How Deep is God’s Love? Breaking Down Ephesians 3

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ti’heasha Beasley (00:00):
Foreign.

Pastor Brent McQuay (00:10):
Welcome to Between Sermons. I am your
host, Brent McQuay. I'm the lead pastor
at Disciples Church, and I'm trying really
hard right now not to laugh because
we've just been having a little bit
too much fun before the camera started
rolling. But, hey, we are here to
continue a conversation from Sunday. So what
we love to do in this podcast
is take the content from Sunday that's

(00:32):
usually, you know, very much a monologue,
just a guy on a stage talking
at a group of people, and we
turn that into an actual conversation where
we can have some back and forth
and ask questions and almost kind of
view this as you get to get
a glimpse of a small group in
session as we discuss the sermon. As
always, you don't have to have heard
the sermon in order to get something

(00:53):
out of this time. But if you
do want to catch that sermon, if
you missed it, it is in the
show notes for you. And so we
are diving through the book of Ephesians,
and to help me do that, as
always, is the one and only Taisha.

I am so happy to be back.
Did you guys. Well, you. You don't
really count, Pastor Issa, but.

Pastor Asa Slaughter (01:10):
That'S the way to start off this
podcast.

No, I'm just playing. You do count.
You count. Did you miss me?

No, I don't know how to answer
that question, because if I say I
missed you, then that's throwing shade on
Pretty.

No. Pretty.

Good job.

I feel like Pretty did a great
job last year.

She did a great job. If I'm
ever. I feel so confident now. If
I ever need to take on Monday,
Pretty can step in. And is that
if you ever need.

To or if you ever want.

Want to both apply. No. Yeah, no.
It was a really good show last
week. I had an opportunity to look
at it. Guys. You guys did good.
But I'm just saying, overall, did you
miss my bubbly personality? Because you're gonna
get that all the time.

Absolutely.

Okay.

And I don't count, so it doesn't
even matter.

You do count. You're like Pastor Carlton
and Pastor. So that chair stays rotating.
You count.

Middle chair.

Lives matter. Well, well, that brings me.
Yes. That brings me to introducing our
amazing, wonderful guest, our campus pastor here
at Disciples Church, Pastor Asa. Welcome.

Thank you. I'm happy to be here.
You're happy that.

Okay.

I know that my identity is in
Christ and not whether y'all believe I
count or not, so therefore, I'm happy
to be here.

No, you totally count. I was just.
Okay. Anyway, I'm not going to explain
myself, because we'll be there all day.
But no, this is going to be
a great conversation because we are continuing
the conversation with book of Ephesians. And
before we go any further, how has
it been. How has this series been
rolling out to you? Like, I know,
Pastor Brent, you've been teaching it, so

(02:41):
I don't know if you have a
lot of insight and, like, what you
feel like it's doing in regards to
impact, but what do you think about
it so far?

I mean, so. So one of the
things that I love is just anytime
we. We take the time to just
really dive into just one.

Yeah.

Book. And I think that sometimes, like,
that's. I guess that's like the danger
of culture when it's all about the
verse of the day.

Yes.

Like, you just. You're taking a bit
from here and you're taking a bit
from there and taking a bit from
over here. But, like, these books were
written as letters, right? Like the New
Testament. They're letters. So, like, when would
you ever, like, get a letter from
somebody that you love and flip to,
like, the third page of the letter,
read the 15th line on the sheet
of paper and be like, oh, cool,
that's all I need for today.

Yeah, I know.

Like, read the whole thing. And so
I love the fact that we're able
to just systematically just kind of walk
through verse by verse by verse. And
so I think that's been great. And
then, you know, I'm leading a group
every week and getting to hear feedback
from. From the guys that are. Are
reading this. This book. Some of them
for the very first time, others for,
like, the 18th time and everything in
between. And it's just. It's really cool

(03:45):
to get other people's insights into the
scriptures and how it affects them. Yeah,
I like it.

I just told you before the show.
But you've been preaching. Preaching. I feel
like you've been preaching.

I'm also not a preacher.

What do you think? Pastor Asa, I
feel like he's been preaching on that
stage, so it's been great.

But I'm also. I'd like to just
read the Word, so I'm good with
sermons where you pretty much just reading
the Word, so it's been really good
to follow up as far as the
groups go. I got a group also
of 12 now, 13 men that. It's
just been. It's just laid out so
well to be able to just jump
right into the conversation. And the conversation

(04:22):
just based around it has just been.
It's been Very, very good. The. The
sermon, everything is just flown together from
Sunday to Wednesday prayer to the groups
and to doing it all over again.
It's been awesome. So Pastor Brent and
I don't even know if he was
at prayer two weeks ago when I
led prayer, but he basically stole a
page out my book.

See how he threw you under the
bus?

He basically stole a page out my
book. So he took the prayer from
Ephesians 3 and prayed it over the
church yesterday and told everybody to pray
it daily. So is still Monday. For
those of you that have not followed
through with reading Ephesians 3, 14, 21,
do it. But two weeks ago, I
read Ephesians 1, 16, 23 over D.C.

(05:06):
and I know y'all talked about it
on the podcast last week about how
our mission, vision, values or how our
no God, find freedom, discover purpose came
from. From that. And it was something
that, you know, we didn't discuss it
or anything, but I just. We were
in chapter one and I just felt
like I should pray this over D.C.
and start praying this over D.C. because
this is who we are. So I
love that you took the prayer from

(05:28):
chapter three and prayed it over the
congregation and just let everybody know how
important and how good of a prayer
that that is. Sometimes you don't have
to make things up. You can just
take the prayers that are in the
Bible and pray them. So that's awesome.
It's one of the prayers. Actually, both
of those prayers are something that back
in 2003, I came home from college
and committed to the Lord and I

(05:50):
used to just pray both of them
pretty consistently just because one of the
ministries I was partnered with that was
part of their prayer letter was, hey,
pray these prayers. You know what I
mean? So it just reminded me to
man, get back to praying those consistently
because they're just so powerful. I was
like, why did he tell them just
a week? Why don't we just keep
going? But anyway, but your assignment is
seven days, so pray it. It's good.

Yeah, yeah, it's cuz the reason why
it's only seven days is cuz then
we get to chapter four and there's
a whole lot of stuff you got
to do in chapter four.

Yeah, yeah.

Oh, I still want to get.

You just want to jump into chapter
four. We going to have to wait
till next week to do that. You.
So the way you are on fire
about chapter four, I would say that
chapter three really set me on fire
because I'm already doing kind of like
my own study on Psalms 1. 239.
And I know they're totally different, but

(06:43):
there was something in chapter three that
really stuck out to me, was when
you talked about love and how much
God really loves us. What verse was
that? And as you can see, I
have my Bible for all the haters.
I'm sorry, actually, actually, this is not
my Bible. This belongs to the church.

(07:04):
But I brung a Bible. I brung
a Bible on the episode.

I mean, I was about to bring
up the fact that you had to
go to your husband's office to get
a Bible.

But then why?

Wow.

I just didn't want to be on
here with my phone again. I wanted
to show that I elevate. I take
constructive criticism and I go higher. But
then you come with your phone.

I consider the Bible, but it's right.

Here on my phone. It's just easier.
This is 2025.

I'm already, like, in a cage over
here with this microphone, this, this chair,
this slim fit chair. I mean, the
Bible is too much.

