September 18, 2023 • 28 mins
Following a sold out live show in London, Malaka and Nana Darkoa kick off the season with one of their star guests, British-Nigerian sexpert Oloni. Her book ‘The Big O’ should really be given to everyone over the age of consent!
Oloni might be famous for her raunchy Twitter chats, but she is also dedicated to seriously educating people about sex.
“Society has told us that sex is something that's done to us,” Oloni explains. “That's just simply not really true, and I would definitely encourage women to try and find their voices.”
In this conversation, she questions the lack of research into female sexuality, explains how to feel comfortable enough to demand better sex, brands Black-British culture the ‘kings of situationships,’ and shares how her partners feel about her work.
The Adventures From the Bedrooms of African Women Podcast is a production of AQ Studios in partnership with Masi Media. Selly Thiam is the AQ Studios CEO and Mercy Githaiga is our operations manager, Frederica Boswell is the senior producer, audio editors are Tevin Sudi and Mercy Barno and Lucas Ngao is our social media manager.
Our theme music is Damn by Ria Boss and music from this episode comes from Epidemic sounds.
Find Adventures From the Bedrooms of African Women anywhere you get your podcasts, and in pursuing all things sex, sexuality, and pleasure, follow us on all our social media platforms @adventuresfrom.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Yeah,
welcome to the Adventures From The Bedrooms of African Women podcast season two.
We are back y'all.
It's your girl Malika Grans and I'm,
it's so great to be back because,
(00:21):
oh,
my goodness,
we have like so many treats for you all in this new season.
It's a sexual buffet of oratory talents.
Like,
let me just tell you.
Hey,
yes.
No.
And I every did you watch starting us off with the fire?
(00:47):
She has been blogging tweeting and speaking about sex for just about as long as we have,
she's got a podcast called Laid Bear and her recent book.
The Big O is out.
Do you know who we're talking about,
Nana?
I mean,
let me just give people a clue.
Ladies.
Let's have some fun.
It's the one the only a lot.
(01:09):
Hey,
thank you so much for having me.
Thank you.
I love that intro as well.
Thank you.
Well,
thank you.
So,
we are so pleased to have you here and to have you back actually,
for those of you who do not know and I don't see why you wouldn't know.
We were recently in London.
There was no way we were not going to go to London and not see the queen and spill some tea with the.
(01:36):
We're so excited to have you here.
Thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you for having me.
So,
the amazing thing about all three of us on stage is that we are all veteran bloggers.
We're all authors now.
Um We both started writing about and sexuality around the same time.
What started you on your journey for me?
(01:56):
I think um growing up,
especially as a Nigerian woman,
um I had so many questions when it came to sex and often when I was around my friends,
I so Aloia,
you are an inspiration for many women.
Just many people in general.
Why did you become a sex blogger?
So I became a sex blogger because I've just always enjoyed talking about sexuality.
(02:21):
I was very curious.
I believed that there were so many questions that I never really had the answer to and I felt like I was always kind of left out because I was,
I was very sheltered.
I came from a religious background.
My mum wouldn't even talk to me about what it was like to have a period.
So and you can imagine period are not necessarily,
(02:41):
they don't have nothing to do with,
you know,
there's nothing sexy about a period.
There's nothing I,
I mean,
I'm on my period now and believe me,
I do not feel sexy.
I feel very unsexy but,
you know,
um growing up,
like,
and when I got to around maybe around 18,
you know,
or even just before that,
the time when you start becoming really interested in boys,
(03:02):
you start dating and around this time,
there wasn't really much forums,
you could only really have conversations with your girlfriends because the internet wasn't live and popping as it is today.
All I had was my friends and the phone and talking to them and because I loved talking about boys and I loved talking about dating relationships,
not understanding,
(03:23):
you know,
men or wanting to,
to try and understand them properly.
I would blog about my experience,
I blog about my dating woes or my friends dating problems or,
you know,
try to understand like why men were from Mars and why women were from Venus.
That's what I really,
really try to,
to take in.
(03:43):
And naturally when you talk about relationships and dating sex comes hand in hand.
And that was around the time I lost my virginity,
which was 18.
And I remember just wanting to just,
you know,
have those conversations.
And again,
I was someone who was very curious because again,
grew up in a very religious household.
So that meant I was going to church every Sunday without bell.
(04:06):
And I just remember like a Sunday school teacher,
like she was an auntie of ours who our parents trusted and she put on a tape which was in my opinion very careless because this was um,
a tape of a woman who was saying how wrong it was to get an abortion.
She was a preacher.
And I just thought to myself,
(04:27):
like,
did you get permission from our parents to even share this tape?
Um,
and there are other ways you could go about teaching us about safe sex.
It shouldn't just be,
you shouldn't get an abortion.
Like there are so many steps before you have sex.
Like,
you know,
if you do,
if you are thinking about having sex,
you know,
I understand when it comes to Christianity or most religions anyway,
(04:50):
that you're not supposed to have sex before marriage.
But realistically,
I think there were so many ways they could have gone about it in terms of teaching us,
you know,
maybe,
I don't know the morning after pill,
teaching us about contraception.
If we ever do find ourselves in those positions,
I think that there were just so many precautions they could have taken.
And I thought again,
(05:10):
it was irresponsible for this woman to put on a tape for us.
And I just remember even though I never had a name for it,
I didn't know what being pro-choice was at the time.
I knew I was pro choice because I just remember feeling so rebellious and thinking,
no,
it's my body.
If I do not wanna bear someone's child,
I will not.
(05:30):
But again,
I never had those conversations growing up So again,
went home blogged about it.
It was probably one of my first blogs as well.
Oh,
wow.
You came with fire.
Yeah,
I did like,
I really dug deep and wanted to have those conversations and you know,
I it just really developed there.
I've always enjoyed talking about sex from an educational standpoint as well as the raunchy and pleasurable side.
(05:56):
So I would say that would definitely be part of my journey as to how I go into it.
