February 11, 2025 • 49 mins
WATCH
▶️ Watch this episode on YouTube
***
EPISODE DESCRIPTION
Episode 92: Matt and Taylor are joined by Mike Shaw. Mike is a former professional freestyle skier and Canadian Olympic development coach from Lake Country, BC, who suffered a life-changing spinal cord injury in 2013, leaving him with incomplete paralysis. Against all odds and fuelled by relentless determination and a mindset rooted in gratitude, Mike walked out of the hospital just months later, and in 2020, he published his amazing journey in his memoir, Never Part of the Plan.
In the years following his accident, Mike has shared his experience with thousands as a professional speaker and consultant. He works with organizations, companies, and teams, and his goal is straightforward: to better prepare you to manage change, overcome adversity, and choose a mindset that will help you reach your full potential.
Today, Mike is focused on being the Founder and a Clinical Counsellor at Gratus Health, an online counselling service based in BC. His physical, mental, and emotional recovery provides a unique perspective he now shares to help others navigate their own peaks and valleys and thrive in the face of adversity.
Mike is here to discuss: → How his life-changing accident and recovery altered his mindset, using his journey to inspire others, and how he wants to help others moving forward. → Gratitudes powerful impact on healing, how you can practice it, and building a foundation of resilience. → Positive vs negative thoughts, caught vs taught habits, and playing the comparison game.
Gratus Health Website: www.gratushealth.com
Mike Shaw's Website: www.mikeshawski.com
Mike Shaw's Instagram: @mikeshawski
Mike Shaw's LinkedIn: @MikeShaw
***
OUR SPONSOR
The Kelowna Real Estate Podcast is brought to you by Century 21 Assurance Realty, the gold standard in real estate. To learn more, visit: www.c21kelowna.ca
***
CONNECT WITH THE SHOW
Kelowna Real Estate Podcast: @kelownarealestate
Kelowna Real Estate Podcast YouTube: @KelownaRealEstatePodcast
Kelowna Real Estate Podcast Instagram: @kelownarealestatepodcast
***
CONNECT WITH MATT
Matt Glen's Website: www.mattglen.ca
Matt Glen's Email: matt.glen@century21.ca
Matt Glen's Instagram: @mattglenrealestate
***
CONNECT WITH TAYLOR
Taylor Atkinson's Website: www.venturemortgages.com
Taylor Atkinson's Email: taylor@venturemortgages.com
Taylor Atkinson's Instagram: @VentureMortgages
***
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to the Colonial RealEstate Podcast.
(00:01):
Estate Podcast.
I'm your mortgage broker host,
Taylor Atkinson.
And I'm your real estate agent
host, Matt Glenn.
What's shaking today, Taylor?
Just got down from Ski Hill, spentthe last week up there.
It was...
Yes, you have.
have.
That was awesome.
So, okay, so it's been freezingdown here.
What's the temperature been likeup there?
It was pretty cold up there too,but we had a couple sunny days and
like, yeah, when the sun was justbeating off the snow, it kind of
(00:24):
warmed you up a little bit, butvery...
Interesting kind of segue intotoday's guest because we recorded
this about five weeks ago.
So Mike Shaw, who was just like an
absolute awesome guy to have on,he was a competitive skier and was
coaching for the Olympic team, gotin a pretty tragic accident and
became paralyzed.
I didn't think it was tragic.
It didn't seem tragic talking tohim.
(00:46):
Well, yeah, I mean, I guess hisoutlook on life was optimistic
moving forward, but like, Iimagine it's a bit of a difficult
time when you have an accidentlike that.
But anyways, I guess the segue Iwas referring to is, you know, we
spoke to him about five weeks agoand talking about skiing and his
big thing is gratitude.
You know, that's how he basically
recovered from being paralyzed,which, you know, spoiler alert.
(01:06):
He is functional.
He walked up the stairs to the
office.
Literally a quadriplegic who
walked up the stairs to record theepisode.
I guess the Literally aquadriplegic who walked up the
stairs to record the episode.
Yeah.
I didn't even know it waspossible.
I didn't know that was possibleeither.
Yeah.
I don't know what the stat is,
like one in a million orsomething, but it's incredible.
So his big thing was like, hey,how I recovered was gratitude and
picked out whether it was apositive thing that happened or a
(01:28):
negative thing, like figured outhow gratitude could elevate him to
that next level.
That was this week as well.
I've been kind of thinking a lotabout that stuff, but you know.
trying to teach my three -year-old how to ski.
Me being on skis as well, since Idon't ski, I'm a snowboarder.
But I was teaching him how to ski.
And there was great days, which I
had a lot of gratitude towards.
(01:48):
And there was bad days where I
don't know what happened.
The previous day, he was great at
skiing, loved it.
And the next day, he did not want
to ski.
He wanted ice skate.
But I had to like really practicegratitude, be like, you know what?
At least I'm here and like with myson and we're having fun and
finished off the week where Emilyand I took him up the plaza chair.
I'm here and like with my son andwe're having fun and finished off
(02:13):
the week where Emily and I tookhim up the plaza chair.
And, you know, cause we were kindof struggling with the magic
carpet.
He just wouldn't like, he wasn't
really jiving with it in the lastcouple of days.
I was like, let's just avoid it.
And we'll like hype up the chair.
So we went up the chair with threegreat runs.
He absolutely loved it.
It was beaming.
How do you like the chair?Oh, I thought it was the coolest
thing ever.
Yeah.
But on the last run, like, man, mylegs were burning.
My back was killing.
Like I'm just doing pizzas, like
trying to hold this kid up on skisthat I don't ski on.
(02:36):
And 20 feet to the bottom, I kindof had to turn to like, you know,
I was at the edge of the run and Ihad to like come back the other
way.
And I kind of slingshotted him a
little bit with the pole and heface planted hard.
He just, yeah.
But.
Still a great week, you know?Does he think that?
Does think that?He does, yeah.
We solved it with hot chocolateand marshmallows.
But anyways, the point is, listento the show.
(02:56):
You guys are going to love Mike.
Really, really.
cool guy.
And like the mindset is just
incredible.
So I think you're going to love
the show.
Yeah.
Mindset over everything isawesome.
Relevant to like real estate rightnow, as we were talking is, you
know, there's a lot of, a lot ofbad media or a lot of volatile
(03:17):
media, especially with liketariffs.
Damn tariffs.
If you look at it in an optimistic
way, as you were saying, Matt andprevious shows, you know, there's
opportunities in these times.
There's always opportunities.
always opportunities.
Winston Churchill, my favorite
historical figure, says neverwaste a good crisis.
So it's like, it makes sense.
There's always an opportunity in
every situation.
If the tariffs come, which they
probably won't, but who knows,they might.
(03:38):
You know, there's going to behurting out there, but there'll be
opportunities too.
So, yeah.
Yeah.
And in regards to that too, we are
having Brendan Ogmanson back on,BCREA chief economist, and he's
got a bunch of scenarios to reviewon tariffs.
So Matt and I won't even really.
talk during that episode.
We'll just let Brendan.
Yeah.
It's when you think about therepercussions, it's just like,
it's mind boggling.
(03:59):
You think, okay, interest rates
are obviously going to go down,but then you'd think inflation is
going to go up.
So does that mean interest rates
are going to go up?Like what's going on here?
So we don't know.
So we got the champ himself,
Brendan Anderson on to tell uswhat's up, but even he's not that
sure about it.
Right.
Like, I guess no one really knows,but he would have the best idea.
(04:20):
Yeah.
I mean, I think he's done quite a
bit of data on figuring outpotential.
But again, like this stuff is,like everything in the past five
years, it's all been very drasticchanges.
I just want to say this comment.
I think if the terrorists do come,
I think what Canada needs to do issend out an army of salespeople to
every other country, right?To the east, over the Pacific, to
all the Asian countries, SouthAmerica, Europe, and just start
(04:41):
selling our shit everywhere elseexcept for the US.
Right?Doesn't that make sense?
You would be like the leadcandidate for that job.
Get you out there.
Get me on there, man.
Honestly, I don't even know whatI'm selling.
Just put it in my backpack andI'll come back with contracts for
everybody.
Honestly, though, I think we just
go out there and just sellourselves to every other country
(05:02):
because that would be an amazingopportunity.
So that's what I think.
That's my political sensory there.
Yeah, for my political I love it.
This episode, like every episode,
is sponsored by Century 21Assurance Realty.
Best brokerage in town.
Best brokerage in BC, in my
opinion.
Taking over the interior.
We're in Kelowna, West Kelowna,Vernon, Kamloops, Kootenays,
Shushwap.
If you need an agent in the
interior of BC, call Century 21Assurance Realty.
Or if you're a realtor looking toswitch brokerages or a new realtor
(05:23):
looking for a brokerage to startout with.
We got great training programs,but train me up.
The reason why I'm just so damnsuccessful right now.
But yeah, we are a good spot tobe.
If you have any questions at all,give us a show.
Hey, I got a question.
Super Bowl is happening in about
an hour and a half.
(05:44):
Who do you think is going to win?
I want the Eagles to win, but Idon't think you can beat Mahomes.
I'm comfortable right now sayingthat Mahomes is going to win.
I'm the same, but I just like,come on, man.
You know what I want to see in theSuper Bowl?
And this is funny because you guysare going to be listening to this
after it's recorded, but I wantSaquon to have a 200 -yard rushing
game, if not 300.
(06:05):
Just absolutely go off.
That's my main goal for this game.
That's your goal.
I love it.
Less important who wins.
More important, Saquon just hasthe...
Because that dude's a champ, man.
He just suffered for so many years
in the worst franchise in theleague in the Giants.
Gets over to the Eagles and justhas a stellar season.
It'd be sweet to see him cap itoff at the Super Bowl.
There you go.
you go.
Some opportunity, you know?It was a grind, but he was
probably practicing gratitudethinking, you know what?
(06:26):
I'm playing in the NFL.
in the NFL.
I think that's exactly right.
So I would love to see him win the
MVP tonight.
That's what I'm hoping for.
Okay.
All right, guys.
Well, enjoy the show.
Enjoy the game.
And yeah.
Enjoy the show.
Mike Shaw, welcome to the show,man.
Thanks for having me, boys.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Yeah.
Well, we like to just start our
show with what's your perfectFriday look like?
(06:47):
What do you do for productivity?What's kind of your daily routine?
And what do you do for fun goinginto the weekend?
Cool.
Perfect Friday would be skiing
waist -deep powder wherever Icould get that in the backcountry.
That's sort of one of my passionsthat I live for.
That's what I saw, That's what Isaw, Pete, thinking about your
history.
No kidding.
kidding.
It's a blessing to be able to
(07:08):
explore the backcountry and slackcountry that we have nearby in the
Okanagan.
But Perfect Friday on a regular
week.
I have a pretty... consistent
morning routine where I wake upbetween five and five 30 and spend
a bit of time for myself, eitherreading or just reflecting and
enjoying a coffee.
And I heard Steve on the last show
say the exact same thing.
And I'm like, oh man, he's on it
too.
(07:28):
like, oh man, he's on it too.
Recipe for success though.
Yeah, I usually start with that
intentional time for myself andthen I'll get some physical
activity in, whether it's a run ora workout.
And then I'll dive into whateverI've got on that day.
And my fulfillment comes fromsupporting others or helping them.
clinical counselor or a speaker.
So I'm usually actively working an
(07:48):
event or supporting individuals ororganizations.
And I think the fulfillment I getfrom that is what is the most
rewarding and would be the answerthat I'd probably lead with is
being helpful.
And that fulfillment would be a
perfect day.
Yeah.
What's your career?What do you tell people you do
for?career right now?
It's a good question.
a good question.
One that I've taken a while tolearn how to answer, but now I'm a
(08:09):
clinical counselor and aprofessional speaker.
I've done a number of differentprojects in the entrepreneurial
space over the years.
And so I've led with the
entrepreneur title.
I'm also an author.
I've also been a consultant inlike the safety industry.
I've done a number of differentthings, but now my big driver is
(08:30):
clinical counseling and speaking.
Nice.
Taylor and I need a lot ofcounseling and need to learn how
to speak.
counseling need to learn how to
speak.
Yeah, yeah.
