Empowering Homeowners and Installers During The Energy Transition | Bodil Energy #podcast

How can we make the energy transition as smooth as possible? We have to make it as easy as possible for every party to choose to change a no-brainer.

Whether that is on the installer side, or the home-owner.

That is at the core of Bodil Energy’s mission. To make things easier for both parties and to provide it all in one place.

So check out this entire interview to hear exactly how Bodil is making that happen, and how they are making the energy transition a reality.

Chapters 0:00 - Energy Transition for Homes 2:01 - Bodil Energy Intro 2:36 - Creating an amazing customer experience 5:16 - How Bodil helps the homeowner 7:49 - Installers on the platform 9:31 - The Ecopreneur goal 10:53 - Competition 15:37 - Viewing the industry from 2 sides 19:24 - Debate 21:04 - What keeps many contractors out of the market 23:59 - Education 25:04 - Why Bodil is multi-product 26:38 - Insulation 28:31 - Paper wool insulation 29:04 - Distribution of Bodil 35:22 - Bodil Goals 38:10 - Tip for Ecopreneurs 39:10 - Best way to get in touch with Bodil Energy: website

 

Check out Bodil Energy’s website:

https://bodil.energy/

 

Check out this interview that I mention at the end of the episode:

YouTube: https://youtu.be/Pa-5c4b9kJg

or

Audio: https://podcast.greenbusinessimpact.com/e/the-solution-for-small-business-owners-to-making-the-clean-energy-transition-nxtgen-clean-energy-interview/

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
It can be so difficult just to find the right information.
About what option is the best fit for you in making this energy transition, whether it's for you, for your home, for your business, because there isn't one easy way to find all of that information about all the different options for your home, whether it's for heat pumps, solar energy, electric vehicles.