Yeah,
I like the word that you use,
particularly in this instance that you describe in the church,
which is careless because I think oftentimes when people are in church or people,
authority figures are in church,
they don't really consider the trauma that this kind of conversation or proselytizing can have on a person because,
(06:21):
you know,
kids are having abortions.
I remember when I was in high school,
my cousin,
by the time we were 16,
had had three.
So I hope that,
you know,
when people listen back to this and hopefully it will make it into some religious circles is have some care,
you know,
when you're sharing these things.
So,
but yeah,
thank you for coming with the fire on that out the gate.
(06:41):
So,
you know,
you said you,
you like talking about um sex from an educational standpoint when you were doing,
you know,
your research in this work.
Did you ever see yourself as a,
a black woman?
A Nigerian woman reflected back in these conversations that you were having in the mainstream,
in the mainstream.
No.
Um I mean,
I'm someone who loves,
(07:03):
I mean,
for example,
Cosmopolitan to me is like the Bible of sex magazines.
And um I never really saw my experiences in there.
I didn't think I could relate because I mean,
it's a white magazine designed for women and um I never really saw myself and of course,
we understand that representation matters.
But I found that I had to look across the sea,
(07:25):
like,
you know,
I would have to read articles from black women in America who were talking about sexuality.
And that's how I kind of saw myself.
Um I mean,
it doesn't mean I didn't really learn anything from the white media that I picked up.
I mean,
if we're talking about sex in the city,
for example,
like those were things I did,
(07:46):
I could still,
there was a bit of relatability in terms of,
you know,
talking to your friends about your boyfriends or your sexual experiences.
But I didn't see a black woman talking about culture.
And I feel like our upbringing is slightly,
there's some similarities,
but I feel like ultimately,
it's different when it comes to a Nigerian woman,
a Nigerian British experience will never be the same as a white woman.
(08:11):
So I guess in a sense,
I was very lucky to have my friends with me and that was all I needed the conversations that I had with my friends,
their experiences.
I mean,
I was like the second person in my friendship group to lose my virginity.
And I remember my friend just asking me like,
did you leave the lights on or did,
did it?
Like,
I still remember it like it was yesterday.
(08:33):
Um But yeah.
Um I,
I don't think to answer your question.
Yeah.
I don't really feel like I ever saw myself in mainstream media when it came to sexuality.
But I think things are changing now.
I think things are,
are getting better.
I do,
I agree.
I think it's a lot more inclusive and I think that it's due to the work that,
you know,
people like you have done,
I'm gonna shout myself out here like myself and Nana have done.
(08:55):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um But I do want to talk about your book for a bit.
So,
you know,
like I said,
you've been a sex expert for over a decade.
You've been writing about this.
And so you're an author,
Nana has just written this book,
The Sex Lives Of African Women.
I've written books on romance.
Can you talk about what it was like to transition from blogging to writing?
(09:18):
Because we're seeing a lot more,
I'm gonna,
you know,
Nigerian women are just taking over like,
I don't know what it is.
You are like if we talk about African writers,
we're talking about Nigerian women.
Yeah.
What was it like making that transition.
Um For me,
it was very difficult because I feel like when I'm blogging,
I think it's the same when I'm mini blogging,
(09:38):
like when I'm tweeting as well,
you know,
I'm showcasing my personality and I'm just talking and I'm sharing my,
my opinions,
even if they come across a bit silly to some people.
Like I have this,
I like to try and push this agenda that I don't believe that women should ride when they're having sex because of the orgasm gap.
I'm just like,
(09:58):
no men need to put more of the work in not women.
Right.
Yeah,
exactly.
Like we need to close the orgasm gap like,
you know,
but that's just me being a bit silly.
It's,
it's become part of my brand now to tell women to stop writing,
but I'm not actually being serious and that's the thing.
I think that a lot of my blogging or my tweeting are very tongue and cheek.
(10:20):
I don't really consider myself a very serious person.
Like I find everything humorous.
However,
I had to handle things with so much care when writing my book.
Of course,
like when you're writing a book and you're stating studies and research,
you have to cite it extremely well and your editors will not let you approve any opinion or research or study if you don't have some sort of proof to back it up with.
(10:46):
So it was it and it took a lot of research,
but I was,
I,
I was educating myself along the way and I was on learning things along the way,
which I really,
really enjoyed.
What did you discover,
um,
when writing this book that you didn't know about yourself or just even information,
I think the whole process was life changing.
(11:09):
But I would definitely say there were facts within the book that I had to take out because they weren't facts.
You know,
a funny one for me was one that a lot of sex educators use,
which is,
oh my gosh,
the clitoris has 8000 nerve endings,
which actually isn't true.
You're joking.
Yeah.
No,
it's not true.
It's not true at all.
(11:29):
And I remember when I was writing this and my editor was just like,
you know,
you have to actually find the study for this.
And I think I was so confident because again,
this was something that was that it said so much in the sex fair that we push it and we all believe it.
And you know,
um when we're having more conversations about the vulva,
these are conversations or narratives you probably do want to push.
(11:52):
But there's no truth to it.
Like I think was done on a cow.
So it would be incorrect for me to have included that.
And um even when I listen to other sex educators still say it,
I'm just like,
uh well,
actually that's actually,
yeah,
be like actually,
that's not true.
So,
I've seen it a lot less now.
I do not see it anymore.
(12:14):
I have to say it,
but it was definitely a study or um a false fact that people really did push and maybe even the clitoris does have double the nerve endings as the male penis.
But it's not 8000.
Yeah.
It probably,
it might,
I don't think it's 8000.
I don't know if it's 8000,
but I don't know.
(12:35):
And,
and I get it,
you know,
we were trying to highlight how important the clitoris is.
Yeah,
how amazing the is and how sensitive it is and,
and you know what happens when blood rushes to it.
But um yeah,
I had to remove that because there isn't any physical evidence.