You won't be short of work here.
How'd you get here?
Like obviously Matt and I knowyour story, but yeah, kind of
start from the beginning.
here.
I grew up in the Okanagan and Ilove it here.
It's amazing.
The accessibility outside here to
(08:53):
adventure is like no other.
And I grew up doing all sorts of
sports, but the one I fell in lovewith was freestyle skiing.
As a young person, I was acompetitive athlete.
Turned coach and I worked my wayup to coach the Canadian Olympic
development half pipe ski team.
And in 2013, specifically on
December 16th, 2013, my lifechanged forever.
In a routine trick demonstrationfor a couple of my athletes, I
(09:14):
performed a 720, two fullrotations where you take off
forwards and land forwards.
But on landing, I ended up like
landing.
what I call some punchy snow.
You know what I mean?I say that like, just, I punched
through these soft layers orcrusty layers of snow and it ended
up stopping my skis dead in mytrack, pitching me forward onto my
head and neck.
And my feet came up over top of my
(09:35):
body, kind of like a scorpion'stail.
And they just, this brief, butsharp pop and pain in my neck.
And then nothing.
I tumbled downhill, slid to a
stop, face down in the snow,screaming at what I thought was
the top of my lungs.
Just like, no, no, no, no, God,
(09:58):
no. This brief but sharp pain inmy neck.
I can't move.
I can't roll over.
I can't feel anything in my body.
I couldn't bounce back up to my
feet like I'd done countless timesbefore falling skiing.
And my world in that moment camephysically and figuratively
crashing down.
Did you know what happened right
away?It was a really sobering event.
Like my mental clarity was like, Iwish I could reproduce that on a
(10:19):
daily basis because I'd never beenmore clear in my mind in that
moment.
They say like your life flashes
before your eyes and a near deathexperience because it's just
searching for any kind ofexperience that's similar to that
to try to pull from.
to help you.
And so my mind was racing, but itwas also very clear because one of
my first thoughts was, well, I'mlucky I didn't just have a
(10:39):
concussion at the same time.
I'd spent about six or seven
months that year out with aconcussion, but the thought went
through my mind.
Like, I'm glad I'm not confused
and paralyzed right now because Ifigured that would be a lot
harder, but I knew because of oneof my great friends and mentors
and ski coach that was in my life,had a spinal cord injury, broke
(11:01):
his back.
rocks the world from a wheelchair
today.
His name is Josh Dueck.
So I thought of him immediatelyand I thought of my situation.
I knew the gravity of it.
So I did know right away how bad
it was.
Yeah, it was difficult.
Like I thought about everything.
I was like, I just ruined my
parents' retirement.
You know, like I was 26, I was 27
(11:23):
at the time.
And so I was like, this is going
to devastate my family.
I knew in that moment that I'd
probably lost skiing forever.
Like every hope and dream, like
wanting to go to the Olympics,which was my original dream as an
athlete that I thought I mightfulfill as a coach, like leading
the next generation that was gone.
Would I ever ski again?
Probably not.
Would I ever have a family?
(11:43):
Like, you know, kids, justeverything was proof in an instant
lost.
And my identity, everything that I
knew about myself was like wrappedup in this person.
who skied and my action spoke forthemselves, you know, like it was,
if you could hit the jump or skithe half pipe, it was what you
could do, not necessarily who youwere that mattered.
And so like my identity, myindependence, everything was just
gone.
So rock bottom.
(12:04):
That happened in Denver, right?Near Denver.
I was in Summit County, Colorado.
So near where Copper Mountain,
Breckenridge, Keystone, AerofoBasin, North Star.
There's a... ton of resorts outthat valley, but I was at Copper
Mountain in the morning and thenwe drove actually over to Keystone
that afternoon and it happened atKeystone.
Then you were airlifted to Denver,the hospital, is that right?
Yeah, airlifted to Denver, hadsurgery that night.
(12:24):
They surgically installed twotitanium rods and 10 screws in my
neck, fusing me from my thirdvertebrae down to my seventh.
You might say I've got a bit of astiff neck now.
Are the rods still there?Yeah, there?
Yeah, it's a bad joke.
It's my best material.
But they're still in there.
And I've had a remarkable recovery
(12:45):
from spinal cord injury.
And technically, I'm still an
incomplete quadriplegic.
I don't have full feeling or
dexterity in my hands, my fingers.
I lose sensation on my lower half
of my body, on my skin.
So I lose my balance like up to 50
times a day.
So like balance, coordination,
agility is difficult.
(13:05):
My strength and capacity takes so
much work to maintain.
And I deal with pain on a daily
basis, but I am so lucky.
I'm like maybe the luckiest of the
unlucky.
No one's lucky to have a spinal
cord injury, but I am gratefulevery single day for my good
fortune.
Yeah, because the studio we're in
right now is upstairs and youwalked up here, is upstairs and
you walked up here, no problem.
(13:26):
Yeah, most places in the world are
not.
accessible you know like talk
about like you know most buildingsaren't but when you start thinking
about nature a sandy beach is a no-go you know cobblestone pathway
is a no -go in a wheelchair likeor really difficult you're not
going down on river walks orhiking or you know skiing
(13:49):
adaptations are required for allof it and when i get to do some of
the simplest things like you saylike walking up a flight of stairs
into a building sometimes itcatches me and i just feel So
lucky.
What is the percentage of recovery
from an injury like that?know like the percentage of
recovery from an injury like that?I've never heard of this before,
so it's got to be obviously prettyrare.
(14:11):
Me neither.
It is certainly becoming less and
less rare now, which is awesomewith modern medical practices.
And there's better research beingdone right now.
I believe that eventually spinalcord injuries will be recoverable
on a much grander scale.
But right now, it's still a
very... small percentage of peoplethat once you have a spinal cord
injury get to get better.
So it's not lost on me how unique
(14:32):
mine is.
Like, I don't know if it's one in
a million, one in 10 million orone in a thousand, but it's not
tons.
Do you have like the medical
industry reaching out to you beinglike, reaching out to you being
like, how did you do this?Studies and stuff like that?
Yeah.
Interestingly, yes.
And it's happened.
quite recently, where in Kelowna
at UBC Okanagan, they have like 16different, they call them labs,
(14:55):
but it's under the same sort ofumbrella for spinal cord injury
research.
I teamed up with Chris West on a
project.
I'm the community representative
or the community partner from thespinal cord injury community as a
consultant on a clinical trial forquadriplegics to try to reduce the
secondary injury that occurs viaswelling in the spine for people
that have had acute injuries.
So we're actually, we've got a
grant going right now andhopefully within the year we'll be
(15:18):
testing a clinical trial to try toreduce that acute secondary
injury, which is part of thereason why I recovered.
I had prompt.
attention from, you know, medical
team and my surgery was in eightand a half hours after my spinal
cord injury.
So that secondary injury that I'm
talking about that happens usuallydelayed within the first 12 to 36
hours of swelling.
That was reduced significantly in
mind just because of how quicklythey got it.
But most people don't get intosurgery that fast.
(15:40):
I was lucky.
And so how can we do an
intervention before thenmedicinally to try to prevent that
swelling from happening?And that's our game plan.
But yeah.
Well, yeah, I mean, that's
amazing.
But let's not take anything away
from what you did mentally tolike, I know, speaking to you, and
you mentioned it already isgratitude, like how that has
(16:04):
really impacted the healing stage.
Yeah, maybe elaborate.
on that awfully astute of youbecause i actually pitched an idea
to chris west at ubco where i waslike we should do a
psychologically driven study totest how mindset and getting your
body into a place of homeostasiswith good chemistry in your brain
(16:25):
and body that's driven through themind could activate better healing
because i know in my case awfullyastute of you because i actually
pitched an idea to chris west atubco where i was like we should do
a psychologically driven study totest how mindset and getting your
body into a place of homeostasiswith good chemistry in your brain
(16:45):
and body that's driven through themind could activate better healing
because i know in my case Toolslike gratitude and shifting my
psychology opened the door tohealing.
It wasn't just that I had amechanism of injury and surgery
that made it recoverable.
My healing has been extraordinary.
And I've often walked this in linebetween how much of it was
(17:05):
surgical intervention, how much ofit was psychological intervention.
And I've had some people in mylife, some great mentors say like,
what's telling you that it's not?where your mindset was in all of
this.
And so I've been leaning into that
and I would like to study itpersonally to get definite data on
it and do an empirical study.
But for me, I'm like, I know that
the gift of gratitude was sosignificant for helping me heal.
(17:29):
Yeah.
Well, and how did you get to that
stage?Like, obviously I'm sure there was
a very dark time, whether it wasweeks or months or, but like, you
know, that would be a pretty toughreality to come out of the.
Well, not to come out of thehospital, but to come out of
surgery and be like, shit, what'snext?
How long did it take and how didyou figure that out?
Did you have books or somebodycoach you?
Like, hey man, this is where we'reat and this is where the mindset
we need to get to.
I legitimately stumbled across the
power of gratitude.
Like it wasn't an intentional
practice, but given the uniquenessof my situation, like I'd had a
(17:52):
devastating spinal cord injurywhere I was told by medical
professionals, prepare yourselfbecause you're probably never
going to walk again.
In fact, you will be lucky if you
get back the use of your arms.
And that did not include my hands
at the time, which also weren'tworking.
So it's like, whoa.
After surgery, my arms did start
(18:13):
working.
I could close my elbows.
So I had bicep function.
Yeah, when I woke up the next day,
that had changed.
And I couldn't open my elbows.
So I had bicep function, whichcloses it.
Tricep opens the elbow.
You probably haven't had to think
about that for a while.
Most people don't.
But I had to start reprogrammingmy body.
So I was sending these messagesall the time.
(18:33):
And my arms started to move.
It took me almost two and a half
weeks before I could lift my handto actually touch my face.
So like when I say they couldmove, they weren't moving a lot.
It was still very difficult.
And my legs came back a little bit
slower.
When I did start to change and my
physical body started to recover,it was like wave after wave of
thank goodness, you know, like,oh, what a really like something
is in every little bit of physicalrecovery was an opportunity for me
(18:58):
to feel this overwhelminggratitude to a point where the
first time I brushed my teeth,which was at 21 days where I could
reach my hand up high enough nowto touch my face.
They put this big rubber stopperon my toothbrush and I. I was able
to brush my teeth for the firsttime.
Kind of had like lobster clawgrip, no individual finger
dexterity.
I couldn't use my wrists.
So I had to get the toothbrusharound to every tooth.
(19:22):
I had to use my tongue actually toget it just to be at the right
angle and everything.
But with a nurse there, I was in a
neck collar.
I couldn't get my wheelchair close
enough to the sink.
They had a bucket for me and they
had to do the taps and everythinglike that.
So it wasn't exactly like I wasbrushing my own teeth.
But I was brushing my own teeth,doing something.
(19:42):
The first thing I'd been able todo for myself and my self -care in
three weeks.
And I was in tears.
I was so thankful.
I had so much joy in that moment.
And brushing your teeth for mostpeople doesn't show up as
something on the radar of thingsyou think you take for granted.
Yeah.
I started to notice.
All of those wins.
And when I did, because I couldn't
(20:03):
feel much in my body, one of thefirst things I started to feel was
emotion in my body.
When I felt emotion, depression or
grief or sorrow, like any of thenegative longing for wanting my
body back, that was all dark andcold.
But whenever I felt joy or bliss,happiness, like even something as
simple as like eating a grape andbeing like, thank goodness I have.
Grapes.
By the time I made it back to
(20:25):
Canada and I was like supported byfriends and family members, like
in a first world country with amedical system that's not perfect,
but it's free and we have it.
I was just like, I'm so lucky.
So every time I felt gratitude andespecially in poignant moments
like that example of brushing myteeth, I would feel these like
warm waves rushing over me.
That was some pretty cool
neurochemistry, oxytocin,serotonin, endorphins, a little
bit of dopamine, but all thisgreat neurochemistry, which was
(20:45):
putting me in a state ofhomeostasis.
And gratitude actually increasesyour immunoglobulin A molecule,
which is like the body'santiseptic.
