The Nico Harrison/Dallas Mavericks Conversation - Featuring Dan Favale

Mort & Dan discuss the firing of Nico Harrison, and get into some Anthony Davis trade ideas.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
What is up, fellow Siko's I am Dan Valley coming
at you. After sixty three minutes worth of sound checks
with mister mort Jensen of the NBA podcast, Fame of
Yah Who's Sports, Fame of Forbes's, Fame of HBO, Max Fame,
and of course only fans celebrity, we are here. Whatever

(00:27):
plans we had are being thrown out the window for
one technical difficulties and two Dallas Mavericks difficulties. They have
relieved more Nico Harrison of his responsibilities as the lead
executive of the organization, This coming about nine months after
he made the glorious, polarizing Quentin Grimes for Kayla Martin

(00:49):
trade that is still just being the ramifications of which
are being felt around the world. We're gonna tackle every
every sort of angle from this. I want to start
here with you first. How the heck are you doing?

Speaker 2 (01:02):
I'm doing very well. I love the fact that you're
telling people that we had audio difficulties and then you're
coming in high as a mountain on the audio scale.
So maybe maybe just dialed down a little bit so
the audio isn't completely distorted, because yes, we did have
sixty three minutes of issues, and you were you were
not pleased, sir, you were you were very you know,

(01:25):
I know you're not. I know you're not. You're you're
probably asked police to Stallas Mavericks fans right now, which
is saying.

Speaker 1 (01:31):
I'm just the multi thousand dollars podcast setup continues to
just be a bang for its buck more though, what
was your reaction when you first saw the news, and
it was, by the way, it was preemptive news to
where Shams did the whole. He's expected to be fired
at a ten am ten thirty Central AM Standard time meeting.

(01:52):
That's like, I'm Nico Harrison has to know because there
was reports before that that Patrick Dumont was meeting with
people behind the scenes, probably to their most recent game,
which by the way, they could have won. But so
he hadn't know it was coming. But like the point
we're at where oh this dude is getting is finding
out he's getting fired before he's officially fired is kind

(02:14):
of a sign of one how things bad had gotten,
but it's also a harbinger of all right, there's some
structural issues here with the Dallas Mavericks.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
So my first reaction was, how is this solving anything us.
He should have been fired at the moment he went
to ownership with the idea of trading Luka Doncic first
and foremost. That that's so like, I'm not putting all
of this on Nico, I'm putting this on ownership. Ownership
signed off on the Luca trade. Ownership signed off more

(02:43):
importantly on the Quentin Grimes trade. Like what the hell?
But they signed off on those on those deals, and
you know, obviously Nico is the front figure. He was
the guy who failed to get a good return as well.
I think. So, I think overall, when it comes to
like straight tructors, you as a general manager or a

(03:05):
team president or whatever you have, you like lead executive,
You go to your ownership group, you say, okay, I'm
thinking about a B and C, and they go, all right,
that's interesting, Like we can get behind this vision of yours.
So like, do your thing, and then that person goes
out and finds a trade package and Bob's your uncle. Right,

(03:25):
So Nico obviously failed in getting full bang for the
buck for Luca. His idea of just negotiating with one team,
although that's been sort of rebuffed a little bit, I think,
But like regardless, that was always dumb. It should have
become a bidding war because it's Luka Doncic. It's not
one of those situations where, oh, if we made it public,
then his value would diminish. It's look at Doncic the

(03:49):
what are you smoking?

Speaker 1 (03:50):
Like I do agree with that, But do you think
that what would have happened if those talks had become
public and it became this feeding front? Do you think
that the divorce would have been uglier? Is there a
chance that they might not have been able to get
just the fact that Anthony Davis didn't know was coming,
Lebron didn't know what was coming in La or at
least those are the reports. Is there any chance it

(04:11):
could have been upended if this became more of a
public spectacle.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
Could you imagine MAVs fans if this came out as well?
Like that would even have given ownership a chance to
like oh oh oh, like you guys hate this idea
to this point, like okay, maybe maybe let's not Hey Nico,
why did you suggest this? Like look at how everyone media, pundits, fans,
like literally everyone on planet Earth who doesn't even like

(04:36):
basketball hate this trade, Like why did you why did
you present this to us? And then Nico would have,
you know, a problem trying to explain that, because how
do you explain that? Like, oh, well, I just don't
like fat Europeans? Is that like the rationale that? So?
My thing is this is ownership? Like is the title

(04:56):
here on this secondis was Nico Harrison the real problem? Like, yes, no,
but ownership is the like the by far the biggest
problem here. They accepted the terms, They accepted that this
was going to be a thing, that trading Luka Dodgic
was something that they bought into. Uh so he should
have been fired long ago. The fact that he's being
fired now is not changing anything for me whatsoever. Like

(05:19):
he should have been fired Okay, now they're waiting. Now
they're trying. He was trying to build something in his
vision and then they fired him, what ten games into
the season? Nine games into the season. It's just this
is probably the most currently at least the most unseerious
franchise in the NBA. Congratulations Kings fans, Congratulations.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
I think the Pelicans still have them beat, all right,
that's fair being in terms of unserious.

Speaker 2 (05:47):
Come on, Dan catching strays man they're catching strays.

Speaker 1 (05:51):
They've done it to themselves at this point. The I
do agree with a lot of what you said, and
what I also can't wrap my head around is is
he Patrick Dedmont has kind of made it seem like
we tried to give him as long as we could
after this it was you said, eleven games into the season,
and if what were the internal expectations for this team

(06:13):
with Kyrie Irving out, with Anthony Davis also missing time,
with Derek Lively the second injured again that because under
normal circumstances, couldn't you look at, yes, some of the
games the MAVs lost, absolutely losing to this version of
the Pelicans or that version of the Pelicans inexcusable, regardless
of who's on the floor. At the same time, like,

(06:34):
couldn't you look at this start given what they've had
to now just forget about the Luca trade. Couldn't you
look at this start as completely explainable given what they've had.
They're missing their crown jewel of the Lukadanci trade for
a good chunk of it. And I just to me
and I think this supports your point. This felt very
much not like Patrick Dumont taking control of the situation.

(06:55):
Although there was the report that he apologized for the
Luca trade of the fan that flipped him off. Did
you see that story? That was really funny. I can't
remember who phrased it like this, but it really does
feel like him just giving the fan base it's pound
of flesh. And I do think that fans are probably happy,
as they should be, that this decision was made. I'm
curious to see where they direct their frustrations moving forward

(07:19):
if things don't work out. It's not going to be
towards they have cogms right now and Michael Finley and
Matt McCarty. It's not going to be towards them unless
they have the license to just do whatever they want.
We have reports saying that Dumont is more involved in
not just basketball decisions, but game decisions where Anthony Davis
would apparently already played if Patrick, Dumont and others had

(07:40):
not gotten involved. It makes for a very weird hier
archical structure in Dallas, and I would agree that they're
still okay. Nico Harrison was he thought He clearly thought
he was the smartest guy in the room with the
Lukadanjis because of why else would you make that the whole.
And that's the thing that where if you really wanted
to point the finger at Nico, is that you want
someone at the super C suite level who's maybe not

(08:02):
gonna meddle as much. And so Patrick Dumont is trusting
his basketball decision makers. At the same time, if he
comes to you with this to be so out of
touch with the organization or have that much faith in
him to sign off on it, is part of your responsibility.
But the thing I can't shake with Nico is that
the way that Luka Doncic was just thrown under the
bus after he left the Dallas Mavericks organization, and that

(08:24):
I think was part of, not all of it. For sure,
the trade itself is just unforgivable and explicable, but part
of there not being any chance of redemption for him
was what happened after the move and how they railroaded
Luca on the way out. For by the way, the
big thing was his weight. There was the work ethic,
and there were some other off court things that were about.
Was the weight. Anthony Davis shows up to camp this

(08:47):
year fifteen pounds heavier than he was apparently when he
left the offseason. I'm not here to weight watch Anti Davis,
but you don't get to trade Luka Doncic and say
he doesn't stay in shape, and then you're dealing with
this star who's played what Davis end up playing in
thirty how many games as he put thirty four for Dallas,
So it's just he has as many No, that might

(09:07):
even be that sounds way too high.

Speaker 2 (09:09):
He's played fourteen games total.

Speaker 1 (09:11):
Fourteen and Luca played thirty fourth of the Lakers. Is
that probably what it is that that might make more sense?
So or that's that's probably not even high enough. I'll
double check what Luca's played in for the Lakers right now,
Like that's the whole one of the issues. I just
can't thirty five. So it's just you traded him because
he wasn't available enough for someone who historically has been

(09:32):
less available or dealt with more injuries than Luca has.
I just don't I'm so curious to see where they
go from here. But like, okay, who is Patrick Dumont
now gonna bear more of the culpability because this still,
as you point out this, this was his trade just
as much it was Nico's trade, even though he isn't
the one who seems like he went out and sought it.

Speaker 2 (09:55):
You kind of hope that the next person in line
to get out out of the organization is Jason Kidd,
right on some level, like you know, you get well,
hopefully you get new a managerial team in there, because
like currently Ricardi and Finley are interim, like we don't
know if they're going to get the job, you know,

(10:15):
full time. I so this isn't an ad thing, but
like I hate the way that Jason Kidd is just
starting out Cooper Flag's career by playing him at the one.
I think that's just too much too soon. I understand
the vision. I think it's ridiculous. I think that's something
that's a year two or year three project, honestly. So
like for me, this gives me hope if I was

(10:38):
a mass fan that all right, now the ball can
start to row. Now you're getting some new blood into
the managerial team. Perhaps that leads to a head coach
who is better than what the current one is. Perhaps
this gives you a level of structure to finally, once
and for all, get over the humb of that Luca

(10:59):
trade and say, Okay, let's start over, because now Anthony
Davis should be fair game. Whoever comes in is not
married to Anthony Davis is not married to Kyrie Irving.
It's not married to Sorry j Jil Russell should be laughing.
So presumably that person is going to get the necessary
freedom to make changes at least you hope.

Speaker 1 (11:21):
So, right. And don't you think you mentioned this with
Jason Kidd. Don't you think that will kind of be
the signal of, well, how much agency is this person
going to actually have? Because one of the biggest red flags,
and this the Pelicans have showed this is when you're
going to hire a new lead basketball executive, construct a
new front office and not give them the license to

(11:42):
change the head coach or to of course make personnel
decisions with players. But the head coach is kind of
that first one to where they should have the right
to instill their own people. I'm just curious, because we
know Jason Kidd recently signed an extension, is whoever they
bring or if you're looking at Nico Harrison replacements, are
they they're gonna be a convenience factor here to where Okay,

(12:02):
Ricardi and Finley are there? Do one of them get it,
and they're just comfortable with kid being there, which again
I don't I would I would think is that depending
on what their vision is, it could technically still be
the right answer. I think I also give and I
never thought i'd say this kid maybe a little bit
more of a pass than you on how Cooper flag
has been used, because what else was he really supposed

(12:23):
to do? They started D'Angelo Russell for a minute. Who
else is on? There's Brandon Williams, there's like you just
Kyrie Irving is not healthy? Is it? Are you relying
a ton on a Jaden Hardy? Did you think that
Dante exem was going at like?

