Fatal Attraction Ep. 05 - Single White Female (with Erin Dawn of the Manic Movie Monday Podcast) - Get Me Another

Episode Transcript
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you
Hello and welcome to Get Me Another, a podcast where we explore those movies that followedin the wake of blockbuster hits and attempted to replicate their success.

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My name is Chris Iannicone and today is episode five in our Get Me Another FatalAttraction series, during which we've been exploring the wave of thrillers that
came in the late 80s and early 90s, which revolve around a stranger entering someone'slife and turning it into chaos.
And this week, we'll be looking at one of the most memorable and interesting films in thisseries, 1992's Single White Female.

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And joining us today to talk about that film is Erin Dawn, host of the Manic Movie Mondaypodcast.
If you listen to the Manic Movie Monday podcast, I promise you,
You will not wish it were Sunday, even if that's your fun day.
Welcome to the show, Erin.
We are very excited to have you

(01:09):
my goodness, it's such an honor to be here.
I absolutely adore your show so much.
So it's so nice.
I it when anyone invites me to come on their show.
It's always so much more interesting.
Thank you so much.
Yeah, I absolutely dig a single white female.
I think the first time I think I saw this movie, I think I was like 14.

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Oh, that's that's that's probably too young.
Oh my goodness.
yeah, way too young.
I don't think I understood anything of it.
I think I just saw like bits and pieces of it and stuff because this was around the timeperiod that MTV would do these like, you know, hey, we're on set of, you know, white
female and we're totally interviewing all these people.

(01:54):
Right.
Yeah.
Absolutely, absolutely.
And actually played music videos which almost save Allie, but not quite.
Music videos at a loud volume almost save her.
We will get to that later, but it is, you know, those were the days, my goodness.
But before we get to the movie, can you tell us a little bit, for those who might not befamiliar with the Manic Movie Monday podcast, can you tell us a little bit about it?

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What's...
You know, I love it.
I'm a huge fan.
It's, know, you've done a couple episodes recently that I really love, like Legend ofBillie Jean and Slumber Party Massacre we've done on this show.
Trick or Treat is just to name a few.
But how did it start?
Why is the manic movie Monday?
Why Monday?
I mean, aside from the song.

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Well, I am a huge fan of alliteration.
Of course.
So really what it came from specifically was Manic Movie Monday.
And what it was birthed out of was that I was tired of podcasts making fun of films.
was just, I had gotten to a point where I think like the straw that broke the camel's backthat started the podcast was that someone

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had done hard bodies on their show and they just could not stop talking shit about it.
That was, I just couldn't do it.
I was like, I, okay, I'm out.
So I, what I did was I was like, what if there was a podcast that took movies that a lotof people don't necessarily, revere and found something good in them.

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Like we find the, we find the gems in the junk and we find the,
the treasure in the trash.
so it started off as just me and another gentleman.
And then he exited and I had Hillary on to to do Basket Case.
And that was such a success that then I had her on to do rabid.

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And then I had her on to do reform school girls and reform school girls was truly themoment where it that was like that.
This is what I want.
I want me.
Hillary to
I mean, reform school girls, who doesn't want it to be?
mean, my good, honestly, all those movies are great.
don't know what you, trash?
Forget it.
Those always are all fantastic.

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We just had such a great time doing it and we come from such different backgrounds.
She's originally from Jersey, I'm from Florida.
We're both sober for a very long period of time.
So we relate the movie usually to our own lives and we talk about stuff.

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get pretty personal on the show as well.
But we always seem to find something that we like.
out of it, you know, even if it's very small.
So it's a very positive podcast.
We to keep it positive and we try to make it as tangential as possible.
Like there's a whole lot of, if you listen to the show, you know, we kind of go, we do gochronologically with the film and then we kind of like stop and talk about how it relates

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to us.
And then we go back and you know, we just have a good old time, man.
it's a fun little hour.
and we
Absolutely.
No, I really like it and I'll I just it's it's it's become one of my regular ones that Ilisten to on a weekly basis and again I don't know what you treasure from trash all those
movies and treasures.

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Those are all great.
The stuff you guys are doing By the way, want to bet I am originally from New Jersey aswell.
So you're you're you are in good company here
I love it.
And the love of my life is also from Jersey.
So yeah.
So it's, it's, it's fun too.
Like we did Alice sweet Alice.
I love it.
It's one of the best New Jersey horror films.

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my God.
Exactly.
So we had a lot of fun talking about how Hillary was brought up Catholic, right?
And I'm Episcopalian, so I'm like fascinated by all of the, you know, all of the pageantryof it.
And so we got to talk about that and talk about Jersey and stuff like that.
it's just turned into this really beautiful three years, you know, and we just have agreat time and we have a pretty

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nice little fan base of people that are so sweet and kind and they reach out to us andthey write us letters and you know or the internet's version of letters and
I've never gotten a real letter.
I would love a letter.
Oh, if only, right?
Oh my God.
So it's been a wonderful experience and it is one of those things that I absolutely do it.

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We don't make any money at it whatsoever.
It is strictly done just out of just our own love of film and our own love of being ableto talk about it.
So yeah.
Well, if you're listening to this show and you haven't listened to the Manic Movie Mondaypodcast, obviously continue listening to this show.
We need you, but make that your next show as well.

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Like it's one of our favorites and it's just terrific.
It's just terrific.
Thank you so much.
I really appreciate it.
But today, we'll be talking about one of the only other movies in this series, aside fromFatal Attraction, where the title itself has become part of our cultural vernacular.

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This is Single White Female.
In this city, on this street, in this apartment.
Hi, are you Allison Jones?
I'm Hedra Carlson.
Hedra?
That's unusual.
When can you move in?
An ad for a roommate brought a stranger into Allison's life.

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I think beautiful, huh?
who shares It's kind of fun having a girlfriend again.
someone Do you guys know when you'll be back?
No, it's kind of an anniversary tonight.
Really?
Who cares?
Where the hell have you been?
Making me feel like I'm 16 years old here.

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Someone who borrows.
I've got a surprise for you.
You've gotta be kidding.
I love myself like this.
It was like looking at myself.
It was scary.
Someone who steals.
Hey, sleepy guy.
No, not Ellie.
Someone who would kill to be her.

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Possible blood stains.
She's a lunatic, Adley.
She needs me.
How do you lock the Terror out?
when you already invited it in.

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Weren't yourself when you did this thing?
I know.
That was you.
I know.

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Single White Female was written by Don Ruse, based on the novel SWF Seeks Same by JohnLutz.
Now, Don Ruse had previously written for TV series such as Heart to Heart, Paper Dolls,and The Colby's, also known as Dynasty 2.
Yeah, the Colby's.

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It's spin-off of Dynasty.
was, that, you know, it's my third, that's honestly, that's my third Dynasty reference onany podcast this year, this calendar year.
I never saw that coming, but that's what happened.
The same year that he wrote Single White Female, he also had another script, Love Field,get made that would, that would go, and he would later go on to write films such as Boys

(10:10):
on the Side and the remake of Diabolique.
And then later would direct films such as The Opposite of Sex.
So this is an early work.
from a guy who has gone on to have a very long career.
The film was directed by Barbette Schroeder, who previously had directed a movie that Ireally like and is oddly one of those movies I can kind of watch any time, Reversal of

(10:31):
Fortune, about the trial of Klaus von Bühler.
It's such a good, it's like, it's weird.
It's one of those movies.
You wouldn't think it, but if I catch it on television, I'm watching it.
I'm going all the way.
Yeah, absolutely.
I totally agree with that on that.
Just that the performances in that are just absolutely amazing.
It's just there's something so so weird about it.

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Single white female stars Bridget Fonda, Jennifer Jason Lee, along with Stephen Weber,Peter Friedman, and Stephen Tobolowski.
Ned Ryerson from Groundhog Day.
Yeah.
Tobo being majorly creepy in this movie.
my God.
from the get-go, you just know.

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And this is interesting, because we've had, you know, we're five episodes into thisseries, so we've had a couple different variations on the fatal attraction model.
But this is the first movie to feature two women in the protagonist and antagonist roles.
And I think it presents a really, really interesting dynamic that we'll get into as we godeeper.

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I also think it's super interesting that both of the leads of this movie are the childrenof famous Hollywood actors.
Bridget Fonda, the daughter of Peter Fonda and granddaughter of Henry Fonda.
And Jennifer Jason Lee is the daughter of Vic Morrow who gave one of our favorite unhingedperformances that we've talked about on this series in 1990, The Bronx Warriors.

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I love him.
I actually I my favorite Vic Morrow movie is Humanoids from the Deep.
Yeah, no, he's great.
He's always great.
And also, furthermore, Peter Fonda and Vic Morrow were adversaries in the 1974 car chasemovie Dirty Mary, Crazy Larry.

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So that's your double feature right there is the fathers and the daughters as you know,going against each other.
That would be amazing.
I had a theater to program, I'd be I'd be doing these kinds of things.
The Dirty Mary, Crazy Larry.
Single white female double feature.
That's the one you show up for.
Now, Aaron, before we kind of, before we start, when we first started talking about havingyou on, I gave you a sort of, here's some of the movies we're thinking about doing in this

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series.
And you know, what would you be interested in coming on and talking about?
And you immediately jumped at single white female.
was like, there was, there was not even a hesitation.
Can you tell us why this, this film has that kind of appeal where you're like, I want togo on the internet and talk about?
this movie.
Well, I had not seen it in about 20 years.

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it was, cause I think the last time I saw it was actually in my twenties.
I was thinking it was probably in my teens, but I believe I probably watched it again inmy twenties.
And I wanted to look at it through like 45 year old eyes.
You know what I mean?
Because there's such a different thing when you've been through relationships androommates and

(13:34):
absolutely.
You've done all of the things, right?
So there's a there's a different perspective that comes with, you age.
So it was interesting watching it and watching it with my partner.
And we were, you know, like it was funny because we were just laughing and like, my God, Ican't remember.
This is so 90s, you know, just the fashion and so 90s.

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But I also really love the building that it's filmed at the the Ansonia.
has such an amazing history to it.
I adore, even though most of the stuff that's shot inside is shot on a soundstage, all ofthe stuff in the basement and the hallways and the outside of it.

(14:21):
The stairwell.
Yes, right.
It's total Ansonia.
So I love that.
love probably because my boyfriend got me like we both met because we were huge Jell-Ofans.
we...
sure.
One of our first conversations was, you know, I've really gotten into Jell-O lately.

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And he was kind of and he kind of challenged me and he's like, really?
What?
Jallow do you watch?
And I was like, well, I really, just saw Torso and I really loved it.
And that was the moment he knew he was going to marry me.
So, he was like Torso, my God.
And then we just had that conversation.
So one of the things about Jallow that drew me to it is the architecture.

