Fatal Attraction Ep. 04 - Sleeping with the Enemy / The Hand That Rocks the Cradle

This week we explore two movies where danger comes not from a stranger, but someone much closer to home.    First, Julia Roberts must escape the “Husband from Hell” in SLEEPING WITH THE ENEMY (1991).   Then we encounter the “Nanny from Hell” in Curtis Hanson’s THE HAND THAT ROCKS THE CRADLE (1992) starring Rebecca De Mornay, Annabella Sciorra, Matt McCoy and Ernie Hudson.

Episode Transcript

(00:09):
Hello and welcome to Get Me Another, a podcast where we explore those movies that followedin the wake of blockbuster hits and attempted to replicate their success.
My name is Chris Cianicone and with me are my co-hosts Rob Lemorgas
when you
you'll reject from your first cigarette until your last dying day, man!

(00:30):
man.
glad you started with that.
so much show tunes in this episode, my goodness.
And Justin Beam!
The jib!
The jib!
you
God, sailing, sailing away.
Today is episode four in our Get Me Another Fatal Attraction series, and we'll be lookingat two films in which the danger comes not from a stranger, but from someone closer to the

(01:01):
main character.
So first up today, from 1991, Julia Roberts is sleeping with the enemy.
She is a stranger in a small town.
What's your name?
Where you from?
I questions.

(01:22):
Is this what they mean by a warm welcome?
Behind her smile...
What is it with you?
...is a secret.
Behind her laughter is fear.

(01:45):
Behind her happiness is a past she can never forget.
Laura!
I had a husband.
He hurt me.
She was the only thing I ever loved.
I guess I'm just really afraid.
She changed her name.
Six months ago, your wife removed her mother from this institution.

(02:05):
Look, there's obviously some mistake.
My wife drowned.
She changed her looks.
What are you doing here?
Waiting for you?
I want this taken very seriously.
She's for you.
She changed her life.
If you need any help, I'm here.
Is she with someone?

(02:25):
Yeah.
The woman she used to be is dead.
Are you okay?
Saying goodbye to all ghosts, you know.
But the man who always wanted her still wants her back.
I know your every thought, Nothing can keep me away.

(02:52):
Sleeping with the enemy.
I don't know why I said sleeping with the enemy like I was like the announcer for the ABCSunday night movie.
Because that's that's, I mean, it's 100 % appropriate.
That's all I'll say.

(03:13):
Which by the way, I was shocked even though I lived in the United States in the 90s andknew this.
while watching these both of the films today, I was like, were these secretly made byItalians?
Because it feels like the Italian episode of a
Yeah
Americans act right

(03:33):
They are two crazy movies and it's really, there's some interesting similarities betweenthem, which we'll talk about.
And it's just, well, we'll get into it.
Sleeping with the Enemy, which came out in 1991, has the distinction of being the firststarring role for Julia Roberts following her breakout performance in 1990s Pretty Woman,

(03:54):
a movie we talked about in our Get Me Another When Harry Met Sally series.
She was also in Flatliners, which came out in the summer of 1990.
but was more of an ensemble piece.
The film was written by Ronald Bass, who had just at that time won an Academy Award forhis script for Rain Man and would later go on to write another Julia Roberts film, My Best

(04:15):
Friend's Weddings.
certified, get me another approved.
absolutely.
My best friend's wedding is terrific.
absolutely.
Sleeping with the Enemy was directed by Joseph Rubin, who previously had directed 1984'sDreamscape, a movie that I like a lot, and 1987's The Stepfather.
And this won't be his only appearance in this series, as we'll talk about his 1993 film,The Good Son, in a later episode.

(04:43):
Now, admittedly, this movie is a little bit different than some of the ones we'vediscussed so far.
because the antagonist here is not a stranger, but the husband of Julia Roberts'character, Laura.
But he displays obsessive and dangerous tendencies that I think put him alongside some ofthe other antagonists we've encountered so far in this series.

(05:04):
In a sense, Sleeping with the Enemy poses the question, what if you married a person whoturned out to be an obsessive psycho?
That is the situation that poor Laura finds herself in.
in sleeping with the enemy.
Absolutely.
This one just right off the bat is super interesting to me because it takes one elementthat is often in this trend, but it's backstory.

(05:35):
You don't get to see it.
So the, the good life that isn't quite right, that just doesn't even happen.
Right.
What you wind up with is a, it's a fun analog that's
in some ways playing with the conventions where you are shown something that at firstblush looks like a good life and is slowly revealed to be completely rotten.

(06:00):
Yeah, absolutely.
mean, I should say the first thing we start with in this movie, and I watched this moviewith my wife and she immediately jumped on this.
She was like, my God, this is the most boring opening title sequence I've ever seen.
It's literally just like white letters on black for the whole thing.
Like you couldn't tour through the beach house or anything like that.

(06:23):
It's just, you know, it's just white letters on black.
And then you come in and Julia Roberts plays Laura Burney, who lives in an absolutelygorgeous house on the beach on Cape Cod.
And her husband Martin is a business-y businessman.
We don't know he does, but he's a business-y businessman played by Patrick Bergen, anIrish actor who had a number of high profile roles around this time, including in the

(06:48):
second Jack Ryan movie, Patriot Games, and the title role in 1991's Robin Hood.
not Robin Hood, Prince of Thieves, but the other Robin Hood movie from 1991, which wasdeveloped at 20th Century Fox in competition with the Kevin Costner-led film and

(07:09):
ultimately aired as a Fox TV movie.
And I watched and actually really liked.
Yeah, you've mentioned it before.
It is the deep impact.
Yes.
Robin Hood, Prince of thieves, Armageddon.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And let's just say it, Patrick Bergen here, guys, he's evil Kevin Kline.
Like, that's his whole look is evil Kevin Kline.

(07:30):
100 % it's like someone took Kevin Kline and Kevin Spacey from Consenting Adults andmashed them up into the same character.
my God, what what a, what a, what a world.
I think the house also looks more like a medical, it looks like an office.
It doesn't even look like a home.
This was a thing.

(07:51):
All these films have homes, living space play big in all of these in varying ways.
And this one, I think it looks the most like an office building to me, aside from being onthe beach.
There's nothing homey about it at all.
Can I make a confession?

(08:13):
I love this house.
And both of these movies, the villains live in these ultra modern houses, which aresupposed to be like, they're supposed to have a cold vibe.
And then the counterpoint is, the protagonists live in much more like homey kind of NormanRockwell like sort of places.

(08:34):
And I'm just like, I want that cold house on the beach.
just.
Like, I want it, I want it right down to the Egyptian bust that he's got, that he gave heras a wedding present.
I'm like, I hate that this guy has entirely captured the style that I would have if I hadthe money to live in that style.

(08:55):
Maybe you're more alike than you know, Chris.
It's really troubling.
But I will say...
That's why you said the movie title the way that you did.
It's all coming out.
But being with Chris.
With the house though, just on one other point besides the it's, not very homey and it's,and that's reflective of the couple's relationship, right?

(09:16):
But I do like that it's the opposite of the fatal attraction home in the beginning, theirapartment.
Yes.
And that this one is all glass windows.
It's, it feels, it is so open to the world and yet it is a trap that she is living insideof.
I like
Look, sometimes it's nice to be on point and sometimes it's nice to be counterpoint, whichthis location is.

(09:41):
Absolutely.
And it has the fixture that we've noticed in so many of these.
It has a wall of glass blocks.
Because again, late 80s, early 90s, that was the thing.
And it's present in both of these movies today.
And I love it so much.
Yes.
We first see Laura and she's clamming.

(10:04):
And as my wife pointed out, she's using her feet to dig in the sand for clams.
That's how you do that, apparently.
Yeah, I just want to I just want to interrupt and say Chris is not this is not some newinternet slang that you are unaware of.
This is literal clamming.
It's not digging for clams in the ocean.

(10:24):
Yeah.
It's in the New Englanders, whatever New Englanders who listen to this podcast, well, no,that's a thing you do.
And I've seen it done or something.
I haven't actually done it myself, but I know of it.
And I will say, she's got a lot of clams in that bucket.

(10:47):
It sounds like a metaphor and it sounds dirty, but it's not.
It's just a lot of clams in that bucket.
You gotta have a lot of clams to have that house, right?
So her husband comes up to her on the beach, and very quickly, you get some bad vibes.

(11:07):
It's not overt, although it soon will be.
But even from this first encounter, you can tell that something is off.
And another hint that the couple, you get a vibe.
And it's interesting because that night the couple was getting ready to go out to a partyand Martin suggests that she wear the black dress rather than the one she already has on,

(11:32):
even if it might be cold in a backless dress.
And then when we cut to see them at the party, she has on the black dress.
And not only that, my wife pointed out that her hair was entirely different.
She changed everything she was going to do in order to avoid a confrontation with thishusband who we are.
Soon to Learn is an abusive, a horribly abusive spouse.

(11:55):
This guy is just pure villainy.
And that's one of the things about these two films, and I'll come back to these a coupleof times, the morality in these films is very black and
yeah.
And one nice directorial choice and I guess editorial when you go to that party, as yousaid, Chris, when you first see her, you just see the back.

(12:17):
Yeah.
So the, the backless dress is what you see first just to highlight it, even that littlebit more.
And, and then with Robert's performance, you can tell how ill it is.
She is.
it's, it's also, I will point out it's the wrong dress for that event in that time ofyear.
Great.
Honestly, this guy's got a lot of nerve making any fashion suggestions considering he'swearing an Asker.

(12:42):
with that mustache.
There's a of questionable wardrobe decisions in this thing.
Yeah, we see how awful Martin is because he demands Laura have this kind of like, it's apsychotic perfection.
And they illustrate that with, you know, like he comes in and she's in the bathroom, youknow, the towels have to be straight and perfect.

(13:03):
The cabinets have to be perfectly organized.
And like when she said, I just forgot and she says, know, he's like, well, we all forgetsometimes.
That's what's reminding is for.
Like that's just like...
This guy is just, I mean, he's got a mustache.
He doesn't actually twirl it, but he might as well, cause he is pure villain through andthrough.

(13:26):
Yeah.
And I have to say here in this, in this early section of the film, as it's being revealed,just how abusive he is.
I mean, it's, it is tough to watch some of these scenes.
is genuinely disturbing.
Um, and you know, he's, as you say, he is just a hundred percent the villain, but he'svery good at it.

(13:48):
I think, uh, it's so uncomfortable, like super uncomfortable.
think both Julia Roberts and Patrick Berget are actually very good in this movie.
Like she does a great job of playing this woman who is just being terrorized, but has tokeep everything close to the chest because you never know what is going to make him fly

(14:12):
off the handle.
And he is just a villain that you absolutely loathe and you want to see get the crapkicked out of him.
mean, he goes out.
He has this conversation with a neighbor who's got a boat and he comes back and he accusesLaura of inviting the neighbor into the house and he just hits her across the face.
I, my jaw just dropped when that happened.

(14:33):
Like it was, holy shit.
It was, and then he kicks her out on the floor.
mean, as you said, it's tough to watch, but it's interesting because there's no attempt tomake Martin even remotely likable.
He's just, he is just an awful person.
and it gets the audience on Laura's side to be like, you got to get out of there, girl.
Like you got to go.

(14:53):
So Martin, you know, he's just a horrible person.
He refers to Laura as my princess, which just sounds super creepy coming out of this guy.
You know, mentions the Egyptian statue that he gave her on her honeymoon.
I'm like, like, it's all feels like this guy is just a super controlling, abusive personand you hate him right from the beginning.

(15:15):
And that's where we are.
when they plan to take a sail with that neighbor who Martin had just accused her of maybelike having a thing with, but they're still going out of the boat.
But it's there we get an idea that Laura has a plan because she goes out and she breaksone of the light bulbs on the lamp, you know, near the beach, near their house.

(15:37):
So there's something she has a plan, but we don't know exactly.
We're not told in advance what it is because we don't have a chance.
It's interesting.
We don't have a chance to really get Laura's internal thoughts for a while.
Eventually we do, and I like how they do it, but it takes some time.
Yeah, that moment just plays like her just frustration having a moment, a place whereshe's by herself for a moment and she seems to just be venting a little bit by throwing

(16:04):
the rocks at that bulb, knocking it out.
but she does two.
And that was the thing where I was like, it's more than just like, there's two bulbs andshe knocks them both out.
So they're going out on the wall.
We also, should mention, we also learned that Laura's mother had died a couple of monthspreviously and Laura disappeared for a few days to go to the funeral.

(16:25):
And Martin was all, you know, he was just terrible about it.
Like he's, again, this guy is just the worst.
That was six months ago.
Martin, my mother was all I had.
And I'll never forgive myself for not bringing her here to live with us.
You shouldn't beat yourself.
You always treated her with love.

(16:46):
She died, Martin.
How could I not go to her funeral?
You had told me I would have taken you, given me a chance to pay my last respects.
But you sneaked off inexplicably.
I didn't sneak off.
And yet I remind you how I worried.
No.
You reminded me enough the night I came back.