Speaker 2 (12:37):
I don't can't answer with it. Oh, I don't care.
That's the thing, because you know, as soon as they
won the lottery, in my mind, they needed to start
over like that. How do you bridge a well.

Speaker 1 (12:48):
That's not a kid thing though, right, No, no.

Speaker 2 (12:50):
No, that's that's that's no no obviously, But as an
executive group, you could also go to Jason Kidd and
you could say, hey, listen, Cooper Flaggs as our point guard,
like in year one, eighteen years old, that's how you
want to start up his career like learning the most
difficult position in the NBA would clearly he's going to
be a forward moving forward. Like again, I don't I

(13:11):
don't hate the idea of giving him point guard minutes
stand that I don't mind, but giving him like all
the point guard all the guard minutes virtually, like, let's
just and I know these are noisy. I know these
are noisy. I fully concede that these numbers from Basketball
Reference are noisy. But like twenty nine percent of his
minutes at point guard, sixty nine percent of his minutes
at two, that's like three percent two percent. Because of

(13:35):
the marchin off era there, come on like he has
to to at least get a chance to play more
forward because that is the role he's going to play
moving forward. He's not going to be a full time
point guard down the list.

Speaker 1 (13:45):
I'm I'm not fighting back against that. I'm just saying
what were And I agree with you that the MAVs
should have as soon as they won the lottery, should
have hit the reset button, cut their losses on the
Luka Dancic stuff, and reconstructed their future on Cooper flag.
I just you signedians, you have Brandon Williams. You have
Jayan Hart, Hardy, Dante exim is the knee injuries you
have to play this season. I just don't fault kid.

(14:08):
I guess you could say, throughout the course of a game,
should he have got especially when you look at some
of the big man injuries they've been dealing with, should
they've been able to put Cooper Flag in better spots?
This This team has dog shit spacing too, So it's
to me it's more of a this was a top
down that, like, have they assembled given you more shooting
or someone who could actually dribble aside from D'Angelo Russell

(14:29):
to and then you continued to play Cooper flag as
primarily on the ball a bunch of in that day
facto point guard spot. I think I'd be more with
you on the oh Jason Kidd like he shoulders some
of the blame in this, but I just I don't
know what else he was really supposed to do. And
maybe it's because I viewed the D'Angelo Russell and like
they they did. Look, they did try it. For how

(14:51):
many games did he end up starting? He ended up
starting four three, Okay, gave one too many? So is
that like his Cardinals, he should have went to that.
I just I don't know.

Speaker 2 (15:02):
I mean, look, I honestly again, that's why I don't
really care. It could be Brandon Williams. It could be
d'An angel Russell. You could play freakin' Max Christie at
the point. You could play Derek Lively at the point.
I don't care. It's just a matter of trying to
put Flag in a more of an advantagious position, right
Like Ryan Nimhart, I don't care, just something because this

(15:22):
team needs to be just crap out. And the fact
that they were trying to do this all we're competitive now,
it was just so un It was so predictable, this
whole thing, like going back to the Luca trade when
they were like, oh yeah, like we're we feel as
though we're a bigger title contender now than with Luca.
Like everyone saw through the BS not a single person

(15:45):
worth his or her salt was like, oh yeah, I'm
buying into this, Like yeah, go, Mask go, Like no,
everyone was like out. Mark Cuban has done literally everything
in his power over the past what nine months to
just kind of say, wasn't my call, wasn't my decision?
Like he's He's done everything he could to distance himself

(16:07):
from all this in a way where he said like
if I, if I still know the team, I wouldn't
do this. And it's just like everything has just been
so predictable in how it turned out, and now Nico
at least is gone. I don't trust ownership. We'll see
what happens at the new managerial level if they have
if they come in with this mandate, Jason Kidd needs

(16:29):
to remain. Then sorry, MAVs fans, you're just screwed.

Speaker 1 (16:34):
Is I would agree? But I want to ask you,
since you brought it up, is there any escaping the
Lukadants trade for the organization?

Speaker 2 (16:41):
No? No, this is a man who dragged their sorry
ass to the finals by his teeth. He was nursing
three injuries going into the finals. And here's part of
this why by the way, Dan, something that sticks in
my head a little bit also in terms of like
ownership whatnot. You remember against the Celtics in the finals,

(17:03):
Luca was just dragged for bad defense, for everything. He
was just dragged. The guy had a bad ankle, and
on the other side of his body he had a
bad knee. He had a Torso that was messed up.
So he was nursing three somewhat major injuries, so his
moveability was limited, severely limited, and yet he was just
like put through the mud by every media outlet out there.

(17:27):
I wonder at times if like Nico Harrison leveraged that
to ownership and said, look, look that this won't work.
We need something else, We need something, We need a
defensive minded big man, because he was also always into
the defense, not realizing the situation he was in and
frankly the privilege that he had of having Lukadanchit on

(17:50):
his roster. So no, there's no escaping this. Ever, what
I feel is important to differentiate and something that I
think is just generally important to remember is when we
see fans online like dragging other fan bases or criticizing
other fan bases, like I want the record to always

(18:10):
consistently reflect that Dallas Mavericks fans were never a part
of this, Like they were never like, oh yeah, I'm
on board with this, that fan base that serves all
and I do mean all of the sympathy for this trade. Like,
so it's so important to differentiate the MAPS organization, like
they can never escape the Lucas Trade mass fans they

(18:31):
deserve to have like some being put in some kind
of box and said, yeah, we're not gonna put anything
on you. We're not gonna laugh at you for what
happened because you fucking hated this as you should.

Speaker 1 (18:41):
No, and it's now they're gonna watch him on the
Lakers forever long he's there, which is just this team
that's a boogeyman forevery not for not supposed to be
for a team like the Mavericks, but they so much
of the discourse. I feel like it's improved over the
past couple of years, but this doesn't do anything to
kind of escape the belief that the Lakers and these

(19:02):
other teams. But it really comes back to the Lakers
a lot. I know people mention the Knicks, but they're
not necessarily free agency heavyweights all the time, shout out
Jellen Brunson, but that these big market teams are just
this pipeline that other marquee stars are eventually going to
end up in, or this kind of fuels Why does
ESPN talk so much about which star wants out? And
why are the Lakers always on that list? They didn't

(19:23):
do Nico Harrison and Dumont and the Mavericks didn't do
anything to help that discourse. I think the other important
differentiation now that needs to be made, and I think
MAVs fans are smart enough to do it. I think
the analysts that would be you and I maybe not
looped in under how it's talked about, but there will
still just be whoever is manning the new front office

(19:44):
you need to give them like it's sort of like
when Sean Marx took over when Brooklyn had no picks,
tore it down. Anyway, the MAVs have no picks either.
They have this year's picks and they have this year's pick,
and then they don't control twenty seven through twenty thirty,
so their first the next time they have control over
their own first round pick is twenty thirty one. We're
gonna get into some hypothetical trades, probably in a couple

(20:05):
of minutes, but I think it will be important to
differentiate that. Okay, we can't just judge this situation now
against what's happening with Luca and Los Angeles or what
Anthony Davis even becomes, because look at the Wizards. When
Dawkins and Winger took over there, they kind of just
washed their hands at Bradley Beal. The return was panned
at the time, But I don't think Anthony Davis is

(20:26):
gonna fetch as much as people think that Anthony Davis
should fetch. When you look at the injuries in age,
it's gonna be important to note that and say, I
understand he was the crown jewel of this Luca trade,
but given his history, given his age, it's almost better
to just argue allowed to rip off the band aid
and begin this rebuild. And that's the distinction that will
need to be made from here. Maybe not yet because

(20:46):
we need to see if like, what is the perma
front office here, because we don't know, and that's that's
the You mentioned this before, and I just really wanted
to to settle on it. Do you trust you said
you hope for MAVs fans' sake that they put someone
in charge who's able to call the shots just the
entire way this went down, because I would honestly have

(21:07):
more respect. Or maybe it's I don't know how to
frame this, because there's the whole don't go chasing good
money after bad. If you leave Nico Harrison in charge,
you let him go through another trade deadline, and that
probably terrifies the hell out of MAVs fans, as it should.
But what are you saying, like, what does it say
about Patrick Dumont the rest of the leadership that they
gave him eleven games of banged up basketball, of a

(21:28):
roster failing in every way. We knew that it was
basically going to fail before making the call? Why did
you let him go through the offseason and the draft
was easy because they knew what they were gonna do.
I just that worries me from the perspective of No,
I don't think I would have had more respect, even
though I just started to say that you should have
let Nico play this season out Like Patrick Dumont said

(21:49):
he was going to. My old thing is why was
he allowed to get to this point? Because that's where
I would then question the forget about signing off the
Luca trade. You claim you kind of had your revelation
after the fact when you saw how much he meant
to mass fans, when you saw what happened in the
fallout of it, Yet you let him go into this season.
That's what I don't understand, and why now? The other

(22:09):
question is is their value in trying to seek out
and finding I would say yes, but I'm just curious
if they will in trying to find a permanent solution
to lead the front office mid season or is this
going to be something they conduct over the offseason, which
by the way, is seventy games away or whatever it.

Speaker 2 (22:26):
Is, Sam Hinky, come on down.

Speaker 1 (22:29):
Well, you know the funniest suggestion I saw what Mike
Mark Cuban. I hope he just gets it in writing
this time.

Speaker 2 (22:40):
That's all I mean, honestly, Like he wouldn't be a
down great Snico Harrison.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
So you have to their first call. I don't know
if you'd better beat a messiah Jerry, that's got to
be one of their first calls. Right, they might prefer
someone who's in house, but.

Speaker 2 (22:57):
Right, I mean yes, And I can't ignore that your
deary just crept out the way he did in Toronto though,
like he's probably still good. Maybe he just got burned
out by that situation. I don't know. It also seemed
like there was a power struggle within that organization that
could have Yeah, like I honestly will see it. Just

(23:20):
for me, it's just about the level of dedication like
whoever you get in there, even if like you make
Michael Finley, let's just say it's Michael Finley, even if
you make him the permanent guy in charge, it's just
so important that you give him the chance to like
settle all this, because you do need to settle this,
I think to your earlier point, this is so frightening.

(23:41):
Like Anthony Davis, You're absolutely right, does not have the
value that most people associate with Anthony Davis. Now, what
could change that? It's just one team. That is something
we need to remember, Like it just takes one dumb
ass team to go out there.

Speaker 1 (23:54):
Just get hired somewhere else.

Speaker 2 (23:56):
Bingo, right, like that that is one way. So well,
all right, if Nico gets hired somewhere else, like, can
Baskin and Robbins make it straight for Anthony Davis? That's
that harsh?