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And this movie has, has a very Jallow feel to it with the architecture, the black glovesthat Jennifer Jason Lee wears.
was gonna say, she shops at the Giallo Black Glove Emporium that every Giallo killer shopsat.
They ship all over the world.
If you need black gloves or raincoats or black fedora hats, they have got you covered.

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Yeah, absolutely.
So I truly think that the movie has a very stylish look to it.
know, it has a very, it's very nineties, right?
And I wanted to talk about that.
Like I wanted, it's, you know, this the snout.
Okay.
That's an edit.
Nostalgia element of it is so much so that, you know, it really brings you back, like justthe haircuts and

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First of all, I didn't know they were both wearing wigs.
I found that out later on.
Oh, yeah.
yeah, I found that out in my research as well, but it makes sense, especially for JenniferJason Lee, whose hair changes several times over the
There's a lot of hair and then it's funny just to watch it like I said as a 45 year oldwould you know just different things happen with her and Steven Weber and I'm just yelling

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at the screen you know I might she
She should drop that guy like a hot potato that's just like covered with ants.
Like, here's the thing.
And we'll get into this.
Hedy is right.
This dude is not, he's not the guy.
And she would have found that out in the long run.
But you know, obviously the movie, the offense of the film intercede and she never getsthat chance.

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This guy was not a good guy.
No, no, he's not a good guy.
And she brings up a lot of interesting points about Ali and about Ali's inability to bealone and Ali's need to want to be with someone, right?
that's a key, key part of it.
Absolutely.
So let's start at the beginning.

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We open with this image of a little girl trying on makeup and playing dress up.
And it's interesting because the camera pulls back and you realize that there's actuallytwo girls.
Like at first you think it's a girl and a mirror, and then you realize it's two girls whoare identical twins.
And one is wearing earrings and one isn't.
They both kind of smile right into the camera, but you're setting up something with thesetwo twin girls.

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And then we cut.
to the building, the exterior of what is called the Victoria in the film.
Although in real life, it is the Ansonia, an apartment building on the Upper West Side ofNew York.
And I mean, I got to tell you, this is the most foreboding looking apartment buildingsince the Bramford in Rosemary's Baby.

(17:49):
Yes.
It's looking down on you.
like, I'm scared to live.
I mean, don't get me wrong.
Someone wants to give me a rent controlled apartment in that building.
I'll take it.
It is on the Upper West Side of New York.
It also, it's the Ansonia in real life.
It served as the inspiration for the Arconia in Only Murders in the building.
Although it's not the building they use for the exteriors of the Arconia, that is yet adifferent building.

(18:14):
Wow, okay, that's interesting.
I didn't even know that.
That's actually really cool.
It's so ornate and like, it's just, there are vibes.
There are vibes to this building.
There are vibes for days.
Now, do you know the history of it, as far as like where it's how it started out and whatit became in the 70s and the 80s?

(18:35):
I'm very curious because I knew you had mentioned you had found some of the history.
So originally it was the Ansonia Hotel, know, and it had everything that you could havewanted, you know, like shops and, and, know, room service and all of the like, but in the
1970s, actually from 1967 to 1968 in the basement of the hotel, it became a bath house,uh, as in a bath house.

(19:04):
Yes.
That kind of bath house.
Like a bathhouse with a capital B.
Right, right.
Referred to as the Continental Baths.
And it's actually where Bette Midler got her start with Barry Manilow, because BarryManilow was her piano player.
Right, right.
And the Continental Baths was where that started.
when the- Amazing.
When the bath house closed down, then it actually turned into, from 1977 to 1980, itturned into Plato's Retreat, which was a very famous swinger's club.

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was almost
It's funny because there's a swingers club that's actually featured in Single Wife Female.
movie.
Right.
Yeah.
The Hellfire Club.
But Plato's Closet was kind of like the sort of upper scale of swingers clubs, whereasHellfire was kind of like the more sort of dirtier, seedier swingers club.
Well, that, the swingers club, the Hellfire club is very 90s.

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And I'm going to recycle a joke that I used in an earlier episode.
It feels like something that would be showcased on HBO's Real Sex.
Oh my God, I missed that so much.
I seriously, I cannot understand how we have Showtime on demand and HBO on demand and theynot allow any of their more prurient stuff that came out in the nineties to be anywhere.

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You cannot find it anywhere.
Anywhere.
No, you can't and it's it's terrible.
I mean that and then red shoe diaries.
What are we doing?
What do we do?
Well, fun fact, Chris, if you do want to watch the Red Shoe Diaries, every single episodeof the Red Shoe Diaries is available on Tubi.
No.
Uh-huh.

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well I know what I'm doing tonight after we record the episode.
I'm bit of an erotic thriller enthusiast, right?
So that type of everything that's like the history of erotic cinema, I'm fascinated by.
So when I found out that it was on Tubi, I was like, I know what I'm doing.
That's fantastic.

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That's fantastic.
So inside the building, we find Alison Jones or Ali as she'll be known and her fiance,Sam, played by Bridget Fonda and Wings, Steven Weber, who are living in this, they're
living in this massive rent controlled apartment.
And, and they seem, you know, they seem very much in love.

(21:31):
They're talking about how many kids they should have and all that sort of thing.
And, and, and I will say to his credit, he says all the right stuff.
You know, he's divorced, they're talking about what kind of wedding to have.
And she says, well, you've already had the big real wedding.
And he quickly replies, no, this is the real one.
Like that's, he says the right stuff.

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Now, that's all going to change because they are woken up by a call from Sam's ex-wife.
Hello?
Hold on a second.
Sam.

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It's your ex-wife.
What?
It's Lisa.
Yeah.
No.
Because I'm hanging up now.

(22:38):
It's where you live.
She's entitled.
Don't answer.
Hi, this is Alex and Trill.
do this?
Talk to her now, you already have.
Alright.
I'll get this.

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the phone please.
Stand 5'6".
You can't come over here and sleep with me!
I noticed when I, cause I watched this twice, I watched it a couple of weeks ago with mywife and then I watched it again this week.

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And I noticed the second time when he went, when she answers the phone and says, it's yourex wife or whatever the ex wife's name is.
He goes, what?
Like he's very, very anxious when he takes the phone, but it's also a movie whereanswering machines play a big role.
If they had
personal voicemails, I'm not sure this movie happens.

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Like she would never have found out, she would have never kicked him out and therefore shewould have never needed a roommate.
you know, there's no movie without an answering machine that everybody can overhear when amessage is being left.
Aaron, what do you think of Sam?
So Sam is what Hillary and I call trash dick.

(24:12):
He's a person who is probably good in bed, but the dick is connected to an absolutelytrash human because you don't have sex with your ex-wife and then come over and have sex
with another woman and then fill her with all of this, you know.

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BS about how we're gonna, you we're gonna get married and you can have any wedding youwant.
It's like, you know, my dick was currently in my ex-wife just a few hours ago.
But yes, honey, you can have whatever wedding you want.
So no, I don't, I don't like Sam.

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It's funny because I adore Steven Weber.
Like I think Steven Weber gave one of the most amazing performances in the Shining miniseries.
He is good.
Really just, he's very nuanced.
He's a really, really amazing actor.
really like the mini-series version.
I really like both versions of that story, both interpretations of that story.

(25:18):
To me, they're not in a battle with one another.
are different.
They are just different aspects, different takes on the same material.
And what I love is how Doctor Sleep is kind of like the conductor sort of bringing bothsides together.
Yes, absolutely agree.
I really, it was funny because I remember telling my mom, you know, I said, do you knowwhat the shining is about?

(25:44):
You know, and she's like, she's like, oh, well, it's about a hotel.
I was like, no, it's about a man who's battling his addiction.
And it's this idea of like, well, you've always been the caretaker.
Like the addiction lives in you and it doesn't matter where you go because you're alwaysgoing to take it with you.
And she was like, well, you're reaching because you're an alcoholic.
And I said, no, Stephen King is also in recovery.

(26:12):
so therefore, this is what this was about.
This was how he exercised his demons or tried to at the time was by was by writing TheShining.
And I know that there's a lot of people who battle addictions and people who are inrecovery.
And we have a very, you know, an affinity towards that particular story because it's like

(26:32):
It's you just get it.
know, it's like, yeah, it doesn't matter where you go, man.
You could go to the most abandoned place possible, but your addiction is going to findyou.
So that is.
because it's part of you and it goes with you.
I think that's the key part of it.
Even you're up in the middle of the snowbound thing.
The Rockies, the Rockies, that would be it.

(26:56):
It would be fantastic for winter sports if they made a way to make it economicallyfeasible.
I don't know why that line always stuck with me.
So the other thing about Single White Female that I think is particularly interesting,because we've got a couple of weeks here on Get Me Another Fatal Attraction with what I'll
say are some relatively chaste movies.

(27:20):
And Single White Female is bringing the erotic back to our erotic thrillers.
There's a lot of casual nudity.
And I actually think it's casual nudity with a
with a point like when people are naked and in front of home and what that says abouttheir their comfort level or what they're trying to do.

(27:41):
We'll get we'll get more into it.
But like even here with the with the answering machine, she's just walking around herapartment, you know, naked as one does because the only person is there is her her fiance.
But then as soon as she hears that that that answering machine now that the theconversation via answering machine, she immediately covers.
herself up, she immediately takes something and kind of pulls it over herself.

(28:03):
So I think it's really interesting when people are naked and when they are not in thismovie.
We'll point them out as we go.
Interesting.
I love that.
It does have a lot of nudity in it it does have a lot of, as HBO used to call it, sexualsituations.

(28:25):
I feel like it is not gratuitous.
No, no, it's definitely not gratuitous.
And it's funny because this 92 was a big year for the erotic thriller.
Like we have had more movies from 92 in this series than any other year.
Um, and, and, know, of course there was this movie, there was basic instinct, which would,we will do as its own series down the road.

(28:52):
Cause it kind of spins off to its own.
All these ways are sort of.
pushing the bounds of female sexuality in ways that we haven't seen in a lot of movies inthe 80s, a lot of sexuality in 80s movies, but female sexuality and I'll say female
pleasure wasn't always at the forefront and you see it starting to change in the 90s withsome of these films.

(29:17):
Absolutely.
I completely agree with you.
I had a gentleman on my show who did a documentary about the history of the eroticthriller called We Kill for Love.
interesting.
And it was such a great interview to do with him.
And it was funny because he kind of had met kind of a kindred spirit in me because I havethis ridiculous encyclopedic knowledge of the history of the erotic thriller.

