Ep 254 - Isaac Weishaupt | Occult Symbolism in Pop Culture - Here For The Truth

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hey, bro, how do I pronounceyour last name?
Sorry, Wise Hop Wise.
And I'll address the name whenwe're doing the hero's Journey part
name, so no worries, Adam.
Yeah, okay.
All right.
Isaac Weishop is a prominentauthor, researcher, and host of the
Occult Symbolism and Popculture podcast since 2014, where

(00:23):
he explores the hiddenmeanings behind pop culture conspiracies
and esoteric philosophy.
With a background inengineering and a deep interest in
the cult systems, Isaacbridges the gap between mainstream
entertainment and the arcaneby decoding the symbols, rituals,
and belief systems woven intofilms, music, and celebrity culture.
He's written several books onIlluminati symbolism, occultism,

(00:45):
secret societies, and the paranormal.
Drawing on a mix of research,intuition, and cultural analysis,
Isaac offers a critical yetaccessible lens on the forces shaping
the modern world from the shadows.
Isaac, welcome to Here for the Truth.
Hey, thanks for having me on here.
I'm here to drop some truthbombs, man.
I'm trying to bring over thattinfoil hat perspective today.

(01:06):
Let's go, bro.
Let's go.
These conversations very muchare connected to our origins of this
podcast as well.
Yeah, so we're excited forthis one, man, for sure.
One way we always like to kickthese conversations off with first
time guests is we want toexplore your personal hero's journey
a little bit.
So like, how did you get here?
What led you down this path?
What were the major rites ofpassage or turning point moments

(01:27):
that kind of catalyzed thisfor you?
So I've, I've, I've.
You're going to cut me off ifI talk too long?
No worries, man.
But, so I was, I was born in79, right.
Just to put my age intoperspective because I think that's
important because I was raisedon 80s and 90s pop culture and that
included.
I've always had an interest inthe paranormal.

(01:50):
Right.
I was really into, you know, XFiles as much as a, you know, 14
year old kid could be into X Files.
And you know, anything wasalien related like, would just grab
my attention and I was alwayssuper interested in these things
and, and I, I don't know wherethat comes from exactly.
I think it was because my, myfather was really into horror movies,

(02:10):
so I just, I just mainlinedall 80s horror movies growing up
and 70s horror movies, youknow that.
So those are kind of my interests.
And I've always been intriguedby the.
I guess like antinomian wouldbe the term you would use.
And I don't, I don't, I didn'tknow that at the time, it was only
when my studies of the occultand Left Hand Path thinking would

(02:33):
come sort of to a realizationfor me is that I was always interested
in the sort of rebelarchetype, the sort of Luciferian
archetype, people, and thatincluded my pop culture interest.
Like, I was always in, like,you know, a lot of people were really
into sort of pop music, and Iwas always really into, you know,

(02:54):
the gangster rap stuff.
And I remember, like, whenBody Count came out and two Live
Crew, and like, at the time,they were really risque, you know,
and I was always drawn rightto whatever.
Whatever the sort ofrebellious thing was.
That was always my.
My draw.
And simultaneously, I grew up with.
My mother would take me to herChurch of the Nazarene.

(03:17):
And I didn't really love it,to be honest.
It wasn't really my.
My thing.
But there was an influence there.
There was a Christianinfluence there which has stuck with
me.
And if you read my first bookI wrote in 2012, that was kind of
my.
My entrance into all of thisalternative thinking is questioning

(03:37):
if things like Christianitywas the right answer.
I don't know.
And I can't.
I can't provide that answerbecause it's so subjective and I
have doubts about a lot ofthings about it.
But ultimately I go back to itand always question, like, is that
because this was sort ofindoctrinated into me as a child?
I mean, what if I was born insome other country where they practice
some other kind of religion?

(03:59):
Like, these are the kinds ofthings that, like, rattle around
my brain all day.
And I don't really have agreat answer for it, but ultimately
I ended up becoming baptizedGreek Orthodox.
Christian.
My Greek Orthodox here.
Oh, hey.
I mean, I was raised.
I'm Greek.
It's my background.
I was raised in the GreekOrthodox Church.
Okay.
I fully 100 follow it thesedays, but yeah.
Oh, it's a Connie's.

(04:19):
Yeah.
That's funny.
My wife's actually the Greek one.
I'm not Greek at all, but she.
She.
You mean.
You mean Weisshoff isn't aGreek last name?
Oh, yeah.
Let me.
Let me.
Let me address the name.
We'll come back to the name.
Let me.
Let me kind of keep going onthe journey and then go to where,
quote unquote, Isaac Weishopcomes to life like Frankenstein's
monster.

(04:40):
Yeah, so.
So yeah, I met my wife.
I was in the military, met mywife, and she was a submarine.
Orthodox.
Right.
She would surface twice a yearfor, you know, Easter.
For Easter.
Yeah, bro.
Yeah.
And so I, I never really lovedthe Church of Nazarene.
No offense, mom, if you'relistening, she knows this because,
like, I hated, I never wantedto go.

(05:01):
And they were like, my mom waslike, well, well, when you turn 16,
you can make that choice for yourself.
The day I turned 16, I waslike, I'm out.
See ya.
Because like, I just couldn'tget along with the people in there.
I don't know what it was.
It's no offense to nondenominational Christians.
It just wasn't my thing.
I didn't like the rock bandchurch thing.
It just felt weird to me.
Felt kind of phony.
I don't know what it was.
So when I met my wife and wedecided to get married, she was like,

(05:23):
well, I'd like to do it in theOrthodox church.
I was like, all right, cool.
So I meet with the priest.
I said some unknowing to me,some heretical things about the communion,
not knowing anything about theOrthodox faith.
And I didn't know whattransubstantiation meant.
And I.
We got into a sort of argumentat the church there because he asked
me about the blood and body of Christ.
And I was like, well, I knowit's not really blood, it's not really

(05:44):
body.
And he was like pretty upsetabout that because he's like, well,
we transubstantiated.
That's literally what we, whatwe are consuming.
And I, and I didn't get that.
So I go through catechism andI was really hardcore about orthodoxy
from like 2003 to around 2000,maybe 17 or 18.
And I didn't like fall awayfrom the church or nothing.
I just kind of stopped goingas much, you know.

(06:05):
You know, life just startscatching up with you.
You start sleeping in onSunday and then next thing you know
you're like, I don't know howI Woke up at 8 in the morning to
go to church every Sunday.
And dude, I was 15 years,perfect attendance, Sunday school.
Growing up in Jersey.
My mom would like break likeknock on our doors, my brother and
me, every Sunday morning, wakeus up head there.
I was an altar boy.
I was super involved growing up.
And then of course I move awayto go to college and.

(06:28):
And I was like, I'm sleepingin, I'm partying and all that.
So anyways, I just wanted to.
It's hard, right?
Where, where.
If you don't mind sharing,where did you live in Jersey?
I'm from.
I'm from Lancaster, Penn.
Allentown, Penns.
Oh yeah.
I lived in Northern Jersey.
I was in.
I went to St. George GreekOrthodox Church in Clifton, New Jersey.
I grew up in Wayne.
I grew up in Wayne.
Yeah.
Oh, okay.
Yeah, I've been down to.
Because my dad's family isfrom South Jersey, so I've been to

(06:50):
the Orthodox church in.
I think it was in Cape May.
I forget the name of it.
Anyway.
There's a lot of Greekparishes in Jersey.
Anyways.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, I was the.
I was the Luca mother chef foralmost 20 years in my.
The Greek festivals.
Yeah, for the festivals.
Yeah.
Oh, dude.
Dude.
We just moved my mom out herefrom Jersey because my dad passed
away last year.

(07:10):
I live in.
I live in California.
And we took her to the SouthBay Greek Festival.
Dude.
And we ate some lucamadas.
Oh, nice.
Yeah, it tastes good.
Boy, cooking them up is a real nightmare.
It's so hot.
For sure.
So.
So, yeah.
So like, like the faithbackground is part of the journey.
And when what, what hadhappened was I started college.

(07:31):
I got out of the military.
I started college around 2003.
And I was going to school for engineering.
And the only reason for thatwas because I was good at math.
And my uncle was an electricalengineer since, like the freaking
70s.
And he was loaded.
He was the only person I knewwith money.
My whole family, everyone elsewas broke, right?
And I, I was like, I don'twant to be broke anymore.
How do I not be broke?
And I was like, well, myuncle's an engineer.
I'm going to do what he did.
So I went to school forengineering and I had like a two

(07:54):
year period between undergradand grad school.
So I.
And you know, you get.
You go to college.
And I was working full time,going to college full time.
And I was just in a habit ofresearch and regurgitation.
And when you do that, for sixyears, my mind was conditioned right
at this point.
So I finally get done withschool and I'm like, I got all this

(08:16):
free time and I'm like, well,what, I'm gonna sit here and just
like, play video games?
Like, no, I got.
I. I was addicted to learning.
So I started the blogilluminati watcher.com and the purpose
of it, originally, theoriginal vision was I was inspired
by.
There's a website calledBloody Disgusting.com that does horror
movie stuff.
And it's like a mix of horrormovies with action figures with,

(08:38):
you know, television shows.
It's like a variety of things.
And that was like, theoriginal vision was to talk About
a variety of things, including.
And I'm.
I'm going to be careful withthe words I use.
Because you're putting this onYouTube, right?
Yeah, I mean, we have a newYouTube channel.
We were deleted off of YouTubeyears ago with our first channel.
Oh, well, you're about to get.
You might get this one.
Torch.
I'll be careful with my words.
I use.
I'll use the.

(08:59):
The YouTube Safe for Worklanguage here.
But part of the blog was toinvestigate, you know, theories of
alternative thought.
Right.
Particularly like David Icke.
I was really into David Ickeat the time, and that was the most
popular post I would make.
So I started focusing in on it.

(09:20):
2012.
I decided, hey, I wrote athesis that was, you know, 100 some
pages.
I could write a book.
So I write a grand unifiedconspiracy theory.
I just said the naughty word.
Sorry.
You're good, right?
You're good.
So I think we're okay with that.
Okay.
So I, I write the first book.
And that was like the crux ofthe first book was me saying, I like

(09:40):
all of these.
I consume a lot of contentabout people presenting different
theories about things.
What I didn't like was howoftentimes they go down this realm
of this sort of spiritualityand how it's.
It's a.
It's either pro Christian orit's pro New age.
And at the time I was like,well, I don't want your sort of spiritual
bias to come into this.
I just want to know the truth.

(10:01):
Yeah.
And that was my original aimand intent.
I didn't realize, though, atthe time.
It took me years of researchto realize that it is a spiritual
thing.
That's like the main guidingprinciple behind all this.
And it takes you into thisstudy of what they call the occult
or the hidden, and you findout that it really is all about these

(10:23):
ideas of spirituality andChristianity, in a sense.
And let me go back two steps here.
So when I started the blog, Ihad a post about.
I think it was something sillyabout a. I was watching Storage wars
on Africa channel and I.
There was some theory aboutsomething on there.
I don't remember what.
And I posted on there and showout of Tulsa, Oklahoma, reached out

(10:46):
to me and they're like, hey,we want to interview you for our
radio show.
I was like, what?
Because I was just blogging,you know.
No, I didn't have a followingor anything.
I said, okay.
And they're like, well, what'syour name?
And I. I didn't want to tellmy real name.
So I came up with the monikerIsaac Weishop as a play on the initials
of Illuminati watcher, the Iand the W. Right.