And you know,
that's just,
that's just female sexuality for you or when it comes to female anatomy,
(12:55):
how much studies is,
is really done on,
on our,
on our body,
not that much,
you know,
I mean,
they're comparing us to a cow.
I mean,
they have nothing to do with,
you know,
a bovine sexual experience obviously,
you know.
Um but that just shows you,
I think it also shows uh in a way how I don't wanna say the word desperate but how keen that we are for,
(13:21):
for us to have to find these amazing studies around our bodies because there's just not that much,
there really isn't that much.
And I think just for a very long time.
There's been little effort when it comes to female sexuality as a whole.
So yeah,
100%.
I have to say this information for me is life changing and it's very freeing because like sometimes you're in a situation and there's so much attention being given to your clits and it's like it has 8000 nerve endings.
(13:48):
Why is it exploding?
Why is it taking 15 minutes to arrive longer for lots of women?
Yeah.
Yeah.
No.
So for me,
this is life changing.
So thank you for sharing that.
I will definitely be delving deeper into the book to learn more.
Yeah.
So as women who write about sex,
you know,
none.
And I have noticed that um men have certain expectations when it comes to being in a relationship with somebody who writes about sex,
(14:16):
they either want to know.
Are you going to write about this or,
you know,
either with anticipation or fear?
I know that you're in a committed relationship now.
But did you have any experience with that prior or even currently with your,
your current partner?
Oh,
my current planet is so easy going.
Like he's just so comfortable.
Um I think my last relationship in the beginning,
(14:39):
he wasn't too comfortable with me talking about sex.
But I think that was kind of a representation of just how society was and how a lot of men would have probably felt.
But with time,
I think when he saw what I was doing and how much it meant to a lot of women he loosened up.
But other guys that I've been with or had,
(15:00):
you know,
casual hookups with,
oh,
I definitely feel like they enjoyed the fact that I had a podcast that was about sex because they wanted to be a hot topic.
Right?
And it also gives them the confidence to be better pleasers because I,
I don't think they wanted me to basically bastardize their,
their,
their performance in and on my podcast.
(15:21):
So,
um yeah,
so they always stepped up to the challenge and I can't really remember the last time I've like had a terrible sexual experience and I think that's because of what I do.
But my fiance now,
no,
he's always,
he's been very supportive.
He loves what I do and you know,
he sees he,
yeah,
he's,
(15:42):
he's always in the background,
like just watching me and cheering me on.
So yeah,
I love him for that.
I think that it's really amazing that you guys are able to go on this journey together because sometimes,
you know,
when you get to a level of achievement,
like you've got and then a man comes in,
um it can be difficult for them to adjust.
And so for him to be so supportive in the beginning,
(16:02):
I think is absolutely incredible for the two of you um has being engaged,
had any sort of influence on on your,
and I hope it's ok to ask this on your romantic relationship or your sexual experience.
And the reason I ask is because I had so many friends,
like,
when I was in my twenties and they were like,
(16:22):
yeah,
we've lived together for 10 years,
but as soon as we got married,
everything in the bedroom just got better.
I'm like,
how?
Oh,
ok.
I thought you were gonna say it stopped because I know there's always this idea that like married people don't have sex and I'm just like,
not me,
I have a high libido.
I need to get mine.
True.
And,
(16:42):
you know,
I,
I guess it's also still the idea that marriage is when you're allowed to have sex.
So people just get even freier and like,
ok,
we're married so we could do everything at this.
We could do all the things.
Yeah.
But I've never really restricted myself if I like you,
if I'm comfortable and you make me feel good.
And I know this is something that's worthwhile.
Like I'm going to give you,
(17:03):
you know,
the best version of myself sexually and romantically.
Yeah.
Have you ever written about what it takes as a woman to become comfortable?
Um,
so that you can have the best sex.
What kind of tips would you give somebody who,
you know,
is feeling that level of discomfort but still wants to share their body with somebody.
I would say the first thing you need to do is to get comfortable with self.
(17:27):
I think it's so important to be comfortable with yourself before you're comfortable with someone else in the room.
You need to understand what pleasure looks like on your own.
And you know,
growing up,
that was something that I did a lot.
Like I remember the first time I masturbated,
I was probably like 13 and I remember when I discovered this big,
(17:49):
oh I said,
oh my God,
I am never going back to what it was.
Just this beautiful euphoric feeling that I had unlocked.
And I didn't know what was going on.
All I knew is that I had these fanny flutters and I needed to just,
you know,
flick my bean.
But I've been comfortable with my sexuality from a very long time.
(18:12):
And I think that everyone's sexual journey is different because I still speak to women who tell me that they've never received an orgasm or that they've never really played with themselves or that their partner doesn't really consider their body.
And I think that when you know what pleasure looks like on your own,
you can take back to the bedroom,
you can direct your partner,
(18:33):
you feel more comfortable and confident in your sexuality,
you know how to guide them,
you know what to tell them.
And um it really does help.
So I would say that would be my top tip is to really,
really understand your,
your body and understand what it is that you enjoy so you can then teach your partner.
(18:56):
Um And I would also say learning to find your voice because I think a lot of us give our sexual partners,
um,
a pass to just try and I guess,
read our minds and figure out themselves what it is that they like.
But I really do encourage women,
especially women who are in relationships to find their voice because we are the ones who are struggling when it comes to the orgasm gap,
(19:24):
right?
And I've always said like,
I think it's because we believe or society has told us that sex is something that's done to us.
It's not something that we're supposed to be a part of or something that we use to gift men with.
And that's just simply not really true.
And I would definitely encourage women to try and yeah,
find their voices and we're told to be a bit more submissive when it comes to our voices,
(19:48):
which we then bring that same attitude to the bedroom.
And we don't say,
hey,
I would love if you could,
you know,
go down on me or I would like if you could touch me like this or don't stop,
I'm enjoying this.
Keep doing that.
No,
I don't really like this,
you know,
and as well as the orgasm gap,
there's also the all sex gap,
you know,
studies tell us that um men are,
(20:09):
men are more unlikely to go down on women in the bedroom in comparison to women.
