What does it look like when a church opens its arms to strangers in crisis? Discover how radical hospitality prepared fertile ground for sharing the gospel with Ukrainian refugees.
📖 Summary:
In this deeply moving episode, Pastor Oliwer Cieslar shares how his church in Poland became a place of refuge and transformation during the Ukrainian war. With no refugee infrastructure in place, the Polish church—and the wider community—mobilized overnight to provide shelter, food, and spiritual care to thousands. Discover how a crisis became a catalyst for gospel hospitality and lasting unity in the body of Christ.
🔑 Main Points:
- Crisis Met with Compassion: In the early days of the war, Oliwer’s church of 200 mobilized and organized buses to rescue 650+ refugees, providing shelter and support.
- From Short-Term Shelter to Long-Term Integration: As weeks turned into years, the church adapted—offering language classes, job support, and a spiritual home for displaced Ukrainians.
- Stories of Salvation and Unity: Oliwer shares powerful stories of Ukrainian refugees finding faith in Christ and being baptized into a new spiritual family.
- Lessons for the Global Church: Compassion became a spiritual awakening in a secularizing culture. Oliwer challenges global churches to embrace the power of hospitality.
Guest Bio:
Oliwer Cieślar born in Poland, associate pastor in local church in Opole. Holds degree in Computer Science and Masters at Practical Theology from Glyndwr University. In ministry since 2014, works for online evangelism ministry DeoLink Association. Project manager for The Chosen TV series in Poland. Husband and a father of two daughters.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
.105802428because of the, situation, people started to open their houses, their doors, their fridges, To like total strangers and started to take them in because there was no facility, no refugee camps, nothing like that. 2 00:00:15,793.502465853 --> 00:00:26,366.419085359 people felt compassion out of the injustice, like, how can you start a war without no reason? you are never alone when you are in the crisis. 3 00:00:26,451.431028441 --> 00:00:46,861.877300666 With the whole church you are all united and when one, piece of the body is, in the ill, in a situation, The rest of the body is taking care of it A very warm welcome to the Luanne Movement Podcast for those who have a passion to accelerate global mission together. 4 00:00:47,415.66956372 --> 00:01:04,95.66956372 My name is Jason Watson, and today on the podcast we have a moving interview lined up for you with Oliver Claw, a pastor from a church in Poland as we explore what it means to practice gospel hospitality in the midst of a humanitarian crisis. 5 00:01:04,458.036475879 --> 00:01:21,468.036475879 In our conversation, Oliver shares how his church and community responded to the war in Ukraine, welcoming refugees with open homes and open hearts, and how that outpouring of compassion has led to gospel proclamation and salvation among refugees. 6 00:01:22,158.036475879 --> 00:01:36,48.036475879 So if you've ever wondered what it truly looks like to be the hands and feet of Jesus in a time of war, I wanna invite you to grab your headphones and let's dive into today's interview with Oliver Clar. 7 00:01:38,245.30194433 --> 00:01:40,135.30194433 Well, Oliver, welcome to the podcast. 8 00:01:40,215.30194433 --> 00:01:41,355.30194433 It's great to have you with us. 9 00:01:41,572.97272071 --> 00:01:43,112.97272071 Thank you so much for having me. 10 00:01:43,390.43489244 --> 00:01:49,624.34525342 Yeah, I'm I'm really excited to have this conversation with you as we, we talk about, the Polish church. 11 00:01:49,674.34425342 --> 00:01:57,219.08915783 We talk about the Ukrainian crisis that has, uh, has really impacted a lot of, your ministry and you've got some stories to share. 12 00:01:57,229.08915783 --> 00:02:01,200.38282496 And so, I'm really excited to have this conversation with you. 13 00:02:01,770.38282496 --> 00:02:13,109.97851043 But to kick us off, could you share a bit about your own background with our listeners, how you came to faith and your role in the church and the broader Christian community in Poland? Yes, uh, with pleasure. 14 00:02:13,555.64559788 --> 00:02:16,515.64559788 been raised in a pastoral house. 15 00:02:16,598.53139202 --> 00:02:23,124.72387886 so my father was a pastor and, I think I'm the fourth generation of, of, Wow. 16 00:02:23,674.31856433 --> 00:02:27,744.8746575 in, my family, which I just count as a privilege. 17 00:02:27,824.8746575 --> 00:02:31,194.8746575 Not to, not to brag about myself. 18 00:02:31,714.8746575 --> 00:02:36,980.99264443 And, Since 2014, I became, ordained in the church. 19 00:02:37,60.99264443 --> 00:02:40,400.99264443 I, I started to become, uh, associate pastor. 20 00:02:41,10.99264443 --> 00:02:44,140.99264443 And since my childhood, I just loved the church. 21 00:02:44,340.99164443 --> 00:02:45,879.55957189 I loved, the ministry. 22 00:02:45,919.55957189 --> 00:02:52,378.69962067 And whenever I was, ready or whenever someone asked me to do, I was just willing to serve. 23 00:02:52,928.69962067 --> 00:03:06,537.60712361 And because I get some, some, experience in the church, after that I was able to start my work because I already have some experience through the church. 24 00:03:06,617.60712361 --> 00:03:10,346.16119603 So the church was always a big part of my, life. 25 00:03:11,351.16119603 --> 00:03:14,371.16119603 And I just wanted to give it back to the community. 26 00:03:14,841.16119603 --> 00:03:40,796.26610182 And, my personal, faith started when I was in, a position of, crisis when I felt that my life is empty and I was feeling like I am like a big bubble, is floating in the air and just one small item and I will blow up and, uh, uh, my life will be, you know, useless. 27 00:03:40,856.26610182 --> 00:03:45,599.92416496 So I felt that I just need Christ in my life. 28 00:03:45,934.92416496 --> 00:03:51,634.92416496 Not for 10 percent or 50%, but for the 100%. 