Speaker 1 (24:12):
That was hard too harsh. I was gonna ask, though,
do you you're the Mavericks right now? Is this is
there an urgency to move Anthony Davis or are you
hoping that? And no one's making trades right now, so
anything before December fifteenth is just not gonna happen. But
is there anything to the idea of do you want
to recalibrate over the off season? Is that waiting too long?

(24:32):
Is it? He comes back, he plays some game, so
you think they have to move him by the trade deadline,
because doesn't that get complicated in the sense of one,
we know their proximity to the second apron right now,
but they'll they'll figure that out. It's more so you
are trading him probably at as low as his trade
value has been. You don't want to give him that
opportunity to try and build it back up.

Speaker 2 (24:54):
It's Anthony Davis. I don't know what I'm walking into.
Like again, people, look, even if he has a healthy
second half of the year, are we gonna sit here
and pretend like NBA teams aren't aware of that injury pattern? Like,
are we really gonna sit there? Again? Maybe if there's
a team out there that's just dumb enough to go

(25:15):
in and say, look, he was healthy through like February,
March and April, like let's go. But I just I
refuse to believe that NBA teams started like that short sighted.
Everyone knows that he's you know, he's I don't want
to stay made of glass because that's not the case,
but he's he's injury riddled, So like, what is that

(25:37):
going to change if anything, like his current issue isn't
necessarily one that's like majorly concerning, right, Like I don't
think so I'm asking.

Speaker 1 (25:53):
Oh, you're asking me about his current injury that was
cash strained that he's dealing with.

Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yeah, that's not necessarily something that's like a major red
flag like that. You can you can probably trade him
with that issue in mind. I know he's not gonna
get traded before you know, December fifteenth, or even right
before the deadline. My point is, you know, he's not
nursing an ACL tear, he's not nursing all that. But
like it's not just Davis though, it's Kyrie, Like does

(26:19):
he have the trade value after an aclchair? Probably not.
Who else is out there Clay Thompson, who's shooting forty
one percent is looking cooked? Does he have trade value?
Probably not. J Angel Russell, who's also looking cooked at
the age of twenty nine. By the way, what the
hell d Lo Like, it's I think, like I'm not

(26:42):
even I'm not even gonna front in terms of like
a one to one trade value. I'm not saying that
he's gonna fetch more than Anthony Davis.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
But like PJ.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
Washington might be outside of Cooper Flag one of their
most like intriguing trade as as it's that they have
because he's on a reasonable deal, he's productive, he's he's
healthy for the most part. Like he plays both sides
of the floor. Like I understand if they go into
the trade deadline and say, all right, like maybe where
we get real value something that we just know we

(27:11):
got in hand. That's PJ Washington, which is why.

Speaker 1 (27:14):
He can he can. PJ Washington can't be traded this.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
Season, right, that's thank you, That is right. That's an
offseason that was over a one thank you. Yes, it's late.
We took sixty three minutes.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
Well, I think so you're at the ad front to
stick there for a second. I think you're right because
he has another guarantee year left on his deal than
a player option after that. I think you The way
to pedal Anthony Davis right now is to say, you
get all this time before you have to worry about
paying him next and that clock is just going to

(27:48):
tick down if you let the season play out, they
move over the off season. You could also say is
he going to improve your record too much if you
keep him at a time when you should be prioritizing
your twenty twenty six draft pick. I think you could
get in to right. Well, Anthony Davis doesn't have to
play the latter quarter of a season, but if he
is healthy, he will presumably help you win some games.
I just don't know when you're looking at his value

(28:11):
in a vacuum, I don't know what he's worth. As
you said, it says it takes only one team. And
are there any teams that stand out to you as
actual they should be in play for Anthony Davis.

Speaker 2 (28:25):
Short or will there's a difference both.

Speaker 1 (28:29):
I mean it's there. You could there's probably some teams
that shouldn't that will get involved if you think those
like are the Bulls gonna come calling and that's gonna happen?

Speaker 2 (28:36):
Yeah, Like again, maybe this might actually prove to be
the Chicago's uh to Chicago's benefit, that they started off
the season strong, that they might believe in this court
because I don't. I don't think they should go out
and trade for anything Davis, but this is an organization
that's proven time and time again they do like to
go out and get big names even past their primes,
especially guys with Chicago ties. We know this from Dwayne

(28:59):
Wade in twenty six as one primary example. Like that
is a team I could definitely see try to get
in there because they have so many, so many expiring contracts,
So that wouldn't shock me if they try to get
involved again, I don't think they should. I wouldn't be
surprised if the Sacramento Kings also are panicky and like,

(29:20):
we need a big name, we need someone who can
really like sell this whole thing, like okay, Like that
wouldn't shock me, should they? No, there really aren't a
lot of teams out there that should one thing I
consider a little bit interesting, and I need to align

(29:42):
their values or not values, Like are they earning the
exact same amount of money I think they are? So
this is legal? How sir, would you like in Anthony
Davis for Jimmy Butler.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
Swab as the Warriors. No, Anthony Davis can't help. There
might be some struggles with this Golden State too. Anthony
Davis doesn't help my offense. When Steph is off the floor,
you're gonna run into some of the same offensive issues
you do with Draymond Green, Anthony Davis, and Jonathan Kaminga,
except that Anthony Davis is not as good as a
ball handler or passer right as Jimmy Butler. So no,

(30:15):
that would be a hard no if I'm Golden State,
which is kind of what we no. You can tell
me if I'm being too harsh on that because he
is younger than Jimmy Butler.

Speaker 2 (30:24):
Is I just like this the fit with Steph. But
I hear you, like that's an interesting component, Like you know,
they they're not really short on the bigs, like they
need the wings more so and they need playmaking wings.
Jimmy is that? But like if that's if that's where
we are, where we saying that's a hard no Anthony

(30:45):
Davis for Jimmy Butler.

Speaker 1 (30:47):
I'm wondering if I jumped to I probably if I'm
Golden State, would say no, right is that that Maybe
that's dumb? That might be dumb on.

Speaker 2 (30:54):
Me, but not, But like that's the thing if we
don't know that speaks volumes right of his value.

Speaker 1 (31:02):
Well, yeah, that's why I don't even know what to
peg his trade value at. I think there's even like
I'm just trying just like you. I've tried to be
racking my brain for destinations ever since this came out
as well, what team could I see like really going
in for him? Would you do something like he's injured
now too, they're both injured, but like this Phoenix try
and get involved. They have that Jail and Green salary.

Speaker 2 (31:24):
That could be interesting. Yeah, not for Dallas, right, No,
I mean they get younger at the very least. I
don't love a Cooper flag jailing Green duo, but like
that could be a part of going the way. How
about Minnesota where you package Go Bear and I guess

(31:45):
what would that be? God, that's actually difficult to find,
like the right trade components.

Speaker 1 (31:50):
Yeah, it would probably have to be Go Bear and
Dante DiVincenzo. Maybe you're throwing you have to throw Dillingham
in there as well.

Speaker 2 (31:56):
I think just because that's so underwell made, it's very underwell.

Speaker 1 (32:00):
And even I think the Wolves could even say, no,
we're not doing that, right, Rudy Gobert is gonna be
more available and can An we trust him to anchor
our defense at least of the regular season more than
Anthony Davis would.

Speaker 2 (32:11):
And and there's a team that should have been interested
like a month ago, but they're getting production out of
their center now, which is going to make that a
hard No, that's Detroit, Like I would have loved to
see a d in Detroit. But yeah, like that.

Speaker 1 (32:28):
They were a team we were going to talk about
today before this news broke. They are signed me all
the way up. I'm in. I'm in on this version
of the Piston. So yeah, keep him, keep and Anthony
Davis trade all the way away from these Pistons. And
by the way, that's another component you mentioned his next
team better making a mandate, mandate that hey, you're a center,
maybe there'll be some dual big lineups, but this is

(32:49):
not like you're not gonna be You don't have the
jumper of a four. Your handle isn't as much as
a an anomaly if you're playing, if you're if you're
a five, all that stuff is great. You're not really
a liability as a shooter. Anything you could do with
the ball in your hands is kind of a plus there.
Still that's gonna have to be I would say a
non negotiable for me. Do you know what team I
thought of? But I don't love it. It just runs

(33:10):
so counter their timeline and what this front office is done.

Speaker 2 (33:13):
Can I guess yeah? Good?

Speaker 1 (33:16):
No, oh god, no, I was gonna say the Hornets
they have I want I want to say this Pozena
Hornets fans will come in the comments. Ryan Klbrenner and
Mussa Diabat. They've actually been really good this year. I've
been really impressed with Calbrener, specifically, just because I knew
nothing about him coming into the NBA. If you could
get and they have Dallas' twenty twenty seven pick, if

(33:38):
you're building something around, hey, you get this pick back.
The other thing I had thought about is how this
is it's Anthony Davis adjacent. I don't think the Hornets
would be an Anthony Davis team, but they they're a
team that could, in theory use the center. If you're
if you're the Hornets with the Mavericks, who says, no,
Derek Lively and Max Christy for the rights of that

(33:59):
Dallas pick in twenty twenty seven, you have to figure
out the wrong money.

Speaker 2 (34:03):
Oh no, no, no, no, no, I'm not I'm not
doing that. If I'm Dallas, so so, I'm very high
on Derek Lively. They're very, very, very very high. So
I'm not doing that. I'm not doing that. Like I'm
I'm almost I will say, I'm unreasonably hot high on
Derek Lively. So maybe I'm wrong on this.

Speaker 1 (34:19):
He's not been like the healthiest big man either, I know,
I know. So you're not. That's a hard no from you.
It is. What if it's just Derek Lively for the
twenty twenty seven pick.

Speaker 2 (34:32):
God, you're such a tease right now.

Speaker 1 (34:35):
All right, you have to that's at least a thinker,
then it is, right?

Speaker 2 (34:39):
Oh no, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, yes it is,
and like it's it's mostly because I I'm trying to
ignore the intrigue pattern with Derek Lively. I think he's
I think there's some real upside there. But you're not wrong.
That is at least interesting to be in and controls
your own draft picks. At the same time, this is

(35:00):
you're three for Lively, so you're gonna.

Speaker 1 (35:03):
Get paid after this an extension after that will be extension.
Alcohol doesn't need to get one, but.

Speaker 2 (35:07):
So that's that's that's that, Like that payment is gonna
come up soon.

Speaker 1 (35:11):
Look, if I'm Charlotte, I really like Derek Lively too,
it's just the availability thing is a big one. If
I'm Charlotte and the offer is only Derek Lively for
that pick, I think you could look at it and
say they have Cooper flag. But if you really believe
they're gonna end up trading Anthony Davis and we're gonna
get into Kyrie in a second, if it's just Derek Wively,
you probably have to say no, right. And you also

(35:34):
just didn't want to pay one injury riddle big man.
You tried to trade him twice, took you two times
to trade him. Are you now gonna invest in another one? Who? Again?
I think the ceiling is higher. Another team I had
thought about here is Memphis. What about like a job
Morant for Anthony Davis challenge trade. There'd have to be
more money and more pieces involved. Who's giving up stuff?