(00:22):
All of it.
.333333333And then of course, once you figure out which one is going to be that right solution for you, you have to figure out who, who is gonna install it for you, and will they do a good job? Because how do you know if you can trust them? And on the flip side of that, the installers have to know that it is worth their time. 5 00:00:40,268.333333333 --> 00:00:56,226.666666667 Is this homeowner actually interested and how do they keep from making these costly mistakes for all these new and innovative products that are out there? How do they keep from making costly mistakes, uninstalling those where they have to come back out and do it? Or things that cut into their margin. 6 00:00:56,236.666666667 --> 00:00:58,426.666666667 And today I am speaking with Nicholas. 7 00:00:58,486.666666667 --> 00:01:08,16.666666667 He is the co-founder and CEO of Bode Energy, and they really work to solve both of these problems on both sides with their all in one platform. 8 00:01:08,26.666666667 --> 00:01:11,691.666666667 So to hear exactly how he is solving the problem on both sides. 9 00:01:11,781.666666667 --> 00:01:15,141.666666667 Make sure you stay tuned for this entire amazing episode. 10 00:01:51,101.15646259 --> 00:01:56,511.15646259 All right, Nicholas, do you mind telling us a bit about Odeal Energy and what you guys do? Yeah, for sure. 11 00:01:56,511.15646259 --> 00:01:58,801.15646259 And thank you for the invitation to be on here, Billy. 12 00:01:58,801.15646259 --> 00:02:00,641.15646259 I really appreciate it and found on the show. 13 00:02:00,696.15646259 --> 00:02:18,866.15646259 Bodil Energy is on a mission to make it easy for homeowners to energy retrofit their homes and to address the supply side installer bottlenecks by making it easy and attractive for electricians and plumbers to enter the market for home energy transition and be really efficient in their work. 14 00:02:18,871.15646259 --> 00:02:24,876.15646259 So we do this by innovating the customer and the installer journey, the first mile and the last mile. 15 00:02:25,96.15646259 --> 00:02:32,206.15646259 And by providing a one-stop shop managed marketplace for heat pumps, rooftop, solar home batteries, and car chargers. 16 00:02:32,486.15646259 --> 00:02:37,281.15646259 And finally at Bodil, we believe that essentially the installation is only half of the answer here. 17 00:02:37,281.15646259 --> 00:02:59,124.48979592 So once we have installed your energy assets, our cloud-based software optimizes their performance over time, leaving the homeowner with the lowest possible energy bill minimizing pressure of course on the grid, and finally ensuring the lowest possible climate impact by spreading consumption out throughout the day and optimizing the heat curve against weather and price signals in a Bodil home. 18 00:02:59,184.48979592 --> 00:03:01,184.48979592 And we go to market through channel partners. 19 00:03:01,184.48979592 --> 00:03:02,924.48979592 We're building a connected ecosystem. 20 00:03:03,174.48979592 --> 00:03:09,234.48979592 So we work with banks and energy companies to decarbonize their mortgage lending or the legacy gas portfolios. 21 00:03:09,484.48979592 --> 00:03:20,374.48979592 And we're also working with these partners to create innovative new financing mechanisms to ensure that a lower energy bill is available to everyone, not just the homeowners who can afford the upfront cost. 22 00:03:20,384.48979592 --> 00:03:20,894.48979592 That's great. 23 00:03:21,284.48979592 --> 00:03:26,782.77777778 And, what are some of the things that you use for, making that transition for. 24 00:03:27,212.77777778 --> 00:03:27,842.77777778 Yeah, for sure. 25 00:03:27,842.77777778 --> 00:03:34,301.16780045 So essentially we are a climate tech company, so we see ourselves as a technology first or technical native company. 26 00:03:34,301.16780045 --> 00:03:49,173.83219955 And a lot of what we provide is that the software enabled service level, right? So if you are a homeowner traditionally getting access to say, figuring out what kind of a hip heat pump would fit for your home, it's been quite a cumbersome at times, pretty frustrating process. 27 00:03:49,473.83219955 --> 00:04:02,551.51927438 I don't know if you yourself have have tried getting one of these things installed in your home but basically figuring out like what is the energy potential of my home? What products fit what sizes of different varis of a product is right for the home? How do. 28 00:04:02,556.51927438 --> 00:04:06,844.70521542 Make choices that enable the, optimum energy generation over time. 29 00:04:06,844.70521542 --> 00:04:23,308.99092971 And basically the lowest thinkable utility bill, right? So we're all about, Using technology to answer some of those questions in a UX and customer-centric modern way that provides that overview, makes those product recommendations and makes executing as simple as clicking on a button. 30 00:04:23,308.99092971 --> 00:04:38,744.26303855 Now, obviously, the last part is is easier set than done, right? And I think if you were to look at our software product, The most theoretically advanced part of it is very much this thermal modeling, right? So getting an accurate view of the individual home and the thermal properties in that home. 31 00:04:38,796.82539683 --> 00:04:46,611.08843537 What materials is it made of, what does the electricity consumption look like? What does the heat distribution system look like? So I'd say that's the most advanced. 32 00:04:46,611.08843537 --> 00:04:50,953.75283447 But, I actually think, and this is, I wanna loop this back to the last mile element, right? The execution. 33 00:04:50,963.75283447 --> 00:04:56,85.74829932 So I actually think that where we have the most lines of code and where we spend the most time is actually at that last mile level. 34 00:04:56,139.6031746 --> 00:04:58,699.6031746 So how do you get something that is. 35 00:04:58,746.38321995 --> 00:05:03,756.38321995 A gritty multi-stakeholder, usually on site or originally, always on site. 36 00:05:04,85.58956916 --> 00:05:35,571.14512472 Growth pricing process, but then also execution process with, electricians, plumbers all of these things coming together to provide a smooth experience, right? So we're all about ensuring that part of the process and and basically making sure that installers have the tools they need to we like to talk about it as like exceeding homeowner expectations, right? These are super expensive products, right? At the end of the day, even though they pay for themselves that, the payback times are pretty quickly somewhere between three and six years on average for our products, even though they pay for themselves the upfront investment is the size of a small car, right? Sometimes also a large car. 37 00:05:35,613.79818594 --> 00:05:42,773.25396825 And so what we think is that homeowners want and expect to be met at the point of sale with a service. 38 00:05:42,845.34013605 --> 00:05:45,335.34013605 That is comparable to what you'd expect when buying a car. 39 00:05:45,395.11337868 --> 00:05:49,575.74829932 And if we look at the industry as is, we're just nowhere near living up to that promise. 40 00:05:49,600.89569161 --> 00:05:57,876.71201814 And I think a lot of that is what drives us today, right? Delivering on the promise of sustainable future for homeowners and for a seamless transition away from fossil heating. 41 00:05:58,184.55782313 --> 00:05:59,850.40816327 And and towards clean altern. 42 00:05:59,913.79818594 --> 00:06:00,633.79818594 Yeah, definitely. 43 00:06:00,633.79818594 --> 00:06:09,539.43310658 And how are you helping the consumer really diagnose their home and what would be most efficient for them? Yeah, for sure. 44 00:06:09,559.50113379 --> 00:06:12,91.81405896 So we took our point of departure on publicly available data. 45 00:06:12,121.81405896 --> 00:06:14,71.66666667 So we look at what's there. 46 00:06:14,543.33333333 --> 00:06:25,285.38548753 Anything from the, digitalized EPC labels to public available housing data using, things like Google Maps visual imagery, whatever we can get our hands on to get an initial view of the home. 47 00:06:25,293.82086168 --> 00:06:36,889.71655329 And then we instantaneously merge those things on the back end into a database of how homes, and then when essentially just you type your address and we will have spit back to you almost immediately, a phase one. 48 00:06:36,939.71655329 --> 00:06:38,709.71655329 We think there's something to be done here. 49 00:06:38,724.569161 --> 00:06:42,88.76417234 And then as you go through the first mile, so digital onboarding flow. 50 00:06:42,88.76417234 --> 00:06:52,294.63718821 So the home energy calculator that we've developed, you feed the model with things that you know, and the way we decided to build the system is to take into account that not all homeowners know everything about their home. 51 00:06:52,361.71201814 --> 00:06:53,711.41723356 And so we're constantly calibrating. 52 00:06:54,71.41723356 --> 00:06:56,471.41723356 An answer for you that just gets better and better. 53 00:06:56,711.41723356 --> 00:07:05,298.00453515 And making it very clear that this first mile part of the experience is essentially just to give you an initial overview, right? A quote that gets very close, but doesn't go all the way. 54 00:07:05,598.00453515 --> 00:07:16,574.19501134 And this is essentially to weed out uninterested customers, but also very much to create excitement for those customers who are really just at the sweet spot of needing this product, right? Like the savings that you're looking at. 55 00:07:16,630.47619048 --> 00:07:39,876.08843537 For that's stick to the heat pump example, right? Which is the primary DNA of our company, right? If you're operating oil firms today, or gas firms today, not even before the energy crisis, and not least after we're able to generate 70 to 80% savings on your home utility bill, right? These payback times are pretty short So for us, making that clear for the homeowner, creating that excitement around, that initial saving is a vital part of of the customer journey. 56 00:07:40,86.08843537 --> 00:07:41,226.08843537 And it's a vital part. 57 00:07:41,231.08843537 --> 00:07:51,525.79365079 And I think this moves us back to the last mile, right? It's a vital part of ensuring that installers are spending their time where installers play best, right? Which is actually being out in homes and making. 58 00:07:51,847.89115646 --> 00:07:59,860.12471655 The sales process, the quoting process, that's not time well spent for the average installer, right? It's actually taking productivity and removing it from the place where we desperately need it. 59 00:07:59,865.12471655 --> 00:08:04,499.59183673 Because installers are the number one bottlenecks in terms of, delivering on the screen transition. 60 00:08:04,499.59183673 --> 00:08:05,783.83219955 That we stand before, right? And. 61 00:08:05,788.83219955 --> 00:08:27,870.69160998 For us, if anything we can do to weed out disinterested homeowners, anything we can do to take care of the, to increase the probability or the likelihood of a sale by simply just positioning it better, talking about it better, having more explainers, more graphics, having qualified energy advisors that are trained as sales people and as energy advisors at the same time, right? The more we can do to make sure that by the time. 62 00:08:27,995.69160998 --> 00:08:30,861.67800453 Homeowner actually is meets and install it at that time. 63 00:08:30,861.67800453 --> 00:08:34,511.24716553 It is it is a certain his conversion to, to an installation is a certainty. 64 00:08:34,539.31972789 --> 00:08:37,548.3106576 That's that's a way for us to make the market function more efficiently. 65 00:08:37,586.79138322 --> 00:08:37,866.81405896 Yeah. 66 00:08:37,871.81405896 --> 00:08:38,411.81405896 That's awesome. 67 00:08:38,411.81405896 --> 00:08:43,849.05895692 And how many different installers are you working with? Yeah, so at the moment, Voil is two and a half years old. 68 00:08:43,881.28117914 --> 00:08:49,364.29705215 Yeah, slightly more, but in that range and at the moment still just operating in Denmark but about to go into two new marks in New Year. 69 00:08:49,364.29705215 --> 00:08:52,365.29478458 But so at the moment we have 114 active installers on the platform. 70 00:08:52,764.05895692 --> 00:09:13,267.32426304 And when we talk about the platform, we have two components to it, right? There's the front end, how we drive the customers, and then there's the installer facing side of it, right? So using our CRM systems, using our tools we're all about providing installers different forms of tools and providing a tooling best practice and integrating to whatever programs they might already be using For CRMs or for quality control. 71 00:09:13,301.81405896 --> 00:09:20,405.2154195 Now we provide a parallel layer to all of those things and we make sure the API connect with with what they're also using so that we become like a seamless addition. 72 00:09:20,405.2154195 --> 00:09:36,376.14512472 And over time what we're actually seeing is a lot of people are referring to a lot of things that I was referring to operate on our software, right? Cuz they've just desperately needed, people that were deeply passionate about digitalization, people that were deeply passionate about creating just like smooth tools that are built very much with the end user in mind. 73 00:09:36,646.14512472 --> 00:09:43,18.88888889 And so what we're finding is that while we built all of these tools initially for ourself and for our own quality control purposes and as our install and. 74 00:09:43,23.88888889 --> 00:09:46,495.31746032 If they would at least operate on these tools, if they were working on our homeowners. 75 00:09:46,557.01814059 --> 00:09:56,71.55328798 Essentially what happened is that the demand for the tools were so big that we ended up basically saying, look, as long as you're also servicing our homes, then go ahead and use this suite of products on your own homes too. 76 00:09:56,139.31972789 --> 00:09:58,80.6122449 And that way we feel, we're all climate people. 77 00:09:58,80.6122449 --> 00:09:59,910.6122449 And so for us it was just a way of augmenting our. 78 00:09:59,966.07709751 --> 00:10:06,157.80045351 And ensuring that that the innovations that we make and the efficiencies that we can drive in our own process actually also benefits the wider market. 79 00:10:06,162.80045351 --> 00:10:07,32.80045351 Yeah, no, that's great. 80 00:10:07,32.80045351 --> 00:10:13,926.91609977 Being able to help others, Work towards this end goal of finding climate change is, extremely beneficial. 81 00:10:13,955.60090703 --> 00:10:24,763.09523809 I was talking to another entrepreneur on the podcast before and he got asked questions before about, what, if somebody comes along and takes your idea, and he's happy, please do please take my idea. 82 00:10:24,763.09523809 --> 00:10:26,329.6031746 Please keep doing this more. 83 00:10:26,329.6031746 --> 00:10:30,237.42630385 We're open to more and more people being able to do this so that we can have. 84 00:10:30,242.42630385 --> 00:10:32,322.13151927 Conversion so that we can, fight this. 85 00:10:32,322.13151927 --> 00:10:36,316.03174603 And, one of the things he said too is where do you hope to be in 10 years? I hope to be out of a job. 86 00:10:36,316.03174603 --> 00:10:39,226.03174603 I hope to be out of business because I hope this problem is solved. 87 00:10:39,536.03174603 --> 00:10:44,641.81405896 that, I think that's so important for this community about we're really trying to fight kind of James. 88 00:10:44,641.81405896 --> 00:10:45,541.81405896 That's the ultimate goal. 89 00:10:45,541.81405896 --> 00:10:46,924.39909297 We're not, trying to make a bunch of money. 90 00:10:46,924.39909297 --> 00:10:48,99.20634921 We're not trying to, do this. 91 00:10:48,99.20634921 --> 00:10:49,329.20634921 We're trying to have an impact. 92 00:10:49,329.20634921 --> 00:10:52,59.20634921 And the more money we can make, the more impact we can make. 93 00:10:52,128.35600907 --> 00:10:53,478.35600907 The money isn't the end goal. 94 00:10:53,688.35600907 --> 00:10:57,298.35600907 And so I think that's part of this whole entrepreneurship and what we're doing here. 95 00:10:57,348.35600907 --> 00:10:57,754.138322 Yeah. 96 00:10:57,824.52380952 --> 00:10:59,286.45124717 Billy that really rings true to me. 97 00:10:59,343.02721088 --> 00:11:03,201.16780045 Just the other day in Denmark, we're all about these Christmas dinners in companies. 98 00:11:03,201.16780045 --> 00:11:04,639.21768708 There's always like the end of year Christmas. 99 00:11:05,126.59863946 --> 00:11:15,887.23356009 We just had ours the other day and we spent a lot of time discussing this question, right? Because since we entered the market, We're seeing a lot of new market entrants come in with similar, sometimes identical value propositions as our own. 100 00:11:16,6.29251701 --> 00:11:19,466.64399093 Many of them are just getting started, others are established and already doing really well. 101 00:11:19,484.76190476 --> 00:11:27,516.91609977 And we talk about, what degree of openness should we have in talking about our mission, in participating in podcasts like this in sharing our software, et cetera. 102 00:11:27,568.9569161 --> 00:11:31,803.9569161 And I think for us it's rewarding to know, unlike many other startups that. 103 00:11:31,813.9569161 --> 00:11:32,950.71428571 Will grind and grind. 104 00:11:32,989.12698413 --> 00:11:45,240.68027211 And if there isn't that exit, if there isn't that that acquisition or if there isn't that ipo, then you can get the sense of course, having been part of something exciting from building a company point of view, but ultimately that the impact doesn't feel so rewarding.