Okay, got it right here. Compact. No,
I think it's good. Going back to
what I was saying, there is a
verse that talked about how. Why God's
love was and how vast it was.
And it reminded Me of Psalms 139.
Because he's talking about how much he
knows you. God is talking about how
much he knows you, and he sees

(07:57):
you. And what really is standing out
to me with this is that if
we understood how much God loved us,
it would solve maybe like, 50% of
the problems we have in our life.
Because it's like, I don't think sometimes,
like, we'll read a, A, a passage
about God's love and then we'll just
like, oh, that sounds good. I didn't

(08:18):
think you said in your message yesterday
for somebody else, but not for me.
So let's, let's. Let's talk a little
bit about that.

And I, I think that's true, but
I think it's true for a lot
of God's word. If we would take
it to heart and actually believe it,
yeah. It would change probably 95% of
our lives if we actually just took
it to heart and believed it and
applied it.

This is such a weird thing to
say, but, like, if people would just
read their Bible and do what it
says, I'd be out of a job.

Out of a job. Crazy.

There's no need for me.

Yeah, it is, because you'll need some
interpretation.

I mean, but if people got to
a point in their life where, like,
they could actually take God's word and
properly interpret and apply it in their
life and start living off of it.
Like, like, I mean, how much of
our pastoral role is counseling people when
they start doing something they shouldn't have
done, when they get into a place
that's, like, challenging. And like, so much

(09:10):
of what we do is just help
people get into their Bible.

Yeah, no, that's true. And just help
people to use it. Like, I know
you see this and you're reading it,
but why don't we.

Apply this to our lives? So.

Yeah, no, that's true. That's a huge
part of man's issue.

Well, I love it every Sunday. So
every Sunday we're reading the entire chapter
to start, and it takes, you know,
three, four minutes to read through all.
But I love it because, like, there's
some people that while you're reading it
are like, oh, yeah, that's good. Amen.
And then there's times when, like, I
finish reading all of it, I look
out there and there's like the glazed
look on people's faces. Like, like the
last four minutes, I have no idea
what just happened.

Right, right. So instead of reading all
of the chap. The verses, the whole
chapter, what I think will be helpful,
Pastor Brain, is if you just give
us a quick summary of what the
chapter is and we can dive into
some of those themes.

Yeah. So the overview of chapter three
is basically Paul's going to pray a
prayer to close out the doctrinal section.
Now, this is partially. This is my
interpretation of events. I've got a lot
of scholars that will kind of say
the same thing, but he starts verse
1 and verse 14 with the exact
same phrase. For this reason, I. And

(10:18):
so the implication there is like, Paul
is he's just preached the Gospel for
two chapters and now he's transitioning into
all of the stuff we're supposed to
do. The therefore is about to come.
But he wants to make sure that,
hey, when you're doing all of these
things, you understand why you're doing it
and how you're able to do it.

(10:39):
And so he has to get people
to understand the doctrinal things. It's really.
It's the beliefs that enable and fuel
the behavior. And if you try and
give people behavior without beliefs, it just
becomes rule following and they don't know
why. And then there's rebellion and just.
It's a mess. Right. It's like the,
the whole adage of like when your.
And you're trying to tell your kid
what to do and what not to
do. Like, there comes a point where

(11:00):
you actually have to explain the why,
not just the, hey, do this. Right,
right. And so, so Paul has been
laying out all of the why. And
then he wants to pray, which is
very typical for Paul to kind of
create a bridge from one section to
the next. And so as he's about
to go into that prayer, it's almost
like the Holy Spirit taps him and

(11:21):
is like, hey, are you sure they
got it? Like, make sure they got
it. And so he just, for 13
verses, he just kind of recaps chapter
one. And he, he's just highlighting the
mystery of the gospel and the unity
in Christ. Right? So chapter one, he's
in Christ, in Christ, in Christ. Chapter
two, he's talking all about this unity.
Now Chapter three, he's reminding us that

(11:41):
we are now one in Christ. Jews
and Gentiles. So the Jewish people and
everybody else, like, so for anybody that's
like, I don't know what a gentile
is, it's everybody that's not Jewish.

Right?

It's just two categories of people, Jewish
and not Jewish. And so we are
all united in Christ. And up until
this moment, there was a belief that
Jews and Gentiles would be united one
day. But the belief from the Jewish
standpoint was that the only way unification
could happen was through conversion, that people
would begin to worship God by following

(12:13):
his commandments. All 600 and what is
it, 13? I always mix up the
number 6, 33.

6, 13.

6, 13, something like that, 600 plus
commandments. And so the, the Jewish idea
was, yeah, yeah, we can be united.
When you get circumcised and when you
stop eating pork and when you stop
wearing mixed fabrics and when you start
worshiping the right way and when you
start. So there's all this, like, you
all need to come join us, then

(12:39):
we're unified.

Yeah.

And Christ is like, how about we
all meet in a different place? And
so we're now united not as Jews
or gentiles. That's why Paul later on
is going to write, you know, now,
therefore there is no longer Jew or
gentile. Greek. Yeah.

So I think what's cool about that,
how you just said, how about we
all just meet in a different place?
Well, if you connect that to the
fact that God made that decision before
the foundations of the earth, we've learned
that you have some people who have
a hang up with the fact that,
well, why were the Jewish people special
at the end of the day? From
the foundation of the world, we were

(13:15):
all to meet in a different place.
So God had all of us on
his mind from the beginning.

And it's funny if, like, if you
just read your Old Testament, it comes
up over and over and over again
where God through the prophets is like,
I didn't pick you because you're special.
I pick you because I chose to.
Like, it was just grace. Like, I
could have picked somebody else.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Like, I just. I just chose you.
Not because you're awesome, not because you're
better than anybody else, but.

Right.

I picked you. And if you really
follow the narrative of Scripture is he
usually picks the weakest and the smallest
and the. The least likely. So, like,
when you start getting, like, all like,
ooh, he picked me, it's like, that
probably means you're not that great. Right.
Which, you know, that's humbling, but also
kind of freeing and, you know, it's
kind of fun.

Yeah.

So. Yeah. So that's the first half.
So 1 through 13 is kind of.
That he goes on a rabbit trail.

Yeah.

The best way to put it. Then
14 starts his prayer. So he says,
for this reason, I, Paul, bow my
knee to the Father. And so the
bowing of the knee to the Father,
that's like the start of his prayer.
And then 14 through 21, he prays
a prayer that it's. It's really. It's
like a prayer through the Trinity. Right.
Like, so he starts off with the
Father, and then he moves into the

(14:28):
Spirit, and then he moves into Christ.
And really, this. The summary of the
prayer, especially that first section of the
prayer, is just, father, grant me power
through the Spirit so that Christ may
dwell within me. He just says it
in a lot more words because he's
Paul.

Yeah.

And then he says some awesome stuff
that I'm so glad that he says.
And he ties it into how wide
is God's love? And then he ties
it into now to him who's able
to do abundantly more than all that
we could ask or think, or. It's
just.

I mean, you really laid that out.
So if you did not watch that
sermon, go back and watch it because
you. You're saying it, like. And he
just said. And he just said. But
when you did it on stage, it
was like you talked about the cross
and the width and the death, and
you talked about the abundant part. Like,
you really painted a really good picture

(15:16):
for us.

Yeah. And. And. And. And I, like,
I can't even take credit. I mean,
that's. That's commentary. That's. That's how a
Lot of people have. Have been able
to interpret when, when he starts giving
quantifiable, like, measurements, it's okay. So what
do we do with that? Like, how
do. How do we measure God's love
and the reality? God's love is measured
in the cross. But the cross, it

(15:38):
points in four directions for a reason.
It has length, it has width, it
has height, it has depth. Right. So
you see the cross and it should.
Mentally, it should. It should give you
this connection to the amazingness. I don't
know if that's a word, but the
incredible.

You'd be making up words on here
all the time. Amazingness.

The awesomeness of wow. We should get
T shirts of all.

Just the words come out, all the
names. I need someone to keep track
of these names because by the end
of Ephesians, we're gonna have a bunch
of words.