(35:57):
Who has to give up more? If that's the if
that's the basis of the package, is that.

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Like the name trade the name trade where the games
are like, not where they they're supposed to be. Uh,
that's interesting. I would probably have thought Jared Jackson Junior instead,
But I you know me, I'm not high on him.
I'm not high on either guide Memphis. I think thatatic
still hold that's good.

Speaker 1 (36:18):
You which, look, I understand the Jared Jackson Junior. They're
still fouling stuff. The rebound stuff is you were you
were basically like climaxing because he had five rebounds in
thirty minutes the other night or whatever.

Speaker 2 (36:28):
No no, no he had no no, no, no no,
that's not fair. I was climaxing because he had five
rebounds in those eleven minutes that I was expecting more.
He finished with six dam and I was like so disappointed,
because I like, I want to be wrong. That that
is something that people often like they think they that
I run with certain narratives and I like have a
personal ven deada on something. I love being wrong. I

(36:51):
don't like I love being wrong. Like Jared Jackson Junior,
if he started averaging eleven boards per game, I would
fucking love it. I would be like, yep, yep, hey, Jared, Well,
you can slam on social media if you want to,
that's fine, But like he doesn't.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
I do think him and Anthony Davis is a heck
of a front court. You're still gonna be in a
primary creator there. But like if you still have if
Scottie Pippen, j Andr and Ti Jerome or healthy Cam
Spencer's there.

Speaker 2 (37:15):
I don't if.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
I'm Memphis, if I can keep and you would if
you have coward Anthony Davis and jaredgestion to use your
front line of the future. And look if you're if
you're Dallas, I don't know what picks Memphis has given you.
They have some of those Orlando picks. I don't know
how many of those will be on the table.

Speaker 2 (37:36):
Used to play right.

Speaker 1 (37:37):
Yeah, they need they need other injury prob this roster too.
I don't mean to I'm not rooting for injuries. It's
just feels like we're talking about a lot of injury
prone bigs.

Speaker 2 (37:46):
But yeah, we're talking about Anthony Davis. Maybe that's fair.

Speaker 1 (37:49):
But I'm thinking I do think, and not just because
of the money. I think it winds up being Memphis
that would have to give up at least a little
bit more. And they do have just these ancillary guys,
Zachi Edy being one of them. Jalen Wells also, I'm
still he'll shoot the ball better at some point, Like
they just have guys they could throw in their play
like that might be deal that could actually work. I
don't know. I don't love the Jaw Cooper Flag pairing,

(38:12):
though Dallas would be able to cover up for job. Defensively,
I have no issue about that. You're certainly taking the
ball more out of Cooper Flag's hands. I just don't
know if I love the fit of playing Flag plus
a big plus whether I mean, if it's Zach Edie,
he might be shooting threes though, So but you know what,
you know what I'm getting at Moran Flag and then
a setter, whether it's Gafford, whether it's Lively, you could

(38:35):
get it. I don't know how much that's going to
do for your offense. Then you're also still what does
that mean for Kyrie? By the way, So that's the
other thing. If you I'm not saying don't make a
decision based on Kyrie's future, I'm just that would be potential.
There would be redundancy there. Kyrie can play off John Moran.
I just you know, defensively, a John Moran Kyrie irving
backcourt isn't going to be any great shakes.

Speaker 2 (38:57):
Here's where I hate the Aprons and currently Anthony Towns
for Anthony Davis trade would be fun, No, wouldn't it
would be fun. Why Okay, Look, I mean you spend
all of last year also talking about like do they
Nick's have enough post defense, like do they have enough
like interior rim protection? They would with Davis assuming health.

(39:22):
But again that's that's assuming health, and that's a big on.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
It's assuming health. And it's just so now you have
Mitchell Robinson and Anthony Davis is the core of your friend,
Like oh Gaonobi is definitely gonna end up starting games
at center at some point.

Speaker 2 (39:33):
I'm assuming that Mitchell Robinson would be pivoted off for
someone else. Uh see, this is this is the issue
right here, We're going through names on teams and players
and we're coming up with Diddley squad.

Speaker 1 (39:47):
Would you we have to throw some usual suspects in there.
You did mention the Spurs. Do you think they should
be in on Davis?

Speaker 2 (39:54):
So that's the thing, right because Davis is I think
it's fair to assume that he's going to pick up
like his player option in twenty seven to twenty eight
at sixty two point seven million. So what you're looking
at is not a two year contract. You're looking at
it if you you know, roughly a three year contract
this year, next year, in the year after, that's a
lot of money for its team that's also going to

(40:14):
have to extend Wemby, who is going to look at
certain options there, like they have the deals to align
it like it would be fun to see, But at
the same time, I think they're aiming higher, Like I
wouldn't be shocked if Gianni's remains on there at the
top of their wish list, and rightfully so, because they

(40:36):
have the weapons to go out there and make a
real trade offer. So you know, it'd be one of
those situations where they might have to settle a little
bit because I feel als though this burst still need
like one big shot, right, like they have one bullet
left of that chamber. Do they want to spend it
on eighty Presumably not.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
I think you would. I would prefer if you're gonna
go for all, but I guess that's not all in.
And then also you didn't what is the package look
like Dearn Fox when he could be traded on February fourth,
I think it is so a day before the day
before the trade that line traded.

Speaker 2 (41:13):
I was actually thinking more so. And again this is
where it gets rough because in in season trades. You
don't really do three for one guys, like because you
can't do the rosters. But I was thinking somewhere centered
around Barnes, Johnson and Cornette or something like that.

Speaker 1 (41:28):
So you're really juicing them with picks, like the rest
of that deal with picks.

Speaker 2 (41:33):
Yeah, And like juicing is a relative term because I'm
not even gonna relinquish like all that much. Again, it
depends like if I'm the Spurs, I could put in
an offer, but it would be you know, in the
lower end, just to see, you know, it's just like, yeah,
we'll offer you this. If that's the best offer you have,
you know, call us back.

Speaker 1 (41:54):
Sort of like they did with Kevin Durant, where well
they end up not with Kevin Durant. Yeah, I'm not,
I'm not. I guess they could. I don't. I don't
know why I'm saying I don't love it. It's just
the I would prefer them if they were gonna get
that spot a higher salary player on obviously say I
prefer for it to be honest, or maybe you're just
looking more at like a wing type rather than going

(42:15):
all in on a forward slash big What about.

Speaker 2 (42:18):
How are we talking about this. It's he's gonna end
up in Miami, isn't he?

Speaker 1 (42:21):
That was one of the teams on my list. I
don't like the offensive fit of Bamin Anthony, especially the
way the Heat have been playing offensively this year. I
don't love the fit of Bamin a d at all.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
No, I don't either that. That just seems like they
have been star hunting for so long now that I'm
just wondering if they're like, screwed Davis is available, let's
just go get him, which would be wrong, by the way.
I don't I don't know, especially.

Speaker 1 (42:46):
Because when you look at the money they would have
to send out. You're sending out Tyler Hero as part
of that, and then what are your other big salaries there?
You can't trade Nikola Yovich is gonna be poison pill,
so that's not gonna do anything for you this season.
You're not gonna move Bam as part of that. You
have Norman Powells expiring deal, but he's like the spacing

(43:06):
that him and Hero. You need at least one of
them on this team. If you've bamed Anthony Davis.

Speaker 2 (43:10):
And with right that there was something there the contract.

Speaker 1 (43:14):
Yeah, that's the that's the other thing too, and we'll
go live to Barry Jackson to see the list of
one thousand and five ways that the Heat were unfairly
treated as part of the Terrozier trade and it should
be renigged and they should get their pick back. I
don't really have any other and this isn't, by the way,
I think Anthony Davis can still be a fan. He
has not looked at the peak of his powers this year,

(43:37):
but based on what we saw prior to his trade
to the Mavericks last year, we just haven't seen him
a ton since. He can still be a huge difference maker.
So for me, this isn't. I think Anthony Davis is
a terrible basketball player. And that's the other we mentioned
distinctions before. You have to separate Anthony Davis from the loop.
It wasn't his decision to be traded for Luka Doncic,
So when he only fetches the Mavericks one or two

(43:59):
first round, that's not necessarily on him. The only other
team I could think of, and it's really more so
they're definitely brazen enough to do this is the Kings. Yeah,
and they have like nine guards and so if they
were oh, but if you ask Doug Christy, they have
too many wings, So why Kean Ellis can't get on board.
So if you were to build something around one of

(44:19):
the expensive then you're playing Sabonus and a d together.
I don't know who has an appetite for any of that.
I think it could work. Sabonis provides enough stretch, I
think anyway. On offense. I know this year has been
rocky for him. But if you're the Mavericks and you're
looking at the actual players they have to offer, you're
kind of saying, oh, are we just taking? Is it
Zach Levine or is it Demard Rosen and Malik Munk?

(44:42):
And then we want, like we want to short the
Kings' future and get their picks. I don't I just
don't know that there's a I could see the Kings
being interested in Davis. I don't know, unless you have
a better I don't see like the workable package that
makes a ton of sense.

Speaker 2 (44:59):
Drew Holland and Jeremy Grant for Anthony Davis and Jayden Hardy.

Speaker 1 (45:03):
That is not the Kings.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
I know.

Speaker 1 (45:06):
I'm asking you, so, do you see a workable deal with.

Speaker 2 (45:08):
The Kings that was my answer. No, I don't.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
Okay, I'm sorry, so Drew Holliday, Jeremy Grant for Anthony
Davis and Jayden Hardy. Honestly, I'm probably not doing that.
If I'm Portland, just well, hold on, I know Danny
Bobby has been great. Yeah, Drew is so important. I
know your offense right now. And also Jeremy Grant's been

(45:30):
kind of hooping this and it's way hi high. Okay,
so sell high. But the other thing I was gonna notice,
they've been running a lot of just I would call
them close to centerless lineups, and Anthony Davis would I
guess if you're gonna play him at the five, that
takes the place of that. But it seems like they
like the whole when it's Timmani and Denny and Jeremy

(45:50):
Grant on the court at the same time with two
of the other guys with them. That's from a value perspective.
I guess if you're Portland you would say, yeah, do that,
But I don't. I would quite. I don't know what
just as we kind of question what their endgame is
when they made the Drew Holiday trade, now I'm wonder
what is the what is the purpose here?

Speaker 2 (46:09):
That and that is why I didn't have an answer
for you with the Kings, because like what is the
end game there? Too? Like why would they even consider.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
I have one that just came to me.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
Okay, are you ready?

Speaker 1 (46:21):
Yeah, Paul George? Yeah, And for Anthony Davis challenge trade
or would you be willing if you're Philly, to use
Jared McCain to get off of Paul George and bring
back Anthony Davis.

Speaker 2 (46:36):
So we agree that Paul George and Nathey Davis are
roughly on this. They both have to.

Speaker 1 (46:41):
This isn't a money I'm well, you can flesh out
the details of the pack, like to make the math work.

Speaker 2 (46:45):
I'm just saying not giving up Jared McCain for that
is both deals a horrendous.