It fights.
infection and supports your immune
system functioning and when you'rein that state of homeostasis your
body can actually divert resourcesto the proper places for healing
like your autonomic functions oryour immune system and so by
having this disposition ofgratitude it was And evidently
helping me heal and the chemistrybehind it and everything is stuff
(21:06):
I've learned since.
So at the time I just kind of was
there by accident, but my recoveryhas been wild.
Yeah.
Good for you, man.
I feel like a lot of people inthat position would like focus
more on the negative, right?Like be angry.
Why, why me kind of thing, but youturned it.
I had those thoughts too, right?Like survivor's guilt and like,
(21:29):
why'd this happen to me in thefirst place?
That's not fair.
So many of my friends and fellow
professional skiers that I grew upskiing with didn't have this
happen.
And then on the flip side of that
coin, it was like, why am Igetting better?
And all these other people aroundme with spinal cord injuries
aren't.
I mean, I went through a lot of
dark times.
It was devastating.
I wouldn't wish a spinal cordinjury on my worst enemy.
(21:50):
There are gifts that can come fromit.
It just depends on how you look atit.
Yeah.
So have you kind of translated
that knowledge, I guess, now toother aspects in life that
gratitude can kind of resolve alot of these issues?
(22:11):
Yeah, my go -to is gratitude as afoundation for resilience, which
is a bit counterintuitive.
And it doesn't matter if you're in
the real estate space or anotherprofession, or if you're just
wanting to get more out of life.
Like gratitude helps us frame
setbacks in the grand scheme ofthings and realize that things
(22:34):
just aren't as bad as we oftenthink they are.
And we all have a negativity biaswithin us that when we do
encounter adversity or setbacks,it consumes a lot of our
attention.
And you think about it in life and
business, though, but it feelsworse proportionately to lose
$100.
then it does proportionally feel
(22:54):
good to make $100.
Yeah.
You know, once you've got it, likeonce I was on an Air Canada flight
flying through from a speakinggig, it was one of the first
flights where Air Canada hadreleased in -flight Wi -Fi.
Yeah.
And I was sitting near the front
of the plane, surrounded by otherpeople that are business people in
their own right.
And everybody's like... thrilled
when the head flight attendantcame out and said we're so excited
(23:17):
to announce that we have our in-air wi -fi on this flight today
and as the first group you'regoing to get to use it for free
people were like standing up intheir chairs like clapping
cheering and i was like cool thisis nice and then um it was like 10
or 15 minutes later people tryingto get online where the flight
attendant comes back out and she'slike I'm sorry to let you know,
but the in -flight Wi -Fi isn'tworking.
(23:37):
And man, the look on everybody'sface is like they had just been
wrong.
There was all this, oh, Air
Canada, this, you know, like itwas like a few moments ago, you
were just happy.
Normal people, all of a sudden you
were elevated and then you crashedto rock bottom.
(23:58):
We weight positive and negativeevents differently.
We all have a negativity biaswithin us and we... can beat it.
It's within all of us.
It's a bias.
I think it's evolutionary.
A really authentic way to beat it
is with gratitude and fortify yourmindset.
Because if you look for the gifts,not the gaps in any situation,
you're going to attract more ofthat positivity for when you'll be
(24:21):
more open to it.
Your chemistry changes, like
literally your physiology changes.
You'll be a warmer person, more
coachable, more approachable.
So many benefits like that, but
it's a huge reframe on the exactsame situation that is causing you
grief.
You can look at it and be like,
what in this situation do I haveto feel thankful for?
It's like the glass is half fullmetaphor, but you're looking at
(24:44):
similar set of circumstances justthrough a different lens, which is
authentically positive.
And can actually change your
chemistry.
And if you can change your
physiology, you change your state,you can change the story you tell
yourself about that situation.
So you can change the strategy
with which you approach thesolution.
It's incredibly powerful and it'soverlooked or maybe not even
looked at at all as a resiliencetool because it's counterintuitive
when you're feeling low to thinkabout all that you have to feel
(25:07):
thankful for.
Yeah.
Because of that negativity bias,we get sucked in.
Woe is me.
Why me?
Those types of things.
So, well, and especially I find
right now, like in the past fouror five years, at least business
related or life related, like it'sa pretty.
volatile time in life, you know,things are busy.
People's businesses arestruggling.
The economy is like, you can justkind of go down that rabbit hole.
(25:28):
But I guess the question is like,how do you practice gratitude?
Like you said, you get up earlyand do some reflecting and like,
is there something that you stickto or a piece of advice you can
say, Hey, this is like a goodstarting point.
This is what people should do.
Or is it just like all day, every
day, like make sure you recenteryourself on gratitude.
(25:50):
It's a very good question.
I'm so glad you brought it up
because how do you practicegratitude?
How do most people practicegratitude?
We might have, you know, a rounddiscussion at the table at dinner
one night where you say, OK, kids,what are you thankful for?
Some people keep gratitudejournals.
That's a common one.
(26:10):
Gratitude triggers are things that
remind you in your day.
That's one I actually like,
because if there's something inyour day that can trigger you to
feel thankful, then I think that'svaluable.
Because if you ask most peoplethat try journaling, it doesn't
really work.
for gratitude journals like a lot
of people say well yeah i kind ofget some benefit out of it because
(26:33):
the thing that's missing isfeeling grateful if you just think
about the things that you have tofeel thankful for and you kind of
categorize or collect this listyou might get a little bit of
benefit out of it but if you wantyour chemistry to change like if
you want the benefits of oxytocinserotonin endorphins like said bit
of dopamine those areneurotransmitters that connect
(26:54):
different synapses in your brainYou are literally changing the way
that your mind thinks to look forsilver linings or opportunities.
Likewise, if you produce thatchemistry in your body and
endorphins, it actuallycounteracts a stress response.
You can't feel stressed andthankful at the same time.
So oxytocin is like the love drug,right?
You seek out connection and peoplelike that you wouldn't necessarily
(27:15):
if you didn't have that chemistry.
Serotonin is the happiness.
drug or happiness hormone.
And that's an incredibly powerful
neurotransmitter, especially forcombating depression.
You can actually feel thankful,create that chemistry and change
the way that you look at yoursituation based on how you're
feeling.
And so for me, when I say to
practice gratitude, it's afeeling.
And you can feel it in the morningduring reflection if that's like
just a momentary mindful breakthat you take or even at night,
especially if you've had astressful day.
(27:37):
You can actually turn every day inyour bad days into good days if
you end it with a gratitude audit.
Whereas most people have a bad day
for like one or two negativeinteractions.
Yeah.
Conversations, tough negotiation
that you didn't feel like youperformed as well as you would
have liked to in.
Or maybe there's a challenge with
your spouse or.
kids or you know someone else
that's outside your professionallife and we hold on to that stuff
(28:00):
you need to release it and thenyou can shift to gratitude one
more point i should make that'sreally important on this and it'll
probably be the next place we takethe conversation to is how you
handle negativity because if youdon't actually deal with some of
the negative thinking that youhave going on or if there is a
situation in your life that istruly bad or a bad day.
(28:20):
If you just try to suppress itwith gratitude, that also isn't a
strategy I would suggest.
You need to release the negative
or process it because I'll ask youguys this, what would you have
more benefit from?Having more positive thoughts or
fewer negative ones?What would you tell me?
I don't know.
Maybe negativity bias, we weight
the negative ones more.
So probably less negative ones.
(28:41):
You're right.
Maybe that's why I set up that
question pretty well.
Most people want to be optimistic
and they're like, oh, morepositive.
Right.
But the answer truly is like fewer
negative because your negativethoughts and beliefs are the only
ones that can hold you back, limityou or keep you stuck.
If you don't deal with thenegativity or let emotional
(29:03):
content.
process, then shifting to
gratitude right away.
It's like the second step in that
process.
And so you asked me, how do you
practice gratitude?There are a number of different
ways to practice it and close thatloop out by feeling it.
But if you don't deal with theunderlying negative beliefs,
(29:24):
whether it's about scarcity oruncertainty or self doubt, am I
capable of doing this?You know, I'm not great at sales.
I don't know if I have what ittakes to achieve my goals.
Like all of that negative thinkingneeds to be dealt with before you
can move to something positivethat supports your growth.
Yeah.
Here's a very relative question, I
guess, for all of us.
(29:45):
But yeah, so congratulations.
You're going to be a new fathersoon.
Matt, congratulations.
Second new father soon.
You know, Emily and I, my wife, wewere talking about this quite a
bit, actually, because like.
I've got two kids, happy, healthy,
doing a lot of fun stuff.
But sometimes you're like, why are
you not more grateful?Like, man, like I had a good
upbringing, but like not all thethings that we're providing for
(30:07):
our kids.
Yeah.
I'm like, you know, so like justwe were up at Big White all
weekend this weekend with our sonand daughter and friends and, you
know, take our son to ski schooland stuff.
Hey, man.
Yeah.
You like skiing.
Yeah.
Cool.
We're going to go tomorrow.
No. And then like, he'll justthrow a tantrum over whatever.
(30:27):
How do you teach gratitude at ayoung age?
You know, cause they're sovolatile.
Like there'll be like emotions areon their sleeve, right?
Best day ever, worst day ever overlike the smallest things.
But, and maybe this is a questionyou'll approach in like a year
from now, but have you everthought of like, how do you
(30:47):
install gratitude at a youngerage?
How do you provide like theplatform for them to deal with
like the negative and the positiveto close that loop?
I think in general, we needcontrast.
general, we need contrast.
of perspective so if it's all good
all the time it's still a flatline it's like you know you need a
little bit of ups and downs peaksand valleys and so the fact that
(31:10):
there are times where it'seuphoric and incredible bliss and
happiness and then times whereit's not that and it could be
quite the opposite like a full dayof tantrums or You know, that
contrast is valuable for anybodyto learn to appreciate the good
times and appreciate things thatare wonderful.
Now, I think in terms offundamentals, you can teach.
say, please.
And thank you all the time.
(31:32):
And I would imagine even withyoung people, I haven't tried
this.
I've done it with some elementary
school groups.
When I've spoken to them, I do a
mindfulness exercise and sometimesit works.
Sometimes it doesn't, but tryingto get them to feel thankful for
like their parents or things theyreally love to do and just, you
know, have them sit with that fora minute and, and feel like it
(31:56):
would be a strategy to approachthat with.
I think it's gotta be a bit oftrial and error.
And then Leading by example.
Most of what kids learn is like
what I call caught behavior.
And I was talking about this
earlier today, what's taughtversus caught for raising children
and how much do you actually teachthem versus how much are they
absorbing by, you know, watchingyou and so on.
Like it's setting an example andtruly feeling it that way.
(32:18):
And so for us, how do we feelthankful when things are, you
know.
so good, but we're still caught up
in, you know, wanting more orfeeling like we're not moving
forward enough, perhaps, orgenerally feeling like a lack of
lust for life, because maybe wehaven't had many of those ups and
downs lately.
And it has been a bit flatlined,
even if it's flatlined, and you'reat like a, you know, four out of
10, or an eight or a nine out of10 for where you, you know, think
(32:41):
happiness lives.
If it's flat, it's flat.
I think it's a societal issue,though, with comparison and
especially in hustle culture whenyou're trying to build things,
build your professional life, yourcareer, your net worth, your
access to fulfilling activities.
Like if you're in a place where
you're fortunate to move towardsfinancial freedom or that's what
your goal is, you're stillcomparing ahead or up.
So you're comparing from where youare in this moment now to where
you want to be in the futureyourself.
(33:03):
Or up ahead to where someone elseis who's at like chapter 100 in
their story and you're at likechapter 30 of yours.
You know what I mean?We rarely utilize comparison in a
healthy way where if we compareback to where we came from and for
most people, and I know this isn'tan original idea or anything like
that, but if you were to look backfive years.
(33:24):
And to realize where you are now,you've probably achieved most of
the goals that you have set outfor yourself five years ago.
So five years ago, you would belike, rock on, man, giving you a
pat on the back and being like,you're nailing it.
And yet us, we're like, oh,looking to five years ahead.
(33:45):
Me still like we're conditioned.
to be in that state.
But if you compare back to whereyou came from, and I don't
recommend this, but I think it'smore of an awareness because I'm
like, don't compare down all thetime, but be aware of where you're
at.