I have. I do. This is totally
off subject, but I have somebody asking
me every single Sunday about DC merch.
Can I just give them your email
address? Can I just start shooing them?

Oh, my goodness, yeah. And then I
can give that all to Pastor Carlson,
who makes the final decision there.

I got attacked about my DC merch
yesterday.

I know, like, where can I get
one of those sweaters?

I'm like, we had them at first
love. They got. Y'all do that every
time. I'm like, do we. Okay, I'm
sorry.

We do. We're working on making that
a staple, so that'll be great. Keep
you wanting more people, but just as
a little segue. I think it's becoming
more than just a T shirt. I
think people are, like, really loving this
idea of discipleship. Well, it's been around.
It's not new. It's not new. But
I had someone who is a part

(16:52):
of David and I's small group. She
was like, in. Her boyfriend got baptized
yesterday, Sean. And so she came to
DC via someone else, Tamar. She was
like, tamar discipled me and brought me,
and now I'm bringing Sean. And Sean
got baptized, so I'm discipling. So, you
know, it's not too far fetched for

(17:13):
me. So it's like people are catching
on to this whole thing. And then
she looked at Sean and was like,
now you have to go and do
this for somebody else.

Oh, yeah. One of my favorite moments
is I said something about Christian Christians
here recently and somebody was like, disciples?
And I was like, yes, Contextually, though,
Christians worked in that sentence. But yes,
but I appreciate it.

It's just amazing to see what God
is doing here. And so I think
that's why we're very excited about the
book of Ephesians as well. I want
to talk a little bit about Paul
because I feel like even though he's
not, he's. He's the person writing these
letters. But I think what makes it
so impactful for us who know about
the history of Paul, it makes it
brings this story alive. So I know

(17:56):
you mentioned that in your passage. So
let's, let's talk a little bit about
Paul. Who is he? What's his background?
And why is this so like mind
blowing that he's writing this letter to
Ephesians, the church of Ephesus?

I was talking a bunch ac. You
want to walk?

Yeah. So Paul. So basically Paul was
so passionate about his Jew, his Jewishness,
that he literally was killing Christian at
the end of the day, he was
going around so passionate about what he
believed that he took it as far
as killing folks. And then when he
got word of revelation of Jesus and

(18:33):
it was a dramatic way that that
happened, he took that same passion and
put it into following Christ. But what's
really cool about it is you have
this example of Paul who he talks
about how he's the worst sinner of
all sinners and you gave the reasons
why, which is some of those I
just mentioned. And for him to be
the one teaching us about God's love
and how deep and how far and

(18:54):
how high and how it just goes
and goes and goes is so interesting
because like you said earlier, if we
would just take God's word and use
it, my life would be so much
better. Like a lot of pastoring that
goes on or just discipling that goes
on is trying to get across to
people that God actually loves you. I
know you just screwed up, but he

(19:14):
still loves you. I know this is
the fifth time you screwed up, but
he still loves you. Like trying to
get that across the people, that's one
of the biggest fights, one of the
biggest thing that the devil fights, he
just tries to condemn and condemn and
condemn. You don't deserve this. You don't
deserve this. And no, we don't deserve
this.

He's correct.

We don't deserve it. But God's love
and the grace of God covers all
of that stuff. And it's not your
license to go do what you want
to do, but it's truly God knows
our hearts. That's what he's going to
judge. And yes, we can't do this
thing perfect. But his love and a
Revelation of his love should be what
begins to transform our lives. And that's

(19:53):
just so people need to get that.
I mean, because getting into condemnation just,
it does not pull you closer to
God, it just pulls you further away.
And the further away you are, the
more you're going to get into your
feelings, the more the devil going to
be able to tell you his lies
and the more you going to buy
them.

Yes.

When at the end of the day,
we have a perfect example of a
horrible man in Paul who's probably more
horrible than most of us. I don't
know how many of us have committed
murder, but I mean, realistically, in our
hearts, God's grace was sufficient for Paul,
his love is sufficient for Paul. And
Paul was able to. And some may

(20:29):
think, yeah, but can I really change
when I was that bad? Yes, actually
with Christ in Christ, you can change.
And that's really what he laid out
that whole time, is that none of
this is about to be you. This
is about to be what you can
do in Christ. In Christ, In Christ.
That's why he just drives that home.
That this walk is about you saying,

(20:50):
yes and saying, I'm actually in Christ.
Let me continue to walk this out
and not quit. And that's just. I
was having that conversation literally driving from
church. Pastoring don't end when church ends.
And when you leave, I'm driving home
and I'm like, ah, I got a
text. Well, let me respond to this
person now while I'm driving because when
I get home, I would love to
be with my family. And literally the
conversation is, man, God still loves you.

(21:12):
It's okay. God, did you not hear
the message that was just preached like
it was for you, man? And it's
just, ah, we got to get a
hold of that. We just do.

Yeah. My. I don't even know who
to give credit to this quote anymore.
But I heard it from my parents.
I don't know if they heard it
firsthand, but a famous pastor was being
questioned, like, what's the hardest thing to
teach your people? Like, is it tithing?
Is it, you know, what's the hardest
thing to teach your people? And he
said, no, no, hand, hands, tithing, all

(21:42):
that stuff that's super easy to teach.
The hardest thing to teach is how
much God actually loves them. And like,
man, the more I've been doing this,
I've been full time ministry for 22
years now, man, I feel old. 22
years of full time ministry.

Why are you telling him that? He's
young, okay?

At the end of the day though,
I absolutely 100 agree. That's the hardest.
Like we could probably teach people about
God's love every single Sunday for a
whole year and you'd still have somebody
at the end of the day going,
but I just don't know if God
loves me.

Yeah, yeah.

And, and I think part of it
is there is a demonic attack. I
think there is a satanic element of
this. Even with how many people in
our lives that were supposed to love
us didn't. How many of us have
felt betrayal or abandonment or had somebody
that said they loved us but then
treated us in a way that wasn't.

(22:36):
And so we feel that and we
see that and we experience that and
then God comes along, he says I
love you. And we're like yeah, but
so did they.

Yeah, that's good.

And I even had to, I'm like,
well Paul's example wasn't enough. So then
I went to David and I'm like
going through all of David's issues and
like I'm kind of showing him what
I've learned lately just reading David and
Saul's story and how King Saul was
always just pointing the finger. He was
like, he'd screw up and he'd point
the finger and blame everybody else. And

(23:07):
then David just as bad, but he
would screw up and he would say
Lord, my bad, I did this and
I repent. And the difference to me
is that that's the difference.

The acknowledgement.

Yeah, acknowledge it. But also don't be
afraid to come to God and say
I did it, I repent. What's wrong
with me, I'm an idiot.

Because he already knows, Lord forgive me.

And then you move forward with your
life and try to do better. Ye
end of that was David was a
man after God's own heart. Yeah. That
don't make sense to none of us
cuz he was a screw up. But
at the end of the day we're
all screw ups so well.

And then like, and back to Paul.
Like you've got Paul saying he'll, you
know, imitate me as I imitate Christ.
But then you also have Paul talking
about this thorn in his flesh that
he can't overcome. You get Paul talking
about how the things I know I'm
supposed to do, I don't do. The
things I don't want to do, I
keep doing. And like he's expressing like
human, average human Christianity like just like
trying to do the right thing and

(24:03):
screwing it up.

Yeah.

And but we look at Paul is
like, but Paul was perfect. Like, Paul
was amazing. He was so awesome. And
Paul's like, dude, I'm. I'm just as
messed up as. Yes, but it's the
grace of God.

Yes.