Speaker 1 (46:50):
Okay, So Paul George for Anthony Davis, I think no. No,
I mean as would probably say no to that. Then
what else are the Sixers giving you? The Clippers pick?
And that's an era. I think the Sixers would need
to be the team.

Speaker 2 (47:02):
Okay, Okay, that's that's fair to be honest. I thought
it in a way that if Paul George goes to Dallas,
at least he would be more floor space or like
he would be integrated. He's also been a he's a
better playmaker than Ancy Davis is.

Speaker 1 (47:17):
It's also not healthy.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
He's also not healthy. Well, I mean, you.

Speaker 1 (47:20):
Don't get that. You you sat here at least it
was like two months ago or something, and try to
tell me that Paul George is basically the worst contract
in the NBA of the past century or something. You
don't get to the mas into taking him there.

Speaker 2 (47:33):
Right, you know what, You're absolutely right? So what is
the Trenton Watford Ports Trenton? Though I don't want him
in Dallas.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
He's doing traded yet either, Trenton triple double lot.

Speaker 2 (47:46):
I like to call him. See, I was just one
year too early on him. I called him, I had
him as.

Speaker 1 (47:53):
We see where he finishes on the ballot before you
go taking him? It was what it was one triple doll.

Speaker 2 (47:59):
I've just said. I'm just saying he's good and people
are finally realizing. So you know, uh, no, you're right,
they would need to add something. I don't want to
be picked. But like, so question seems like a big one, right,
gonna say.

Speaker 1 (48:14):
Does it you have MAXI VJ. Edgecomb and Quentin Grime.

Speaker 2 (48:17):
Well, just because you have a lot of guards, it
doesn't mean that the guy doesn't have value though, then you.

Speaker 1 (48:21):
Can get value. But also we're talking about health. How
many games has Jared McKay played in?

Speaker 2 (48:29):
Well, I honestly need to look that up, right, Yeah,
we're down in that threshold. Yes, I do not.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
But here's the question. Who's played in more games? Luca
doncs with the Lakers or Jared McCain with the Sixers
twenty five career episodes. Luca with the Lakers.

Speaker 2 (48:46):
Yeah, and that's thirty five. I mean, yeah, you're okay,
he's Look, it was.

Speaker 1 (48:50):
A good value pick. I'm just saying I don't know
that if also I don't know Philly does it anyway,
I mean, this is the whole Joelle and Bean and
Anthony Davis, but they won't be playing together a ton.
It's a ef actively they're gonna play. Joel Embiid plays
what you're probably putting him in, like that twenty to
twenty five minute per game role that he's basically in
right now. Son Anthony Davis is definitely on the court

(49:11):
for the other twenty five to twenty eight that Embiid
is not all right, all right.

Speaker 2 (49:16):
You sold me, you sold me, Because here's the thing.
He McCain is six'. Two he's more of an off
guard than a. ONE i think we can't agree on.
That so he's probably always going to be more of
an undersized, scorer, right.

Speaker 1 (49:27):
Yeah like unless you trust him to be able to
initiate your, offense WHICH i think you could maybe do
as more of a second unit. GUY i don't know
HOW i trusted against starter level, defense, right.

Speaker 2 (49:37):
And we know that those guys right now are not
in high. Demand like look at What Cam, thomas like
the negotiation factor he went through With brooklyn, Two, like
are we sure That jared McCain is not going to
end up in a roughly similar situation if he's not
showing on ball. Skills so through that, perspective gun into my,

(49:59):
HEAD i see. IT i can see your vision. There
and at the same, time he would kind of help
Out Flag like the floor spacing of McCain is, Good
LIKE i don't hate that that that might be legitimately
a decent. Deal so what would that look like For?
Philly so it's a d em, beat, Okay, Maxie, maxie.

Speaker 1 (50:24):
An edgecomb is a nice format base and you're still your.
Thinner you're thinner at the, wing which you've been in
thinn all year Because Paul george wasn't. Playing but you
just bet, on, Like, okay we have Justin, edwards we
have Kellyoo bridge and your quent and. Grind you just
figure it.

Speaker 2 (50:38):
Out trent And watford is still, there so you're not
really going down on a lot of these. Issues, okay,
Okay like we need to get the approval of our
mutual Buddy brian's of, poring but LIKE i don't.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
SURE i feel like he's probably already posted about it
on social media, somewhere, yeah because that's how that's how
his brain. Works do you HAVE i have a couple
other questions THAT i think we need to get. It
do you have anything any other team here that is
there any of the just teams that are so far
away at the moment that you could see kind of
inging in on.

Speaker 2 (51:10):
This The hawks are a seem THAT i wouldn't be.
SURPRISED i see are they far? Away that's there's such
there is such a weird situation because they accelerate their,
timeline Got christops in, there they can't really figure out
you know the new Contract Trey Jail johnston is. Good
how good is? He we still don't like fully, know

(51:32):
like what is their plans moving? Forward but they could
they could at least make an interesting trade offer if
they were willing to move off Of percinkis? Right could
they they.

Speaker 1 (51:43):
Could make an interesting. ONE i would be curious they're
incentive for doing so if they kind of it feels
like they're evaluating where they are year over year and
now you're tacking on long term money with that. Deal and,
also as we record, THIS i know part of this
is Because Trey young has missed, time their defense has
outperformed their, offense AND i don't know That Anthony davis
is going to come in and help your. Offense and

(52:03):
so you're you're, THINKING i, Mean Anthony davis And Jalen
johnson can absolutely work as a front. Court that's not a.
PROBLEM i would just what is the other compensation With?
Porzingi and then, look having a D i'd like to
help Insulate, Trey Like AD's definitely a better insulator on
defense Than porzingis is, right Because porzingis kind of has
that elite one elite. SKILL i don't want to say just,

(52:25):
one but you know WHAT i, mean And davis can
do when he's, healthy blow up a bunch of different
things in the defensive. End if the price was low,
Enough i'm not giving up any of Those pelicans bucks
picks THAT i haven't in one of the next two.
Years that's not. Happening so what.

Speaker 2 (52:38):
It's percincis Okongbu, jesus that's only forty five Million gokongou
is such a cheap?

Speaker 1 (52:45):
Contract, well, yeah then you're gonna want to backup. Center, yeah, Right,
still so you're trying to get, out they. Don't the
money gets tricky with them unless you're Gonna, yeah they're
probably not a good.

Speaker 2 (52:55):
One so they're they're not a great. One it's, honestly
AND i really don't want to get. There just everything
comes back to The bulls to. Me it's just that
team feels, like, no it feels like an, inevitability right
because of their expiring.

Speaker 1 (53:08):
Contracts so what would That what does that deal look
like then to? You so they're expiring? Contracts are they have?
Vouch they Have Zach Kobe, White Zach, Collins Kevin, herder
that's what what is the? Compensation so what as the
as The. Mavericks what are The bulls? Get is it
just draft equity because none of the players we, mentioned

(53:29):
they're going to look at and, say, like the value
of the trade that we're building at the moment is
they're getting off of long term, money which is just
in AN A d. Trade you need to get, more
do We?

Speaker 2 (53:41):
YEAH i mean, yeah do you need? To but can
You that's, like, Honestly i'm just trying to play the
devil's advocate, here and not specifically with The, bulls just any.
Team if you have expiring contracts that can Absorb Anthony
davis and just after this, season take a let me
just see, here one hundred and eleven million dollars in

(54:05):
future money off your books for Anything, davis do you
at least consider it if like there are no other
deals for like high value draft picks or young.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
Players, look if you're saying that you get to the
market for ad and that there just isn't a, market then,
yeah you reached THE i just do you think there's
a chance they can't even get, anything really anything for?
HIM i feel like that overstates the gravity of the
situation maybe ten.

Speaker 2 (54:35):
Times well, No, well So i'm not saying, that But
i'm not closing the, door you know WHAT i? Mean like,
It we're at that point now where nothing shocks me.
Anymore like if we let's say we come into the
to the trade deadline and we hear his name being
mentioned all the, time and we get continuous reports that
The mavericks are exploring trade options but are not finding

(54:56):
the return that they're looking. For that is not something
that would shock me. Whatsoever quite the, opposite because again
the narrative Around, ad which is fairly, accurate is he's often,
injured often unavailable for some inexplicable. Reason he decides THAT
i want to be a power, forward not realizing that that's,

(55:20):
sure but you're better at center like him not even
realizing his own best position is also quite. Worrying So
i'm just THINKING nba seems must be aware of. This
this is a guy who's earning thirty five percent of the,
cap like full, blown you, know top to your? Max
are you really that attractive of an. Asset we've just

(55:41):
gone through the damn, League, dan we can't really find.
Anyone so if that deal is there for, like, hey
mass you're not going to get any draft. Picks you're
not going to get any young, players but you aren't
going to be able to just get him off the
cap by twenty twenty six and all of. It i'm
just not closing that door like you brought up The

(56:03):
Washington wizards example of just you, know ripping off the band.
Aid that would.

Speaker 1 (56:07):
It so here's an interesting way to wrap the ad. Discussion,
then by the, way does Uh Emmanuel quickly and Yaka
peardle do anything for? You is A Dallas raptors? THERE
i think The raptors probably say.

Speaker 2 (56:20):
No, Yeah so he's been having a rough year AND
i JUST i don't want to be wrong about, him
BUT i Am i'm getting worried about. Quickly i'm really
getting worried about it.

Speaker 1 (56:30):
Quickly the mamu a d front court would hit like.
Cocaine Though Colin, Murray boyle's And ad, too comrade boys
hitting some arc threes this year coming into his Rookie.

Speaker 2 (56:42):
I'm so glad he's actually. PLAYING i was afraid he wasn't.

Speaker 1 (56:45):
That what did we? SAY i think we both said
AND i even said this to Samson folk when we
were talking for our raptors look at, IT i, Said
i'm A Colin Murray. Boyles, GUY i wasn't A cmb
on The, raptors, guy and Now i'm a see. IT
cmb can be, Anywhere, GUY i just want to SEE.
Cmb that's Where that's Where i'm. At What i'll, Say,
okay let's do this over under one and a half

(57:05):
first round picks For Anthony. Davis in An Anthony davis,
trade you're taking the. Under i'm gonna take the.

Speaker 2 (57:12):
Over so, well, okay let's just. Clarify first round pick
is like a that's painting with a broad, brush right as? Well,
like what are we talking? Here are we talking About.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
We're talking about a first round, pick.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
Protected, UNPROTECTED i projected to be, late projected to be.
High what are we dealing with?

Speaker 1 (57:33):
Here let's say over under one and a half lottery
protected or looser first round. Picks, well maybe even top
ten protected or looser first round. Picks let's go top
ten protected or. Looser i'll still take the over.

Speaker 2 (57:49):
There i'm gonna go.

Speaker 1 (57:50):
Under now are you baking in the fact, that, well
maybe one of these teams will trade a prospect in
only one first round pick or. Something so what about
the equivalent of two first Round.