29 00:03:51,644.92416496 --> 00:04:07,338.25749829 And when I committed, my life changed and I just became, whole, in a sense, that I, I know who I'm serving and that being in God's will is just for me the best place to be. 30 00:04:07,930.92416496 --> 00:04:19,489.01697933 So right now, what is your role? How are you serving, the kingdom in I'm serving as an associate pastor in a local church in Opole, which is in the south part of Poland. 31 00:04:19,835.23773029 --> 00:04:30,617.02086459 It's a Pentecostal church and very happy to be in like a team of three pastors who are serving here. 32 00:04:31,37.02086459 --> 00:04:42,262.02086459 So, I, it's, this is my Like a perspective of the not very big city, but a pretty small city. 33 00:04:43,56.68753125 --> 00:04:51,569.2066867 So, those who have been listening to the podcast for a while will know that, whenever I hear that there is a generational blessing of, ministers. 34 00:04:51,579.2076867 --> 00:04:54,69.2076867 So you mentioned there's been four generations. 35 00:04:54,69.2076867 --> 00:04:56,829.2066867 You're the fourth generation of ministers of the gospel. 36 00:04:57,369.2076867 --> 00:05:03,213.58198303 I always stop and ask the question, how that came to be, you know, I think there's often this. 37 00:05:04,113.58198303 --> 00:05:09,913.58198303 misconception that pastors kids or minister kids always fall off the wagon, or they're always rebels. 38 00:05:09,913.58198303 --> 00:05:31,32.16171817 But you seem, I mean, you mentioned that you have a love for the church and, and I'll just be curious to hear from you before we dive in to, why you believe that is, what was it that your parents did that set you up to, to have a genuine love for Christ? Maybe I start with my grand because his story is very amazing. 39 00:05:31,32.16171817 --> 00:05:34,461.79289037 So he was raised in a Catholic family. 40 00:05:34,766.24775725 --> 00:05:38,751.77758418 And because, pre war he wanted to have a better life. 41 00:05:38,761.77858418 --> 00:05:46,480.43599195 So he migrated to United States to find a new land, a new, land of promise. 42 00:05:47,220.43599195 --> 00:05:47,770.43599195 And. 43 00:05:48,108.51734822 --> 00:05:55,960.56785327 be able to support his family, and he really finds something new, but in, in the faith sphere. 44 00:05:56,320.56685327 --> 00:06:18,781.32846257 So, he met with Christians from the Azusa Street, in New York, and he just, catch the fire of the Holy Spirit and started to move in this sphere and, and he just had the passion of, telling everyone about, Christ, about the Holy Spirit, about the God who is moving in our society. 45 00:06:19,67.79302458 --> 00:06:31,828.84513198 A few years later he, came back from the States to his own, country and, instead of bringing, lots of goods and money, he brought lots of books, Bibles and literature. 46 00:06:31,960.92876061 --> 00:06:35,575.51179865 for the church and for the people who would be interested. 47 00:06:35,688.24284151 --> 00:06:54,232.38820308 and his first way of preaching was to, go to the houses of their neighbors, go to those who had some family or relatives in the States and started to telling about their relatives and also started to tell about, about new faith. 48 00:06:54,991.66576497 --> 00:06:57,201.89097092 new, outpouring of the Holy Spirit. 49 00:06:57,531.89097092 --> 00:07:03,301.32599387 So, this was his way of, telling, Christ by visiting home by home. 50 00:07:03,301.32599387 --> 00:07:28,547.4314929 And for me this, story is very impactful because I can see that from the generation to generation God is faithful and God is moving us into new directions and I'm just trying to, see myself in this new way and try to, to find His purpose in my life. 51 00:07:29,67.4304929 --> 00:07:35,962.4314929 And the biggest blessing is that I feel at home when I'm doing his will. 52 00:07:36,882.4314929 --> 00:07:38,862.4314929 So this is the best place to be. 53 00:07:39,392.4314929 --> 00:07:42,362.4314929 And I just don't want to be anywhere else. 54 00:07:42,910.09815957 --> 00:07:43,420.09815957 That's wonderful. 55 00:07:43,430.09815957 --> 00:07:47,310.09815957 Thank you for going personal and just sharing a bit about that. 56 00:07:47,657.75798917 --> 00:07:55,712.15289069 so this conversation's all about, the Ukrainian war, but more specifically, the Polish church's response to, to the war. 57 00:07:56,82.15189069 --> 00:07:59,748.55224113 Now, for those who are listening in, we are recording this. 58 00:07:59,913.56513848 --> 00:08:07,811.33510778 on the 13th of February, 2025, and, uh, the Ukraine war officially broke out, in February, 2022. 59 00:08:07,841.33610778 --> 00:08:37,54.15276748 And so we, we sitting on just shy of three years, well, as we recording this three years of that happening, I'd be curious to hear from you, Oliver, what was your first response when the war in Ukraine broke out in February, 2022? And, and how did you and your church decide to step in? remember that I was so shocked about the aggression of Russians into Ukraine and, and I felt like very depressed. 60 00:08:37,84.15276748 --> 00:09:00,830.68338343 And at the beginning, everyone, not only Ukrainians, but Poles were thinking, what will happen next? Is it going to spread? Will the war go out? Should we pack also? Nothing was really clear, but, we knew that, that this aggression was, it, it, it wasn't, it wasn't fair. 61 00:09:00,907.95207349 --> 00:09:08,829.75220631 it was something that, nobody expected, but we wanted to step in and help in any way possible. 62 00:09:09,449.75220631 --> 00:09:14,482.13947259 In Poland the solidarity, word means a lot to us. 63 00:09:14,562.13947259 --> 00:09:22,592.60885704 So be solidar with those who are suffering and stay with, those who are, in oppression, in, in the need. 64 00:09:23,152.60885704 --> 00:09:34,28.99734818 So just, just before the war, in our pastoral team, we were thinking about the next, Next, uh, sermon sessions. 