(11:45):
.75510204If a competitor comes in and copies what you've done, it is what it is. 106 00:11:48,615.8276644 --> 00:11:52,455.8276644 That's not an exciting situation to be in, right? But we find that every little innovation that. 107 00:11:52,527.87981859 --> 00:11:58,245.95238095 We make we almost expect larger players to see what we're doing and to go, Hey, that's really cool. 108 00:11:58,245.95238095 --> 00:12:07,699.41043084 Now I think that might be a good point of departure to talk about our philosophy as well for Heart partner, right? Because cuz there are two types of companies that we're seeing, some of them will go, Hey, that's cool, we're gonna build that. 109 00:12:07,939.41043084 --> 00:12:09,650.02267574 And another type, contacts us. 110 00:12:09,980.02267574 --> 00:12:18,228.75283447 As the partner and BDU is all about partnerships, right? We're all about enabling the entire value chain and we're all about not owning the value chain. 111 00:12:18,228.75283447 --> 00:12:24,953.73015873 And I think in our space at the moment, and I think as part of this large industry transition, that we stand before we're gonna see two waves. 112 00:12:24,963.33333333 --> 00:12:27,88.33333333 And both of these waves will be very successful. 113 00:12:27,118.33333333 --> 00:12:28,868.3446712 Both of these will be very powerful. 114 00:12:28,897.57369615 --> 00:12:45,756.83673469 But but we just firmly come from a position of representing one of them, right? So for the first wave is that of consolidation, right? So the roll up shop strategy buying up the value chain in order to deliver on a promise of better quality and of course of growing margin, right? And then I think on the other side is the kind of philosophy that we come from. 115 00:12:45,805.66893424 --> 00:12:53,673.58276644 Building the tools and creating the ecosystems digitally and in person to essentially make people collaborate better across the value chain. 116 00:12:53,683.9229025 --> 00:12:55,63.9229025 That's very much where we come from. 117 00:12:55,121.46258504 --> 00:13:05,392.46031746 And I think it's important to explain why and also probably why a previous attempts that at things that look a bit like global energy have done the opposite, right? Why they've pursued m and a or vertical integration. 118 00:13:05,752.46031746 --> 00:13:06,35.36281179 Now, I. 119 00:13:06,40.36281179 --> 00:13:14,593.90022676 A lot of that comes from wanting to deliver on this promise of quality, right? I think you have this view, I think Sphere and Sweden is an excellent example of this. 120 00:13:14,609.21768708 --> 00:13:17,694.98866213 They've been providing and innovating in the solar space for years and years. 121 00:13:17,694.98866213 --> 00:13:20,169.88662132 For them because they hit the market really early. 122 00:13:20,169.88662132 --> 00:13:26,960.77097506 It was a truth that there was a lack of qualified installers to basically execute on the demand for solar installations. 123 00:13:26,965.77097506 --> 00:13:39,955.89569161 And I think that this view along with difficulties, because of having difficulties finding qualified installers, like the view developed that you had to essentially home grow talent and you had to essentially buy or acquire quality installers. 124 00:13:40,19.52380952 --> 00:13:42,809.52380952 Now I, I think in its time this view was very accurate. 125 00:13:42,839.52380952 --> 00:13:44,529.52380952 I think in this time it was a way. 126 00:13:44,563.86621315 --> 00:13:48,836.27891157 Learn about the value chain and learn how to innovate and learn how to create excellence in it. 127 00:13:48,858.29705215 --> 00:14:01,70.60997733 But I find that as new players are entering the market today with similar hypothesis we're seeing that, for example, with e Kma in, in Germany, the company that I think will be doing amazing things in exactly our space in the coming decade. 128 00:14:01,340.60997733 --> 00:14:03,829.99773243 So they're launching again on this premise of owning the value chain. 129 00:14:03,829.99773243 --> 00:14:05,540.38321996 Now what we believe in Bo is. 130 00:14:05,540.38321996 --> 00:14:19,209.31746032 If you look at the average installation company like from mom and pop shop up to mid-level local, regional champions, I think what we're seeing is many of them don't actually want to be acquired, right? There's a strong tradition of of apprentice ship. 131 00:14:19,209.31746032 --> 00:14:22,674.55555556 There's a strong tradition of wanting to own your own company. 132 00:14:22,674.55555556 --> 00:14:22,928.79591837 And I. 133 00:14:22,945.72335601 --> 00:14:29,588.9659864 A lot of these players they're being a bit squashed, right? They're seeing, these big consolidated players that they're having to compete with that are buying up the value chain. 134 00:14:29,624.09070295 --> 00:14:33,839.98639456 They might see energy companies being active in this space as well, and maybe also pushing them. 135 00:14:33,844.98639456 --> 00:14:34,414.98639456 A little bit. 136 00:14:34,634.98639456 --> 00:14:35,786.3015873 And they're looking to compete. 137 00:14:35,876.3015873 --> 00:14:43,907.46938776 They're looking to provide a customer experience that is on par with what these large consolidated challenger plays are able to provide. 138 00:14:43,912.46938776 --> 00:14:52,484.29478458 And I and I think bode's promise to the market, bode's value proposition is to all of these installers that wanna pursue excellence, but wanna do it owning their own shop. 139 00:14:52,556.36961451 --> 00:14:56,388.65986395 Essentially there's now a platform available in Bo Blood Energy. 140 00:14:56,470.99546485 --> 00:15:03,667.5260771 Which provides them not only with access to, an an infinite amount of homes that we build or that we create through our channel partnerships. 141 00:15:03,672.5260771 --> 00:15:05,414 And I'll return to that later in the conversation.