(29:42):
And we talked about directors and we talked about, you know, tropes.
and different things.
But one of the really big things that I love about the erotic thriller is specifically ofthe 90s is yes, it is the women owning their sexuality.
It is independent women who don't really necessarily need a man, know, they're just,they're there to get what they need and what they want and they're going to do it in any

(30:10):
way they can.
yeah, it's really, I...
I absolutely love those movies and a lot of the ones that spun off of basic instinct likeMirror Images or Sins of Desire or any movie with the word desire or sin.
we're gonna need to come to you when we start putting together our basic instincts here,because I have a few movies, some of the big ones, but those are ones I don't know and

(30:37):
we'll come knocking at your door for that.
Yeah, that's my bread and butter, buddy.
I love that stuff.
So now that Sam is kicked out of the picture for a little bit, Allie is going to need aroommate in order to afford that apartment, even though it's rent controlled.
I mean, this is just not the type of apartment that you give up.

(30:58):
it's, like it's, it's huge.
It's rent controlled.
You will live there for the rest of your life and pass it on.
to whoever your heirs might be.
Like you are not given this thing.
I've been in that situation where I had a great apartment when I was living in Boston andI, my friends who I lived with left to go to other cities and I had to find some roommates

(31:20):
and man, that was a tough one.
That was not easy.
God.
And you know, it's I've lived with so many bad roommates, you know, that I, mean, I had aroommate, I had a male roommate at one point who was so filthy and dirty that his bathroom
was so disgusting that my boyfriend at the time walked in his bathroom, walked out of hisbathroom and said, I'm going to go in the street.

(31:50):
my God, that's crazy.
So she's got to find a roommate.
it's funny, because this series, we've talked a lot about real estate.
Because real estate has come up a bunch of houses and apartments.
this thing, this rent controlled apartment of this size on the Upper West Side, this isthe brass ring.

(32:15):
Even with the fact that the neighbor
Her upstairs neighbor and friend, Graham, can listen to everything through the vents.
And what's interesting about that is that the first time you see that, you don't know whohe is.
So it's like, is this guy suspicious or not?
Is it...
Yeah, you just think like, it's just some creeper who lives in the apartment.

(32:37):
Like, you don't know if he seems, it's like he's just listening down there to them havinga fight and it's like, it seems sinister and later you'll find that it's not, but like
it's certainly strange, know?
So Ali, she's also got business concerns and that factors into this movie quite a bitbecause she is a software developer who designs what I see is very cutting edge software

(33:03):
for the 90s.
It's basically like a virtual try-on simulator for clothing, which now you see all thetime with like eyeglasses and all these kinds of things where you can try them on
virtually.
like, Erin, in 1992, that's science fiction.
Absolutely.
It was crazy.
I remember seeing something similar to this in Don't Tell Her It's Me with SteveGuttenberg where-

(33:33):
Sure, aka the boyfriend school.
The boyfriend school.
Yes.
my goodness.
And there's a part where he's there like take he's like on like on this computer screenand you see his face and they just keep doing different like hairstyles, you know.
And I remember thinking like, my God, someday that'll be me.

(33:57):
I'll be able to do that and see what I look like as a blonde.
You know, spoiler alert, not good.
good at all.
am born to be a redhead.
Should have just stuck with that for the rest of my life.
so yeah, I was fascinated by the fact that she does make the software where, you know, weget to see these different outfits.

(34:20):
Basically, it's like it is it's a it's a virtual dressing room.
It's the wave of the future.
It's amazing.
So her client, her perspective client is Steven Tobloski.
And he plays a guy named Mitchell.
He's a fashion designer.
And he's just the...

(34:41):
So, yes, yes, it-
You get a sense of it early when they're talking, like she meets him in restaurant.
He's just so condescending.
This is Allison Jones software and it's a marketing tool no one else has.
Who do I get to run it?
I state that it goes up to speed.
That's included in the quote.
Ah, the quote.

(35:02):
That's one thing I haven't seen.
Best for last.
I think you'll find that it's reasonable.
As a ballpark.
Here's where I was thinking of playing.

(35:24):
It makes sense for you.
See, after our last meeting, I made some phone calls.
To your former partner, for one.
Well, I wouldn't rely too much on what she says.
It was not a friendly split, and I did all the work, and she took all the credit, and shedidn't like me telling her so.
Well, I was more interested in the settlement you made.
You walked off with the hardware and a rent-controlled apartment, which means youroverhead is minimal, as is your client list.

(35:51):
I could improve that.
if you're as good as you say you are.
But that is the only way to prove it.
Well, I could go for something.
no, please, please don't embarrass yourself.
That's my final offer.
That he's negotiating over the price is not the problem.

(36:11):
The problem is the way he does it.
like, don't embarrass yourself.
he talks, he talks down to her.
He, you know, addresses her with his eyes.
He's 18 different shades of creepy in the.
Oh, yeah.
Every time you see him, he's undressing her with his eyes.
Like it's just, But she takes the job, not just for the money, but because of thepotential contacts that it will hopefully bring if successful.

(36:40):
Again, it's interesting because it's not just a B story.
It all kind of dovetails together at the end.
Yes, yes it does.
that's what I one of the things I really love about this movie is that nothing, everythingcomes back, right?
Everything that happens comes back.
There is nothing that is part of that script that wasn't specifically designed to be thereto come back later.

(37:03):
Like the vent that the neighbor is listening to the conversation, that's going to play amajor role later on.
Actually, I want to mention this before we go further, there's a really good moment here.
There's a really good emotional moment when Ali, she goes to the meeting and she comesback to the apartment and the sheets are still on the bed from when Sam was.

(37:24):
Gotta get rid of them sex sheets man, you know she- Tears!
starts tearing them off like like it felt really authentic to me like that that pain justfelt really
Yeah, it was such a beautiful moment.
I mean, I have gone through breakups where you go to bed and you wake up and you think,was it a dream?

(37:47):
yeah.
And then you're like, no, it's true.
We're really over.
Right.
And then you just you got that like just gut wrenching, sad feeling of it.
And yeah, I mean, and yes, the only thing to do really is just to get rid of those sexsheets because it's too much of a reminder of this person who hurt her.
like really truly hurt her so you know.

(38:09):
Marry him like she was, you know, she was, it's, it's, it's crazy.
It's like this guy, this, this, this guy, I swear.
So we also meet Ali's upstairs neighbor and gay best friend, Graham, who, who he was theguy listening through the vents.
And now we learned that he's not that suspicious.
He's just, he's just, you know, he's just the upstairs neighbor and gay best friend.

(38:31):
And, and I gotta say, they have a conversation about Ali's need to be with.
Yes!
What is this?
A song cue?
You're nobody till somebody loves you?
It's just living alone, you know?
And the thought of buying those books like cooking for one and...
It's just too depressing.
There are worse things than being on your own, you know?

(38:54):
Maybe it's all a sign I should go home.
Come on, you came here for a reason.
Sam has nothing to do with that.
No guy does.
You think I let some guy interfere with my acting career?
Assuming I had a career?
or guy to interfere with it?
He'll find someone again.
Maybe I will.
Why not?
But the point is, if I don't, I don't.
I gotta say, Graham has really got the right attitude here.

(39:16):
You know, he's like, I hope I end up with someone, but if I don't, I'm okay with me.
And that's the important thing.
And that's kind of like setting up the thing that Allie needs to learn in the movie.
Yes, absolutely.
of the main characters have these holes that they're trying to fill with other people andone of them in a much more extreme way.

(39:39):
that's kind of the key is over the series, we've talked a lot how characters in theseseries from Fatal Attraction on often have, not always, but often have this kind of
emptiness.
There's something they're looking for.
you know, even if they have really great lives, which a lot of them do.

(40:00):
But like that thing that they need to fill is what leaves them open to the dangerousstranger who's going to enter their lives.
Now, Ali needs, you know, she needs a roommate to pay the rent.
But like, I think it's it's her need for some kind of emotional connection thatspecifically leads her to settle on Hedy as opposed to one of the other.

(40:22):
Yeah.
Now, did you recognize any of the girls that came in to look at the apartment?
Well, I recognize one of them as Jessica Lundy of Caddyshack 2.
You, I knew, so I was hoping you were gonna get it.
Kate Hartoonian aka Kate Hart.
Yes.
But she's not going.
I so it's funny because I saw her and I said look at this woman and tell me who this isand my boyfriend's like I the voice sounds familiar I said she's from Madhouse honey she's

(40:51):
the Jersey she's the Jersey housewife from from from Madhouse and he and I said it alsofrom Caddyshack too as well but
Yeah, then he recognized her and he also recognized Renee Estevez is the other roommate,the little blonde, the little cute, cute blonde girl that comes in and she's like, this is

(41:12):
such a pretty place.
I have to admit, I've seen Candy Shack 2 way more times than I should have.
It was on HBO all the time in the late 80s, early 90s.
I saw it so many times, it's not a good movie.
Okay, it's a terrible movie, but I will I will give you this I Adore the theme song tocatty shy fuck yes, I love I love Kenny Logan so much

(41:43):
going all the way sooner or later, you gotta love somebody.
It's better than the theme from Caddyshack.
The only time where Caddyshack 2 outstrips its predecessors is they both have KennyLoggins themes and Caddyshack 2 has the better one.
It's a great, it's a great Kenny Loggins.
I completely agree with you.

(42:04):
I love Nobody's Fool.
It's a great song.
That's the name of it.
That's it!
Kenny Loggins, who I am still certain that there's the movie, there's the song he wrotefor the movie Over the Top.

(42:24):
meet me halfway.
If I have any conspiracy theory in me, swear there's no way he did not write that for TopGun and he didn't make it into Top Gun.
he just sold it over the meet me halfway.
Across the sky?
There's no way it's not was not written for Top Gun.

(42:44):
They were like, yeah, we want to go with danger zone.
Like it's, you know, but then it was like, well, you're not going to let that go to waste.
So, know, hey, an arm wrestling movie is as good as anything.
Lord, yeah, I know wasn't enough arm wrestling going on
Honestly, another movie I've seen way too many times.
yeah.

(43:04):
So we put she puts it in the classified as you did back then.
have the montage of meeting prospective roommates and then, you know, we meet HedraCarlson, who Allie calls Hetty, played by Jennifer Jason Lee, who is just fantastic in
this.
I mean, both both her Bridgifond are great.
But Jennifer Jason Lee has such range because I have seen her in other stuff.

(43:28):
where she is not this mousy kind of character at all.
Like, HUD sucker proxy.
Like, she's just, like, she's amazing.
Yeah.
no.
Anything I've ever seen her in, she just knocks it out of the park every single time.
She's in this really bizarre movie with Judith Ivy and Eric Stoltz back from the eightiescalled Sister Sister.