65 00:09:34,108.99734818 --> 00:09:37,688.99734818 And we all agreed that we need to talk about missions. 66 00:09:38,448.99734818 --> 00:09:43,724.17459268 We need to talk about missions, missions abroad, missions in, our city. 67 00:09:44,334.17459268 --> 00:09:59,814.17359268 And really, a few weeks after the war broke out, I realized that God was already preparing us for the missions, but not in a sense of going out, but the missions came to us. 68 00:10:00,314.17459268 --> 00:10:05,984.25306738 So our heart were already prepared to, to serve, to be helpful. 69 00:10:06,545.24706416 --> 00:10:10,175.24606416 so we, we just wanted to do any, anything. 70 00:10:10,365.24606416 --> 00:10:13,855.24606416 And we had this blessing of, of having a couple of families. 71 00:10:14,215.24706416 --> 00:10:23,681.63635414 from Ukraine, before the war, who came to Opole, settled in, in the church, they started some businesses, and they were very lovely people. 72 00:10:23,681.63635414 --> 00:10:29,821.63635414 So, so they were the first one who, who started to, like, operate. 73 00:10:30,11.63635414 --> 00:10:45,157.01855283 What can we do? And because of the war, the first thing people started to fleet, from Ukraine, especially from the east side and the middle side, people were just trying to, find a shelter. 74 00:10:45,252.8058224 --> 00:10:51,146.27778949 and, it was really, really huge thing for the movement of people. 75 00:10:51,626.27778949 --> 00:10:55,951.27778949 So we decided to, to rent some buses, we decided to go to the. 76 00:10:56,541.27778949 --> 00:11:03,385.52244082 to the border, pick people up from the border and transport them into, our town. 77 00:11:03,675.52244082 --> 00:11:10,832.18810749 And, you know, try to find some shelter for them, try to locate them, make them, home. 78 00:11:11,162.18810749 --> 00:11:16,922.18910749 And people at the beginning of the war, especially Ukrainians, thought that they are migrating for a week. 79 00:11:17,142.18910749 --> 00:11:19,12.18910749 Or two, maybe a month. 80 00:11:19,52.18910749 --> 00:11:25,372.18910749 That, that was, that was the, the biggest period they, they thought they will be out of the country. 81 00:11:25,402.18910749 --> 00:11:28,635.52144082 But unfortunately, it wasn't the case. 82 00:11:28,845.52244082 --> 00:11:34,671.18053549 So, our small congregation, we, we had around, 200 members. 83 00:11:35,153.42272987 --> 00:11:41,583.42272987 we send buses to collect 650 people and, and transport them to Opole. 84 00:11:41,633.42272987 --> 00:12:08,441.1729937 And then, you know, on the fly you were calling to some offices, to some dormitories, to some universities where they could be put, where are some rooms to, to rent or, or to, give them so they, they will be able to sleep in, uh, Good conditions, especially because they, all of them were in distress, in a very bad shape. 85 00:12:08,501.1729937 --> 00:12:13,547.83966037 You know, you don't know what you're gonna have when you come back. 86 00:12:13,677.83966037 --> 00:12:23,977.83866037 If it's going, still be going to, to be like a house or it will it be destroyed? So people's mind were occupied with the stress and the crisis. 87 00:12:24,667.83966037 --> 00:12:32,474.83407153 So we needed to, find some, some shelter for them, at least to, to take care of the, the basic needs. 88 00:12:32,915.18099179 --> 00:12:37,446.96082333 I think it wasn't only the church that, helped at the beginning of the war. 89 00:12:37,736.95982333 --> 00:12:43,256.96082333 It's really worth mentioning that it was like a society upbringing. 90 00:12:43,736.96082333 --> 00:13:03,525.43237381 People, because of the, the situation, people started to open their houses, their doors, their fridges, To like total strangers and and started to you know, take them in because there was no facility, no refugee camps, nothing like that. 91 00:13:03,925.43237381 --> 00:13:12,185.43137381 So either you take a person or a family to your home or they will, you know, they will freeze. 92 00:13:12,325.43137381 --> 00:13:13,925.43137381 It's winter, it's cold. 93 00:13:14,295.43137381 --> 00:13:33,885.89907692 So what can you do? And, and people out of compassion, started to open their houses and, and start to, you know, bringing people into their, homes, feed them and give them shelter, even if they didn't understand anything that they were saying to them. 94 00:13:34,717.98953671 --> 00:13:43,728.92211115 maybe there are similarities between Polish language and Ukrainian or Russian, because they were speaking either Ukrainian or Russian. 95 00:13:44,278.92211115 --> 00:13:48,343.92211115 There are some similarities, but not Not so big. 96 00:13:49,93.92211115 --> 00:13:57,10.69992167 So the communication at the beginning was a huge barrier, but it, it doesn't matter. 97 00:13:57,230.69992167 --> 00:14:06,144.52814093 It doesn't matter where, where you have a compassion to me and you have a place to shelter someone, you just do it. 98 00:14:06,184.52814093 --> 00:14:08,70.02034471 And that was really great. 99 00:14:08,580.02034471 --> 00:14:11,800.02034471 So in the church, we had those families. 100 00:14:12,10.02034471 --> 00:14:24,597.54225023 That's, they just call to their relatives, they just call to their homes and say, Come, we'll pick you up from the border, we will accommodate you and you will, find a shelter here. 101 00:14:25,107.54325023 --> 00:14:33,228.51565381 So that was really, uh, huge blessings, that, we had those people and we just, you know, as a church supported them. 102 00:14:33,879.91104151 --> 00:14:58,773.65142907 at the beginning, we also were raising money and, and very soon, in the society, there was a lot of, help and, like a refugee center that wasn't, done by the government officials, but it was from the downward, from the bottom, uh, not from the, not from the officials, but from the, you know, people who wanted to help. 103 00:14:59,173.65242907 --> 00:15:10,918.07705188 So this, they started to organize some warehouses, sort food, sort, clothes, whatever was needed at that time. 104 00:15:11,355.55835318 --> 00:15:13,735.61214888 and they were trying to, give them something. 