And not give yourself a good bit kick
about it.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Well, give us a call on eight hundred and eighty
ten eighty if you've got you may have some advice
for people who are really struggling. Is if you've been
through tough times and you look at a lot of
successful people who and it seems like a trite story
that a lot of them like to point towards hardship
in this, but actually it's true a lot of them
have been through that hardship. And the difference between what
was the difference between single swimm I don't know what
(11:26):
it would have been, but we'd love to hear from
you on eight hundred and eighty ten eighty.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
I would just want to.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Dig into the the IRD because I've I was pleased
to hear you mention the IRD and that they're not
the sort of the bogey man that you know it
used to be, the sort of the ultimate sort of
heartless organization. The tax man is coming for you. But they,
my dealings have been quite surprising over the years in
(11:54):
that if you, especially if you communicate with them, they
are my I mean, look, there'll be people who have
exceptions to it. I thought they're fantastic actually, yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:04):
And I think you know that's you know, my personal
experience and experience you know, obviously working with people over
the twenty five years that I have done, is that
if you communicate politely and fairly, they will do the same. Right,
But if you're going to give them grief because you're
going to remember, the person at the end of the
telephone and customer service is not the person who sets
the tax rates. So if you've put an issue with
how much tax you're paying, then obviously you're going to
(12:24):
have a problem. But you know, if you're just going
I'm behind in my taxes and I'm really struggling, and
you're genuine about it, they will you know, they're not
going to come down on hard, are you, because how
are they going to get their money if they just
come down to hard on you. They're going to genuinely
want to try and put a plan in place to
pick up their taxes. Right, But then you've got to
make sure that you follow that pain and then you
communicate if you're not following that plan, because otherwise if
(12:45):
you don't, then you get yourself into trouble.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
If you have people talking to you about what are
the first bits of advice you give to people who
are struggling to make ends meet that they maybe hadn't anticipated.
Speaker 4 (12:56):
Yeah, well, I think it's coming back to the basics,
which is really looking at every single thing that you
spend money on. And this is something I found really
quite interesting because obviously I've looked at so many people's
financial situations over doing this for twenty five years, and
you know, people go, oh, you know, I'm doing it
pretty tough. And then I see the nails, and I
see the new iPhones and you see all these sort
of things that may be important to them, but really,
(13:18):
if you're in a bit of a financial pack or
how important actually are they? So I think it's just
been super realistic and going back and going what other
things I can genuinely cut out. It's not necessarily forever,
but just to get yourself through this tough time.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
Is that one of the mental.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Blocks for people though, because.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
I would say for one of the mental blocks to
people properly planning for their retirement is so they don't
want to know how bad it's looking yep, and what
they're going to have to do. And that would be
the same that you're worried about certain key little things
in your life that you're thinking, but I just couldn't
bear it if I had to give up this simple
pleasure yep, or this, And I think that's a really
(13:57):
understandable human thing You've got to find you suddenly aiming
to metaphorically speaking sleep on a you know, on a plank.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Well, that's right. But then the other side of it
is is going, okay, well, if I don't, you know,
let's let go of this thing that gives me a
bit of pleasure, then where am I going to be financially?
What's the other side of that? So I get this
temporary relief from getting my nails done using the same example,
But then on the other side of you thinking, gosh,
you know, I'm not paying off my credit card, so
just one negate the other. And then the other thing
(14:27):
to think about, too, is that you don't necessarily not
have to do that thing that gives you pleasure for
the rest of your life. You may just say, look,
I'm just going to knock on its head for three
months just to get me through the tough time that
I'm in at the moment.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Yeah, okay, So we'd like to hear from you E
one hundred and eighty ten eighty. If you've got any
questions for Lisa Dudson, she's are you actually do we
describe you as a financial advisor as well? I can't
mean what the rule?
Speaker 4 (14:49):
Yeah, well I am in a financial advisor, but I
don't I'm not a regulated one.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Okay, right, So we're not giving specific financial advice, but
if you if you'd like to have a chat, share
your experience, or if you're seeking some advice on a
problem you want to get on top of, then we'd
love to hear from you on how do you deal
with financial stress without resting ruining your life or seeping into.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Every other area of your life.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Give us a call eight one hundred and eighty ten
eighty in text on nine two nine two, and actually
this hour as well, we're else it going to touch
on you know, there's is there a silver lining to
some of these dark times and opportunities that might present themselves,
and how do you make sure that you're one of
the ones who does it. It's twenty two past five
News Talks.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
He'd be.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Now sunbound myself.