(11:06):
So Isaac Weishop, you know,and Weishop is the name of the Bavarian
Illuminati founder Adam Weishop.
So it's a terrible pseudonym.
No one knows how to spelleither, either first or last name.
So in hindsight I shouldn'thave chose that one.
But hey, here we are.
So I've, I've been on thatjourney since basically 2011, full

(11:26):
time of.
I've written nine books.
I've been podcasting since2014 and it's taken me on a lot of
crazy adventures and you know,the hero's journey aspect of it,
I guess if there was one.
There's been some really darkencounters and a lot of strange connections

(11:49):
I've made over the years doing this.
And, and it's, it's weird, right?
It's weird to sit here in 2025because in 2020 everything changed
in the podcast realm,especially in the sort of truther
realm, and a lot of peoplestarted getting really sort of fervent
about these things and a lotof interests were devoted to this

(12:13):
school of thought and we'vehad a lot of new people show up and
in my personal opinion, youknow, and I'm a paranoid guy, so
like, let's get that rightoff, off the bat.
I'm a paranoid guy.
I don't really trust anybody.
There's some people I've beenworking with since 2011 that I trust
fully, you know, like JayDyer, you know, also Greek or not

(12:34):
Greek Orthodox, but he's Orthodox.
I don't know if he's Greek Orthodox.
But yeah, I might have seenthat on, on like his post or something
Instagram once.
Yeah, yeah, he's Orthodox for sure.
He's an ortho bro, like me, I guess.
But like, and, and we don't,and to be fair, like, I don't agree.
My, my place in this trutharound is like, I don't agree with
everything every truther says.
I really don't.
I, I am totally not on boardwith everything they say.

(12:57):
Like, I'm very anti Q. I thinkthat's a big psyop from the get go.
There's a lot of things wecould go down the list and most of
it's like too, too hot forYouTube, but, but there's a lot of
people I trust whether I agreewith them or not.
That's, you know, people likeJay Dyer and Greg Carwood and Sam
Tripoli.
Like, these guys I've knownfor, since before 2020, and they're

(13:19):
all good people and I trust them.
And then that's not to say Idon't trust anyone that came around
after, but there's a lot ofpeople that I suspect are part of
a attempt to create a newmainstream media and alternative
stream media.
And you see it, you know, whenyou're in this sort of business,
you see it when, you know,some people get.
For whatever reason, they'reallowed to accumulate a giant following

(13:40):
and not get banned, eventhough they're saying the certain
terms and words that I, youknow, I've been banned off YouTube
three times.
I've been banned off of Vimeo,which I was paying Vimeo.
I've been banned off everything.
I've got a. I've got a sob,sob story on my website, on the Start
Here page.
But I just face constantbattles and I, I try to differentiate
myself from the rest of thetruth or community in the sense that

(14:03):
not the rest of that soundslike I'm throwing shots.
I, I try to be the guy whoinserts some form of rational normie
point of view into this stuffbecause a lot of people that get
into this and, And I wasthere, too.
I was very overzealous at the beginning.
Every, every celebritycovering one eye, I was like, oh,
my God, they're in theIlluminati and they worship the devil,
you know, and, and there'selements of that that could hold

(14:25):
some truth or it's at leastworth peeling back.
But I've sort of found that alot of that becomes sort of.
What do you call it?
It's kind of like when.
Well, I can't use the term Iwant to use, but they're like, people
like, they get off on.
On just like, pat themselveson the back with, like, their own

(14:45):
point of view.
They're like, well, see,that's why Christ is the best.
And again, like, I'm a Christian.
I, I'm on board with all this.
Like, I'm definitely aChristian, but I think some people,
they find these things andthey like to make a boogeyman out
of these celebrities.
And I'm like, I don't know ifit's that simple.
I don't, I really don't thinkit's that simple.
I think there's a lot ofstrange things happening behind the
scenes that we don't know about.
And the more I learn aboutthese occult belief systems and religions

(15:10):
and secret societies, it'sclear that they're Using these celebrities
on some level.
And I think some celebritiesknow about and some don't.
And.
Yeah, I think.
Yeah, that's the thing theretoo, is because it's like they're
down the line very often.
So, like, just because you seea hundred celebrities, you know,
in a mashup montage with theirhands over their eye doesn't mean
they're like, listen, I thinkI want to put my right hand over

(15:32):
my right eye so I could.
I could tell everyone whatgroup I'm a part of.
Like, you know, like, you havean ad agency and you go up and then
all of a sudden there's aphotographer and.
Anyways.
Yeah, yeah.
And some of those.
And what's making it even moredifficult today is with AI, you can.
Because there's.
There's a famous montage, I'msure you're alluding to, of a lot
of black and white images of,like, just dozens of celebrities

(15:54):
doing the same thing coveringone eye.
Yeah.
And I suspect, like, just bylooking at them, you know, years
ago, it looks like a lot ofthem aren't natural.
Like, they look very much likesomeone photoshopped that angle.
Some of them are real, though.
So I don't know it.
I don't discount the thing.
I'm not like, oh, if youbelieve that, you're stupid.
I just think that I justbecome very.

(16:15):
It can become very black andwhite people.
People enter this world, and Ithink, you know, complex thinking
is something that most peopleare lazy to kind of engage in.
So they discover one thing,they pull one thread, and all of
a sudden, anything connectedto Hollywood, anything connected
to celebrity culture, anythingthat's received a level of popularity,
fame, wealth, just falls intothis basket.
I think it's just a symptom oflazy thinking, you know, whereas

(16:37):
there's nuance each.
Things are a case by casebasis, in my view.
Yeah.
And.
And things got really weirdbecause back in the day in 2014,
I.
You know, when you podcastedback then, you had to pay a host.
So I was paying a host.
I remember there was alistener of mine, or someone who
read my blog, I should say,and he was pushing me to do a podcast.
I had a couple friends whowere like, yeah, we should podcast,

(16:58):
like Joe Rogan.
And I was like, I don't know, dude.
And at the time I was doingYouTube videos, so I thought, all
right, well, I mean, it's notthat big of a jump.
I'll just do it.
And I was paying.
Like, I don't remember.
It was like 20 bucks a monthto have this hosting, but that's
a totally different game.
Like today, now you can makebig dollars on it.
And I. I think that that makesit more enticing to be more sensational

(17:19):
and that, you know, like,you're gonna make more money by doing
certain things, beingsensational and sort of like saying
obscene, crude, demeaningthings about people or going heavy
into one side of the politicalspectrum, either left or the right.
But that's where all themoney's at.

(17:40):
And, like, I.
That's just not me in my real life.
That's not how I want to makemy money, and that's not how I want
to earn a living.
And I, like, I'd rather sleepat night.
And I always say, because, youknow, and thank goodness I've got
a background in engineeringand program management because, like,
that's my.
I always say, like, that's the thing.
Working a dreaded day job isthe thing that makes my show.

(18:01):
I could be more authentic withhow I want to present my stuff because
there is temptation to, youknow, kind of be sensational about
things.
Because, I mean, look at AlexJones, right?
Like, that's the way.
That's the way he rolls.
It's like he's like,everything's an emergent emergency
broadcast.
And it's like, oh, my gosh,dude, like, my heart.
That's a pretty good impression.

(18:22):
Thanks.
Yeah, I. I've done a coupleAlex impersonations on my show, so
I've been working on it.
You got.
You got to have that real gravity.
It was like, folks, folks,listen up.
You know, he's always poundingon the desk.
That's like, the point, right?
But, yeah, I hear what you'resaying, man.
Like, polarization isextremely engaging.
And now there's all thesedifferent incentives and avenues
to make lots of dollars byhaving more engagement, by having

(18:44):
more clicks, even through X.
People are making massive bankon X just by sticking to extreme
narratives.
Because it continues this viewcount, you know?
Yeah, I've seen it too.
Like, people using, like,offensive language about stuff, and
I'm just like, oh, I just.
I just couldn't do it, man.
I'd rather go.
I'd rather just quit it andjust work overtime at the dreaded
day job than.
Than sit here and like, bro,you're Greek Orthodox.

(19:05):
You gotta have some class, bro.
You know what I mean?
Yeah, that's right.
Yeah, you got it.
You know it.
Yeah, so.
So, like, I try to live bythat, and then on top of that, I've
got a Great wife who, like,keeps me in line because it's not
like I'm not.
Sometimes I can go down thatrabbit hole, and I'm kind of nutty.
Right.
Like, in 2020, things werecrazy and, like.

(19:25):
Anyway, yeah, I don't talkabout certain things on here, but
you know.
You know what happened backthen, and, like.
Yeah, yeah, we've had thingson it.
Yeah.
Yeah, things were really diceyback then, but, yeah, so.
So, yeah, the hero's journey is.
Oh, yeah.
I was.
I was trying to tell you therewas, like.
There's been a lot of strangeinteractions I've had with, like,

(19:48):
some famous people.
And, like, I got to.
I got to do Dave Navarro showtwice back in, like, 2016.
And it was just weird to mebecause it's like sometimes these.
These celebrities, like,they're really into this sort of
stuff, and I.
And I don't think it's justbecause they like truth or things.
Like, sometimes I thinkthere's something they know about
what goes on behind thescenes, and they're trying to understand

(20:10):
it some more.
Yeah.
And there was some other,like, really crazy stuff that had
happened in my past of doingthis stuff, real close calls with,
you know, like, I was.
I was.
I was friends with Max Spearsbefore he passed away, and that was,
like, a whole weird situation there.
And I don't know.
There's a lot of weird stuff, man.

(20:30):
And it's.
What I'm saying is there'senough weird stuff going on that
I believe wholeheartedlythere's something behind the scenes.
There's something hidden,there's something occult going on
with the power brokers ofsociety, mainstream media, the Hollywood.
And I'm certainly not sayingevery single one is guilty.
I'm just saying that behindthis all, there's something going

(20:52):
on.
And.
And I think that a lot ofpeople are waking up to that stuff.
When you see, you know,certain things happening, like the
whole Diddy trial, who, youknow, now he's gonna get off, and.
And the whole Epstein thing,like, there's a lot of weird things
going on.
You're like, this doesn't add up.
And.
And it's because there's some.
There's like, two versions ofreality happening.
And that's where you get intosort of some of these ideas that

(21:15):
I. I focus on with my show ofoccult systems of ritual, magic,
and manifesting realities andthings like that.
Yeah.
What do you.
What do you think?
Real briefly, just like, withthe whole Diddy thing, like, you
think they'd want maybesomeone to take the fall.
I feel like some things theylike, they kind of give people a
bone, you know, they justthrow it out there.
Oh, look, this bad person,we're going to put them in prison.

(21:35):
But like it just seems likethat just kind of has gone away and.
Yeah, yeah, there's, there's.
You know, it's interestingbecause he was such a central figure
in the legacy of hip hop.
You know, I grew up listeningto hip hop.
My second book was calledSacrifice Magic behind the Mic.
And I talked about these exactSubjects back in 2013 or 14 or whatever

(21:56):
year it was.
And the whole Diddy thing isstrange because when you unpack,
because I did several shows on Diddy.
I did like a four hour deepdive on the history of Diddy.
I mean, he goes and, and wecan talk about the ideas of like
ritual sacrifices and howthat's sort of a.
An element of energy focus inthe occult.