(17:09):
You aren't suggesting I enjoyed that.
God, no.
That would make you a monster.
And so they go out on the boat, and a storm that wasn't predicted comes up, and there'schaos on the deck, and the mast is swinging, the jib is jibing, and all that sort of

(17:30):
nautical stuff.
I...
I'm not a nautical person, but I could have had a nautical life in a different universe.
And all this storm comes up and when Martin turns back towards Laura, she's gone.
And guys, he screams her name so many times.
Laura!

(17:51):
Laura!
And that goes, that's not just on the boat, although it does happen a lot on the boat.
But I believe once he's on land, there's, there's more name screaming.
Is there not?
He does, then he comes back to the house and he goes, smashes a window with that Egyptianstatue and then starts screaming out into like into the void.

(18:14):
Laura!
From the point that there's this accident at sea where the boat, know, the waves crashover the boat and everything comes from Martin's point of view.
We see him on a coast card vessel searching for her, her life jackets found.
There's like a, there's a
know, buoy bobbling in the water and everything up through Laura's funeral.

(18:38):
I this woman is so miserable, even her funeral photo looks just miserable.
Like she is living in a terrible life with this horrible human being.
I gotta tell guys, it didn't look like she was buried in any kind of graveyard.
It was like a random headstone near the beach.
That happened so fast.
Like the storm happened fast.

(19:02):
mean, you get there getting talking about the boat.
The next thing you know, they're, they're throes of a storm and it's not just a littlestorm.
How does something like that happen that fast?
Maybe it's because I'm from the Midwest.
I don't understand that when you're out in a boat, there's no sign whatsoever of changingweather that would give you the opportunity to turn around.

(19:22):
But all of a sudden you are absolutely overwhelmed.
Like Godzilla just stomped on your city.
You don't have a minute to think about that.
This is the Godzilla of storms.
It's just going to come and just destroy everything in such short order.
And the funeral was the same thing.
I mean, once that window was broken by the sculpture.
So you're right into the funeral and the funeral thing lasts all of 20 seconds and thenpow, we're on to the next from there.

(19:48):
So it's it's clear they're trying to just make short work of this to the audience doesn'tconsider too much the logistics about so.
What is all this again?
How is this going to be playing out?
Yeah, and here's where the movie switches perspectives, because then we go and we see someof those same events from Laura's point of view with a little bit of voiceover narration.

(20:10):
And we see her clinging to that buoy that I mentioned while Martin is screaming.
And we learn that she had been planning for this a while, secretly learning how to swim atthe YWCA, because I failed to mention that she doesn't know how to swim and is afraid of
the water, but she worked to overcome that.
I kind of like, I was...
That's what was the first sort of moments where I'm like, you go, like it's, you know,she's learning how to swim because she wants to get away from this guy.

(20:37):
And we see her whole journey from like the lights that she broke on the beach.
That was where she, where, so she knew where to go to.
and then, you know, she goes to the house, which, and grabs like a bag that she hasprepped and she cuts her hair and she puts on a wig, which honestly, that was the
surprise.
like,
Why take the chance of going back to the house?

(20:58):
Like stash your go-bags somewhere else and cut your hair in a motel room.
beyond that way beyond that and in front of that is the concept that she planned all this.
She knew she was going to have a short window of time if this whole thing was going to behappening.
By the way, she didn't have anything to say.
The whole boat trip thing was something that seemed to be sort of against her will.

(21:19):
Right.
And, and so it wasn't as though this was some mapped out plan that she had, but she surelyknew that she had a limited amount of time to get to this house.
She gets in there, okay, you're gonna have a go away bag.
I guess that makes sense.
You had it stashed up above, cool.
That would make sense in the situation of an abusive relationship because he probablywould have isolated her.
She wouldn't have a lot of friends to help her get out.

(21:41):
She had to make these secret trips to the Y to learn how to swim or whatever it was.
Okay, maybe there isn't another place to put that.
But the great logic leap, the greatest logic leap is this situation in the bathroom whereshe's.
cutting her hair which could leave evidence everywhere.
She's brought through the house which could leave evidence everywhere.

(22:02):
The worst though, the jump the shark moment in Sleeping with the Enemy is when she triesto flush her wedding ring down the toilet.
makes no sense at all because there's a catch there.
There's a lot of things that would, that's just not how.
That's not how plumbing works.

(22:22):
Yeah, you've just swam through the ocean.
Throw it in the ocean.
Exactly.
You know he's going to find it in the toilet.
mean, you just know it.
I mean, let's just say this.
Here's the biggest question is what if there hadn't been a freak storm that night?

(22:46):
Yeah, exactly.
Like the plan only works if there's a freak storm.
If there's no storm, there isn't enough chaos for her to make her escape.
If the storm was predicted in advance, they wouldn't have gone sailing or they would haveturned right back as you're saying.
Right.
It's this, and now you could say that she had the bag ready and it was, you know, she waslooking for her chance.

(23:08):
And I get that's a reasonable thing, but it's just like.
It feels like all these things had to fall into place in a very particular way in orderfor this to happen.
But again, she is leaving physical evidence every step she takes.
Like if you're going to cut your hair, do it in the hotel.
If you're going to put a wig on, do it after you cut your hair in the hotel or whereveryou're heading, however you're going to make your way out of there.

(23:35):
Do it on the bus, on the train, on the wherever.
It's like Harrison Ford taking the time to cut his beard and dye his hair in the crashedbus in The Fugitive.
And, and then on the back end of this thing, because this is, we're going back in time tosee it from her perspective.
Well, I will just jump ahead, you know, on this one point is that he will find thatwedding ring at a certain point, you know, in the future, as we go through, but obviously

(24:03):
if they had a funeral, that doesn't happen the next day.
like, you know, I hate to get into the plumbing situation here, but did that have
Well, or the other one, the other one.
Because, uh, you know, one thing that could get that ring to go all the way down would be,uh, you know, a number two.

(24:25):
Let's just, I'm calling it out.
I'm calling it out.
How about when he walked in the house later that night and there would have been wetfootprints in and out.
Well, you see her mopping it up with a towel, but the point is, why did she even take thechance?
Like, why wasn't the go-bag stashed, under the, the, what do call it?
The porch.
That's what I'm, the porch or the deck or something, you know?

(24:46):
That I could say is that because she didn't know it was going to be a freak storm, shedidn't know this was going to be her boat chance.
But another thing about this I do want to bring up is that because this movie starts as akind of legit two-hander with, know, with Julia Roberts and Patrick Bergen.
And then she supposedly dies, you know, in the, and it's you're with Patrick for a while.

(25:12):
And then it cuts back.
You go back in time to see where
She actually went, you know?
And so very early on in Act One, this movie established, which you have to do, itestablishes that you could be with either character's POV, right?
But then I think it creates actually an issue down the road, which we'll get to, but whichI just want to, call out here and then we'll talk about it when we get there.

(25:40):
But because you spend so much of Act Two just with her,
that by the time you then cut back to him figuring things out and you know, it's, youknow, it just feels like you've gone a little too far anyway without having him.
And then additionally, it just makes it less scary because you know what's coming, right?

(26:02):
It's, is another, another issue with it.
Right, right.
No, all of that is, I think is a hundred percent right.
We do follow Laura.
We see her on a bus, you know, she's got the wig on, she's on a bus and she has aconversation with an older lady who offers her an apple.
And I actually really like this because we get to hear some of her backstory, which shetells, but like in the third person.

(26:26):
You live back East.
I was visiting an old friend.
She needed me.
Say, Gouache.
Of course, it's none of my business.
She left her husband.

(26:48):
He was a horrible man who used to beat her.
Started right after their honeymoon.
At first he was charming, tender, but it all changed.
He said if she left him, he would punish her, and he meant that his punishments wereterrible.
He would never let her go so that he could find her anywhere.

(27:12):
Couldn't she call the police?
Well, she did.
She called them.
And a lawyer, too.
They said she could make a citizen's arrest.
Get a restraining order?
It was pathetic.
Well, how did she leave?

(27:32):
She risked everything, escaped, started a new life.
brave girl.
She thinks she's a coward.

(27:54):
Coward.
Not a girl like that.
How long did you stay with him?
Too long.

(28:16):
Three years, seven months.
16
And I like how this was done and we learned, it's like, okay, she met this guy, he wasn'tlike this.
And then very soon after they were married, that guy changed.
And clearly he had been hiding his, who he really was through the courtship.

(28:40):
And then once she was married, was, and realized who he was, it was all too.
And this is the backstory acknowledgement of what would have been the good life that thengets wrecked.
do really love this scene because it's very functional because you're learning the historyof it all and how she came to be trapped in that situation.

(29:01):
with that woman on the bus, because as Chris said, it's Laura talking about herself, butkind of third person, it's very thinly veiled.
And this woman on the bus knows exactly who Laura is talking about.
absolutely.
It's such a sweet moment between them and Laura's saying that, you know, she, you know,the, the friend who left feels like a coward and this woman's going, she sounds strong to

(29:24):
me that those aren't the actual lyrics, but it's such a nice little scene.
Yeah.
No, absolutely.
I really liked that scene.
Because the way the movie is structured, we really didn't get Laura's kind of internalthoughts up until that point.
And I just really liked how that was done.
And then she arrives, guys, in Cedar Falls, Iowa, a town that looks straight out of 1955,like it's Marty arriving in Hill Valley in 1955.

(29:53):
I kept expecting to hear Mr.
Sandman.
How charming, and they shot in South Carolina.
Just shoot in Iowa.
Just give Sioux Falls something.
And by the way, Sioux Falls is not some quaint little town.
or Cedar Falls.
Yeah.
He's gonna ask you how realistic this depiction of Iowa this was.
I mean, it is not a realistic depiction of the of the area around the University ofNorthern Iowa, because it's Cedar Falls and it's supposed to be like near the U up there.

(30:22):
It is not really like that at all.
But I do remember, I don't know if you do, Justin, that when this movie came out, likethere were whole news stories about the fact that this movie was coming out.
I don't remember that.
No, I, but the town they chose does look and feel very Iowa.
I will say that it's easy to buy.
It's not like they just showed a farm in establishing like some flyover drone thing, notdrone at that time, helicopter shot.

(30:50):
And then they just cut to inside the house.
It does feel like a large number of Iowa towns.
So they did a good job.
Yeah.
great.
It looks great.
Like it's looks like
And it is but it's just Cedar Falls is a little bigger the Cedar Falls Waterloo, meanparts of it at least but in any case, I will I will I'm done quibbling on the Iowanness.

(31:13):
I was so excited because I have two Iowa natives.
was like, this is the perfect opportunity to deconstruct how realistic a depiction of Iowathis movie purports to be.
So pretty soon she's ditched her escape wig.
Cause the studio, there's no way the studio was going to let Julia Roberts wear that blackshort wig for the whole movie and not have her hair be on display for the whole thing.

(31:39):
There's just no way.
She rents a house for $700 a month under the name Sarah Waters.
The whole house for $700 a month!
I mean, I know it's 1991, but my goodness.
That's still not too far off.
Amazing.
It's a whole other world.

(32:01):
And she ends act one sitting on the porch of her new house, basking in freedom.
And it feels, it's funny, like the end of act one of this movie is the end of act three oflike a different movie.
Like you could have, where you did see the courtship and then her experiences and then hereventual escape.
But of course the problem is this guy's going to come out.

(32:21):
He knows she had to fake her death because if he knew she was alive,
this obsessive maniac would never stop looking for.
Chris though, you're you're moving right beyond one of the key elements in all of thesefilms, which is the house renovation montage.
Yes, you're right.
And we certainly get that in no time.
She moves in and all she has to do to move in saving us the time of worrying about how shehas money, how she does anything logistically.

(32:49):
She.
It's.
How much money that gold could have found?
It didn't look like much of a ring though, but her house that she's renting here isconveniently fully furnished.
All she has to do is take a few sheets off of things and she's moved in and by the end ofthe day, boy, what a day.

(33:11):
She's out in the front porch in a swing, just enjoying the simple joys of life to thesound of crickets.
It is a very Iowa.
You know, it's nostalgia for those of us who grew up in the Midwest is those summer dayswith the sun setting and all you hear is crickets and it's nice and quiet.
I really liked that a lot.
was just interesting how easy it was for her to move into this situation.

(33:34):
Right, right.
but with no documentation whatsoever.
was wondering about that too.
Like today, if you made this movie today, you'd have to have her have prepped like fakeIDs and like a whole other, she would have created a whole other identity that would have
been in the go bag from the get go.
Like you would have, you would have had a whole thing about that in a movie in the modernversion.

(33:54):
Well, and in the last episode, we learned a lot about the logistics of renting a place andthe paperwork involved with renting a place.
Not in Iowa.
No!
Cedar falls, it's a different land, I also, yeah, this is the space too, where, this was,the score was by Jerry Goldsmith in this film.

(34:17):
It's a very good score, but one thing that I really, you get it at the beginning, but atthe beginning, I almost chalked this fact up to the mislead of the film where the score is
so kind of light and nice, right?
And almost idyllic itself.
It's, not the score of what one would, you know, it's not a, cliche thriller score.