(15:05):
.36281179I think But also provides you with tools so that you can create superior digital offers, right? Like how do you create quoting that's on pair with the best challenger companies? How do you do cross product integration, right? So how do you calculate the lifetime value of a heat pump and a solar and battery all at send your car charger all at the same time? How do you distribute smart home smart energy management or energy asset management as we call it in bil? How do you distribute these things at the point of. 143 00:15:29,342.41496599 --> 00:15:40,633.77551021 As an installer, if you don't own your own platform or your own software, we're essentially we're saying, look, we're trying to provide all of these things to the market and we're trying to do it for those that are not looking to be consolidated. 144 00:15:40,679.72789116 --> 00:15:41,159.72789116 Yeah, definitely. 145 00:15:41,168.11791383 --> 00:15:50,492.74376417 a, that's an important point because, there is that sense of pride that someone has with owning their own business, wanting to run their own business and call the shots and we can get consolidated. 146 00:15:50,502.74376417 --> 00:15:54,132.74376417 That can be great for some people, but sometimes they don't wanna have that overarching person. 147 00:15:54,402.74376417 --> 00:16:01,85.47619048 The reason they got, into entrepreneurship or into, the family business if it was that is, to have that ownership. 148 00:16:01,85.47619048 --> 00:16:04,102.40362812 And so we taken over, consolidated into this big thing. 149 00:16:04,102.40362812 --> 00:16:08,277.40362812 There can be things that just don't, jive with their personality or the way they wanna work. 150 00:16:08,277.40362812 --> 00:16:14,187.40362812 And so that's like really important to have that option too, of like, you know, you wanna still stay competitive. 151 00:16:14,205.13605442 --> 00:16:27,510.52154195 And it's really hard to do that when you're competing against, A conglomerate of all these different companies where they have the resources, they have the money to spend on these great tools, and it's as a independent business owner, that's really difficult to do. 152 00:16:27,515.52154195 --> 00:16:31,374.80725624 So that's really important I think that's very true and I think two things I would add. 153 00:16:31,397.70975057 --> 00:16:41,624.5804989 So we come at this problem believing and seeing the signs both early and not so early of an industry that's changing, right? Of installing rooftop solar and heat pumps as going from. 154 00:16:41,829.5804989 --> 00:16:57,977.2562358 Being highly specialized to actually being increasingly something that electricians and plumbers, et cetera, and contractors are looking to upskill themselves in, right? and this relates back to the hypothesis that we have, which is different than I think the rest of the market, which is that while the rest of the market. 155 00:16:57,982.2562358 --> 00:17:01,642.2562358 Once to consolidate, to deliver because there is a lack of skilled labor. 156 00:17:01,912.2562358 --> 00:17:11,542.8911565 What we're saying is there is only a lack of skilled labor if you define it very narrowly as people that have been installing heat pumps for a very long time that have been installing rooftop for a very long time. 157 00:17:11,569.8412698 --> 00:17:12,189.8412698 We're all about. 158 00:17:12,261.9387755 --> 00:17:18,201.9387755 Essentially growing the install base in two ways by making the existing installers more efficient at what they do. 159 00:17:18,206.9387755 --> 00:17:24,996.9387755 But just as importantly, by enabling new players to participate in the market at the highest quality possible. 160 00:17:25,5.3741497 --> 00:17:32,370.0453515 And we're having great traction with this, right? So we're helping these regional champions in let's say solar and car chargers transition. 161 00:17:32,540.0453515 --> 00:17:46,584.3537415 Into heat pumps essentially by providing them the standardized processes and tools and workflow management systems that basically enable, much fewer mistakes and ensures that that new people can participate, right? There's this excellent example that I always like to quote. 162 00:17:46,854.3537415 --> 00:17:47,494.3537415 We had. 163 00:17:47,511.3038549 --> 00:17:52,608.5600907 Who were somebody who who leads up a large solar company that had always also been doing heat pumps for a little while. 164 00:17:52,758.5600907 --> 00:17:57,643.3673469 And he was saying it used to always be the manager of this company that was out doing the sales of of the heat pumps. 165 00:17:57,643.3673469 --> 00:18:02,607.585034 Cause remember these are mid-sized sometimes family run jobs, right? So up to 20, 30 people. 166 00:18:02,674.6485261 --> 00:18:05,36.4285714 And so this guy would always be out closing the sales. 167 00:18:05,36.4285714 --> 00:18:08,576.4285714 And that's simply because if he didn't, what he would see was he would make too many mistake. 168 00:18:08,641.2811791 --> 00:18:10,411.2811791 And those mistakes would over time become costly. 169 00:18:10,721.2811791 --> 00:18:13,368.5600907 And that dynamic keeps a lot of contractors out of this space. 170 00:18:13,368.5600907 --> 00:18:15,4.3877551 I think we should maybe return to that point as well. 171 00:18:15,4.3877551 --> 00:18:31,38.2086168 But essentially what he was seeing now was that because of our sort of flow standardization, he could send out even some of the newest employees in the company, right? Because our fulfillment apps essentially require you to document things in the home and go through a standardized sort of step by step list and take photos. 172 00:18:31,84.138322 --> 00:18:40,874.5578231 We kind of auto spec the amount of piping needed and where to place the equipment outside and whether that stays within local noise, and regulations for, again, for the heat pumps. 173 00:18:40,887.8231293 --> 00:18:45,461.122449 Cuz sometimes, there's sound and you wanna make sure that you're respectful of the neighbors, but also of the regulation. 174 00:18:45,641.122449 --> 00:18:47,400.6122449 So by basically providing all of that and. 175 00:18:47,415.7823129 --> 00:18:51,508.3673469 The kind of onboarding first mile flow that we've come to expect of the internet. 176 00:18:51,536.4172336 --> 00:18:58,77.4829932 By doing all that he's able to basically grow his company because new people are able to take part in what used to be more high skilled. 177 00:18:58,94.3877551 --> 00:18:58,784.3877551 Type tasks. 178 00:18:58,994.3877551 --> 00:19:01,4.3877551 And that's the kind of stuff that gets us really excited. 179 00:19:01,15.6802721 --> 00:19:03,385.6802721 Creating some kind of delta on the install side. 180 00:19:03,407.9478458 --> 00:19:07,40.600907 Because that's what's needed if we want to stay within 1.5 181 00:19:07,45.600907 --> 00:19:07,430.600907 degrees. 182 00:19:07,458.6281179 --> 00:19:08,850.2834467 And that's of what drives us. 183 00:19:08,901.2131519 --> 00:19:10,41.2131519 Yeah, definitely. 184 00:19:10,41.2131519 --> 00:19:18,83.6961451 That's really exciting because when you mentioned that, he's, Taking time out of his day, which he could be focused on so many other tasks that he needs to do, but he has to go close that sale. 185 00:19:18,83.6961451 --> 00:19:27,850.3174603 And now they've given that opportunity because, he was able to go there and he has saw things that he would know to, remember or note down and things like that. 186 00:19:27,855.3174603 --> 00:19:29,720.3401361 But then a new person coming on wouldn't. 187 00:19:29,725.3401361 --> 00:19:34,585.3401361 Have the knowledge to go and look at those things or see those things or document those things. 188 00:19:34,855.3401361 --> 00:19:51,356.0090703 But now that you have a standardized system, and he might be like really great at training his people too, but there's some things that he might just not think about or just passively understand, but didn't think about oh, let me write that down as a step for a new person coming in. 189 00:19:51,356.0090703 --> 00:19:54,56.0090703 But he would recognize that or there's like you. 190 00:19:54,87.4263039 --> 00:20:00,191.4965986 Different situations where like a crazy thing happens at this house but is only, 1% of houses or something like that. 191 00:20:00,216.3265306 --> 00:20:04,804.1723356 He'd be able to see that and diagnose that, but, his new person wouldn't be able to see that. 192 00:20:04,804.1723356 --> 00:20:14,634.9886621 But now with this, documented system that you have, you can easily, catch all of those things or take the pictures so that he can review them afterwards so he knows how to, diagnose it forward. 193 00:20:14,634.9886621 --> 00:20:15,930.2494331 So that's really impressive. 194 00:20:15,982.8117914 --> 00:20:16,386.3718821 love that. 195 00:20:16,426.4965986 --> 00:20:17,956.4965986 Yeah, Billy, that's exactly right. 196 00:20:17,956.4965986 --> 00:20:30,66.4512472 And I think, it's related to a debate that's going on here in Scandinavia, right? We talk a lot about for contractors that, they have the qualifications to be doing the things needed to participate in this market, but they might not have specifically trained. 