(22:19):
And that's where Diddy got hisstart, right?
Is with a little bit of like ablood sacrifice thing because he
was running basketball tournaments.
And one, he oversold thetickets for this basketball tournament
with.
I think it was with Def Jam ornot Def Jam, who was Heavy D signed
under.
Was it Heavy D?
I don't remember.
It doesn't matter.
Anyway, he.

(22:40):
He oversold tickets and therewas a stampede and a bunch of people
died of this basketball tournament.
And it didn't, it didn't evenslow him down.
Like he just got way morefamous after that.
Which, you know, you couldargue what you want about that, but
there is an element ofSaturnian ritual sacrifice.
And I think that Diddy is.
When you read through thecourt documents specifically, the

(23:00):
most interesting one is LilRod, the music producer that, that
sued him right after Cassiesued him.
He, he lays it out like a dang truther.
He's saying, look, he'sDiddy's running Epstein operations
with blackmailed videotapesand he's paying off cops and he's

(23:20):
doing hits on people andthere's trafficking going on and,
and he even names, names themost powerful man in all of music,
Lucian Grange.
He names him specifically inthe documents.
He also names a. I can't thinkof her name.
Oh man, I can think of her name.
Anyways, he names a.
A woman who's very prominentin the.

(23:43):
As an eight who runs an agencyfor massive Hollywood stars like
Brittany Lou Taylor.
Lou Taylor.
And Robin Greenfield.
He names, I believe, RobinGreenfield who's like, kind of works
with Lou Taylor.
He names her specifically.
And, and these are huge namesin the music industry.
And then you also add in thefact that little Rod says he was
basically abused or subjectedto certain amounts of trauma, I should

(24:08):
say, by, you know, famous people.
Cuban Gooding Jr. Is named inthe document.
There's a photo of him andKiwi Gooding Jr. And, and the.
There's a bunch of.
Obviously bunch of celebritiesand rappers that did he's affiliated
with that hang out with him.
Like Jay Z's his best friend.
And you know that.

(24:29):
And you hear all the people,all these video clips of people talking
about going to these Diddy parties.
Ashton Kutcher.
Who him and Mila Kunis recently.
Oh, yeah.
LeBron James.
Yeah.
Kevin Hart.
Jamie Foxx, who was hisvideographer since the 90s.
There's videotapes of him, youknow, run around the video camera
talking about how wild theseparties are.
And everyone's either beingreal quiet and not saying a word

(24:52):
or they're trying to, like,distance themselves.
Like how Jamie Foxx had thatcomedy stand up that he did on Netflix
where the whole thing was.
It wasn't even funny.
And it seemed like there wasonly one main message that I got
from it and that was himtrying to distance himself from Diddy.
He was saying that, you know,he never saw any of this stuff at

(25:13):
the parties.
And.
But then he also comparesDiddy to the devil.
So I don't know what JamieFoxx's role is, but in the 90s, it
was all good because he wasbest friends with him and filming
the parties.
But then he had that in thatthing where he had that medical emergency
and slipped into the coma orwhatever it was, and he allegedly

(25:34):
was.
One of the allegations goingaround was that Diddy had something
to do with it.
But he comes out and he says,no, nothing to do with that.
And in fact, I don't.
I never hung out of those parties.
And I was.
It's just weird.
The whole thing is bizarre.
What.
What role?
I know there's a lot ofconjecture, but what role do you
think Diddy played in Tupac's death?
Yeah, so, you know, I think.

(25:55):
I think it's like official,sort of like in the court convicted
with Keith Keefe D or whateverhis name is, that he claimed that
Diddy paid him off or I guesshanded him the money to hand to the
guy who put a head out on Tupac.
And there's all these, youknow, allegations of him, like doing
it to Big as well.

(26:16):
There's a lot of strange stuff.
And then you look at all thedeaths around Diddy with Kim Porter,
his own, you know, baby mamawho died from a weird pneumonia when
she was, like, very fit andshe was in her 40s.
And then Brittany Murphy, whowas dating Ashton Kutcher, dies from
pneumonia very.
You know, you could argue thatshe was.
I think they're saying she wasbulimic or something, but she was

(26:37):
relatively fit in her 40s.
Like, it's not.
It's.
Anyway, and then her husband, also.
I forget his name.
He.
He again died from pneumoniain his.
In his 40s or 50s, maybe.
And then the thing that makesit weird, when you get into the realm
of the occult, you startpeeling back some of these weird
metaphysical things and youfind out stuff like how Britney Murphy

(26:59):
lived in the same house thatBritney Spears had lived in.
And Britney Spears was talkingabout how she saw these, like, dark
spirits in there, and that'sthe reason she left the house.
So are we.
Are they messing with.
With forces?
You could argue that, becausethere's a thing called the Faustian
bargain where, you know, yousell your soul for fame and fortune.

(27:19):
And you see this constantly referenced.
You see.
And over the years, I've readmany books of celebrities that have
talked about this exact thing happening.
Dave Grohl from Foo Fightersliterally says that he sold his soul
in the mirror to be famous inhis autobiography.
Same goes for Roseanne Barr.
She wrote a book and shetalked about how she sold her soul

(27:40):
to the devil to be famous.
And then later, she was buggedout by it.
So she talks to her Kabbalahpriest, which, you know, Kabbalah
is one of these occultreligion systems that Ashton Kutcher
and Mila Kunis that, you know,they wear the red string bracelet.
That's.
That's how, you know they'reinto Kabbalah.
Tucker Carlson, same thing.
But they.
She talked to this Kabbalahpriest and was like, hey, like, do

(28:02):
I really gotta give the devilmy soul?
And the Kabbalah priest, like,no, that's all nonsense.
You're good.
Don't even worry about it.
And she kind of was like, oh,okay, cool.
I guess I'm good now.
And so did Matthew Perry.
Same thing.
Said the same thing.
Like, it's just weird, likehow I just.
I. I refuse to believe thatthis is just people saying stuff

(28:23):
to be sensational or to havesome kind of interesting backstory.
Which it.
I mean, it could be, right?
It could be.
But it goes back to RobertJohnson, who was the.
The guy who learned how toplay the blues, right?
Selling assault, thecrossroads to the devil.
And he had musician friends that.
That said, yeah, this guycouldn't play a lick.
And then he sold us all at the crossroads.

(28:45):
And now he's like thisprominent musician, blues musician.
And then, you know, you getinto Led Zeppelin, and, you know,
it's just like, I could go allday like a nutty person.
When I was.
When I was like 12, 13 yearsold, playing Stay With a Heaven backwards
creeped me the freaking hell out.
Oh, yeah, man.
That, like, they, like.

(29:05):
That's so intentional, youknow, like, coding that message in
there.
Yeah, Led Zeppelin's fat.
I. I'm a pretty big LedZeppelin fan.
And the.
You know, Jimmy Page was intoAleister Crowley, the.
The world's wickedest man there.
He's.
He's kind of the.
The biggest boogeyman of theoccult, if you guys are familiar
with him.
But, you know, Robert Plant, he.

(29:26):
He went and retrieved dirtfrom the crossroads where Robert
Johnson sold his salsa.
He was into this too.
And his.
His mother was a gypsy, solike, they had a sort of alternative
sort of upbringing.
But Jimmy Page also owned,like, a bookstore of occult literature.
He's super into AleisterCrowley to the point where he purchased

(29:46):
the.
The Bull Skin Estate, where.
In the Loch Ness in Scotland,where Crowley was doing rituals and
summoning entities.
Supposedly this was earlier onin his career as a magician, and
he wasn't really good atfinishing the rituals, so that there
were supposedly all these sortof spirits on the.
On the grounds there.

(30:06):
And Jimmy Page saw a floatinghead while he was there.
And the Bowl Skin recentlyburned down just a few years ago,
and someone rebuilt it.
But yeah, you know, and thatalso ties into Loch Ness and makes
you wonder, like, oh, all thattalk about seeing creatures of the
Loch Ness, like, maybe thatwas just some kind of entity that
Crowley summoned in.
Into existence.
And it's, you know, in thelake there.

(30:29):
Who knows, man?
Listen, there's so manyavenues we can go down, especially
from a, like a music Hollywood standpoint.
But I know one of the thingswe wanted to kind of dive into is
like, your thoughts and yourviews on the whole Kobe.
Kobe Bryant situation thathappened back in.
Was that 2020 now?
Yeah, 2020.
I can't believe it's been likefive and a half years and then potentially

(30:52):
your thoughts on even thehome, you know, Michael.
Michael Jordan's father beingmurdered and things of that nature.
So, full disclosure, I'm notreally into the sports ball, right?
So I never seen Kobe Bryantplay a game in my life.
I. I have.
I. I was really into allSports until I turned about 16, so
we're talking like 95.

(31:14):
So I was huge into MichaelJordan, you know, back when they
were dominating basketball.
But after that, I, you know, Idon't know what happened.
It's not like I'm anti sports.
I just kind of moved on.
And, you know, 10 years blowsby now you don't know anyone who's
playing.
So I just last year startedwatching NFL again.
So, you know, I'm really intofootball right now.
But the.
So full disclosure, I don'tknow much about Kobe Bryant besides

(31:37):
what I researched.
Obviously, he's one of thegreatest, if not like the greatest
basketball player of all time,which is, you know, quite an accomplishment.
And so when he died In Januaryof 2020, as everyone knows, he was
in a helicopter, that the.
The fog was too thick, and they.
They.
They ran into the side of a.

(31:58):
A hill or a mountain orwhatever in Calabasas, very close
to where I am.
Oh, okay.
Yeah, I. I love Southern California.
So that's.
Yeah, that's.
That's also part of this whole thing.
Like, people talk about the.
The city of angels, and, like,a lot of people get into this whole
thing of it's a city of fallenangels and there's a lot of, like,
demonic forces and howHollywood is a reference to ritual

(32:22):
magic.
It's.
It's.
It's a term about a.
The holly stick.
Yeah.
Being the most magical, mostmagical wood that you can make a
wand out of.
But anyway, the.
What's interesting is there'sa lot of.
A lot of theories about whathappened here, and I guess we can
kind of go through them alittle bit here.

(32:42):
So the first one.
Well, the first one was like, the.
The debris of the crash, Iguess the helicopter was black and
the debris was blue and whiteis like one of the early theories
that I saw, which at the time,I didn't think a whole.
I didn't invest a lot ofenergy into the theory about the,

(33:04):
you know, the one country thathas the same colors for their flag,
because I found.
I just.
I just.
I don't know.
I always feel like thatthere's like a weird kind of vibe
to that whole theory that I'mlike, I don't know if I want to associate
with that.
There's enough people thattalk about those things.
I'll let them do it.
But let's stick to, like, the,like, things that are, you know,
the.
Maybe the most rational potentially.

(33:25):
Okay.
Okay.
So if you look at the.
The ideas of predictiveprogram, because a lot of people
talk about how in Hollywoodand entertainment there will be examples
of things that happen on showsor movies before they actually happen
in real life.
And there's a few reasons whythey think that happens.

(33:47):
One is like a karmicretribution thing.
Another is to sort of preparethe mind to understand what's going
to happen.
That's a lot of theories aboutlike, 911 when you see, you know,
the Simpsons had a thing ofthe twin towers.
There was a record that hadthe tin towers blown up.
Biggie had a line aboutblowing up the World Trade Center.