(34:42):
Right.
I'll put it that way.
Right.
and here again, once she's made her escape, it's like all very, I mean, it's pastoral isthe wrong word, but in any event, this movie, the score, and I think in the next one too,
I'll talk about a little bit, but these scores I think are very much indicative of thefact that these are

(35:05):
both thrillers, this one has a slightly harder subject matter, tackling domestic violencebetween a husband beating up his wife.
And the score really helps to make it palatable.
Those early scenes are tough, but the bulk of this movie, they really are really trying tomake it mainstream.

(35:29):
Is just.
And they succeeded based on the success of this movie.
it is totally.
Yeah, this is this is outside of a couple of those early scenes.
This is not a movie that wants you to feel icky at all.
Right.
It wants this to all happen within, you know, a a Hollywood film container.
And I think Goldsmith score is a huge, huge part of that and just reassuring the audience.

(35:54):
Absolutely.
One other point before we leave into the next section, when she's putting the housetogether, she gets some flowers she puts on the window and my wife pointed out that they
are forget-me-nots.
And she leaves the towels, she's got the three towels like she had in her old head, sheleaves them all skishod because her husband...

(36:15):
And the same with the soup cans in the same as you're getting Chekhov's hand towels andChekhov's pantry arrangement in this film.
Yes.
So her new home also comes complete with an attractive neighbor who has nearly as goodhair as she does.
He looks like Elaine

(36:39):
His hair is as big as hers and she has huge hair in this movie.
does.
This guy is a fucking weirdo.
I think he is one of the most sinister characters that we've encountered yet because ofhow intrusive he is, how forceful and manipulative he is of her.

(37:02):
And we're to get into that as we're talking through this thing.
But this guy is, he's awful.
But he's supposed to be the nice guy, but from the very beginning, from the get go, it'slike we're all rooting for her to have some peace.
And that moment of her having it is so brief.
And as soon as this guy comes dancing and singing with a hose into her life, he doesn'tleave her alone.

(37:29):
try to be an actor in New York.
He tried to be an actor in New York and now is teaching theater.
He worked summers at the camp from the burning.
apparently cause he's a real pushy guy.
my god.
First of all, his hair.
I want to talk to his hair for a second.
I don't know if you guys remember from the show Family Ties, Mallory's boyfriend, but he'sgot Nick's hair from Family Ties.

(37:55):
he's also like one of the two dads on My Two Dads.
can't remember which one.
me!
Yeah.
But yeah.
Yep.
Yep.
That's the, the, the, what, right from BJ and the bear to, to my two dads, eventually totech war.
So we have this kind of like, again, this is a meat, not cute.
Like we, we've talked about this before where it's like, they're trying for a meat cute.

(38:16):
Like she's stealing apples from his yard and he just is a dick about it.
And she's like, well, you know, I'm going to, she just drops them and, know, and, and, andthen eventually he brings them over and hopes she'll make him a pie.
while constantly scaring her.
Yeah.
And then she gets scared and he goes, Oh, did I scare you?

(38:37):
Why don't I cut it like five?
does have so He moves like Michael Myers.
He does.
His entire presence is a combination of Michael Myers and I don't know who else it wouldbe, someone hyper aggressive.
He's so incredibly aggressive.

(38:57):
But his MO is definitely sneaking out of, like there's that scene in Halloween, 1978,where Laurie has been attacked by Michael.
She's exhausted.
She's got a slash on her arm from him.
She's leaning up against the closet and she's catching her breath and out of the etherbehind her the darkness in the closet Mike the shape Michael's mask appears.

(39:19):
Absolutely it is.
But this guy Ben he sucks but he's the same way.
He looked at Halloween as a how-to!
That's exactly right.
That's his dating profile is him and his face emerging from a closet and saying like, butevery he doesn't enter a room.

(39:40):
never just enters a room.
He's already, he's already there whenever someone else enters the room.
And that's throughout the whole film.
And he's not even the bad guy.
No, he's not.
I gotta be honest.
Here's where the fuck
turtleneck in summer
theater teacher who's to course I mean it's just it's just takes it too far

(40:03):
real red flag with this guy is that his apple tree is a green apple tree.
It's Granny Smith.
you're a monster.
want to take this opportunity and use this turtleneck as a line to what I started makingnote of as I was watching these.
There are signature elements to the movies that we're watching in this series.

(40:24):
Yes.
I've put together what I consider to be a good list, a solid list of the bullet pointsthat these writers are all maybe unconsciously referencing among themselves.
We have of course the square glass blocks.
We've talked a lot about water.

(40:47):
Water is an element in pretty much all of these in one way.
tub, ocean, whatever it is, water is a continual element.
Well, wealthy modes of transportation, boats, cars, jet skis.
There's gotta be that.
We have boring male characters who dress like lame-os.
And that's absolutely the case here too.

(41:08):
We have glass breaking, which happens at least twice when someone's being tackled throughthe glass.
And we're going to get into that at least once today on this episode.
That glass breaking, it's never a glass block, is it?
They're just too strong.
They're so popular, which you understand and we're in full support of.
have farm houses or rural houses.

(41:31):
They're very, very large.
No matter how many people are moving into them, they're very large and they're alwayswhite.
We have the home renovation element, usually with montages.
That's it.
They're almost always going to involve painting.
And in none of these, does anyone know how to paint?
They all pay tarot
from an Archer right on they all paint it's terrible it's like you

(41:55):
Griffith knows.
Melanie Griffith knew how.
She tried to correct him.
they can all look kind of adorable with a little bit of paint on their face.
That's what I was just gonna say the poor continuity person on each one of these films hasto keep tabs on these little dabs of always white paint somewhere on someone's sleeve or
their neck or wherever it might be.
I have leprechaun on the other day on St.

(42:17):
Patrick's Day.
And I was looking at some paint.
They had a painting thing in that movie.
the paint splotches kept moving around everyone's bodies.
They clearly didn't have a continuity person for that.
Well, that could be considered part of this series and I'm officially making it so.
Leprechaun is now officially part of Get Me Another.
We'll do a bonus episode of Leprechaun

(42:40):
Okay, then we have shower scenes strangely, usually not erotic or even involving nudity infilms that it's almost like they include a shower scene or a shower running just so they
can put it in the trailer and give the audience the idea this is going to be hot.
And so far we haven't encountered much of that.
No, we have, we have recurring use of turtlenecks.

(43:03):
We have telescopes in almost everyone's house and I, the outside of body double.
I don't know many movies where they actually touch the telescope, but they're alwayspresent.
Well, you know, that I will say, feel like, you know, by the water in Cape Cod, I hadfriends, you know, who had a house down on the south shore of Massachusetts.

(43:23):
always have a telescope, you go watch the boats.
Yeah, I get that.
But they're in every one of these films, I think, so far, and some of which are just inthe city and there's nothing to what are you going to look at through a telescope?
And they're always just sort of sitting by this by the window, just cocked up toward theceiling.
It's bullshit.
Underwater shots inside bathtubs.

(43:44):
That's a frequent thing that we see.
But that's as important as the glass blocks.
Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
African-American intruders.
That's another thing that's happened at least maybe three times so far.
think we have male characters always being overdressed.
There's a lot of ties at home.
There's a lot of button up shirts when you're just chilling out.

(44:05):
Ascotts.
We got turtlenecks.
We have a lot of overdressed men in these things.
There's always a problem with the mail.
There's problems with mail in a significant number of these things.
I don't know why that's such a complicated affair, but it is.
We have car accidents or near accidents in almost every single one of these.
And if it's not a car accident, it's a bike accident or almost a bike accident.

(44:28):
And let's get real, almost all of these accidents occur because a woman is hysterical.
Right.
Yeah.
absolutely.
Or Kevin Spacey's just that zany guy.
Yeah.
As we learn, we know he's reckless because he just didn't even slow down.
And then we have classical music playing a key role.
And I think three of the four films in the last two weeks, including both this week.

(44:52):
Yeah, exactly.
So maybe four, we're four for four.
And this in fatal, obviously, it's in fatal attraction is a huge, huge motivator.
Yep.
Yep.
And then finally, impalements.
That seems to be a common theme too, in most of these things.
So this is the playbook.
I can't imagine why impalements are in erotic thriller movies.

(45:14):
Can't for the life of me figure out that one.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That is an amazing and a bravo for doing that work.
The Lord's work, let's just say it.
There's no question this is the Lord's work.

(45:35):
And none of that's interesting.
That's the greatest crime of all.
That is a list of things I'd be like, yeah, I guess.
mean, just keep him in your back pocket for when we're doing revisions.
None of that is interesting.
Anyway, onward we march.
Martin slowly comes to the realization that Laura is alive.
First he finds like the broken shards and the light bulbs, but that doesn't really, likethat could have just been, you know, kids, local kids doing something.

(46:01):
But what really sets off the alarm bell is when one of the ladies from the YWCA calls towish her condolences and lets the cat out of the bag about the swimming lessons.
And that leads him to the inevitable finding of Laura's wedding ring in the toilet.
Again.
From the moment she put it in the stupid toilet, I knew, you knew, we all knew that he wasgonna find that ring.

(46:28):
he even entertain a call that long?
He's walking around his office, he's confused, he's...
He's a business man, he's gotta do business, know?
Come on.
Well, and, and, oh, and the other thing I need to add to that list, I'm sure I'm going tocome up with some more as we move through these damn things is that nobody works.
If we see them working, it's brief at best that we're like this guy, we see him in theoffice one time in the whole film.

(46:54):
It does.
just know he has a speaker.
It's general business.
And so he entertains this thing.
He smashes his phone with something, which isn't out of character.
No, no, this guy, this guy was-
And then we have a montage of him making an app.
So this is a guy, right?
Who can't handle towels being uneven on the racks.

(47:15):
This is a guy who keeps his place so Spartan and spotless that it feels soulless, whichapparently appeals to Chris.
so he in this month, the second montage of the film so far gratuitous montage is Joe Bobwould say montage foo is what he would call it.
He's digging through.
everything that relates to his wife, including a box that is helpfully titled, in bigletters on top, Laura's personal belongings.

(47:42):
And he makes a
I don't have a box labeled your personal.
I have a Chris's personal belongings box.
So my wife knows those are my personal belongings.
It's on the shelf below my go bag.
Which was probably labeled, maybe we just missed it.
But he's making an absolute mess out of everything.

(48:03):
he's not even helping, it's not even helpful.
When you're looking for something, you don't make a bigger mess to have to sift through totry to find it.
That's not how life works.
That just isn't how life works.
this is where it starts to, when we're cutting back to him, figuring things out where Ithink it starts to get into some issues for me, which is number one, I want him to be

(48:28):
smarter and to see the wedding ring and see the glass.
And they have those, they have those clues in those moments for him, but then they justgive him essentially a phone call that says your wife's alive.
And then he goes, wait a minute, my wife's alive.
Hold up.
And then he goes and, and you know, how does he track her down?
He just goes to a private eye and it's like track, track her down.

(48:52):
And, and look, it's all efficient and like, you know, at the end of the day, is it thatbig of a deal in those moments?
You know, maybe, maybe not, but I, makes him less formidable.
I would wrap much rather that he had figured it out from, you know, a couple of clues,like those two clues, the, the broken light, and then the wedding ring in the toilet.

(49:15):
should have been enough to motivate him to go do one more thing.
Right.
That he then figured out that she was alive.
Right.
And then, and then my personal preference is to just have him go away and know that theshark is coming back to, you know, metaphorically speaking, and we don't know when or
where, but they do keep cutting cross cutting and

(49:38):
Like I know that sometimes having the bomb under the table is good, but in this instance,it's kind of like knowing where Michael Myers is at all times.
But in the meantime, Laura is getting to know Ben and he is using his sweet, sweet theaterdepartment to charm her.

(49:59):
know, he puts her up on the stage and he puts on the theater lights and...
wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
You're jumping way far ahead here.
No, this is the next bit!
Is him in the theater using the theater to charm the
No no no no no no.
Sarah goes over to Dummy Ben's house.

(50:21):
Where he's illustrating oops I can't cook.
I can't cook.
Yeah, she brings over the apples.
You're right, you're right.
What a way to humanize him.
even he brings her, he brings her after this tree encounter where Michael's hanging outlurking, he brings her a ridiculous amount of apples, which first of all, if you even care
about your tree, you're not just going to eviscerate your stock of apples.

(50:45):
She, she doesn't need a full Bolshe worth worth of apples.
That's not, wasn't, it's not sweet to show up with 8,000 apples and then spill them allover the table, which is exactly what happened when dummy Ben got there with.
nobody in Iowa have a bag?
Exactly right right and then he and he's like, you know small towns are funny places.
And so the next thing

(51:06):
You put it that way, it's very creepy.
my goodness.
So the next thing
He her that he likes pie.
to try and...
Real As he's bringing the apples and stuff.
Oh Jesus.
oh my god.
Yeah.
Next thing you know, he should be digging for clams.
So next thing, next thing we know she's having dinner at his house, sitting at his table.