(43:49):
And she's excellent.
Yeah, it's a New World Pictures movie.
She's excellent in that.
And then of course, she was also in a movie called In the Cut with Meg Ryan where she's...
was a later Meg Ryan movie.
it's a Meg Ryan erotic thriller with her and Mark Ruffalo and Jennifer Jason Lee plays hersister in it and she does such an amazing job in it and she's just one of those really

(44:18):
great actresses and of course, hateful eight, know, she kills it in that, know, so yeah, Ishe always brings it.
She's always dark as fuck.
She is, but she also, again, it's not like she just specializes in the mousy type ofcharacter.
She's got range and some differences.

(44:39):
It's real interesting.
And the other thing that I think is real interesting in this film and the dynamic here isthat in some of the other films where we've had two people of the same gender where the
stranger, basically two guys.
It's the stranger that's always the sort of more dynamic and cool one.

(45:03):
Like Rob Lowe enters James Spader's life in bad influence and Spader's character wants toemulate him.
Here it's the reverse is that Hetty is the more kind of quiet and reserved, at least atfirst, whereas Bridget Fonda plays the more kind of outwardly, you know.

(45:24):
glamorous, it's not quite the word, but like the more outwardly confident of the two.
And it's just an interesting dynamic.
There are different moments in the movie where they kind of, it's almost like they fill ineach other's cracks, right?

(45:47):
Whereas she kind of, Hedy kind of empowers Bridget, empowers Allie, and then Allie kind ofalmost gives Hedy a safe place.
Yeah.
Right?
Yeah.
They got gaps.
It's like the line from Rocky.
she's got gaps.
I've got gaps together.

(46:07):
We full gap
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, it works.
And, you know, they do a little bonding with the broken sink where the churns on the sinkand sprays everywhere and Hetty seems pretty handy with that.
And Hedra says she doesn't like her name.
And it's Allie that starts calling her Hetty, a reference to actress and torpedo guidancesystem inventor Hetty Lamont.

(46:36):
Yes, absolutely.
She co-invented a radio guidance system for torpedoes during World War II.
Yeah, amazing.
Really amazing.
Amazing.
It's fantastic.
know, Hedy's concern, and she's not wrong about this, is that Ali might reconcile with herfiance, and that would put her in a position of, you know, essentially being the third

(47:03):
wheel.
But Ali assures her that's not going to happen.
Spoiler alert, it's going to happen.
it was hot take coming, okay?
But I was super mad at Allie when that does happen.
was like, are you fucking kidding me right now?
Like you're gonna get this girl in here and she's gonna get super excited and she's gonna,and she asked you point blank, are you gonna get back together with your douchebag ex?

(47:31):
And she was like, no, that'll never happen.
Well, it's funny because my wife and I were watching this and I had never seen it before,you know, a couple of weeks ago.
I don't know if my wife had seen it previously, but like early on, you know, a lot ofthose these types of characters, the antagonists in these movies give off, you know, what

(47:51):
we call red flags.
I always end up trying to make a Les Miserables joke, which I always invariably cut outbecause it never lands.
know.
just hit me.
I didn't have one here.
It's just, you know, but here there's no red flag with her early on.
Eventually stuff comes, you know, comes to the surface.

(48:12):
But in the early part of this film, there isn't that moment where it's like, well, this isweird.
know, again, Rob Lowe in Bad Influence, it's like, here's a guy who uses more than onename.
Well, that's a red flag.
Like most people just use the
Exactly.
Like I absolutely adore that influence by the way.
like I.

(48:33):
So good.
scene, the scene where I'm sorry, you're going to have to cut this out, but just thewhole.
But the scene where, where he goes, you know, he's in there killing the girl with the golfclub and you just know that that's what's happening.
And it's just this, my God.
And the way they cut between the image of Rob Lowe on the TV and what's happening in theactual apartment.

(48:57):
Oh no, it's great.
That's staying in.
We're not cutting any of it.
It's worth mentioning.
Yeah, absolutely.
you know, Hedy, early on, there's no, there aren't that red flags.
In fact, there's more red flags from Ali.
you know, well, we'll get to it.
Because first of all, she has to give Hedy the tour of the building.

(49:19):
Or should I say,
checkoffs building tour.
Because we are shown all these elements that are going to come into play in the third act.
We have the incinerator in the basement, the wonky elevator that sometimes needs ascrewdriver to work.
All these things that are going to come into play later, we get on the tour.

(49:39):
And they start to bond and they become friends.
Like it's just...
You know, it's honestly, it's Allie who makes the first transgressive move by snooping inHedy's room.
That's the first.
I was like, what are you doing?
Because when I was first watching it, I went, was like, that's her room.
And then I was like, no, that's Teddy's room.

(50:00):
What are you doing?
And she's like putting on her earrings and she's just like, perfume.
I was like, girl, no.
Yeah, like it's not, it's very, yeah, no, totally.
And then of course she gets caught and I didn't know you're home.
Well, no shit, you didn't know she was home.
I mean, you wouldn't have been doing, and Ali, to her credit, is able to diffuse thesituation by kind of making fun of herself.

(50:29):
again, this is where an interesting use of nudity, which I mentioned at the top, and Idon't mean that in a sleazy kind of way,
No,
Correct me if I'm wrong.
Because, you know, I don't always understand things about ladies.
Sometimes I've been a guy for very long time, so that's, you know, I don't know.

(50:49):
But there's definitely an attraction from Hetty to Ally.
Definitely, right?
Like, I'm not reading into this.
No, No, definitely you're not reading into that.
No, Hetty is obviously very, very much attracted to Ally.
Like it's interesting, she's got that line, anything of mine you like, just go ahead andimmediately after she says that line, she very casually takes off her robe in the context

(51:16):
of changing.
like the timing of that is not, you know, that's not going to be a coincidence thing.
Yeah.
And I mean, it's it's Hetty is the kind of chick that goes to, you know, sex clubs, right?
Like Hetty, Hetty's right.
No, we don't know that.
that.
She seems like the mousy type who doesn't go.
I guess that's true.

(51:37):
guess that's true.
Yeah, and it's interesting because Ali, when Hetty does that, Ali averts her eye.
That attraction is not reciprocating.
does.
She's like, naked, because, you know, there's people it's it's funny because there arepeople who grow up where nudity is not taboo and nudity is not sexualized in any way.

(52:00):
And it's just a part of like their life.
Right.
And they're just very comfortable with their bodies.
And then there's people who grow up and it is not comfortable for them.
And it is not something that they readily do.
And so
Yeah, and then you get those two people to live together and it's quite an interestingtime.

(52:20):
It's an odd couple waiting to have.
So we get a little bit of Hetty's story about how she once had a twin.
She was going to be a twin, but that her twin was stillborn.
Smells nice on you.
I you don't mind.
I just always wanted to try that.
God, no.
Anything you want, you want.

(52:42):
Go ahead.
Share and share a life.
Well, I don't really know about that.
I'm an only child.
Do you come from a big family?
this me?
Mm.

(53:15):
A story that, you know, already we suspect, just from being shown those two little girlsat the beginning, we already suspect that this might not be true.
Exactly.
We don't know.
We don't know the context of that opening shot.
So we don't know, you know, is there something more to it or not.
And Allie buys Hedy a lampshade as a housewarming gift.

(53:38):
Hedy responds by giving her the pearl earrings she was looking at.
And it's just like, that's way too much of a gift.
Like, it's all out of bound.
Like, a lampshade?
Totally fine.
That seems reasonable.
Pearl earrings?
Just too much.
Just too
Well, Hedy also has a very almost emotionally stunted childlike way of looking at things.

(54:02):
Yeah.
And very much a like, well, if I give you this gift, well, then I will you'll love me.
And so it's this very you can tell it's this very much like, OK, well, I'll just give youthis and then you'll love me.
And then, you know, and then when she doesn't, you know, then she gets mad and wants topunish her, you know.

(54:23):
Yeah, it's real interesting that, you know, that on the surface, very kind, but then alsothere's an obligation that comes.
Yes.
With pearl earring, you know?
Absolutely.
From here, we start to get more odd behavior from Hedy.
She erases an answering machine.
Again, we get that answering machine message thing, you know, message from Sam, she erasesthat, which again, Ali shouldn't bother with Sam.

(54:52):
But that's not Hedy's decision to make.
Yeah.
No, it's definitely not Hedy's decision to make.
I love that moment?
Absolutely.
But I also was like, that's a little, that's not good.
yeah, she, and then she adopts a puppy.
Oh, what a clever gambit to manipulate Ali's emotions.

(55:16):
And I didn't notice till the second time, she bought the puppy, but she tells Ali thatthey were just giving him a lot.
But we see the receipt with the date of August 16th.
This is a movie that is very consistent with its dates.
It all happens in August of 1991.
And I, for some reason, really like that.

(55:38):
I like...
If you're going to show me a date, make the dates consistent.
I love it.
Yeah, it's there's an attention to detail with this movie that not some erotic thrillersdon't do, You know, some of stuff, like I said, you can't it's you're taking something
like this movie.
And then unfortunately, there is a sequel to this movie also.

(56:00):
I was.
going to talk about the sequel.
We'll talk about the sequel at the very end.
The sequel has one of my favorite direct-to-video sequel titles.
We've got people stick around to the end of the podcast for the reveal on the single whitefemale two subtitle.

(56:22):
god!
So, so, you know, you know, the dog thing, I mean, it's interesting, because that mightnot have worked.
Like at first, she's very kind of resistant to the dog.
If you're not a dog person, like someone just brings a dog into your house, like that's,but for all her efforts, you know, like that's, it works because she can't listen to that

(56:43):
dog whimpering outside.
She brings it into the, into her bedroom and you know, they adopt the dog.
It becomes like the third member of the house.
Take a
Ticket Polaroids with the two of them and the dog.
Yeah, yeah, there's, it's interesting if you notice that the dog gravitates towards Alliedoesn't gravitate towards Hetty.

(57:04):
Yes.
And that it's Allie's door, the dog is crying at, not Hetty's, you know, so, until laterwhen, you know, Hetty's double clicking her mouse and the dog is crying at the door.
That's awkward.
but yeah.
and then, you know,
I feel like, it was definitely a manipulative tool on her part.

(57:26):
was like, here, I'm going to bring this dog into here, and we're going to instant familythis, right?
I'm going to fully admit it took me a beat to realize what double clicking your mouse
Just like right now as you were talking, I'm like, double kicking, was there a scene whereshe's on the computer?
no, it's that scene.

(57:47):
get it.
I get it.
What a, a, what what a, guy, I swear to God.
But for all of Hattie's efforts to keep Sam out, eventually he gets back in and there'sthe scene where Allie comes home and she's, don't be mad.