Speaker 5 (15:36):
Heselfvery week content.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Yes, welcome back to smart Money. This is the week
in collective. I'm Tim Beverage. My guest is Lisa Dudson's.
She's a personal wealth educated from acumen. She's how many
books have you written, Lisa hones?
Speaker 4 (16:04):
Seem to you might, oh, that'd be helpful at eight eight,
But that's over twenty years.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Wow, I remembered it was quite some number when you
wrote your first Yep, what's because I would have thought
you'd get it out of your system if you've written,
you know, I guess, yeah, what makes you write?
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Say for it? You've written number two?
Speaker 2 (16:25):
One, it does well, maybe I'll run another and okay, three,
that's fine, But then you go four, five, six, seven, eight.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
Now, there was seemed to be a bit of a
reason why I wrote one, you know, at the time,
and and the first one was actually because I used
to talk to property vistas all the time and teach
them how about how to be property visitas. And then
I kind of got a bit bored telling people the
same thing over and over again, and then kind of thought, well,
why didn't I put this into a manuscript? And then
I put into a manuscript, and then I had a
bright idea one day I thought why didn't I publish it?
So I opened up the Yellow Pages and started ringing,
(16:51):
and I rung Penguin and they said, they said, oh yeah, yes,
Sin just manuscript, and so I sent it and they said, oh,
you know, we're quite keen to publish that, but then
turned it down at the lembit of hour and then
I was like, oh my god. So I went into
morning for about a month about it, and then I thought,
oh no, I'll pick up Yellow Page and I you
know this, this is in the old days, it's twenty
years ago. And then I sort of rang a few
other publishers and then got a contract with Read and
(17:12):
Random House and had to choose between the two, and
then you know, the rest is history. So it kind
of started as a way for me to be more
efficient and not keep repeating myself to all my clients.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
I'm not sure you could invite somebody comes on financial
advice and you go, listen, just here's the book.
Speaker 4 (17:28):
Come back from your well, there's a lot of information
to try and impart right. You know, you're charging people.
So I was trying to be efficient and be cost
effective for my clients, and you know, and I've just had.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
This sort of comic image of like, oh, look, here's
here's the book.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
Well that's not how most people typically decide to write
a book, but it was quite effective.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Okay, now, let's just on the a few people are
suffering from financial stress. What are the proactive steps that
I mean, I'm not saying we're going to come up
with a list of things, but from your experience, what
are the things that can be helpful to people to
start one perceiving their problem in a different way? I
(18:07):
guess yeah, Well.
Speaker 4 (18:08):
It gives me talk to a little bit about the
sort of the mental side of it and how you
approach it, because if you're a bit more positive about it,
I think you're gonna have a better outcome than if
you're very doom and gloom about it. So that probably
would be your first point. The second thing is probably
really around creating some awareness because most people, it's really
quite surprising is how little awareness people have over where
(18:29):
they actually spend their money, but tepicularly in the world
that we live in today, because we just you know,
we se that credit cards. In fact, we don't even
do that now. We use our phones right with payWave,
and so we lose a lot of that awareness that
we had when we did use to use cash.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
There's some app, isn't there is it? I seem to
have some recollection of an app that you could plug
your finances in too, and it would tell you you've
spent In fact, I think I might have had it
but deleted it.
Speaker 4 (18:56):
There's been a few different ones over there.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
You've spent this amount at the supermarket, You've spent this
on at cafes, and it gives.
Speaker 4 (19:04):
You categorizer and some of them have, you know, the
categorized you're spending.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
But then you've got to still to look at it like,
I don't think I like what I read so well.
Speaker 4 (19:12):
And that's the problem right with awarness thing, right, because
you've got to have a bit of a bit of
confidence and a bit of bravery when you do actually
decide that you want to be a little bit more
aware with your money. But that's I think, really what
your first step is is to create that awareness, and
then once you've got that n awenness, you can actually go, well,
am I actually being smart with where I'm spending my money?