(51:29):
And then he turns to her at one point.
Now they've already, he's already stalked her and countered her at a tree.
He's brought her what I would consider an abusive amount of apples to her house.
My wife pointed out, my wife makes apple pies and she's like, I wouldn't use that many.
And my wife makes dense apple pies.
I swear to God, this is true.
And she's like, I would not use that many apples for two pies.

(51:54):
it was a real problem.
this dinner where they're sitting there with his stupid puffy fucking hair they're sittingthere having the conversation and finally presumably days into this whatever we want to
call this relationship he says do you have a name
Okay.
It doesn't matter if you're from Iowa, if you did theater in New York, what's one of thefirst things you do?

(52:19):
Hey, what's your name?
Yeah, what, what, you know, what's your name?
I may walk into your house unannounced at some point.
Let me give you my name.
What's your name?
There's some common, there's civility at play in Iowa when you're meeting somebody, andwe're nice folks.

(52:39):
We're willing to share our name with someone who's being nice to us, but why wait tillthey're in your house to ask even who they are?
So I understand you're looking for a job.
Where'd you hear that?
Well, small towns are funny places.
Everybody knows everybody.

(52:59):
But I know a lot of people over at the college.
They're dropping a good word for you, if you like.
Why would you do that?
God, such paranoia.
Where are from, New York?
Honestly, it's...
I'm surprised there wasn't a sleeping with the enemy 2 where she found out that Ben turnedout to be a psycho as well and that you know that was just the type of man she was

(53:23):
attracted to.
Good God.
I was expecting that to happen.
was expecting at some point for him to be in cahoots with Michael and for Michael to havehad tabs around her hometown and where her mom would be to try to figure out if she ever
showed up there.
And I really thought that dummy Ben was going to be his watchdog there.

(53:44):
I fully expected that to be revealed at some point, but it never is because Michael's justtoo creepy.
mean, Ben is just too creepy not to be something more than what he is.
But he does bring her to the college theater to charm her and he you know He puts on thelights and and he makes it snow on stage And I'm thinking to myself, know, like there's

(54:05):
some freshman theater major Who's gonna clean up all that fake snow later like that?
there's some poor bastard who's gonna have to sweep all that stuff up and We have thiswhole trying on costumes montage with
Van Morrison's Brown Eyed Girl.
This movie is directly responsible for the 90s revival of Brown Eyed Girl.
Like that's where it came from.

(54:26):
And they, they knew if you had Julia Roberts, you needed a three, like a pained mirror forher and her putting on outfits in a musical montage.
And she's like having fun and so charming.
It's like straight out of pretty woman.
Right out of...
It really is and it's the third montage of the film again montage foo in between thoughprior to that we see Michael going to talk to a lady who's clearly from 1901 and he's

(54:56):
asking her about a situation with his ex and he's putting the pieces together creepy Benshows up again and Surprises Sarah admits that he's been following her around town.
Oh, and I mean she's a magnet for assholes in this
Yeah, no, there's no question.
She keeps saying that she's not really down for it.
He pushes and pushes.
He's very aggressive.

(55:17):
And again, to your point earlier, Rob, the music sounds so romantic, but what he's doingis straight up harassment and complete disregard for her boundaries.
It is absolutely, it is absolutely, he is, again, there's an, there's an unmade sequel tothis movie where it turns out that Ben is also just a terrible, terrible human being.

(55:37):
Michael hires a private investigator.
This is all before your montage with the snow jizz and everything else.
He hires a private investigator.
There's a parade that looks like it's from 1920.
Ben is in the parade carrying a child question mark.
He pushes his way through a marching band, which by the way is a Dick move.

(55:58):
don't make it.
Doesn't matter if you're in Iowa or anywhere else, marching bands.
These kids are focused.
You're not going to have some jerk and he pushes his way through.
He doesn't just like,
tiptoe around it where there's a space.
He makes a line directly through the band and kind of elbows a couple kids out of the wayto get over to her.
And that's what he
hard enough to perform John Philip Sousa while you are on the move in high school.

(56:23):
This guy is not helping.
You don't need mullet men coming through and disrupting the lines, which I'm sure theyworked very hard on these kids to do.
And so Sarah Laura, as I'm going to call her, is at home.
She drops her knitting needle.
Martin is just standing in the room staring at her.
This is another Michael Myers scene where all of a sudden there's no knock at the door.

(56:47):
He's in the room with her.
This is the reveal that we learned about in fatal attraction in the bathroom.
But in this case, it's just mullet man wanting to score and he's already in the house.
And this is the point where he says again, then we jumped to, and this is all before yourpretty woman thing here.
We jumped to another time, another night or whatever.

(57:10):
Ben jumps up at her at the front door after he's beating on it and he goes, did I scareyou?
And then the next thing we see her in this theater on a giant.
He wasn't titled to a good scale.
That's right!
That's right.
He was doing very well last night.

(57:30):
So Ben is there.
Ben has a studio with a giant swing on it.
He wastes a lot of snow, which you're not going to do.
then the Reese.
sources of this theater department.
You gotta be kidding me.
You gotta be kidding me.
He queued the pretty woman costume montage.
He's not dressing up.
He's just being a douche and a turtleneck while she is prancing around, but he's kind offorcing the clothes onto her.

(57:54):
He's giving her things to wear.
This is not a path of discovery for her.
He's he is in his environment in complete control of everything from the snow to thelights, to the clothes.
And she's changing.
He switches the song to do op.
We got run around Sue and then he forces her to dance and it's not a sweet
It's like a forced dance.

(58:14):
It's not romantic.
And then he, as I, as I put it in my notes, he's dancing with her rather violently.
He, the next thing, a hard cut into the house and he's pushing her through the door,violently pushing her through the door.
And then they're on the stairs and then he's trying to force himself on her.
And she has to say no about 10 times before he backs off.

(58:37):
And that's only after she pries herself out of his hands.
basically is crying because, you know, obviously she's got trauma to, because of what hadhappened in her past.
Yeah.
I mean, honestly, just one note should be enough.
Be like, Hey, listen,
She asked him to leave and he's pouty.
Yeah, he's a little bit and then he's and he makes his way out the door Like I gave herall the snow.

(58:58):
I deserve and he makes
a whole montage of trying on clothes
And you're like, three montages, we got so much going on, this poor woman cannot escapepredatory men at all.
No, you're right.
right.
But his theater skills come into play when he disguises her to see her mother.

(59:19):
Because we learn that the mother didn't actually die, that Laura, in the planning of this,had moved her mother to a different funeral home.
Funeral home, Jesus.
Had moved her mother to a different nursing home, my goodness.
you know, but she's afraid to go see the mother because she doesn't know if that couldexpose her or whatever.
So he dresses her up.
It will totally expose her.

(59:39):
will.
Absolutely will.
like he dresses, it's like dresses Julia Roberts up as Justin Bieber.
I can't say it, she, like, she turns like, and I-
weird thing she kinda with the stash she he kind of dresses her like her ex-husband
Absolutely.
well that's a, that's that's a, that's a.

(01:00:00):
And Rob, didn't you expect that to come into play once the confu- I expected there to beconfusion at some point about them being the same person.
No, I saw him come earlier.
No, he came later.
I didn't, but it never came into play that he's looking exactly like the ex except with ahat on.
Right.
No, but of course the day she goes to see her mother is the exact day that Martin arriveshaving tracked the mother being alive down.

(01:00:28):
So we have like a bunch of near misses where he almost sees Laura.
Martin drinks from a water fountain in the creepiest way I've ever seen.
my God, is just.
times he makes his way to a drinking fountain.
And he's just there.
By the way, they introduced the fact when she is starting, like prior to her disguiseactivities, they just show him standing in the room with the mom.

(01:00:54):
He's just standing next to her.
Again, another nod to John Carpenter, which I understand respect for John Carpenter aswell.
And I love Halloween.
We all love Halloween.
but we have two men in this movie who are Michael Myersing it from front to back.
And he's just, and so what was he doing while she was not only getting the costume on, butthen getting to this place, all of that, he's just wandering around the halls.

(01:01:19):
nobody's asking him.
Michael Myers is not the handbook on how to, like that's not the point of Halloween, isthat it's the handbook on how to behave around women.
Right!
No.
Well, and with this, now that we're like getting into the home stretch here with hisstalking of Martin stalking Laura slash Sarah, this is where the, it really, I think there

(01:01:43):
is a functional issue for me, which is that following him around, it's not just that hecan't jump out to scare.
It's not about that.
It's that he is the protagonist when we are following him.
Right.
Effectively.
And what we are doing is seeing him track her down and we don't want her to.
And I want to contrast this with another movie that does something similar.

(01:02:04):
The fugitive, right?
Sure.
When we're following Tommy Lee Jones, trying to track down, you know, Richard Kimball.
and I know I just mixed up a character and actor.
Yeah.
But that is a difference in that we are also seeing his mistaken beliefs are slowlygetting.

(01:02:25):
in that one, right?
So it's not just about the tension of, he going to track them down?
Because in many ways, if we are just with Dr.
Richard Kimball and following him, then you don't know how close the feds are or not.
But it's very functional because we're also seeing the cracks form in the official story.

(01:02:46):
Right, like when he goes to the hospital and learns that Kimball took the time to save thekid.
And it's like, well, that tells him something and he starts to, well, maybe this guy,where are you at, Desmondo?
it's that, there's two lines of discovery in that movie.
is Kimball trying to figure out who the One-Arm Man is and Gerard figuring out inessentially who Richard Kimball is.

(01:03:11):
Yeah, but here we just have a villain, but who is functioning as a protagonist trying todo something we don't want them to do.
And it's just but it's just kind of played like it's any other kind of shoe leather in anyother movie.
And it's such a weird mismatch for me because I like even when he's frustrated, I'm notfeeling like, yeah, maybe maybe he won't find her.

(01:03:37):
Maybe she will get away like that.
It's not even provoking that kind of an emotion.
And, you know, I'm not, you know, not really sure why, but it, really takes the steam outin an area where the momentum should be building for me.
No, I agree.
agree.
And also, it's interesting, these two movies both have scenes where you think the villainis going to smother somebody, some human being, with a pillow, and then it's just kind of

(01:04:05):
pillow-smothering fake out.
But least in this one
He was going to kill, you know, the mother and you he, learns from the mother, he talks toher and, and, and, know, he says he's a cop or whatever and she's, is blind.
So that makes it easier.
And, and, and he learns that, that she is dating a, you know, theater department guy thatat Cedar falls at the university there.

(01:04:30):
So he goes around, he goes to Cedar falls and starts attacking the drama departmentfaculty.
Like he grabs one guy in his car who's like, you know, there's no, there's half.
faculty members.
Now first of all guys there's no way a university of that size would have half a dozenfaculty members in the drama department.
There's no way.

(01:04:50):
just
Well there's also no way Michael could know this guy was one of them.
What?
It's just a guy in his car and he's in like, he's not like he followed him out.
He's in a car.
Michael is in the back seat, just like in Halloween 78.
It's another guy named Michael hanging out in a back seat, waiting for someone tohopefully come in the garage so we can reach around and give him heck.

(01:05:12):
And that's exactly what happened here.
But in this one, it turns into like this.
The whole thing.
this, yeah, he's got to find them and that's how, you
All those copies of Arthur Miller in the backseat.
knew it had to be one of the best.
just search in the cards
this guy's got a, this guy's got a physics textbook.

(01:05:33):
It's not the way it's, I love the alternate version where there's like a half an hour ofhim just getting the wrong professor.
I'm it again.
this really does turn into sleeping with the enemy in Haddonfield when the next thingwe're seeing is a POV shot from behind a tree.
And now all of a sudden we have Michael Bartel Myers just keeping his eye out for anyonewho happens to be near any proximity of the drama department.

(01:06:02):
He's going to follow big dumb hair Ben right out of there and know exactly who he is.
And then he's going to follow him around.
And where is he going to follow him guys?
The best place to go to follow someone and make sure to have easy tabs on them.
The town carnival at night, which is the most populated carnival in the universe forplaying this as a town that has parades from 1901.

(01:06:28):
This thing has a thousand plus people wandering around at it just packed.
And it's a, it's another montage number four of just
people moving cross camera, allows them to cut to another shot.
Here's another one.
Here's another one.
And instantly he finds his targets right away.
There's no break in the pace for dear old.

(01:06:49):
The important part here though is very reflective of Iowa.
These kinds of carnival fairs would be like RIP hog wild days in Hiawatha.
We got the St.
Pius chili days, the St.
Jude corn festival, anywhere where you can get food and have rides.
New Jersey too.
It would be the St.

(01:07:10):
John's Yanni Fair in New Jersey.
Come on.
Yeah, we didn't have TikTok.
We had to go get tossed around on a creaky metal ride.
Yeah, get on the the on the that machine that spins you around until you just what anightmare that one Ron my god is the worst I hate it so much
The silly silo at Adventureland.

(01:07:32):
So for people who are Halloween aficionados, in Halloween Six there's a character namedBarry Sims who was the time a riff on Howard Stern, but part of his disguise when he first
walks out on stage is he's wearing this black trench coat with the collar flipped up andhe's got the mustache and he's got the hair.
And Michael Bartel in our film here walking around looks straight up like Barry Sims atthe carnival.

