#26 Mr. Master | Attractive women, rapping, big questions - Bang Two Three Podcast

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Hey beautiful people and thank youfor listening to the Bang 2 3
podcast. If you find this funny,entertaining, or insightful, feel
free to leave us a review on Applepodcast or if you want to make my day,
go show us some love on our Instagrampage because I love each and every
single one of you. Thank you forlistening. Uh, yeah, I was talking

(00:22):
to this chick from Ireland and shewas telling me that over there, they
don't like accept bullying and soI'm like, what do you mean you don't
accept bullying? And this is whatthey mean. So like, let's say I would
make fun of you, right? I would say,hey, orange coat, you look stupid.

(00:44):
And then, oh yeah, shut up orangecoat. You're so dumb looking. I
can't believe you're who would wearorange coat dummy. And what she said
is people would step in and they say,hey, why do you keep talking him like
that? Maybe he just wants to wear anorange coat today. Why don't you
shut up Chris? I'm Chris, right? AndI'm like, whoa, I didn't know this
type of healthy young personecosystem existed in the entire

(01:07):
world. Yeah, I mean, there's activeintervention in a situation like
that and there's this passivetranscendence of that modality. I
didn't know what you mean. And I'vebeen around people like that and I
was never really that kind of ajoker, I guess. And I feel like I was

(01:32):
always even in middle school andstuff. So out there with my approach
to things that it kind of just, Idon't want to say I'm rubber in your
glue. Like the glue is out of theequation, but it just kind of
bounced right off of me because I waslike, I didn't know anything else.
It's like, I definitely wouldn'tlike respond in that same roasty
kind of way. That's not really myhumor. So there's being like, hey,

(01:55):
come on, be nice. And then there'sjust speaking a whole other
language, which I kind of feel like Ihad from early and I hope that
reflects the music. Yeah, okay. Soactually, I think I know what you're
talking about. And these are thekids in school who it was impossible
to make fun of because you're right.So for example, I would say, hey,
Gabriel, shut up orange jacket. Andthen at least the kids that I

(02:20):
witnessed who deployed this tacticextremely successfully, by the
way, this tactic is extremelysuccessful. If you're getting
bullied at school, you need tolisten to this or you need to know
this. I would say, hey, shut uporange jacket. And they would say
something like, yeah, little didyou know, but orange was actually
the most prominent color worn inRome. And it signified that you were

(02:42):
the richest and the highest class inthe entire nation. Do you not read
history? And then oh, shit. Theywould they would just say something
like that to disarm the wholesituation because you're right. If
you responded like this roasty way,it's like, oh, I got an orange
jacket. Well, look at you with yourred shirt on. What are you bleeding
dummy? Then it's now you've engagedin the verbal spar and it's a fight

(03:08):
till death. And I'm not that type offighter, you know, and even so,
like, because people knew that Iwrapped from early. So even back
then, like I started wrapping inmiddle school in like eighth grade
about. So I became pretty known asthe kid who wrapped early on. And
it's like, oh, hey, wrapping kid islike, that's the thing you're going

(03:29):
to diss me about. Like how often doyou get to use that? You know, it's
like dissing me like that is justsaying the truth and it's Loki flex.
It's like definitely like, oh, youthink you can wrap like how are you
going to make up fun to me for that?You know what I'm saying? How how
many kids wrapped in your school?Almost none. I mean, the only other

(03:53):
person is the person I shout out allthe time. And I've told the story of
her in a different podcast. But I saythe name Funkhouser a lot in my
music. And that's the name of afriend that I had in high school who
was an artist to she didn't rap, butshe did spoken word. And I did that,
too. And long story short, soonafter I graduated high school, I

(04:16):
found out that she passed away. Andwith artists, it's always, I'm not
too sure. But I mean, it was she was ayear younger than me. It was like it
wasn't like a we were the same age.She was younger and I left. I left San
Diego where I'm from to go to collegein Northridge and I found out there.
Fun fact, I had a performance thatsame day and I dedicated it to her.

(04:40):
Wow, holy shit. But yeah, soartists, you know, like, oh, we
should collab type thing,especially when you're younger,
it's like, oh, we should work onsomething totally. And that never
happened. And in my mind, it's justshe kind of stays there as the person
that. The closest person to like whodid artistic stuff at all in high

(05:03):
school. So the otherwise I hadnobody to relate to even people who
like listen to rap music. Nobody waslistening to rap music, let alone
making it except her. So she's theclosest one. And I value her and
remember her for that. And that'swhy I shot her out to the state. Yeah,
that's so interesting for peoplewho don't know. A fun fact, I lived in

(05:24):
San Diego for two years. Actually,yeah, I went to visit a couple of
months ago, actually. My favoriteplace on earth for people who've
never been to Southern California.I'm not from Southern California,
but I did live there for a couple ofyears. I left right when covid
started. Southern California hasthe most beautiful women in the

(05:45):
entire world. And this is myopinion. OK, it's just mine. And
it's not so much that, oh, you'regoing to find a tin in Southern
California. But in Illinois, youcan only find a nine. No, there's
tens everywhere. Tins absolutelyeverywhere. You could go walking to
your supermarket in Springfield,Illinois, or in the middle of the
cornfield, you'll find a tin. Imean, a fucking tin, like a tin. But

(06:10):
the tins per capita in SouthernCalifornia is fucking insane. Like
it's not even fair. And not only arethey tins, but they're something
like with the with the fashion gamedown there, they're up on all of it. I
remember whenever I was moving in tomy apartment in San Diego, downtown
San Diego, I see this girl who waslike carrying something and she had

(06:34):
on like not only like like bootyshorts, they were like the spandex
material. But she had a seam in hereyes, crack that like went into the
crack, probably an inch or two, andshe had little ruffles on the
cheeks. That was the first time I'veever seen these style of shorts. And
holy shit, there's just so many jawdropping, literally can be a model.

(06:55):
Women everywhere. They're workingat Whole Foods. They're working at
the coffee shop. They're working atbingo. Shit, they may even be
changing your oil. Like it isfucking insane. And they're all
stunning. So Gabriel, how did youkeep your dick in your pants living
down there? How was it possible?Look, man. So, um, bit of a

(07:19):
precautionary statement before Isay anything in regards to this. Um,
so I just graduated from San DiegoState University. Whoop, whoop.
Thank you. I am trying to get hired atSan Diego State University full
time, which is its own story toexplain why. Um, I have a lot of

(07:40):
involvements that I started thispast year and it actually plays a
role in the music as well. So I want tobe very careful about the
experiences I've had. Notice howcarefully I'm choosing my words.
The experiences I have had withcollege age women in San Diego. It's

(08:02):
just your experience. It's justyour personal experience. This is
not a projection. This is not adeclaration of anything. This is
just you. Right. Let me see. Thething about being around
attractive young women prettyoften is that you get to know them a

(08:25):
little bit for who they are. I'm notsaying all my best friends are women
like that. I'm just saying that ifyou don't see hot girls super often,
a hot girl pops up and you're like,well, and it completely just throws
you off. The thing about seeing hotgirls like that all the time and
actually getting to know some isthat it wears off and you just start

(08:51):
to see them for the people they are,the my personal approach to things.
So nothing keeps your dick in yourpants more reliably than actually
getting to know a person and beingfascinated about the person they
actually are beyond any sort ofsexual satisfaction they could

(09:11):
provide you. Holy shit. Okay. Thisis brilliant. Oh, my goodness.
Gabriel, you, your rapper, yourvery intelligent, your college
graduate and your professional tapdancer, the way you just tap dance
around that so beautifully. Oh mygosh. That was great, dude. And

(09:35):
great insight, by the way. And Idon't at the same time want to dance
around it because I agree with you. Idon't want to act like I don't agree
with you. It's just there's so muchmore to it. And that's honestly the
angle that I take to so many things inlife where you're right and like,

(10:01):
yeah, it's not like after you get toknow someone like it. Hmm. I don't
want to act like that's somethinglike a kind of thinking that I've
just transcended and I just don'tthink in those terms anymore. And
I'll step in even the more like diceyor territory in that I don't think

(10:23):
it's going to go away if I stickaround at the university, which the
plan for me is to actually stickaround at the university for a long,
long time. So a little bit more on itthen. I got super involved,
particularly this past year at myuniversity. And after a long time of
not knowing what I was going to doprofessionally in the future, I'm

(10:44):
26. So it took me eight years tograduate college. That's its own
story. I found a community that wasthe university and I plan on staying
there for a long time after having noreal other options to consider.
There are people, staff members whoI met at the university this past

(11:05):
year who have been working there for10, 15, 20 years. And I was like, that
sounds, that's got a nice ring to it.It would be cool to be able to say
something like that decade or twofrom now. So the long term vision for
me after graduating is actually tostick around at that university.
I'm going to be completely honestwith you right now and say part of the
reason why of the many, many, manyreasons why I want to stick around

(11:29):
there is because of that. Not like inlike a purely looks kind of way. And
I'm speaking to like my unconsciousunconscious, conscious list, not
thinking with my moral conscience,pure animal, visceral type of

(11:51):
thing. I'm just kind of calling thatout as a thing that I don't think I can
avoid. Like if I had the option tostick around at a place where women
like that were there all the time,sure. Yeah. I say that kind of like,
duh, because I up here in my braindon't really want that like that.
There's so many other things that Iwant, but that's included in there
too. And I don't want to deny thattoo. I feel like if we're talking

(12:14):
about sex and stuff, it can get superlike we're only talking about sex
and then there's just, oh, it's sodepraved to talk about sex. You need
to think about things like super,super morally and mentally and
consciously. And I want to try andspeak to both. I feel like there's a

(12:35):
line of dots you could connect in themusic that could speak to that too.
But yeah, it's a complex thing. And Iguess just it's my understanding of
sex is not very sexy. If you canalready tell. No, listen, and by the
way, you're right. You didn't fallfrom my false dichotomy, which is

(12:58):
right. So I was like, is your dick inyour pants or is it out all the time?
Right? You was like, no, it's not a toanswer question. But you're right.
Okay. And this is great too. And Ithink a lot of people could benefit
from that because from what you'resaying, it's like, Hey, yeah, I was
around so many beautiful women sodamn often that I actually got to

(13:20):
know them and realize that, Hey,they're just like everybody else.
And this is a powerful thing that Ithink makes you unique because as a
man who enjoys women sexually,whenever you see a stunning woman,
it's hard to not make sex the firstthought. That is hard. It's just

(13:46):
like whenever I see Burger King,it's hard not to go in and eat fucking
all of it, but I know I shouldn't doit. I should not do it. So I think it
speaks to you as a person to say, Yes,right? We all know what we're
thinking, right? As guys in, youknow, essentially swimsuit models
walking. But to take that time tosay, Hey, you should get to know