197 00:20:30,104.5238095 --> 00:21:04,378.446712 In heat pumps, right? But then they've done gas and then they've done solar and then they've done, all the pivot requires is a little bit of upskilling, right? And and what are the debates we're having at home is, should there be three or four days of courses on this subject? And what does that fourth day or maybe the fifth day mean for installer's ability to operate with excellence? And I think what we're saying is, You could spend two months upskilling people, right? What drives success is not necessarily putting a lot of things into people's head, but actually providing them with better ways of working, right? And so we're all about that augmentation of skills, right? And and having this digital. 198 00:21:04,782.2222222 --> 00:21:12,133.1972789 And physical way of working where, you don't need to remember every single contextual spec for every heat pump model. 199 00:21:12,188.6848073 --> 00:21:18,54.9206349 Because essentially once you've chosen a specifically heat pump, then our sort of contingent workflows will change. 200 00:21:18,294.9206349 --> 00:21:32,554.5578231 So fit this pump, right? Or if the homeowner has a question specifically related to this brand, whether it's a Siemens versus Bosch, what we see very much Is that keeping track of all those things and expecting the installers to be able to keep track of all those things, it's simply not realistic. 201 00:21:32,824.5578231 --> 00:21:39,267.0861678 And so what we want to do is basically enable the mass participation of people with the right backgrounds to do this and do this well. 202 00:21:39,317.0861678 --> 00:21:44,634.8412698 But through this augmented quality control system, that delivers on this last mile excellence promise that is our north. 203 00:21:44,906.4852608 --> 00:21:45,566.4852608 Yeah, definitely. 204 00:21:45,566.4852608 --> 00:21:56,671.122449 And that's what you were mentioning keeps a lot of contractors out of this market, right? Is this, inability to, not know how to directly diagnose all the different types and models and things like that? That. 205 00:21:56,671.122449 --> 00:22:03,0.170068 And then the related thing or derived problem from that is predictable unit economics and customer satisfaction. 206 00:22:03,46.9274376 --> 00:22:18,772.2902494 So again if it relates back to this idea of growing the category, of growing the fulfillment base, right? The reason why a lot of people who are technically qualified to carry out this work don't spend more time carrying out this work is because it's simply easier as a contractor to be working on less one. 207 00:22:19,27.2902494 --> 00:22:21,35.5668934 And more larger contracts, right. 208 00:22:21,59.4444444 --> 00:22:32,769.1496599 with a larger volume of work as part of the, a single contract because of the predictability of the unit economics and because of the risk that you'd see taking on something like A home retrofit, right? Or a home energy transition. 209 00:22:33,71.122449 --> 00:22:42,173.7981859 So as soon as you, make the smallest mistake, right? And procuring hardware then that's on you, right? You own that mistake that can, cut something outta your margin as soon as you've spent. 210 00:22:42,178.7981859 --> 00:22:47,469.6031746 Too much time on sales, right? If you've had to revisit the home two, three times, that's taken from the margin. 211 00:22:47,543.2086168 --> 00:22:52,517.4489796 If that homeowner doesn't obviously convert, then that's also taken from your margin on that sale. 212 00:22:52,550.2040816 --> 00:22:58,31.2471655 And then finally, once you are, In the house installing, you're dealing with a homeowner that may be happy, maybe a bit annoyed. 213 00:22:58,31.2471655 --> 00:23:05,301.7006803 It's always a bit anxiety invoking with somebody's is drilling at the core of your house, right? And your energy source very much is the core of the heart of the house. 214 00:23:05,306.7006803 --> 00:23:07,526.7006803 So there's all of that complexity to manage too. 215 00:23:07,556.7006803 --> 00:23:15,968.8095238 And then finally, if installations are not done well, and this is unfortunately true in upwards of 80% of installations, there's some degree of underperformance. 216 00:23:15,968.8095238 --> 00:23:22,49.1269841 The underperformance, again, is either the equipment doesn't fit the house or the equipment actually fits the house, but hasn't calibrate properly to the house. 217 00:23:22,349.1269841 --> 00:23:28,629.1043084 Any number of these things will get you called back on site after an installation, right? Which again, takes out of your margin. 218 00:23:28,676.292517 --> 00:23:29,392.1655329 And all of that. 219 00:23:29,762.1655329 --> 00:23:33,462.1428571 It comes from the margin, but ultimately it's actually added to the price that's added to the consumer. 220 00:23:33,462.1428571 --> 00:23:45,784.9546485 But what we're seeing is so that's what happens at market aggregate, right? The price is added to the consumer, but individually for the installers, it comes from their margin, right? And so for them it is a less attractive way to be spending. 221 00:23:46,59.9546485 --> 00:23:49,564.8526077 Their work time them participating on larger contracts of different sorts. 222 00:23:49,774.8526077 --> 00:24:00,40.9297052 And so what we are trying to do is really provide that predictability at the unit economic level so that we can maximize the install base ci willingness to to participate in this crucial transition. 223 00:24:00,45.9297052 --> 00:24:00,585.9297052 Yeah, definitely. 224 00:24:00,615.9297052 --> 00:24:04,971.7346939 Cause when for a business owner, you can expect, I'm gonna take this time to do this. 225 00:24:05,40.1020408 --> 00:24:17,710.9523809 I know my margin is gonna be this, but when there's all that risk involved about how many times you have to go out or how much time it's gonna take, and like you mentioned, it's gonna cut into that margin when that margin might be, whether or not you're be able to pay for groceries this next week. 226 00:24:17,743.537415 --> 00:24:25,278.2993197 That's important Or be able to pay your workers or pay people that you're, working with or, be able to pay for that next Thing that you need for your business. 227 00:24:25,278.2993197 --> 00:24:26,788.2993197 So that next tool or things like that. 228 00:24:26,788.2993197 --> 00:24:34,686.8027211 So it can be become very nerve-wracking for a business owner to say I can't cut into that margin, so let me take these Sure. 229 00:24:34,686.8027211 --> 00:24:39,516.8027211 Things that I know that I can do well, I know what the margin is gonna be, all that kind of stuff. 230 00:24:39,516.8027211 --> 00:24:41,122.2335601 So yeah, that that's really important. 231 00:24:41,174.7732426 --> 00:24:52,820.3514739 And is the workflow management for each of these, the heat pumps and things like that? is that what you're providing for these installers? Do you also provide like education around this? Yeah, so it's a great question. 232 00:24:52,970.3514739 --> 00:24:59,319.0702948 So we've not yet gone into education, but very much expect to be doing that by I think halfway through 2023. 233 00:24:59,319.0702948 --> 00:25:09,760.2267574 So at the moment the level of education that we do provide is through the standardization of the flows, and it's through education on using and navigating our home energy transition software platform. 234 00:25:09,760.2267574 --> 00:25:16,520.2267574 And so beyond that, we will, I think just like many of the other part, Participating players hoping to make waves in the space. 235 00:25:16,640.2267574 --> 00:25:19,360.2267574 Also be playing our role in upskilling workers. 236 00:25:19,580.2267574 --> 00:25:26,854.2857143 And doing that I think, with strong synergies to the product so that essentially we can point to using these things in a way that creates these good outcome. 237 00:25:26,914.2857143 --> 00:25:29,26.3605442 But we're not today participating actively in training. 238 00:25:29,246.3605442 --> 00:25:31,843.3106576 But but we absolutely think that this is a key part of our future. 239 00:25:31,843.3106576 --> 00:25:32,323.3106576 Definitely. 240 00:25:32,383.3106576 --> 00:25:32,833.3106576 For sure. 241 00:25:32,838.3106576 --> 00:25:39,480.3061224 And I wanted to ask you about this because I read this on your website before and I wanna get it in before we end our interview here today. 242 00:25:39,480.3061224 --> 00:25:44,747.3015873 But you mentioned about paper, so I'd love to hear more about this installation type. 243 00:25:44,752.3015873 --> 00:25:49,127.3015873 We talked a lot about heat pumps today, but installation is super important to you because once. 244 00:25:49,132.3015873 --> 00:25:51,65.861678 Bring the energy in and heat your home. 245 00:25:51,65.861678 --> 00:25:52,985.861678 You gotta make sure that heat stays in the home. 246 00:25:53,5.2154195 --> 00:25:56,263.5714286 Yeah, I'd love to hear you talk about paper wool and insulation yeah, for sure. 247 00:25:56,263.5714286 --> 00:26:00,853.5714286 So we believe very much in this being the one stop shop and being multi-product. 248 00:26:01,133.5714286 --> 00:26:03,921.8027211 And I think to start with a few words on why we do that. 249 00:26:03,951.8027211 --> 00:26:05,362.4603175 And then I'll end on the product side. 250 00:26:05,434.5351474 --> 00:26:28,59.138322 What we see is that increasingly homeowners aren't asking the question, how do I get solar cells on my roof? Or, how do I get a heat pump? Or what installations did I get? What we find that homeowners ask is, how do I lower my monthly energy bill? And what initiatives can I take that are actually, worthwhile that pay for themselves, right? Where the investment isn't just good for the climate, but is also good for people's wallets. 