(01:07:57):
Everyone else is out having fun.
running around with family and he is like this black cloud in a trench coat making his waythrough a rural fair not looking at all like a pervert just waiting to find who knows who
and do who
no way, you or Nell, you'd be looking at that guy and he's like, God, he's got nothing onunder that tree.
Exactly like why is this guy here?

(01:08:18):
But it but to him that's his disguise and he finds what he needs to see but then whathappens he just leaves
He just leaves.
Well, he's going to intercept them back at the house because they go back to the house andthey're going eat out in the backyard, but Laura wants to go in and take a bath.
She's like, she tells him it'll be 20 minutes, which seems unlikely for a full bath withhair wash.

(01:08:40):
before a date.
So they're supposed to get together.
And she had already established earlier that she takes showers because we saw her.
Right.
She came out of the shower earlier before dumb dumb came and shocked her for the thirdtime.
And she was standing in her towel, looking out the window.
No, that that's when he was prancing around the yard with his hose.

(01:09:00):
He's gesticulating.
Right.
So she takes showers is the bottom line.
And so if she's in a hurry to hang out with this guy, what's she going to do?
Draw back.
nice luxurious bath, but that allows her to notice bathroom towels are straight.
But here's what I was confused, because like, they weren't perfectly straight.
Like the one on the far left is down further than the other.

(01:09:22):
So I was like, wait, is this a sign that he's here or is it just like, is it a weirdthing?
And it's just like, there's a whole bit where like, then she goes back out.
Like she goes back outside to Ben and then it's not until she comes back inside and shenearly starts a fire with the toaster that she notices the cabinets being perfectly

(01:09:45):
arranged.
And that's the, I was confused by the towel thing because they were straightened, but notreally straightened.
I'm like, you know.
so then he, you know, thankfully Martin brought a boom box so he could play that classicalmusic that she hates.
But he uses-

(01:10:07):
Right, like it's the same piece of music at the beginning of The Shining, like whenthey're driving up.
Creepy as hell, but all I could think of was the Shining, which is, know, so he's in thehouse and he's there.
So we're we're we're we're hurtling towards the big confrontation.
Now.
I think that that this is where I actually think the movie does a great job, because it'slike it wants you to think that Martin's going to burst in, you know, to like be the

(01:10:34):
rescue or Martin that Ben is going to burst in to be the rescue.
But instead, you know, like there's a scene where like.
Martin's on one side of the door, Ben's on the other, and Laura's there, and once youthink Ben is gone, he bursts in, and then Martin promptly beats the crap out of this guy
and just knocks him.
Yeah, but wait, you're missing this other, this is another creepy moment for Ben becausethey had established like, what did she say?

(01:11:01):
They're joking around about like, well, after I'm ready, I'll see you tomorrow orsomething like that.
Oh, he said he couldn't wait, it's tomorrow!
I forgot, oh yeah!
Because he goes...
It's 12.05, so it's tomorrow!
Michael latches the door and hides kind of opposite of where it would open.
And so our, I keep saying Michael.

(01:11:22):
I saying the Okay.
All right.
I'm so sorry.
I've been saying in the second movie we got a Michael.
Okay.
I'm so sorry you guys.
So Martin is he he's behind the door.
Sarah Laura is on the side that would open, the lad, but like the little chain thing hasbeen closed.
so Ben can see Ben tries to push his way in.

(01:11:43):
And she's like, Hey, I'm not quite ready yet or something like that.
And he goes, well, it's 12 five.
couldn't wait until tomorrow.
And it's like, that's his worst continues to be his mo even after she's trusting him.
He's still trying to force his way into every.
This guy just couldn't be a little bit cool.
Man, I just hate it.
But then, you know, then he does try to burst in.

(01:12:04):
He clearly gets the vibe that something's wrong or maybe he was just going, you know,like, I don't know, but he bursts in and he just promptly gets the crap beaten out of him
by Martin.
And so the key thing about this movie, and I think it's one of the things that made it sosuccessful, is it's up to Laura to save herself.

(01:12:24):
It's not, she is not waiting for someone to save her.
And she knees Martin, there's a whole scene where Martin's getting close and he's talkingto her.
He's like, you know, I love, he's saying all kinds of creepy creeper abuser shit.
And then she knees him in the balls and she grabs the gun and fires, which I loved becauseshe didn't wait.

(01:12:47):
She wouldn't stand there like, oh, shaking with the gun.
Like she fires, she misses.
But hey, listen, I've never shot a gun.
I would probably miss too.
I don't have a problem that she misses, but she fires.
and fires again.
Yeah.
She does not stop at one.
Yeah!
Shot him six times!
Like, but there's a brief moment of pause where she like, you we get that line fromMartin, that famous line.

(01:13:25):
I know your every thought, You're wondering if they can protect you.
knows?
They may issue an order instructing me to stay away from my own wife.
Nothing can keep you.

(01:13:47):
live with
The bad news is that Ben probably feels the same way when he wakes up.
And then she shoots him.
And she shoots him several times.
Obviously, Julia Roberts was at the peak of her fame for Pretty Woman.
But at the same time, I think the fact that she takes action herself makes a hugedifference in this.

(01:14:14):
Yeah, I mean, was I was actually I'd never seen this one before.
I was actually surprised that a movie from this time period actually let her be the onewho say that.
I was totally expecting it to not be made.
drop the gun immediately thereafter too.
So that's always an annoying thing when that happens in movies when someone just drops theweapon that they could use to make sure that they're safe.

(01:14:37):
Right, but I mean she shot him a couple times at this point.
She has not seen all the movies in this series, so she doesn't know what we know is thathe's going to pop up one more time because that also needs to get added to your list of
the villain popping up one more time.
but she probably has seen Carrie.
She has seen something that would have given reference.
What he allows her to see.

(01:15:00):
You know, we don't know what, you know, what his.
You know, like she she doesn't know.
So but he grabs the gun.
But thankfully, it's empty because she did.
She did fire it.
And then he died.
So that's again, I think that that is the key to this movie.
And again, and the star power of Julia Roberts.
And honestly.

(01:15:20):
Whatever flaws this movie has and they it does.
But I think it was a great.
role for Julia Roberts following Pretty Woman because if she had just done anotherromantic comedy, she could have gotten very quickly pigeonholed as just a romantic comedy
actress.
And she's great here.
Like she is really good.

(01:15:41):
You spend a lot of time with her and she's really good carrying this thing with theseterrible men swirling around.
Yeah, no, she's fantastic in it.
And the movie, like some of the stuff, I think it's just baked in a little bit on the, onthe script side where there, there are things that, you know, they sound good on paper,

(01:16:04):
but just kind of the way it came together, it just, there are times I think in that, inthe second half where the movie is really working against itself.
In addition to, you know, all the other stuff going on, but,
But and Bergen is a great villain.
Yes.
Also want to restate that.
It's the greatest Lifetime movie ever.
Yeah.

(01:16:25):
Yeah.
This would have been a perfect rental.
Friday night, you didn't know what was going on.
And then you're just like, that's on the shelf and you get this and you'd probably you'dhave some popcorn and you'd probably be fine.
You know, I'm
I'm going to talk about that at the end when we get to the end of the second movie,because there's a little bit of both of these movies were very successful in their

(01:16:45):
theatrical run, but were very successful on home video.
And that's an interesting thing, I think, about both of them.
So, you know, I mean, it's again, I feel bad for Laura Sarah because, you know, this guy'sgoing to wake up and she is going to realize in like another two years or six months or

(01:17:06):
eight days,
that she has gotten together with another creeper because Ben is just terrible.
He's not the worst because Martin is the worst, but Ben is just terrible too.
Like Sleeping with the Enemy, our second film today also involves a villain who isobsessed with a particular woman, although that obsession prompts a very different set of

(01:17:29):
actions.
So from 1992, this is The Hand That Rocks.
The Bartels couldn't believe how fortunate they were to find Peyton.
I adore children, Mrs.

(01:17:50):
Fartel.
I love being with them.
I love taking care of them.
For me, it's the next best thing to actually being a mother.
But they didn't find her.
She seems terrific.
There is no guy her.
She's great.
She chose them.
You never let an attractive woman take a power position in your home.

(01:18:12):
All I'm saying is you have to watch your back.
Now, their innocence is her opportunity.
Do you really think so?
Their trust...
Faith's been great.
Has she?
I don't know what we would have done without her.
...is her weapon.
The hand that rocks the cradle.

(01:18:35):
The Hand That Rocks the Cradle is the second film we've discussed in this series fromdirector Curtis Hanson following bad influence in episode two.
And Hanson would follow this with a number of critically acclaimed films over the nextdecade, including The River Wild, LA Confidential, and Eight Mile.
And like bad influence, this movie really illustrates how good Hanson is at handling thistype of material.

(01:18:56):
Because I think what makes this movie successful is it lulls you into this false sense ofnormalcy before unleashing
Absolute insanity this movie is bonkers and I'll just say at the outset if you're obsessedwith breastfeeding Greenhouses or Gilbert and Sullivan.
This is the movie for you

(01:19:18):
Wait a minute.
Wait a minute up.
I see movement on the big board Chris
my God, Ernie Hudson is in this movie.
This is, mean, he's a get me another favorite.
This is his fourth get me another film, which puts him in the rarefied air of WilliamHootkins and Luciano Pagosi.

(01:19:40):
That's right.
You're you are it.
Once you've reached Italian level of numbers, those, those are big numbers, man.
They are, they are big numbers.
The Hand that Rocks the Cradle is written by Amanda Silver, who with her husband andproducing partner Rick Jaffa went on to work on the modern of the Planet of the Apes saga,
as well as James Cameron's continuing sci-fi series Avatar, all of which I'm sure has madethem very, very wealthy.

(01:20:07):
And the title, I should, I want to point out, takes its rather, the rather lengthy titlefrom an 1865 poem by William Ross Wallace that is quoted in the film,
The hand that rocks the cradle is the hand that rules the world.
Which guys makes it sound like this is a movie about someone trying to geneticallyengineer super babies with the aim of taking over the world, but it isn't.

(01:20:31):
It's just like, you're honestly, kind of called it bad nanny and that would have done it.
Excuse me.
I'm, leaving this podcast right now.
I'm not going to be writing a genetics super baby movie.
That's not what I'm doing, Chris.
Just, but what I, know, the, me, the perfect thing about this movie, it's fun as hell andit's great.

(01:20:54):
This is like the nineties.
I, know, erotic thriller, even though it's not erotic, but you know, it's that time.
It's a little, it's a little erotic.
The, the nineties erotic thriller version of Megan is how I would put this, where it, youknow, you know, maybe, you know, you know, it's just like, they are, they, it's just like

(01:21:18):
at every turn they go, well, what would be the most fun thing to do?
And then it's like, does, does it make sense?
Doesn't matter.
We're just doing the thing.
We're just going to do the thing.
Yeah, the film stars Annabella Sciorra, Rebecca DeMorne, Matt McCoy, as we mentioned,Ernie Hudson and Julianne Moore.
So it's a pretty accomplished, I mean, Annabella Sciorra and Rebecca DeMorne have had verysuccessful long careers.

(01:21:43):
Obviously Ernie Hudson, we love her, get me another.
This was an early role for Julianne Moore, who has become one of the most accomplishedactresses of the modern era.
And Matt McCoy took over from Steve Guttenberg as the lead in the later Police Academy.
Yeah, I think started with five.
was looking.
Yes, yes, was up.
was assignment Miami Beach and then he continued into city under siege.

(01:22:05):
Yeah, I know those things.
I know you do.
So we opened, again, we opened with a credit sequence, which does what I wanted SleepingWith the Enemy to do.
Just go through the house, put something on screen while you're doing, when you have thenames coming up, just something.
And we go through this beautiful Seattle home.
Now the Seattle location, I think, is really interesting in this point because in theearly 90s, Vancouver, British Columbia hadn't yet become Hollywood goes to filming

(01:22:36):
location.
So in fact, this was originally supposed to be shot in the Atlanta area, but the Seattlelocation for this time makes it a bit unique.
It's not like now where every movie is kind of, you know, Pacific Northwest overcast andhalf the movies and 75 % of TVs have a Pacific Northwest look to them because they all

(01:22:57):
shoot in Vancouver.
That wasn't the case back
Yeah.
So I think canonically, this is, around the same time as sleepless in Seattle.
So I think these things take place in the same universe.
Absolutely.
I mean, why not?
So the house is the home of Claire and Michael Bartel, who already have a young daughter,Emma, and Claire is currently pregnant with their second child.

(01:23:19):
And Michael is like a scientist of some kind.
Maybe he's working on the genetically engineered super babies.
I'm not sure.
That would have been a twist.
Claire does volunteer work at the local garden center and
Michael is apparently, this is the second movie where like, where the male, the principalmale non-villain is obsessed with show tunes.