(14:08):
them. They're cool. Because one,right? It's obviously it's not the
first urge. Just like saying, Hey,have you ever read the ingredients
on that burger? Instead of eatingit? It's not your first urge. And
then two, I think it speaks to it aswell because people are scared to
talk to these girls, bro. Likeeverybody is terrified to

(14:29):
approach. these stunning women,what's been like your experiences
like? Were you intimidated atfirst? I mean, it helps to be in a
situation where you just end up, I'mtrying to think of a better word than
forced, because- Like you're in agroup project together. Yes,

(14:50):
exactly, exactly. And she just sohappens to be in your group,
something like that. It's not likeI'm walking up to girls like that.
It's like, one person who comes tomind, right, I'll tell you like a
specific story of someone. Cause Ifeel like this changes way more for
me. Like I can be all, oh, I read a lotabout this and listen to these
podcasts about sex and had a supermental understanding of it all. And

(15:12):
that's how I got to the conclusionsthat I'm at right now. Or I could tell
you the story of this person who I metwho easily, like easily is like one
of the most attractive women that Iever met in my life. I was like
sheesh. And like I ended up with herin a group project in class. So we're
talking and yeah, like I'm shook.And a few months into the year, I

(15:40):
wanna say it was this past fall.Yeah, everything kind of blends in
together. It was super recently. Afew weeks into the class, class
ends, and I end up talking to her,like we're walking in the same
direction away from class, likeshe's walking home and stuff. And so
we're walking in the samedirection. I just like talk to her
and it's raining and we're justchatting and then we split up. She

(16:07):
goes her way, I go my way. And withouteven thinking about it, right? It
was so weird. Like to this day, likeI've reflected on it now it was such a
weird moment within me because oneof the first thoughts, like pretty
much the first thought that I hadafter that interaction of us
actually talking, could be afterfinding out that she was in a
relationship already and all,there's that. To feel suddenly the

(16:31):
first thing after be like, I reallywanna be her friend. That's it. Like
I can't even wrap my mind around,like I said, one of the most like
attractive women I've ever seen.And just after talking to her, it's
like, that doesn't even, likethat's not what I think of when I
think of her and I think of her now andI saw her like a few times, maybe just
one time actually after that class.And I look at her and it's like she's

(16:53):
hot. And that's the feeling I havewhen I see her. It's like, I wish I got
to know her better. Just likeliterally just as a friend, not even
like, oh, let me like get at her likein any sort of way beyond, hey, I just
wanna talk to you. I like talking toyou. That's it. That's literally
it. So I feel, and you know, at thesame time, like you say, like it's
not a matter of, I feel like peoplemay think it's like those feelings

(17:16):
of sex, like you're around likesomeone who's hot and you just think
about sex all the time. I feel like itcan be like, you try and stop
thinking about those thoughts. Forme, it was at a point, like I said,
like it just happened so often thatit's like, that's gonna happen no
matter what. And like, I might evenslip up and like, say something out
of pocket. Once again, careful withmy words. I'll say this too. And I

(17:40):
hope this reflects in the lyrics,like as much detail as I put in the
lyrics of my stuff. I'm soparticularly with words and have
been for years and years now. Thatincludes words as I'm speaking.
Like in life, I'm being carefulabout the words that I say. Fun game
for the listener to play. Let's seehow often I could use a word that has a

(18:02):
sexual double meaning and I try tosidestep it. Like dangerous
territory. Yeah. And so I say that tosay that I'll catch myself slipping
in that sense too. And I'm like,okay, that's fine. You know. Yeah.
That's just what happens whenyou're in that kind of environment
with people who are younger than me.And I'll just gesture briefly in the

(18:27):
direction of the age gap that existstoo. Me being at least four years
older than pretty much every personin my classes. That not being too
obvious. Like there areimplications there that would be
very gratifying to oneevolutionarily rooted, a moral

(18:50):
side of me. Yeah. That is unerasableand ever present that I don't wanna
try and deny. So I just try and go inany situation and tell the truth.
And part of the truth is that my bodywants to have sex with you. I don't up
here. It's like, but everythingelse in the like a kind of way like

(19:16):
that. And that's gonna come acrossanyway. So my idea of things is to
generate ideas to exist alongsidethat truth, to find other truths,
listen for other truths in the otherperson. That's another thing too. I
mean, objectification is real.Like one real way to, another real

(19:37):
way to kind of sidestep it in thatentire thing is like, hear her out.
Like listen to what she has to say.She has a whole story too, right? You
know, she has a life and feelings andthoughts and pains and highlights.
I just like, it's funny like being ina situation like this where I'm the
one talking, cause I usually flip itlike in life. I'm the person who's

(19:58):
asking the questions. So again,it's like, there's something
satisfying about seeing somebodyexcited and take excited in
whatever direction you want,right? Like there's a sexual
excitement. I'm kind of just likefreestyling here. There's a sexual
excitement. And then there's likethe excitement of being in the space

(20:22):
of someone who genuinely issincerely curious about
everything that you have to say.That's where I'm at. So I don't even
have to try to not think about sex ifI'm listening to this woman and tell
her story and I am enthralled by it.I'm just at the edge of my seat being
like, wait, so what about this andthis and this? Yeah, like this is

(20:45):
something I never forget to talkabout. So like, and I have a lot of
talk on this, so thank you. No, no,real quick, I'm gonna let you go.
Would you be on the edge of your seatif she looked like she just got beat
by an ugly stick and she wasn'tpretty? Are you kidding me? Don't
lie, don't you lie Gabriel. I'm notsaying you're lying. I don't know
you- How fast I answered that. Bro,like- You did fast, it was. Like, it
was fast. Humanity is fascinatingto me. And that's the great

(21:07):
equalizer, right? It's just onething that the hottest girl in the
world and the ugliest dude in theworld haven't come with me is that I
don't know anything about them orhow they think or why they do what
they do or why they feel life is athing that's worth living.
Everybody has their take on that andthat's fascinating to me at the

(21:30):
core. And then it's just likeeverything else stems off that.
Like, and also I guess I'll say too,besides the innate curiosity and
the satisfaction of learningsomething that I didn't know
existed before, part of it is alsothe skill of listening and how much
fun I have just with that. And I don'talmost, I hesitate to say game kind

(21:53):
of level because that kind of hasimplications, but it is a kind of, so
in quarantine, right? Somethingthat I was up to in quarantine was I
connected with a lot of people wholistened to my music or still do I
guess, or I don't know, but like atthe time they listened to my music, I
went on Instagram and I was like,hey, I'm bored and lonely. Does

(22:14):
anybody want to just talk? Andpeople did respond. I was lucky
enough to have enough of a followingthanks to the music to get, I want to
say 30 or so people to just chat. Andso through quarantine,
semi-regularly, I want to sayaveraging out to about every three,

(22:35):
four or five days, I would have a talkwith someone who listened to my
music and it would be like at leastthree hours long, probably like
four, five, maybe even six hourslong. That's what I was up to during
quarantine. I remember telling afriend of mine early on in person,
like, hey, I'm having all theseconversations with people. I feel

(22:56):
like I'm getting so much better attalking to people and listening to
people and interacting with peoplesocially. And he was like, cool. But
a lot of people probably got wayworse at that. Like, good for you.
And I was like, all right, yeah, lowkey. I was lucky enough to have that
opportunity to practice a lot ofthings in situations like this,
like one-on-one conversations,which I just love and seek out now.

(23:18):
Like I feel kind of awkward and not asequipped in group conversations,
so I'm kind of quiet. But if it'sone-on-one, like I'll just, I
really like that kind of dynamic.And one part of it is, especially
across time too, acrossconversations, because there's
something satisfying about seeingthe satisfaction in someone else

(23:41):
when you bring up something that youlistened to before and remembered
and they thought that you would haveforgotten something like that.
That's like so satisfying to me. AndI feel like it's something as simple
in theory as listening closely,being fascinated, very easy on my

(24:02):
end, right? It's just be verycurious and fascinated by this
person. There's like having a goodmemory and seeing everything as
memorable. And so I forget what thequestion was, but. We talked about
girls. I thought you made a reallygood point about the pretty girls
earlier that stuck with me, whichis, I think you were saying that,

(24:25):
hey, even though these girls arestunning or whatever, that, hey,
they have stuff to say as well. Andthey deserve to be heard. And they
deserve small talk, just like theugly girls who are more
approachable, whatever, moreapproachable girls, who may be
ugly, but. Right. Go ahead, goahead. Yeah, I wanna say very

(24:46):
quickly to that. Like, I've noticedvery recently, very, very
recently, like yesterday, likejust a few days ago. So just to like
say, I guess, like that getsflipped. So like one thing that I
more guess than know throughactually talking to people is that

(25:11):
it can get, I wanna say alienating. Idon't know if that's an appropriate
word, but there's a, let me say this,a real realization, low key, it's
dramatic to say epiphany, but a bitof a realization that I had was in
thinking more about sex andattractiveness and all those

(25:34):
things, I was like, okay, so thismight require some, a little
backstory. Let me see if I can keepthis thread connected. So once
again, returning to my time atuniversity, I was very involved. So
I was able to only need to take twoclasses in the fall and two classes

(25:57):
in the spring. So I could bepart-time, which was not very much
time. And I was a business major. Sothe classes that I had weren't very
demanding academically. So Irealized that I could spend the
whole year, this past year, mainlydoing extracurricular
activities. So I joined like over 20clubs, volunteered at so many

(26:19):
different events, the university,just went to so many things. And I
felt like I built up this kind ofreputation as being the person who
knows everyone and is in everythingand does everything and just is
everywhere, which was cool. Thatwasn't the aim or anything. It was
just, I'm saying like this innatecuriosity of just I like meeting

(26:42):
people, anybody at all, especiallypeople who would not like me. And it
eventually got out, I guess, that Imake music too. So, and so this kind
of goes back to what I was sayingearlier too, where I was like always
kind of sticking out, always,because I was the rapper kid earlier
and I had nobody to relate to there,except for Funko. And that carried

(27:05):
it over into college. I went toNorthridge after that and I rapped.
And I met other people who rapped,and nobody rapped like me, like
wordly. It was nice to have thatkinship of like we make music, but
still nobody writes the wordy kindof stuff that I do and definitely not
to the degree that I write it. So justthis further and further

(27:25):
distancing up till now, wherethere's so many things to stick out
about me at university, like thefact that I am older. Some people
know that, some people don't. Imight give off a vibe of like off the
way that I talk, my voice, the waythat I dress, the fact that it's all
very bright color type sticky outystuff, the fact that I am older and am