And that's just awful and it's because we're not speaking up or we're returning to these guys who believe that it's ok to give us halfhearted sex.
So you need to,
even if you want to be submissive in the bedroom,
I feel like it's important to tap into being a Dom and a dom,
(20:31):
meaning that you need to be comfortable exerting your power in your voice and saying this is how I enjoy being pleasured.
And if you don't pleasure me this way,
I'm not returning back here again,
tap into that,
into that energy,
that energy that you know,
and,
and talk to him with it and say,
(20:52):
nah,
this is what I really enjoy and you don't have to do it in a dismissive way or like,
oh,
you're really crap.
You can do it in a loving way.
There is,
you know,
that you can do it in a way where no firm.
Yes.
But you know,
you,
you talked about the Big O and when you discovered it and that's also the title of your book.
We've talked about,
(21:13):
you know,
themes of,
of religion and,
you know,
spirituality and different people's beliefs can affect their approaches to sex.
And you've got something in the book called Elonis 12 Commandments.
How did you come up with that list?
And what is one key commandment from that list?
I think one key commandment is definitely love who you want to love.
And that's because I,
(21:34):
I think that there's just so much emphasis that's put on our sexuality to either be straight or gay or bi.
And,
um,
people don't understand what being sexually fluid means.
I mean,
I still get women who will send me a dilemma.
I had one recently,
um,
we discussed it on my podcast and she said,
(21:54):
um,
dear or no,
you know,
my boyfriend and I were,
were drunk and we were talking and he admitted that he'd love me to take him.
Does this mean that he's gay?
And I'm just just gay.
So me and my husband were just like,
no,
it means that your boyfriend's a freak,
you know,
get that in.
And um I just think that we just put too much emphasis on our sexuality and we put too much emphasis on labels and titles when we should just enjoy what we wanna enjoy,
(22:22):
experiment how we want to experiment and understand that it doesn't really define us.
You know,
society is so accepting of lesbians.
But let a man say that he enjoys a shower twice a day.
It means he's gay,
right?
Do you know?
Yeah.
Yeah.
We like,
we look for any excuse to try and emasculate a man just because he might do something that we dem out of the ordinary.
(22:47):
But um I really did come up the rest of the 12 Commandments as I was writing the book,
I think one that also stuck out to me as well was um not allowing your happiness to rely on a man.
I have a section in there which is about relationships and heartbreak.
And I feel like a lot of the young women who inspired me to stop blogging properly and put a lot of effort into my work.
(23:12):
I saw something that was a reoccurring theme when they would send me their dilemmas,
which was them not wanting to leave a situation that they'd been in for so long.
Um Them not wanting to leave a situation because they lost their virginity to him.
And it was just this repeated thing.
And I noticed and this is another thing I noticed in our culture,
(23:34):
a lot of African black women have been raised to be someone else's wife.
We have not been raised to be our own individuals.
And,
and honestly,
it's just,
I,
I notice it with everything that we do.
I noticed it when I was at university.
Um You know,
our parents assuming that we were gonna find the love of our lives as soon as we diversity.
(23:57):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it was just like mom,
it's not the same anymore.
Like,
you know,
society and university has really changed like guys will fuck you and feed you and say that that's it and that,
you know,
that's it.
And to my mom,
she would assume,
no,
that's your boyfriend.
I'm like No,
he's a heartbreaker.
This is your budding husband.
Exactly.
(24:18):
Uh He fed you,
he sexualized you.
That's your husband.
That's your,
my husband,
that's your boyfriend.
You know,
cause she just immediately thinks if you're having sex with that person,
then that's the love of your life and it's a relationship now it's a relationship.
It's like you don't even understand.
We are so scared of commitment in the Black British culture like we are,
(24:40):
we are,
I like to say we are the kings of situations because there are so many levels that we take before we actually,
you know,
become very serious about commitment.
But um yeah,
no,
when it,
when it comes to writing the commandments,
um I really,
really wanted women to understand that,
(25:01):
you know,
sex and being in a relationship is not enough to continue in a bad situation,
especially if it,
if it does nothing for you,
if it doesn't serve you,
like,
please leave.
Mm 100%.
Yeah.
So as a final question,
um this is a question we are asking all of our guests this season.
(25:24):
Can you share with us a sexy secret and you can interpret that any way you want?
Yes.
OK.
My sexy secret.
I think my sexy secret would definitely have to be recording the audio of sex.
I love to record the audio,
if not the visual,
I love to record the audio.
(25:45):
Um I'm a big believer in looking for different ways to enjoy self pleasure,
you know,
porn,
especially ethical porn is great,
but it's important to find different ways to tap in to your fantasies.
And I think just by recording the audio when you and your partner or whoever are having sex,
um,
(26:05):
this is something you can go back to and listen to later on your own.
Um,
and it's,
I don't even know how I started doing it.
I just remembered that one day.
I just wanted to record the audio and um I do it quite often.
It's something that I used to like,
stimulate myself with.
It's something that I like to try and remember like,
(26:25):
you know,
what were we doing?
I wonder what we were doing,
creeps in the bed,
the noises that I'm making,
what he's whispering in my air and it just takes you back.
I have flashbacks like,
oh my God,
that was amazing.
So,
yeah,
getting hot beneath the collar.
Loni This has been so much fun.
Thank you so,
(26:46):
so much.
Oh,
thank you so much.
Appreciate it.
I'm excited for the rest of the season.
We are off to a fantastic start.
Are you excited?
It's going to be a fire season.
We have so many big names who agreed to be on the podcast.
(27:06):
Y'all like us.
We like that.
You like us.
Thank you for the love.
Keep tuning in new episode next week.
Just stay tuned.
We'll see you next week.
Give us a review.
Five stars.
Yes,
five stars.
We deserve all the stars.
Show us some love the adventures from the Bedrooms of African Women podcast is hosted by Malike Grant and Nana Damas AKI Ceo is an executive producer alongside the hosts,
(27:52):
Freddie Boswell is a senior producer.