And that was the stuff at one
when he was a believer. That wasn't
for the believer stuff. That was the
believer stuff.

Right after I put my faith in
Jesus, I'm still trying to figure this
out. Not that I have yet achieved
it, but I'm continuing to run the
race.

Yeah, yeah.

We're all. We're on this journey together.

Yeah. I'm going to say that that
is what makes. I think that's why
God use those who have these major
crazy testimonies. Because if it was like
not saying he can't use the perfect,
I guess, you know, if there's the
perfect, if there's a perfect, I think
he uses the screwed up people to

(24:51):
show like, I am God. You do
need a savior. You do need a
redeemer. And that is what makes the
story even more incredible is the fact
that he had such a horrible history.
According to our standards, God redeemed him.
Now he's preaching the gospel and, and
getting other people saved. Like, that's incredible.

Yeah, it's really good. It's really good.

Yeah. The guy that gave God a
million reasons not to be lovable is
the one telling us how much God
loves us.

Yeah. Let me be. Did you know
God knew that he would be redeemed
and he would no longer crucify Christians
or kill Christians?

Yes. Because God is.

He's sovereign.

Sovereign.

That's my word.

See, you get yourself. You do it
to yourself at the end of the
day.

But did you know? Did you know
he knew that?

I know that God is all knowing.
Yes, Yes, I am aware of his
omniscience.

Yes.

And he's good with.

He is.

And if we would just follow him
and obey, it can go different than
what we might want it to go.

Yeah.

And he didn't make Paul do it.
Paul had a choice and he did
it.

And he used that for his glory.

He absolutely did.

Okay. So. No, I'm not. I'm. Leave
it alone. Because I can go deeper.
I can go deeper. No, I know,
I know. You're so, you're so kind.
You're a great campus pastor. Who was
pastor?

I mean, we did hire him so
that he could balance Carlton. I. We
needed some love in the. In the
mix.

In the, the mix. Yes. So there
was something you brought up yesterday during
your message and you were like, we're
Going to talk about that on the
podcast. So let's dive into that. What
verse was that? That.

It's before verse 10. 10 is where
it goes into the. Or the object
lesson.

Yeah, the mystery. We're going to dive
in first.

Nine, maybe eight and nine.

Yeah, that's where he talks about. It
was made known in other generations.

Yes. So yeah.

And. And to reveal for all people
what is the fellowship of the mystery,
which from the beginning of the ages
has been hidden in God who created
all things through Jesus Christ. That one.

Yeah, yeah.

He kind of mentions it a couple
times when he's talking about the mystery.
Yeah. Earlier in verse five when he
says, which was not made known in
the sons of men and other generations,
as it has now been revealed to
his holy apostles and prophets by the
Spirit.

So yeah. Why did he choose?

Yeah, so, so I'm gonna give the
first, I'm gonna give the, the honest
answer that nobody's gonna wanna hear and
then we can hypoth, like make some
hypothetical. Okay, like we can.

I like that game.

We can.

Making stories. I'm a story.

There's a word that I'm trying to
figure out and it's just, it's escaping
me right now. My brain is, is
on vacation.

Storytelling.

No, no, it's all right, we'll move
on.

Okay.

So anyways, the, the primary answer to
that question is cuz he's God. Who
knows? Like, like, like we, we, we,
we really don't, we really genuinely don't
know.

So you made them wait?

No, no, no.

There's.

There's a bunch more that we can
say about it. So we don't fully,
fully, fully know. You know, it's God's
will, God's wisdom. He knows things that
we don't know. He sees things that
we don't know. And so basically the
question, if I can lay it out
first though, is why Jesus came in
the first century. Why didn't Jesus come
earlier than that? You know, you got

(28:19):
a couple thousand years of them struggling
and promising a messiah. Like, I mean
if you read the Old Testament, it's
like the Messiah is promised in Genesis
chapter, what is it, three, Chapter two,
Somewhere in there. I'm blanking now, but
right at the beginning, right when they
sin and he's like, okay, but your
seed is going to crush the serpent.
So the Messiah's promise in Genesis right

(28:41):
at the very beginning, but then it's
repeated like with Pretty much every prophet
is coming in saying, the Messiah is
coming, the Messiah's coming, Messiah's Coming, it's
like thousands of years and Messiah ain't
come. So why didn't he come earlier?
And then a lot of people, especially
skeptics, will, will bring up this argument
of like, well, you know, it's really
convenient that he came in a time
when, you know, our historical records aren't

(29:02):
very good. Like, if he had come
in 2000 and everybody had a cell
phone camera, like we could, you know,
and then you get into weird arguments
because I was like, yeah, but fake
stuff with AI like, somebody would be
like, oh, he's walking on water. I
know how that magic trick is done,
right? So there's, there's all kinds of
like, stuff. So, so why the first
century? And so first and foremost, we
don't know. But there is a prophetic

(29:23):
word given in the book of Daniel
in chapter nine that talks about these
77s. And so it's laying out a
time frame of when the temple is
going to be rebuilt, when the temple
is going to be destroyed again, and
that the Messiah is going to come
at a certain point in time between
those events, but that he would, he
would. There's a special language that they

(29:45):
use for he's going to leave that
isn't like he's going to leave. It's
basically like he's going to die horribly
and then a certain number of years
are going to pass and then the
temple is going to be destroyed. So
based off of that, the temple is
destroyed in 70 AD by, by the
Romans. But if we backtrack the. The
years and this is where it gets
into like, this is stuff that's way.

(30:05):
I might sound smart on the podcast,
but I'm an idiot. So like, this
is above my head too. But they.
Based on the Jewish calendar was 360
days, not 365 days. And if you
do the math, it actually brings you
to the Messiah is going to be
crucified in 32 A.D. like, if you
do. If you run the math from
the prophecy in Daniel and you run

(30:25):
it out, then it puts it right
in line with when we believe Jesus
would have been crucified right about 32,
33 AD and it's like the perfect
segment of years based on that prophetic
word. So why did God make that
prophetic word? You know, this is hundreds
of years before Jesus. Why did he
make that prophetic word? We don't know.

(30:46):
But the Messiah had to come before
the second temple was destroyed, which happened
in 70 A.D. so if that prophecy
is going to be fulfilled, Messiah has
to come in this window. And that's
when he came. So it's kind of
cool.

Yep.

Okay. Do you have something you want
to add on that?

Something real? Just a clarifying thing because,
I don't know. People may not know.
32 AD people think that's after death.
Jesus come 32 years after death.

Yeah. So the time. The language of
the time frame is actually kind of
weird. Jesus was actually crucified. Historically, they
would say. I think some scholars would
put it somewhere between 30 and 33.
A lot of scholars will just say
33. There's some that will say 32,
but it's right in that window of
when Jesus actually was crucified, actually died.

(31:40):
So AD after death was more of
like a layman's term. Like, it was
just to give a window of when
that. It actually. There's a Latin word
for it that has nothing to do
with death.

But, yeah, I can't think of the
word.

Yeah, I'm too stupid.

That's why I went to you.

That's why I said, I ain't remember
that word. My wife looks at me
sometimes. She's like, you're so smart. I'm
like, I am just an idiot that
can research.

But there was a point where that
was confusing. I was like, but that's
after death. That don't make sense. But
yeah, it didn't. It didn't really mean.

Yeah, no, there's a lot of people
that think that the. The year Jesus
was crucified is zero. And then we
count from there. But it's actually, technically,
you would say it's like Jesus birth
would be zero.

Yeah.

Because he. He died at 33. So.
Yeah, but even then, it's, you know,
the way time works and. Yeah, like
the Jewish calendar being 360 days, not
365, throws some people's math off. Like,
well, 70 times 7.

I'm just so basic because I'm like,
well.