105 00:15:13,960.61314888 --> 00:15:16,800.61314888 For them to, to survive this first, uh, period. 106 00:15:17,239.78826295 --> 00:15:46,463.1881767 I'm still in awe that, Poles were willing to open up their doors, open up their homes and, and be so generous, you know, and I'm, I'm reflecting just in terms of my own culture, um, and where I find myself in the world and I, and I'm wondering what our response would be, not only as a society, but also as a church, you know, I would, I would hope to imagine that the church would be, you know, As open and as willing to, to open up their doors to, to refugees. 107 00:15:46,823.1881767 --> 00:15:51,931.95698268 Where do you think that comes from? you mentioned the word solidarity and, how that's important for Poles. 108 00:15:52,339.10408961 --> 00:15:59,413.10074966 where does that come from and why is that so important? I would say, it come from, like feeling the injustice. 109 00:15:59,937.14489177 --> 00:16:21,368.97857619 That people felt compassion out of the injustice, like, how can you start a war without no reason? How can you start bombarding houses where there are civilians? And how can you be so cruel? And we have a lot of history with, Like a negative history with Russians. 110 00:16:21,458.97857619 --> 00:16:37,268.46499899 So, you know, the it's like a common enemy So we thought that helping Ukrainians will be an act of Stopping the injustice and saying no to the oppressions. 111 00:16:37,813.21753289 --> 00:16:44,263.37363 So this, this was probably the, the one thing that, brought the society, together. 112 00:16:44,853.37363 --> 00:16:49,553.37363 And the second thing is that we are just brothers and sisters. 113 00:16:50,33.37363 --> 00:16:52,253.37363 And there are no barriers. 114 00:16:52,283.37363 --> 00:16:55,485.8220634 You know, the border is just a border, but. 115 00:16:55,957.9129837 --> 00:16:57,327.9129837 The same people live there. 116 00:16:57,767.9129837 --> 00:17:03,853.7296745 And because we, had Ukrainians, we, we love them, we respect them. 117 00:17:04,274.3377782 --> 00:17:14,679.5829876 we see a lot of benefits from them, how they serve in the church, how they, how they, operate, how they are praying for, for other people. 118 00:17:15,59.5829876 --> 00:17:16,249.5829876 It's just amazing. 119 00:17:16,259.5829876 --> 00:17:18,119.5829876 So they are wonderful people. 120 00:17:18,949.5829876 --> 00:17:31,590.5829876 And how can you not help them? And at the beginning of the war, they calculated that there were around two million people that crossed the border, Wow. 121 00:17:31,847.6391842 --> 00:17:35,407.6381842 the Polish border, not mentioning the other countries. 122 00:17:35,897.6391842 --> 00:17:43,318.7575027 So, you know, Such a huge crowd of people, you know, everybody need to, to help out. 123 00:17:43,693.0024909 --> 00:17:56,80.5791481 if anybody had like a empty house, or was renting a room, a flat, or, you know, any, anything that they could be, Sheltered. 124 00:17:57,300.5791481 --> 00:17:59,330.5791481 Why not? Why not? Use it. 125 00:17:59,370.5791481 --> 00:17:59,750.5791481 Use it. 126 00:17:59,780.5791481 --> 00:18:06,402.6120994 And, nobody will thank you, but, but, you know, you are doing this because you just want. 127 00:18:06,432.6110994 --> 00:18:18,610.2231548 And I think love of Christ was just outpouring and nobody was, you know, complaining feeling that he needs to earn something on this. 128 00:18:18,990.2231548 --> 00:18:28,909.0400378 No, it was just a huge, huge outpouring of God's love in a society that is getting, secular and secular. 129 00:18:29,424.0400378 --> 00:18:36,751.4244206 So, I think some people were seeing this like, uh, being decent. 130 00:18:36,861.9584163 --> 00:18:39,775.612022 it's like a test of your, humanity. 131 00:18:40,101.2774217 --> 00:18:49,687.5913205 And I'm proud of my, my country And I think you should be, and I think you should be proud of your church as well for opening up their doors and being so responsive. 132 00:18:50,167.5903205 --> 00:18:54,907.5913205 200 people to try and support 600 people is, is quite the feat. 133 00:18:55,257.5913205 --> 00:18:58,807.5913205 And then you multiply that by all the other churches that I'm sure there was a response from. 134 00:18:59,237.7913266 --> 00:19:02,577.7913266 so can, can you unpack this for me? So we, we're now sitting three years out. 135 00:19:02,577.7913266 --> 00:19:02,877.7913266 So. 136 00:19:04,97.7913266 --> 00:19:24,292.7913266 I'm speaking from a global perspective, you know, we would go on to the news sites and I mean there would be a daily countdown, day five of the war, day 70 of the war and then obviously with Israel Palestine, almost as if The Ukrainian situation kind of just disappeared from the global consciousness. 137 00:19:24,802.7913266 --> 00:19:27,452.7913266 And so I would love for you to, to unpack. 138 00:19:27,452.7913266 --> 00:19:35,412.7903266 And I mean, even the stories of, of the Poles opening up their homes, those are all part of the narrative that, that we were receiving. 139 00:19:35,516.1236599 --> 00:19:45,6.1226599 Can you unpack for us, like what happened from those early days of you opening up your homes? They thought they were going to be there for maybe a maximum a month. 140 00:19:45,556.1236599 --> 00:19:46,616.1231599 We're now three years out. 141 00:19:46,616.1231599 --> 00:20:02,270.9146257 So can you maybe bridge the gap for us so that we can hear a little bit more about what's happened within your own circumstances? Uh, at the beginning, there was prayer and, you know, support, had to be, uh, both legs on. 142 00:20:02,970.9146257 --> 00:20:10,270.9146257 So, so we were organizing transport and figure out how we gonna feed them. 143 00:20:10,337.1635907 --> 00:20:20,414.8312179 what are the needs and, and, uh, And since the beginning, we, we started a prayer, daily prayer, the masses of Ukraine's that were coming. 