(01:23:40):
Cause he is obsessed with Gilbert and Sullivan.
There's Gilbert and Sullivan posters throughout the house.
He sings Pirates of Penzance with the daughter.
And it's just, I just find it very interesting that in both movies today, the male lead isintroduced singing show tunes and turns out to
And I think there's a reason for that being in both movies.

(01:24:01):
It's because both of these movies up to this point, it's been almost exclusively maleleads.
Like the male is the hero, right?
Right.
And this is the first set of movies where the hero is female.
And yet also in this, first, in Sleeping with the Enemy, you could argue that you dohave...

(01:24:25):
Your other main character is the villain, right?
Right.
In a way we probably haven't seen quite since fatal attraction where it's like they aretheir own, you know, you're, going out with them.
Like we never went anywhere with Rob Lowe alone in a bad influence or, know,
Rarely with Ray Liotta in Unlawful.

(01:24:46):
Yeah.
You know, yeah.
But what I would argue is that this movie and a Bella Sierra is not the hero of thismovie.
The hero of this move, like the or the protagonist is Rebecca de Mornay.
The protagonist is the way I meant to say it.

(01:25:07):
It is her movie.
Yeah, no, I think that's absolutely true.
Yeah, it's because you're following this arc for her.
Correct.
And we'll get into the specifics of what that is.
And a lot of times, and it's honestly, it's a testament to how good Annabella Shorah isbecause she spends most of this movie, until the very end, reactive rather than active.

(01:25:30):
she's still good because that's hard to play reactive and she does a great job with it.
But it's Rebecca that Mournain that is the active character.
No, it is a bit of a magic trick with the performances and direction and everything,because, it's not, I don't know that I was actively thinking about it during the film.

(01:25:51):
Right.
It was only after reflecting like, that's, that's Peyton's movie.
She does everything in this movie until, until like the, the last.
The very end, yeah.
The very end, yeah.
And as the movie begins, it's interesting, because we see a man approaching this house ona bike with a tool chest.
And this is Solomon, played by Ernie Hudson.

(01:26:12):
And it's funny, in Justin's list, he mentioned there's a frequent recurring theme of blackmale intruders into homes.
We saw that on Lawful Entry.
They actually kind of play with that trope.
because you see Ernie Hudson kind of wandering around the backyard and then you have thereveal that he is playing a mentally handicapped man who has been hired to build a fence

(01:26:41):
around the Bartels house.
And guys, I was so nervous this whole movie.
I was so nervous that, cause like, you know, obviously Ernie Hudson is an accomplishedactor, but playing a character like this who is mentally handicapped, I'm just like.
Dear God, please do not go into I am Sam territory.
Please, please, I can't, I can't do it.

(01:27:02):
And he didn't.
He stayed on the other side of the I am Sam line and thank God.
Yeah, and an interesting thing too that it does and look, it'll, how successful willdepend on, I'm sure the viewer, but at least this movie is at least acknowledging and
trying to make the main characters feel bad for the knee-jerk racism when they see thecharacter, know, when they see him come.

(01:27:29):
But then it actively makes the white characters knee-jerk racist reactions into a storypoint.
down the road as well.
It's a key point in the movie.
Right.
And, and our character and they, and the characters pay for it.
So I, and look, you know, I, this is not a movie that is about that at all.

(01:27:50):
It is just, you know, a piece that is used within the film, but as compared to say PacificHeights, where you have something very similar with a detective character who comes back,
but it's not really, it is, it is just lip service in that movie.
Whereas
It amounts to nothing.
Here it amounts to something and they functionally use it and you know, you know, it'sit's at least interesting that if you're going to do it, that you're trying to do

(01:28:17):
something a little more rather than just regurgitate the stereotypes.
No, I agree.
Absolutely.
So Claire, Claire is pregnant.
She's pregnant with their couple's second child.
So she goes to her gynecologist office, which guys did you see it?
The biggest wall of glass blocks yet at the gynecologist office.
My

(01:28:38):
I have it in all caps.
Oh, me too.
Enormous wall of glass blocks in all caps in my notes.
Yes, absolutely.
And so we have a situation where her old doctor just retired, like in the middle of herpregnancy.
So now John Delancey is taken over as her doctor, who we saw previously in Curse Hansen'sBad Influence.
And John Delancey's character, Dr.

(01:28:59):
Mott, is a bad doctor.
He is a bad doctor.
as, again.
This is one of those things where this scene is very, like the scene where Laura gets hitin Sleeping with the Enemy.
Here, Dr.
Mott molests Claire, sexually molests Claire right there in the doctor's office.

(01:29:25):
it's just like, it's such a shocking turn of events.
I'm like, I can't believe this is happening.
No, it is very shocking.
It's, hard to sit through.
It's, it's thankfully, you know, yeah.
I mean, it's, there to do what it's supposed to do for the story and motivate things, butit is, yeah, it is.

(01:29:46):
It's all.
In a moment, he takes off the gloves.
takes off that rubber glove and you hear it and it's just, my God, it's just terrible.
So Claire is understandably upset and angry about this and she tells her husband about it.
And for once, the guy in the movie handles this kind of thing well, because he's like, youshould report this guy.

(01:30:07):
know, like he's not, thank God he wasn't like, hey, you should just forget about it ordon't make it a big deal.
He's like, no, you should report this guy.
And when she does, apparently that opens a floodgate of other women that he had abused.
And the disgrace and pending criminal charges lead Dr.
Mott to kill himself.

(01:30:27):
This is all in the first like seven minutes of this movie.
Like this is happening fast and it's crazy.
And then we learned that Dr.
Mott's own wife was pregnant with their first child.
And who is that wife?
It's Rebecca DeBord.
Honestly, mean, it's just, this movie, it goes hard and it's just like.

(01:30:49):
Early.
we haven't even gotten to anyone renovating anything in a house yet.
That's not really.
Well, know, Solomon's gonna be building a fence for her.
He's doing renovations around that house for months.
I don't know what they have him doing, because they haven't just moved it, but anyway.
So, due to the stress from her husband being accused of sexual assault and then killinghimself, Rebecca DeBordi's character, Mrs.

(01:31:13):
Mott, loses the baby and because of the emergency hysterectomy is incapable of havinganother one.
What I thought was really interesting here is that they...
they did not make any attempt in the movie to hide the identity of Rebecca de Borne'scharacter.
I feel like another film would have tried to make an attempt at making her identity themystery and then having the audience learn it as the characters do.

(01:31:40):
But the film side steps all of that by telling us who she is at the outset and thereforeletting us in on the sequence.
And that's part of the letting us in on it.
You, really does become the active character in the movie.
what Peyton, Is Peyton.
Yeah, Mrs.
Mott, she takes the name Peyton when she goes and becomes their nanny.

(01:32:03):
This is, think very much us knowing who she is.
This is bomb under the table territory.
Cause it makes all of these, every normal scene gets of like, you know, a nanny with afamily and, and you're not, it's not anything crazy yet, but the tension because we know

(01:32:23):
and you can, and Rebecca de Mornay's performance in this is great because their wholescenes where
you know, on the surface, nothing happened out of the ordinary.
It's, know, like the equivalent of, you know, we're going to go to a party, watch the kid.
mean, that's not it, but in any event, and what you see are these very subtle wheelsturning with her and you know, she's doing something, but you don't yet know what it is

(01:32:51):
and it gets revealed.
And that's part of the fun of this is seeing what kind of mayhem she's going to cause, youknow, it's like,
You know, she just did something and then three scenes later, you're going to see it blowup in the family's face.
And they tip their cards a little bit right there in the emergency room when she's havingthat emergency hysterectomy, losing her baby.

(01:33:13):
It's like this bloody scene in the emergency room, intercut with footage of the Bartelsplaying with their kid on the bed, rolling around.
mean, it's just back and forth and back and forth between the two.
So it's very clear that they're like, make note of this.
This lady's losing everything.
She has now lost everything.
These guys seem to have it all.

(01:33:34):
It's very much like the contrast between Alex alone in her apartment, flipping the lighton and off, the family, Michael Douglas and Archer and the family going out and bowling
and having a good time.
It's that direct contrast, and we get that here in this scene where we're cutting back andforth between a tale of two babies, one lost and one not.

(01:33:58):
What I think is just so interesting with us, with the audience knowing so much but notall.
is that it makes us kind of co-conspirators to a degree.
Like we're in on it.
We know what's happening, but we know more than the main characters or the protagonists.
But we don't know everything.
And it's real interesting.

(01:34:19):
There's never a time I think where it's safe to assume what her end game is.
No!
No, she's sh-
no straight revenge.
Cause if she wanted to just kill this woman, this movie could have been a short.
It could have been 15 minutes long and it could have been done.
So you're wondering the whole time, like, why is she going to these lengths and why doesshe continue to drag this out?

(01:34:41):
And I think that's a great way to keep the audience on the hook from front to back becauseit's absolutely intriguing.
What, what is she doing all this for?
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
So they have the, she loses the baby.
We jump ahead six months and the Bartels now have a new baby boy named Joey and Solomon'sfinished the fence, but he seems to have just taken a permanent position doing odd jobs

(01:35:06):
for the family.
And Claire is considering getting a nanny.
And this is interesting and it speaks to something Justin brought up earlier, which isthat nobody works.
Like,
If this movie was made today, Claire would need to be getting a nanny because she's goingback to work.
As many people do because, you know, two income families.

(01:35:28):
But this is not a two income family.
She's getting a nanny because she has time to build a greenhouse in the backyard!
and to volunteer at the other greenhouse.
and the volunteer.
There's somebody green.
There is, it's greenhouse food.
She has nothing but a volunteer gig, which has to be occasional at best, but they need ananny.

(01:35:52):
It's just too much.
And Michael is like, man, how are you going to handle all this?
mean, do you think you're taking on too much?
And I'm thinking, taking on too much of what?
Yeah!
Solomon's doing the work around the house.
You have, I mean, what, what do you need?
I don't know.
It's, it's...

(01:36:14):
So, so she's approached by, by Mrs.
Mott, who's taken on the name of Peyton Flanders, with the aim of getting the nannyposition in the Bartels' house.
But wait, how are we introduced to her being in this same area, to Peyton being in thisplace?
Peyton stands in front of the school bus until it stops.
She had like the kid had forgotten something.

(01:36:35):
was a, I forget, clothing, lunch, whatever.
Right, but she says to bus driver, after she appears on camera out from in front of thebus, thank you for stopping.
That's what Peyton says to the bus driver.
So what, she was like flagging the bus down to stop?
How would she even know that any of this was gonna be happening?
And then immediately this bond is formed.

(01:36:58):
Excuse me, do you know where the Bartels live?
Oh, well, I'm Claire Bartel.
Oh, hi, I'm Peyton Flanders.
Hi.
I was coming about the nanny position.
Oh, oh, all right.
Well, you want to come on up to the house?
I can't believe I forgot that I had an appointment with you.
I'm usually so good about these things.

(01:37:20):
Well, actually, I didn't have an appointment.
did the agency just tell you stop on by?
Well, no, I'm not with an agency.
Well, you see, the truth is I've only worked with one family and they're moving away.
And I didn't know what I was going to do next.
And, well, I was with a little girl in the park and Nanny's talk and I heard that yourfamily needed someone, so.

(01:37:47):
I'm sorry.
I shouldn't have just showed up.
guess I've made you uncomfortable.
No, it's fine.
Really.
I mean, you're here.
Come on in.
Are you sure?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
mean, first of all, how did she know that they were hiring a nanny to begin with?
Like, yeah, like it's, it's like, here's the question is what was her plan if they weren'tgoing to get a nanny?

(01:38:13):
Right.
Or if she didn't get the job?
Like she mentions that she heard the position being talked about in the park where Emmaplays and that like that's nanny's talk.
She actually says the line nanny's talk.
And I'm like, was there a scene at one point that was cut where we see her hanging out ofthe park without a kid of her own?
And she overhears, the Bartel, I interviewed with the Bartel family, but I don't think I'mgoing to get the gig.

(01:38:38):
Or is she just going to ban it up and just show up at the house and force her way?
know bends it up as it is.
But like it's it's so but Peyton she quickly endears herself to Claire like so much sothat Claire invites her over for dinner to meet the rest of the family.
Love this devilish move.

(01:39:00):
at the.
saves baby Joey from choking on the back of Claire's earring by planting it in the, likeshe notices it fall on the floor.
She grabs it.
And then at the right moment, she plants it in the crib and then saves the child.
It's amazing.
It was in his mouth.
I saved him from choking.
We also have Chekhov's breast because Peyton watches Claire very openly breastfeeding infront of Peyton, welcoming her in.

(01:39:28):
Later on, Claire's going to be half naked, changing and just having conversation withPeyton who happens to appear at the door.
So Claire's very open.
We can see from the very beginning here, but the whole breastfeeding thing, we're gettingthis right from the get-go.
Like, well, I'm sure this is going to come into play later.
And this is also when we have more painting.
We get to the renovation here at the same point in the film and Solomon, he's got paint onhim.

(01:39:53):
There's some paint on the ladder.
It's just kind of messy.
Like he's been working there for six months!
but he doesn't trust he has this eye.
looks at Peyton like, wait a minute, something's a little weird here.
And then Peyton moves in.
Peyton moves into the, like, that's the thing, she's a live-in nanny for a family with oneparent working.