251 00:26:28,59.138322 --> 00:26:36,289.7505669 We have to remember that, home energy is at the heart of not just a climate crisis or a geopolitical crisis, increasingly, but very much also at a cost of living crisis. 252 00:26:36,297.4829932 --> 00:26:37,329.0929705 And we take that mandate. 253 00:26:37,334.0929705 --> 00:26:38,204.0929705 Very seriously at Bo. 254 00:26:38,669.0929705 --> 00:26:42,303.0839002 Cuz we are seeing people heap their homes, right? For bills that are too high and and. 255 00:26:42,308.0839002 --> 00:26:49,602.6643991 So they're asking the question, how do we do something? And then expecting somebody to tell them a series of answers and so that's true on the customer side. 256 00:26:49,602.6643991 --> 00:26:53,16.0770975 It's also true on the installer side, they have multiple skills. 257 00:26:53,16.0770975 --> 00:27:01,594.138322 So typically installation will not be the same group of people as as installing, say, heat pump, solar car charges or the electrification side of home energy transition. 258 00:27:01,696.723356 --> 00:27:06,314.8639456 But the other three all kind of have strong synergies on the installer side or on the contractor side. 259 00:27:06,319.8639456 --> 00:27:09,259.8639456 So contractors are also very interested in being multi-product. 260 00:27:09,364.8639456 --> 00:27:14,388.5147392 And finally because we go to market through institutions and I think we should touch on that at the end of our chat. 261 00:27:14,441.8820862 --> 00:27:28,564.7505669 But they are also asking the question, how do we minimize it, decarbonize our portfolios, and not just how do we deploy more heat pumps or deploy much older? So anyway so that's why we're very passionate and feel strongly about this multi-product approach is to really answer the homeowner's concerns. 262 00:27:28,602.8004535 --> 00:27:30,460.0340136 For decarbonizing their home, in its entirety. 263 00:27:30,490.0340136 --> 00:27:46,949.9773243 Now with regards to installation, Insulation is an amazing product because essentially all of the other categories that we deal with are categories that, obviously generate electricity and solar but for the purpose of it being then used by the heat pump or used by a car charger or used by a washing machine and lights. 264 00:27:46,949.9773243 --> 00:27:55,862.8117914 But so all these other categories, Our, with the exception of solar in a way, but our energy is consuming, right? Your heat pump is a way to generate heat, but consume energy. 265 00:27:55,874.1950113 --> 00:28:06,717.7097506 What we're seeing with insulation is that the potential to lower your heating bill is very substantial, right? We are able to, at the point of sale of the heat pump, actually recommend you a smaller size heat. 266 00:28:07,81.0430839 --> 00:28:11,99.7732426 Provided you are willing to do simple measures with regards to insulation. 267 00:28:11,109.7732426 --> 00:28:30,781.5986394 And what we'll see is that your upfront cost might go up a little bit, but the total cost of ownership go down quite substantially because for every step in size down, you can go on a heat pump that is also a lower monthly electricity bill or, and, or a lower spend that needs to come from the roof in, in the case where you're generating your heat pump electricity through your solar cells. 268 00:28:30,842.0634921 --> 00:28:49,803.5714286 So for us what excites us is really this ability to lower the total cost of ownership of this product by being, again, multi-product by making this recommendation, and again, what we've seen in the market is the lack of ability to provide that clarity or that transparency to the homeowners because these things are traditionally sold multi. 269 00:28:50,368.5827664 --> 00:28:58,3.8662131 You need one vendor for the installation, one for your charger, one for your heat pump, one for your solar, and you're not able to get a click or, toggle on and off. 270 00:28:58,3.8662131 --> 00:28:58,466.7687075 You. 271 00:28:58,516.7687075 --> 00:29:04,186.7687075 How does the total cost of ownership change if I do two out of four recommendations? So four out of four recommendations. 272 00:29:04,186.7687075 --> 00:29:08,577.4263038 So just do one, and so for us, installation becomes super interesting because it becomes a way. 273 00:29:09,61.9954648 --> 00:29:21,309.3764172 Spend a little bit more upfront, but spend substantially less over time while also getting a better home getting better air quality, getting less of a draft inside Feel like you can lean against the wall even on a cold winter's day without getting a sniffle. 274 00:29:21,314.3764172 --> 00:29:22,809.9319728 I think we're excited about insulation. 275 00:29:22,819.9319728 --> 00:29:23,809.9319728 You mentioned paper. 276 00:29:23,814.9319728 --> 00:29:24,79.9319728 Woo. 277 00:29:24,79.9319728 --> 00:29:31,330.7482993 So paper wall is is actually an amazing product where we upcycle used paper rather than use a some of these more industrially heavy. 278 00:29:31,340.7482993 --> 00:29:33,260.7482993 Or industrial from a process point of view. 279 00:29:33,288.5260771 --> 00:29:45,837.8117914 It's substantially more carbon emitting to use things like Rockwell or et cetera, right? So we try to look for also products where the life cycle analysis points to they're being a good fit, but the heat retaining properties are, people are quite good. 280 00:29:45,842.8117914 --> 00:29:46,922.8117914 So we're excited about the product. 281 00:29:46,932.8117914 --> 00:29:47,292.8117914 Yeah. 282 00:29:47,342.8117914 --> 00:29:47,882.8117914 That's awesome. 283 00:29:47,937.8117914 --> 00:29:51,842.8117914 Oh, you wanted to talk about something at the end with Oh, yeah. 284 00:29:51,847.8117914 --> 00:29:52,292.8117914 Distribution for sure. 285 00:29:52,299.4897959 --> 00:29:52,364.4897959 Yeah. 286 00:29:52,384.4897959 --> 00:29:52,624.4897959 Oh yeah. 287 00:29:52,624.4897959 --> 00:29:53,164.4897959 Send that too. 288 00:29:53,169.8185941 --> 00:29:53,289.8185941 Yeah. 289 00:29:53,289.8185941 --> 00:29:55,861.4965986 Should I touch on that or yeah, go ahead, please. 290 00:29:56,71.4965986 --> 00:29:56,551.4965986 Yeah, for sure. 291 00:29:56,565.69161 --> 00:30:10,962.3015873 So when we launched Bil, we had two driving hypothesis, right? The first was, Something new and something major was done in order to drive consumer demand for these products, right? We simply saw that at the awareness level, homeowners weren't aware of the energy potential in home. 292 00:30:10,962.3015873 --> 00:30:15,622.3015873 Something new was done to drive up the market, and the second part was something new was done in order to like deliver. 293 00:30:16,12.3015873 --> 00:30:21,325.4648526 And we've talked a lot about delivery today, but think it might be worth touching a little bit on, driving market demand. 294 00:30:21,385.4648526 --> 00:30:33,287.2222222 Now it should be stated of course, that the tragic situation in Ukraine has, has shifted this equation, right? Demand has gone up substantially, but it is still true that for the majority of homeowners, they're unaware of the energy potential in their homes. 295 00:30:33,581.462585 --> 00:30:38,661.8480726 And that they are unaware of how to go about getting a quote or going from A to Z. 296 00:30:38,701.9727891 --> 00:30:40,51.9727891 And getting these things installed. 297 00:30:40,321.9727891 --> 00:30:56,129.3537415 And so one way that we decided to go to market pretty early on was to go to market through large corporate partners that had an a material interest in reducing at a portfolio level, the carbon emissions in buildings, and particularly in private homes. 298 00:30:56,139.3537415 --> 00:31:03,79.3537415 So one very obvious example of that is our financial institutions are very specifically commercial or consumer. 299 00:31:03,439.3537415 --> 00:31:36,191.4739229 If you are operating a large consumer bank today chances are you've almost certainly made what are known as GFA or Glasgow Financial Alliance fine net zero pledges, right? So pledging with science based target in targets indicators, and this is really important, right? Cause cuz we are expecting to see mechanisms coming out of gfas where if you're not reporting along science based targets, than you can't be in the group, right? They're receiving some pushback at the moment, but I think it's far too soon to be criticizing, right? These pledges were made a year ago, and we're talking about, I think, like 900 trillion worth of, capital committed, right? So let's not expect miracles overnight. 300 00:31:36,191.4739229 --> 00:31:44,871.4739229 What is important is that these institutions have said, look, By 2030, we're cutting our finance emissions by half and by 2050 we want them to go to zero. 301 00:31:44,938.5260771 --> 00:31:47,386.6893424 And if 50% do, that's still the miracle. 302 00:31:47,386.6893424 --> 00:31:49,816.6893424 It'll still be the most important thing to have happen in climate change. 303 00:31:49,816.6893424 --> 00:31:51,736.6893424 So I'd say give chief fans a little break. 304 00:31:51,976.6893424 --> 00:31:52,666.6893424 Let's see how they do. 305 00:31:52,710.5668934 --> 00:31:58,49.7052154 I might be unpopular for that opinion, but that's because I'm an optimist, because I work on the receiving end of this. 306 00:31:58,59.0702948 --> 00:32:00,369.0702948 And the tail end of it, because they've made these pledge. 