(27:46):
able to provide different kinds ofinputs than somebody who's like 19.
It's like, if we're in a meetingtrying to discuss how to approach
something, like an 18 year oldfreshman is gonna say something and
then a 26 year old guy is gonnaprovide a different perspective
that's kind of different,especially the way that I approach
things. There are so many differentreasons. I've rapped and then like
I'm in everything, like on top ofeverything, it's like, I feel like,

(28:10):
I felt like if I were ever in a roomanywhere with people, like people
knew who I was. And I felt there was apotential for a kind of
gravitational attention shifttowards me is what I felt. Like this
feeling of like always, like in anyroom, especially if it's like a

(28:32):
smaller room to feel a kind of, ohGod, like he's in the room, the guy
who's in everything is in the room.Feeling this kind of attention
shift to me. And I remember havingthis moment of realization, I was
like, oh my God, I wonder if this iswhat it feels like to be a hot girl. To
feel like, bro, like everybody'slooking at me all the time. Like I

(28:54):
kind of need to be like careful.Like, and once I realized just the
thought that that maybe might be thething case it's like oh wait a second
now it's like there's a bridge tobuild there it's not something I
have to imagine it's like I think I'mliving it so there's a point of like
points of relate there and what I wasgonna bring back I'm glad I was able
to stick this together anotherthing that I there's a the original

(29:16):
point I was gonna make so anotherthing that I did of the many things I
did at my universities that I gothired at my university's two
concert venues so we have an arenaand an open-air theater and I've
been working there for just over ayear now a lot of co-workers some are
attractive multiple times likethere's certain people who come to

(29:37):
mind where I always see them clickedup it's like you know there are
people who join the job to doconcerts and stuff you know it's
students and all and they havefriends and they apply together and
get hired together and they'realways hanging out at the concerts
you know I'm the type of person who'salways kind of on the outside and me
being older and fascinated bythings like I'm looking out for

(29:58):
everybody so I'm talking toeverybody I'm keeping an eye on
everybody and being like ifnobody's talking to someone a
particular person it's like I'll goup to them and talk to them yeah in
multiple situations withdifferent girls so like I see this
like particular group of girls whoare always like you know they're
attractive and clicked up usuallyand then there will be nights where

(30:20):
there's a concert and everybody'stalking to their little group
except for this one girl who wasattractive and by herself and part
of me wonders it's like there has tobe a real intimidating thing about
that because who's gonna go and talkto the hot girl even if she does look
sad and lonely it's like oh but she'shot oh my god huh like and I have

(30:43):
definitely felt a similar vibe ofbeing intimidating to initiate a
conversation with because it'slike oh my god it's like this is this
is that guy so I initiate that samekind of thing so we can flip you know
it's like some there is a thing to ohif you're like ugly it may be easier
to approach you but like that causesthat same kind of loneliness I mean

(31:08):
there's a commonality of likeloneliness across like humanity
there's something to say to that solike I don't know like once you
realize how much in common there isbetween you and somebody who's like
physically attractive it likelessens that gap it brings things
closer together where it's easierto make that point of contact
because it's like if I were you rightnow and I didn't have the security

(31:32):
that I've cultivated like thepersonal identity and security and
myself that I've cultivatedthrough the music if I didn't have
that and I was alone in a situationlike that I would have wanted
somebody to come up to me who was ableto it's like I feel lonely right now
and it's like I caught that and waslike hey what's up that's not even
and that's not a hot thing I like it'slike I feel like you can see

(31:55):
something like that and it's like ifyou were to see it from the outside
it's like oh I'm trying to get at youit's like yeah yeah yeah you're you
look sad maybe I can just like be withyou right I do that for everybody
like I said like I'll keep an eye outand it's like if it's like some dude
who's not talking to anybody and helooks kind of like alone it's like
I'll go up to him so it's like onething that I feel has been a real

(32:20):
measure of maturity for me istreating hot girls like anybody
else like it's not a big deal and partof me like would like to believe that
that's kind of what people want atthe end of the day like to not be like
it's a big deal that you are thisbecause I can relate to that too it's

(32:41):
like it's not a big deal that you'rethis or that it's like I'm just gonna
talk to you like you what see thatthat's the thing too it's hard for
guys like me and you who wereprobably you know I can't speak to
you but I was a loser becausewhenever you're a loser or you are
not popular you're not hot right youI don't know the mechanism behind it

(33:03):
but you develop character youdevelop like a lot of fat ugly people
are really freaking funny they'rereally funny what I see a lot of times
is these really hot girls theirwhole personality gets kind of
developed around them being hot andit's not their fault it's not their
fault they're their product oftheir environment if every single

(33:24):
person who comes up to them the boyscome up to them and immediately say
hey what's up sexy like what youdoing tonight I want to get a drink
what you doing the girls come up tohim and they say oh my gosh how do you
do your hair where'd you get thoseboots you're so cute they post
something on Instagram it gets5,000 likes right all of this it's
like we kind of become what we get ourattention for right this happens to

(33:46):
guys this happens to girls you rapright if someone comes up to you and
says hey Gabriel dude I just want tolet you know that that song you made
it really changed my life I thinkyou're so talented right you're
gonna wake up tomorrow you're gonnasay shit I'm not Gabriel anymore I'm
Gabriel the motherfucking rapperright and if you got a problem with it

(34:06):
you could fuck off right because nowyou're confident right I am not just
Gabriel I am a rapper and peoplethink my shit's good and that feels
damn good I could only imagine whatit's like for a girl because you're
born with it right I see you in themall and like I don't know if you're a
rapper if you start rapping I thinkthat would be really cool but like
these girls they can't turn it offand that's the thing I don't know if

(34:30):
you've experienced that but youever go talk to one of these stunning
girls and you're just like hey yeahman what like what was the coolest
thing about your childhood andthey're like I don't know like I'm
just so hot right they just kind ofgive off this personality how do you
I feel bad whenever I sense that awhole girl their whole personas

(34:57):
around their looks how does thatmake you feel have you ever seen that
no because I wasn't looking for itthe thing about that is that so to not
be a guy who is like that to be like I'mnot looking at you or trying to
interact with you as a steppingstone to something else whether

(35:19):
it's a relationship or sex or youknow it's not this whole
interaction is based on your beingattractive I'm listening for the
hmm part of me wonders in ahypothetical situation like that

(35:43):
because I haven't found myself in ithypothetically part of me wonders
if like if I am in a situation likethat and I just don't see you like
that you're just not gonna answerthat saying that question in the
same way because if I it's like why doyou get a response like that is it
like is it because she can sense thatyou want something else and you're

(36:04):
asking that question for adifferent reason like I would hope
that it gets across in some way thatthe way that I approach people and
ask them questions it's not becauseI eventually want something again
in general I'm not even talkingabout just hot girls or anything
it's just I don't want anything morethan this moment that we have right

(36:26):
now and that's what I'm fascinatedwith I feel like showing up with that
kind of open-mindedness andpresence in the present moment
something comes out of people liketo be allowed that space because you
are who you are until somebody justpops into your life and says you're
not that like I'm saying like thereason I told that story earlier is

(36:48):
because I don't know if I would haverealized that thing without her
without this entire person showingup in my life and you know because
like I was saying like you can readbooks and all that and you can change
your mind that way you can just meetsomeone who's like oh you can meet
someone who's super hot andactually just want to like feel
nothing like the thought of havingsex with her the girl I told a story

(37:10):
about it's like low key you it's likecuz I just like I don't see like that
at all so that's like a huge shift forme and like to look to seek out
opportunities like that to be liketo meet somebody for who they
actually are and not have anyexpectations about that you know
and like also to have the patiencetoo because like I said I've been in

(37:35):
multiple situations where it'scarried out over time so like even
initially somebody might be likethat who's just oh they seem boring
or that vapid or they don't have muchto them and then just keep asking
keep seeking that thing out and thefunny thing about humans about

(37:55):
people is that it doesn't take longto find in my experience it doesn't
take long to find something to belike wait what like with anybody and
then just continue that like waitthis is something that I'm gonna ask
you a lot of things about becausethis is fascinating I would like to
believe that everybody hassomething like that and it is as much

(38:16):
like the onus is on the personlistening as much as the person to
you know why is this person notinteresting is it because they
themselves have not lived aninteresting life or I don't have
attuned enough receptors fordetecting interestingness in
someone for me that's like all theway up and so I feel it's like a

(38:38):
win-win type situation where youget to tell your truth and figure it
out in a pretty safe space withsomebody like me who wants to hear
everything you're saying and itsupports it all and I feel like
you're in a similar space no like Imean I've listened to the podcast
it's like you have a wide variety ofpeople and you talk about a lot of
stuff and it's like it's not like awhole thing of like judging someone

(39:01):
based on those experiences and I'llsay too that like to the patient's
point and like hearing people outfor a bit because it can be that
initially but another thing thatthose conversations quarantine
taught me I've put it in my headworded it out like there are things
that you access in the fifth hour of aconversation that you do not get

(39:27):
maybe anywhere it's like I was ableto have conversations like that
with people regulated throughoutquarantine and if you just have the
patience to wait it out which is askill it also just takes like the
brain training of being able to payattention for that long and listen

(39:47):
like that like I said I was able to getthat practice and it was the
technical skill of listening so toanswer your question no I don't have
experiences like that with anyonebecause nobody's boring to me to me
and I feel like all I can speak to is myend of things and how I listen and

(40:08):
approach other people I think thatis brilliant and beautifully put
and I think that kind of one of thesuperpowers that I'm picking up
from you that I think you may have isthis ability to listen and I think
that if you were an Avenger you wouldbe one of the most powerful ones with

(40:32):
this super ability because forwhatever reason it seems like
everybody is extremelyself-absorbed and they don't give a
shit about anything you have to sayjust shut up so that I can trauma dump
that's my new favorite word I can'tbelieve I used it in a sentence so

(40:55):
that I can trauma dump aka so I couldjust spill all my shit on you it's
like Gabriel just shut the fuck upbecause I want to tell you how bad my
day was and I just want you to sit downand listen but no one listens
anymore and you know what you'reright whenever you do genuinely sit
down and talk with somebody and sayhey I wonder what it would be like to

(41:20):
walk a mile in his shoes or her shoesit unlocks powerful connections
that you will get nowhere else sowhere where did you pick up this
ability to listen were you alwayslike this no goodness gracious no I
was a loser to back in middle schoolin high school I was a big nerd and all

(41:44):
I did was make music all day well notall I did I was honestly pretty
involved back then and I kind of hadto rediscover it because when I was
in high school I made music on theside and I was in ROTC mainly that was
my main like identifier as a highschool kid I was a Marine Corps ROTC

(42:06):
program three years which mayexplain some things I don't know but
that's like rooted in me alongsidethat though there's I was in two
theatrical productions in highschool as well I was on my oh cool okay
okay Peter kid so I was also on myschool's yearbook which was its own