144 00:20:20,981.4498201 --> 00:20:23,415.9097961 They wanted to meet and they wanted to pray. 145 00:20:23,415.9097961 --> 00:20:25,595.9097961 And we joined the prayers. 146 00:20:26,165.9097961 --> 00:20:46,582.7112972 And every week, every sermon that we had, we started with a prayer for the Ukraines and we prayed in Polish, in Ukraine, and at the beginning we, you know, we just wanted to, you know, to host them and to make a safe place for them. 147 00:20:47,2.7112972 --> 00:20:55,992.7102972 But after some time you started to realize that this situation will be a permanent situation. 148 00:20:56,442.7112972 --> 00:20:59,798.3504772 So, months were passing by. 149 00:21:00,308.3504772 --> 00:21:23,910.9004648 And you start to think, okay, what's, what will be the next step? Will they stay? Will they go to school? Uh, will they start learning a language? And from, you know, the first response, team, we started to think about how to Help them navigate through life in the long term period. 150 00:21:24,720.9004648 --> 00:21:45,122.3236073 So there were like Polish classes helping out with accommodating them in in the schools because a lot of Ukrainians came Not not whole families But, rather, women with their children or the elder, uh, people. 151 00:21:45,598.4455273 --> 00:21:47,528.4465273 So, because the men were at the war. 152 00:21:48,40.310339 --> 00:21:49,620.309339 Men were, in the army. 153 00:21:50,240.310339 --> 00:22:01,240.2321368 They could not go, outside of the country, only if you had three or more children you were allowed at the beginning of the war to, to go through the border. 154 00:22:01,760.2321368 --> 00:22:24,599.2273997 So, you know, families displaced and how can we navigate that? And on top of that, our church was rebuilding, renovated, and instead of having like a big hall, we were squeezing in a small room and every week there was 100, 200 people more. 155 00:22:24,719.2283997 --> 00:22:28,754.2283997 So, you know, challenge is and challenge. 156 00:22:30,124.2283997 --> 00:22:32,804.2283997 But with the challenge comes the blessing. 157 00:22:33,44.2283997 --> 00:22:42,587.3273228 So we rented the bigger space for all of us to meet in a good condition and show our love and support. 158 00:22:43,343.5978913 --> 00:22:45,3.5978913 the church was very impacted. 159 00:22:45,503.5978913 --> 00:22:54,263.5978913 Even the way what to preach, how to communicate about war, how to tell about God's love. 160 00:22:54,928.5988913 --> 00:23:05,95.1181288 And how you, you know, keep the, the faith going and how to navigate them through the crisis. 161 00:23:05,645.1171288 --> 00:23:10,136.5120757 That was, I think, our big challenges for all of us. 162 00:23:10,486.5120757 --> 00:23:16,336.5120757 Should we say, everything is fine, you, you're gonna be okay. 163 00:23:16,376.5120757 --> 00:23:24,881.5120757 Or should we say, everything is fine, you, you're That God is in the midst of the crisis or, you know, that, that was the challenges. 164 00:23:24,891.5120757 --> 00:23:43,818.7346344 So, we started to, to have also this, long term, support in a sense of, uh, helping find jobs, teaching them Polish language, accommodating them in the schools, helping them out with some legal stuff, permits and, and so on. 165 00:23:44,558.4225954 --> 00:23:48,928.4215954 with this mindset that they are, they want to go back home. 166 00:23:49,518.4215954 --> 00:23:56,588.4225954 They are here for just a short period of time and they are always thinking about home. 167 00:23:56,758.4225954 --> 00:24:02,908.4225954 So this is their second place, but for some of them it became their home. 168 00:24:03,228.4225954 --> 00:24:03,778.4225954 actually. 169 00:24:04,578.4225954 --> 00:24:10,998.4225954 So they settle in, they start their work or their businesses. 170 00:24:11,628.4225954 --> 00:24:16,469.480163 They were, they are very hardworking people, so they didn't have huge problem with, that. 171 00:24:16,773.9391389 --> 00:24:28,131.7169188 And in the church we saw a huge blessing, because not only they were very grateful for the support, but they were also, you know, a huge blessing to us. 172 00:24:28,456.7169188 --> 00:24:42,633.3486818 And we started to see that we are all, equal members of the body of Christ and everybody is unique and have the unique gifts and we can all benefit from that. 173 00:24:43,213.3486818 --> 00:24:48,50.5707705 So incorporating them in the church was, the huge blessing. 174 00:24:48,180.5707705 --> 00:24:52,790.5707705 We, we were blessing them, but they were also blessing us at the same time. 175 00:24:53,443.5707705 --> 00:25:09,38.9993754 Could you share some stories, of some Ukrainian families or individuals who, may have even just given their lives to Christ because of the hospitality that you showed them? Yes, we have find out that, Ukrainians are very diverse group. 176 00:25:09,129.0003754 --> 00:25:21,394.9011867 So, at the beginning, nobody was asking what is your church background? What is your, denomination or, or what? and we soon find out that, they are from Poland. 177 00:25:21,774.9011867 --> 00:25:48,97.8689532 Totally different backgrounds and they found shelter here because somebody wanted to have them in the church And We always thought that The diversity is beautiful That we don't need to make everybody the same or make them believe the same thing, but we can, be united in the midst of our differences. 178 00:25:48,687.8679532 --> 00:25:57,339.201186 So there, there was this family of, mother and father and, and four, siblings who just look, look the same. 179 00:25:57,349.201186 --> 00:26:03,987.5273087 They very tall guys and, they were in, in their youth. 180 00:26:04,149.1311343 --> 00:26:04,549.1311343 age. 181 00:26:04,999.1311343 --> 00:26:10,879.1311343 And after a year and a half, they decided all to be baptized. 