(58:08):
He admits he forced his way in, know, basically, and, you know, he's talking his way backinto her heart.
But honestly, I think this guy is bullshit.
I think this guy is bullshit and he doesn't, like, even during that conversation, he'sputting some of the blame on her.
He's like, well, I sent you a letter.
Didn't you get it?
And she's like, no, I didn't get the letter.
But that's not her fault she didn't get a letter.

(58:29):
You know, talk to the US mail, you know, it's, well, we know what the letter, but likefrom Ali's point of view,
He's already like putting part of the blame for what happened on her and she's acceptingit, which is ridiculous.
Yeah, and it's also indicative of the, which is a sexual roles of its time, right?

(58:52):
In the 90s, it's very indicative of the way that men and women interacted.
And there was a lot of like narcissistic behavior, where as he's, yeah, he's kind ofmaking it her fault that they didn't get back together sooner.
Yeah, like, you you didn't, oh, you're not forgiving me.
And it's like, well, no, because you stuck your dick in someone like we're not.

(59:14):
Exactly, exactly that!
I mean, you didn't, you know, you didn't forget the milk.
You stuck your penis in another human being.
Yeah, was.
Yeah, exactly.
You didn't forget the milk.
It's whole other thing.
It was a very intentional.
It didn't happen by accident.

(59:34):
No, absolutely not.
It's, an, you made an intentional choice, pal.
You gotta, you gotta live with it.
I mean, again, you know, if I were him, I'd be cursing.
Well, if I were him, I wouldn't have done it.
But if I were him, I would also be cursing that freaking answering machine.
It's all, it all comes down to the answering machine.
This whole movie doesn't happen a few years later with voicemail.

(59:54):
right.
Yeah, exactly.
So, I mean, but again, Hedy, Hedy doesn't think that Sam is worth it.
I agree with Hedy.
ultimately that's Ali's decision.
And we get mention of this letter that he sent with the, including the apartment key, butAli never got that.
We'll come back later.

(01:00:14):
I also want to talk about the apartment itself.
Cause the apartment itself is like the setup of this is interesting and odd.
Cause it seems like there's a central foyer.
And then all the rooms, like the bedrooms, the living room, the kitchen, everything isjust the bathroom.
all around the periphery.
So there's a lot of like opportunities to watch from one room to the next.

(01:00:39):
Mm-hmm.
See, I said very Jalo, very Italian.
definitely.
There's a very European vibe because it's an older building.
They designed the apartment to what they needed and built that on a soundstage.
it's not illogical because it's an older New York building.

(01:00:59):
It's not like it's a high rise from the post-war era.
And it reminded me, this is going to sound odd, there's a theory of prison design calledthe Panopticon.
And you have a watchtower in the middle and the cells are around the perimeters.
So the prisoners could be watched at any time, but because like, you know, the guard toweris like shaded, they don't know when a guard might be there or might be looking.

(01:01:27):
So they just have to assume that someone's watching all the time.
mean, even though the main, there's a scene where she's watching like through the windowfrom like the hallway outside because of the.
The way the building's set up, she's watching in through the window.
That's where she encounters the older woman played by Frances Bay.
She was Mrs.
Tremont on Twin Peaks in Fire Walk with me.

(01:01:49):
Yes!
It's also the setup of this apartment.
It's the opportunity to stage some great shots.
when Hetty is calling to see if Allie is okay, it's like the one time we see her at work.
You have the foyer with the answering machine, you know, like is in the foreground and youhear the message, but then you can see Ali and Sam making out in one of the rooms in the

(01:02:13):
background and it's all, it's all set up.
you, you gives you opportunities for stuff like that.
Yeah, is really the way that that shot is really cool.
The cinematography in this is amazing.
I didn't look at it.
I did not look up the DP.
So I'm not even sure if that's Barbier or if it's somebody else.
But I thought that they did such a such a tremendous job with it.
Yeah, there's some real great lighting, the blue, like there's some blues where she's inher room and it's just like, it's kind of bathed in this blue light.

(01:02:41):
And we get like a very fatal attraction as contrast as Allie and Sam, like they go to ahotel, he's staying at a hotel.
Yeah, right.
So he's exactly he's he's staying at whatever his local fuck shack is like he has he goesinto this.
He apparently just stays there all the time, by the way.
Right.

(01:03:02):
Because they know who he is.
They know who Ali is.
They know who everyone is.
Right.
So and she's and I I totally I got to, you know, like I said, hot take.
I am on Hedy's side with this because.
No, she's totally right.
She didn't leave her a note and say, look, I've gone to a hotel with Sam.

(01:03:23):
I don't know when I will be back.
Love you.
Ice cream in fridge.
Goodbye.
Tell buddy.
love him.
Whatever.
like she, she didn't and she, and she didn't call and she didn't say, you know, Hey, youknow, get my freak on, be back later.
a phone
And we get that contrast of like, she's having sex in the hotel with Steven Weber andHedy's eating ice cream alone.

(01:03:50):
God, I hate, I can't stand this scene because I don't like the way she treats buddy.
it breaks my heart so much.
basically kicks the dog away and no wonder the dog prefers Alan.
Like it's like Jesus, you know, like it's.
Yeah, so the ice cream and puppy kicking.
Just that's what she's doing that night.
Yeah, absolutely.

(01:04:11):
That's where you really start to like, she's done things that are wrong, but the puppy
yeah.
and then, like I said, then obviously it escalates.
yeah, you're at this point, you're just like, man, she's kind of a bitch.
And then when Allie does get home, Hetty hits her with, where the hell have you been?
Which is not, I mean, in the one hand, it's kind of understandable, but on the other hand,it's very intense.

(01:04:38):
Yeah, like I really wish she would have called.
That would have been fine, right?
But like, yes, the notes, but the sitting.
But seriously, like the sitting in the dark, just like, where the hell have you been?
Yeah, munching on marbles all night.
You know what I mean?
Like it's a pretty like a Kim Karns kind of deep, deep guttural type voice that she'susing at this time.

(01:05:02):
And so I understand Ali's like, what the fuck?
You know, like I was I was with Sam and, you know, etc.
or whatever.
Also, I I also have to remind myself that I am 45 and that these women are supposed to bein their like late 20s.
Maybe 20.
And in my late 20s, I probably would have gone gallivanting with my piece of shitboyfriend at a really nice hotel and not called a single person.

(01:05:29):
You know, this is where Ali is so confrontation averse.
actually like, she's, know, because they're talking about, you're going to want me to moveout if he's, you know, if Sam is back, you're not, you're to want me to move out.
And Ali like actually floats the idea of maybe her and Sam will move, which is insane.

(01:05:50):
Like, again, you wouldn't give up this apartment for anything.
It's, it's.
Like that's crazy.
And they go to look at another place that in Sam's words is half the space and twice theprice.
Although it still looks pretty sweet.
It's gorgeous with those windows.
reminded me of when Harry met Sally.
Yep.
Actually is exactly what it reminded me of is when Harry met Sally, when they're rollingout that carpet together and everything.

(01:06:14):
That's exactly what it reminded me of.
And I absolutely love it.
I thought it was like, wow.
So classic upper vest side.
Like
for sure.
Absolutely.
No, it's, know, those apartments just fantastic.
the Jillian dollar.
mean, that was like the, did Pacific Heights a couple of weeks ago and they're like, youknow, they're trying to buy this, this Victorian in San Francisco to fix up.

(01:06:39):
I'm like, if they don't, I will invent a time travel machine so I can buy it because Iknow how much it will be worth here in the distant future of 2025.
Yeah, I'll go release the cockroaches in my own apartment just so I can live there.
So disgusting.
Oh my God.
So disgusting.
my God.

(01:07:00):
while Allie is dealing with all of this, she also has to contend with her client,Mitchell, who is just a creep and is really into inappropriate touching.
Like even before the big incident happens, know, like man, you don't need to reach for themouse that close.

(01:07:22):
Like you don't need to do that.
No, it's obvious.
It's obvious.
It becomes obvious in this movie that like Toba wants to take her to Uncle Touchy's nakedpuzzle basement.
You know, mean, against her will, definitely.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's not, it's not a, it's not a, you know, she's not accepted the invitation totouch anything.

(01:07:44):
Like I, I like tall guys, but yeah, Tobo's not my flavor.
So.
Well, you know, mean, he's Ned Ryerson.
That first step is a deuce.
This is indeed, it is a doozy.
That's not a problem.
God.
But what's interesting is she's she's uncomfortable at work.
Allie's uncomfortable at work with this guy.
She's more and more uncomfortable in her own home.

(01:08:06):
Like we see her kind of like creeping around to try and avoid Hedy, who just always seemsto be there.
She's ready to make breakfast for for, you know, Allie and Sam and, you know, and even onenight where where she wakes up to see Hedy masturbating in a room with the door open.
Yeah, that was a it's the problem.

(01:08:29):
That was a bold choice.
Yeah, that is that's a pretty that was a pretty wild choice on on Hedy's part.
Indeed.
And then the yeah, the dog, I think she picks up the dog.
Yeah, the dog of course like, you know, squeaks at the wrong moment and then, you know,she...
But like, the interesting thing here is like, I mean, honestly, it feels like for theearly 90s, just kind of admitting female masturbation feels like a big deal.

(01:09:02):
Yeah, wasn't a thing.
mean, I think probably one of my favorite uses of female masturbation in a movie is thetruth about cats and dogs with Jeanine Garofalo and Ben Chaplin.
Which I remember, but I have not seen.
You know what?
I love that movie.
I'll go to, yeah, I'll die on that hill.

(01:09:24):
That's fine.
And there's a scene where she has phone sex with him.
And it's the first time I've ever seen phone sex correctly, you know, portrayed, if youwill, in a movie.
And also it was like, that's pretty hot for a PG-13 movie, man.
It's like, damn, all right.

(01:09:47):
But it was also...
one of those only instances where you see something even remotely like that, right?
Because, you know, images of women's pleasure, it's like, heavens to Betsy.
Exactly, exactly.
There's a lot of sex, there's a lot of sexy stuff in the 80s, but 80s sexy stuff doesn'tseem to be oriented around women's play.

(01:10:11):
It's not, it's a lot of dudes jerking off.
But exactly that.
is exact.
it feels like this, I mean, again, this coming the same year as Basic Instinct feels likeit is a really distinct change.
And not that it would change all overnight, not that it fully has, because obviouslythere's a lot of stuff that's just got a very male gaze towards things.

(01:10:35):
But it feels like at least the needle is moving a little bit.
Yeah, yeah, I really I feel like it it it definitely does.
And then there's there's there's definitely a shift with the with the genre, you know,where women are kind of taking control.
And that just wasn't a thing that was happening, you know.

(01:10:57):
Now, this brings us to the incident with the dog.
God.
OK, so we actually because I mean, both both Gregory and I, we were like, OK, we got toyou got to we got to fast forward this.
I can't I can't I can't do it.
I can't do it.
I can't do it.
So as soon as we want, as soon as we saw them walk around, walk around the bend, they werelike coming to the street.