(42:32):
kind of like I was literally doinginterviews for that too so I might
have had a similar kind of tendencytowards socializing back then but
like I all the way lost it when I wentto Northridge because I went all in
on music I like just I ended up movinginto apartment with a bunch of

(42:55):
artists with like four differentartists and like we're just locked
in on music and I just went all the wayin on my music thing I'll say too that
when I say all the way in to not keep itas abstract the hoodie that I'm
wearing right now like this exacthoodie I wore this for a year and a

(43:18):
half straight like only this withthe same shorts the same shoes as an
act of commitment to the projectthat I initiated back in 2017. I want
to say it was like March 2017. Theproject comes out the first
iteration of it comes out August2017 and I just keep it up for like

(43:40):
over a year all the way throughsummer of 2018. Real quick, can I
just why do you call it a project?Because you're the second rapper
I've had on in the past week and healso called his a project. Why do you
call it a project? Shout out God. Ididn't listen to his thing. I didn't
listen to his music. I heard thatlike I was like oh cool funny that you
have another rapper on. When I sayproject I mean because I feel like

(44:03):
people usually say project as just asynonym for album collection of
songs. Yes. That's it. For me, thisis a hilarious that like we are this
far into the the conversation and Ihaven't even mentioned the music. I
appreciate that a lot. So yeah musicright? What I hit you up about it

(44:24):
initially was I've got this projectthat I'm working on. It's called
Ultra. It's a project because it'snot as simple to me as an album. If we
want to make it simpler a way that Istarted to explain it or I've been
explaining it is that it's an albumthat I've kept adding songs to. So

(44:48):
2017 August 1st my 21st birthdaymidnight I'm uploading 15 songs in
this style of music that I've beenexperimenting with for some years
now. Really. Here's just pauseright there. You're the most
dedicated motherfucker. I justhope people heard what he just

(45:11):
glossed over right? He's just likemidnight 21st birthday. I just stop
right there and they're gonna sayfuck yeah I'm wasted. I'm wasted.
But you were uploading 15 songswhich is freaking fantastic. So
kudos. Thank you and the thing iseven back then it was not here I am

(45:37):
uploading a 15 song album. Back thenit was here are the first 15 songs of a
project that I plan on continuinginto the future. So that's funny.
See it's like this stuff is so likenatural to me. I'll just say it
because like okay I'm done. Likethat's what you do on your 21st
birthday. It's like no yeah like Iintentionally like wanted to like

(45:59):
have it be like intertwined like Ican't celebrate my birthday
without celebrating the project. Idon't turn six this year on my
birthday when I turn 27. And so 15songs in this style on that day.
Witty clever pop-culture-y triviakind of lyrics. Cartoon-y noisy
well it ended up being noisy but it'slike cartoony hip-hop

(46:22):
instrumentals putting thattogether in one style. 15 songs
there you go. Less than a year later Imake 15 more songs in that style.
Feel like I've progressed in somemeaningful way. Release those 15
songs and then add them to theoriginal. So it's a soundcloud
playlist that I've just kept addingsongs to. And after those first 15

(46:45):
song drops after it became 30 I justkept adding songs one by one to today
nearly six years later where itcurrently sits at 133 songs just
over six hours of music. Very proudof myself for having done that. So
thank you. Seriously? Yeah like thefinal undergraduate total like now

(47:11):
that I've finally graduated is likethe definitive like all the ones I
made in college 133. And that hasalways been my laboratory for
crafting my identity anddiscovering my purpose because

(47:32):
when I did the the initial ideamaking in 2017 it was just about
making a unique kind of music that'sit. Loki maybe just making a new
genre because wouldn't that be coolthat was it you know 20 years it's
like I couldn't think of anything inany other terms. Made the

(47:52):
commitment to just all the way go inon the music and the project
specifically and it just zoomed allthe way out into this exploration of
who I am and why I'm here and afterthat year literally just that year
of focusing on this and only thismaking the music learning about all
these different subjects andputting them into this novel

(48:16):
synthesis transinterdisciplinary type of
artistic project and continuingthat for a long long time and like
it's a hip hop project so one elementamong many floating around in that
project is the self-centeredness.So there's a real statement to be
made about that self-centered kindof nature as it presents itself in

(48:42):
hip hop music where it's so much lookat me me me me I'm the best rapper I'm
better than you look at all thethings that I have no new friends
like just me on my own independenteverything and I speak on those
things because I can because I can'tI mean that there's a truth to that
that I can speak to because I'm thisoutsider type of person so I big that

(49:05):
up I was like bro like if I was notcareful if I was not considerate I
could be the most megalomaniacalegotistical person in history like
if I wasn't careful if I didn't havethe outlet of music like if we want to
talk self-centered like I would bethe center of everything like all
the like why does music diffuse thatbecause I get to be that person and

(49:29):
say the things and brag about myselfand be prideful in my in myself in the
music so it's like it's not bottledin and it doesn't like seep out into
my actual life to people I talk to itin my actions it's like there is a
real part of me that is like you knowlike I try to stay humble but it's
like if you allow me to flex I feellike I have a good amount of things to

(49:51):
flex about partly because when Imade those 15 songs initially I
wasn't doing it on some like let mejust make a cool little album it's
like I want to make history with thisI do not say that lightly I've been
thinking on those terms for yearsanother thing people can't really
relate on like this is ambitious Ibet my life on this project I put all

(50:15):
of it in this to be like I think I gotsomething that is unlike any sort of
artistic anything in the history ofhumanity let's be dramatic about it
why not yo let's talk about that yeahlet's talk about that because that
was something else I got from Godtalking to God he one of the quotes

(50:37):
that he gave me he says yo his projecthe says this this shit should win a
Grammy and he did he wasn't smilinghe was dead-ass serious and you're
kind of saying the same shit man thisis crazy y'all have similar makeups
so at taking yourself as a listenerof your music what what type of
advice or what type of approachshould a listener have approaching

(51:00):
your music because it is not I'velistened to probably more than 10 of
your songs it's not like anythingthat I've ever heard it's it's very
just use a couple adjectives orwhatever it's very dense and it is
very it's just very different thananything you would listen to so I

(51:21):
feel like whenever I was listeningto it I had to adjust my entire
expectations and it was difficultbecause there was not something
like oh yeah this is just like thatalbum that I listened to in the 90s oh
this is just like X it's not likeanything so how should a listener
approach your music should they bestoned should they be a little drunk

(51:46):
should they read the lyrics as theylisten should they turn it up turn it
down bass up what what's the deal sofor for example if I'm listening to
like I don't J Cole or something likethat I just like to get in the dark
room I light up a blunt and damn it I'mjust like I'm just like letting his
words take me for a ride that's how Ilike to listen to J Cole what about

(52:10):
people listening to your music myideal vision is in a musical context
sit stroke chin scrunch foreheadlisten very very closely like jazz
listen to it like jazz and like youreally really love jazz and I really

(52:31):
into each little detail and tryingto pick it out I listen to stuff like
that like music like that beautifuloutside of music there are some
songs that are more fit for a flexurehall type situation where it's like
part of me has wondered abouttranslating the project live and

(52:53):
not like literally just likebecause I don't think that's just
the logistics of that or just I don'tthink that'll ever happen and I
don't really want to see it happenhypothetically an ultra type
concert would not be in a standingroom only venue it's like you sit
down and you listen to this stuffespecially like there's a kind of

(53:14):
song throughout the project that isprobably the most consistent which
is one big rap is one big freestyleverse the whole song like from the
very beginning those first 15 songs2017 up until now that's something
that I really enjoy making andlistening to because there's a real
precedent for that in hip hop of justone very long verse inside baseball

(53:37):
which I've discussed elsewhere the18 minute version of that it's like
that's the centerpiece of ultra fora reason because for many different
reasons one of them being it's justthis one long dense wordy thing that
I feel like if you really want to getwhat it is like you said looking at
the lyrics like probably like I meaneverything's super clear to me

(54:03):
because I wrote it but like so andlike I'm the type of person who
watches lectures like the reasonthat I'm able to write this dense
stuff is because I'll watchlectures about super academic type
of subjects for fun like while I'meating lunch on like two times the
speed like if that translates tolike that kind of those the sonics of

(54:31):
that translate to my music toobecause it's very dense very wordy
it's like that's the kind of stuffI'm listening to so I'm acclimated
to that like it's hard for me toimagine somebody listening to it
cold like a song like that anddefinitely the project in general
but I feel like that style is likethat's ultra condensed to one

(54:51):
focused style because if we'retalking about the project in
general I would hope that it's moreinclusive because what I say is I
don't expect anyone anyone tolisten to 133 songs top to bottom in
one sitting that's not what it'sabout from the very beginning I was
like shuffle this the idea is thatyou shuffle it and though the big

(55:17):
freestyle songs are the main thingthere's so many other one-off type
songs that are way simpler wayshorter I don't know if you saw
there's a whole there's a whole Iguess albums worth of covers of
songs from Broadway musicals likesnug in there somewhere there's a

(55:40):
synth punk song as a bit of an Easteregg so in terms of that listen to the
actual project I'm like shuffle itsee what comes up and what I said
earlier patience of like hear it outbecause you're right I mean if I did
it right then there should be noprecedent for any of this it is very

(56:03):
likely that you shuffle it and thefirst song you get is one of those big
freestyle verses next song you getis some skit and then the next song
you get is a Broadway song and it'ssomething like that and it's just if
you hear it out then I hope there'ssomething there and if anything

(56:24):
like that aim is not joy I don't wantto have I want to have people to have
like a good listening to it like ifyou give it a shot I would at least
hope that if you listen to a few songsvery quickly and at least decide
like not for me you know fair totallyvalid I would hope that at least what

(56:46):
you listen to is like it can at leastdo what I've been saying of
introduce you to like hey just so youknow if you listen to five minutes of
this project like just so you knowthere's like way way more of this and
if you get a sense of there's noprecedent for this like just you
know there's a whole world of thisstuff likewise it's like there is a

(57:09):
whole world of the world out thereand I hope that like if you just see
that like somebody like this existsthey have a whole other thing to them
and if you can get that there'ssomething like that you can just get
like a hint of that from any of thesongs like if you shuffle it listen

(57:31):
to a few and that's that then I feellike if I did it right this stuff that
I made is so out there that there's nolike way you should listen to it like
if you listen to it at all it'll do itsjob because the fact that it hits
your ears and does this I could getvery esoteric and neurochemical

(57:53):
about this but I would like tobelieve that if you just hear this
completely novel type of music thatis not something you can compare
everything to it's like now you havea new point of reference that not
only is a new piece of novelinformation in itself but is a novel