Audio edit are Mercy Bono and alongside production support from Mercy Gua and Lucas.
The Adventures From The Bedrooms of African Women Podcast is a production of A Q studios in partnership with media.
Follow us on all our socials at A Q studios podcasts.
(28:13):
Our theme music is Dam by Boss Find Adventures From the Bedrooms of African Women.
Anywhere you get your podcast and in the pursuit of all things,
sex,
sexuality and pleasure.
Follow us on all our social media platforms at adventures from thank you for listening them li the it.
(28:39):
God damn,
she's so nice.
Is it?
God damn.
Yeah,
welcome to the Adventures From The Bedrooms of African Women podcast season two.
We are back y'all.
It's your girl Malika Grans and I'm,
it's so great to be back because,
(00:21):
oh,
my goodness,
we have like so many treats for you all in this new season.
It's a sexual buffet of oratory talents.
Like,
let me just tell you.
Hey,
yes.
No.
And I every did you watch starting us off with the fire?
(00:47):
She has been blogging tweeting and speaking about sex for just about as long as we have,
she's got a podcast called Laid Bear and her recent book.
The Big O is out.
Do you know who we're talking about,
Nana?
I mean,
let me just give people a clue.
Ladies.
Let's have some fun.
It's the one the only a lot.
(01:09):
Hey,
thank you so much for having me.
Thank you.
I love that intro as well.
Thank you.
Well,
thank you.
So,
we are so pleased to have you here and to have you back actually,
for those of you who do not know and I don't see why you wouldn't know.
We were recently in London.
There was no way we were not going to go to London and not see the queen and spill some tea with the.
(01:36):
We're so excited to have you here.
Thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you for having me.
So,
the amazing thing about all three of us on stage is that we are all veteran bloggers.
We're all authors now.
Um We both started writing about and sexuality around the same time.
What started you on your journey for me?
(01:56):
I think um growing up,
especially as a Nigerian woman,
um I had so many questions when it came to sex and often when I was around my friends,
I so Aloia,
you are an inspiration for many women.
Just many people in general.
Why did you become a sex blogger?
So I became a sex blogger because I've just always enjoyed talking about sexuality.
(02:21):
I was very curious.
I believed that there were so many questions that I never really had the answer to and I felt like I was always kind of left out because I was,
I was very sheltered.
I came from a religious background.
My mum wouldn't even talk to me about what it was like to have a period.
So and you can imagine period are not necessarily,
(02:41):
they don't have nothing to do with,
you know,
there's nothing sexy about a period.
There's nothing I,
I mean,
I'm on my period now and believe me,
I do not feel sexy.
I feel very unsexy but,
you know,
um growing up,
like,
and when I got to around maybe around 18,
you know,
or even just before that,
the time when you start becoming really interested in boys,
(03:02):
you start dating and around this time,
there wasn't really much forums,
you could only really have conversations with your girlfriends because the internet wasn't live and popping as it is today.
All I had was my friends and the phone and talking to them and because I loved talking about boys and I loved talking about dating relationships,
not understanding,
(03:23):
you know,
men or wanting to,
to try and understand them properly.
I would blog about my experience,
I blog about my dating woes or my friends dating problems or,
you know,
try to understand like why men were from Mars and why women were from Venus.
That's what I really,
really try to,
to take in.
(03:43):
And naturally when you talk about relationships and dating sex comes hand in hand.
And that was around the time I lost my virginity,
which was 18.
And I remember just wanting to just,
you know,
have those conversations.
And again,
I was someone who was very curious because again,
grew up in a very religious household.
So that meant I was going to church every Sunday without bell.
(04:06):
And I just remember like a Sunday school teacher,
like she was an auntie of ours who our parents trusted and she put on a tape which was in my opinion very careless because this was um,
a tape of a woman who was saying how wrong it was to get an abortion.
She was a preacher.
And I just thought to myself,
(04:27):
like,
did you get permission from our parents to even share this tape?
Um,
and there are other ways you could go about teaching us about safe sex.
It shouldn't just be,
you shouldn't get an abortion.
Like there are so many steps before you have sex.
Like,
you know,
if you do,
if you are thinking about having sex,
you know,
I understand when it comes to Christianity or most religions anyway,
(04:50):
that you're not supposed to have sex before marriage.
But realistically,
I think there were so many ways they could have gone about it in terms of teaching us,
you know,
maybe,
I don't know the morning after pill,
teaching us about contraception.
If we ever do find ourselves in those positions,
I think that there were just so many precautions they could have taken.
And I thought again,
(05:10):
it was irresponsible for this woman to put on a tape for us.
And I just remember even though I never had a name for it,
I didn't know what being pro-choice was at the time.
I knew I was pro choice because I just remember feeling so rebellious and thinking,
no,
it's my body.
If I do not wanna bear someone's child,
I will not.
(05:30):
But again,
I never had those conversations growing up So again,
went home blogged about it.
It was probably one of my first blogs as well.
Oh,
wow.
You came with fire.
Yeah,
I did like,
I really dug deep and wanted to have those conversations and you know,
I it just really developed there.
I've always enjoyed talking about sex from an educational standpoint as well as the raunchy and pleasurable side.
(05:56):
So I would say that would definitely be part of my journey as to how I go into it.
Yeah,
I like the word that you use,
particularly in this instance that you describe in the church,
which is careless because I think oftentimes when people are in church or people,
authority figures are in church,
they don't really consider the trauma that this kind of conversation or proselytizing can have on a person because,
(06:21):
you know,
kids are having abortions.
I remember when I was in high school,
my cousin,
by the time we were 16,
had had three.
So I hope that,
you know,
when people listen back to this and hopefully it will make it into some religious circles is have some care,
you know,
when you're sharing these things.
So,
but yeah,
thank you for coming with the fire on that out the gate.
(06:41):
So,
you know,
you said you,
you like talking about um sex from an educational standpoint when you were doing,
you know,
your research in this work.