(01:11:17):
I was like, did it change it?
Like I can't, I can't do it.
Sorry.
We got, we got to set this up first.
Cause there's like a, there's a big window and then there's like, it's like a, like aJuliet kind of balcony.
It doesn't look like you could be completely out.
Like it's just like a little bit of a balcony where, you know, you, you, and there's likea railing, like an ornate railing.

(01:11:38):
And we see Sam fixing this railing on this small balcony, but he doesn't finish the workbecause he's distracted by, by Hedy making breakfast.
Right.
And, clearly Hedy is unhappy that the dog seems to prefer Allie to her.
Like that's like, you know, they're both kind of, they're doing that thing where it'slike, who's the dog going to go to?

(01:12:00):
So Sam and Allie, they go, they're going to look at the other apartment, which is, I mean,beautiful, but you're not going to give up.
You're not going to, it's crazy.
And then they're coming around the building and they see a commotion and the dog is deadon the ground.
And Allie, who was at home, had headphones on.
She didn't hear a thing.

(01:12:20):
So what happened?
What do you think really happened with that?
I mean, I literally think that Hedy just threw out the fucking window.
mean, threw him off the...
just threw him out the...
out of the...
And I have another theory that Hedy actually killed her twin.
Well, yeah, mean, there's there's there's yeah, it's interesting because the movie withlet's take the dog first, because I think it's there's there's not any kind of textual

(01:12:47):
thing for she killed the dog.
Like there's never a moment where like even even between her and the camera, like sheturns and, you know, smiles maniacally or something like that.
Right.
Right.
Right.
Right.
Like it's but at the same time.
You know, was it an accident due to the faulty railing repair?

(01:13:08):
But it feels much more like this is another manipulation on Hedy's puzzle.
Yeah, I think it was just that the dog took up too much of Allie's time and energy, so tospeak, So Hattie just decided, I'll just get rid of the dog.
It's similar with the, we're going to learn that in fact that the sister that was notstillborn, that she died much later in life, think it was age nine or something like that.

(01:13:37):
it's not ever said directly that Hedy did something.
She clearly feels responsible, but you can feel responsible for things.
Hey, I feel responsible for stuff that I'm not actually responsible for all the time.
Like that's just life, you know?
But like,
You know like the bit with the dog yet.

(01:13:59):
You don't know what the truth actually is and it's a really interesting a lesser moviewould have Hedy turn to the camera and give this maniacal smile and you know, right but it
pulls back from that and I think it's it's really really So in the wake of the dog's deathHedy gives Sam a very inappropriate kiss and which he

(01:14:22):
you know, doesn't report by all accounts.
it's, you know, he doesn't, he doesn't, I mean, he doesn't tell Allie that, your roommatetried to kiss me in her, in her grief of the, of the dog.
It's, mean, it's still less inappropriate than what she's going to give him later, butlike, we'll, we'll get to that.
But Hedy begins to dress like Allie and Allie's got a very distinctive style.

(01:14:45):
She's got a very distinctive haircut.
And you know, she's going to dress like her.
We have this scene where she wakes up and Allie's racing to get ready for the big meeting.
And she finds that like Hedy's closet is filled with like duplicates of her, of all theclothes she's owned.
cat of all the clothes she has, yep.
But she's got to go because she's got the big meeting at Mitchell's company, whichapparently goes well.

(01:15:09):
as soon as her and Mitchell are alone, I mean, you've seen it come in the whole movie.
This guy, this guy's, I mean, you can't say the movie didn't set it up.
can't say that, you know, he's been leering from moment one, but like,
Yeah, it's such a gross moment.
It's really disgusting.
But yeah, she he tries to sexually assault her.

(01:15:30):
She ends up punching him in the dick, which I love.
Good for her.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then she gets, you know, she gets home and Hedy.
This is Hedy's moment, right?
This is Hedy's moment to take care of Ali, because Ali is devastated by this anddevastated by what this means for her business and what this means for everything.
Also, her comfort as the fact that this is.

(01:15:50):
this is a job and you know all of the things right so.
she says it's not even so much the money, it's that I was counting on him to providecontacts.
That's the thing, because I need to have more jobs after this.
Which he had no plan of
you could tell early on he was like, oh yeah, yeah, I'll introduce you to all kinds ofpeople or maybe I'll just keep you to myself.

(01:16:18):
like, and to Hedy's credit, like Hedy, the stuff that Hedy says to Ali in the wake of thatis all right.
Like Ali is the victim.
None of that is her fault.
Right.
You know, and we see this different, more aggressive side to Hetty as she calls Mitchellat home and threatens him, pretending to be Allie.

(01:16:42):
And that is a great, great moment.
my goodness.
Hello.
May I speak with your husband, please?
Who are you calling?
Yes, I know it's late.
Tell him it's Alison Jones.
He'll take the call.
Listen, you pathetic shit.

(01:17:02):
You want to hold on to your business?
No.
You listen to me this time, asshole.
If you trash me around town, you're fucked.
And your family is fucked too.
You got that?
It won't just be you.
Ta-da!

(01:17:26):
Let me tell you, he is pissing in his PJs right now.
Gee, Hattie, I hope you never get mad at me.
And in a lot of ways, it's actually setting this whole stage for Hetty to take over Ally'slife.
Yeah, I mean, this is the first time we see her really essentially impersonating here.

(01:17:47):
And here it's in a context that is benign to Ally.
Yes.
But soon it will not.
then, then it's shortly after this that Hedy takes Ally to the salon and we get one ofthose most, one of the most memorable moments in the movie when Hedy duplicates Ally's
very distinctive short haircut.

(01:18:09):
And it's,
man, is just like, this is one of those things I think people think of when they think ofthis movie is Jennifer Jason Lee and the reveal of like the short red hair.
yeah, but I absolutely have to, as far as suspending disbelief is concerned, the momentwhere Hetty jumps in the shower after going to the salon, I flipped out.

(01:18:35):
I was like, no, especially, especially if you get your hair colored red, you are not goinganywhere near a shower for like a week.
You're gonna take a horror bath like the rest of us.
Can we talk about that shower for a second?
my.
Like, cause it is like that shower is the most uncomfortable looking shower I've ever,it's like, it's, like a tube in the corner of the room with like all these metal like rods

(01:19:06):
and there's a shower curtain that goes all the way around.
I hate shower curtains.
Like give me a door if at all possible.
like, like it's.
But like you can barely move.
It looks neither comfortable nor private.
Yes.
It's really bonkers.
And it's funny because the, rest of the, bathroom, way that it's set up, it's very, itreminds me of Diabolique actually with the, with the claw bathtub and everything.

(01:19:37):
and also a little bit of fatal attraction to throw in for good measure.
for sure.
Bath tubs, you know, water figures very heavily into all of these movies.
That's one of the things we have found.
Interesting.
But the haircut's a major turning point because up until now, Hattie's behavior has beenkind of odd and but like this is where things start to escalate.

(01:20:00):
Ali finds the shoe box.
Ali's a snooper.
But in this case, she finds the shoe box with all this disturbing stuff like letters.
That is her real name Ellen Besh.
And we learn about the twin sister who was not stillborn, but died by drowning at the ageof nine.

(01:20:21):
See, that's why I thought it was like I got very big like bad seed vibes from that.
where where she kills the where she kills the kid, you know, she beats him to death withher tap shoes.
And, you know, like that's what I thought.
I was like, she's probably just not didn't want to share the spotlight with her littlesister or with her twin sister rather.

(01:20:41):
So she just drowned her.
I mean, in a couple of weeks, we will do one of the strangest movies in this series,Macaulay Culkin in The Good Son.
Good son, my goodness, yeah.
God, it's gonna be crazy.
you got to follow that one up with Mikey.
Like if you're going to do good son, you have to like in your private life anyway, youhave to follow it up with Mikey.

(01:21:05):
And so you watch the kid from family ties play just the most like deplorable child killerof all time.
You never saw Mikey?
I've never heard of it, no.
my goodness!
you're in for a treat!
I'll add it to the list.
The list is very long.
I'm convinced if I keep adding lists to the list of movies, eventually got to watch and Isubtract some as I watch them.

(01:21:32):
But if I keep adding lists, I'll never die because I still have movies to watch.
It's a wild watch.
It's a wild watch.
can understand why it absolutely is just persona non grata as far as movies are concerned.
Because it is essentially good.
It is essentially good son.
It's just good son if it was turned up to like 11.

(01:21:52):
And it's really violent and bizarre.
the little like I said, the little kid who played Andy on Family Ties plays this.
Ryan Bonsai
Bonsel.
Yes, Brian Bonsel and just got Josie Bissette in it and John Deal from Miami Vice.
I'm a huge Miami Vice fan.

(01:22:14):
So, yeah.
Yeah, but it's a it's it's it's a pretty brutal horror film, you know.
So, yes, there you go.
There's your recommendation for the week.
It's, you know, hey, you know, always something for a Saturday night.
How could you go wrong?
And on top of all the stuff about Hattie, she also finds the missing letter and the keythat Sam mentioned earlier, but that she never got.

(01:22:41):
like, you know, this is where things really start to sort of escalate.
love that she goes to Graham's house, like she goes to Graham's apartment and she's like,she's crazy.
And Graham without missing a beat.
He's just like, he's like, get rid of her.
Get rid of her, call the cops if you have to.

(01:23:02):
Do whatever you have to do.
No, Graham is right on the money.
No question about it.
But before that, she still has to go out and she follows Hetty out.
Oh yeah, yep.
This is where we go down those very Argento looking stairs and she's got the black glovesand we go to the Hellfire Club in New York's Meatpacking District.

(01:23:25):
And this was a real club that existed at the time.
And it feels like an evolution of the club from bad influence, but it's less performative.
There's no dancers with light sticks here.
Yeah, it's like I said, it's all fun and games till someone puts on Enigma, you know, andthen someone's getting, and then someone's getting laid in the basement.

(01:23:47):
And what does Allie find?
She finds Hetty, who looking very much like Allie, using her name and talking to a guythat looks a lot like Steven Weber.
And she even says, you look like my sister's boyfriend.
And it's really interesting because identity is so fluid here.

(01:24:10):
Does Hetty see Allie as a replacement for her sister or does she?
Does she want to be Allie or does she want to sleep with Allie or is it all of the above?
It's this complex knot of very fractured identities.
But it's really interesting.

(01:24:31):
on one level, makes Heady, both Heady and Allie have difficulty defining themselveswithout the context of another person.
But Heady in a much more extreme way.
Absolutely.
And I think that Ali reacts in a different way than Hedy reacts.
believe Hedy goes more into the extreme behaviors.