(58:14):
piece of information that canrecontextualize others do you know
what I'm saying of like it's not onlythat you hear this new thing it's
like whoa thing I've never seenbefore I would hope that it can be
like oh my god thing I've never seenbefore I wonder what else I haven't
seen before hopefully becausethat's the thing that gets

(58:35):
constantly inspired within me andif it doesn't do that it doesn't do
that but I would hope that if you'rejust hearing the project for the
first time the ideal would be you atleast get a sense that there's so
much more to this than just oh this isjust another rap song sure let me see
if I can like bring it back to becausethere was the other question that I

(58:58):
was still answering um about beingable to listen and I really want to
like bring that back I hope that likeis also a live demo of me remembering
something and trying to bring itback because like no let's do it so
we're talking about your your yourgifted ability to yes and so I like a
lot of things I source it back to themusic and so I found myself through

(59:23):
the project I know who I am I know whyI'm here I know what I want to do in the
future I can say those securely andI've been able to say those securely
for years now thanks to the music I aman artist it's like that's what I'm
here to do I'm here to make art in theway that I know how to make it that I am

(59:44):
fairly certain that only I can doit's like all I need to do is stick at
this art thing as best as I can and mylife will be fulfilled I got it I got
my path probably figured that outaround like 2018-ish and have just
had that affirmed and affirmed moreand more as time is going on long

(01:00:07):
before quarantine even you know andI so what was it um because I really
like where this really it was like anexponential curve where
everything just went all the way upin the past year and I was able to
exercise all these skills it's likeeverything was like charging up for

(01:00:31):
this past year where I was just ableto go all out and have my full toolkit
at the ready and just go in thisthriving community bustling
everything's happening all thetime and just go everywhere and help
like to take this listening skill ofbeing like oh and so like how I got
there was like when so theself-centered always thinking

(01:00:56):
about like I feel like those areenormous questions to ask and I have
them squared away of like who am I whyam I here type thing especially
younger people I didn't know thatwhen I was like 20 right I wasn't even
thinking those terms but those arelike big rest of your life biggest
possible picture questions and Igot them squared away years ago and

(01:01:17):
so I feel like that can I just ask youreal quick yeah why why did those
questions matter because I andbecause every I hear lots of people
ask these questions and meditate onthese questions and these
questions are extremely importantfor everybody but in your opinion
why do they matter why does it matterif I know why I'm here or what my

(01:01:38):
purpose is or where I go when I diewhat like what impact do those have
on people every day or does it mattervery big question it's like yeah
this uh yeah so we have this bigquestion and I'm sorry Gabriel I'm

(01:01:58):
gonna throw it on you okay okay thankyou for answering it now let's ask
why are we asking the big question soyeah dude just just whatever man
just off the top of your head it'sit's just always curious because as
you're talking I'm askingquestions and I've always wanted to
ask someone as smart as you like whywhy do these questions matter let's

(01:02:21):
see um part of me wants to likecompletely freestyle let's see um
part of me wonders whether or not thequestion itself kind of boxes
things in because I feel why impliesa causality of logic a sense making
apparatus to get a hold of of likethere's some sort of explanation

(01:02:45):
and there's not and I feel in the faceof that because I will not be the
first person at all to say nothingactually matters in the grand
scheme of things it's like we're allgonna die like what's the point of
life anyway yeah and I feel from thatnihilism stems a lot of a lot you know

(01:03:11):
a lot of stuff that tends towarddecay and well like for example
whenever I was a kid right whenever Iwas up in high school you want to know
what the big question of my life waslike the big question can I suck my
own dick and if I could would I do itand it's like oh man and we all try to
it's like oh I can't do oh damn I can'tsuck my dick it's like oh man shit

(01:03:35):
okay all right cool and now that I'man adult the big questions are why am
I alive why am I here do I have apurpose if I can go back would I
choose to not be here all of thesethings and I'm like who picked these
questions to be the the questionsfor adults why are these the
questions it seemed like like I kindgot the questions as a kid it's like

(01:03:58):
oh shit it kind of like it kind of ishard to try to suck your own dick and
like you know your kids are likeanything about sex is you know but so
it's like yeah I get it you know butlike now I'm like whoa like these
questions are like who made thesequestions and who chose these
questions why aren't the questionslike hey is gluten good or bad or hey

(01:04:22):
should you own a weenie dog or agolden retriever right but instead
it's where do you go when you die orare you living your purpose today
like why are these questionsimportant my gut says if you child

(01:04:43):
like giddly keep asking why that'swhere you get oh wow why it's like oh I
wonder if I can suck my own dick whyit's like oh it feels good why why do
things feel good it's like huh andthen we start getting to like the
human condition of look why thingsmatter at all and then you hit a wall

(01:05:08):
because it's like things cascadedownward of like oh why do I do this
thing because it feels good thatactually makes sense in a because
kind of way of understanding thingsonce you get to why am I here why is
there anything at all it kind oftranscends that way of framing

(01:05:31):
things in such a way that is socomplex that it is so
understandable to not try and faceit I mean yeah that's why so many
people don't ask those questionsit's just they're hard it's like the

(01:05:54):
hardest questions you can facebecause if you ask answer that
question it just it's at the root ofeverything so if you want to just
stay at this surface level typething great you'll have security
all the way up here at the surface andyou never get down here into the
deeper type things and people liveentire lives like that also me as an

(01:06:20):
artist right I feel my transitionfrom being just a rapper or somebody
who makes music to being an artistbecause that wasn't always the case
either where I could so confidentlyproclaim that I am an artist and
that's like who I am right again likebit of a dramatic sidebar of I say

(01:06:44):
that I rap I produce instrumentals Ising I write poetry I am an artist
where the verb in that sentence is belike in terms of my being like who I am
who do I exist as it is an I am I am anartist because I feel everything I
do is a kind of art my life is a kind ofart I remember realizing I think

(01:07:09):
near the end of this past yearthere's a very strong argument to be
made in the context of the projectthat all this involvement that I did
all this listening that I did thisconnecting of different
departments on campus connectingpeople with other people bringing

(01:07:32):
this campus closer togetherthrough what I was able to do just
through me being this common node inthis huge network throughout the
university there's a very realargument to be made that that was
just one big manifestation of whatI'd been doing in the project which
is like I said academic type lyricsbringing concepts from the

(01:07:56):
sciences and the arts and historyand so from different cultures and
astronomy and marine biology andlike all the different likes the law
and like medicine and like all thedifferent types of disciplines you
could learn about putting them allin one rap song there's the density
right dense with what it's like witheverything across the entire

(01:08:18):
universe theoretically basicallyyou could frame my hyper
involvement at as it was dubbed by astaff person across the university
as one big performance art piece asthat I did through ultra I mean that

(01:08:39):
was just ultra that was it meanliving ultra out that's just living
one big artistic project out but notjust a frivolous artistic project
that was let me do something weirdbecause life is weird nothing makes
sense lol I'm just gonna dosomething random it's like it's

(01:09:04):
that in this vacancy of an actualpurpose to it all that can be very
disheartening very discouragingto an artist it's a blank canvas and
you are free that's the mentalityI've had for a long time and so the
thing about having that mentalityof liberty and the skill to be like if

(01:09:27):
you're willing to take this jumpwith me so okay maybe this actually
brings it back to the listeningthing too of being able to listen in
some way of like because to have thisoutlook on things that I'm pretty
sure is rare I am so unshakablyoptimistic like to the core of me and

(01:09:50):
I feel in the world we're living innow that is so needed I recognize it
in myself that what is moreprevailing is this narrative of
hopelessness and helplessness asan artist it's like I'm gonna make
beautiful art in the face of that andnot just like pretty looking but

(01:10:11):
like emotionally resonant andhopefully productive because it's
not even like I'm trying to makebeautifully music you've heard
this stuff it's not like beautifulright it's to my aesthetic
standards it kind of is but not likein a it's not mainstream yes and it's
definitely not like high art in atraditional sense but I would hope

(01:10:38):
that it's like technicallysophisticated and like
respectable in that regard at leastum so I might be drifting off here but
I think that's the idea you gave me acanvas and there's a tendency to be

(01:11:04):
presented with a blank canvas ofthat high of stakes who am I why am I
here why does that anything need tomatter at all I just paint I really
don't want to come off as like artsyfartsy though like bro be yourself
you're a beautiful person I like I'mso confident in everything you said

(01:11:26):
if all the people I've had on thispodcast I think I'm more confident
in you to like let that tongue gobecause you're a wonderful person I
mean thanks I appreciate it I like Irarely get the opportunity to to and
I've already spoken about so muchthat I just do not get to talk about
like in general like even outside oflike um podcast so like thank you for
the chance to like um even word thisout because I'm just not even I'm not

(01:11:52):
prepared anything I'm just ravingum I will say too just that what
matters to me is that things matterat all because you can just not care
about you can just not care aboutanything like yeah yeah anything

(01:12:12):
and I just like I personally justcare so much about everything which
is like I don't know maybe if we wantto go back to when I first started out
it was just music just did somethingfor me and I really it just became
really Fascinating to me in justthis like Toy that I could just keep
playing with and I could learn moreand more about it just at the level of

(01:12:35):
Music alone of just this is fun Astime has gone on I feel like what I did
with like the The hoodie commitmenttype situation just committing to
the project as much as I have It Like alot of things with art. It's like
it's bigger than the art It's likewhat I did was practice caring and

(01:12:57):
not just caring in the moment I justI've practiced caring about
something For at least six years ifyou want to go back to when I started
making music like it's over a decadeof just Making a rap song and I hope
like another thing with the musiclike I hope you get a sense like this
guy like really like is Into thislike oh, yes a lot of percent. Yeah,

(01:13:21):
like it's it takes a lot of effort anda lot of attention and intention and
time to craft a verse like Insidebaseball let's say or any of the big
like verses like And I guess just tosay to like at the end of inside
baseball the very last line I waslike 300 bars it's like how am I gonna

(01:13:43):
end this and It ended up being I'mtrying and like if this gets you to
start trying now then like that'sall I could have ever asked for It's
like this is 18 minutes here's sixhours of me caring as much as I can
about something that does not needTo be cared about it's art. Nobody

(01:14:04):
needs to make art. Nobody needs tomake art It's like if people just
stop caring and let AI just make allthe art for us Then we can just let our
capacity to care atrophy into whoknows what it's like if you want to do
that go on ahead This is just mePlaying pretend like the actor that

(01:14:26):
I am like the theater kid that I havehad a president of being and just
playing pretend Like this matters.It's like if you slap me in the face on
stage. It's like I'm gonna sell thatIt's like I'm gonna make it look like
that hurt Right, it's like if I'm in ascene and you need me to cry I will oh
my god, which is a skill as well by theway, it's like that's There's the