(34:08):
Did you see the Back to theFuture video that says it predicts
911 too?
Have you seen that one?
That's pretty fun.
Yeah, yeah, that one's good.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I did an episode about Back tothe future forever ago in regards
to that.
Because.
Because it goes from the.
The Twin Pines Mall to thelike the Lone Pine Mall or whatever
it is, like from two into one,which is very.
Which is a very occult thing.

(34:28):
And.
And there's also some weirdstuff in that movie.
If you.
Do you remember if you watchBack to the Future in the marquee,
they're living in this littlewholesome, you know, 50s town.
And in the marquee to themovie theater next to the ice cream
shop, it's like.
It's got like movie titles of smut.
Did you ever notice that?
I know.
Not that one.

(34:49):
It's.
It's wild.
Yeah.
Look at that.
It's crazy.
And you're like, why did theyput that on there?
Anyway?
Well, we'll stick with Back to Kobe.
Kobe.
So.
So this idea of predictiveprogramming and Kobe had said he
wanted to die young, which isalways an alarming thing.
That.
That was per an interview DJVlad had with, I think Nick Cannon.

(35:12):
He said that.
And the idea is that there'spower in the spoken word.
There's power of manifestingreality, maybe even on a subconscious
level.
So when people say that kindof stuff, I think it does hold a
certain amount of power.
And what's interesting is thatKobe Bryant believed in magical thinking,
which we'll talk about here ina second.

(35:33):
But for him to say he wantedto die young, it reminded me of Ke$ha,
the artist who.
She had that very famous songDie young.
Right.
And it was number one on the.
On the.
On the charts.
When an event happened up in Connecticut.
I'm not gonna say the term on here.
Yeah.
But you know what I'm talkingabout, where bad things happen to

(35:56):
a bunch of kids.
And they took that song Down.
And that's understandable.
Right.
But then Kesha come out andsaid, I never wanted to sing that
song.
I was against singing it.
I didn't even like those lyrics.
And they made me.
They forced me to sing thissong, which I thought was really

(36:18):
weird.
And then.
Then she later has this wholeweird fallout with Dr. Luke, her
producer, and she had thiswhole vendetta against the music
industry because of, like,some horrible things that happened
to her.
Yeah.
Weird, weird stuff thathappens sometimes on the sort of
subconscious level.
That's kind of the mostrational part.
Then you've got the fact thatKobe had made a pact to never fly

(36:42):
in a helicopter with his wife,which is.
I mean, I guess it's kind of understandable.
It's also pretty rationalbecause you're like, yeah, because
if it goes down and you don'twant your kids to have no parents.
So, like, I kind of get that one.
Still kind of strange.
But then it gets weirderbecause there was a cartoon on Comedy
Central called Legend ofChamberlain Heights.
Yeah.
And there was an episode in2016 called End of Days, which is

(37:04):
a curious title.
And there's a scene where ahelicopter with Kobe inside of it
crashes.
Kobe goes to crawl out of it,and then the helicopter explodes
and kills him, and his NBAchampionship rings roll off.
And these kids pick it up andthey say, oh, these are shacks anyway,
which, you know, obviouslyreferring to the basketball player

(37:26):
Shaq.
And on one level, you think this.
This is just like a dissagainst Kobe, I guess, and saying
that, like, you know, Shaqpulled the weight of the team or
whatever.
But to me, I look at thatbecause Shaq's a very prominent Freemason,
and I think, well, that's kindof strange.
Like, are they saying, like,this is going to happen and Shaq
is going to have something todo with it?

(37:47):
No idea.
These are just speculation.
Yeah.
I mean, the odds of being soin the nose with a helicopter crash.
Curious.
Very weird, right?
Very weird.
And.
And from here, like, if forpeople who are looking for a reason,
if they're like, you have a.
Why.
Why would they do that?
How would they know that?
You have to understand how theoccult works and how they think and

(38:08):
they believe in hermeticprinciples, which is.
Well, we can come back to that.
Let me.
Let me put a pin in that.
We can talk hermeticprinciples later if we get down into
it.
But this was also the morning of.
The 6, the 62nd, the Grammyswhen it happened, which, again, is
a very interesting ritualisticdate city.

(38:30):
2.
6/2 is 8.
Kobe famously wore number 8for half of his career.
Yeah, he.
Yeah, that whole thing withthe numerology of Kobe is also fascinating
because in high school, he wasnumber 33, which is a super occulted
number because 33 is the ageof Christ.
33 is Christ when he, youknow, died and resurrected.

(38:52):
And then 33 is also thehighest point of the Scottish rite
of Freemasonry, which is likespeculative Freemasonry.
And they do initiationrituals, and you can.
You can progress up to the32nd degree, but only those who make
it to 33 have been invitedinto it.
So it's very much a.
A boys club of, like, who canhold the secrets.
Who.

(39:12):
Who's like, in the boys club.
So his high school jersey was 33.
Yeah.
And 33 basically representsman turning into a God, or apotheosis,
which is a recurring themeyou'll find in the career of Kobe.
Brya.
And then when he gets into theNBA, he uses the number eight, which
is the symbol for theOuroboros, a snake eating its own
tail.

(39:32):
Again, it's immortality, it'sapotheosis, it's man becoming God.
And then he changes it to 24.
Because he said he was betterthan Michael Jordan, and Michael
Jordan was the God of basketball.
Right?
So, like, he has this kind ofrecurring theme that he keeps pushing
of.
Of he's more than just anormal player.
He's.
He's a God.
Right?
And.

(39:52):
And this goes into the BlackMamba thing, His.
His alter ego, which.
And.
And to finish the helicopterstuff, there was a.
The rapper Tyga, who I want.
Who I met in Las Vegas onetime, by the way.
I didn't meet him, but, like,I walked past, we were going through
mgm, and this is before he wassuper famous.

(40:15):
I just happened to be reallyinto rap music, so I knew who Tyga
was.
This is before he got real famous.
And he.
He was walking and I noticedthe dude, I was like, well, you can
tell.
You can tell with someonefamous is kind of walking by.
Like, they just lookdifferent, right?
They carry themselves differently.
Pretty short guy.
I'm not the tallest guy onearth, but he was shorter than me.
I walked right past him.

(40:35):
And like, I still kick myselfto this day because I really like
Tiger as a rapper, as a performer.
But, yeah, he had a videocalled Young Kobe and there's a helicopter
in it.
So did Chief Keef.
He has a video called KobeHelicopter in it.
Right.
This is all before the death.
This is also One of the mostinteresting aspects to me is so a
few years earlier, LeBronJames signed to the Lakers, the soul

(40:57):
team that Kobe was on for hiswhole career.
And 12 hours before Kobe died,LeBron surpassed Kobe for number
three on the all time scoring list.
And this happened in the cityof Philadelphia where Kobe was born.
And so there's a lot ofconjecture around LeBron.
And you know, he's pre NBAritualistic hand gestures, he's pre

(41:20):
game hand gestures, etc.
Like for me, I remember whenit happened, I was like, that is
weird.
Like, is this a passing thetorch sacrifice moment?
You know, which I thinkthere's something to that.
You know, it's like Michaelpasses to Kobe, Kobe passes to LeBron.
Because LeBron followed inKobe's footsteps in many ways with

(41:41):
the career steps that, thatKobe took with writing books.
Their adoration for a bookcalled the Alchemist, which, which
we'll get into here.
I got, I got something on that.
But we got to get up to thepoint where he releases children's
books that are full of occult teachings.
And the main, like one of themost occulted things about Kobe is

(42:05):
this alter ego of Black Mamba,which a lot of people I think argue
that truthers look too deepinto this stuff.
But when you look at the ideasof mind control techniques and knowing
how the mind works, youinevitably get into the CIA, MK Ultra

(42:26):
stuff, which was studying howto try to dissociate someone's mind,
how to force the creation ofan alter ego.
Because what they wanted to dowas create mentoring candidates or
see if they could create amentoring candidate that could go
into a murder in thisdissociated state and then come back
to their normal self and noteven remember it, right?

(42:48):
Like it's like the perfectsort of hitman.
And they were trying to makethat happen.
So they were practicing allthese ways of disassociating and,
and they got this from the,the German, the World War II Germans
that we took over here inOperation Paperclip.
Like that's where this camefrom is these sadistic experiments
they were doing over there.

(43:09):
And we were like, oh yeah,cool, let's hire them and bring them
over here.
And then we also hired a bunchto do, you know, rocket science with
Aleister Crowley's bestiethere, Jack Parsons, which gets us
into a whole nother rabbithole of satanic occult stuff.
But in NASA and things like this.
Well, people can go read yourbooks, they can read your books to

(43:29):
go all this stuff.
Yeah, yeah, I got one rightHere, actually, it's the dark pad.
I just, I just opened up a newshop, so I'm selling, I'm going through
my inventories.
But the, the, the Black Mambawas Kobe's alter ego.
And he says many things.
I got some quotes here forpeople who think like.
Because I think in general,people don't think about this and
they just think like, yeah,it's because he's, you know, it's

(43:51):
like when you're performing,you're, you're, you're putting on
a show and you're just like,you know, you got to sort of pump
it up and you got to harnesssome kind of other personality.
And he said, Kobe said I hadto separate myself.
It felt like there were somany things coming at once.
It was just becoming very,very confusing.
I had to organize things, so Icreated the Black Mamba.

(44:12):
And then he said that Kobe wastasked with dealing with all of his
personal challenges while theBlack Mamba handled business on the
court.
And he uses a symbol for the black.
There's like two symbols.
And maybe you guys can correctme here, but there's two symbols
he uses primarily of what Ibelieve is the Black Mamba.
And then the one is like thatsort of looks like a cross of sorts

(44:36):
with almost like you could,you could interpret to a two headed
snake on it, which is veryreminiscent of the Freemasonic double
headed eagle.
Right.
And you always see the eagleiconography mixed in with snake iconography.
You know, snake represents Lucifer.
The eagle is actuallyrepresentation of man becoming God.

(44:58):
It's the alchemical process ofturning into the phoenix.
Because the eagle in occultFreemasonry is the phoenix mythical
bird.
And the reason I say that isfrom Manly P. Hall.
He talks about this in theSecret Teachings of All Ages, which
is a very difficult book to read.
I don't recommend that for beginners.

(45:18):
I don't.
I don't even recommend it.
For me, it's so difficult.
I'm like, what is this guytalking about?
But then another version of asymbol that I've seen.
And I don't know if this isthe Black Mamba or just something
different Kobe had.
But there was A.
The 8, right, which is hisbasketball jersey number.
And it's the ouroboros of thesnake eating his tail, which again
is the idea of regeneration.

(45:39):
It's the idea of man becoming God.
Like it's this apotheosistheme that he constantly is, is showing
us, right?
So all of that was like, fine.
Because when he, when he, whenhe Died.
You know, when celebrities diein tragic early fashion like this,
it.

(45:59):
All the speculation happens, right?
And I really try to focus inon it and see if there's anything
there before I just sort oflike, you know, jump in the ring
with everyone else who'strying to like, sensationalize someone's
tragic.
You know, this guy, it sucksbecause, like, the guy had a wife
and kids and it's like his,his eldest.
Daughter died with him as wellas her whole team.