Because, and I think you alluded
to it at the start, like I grew upin such a, you know, a great
household or in the Okanagan.
(34:05):
Like for me, that's where I grew
up.
I was like, this is, you know.
An epicenter of awesomeness, likeso lucky to get to deliver.
And so like understanding whereyou're at, because in the
hospital, when I was gettingbetter from my spinal cord injury,
I saw plenty of people thatweren't.
And so I had that contrast inperspective there where I was
(34:28):
like, oh, goodness, like if Idon't give everything I've got to
this recovery, like there are somany people that would kill for
the opportunity to.
I don't know if that answered your
question.
I kind of went on a bit of a
tangent.
Taylor's like a full dad now.
You're like one step away fromtelling them that you had to walk
10 feet of snow uphill school bothways.
(34:49):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, the caught and
taught thing is so powerful.
Man, they are like sponges in
everything.
But I guess if you take that
mindset like throughout life withfriends and family and like, you
know, we're no different.
Yeah, we're aged, obviously.
And we're a little bit probably,you know, less malleable to that.
But like people still.
feel your energy and then drive
(35:10):
what you're driving, right?Yeah, it's applicable beyond
raising children, right?Yeah, totally.
I just have that meme in my headwhere it's like, it's a Sunday
morning, it smells like cinnamonpancakes, my favorite cartoons are
on, the snow has lately fallen,and the three -year -old is blind
with rage.
Yeah, but you're blind with rage
because you're a three -year -old.
(35:32):
Yeah.
I mean, you're probably right.
They don't have a lot to compare
it to, right?It's like life's pretty cruisy for
them.
Let it happen.
it happen.
Let it process.
Because the moment you starttrying to suppress that or being
like, oh, you can't feel angry oryou can't have this momentary
tantrum, it's like they'relearning emotional regulation.
Yeah.
And it doesn't matter what the
(35:53):
environment is like.
If your mindset is like.
It doesn't matter how much youtell them in that moment to like
calm down because their experienceis their experience, that
emotional rage, even though ifit's like on all accounts, you're
looking at it like, why is thishappening?
This shouldn't be.
It's an awesome conversation right
now because like even in my head,I'm thinking, okay, yeah, where's
the gratitude in that?Like, well, grateful like my son's
(36:14):
able to throw a tantrum, you know,and he's here.
And like a lot of, like you said,people can't have families.
Yeah.
Also grateful that you're setting
the baseline for his life prettyhigh.
Yeah.
Also grateful that you're setting
the baseline for his life prettyhigh.
Yeah.
And easy for me to say at three o
'clock after a good day and had acoffee and he's at daycare.
(36:34):
And then when it's bedtimetonight, try and instill that.
Oh man, I'm stoked.
You want to read another book for
the fifth time and you're yellingat me.
Yeah, it's good.
It's powerful stuff.
I love it.
It is called a practice though, a
practice though, for a reason.
And I really do believe that like,
you've got to feel it.
You got to close out that loop.
You've got to cut out negativityif that's what's holding you back.
(36:54):
And like, maybe tell yourself adifferent story before you can
actually start feeling.
thankful for your present
situation or the one you're aboutto have and open yourself up to
that reality with like authenticgratitude but the opportunity to
like shift mentally in times whereit is really difficult it falls
back on a bit of practice like youneed some repetitions before it
comes the default mindset but whenit does it's pretty awesome i
still have to work on it nowbecause the farther i get out from
(37:18):
my accident the harder it getssome days, you know?
I'm human as well with all this.
So with your injury, your injury,
is your injury always gettingbetter?
Like, is there a regression riskor like, how does that look for
you?It's interesting because my
neurological picture plateauedwhat it felt like between like
year two and three in recovery.
(37:39):
interesting because my
neurological picture plateauedwhat it felt like between like
year two and three in recovery.
Like my sensation on my body
hasn't changed, but I havecontinued pushing really hard,
setting big.
physical objectives and goals to
try to keep myself reaching thenext level of what I can handle
physically.
And my capacity has continued
getting better and better, likewith endurance training and skiing
and stuff like that.
I'm back in the mountains and
doing it in a way that if youwould ask me 11 years ago, if I
(38:02):
thought it were possible, Iprobably would have told you no.
So I've even beat some of theexpectations or achieved some of
the things that I didn't eventhink were possible.
So I'm pretty stoked.
But it's been a physical plateau,
like in neurological sense, butnot in terms of what I've been
able to accomplish.
I've set some pretty lofty goals.
So, yeah.
Good for you.
(38:22):
And I mean, so many otherchallenges and achievements you
have to make now too, right?Like, so where's business at now?
You're coaching, training otherpeople, business people, just
mostly on mindset now.
Like, or are you helping on
recovery on injuries as well?Like, who are you mostly speaking
to and working with?In my speaking and like consulting
or coaching role, it's more likeorganizations.
And I've worked with someindividuals one -on -one, but it's
primarily like sharing a messageof resilience and gratitude and
team building, shared vision,leadership.
managing uncertainty,organizational transformation.
I do all that from the stagetypically or like online.
(38:44):
And so I've spoken in front oflike 40 ,000 people in audiences
over the last six or seven years.
It's been a lot of fun traveling
to do talks and conferences andstuff like that.
But as of recently, I've justshifted gears more into the mental
health space.
And I've started a new company
called Gratis Health.
Gratis is G -R -A -T -U -S.
That's the Latin origin forgrateful.
My goal is to get into integrativehealth and support people from
mind and body like psychosomatichealing.
People that are either strugglingwith a physical presentation that
(39:05):
their physical healing isencumbered by their psychology
because they haven't got to thatplace where their mind and body
place that's open to heal.
So help them with mental blocks or
if people's physical presentationis directly.
linked to their psychology becauseof something like trauma that
they're holding in the body oremotional suppression, chronic
(39:25):
pain and stuff like that.
Even as much as like functional
neurological disorder, I've helpedcure non -epileptic seizures.
So I've had a client that wentfrom having like three to four non
-epileptic seizures a week relatedto trauma down to about one close
call a month.
where they can start to recognize
a seizure coming on and then withpsychology take themselves back
from the edge and prevent it fromeven happening.
So I'm really excited with GratisHealth is going to bring about in
(39:47):
terms of blending mind and bodyhealing.
Awesome.
Good for you.
Before we jump into our wrap -upquestions here, tell us about the
Kelowna Marathon.
Oh, man.
Okay, this year I ran the KelownaMarathon.
I didn't know how hard it wasgoing to be.
It's like marathons are...
It's such a huge physical
challenge to overcome for anybody,but let alone somebody who had a
spinal cord injury.
And I've done a fair bit of
(40:09):
running over the years, butnothing to that extent.
And I would like to share withpeople that you're capable of more
than you think you are, or you cando more than you think you can do.
You may have heard that, but Isubscribe to the idea that you can
do as much as you think you cando.
So your mindset and all this is soimportant.
And for me, setting a goal likedoing a marathon was preposterous
(40:31):
initially.
And even once I got into the
training, I was like, man, why didI even start doing this?
It's way too hard.
But the goal is set and I ended up
completing the race.
And then it is true that if you
choose to change your mind about acertain situation and believe that
you've got it within yourself topush through or that if it's not
(40:53):
working out right now, it'llalways work out.
Because things always work outthat feeling of I'm just not
finished yet.
I just need to keep going.
If you truly believe that you'vegot it within yourself to achieve
your goals or succeed on thebackside of adversity, that to me
was like the epitome of that.
And if everybody out there is
(41:14):
listening to it could take thataway, I'd say this would be a big
success for me in this wholeconversation.
It's like you've got it withinyourself, like trust that you're
capable of as much as you thinkyou are.
So aim high.
Man, you're going to run out of
(41:35):
big stuff to do.
Like you're just ticking off
everything.
Hey, that's impressive.
Yeah.
I think being a family man is the
next big thing.
know next big thing.
That is a trade for a marathonwith a young child.
a trade for a marathon with ayoung child.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's the next.
It's going to be wild.
Yeah.
trade All right.
(41:56):
Well, yeah, we'll dive into ourwrap up stuff here.
If you could buy a property in theOkanagan in the next 12 months,
what would it be?My desire would be to have.
be to have.
Land, privacy, and a view.
So potentially in Lake Country upon the hill overlooking Okanagan
or even Kelowna Mission would bephenomenal.
(42:19):
I love Kelowna.
I'm from the North Okanagan, but
I've definitely started to feelmore like Kelowna is home these
days.
But I would look for something
where I have a little bit ofprivacy.
A view of the water and themountains around here is part of
why we live here.
Yeah.
And that would be my go -to forsure.
(42:41):
Nice.
If you could give your 20 -year
-old self any advice, what wouldit be?
I would tell my 20 -year -old selfto not be so hard on yourself.
would tell my 20 -year -old selfto not be so hard on yourself.
I was in a sport and a career thatit was like very much about
(43:01):
performance and hitting metrics.
And in fact, this is very
vulnerable and for me to evenshare, but I gave up on my
competitive dreams too soon.
And I wish I could have gone back
and said, stay persistent, stay init and believe in yourself because
you're capable of as much as youthink you are.
And your thoughts are directlyrelated to those self -beliefs.
So believe that you have it withinyourself to achieve the things
(43:23):
that you want to achieve.
That's great.
Yeah.
I feel like a lot of people have
probably call it a little bit tooearly.
You know, what's the worst thatcan happen?
You're going to have a bit morefun in life and, you know, do
something you love.
Yeah.
Good for you.
Yeah.
It's like so much growth lies onthe backside of that uncertainty
and risk.
Yeah.
Like that's where the magic is.
(43:44):
Yeah.
What's your favorite charity orhow do you get back?
your favorite charity or how doyou get back?
My favorite charity, that one'seasy, is the Wings for Life
Foundation.
And my big give back every year is
organizing a world run event.
I'm doing one here in Kelowna this
year on May 4th.
It's a 4 a .m.
run.
So for those of you that don't
like getting out of bed, this isgoing to be extra special for you
(44:08):
because you'll be living outsideyour comfort zone.
But it's definitely May the 4th bewith you.
Yeah, 4 a .m.
on May the 4th.
But I team up with the OkanaganLifestyle crew, Jax and Ryan and
their team.
They open up their doors, the
venue.
That's where everybody meets.
And then we set off from there.
But it's a charity for spinal cord
injury research.
It's all about running for those
(44:29):
who can't.
There's no minimum or maximum
distance.
Once you start running, you just
want to see how far you can go. 30minutes after you start running,
everybody downloads an app.
The finish line actually starts
coming after you.
Oh, you got to stay ahead of the
finish line.
So you're being chased.
Like for anybody that loves alittle bit of an adventure, like,
you know, living outside theircomfort zone, because nobody wants
to get up and start running at 4 a.m.
Does the finish line just getfaster and faster?
(44:51):
finish line just get and faster?Yes.
Nice.
And so after 30 minutes of it
going, it goes from 15 kilometersan hour to 16.
Most people surprise themselveswith how far they can actually go.
A lot of people run like 10Ks thatdon't normally run 10Ks.
And some people that are used torunning a little bit run like 15
to 20.
It's all for spinal cord injury
research.
And we're having an event in
(45:13):
Kelowna.
in may and it's run all around the
world it's the biggest runningevent on the planet there's like
280 000 people approximately thatran it together last year at the
exact same time that's why itstarts at 4 a
m in our time zone we just have acrazy yeah we don't have the best
time zone for it but it's ashotgun start around the world
it's a very very cool uh projectthat's an awesome that's a nice
(45:33):
event yeah you guys should comeout yeah where i am i would love
to i'm doing the bmo half that dayare you yeah yeah that's they'll
be with you there the challengedouble up it probably doesn't
start till nine yeah i'll just runto vancouver we've got some great
groups like accessible okanagan isgoing to come out for the spinal
cord injury community and uh northend run group like they've got a
lot of members that we're gonnatry to pull out this year and get
(45:55):
a bunch of people just to gettogether and a guys should come
out where i am i would love to i'mdoing the bmo half that day are
you yeah yeah that's they'll bewith you there the challenge
double up it probably doesn'tstart till nine yeah just run to
vancouver we've got some greatgroups like accessible okanagan is
going to come out for the spinalcord injury community and uh north
end run group like they've got alot of members that we're gonna
(46:15):
try to pull out this year and geta bunch of people just to get
together and Do some good exerciseactivism, I like to call it.