Okay, so.

So that.

So that. That was kind of the
cool part. Now there's even, like, a
deeper conversation. This is why I was
like, well.

We'Ll talk about something deeper than what
you just said.

Yeah, so there's a. There's a. I
don't know if deeper is the right
word for it, but there's other hypothesis.

Okay.

Those things. Because Rome changed the world
and first century, because of Rome, there
were three things that enabled messages to
be transmitted more clearly. So the Church
being started in the first century actually

(33:14):
makes a lot of sense. So with
Rome conquering so much of the world,
especially that part of the world. It
meant that there was stability, like, there
was peace to a degree in that
area. So, like, if you want to
be able to communicate a message, peace
is a great time to do it.
On top of that, Roman infrastructure brought

(33:38):
in Koine Greek, as the common language.
In a lot of ways, it would
be like English today, right? We're like,
it's not just people in England that
are speaking it, right? So. So it
wasn't just the Greeks that were speaking
Koine Greek, which. Koine just means common.
So, like, the common Greek was being
spoken in a lot of different places.
In fact, if to do business, especially
if you were a trader or something,

(33:58):
like, you had to speak this language
because that was the language that you
could get by with everywhere. So now
there's a common language for a large
portion of the world where the message
can be transmitted more easily. And then
on top of that, there's an infrastructure
that the Romans bring in with roads.
And so Roman roads was, like, way
different than how travel and things would

(34:19):
happen before. So now you're able to
travel greater distances with greater ease. And
it's really. The first time is in
the first century. So there's, like, there's
historical reasons why first century Roman occupied
Jerusalem is the perfect time and place
for the Messiah to come so that
the church can be birthed, so that

(34:39):
the message of salvation can spread.

So I hope that that answers your
questions, guys.

And if that didn't and at the
end of the day, why did he
wait to the first century? Because he's
God and he does what he wants
to do, not what you want.

I like that answer. That's the easy
answer.

Some people are gonna be like, I
tuned in for that.

No, no. I mean, it was good.
It was good. A lot of those,
like, David, he'll love that little portion.
You just.

I mean, those kind of things are
really fascinating to me. Like. Yeah, and
like, I love Roman and Greek history
when I was in school. And so
just learning some of those things and
then seeing where the. The Christian message,
the story comes in, in the midst
of all that, I think it's fascinating.

I agree. It shapes, you know, our
history. It shapes the Bible. So I
agree with that.

And. And God's. God's got plans and
God's smart.

Yeah. Very strategic.

God knows what this message would have
looked like if it came in 2025.

Yeah.

Versus it coming in the year 3380.

Man, every time you say that, I
just think about the way 2025 is
set up already. If we didn't know
Jesus before. At this point, I would
probably be. We would. None of us
would be sitting here. Let's just say
that may not be. Or it would
be really tough.

And things would be. Be different.

So different.

Just because you don't have the Holy
Spirit in mankind. I know, I know
God was doing marvelous things, just, you
know, using people. But it helps to
have some Holy Spirit filled people on
the earth to try to hold back
some of the evil and things like
that.

And that's the man. So this is
probably like, this is. I'm about to
open up a whole can of worms.

Let's do it.

Ty's gonna roll her eyes at me.

Okay. Okay.

So like, I hear a lot of
people blame Christianity for things like slavery
in the US because like there's a
slave Bible and, and all this stuff
and that, that, you know, Christians were
slave owners and all this stuff. And
the reality though is it was Christians
that drove abolition. Like, it was, it
was Christians that were driving this whole,

(36:51):
hey, this is not right. This is
not okay. Yeah, there were some people
that used Christianity to try and mask
the right. They would take Paul saying
there's no longer slave or free, and
they're like, see, so it doesn't matter
that you're my slave. It's like, man,
that's not the message of the Bible
though. And so there's a distortion of
it. But it was, it was, it
was Bible believing Christians actually in England

(37:12):
that started this, this rebellion against. Hey,
this whole slavery thing doesn't make sense
from a Christian perspective. And so Fast
forward to 2025 and here we are.
And like racism is still alive and
well in our country and there's all
kinds of just issues that are going
on.

Yeah.

And if people would just go to
their Bible and actually do what it
says to do and actually love each
other the way that we're supposed to
love each other. Like, racism literally makes
absolutely no sense for a Christian.

Yeah, I agree.

I don't know how you could read
the New Testament and be like, yeah,
I'm gonna hate that person because of
the color of their skin. Yeah, like,
how stupid do you have to be?

Yeah, no, I think I'm not gonna
roll my eyes. I don't know why
you felt like I would.

We were just open up.

Like, I know it is.

Let's talk about racism.

I literally just said we should not
know. But I feel like that was
a great segue to the unity piece
that we talked about in the Message
yesterday. So it's like, how can you
not talk about unity without identifying ways
that we are dysfunctional in 2025? And
so I think it's just a very,

(38:17):
I love how you stated that we
are unified in the body of Christ
and that's where the unity starts for
us. And I, and I know there's
a lot of people who have opinions
about, well, you know, well, this happened
to, to us or even within the
political parties. Like, you voted this way,
you voted that way. David and I
intentionally do not get involved in those

(38:39):
conversations because honestly, we are heavenly minded
not to say that we tried to
live higher than other people, but we
have to stay focused on God. Like
I am a citizen of the kingdom
of God and I, Brent is my
brother in Christ just like you are
my brother in Christ. And it does

(39:00):
not matter your skin tone because we
are unified because we have the same
father.

Amen.

So, you know, and it's a tough,
we don't talk about politics on our
social media or any of this, you
know, because it can get tough, you
know, when you're trying to, to defend
what you really stand on because, you
know, I am, I am African, African
American woman. We can't, you know, take
that off the table. Can't deny that.

(39:27):
And I do understand that there's things
not to go into. There's things that
we do deal with. But I unify
on all topics.

We've decided we're going to be kingdom
focused.

Yeah.

So there's some subject matters that when
it's brought up in kingdom language, hey,
we'll talk about it when there's scripture
to address it. Hey, we'll address it.
We're not going out of our way
to just bring in a political message
one way or the other. Right. Because
that's not our focus is Jesus. How
do we get Jesus across? And so,

(39:58):
yeah. But yeah, there's elements of alleviating
poverty and working on all these other
things. You need that. Yeah, we're going
to address it. We're going to walk
through those things. But at the end
of the day, like our message is
Jesus died for you.

Yeah.

And I think it's just, I'm going.

To get hate mail after this, but.

It'S okay, you'll be fine. I think
it's as simple as the individual, we're
the body of Christ, but the individual
needs to say, okay, what is this
Bible telling me? And where am I
out of line with this Bible?

Yeah.

And our job is to we get
in line with what the word of
God says, regardless if it offends our
sensibilities concerning race, concerning sex, concerning any
of it.

Yeah.

Our job is to line up with
what we learn that the word of
God says, now if you don't know,
you don't know. But I got a
feeling everybody know that racism's wrong or
sexism or a lot of those things.
So at the end of the day,
we have to constantly tweak our behavior,
our mindset with the word of God.
We've got to constantly tweak who we

(40:58):
are based on what the Bible said
we need to be.

Yeah.

And it's just that simple. Now we
can do that or we can allow
the opinions of man, the opinions of
whomever, to shape who we are, or
we cannot. We can decide to say,
yeah, I'm going to choose what God
says over the color of my skin.
It actually don't matter. It just truly
doesn't. What matters is what the word

(41:23):
of God tells us.

Yeah.

And at the end of the day,
Jesus told us to love our neighbor
as ourselves. That's as clear cut.

What if my neighbor's a different skin
tone than me?

As ourselves. And. And in my experience,
the more you get to know people,
the more you realize you and people
are just alike.