(46:22):
Like, yeah.
And this is, this is alsoanother issue we find in our.
In this world of alternativeresearch and conspiracy is like,
people can't wait.
Like, it's like, no, I have tobe the first one to tell the story
and then I gotta jump on thebandwagon and I gotta come to my
conclusions.
It's like, what, you know, itall after a day, you have all the
answers.
You know exactly what it is.
Day one after an event, like,come on.
Yeah, we, we become experts oneverything that, you know, we experts

(46:45):
on health and there wereexperts on the economy, There were
experts on Kobe Bryant.
Like, I, I totally get it.
I totally get it.
And I think like, a generallack of empathy comes through in
some of the extreme truthseeker archetypes as well, where
it's like, oh, someone justfalls into this category, therefore
they weren't human, theydidn't have lives, there's no separation
of anything going on, etc, youknow, like, for me, man, like, I

(47:06):
love Kobe.
Like, Kobe's legacy was and isa huge inspiration to me.
Just the drive, the will, youknow, getting over the hump, etc,
whatever it might be.
And it's like.
But I'm able to separate thatfrom whatever else there might be
there as well, you know?
Right.
And I feel you, man.
And I, that's the struggle Iconstantly have with it because I
look at stuff like, eventhough I didn't know Kobe, I, you
know, don't know much about him.

(47:28):
I had no connection to him whatsoever.
Like, I feel for him as ahuman being.
It's like, dude, this istragic, man.
This sucks.
Like, no matter what happened,it's like his wife and kids are like,
and the one kid, like you saiddied with him.
It's like, what an awful experience.
So, like, I hate how sleazy itfeels, but nonetheless, it is how
it rolls.
It's like, these are trendingtopics and people want to like, find

(47:52):
some meaning in it all.
And like, I guess thecomparable example for me would be
Ozzy Osborne.
Like, I really liked Ozzy Osbourne.
A lot.
I don't know if he was a gooddude or not.
Like, it seemed like he hadissues with alcohol and seems like
he wasn't the most loyal,devoted husband on the planet.
I mean, there's also a ton oflike, satanic symbolism of what he

(48:12):
does.
But nonetheless, I just likeyou, I can sort of separate those
things and be like, it doesn'treally matter.
Like, to me, it's, what didthe music mean to me?
How did it make me feel?
How did it get through?
How did it get me through hardtimes in my past?
Yeah.
And then it's.
This is him.
Like, this is a guy who had afamily that they all seem to love
each other very much.

(48:32):
So, like, he seemed like hewas a pretty good dad and husband
and it's none of my businessto begin with anyway.
Even if he was a terriblehusband or a great husband, it doesn't
matter, right?
Like, people miss him and.
But then on the same hand, Ialso feel like I can talk about him
and say, well, this is.
Some of this because I did awhole show about him and I read through
his book, I Am Ozzy.
And there's actually a lot ofsort of capitulation he had about

(48:53):
Satanism because in the, thebeginning of Black Sabbath, they
were, they were purposelyevoking like, satanic symbolism.
Like, Geezer Butler was reallyinto the occult and he had this book
which Ozzy, as the legendgoes, there was a.
This 16th century magic bookand they saw these dark shadow figures

(49:17):
and it freaked Ozzy out and whatever.
And that's where like BlackSabbath came from.
And they, they employ a lot ofthat dark imagery in all of their,
their albums and, and work.
And to me, I really, like, Italked about the beginning of the
show.
Like, I'm really drawn to that.
It's really fascinating to me.
It doesn't make me want toworship the devil or like, you know,
kill animals or something crazy.
Is it like his lyrics to Mr.Tinker Train, they're pretty weird

(49:39):
too.
Have you read those?
They seem a little likepotentially pedophilic or something.
Totally.
Yeah, totally.
Yep.
That.
And, and you know, he had awhole song to Mr. Crowley, right?
Which is Aleister Crowley.
And I think when, I think when he.
I think Mr. Crowley waswritten with Randy Rhodes, the guy
who people claim is the bloodsacrifice for Ozzy.

(50:02):
He was the, the guitarist andhe helped Ozzy write his tracks when
he went solo.
He died in that plane crashright next to Ozzy, basically.
Yeah, there's a lot of weirdstuff With Ozzy.
And it goes back and forthbecause in his book he, he.
He talks about, like, howweird he thought these satanic people
were.
And he was like, he didn'tlike that.
He didn't really like the, theweird vibes he was getting from a

(50:24):
lot of people.
But the, the, you know, themusic was like, people liked it,
so he just kept doing it.
And some people say that heeven would say prayers before every
concert, like he was a Christian.
So I, I don't know.
It's hard to know what's realand what's like, propaganda.
Yeah.
But anyway, going back to Kobe.
Yeah.
One other thing I want to mention.

(50:45):
You know how I mentioned itwas the, the day of the 62nd Grammys
Awards, so they were actuallybeing held in Staples center where
like, Kobe spent his wholecareer as well.
And so just think about like,in terms of the potential of like
a mass televised energyharvesting thing.
Like all eyes then came ontoStaples center as not just this musical
kind of awards celebration,but like, as a memorial, you know,

(51:08):
so to speak, as well.
Just really like harnessingwhatever was in the field there.
And that's, and that's one ofthe ideas of when people try to understand
how this works.
Eliphaz Levy, who was a Frenchoccultist magician, he talked about
the magnetic chain and how youcould basically charge up sigils
and symbols with enough energyand focus.
And that's kind of what theidea of when, When Nazi Germany took

(51:34):
the Olympics, they, theyincorporated the opening ceremony
because they used to not do itthis way before and because they
were really into like, paganoccult stuff.
Right.
So they, they started thetradition of the, the Olympic flame
going all the way to.
What's it called, Mount Herain Greece or something like that?
Anyway, Yeah, I don't know the exact.
Yeah, the first openingceremony, was that those Berlin Games,

(51:58):
what was it?
Munich or Berlin?
I remember anyway.
Yeah, I think it was Berlin.
But yeah, yeah, that was, thatwas because the occultists and the
Nazi party, they, they madethat happen.
That's interesting.
I always wondered what.
Where it's such a big ordeal.
And then obviously we can havemultiple episodes just talking about
the different openingceremonies from the Olympics and
like, what they're potentiallylike, programming the public to get

(52:20):
ready for.
I mean, that's weird as hell too.
And they're so odd.
It's like, how does this, whatdoes this have to do with like, a
bunch of like, amazing, like,athletes from different countries
about to compete against each other?
It's like, so odd.
Some of these.
Yeah, that's one of those.
That's one of those thingsthat over the years, you know, there's
certain events thateverybody's clamoring for.
The.
The symbolism breakdown, andit's the opening ceremonies, the

(52:42):
closing ceremonies, and theSuper Bowl.
The Super Bowl.
So, like, those are.
Those are my overtime days.
Anytime that happens, I'mlike, clear the calendar.
I'm.
We're not doing nothing.
I gotta be locked in on thisthing because, you know, everyone
just wants the interpretation.
And you're right.
What you said earlier, you're100% right.
There's this battle thathappens of theorist who can get it
out first.

(53:02):
Because I've been the.
I've been labeled this before, too.
Like, if you're a little lateand you happen to find the same information,
people like, oh, he stole thatfrom this other guy.
And it's like, truth is just we.
We slice each other's throatsas fast as humanly possible.
And it's like, you build afollowing online, social media, and
you almost feel this pressure,like, I have to comment.
I have to comment onsomething, you know, right away.
You know, people.

(53:22):
People are waiting for me tocomment, you know, Totally.
And that's how.
That's how it goes.
And that's just the nature ofit, unfortunately.
But I try to.
I try to be.
I try to.
I try to sort of leveragethings beforehand.
Like, if I know who'sperforming at the Super Bowl, I'll
kind of go through their wholecatalog, watch all their music videos,
and.
And sort of come up with like,okay, here's all the themes of what

(53:43):
I see from them.
So let's see what happens atthe Super Bowl.
Like, I kind of do that.
And also, too.
It's a matter ofcommunication, too, because you see
people, how they communicate,and they come across as very absolute,
as opposed to, you cancommunicate the same information
and go, hey, this is where Iam at right now in my research.
I know this event just happened.
These are my thoughts.
I'm open to changing.
I'm open to things shiftingdown the road.

(54:04):
And that tells a completelydifferent story.
As opposed to day one, daytwo, right after, okay, this is what
happened.
The Kobe murder.
This is.
Or the Kobe death, et cetera,et cetera.
And so I think it's like.
I think that allows you somegrace where you go, listen, you know,
I could comment on somethingright away, and I have enough space
to go.
I could be wrong, and I maychange my point of view down the

(54:26):
road.
That's just, you Know my twocents on that.
Yeah.
And I think that those areimportant things to, to consider.
Right.
Because I've, I've.
Man, what was I doing recently?
There's something I did.
Oh, the Ozzy show.
I did.
I, I mistakenly said that hewas from Leamington Spa when he was
actually from Birmingham.
Like, pretty famously from Birmingham.

(54:47):
I don't know anything aboutEngland or the uk.
I've never been there.
But Leamington Spas wereAleister Crowley and Leon Vitales
from.
Leon Vitale from Eyes WideShut and Kubrick's History.
But the.
He actually lived inLeamington Spa when he was the beginning
of Black Sabbath.
So I had to stand corrected there.
But yeah, so sometimes in therush to sort of get something out,

(55:10):
you kind of get things wrong alittle bit.
And.
Yeah, and that's okay.
The thing is.
That's okay.
It is okay.
Like, yeah, we're all human.
We all make errors.
Again, how do we come across?
You know, do we have integritywith what we put forth?
Do we take responsibility?
Oh, yeah, I was, I wasmistaken there.
Like, there's nothing wrongwith that.
I just, I have the issues withthe hardcore absolutists that are
just like, I'm right, I knowthe answers.

(55:31):
Yeah, absolutely.
I agree with you 100% on that.
It's, it's.
It.
I feel like it makes you kindof less human and less trustworthy.
But.
Hey.
But yeah, the, the, the, theOlympic flame, the idea is, is like
what Elvis Levy was sayingwould be to go to your Staples Center.
Point is you get mass focusand mass attention, and it's like

(55:53):
a concert that the performercan feel the energy from the crowd
and it sort of charges them up.
And that's kind of the ideawith the Living Flame.
Like, we're all focused onwatching this flame and it's like
this huge central point ofthe, of the ceremony.
Right, but these are all ideasthat tie into the realm of magic.
These are not.

(56:13):
These are, These are ideasthat Kobe Bryant subscribed to as
well.
Because when he died, I didn'tknow this at the time.
On my first show I did about him.
It was like my second or thirdshow where I unpacked his kids books.
I read through.
He had two books released atthe time through a media company

(56:33):
he started called Granity.
And if you read through thebooks, Granity is based on a term
that he called.
I think it's called grana inthe books and it means magic.
And he's talking about, youknow, and you could argue that all
this is just like Disney, right?
Disney talks about magic andit's like, for kids.
So, like, I get that that'sone angle of this, but the other
angle is you're talking aboutreal occult practices and real hermetic

(56:58):
principles of magic andliterally manifesting new realities.
And.
And Kobe talks a lot aboutthis kind of stuff.
Right.
And.
And.
And look, aren't therepositive elements, though, of that?
Like, man, totally.
Realities.
Yeah.
Yes.
Obviously hermeticism is verymuch so aligned with, you know, natural
law principles and things likethat as well.
So just not to throw thesewords out there then.

(57:20):
People just cling to thesewords, like hermetic, everything.
Hermetic is evil, you know.
Right, Totally.
Because.
And that's where.
That's where I get kind oftrapped into this.
This state of not being surewhere to go with it.
Because I practiced a lot ofNew Age stuff, read a lot of New
Age things, meditation.
I've done yoga before, youknow, who hasn't?