182 00:26:11,519.1311343 --> 00:26:21,833.7733798 So we had this privilege of baptizing all four brothers in the water and be joyful with their, you know, faith. 183 00:26:22,313.7743798 --> 00:26:25,33.7743798 And they all became part of the, church. 184 00:26:25,327.0687872 --> 00:26:29,717.0687872 started to be involved and it was such a beautiful thing. 185 00:26:30,247.0687872 --> 00:26:34,707.0687872 Just recently we had a baptismal of ten people. 186 00:26:35,174.5231636 --> 00:26:37,504.5221636 and six of them were Ukrainians. 187 00:26:37,711.5001086 --> 00:26:40,914.8334419 some of them from the, Orthodox Church. 188 00:26:41,181.2960327 --> 00:26:42,721.2960327 they found faith. 189 00:26:43,9.1804747 --> 00:27:05,646.2292202 one lady who at the beginning of the war was translating all the sermons to the other Ukrainians She was also from the orthodox church and she decided to to put her whole heart into Christ and because she saw that The God is bigger than only just a church. 190 00:27:05,656.2282202 --> 00:27:09,626.2292202 That's You This is a community and this is relationships. 191 00:27:10,886.2292202 --> 00:27:21,776.2282202 So for her coming to new land was also coming to a new faith and and putting her faith in in Christ. 192 00:27:22,536.2282202 --> 00:27:40,83.4628194 I remember, One story, just at the beginning of the war, it was a story of salvation, but not in a faith manner, but real, like, salvation from the, from the issue that they were having. 193 00:27:40,93.4628194 --> 00:27:42,613.4638194 It was family of, four kids. 194 00:27:42,788.4638194 --> 00:27:53,978.7587834 So they were all six of them in a small car, in like a, um, six seat car, packed with all their goods that they could, bring. 195 00:27:54,908.7587834 --> 00:27:56,995.265925 And, their car broke out. 196 00:27:57,885.265925 --> 00:28:02,312.8733991 It, that, it, it, you know, they were not able to drive. 197 00:28:02,812.8733991 --> 00:28:05,542.8733991 They were trying to reach, uh, Poznań. 198 00:28:05,971.5314622 --> 00:28:08,601.5314622 But they were not able to, to reach it. 199 00:28:08,671.5314622 --> 00:28:11,327.4276603 So, didn't know anybody from Poland. 200 00:28:11,580.3126553 --> 00:28:12,955.6960322 but he was praying. 201 00:28:13,320.6960322 --> 00:28:16,950.6960322 that God would, you know, help in this situation. 202 00:28:17,120.6960322 --> 00:28:27,144.3540954 You know, you are in a different country, your car broke out, your whole family is here, it's beginning to be, night, and you don't know what to do. 203 00:28:28,24.3540954 --> 00:28:35,773.7857655 So he started to pray and, another friend from States had this sense of, I need to call this guy. 204 00:28:36,283.7857655 --> 00:28:37,293.7857655 I I know him. 205 00:28:37,403.7857655 --> 00:28:41,443.7857655 I need to call him and just ask if, if you are okay. 206 00:28:41,773.7847655 --> 00:28:49,678.7587273 So he called him and he said, thank you for calling because, I just, my car broke and I'm in Poland. 207 00:28:49,698.7597273 --> 00:28:51,238.7597273 I don't know anybody here. 208 00:28:51,608.7597273 --> 00:28:53,320.2828254 I don't have local money. 209 00:28:54,445.2828254 --> 00:28:56,5.2828254 I'm desperate in need. 210 00:28:56,355.2828254 --> 00:29:05,715.2818254 So this guy called another guy and this another guy called me and I was able to help because it was very close to my, my home. 211 00:29:06,355.2808254 --> 00:29:14,226.7962507 And I, in a matter of Minutes, I was able to call my friend in two cars. 212 00:29:14,256.7962507 --> 00:29:15,786.7962507 We drove to them. 213 00:29:15,836.7962507 --> 00:29:24,465.5430645 We, managed to, find some hotel for them and the owner of the hotel say, I won't charge them anything. 214 00:29:24,896.689193 --> 00:29:28,406.689193 they are free to stay here how long they want. 215 00:29:29,446.689193 --> 00:29:31,426.689193 Because I understand the situation. 216 00:29:32,476.689193 --> 00:29:36,896.689193 So we drove to this car, to this family. 217 00:29:36,976.689193 --> 00:29:39,256.689193 We drove them to the hotel. 218 00:29:39,626.689193 --> 00:29:58,355.8800676 We then take somebody from the hotel who actually was an engineer or mechanic and he was able to pick the car, fix it on his own cost and this family had More than enough. 219 00:29:58,375.6628143 --> 00:30:03,265.2155836 they were totally taken care of in the midst of, this crisis. 220 00:30:03,376.7141649 --> 00:30:08,336.7131649 and everywhere you ask, there were people willing to, to help. 221 00:30:08,626.7131649 --> 00:30:10,216.7131649 So, Yeah. 222 00:30:10,446.7141649 --> 00:30:11,386.7141649 God moments. 223 00:30:11,747.7141649 --> 00:30:12,207.7141649 Yeah. 224 00:30:12,207.7141649 --> 00:30:13,897.7141649 And thank you for sharing those. 225 00:30:13,927.7141649 --> 00:30:15,597.7141649 I think that it's so inspiring. 226 00:30:15,987.7131649 --> 00:30:27,533.6817704 I would love to, to begin to talk about this when we have a global audience listening to this podcast and, and I believe that, every church community has something to teach the global church. 227 00:30:27,563.6817704 --> 00:30:33,788.6817704 And as I'm, as I'm listening to the story of how, you know, The Polish church has responded to this crisis. 228 00:30:33,788.6817704 --> 00:30:36,718.6817704 I feel like there's some lessons that can be learned. 229 00:30:37,248.6817704 --> 00:30:39,568.6817704 And so I'd like to go there with you. 230 00:30:40,58.6817704 --> 00:30:42,758.6807704 But before we do, I'm curious to hear from you. 231 00:30:43,578.6817704 --> 00:31:12,174.4556618 In what ways has, has the war impacted your life? And if you had to look at Oliver three years ago, compared to Oliver today, how has God used what, what is this actually a terrible thing to, for his glory within your own life and ministry? my life was impacted in so many ways, especially in a, in a way of, that you are never alone when you are in the crisis. 