Did you ever see yourself as a,
a black woman?
A Nigerian woman reflected back in these conversations that you were having in the mainstream,
in the mainstream.
No.
Um I mean,
I'm someone who loves,
(07:03):
I mean,
for example,
Cosmopolitan to me is like the Bible of sex magazines.
And um I never really saw my experiences in there.
I didn't think I could relate because I mean,
it's a white magazine designed for women and um I never really saw myself and of course,
we understand that representation matters.
But I found that I had to look across the sea,
(07:25):
like,
you know,
I would have to read articles from black women in America who were talking about sexuality.
And that's how I kind of saw myself.
Um I mean,
it doesn't mean I didn't really learn anything from the white media that I picked up.
I mean,
if we're talking about sex in the city,
for example,
like those were things I did,
(07:46):
I could still,
there was a bit of relatability in terms of,
you know,
talking to your friends about your boyfriends or your sexual experiences.
But I didn't see a black woman talking about culture.
And I feel like our upbringing is slightly,
there's some similarities,
but I feel like ultimately,
it's different when it comes to a Nigerian woman,
a Nigerian British experience will never be the same as a white woman.
(08:11):
So I guess in a sense,
I was very lucky to have my friends with me and that was all I needed the conversations that I had with my friends,
their experiences.
I mean,
I was like the second person in my friendship group to lose my virginity.
And I remember my friend just asking me like,
did you leave the lights on or did,
did it?
Like,
I still remember it like it was yesterday.
(08:33):
Um But yeah.
Um I,
I don't think to answer your question.
Yeah.
I don't really feel like I ever saw myself in mainstream media when it came to sexuality.
But I think things are changing now.
I think things are,
are getting better.
I do,
I agree.
I think it's a lot more inclusive and I think that it's due to the work that,
you know,
people like you have done,
I'm gonna shout myself out here like myself and Nana have done.
(08:55):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um But I do want to talk about your book for a bit.
So,
you know,
like I said,
you've been a sex expert for over a decade.
You've been writing about this.
And so you're an author,
Nana has just written this book,
The Sex Lives Of African Women.
I've written books on romance.
Can you talk about what it was like to transition from blogging to writing?
(09:18):
Because we're seeing a lot more,
I'm gonna,
you know,
Nigerian women are just taking over like,
I don't know what it is.
You are like if we talk about African writers,
we're talking about Nigerian women.
Yeah.
What was it like making that transition.
Um For me,
it was very difficult because I feel like when I'm blogging,
I think it's the same when I'm mini blogging,
(09:38):
like when I'm tweeting as well,
you know,
I'm showcasing my personality and I'm just talking and I'm sharing my,
my opinions,
even if they come across a bit silly to some people.
Like I have this,
I like to try and push this agenda that I don't believe that women should ride when they're having sex because of the orgasm gap.
I'm just like,
(09:58):
no men need to put more of the work in not women.
Right.
Yeah,
exactly.
Like we need to close the orgasm gap like,
you know,
but that's just me being a bit silly.
It's,
it's become part of my brand now to tell women to stop writing,
but I'm not actually being serious and that's the thing.
I think that a lot of my blogging or my tweeting are very tongue and cheek.
(10:20):
I don't really consider myself a very serious person.
Like I find everything humorous.
However,
I had to handle things with so much care when writing my book.
Of course,
like when you're writing a book and you're stating studies and research,
you have to cite it extremely well and your editors will not let you approve any opinion or research or study if you don't have some sort of proof to back it up with.
(10:46):
So it was it and it took a lot of research,
but I was,
I,
I was educating myself along the way and I was on learning things along the way,
which I really,
really enjoyed.
What did you discover,
um,
when writing this book that you didn't know about yourself or just even information,
I think the whole process was life changing.
(11:09):
But I would definitely say there were facts within the book that I had to take out because they weren't facts.
You know,
a funny one for me was one that a lot of sex educators use,
which is,
oh my gosh,
the clitoris has 8000 nerve endings,
which actually isn't true.
You're joking.
Yeah.
No,
it's not true.
It's not true at all.
(11:29):
And I remember when I was writing this and my editor was just like,
you know,
you have to actually find the study for this.
And I think I was so confident because again,
this was something that was that it said so much in the sex fair that we push it and we all believe it.
And you know,
um when we're having more conversations about the vulva,
these are conversations or narratives you probably do want to push.
(11:52):
But there's no truth to it.
Like I think was done on a cow.
So it would be incorrect for me to have included that.
And um even when I listen to other sex educators still say it,
I'm just like,
uh well,
actually that's actually,
yeah,
be like actually,
that's not true.
So,
I've seen it a lot less now.
I do not see it anymore.
(12:14):
I have to say it,
but it was definitely a study or um a false fact that people really did push and maybe even the clitoris does have double the nerve endings as the male penis.
But it's not 8000.
Yeah.
It probably,
it might,
I don't think it's 8000.
I don't know if it's 8000,
but I don't know.
(12:35):
And,
and I get it,
you know,
we were trying to highlight how important the clitoris is.
Yeah,
how amazing the is and how sensitive it is and,
and you know what happens when blood rushes to it.
But um yeah,
I had to remove that because there isn't any physical evidence.
And you know,
that's just,
that's just female sexuality for you or when it comes to female anatomy,
(12:55):
how much studies is,
is really done on,
on our,
on our body,
not that much,
you know,
I mean,
they're comparing us to a cow.
I mean,
they have nothing to do with,
you know,
a bovine sexual experience obviously,
you know.
Um but that just shows you,
I think it also shows uh in a way how I don't wanna say the word desperate but how keen that we are for,
(13:21):
for us to have to find these amazing studies around our bodies because there's just not that much,
there really isn't that much.
And I think just for a very long time.
There's been little effort when it comes to female sexuality as a whole.
So yeah,
100%.
I have to say this information for me is life changing and it's very freeing because like sometimes you're in a situation and there's so much attention being given to your clits and it's like it has 8000 nerve endings.