(01:14:47):
heart for it and then there's likethe skill to do it and I feel like I
Have both and I feel like inrecognizing my willingness and
ability to Make novel change in theworld I feel a responsibility to get

(01:15:09):
out there and just Kind of likeinsert myself into situations like
that like you didn't kid me up,right? It's like I hit you up It's
like it. Can I get out here and like dosome stuff because like Yeah, um
Yeah, I think there's one thingwhenever listening to your music
There's probably lots of ways todescribe it but I think one way that

(01:15:35):
you cannot help but describe it isYou could tell it just kind of comes
through every single verse or everysingle minute of each song that This
guy is doing what he was put on thisearth to do and That this guy loves
this shit and I think there'ssomething weird That happens

(01:15:59):
whenever you observe Somebodydoing something that they were put
on this earth to do for example I havea family friend who is an insurance
salesman and Insurance is like themost boring shit in the world. It's
terrible But man you get this guytalking about insurance and holy
shit the whole room lights up andit's just like damn And it's like

(01:16:20):
what you said, right? It says hey yousaid hey man If there's nothing you
got out of this at least get that Icared and damn it You should care too
and it's the same thing. It's Holyfuck after listening to a family
friend talk about insurance. I'mlike damn I I gotta I need to I got a

(01:16:41):
lurt piano I got to do something thatlike I need to find something that I
care about as much as this guy caresabout insurance I get the same
feeling whenever listening to yourmusic and it's beautiful. It is
wonderful and I thank you for thatChills, okay And see so I'm the type

(01:17:01):
of person who like Praise is like,you know, I go out of my way like
admittedly I go out of my way to makethis big fancy thing and I do hope
that it's Worth some sort ofrecognition like I do honestly hope
it's worthy of pretty high praise asbig as I think about it But yeah, like

(01:17:23):
my reflex is just like turn it backaround I mean cool like all this is a
like like I like I said like Iactually Don't really Share that I
make music like that like I don't goout of my way to mention it though if
we talk about Me and like What I'm upto it's like the only thing I can say

(01:17:47):
is music that's all I'm up to but Inever get the chance to Say what I'm
up to because I'm so busy askingother people those questions
Helping them find that thing thatlights them up. It's like cuz Yeah, I
mean like there's Demonstrating itsetting that example and I hope to do
that But then there's running therisk of like being so on your own path

(01:18:10):
that Like I don't want people to seewhat I'm doing I kind of like this is a
concern of mine because I feel likeit is pretty Or it could be you know, I
don't want to like mind-readinglike I just there could be Based on
how I present myself at university,especially to like people who are
younger there's this chance thatseeing how hard I work and how Liked I

(01:18:34):
am I hesitate to say like I would liketo believe that that's the case They
just see somebody like me and they gowow look at that guy. He's great Oh,
okay, like I just leave that that ofbeing like I really hope that I can
just Do that where it's like you seesomebody like that's like oh I hope

(01:18:54):
that I can do that because you can seelike Like an Olympic level athlete
and be like wow It's like it's notlike oh, let me go join like let me go
join a sport now It's just like wowthat's great for them. That's good
that that kind of talent exists inthe world There's no way it exists in
me like there are people who are likethat and I really do not want to be
like somebody like that it's likewhich it's this juggling act of

(01:19:20):
being sticky outie and unrelatablein a That's how you push things
forward kind of way Of courseworking within the system as it
exists right now the system whichcan mean a bunch of different things
just like Working beyond thatseeking to transform that it's like
you to go away from whatever existsright now And then there's existing

(01:19:42):
in how things exist right nowbecause if you're gonna do things
with other people It's like you gotto understand them at some level so
like On a spectrum of the extreme ofbeing so so far out there that nobody
gets you But you're doing themaximum amount of change at the cost
of your social Currency or whateverof like you're so out there that

(01:20:06):
nobody's even gonna interact withyou because you're so Uninteract
with the bull and then there's likeyou're so relatable And you
actually can like connect withpeople on a meaningful level But
you're working just within thesystem as it exists right now. It's
like Oscillating back and forthbetween that as a way of approaching

(01:20:27):
like life and the music too to kind oflike bring it back To the music like
there are the songs where Where it isvery dense and intentional and very
heartfelt honestly like there arethings that I've communicated in
lyrics where Alongside like jokesjust straight up jokes where it's
like this is a point that I reallyreally want to try and make right now

(01:20:47):
and word it as clearly and Cuttinglyas I feel like it deserves, you know,
like one point that I keep returningto in the music is Variations on the
world is falling apart and there'sso many things we can still do about
it alongside That which is its ownkind of thing to branch off into of

(01:21:08):
like how that reflects in the musicand Then like I'm saying so you can
shuffle the playlist and get a songlike that where I'm just really
opening my heart and speaking mymind on The biggest possible
subjects and then the next song willbe like I don't know like Say be oh the
sex one or like Halloween spookswhich I put out recently which is

(01:21:32):
literally just me screaming overthe noisiest instrumental that I
made like ever like So duality of manAnd it's like the only thing that
like well it Is possible throughthat Hmm I'll be losing it here I

(01:21:55):
Sure, let's let's put a period onthat one up. Ah, I love it I wanted to
ask you about some I Love it man. Hey,that's that's brilliant that
you're so in the moment It's just youdon't you don't even know three
words down down the road. Yeah, youliterally like It's refreshing

(01:22:15):
bro. Don't don't don't change yousaid this this thing in I think in
your notes to me It said that theproject you said the project is my
passionate counter response tomodern civilization collapse What
do you mean by that sentence? I?Forgot that I wrote that um
Passionate counter response tomodern civilizational collapse

(01:22:39):
see that's another example of mejust kind of going off I literally
forgot that I wrote that okay Quitebeautiful. Okay, thanks And I guess
just to zoom it out super quick thisfeels a bit of a microcosm of The
project where I'm kind of just in themoment writing songs and then I'll
put the song out complete and Thentime will pass and I'll revisit the

(01:23:01):
song and now I can speak to the songnot as the artist making it But as
just some person listening to it, ofcourse so there's a conversation
that I've been able to Capture inlike a futuristic sense to where
it's a proactive as well asretroactive thing because 2017 me
is here right now still like Presentin this conversation because I was

(01:23:25):
thinking about this back then andthen five years from now six years
from now like that Like that's justas present for me now as it is that so
like just microcosm of that of likethere's a thing that I forgot let me
like Contextualize it which is justwhat I do I hear that I listen to the
music and you know every once in awhile I'll shuffle the playlist
myself because it's music I like andevery time you know like something

(01:23:47):
will pop up and I'll Realizesomething new about it that I had no
intention Of back when I made it sopassionate counter responses the
civilization class So like I said,I'm an artist right if you listen to
the music It may come off as like I'msome super genius person polymath

(01:24:07):
type person who Just knowseverything about everything in
science and business and likeeverything about the entire world
when in reality Well, why who I am isan artist and I don't want to trick
myself into thinking that I'manything beyond that within my

(01:24:27):
capacities as an artist I can Speakto all these different disciplines
just as an artist. That's thebenefit of forming an identity is
that you are able to differentiateyourself between others whether
that's other people or Communitybecause like when you're younger
it's like you're figuring yourselfout So it's like you see somebody do a

(01:24:49):
cool thing and it's like oh, maybe Ishould try doing the cool thing to
see if it's like good for me You know,it's like this constant exchange of
ideas and that can carry on evenbeyond childhood It's like for me.
It's like I know the differencebetween something that I like
something that I thought of andSomething that exists outside of me

(01:25:10):
So I can step into knowing that I'm anartist. It's like, okay cool. I can
go into any space then and providethe input that I can provide as an
artist and Take any inputs from thisother discipline and have there be a
conversation there instead of likethis one like a Morphous blending

(01:25:31):
together of something rightbecause it's like what is a
conversation? If it's just twopeople who don't really know what's
going on kind of exchanging halfideas, you know, hmm. It's like
there's something Exciting aboutseeing like a debate of like
somebody really believes in onething on one side and somebody who
really believes another thing onanother side to Passions kind of

(01:25:56):
exchanging those ideas. There'ssomething exciting about that and I
think that's what it is that Thisperson very clearly wants
something this person very clearlywants something else and they're
trying to make sense of that wherethere's no real progress to be made
though because There's no give, youknow for me. It's like that same kind
of passion in what I believe in butwith none of the the Defense the

(01:26:21):
wanting to keep it this way. It'slike I believe in this so strongly
like that I but my stance is onEverything like I said the optimism
and all that like I believe that sostrongly and at the same time like
I'm willing to hear other people outwho Believe the exact opposite
thing with the ultimate aim that inthis conversation. We can actually

(01:26:41):
move things forward With and I feellike that's the novel thing like I
said like Me just as a person I feellike I Mean you said it earlier like
this lack of people Having thisskill this capacity to listen. I
feel like you could source that backto like, or you could extend that to

(01:27:03):
so many things nowadays of likepeople just aren't willing to hear
each other out on things, or Ishouldn't say willing, they are
unable to hear people out on thingsbecause they don't have these big
question squared away because morelike other values are taken into
account and there's nodifferentiation between things,
right? It's like, who am I? Do Iactually me the person believe

(01:27:24):
this? Or am I just identifying withthis group and this is what the group
believes? So I'm just gonna takethat wholesale unquestioningly
and have that be my thing. If there'sno differentiation there, then how
much of a self is there there really?So I feel like, and also to like in the
face of complexity, right? Sothere's probably the biggest

(01:27:48):
complexity of philosophical why isanything even anything? And then
there's maybe like a step belowmaybe of slightly less complex
complexities where it's cultures,systems, governments, histories,
interconnected across like humanhistory, like anthropologically

(01:28:10):
speaking. It's like that's complexof like why is anything even here?
It's like, why is, I hesitate to saythe country, the way that it is right
now? Like not to like make it thatkind of thing, but it's like that's
complex in itself and like. Yeah.And like so complex in fact, that
it's much easier to just devolve.That might be dismissive, but like

(01:28:33):
to to regress might not be veryconsidered either but it's like you
go to what's simpler and what'ssimpler is going to somebody who has
it figured out and being like, I'lljust let you do it. So there's a real
lack of differentiation. Again,riffing like of individuality, of

(01:28:55):
differentiation between this iswhat I believe and this is what other
people believe. And there arepeople who have a very similar
degree of passion to me who lack, whohave no degree of similarity in the
kind of consideration I have ofother people's humanity and
seeking to inspire the cultivationof their own unique identity. And
they capitalize on people likethat. They take advantage of them

(01:29:18):
and be like, oh, the world we'reliving now kind of because of how
complex it is, because of how muchstuff is going on, people just shut
down. Like they shut off and just goto what's simplest. You know what
that means. Like I can trick theminto doing what I say because
there's no them to defend againstlike, oh, but this is what I actually