That's nice.
just run to How can Taylor or I or
our listeners help you?What can we do for you?
Live with a little bit moregratitude in your daily life.
with a little bit more gratitudein your daily life.
And if you want to find me andconnect, I'm pretty easy to find.
(46:37):
My website's MikeShawSki .com.
So MikeShawSki, S -K -I dot com.
And find me on Instagram or find acopy of my book, whatever.
Reach out to me.
Connect.
I love to have conversations withpeople in our community,
especially if I can support you inany way.
And related to what we talkedabout here today, that'd be
amazing.
I love it, man.
Awesome, man.
It's been great talking to you.
Thank you so much for stopping by.
(47:00):
so Grateful.
Grateful that you're here.
Yeah.
Grateful to be here.
Thanks for having me.
to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Okay.
Have a good one.
You too.
Welcome to the Colonial RealEstate Podcast.
(00:01):
Estate Podcast.
I'm your mortgage broker host,
Taylor Atkinson.
And I'm your real estate agent
host, Matt Glenn.
What's shaking today, Taylor?
Just got down from Ski Hill, spentthe last week up there.
It was...
Yes, you have.
have.
That was awesome.
So, okay, so it's been freezingdown here.
What's the temperature been likeup there?
It was pretty cold up there too,but we had a couple sunny days and
like, yeah, when the sun was justbeating off the snow, it kind of
(00:24):
warmed you up a little bit, butvery...
Interesting kind of segue intotoday's guest because we recorded
this about five weeks ago.
So Mike Shaw, who was just like an
absolute awesome guy to have on,he was a competitive skier and was
coaching for the Olympic team, gotin a pretty tragic accident and
became paralyzed.
I didn't think it was tragic.
It didn't seem tragic talking tohim.
(00:46):
Well, yeah, I mean, I guess hisoutlook on life was optimistic
moving forward, but like, Iimagine it's a bit of a difficult
time when you have an accidentlike that.
But anyways, I guess the segue Iwas referring to is, you know, we
spoke to him about five weeks agoand talking about skiing and his
big thing is gratitude.
You know, that's how he basically
recovered from being paralyzed,which, you know, spoiler alert.
(01:06):
He is functional.
He walked up the stairs to the
office.
Literally a quadriplegic who
walked up the stairs to record theepisode.
I guess the Literally aquadriplegic who walked up the
stairs to record the episode.
Yeah.
I didn't even know it waspossible.
I didn't know that was possibleeither.
Yeah.
I don't know what the stat is,
like one in a million orsomething, but it's incredible.
So his big thing was like, hey,how I recovered was gratitude and
picked out whether it was apositive thing that happened or a
(01:28):
negative thing, like figured outhow gratitude could elevate him to
that next level.
That was this week as well.
I've been kind of thinking a lotabout that stuff, but you know.
trying to teach my three -year-old how to ski.
Me being on skis as well, since Idon't ski, I'm a snowboarder.
But I was teaching him how to ski.
And there was great days, which I
had a lot of gratitude towards.
(01:48):
And there was bad days where I
don't know what happened.
The previous day, he was great at
skiing, loved it.
And the next day, he did not want
to ski.
He wanted ice skate.
But I had to like really practicegratitude, be like, you know what?
At least I'm here and like with myson and we're having fun and
finished off the week where Emilyand I took him up the plaza chair.
I'm here and like with my son andwe're having fun and finished off
(02:13):
the week where Emily and I tookhim up the plaza chair.
And, you know, cause we were kindof struggling with the magic
carpet.
He just wouldn't like, he wasn't
really jiving with it in the lastcouple of days.
I was like, let's just avoid it.
And we'll like hype up the chair.
So we went up the chair with threegreat runs.
He absolutely loved it.
It was beaming.
How do you like the chair?Oh, I thought it was the coolest
thing ever.
Yeah.
But on the last run, like, man, mylegs were burning.
My back was killing.
Like I'm just doing pizzas, like
trying to hold this kid up on skisthat I don't ski on.
(02:36):
And 20 feet to the bottom, I kindof had to turn to like, you know,
I was at the edge of the run and Ihad to like come back the other
way.
And I kind of slingshotted him a
little bit with the pole and heface planted hard.
He just, yeah.
But.
Still a great week, you know?Does he think that?
Does think that?He does, yeah.
We solved it with hot chocolateand marshmallows.
But anyways, the point is, listento the show.
(02:56):
You guys are going to love Mike.
Really, really.
cool guy.
And like the mindset is just
incredible.
So I think you're going to love
the show.
Yeah.
Mindset over everything isawesome.
Relevant to like real estate rightnow, as we were talking is, you
know, there's a lot of, a lot ofbad media or a lot of volatile
(03:17):
media, especially with liketariffs.
Damn tariffs.
If you look at it in an optimistic
way, as you were saying, Matt andprevious shows, you know, there's
opportunities in these times.
There's always opportunities.
always opportunities.
Winston Churchill, my favorite
historical figure, says neverwaste a good crisis.
So it's like, it makes sense.
There's always an opportunity in
every situation.
If the tariffs come, which they
probably won't, but who knows,they might.
(03:38):
You know, there's going to behurting out there, but there'll be
opportunities too.
So, yeah.
Yeah.
And in regards to that too, we are
having Brendan Ogmanson back on,BCREA chief economist, and he's
got a bunch of scenarios to reviewon tariffs.
So Matt and I won't even really.
talk during that episode.
We'll just let Brendan.
Yeah.
It's when you think about therepercussions, it's just like,
it's mind boggling.
(03:59):
You think, okay, interest rates
are obviously going to go down,but then you'd think inflation is
going to go up.
So does that mean interest rates
are going to go up?Like what's going on here?
So we don't know.
So we got the champ himself,
Brendan Anderson on to tell uswhat's up, but even he's not that
sure about it.
Right.
Like, I guess no one really knows,but he would have the best idea.
(04:20):
Yeah.
I mean, I think he's done quite a
bit of data on figuring outpotential.
But again, like this stuff is,like everything in the past five
years, it's all been very drasticchanges.
I just want to say this comment.
I think if the terrorists do come,
I think what Canada needs to do issend out an army of salespeople to
every other country, right?To the east, over the Pacific, to
all the Asian countries, SouthAmerica, Europe, and just start
(04:41):
selling our shit everywhere elseexcept for the US.
Right?Doesn't that make sense?
You would be like the leadcandidate for that job.
Get you out there.
Get me on there, man.
Honestly, I don't even know whatI'm selling.
Just put it in my backpack andI'll come back with contracts for
everybody.
Honestly, though, I think we just
go out there and just sellourselves to every other country
(05:02):
because that would be an amazingopportunity.
So that's what I think.
That's my political sensory there.
Yeah, for my political I love it.
This episode, like every episode,
is sponsored by Century 21Assurance Realty.
Best brokerage in town.
Best brokerage in BC, in my
opinion.
Taking over the interior.
We're in Kelowna, West Kelowna,Vernon, Kamloops, Kootenays,
Shushwap.
If you need an agent in the
interior of BC, call Century 21Assurance Realty.
Or if you're a realtor looking toswitch brokerages or a new realtor
(05:23):
looking for a brokerage to startout with.
We got great training programs,but train me up.
The reason why I'm just so damnsuccessful right now.
But yeah, we are a good spot tobe.
If you have any questions at all,give us a show.
Hey, I got a question.
Super Bowl is happening in about
an hour and a half.
(05:44):
Who do you think is going to win?
I want the Eagles to win, but Idon't think you can beat Mahomes.
I'm comfortable right now sayingthat Mahomes is going to win.
I'm the same, but I just like,come on, man.
You know what I want to see in theSuper Bowl?
And this is funny because you guysare going to be listening to this
after it's recorded, but I wantSaquon to have a 200 -yard rushing
game, if not 300.
(06:05):
Just absolutely go off.
That's my main goal for this game.
That's your goal.
I love it.
Less important who wins.
More important, Saquon just hasthe...
Because that dude's a champ, man.
He just suffered for so many years
in the worst franchise in theleague in the Giants.
Gets over to the Eagles and justhas a stellar season.
It'd be sweet to see him cap itoff at the Super Bowl.
There you go.
you go.
Some opportunity, you know?It was a grind, but he was
probably practicing gratitudethinking, you know what?
(06:26):
I'm playing in the NFL.
in the NFL.
I think that's exactly right.
So I would love to see him win the
MVP tonight.
That's what I'm hoping for.
Okay.
All right, guys.
Well, enjoy the show.
Enjoy the game.
And yeah.
Enjoy the show.
Mike Shaw, welcome to the show,man.
Thanks for having me, boys.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Yeah.
Well, we like to just start our
show with what's your perfectFriday look like?
(06:47):
What do you do for productivity?What's kind of your daily routine?
And what do you do for fun goinginto the weekend?
Cool.
Perfect Friday would be skiing
waist -deep powder wherever Icould get that in the backcountry.
That's sort of one of my passionsthat I live for.
That's what I saw, That's what Isaw, Pete, thinking about your
history.
No kidding.
kidding.
It's a blessing to be able to
(07:08):
explore the backcountry and slackcountry that we have nearby in the
Okanagan.
But Perfect Friday on a regular
week.
I have a pretty... consistent
morning routine where I wake upbetween five and five 30 and spend
a bit of time for myself, eitherreading or just reflecting and
enjoying a coffee.
And I heard Steve on the last show
say the exact same thing.
And I'm like, oh man, he's on it
too.
(07:28):
like, oh man, he's on it too.
Recipe for success though.
Yeah, I usually start with that
intentional time for myself andthen I'll get some physical
activity in, whether it's a run ora workout.
And then I'll dive into whateverI've got on that day.
And my fulfillment comes fromsupporting others or helping them.
clinical counselor or a speaker.
So I'm usually actively working an
(07:48):
event or supporting individuals ororganizations.
And I think the fulfillment I getfrom that is what is the most
rewarding and would be the answerthat I'd probably lead with is
being helpful.
And that fulfillment would be a
perfect day.
Yeah.
What's your career?What do you tell people you do
for?career right now?
It's a good question.
a good question.
One that I've taken a while tolearn how to answer, but now I'm a
(08:09):
clinical counselor and aprofessional speaker.
I've done a number of differentprojects in the entrepreneurial
space over the years.
And so I've led with the
entrepreneur title.
I'm also an author.
I've also been a consultant inlike the safety industry.
I've done a number of differentthings, but now my big driver is
(08:30):
clinical counseling and speaking.
Nice.
Taylor and I need a lot ofcounseling and need to learn how
to speak.
counseling need to learn how to
speak.
Yeah, yeah.
You won't be short of work here.
How'd you get here?
Like obviously Matt and I knowyour story, but yeah, kind of
start from the beginning.
here.
I grew up in the Okanagan and Ilove it here.
It's amazing.
The accessibility outside here to
(08:53):
adventure is like no other.
And I grew up doing all sorts of
sports, but the one I fell in lovewith was freestyle skiing.
As a young person, I was acompetitive athlete.
Turned coach and I worked my wayup to coach the Canadian Olympic
development half pipe ski team.
And in 2013, specifically on
December 16th, 2013, my lifechanged forever.
In a routine trick demonstrationfor a couple of my athletes, I
(09:14):
performed a 720, two fullrotations where you take off
forwards and land forwards.
But on landing, I ended up like
landing.
what I call some punchy snow.
You know what I mean?I say that like, just, I punched
through these soft layers orcrusty layers of snow and it ended
up stopping my skis dead in mytrack, pitching me forward onto my
head and neck.
And my feet came up over top of my
(09:35):
body, kind of like a scorpion'stail.
And they just, this brief, butsharp pop and pain in my neck.
And then nothing.
I tumbled downhill, slid to a
stop, face down in the snow,screaming at what I thought was
the top of my lungs.
Just like, no, no, no, no, God,
(09:58):
no. This brief but sharp pain inmy neck.
I can't move.
I can't roll over.
I can't feel anything in my body.
I couldn't bounce back up to my
feet like I'd done countless timesbefore falling skiing.