Yeah.

Going through a lot of the same
stuff. Y'all are very. Y'all a lot
more similar than you think. Trust me.
And I don't have experiences all around
the world, but even in my short
little, two little mission trips that I
did to Asia twice, we are a
lot more alike than y'all think we
really are.

I will say you're a little bit
taller than. A little bit taller and
the Philippines.

A little bit taller. But we see
the same issue and can have a
heart for it. We see the same
problems and want to pray for it
and want to love each other and
want to help somebody. Like, literally, man,
we a lot more alike than we
know.

Sorry, I got to jump in because
here's one of the things that I
love about the message that Paul has
in Ephesians and in other places is
that we are one body and the
unity is within the body. But unity
does not mean uniformity.

Right?

Right. So, like, it's. He's the. And
that's why I love that he uses
body language. Because it's not if every
single one of us was a finger.

Yeah.

Like, that's a messed up body. Like,
where's your eye? Where's your nose? Where's
your ear? Like, like if everybody's a
finger. Like, so the uniformity that Some
people are looking for is completely opposite
of the message that Paul's trying to
get across through the Holy Spirit. That,
like, hey, we are one body that
makes us unified. Right? Like my whole

(43:05):
body, like all of it's still attached,
right? But this arm is different than
this arm, is different than this eye,
than this eye. And so, like, there's
this beautiful symmetry that happens when we
are coming together. But you're still bringing,
you know, your. How did you put
it? African American woman ness to it?
Is that how to. What did you.

(43:26):
You said earlier, African American womanness to
the table.

We got the words. This is another
word, guys. No, and you know what?
We can negate the experiences, right? But
if going back to that unity piece,
all of our experiences, on whatever side
you land, you filter it through the
word of God, like that's where the
unity falls in place. And I think
that's where people need to, I don't

(43:52):
want to say, become more educated because
I'm not trying to. To say it
like that, but I'm just saying, like,
as a believer, I filter my experiences
through the word of God. So it's
like I don't allow racism to. I
know it happened, it's there, I care
for it. That's my. A part of
my experience. But it don't shape who

(44:13):
I am as a. My thinking, my
perception. So it's like even on the
other side, it's like if you know,
you come from a group of people
who were mean and evil, it's like,
I don't identify with that group. I
filter it through through scripture, through my
identity in Christ. And so it's like
we don't take away from people experiences,
but we handle it through biblical perspectives

(44:37):
and languages.

At the end of the day, everybody
has a choice to make. You can
be bitter or you can be better.
Right, Right. And so we're choosing better.

Yeah, on both sides.

And it's interesting because I had a
very interesting life when it comes to
racial relations. So thank God for my
mother who was able to take her
teen boy and plant them in the
middle of tinley park, which 1993 ain't
long ago for us that's been alive.
It's long ago for some. Don't seem

(45:07):
like it should be a time where
you're dealing with a whole lot of
stuff, but we know today you're dealing
with a whole lot of stuff. So
I was able to. Well, first off,
we're living there because we had nowhere
to live. So a white man from
our church allowed us to live in
his condo until my mother could afford
to pay him. So you have this
white person that clearly he ain't. At

(45:29):
least in that context, he ain't got
no hangups. I don't know if he
like all black people, but he cool
with my mother.

Like at least one, right?

They like at least one. Now I
walk outside of the home and walk
down the street we live on. Not
live on. This church is on Ridge
Lano. Walk down Oak Park Avenue, and
they yelling the N word at me
in 1993, walking down Oak park at
13 years old. So now I go
home and I tell my mother, and
she has a decision to make. Asa,

(45:58):
those people are just blah, blah, blah,
blah, blah. Or Asa, everybody's not like
that. You should love them just like
you love me, just like you love
anybody. That person's an idiot. But everybody
of that color is not an idiot,
so don't judge them that way.

Right.

Thank you, Mama.

Yeah. Cause literally, I got a white
wife and two mixed kids, and it
wouldn't have went that way. Not that
it had to go that way because
of that, but there would have been
some real bitterness in my life if
I was taking that stuff and putting
it in my heart and allowing it
to grow. And then now my reaction
to it is a whole different thing
than the life I've been living. And

(46:36):
that was just the first week I
was there.

Yeah.

I spent four years in Tinley park,
and it didn't get no better.

Yeah.

And now I'm a pastor in Tinley
Park. It's cool. All good. I think
that's progress.

But either way, did they let you
in?

Right? Did they let me back in
the neighborhood? But either way, the more
to the story is, what are you.
How are you going to allow your
experience, your experiences, what the TV tell
you, everybody's experiences is how are you
going to take those experience and let
them get into you and change who
you are? And that's the moral to
the story.

That really is.

You can take the message that the
TV is selling you that all black
folks is this and all white folks
is that, and all Asian folks is
this. Or you can take God's word,
which tells us to love others, and
then as you experience people, you treat
them accordingly. But you remember the law
of love, which means you got to
treat them with love and respect.

It goes back to scripture. If we
just stick there anyway, we all good.

If you just stay there, you ain't
even got to go through it all.

So, yes, that's the hard Part of
Christianity, though, because it calls you to
love the racist.

Yes, absolutely.

And that is. It's hard. Yes, that
is hard. I mean, if we keep
it in a buck. Is that how
they say it? If you're keeping it
a buck.

That's been going on.

Oh, I'm too white for.

In the men's meeting, keeping it a
buck was happening, and I was like,
new flames.

It is difficult, but that's when the
scripture really matters. Not when it's easy.
Not when it's like, someone that's the
same color as me. Oh, I can
love you. Even though you do some
crazy stuff. Sometimes it's like, no, I'm
loving someone who intentionally do not love
me because of the color of my
skin, who don't know how to relate
to me and the struggles I go
to. I'm going to surrender my feelings

(48:16):
to just be like, I'm going to
love you in spite of how you're
treating me, how you feel, how you
perceive me and my experience.

Yeah. Yeah.

You can love that person. It doesn't
mean you're giving them keys to your
house, right?

No. And it don't mean I ain't
got the side eye. No, I'm just
playing.

But.

But what it does mean is you
can't carry that stuff. You can't feel
no type of way toward that person.
According to the scripture, you absolutely have
to forgive and not feel some type
of way about that person or anybody
that look like them.

That's crazy.

Anybody in a family.

This is real life.

Children, man.

We haven't even gotten to the application
stuff in chapters four, five, and six
yet.

But that. Hey, you might want to
start thinking about applying God's word now,
because it's coming. It's coming.

It's so real. It makes it real
for 20, 25. Like, this Bible makes
it real. Like, we can. We can
skate around certain issues, but the issues
we are dealing with, the word of
God written.

Yeah.

All the way back then, knew that
we would be dealing with these issues,
and it's here for us to be
our guide.

Yeah.

Yeah, man. It's good. So look at
Brett. He's like, I don't know where
to go from this.

No, no. Yeah. Now, I was just
gonna say, is there anything else in
Paul's prayer that you wanted to highlight?
Because, like, I'm. I'm curious. Like, if
you were to try and describe for
somebody or explain to somebody the. The
dimensions of God's love, like, what would
you do? How would you describe his.
The height and Depth and width and

(49:45):
length of his love.

I mean you did. I. I would
never think to use the cross as
an example. I would just try to
just talk my. Just talk. Just talk
my brains out or something. I don't
know. Like how do you can't describe.
It's unmeasurable. You can't. There's nothing.

That's why I love asking it because
it's like it literally Paul says like
you're not going to understand this, understand
it. And even then it's like really
a revelation.

Like is that something that God have
to give us like to understand his
love? I feel like it's a transformation
type of thing that happens within your
heart to perceive it.