(01:29:40):
want. You don't know what youactually want. It's like, you're
kind of right. So to kind of besomeone who, and all it can do is like
be someone who's like that at the endof the day. I mean, I'm not gonna run
for president or anything. It'sjust I have my way of approaching
things. And I'm lucky enough to havehad the opportunity to stay at my

(01:30:03):
university, hopefully. I mean, Igot an interview, a job interview
next week. Like, we'll see, but ifthat's the case. Holy shit, dude,
you have a job interview next weekfor your dream job to stay at your
university? For my dreamuniversity, yeah. So we'll see,
we'll see. And I know the personinterviewing me. So like that's

(01:30:24):
how, you know, the person that'swhat networking will get you. How
long is the interview? How manyminutes? An hour, an hour. One hour,
just one interview for one hour?Yes. That's fucking insane. That's
not fair. Hold on. That's not fair.It should be the first interview.
It's an initial interview. So thankyou for the interview prep, by the
way. You wanna know something? Mywife is actually, is doing an

(01:30:50):
interview today. In fact, like anhour ago, and I was prepping her with
like the questions like, hey, couldyou please explain to me a situation
that you were in where you had tolearn something new and apply it at
work? Like these shitty, well notshitty, but these interview
questions that everybody gets. Andit's like, ah, and so, man, dude, I am

(01:31:11):
so excited for you. Thank you. Holymo- Do you know what to expect in this
interview? Just like, kind of? No. Imean, but do I ever expect to know
anything that's going on? I mean, myapproach to things, I don't know if
you've been able to tell, like insituations like this with
interviews, because I've done, youknow, other podcasts, ones before
and had other job interviews too. Toa fault, perhaps, my approach is

(01:31:34):
like, don't prep at all. Oh, shit.And rely, but like rely on my theater
skills, my improvisational skillsto be like, whatever comes up on the
spot, I'm just gonna see whathappens. Because like, what? It's
like, I don't know if you can tell,again, it's like, if I am not sure of

(01:31:56):
the answer that I'm about to give,it's not like I'm gonna get nervous.
It's like, I move straight to that.It's like, that's what I aim for. So,
I feel like I thrive in situationswhere there is no preparation,
there's no opportunity to prep forit. It's like, I like living in the
moment. The job at the arena that Imentioned earlier is a lot of that.

(01:32:18):
And yeah, like, so. But yeah, so. I'mjust gonna wing it. No, no, if it's
anything like this, you're golden.I would hire the shit out of you. But
see, here's the thing, here's whereit's not, it's like, it's just not
how it is, unfortunately, in thecorporate world, and I've never
worked in academia. But, becausehere's what'll happen. Let's say me

(01:32:42):
and you are going to interview atsome job. Just call it at the donut
shop, whatever. And you are like,let's say you're a better person to
me, which I think you are. And so,your heart is made out of gold. My
heart is made out of wood. So, theowner should hire you, not me. But

(01:33:02):
what I do is I Google and prepextensively, right? And so,
whenever they ask me all of thesequestions, I see it coming. I know
it's coming. I have three differentprepared answers. And so now, I
sound more professional andprepared than you do, because you
speak from the heart, right? And I'mcunning. I'm a corporate demon. And

(01:33:25):
so now, I get hired instead of youwhenever you're more qualified. I
wish, I wish, by the way, if thesystem was perfect, you would get
hired. But in the corporate world,or which is where I come from, I work
in tech, it's just not that at all.We're gonna hire the person who
sounds like, or appears to have allthe answers. And they sound really

(01:33:49):
nice. And man, did you see those bigwords he was using? I didn't even
know what that third word was. Oh, Iam so impressed. Like, this is how
people get hired now, and it sucksass. So hopefully, your interview
is not like that. And hopefully, thepeople who are interviewing you are
wise enough to see that, hey, thisguy speaks from his heart and his

(01:34:13):
soul. And this is a rare commodity.And I hope they hire you. I'm so
serious, I hope you get hired so bad.I want it so bad for you. What are you,
like, what? So you're not thinkingabout it at all? You have to be
thinking about it, right? Aboutwhat, you mean? The freaking job
interview, dude! Oh, I mean, see,because like, well, first off,

(01:34:35):
like, I know the personinterviewing me. It's like, we work
together, all this pass here. Oh,okay. It's hard, all the time. So I
don't want to act like I got in the bagor anything, but it's like, part of
me, it's not like it's the first timeshe's meeting me ever. Not at all.
Like, I've known her for over a yearnow, like longer than a lot of
people. So I don't want to rely onthat. But what do you mean? Could

(01:34:59):
that hurt you that you know her solong? You think you would help her?
Or hurt? It might hurt more becausethere's a chance that I could rely on
it and I don't want to do that. Whereit's like, oh, I got this in the bag,
so I'm not even gonna take itserious. I will. I just will take it
serious in the way that I take itserious. Which, and it's not like
I'm gonna not prep at all. It's justlike, I feel like the whole try to

(01:35:21):
pre-empt the questions type thingand like, ask me questions. Like, I
can do that in my head. Like, I don'tneed any of the actual stuff. Like,
in terms of the actual material ofwhat I need to know for the position,
I'll do that. But like, the actual, Ikind of just had like a flash of like,
what if they see this? I don't know ifit'll come out in time. But like,

(01:35:42):
that'll be hilarious. No, it will. Iwill make sure it will not. It will
not. It will not. That'll behilarious if they ended up saying
like this. But I mean, like, andhere's the thing too. Like, to speak
to the situation you said before,like, part of me is like, to speak as

(01:36:03):
well to another point that I madebefore. Like, this is something
that I'm not willing to conform oninterviews. Awesome. Where it's
like, and you know, perhaps to afault. Like, if you do get that job in
this like, type of politicalscenario, I'm like, cool. Like, I
mean, it's up to them. If theythought you did it, there you go.
Like, I'm like, I guess it's just nota good fit then. And you know, I have

(01:36:26):
my style of working. I would like tobelieve that it works well with the
university. But if it's not like,I'm not one to fit myself into a
position like that. I got aninterview for an internship with a
military defense contractorthrough an aerospace engineering
club at the university that I joinedout of pure curiosity with zero

(01:36:49):
background in aerospace. And I waslike, I'm not perfect for this at
all. Like, I'm just, and I justlucked out on it. I didn't even seek
it out. It's just, I sat in my resumein and I got a call out of nerve being
like, hey, I got a, we want an airview. And I was like, bet, no prep. I
was like, I'm just gonna go blind. Ididn't get it. But like, for me, it

(01:37:11):
was like not that big of a deal.Partly because I just lucked out on
it. And also because I'm like, I havethat mentality. And shoot, it like,
it might come at a cost. If I don't getit, I don't get it. And like, that's
on me. That's literally on me. Butwhat I feel is the most validating to
me, to myself, in the longer run isthat I say true to myself. Like, I

(01:37:34):
would feel kind of off if I was likechanging my whole thing up for
someone else. It's like, that'sjust my personality and my
background. So if it means notgetting a job, it means not getting a
job. And if that's crazier, I'vedone crazier. If that's crazy, I've
done crazier things. No, dude,that's definitely the way to go.

(01:37:56):
It's just, I think me, I've becomejaded working out of college and
kind of working in the corporateworld. It's not like what anybody
told me. It's very fake. It's verylike the memes from the office and
these type of TV shows about themanager and shit you can't say and

(01:38:18):
all of this HR. It's all true. And Iwas just a kid who I like to write
computer code. And I think computercode is fucking awesome. It's like
something cool as shit ever. But youcan't get by just liking that. And I
think it's really kind of, like Isaid, it's jaded me and it's fucked

(01:38:41):
with me because I think your way isthe way everybody should be. But I
guess there's some try-hars outthere that ruin it for us all. I mean,
don't speak for all of us now. I wouldlike to believe that I have not
really a capacity to be jaded in a waythat incapacitates me. Again, like

(01:39:06):
I don't wanna act like I'm some superinvincible. My spirit is just
invincible and nobody can ever dragme down on anything like I'll feel
that too. And I felt that similarkind of helplessness that I was
speaking to earlier. And I willcontinue to feel it. And I feel

(01:39:27):
there's a utility in feeling itbecause there's that opportunity
to relate. I would not even want to besomebody who didn't feel that same
kind of feeling because then I wouldbe that other person who's so out
there and unrelatable that there'sno point of connection there. So, I

(01:39:47):
mean, again, all I can hope to do isinspire, like is to have it not be
that, maybe, you know, like, I feelthe need to bring up, let me see how
briefly I can bring this up entirelyseparate, like, well, I'll bring it
back, but like. Let's do it, let's doit. At the university, one of many,

(01:40:10):
many, many things I did was I met someChristian students who I was
sitting on campus one day and theywalked up and like, hey, I forget
what they asked, but I was like, yes,because I'm in a position in my life
where I'm willing to hear people outon that. So, we set up a time to eat. We

(01:40:31):
set up another time to eat and chat.And then another time, I think we
talk like three times or something,a few times, right? So, like, we're
just going back and forth on ideas.And they honestly heard me out like
this. Like, they actually just letme talk way more than them. And then I
heard them out and there was ahealthy exchange of like, it was so
civil. And like, after talking tothem after like a while, again,

(01:40:56):
like, this is a testament to like, ittook multiple times, you know,
compared to like a usual situationwhere somebody walks up to you in a
public place being like, hey,Christianity, and it's just like,
no, or nothing at all, right? You'relucky to get a no. It's just nothing.
In a situation like that, I'm like,yes, and, and I keep going and going.
And then after that, after thosemeetups and the extended continued

(01:41:21):
conversation, I was like, yes, solike, I'm not somebody you can call
me. and convert straight up. And I'mnot gonna trick you into thinking
that there's a chance with me. Likebe clear. Like I've done this with
multiple other people by the way.Like straight up, like again, like I
know what I believe in. I know who Iam. I am also not trying to fault you

(01:41:45):
for anything. Cause it's not likethere's no point of relation for me
with everything. I mean like thiscould branch off into a whole other
thing of like how like, so those bigquestions, right? It's like,
that's religion. There you go. It'slike that's where like religion,
can you just like hand everythingover to a certain religion and just

(01:42:07):
there's that. I, this is somethingthat I've wanted to do with other
people before and I did do it withother religious people, Christian
people of like, so you're not gonnaconvert me. You're not gonna change
my mind on this. I'm not gonna,you're not gonna convert me. Now
what? Because I'm not on your side.You're not gonna get me on your side.