307 00:32:00,425.1927438 --> 00:32:04,39.7052154 And now they're scrambling these financial institutions to basically make it work. 308 00:32:04,44.7052154 --> 00:32:10,224.7052154 And so what we've been doing is we've been working with banks saying, look, mortgage represents a particularly difficult problem for you. 309 00:32:10,279.7052154 --> 00:32:24,527.6870748 You can hire engineers and do a case by case basis and go, if I finance this production facility, do my finance admissions go up or down? Is there a transition plan? That's something as a bank you're doing a thousand times a year, right? You can manage that maybe 2000 times a year. 310 00:32:24,617.6870748 --> 00:32:25,77.7097506 Real large bank. 311 00:32:25,82.7097506 --> 00:32:31,82.7097506 It is substantially harder to be managing tens of thousands, sometimes hundreds of thousands of homes. 312 00:32:31,82.7097506 --> 00:32:34,541.1678004 And if you are a mortgage lender or a bank that's involved in mortgage or. 313 00:32:34,608.2426304 --> 00:32:44,227.1088435 Or loans for homes in any way, you essentially will own the emissions coming from that house, right? So if there's an oil furnace, if there is a gas earn, then essentially you are on the hook for those emissions. 314 00:32:44,497.1088435 --> 00:32:50,903.3446712 So what we do is we work with banks to say, let's set targets for reducing these finance emissions across your lending portfolios. 315 00:32:51,83.3446712 --> 00:32:55,848.9795918 And then let us provide, this excellent digital experience that you can implement in your. 316 00:32:55,858.9795918 --> 00:32:58,288.9795918 Online web bank that you can implement on your. 317 00:32:59,16.814059 --> 00:33:15,694.4331066 And essentially as soon as you have a homeowner calling you at the moment, you know the height of the cost of living crisis and saying shit, our utility bills are going through the roof, what do we do? You actually have an answer, right? You send them our way and we manage from there the entire process in as quality controlled away as can be done. 318 00:33:15,994.4331066 --> 00:33:18,94.4331066 We're very clear to our partners Mistakes will be. 319 00:33:18,157.8004535 --> 00:33:20,737.8004535 This is a gritty space if you want to get involved in it. 320 00:33:20,907.8004535 --> 00:33:34,104.1836735 You're gonna have a complaint here and there, right? Cause cuz we cannot guarantee perfect execution, but we can guarantee that we take responsibility and that we problem solve at every step of the way, right? And that we are the bank's person in guaranteeing that that things go as well as they can. 321 00:33:34,344.1836735 --> 00:33:35,694.1836735 So let us manage that process. 322 00:33:35,724.1836735 --> 00:33:42,729.4217687 Let us decarbonize every homeowner that you send to us, and just as importantly, let us trace that decarbonization. 323 00:33:43,24.4217687 --> 00:33:43,551.8480726 Back to you. 324 00:33:43,562.1882086 --> 00:33:47,592.1882086 So let us track, let us measure, and let us provide you full transparency. 325 00:33:47,592.1882086 --> 00:33:51,85.7709751 The data so that you can see, the works of their activism. 326 00:33:51,85.7709751 --> 00:34:02,116.4512472 And I think I want to call it that, right? If an employee at a bank is just sending pension, which is essentially what they can be, asked to sell, right? If they have a collaboration with a pension company or insurance, these things are typically what they're asked for. 327 00:34:02,326.4512472 --> 00:34:02,686.4512472 All of a. 328 00:34:03,278.9795918 --> 00:34:09,627.3696145 They're being asked by their managers and we're, aligning these incentives all the way up to senior management level at these banks and making them probably commit. 329 00:34:09,807.3696145 --> 00:34:16,76.7913832 If all of a sudden you're being asked by your employee, no, make leads to bo that energy, they'll decarbonize our local community. 330 00:34:16,81.7913832 --> 00:34:24,453.1746032 It's so much more motivating, right? And for them, it becomes this thing where they can see the two savings in their local community ticking upwards as we decarbonize homes among their portfolio. 331 00:34:25,13.2879819 --> 00:34:28,248.2879819 And so it becomes a form of activism from these large corporations. 332 00:34:28,278.2879819 --> 00:34:34,618.2879819 And so we trace these emissions back and we say, you should show if you're doing well, If you're decarbonizing these finance emissions, then that is a good thing. 333 00:34:34,618.2879819 --> 00:34:36,868.2879819 Now you can't use it as an offset product. 334 00:34:36,868.2879819 --> 00:34:37,918.2879819 We're very clear about that. 335 00:34:37,948.2879819 --> 00:34:42,995.2267574 We don't think the additionality is strong enough but very much they should be able to at least take some pride in. 336 00:34:43,0.2267574 --> 00:34:45,875.2267574 And we're seeing employees in all these institutions take great pride. 337 00:34:46,115.2267574 --> 00:34:53,215.2380952 And yeah, so we're generating thousands of thousands of interested homeowners and and have targets for tens of thousands of of homes converted through through these channel partnerships. 338 00:34:53,215.2380952 --> 00:34:54,835.2380952 Energy companies are another example. 339 00:34:55,105.2380952 --> 00:34:57,655.2380952 We don't think all energy companies should build their own software. 340 00:34:57,713.6281179 --> 00:35:04,222.5283447 We don't think all energy companies should have sophisticated thermal models of homes or manage these complex installer networks. 341 00:35:04,284.5464853 --> 00:35:13,385.3514739 And so what we allow energy companies to do is launch attractive decarbonization offerings for residential gas particularly, but also for the deployment of rooftop solar and charges. 342 00:35:13,390.3514739 --> 00:35:15,400.3514739 To launch these offerings to their customs. 343 00:35:15,710.3514739 --> 00:35:21,957.0975057 And we do these, almost white label, but not quite powered by bodal onboarding flows that our partners are. 344 00:35:21,957.0975057 --> 00:35:26,97.0975057 In their, on their website, embedded in their platforms or through for the API connected. 345 00:35:26,97.0975057 --> 00:35:28,527.0975057 If they wanna own the design of the front end, they can do that too. 346 00:35:28,857.0975057 --> 00:35:33,737.7777778 And then essentially we manage, again, the last mile complexity in the installation networks on their behalf. 347 00:35:33,804.829932 --> 00:35:35,765.170068 And we're seeing this as a super powerful engine. 348 00:35:35,818.5600907 --> 00:35:41,908.4013605 We have partnerships with KPIs at the moment, representing more than a hundred thousand tons of CO2 emissions annually. 349 00:35:41,975.4988662 --> 00:35:45,83.0272109 And for us now, it's really just a task of executing and. 350 00:35:45,216.6099773 --> 00:35:47,106.6326531 Yeah, continually growing the team and just. 351 00:35:47,135.1927438 --> 00:35:50,466.723356 Executing on this future opportunity because the time is now as you will. 352 00:35:50,900.2040816 --> 00:35:51,350.2040816 Yes. 353 00:35:51,350.2040816 --> 00:35:52,40.2040816 Yeah, definitely. 354 00:35:52,40.2040816 --> 00:35:52,730.2040816 The time is now. 355 00:35:52,730.2040816 --> 00:35:57,854.4444444 And that's super exciting that you were able to help these banks who have these goals and they're like, oh. 356 00:35:57,859.4444444 --> 00:36:02,180.1247166 What do I do? How do I make those goals? And then you're saying like, hey, this is an option. 357 00:36:02,192.0748299 --> 00:36:04,894.3650794 Use us as part of your way to reach those goals. 358 00:36:04,961.4285714 --> 00:36:07,547.9138322 And so that's super important to be able to align with them on that. 359 00:36:07,547.9138322 --> 00:36:08,207.9138322 So that's awesome. 360 00:36:08,597.9138322 --> 00:36:18,104.478458 And what are your goals for the next coming months for you guys? Besides executing on that Yeah, so we're currently fundraising to essentially take bil abroad. 361 00:36:18,374.478458 --> 00:36:21,633.5034014 So we expect to launch in two new markets in 2023. 362 00:36:21,700.600907 --> 00:36:25,612.1768707 And at least three within the financing period that we're reasoning for. 363 00:36:25,640.1247166 --> 00:36:29,630.6575964 So a large priority for us at the moment is closing this round that we're currently raising. 364 00:36:29,630.6575964 --> 00:36:32,258.0952381 We expect to do that in January 2023. 365 00:36:32,308.185941 --> 00:36:35,474.7619048 And once, completed we'll be looking to go into two new markets. 366 00:36:35,502.8117914 --> 00:36:42,555.6235828 We're pretty confident the UK will be one of those two markets because we, there see this particular need to help grow the install site which is our mo. 367 00:36:42,583.3560091 --> 00:36:51,215.8956916 And beyond that we're looking very closely at Germany Poland France perhaps the Netherlands as places that could fall under that second country category for our expansion. 368 00:36:51,266.2358277 --> 00:36:52,884.0362812 So that's a high priority for the entire. 369 00:36:53,195.9863946 --> 00:36:57,834.399093 Another thing that we ra focused on is in this home energy management space. 370 00:36:57,839.399093 --> 00:37:07,521.292517 So we've been very successfully testing our digital twin models of homes, right? So at every installation we collect data that we feed our model, gray box model. 