And because I've done this for so many years now,
(19:34):
I know that in the vast majority of cases when
people actually do pay some attention and track where they
spend their money for let's say a month, they will
usually be quite surprised about where they spend their money
because it's twenty dollars here, it's fifty dollars here, and
then they don't realize how much that adds up to
over a period of time.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
It's actually recently I have I don't eat out very much,
and I think I did. We have a bit of
a get together with some of the hosts here who
work overnights and we do a regular monthly lunch. But
it gave me a taste for having and I did
stop and I thought, hang on a minute, so that
cost me X that one I did on Wednesday, and
(20:11):
I went, I, I'm I have to button back on that,
because man, it adds up as soon as you just
do a little bit of analysis. It can be quite
confronting because that piece of plastic that just goes blip.
Speaker 4 (20:22):
Yep, yeah, well that's wrong.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
Pray.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
A lot of my more professional clients who reasonable and
comes maybe spending five teen thousand dollars a year easily
on lunches and lattes and the odd wine after work
and not even talking about dinners out at night, but
just literally buying their lunches and morning teas well.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Actually even and when we don't even need to be
talking about having a flash lunch where you sit down
for a nice meal and have it last one. But
if you are buying a filled roll yep, five times
a week and then you go, yeah, i'll get a
coffee today, I'll get another call.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
Well, there's probably twenty dollars easy, no sweat, Yeah, that's right.
So all those things add up and so then you go, okay,
well is there a smarter way for me to spend
my money? So I think it's looking at them and
go you know, are you going to make can you
make different decisions about where you spend your money? And
then the other side of it is to kind of
look at and where can you create some income. So
(21:13):
I saw something that came through on my Facebook page
of the day that you know, someone was looking to
house Chinese students who were over here for I think
it was only about a month or so, but they
were paying four hundred dollars a week. Now, you know,
you've got to obviously feed them, but it's probably not
a huge amount extra on your family grocery bill, but
that could be a way of raising ony twelve hundred
dollars over a month, which may help with paying off
(21:35):
a credit card bill. And then you may say, well,
you don't necessarily like having other people in your homes,
but then you how do you you know, you just
goint of reconcile the value of that money versus having
someone in your house, and it could be a great
cultural experience too for your kids.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
The other well, the other thing you touched on earlier
at the start of the show is budgeting services. Yeah,
and I would imagine there wouldn't be too many people
involved in budgeting services who who would say, actually, we
had this person and we couldn't save them any money.
Speaker 4 (22:01):
Yeah. Oh, honestly, I've you know, I've been doing this
for twenty five years, what I've been doing and doing
consultations and charging people for it. And I would be
absolutely stunned if I have ever had a client and
the whole time that I've been in business that I
haven't been able to save them my fee of coming
to see me. Because there's always something that you can find, right,
and part of it is is because you know, just
(22:21):
human nature sometimes we don't want to have to look
at some of those things because we go, oh, we
actually really like that, so but you may like it,
but it may not actually be that good for you.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
What a sort of it?
Speaker 2 (22:30):
What are some obvious areas of wastage that people might
find if they went or hang on a minute, I
think she's got a point that I'm not going to have.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
A look at that.
Speaker 4 (22:36):
Oh, I mean, I think food is probably number one.
It's looking at making visual food. Yeah, yeah, and let's
take aways. You know a lot of people, you know busy,
so you know uber eats, you like, I've got lots
of friends who are complaining about their kids spending all
their money on ubeats, you know, and after Nuban eats
you're paying more than what you are even going out.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
And actually well also and actually I think probably because
it's uber eats, people think, oh, it's quite a bargain
driven sort of deal.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
No, because they usually the I think the prices are
usually higher with ub eats than if you went and
picked up takes away and they've got a fee.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Usually well, I wouldn't know because I've never done them.
Because I'm inherently sort of thinking I'll do it myself,
thanks very much.
Speaker 3 (23:13):
Yeah, well there is usually sober.
Speaker 4 (23:15):
So usually well we order some for some friends, some
burgers one night from I don't know where it was,
and they were like thirty dollars each by the time
around burger on uber eats, and I was like, holy moly,
that's expensive, you know, So that's that's not one. I mean,
I think food is a big one, right, So it's lunches, lat's,
you know, you know, takeaways, Uber eats, that's a biggie. Also,
(23:36):
looking sometimes at your clothes, you know, because there are
some great secondhand places out there where you can get
second hand clothes, second hand clothes for your kids, second
hand clothes for yourself. That can save you a bit
of money. There's also quite a bit in nails, facials, massages,
a lot of you know, those sorts of things that
make you feel.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Good, well actually beauty treatments and bety treatments. Yeah yeah,
I mean again, I don't have a hell of a
lot to do with that apart from the old hair cut.