(57:43):
But I was really into quantumthinking and stuff.
Like Dr. Joe Dispenza's booksI read.
What the bleep do we know,like, two of those books.
Who's the guy who's the Toltecpriest who does all the.
For what's it called anyway?
Don Miguel Ruiz.
Yeah, yeah.
I've read a couple of his books.
So, like, all those things arevery inspirational to me.
They're very good.

(58:03):
It's very good to havepositive thinking.
So, like, that there is thatelement of you do create your own
reality with your thoughts.
Like, if you sit here andthink negatively about things all
day long, you're going to bein a negative state.
You will create your own helland you will live in it.
I 100 believe in that.
So I'm not condemning allmagical thinking or all New Age thoughts,
but that's the focus of theshow as I talk about the occult and

(58:27):
these sort of hidden.
Hidden ideas and occultesoteric ideas.
And that includes hermeticthinking, ritual, magic.
And Kobe was also into this stuff.
And that's not to say heworshiped the devil by any means,
but he was definitely intooccult concepts, which is why he
named his multimedia companyGranity, which means magic to him.

(58:49):
That was his interpretation ofthe term magic.
And he said repeatedly hisfavorite book was the Alchemist by
Paul A. Coelho, same as LeBron James.
Like, they both said that thatwas their favorite book, which.
It's a lot of people'sfavorite book, to be fair.
I mean, I read it four times.
I love that book.
So I'm curious.
I actually.
Because you wrote a book ofthis, so yeah, you can maybe touch

(59:10):
on some things related to that.
Because I feel like a lot ofour audiences listen to like, I read
that book.
I kind of like it.
It's a simple, sweet storyabout listening to your heart and
following your dreams andpaying attention to the omens.
I think the person whoprobably hasn't read it is LeBron.
He probably, he's probably onpage one on his, on, on an interview.
And the reporter's like, sowhat do you think about the Alchemist?
Well, you know, it's a, it's agreat story and it's filled with

(59:31):
a lot of education and it's alot of things to help people.
You guys aren't LeBron fans or what?
Well, no, I mean, I, I, no, Ilisten as I play basketball.
I love basketball.
I was, I admire excellence,you know, I do admire excellence.
And so you have someone likeLeBron who's had the most projections
onto him coming into theleague as a 16 year old and like,

(59:53):
has pretty much lived up tothem and exceeded them.
So I respect them there, youknow, as an athlete.
But like, come on, like himholding the Malcolm X book at the
interviews, like, it's like,who are the handlers that go walk
out with this book?
And yeah, there's like ahistory of like him lying and just
pretending to have done thingsand read things, etc that like, he

(01:00:13):
obviously hasn't.
They're just going on theseweird rambles that like a completely
different to the, the book inquestion or whatever it might be.
Okay, I didn't know any of that.
I didn't know any of that.
Okay, interesting.
Beyond any like sociopoliticalstuff that he gets behind, but just,
it's just funny, you know, heholds a book and it's usually like,
like the first couple pagesthat are like, that are like, like
he's holding or bookmarked or something.

(01:00:34):
I think a well known one wasthe, was the Malcolm X one.
I think he was like holding itand then someone asked him questions
about the Malcolm X book andit was like obvious he hadn't read
the book.
It was so vague and so general.
Was a good man and you know, like.
All right, bro, give us some details.
Okay, continue.
I mean, at least, at leastwatch the movie, bro.
Come on.
Yeah, so.

(01:00:57):
So yeah, the reason theAlchemist has it's, it's got a lot
of like New age occult ideaswithin it of alchemy, obviously.
Right.
And the author, Paul Coelho inhis history he was actually practicing
black magic.
He went to some Jesuit school.
He was in a punk rock bandthat had.

(01:01:18):
Because he was a, he was afollower of Aleister Crowley.
He was actually a Thelemite.
Crowley had a religion calledThelema and Coelho was, was.
He had lyrics adoring Thelema.
I forgot what the line was.
There was a line he wouldrepeat in the song about this new
age coming that Crowley talkedabout called the Aeon of Horus.
So he for sure at some, youknow, in his history was into this

(01:01:42):
very like occulted stuff ofAleister Crowley.
And you know, that's, that's,that's the point of the, the Alchemist
is it is based upon alchemyand the hermetic wisdom, which it
depends on how crazy you wantto get, right?
I think that all of these newage practices, they're a funnel.
And the funnel can lead youall the way into like left hand path,

(01:02:05):
Luciferian thought and evenGnostic thought, right?
And that's the like thewarning I would have.
And I don't even care ifpeople want to worship the devil.
If people want to believe thatwe live in a simulation.
Like, doesn't bother me one bit.
I could care less.
I have friends that areatheist friends that have satanic

(01:02:26):
tattoos.
Like it bothers me none at all.
I just think people should beaware of the influences.
Like if someone is ferventlyChristian and they're trying to live
a Christian lifestyle, I wouldnever tell them, well, don't read
the Alchemist because that'srooted in, you know, black magic,
Satanism, because that's whatthe author was into.
I would just tell them theauthor was into this stuff.

(01:02:48):
So like know that there mightbe a, a funnel where you get into
this thing and you startpracticing and next thing you know
you're doing shadow work.
Next thing you know you'resubscribing to Gnostic thought.
And then the next thing youknow you're worshiping the devil,
right?
Like that's a possible progression.
I don't know how many peopleactually go all the way down that
pipeline.
But it's possible, right?
Like you can't be totally naive.

(01:03:10):
You know, what does the Bible say?
Be wise as serpents.
Because, because these thingscan sort of chip away at, at things.
And sometimes you could arguewith me.
They're like, well, yeah, it'sbecause, you know, organized religion
is a man made thing to deceive us.
And it's like, okay, I meanthere's elements of that, that I,
I see and I agree with someelements of that that I think.

(01:03:30):
I, I think the important thingis, is that every individual has
a mind and it's like, how doyou use it and how do you discern
and how do you not throw thebaby out with the bathroom water?
Right.
You know, don't throw the babyout with the bath water.
Exactly.
You know, because again, likewe can have a whole conversation
on, on organized religion,like you said, we can have a whole
conversation on the issueswith, you know, certain new age things

(01:03:51):
or psychology and then.
But there's also gold to bemined within there.
So I think it's up to theindividual to go, hey, how can I
utilize this to know myselfbetter, to have a better life and
to be a good human being, youknow, without getting sucked into
the dogma of it or being takendown a path that pulls you further
away from, from who you are atyour essence.

(01:04:12):
But anyways, same, same with psychedelics.
I think they're very powerfultools you could use.
You could also ruin yourentire life with them.
I mean, I, I agree, man.
We've had conversations onthat, especially looking at things
from a physiological and anervous system standpoint as well.
I wanna, I just want to add a caveat.
I know you seem to be prettyconclusive on Aleister Crowley.

(01:04:35):
I know previously we mentionedboth being like influenced along
our journeys by MichaelTercerian in certain aspects.
Michael actually mounts adefense for Crowley.
And Michael believes Crowleyis one of the most demonized characters
in history and has beenweaponized as this massive boogeyman
of the occult.
But there is other narrativesaround there about Crowley.
Just whoever's listening, likemaybe it's not as, as conclusive,

(01:04:57):
but I want to share thatarticle with you that Michael wrote
on Crowley after this show aswell, actually might open some other
perspectives potentially.
Yeah, for sure.
I, I think that there, I thinkthere is an element of him being
demonizing him leaning intothat and sort of just like rolling
with it for the publicity and,and you know, yeah, it feels good
that people talk about you, I guess.
But he's also, he was likehorrifically abusive to his, his

(01:05:20):
wives.
He drove them insane to thepoint of being institutionalized
and them killing themselves.
He was horrific to animals andwhich sacrificed them and he supposedly
even allegedly sacrificed ababy at the Abbey of the Lima in
Italy and that's why Mussolinikicked him out.

(01:05:40):
So I, I, it's a, it's amazing, man.
Maybe there's redeemingqualities, but like to him, I'm Like
F. Crowley all day.
Like, yeah, bro.
Yeah.
So.
I don't know.
I, I don't.
Michael Siren knows far moreabout Crowley than I do, so, like,
I, I definitely would considerwhat he has to say, for sure.
Well, yeah, totally.
And I think this is it.
Even in the name of our podcast.
We say this all the time.

(01:06:00):
We're here for the truth.
Like, I like to be open to things.
Like, I want to check myselfwhen I feel like I'm so sure about
something.
I want to see what can I do tocreate a little space to go.
Maybe there's something I'm missing.
Doesn't mean I take.
I, like, don't follow myconvictions because I'm going to
continue to do that.
But I like this, even thislittle conversation here.
Like, there's probably so muchtruth to what you're saying and maybe,

(01:06:21):
maybe there are stuff that,that our audience like, may not be
aware of and, and they eachcan go down their own path and like,
read whatever books they wantto read and come to their own fucking
concl.
Conclusions.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I do think that you've got a.
There's also a, you know, this was.
He was around, you know, 100years ago, different culture back
then.
Zeitgeist was probablydifferent at the time.
Yeah.
So.
So, I mean, there's a lot of,there's a lot of angles you could

(01:06:43):
run with that.
And I think no one's perfect.
So, like.
But anyway, he, he did saysomething about how, like, he was
Satan's right hand man.
Unless he was again, like,unless he was just being sensational
for people, who knows, youknow, but, but to get back to Kobe,
what I find the mostinteresting about Kobe's sort of

(01:07:03):
odd connections to the occultis these, these kids books he had
because.
And I, I've got two of themhere that I read through.
The first was the wizardseries Training Camp, which was the
first book that he wrote.
And it was March 31, 2020,that it released.
So it was right after his death.

(01:07:23):
And it's.
I got some notes here.
The, The New York Times calledit a story of strain and sacrifice,
supernatural breakthroughs andsupreme dedication to the game.
And in the book, the.
There's this presence there,this guy named Professor Robbie who
is constantly whispering inthe boy's ears, sort of like train,

(01:07:46):
like grooming them, tellingthem what to do.
Very much like AleisterCrowley's holy guardian angel called
Awaz, because Awas wouldwhisper into his ear and inspire
him and stuff.
Right.
But the storyline is aboutThese kids going through various
initiations to go to thistraining camp to play basketball.

(01:08:06):
And they would go throughthese ritualistic initiations where
they would have to face death,they would face fears, face the darkness,
which is a classic sort ofinitiation tactic of going from dark
to light and also facing one'sown death.
And the boys sign a contractwith this Professor Ro Lobby guy,

(01:08:28):
the wizard.
They sign a contract forwisdom so they can be better at basketball
and, you know, get fame andfortune and all these things.
It's a Faustian bargain, basically.
And the contract says thatthey're bound to the laws in the
kingdom of.
Of Granity, which is like thismagical realm.

(01:08:51):
And the first book is about the.
It's about a few characters.
One of them's name is Rain,and Rain is actually Kobe.
Like, it's about Kobe himself.
So he kind of is allegoricallyexplaining how he got famous, which
you could argue like, did hesign a Faustian bargain?