232 00:31:12,631.7473985 --> 00:31:24,334.0143057 With the whole church you are all united and when one, one piece of the body is, in the ill, in a situation, The rest of the body is taking care of it. 233 00:31:24,774.0143057 --> 00:31:36,578.2322252 So we've worked with Ukrainians, those who are already in Opole, to help those who were staying in their homes in Ukraine. 234 00:31:37,98.2322252 --> 00:31:44,143.2322252 And whenever there was a need, we We prayed and the need was satisfied. 235 00:31:44,703.2322252 --> 00:31:55,896.255543 The, it, it was amazing that people from all around the world wanted to support, wanted to, to know how to pray. 236 00:31:56,156.255543 --> 00:31:57,876.255543 What to pray about. 237 00:31:58,207.2372507 --> 00:32:01,120.3008706 we were just, you know, unbelieve it. 238 00:32:01,250.3008706 --> 00:32:02,920.3008706 Uh, I couldn't believe it. 239 00:32:03,20.3008706 --> 00:32:08,110.1577894 Uh, you know, every week there was like a transport of goods, to Ukraine. 240 00:32:08,230.1577894 --> 00:32:26,931.163913 Every week there was somebody coming in and, he, Very quickly was finding a place where was finding a, a solution to, his problems and, and accommodation and everything was, you know, working very, very smooth. 241 00:32:27,531.163913 --> 00:32:30,56.0640827 And I, my life was impacted. 242 00:32:30,571.0640827 --> 00:32:33,361.0640827 of how wonderful Ukrainians are. 243 00:32:33,721.0640827 --> 00:32:38,409.4859013 How wonderful those, Christians who really love their neighbors. 244 00:32:38,792.6923197 --> 00:32:45,38.2964963 it doesn't matter what denomination, what background, what city he was in. 245 00:32:45,48.2964963 --> 00:32:48,343.0642619 He was in and, everybody wanted to help him. 246 00:32:48,933.0642619 --> 00:33:01,285.1744589 So, I'm so grateful to, to God that, I met such a lovely people and I'm, very confident that, if something happened to us, God will take care of it through his people. 247 00:33:01,735.1734589 --> 00:33:11,266.3492742 So this, really big heart to others, it's what's, stand out in the whole crisis, in the whole situation. 248 00:33:11,686.784127 --> 00:33:16,88.660405 So, uh, you joined us, in Incheon last year in September. 249 00:33:16,164.387606 --> 00:33:21,804.7152319 you joined with the global church in just celebrating together, in declaring, displaying Christ together. 250 00:33:21,854.7152319 --> 00:33:22,824.7152319 That was the mandate. 251 00:33:23,126.9477744 --> 00:33:45,991.4288973 What key lessons do you believe the Polish church has to teach the global church when it comes to to facing crisis or supporting people in war? Do you feel like there is some, there's some value that, that you could add to our global community? of course, I was, so impactful by ICHEN and, and the whole Lausanne Congress. 252 00:33:46,591.4288973 --> 00:33:56,91.4288973 And I feel the community of people, with wholeheartedly loving Christ from different nations. 253 00:33:56,471.4288973 --> 00:33:58,151.4288973 And I felt like at home. 254 00:33:58,991.4288973 --> 00:34:03,781.4288973 I felt like I'm brothers and sisters with, with all of them. 255 00:34:04,261.4288973 --> 00:34:05,551.4288973 And there is no problem. 256 00:34:06,461.4288973 --> 00:34:10,941.4288973 There is a unity between us in a spiritual sense. 257 00:34:10,981.4288973 --> 00:34:20,577.5849409 Of course, we were very different in the way we dressed or how we looked, but, you could sense that, the neighbor is your brother. 258 00:34:20,827.5849409 --> 00:34:29,477.1549653 And I think what, the global church might, might, uh, learn from it that, never underestimate your neighbor. 259 00:34:30,342.1549653 --> 00:34:42,657.7056008 In a time of situation, in time of crisis, there is so much good in people, so much, love and so much, hope when you have each other. 260 00:34:42,967.8676593 --> 00:34:53,392.6067705 even in the secular society, or becoming more and more secular society, look for the, um, Opportunity to find good in others. 261 00:34:53,764.1332463 --> 00:35:03,859.5370375 in one of the refugee center where they distributed food and clothes and those basic supplies. 262 00:35:04,319.5360375 --> 00:35:07,219.5370375 I met a lady from Greece. 263 00:35:07,626.2037042 --> 00:35:20,305.0214889 Mariana and, she's not a believer yet, but, we had this amazing connection, because she wanted to help in the situation. 264 00:35:20,662.7874992 --> 00:35:22,682.7874992 And we wanted to help also. 265 00:35:22,962.7874992 --> 00:35:26,977.3581309 So we found each other and we were able to talk. 266 00:35:26,993.0664381 --> 00:35:30,134.8442159 we spent some time, we invited her to our home. 267 00:35:30,144.8442159 --> 00:35:39,534.8442159 We had some nice conversations talking about God, talking about why we do it and why she do it, understanding the perspective. 268 00:35:40,4.8442159 --> 00:35:41,974.8442159 And it connected us. 269 00:35:41,974.8442159 --> 00:35:46,879.3600768 so much, because we were just doing the same, the same thing, the same job. 270 00:35:47,199.3600768 --> 00:35:56,719.3600768 Maybe our perspective is a little bit different or the motivation, but, uh, I would say look for the good in other people. 271 00:35:56,849.3610768 --> 00:35:59,559.3590768 And this is something that connects us. 272 00:35:59,803.5333001 --> 00:36:01,23.5333001 one other thing is. 273 00:36:01,318.6951818 --> 00:36:19,61.1581675 maybe a little bit of, of challenge, because whenever you are dislocated, whenever you, you feel not at home, you have, there is two options, either to integrate or, become a part of. 274 00:36:19,436.1581675 --> 00:36:24,206.1581675 of something that is already there or start something on your own. 275 00:36:24,746.1581675 --> 00:36:30,136.1571675 So there, sometimes there was this challenge and also opportunities. 276 00:36:30,710.9038891 --> 00:36:39,650.9038891 how should believers from Ukraine find themselves in a new place? Should they start there? Ukrainian church. 277 00:36:39,860.9038891 --> 00:36:48,148.0218287 Should they join, already Polish churches? And, uh, in our case it was disintegration. 