Speaker 4 (24:05):
But yeah, you know, you don't spend a lot of
money on facial.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
It's no regular facial, you can tell.
Speaker 3 (24:08):
I don't spend a lot of money on probably is
it a surprise.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
I mean, so if people went through a simple what
period of time would they look at with their budget,
basically a month or time?
Speaker 4 (24:19):
I think a month is the minimum and if you
can check in and I always think if you can
do it really strictly with the month, So if you
had some sort of notebook or piece of paper that
you wrote down every single set that you spend over
the course of a month, that would give you a
really good understanding. If you could squeeze it sort of
to two months or three months, that would be awesome.
But I think one month is the minimum. And say,
(24:41):
because I've done this exercise with so many people over
the years, they winge and moan, and you know, but
once they actually do it, they actually realize how rewarding
and how helpful it actually is.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
And how does that change? I mean, what does that
lead to in the end if they once they started
addressing that, what's the sort of journey they take? Well,
they just.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
Typically go, gosh, I had no idea of spending that
much money on that, right, So that's really what the
issue is. And then it's going, Okay, now I realize
where I'm spending my money and I've got this financial
stress on the other side of me. How do I
actually reconcile those things? And it's the same when you're
trying to lose weight, you know, the Dietesians always tell
you to write down anything that you eat so you're
not you know, and then you're starting to realize, oh, well,
I'm having three chocolate bars every afternoon, right, And whereas
(25:22):
if you hadn't written it down, you may not have
been aware that you were okneaking in the chocolate bars.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
On the more serious side of things, okay, imagine there'll
be people who have lost their jobs, and we've had
some high profile job losses of course with the news
have people which is just one section of society where
people have lost their jobs are very public. But if
you've got a mortgage, you know the cash rate's still high,
you might have refixed recently, and it's not just a
case of cutting out the lattes.
Speaker 5 (25:47):
What is.
Speaker 3 (25:49):
What is the first step you should I guess you should.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
Talk to your bank, absolutely, talk to your bank, talk
to your mortage advisor, and then go okay, right, I'm
just not going to be able to pay my mortgage
this month, and you know, get a bit of a
break on your mortgage if you can. So that's the
that's the first thing that you've really got to be
doing again. It's all this stuff about being proactive, because
I think as soon as you get onto it, the
better off you're going to be.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Has there been it?
Speaker 2 (26:13):
I remember my Donkeys years ago that you could read
the property press and there was always a section at
the back well. At one particular time it must have
been in an earlier crash, but there were a lot
of mortgage sales the black and white pages. And I
think from chatting to people in the property sector as well,
in which you've been heavily involved as well, that there
(26:33):
has been a change of culture even that we will
never see those days of those chapters of mortgage sales
because the banks, it's just the institutions seem to approach
it from a more I don't know, this is the
last thing they want to do. I wonder if in
days gone by, maybe twenty or thirty years ago, mortgage
b sales happened more frequently simply because the attitude of
(26:57):
the bank, the culture of banking is. Is there a
difference now being a bit too sunbeam and rainbows sort
of optimistic about the way that the banks treat these
things well.
Speaker 4 (27:07):
I mean I don't necessarily know because they still are
morgs Stales happening, but I think there is differently. You know,
these banks today have departments that deal with financial hardship.
So the banks don't want to They want to try
and make it work for you. And this is the
same when I was saying with the IAD before. You know,
if you're proactive and you sit down and go, I'm
(27:28):
in this, you know, financial challenge, how do we work
through it? They will do their best because they don't
want to tip you out of their you know, out
of your home. It's the last thing I want to do.
But again, you can't just ring them after the third
month that you've not paid your more, because you've got
to do it as soon as you possibly can.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Okay, look, we take a quick break and come back
in a moment. It's a twenty three twenty three minutes
to six. Gosh, time flies already. We're with Lisa Dudson
talking about financial stress. How have you dealt with it?
Speaker 3 (27:56):
With it? Have you any lessons you like it?
Speaker 2 (27:58):
In part to us that might be useful for people
who are doing it tough. Right now, this is NEWSTALKSB.
It's O eight hundred and eighty ten eighty and the
time is twenty Hamman. I almost read that time for
a second, twenty three minutes to six.