371 00:37:07,521.292517 --> 00:37:13,167.9931973 And it enables us to have this, case by case or like home specific view of the thermal properties in. 372 00:37:13,607.9931973 --> 00:37:19,489.8185941 And we use that to make predictive bets on indoor temperature given certain outdoor weather conditions. 373 00:37:19,567.4489796 --> 00:37:23,732.4489796 And essentially we use that to make recommendations for optimal heat curve settings. 374 00:37:23,737.4489796 --> 00:37:29,31.2018141 So the heat curve on the heat pump we believe needs to be actively managed and micro calibrated. 375 00:37:29,201.2018141 --> 00:37:32,997.4829932 And we think it should not be in this today is very much like a summer winter binary. 376 00:37:33,357.4829932 --> 00:37:36,117.4829932 It has a switch and then, and now it's a summer curve. 377 00:37:36,184.5578231 --> 00:37:40,501.2698413 In the winter curve we believe that we should be looking to use 48 hour predictive analytics. 378 00:37:40,540.9977324 --> 00:37:45,600.8730159 And we think that That should be constantly managed, right? And so we've been very successfully testing that system. 379 00:37:45,810.8730159 --> 00:37:57,462.5170068 And now what we want to do to be able to deliver on this promise of true, smart energy or home energy, actively managed, is to connect that also to the inverter for the solar cells, for the car charger and for the battery. 380 00:37:57,732.5170068 --> 00:38:12,351.3945578 And so for us, this is very much the focus now, being able to deliver on that promise by tying these These different energy assets together in a single app managing across energy assets, but also across manufacturers, right? It's very important to say that we are trying to build an open ecosystem. 381 00:38:12,401.0544218 --> 00:38:18,56.3151927 And this again will be one of these ways that we'll see some manufacturers wanting to own that side for themselves. 382 00:38:18,123.4126984 --> 00:38:22,116.4965986 And others that are saying we believe that this is important for the grid. 383 00:38:22,356.4965986 --> 00:38:24,96.4965986 We believe it's important for the climate. 384 00:38:24,96.4965986 --> 00:38:34,666.2358277 And we know that by closing the ecosystem off essentially it becomes the homeowner's hassle, right? Because, they may have one set of solar cells and one inverter and then a heat pump from a different era or a charger from a different brand. 385 00:38:34,666.2358277 --> 00:38:37,181.1337868 And for us it's very important to provide access to as. 386 00:38:37,622.8004535 --> 00:38:39,362.8004535 Produces as possible on the platform. 387 00:38:39,688.9229025 --> 00:38:44,559.8866213 But of course that also means that we have to have these API partnerships with manufacturers. 388 00:38:44,589.5464853 --> 00:38:50,279.4217687 And with some we're finding that is an easy conversation and with others we're finding it's a very challenging conversation. 389 00:38:50,279.4217687 --> 00:38:54,108.8548753 So that will also ultimately affect the availability of products on our platform. 390 00:38:54,125.7823129 --> 00:38:54,925.7823129 Yeah, definitely. 391 00:38:55,315.7823129 --> 00:39:02,632.4489796 And what is one tip that you would give for any computer in the audience listening today? What is one tip that you would give? For growing their Yeah. 392 00:39:02,816.3265306 --> 00:39:06,938.1746032 So I think be radical about fixing market failures across the value chain. 393 00:39:06,990.2947846 --> 00:39:09,295.2947846 I think there's a lot of pressure in. 394 00:39:09,300.6235828 --> 00:39:14,182.9138322 The startup community to have very simple answers for extremely complicated problems. 395 00:39:14,482.9138322 --> 00:39:22,107.1088435 And climate change is extremely complicated, and I think don't let that enticing of saying, we're this one specific thing, get in the way of you solving. 396 00:39:22,854.7845805 --> 00:39:25,568.3900227 Multiple problems for multiple vectors in your value chain. 397 00:39:25,568.3900227 --> 00:39:32,78.3900227 I think that's been core to our success, is seeing for every person participating or that we want to see participating. 398 00:39:32,348.3900227 --> 00:39:36,378.4920635 What is the main barrier? What's the main bottleneck? Experienced by this actor. 399 00:39:36,648.4920635 --> 00:39:44,826.0657596 And how do we address those in an intelligent way? So I would say, be radical about solving market failures and solving problems across the whole value chain. 400 00:39:44,826.0657596 --> 00:39:50,555.1473923 Cause, the kinds of exponential curves that we'll need to see for the deployment of almost all climate technologies. 401 00:39:50,583.1746032 --> 00:39:53,778.6848073 They require you to take a sort of an ecosystems approach. 402 00:39:53,778.6848073 --> 00:39:56,150.0680272 And that's very much been our driving philosophy at Bil. 403 00:39:56,210.5555556 --> 00:39:56,480.5555556 Yeah. 404 00:39:56,610.5555556 --> 00:39:57,25.5555556 That's great. 405 00:39:57,415.5555556 --> 00:40:02,655.5555556 And if anybody wants to reach out to you, learn more about body energy, how can I get in touch? For sure. 406 00:40:02,655.5555556 --> 00:40:05,526.553288 Our name is also a url, so bodal.energy. 407 00:40:05,644.4557823 --> 00:40:14,875.8390023 So that's a good place to start if you're interested in working with us, if you're interested in investing in us, if you're interested in partnering with us in any way or just saying hello, we'd love to hear from you. 408 00:40:14,936.3038549 --> 00:40:16,517.2562358 Then I think reach out to me. 409 00:40:16,517.2562358 --> 00:40:21,283.1179138 My email is Nicholas n i k a s Bodle. 410 00:40:21,887.0294785 --> 00:40:27,509.9886621 For any questions? If you're interested again, in working with us or just hearing what we're about we're really nerdy about this space. 411 00:40:27,509.9886621 --> 00:40:31,994.5578231 We're really excited for other people that are excited and we're seeing it a growing excitement. 412 00:40:31,994.5578231 --> 00:40:39,997.7437642 I was teased at my wedding, that I'd quit a career in kind of management consulting and within sustainability to now become a glorified radiator salesman. 413 00:40:40,75.8843537 --> 00:40:49,306.9274376 And at the time, I was just smiling, but I think very much our thesis has been, pretty well, we're seeing that our hypothesis that these things needed to happen be, become true sooner than we expected. 414 00:40:49,306.9274376 --> 00:40:51,568.6281179 And, and we're seeing a lot of excitement from others. 415 00:40:51,568.6281179 --> 00:40:58,149.1269841 Now in this space, the amount of talent that we're able to attract is night and day relative to when we started, right? We have, tier one ex consultants. 416 00:40:58,149.1269841 --> 00:41:01,989.1269841 We have like data scientists and exceptional developers coming in. 417 00:41:02,23.6621315 --> 00:41:04,743.0725624 We have investment bankers taking an interest in this. 418 00:41:04,748.0725624 --> 00:41:09,558.3333333 We have fintechs that are joining, as investors or as collaborators and finance shares. 419 00:41:09,558.3333333 --> 00:41:13,840.4648526 And it's just There's an extraordinary tailwind right now for anything in the climate space. 420 00:41:13,890.4648526 --> 00:41:18,112.7777778 And yeah, so reach out if you share that excitement that we have for getting this work done. 421 00:41:18,144.2403628 --> 00:41:19,74.2403628 Yeah, definitely. 422 00:41:19,102.9478458 --> 00:41:19,562.9705215 That's great. 423 00:41:19,584.0816327 --> 00:41:22,554.0816327 Thank you so much, Nicholas, for coming on the show today. 424 00:41:22,559.0816327 --> 00:41:27,744.0816327 It's been so awesome having you on talking all about energy efficiency and really all in this space. 425 00:41:27,744.0816327 --> 00:41:29,244.0816327 So thank you so much for coming on the. 426 00:41:29,700.7709751 --> 00:41:30,660.7709751 Thank you for having Billy. 427 00:41:30,660.7709751 --> 00:41:31,763.015873 This was this was a pleasure. 428 00:41:31,768.015873 --> 00:41:38,117.7891156 Thank you for your important work both motivating us creating entrepreneurs, but also enabling us and giving us a platform. 429 00:41:38,137.1315193 --> 00:41:39,108.446712 It's super appreciated. 430 00:41:39,180.521542 --> 00:41:41,14.0816327 It's it's important for the ecosystem, so thank you. 431 00:41:41,31.031746 --> 00:41:42,21.031746 Yeah, definitely. 432 00:41:42,21.031746 --> 00:41:48,602.4716553 And, everybody just needs to hear more about this and easy to know how to support, how we can make this transition that we need to make. 433 00:41:48,607.4716553 --> 00:42:00,37.4716553 And if you enjoyed this interview with Nicholas from Bode Energy about how they're making homes more energy efficient, then I invite you to check out this interview with NextGen Clean Energy Solutions. 434 00:42:00,127.4716553 --> 00:42:06,847.4716553 They consult with small businesses to help them determine what is the best option for them when it comes to this green energy transition. 435 00:42:06,967.4716553 --> 00:42:15,402.4716553 Because whether it is homeowners or small businesses or big businesses, Or governments everywhere, and everyone needs to make this energy transition. 436 00:42:15,432.4716553 --> 00:42:20,52.4716553 So make sure you check out this interview with NextGen Clean Energy Solutions.