And my world in that moment camephysically and figuratively
crashing down.
Did you know what happened right
away?It was a really sobering event.
Like my mental clarity was like, Iwish I could reproduce that on a
(10:19):
daily basis because I'd never beenmore clear in my mind in that
moment.
They say like your life flashes
before your eyes and a near deathexperience because it's just
searching for any kind ofexperience that's similar to that
to try to pull from.
to help you.
And so my mind was racing, but itwas also very clear because one of
my first thoughts was, well, I'mlucky I didn't just have a
(10:39):
concussion at the same time.
I'd spent about six or seven
months that year out with aconcussion, but the thought went
through my mind.
Like, I'm glad I'm not confused
and paralyzed right now because Ifigured that would be a lot
harder, but I knew because of oneof my great friends and mentors
and ski coach that was in my life,had a spinal cord injury, broke
(11:01):
his back.
rocks the world from a wheelchair
today.
His name is Josh Dueck.
So I thought of him immediatelyand I thought of my situation.
I knew the gravity of it.
So I did know right away how bad
it was.
Yeah, it was difficult.
Like I thought about everything.
I was like, I just ruined my
parents' retirement.
You know, like I was 26, I was 27
(11:23):
at the time.
And so I was like, this is going
to devastate my family.
I knew in that moment that I'd
probably lost skiing forever.
Like every hope and dream, like
wanting to go to the Olympics,which was my original dream as an
athlete that I thought I mightfulfill as a coach, like leading
the next generation that was gone.
Would I ever ski again?
Probably not.
Would I ever have a family?
(11:43):
Like, you know, kids, justeverything was proof in an instant
lost.
And my identity, everything that I
knew about myself was like wrappedup in this person.
who skied and my action spoke forthemselves, you know, like it was,
if you could hit the jump or skithe half pipe, it was what you
could do, not necessarily who youwere that mattered.
And so like my identity, myindependence, everything was just
gone.
So rock bottom.
(12:04):
That happened in Denver, right?Near Denver.
I was in Summit County, Colorado.
So near where Copper Mountain,
Breckenridge, Keystone, AerofoBasin, North Star.
There's a... ton of resorts outthat valley, but I was at Copper
Mountain in the morning and thenwe drove actually over to Keystone
that afternoon and it happened atKeystone.
Then you were airlifted to Denver,the hospital, is that right?
Yeah, airlifted to Denver, hadsurgery that night.
(12:24):
They surgically installed twotitanium rods and 10 screws in my
neck, fusing me from my thirdvertebrae down to my seventh.
You might say I've got a bit of astiff neck now.
Are the rods still there?Yeah, there?
Yeah, it's a bad joke.
It's my best material.
But they're still in there.
And I've had a remarkable recovery
(12:45):
from spinal cord injury.
And technically, I'm still an
incomplete quadriplegic.
I don't have full feeling or
dexterity in my hands, my fingers.
I lose sensation on my lower half
of my body, on my skin.
So I lose my balance like up to 50
times a day.
So like balance, coordination,
agility is difficult.
(13:05):
My strength and capacity takes so
much work to maintain.
And I deal with pain on a daily
basis, but I am so lucky.
I'm like maybe the luckiest of the
unlucky.
No one's lucky to have a spinal
cord injury, but I am gratefulevery single day for my good
fortune.
Yeah, because the studio we're in
right now is upstairs and youwalked up here, is upstairs and
you walked up here, no problem.
(13:26):
Yeah, most places in the world are
not.
accessible you know like talk
about like you know most buildingsaren't but when you start thinking
about nature a sandy beach is a no-go you know cobblestone pathway
is a no -go in a wheelchair likeor really difficult you're not
going down on river walks orhiking or you know skiing
(13:49):
adaptations are required for allof it and when i get to do some of
the simplest things like you saylike walking up a flight of stairs
into a building sometimes itcatches me and i just feel So
lucky.
What is the percentage of recovery
from an injury like that?know like the percentage of
recovery from an injury like that?I've never heard of this before,
so it's got to be obviously prettyrare.
(14:11):
Me neither.
It is certainly becoming less and
less rare now, which is awesomewith modern medical practices.
And there's better research beingdone right now.
I believe that eventually spinalcord injuries will be recoverable
on a much grander scale.
But right now, it's still a
very... small percentage of peoplethat once you have a spinal cord
injury get to get better.
So it's not lost on me how unique
(14:32):
mine is.
Like, I don't know if it's one in
a million, one in 10 million orone in a thousand, but it's not
tons.
Do you have like the medical
industry reaching out to you beinglike, reaching out to you being
like, how did you do this?Studies and stuff like that?
Yeah.
Interestingly, yes.
And it's happened.
quite recently, where in Kelowna
at UBC Okanagan, they have like 16different, they call them labs,
(14:55):
but it's under the same sort ofumbrella for spinal cord injury
research.
I teamed up with Chris West on a
project.
I'm the community representative
or the community partner from thespinal cord injury community as a
consultant on a clinical trial forquadriplegics to try to reduce the
secondary injury that occurs viaswelling in the spine for people
that have had acute injuries.
So we're actually, we've got a
grant going right now andhopefully within the year we'll be
(15:18):
testing a clinical trial to try toreduce that acute secondary
injury, which is part of thereason why I recovered.
I had prompt.
attention from, you know, medical
team and my surgery was in eightand a half hours after my spinal
cord injury.
So that secondary injury that I'm
talking about that happens usuallydelayed within the first 12 to 36
hours of swelling.
That was reduced significantly in
mind just because of how quicklythey got it.
But most people don't get intosurgery that fast.
(15:40):
I was lucky.
And so how can we do an
intervention before thenmedicinally to try to prevent that
swelling from happening?And that's our game plan.
But yeah.
Well, yeah, I mean, that's
amazing.
But let's not take anything away
from what you did mentally tolike, I know, speaking to you, and
you mentioned it already isgratitude, like how that has
(16:04):
really impacted the healing stage.
Yeah, maybe elaborate.
on that awfully astute of youbecause i actually pitched an idea
to chris west at ubco where i waslike we should do a
psychologically driven study totest how mindset and getting your
body into a place of homeostasiswith good chemistry in your brain
(16:25):
and body that's driven through themind could activate better healing
because i know in my case awfullyastute of you because i actually
pitched an idea to chris west atubco where i was like we should do
a psychologically driven study totest how mindset and getting your
body into a place of homeostasiswith good chemistry in your brain
(16:45):
and body that's driven through themind could activate better healing
because i know in my case Toolslike gratitude and shifting my
psychology opened the door tohealing.
It wasn't just that I had amechanism of injury and surgery
that made it recoverable.
My healing has been extraordinary.
And I've often walked this in linebetween how much of it was
(17:05):
surgical intervention, how much ofit was psychological intervention.
And I've had some people in mylife, some great mentors say like,
what's telling you that it's not?where your mindset was in all of
this.
And so I've been leaning into that
and I would like to study itpersonally to get definite data on
it and do an empirical study.
But for me, I'm like, I know that
the gift of gratitude was sosignificant for helping me heal.
(17:29):
Yeah.
Well, and how did you get to that
stage?Like, obviously I'm sure there was
a very dark time, whether it wasweeks or months or, but like, you
know, that would be a pretty toughreality to come out of the.
Well, not to come out of thehospital, but to come out of
surgery and be like, shit, what'snext?
How long did it take and how didyou figure that out?
Did you have books or somebodycoach you?
Like, hey man, this is where we'reat and this is where the mindset
we need to get to.
I legitimately stumbled across the
power of gratitude.
Like it wasn't an intentional
practice, but given the uniquenessof my situation, like I'd had a
(17:52):
devastating spinal cord injurywhere I was told by medical
professionals, prepare yourselfbecause you're probably never
going to walk again.
In fact, you will be lucky if you
get back the use of your arms.
And that did not include my hands
at the time, which also weren'tworking.
So it's like, whoa.
After surgery, my arms did start
(18:13):
working.
I could close my elbows.
So I had bicep function.
Yeah, when I woke up the next day,
that had changed.
And I couldn't open my elbows.
So I had bicep function, whichcloses it.
Tricep opens the elbow.
You probably haven't had to think
about that for a while.
Most people don't.
But I had to start reprogrammingmy body.
So I was sending these messagesall the time.
(18:33):
And my arms started to move.
It took me almost two and a half
weeks before I could lift my handto actually touch my face.
So like when I say they couldmove, they weren't moving a lot.
It was still very difficult.
And my legs came back a little bit
slower.
When I did start to change and my
physical body started to recover,it was like wave after wave of
thank goodness, you know, like,oh, what a really like something
is in every little bit of physicalrecovery was an opportunity for me
(18:58):
to feel this overwhelminggratitude to a point where the
first time I brushed my teeth,which was at 21 days where I could
reach my hand up high enough nowto touch my face.
They put this big rubber stopperon my toothbrush and I. I was able
to brush my teeth for the firsttime.
Kind of had like lobster clawgrip, no individual finger
dexterity.
I couldn't use my wrists.
So I had to get the toothbrusharound to every tooth.
(19:22):
I had to use my tongue actually toget it just to be at the right
angle and everything.
But with a nurse there, I was in a
neck collar.
I couldn't get my wheelchair close
enough to the sink.
They had a bucket for me and they
had to do the taps and everythinglike that.
So it wasn't exactly like I wasbrushing my own teeth.
But I was brushing my own teeth,doing something.
(19:42):
The first thing I'd been able todo for myself and my self -care in
three weeks.
And I was in tears.
I was so thankful.
I had so much joy in that moment.
And brushing your teeth for mostpeople doesn't show up as
something on the radar of thingsyou think you take for granted.
Yeah.
I started to notice.
All of those wins.
And when I did, because I couldn't
(20:03):
feel much in my body, one of thefirst things I started to feel was
emotion in my body.
When I felt emotion, depression or
grief or sorrow, like any of thenegative longing for wanting my
body back, that was all dark andcold.
But whenever I felt joy or bliss,happiness, like even something as
simple as like eating a grape andbeing like, thank goodness I have.
Grapes.
By the time I made it back to
(20:25):
Canada and I was like supported byfriends and family members, like
in a first world country with amedical system that's not perfect,
but it's free and we have it.
I was just like, I'm so lucky.
So every time I felt gratitude andespecially in poignant moments
like that example of brushing myteeth, I would feel these like
warm waves rushing over me.
That was some pretty cool
neurochemistry, oxytocin,serotonin, endorphins, a little
bit of dopamine, but all thisgreat neurochemistry, which was
(20:45):
putting me in a state ofhomeostasis.
And gratitude actually increasesyour immunoglobulin A molecule,
which is like the body'santiseptic.
It fights.
infection and supports your immune
system functioning and when you'rein that state of homeostasis your
body can actually divert resourcesto the proper places for healing
like your autonomic functions oryour immune system and so by
having this disposition ofgratitude it was And evidently
helping me heal and the chemistrybehind it and everything is stuff
(21:06):
I've learned since.
So at the time I just kind of was
there by accident, but my recoveryhas been wild.
Yeah.
Good for you, man.
I feel like a lot of people inthat position would like focus
more on the negative, right?Like be angry.
Why, why me kind of thing, but youturned it.
I had those thoughts too, right?Like survivor's guilt and like,
(21:29):
why'd this happen to me in thefirst place?
That's not fair.
So many of my friends and fellow
professional skiers that I grew upskiing with didn't have this
happen.
And then on the flip side of that
coin, it was like, why am Igetting better?
And all these other people aroundme with spinal cord injuries
aren't.
I mean, I went through a lot of
dark times.
It was devastating.
I wouldn't wish a spinal cordinjury on my worst enemy.
(21:50):
There are gifts that can come fromit.
It just depends on how you look atit.
Yeah.
So have you kind of translated
that knowledge, I guess, now toother aspects in life that
gratitude can kind of resolve alot of these issues?
(22:11):
Yeah, my go -to is gratitude as afoundation for resilience, which
is a bit counterintuitive.
And it doesn't matter if you're in
the real estate space or anotherprofession, or if you're just
wanting to get more out of life.
Like gratitude helps us frame
setbacks in the grand scheme ofthings and realize that things
(22:34):
just aren't as bad as we oftenthink they are.