Speaker 2 (58:00):
Okay that's. Interesting that, yeah and again that that depends
on the value of the, prospect, Right, NO i mean
you know, What i'm Fucking i'm gonna say, No i'm
gonna say. Under and it's LIKE i might be. WRONG
i just don't like the trade. VALUE i just don't
and AND i could be very wrong about, This but,

(58:20):
look he's A.

Speaker 1 (58:22):
Lakers get.

Speaker 2 (58:22):
There he's played fourteen games For, dallas so it's not
like he's been. Available first and, foremost what was it
for The? Laker he played seventy six games in twenty
three twenty. Four that was when we're all, like, oh
look he's, healthy this is. Great and he went back

(58:44):
to fifty one last year the year before the seventy.
Six were all worried because that was fifty six games
that it was forty forty six the year. Before, like
you just can't as AN nba. Organization i'm just gonna
go To Basketball reference and just go through. This so
since his twenty eight twenty eight age, season he's played

(59:04):
them just two hundred and twenty eight. GAMES i can't ignore, That,
DAN i. CAN'T i.

Speaker 1 (59:10):
CAN'T i don't think, AGAIN i as you, said, THOUGH
i think it only takes one team BUT i want
to undermine my own. Argument is really hard to come
up with a team right now that you think should
be going all out to Get Anthony. Davis and part
of that is the, injuries part of it's the. Age
the other part is just his type of contract in

(59:31):
the current salary cap.

Speaker 2 (59:33):
Climate Maybe i'm just sposed to get him To milwaukee
so they can wave and stretch. Him they, can by the,
WAY i know the, rules they. Can't they're already maxed
out on the account.

Speaker 1 (59:45):
They could they get it would take them if they
wanted to trade for ad without giving up be, honest
they would have to wait for trade restrictions to, lift
and it would still take three, players right Because Miles
turner And Kyle kuzma doesn't or would that get you?

Speaker 2 (59:57):
Too that is forty seven point.

Speaker 1 (01:00:02):
Seven that's way closer THAN i. Thought, yeah underestimated how
Much Miles turner was. Making, yeah they.

Speaker 2 (01:00:06):
Can they can get. There they can get, THERE i,
think right because they're not even over a single. Apron, yeah,
yeah that could get. Them janna's.

Speaker 1 (01:00:19):
The one pick they could trade in twenty thirty one Is.
Dallas Is dallas Taking MATT i mean.

Speaker 2 (01:00:25):
If they're if IF ad is going, OUT i think
they're taking whatever draft pick they. CAN i mean that's
Where i'm. Mad i'm, AGAIN i might be, wrong BUT
i just don't see what seems out, there just salivating
at the. Idea what about The? Clippers can The clippers get?

Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
There or do you want to play him next To?
ZOO i Know zoo hasn't had the best, year BUT.

Speaker 2 (01:00:45):
I, mean, look he wants to be Before.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
James harden For Anthony Davis challenge treble. Reap Oh kyrie And.

Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
Harden oh, god that'd be that'd be amazingly. Stupid, NO
i can't get there.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
There, okay let's wrap with this my favorite theoretical Destination Ranthony.
Davis recognize that it's never gonna. Happen Is memphis Looking
Brandy davis?

Speaker 2 (01:01:08):
Specifically, yeah that's.

Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Mine what's?

Speaker 2 (01:01:10):
Yours my best theoretical The? Bulls, no, no, no, no that's.
No like, again he wouldn't be fun on teams where
we don't really know where they. Are LIKE i understand
your point earlier about The, knicks, though but like a
HEALTHY ad In New york instead of towns defensively would

(01:01:32):
be interesting.

Speaker 1 (01:01:33):
That you would do to their.

Speaker 2 (01:01:34):
Offense, yes that was exactly WHERE i was getting, To
like where would that? Go perhaps my most interesting like theoretical,
fit And i'm not sure how they get. THERE i
don't think there's really an, opportunity but they don't have
to be patient with a thirty two year old who
is like super inchent all the. Time might be The
pacers just for When Tyrese halberton.

Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
Comes, back so you're running the plan would be to
run him With siakam And. Haliburton mm. Hmm The pacers
are footing the bill for that, trade that's the.

Speaker 2 (01:02:12):
Thing they're probably, not but like at least easier to
make that trade over the off season as, Well like
you can use nim hard topping like you, can you
can probably get there over the off.

Speaker 1 (01:02:21):
Season do you Think Troy weaver can Talk Joe dumars
into doing it In New orleans like A zion for
A d? Challenge zion could Come, uh a d could come.
In he could play power forward next To Derek.

Speaker 2 (01:02:32):
QUEEN i, mean he knows the, city he's, around he's been.
AROUND i think that's that's.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
Enough On Anthony, davis what do you think happens With?
Kyrie like do you if you're The. MAVs i think
there's a couple of things they could. Do they could
just trade him while he's, injured before he comes, back
they could bring it. Back and if he comes back
before the trade, deadline hope he increases his. Value they
could bring him back whenever he comes, back hopes he
increases the value for himself over the off, season or

(01:03:05):
they just don't bring him. Back what's the right way
to Handle kyrie in the context of what the mass
are going to look like from?

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
Here if they're going to, sang which they, should there's no.
Rush so you Sit kyrie, down you're, saying, look if
you want to come back this, year that is, okay
but we would strongly encourage you to just take the
time that you need and to just make sure that
everything is. Right like everything just don't be afraid to
take your. Time that would also benefit. Us but if

(01:03:36):
it's rate offer jumps up in the meantime and someone is, like, Oh,
kyrie we might be able to Get. Kyrie you explore,
That but, AGAIN i JUST i don't see who out
there is like super willing to go out of the
way to give up a significant package for a guy
who just had an aclsair at the each of what forredy? Two,

(01:03:58):
yep THERE'S i don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
That could that be another job For? Kyrie challenge trade
is That memphis is on getting. Healthier you could go
that route. Too i'm just gonna keep Naming memphis.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
Scenarios Anythink davis And kyrie irving For john willrand And
Jared Jackson junior get it? Done just swap? Issues Would?

Speaker 1 (01:04:16):
Minnesota could they do something to where then they, say,
well wait For kyrie to come back and bank on
this working next.

Speaker 2 (01:04:21):
Times Just minnesota is definitely the, team aren't.

Speaker 1 (01:04:25):
They, WELL i think when you're thinking about the potential,
package they're decidedly not the team BECAUSE i.

Speaker 2 (01:04:31):
Just don't, Know, no but like seem. Interested, sorry, yeah you're.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
Right because are you? GETTING i think if you're Getting,
kyrie you probably should be Trading Julius. Randall but if
you don't know When kyrie is coming, back how do
you Trade Julius? Randall your offense is already you, know
your offense Been their offense has been buying large good this.
Year But Julius randall is kind of a big reason.

Speaker 2 (01:04:50):
Why, WELL i mean it's the mass and they like love,
defense help about a very.

Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
What Is minnesota? Doing and then there's you would Have
Kyrie Julius randall and then a nas. Read i'd be
curious what that defense looks.

Speaker 2 (01:05:05):
Like who? Cares we hop fair?

Speaker 1 (01:05:07):
Enough fair? ENOUGH i.

Speaker 2 (01:05:10):
Can't jade, McDaniels your responsibility level just increased. Dramatically what
about Would detroit look at that.

Speaker 1 (01:05:23):
As the guy playing next To? Kaide?

Speaker 2 (01:05:25):
No why should? They that would be awful timeline, wise
not even sure like how he would fit In LIKE
i don't get me, Wrong kyrie is obviously better Than
jade And ivy by a significant. Margin before the. Injury
we have no idea what the guy looks. Like right,
now we have absolutely no.

Speaker 1 (01:05:43):
IDEA i wouldn't go nuclear for. Him but if it's
money and the mat was, like, hey we're just looking
to get off salary here and it was a protected
first round, PICK i don't. KNOW i might think LIKE
i honestly Think kyrie and k would be a divine
fit offensively. TOGETHER i get everything you're saying is. CORRECT
i want to make that. Clear IF i were The,
pistons push comes to, Shove i'm not doing, it But

(01:06:04):
i'm Just i'm just asking questions and naming. Destinations, no but.

Speaker 2 (01:06:08):
Like if you're getting That, kyrie The kyrie we, know, yeah,
absolutely then you're, right that would be.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
Interesting The pistons would be a team though when you're
looking at, it, WELL i mean the Timber wols have
fallen With umbrella. Too is when Is kyrie coming? Back
because you are trading for someone who you don't there
the teams that are willing to give up something For
kyrie right now is probably not an extensive. List that
list is going to shrink even further if you either
don't know when he's coming back or if you're acquiring
him under the guys that he isn't coming back until next?

Speaker 2 (01:06:34):
Year what about? It Jamal murray Seek nashi For kyrie,
Deal but again that's just such a. Gamble giving that's a.

Speaker 1 (01:06:44):
Gamble And Jamal murray's passing has been really good Without
jokic on the floor this.

Speaker 2 (01:06:48):
Year he's been fine this. Year so it's, Like i'm
just asking, Questions, Stan you're.

Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
Right what About so they're they're clearly probably realigning themselves
for next, Season but It's Fred VanVleet salary picks For
kyrie or maybe Does red Van fleet do it? ALONE i.
DON'T i haven't. Looked you'd have to look at that.

Speaker 2 (01:07:07):
Math But houston did that relationship?

Speaker 1 (01:07:12):
END i MEAN kd seemed. Fine it was him And
hardened that wrong and that went?

Speaker 2 (01:07:16):
Wrong, yeah that did not. End, well.

Speaker 1 (01:07:23):
That's maybe should we Throw sacramento in here so they
can get another guard on the roster who's.

Speaker 2 (01:07:27):
Not noticed With. HOUSTON i actually liked that one because
So Van lee is twenty five. Million then you at
What Dorian Phinney, smith.

Speaker 1 (01:07:37):
That's probably the that's THE i, mean what other REAL i.
DON'T i don't want to Call Dorian Finney smith, filler
but like what other real filler? Salary do they? Like?

Speaker 2 (01:07:46):
Shepherd?

Speaker 1 (01:07:47):
Obviously, well hold, on, Ree shepherd's on kind of a
heater right. Now let's.

Speaker 2 (01:07:50):
RELAX i just, look oh you, Know i'm. Kidding i'm
going to write about him over At yeahoo're here in
a couple, days so, RELAX i got.

Speaker 1 (01:07:57):
You he should he's he's one of the. PLAYERS i
Think alpha And shangun is materially, elevating but it would
AND i think you would need this one would need
like a third team because of both of these teams' financial.
Situation But kyrie's at thirty six, Five lee's twenty. Five oh,
man that's pretty. Close that's thirty seven to seven Versus
so it would take Something, ailien but that would be

(01:08:18):
that plus. Picks does that mean that.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
Like assuming picks like? That AM i?

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
Wrong like?

Speaker 2 (01:08:25):
These so with A d And, Kyrie i'm probably? Wrong
BUT i WHEN i look at their, age WHEN i
look at their injury, histories WHEN i look at, everything
AM i just being way too harsh in SAYING i
don't want to relinquish like first round picks for either.