(01:42:33):
I'm not against you in any way. Nowwhat? I feel like something as
simple as that. It's like, so what dowe do now? Because we've exhausted
all the potential paths that areusually here. It's like, we're not
gonna fight. You're not gonnaconvert me. I'm not gonna, not pay

(01:42:55):
attention to you at all. Now what?It's like, and I love being in spaces
like that, right? It's like, nowwe're actually thinking because we
just exhausted all the solutionsthat people are used to using. And
what they said was like, you know, atthe end of the day, like here's the,
we got this info. I'm getting alittle emotional right now because

(01:43:17):
she was like, you know, I really hopelike, when it's all said and done, my
paraphrase of her words, like whenit's all said and done, it's like, I
really wanna see you like, and likeeverything's like, you know, gates
of heaven, everybody's there. LikeI really wanna see you there. And I
was like, even though I was like,you're not gonna get me. I don't

(01:43:38):
believe it. I was like, just beingsincere, being honest and being
open. It's like, yeah, and it'slike, she was like, it was a girl and a
guy, it was Jennifer and Daniel,their names. And they were just
like, yeah, like at the end of theday, it's like, we're trying our
best. Here's some info. Take it intoconsideration. Once it's in your

(01:44:02):
hands, do whatever you want with it.It's like, what? Like I'm not gonna
like hold you too. It's like, here'ssome information that I feel is
worth valuable. Worth a lot is veryvaluable. Is life saving. And
that's something I respect aboutpeople who are religious too, very
devout religious people. You wannatalk about care, right? You wanna

(01:44:23):
talk about people who care aboutstuff. It's like, say what you want
about somebody going around tostrangers and public asking about
religion and all, it's like, thatperson cares. And they get my
respect off that alone. You reallycare. It's like, if you're willing
to interrupt people, all that, it'slike, respect. And that's why I give
them the time of day because Irespect that. And then, you know,

(01:44:44):
so, on my end, I feel like in responseto, like I'm not gonna act like I can
save the world. I wanna believe thatI can because I feel like believing
it is useful and can be used as fuelto, for practical actions that can
be taken. But at the end of the day,it's like, I hear a situation like

(01:45:09):
that. It's like, you know, if I'mable to help in some way to, at least
like, it's not like everything'sgonna be all right in the end. It's
like, there's so much more toeverything than you think you know,
and there always will be. And if thatfinds you in some helpful place and
it provides some solace and forwardmomentum potentially, cool. Like

(01:45:33):
it has for me and it's led me to whereI'm at today. I am not you. It's like,
do whatever you want with it. I thinkthat's beautiful. Damn, yeah, I
think that's really beautifullyput. I think my last question for
you, and I hate to cut this short. Ithink I could talk for four more

(01:45:55):
hours to be honest. I'm juststarving. Yeah, I'm just hungry.
Actually, I can't believe I spoke onit because man, I would love to go to
San Diego and get me a freakingCalifornia burrito or a nice greasy
breakfast burrito, but I can'tbecause I'm not there. What would be

(01:46:15):
your advice for young people? Seekout as many new opportunities as
possible. You have to actively seekthem out because they will not be
presented to you. This is a veryrelevant, resonant question for me
if this is the field that I'm tryingto go into being around young people

(01:46:38):
all the time and being around youngpeople like I was before,
17-year-old, 18-year-old, likefreshman. If I had the chance to give
advice, which I did not, I tried mybest not to, me being the older
person, I could easily be like, hey,you kids, and just give unsolicited
advice literally. But I tried mybest not to do that and just meet

(01:47:01):
people at the level that I've beensaying. But if I were to, that's the
first thing. And I feel like ifsomebody asked me for advice on
anything, I try my best to not giveadvice that has been given or is not
very practical. Things like, beyourself. I mean, I could easily say
that, right? That's the theme ofthis interview. It's like, just be

(01:47:24):
yourself. And try new things is athing too, like especially if
you're in college or about to go intoit. My whole thing is, so I mentioned
earlier that I was a part of anaerospace engineering club that I
joined for, I stayed in for two yearswith zero knowledge of aerospace,

(01:47:48):
no familiarity with it, spent twoyears there, couldn't tell you a
thing about aerospace still. Ididn't really learn anything in
terms of technical aspects. I wentfor the people and I stayed for the
people because they're great andgeniuses as far as I can see. And they
make me feel like an idiot in a verywelcome way. So like, yeah, I feel

(01:48:10):
like I'm comic relief to thembecause like I'm just kind of there
and I'm the business major who knowsnothing. And I'm just like, I hope I
can just be happy to be here and havethat be my contribution because I
didn't help with the plane that webuilt. No one's gonna tell the
business majors who are incoming tothe university, hey, join the Aztec

(01:48:34):
Aerospace Design, hey, join theAerospace Club, join the
Mechanical Engineering Club. But Idon't know anything about that.
It's like, that can prevent you froma lot of opportunities. It's like,
the reason I went there was because Ididn't know anything about that.
And the special thing about auniversity is that you have all
these opportunities to learn frompeople who are knowledgeable about

(01:48:57):
that stuff. It's like, we're alljust students, so just go. I think in
terms of the bylaws of theuniversity, you're not supposed to
be able to turn anybody away from aclub. So they can't tell me to go away
because I'm not contributinganything. It's like, if I just keep
showing up to the meetings in a waythat shows more dedication than

(01:49:20):
some other people who actually wereaerospace people, not to call
anybody out or anything, but Ishowed up a lot. I showed up just as
much as anybody who actually wasstudying aerospace did. Why? It's
like, because I'm an artist and Ithought that was just a fun thing to
do just because life is short andpointless, so why not do something
wild? And wild for me means, let mejust learn something completely

(01:49:47):
unexpected. And so especially whenyou're young, it's like, I looked
into having this hobby of mine be achannel through which I could
discover all these differentperspectives on the world, all
these different disciplines andbits of information and all that
fostered this curiosity of I'mgonna go out there and learn because

(01:50:10):
there are real barriers in place, Ifeel. So many people are on social
media and not to harp on social mediatoo much, just because people do
that. One thing I'll say is that, andthis is documented, this is known
how the recommendation algorithmsfeed back to you things that you

(01:50:33):
already like. It's like, oh,here's, you like the videos of dogs?
Here's more videos of dogs. Youdon't like the videos of cats,
here's less videos of cats. Rarely,oh, this is something I really just
wish I could fill out a request formand be like, hey, internet, can this
happen, please? A recommendationsystem that suggests to you things

(01:50:56):
that you have never, ever, everheard of and would have never heard
of otherwise. It's like, if you'rebig into music, let's say, your
Instagram will be filled with musicstuff and not ever any educational
content ever. And I'm not sayinghave the social media platforms mix

(01:51:16):
it up, that would be cool from a topdown kind of way. I'm advocating for
a bottom up kind of, you just have tolook it up. I've gotten myself into
the rhythm of this little game that Iplayed with myself of like, I'm
gonna look up some random subject.I'm not gonna look, I'm just gonna
sit here and think of somethingrandom and be like, Venezuelan
archeology and look up somethinglike that. I've gotten kind of like,

(01:51:37):
you know, as much as I've like done islike, some random subject in the
world, I'll just look that up, seewhat comes up, and then be like, huh,
and then that's my time for, that'slike what, five, 10, 15 minutes or
something? As opposed to like,scrolling on social media all the
time. That's rare, I wish itweren't. Not maybe not that
specifically, but just like thepoint of, I wonder if I would have

(01:51:59):
considered engineering straightout of high school if it were
presented to me because it wasn't. Igot a high school and I was a
journalism major because I workedfor the school newspaper, so I
wasn't presented with anythingelse. It's like if there were a
career fair or something where it'slike, here's the medical field,
here's law, here's STEM. I wasn'tpresented anything in STEM, right?

(01:52:25):
Now I'm like, having met people whoare studying that kind of stuff,
it's like, part of me really wishes Idid that. I mean, with my mentality,
it's like I am very detail-orientedand practical and pragmatic when it
comes to things, and I've appliedthat to music, but part of me wonders
if there's some sort of alternateuniverse where if I found
engineering or some sort ofscientific something that early, I

(01:52:46):
could have been that easy. Likeeasily, had I found that out
earlier, I worry that there's notop-down recommendations for
things like that, so you have to seekthem out. And the tough thing is to
look up things that you do not know.And it's not even things you
dislike. Maybe that's a start of Iactually hate sports, but let me

(01:53:09):
just look into sports, why not? It'slike some people don't even know
that civil engineering, which isfascinating, and I didn't find that
out until very, very late intocollege, I'm like, if somebody told
me about that, bro, it would havebeen over, but nobody did. It's like
there are so many fields out therethat are just fascinating and they
need people and people just don'tknow about them. And so until

(01:53:31):
there's some sort of systemic way ofpresenting that, which would take
way too long to implement, it'slike, hey, while you're young, look
up as many different things aspossible, you have to do it, which is
effortful, but it's effort that'llpay off in the end because it might
lead you to a life path thatdefinitely would not have been

(01:53:53):
presented to you. That is beautifuladvice, and everybody who changed
their majors three times shouldhave heard this advice eight years
ago. So really. I think you justdescribed to me, like something
like eight years ago. Oh, I'm sosorry. I changed my major like four
or five times. Well, actually, I'mnot sorry, but I'm glad you said that

(01:54:16):
because. Literally eight years agotoo. It's great advice because it's
coming from the horse's mouth, so tospeak. If you wanna hear what it's
like to be a rapper, don't listen tome, listen to you. If you wanna hear
what it's like to be a coder, talk tome. So great freaking advice,
really, really good. And yeah, man,fucking great, dude. Your brain

(01:54:38):
needs to be explored more, but Ithink my stomach needs to get
filled. Gabriel, where can peoplefind you? I know I have your
SoundCloud. Is there anywhere elsefolks can find you on the internet?
I'm most active on Instagram.That's my artist Instagram, a lot of
rap videos and whatnot. That'sMataMoney, M-A-T-A-M-O-N-E-Y,

(01:55:03):
MataMoney. If you look up Mr.Master, M-R-Dot, M-A-S-T-E-R on
YouTube or Spotify or something,you'll be able to find me that way.
Beautiful. If you could do me a hugefavor and just send me a Reddit
message with all of these links. Ohsure, yeah, yeah, totally. And I'll
put them in the show notes and all ofthat good stuff. Gabriel, thank you

(01:55:26):
so much for your time today. I knowwe've been talking a long time, but
thank you so much. I genuinelyappreciate it and you are a
fascinating person. Likewise,man. Oh, man, this is special. I
appreciate it. I really, really,really do. Thank you for listening 1450 01:55:39,220 --> man, I appreciate it. Awesome, have a great day. You too.

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#26 Mr. Master | Attractive women, rapping, big questions

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}#26 Mr. Master | Attractive women, rapping, big questions