And we all have a negativity biaswithin us that when we do
encounter adversity or setbacks,it consumes a lot of our
attention.
And you think about it in life and
business, though, but it feelsworse proportionately to lose
$100.
then it does proportionally feel
(22:54):
good to make $100.
Yeah.
You know, once you've got it, likeonce I was on an Air Canada flight
flying through from a speakinggig, it was one of the first
flights where Air Canada hadreleased in -flight Wi -Fi.
Yeah.
And I was sitting near the front
of the plane, surrounded by otherpeople that are business people in
their own right.
And everybody's like... thrilled
when the head flight attendantcame out and said we're so excited
(23:17):
to announce that we have our in-air wi -fi on this flight today
and as the first group you'regoing to get to use it for free
people were like standing up intheir chairs like clapping
cheering and i was like cool thisis nice and then um it was like 10
or 15 minutes later people tryingto get online where the flight
attendant comes back out and she'slike I'm sorry to let you know,
but the in -flight Wi -Fi isn'tworking.
(23:37):
And man, the look on everybody'sface is like they had just been
wrong.
There was all this, oh, Air
Canada, this, you know, like itwas like a few moments ago, you
were just happy.
Normal people, all of a sudden you
were elevated and then you crashedto rock bottom.
(23:58):
We weight positive and negativeevents differently.
We all have a negativity biaswithin us and we... can beat it.
It's within all of us.
It's a bias.
I think it's evolutionary.
A really authentic way to beat it
is with gratitude and fortify yourmindset.
Because if you look for the gifts,not the gaps in any situation,
you're going to attract more ofthat positivity for when you'll be
(24:21):
more open to it.
Your chemistry changes, like
literally your physiology changes.
You'll be a warmer person, more
coachable, more approachable.
So many benefits like that, but
it's a huge reframe on the exactsame situation that is causing you
grief.
You can look at it and be like,
what in this situation do I haveto feel thankful for?
It's like the glass is half fullmetaphor, but you're looking at
(24:44):
similar set of circumstances justthrough a different lens, which is
authentically positive.
And can actually change your
chemistry.
And if you can change your
physiology, you change your state,you can change the story you tell
yourself about that situation.
So you can change the strategy
with which you approach thesolution.
It's incredibly powerful and it'soverlooked or maybe not even
looked at at all as a resiliencetool because it's counterintuitive
when you're feeling low to thinkabout all that you have to feel
(25:07):
thankful for.
Yeah.
Because of that negativity bias,we get sucked in.
Woe is me.
Why me?
Those types of things.
So, well, and especially I find
right now, like in the past fouror five years, at least business
related or life related, like it'sa pretty.
volatile time in life, you know,things are busy.
People's businesses arestruggling.
The economy is like, you can justkind of go down that rabbit hole.
(25:28):
But I guess the question is like,how do you practice gratitude?
Like you said, you get up earlyand do some reflecting and like,
is there something that you stickto or a piece of advice you can
say, Hey, this is like a goodstarting point.
This is what people should do.
Or is it just like all day, every
day, like make sure you recenteryourself on gratitude.
(25:50):
It's a very good question.
I'm so glad you brought it up
because how do you practicegratitude?
How do most people practicegratitude?
We might have, you know, a rounddiscussion at the table at dinner
one night where you say, OK, kids,what are you thankful for?
Some people keep gratitudejournals.
That's a common one.
(26:10):
Gratitude triggers are things that
remind you in your day.
That's one I actually like,
because if there's something inyour day that can trigger you to
feel thankful, then I think that'svaluable.
Because if you ask most peoplethat try journaling, it doesn't
really work.
for gratitude journals like a lot
of people say well yeah i kind ofget some benefit out of it because
(26:33):
the thing that's missing isfeeling grateful if you just think
about the things that you have tofeel thankful for and you kind of
categorize or collect this listyou might get a little bit of
benefit out of it but if you wantyour chemistry to change like if
you want the benefits of oxytocinserotonin endorphins like said bit
of dopamine those areneurotransmitters that connect
(26:54):
different synapses in your brainYou are literally changing the way
that your mind thinks to look forsilver linings or opportunities.
Likewise, if you produce thatchemistry in your body and
endorphins, it actuallycounteracts a stress response.
You can't feel stressed andthankful at the same time.
So oxytocin is like the love drug,right?
You seek out connection and peoplelike that you wouldn't necessarily
(27:15):
if you didn't have that chemistry.
Serotonin is the happiness.
drug or happiness hormone.
And that's an incredibly powerful
neurotransmitter, especially forcombating depression.
You can actually feel thankful,create that chemistry and change
the way that you look at yoursituation based on how you're
feeling.
And so for me, when I say to
practice gratitude, it's afeeling.
And you can feel it in the morningduring reflection if that's like
just a momentary mindful breakthat you take or even at night,
especially if you've had astressful day.
(27:37):
You can actually turn every day inyour bad days into good days if
you end it with a gratitude audit.
Whereas most people have a bad day
for like one or two negativeinteractions.
Yeah.
Conversations, tough negotiation
that you didn't feel like youperformed as well as you would
have liked to in.
Or maybe there's a challenge with
your spouse or.
kids or you know someone else
that's outside your professionallife and we hold on to that stuff
(28:00):
you need to release it and thenyou can shift to gratitude one
more point i should make that'sreally important on this and it'll
probably be the next place we takethe conversation to is how you
handle negativity because if youdon't actually deal with some of
the negative thinking that youhave going on or if there is a
situation in your life that istruly bad or a bad day.
(28:20):
If you just try to suppress itwith gratitude, that also isn't a
strategy I would suggest.
You need to release the negative
or process it because I'll ask youguys this, what would you have
more benefit from?Having more positive thoughts or
fewer negative ones?What would you tell me?
I don't know.
Maybe negativity bias, we weight
the negative ones more.
So probably less negative ones.
(28:41):
You're right.
Maybe that's why I set up that
question pretty well.
Most people want to be optimistic
and they're like, oh, morepositive.
Right.
But the answer truly is like fewer
negative because your negativethoughts and beliefs are the only
ones that can hold you back, limityou or keep you stuck.
If you don't deal with thenegativity or let emotional
(29:03):
content.
process, then shifting to
gratitude right away.
It's like the second step in that
process.
And so you asked me, how do you
practice gratitude?There are a number of different
ways to practice it and close thatloop out by feeling it.
But if you don't deal with theunderlying negative beliefs,
(29:24):
whether it's about scarcity oruncertainty or self doubt, am I
capable of doing this?You know, I'm not great at sales.
I don't know if I have what ittakes to achieve my goals.
Like all of that negative thinkingneeds to be dealt with before you
can move to something positivethat supports your growth.
Yeah.
Here's a very relative question, I
guess, for all of us.
(29:45):
But yeah, so congratulations.
You're going to be a new fathersoon.
Matt, congratulations.
Second new father soon.
You know, Emily and I, my wife, wewere talking about this quite a
bit, actually, because like.
I've got two kids, happy, healthy,
doing a lot of fun stuff.
But sometimes you're like, why are
you not more grateful?Like, man, like I had a good
upbringing, but like not all thethings that we're providing for
(30:07):
our kids.
Yeah.
I'm like, you know, so like justwe were up at Big White all
weekend this weekend with our sonand daughter and friends and, you
know, take our son to ski schooland stuff.
Hey, man.
Yeah.
You like skiing.
Yeah.
Cool.
We're going to go tomorrow.
No. And then like, he'll justthrow a tantrum over whatever.
(30:27):
How do you teach gratitude at ayoung age?
You know, cause they're sovolatile.
Like there'll be like emotions areon their sleeve, right?
Best day ever, worst day ever overlike the smallest things.
But, and maybe this is a questionyou'll approach in like a year
from now, but have you everthought of like, how do you
(30:47):
install gratitude at a youngerage?
How do you provide like theplatform for them to deal with
like the negative and the positiveto close that loop?
I think in general, we needcontrast.
general, we need contrast.
of perspective so if it's all good
all the time it's still a flatline it's like you know you need a
little bit of ups and downs peaksand valleys and so the fact that
(31:10):
there are times where it'seuphoric and incredible bliss and
happiness and then times whereit's not that and it could be
quite the opposite like a full dayof tantrums or You know, that
contrast is valuable for anybodyto learn to appreciate the good
times and appreciate things thatare wonderful.
Now, I think in terms offundamentals, you can teach.
say, please.
And thank you all the time.
(31:32):
And I would imagine even withyoung people, I haven't tried
this.
I've done it with some elementary
school groups.
When I've spoken to them, I do a
mindfulness exercise and sometimesit works.
Sometimes it doesn't, but tryingto get them to feel thankful for
like their parents or things theyreally love to do and just, you
know, have them sit with that fora minute and, and feel like it
(31:56):
would be a strategy to approachthat with.
I think it's gotta be a bit oftrial and error.
And then Leading by example.
Most of what kids learn is like
what I call caught behavior.
And I was talking about this
earlier today, what's taughtversus caught for raising children
and how much do you actually teachthem versus how much are they
absorbing by, you know, watchingyou and so on.
Like it's setting an example andtruly feeling it that way.
(32:18):
And so for us, how do we feelthankful when things are, you
know.
so good, but we're still caught up
in, you know, wanting more orfeeling like we're not moving
forward enough, perhaps, orgenerally feeling like a lack of
lust for life, because maybe wehaven't had many of those ups and
downs lately.
And it has been a bit flatlined,
even if it's flatlined, and you'reat like a, you know, four out of
10, or an eight or a nine out of10 for where you, you know, think
(32:41):
happiness lives.
If it's flat, it's flat.
I think it's a societal issue,though, with comparison and
especially in hustle culture whenyou're trying to build things,
build your professional life, yourcareer, your net worth, your
access to fulfilling activities.
Like if you're in a place where
you're fortunate to move towardsfinancial freedom or that's what
your goal is, you're stillcomparing ahead or up.
So you're comparing from where youare in this moment now to where
you want to be in the futureyourself.
(33:03):
Or up ahead to where someone elseis who's at like chapter 100 in
their story and you're at likechapter 30 of yours.
You know what I mean?We rarely utilize comparison in a
healthy way where if we compareback to where we came from and for
most people, and I know this isn'tan original idea or anything like
that, but if you were to look backfive years.
(33:24):
And to realize where you are now,you've probably achieved most of
the goals that you have set outfor yourself five years ago.
So five years ago, you would belike, rock on, man, giving you a
pat on the back and being like,you're nailing it.
And yet us, we're like, oh,looking to five years ahead.
(33:45):
Me still like we're conditioned.
to be in that state.
But if you compare back to whereyou came from, and I don't
recommend this, but I think it'smore of an awareness because I'm
like, don't compare down all thetime, but be aware of where you're
at.
Because, and I think you alluded
to it at the start, like I grew upin such a, you know, a great
household or in the Okanagan.
(34:05):
Like for me, that's where I grew
up.
I was like, this is, you know.
An epicenter of awesomeness, likeso lucky to get to deliver.
And so like understanding whereyou're at, because in the
hospital, when I was gettingbetter from my spinal cord injury,
I saw plenty of people thatweren't.
And so I had that contrast inperspective there where I was
(34:28):
like, oh, goodness, like if Idon't give everything I've got to
this recovery, like there are somany people that would kill for
the opportunity to.
I don't know if that answered your
question.
I kind of went on a bit of a
tangent.
Taylor's like a full dad now.
You're like one step away fromtelling them that you had to walk
10 feet of snow uphill school bothways.
(34:49):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, the caught and
taught thing is so powerful.
Man, they are like sponges in
everything.
But I guess if you take that
mindset like throughout life withfriends and family and like, you
know, we're no different.
Yeah, we're aged, obviously.
And we're a little bit probably,you know, less malleable to that.
But like people still.
feel your energy and then drive
(35:10):
what you're driving, right?Yeah, it's applicable beyond
raising children, right?Yeah, totally.
I just have that meme in my headwhere it's like, it's a Sunday
morning, it smells like cinnamonpancakes, my favorite cartoons are
on, the snow has lately fallen,and the three -year -old is blind
with rage.
Yeah, but you're blind with rage
because you're a three -year -old.
(35:32):
Yeah.
I mean, you're probably right.