(01:40:14):
50 % of the adults in that house are just volunteering sometimes.
And I'm just going to say here in the patent cut of this movie, when you're first of all,they're throwing her in the basement as if she's like, like, there's a horror movie from
her from her POV here for sure.

(01:40:37):
And they're like, look, no, this part's really sunny.
And you're like, yeah, I'd be like, you know, have a of sunlight you're getting becauseyou're below ground.
Meanwhile, they have an attic that is just storage.
Yeah, that would be a great place.
And Peyton starts getting up at odd hours of the night to breastfeed Joey.

(01:40:57):
Like she sets an alarm for like three in the morning.
And I will admit, I did not understand why until later in the film.
Like it's very cleverly done.
Because I'm like, well, okay, she's getting up in the middle of the night to breastfeedand like, okay, sure.
And that's the second pillow that you mentioned earlier.
second pillow fake out is here where you think she's gonna you know just smother the childand like well

(01:41:19):
that baby is the cutest baby that we've seen in any film in any series so far.
is the most beautiful little baby, so adorable.
I'm just like, man, I'm a sucker for babies anyway.
But usually a lot of times in movies you're like, that kid's like three times older thanthey would be or there's something wrong.
With this baby, nothing wrong.
No, no, it's on this baby.

(01:41:39):
What's on the baby?
No, absolutely.
But so her plan, like Peyton's plan, as we're going to learn is like essentially to pushClaire out and take her place in the family, which is absolutely insane.
Like that is an absolutely insane, of all the villains in this series, she has the mostbonkers plan.

(01:42:04):
Yeah, because most of her plan involves being totally awesome.
Right?
And then just doing some stuff behind the scenes to slowly make Claire go crazy.
Like the perfume on the dress.
It's little things like this.
much petty sabotage that she engages in.
I like, again, it's usually, it's a delight.

(01:42:27):
It's like, it's like, they're going out, the, couples going out for, for like a night outwith, with their, friends, which is the, the, you know, like they have this couple that is
their friends, which are the Cravens, which I'm going to talk about in a minute, but, butthey're, they're going out and she,
She puts a spot on the dress that Claire was gonna wear, so she has to wear this other,much less attractive dress.

(01:42:49):
And Ed prompts Michael to ask her, why didn't you wear the dress I'm like?
Bad move, Michael.
Come on, no woman wants to hear why didn't you wear the dress I like.
And the friend makes note of the perfume too.
you're wearing Claire's perfume.
Yes.
I have to run upstairs.
Then she runs up to the baby or whatever.
So yeah, it's not lost on everyone that something's a little bit amiss, but that neverreally becomes anything.

(01:43:13):
And at this dinner, they say the thing.
Well, yeah, yeah, we will get to that.
But I have to talk about the Cravens first because the wife, Marlene, is this bitchy,campy, like high powered realtor.
And it's like, it's a fascinating thing because we don't see much of the husband exceptthe first thing he does is leer at Rebecca DeMornay and wonder out loud if maybe they

(01:43:37):
should have kids so they can get a nanny.
And I'm like, dude, you're married to Julianne Moore.
What is your problem?
Like, it's just like it's saying.
And the relationship between these couples is odd.
Because a couple of times I found myself asking, like these two women, like Claire andMarlene are so different, why are they even friends?

(01:43:58):
And the answer to that is that Marlene is lifelong friends with Michael, the husband, andthe two used to date.
Guys, and I had a conversation with my wife about this.
If you think...
For one second that my wife would want to be friends with a former girlfriend of mine andher new husband and that we would all hang out together, I will take things that would

(01:44:26):
never fucking happen for 1,000, Alex.
Holy shit, especially that wife was, the ex was Julianne Moore.
Forget it.
It's in, the whole relationship is insane.
Really.
In a relationship I was in, it was suggested and she was just really put off by the factthat I didn't want to go and visit her ex in California and hang out with him and his

(01:44:50):
wife.
No!
Like it just...
But like it's all insane.
it's emblematic of sort of this movie, which I liked.
It is a very entertaining movie because it's this batshit crazy fun movie.
But in order to make this Rube Goldberg plot work, you have to allow for all thesecontrivances.

(01:45:13):
Otherwise, Mrs.
Mott's plan would fall apart.
Like if Michael and Marlene didn't have that prior relationship,
the seeds of infidelity that Mrs.
Mott puts in Claire's mind wouldn't have been so strong.
And it's just like, but this is, there's no, I actually asked my wife at dinner the othernight, like, would you be all right with this?
And she'd be like, she looked at me like I was nuts.

(01:45:36):
Just absolutely insane.
There's no way.
I mean, it's just.
I it's different in Seattle, you're right, Chris.
A lot of things won't work.
mean, but another way to look at it, which is it's like having your ex be family friendsis like the clock tower flyer.

(01:46:05):
It's like, know where lightning is going to strike in 1955 and the movie won't workwithout that.
Right.
Like how many times in your life have you ever had a flyer that's like, exactly this timelightning struck?
Three or four?
I mean, only three or four, you know?
You know, and at the end of the day, it's as you said, it's the Rube Goldberg machine.

(01:46:26):
And there's just such a pleasure in watching it is stuff happen.
It's the dominoes just keep falling.
Yes, and it is both, like I acknowledge that this movie is ridiculous.
And I also, it is incredibly entertaining.
Like both of those things are true.
Yeah, I mean, I don't need everything to be the most realistic.

(01:46:47):
Sometimes I just want it to be fun.
Yeah.
And it's, it's, it's, this is where Marlene, they go out to Dan, this is where Marlenewarns about letting another woman take a power position in her house and we get the sweet
title drop.
Wait, I got it.
The hand that rocks the cradle is the hand that rules the world.

(01:47:07):
And here's the thing about Mrs.
Mott, like a slash Peyton, she's not really that bad of a nanny.
Like she lets Emma watch the 1932 classic white zombie while her parents are out.
not that bad.
She is the best Danny aside from the whole murder stuff.
That's good.
There's stuff, like, she's kind of great.

(01:47:28):
Like, yeah, like zombie is a class.
I mean, let's get real.
Emma likes her better than her own mother.
And you know,
Emma's getting bullied by a boy at school?
Like, Mrs.
Mott does not hesitate to step in to set that little shit straight.

(01:47:48):
I got a message for you, Leave Emma alone.
Look at me.
If you don't, I'm gonna rip your fucking head off.
Don't forget it.
Y'all rip your fucking head off.
Amazing.
I mean, honestly, she should have just gone into as a legitimate nanny.

(01:48:10):
She's great.
Like it's funny because these two movies have this inverse thing where like Ben inSleeping with the Enemy is supposed to be like the good boyfriend, but he sucks.
And Mrs.
Mott slash Peyton is supposed to be the evil nanny, but she's fucking awesome.
I mean, let's face it.
She's Mrs.
Surefire.
Am I right?

(01:48:30):
There we go.
So we get more little sabotages like when Mrs.
Mott destroys an important letter that Claire was going to take to FedEx for her husband.
And she sneaks out of Claire's bag.
love, they're at the garden center where Claire volunteers.
She goes to the bathroom stall and she just so fully commits to destroying that letter andthe bathroom.

(01:48:54):
Like she just goes completely fucking mental and then just fixes her hair and goes back toher duties.
But she gets the job done.
That ring's not gonna be sitting in that toilet.
I tell ya.
Exactly.
And more importantly, by the way, if the letter's that important, maybe you don't waituntil the last day to send it out, Michael.

(01:49:15):
You know, like, come on.
Problems with mail, I'm telling you.
You're right, you're right, there's problems.
And when Claire can't find her, she has a full on asthma attack, which is one of severaltimes the movie sets up her debilitating asthma, which is gonna be important.
But it's always handled poorly because it's inserted after the fact and none of theheaving and heavy breathing matches what she's doing at all in any scene where she has an

(01:49:44):
asthma attack.
It's like you think that Michael Myers is behind the camera and he's...
But she's just, I don't know, not selling it.
No selling.
She's the undertaker, not selling.
And Mrs.
Mott admittedly has the signature move.
She's got her signature move, which is to verbally plant the seeds of something and thenliterally plant an item that will confirm that idea.

(01:50:14):
Because that's how she gets rid of Solomon.
Solomon is the only one who doesn't trust her and he secretly saw her breastfeeding Joey.
that means he has knowledge.
He doesn't understand what that means, but he knows it's wrong.
And it's a great moment where she tries to intimidate him and he can't really speak up toher because of his condition.

(01:50:36):
But once she's gone and there's a great little bit of acting by Ernie Hudson, he's like,I'm not going to let you hurt my friends.
He can't say it to her face, but he says it when she's gone and it's really good.
And then that tear rolls out from him.
I mean, it's a short moment, but it is probably his best moment in the whole film.
He's that one right there.

(01:50:57):
But she starts that with him, cornering him, pushing him up against the wall and saying,are you a retard?
And then she whacks him, slaps him in the face and says, don't fuck with me retard.
My version of the story will be better than yours.
And you're like.
WHA-
Yeah, no, she is such a great villain.
mean, guys, she's really one of the best villains of the series so far.

(01:51:23):
I think Alex, think Ray Liotta in Unlawful Entry and Rebecca DeMorda here are just,they're at the top tier right now.
We'll see how this series progresses, because we have a ways to go.
So we cut to Michael, like the husband, asking Solomon to step in the garage.
And he's like, he says it in a tone that like Solomon's in trouble.

(01:51:46):
Like there's no ambiguity about his tone, but it's just the fake out to reveal the brandnew bike the Bartlett's have bought him.
But Mrs.
Mott, she's not done with him yet because she suggests to Claire that Solomon might betouching Emma inappropriately.
And then what does she do?
She plants a pair of Emma's underwear in Solomon's tool chest.

(01:52:08):
So Claire, at just the right moment,
would find it and then freak out and promptly fire him.
I mean, it's an amazing move.
So not only does that get Solomon out of the way, but since Emma and Solomon have had sucha strong bond, that starts to put distance between Emma and her mom.
That said, Solomon continues to watch the family from afar because he knows that this is abad nanny.

(01:52:32):
So for Peyton slash Mrs.
Mott's next gambit, we have the surprise berth.
This is incredible.
This is my number one devious move and it doesn't even result in anyone dying.
No, but it's the best one.
So basically, she suggests to Michael that they plan a birthday party, a surprise birthdayparty for Claire, and that he's going to plan it with Marlene.

(01:53:03):
And then plants the seeds in Claire that Michael is cheating.
And I just want to say, putting aside this movie for a second, I just want to say as ageneral note, I don't think surprise parties, they're almost never good ideas.
Don't make the party a surprise.
There's too much that can go wrong.
There's plenty of surprises you can have at the party without the party itself being oneof them.

(01:53:25):
That is my feeling on surprise parties and this movie bears that out.
And this is the only moment well one of just a couple very brief moments when Peyton showsup at his off at Michael's office Yes, and and they have their little discussion and he's
like, yeah, that's actually a really great idea and And then she gives them a couplelittle looks and you see him return those little looks and it's the only time It was

(01:53:54):
interesting the last episode same where these aren't movies at this point
that are reliant on cheating.
There aren't affairs being had here.
It's a different kind of arrangement all around, but you keep expecting her to try to getinto his head a little bit, into his heart a little bit.

(01:54:15):
And this is one of those moments where you start to wonder, like, is he gonna take thebait?
And I thought that that was well done at this scene in the office.
And it sets like his, his coworkers, nothing really comes of this, but his coworkers arekind of watching this attractive woman come into the office and he's talking with her.
They don't hear the conversation, but you know, like, and then later he's talking to oneof the coworkers is like, it's my nanny.

(01:54:38):
And the guy's kind of like, yeah.
Like it's, but like the whole party thing.
like,
Marlene is a smoker and Michael, we learn, will occasionally smoke when he's with her,including when they are together planning the party.
So when Claire smells smoke on Michael's clothes, she asks him about it.

(01:55:02):
And this is where he makes the mistake.
He lies.
He lies.
All he needed to say was, I saw Marlene and yeah, I had a cigarette.
But the fact that he lies puts in her mind, what else is he lying?
I mean, it's just, and so that puts the seed of doubt in her head.
And then when she finds Marlene's distinctive gold lighter in Michael's jacket, she thenshe's like, God, he's cheating.

(01:55:29):
And she confronts him about it at the absolutely perfect time.
Claire.
Honey, what's the matter?
How could you do this?
What are you talking about?
You've been lying to me!

(01:55:51):
Honey, just calm down.
Don't tell me to calm down, you son of a bitch!
Honey, don't understand.
I understand even fucking Marlene!
Alright, that's enough!
There are people
in there.

(01:56:15):
Talking about a surprise party.
Everybody's in there.

(01:56:47):
surprise.
Honestly, when it is revealed that this is the day of the surprise party, it's it is sucha genuinely holy shit moment despite being absolutely ridiculous in its contrivance.
is the perfect emblem of this whole movie.
It's ridiculous.
And I love it.