Speaker 5 (28:12):
Please please please don't true, please please please don't bring
me years.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
We just us and welcome back to the Weekend Collective.
This is smart money. My guest is Lisa Dudson, Personal wealth,
educated from acumen. Now, actually we're going to shift the
topic as well, because there are two sides to There
are two sides Lisa.
Speaker 3 (28:40):
Of course to win.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
There's a bit of a downturn, and that in fact,
I know that unless I do something about this myself,
I'll be kicking myself in a couple of years time again.
But of course, in tough times, there are other opportunities
to be had, aren't they.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
Oh, look absolutely, I mean, now's a great time to
be looking at, you know, the property market, because the
property markets really in a bit of a lull at
the moment. I mean, I think some people tend to
think that it's you know, has further to fall, and
maybe that might be on the short term, but I
think Every commentator that I tend to talk to is
pretty positive about the future. But that future probably starts
(29:15):
next year rather than this year.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
What do you think I mean, how I mean this
is reckons It does have.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
The idea. It does feel like it might be soft
for a while.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
Should I say because we've got the government saying we
want to Well, it's not because of them, it's because,
you know, it's expensive to borrow in comparison to what
people have got accustomed to two or three years ago,
and there are people struggling, there are people who need
to sell. How long do you see that sort of
(29:49):
the current situation persisting for, you.
Speaker 4 (29:52):
Know, looking into my very hazy crystal ball, I would
think that as soon as we are start sing industrates
come down, that will be quite a fundamental change. Obviously,
firstly from the perspective that you you're starting to pay
less for your money. You've i mean for a lot
of people who got fixed rates that you've obviously got
to come to the end of your current rate to
(30:12):
be able to take advantage of that. But then also
sentiment changes, and I think that's the challenge we have
at the moment, is that when everyone we're in the
middle of the winter. We're in the middle of winter
with the economy as well as the weather, so everyone
around you is often talking about losing your jobs, and
things are tough, so you get a bit kind of
drowned in it, and that's all that you see. Whereas
let's imagine we get to the end of the year
(30:34):
and interstrates start coming down, some is out, you know,
sunshining every day, and then people will start feeling a
lot more positive, and that has a bit of a
it becomes a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy. So
I think, you know, we're not far away from that.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
It does have I do have a sense that with
property that we're a little bit like a herd, of course,
and there are many who who sort of run in
a different path to the herd, and those people probably
sometimes do quite well because the interest rates drops all
of a sudden, Whe's like, oh, you know, put the
heads up and think about getting in to it, and
all of a sudden. I wouldn't say there's going to
(31:06):
be a stampede or anything, but we have seen those
moments in the proper mines of way, of course.
Speaker 4 (31:10):
So look, you know, a lot of my friends of
mine and people I know that are successful investors have
all been buying right now if they can get the money,
they're buying right because I think that's never going to
be cheaper than what it is right now. You know,
Back in October sort of into twenty twenty one, I
was saying to everyone who listened to me, is like,
don't buy. We're in a bubble. The prices are too crazy,
and we had the whole sort of fom I think
(31:32):
going on the fear of missing out. So everyone was
going gangbusters and going into property paying silly, silly prices.
And then obviously the thing you know that started it
peeked out and it has dropped it a twenty odd
percent since then, so you know, but it's that herd mentality, right,
and people are saying, to my least, you're wrong. It's
still got lots to go. Everything's happening, and I'm like,
it's getting to out of control. And it's the same
(31:52):
thing in reverse now. Right, everyone's thinking very doom and gloom.
But I think it's actually the time to be seriously
looking at buying.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
For that.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
It's interesting for people who actually are looking to sell
simply because they want to well they want to upsize,
downsize or whatever. But buying and selling it, I guess
the buying and selling in the same market is never
such a problem, but it does.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Is it a tricky sort of.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Climate to negotiate it if you're getting out to get
into something else.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
And it was funny because a conversation with a friend
came to mind recently and that an investment property and
they were thinking about selling it because they go, you know,
seven percent interest rates. It's costing us X dollars you know,
per month extra than what we thought it was going
to cost to keep this rental property. So we've got
negative cash flow on it. And I'm like, okay, well
why did you go into the property? Okay, we went
with the property for the long term. Okay, So now
(32:42):
it's not long term, is it. You know, you're taking
a short term view. So if you think about the
long term. So let's say that you sell that investing property,
you take a bit of a hit on it, and
then you're saving yourself a bit of a bit of
that negative cash flow. But then in twelve months time
or two years time, when the market's gone up again,
you're buying in and paying fifty thousand dollars more so,
how does that compare to the money you're paying to
(33:03):
top that place up? Right now?