(01:09:11):
You could argue that, right.
And each initiate tells theirsort of perspective of this story
and of them going through allthese different rituals.
And Ro Lobi is described as awitch or a wizard.
And they go through variousstages of rituals with like pyramids
and mountains and mirrors,which are all very occulted.
But what's interesting is thatthey confront their shadow, which

(01:09:33):
is like a very Carl Jungian principle.
They confront the dark side,which is Kobe's black Mamba.
And in the story, they.
There's this like traumaticstuff that happens to them with these
alchemical things that happenwith this black goo.

(01:09:54):
But what's crazy is thatthere's a story about how the kids
parents would die in anaccident orchestrated by the government,
which I thought, like, that'skind of.
That's kind of weird, right?
And then when we talk aboutKobe's connections to China, it gets

(01:10:15):
even weirder.
Right?
And I don't know if we'regonna have time for that today, but
let me go through the secondbook real quick, because the second
book has even crazier stuff in it.
And the second book is calledthe Tree of Ecroft.
It's force spelled backwardsbecause force is a reference to the
ideas of Star wars, which isalso very occulted.
It's about balancing the forceand confronting the shadow and Luke

(01:10:38):
confronting Darth Vader.
But the.
The book, the Tree of Ecroftis about this.
This character named Precia,who makes a Faustian pack with this
Luciferian energy, this spiritin exchange for athletic prowess.

(01:10:58):
So again, just like the otherbook, it's about a Kid sort of making
this bargain to become a great athlete.
And in the book, she lightsthis flame to this fallen God named
Harel.
And Harel gives her thesemagical abilities.
And in the story, she has thisshadow version of herself that comes

(01:11:21):
out and the shadow versiontakes over.
And the shadow version is sogood at sports and athleticism that
she's dangerous.
Like, the shadow side takesover her body and almost like kills
any of her competitors because she's.
She's so, so good at this.
This sport.
Right.
And there's a lot of strangethings in the book with.

(01:11:42):
They talk about magic, ofcourse, and this academy of magic
and how they talk about howshe got this magic from.
From Harel, that.
That fallen God, and the.
And you find out that themagic that she got from Harel was
actually a cursed magic.
That's why the.
The shadow is so sort of dangerous.
But she.
She.
She goes through this processof trying to, like, manage this shadow

(01:12:07):
to.
So that she can use the athleticism.
And while she's at thisacademy trying to learn this stuff,
they teach her all theseoccult practices like visualization
and going into what they callthe selfless zone, where it's like
a death of the ego kind ofrealm, and you let the shadow take
over and.
And.
And all the while, they'regoing through the study of magic.
Kind of like Harry Potter type stuff.

(01:12:28):
Right?
And the.
Let's see.
I got one more note here.
Okay, so that.
So there's a bunch of stuffthat happens.
But anyways, at the end of thebook plot, spoiler coming.
She walks in on her uncle, andher uncle is on his knees praying
to this fallen God, Harel.
And the uncle tells her, hey,you know, evil isn't always a bad

(01:12:52):
thing.
And that's how the book ends.
Like, that's insane.
Really.
It's crazy.
Yeah, you'd have to read it.
It's pretty wild that he putthat in a book.
And then Lebron, like I said,he followed in Kobe's footsteps.
It's kind of like you alludedto is like, maybe there's this sort
of passing of the torch.
Also, he was very much intothe alchemist, which, by the way,

(01:13:13):
Kobe was writing a book withPaul A. Coelho when he died, and
Paul Quell.
And you would think anyone onearth would continue to publish this
book either because they wantthe money, because it's got Kobe's
name on it, or because out ofrespect and to be like, hey, this
was a project he was working on.
I wanted to see it throughcompletion Whatever.
No, Paul Coelho burned it.
He threw it in the garbage andwas like, we're not doing this after

(01:13:34):
he died, so whatever.
But LeBron also startedwriting kids books just like Kobe
did.
And.
And there's all these theoriesabout Kobe and.
Or LeBron being in the.
The boule, which is like the.
The supposedly, like the BlackSkull and Bones secret society.
That's what that big chest,that big tattoo on LeBron's chest

(01:13:56):
is.
It's like of a big sort oflion, and it's the same logo as the
boule.
So, I mean, he could have beenin the boule.
I. I don't know.
I don't know.
I haven't dug in enough on LeBron.
I know he has a crazy.
You guys are making meinterested now, all this talk about
him.
I know.
I'm kind of curious.
Yeah.
LeBron's interesting for sure, man.
For sure.
And we think about thepotential for a Faustian bargain,
you know, like, what comes tomind for me is that 2003, 2006 period,

(01:14:21):
he was in a rape trial, right?
Yeah.
And then all of a sudden, theaccuser doesn't testify, and then
it's after that where hechanges his name to Black Mamba.
The Nike campaigns resume.
He wins his number then, or what.
Did he change his number thenas well?
He changed his number then as well.
Oh, the Nike campaigns resume.

(01:14:41):
He wins two championshipswithout Shaq, etc.
Like, that's.
He really skyrocketed post that.
Right.
That rape trial, which he wasnever convicted of.
Yeah.
And, you know, if you're in a.
Compromised position at acertain point, and it's like, oh,
hello, you know.
Yeah, because you know that.
That's like, kind of moremobster style things, right?

(01:15:01):
Like, you can.
You can like, humiliationritual stuff.
It's.
It's.
And I think that's part ofwhat the Diddy trial was, is I think
Diddy, you know, Kanye westsaid Diddy was a fed, and I believe
that.
And I think Diddy has a lot offootage and knows a lot of.
Has a lot of connections.
And like I said, there was.
Lil Rod said that LucianGrange, the.
The guy who basically is the.
The main figure in all ofmodern day music.

(01:15:23):
He was hanging out with Diddyat some of these parties.
And I think that.
I think that he.
I think Diddy's plugged intointelligence agencies, and I think
he's.
He knows where a lot of bodiesare buried, and I think he was maybe
getting a little too reckless.
So the.
The powers that be Might havechecked him and been like, hey, man,
you better watch it, becausewe could really mess you up.

(01:15:46):
Kind of like this whole thingwith maybe.
Maybe the rape trial is like,maybe they're saying, like, hey,
look, I don't know if you knowwho runs this thing, but, like, we
could really ruin your life.
So, like, maybe they scare thecrap out of them because Diddy was
looking at life in prison.
He was literally supposed tobe in there forever.
And I think.
I thought.
I thought I was.
I.
Not that I was going deep intothe trial, but I expected.
It was like, okay, there's somuch shit on him.

(01:16:07):
People have been talking abouthim, and then all of a sudden, it's
like, oh, yeah.
Kind of like a slap on the wrist.
Yeah, it's.
It's bizarre.
I followed the case every.
Every transcript, every day Iread, and I kind of thought that
he was going to get off basedon the things they were talking about.
And.
And it was just like, theEpstein thing.
I was like, why are we nottalking about the bigger picture

(01:16:27):
here of, like, the.
The.
All these other peopleinvolved and how all these people.
You know, because if you watchthe First 48, I. I learned the law
through TV, and they told me,if you're participating in doing
it, like, if I.
If me and my buddy want to gorob this guy's house over here, and

(01:16:48):
we break in and we stealingstuff, and the guy comes out with
a gun and shoot and kills myfriend, I'm going to prison for murder.
Like, that's the way it works.
So, like, when Jay Z is bestfriends with Diddy, I'm like, how
is he not involved in any of this?
Right?
Diddy had that.
That baby mama that.
That died unexpectedly, too,right around the time Beyonce was
around.
And there's a lot of weirdthings, and I'm just like, this is

(01:17:10):
such nonsense.
The whole thing was crazy.
I was like, this is crazy.
They even took this to trial.
You know, the Southerndistrict of New York has this supposedly,
like, 99.5% success rate, and,like, they were coming out with the
weakest stuff.
I was like, this is crazy, man.
Because even just readingthrough it, like, I think Diddy's
a scumbag for sure, but, like, the.
The feeling I got readingthrough the transcripts was that

(01:17:32):
they basically were trying tocondemn him for being into freaky
stuff and having.
And having.
And watching his girl havesome other dude, like, drop the pipe.
And I'm like, well, I don't know.
Like, I'm not into that, but,like, That's.
You certainly shouldn't go toprison the rest of your life for
that.
And I think that's what thejury thinks too.
They're like, well, I don'tknow, what do you want us to do?
He's freaky.
Who cares?

(01:17:52):
It's legal.
You're allowed to have freak offs.
But yeah, yeah, but it's theother stuff, right?
It's the other stuff thatLittle was all in little Rob's lawsuit
that I was like, what aboutall of that?
Are we not going to talk aboutany of these things?
Like, there was a.
He was plugged into a lot ofcrazy stuff.
Yeah.
But anyways, videos withJustin Bieber and Usher, you know,

(01:18:13):
that was, that video.
With Bieber was so creepy.
Yeah.
You know, dude's creepy for sure.
And I'm like, I find it hardto believe they don't have more things
they could have thrown at him.
Exactly.
But I don't think that was the point.
I think the point was to scarehim and to, for them to get him back
in line so he could keepproviding intel for them for whatever
it is he's doing.
I, I know we probably needmore time for this and you just have

(01:18:35):
10 minutes, but I.
Something I just want to touchon because it's a conversation I've,
I've had with people.
When Michael Jordan left theNBA for two years to go play baseball,
which was odd, you know, he'sat the height of, you know who he
player his prime, and then hisfather also dies.
Like, what are your thoughtson that?
Like the connections betweenthat and of course, you know, he's

(01:18:57):
had a big history of gamblingand, and there are different thoughts
and speculations on what mayhave occurred in your research.
What are your thoughts on that?
Yeah, I, I actually had neverlooked into this until you guys asked
me that and I was like, well,let me look into it.
I don't know much about, aboutthe story of his dad.
The only thing, the firstthing that came to mind was Kanye
west, who said something abouthow people go missing and how Michael

(01:19:21):
Jordan's dad got killed forfame or whatever.
And I, I was like, what?
But Kanye west is kind of acrazy dude.
So I, he is, dude.
I don't, I don't get.
I don't get him either.
Seems like a glitch, dude.
Seems like a glitch.
Glitch.
Yeah.
I, I don't know what to makeof the guy.
Sometimes he says stuff that,like I was defending him back in
like2013 when he, when he wasgoing on Sway in the morning.

(01:19:43):
And you know the answer.
Sway?
You didn't have the answers.
You know the answer is right.
Because he said a lot of stuffthat I was like, if you could turn
down the volume and all thecrazy stuff.
Like, he's saying a lot ofinteresting things about how we're
controlled by symbols and things.
And I.
But he's gone off the deepend, in my opinion, so I don't really
pay attention to him anymore.
But he did say something aboutMichael Jordan's dad.
So anyways, I looked into allthis because I was like, well, I

(01:20:05):
don't know much about it whenyou guys asked me on the email.
And his dad died July 23, 1993.
And the story is that he wassleeping in his Lexus and got robbed
in Lumberton, North Carolina,and they shot and killed him.
They find his body 11 days later.
And right off the bat, you getinto a lot of ideas of numerology,

(01:20:28):
which I'm not heavy intoGematria stuff, but there's an element
there that could be, you know,worth looking at.
And, you know, if he died onthe 23rd, that's in Discordian.
They call it the law of fivesor the 23 enigma, that things always
happen with the 23.
And that was Jordan's number.
Oh, yeah.
I didn't.
Duh.
Yeah.
I should have known that I wasa huge Jordan fan when I was growing

(01:20:50):
up.
I didn't even think about that.
Good.
Good call.
No, I didn't know that's when.
That's the date he died on.
So that's.
Yeah.
Also the, the first day of Leo.
Don't know if that's interesting.
Oh, I don't.
You know what's funny is like,I, I keep meaning to, like, get into
astrology to understand itbetter, but I, I, it's confusing
as it all get out to me.
Well, that is interesting.
The first day of Leo, the line.
And you brought up LeBron andthe lion tattoo of the, of the, of

(01:21:12):
whatever that the bullet blackIlluminati is.
Whatever you said it was.
Yeah, yeah.
Look at us.
Look at us, guys.
I know.
We're making connections.
Let's start the podcast.
Get it out there, get it out there.
So, so, yeah, the 23, which.
Good point.
With the Michael Jordanjersey, then you got.
It was 1993.
93 is the, the number forAleister Crowley's religion Thelema.