(01:24:53):
For sure.
For sure.
this is what this is when she goes back to the building and tells Graham and you're right.
I love he's just like, get rid of her, get rid of her tonight.
But what they don't realize is that vents can carry sound both ways.
Got it.
You know, he knew he knew that you could listen to those vents and he was not carefulbecause Hedy hears the whole thing.

(01:25:17):
Yep.
And she sneaks into Graham's apartment.
She's still wearing her giallo gloves.
Ali leaves, she goes downstairs and she tries to call Hedy's father.
I guess she found the number in the shoebox and tries to call Mr.
Besh.
Mr.
Besh.
Mr.
Besh.
I don't want to leave this all on an answering machine.
Well, everything else gets left on an answering machine.

(01:25:37):
was gonna say, answering machines are really the character, or really another character inthis movie, really.
for sure.
for sure.
But what's interesting is that when Graham catches Hetty in the apartment, first he thinksit's Ali that she's still there from behind, then he realizes that it's Hetty and she's
trying to get out.

(01:25:58):
Like she didn't go up there with the intention of doing harm.
She's trying to get out the door, but unfortunately, Graham uses this long metal rod tolock his door and that is, you know.
That's gonna be a weapon and and Hedy's gonna gonna beat the crap out of him with it.
Yep.

(01:26:18):
And there's a while you don't know what happened to him.
He just kind of disappears.
Yeah, he disappears.
And then I was glad when he popped back up.
I was like, you know what I mean?
Like this scene was, I was like, God.
And then she's covered in his blood.
Like her clothing is covered in his blood and she even, she puts the clothing in the sink.
when, Allie looks at it, she says, you know, she refers to her period.

(01:26:43):
says, well, my period always comes when I'm wearing something nice.
Right.
So she doesn't question her.
She's like, okay.
Yeah, no.
then Hedy seems to grow more and more unstable at this point.
And Allie basically says, hey, listen, you gotta leave.
And this is when the father calls back and Hedy puts the phone off the hook.

(01:27:04):
And telling Hedy she has to leave, that is gonna lead to another trip to the HotelAtherton.
which apparently has very bad security.
Yeah.
It's not a secure place.
My goodness.
My god, so just terrible security and yeah, she just, I don't...

(01:27:28):
did she get in that room?
Like she's wearing that distinctive silver jacket.
She slips into Sam's room.
I don't know how she got the key.
I mean, I could see how someone from a glance would think it was Allie, but how did sheget the key from the front desk people?

(01:27:48):
Don't stay at the Hotel Atherton.
They are not doing their jobs as far as hotel security.
God, yeah.
Then we have this scene where she climbs into Sam's bed in his hotel room and proceeds toperform oral sex on him.
I mean, naturally, of course, Sam at first assumes it's Allie.

(01:28:11):
Right.
know, I mean, it looks like at a glance.
But then, you know, when he says her name, Eddie replies, no.
Right.
And then she basically like, like, let's, let's not make any bones about this.
She blow rapes him.
Like, you know, and he climaxes pretty quickly.
really quickly and then afterwards he curls up into the fetal position like he's in theacute

(01:28:34):
Yeah, it's so weird.
It's such like, I can't, I'm not sure I can call it cheating because it's such a bizarresituation.
Like he's like he's already kind of far along when he realizes it's not Allie and like.
Yeah, as much as, okay, as much as I hate Sam, like I said, total trash dick, 100%.

(01:28:55):
This was not his fault.
Yeah, like it's such a bizarre situation.
Like it's again, in particular, if the first infidelity had never happened, you wouldn'teven, you'd be like, oh, well, this is just, this is, yeah, she blow rapes him.
That's the, there it is.
Like that's, and of course, like Hennie says that like he's incapable of being faithful,like, and she's going to tell Allie what happened and Sam to his credit calls her bluff.

(01:29:23):
Yeah, he goes, tell her, I don't care.
I'm sorry.
I'm sorry.
Look, I know you want a safe face.
I won't tell her, okay?
Just pick up the phone and call her and tell her that you're going back to your ex-wife orsomething.

(01:29:47):
And I won't say a word, okay?
Yeah, well, you won't have to say a word, sweetheart, because I'm going to tell hermyself.
No!
And, you know, and then that leads to a stiletto to the eye.
Which I really think we need to get Mythbusters on this, because I'm wondering if you canindeed stab somebody through the eye with a very expensive stiletto heel and kill them.

(01:30:19):
kill them.
You would probably do damage to their eye for sure.
Like you could you could blind somebody by that but like that it would go so deep that itwould like kill them instantly like go into their brain.
Yeah.
was a, that's a, that was a bit of a stretch with that.
It's I mean, it makes for a great, you know, like it makes for a great moment, but like,it makes Steven Weber the bunny for the single white female.

(01:30:46):
Like, yeah.
Put them on the stove.
He's done.
I mean, now did you see Jade?
Did you guys do Jade as an other movie?
Jade as part of the Basic Instincts series, but I have seen Jade.
Because I'm like, speaking of stiletto heels used in ways that we didn't think werepossible.
yeah.

(01:31:07):
Jade Jade is an insane insane insane movie.
Love it.
my God.
my God.
I'm looking forward to eventually watching again when we do when we do get me to the basicinstinct for sure.
That's also one though that like I swear to God I love Friedkin like I love Friedkin.
I love to live and die in LA is.
Chef's.

(01:31:28):
French connection.
You know all of this, but I swear to God I cannot with the fucking 12 minute car chasescenes.
I get it.
It's a thing.
It's a Friedkin thing.
It's a very specific Friedkin thing, but Jade I swear to you that scene goes on.
I could get up.
I could shave my legs, I could come back, and it would still be play.

(01:31:53):
my god, my god.
Yeah, no, you're right.
You're right.
It's something's, you know, it's like a, you know, a jazz odyssey solo at like a fishconcert.
Yeah, he's a little, yeah, it is definitely a little bit like that.
Yeah, that's a good way putting it.
Yeah, a Jazz Odyssey solo to Fish concert.

(01:32:16):
So the next morning, Allie awakens to find Hedy cleaning and packing.
So maybe everything's going to be fine.
She's getting ready to go, you know?
Everything will be OK, at least until she sees the news report about the murder at theHotel Atherton, room 612.
And she realizes that's Sam.
And then she sees the bloody shoes, which Hedy helpfully left right in the middle of thebathroom floor.

(01:32:40):
was fantastic.
That was really great.
She looks at the shoe and then she wants to vomit because she's like, my God, she killedhim with her shoe.
But it's like she goes, she's trying to play it cool when Hedy comes back.
Like she's, know, like, and I love this detail.
I noticed this when, like, when Hedy goes on to like, she comes in, you know, cause Ali'sgot her head in the toilet.

(01:33:05):
She runs the water on the tap and she uses her dress to not touch the tap because she'sbeen cleaning all her fingerprints from the place because she is getting ready to get out
of dodge and.
Either Ali's gonna have to come with her or, you know, she's gonna get arrested, you know.

(01:33:25):
So she's already wiped her fingerprints.
It's really great.
And there's also this really great visual moment where Ali is getting dressed.
Again, we know that Ali knows, but we don't know that Hedy knows that Ali knows.
Absolutely, and she's putting on her jeans
And you see Ali is in the foreground entirely in shadow and Hedy is in the backgroundwatching her, but they basically both have the same silhouette because of the haircut and

(01:33:53):
all of them.
so, it's so cool.
It's such a good shot.
but Hedy's already figured out that Ali knows that Sam's dead and, and she, you know, shekeeps down in her, her storage locker.
She keeps a gun in a cowboy boot for just this kind of occasion.
Absolutely.
Like she has a kill plan.
Like really, she does.
Like she's in there cleaning stuff up like Dexter.

(01:34:13):
You know, she's she's wiping stuff down and you know, just living in those black leathergloves, you know, and and then she and then yeah, she's she's like, OK, I'm going to store
some of my stuff downstairs.
Wink wink nudge nudge.
Down near the incinerator, I might add.
Pull out this gun, you know?

(01:34:34):
Yeah, right out of the cowboy boot.
then, you know, she, she's like, you you know, she, she pulls the gun out and she's like,you know, basically you stay there.
You're going to be arrested for Sam's murder because nobody knows that, that I was evenhere.
There's no name on the lease.
There's no evidence I was here.
It's she actually says you have to come with me or they'll put you away.

(01:34:54):
yeah, absolutely.
I mean, she she really does this whole like almost Bonnie and Clyde thing like, yeah, likethat's what we're going on the run.
Yeah, we're gonna, we're gonna Thelma and Louise it together.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then she takes Ali up to Graham's place.
She duct tapes her to a chair with tape over her mouth.

(01:35:16):
And then she has to go out and get like money and, like she, but you know, she leaves theremote control.
The movie channels are on like 23 and 48 or something like that.
Yeah.
And that's where MDB almost saves her life.
Cause she puts on like a music video and like the
the volumes reel out and to draw the superintendent, but Hedy comes back a little tooquickly.

(01:35:37):
And the look on Jennifer Jason Lee's face when she realizes Allie was trying to escape.
She's so hurt.
She's just like, she's just devastated by this because she really, think on some levelwants to believe that they're supposed to be together.
Absolutely.
And the only way that Allie could save herself is by initiating a kiss and trying to sortof play along.

(01:36:03):
Yep.
you know, pretty soon Allie, pretty soon Hedy figures that out and binds her again whenshe goes down to the basement.
There's this creepy moment in the basement where she pulls out a suitcase and then kind oflike gets inside.
And I went through like, why is she doing that?
And then like almost a beat later it was like, she's going to put Allie's body in thatsuit.

(01:36:25):
Yes, yes, I saw that.
went, my God, like it reminded me of the spoiler alert kids, the end of Henry portrait ofa serial killer, where he just takes that where he just takes that suitcase and just
throws it on the side of the road.
And you're like,
Kids it the movie is called Henry portrait of a serial killer.
You got to know what you're in for there

(01:36:47):
Bro, I honestly, after I watched that movie, I didn't know whether to like shower or cry.
yeah, you know, honestly, I think both is the answer.
It's just like, you know, like it's, it's let the, let, let the, hopefully it's not thatvery uncomfortable shower from, from the apartment in single white female, something more
comfortable than that.

(01:37:09):
With a door.
no, I'm with you a hundred percent a door.
So then this is where Mitchell comes back into the mix because Allie has built this buginto her software that will shut the whole thing down.
and erase the data if she is in pain.
She's a computer genius.
love this scene.
I absolutely love this scene so much.

(01:37:32):
when the when it just starts erasing things and even his assistant who's got like theswing out sister haircut, like she's got that like short black like cropped haircut.
She's like looking at him like smirking like, haha, dickhead.
She hates that guy.
totally, she totally hates that guy.
my God.
Yeah.