Speaker 2 (33:05):
Is it that people just get There'll be people who
just I'm just so over absolutely subsidized in this bloody
property and it's it's is it going to go up?
And they're starting to lose faith in it and they're
just knack it emotionally and they're sick of they just run.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Out, you know.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
And it's a really strong impulse for people, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
Yeah? Absolutely? And again it's that all that negativity around you,
and then everyone sees it's like the TEXTI driver right.
Everyone says, oh, you know, shouldn't be buying property right now?
And then you look at you all this money going
out of your bank out every month, and you're going, oh, gosh,
maybe I should sell. But then again, because I've been
doing this for such a long time, I would almost
say to spend. Every single person I know that has
sold the ever ende property in these situations has later
(33:45):
regretted it.
Speaker 3 (33:46):
Well, it is a little bit locking in your locking.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
Your losses as well.
Speaker 3 (33:52):
It is that.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Always simple, simplistic.
Speaker 4 (33:55):
Now, now all these things are simplistic really, because you're
really going to look at your own personal circumstances. Now,
if it's a matter of you don't like it's a
bit tough, but you don't really like that negative cash
every month, that's a bit different from you can't afford
you seriously cannot afford that negative casual every month. So
they're two slightly different situations, right, because.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Look, if I was an expert, i'd be sitting where
you are probably. But the one thing I get the
sense is that if you can, if you can hold
onto the property. Now, you should hold property, if you
should hold onto it, if you are an investor, if
you can, because when it turns around, it'll.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
You'll catch up.
Speaker 4 (34:33):
Yeah, that's right. And look, there's you know, there's always
downturns and where you know, we can look in lots
of different analysis over the years about share markets and
property markets and all sorts of different types of investment
markets and you'll find that there's always peaks and drops.
But if you hold for that long term, you know,
it's very very rare that you won't do well. But
the things with property, though, is long term. I perceive
(34:53):
I always think it's ten years plus yeah, it's not
under ten years. It's over ten years. And I'm always
encouraging people that I'm dealing with to be thinking at
least ten years.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Is that Do you think that that's because so many
of those headline in the boom sort of time, we're
all about, oh.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Well, the property flippers.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Of course we never read about the property flippers who
bought just before it turned to custard and flipped it
for a massive loss. But let's put that to one side.
But there's so many stories about, oh, only bought it
four years ago. It's we're worth another three hundred thousand.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
It's so unhelpful.
Speaker 4 (35:25):
Yeah, yeah, and we've all got that. We've all got,
you know, buying zero. She is she is at certain
price or testa she is at certain.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
Prices down those few years ago.
Speaker 4 (35:33):
Yeah, that's right. So but if you know, it's all
about timing sometimes and sometimes you kind of luck out
of wee. And look, I've got a friend of mine's
a very been a very successful trader over the long term,
but he's had a couple of doozies in the last
couple of years. You know, he's got it wrong. So
you know, that's the thing with most things in life.
And it's not all sunshine and roses.
Speaker 2 (35:50):
No, it's just that people like to talk about the
sunshine and roses and they leave out the crappy stories.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
Yeah, that's right. So I think a lot of these
things come back to looking at your personal circumstances, what
are you trying to achieve, and thinking about context and
also been read careful about listening sometimes to your friends
and family because often they don't know much about anything.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
What are the sort of properties that people right now?
I mean you've talked about property investors. If they can
they're getting in. Is there a type of property in
general that people are going for that is the most
appealing sort of investment? And I guess you're going to
say it depends what you want. Do you want the yield?
Do you want the yield from the investment, or do
you want to even though you can't tell the taxman
(36:33):
you buy it with the intensive capital gains because technically
you have to pay tax on that that they can
improve your intention. But let's be honest, most long term
people are holding because well, I mean they're looking maybe
that they get on top of it and get the yield,
but also eventually it's going to be worth a lot.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
Yeah, that's right. And look, I think again there's pros
and cons are different types of property because like there's
some advantages to new bills. For instance, you know their
exempt from the DTIs, you know, less deposit year, low maintenance,
you know, quite good cash flow on them because consistent
cashlo because you don't have that maintenance issue. But then
you know, and they're quite good for more passive investors.