(01:21:34):
It also happened in Lumberton,North Carolina, which is where David
lynch filmed Blue Velvet, or Ishould say it's where Blue Velvet
takes place.
He actually filmed it inWilmington, North Carolina.
But Lumberton, the only reasonthat came to my ex, I was like, oh,
that's crazy, becauseLumberton has all these.
Blue Velvet has all theseconnections with Twin Peaks, which

(01:21:55):
is a fascination of mine.
If anyone's interested in TwinPeaks, I got a 55 episode deep dive
on my Patreon.
You got to check out.
Oh, wow.
Just on Twin Peaks.
Just on Twin Peaks.
Everybody hates it.
Everyone on my feet is like,dude, shut up about the Twin Peaks.
And I couldn't help it.
Our show.
It was my favorite show.
Why you ruin it, bro?
I. I'm obsessed.
I absolutely love Twin Peaks.

(01:22:17):
I only started watching itjust a couple years ago, and I watched
it over the years.
So many people said, you gotto watch Twin Peaks.
And I was like, I've neverseen it.
I don't care.
And I got so sick in 2023, I'dseen everything.
I was like, well, let me tryit again.
And I tried it again.
Didn't like it.
The whole.
The whole journey, I had upsand downs where I was like, this
is stupid.
I don't even get it.
And I made it through.

(01:22:38):
And I was like, well, fine.
I finally finished it all.
It's like, you know, becauseit's a lot of content.
And I tried to go back to sortof watching the things I wanted to
watch finally, but I. I didn't care.
All I could think about wasTwin Peaks.
I was like, dude, what is upwith this?
It, like, totally got in my brain.
And that's such a familiarexperience for so many Twin Peaks
fans.
And I was like, you know what?

(01:22:58):
All these people over theyears wanted me to talk about Twin
Peaks effort.
I'm doing it.
I'm doing an episode on everypiece of Twin Peaks.
Every episode.
The movie, the books, everything.
I'm making a comprehensive theory.
And it pissed people off morethan anything.
I mean, there's a handful ofpeople that are Die Hards that were
like, hell, yeah, this is great.
But most people were like, oh,my God, stop it already.
So that's funny in hindsight.

(01:23:20):
Don't do that ever.
Okay?
Start a whole separate podcastif you're gonna really nerd out.
Anyway, so.
Yeah, but like I said, theconspiracies are that Jordan was
addicted to gambling and thiswas some kind of punishment.
You know, he was known forgambling excessively and apparently
owed, I don't know, the mafia,lots of money.

(01:23:42):
But, like, he was good for it, right?
Like, the dude's Rich.
So I don't understand.
I don't know about that theory.
Another idea that I cameacross was NBA commissioner David
Stern wanted to suspend himbecause of all this gambling problems.
So instead it somehow lookedbetter for him to retire because
his dad dies.
And then a few months later,Jordan retires from basketball.

(01:24:03):
Just like you said at the peakof his career.
They just.
The Bulls are just three people.
Yeah, it's three feet.
It's.
It is insane.
It doesn't make any sense.
I didn't realize this at alluntil I was looking into this.
I was like, that is weird.
Like, why would he do that?
And the, the.
What's strange is that when hecame back to basketball, he came
back to the Washington Wizardsand the Wizards.

(01:24:25):
Ties us into all this occultstuff and magic.
Well, first he came back andwon three more.
Three more championships withthe Bulls.
And then he switched to the Wizards.
He had two.
Yeah, people were saying, oh,you could have maybe won eight straight,
you know, but instead he takesa break.
The Rockets win two titles andthen, and then he comes back and
then they win three titles.
The second.

(01:24:45):
Geez.
Yeah, see, I, I had stoppedwatching sports around that time,
so I didn't see him when hecame back and that.
Listen, do you have any sportsquestions, bro?
We could be your consultants,you know, just credit us in your
episode.
Yeah, dude, I might actuallytake you up on that because there's
a lot of interesting sportsconspiracy that I just don't have
the background.
I didn't know he came back in three.
He really was like the best man.

(01:25:05):
Hard to mess with his like6.06Finals MVPs.
I mean, it's never, never lostthe finals appearance.
Yeah, man.
I mean, that's crazy.
Yeah, so.
So the, the idea is the, theidea you will find in a lot of Truth
or Circuits is that.
Well, the.
It was a blood sacrifice.
You have to, you have tosacrifice one of your, you know,
most loved people for the Illuminati.

(01:25:27):
Right?
So he put his dad on the, onthe hit list.
Right.
And what, what.
I guess like the onlyconnection I could maybe link that
to say.
Yeah, maybe there's something.
There is because Jordan wasthe one that put Nike on.
They were, they weren't, theywere nothing before Jordan.
They were, you know, Adidasand Converse had all the basketball

(01:25:47):
stars.
Nike had nobody.
They signed him as a rookie.
He specifically Jordan madeNike a multi billion dollar industry.
He's still collecting hundredsof millions a year in checks from
Air Jordan shoes.
I mean, it's crazy.
So he, he's a great movie, by.
The way, that, that Nike movieon that.
I think, I think I've seen that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

(01:26:09):
It's pretty interesting.
But the Nike symbolism, if youlook at it, you know, Nike means
like the goddess of victory.
But in, I think David, Ike wasthe first person that.
Or maybe it's Freeman Fly wasthe one, the first that talked about
this.
The swoosh is actually showingus a.
The ring of Saturn, which,like, that's the only connection
I could make into this idea of sacrifice.

(01:26:30):
Because when you get into someof the darker aspects of Left Hand
Path occultism, you'll findthe Fraternatus Saturnus, which is
like the brotherhood of Saturnin this cult of the Black Cube.
And I just read this book byArthur Morris called the Cult of
the Black Cube that ifanyone's trying to understand how

(01:26:52):
this is a real thing, like,read the book because it goes through
a few ancient cultures and oneexisting Saturnian culture in India.
And it gets, it's really outthere on some levels because it talks,
because you have to understandthe history of the occult.
And there's a book by MarkBooth called the Secret History of
the World that explains thisbizarre interpretation they have

(01:27:14):
of the creation of our world.
And they attribute Saturn asto being this sort of like, chaotic
force.
And it's, it's supposed to, interms of initiation, it's.
The Saturnian force issupposed to be the outer or the adversary.
And it's kind of the final,the final test for an initiate to

(01:27:35):
sort of cross over and becomethis new enlightened character.
So they're always using thisSaturnian current, this magical current.
And one way you can employthis Saturnian magical current is
through blood sacrifice.
And so that's why in the Cultof the Black Cube, in these various
cultures that worship Saturn,they would do human sacrifice.

(01:27:56):
Some people in the book, it'slike, hey, because the book is very
sympathetic to it, it tellsyou how to be a worshiper of Saturn.
And it says you can, you canblood sacrifice animals.
It, it offers different,different ways of like, bloodletting
and stuff, like if you're nottrying to kill animals and things
like this.
But the, the existingSaturnian cults, they still do sacrifices.

(01:28:20):
Now, are they human sacrifices?
I believe it.
You know, these are, theseare, you know, people that really
believe this stuff.
So they think that the highestpower comes from that.
And this goes back throughlike the Aztecs, you know, they would
do the blood sacrifices at thetop of Chichen Itza and, and this
is a very gnostic thing.
They think that through thehuman sacrifice, if you do it violently

(01:28:42):
enough, you can release thepowers and the energy of the human
spirit.
And they think that if you doit violently enough, it can escape
this sort of gnostic prisonplanet and go back into the pleroma
where the real God is and notthis sort of fake God, the simulation
world that we're stuck in.
I know, I know we're goingreally bizarre at the end here.

(01:29:03):
But the point is there's a,there's a cult of Saturn that this
attorney and death cult thatyou could link into the whole Michael
Jordan thing.
Yeah.
And not, not to mention, youknow, Nike being the Greek God, goddess
of victory, you know, is theresome goddess cult connection?
Michael has a whole thing onfemale Illuminati.
And let me, let me put on yourhat for a second and connect Aleister

(01:29:25):
Crowley to this.
You know, just do it, Crowley.
You do what thou wilt, you know.
There you go.
Man, you guys are good at this.
Dude, you should, you shouldtotally change up.
You're getting kicked off ofYouTube anyway.
Yeah, yeah, we mix it up onthis podcast of what we do, you know,
that's great.
Well, listen, man, we want tohonor your time.
I know you said 90 minutes.
You, you, you had to go.

(01:29:46):
Any final things you want to say?
You want to guide ourlisteners if they're interested in
all this stuff, to read yourbooks, to support you.
How can they do that?
Yeah.
So there's a few options.
Depends on what you're into.
If you like reading the oldfashioned way, I've got nine books
on Amazon and you can buysigned paperbacks@ultsymbolism.com
or you can do the audible version.

(01:30:07):
I narrated almost all of them.
Or if you're not into books,I've got a podcast, Occult Symbolism
and Pop Culture.
If you.
Oh, going back to the books.
If you want my first book forfree, if you go to illuminatiwatcher.com
and sign up for my email list.
If you go to the Start heretab or the free book tab, you'll
see you can put in your emailand I'll send you the PDF of my first

(01:30:30):
book for free.
That's for like newbies whoare brand new into this and it's
really basic and.
But the, but the principleshold up after, you know, 14 years
later.
But those are some options now.
And I've got a link treeallmylinks.com Isaac W. You can find
jump offs to all of thatBecause I'm all over the place.

(01:30:50):
I'm on YouTube at a cultsymbolism for my third attempt at
building a channel.
But I'm kind of all over the place.
And unfortunately, in thebusiness of what I talk about, you
face constant cancellation and torching.
So I always just refer peopleto the link tree to find the latest
place.
We'll have that linkunderneath in the show notes.

(01:31:11):
It's just the easiest insteadof like posting 16 different links.
Yeah, it's a pain in the butt.
And my most popular socialmedia is Instagram.
@ Isaac Wisehub, again, on thelink tree, you can find that.
But yeah, that.
That's great, man.
I appreciate you guys havingme on here, dude, you guys are great.
Thank you.
We appreciate it.
For sure, bro.
If you're down, we'll have todo a number two and get into, like,
the CIA hip hop connections.

(01:31:32):
I think that'll be an awesometopic to cover.
Definitely.
Yeah, definitely.
That's that hip hop thing.
Hip hop's my life.
So, yeah, I'm definitely into that.
Love it, bro.
Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you, everyone else, forlistening and we'll see you next
time.
Take care.

All Episodes

Ep 254 - Isaac Weishaupt | Occult Symbolism in Pop Culture

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Crime Junkie

NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ep 254 - Isaac Weishaupt | Occult Symbolism in Pop Culture