So I, I think that there are.
There are definitely moments throughout my life
where I understood God's love better than
I had before. That moment in my
life. Like one of the biggest moments.
And I'll never forget this one. This,
this is like it just clicked. My
first son had just been born. And
I'm holding my son and I'm looking

(50:42):
at this screaming, pooping, just machine like
that's all he does, literally just scream
like and, and like. And this kid
had some kind of like colic issue
when he was first born. The first
like two or three weeks. Like I
literally had to walk around the house
from like midnight to like 6 in

(51:02):
the morning just holding him. And then
he got this weird thing where like
I had to hold him like man,
it was like Lion King moment. Like
I was like holding him like out
like this. And that made him happy.
It was like. It was like the
danger hold. Like he could fall at
any moment. That's what would finally put
him asleep. And then I'd pull him
in close when my arms would get
tired and he'd start crying again. So

(51:23):
I'm holding them out and it was
like this kid was just nothing but
problems. And every time I looked at
him I was like, I love you
so much. Like I love you. There's.
You've never earned it, you don't deserve
it. There's nothing that you have done
at up to this moment to make
me love you. In fact, everything you've
done up into this moment has made
me probably not want to love you.
And yet I look at you and

(51:44):
you're just. And it was, it was
the love of a father to a
son that for the first time it
was like. It was like in one
of those moments, it was like 2
in the morning, I'm holding him in
my, my living room and it just
Felt like God was like, now you
get it.

Yeah, that's good.

And that's so real. So in my
group the other day, I asked this
question on Tuesday, and we were talking
about God's love because.

You know, it shows up a lot.

It shows up a lot. And people
have a hard time accepting it. And
I said, how many of y'all got
children? And I said, I know from
me. I said, I got children. And
I said, how many of y'all got
children? You know, they said who they
are. And I said, what can they
possibly do to make you not love
them? Nothing. Like, to a man, it
was like, well, it ain't really nothing
they can do to make me stop

(52:27):
loving. And I'm like, okay, now multiply
that times infinity. That's God. I'm like,
that's how God loves you. And that's
exactly what happened to me with. With
my first child. It's like, oh, God,
you love. I get it.

Yeah.

And I still don't get it. We
know we don't get the fullness of
it, but I think it is. It's
a journey of, you can go. You
can just keep going up levels to
understanding how much God love you. The
more you accept experience him. And that's
what it's about. The more you experience
God, the longer you stick with him,
the longer you really try to obey

(53:02):
and put in practice what he's having
you to do, the more you grow.
It's just a process. You're going to
always be on a journey. And I
think that's going to be an eternal
thing. That's going to be part of
the awesomeness in eternity.

It is.

Is that we're going to continue to
be discovering how much God loves us.

For eternity, the unsearchable riches of Christ.

Yeah, that's lovely. And I was thinking
about that from the perspective of Paul,
who wrote this. He, you know how
you get to that moment where you're
like, having this moment with God and
you're just saying everything that you. Everything
you've experienced is just coming out of
your mouth. So that's why I feel
like this moment is for Paul. It's
like, man, I was the worst of

(53:42):
the worst, and you loved me. Like,
there is no. And then that. It
just turns us into, like a poem
almost. It's like, for this reason I
kneel. It's like you can almost feel
the passion there even when he's before
you, Father. Like, these words start to
come alive because of Paul's personal experience

(54:03):
with him. And So I think that
is my prayer for those who read
this, is that these words start to
come alive because of your personal experiences
with Jesus. And so that's. That's what
I would say.

And that's what Paul's writing it out
of. He's writing it out of his
personal experience. So you can have a
personal experience.

Yes. Yeah. That's good. So I know.
Is it time to say, let's bring
this plane.

You're the. You're the boss.

So just one last thing before we
land the plane. Let's touch a little
bit on the verse that talked about
the demons and the angels, because I
know.

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

There was some people who probably walked
away. Like my headache verse. The headache.

Okay. You want to read it? You
got it.

Yes. So I think that's verse 10.
10. Okay. His intent. What? His intent
was that now through the church, the
manifold wisdom of God should be made
known to the rulers and authorities in
the heavenly realms according to his internal
purpose. I'm getting confused reading this. His

(55:04):
eternal purpose that he accomplished in Jesus
Christ, their Lord, our Lord is. Are
you sure that's the verse?

It's verse 10.

Okay.

Yeah, you might have. You might have
skipped the part, though. No.

What version is this?

So that through the church, the manifold
wisdom of God might not be known
to the authorities in the heavenly places.
This verse 11. This is according to
his eternal purpose. Yeah, no, yeah, you
got it. Okay. Yeah. So the. The
mystery being name made known so through
the church means that were the object
lesson. And it's going to be made
known to the rulers and authorities in

(55:39):
heavenly places. So in other parts of
the Bible, when it talks about rulers
and authorities in heavenly places, it's talking
about angelic beings. Often it's talking about
demons, but it can also be referring
to angels. And so the concept here,
and I totally understand it, it still
just hurts my brain. Is that because

(56:02):
you explained it? Because it but it's
like, okay, so. But here's why it
hurts my brain. It's funny because I
brought this up in our sermon planning
and like, all the other pastors were
just like, I don't know what your
problem is. Like, literally everybody in the
room was like, brent, you just. You
got issues. But I'm like, I'm just
having such a hard time with just
the fact that every time an angel
shows up in the Bible, he opens

(56:22):
his mouth with, be not afraid. Because
angels are terrifying. Right? Like, you don't
have to show up and be like,
hey, don't be afraid. Like, have you
ever walked in the room with me
and be like, hey, branches, don't be
afraid. Like, I'm like, oh, no, Taisha's
here. Like, you're not, you're not scary,
right? But an angel apparently is. And
then if you read like, the, the

(56:43):
like anatomically correct description of angels with
their thousands of eyes all over their
bodies and multiple wings and like, there's.
There's some freaky stuff happening here. The
fact that they look at us and
go, oh, now we understand the God
that we've been face to face with
our entire existence, that makes no sense

(57:06):
to me in the sense, like, it
just. It hurts my brain because I
think for a lot of us, like
we look at angels and demons is
like these, like, whoa, this massive spiritual
being. And they're looking at us going,
wow, humans.

Demons are. See, I'm. I'm caught up
on that demon piece because I guess
I grew up in a super, like,
we feel cast out demons. And I'm
like, so when you said demons are
looking at us, I'm like, I thought
they were just sent to torment us.
Like, they're studying us, they're learning from
us.

And, and I mean, the, the. One
of the cool things about this and.
And I briefly mentioned it is that,
like, we are made in the image
of God and they're not. Like, there's
no passage in the Bible that talks
about angels or demons being created in
the image of God. Like, it's, it's
exclusive to mankind. And so, like, they're
looking at us and we're like this,
like, representation of this indestructible, omnipresent, omniscient,

(58:00):
like, amazing, powerful being. And then like,
literally a piece of paper can make
me bleed. Like, I can get a
paper cut. Yeah, like, like, I'm sorry,
but that's just. That's just wild.

I can see why as a mystery.
I mean, because they didn't. They were
kicked out of heaven, they didn't receive
any grace. And we get grace all
the time.

Yeah, yeah.

And the interesting part too is so.

Then his grace tied to the fact
that we mess up, but we haven't
seen them face to face. When they
messed up, they were literally in his
presence and still chose to rebel.

Do you know the answer? Because I
feel like it's a Bible study. I
don't know. I mean.

Yeah, I don't know. I was thinking
about something else and then that question.

That was a deep question.