(37:10):
But if you've got the time and I'm talking about
some serious amount of time to actually loan to be
a property investor, you know, like for instance, training friends
of mine might look at fifty houses before they buy
buy one, all.
Speaker 3 (37:20):
Right, they just go out and go, right, there's one.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
And they've often spent years learning about that market, right,
So there's a lot of time and effort that goes
into it. So let's say you buy something and you
buy it quite well, and then you've got to go
and get a trades team together and renovate it and
make sure that you renovate it well so you don't
have any issues, but you don't overspend because then you
overcapitalize and then with a bit of ac because you've
bought well, you've done all that research, you've bought well,
(37:45):
you've renovated, well, then you might have an upside with
the revaluation.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
So somebody has decided they're going to buy an investment property,
Now how I mean, where would their starting point for
homework be?
Speaker 3 (37:55):
Do you think?
Speaker 4 (37:57):
I always think for the most part, you're better off
trying to find something that's kind of local to you,
because it's all very well saying okay, you're an Aukland,
you can buy a house is cheaper Dunedin, but you've
got to get on a plane and be able to
get down to Dunedin and do that research. I mean, yes,
you can do a lot of stuff online, but nothing
beats on.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
The paper, whether people just look on paper or whether
it's best to you know, focus on a market. You
one or two markets, you think you'll have a hunch
about them, then go do you?
Speaker 5 (38:22):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (38:23):
And I think it's just you know, these property investment
groups out there, there's heaps and heaps of stuff online
that you can go and have a look at. It's
just doing that research. Joining your local property investors association
is fantastic, so you know, there's it's just trying to
build up that knowledge like anything new that you're learning,
it's just it's building up that skill in education.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
Fantastic. Look, we'll be back in a moment. This is
Smart Money with Lisa Dudson. I'm Tim Beveridge. That is
just gone nine minutes to sex News Talk to Welcome
back to the show. I'm Tim Beveradge. This is Smart Money.
We've only got a couple of minutes left, Lisa, And
actually it's a shame we went on are while we
(39:02):
were chatting just about now. Somebody something in text about
is it a good time to buy shares at the moment?
Very very open open question. Is it depends what shares?
Speaker 3 (39:11):
I guess.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
And but we were talking about our chat that I've
had with Martin Haores and that it used to be
the key we discussion on shares that I should buy
X company ABC or this or that, And it seems
that most of the people know what they're talking about, saying, look,
go with a good fund. They're always going to be
hit on you their amount of money they spend on
researchers and either that or just go to the races.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
Like that. Isn't it for picking your own stocks? Unless
your one on Buffett, Well.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
That's right, and I think, look, I do meet some
people that do okay picking their own stops, but that's
lack a part time job that they have, right, and
so they spend a lot of time on that. But
I think for the average investa far better off going
to a fund manager. I think one of the barriers
is people go, oh, well, I've got to pay for them,
but it's like, yeah, you've got to be looking at
what do you actually get in return? And you know,
we because I have another company called Satin Advice, and
you know, we outsource a lot of our research of
(39:59):
our funds, and we spent a fortune on that. And
they're let alone the money that the company that we
get all our research from, how much time benefit that
they spend keeping on top of the market. So there's
a there's a lot of work that goes into trying
to figure out not only when you buy, but when
you sell. And like we were talking about before, you know,
the price of shares can actually change super quick.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
Yeah, and if if you get caught out then I've
been caught out by that before. Just fun story, but
won't share that with you. We've only got about thirty
seconds together. But I people want to check out your work.
Speaker 4 (40:27):
It's acumen acumen dot co dot insid.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Acumen dot co dot inziend gosh, time flies.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
Thanks so much, Lisa, very welcome.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
Yeah, and how did you manage to miss getting a
town in grease?
Speaker 4 (40:38):
Well?
Speaker 2 (40:41):
Sorry, I was just killing twenty seconds with an insult
you forel bit about just killing hey. Thanks, thanks so
much for coming, and thanks my producer, Tyra Roberts. I'll
actually I'm away for a couple of weeks, so we'll
catch you Weekend up the next and enjoy the rest.
Speaker 3 (40:59):
Of your evening and catch you soon.
Speaker 5 (41:05):
Awesome.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to news
Talks it Be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
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