They don't have a lot to compare
it to, right?It's like life's pretty cruisy for
them.
Let it happen.
it happen.
Let it process.
Because the moment you starttrying to suppress that or being
like, oh, you can't feel angry oryou can't have this momentary
tantrum, it's like they'relearning emotional regulation.
Yeah.
And it doesn't matter what the
(35:53):
environment is like.
If your mindset is like.
It doesn't matter how much youtell them in that moment to like
calm down because their experienceis their experience, that
emotional rage, even though ifit's like on all accounts, you're
looking at it like, why is thishappening?
This shouldn't be.
It's an awesome conversation right
now because like even in my head,I'm thinking, okay, yeah, where's
the gratitude in that?Like, well, grateful like my son's
(36:14):
able to throw a tantrum, you know,and he's here.
And like a lot of, like you said,people can't have families.
Yeah.
Also grateful that you're setting
the baseline for his life prettyhigh.
Yeah.
Also grateful that you're setting
the baseline for his life prettyhigh.
Yeah.
And easy for me to say at three o
'clock after a good day and had acoffee and he's at daycare.
(36:34):
And then when it's bedtimetonight, try and instill that.
Oh man, I'm stoked.
You want to read another book for
the fifth time and you're yellingat me.
Yeah, it's good.
It's powerful stuff.
I love it.
It is called a practice though, a
practice though, for a reason.
And I really do believe that like,
you've got to feel it.
You got to close out that loop.
You've got to cut out negativityif that's what's holding you back.
(36:54):
And like, maybe tell yourself adifferent story before you can
actually start feeling.
thankful for your present
situation or the one you're aboutto have and open yourself up to
that reality with like authenticgratitude but the opportunity to
like shift mentally in times whereit is really difficult it falls
back on a bit of practice like youneed some repetitions before it
comes the default mindset but whenit does it's pretty awesome i
still have to work on it nowbecause the farther i get out from
(37:18):
my accident the harder it getssome days, you know?
I'm human as well with all this.
So with your injury, your injury,
is your injury always gettingbetter?
Like, is there a regression riskor like, how does that look for
you?It's interesting because my
neurological picture plateauedwhat it felt like between like
year two and three in recovery.
(37:39):
interesting because my
neurological picture plateauedwhat it felt like between like
year two and three in recovery.
Like my sensation on my body
hasn't changed, but I havecontinued pushing really hard,
setting big.
physical objectives and goals to
try to keep myself reaching thenext level of what I can handle
physically.
And my capacity has continued
getting better and better, likewith endurance training and skiing
and stuff like that.
I'm back in the mountains and
doing it in a way that if youwould ask me 11 years ago, if I
(38:02):
thought it were possible, Iprobably would have told you no.
So I've even beat some of theexpectations or achieved some of
the things that I didn't eventhink were possible.
So I'm pretty stoked.
But it's been a physical plateau,
like in neurological sense, butnot in terms of what I've been
able to accomplish.
I've set some pretty lofty goals.
So, yeah.
Good for you.
(38:22):
And I mean, so many otherchallenges and achievements you
have to make now too, right?Like, so where's business at now?
You're coaching, training otherpeople, business people, just
mostly on mindset now.
Like, or are you helping on
recovery on injuries as well?Like, who are you mostly speaking
to and working with?In my speaking and like consulting
or coaching role, it's more likeorganizations.
And I've worked with someindividuals one -on -one, but it's
primarily like sharing a messageof resilience and gratitude and
team building, shared vision,leadership.
managing uncertainty,organizational transformation.
I do all that from the stagetypically or like online.
(38:44):
And so I've spoken in front oflike 40 ,000 people in audiences
over the last six or seven years.
It's been a lot of fun traveling
to do talks and conferences andstuff like that.
But as of recently, I've justshifted gears more into the mental
health space.
And I've started a new company
called Gratis Health.
Gratis is G -R -A -T -U -S.
That's the Latin origin forgrateful.
My goal is to get into integrativehealth and support people from
mind and body like psychosomatichealing.
People that are either strugglingwith a physical presentation that
(39:05):
their physical healing isencumbered by their psychology
because they haven't got to thatplace where their mind and body
place that's open to heal.
So help them with mental blocks or
if people's physical presentationis directly.
linked to their psychology becauseof something like trauma that
they're holding in the body oremotional suppression, chronic
(39:25):
pain and stuff like that.
Even as much as like functional
neurological disorder, I've helpedcure non -epileptic seizures.
So I've had a client that wentfrom having like three to four non
-epileptic seizures a week relatedto trauma down to about one close
call a month.
where they can start to recognize
a seizure coming on and then withpsychology take themselves back
from the edge and prevent it fromeven happening.
So I'm really excited with GratisHealth is going to bring about in
(39:47):
terms of blending mind and bodyhealing.
Awesome.
Good for you.
Before we jump into our wrap -upquestions here, tell us about the
Kelowna Marathon.
Oh, man.
Okay, this year I ran the KelownaMarathon.
I didn't know how hard it wasgoing to be.
It's like marathons are...
It's such a huge physical
challenge to overcome for anybody,but let alone somebody who had a
spinal cord injury.
And I've done a fair bit of
(40:09):
running over the years, butnothing to that extent.
And I would like to share withpeople that you're capable of more
than you think you are, or you cando more than you think you can do.
You may have heard that, but Isubscribe to the idea that you can
do as much as you think you cando.
So your mindset and all this is soimportant.
And for me, setting a goal likedoing a marathon was preposterous
(40:31):
initially.
And even once I got into the
training, I was like, man, why didI even start doing this?
It's way too hard.
But the goal is set and I ended up
completing the race.
And then it is true that if you
choose to change your mind about acertain situation and believe that
you've got it within yourself topush through or that if it's not
(40:53):
working out right now, it'llalways work out.
Because things always work outthat feeling of I'm just not
finished yet.
I just need to keep going.
If you truly believe that you'vegot it within yourself to achieve
your goals or succeed on thebackside of adversity, that to me
was like the epitome of that.
And if everybody out there is
(41:14):
listening to it could take thataway, I'd say this would be a big
success for me in this wholeconversation.
It's like you've got it withinyourself, like trust that you're
capable of as much as you thinkyou are.
So aim high.
Man, you're going to run out of
(41:35):
big stuff to do.
Like you're just ticking off
everything.
Hey, that's impressive.
Yeah.
I think being a family man is the
next big thing.
know next big thing.
That is a trade for a marathonwith a young child.
a trade for a marathon with ayoung child.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's the next.
It's going to be wild.
Yeah.
trade All right.
(41:56):
Well, yeah, we'll dive into ourwrap up stuff here.
If you could buy a property in theOkanagan in the next 12 months,
what would it be?My desire would be to have.
be to have.
Land, privacy, and a view.
So potentially in Lake Country upon the hill overlooking Okanagan
or even Kelowna Mission would bephenomenal.
(42:19):
I love Kelowna.
I'm from the North Okanagan, but
I've definitely started to feelmore like Kelowna is home these
days.
But I would look for something
where I have a little bit ofprivacy.
A view of the water and themountains around here is part of
why we live here.
Yeah.
And that would be my go -to forsure.
(42:41):
Nice.
If you could give your 20 -year
-old self any advice, what wouldit be?
I would tell my 20 -year -old selfto not be so hard on yourself.
would tell my 20 -year -old selfto not be so hard on yourself.
I was in a sport and a career thatit was like very much about
(43:01):
performance and hitting metrics.
And in fact, this is very
vulnerable and for me to evenshare, but I gave up on my
competitive dreams too soon.
And I wish I could have gone back
and said, stay persistent, stay init and believe in yourself because
you're capable of as much as youthink you are.
And your thoughts are directlyrelated to those self -beliefs.
So believe that you have it withinyourself to achieve the things
(43:23):
that you want to achieve.
That's great.
Yeah.
I feel like a lot of people have
probably call it a little bit tooearly.
You know, what's the worst thatcan happen?
You're going to have a bit morefun in life and, you know, do
something you love.
Yeah.
Good for you.
Yeah.
It's like so much growth lies onthe backside of that uncertainty
and risk.
Yeah.
Like that's where the magic is.
(43:44):
Yeah.
What's your favorite charity orhow do you get back?
your favorite charity or how doyou get back?
My favorite charity, that one'seasy, is the Wings for Life
Foundation.
And my big give back every year is
organizing a world run event.
I'm doing one here in Kelowna this
year on May 4th.
It's a 4 a .m.
run.
So for those of you that don't
like getting out of bed, this isgoing to be extra special for you
(44:08):
because you'll be living outsideyour comfort zone.
But it's definitely May the 4th bewith you.
Yeah, 4 a .m.
on May the 4th.
But I team up with the OkanaganLifestyle crew, Jax and Ryan and
their team.
They open up their doors, the
venue.
That's where everybody meets.
And then we set off from there.
But it's a charity for spinal cord
injury research.
It's all about running for those
(44:29):
who can't.
There's no minimum or maximum
distance.
Once you start running, you just
want to see how far you can go. 30minutes after you start running,
everybody downloads an app.
The finish line actually starts
coming after you.
Oh, you got to stay ahead of the
finish line.
So you're being chased.
Like for anybody that loves alittle bit of an adventure, like,
you know, living outside theircomfort zone, because nobody wants
to get up and start running at 4 a.m.
Does the finish line just getfaster and faster?
(44:51):
finish line just get and faster?Yes.
Nice.
And so after 30 minutes of it
going, it goes from 15 kilometersan hour to 16.
Most people surprise themselveswith how far they can actually go.
A lot of people run like 10Ks thatdon't normally run 10Ks.
And some people that are used torunning a little bit run like 15
to 20.
It's all for spinal cord injury
research.
And we're having an event in
(45:13):
Kelowna.
in may and it's run all around the
world it's the biggest runningevent on the planet there's like
280 000 people approximately thatran it together last year at the
exact same time that's why itstarts at 4 a
m in our time zone we just have acrazy yeah we don't have the best
time zone for it but it's ashotgun start around the world
it's a very very cool uh projectthat's an awesome that's a nice
(45:33):
event yeah you guys should comeout yeah where i am i would love
to i'm doing the bmo half that dayare you yeah yeah that's they'll
be with you there the challengedouble up it probably doesn't
start till nine yeah i'll just runto vancouver we've got some great
groups like accessible okanagan isgoing to come out for the spinal
cord injury community and uh northend run group like they've got a
lot of members that we're gonnatry to pull out this year and get
(45:55):
a bunch of people just to gettogether and a guys should come
out where i am i would love to i'mdoing the bmo half that day are
you yeah yeah that's they'll bewith you there the challenge
double up it probably doesn'tstart till nine yeah just run to
vancouver we've got some greatgroups like accessible okanagan is
going to come out for the spinalcord injury community and uh north
end run group like they've got alot of members that we're gonna
(46:15):
try to pull out this year and geta bunch of people just to get
together and Do some good exerciseactivism, I like to call it.
That's nice.
just run to How can Taylor or I or
our listeners help you?What can we do for you?
Live with a little bit moregratitude in your daily life.
with a little bit more gratitudein your daily life.
And if you want to find me andconnect, I'm pretty easy to find.
(46:37):
My website's MikeShawSki .com.
So MikeShawSki, S -K -I dot com.
And find me on Instagram or find acopy of my book, whatever.
Reach out to me.
Connect.
I love to have conversations withpeople in our community,
especially if I can support you inany way.
And related to what we talkedabout here today, that'd be
amazing.
I love it, man.
Awesome, man.
It's been great talking to you.
Thank you so much for stopping by.
(47:00):
so Grateful.
Grateful that you're here.
Yeah.
Grateful to be here.
Thanks for having me.
to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Okay.
Have a good one.
You too.
Popular Podcasts
Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club
Welcome to Bookmarked by Reese’s Book Club — the podcast where great stories, bold women, and irresistible conversations collide! Hosted by award-winning journalist Danielle Robay, each week new episodes balance thoughtful literary insight with the fervor of buzzy book trends, pop culture and more. Bookmarked brings together celebrities, tastemakers, influencers and authors from Reese's Book Club and beyond to share stories that transcend the page. Pull up a chair. You’re not just listening — you’re part of the conversation.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com