(13:48):
Why is it exploding?
Why is it taking 15 minutes to arrive longer for lots of women?
Yeah.
Yeah.
No.
So for me,
this is life changing.
So thank you for sharing that.
I will definitely be delving deeper into the book to learn more.
Yeah.
So as women who write about sex,
you know,
none.
And I have noticed that um men have certain expectations when it comes to being in a relationship with somebody who writes about sex,
(14:16):
they either want to know.
Are you going to write about this or,
you know,
either with anticipation or fear?
I know that you're in a committed relationship now.
But did you have any experience with that prior or even currently with your,
your current partner?
Oh,
my current planet is so easy going.
Like he's just so comfortable.
Um I think my last relationship in the beginning,
(14:39):
he wasn't too comfortable with me talking about sex.
But I think that was kind of a representation of just how society was and how a lot of men would have probably felt.
But with time,
I think when he saw what I was doing and how much it meant to a lot of women he loosened up.
But other guys that I've been with or had,
(15:00):
you know,
casual hookups with,
oh,
I definitely feel like they enjoyed the fact that I had a podcast that was about sex because they wanted to be a hot topic.
Right?
And it also gives them the confidence to be better pleasers because I,
I don't think they wanted me to basically bastardize their,
their,
their performance in and on my podcast.
(15:21):
So,
um yeah,
so they always stepped up to the challenge and I can't really remember the last time I've like had a terrible sexual experience and I think that's because of what I do.
But my fiance now,
no,
he's always,
he's been very supportive.
He loves what I do and you know,
he sees he,
yeah,
he's,
(15:42):
he's always in the background,
like just watching me and cheering me on.
So yeah,
I love him for that.
I think that it's really amazing that you guys are able to go on this journey together because sometimes,
you know,
when you get to a level of achievement,
like you've got and then a man comes in,
um it can be difficult for them to adjust.
And so for him to be so supportive in the beginning,
(16:02):
I think is absolutely incredible for the two of you um has being engaged,
had any sort of influence on on your,
and I hope it's ok to ask this on your romantic relationship or your sexual experience.
And the reason I ask is because I had so many friends,
like,
when I was in my twenties and they were like,
(16:22):
yeah,
we've lived together for 10 years,
but as soon as we got married,
everything in the bedroom just got better.
I'm like,
how?
Oh,
ok.
I thought you were gonna say it stopped because I know there's always this idea that like married people don't have sex and I'm just like,
not me,
I have a high libido.
I need to get mine.
True.
And,
(16:42):
you know,
I,
I guess it's also still the idea that marriage is when you're allowed to have sex.
So people just get even freier and like,
ok,
we're married so we could do everything at this.
We could do all the things.
Yeah.
But I've never really restricted myself if I like you,
if I'm comfortable and you make me feel good.
And I know this is something that's worthwhile.
Like I'm going to give you,
(17:03):
you know,
the best version of myself sexually and romantically.
Yeah.
Have you ever written about what it takes as a woman to become comfortable?
Um,
so that you can have the best sex.
What kind of tips would you give somebody who,
you know,
is feeling that level of discomfort but still wants to share their body with somebody.
I would say the first thing you need to do is to get comfortable with self.
(17:27):
I think it's so important to be comfortable with yourself before you're comfortable with someone else in the room.
You need to understand what pleasure looks like on your own.
And you know,
growing up,
that was something that I did a lot.
Like I remember the first time I masturbated,
I was probably like 13 and I remember when I discovered this big,
(17:49):
oh I said,
oh my God,
I am never going back to what it was.
Just this beautiful euphoric feeling that I had unlocked.
And I didn't know what was going on.
All I knew is that I had these fanny flutters and I needed to just,
you know,
flick my bean.
But I've been comfortable with my sexuality from a very long time.
(18:12):
And I think that everyone's sexual journey is different because I still speak to women who tell me that they've never received an orgasm or that they've never really played with themselves or that their partner doesn't really consider their body.
And I think that when you know what pleasure looks like on your own,
you can take back to the bedroom,
you can direct your partner,
(18:33):
you feel more comfortable and confident in your sexuality,
you know how to guide them,
you know what to tell them.
And um it really does help.
So I would say that would be my top tip is to really,
really understand your,
your body and understand what it is that you enjoy so you can then teach your partner.
(18:56):
Um And I would also say learning to find your voice because I think a lot of us give our sexual partners,
um,
a pass to just try and I guess,
read our minds and figure out themselves what it is that they like.
But I really do encourage women,
especially women who are in relationships to find their voice because we are the ones who are struggling when it comes to the orgasm gap,
(19:24):
right?
And I've always said like,
I think it's because we believe or society has told us that sex is something that's done to us.
It's not something that we're supposed to be a part of or something that we use to gift men with.
And that's just simply not really true.
And I would definitely encourage women to try and yeah,
find their voices and we're told to be a bit more submissive when it comes to our voices,
(19:48):
which we then bring that same attitude to the bedroom.
And we don't say,
hey,
I would love if you could,
you know,
go down on me or I would like if you could touch me like this or don't stop,
I'm enjoying this.
Keep doing that.
No,
I don't really like this,
you know,
and as well as the orgasm gap,
there's also the all sex gap,
you know,
studies tell us that um men are,
(20:09):
men are more unlikely to go down on women in the bedroom in comparison to women.
And that's just awful and it's because we're not speaking up or we're returning to these guys who believe that it's ok to give us halfhearted sex.
So you need to,
even if you want to be submissive in the bedroom,
I feel like it's important to tap into being a Dom and a dom,
(20:31):
meaning that you need to be comfortable exerting your power in your voice and saying this is how I enjoy being pleasured.
And if you don't pleasure me this way,
I'm not returning back here again,
tap into that,
into that energy,
that energy that you know,
and,
and talk to him with it and say,
(20:52):
nah,
this is what I really enjoy and you don't have to do it in a dismissive way or like,
oh,
you're really crap.