(01:57:08):
my God.
There's people in the other room, Claire.
Like,
The look on the daughter's face in and you know, everyone has heard it.
This, this is the peak puppet master moment.

(01:57:29):
Like, my God, evil genius.
anything had been different, this wouldn't have worked out.
Again, it's the perfect emblem for this movie.
This is a ridiculous situation, but it is just amazing to watch.
I gotta say, is, Julianne Moore is fantastic in this movie, because she plays this kind ofover-the-top bitchy lady, but stops short of making her cartoonish or unlikable.

(01:57:56):
It's a real fine line to walk.
Because we have then this sequence where we follow Marlene for a while as she putstogether the pieces of Mrs.
Mott's identity.
Like she's the one actually selling the Mott's gorgeous ultra-modern house, another housethat I want that my wife and I would be very happy in, in its beautiful coldness.

(01:58:22):
What I love is that this is where Marlene's hatred of the wind chime gifted the family.
The hatred of that wind chime is the key to it all.
We get the microfiche after that.
So I'm a happy boy.
At the House Two is a great mystery.

(01:58:47):
They're showing the house, right?
The realtor lets them in, walking around and stuff.
They left the breast pump?
If you're gonna show a house you're at least gonna I don't know dust whatever you wouldThe used breast pump six months later might not just be hanging out

(01:59:07):
But it's been sitting there for six months.
But yeah, they established, I want to talk about the wind chimes.
Mrs.
Mott Payton gives a gift of wind chimes to the Bartels, which they hung up.
And then Marlene comments on those awful wind chimes.
And then when she's looking at like the realtor material for this house, she sees the windchimes and that's where she makes the connection.

(01:59:33):
And then eventually finds a picture of Mrs.
Mott and it's just,
It's, love the whole detective Marlene as the detective sequence in this.
And that leads to the microfeed where she finds the picture.
It's amazing.
And, and here's what I love, despite the fact that Claire just like publicly accused herof sleeping with her husband at a party, Marlene immediately tries to reach Claire.

(02:00:02):
And when she can't do it by phone, she drives like a mad woman across town.
to get to that house where she's going to meet a gruesome fate.
Because Mrs.
Mott, she's finally getting ready to off Claire.
So her plan, I love this plan, is to rig the greenhouse that Claire has built in thebackyard so the glass roof will rain shattered shards of glass down upon her.

(02:00:28):
is a perfect, again, this movie is ridiculous, but it is consistent in its ridiculousness.
And I love it for
That in an Argento film would have been handled very differently how the greenhouse thingplays out.
But it is straight up Italian giallo moment.
It really is.
It's insane.
Again, I all over the place thought this week that we were secretly watching Italianfilms.

(02:00:55):
my God.
So Marlene goes into the greenhouse thinking that's where Claire is.
Cause she's trying to tell her, you know, she, she actually even reveals, you like, I knowwho you are, Mrs.
Mott.
And then she goes to the greenhouse looking for Claire and the trap is sprung and those,that glass comes down and it's just, it's, it's a bloody mess.
And, I, what, again, one of the things I love here is that with her greenhouse planfoiled, cause you can't, you can't pull that one twice.

(02:01:22):
she immediately pivots to a backup plan of sabotaging all of Claire's inhalers, which sheknows she'll need when she discovers, you know, cut to ribbons Marlene.
And it's exactly what
Yeah, they go they go into great detail with this too, where there's really, at first,she's trying to just go one squirt at a time.
And that's right.

(02:01:43):
She's like, poking them open and then like, so she finally gets the system down.
So you get to see you get to the genius at
are her co-conspirators.
We're in on the whole thing.
And Claire rushes home and she sees what is going on.
She has an asthma attack on the porch of the house, which is honestly terrifying.

(02:02:08):
we're watching Claire literally gasp for air and the camera holds on Annabella Sciorra'sface for so long and her breaths become further and further apart.
I have no idea how they shot that.
Terrifying.
And the makeup on that section is great.
Makeup is so good.
mean, it really does look like she's getting oxygen to pride, but like subtly.

(02:02:33):
So it's not, it's not too much.
actually, really like.
It's, but it's terrifying.
and it's just like, now she did before she goes out on the porch to have her final attack,she does put in a call to 9-11.
So she saved at the last minute.
We have this thing where like Mrs.
Mott had taken out the kids for a walk and she sees the cops and the EMTs on their way.

(02:02:56):
And she knows that her plan, at least this plan was foiled.
then Claire, while Claire's in the hospital, Mrs.
Mott slash Peyton starts putting the move on Michael.
She starts putting the moves on Michael.
And this is the moment where I thought she kind of overplayed her hand.
Like this guy clearly has no desire to cheat on Claire.
If he never did with Marlene in all those years, he's not going to do it now with thenanny while his wife is in the hospital after having nearly died.

(02:03:25):
But she, you know, she she's very wet in the the in the laundry room.
There's a whole thing.
But he's, you know, he's a stand up guy, at least, you know.
In that regard...
he did see one thing earlier in the film that would have given him, I think pause.
And that's that she spilled all the ice on the kitchen floor and then just threw it allback in the ice tray to put it back in the fridge.

(02:03:50):
You know, So he knew deep down.
no, no reasonable person would do that.
No, absolutely not.
So then we have this whole sequence where Claire finds a note from Marlene in her laundry.
And that leads her to basically following the same path to discover Mrs.
Mott's identity.

(02:04:10):
And she, goes to the house, you know, the super modern house, she finds, turtle stencilsin the bedroom, which, you know, is,
which Mrs.
had done in their own house.
And then, again, I love this.
She comes back to the house.
She's learned who Mrs.
Mott is.
She comes back to the house.
She walks in.
She doesn't say a word to Peyton slash Mrs.

(02:04:34):
Mott.
She just hauls off and hits her right in the face, sends her flying over the dining roomtable.
It's fantastic.
Like it's a fantastic moment.
Both of these movies have moments where the female protagonist does the thing you wantthem to do rather than fucking around.
With Laura, it's firing the gun when she gets it.

(02:04:56):
Here, it's just clocking Peyton across the
The moment has been earned.
Absolutely.
Ten times over.
Yes, yes.
Oh my goodness.
And then, you know, they throw Mrs.
out, they don't even let her go down to the basement to collect her stuff.
And they're preparing to move to a hotel, go to a hotel for safety when Michael hears themusic from the basement where Mrs.

(02:05:19):
Mott's room was.
And that's, you know, he goes down to check it out, doesn't find anything.
But on his way back up, Mrs.
Mott pops out of nowhere and smacks him in the face with a shovel, knocking him over thestairs.
and breaking both of his legs.
Holy shit.

(02:05:39):
And he's basically at a commission for the climax.
So it's another movie where you have this male protagonist who's just, you know,essentially the male lead is out of the, he's just out of it.
And it's up to the female protagonist to essentially save the day.
So next Mrs.
attacks Claire.
You know, she knocks her out with a shovel.

(02:06:01):
There's a whole hide and seek.
cat and mouse game where Emma has witnessed her mother get attacked by the nanny who sheliked.
And, you know, she's trying to hide baby Joey.
There's a clever use of a baby monitor.
Solomon shows up, because remember he's been watching, tries to help the kids escape.
And we wind up in a climactic scene in the attic where Claire fakes an asthma attackbefore, you know, the final confrontation with Mrs.

(02:06:27):
Mott, which that attic window, you know, she's going out that attic window.
You just know it the whole time.
The fall from a great height will be coming well, or at least a good height.
Yes, I was going to say she pushes her out the window and she's impaled on the picketfence that Solomon had built.
So there's no pop-up moment.

(02:06:48):
in some of the other films, there's no that last pop-up, but that other 90s method ofkilling the villain, the fall from a great height, which we saw in Batman and a number of
the other movies in our Get Me Another Batman series.
And the day is saved.
And I got to say, this movie is bonkers and I absolutely loved it.

(02:07:10):
It is, it's an insane movie and it is incredibly entertaining.
you want your Curtis Hansen crime double feature, I would actually recommend not a badinfluence to pair with this.
But if you want just bonkersness that is super entertaining is the, I guess newlyrediscovered cause I saw it cause was on Criterion channel a few years back or whatever,

(02:07:36):
but the silent partner is great Christmas movie.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And, and that movie,
paired with this, think they're both, cause they both are completely of their genre, butlike so off the wall as well in like wonderful ways.
Right, right.
You know, honestly, I haven't seen The Silent Partner and I have to, it is on my list.

(02:08:00):
if you want to see Christopher plumber in a fishnet shirt, you need to see the silentpartner, my friend and I and eyeliner.
Yeah.
I want to mention one thing I read about this film and it's interesting.
there was a Bollywood remake of the hand that rocks the cradle in the nineties.
And there's a number of films in this series that have had overseas remake, includingunlawful entry.

(02:08:26):
There'd been a couple overseas versions of consenting adults.
So maybe guys, we're going to have to do an episode, a bonus episode down the road withsome of the international versions from this series.
If we could find them.
It's,
It's interesting because there's a number of minor similarities between today's two films,but what really stands out to me between them is we have very black and white morality.

(02:08:52):
by this, at this point, know, gone is the complexity of fatal attraction or presumedinnocence or even bad influence.
Like good and evil in both of these movies stand in very stark contrast to one another.
Correct.
The other thing about these two movies that have in common is that they were both reallybig hits.
When they came out in 1991 and 1992 respectively they they did really well both hadbudgets under 20 million dollars Sleeping with the enemy made a hundred and seventy five

(02:09:21):
million worldwide hand that rocks the cradle made a hundred forty million worldwide andBoth were hugely successful on home video
and wasn't sleeping with the enemy because it came out whatever February, early February.
So I think it was the movie that knocked home alone off of number.
Yes, it was.
Yeah.
Yeah, Tom Malone at the top of the box office for like 12 weeks.

(02:09:44):
And this was movie that knocked it out.
both of them, again, both of them were huge on home video.
They were both on the list of the top 10 video rentals of their respective years.
Like these movies feel like Saturday night at blockbuster staples.
Like you mentioned that earlier, Rob.
I think it's just like these are movies that just did incredibly well.

(02:10:08):
in the VHS rental market of the time because they are, you know, you'd take them home andyou'd be like, it's it's it's Friday night or Saturday night from Blockbuster.
Yeah, I definitely rented Hand that Rocks the Cradle a couple times because it's a funone, you know?
It is!
It's a re-watcher.
You can watch this movie, you know, again and it's still fun as hell.

(02:10:30):
And both for the era were mid-budget movies that were incredibly profitable.
And it just feels like it's the kind of movies that in our current like tent pole andstreaming focused ecosystem, they just aren't made that much anymore.
And when they are, they struggle to find the huge audiences that these films have.

(02:10:51):
It's really, I think it's the real problem with movies today is that it's just, it's thatthose mid-budget movies
don't seem to exist.
And when they do, they have trouble finding it.
Which is why we have a whole slate of mid budget movies based off sleeping with the enemy.
have sleep walking with the enemy.
We still sleeping with the enemy.

(02:11:12):
We have sleeping with the frenemy.
That's going to be a good one.
It's just we're going to we're going to bang them out here.
yeah, no, we could do a whole, we could do a whole thing.
Honestly, Sleeping With The Enemy, I don't know if there were Lifetime movies at thispoint.
I don't know if Lifetime was making original movies at this point, but this Sleeping WithThe Enemy is the template for Lifetime original movies in the future, for sure.

(02:11:35):
That is probably the place to stop for today.
This is gonna be a terrific episode.
I'm really excited about this one.
And we'll be back next week.
We have a very special guest joining us.
For the first time will be Erin Dawn of the Manic Movie Monday podcast.
It's a terrific podcast.
And we are very excited to have Erin joining us to talk about another thriller about anobsessive stranger, 1992's Single White Female starring Bridget Fonda and Jennifer Jason

(02:12:08):
Lee.
It is going to be terrific.
You don't want to miss it.
Also one hell of a movie.
It's, it's, yeah, it's going to be a fun one.
I'm very excited.
I'm very excited.
Gentlemen, as always, it's great to have, it's great to talk about these movies with bothof you.
And thank you everyone for listening.
Again, we are your host, Chris Iannicone, Rob Lemorgis and Justin Beam.

(02:12:29):
If you've enjoyed the show, please consider subscribing and following us on Blue Sky,Instagram, threads and Twitter at Get Me Another Pod.
In addition, check out the Justin Beam Radio Hour wherever you listen to podcasts.
And you can find Justin's book, Roadside Memories at JustinBeam.com or wherever books aresold.
And if you've liked the show, please tell your friends about it.

(02:12:50):
Tell your enemies about it.
Tell your non-cheating spouse about it, as well as the people who are listening in thenext room.
And join us next time as we continue to explore what happens when Hollywood Says, Get mean R.

(02:13:19):
And Justin Beam!
Damn it, I lost it again.
I did the same thing on the last episode.
No, no, no.
Hold please.
We're holding, we're holding.
Now, who's

(02:13:39):
This feels like the second act of sleeping with the enemy all of a sudden.
You