(01:37:52):
So, so, and, this, the movie does an interesting thing because Mitchell makes his way tothe apartment looking for Ali because he's his data and he eventually goes up to Graham's
place.
had that number.
So he goes, you know, like he had the apartment number from when Ali was like housesitting or whatever.
But like the movie does an interesting thing here because we're presented with two malecharacters.

(01:38:15):
could be potential rescuers.
Mitchell certainly would be a non-traditional choice for that role, given everythingthat's happened.
he hears someone inside, he forces his way in, and he finds Ali bound on the floor.
This is where he takes the tape off.
Be careful,

(01:38:36):
Right.
Be careful.
She's crazy.
And then she pops up behind him and like, get off of her.
Because for her, he is a sexual predator.
And to her, he is on top of this woman that she loves.
know, you know.
yeah, no.
And then it's it all, you know, I mean it all goes, it all goes sideways for Mitchellbecause he's got a gun.

(01:39:00):
She shoots him point in the face.
puts the pillow over his face.
the pillow over his face and shoots him and it's like, we're done here.
god.
my god.
And at this point, it's clear what Hedy's gonna do.
So she dictates a suicide note to Allie.
I love how this is done.
I don't want to try to be loved anymore.

(01:39:22):
I don't want to be scared anymore.
Or to kill anymore.
I don't want to kill anymore.
don't want to be alone anymore.
I don't want to be anything anymore.
I don't need a reason to kill myself.

(01:39:46):
I need a reason not to.
There is no one.
You want to say anything special to anyone?
Okay, Alison Jones.
Come on.

(01:40:20):
Now they'll know it was you.
No one who knows me will believe that I wrote that.
I was never that scared.
Not like that.
It's you.

(01:40:42):
I never met anyone so scared of being alone.
Mm-hmm.
And I saved you from that.
But you don't care.
Did you know that identical twins are never really identical?

(01:41:04):
There's always one who's prettier.
And the one who's not does all the work.
She used me and then she left me.
Thank you.
hear Hedy saying all this stuff and you're like, maybe she's decided that and then youdon't really pull back.

(01:41:29):
You realize Ali is typing it at gunpoint.
Yeah, and and Ali even says like, no one's ever going to believe this because they willnever believe that I was that sad.
And Hedy says to her, I've never met anyone so scared of being alone.
Amazing.
Except of course, possibly herself.
Like that's the thing.
So then Hedy's going to force Allie to take a fistful of pills, but Allie, to her credit,she takes that glass and smashes it into Hedy's head.

(01:41:57):
This is when we learn that Graham isn't dead.
He was knocked out in the bathroom.
So he's the second potential rescuer.
love that he, first of all, I love the fact that the cat survived because I was worried.
I was like, where's that kitty cat?
And then, but the cat is just, the cat is just sitting on him.
Like he has a gaping head wound and he wakes up and the cat's just like, yeah, what's up?

(01:42:22):
Like he doesn't.
It's the difference between cats and dogs right there.
my goodness.
And, and, like he, he does kind of run interference for her, which is really cool.
You know, like, but then like it's, it's actually Allie who saves him by dragging Hedy outand then locking him in the apartment.

(01:42:44):
Yeah, because she's like, get away from him.
And so like he's safe inside, they're outside, and then the fight goes into the elevatorand Allie is knocked out.
And Hedy, of course, will take that moment, you know, needs a moment for a kiss beforedragging Allie down to the incinerator.
And then we get a cat and mouse chase in the basement.

(01:43:05):
Again, really good.
There's a great moment where Hedy thinks she's found her in this like old wardrobe.
Oh, and she's like, I can see your shirt.
It's sticking out of the closet.
Yeah.
And then she opens it up.
There's a mirror inside which Hedy reflexively smashes.
And I'm like, that's it.
She, you know, right there.

(01:43:27):
But that's when Allie swings down and buries that screwdriver that you needed to use tooperate the elevator into Hedy's back.
And you go.
know, both of our movies last week, Sleeping with the Enemy and The Hand that Rocks theCradle, the female protagonists in both of those movies, it was up to themselves.
to save themselves.
And I feel like this is also in that category where it's up to her to save herself.

(01:43:52):
She's not, this one teases these guys who could potentially play a partner rescue, but inthe end it's up to her.
And it's so good.
Apparently there was a different ending that test audiences didn't like.
I looked high and low for what it was.
Like Fatal Traction, we've talked about, there was a different ending and you could findit online.

(01:44:18):
We talked about it extensively in episode one.
I could not, for love or money, find out what the original ending was.
it's not out there to find on YouTube.
It's not on the DVD or anything like that.
The only thing that's interesting, like here, it's like you don't get the pop-up.
Like you get, in so many of these movies, you oh, think the killer's dead, you get thepop-up.

(01:44:41):
You don't get that one here.
It's just she kind of slouches over in the basement and, you know, the final scene, she'smoved into that apartment that she had been looking at with Sam with the fantastic
windows.
I mean, I guess I understand her leaving the Victoria, I think they call it in the movie.
I guess I understand her leaving that apartment given everything that's happened, butstill.

(01:45:04):
I mean, those windows do help, you know.
The view helps.
Yes, good architecture will save you.
And we get a monologue at the end about how she grieved for Sam and ultimately forgaveherself for what happened with Hetty and that final shot is a picture split down the
middle between the two of them and, you know, on one side, Hetty on the other.

(01:45:26):
It's a great, it's a great shot to end on.
I think like this movie, you know, really has got, you know, there's a lot going on inthis movie.
Like there's a lot of issues of sexuality.
There's a lot of duality image here.
Like it's one of the more complex movies that we've had in this series, which is why I wasglad to have it kind of on its own and to have you on to talk about it.

(01:45:52):
It's really just an interesting, and it's still like pulpy enough to be fun.
yeah absolutely I think it's a great time it is it's a great time
and like both of last week's movies, it did really well in theaters when it came out inthe summer of 92, and then even better on home video where it was a blockbuster video

(01:46:14):
staple.
This in Hand, The Rocks, The Cradle?
That's your Saturday night.
man, I'm it, know what?
And hand the rock, cra rocks, the cradle is another one that's just so excellent.
And, and Rebecca de Mornay is just such a wow.
she's great.
my God, she's so great.
when she takes a kid's arm in the like, don't you ever mess with her.

(01:46:38):
She's such a good nanny until she turns bad.
Yeah, she's great.
love that movie is another one that's just really it's very well written and very wellacted.
Yeah, no, absolutely.
Maybe not well written and well acted.
Eventually in 2005, there was a direct-to-video sequel to Single White Female.
And I use that term loosely.

(01:46:59):
And it was called Single White Female 2 The Psycho.
The psycho.
Yes.
As if this film was about a well-adjusted person.
my god.
And from what I can tell, like none of the cast was in it.
Not even any of the characters.
I'm not even sure if that's really a sequel.

(01:47:20):
It's just.
It's probably, if I had to hazard a guess, I would say this is a situation like withAmerican Psycho 2, Red-Blooded American Girl.
I say that this probably was a situation where they had this direct-to-video shit movieand they were like, you know what we should do?
We should just call it a sequel and then we'll get the European buyers and we'll get thenostalgia people and it'll be great.

(01:47:48):
We'll get some kind of a cable
show on it, you know?
Single white female to the psycho.
mean, you know, next week we're, we're going to, one of the movies we're to look at nextweek is poison Ivy, which did, you know, it also, you know, get a whole series of direct
to video.
We'll, we'll get into that.
That's going to be, that's going to be interesting.

(01:48:10):
I think that probably brings us to the end of today's episode.
Thank you so much for joining us on the show.
It has been absolutely terrific.
what a, what a delight.
What a delight.
Thank you.
Can you tell people where you and the Manic Movie Monday podcast can be found?
Absolutely, you can catch me and Hillary on Manic Movie Monday every Monday on Spotify,iTunes, and Amazon Music.

(01:48:37):
And apparently a couple other ones, but I'm not quite sure what they're where they are.
wherever you listen to podcasts.
There you go.
if you want to contact us or anything, we also have an Instagram page and that's prettymuch all she wrote because we're not on Facebook or anything like that.
So, yeah, we are we're definitely on the Instagram at Manic Movie Monday podcast.

(01:49:00):
Instagram at Manning Movie Monday podcast.
That is fantastic.
Thank you so much for joining us.
It has been just, it has been a real pleasure.
God, it was so much fun.
This was wonderful.
And yeah, if you get a chance, man, check out that erotic thriller episode that I did withthat documentarian, because I think you'll really love it in preparation for what you guys

(01:49:21):
are going to do.
I definitely will.
you're going to have to come back for when we do our Basic Instincts series.
I you know, do you want to talk about Jade?
talk about pretty much any I would love to see your erotic thriller list.
Yes.
It to be created.
Cause that will do a little bit down.
We'll give a little space.

(01:49:42):
We're still working out our summer series and what we're going to do after that, but itwon't be too long before we cycle back to the, cause the way we look at it was like, fatal
attraction was like Halloween.
instinct was like Friday the 13th.
It's, it's, it's, it's taking it to the next level and it's kind of creating its ownbranch off the tree.
Absolutely.

(01:50:03):
Absolutely.
then, like I said, then it gives way to, you know, the Catherine Tramiel's and all ofthese different characters, right?
These different women that are, you know, very sexually aggressive.
Femme fatales, absolutely.
So we'll be back next week.
And we already mentioned one of the movies we'll be talking about.
Well, we'll be talking about two films with teenage variations on the fatal attractionmodel.

(01:50:27):
So join us then as we discuss 1992's Poison Ivy, starring Drew Barrymore, and from 1993,The Crush with Alicia Silverstone.
Again, thank you so much for listening.
I'm your host, Chris Iannicone.
If you've enjoyed our show,
please consider subscribing and following us on Blue Sky, Instagram, threads, and Twitterat Get Me Another Pod.

(01:50:50):
In addition, check out the Justin Beam Radio Hour wherever you listen to podcasts, and youcan find Justin's book, Roadside Memories at JustinBeam.com or wherever books are sold.
And if you like the show, tell your friends about it, tell your enemies about it, tellyour roommate about it.
I mean, even if they're a little crazy.

(01:51:10):
And join us next time as we continue to explore what happens when Hollywood says, Get meanother.
If you listen to the manic movie, Bundy pod, I had it.
If you listen to the manic movie, Bundy, one more time.

(01:51:36):
I do a lot of we'll take that.

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Fatal Attraction Ep. 05 - Single White Female (with Erin Dawn of the Manic Movie Monday Podcast)

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Fatal Attraction Ep. 05 - Single White Female (with Erin Dawn of the Manic Movie Monday Podcast)