You can do it in a loving way.
There is,
you know,
that you can do it in a way where no firm.
Yes.
But you know,
you,
you talked about the Big O and when you discovered it and that's also the title of your book.
We've talked about,
(21:13):
you know,
themes of,
of religion and,
you know,
spirituality and different people's beliefs can affect their approaches to sex.
And you've got something in the book called Elonis 12 Commandments.
How did you come up with that list?
And what is one key commandment from that list?
I think one key commandment is definitely love who you want to love.
And that's because I,
(21:34):
I think that there's just so much emphasis that's put on our sexuality to either be straight or gay or bi.
And,
um,
people don't understand what being sexually fluid means.
I mean,
I still get women who will send me a dilemma.
I had one recently,
um,
we discussed it on my podcast and she said,
(21:54):
um,
dear or no,
you know,
my boyfriend and I were,
were drunk and we were talking and he admitted that he'd love me to take him.
Does this mean that he's gay?
And I'm just just gay.
So me and my husband were just like,
no,
it means that your boyfriend's a freak,
you know,
get that in.
And um I just think that we just put too much emphasis on our sexuality and we put too much emphasis on labels and titles when we should just enjoy what we wanna enjoy,
(22:22):
experiment how we want to experiment and understand that it doesn't really define us.
You know,
society is so accepting of lesbians.
But let a man say that he enjoys a shower twice a day.
It means he's gay,
right?
Do you know?
Yeah.
Yeah.
We like,
we look for any excuse to try and emasculate a man just because he might do something that we dem out of the ordinary.
(22:47):
But um I really did come up the rest of the 12 Commandments as I was writing the book,
I think one that also stuck out to me as well was um not allowing your happiness to rely on a man.
I have a section in there which is about relationships and heartbreak.
And I feel like a lot of the young women who inspired me to stop blogging properly and put a lot of effort into my work.
(23:12):
I saw something that was a reoccurring theme when they would send me their dilemmas,
which was them not wanting to leave a situation that they'd been in for so long.
Um Them not wanting to leave a situation because they lost their virginity to him.
And it was just this repeated thing.
And I noticed and this is another thing I noticed in our culture,
(23:34):
a lot of African black women have been raised to be someone else's wife.
We have not been raised to be our own individuals.
And,
and honestly,
it's just,
I,
I notice it with everything that we do.
I noticed it when I was at university.
Um You know,
our parents assuming that we were gonna find the love of our lives as soon as we diversity.
(23:57):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it was just like mom,
it's not the same anymore.
Like,
you know,
society and university has really changed like guys will fuck you and feed you and say that that's it and that,
you know,
that's it.
And to my mom,
she would assume,
no,
that's your boyfriend.
I'm like No,
he's a heartbreaker.
This is your budding husband.
Exactly.
(24:18):
Uh He fed you,
he sexualized you.
That's your husband.
That's your,
my husband,
that's your boyfriend.
You know,
cause she just immediately thinks if you're having sex with that person,
then that's the love of your life and it's a relationship now it's a relationship.
It's like you don't even understand.
We are so scared of commitment in the Black British culture like we are,
(24:40):
we are,
I like to say we are the kings of situations because there are so many levels that we take before we actually,
you know,
become very serious about commitment.
But um yeah,
no,
when it,
when it comes to writing the commandments,
um I really,
really wanted women to understand that,
(25:01):
you know,
sex and being in a relationship is not enough to continue in a bad situation,
especially if it,
if it does nothing for you,
if it doesn't serve you,
like,
please leave.
Mm 100%.
Yeah.
So as a final question,
um this is a question we are asking all of our guests this season.
(25:24):
Can you share with us a sexy secret and you can interpret that any way you want?
Yes.
OK.
My sexy secret.
I think my sexy secret would definitely have to be recording the audio of sex.
I love to record the audio,
if not the visual,
I love to record the audio.
(25:45):
Um I'm a big believer in looking for different ways to enjoy self pleasure,
you know,
porn,
especially ethical porn is great,
but it's important to find different ways to tap in to your fantasies.
And I think just by recording the audio when you and your partner or whoever are having sex,
um,
(26:05):
this is something you can go back to and listen to later on your own.
Um,
and it's,
I don't even know how I started doing it.
I just remembered that one day.
I just wanted to record the audio and um I do it quite often.
It's something that I used to like,
stimulate myself with.
It's something that I like to try and remember like,
(26:25):
you know,
what were we doing?
I wonder what we were doing,
creeps in the bed,
the noises that I'm making,
what he's whispering in my air and it just takes you back.
I have flashbacks like,
oh my God,
that was amazing.
So,
yeah,
getting hot beneath the collar.
Loni This has been so much fun.
Thank you so,
(26:46):
so much.
Oh,
thank you so much.
Appreciate it.
I'm excited for the rest of the season.
We are off to a fantastic start.
Are you excited?
It's going to be a fire season.
We have so many big names who agreed to be on the podcast.
(27:06):
Y'all like us.
We like that.
You like us.
Thank you for the love.
Keep tuning in new episode next week.
Just stay tuned.
We'll see you next week.
Give us a review.
Five stars.
Yes,
five stars.
We deserve all the stars.
Show us some love the adventures from the Bedrooms of African Women podcast is hosted by Malike Grant and Nana Damas AKI Ceo is an executive producer alongside the hosts,
(27:52):
Freddie Boswell is a senior producer.
Audio edit are Mercy Bono and alongside production support from Mercy Gua and Lucas.
The Adventures From The Bedrooms of African Women Podcast is a production of A Q studios in partnership with media.
Follow us on all our socials at A Q studios podcasts.
(28:13):
Our theme music is Dam by Boss Find Adventures From the Bedrooms of African Women.
Anywhere you get your podcast and in the pursuit of all things,
sex,
sexuality and pleasure.
Follow us on all our social media platforms at adventures from thank you for listening them li the it.
(28:39):
God damn,
she's so nice.
Is it?
God damn.
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