Speaker 1 (01:08:42):
GUY i think if you were sitting here saying there's
no team that should Touch Kyrie irving the basketball player
with one hundred foot, poll that would be an. Extreme
BUT i think everything the conversation we're having now to
me is at least this is very just in Struct
these are what the conversations front offices are going to be.
Having you have to weigh the risk reward, profile and
that profile is inherently different because he's, older because of his,

(01:09:04):
contract and most of all because of the injury he's
working his way back.

Speaker 2 (01:09:08):
From, YEAH i JUST i would feel queasy giving up
significant draft capital for either of those GUYS i.

Speaker 1 (01:09:18):
Was thinking more Of so for like a With, KYRIE
i thought like a pick From. HUGHES i, again if
you're The, maverick you might sit there and, say, well
that's why we're not going to Trade kyrie right, now
because that's all we're gonna.

Speaker 2 (01:09:28):
Get so For, KYRIE i HAVEN'T i have some place
that's that's potentially. Interesting, No but ALTHOUGH i do get
your thinking, there how About orlando sugs those contracts are like.

Speaker 1 (01:09:49):
FLIPPABLE i Think orlando would say no because what is
THE i Think orlando says no because you're still trying
to to figure out The Bain Palo franz of it.
All now you're gonna Throw kyrie we all know like
he's Someone actually a bunch of other people might solve.
It but, man THAT'S i did not think of that. One,

(01:10:13):
wow there's no way that ONLY i know would consider
it after going all in For, bain.

Speaker 2 (01:10:18):
RIGHT i, mean, LOOK i Like jalen sucks a fair,
bit AND i think he's been good this year in
very limited. Minutes by the, way too many e turnal,
wars so what the?

Speaker 1 (01:10:30):
Hell but saying about the magic in, general.

Speaker 2 (01:10:33):
Yeah, Yeah but, like, look maybe it's also part of
what Like i'm, Not i'm not out on The polo
experience as like the number league number one. GUY i
spoke about this on an earlier show with With, Brian but,
LIKE i am questioning whether he's got like that top
to your playmaking capability where you're like you can trust

(01:10:55):
that the offense is gonna throw go through. HIM i
still think his team has off of. Issues if you're
getting A kyrie who is just eighty percent of who
he used to, be WHICH i think at his age
considering the gravity of the, injury would be a. Win
it's not a bad like inclusion. There so you're Running,

(01:11:16):
Kyrie Baine Franz, polo And Wendell carter in the starting.
Lineup i'm seeing some upside there at.

Speaker 1 (01:11:24):
Least, YEAH i don't know Why I'm i'm just harping. On,
okay well who is left after? That the silvasuming one.
Deal but that's What i'm saying Is i'm not crazy
about their depth that's currently, constructed.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
All, Right but you're not HURT i mean, again you're
not hurting the. Depth, again if you're you're Getting, kyrie you.

Speaker 1 (01:11:47):
Are getting, well you're not Because kyrie and the well
one you might be because how available Is. KYRIE i
Know suggs is dealt with his own, issues but you.
Are you're certainly diluting your defensive depth.

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
Here, okay, sure but if there's a team out there
THAT i actually trust to figure OUT i know it's
been rough defensively this year compared to two previous, Seasons
but if there's a team out THERE i kind of
trust to figure out their, defense it's probably A orlando.
Honestly and at the same, Time i'm gonna repeat. MYSELF
i feel like LIKE i say this every single, episode

(01:12:21):
but like we've got to remember something, Here, dan it's
the team with the most points at the end of
the game that. Wins like that's point. Production point generation
is sort of the, YEAH i think point.

Speaker 1 (01:12:33):
HERE i don't hate the logic on your. Part it
just seems too far out there for the magic is
probably What i'm struggling to wrap my head. Around and
by the, way If I'm, DALLAS i might jump at
the one for One. TRAINE i KNOW sugs doesn't do
anything to kind of simplify your life With cooper flipp
BUT i mean talk about building a defensive behemoth with
sugs and flag And Max. Christie If Derek lively is still, THERE. Pj,

(01:12:54):
Washington Naujie, Marshall is that really that bad?

Speaker 2 (01:12:59):
Offense, No i'm Just i'm just based the trade. Itself
is it really that?

Speaker 1 (01:13:04):
Unhinged If i'm in a, Vacuum i'm thinking about. IT
i don't Think orlando gives it a second of. Thought
that's where Maybe i'm. Wrong if we Have magic, fans
they could they could correct us.

Speaker 2 (01:13:16):
There so there's one point THAT i feel is very
important to note. Here Jalen sucks's contract is, descending so
it's gonna be like better and better and. Better that
in and of itself is an. Asset SO i Think
Orlando magic fans would rightfully point, Out, look his cap
percentage is going to decline every single. Year that alone

(01:13:38):
is worth additional. Compensation i'm not against that logic. WHATSOEVER
i think that's that's a fair.

Speaker 1 (01:13:45):
Point If I'm, dallas, though my pushback would, Be i'm not,
like you want The lakers first With kyrie so that
we can Get Jalen. Suggs they might be writing at
that and saying it's.

Speaker 2 (01:13:53):
That's that's where it might be an. Issue, no but
like And i'm really struggling to come up with like teams,
here like The. Kings this is where we can talk
about The. Kings this is where we can talk about the.

Speaker 1 (01:14:08):
Games i'm, sorry there might be a fun one we
have to get. Out what what About?

Speaker 2 (01:14:12):
Toronto let me see If i'm getting your logic? Here
so it's quickly and well just quickly Maybe, no they
can't do that because that will get take them into
the first apron so quickly and something they could.

Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Do that OR i, mean you could give Up, barrett
he's had a good. Season there you, Are You're it's
funny because quick But kyrie's he's not. THIS i want
to be. Clear he's not the. Same but it just
doesn't it sound bizarre to Add kyrie to a team
where we were worried about there being kind of too
many odd ball cooks in the. KITCHEN i don't think
it would be as big of a. CONCERN i think
he'd be perfect for, THEM, yea to be, honest.

Speaker 2 (01:14:49):
Yeah because he's got off ball. Capabilities he's a good. Shooter, yeah, yeah,
YEAH i don't hate. THAT i, AGAIN i so it's buried,
Instead so you want to BE.

Speaker 1 (01:14:58):
I think it's PROBABLY i think it would be quickly is?

Speaker 2 (01:15:00):
Right so quickly and Like Jacoby, WALTER.

Speaker 1 (01:15:06):
I don't. Know If I'm, TORONTO i might say, no
you could because the To, kobe he Should Maybe i'm
just married to what he showed as a. Rookie what
about because he's gonna get? Paid Maybe toronto does want
to be the one doing the pay With akbajie and.

Speaker 2 (01:15:19):
Quickly, NO i, yeah that's. Fine does that? WORK i
Think dallas is taking on too. Much, yeah you can't do.

Speaker 1 (01:15:28):
That, yeah you might NEED i mean, THERE i think
you might need to take on another team, here but, okay,
yeah that's like, yeah and the parameters are just they're
the numbers are close enough that it shouldn't be hard
to rope in another team to make. It, so you're,
Saying Jacoby walter and quickly, works but Ak bajie and
quickly does not have Much.

Speaker 2 (01:15:48):
Well, well, actually actually hang on because it might not.
Work let's. See, no it will, work, yeah, barely but
like that. Works.

Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
Whatever if it doesn't rope another that's, MAN i throw
that'd be wild And toronto with that they'll all to,
say this is a very hard, exercise and it's probably
easier to sit and, say, oh The MAVs need to start,
over but they need to start. Over AND i Think
i'm with you in the sense THAT i think there
needs to be a bit of urgency with, it or
at least there needs to be a. Commitment maybe it's

(01:16:19):
not blowing up the entire, thing BUT i would like
to see them do something to Streamline Cooper flagg's life
on one side of the or Optimize Cooper flag's life
on even one side of the. Floor, like let's get
to if you're not gonna make these big, moves put
him in the defensive role that you think he's going
to be in for the next fifteen, years and then

(01:16:40):
you just build out that around him or offensively do
what you. Can this would this is the part that's
so easier said than. Done try to surround him with,
shooting try to get you really should try a trade
for another ball, handler because even, then if he's your
kind of tertiary ball, handler those are reps that will be. Valuable,
NOW i think at this, point or what they've done

(01:17:01):
for a lot of this, season they've probably overtaxed him
in a way THAT i don't know how beneficial it.
Is and if you wanted to use him this, WAY
i think you needed to have a lot better floor
balance around him than they've had thus.

Speaker 2 (01:17:12):
Far imagine for a, moment if ownership group In dallas
is thinking of this upside down than we. Are we're
all here sitting here presuming oh, yeah they're gonna build
Around Cooper. Flag this is their. Future consider if their
next manaturial, signing they're like trying to, Say, okay how
do we accelerate this? Thing like what can we get For? Flag? Coulde,

(01:17:35):
No here's?

Speaker 1 (01:17:35):
Well, OKAY? WHOA i hope THAT i would go, there
BUT i was gonna like part of the issue here
is that they have to have the stomach to redo
this thing while not having the payoff in the draft
unless they're getting any of their own selections. Back and
so what you're saying, about are they sitting here trying
to accelerate? IT i, doubt highly doubt they're having their

(01:17:58):
should we trade The COOPER fa? Conversation?

Speaker 2 (01:18:02):
OH i was, kidding but that would be hilarious if
that was the.

Speaker 1 (01:18:05):
Case but is there a chance they're having, That, well
how do we get really good by the start of
next season, conversation because they don't control their own draft,
picks and that's a dangerous way to look at things
because it might force you to act. Impulsively, again what can.

Speaker 2 (01:18:20):
We get For Derek? Lively you? Mean, yeah, YEAH i.

Speaker 1 (01:18:23):
Don't, Okay i'm gonna say. Something i'm just asking. Questions
is that very much impulsive at this? Point if you
were to just trade him for second round? Picks? Yes
but do you View Derek lively AS i. DON'T i
View Cooper flagg as the only legitimate. QUARTERSTONE i Love
Derek lively and what he looks like at his, peak

(01:18:43):
but if you tell me that he's gonna be healthy
the rest of the, season, okay sure we can have
that conversation without that. ASSURANCE i do think that, Him Max, CHRISTY. Pj,
washington these are all really good. Players but to, me
just given where The MAVs are, at they're also.

Speaker 2 (01:18:58):
FUNGIBLE i get he's twenty. One that's Why i'm like
hesitant like, You.

Speaker 1 (01:19:06):
Yeah i'm not SAYING i don't think you seek out
trades For derek or use him as a throw in
to get. Off but, again an example to circle back
would be If charlotte came calling and, said we'll give
you back your twenty twenty seven pick For Derek.