So it's interesting because the whole the
demons are looking at us thing so
this is my thought and this is
just. This is aceology now we can
coin that way. Don't say that. I
said that the Bible say this, but
I haven't found in the Bible that
demonstration fallen angels. The object of. In

(59:11):
the. The Bible, God made us in
his image. We don't see in the
Bible angels and demons worrying about too
much else other than they got puffed
up. The ones that fail and followed
Satan. And now they're. To me, it
seems like their whole battle is to
come against God's man.

Right.

So that's kind of the. What else
are they out there fighting? And maybe
it's plenty, but I don't know what
else they're out there dealing with other
than God's man. So I'm. So it's
kind of like not to make us
the center of it, but realistically, God
made us in his image.

Yeah.

And gave the world to us and
we gave it to them.

Yeah. I think part of the problem
too is I think a lot of
people, their understanding of angels and demons
doesn't come from the Bible. It comes
from Hollywood. Right. And so that just
throws off a lot of things. But
yeah, I think part of it too,
and I briefly mentioned this, is just
that it had to be a mystery.
Like God had to conceal it.

Pastor Asa Slaughter (01:00:12):
Yes.

Pastor Brent McQuay (01:00:13):
Or else they would have never crucified
Christ. Like the, the, the, the demon
speaking to Judas saying, hey, you know,
yeah, 30 pieces of silver looking pretty
good, bro. Like that he would have
been like, hey, stop. Know. And so
the fact that like the enemy thought

(01:00:33):
that he was victorious when, when Christ
died, if God hadn't concealed this, if
he had made it known, then it
would have never happened. And so, like,
it makes sense. It still just hurts
my head. And that's. I guess that's
the hard thing for me to express
is why does it hurt? My head
just hurts my head because it just,

(01:00:55):
it's too big. It's too much for,
for me. I can't handle it.

Yeah. You know, I don't know. David
wrote what is, man, Lord, that you
are mindful of them. I don't know
what we are, but we made in
his image. I think that's the difference.
Like, do angels and you don't know,
do they know God's love? Can they
experience the.

I guess they can.

I don't know. It's such a, it's
such an interesting thing that we have.
We reciprocate God's love back to him.
And I guess angels and some way.

Was doing and they're singing of his
glory. They're singing like there's some kind
of understanding, but it.

Ti’heasha Beasley (01:01:28):
But that's their purpose. I feel like
we need to do a whole another.

We would have to get somebody on
here that's way more qualified, but amids.

And angels and demons.

And demons.

I don't know either, but.

Because I have a lot of questions.
I have a lot of questions about
demons.

Well, here. Here's. Here's what you need
to know. Christ defeated him, and he
gave you power to tread on serpents
and scorpions and over all the power
of the enemy. And nothing shall by
any means. So just resist, devil, and
he'll flee. That's. I don't care what
it look like or what it is.
I'm going try to just resist the
devil and he'll flee. That's all I
can do. I ain't got to know
the answers behind. I ain't got to
know how to.

Yeah.

How to. Something is made. I don't
know. Y'all know the saying.

But anyway, because when we talk about
spiritual warfare, we talk about wrestling not
against flesh and blood, but spirits and
principalities and rulers of dark places. So
anyway, that's a whole another conversation, a
whole another show. So let's land this
plane, because production team over there looking
at me like I'm crazy.

You just got into spiritual warfare. But,
hey, here's the thing. Hold that okay,
for chapter six, okay. Because. Okay, so.
So good history lesson. And I think
we mentioned this maybe in week one,
but the city of Ephesus was highly
spiritual, but like a cult, black magic.
Like, they were worshiping a bunch of

(01:02:44):
different gods, but then they were like.
It was like this hunger for, like,
power. And so, like, even they're the.
All of the gods, they had. They
had tears to them. Like, there was.
There was like, this God, and then
this God was stronger than that God,
and then this God is stronger than
those two gods and this one. So,
like, they had this whole system in
place, and it was all about gaining
power. And so there was a lot
of demonic presence in Ephesus. So Paul

(01:03:06):
actually talks about that a bunch. And
so that's why in the. In the
book of Ephesians, he talks about, you
know, the name that is above every
other. Yeah, right. It's because there's a
list of names and there's a hierarchy,
and I forget the. It was. The
fertility God was the top one. I
forget her name. But higher than every

(01:03:28):
name, above every name. And so that's
why he talks about that. But that's
also why Ephesians 6 closes with the.
The armor of. Of God. So save
your spiritual warfare, man.

I'm excited for that conversation. Who on
that show? Pretty. Who owned that show?
Okay, we'll talk about that later. Talk
about that later. But I think that
this is such a timely message, so
we could give quick, quick takeaways. It
doesn't have to be like, who had
the best, but I'm just excited for
the book of Ephesians. I feel like
it's a timely message for this generation.

(01:04:01):
Like, just all the topics that are
being brought out, like unity, spiritual warfare,
name above all names. Like, we are
dealing with these things right now. So
I think it's just a good chapter.
That's my takeaway.

I gotta take away. I got two.
Who's preaching verse, chapter six. Pastor Chris.

Pastor Chris.

She's the resident angel and demon specialist.
She'll do a great job of that.
Wait for that. She'll do great. My
takeaway. God loves you as far as
the eye can see and further. So
just accept it, man. Accept it.

I think for me, it's all Paul's
prayer. I think that I could spend
the rest of my life just studying
just those few verses, 14 through 21.
And I think that, you know, the.
The truncated version of the prayer. May
the father grant you power through the
spirit that Christ would dwell in you.

(01:04:53):
That. I mean, that. That's got to
be our heart every single day. But
what. What I'm. My takeaway is actually
when Paul prays that you would have
the strength to comprehend. And I think
that in my role as a pastor,
I think that that's my prayer from
here on out. Like, every day is.
I just want to pray that you,

(01:05:14):
whoever you are, that you would have
the strength to comprehend the love of
God.

That's good. Those are all good. We're
not rating. Not rating anyone unless you
guys want.

Secretly, since we don't want to rate
and y'all probably competed enough, I just
want to give a shout out.

That's all the time we have for
this episode.

And I just want to give us
a shout out to my team of.
Andy, David. Yeah, he's clapping in the
background. Andy, David, Beth, Marcus, your wonderful
husband.

Yeah, yeah.

And myself and Dina, who won't escape.
And Jorge. I was missing somebody. My
bad. Jorge.

Throwing your team on the bus, right?
Don't even throw your team.

Who won the staff challenge today at
the escape room. And we escaped.

Couldn't wait to say that. Could not
wait to Say that we are the
champions. I'm not gonna tell you what
your team said. How you came through
in the clutch.

I came through in the clutch.

Okay, yeah, in the clutch, like Steph.

For you young bucks. But for y'all,
that been around a while.

The word I got from the team
was ASA was dead weight until the
very end.

As long as I made an impact
before it was over, that's all that
mattered. I looked looked up, and I
was like, I got the answer.

I got it. I led my team
from start to finish, but we. We
came up a little bit short.

Play your role.

I played my team one, but we
came in second.

Well, the Bible do say a fall.
What is it? The pride. Yeah, he's
been talking crap since, what, last week
of how his team was gonna win.

Pride comes for destruction.

That's what. That's. Clear it up. Clear
that doctrine up.

You got to. You got to read
your Bible.

Clear that doctrine.

Pride don't come before you fall down
before dest. Pride comes before you are
destroyed.

Destroyed. And that's exactly what we did
today. We destroyed y'all.

On that note, we're not going to
drag you into our foolishness. We want
to thank you for joining this conversation.
Let us know how this conversation has
been blessing you and encouraging you, make
sure you guys are doing so well.
You're liking the page. You are letting
us know where you're tuning in. So
continue to do that share between. Let
us know how we are doing on

(01:07:27):
this show and join us next week.
I'll see you soon.

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