Speaker 2 (01:19:18):
Lively that's a, conversation, yes, yeah, right it. Is it
is because despite how GOOD i think he can't be
in despite the fact that he's so young THAT i
think he can overcome like his injury. Pattern you're, right
like having control of your own draft picks as soon
as you Drafted Cooper flag is going to be. Essential
this is WHERE i think ultimately they're going to come
up short when they're going to go into like the trade,

(01:19:41):
season before the trade, deadline they're probably gonna go to
teams and, say, well we'll give You kyrie And Anthony
davis if you can get our pickbacks or picks, back
and seams are gonna just he want us to get
those picks for you for those. Guys SO i think
that's where they're gonna come up. Short if they can
do that With Derek. Lively, Though, yeah it's a, conversation

(01:20:03):
and if That hornet situation is is, feasible they should
look into, that like They but you're right, though if
they can't do that and they're trying to not, Accelerate
but like trying to win as many games as possible
this year just because they don't control their own draft
pick moving? Forward or, wait are saying they control their
own draft pick this, year so like they wouldn't it
wouldn't even behoove them to be bad here in twenty

(01:20:26):
five twenty six.

Speaker 1 (01:20:27):
Though, no it would they have their own draft pick this, year.

Speaker 2 (01:20:30):
So, exactly, yeah so so, yeah that's, why or say
it wouldn't prove them to get. Better, sorry that was
WHAT i was gonna. Say oh, yeah it would behoove
them to be bad this. Year but like moving, forward
like how do they get those picks? Back like if
they can get The charlotte pick, back that's one, Thing
but like twenty eight.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
Is Oklahoma CITY i think controls that, one and they're
not gonna what do they want that The MAVs do they? Want, like,
well The dallas be, like, hey we'll give you our
twenty and thirty one first round pick for the rights
to our in twenty eight first. ROUND i don't know
that's that'd be weird if You're Oklahoma, CITY i think it,
WELL i don't know that if If dallas makes that

(01:21:10):
offer in Your Oklahoma, city are you saying yes or
no two thousand and thirty one for twenty twenty.

Speaker 2 (01:21:14):
Eight how old is coup at that you have.

Speaker 1 (01:21:18):
To you probably just say, no, right just because you're
deeper into flags prime at that.

Speaker 2 (01:21:23):
Point, yeah and you need the assets you need to
cost controlled assets at that point in. Time, YEAH i
think you. DO i just, noticed, like is It dallas
that has the swap for San antonio in twenty twenty?
Thirty is it them that have the? Rights?

Speaker 1 (01:21:39):
Yeah they, Have, no it's to San. Antonio San antonio
has The dallas swap or minute, no no hoop that
one is San. Antonio, no, no San antonio has the
right to swap With.

Speaker 2 (01:21:51):
Dallas, okay so there's there's something interesting there as, well
like what can they give The spurs to get that?
Pickback can they give them? Anything? NOW i don't.

Speaker 1 (01:22:04):
KNOW i, MEAN i Guess Max christie would make. Sense
i'm just stoping The. Spurs i'm not itching to give
that up for anything less than a concide For. Flower
wasn't gonna go that.

Speaker 2 (01:22:14):
Far but, yeah, No, no that's the only INTERESTING ascid
right now that you probably put that up.

Speaker 1 (01:22:19):
For they do have this language is the finicky. Languages
So houston is part of Giving brooklyn its picks. Back
they get this is in twenty twenty, nine they get
the two most favorable of their own twenty nine first round,
Pick dallas's twenty nine first round, pick And phoenix's twenty
nine first round. Pick so are you Giving dallas an

(01:22:39):
end of? That could that do? Something but, again what
do you want that does? That part of the is
that the compensation and The kyrie trade relaid. Out it's
that nibble of the pick Plus Van vliet And Dorian
Phinney smith and if there needs to be anything else
to make.

Speaker 2 (01:22:55):
That's, interesting that's. Interesting. Yeah, yeah, AGAIN i think any
team that's rebuilding where they have potentially given up the
farm in previous, years those are the deals that you
have to seek. Out we're getting the picks Back like
this is Why i've always been a, little you, know
skeptical of giving up the farm for guys who aren't,

(01:23:16):
necessarily you, know ALL nba first team caliber, players because
when you're sitting in this situation and you've just routinely
given out, picks it's it's got to be so frustrating
to go to like five or six teams and, go
can we have our pick? Back? Please, like let's try
to find a deal that that has to be infuriatingly.

Speaker 1 (01:23:36):
Frustrating and how often does it? HAPPEN i, mean The
Brooklyn houston thing was an anomaly Because brooklyn with. Themselves
but it's when have we seen these other teams kind
of come in to give these other teams their picks
back to help a third team or for whatever get the.
Player that's what makes it all because, look use it
as an. Example if You're houston in the trade we,

(01:23:58):
outlined you're getting something big as part of. That but
if You're, charlotte like Knowing derek wives extension, eligible knowing
he's played in under one hundred games for his, career
and you still, don't by the, way you stilln't even
really know what he looks like independent of an elite.
Playmaker so why would you give Back dallas is twenty
twenty seven?

Speaker 2 (01:24:17):
Pick, yeah it's it's a fair. Question AND i think
that is where the teams that have gotten those picks
are pretty. Wise. Now they're, like, no if you want that,
pickback you've got to give up something of significant, value
and you can't because you're bad for a, reason.

Speaker 1 (01:24:33):
Which is Why i'm. Trying i'm really going to be
fascinated to watch how The mavericks operate, then regardless of
who's in, charge as we lead in to the trade,
deadline BECAUSE i think there's going to be something subtle
AND i won't even say it needs to be huge
in the vein of they Shopped Anthony, davis so they
actually traded, him but there needs to be some sort
of we've kind of The charlotte. Indicator remember when it

(01:24:56):
was they TRADED. Pj washington to The mavericks and it was.
Okay this front office isn't going to play the short
game as much as the previous, regime And dallas's situation
is even more fascinating because they don't control so many
of their first round picks moving. Forward i'm looking for
a hint of anything over the next few months that

(01:25:16):
shows they're prepared to weather this storm and rebuild Around
Cooper flag independent of whether they do have their draft
picks or. Not AND i won't say if Both kyrie
And Anthony davis are on the roster pass the trade
deadline that that proves they're, not but it does If davis,
specifically just because he's not dealing with AN acl type

(01:25:37):
injury Like Kyrie is is still on this, team and
they haven't made any other. Moves you're gonna sit there
and wonder do they really believe that they can just
get a high pick this year and come back next
year and kind of pick up Where Nico harrison left.

Speaker 2 (01:25:51):
Off, basically it's a good. QUESTION i don't have an
answer for. THAT i don't.

Speaker 1 (01:25:59):
KNOW i, MEAN i think Maybe i'm giving them too.
Much i'm not giving them the benefit of the. Doubts
so Maybe i'm just an. Idiot it is the better
way to couch. THIS i think that they're not going
to go and short circuit this thing after this. YEAR
i don't think they're gonna look at this as a
one year gap year. THING i would assume That dumont,
specifically or even more, importantly let's Say Michael Finley, riccardi

(01:26:23):
they're in the running to have the permanent. Responsibilities. Right finley,
specifically just being around this organization for as long as
he has even as a, player probably understands that this
isn't going to. Work but the bigger thing might be
this is a nice way to book end. It because
we talked about this at the, top whoever's in. Charge
this might be more of an off season. Thing do

(01:26:44):
they have the power to change the head? Coach and
if they, don't that might say all we need to
know about where what direction The MAVs are. Headed but
the right, one the right direction is the same as
it was Post Luka doncics. Trade that's. Done you have
to move. On it's lost money and never should have been.
Done but it's. Done if you were gonna move, him

(01:27:04):
it should have been to. Rebuild they. Didn't they got
A mulligan opportunity when they won the draft, lottery they
still haven't taken. It they need to kind of take it,
now and that is the. Move you're not gonna own
your own picks moving, forward AND i would say they
could maybe get one of those picks. Back maybe you

(01:27:26):
just have to come to terms that you're not going
to get all of them back and that you need
to do everything in your power to optimize the roster
Around Cooper flag with the, tools with the resources that you.
Have easier said than done is the. CLICHE i do
think they'll ultimately end up, there even if they don't
push the implosion button this. Year necessarily that has to

(01:27:47):
be where this is, headed because otherwise it's WHY i
don't want to say why get rid Of, Nico but
do you really think, that you, know there's a chance
we might have been better Without luca if it Wasn't
nico running the.

Speaker 2 (01:27:58):
Show, NO i think it's so important, actually just to
wrap this, up because they have their own twenty six
pick that they just lean majorly into this year in
terms of like getting the highest upside, pick because this
is another strong. Draft last we know that so many
teams identified twenty five and twenty six as to two

(01:28:20):
years to have top draft. Picks if The mavericks go
out in during the tradeline and, say, well, look let's
just give it one more, Shot kyrie's coming. Back eighty
is healthy. Again Cooper flack has now played forty five forty, games,
like let's let's ramp this, up let's go out get another, Guy,

(01:28:42):
dan and Then i'm just out And i'm just. OUT
i get. That it just that would be the worst
decision you could possibly, make because then if you end
up winning forty, five forty, eight forty nine wins and
you're like stuck in the back half of the lottery
and you don't really have a chance for, It Darren
peter's like a real chance or at ah D bonsa or.

(01:29:04):
Whatever where are you going from? There like this twenty
twenty six, draft it sounds so weird when you just
had the number one pick in twenty twenty five With
cooper Fla cooper, Flag and Now i'm sitting here saying
twenty twenty six might be the most important draft clash
for them moving, forward but it.

Speaker 1 (01:29:22):
Is it's the only one they have unrettered access to
until twenty thirty.

Speaker 2 (01:29:27):
One and also the, quality it's just it's so high.
End like if you just get a top three draft
pick next, year you're pretty, golden just in terms of
having two guys moving forward who you can build around
instead of. One like that gives you some, Leeway that
gives you some, opportunities and if you somehow could finagle

(01:29:50):
whether It's Derek, Lively i'm coming to terms with. It
as you can hear for the pickback in twenty twenty,
seven if there's something you can do to get that pick,
back all, right, great, great.

Speaker 1 (01:30:03):
You can make the case that is the most single
most important pick to get, back because then it gives
you three consecutive yeah, drafts including this past one of
having your own first round. Pick this is all to, say,
though on The Nico harrison, front this was the right.
Decision it was probably an overdue, decision but it was
also the easy. Decision and what matters more is literally
everything that comes next.

Speaker 2 (01:30:25):
In Ordership yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:30:27):
Moret are you able to tell our listeners where they
can find you and all the fantastic work that you.

Speaker 2 (01:30:31):
Do i'm not gonna be able to tell people literally
where they can find, me because that'd be. Creepy but
they can find my work at least over At Yahoo,
sports over At, forbes on THE nba, podcast and if
you Speak danish on the Podcast Buzzer, beater and if
you want to catch, games you can listen to me
in a Red.

Speaker 1 (01:30:48):
Peachtreal mets until next. Time, that as, always with a
shout out to the one the, only the indelible maybe
could have fixed The mavericks at point Guard Fister frank
sla