278 00:36:48,602.8563284 --> 00:36:55,722.8553284 so they, joined the church and we had to expand our mindset, our thinking. 279 00:36:55,860.8950132 --> 00:36:59,676.6097271 How to serve both Polish and, and the Ukrainians. 280 00:37:00,133.768904 --> 00:37:11,98.9608392 But in some cases, there was, you know, new churches, uh, Ukrainians, in Ukrainian language, and it all, it's all good. 281 00:37:11,278.9608392 --> 00:37:12,28.9608392 It's all good. 282 00:37:12,238.9608392 --> 00:37:26,804.1362671 So, you can, uh, start your own ministry or you can join someone's else ministry and, God is, you know, moving in both directions and we are just so blessed to have them. 283 00:37:27,191.8029338 --> 00:37:43,181.8029338 So as we begin to wrap up the conversation, I'm sure that there might be some on the other end of who are listening in who might say, I want to know how I can, I can contribute and participate in taking care of these refugees. 284 00:37:43,603.8209284 --> 00:37:55,844.487595 As the war continues, what is still needed? How can Christians globally continue to pray for or support the work that's happening in Poland? think that the key is the prayer. 285 00:37:56,444.487595 --> 00:38:06,214.487595 And I would say the Romans 12, 15, this verse pops up, pops out of my mind whenever I think about it. 286 00:38:06,544.486595 --> 00:38:08,344.487595 Rejoice with those who rejoice. 287 00:38:08,909.487595 --> 00:38:10,799.487595 And weep with those who weep. 288 00:38:11,969.487595 --> 00:38:33,617.8539789 And I think this is, this is something that, we all need, to pray for the situation in Ukraine, to end this war and not become too accustomed to the war situation, not become too accustomed that this is something As it is. 289 00:38:33,845.9714862 --> 00:38:38,55.9714862 No, we, we want to bring peace to this nation. 290 00:38:38,135.9714862 --> 00:38:45,480.9755015 We want to bless this nation, bring them joy, bring them faith we don't want to forget, them. 291 00:38:45,970.9765015 --> 00:38:57,790.9755015 So it's been three years since the start of the war and in our church every Sunday we pray, we have a short time of prayer just for the Ukraine. 292 00:38:58,690.9755015 --> 00:39:04,23.4476085 So, we will be doing that till the war will end. 293 00:39:04,329.688178 --> 00:39:07,418.5833838 we want this country to be, touched by God. 294 00:39:07,918.5833838 --> 00:39:14,323.4181907 And we want this country to be rest with, uh, blessing and, and peace and hope. 295 00:39:14,853.4181907 --> 00:39:24,526.1806531 So, I pray that the whole church and ask the whole church to continue to pray, because the challenges are, you know, big. 296 00:39:25,147.2558038 --> 00:39:46,111.1687025 the families that were separated, children are raising up in without father, there are homes are, you know, only mothers, some, some struggles with, the young hood and adulthood and how to be part of society in other country. 297 00:39:47,171.1687025 --> 00:40:02,831.1677025 So there are some challenges in our country and in their country, but we all need to unite in prayer and and seek for God's right moment to bring peace and that's my hope. 298 00:40:02,831.2677025 --> 00:40:04,71.0110501 I Thanks, Oliver. 299 00:40:04,111.0110501 --> 00:40:12,492.4753363 And I think it'd be great for us to close this interview off with just inviting you to pray, for those who are affected and for the Ukrainians. 300 00:40:12,902.4753363 --> 00:40:25,829.3070172 But before we get there, as we close off, do you have any last thoughts that you, or words of encouragement that you'd like to leave with our listeners? last comment is that, challenge is always an opportunity. 301 00:40:26,29.2815331 --> 00:40:33,452.3187873 because, people are in a desperate need, they are looking for the things that matter. 302 00:40:33,824.0289395 --> 00:40:36,634.0279395 they are reaching out to the unknown. 303 00:40:37,79.0289395 --> 00:40:47,456.2306134 To the spiritual things and for many of people war became a blessing of, reconciliation with God. 304 00:40:48,156.2296134 --> 00:40:57,491.1977436 I know that's not for all of them, but, uh, yeah, something that, in the midst of, of crisis, in the midst of, evil. 305 00:40:58,266.1977436 --> 00:41:01,656.1977436 is still working and this is a great hope for us. 306 00:41:01,851.938549 --> 00:41:03,330.9433625 he doesn't stop there. 307 00:41:04,337.6707667 --> 00:41:08,207.6697667 using even evil to turn it into, into good. 308 00:41:08,417.6707667 --> 00:41:25,239.9965473 And just amazed our God is, wonderful and, and yeah, let's, be in his will and put our hands and mouth and, feet into action he will lead us. 309 00:41:27,43.2234448 --> 00:41:32,255.9395004 would you mind closing us off in prayer? Heavenly Father, thank you for this. 310 00:41:32,658.6591377 --> 00:41:38,311.7994689 Thank you for your, not ending help in all of our situation. 311 00:41:39,121.7994689 --> 00:41:42,575.890378 That, uh, you are not, away. 312 00:41:42,625.890378 --> 00:41:46,735.890378 You are still with us in this situation, in this crisis. 313 00:41:47,645.890378 --> 00:41:51,195.889378 I pray for the blessing of the Ukraine nation. 314 00:41:51,385.889378 --> 00:41:58,815.890378 I pray for, pray for peace that will come into their hearts and into their lands. 315 00:41:59,664.7267461 --> 00:42:04,804.7257461 I pray that the evil will stop and the righteousness will flourish. 316 00:42:05,351.9058988 --> 00:42:21,635.1937061 I pray for my brothers and sisters who came and find shelter in Poland and other countries, so they could be a part of the community, people of faith, united with you. 317 00:42:21,815.1937061 --> 00:42:30,360.1937061 And I'm so thankful that all of the circumstances, always blessing us. 318 00:42:30,370.1937061 --> 00:42:31,670.1937061 You were always there. 319 00:42:31,820.1937061 --> 00:42:36,478.2411416 You were always, with, with us and we are never abandoned. 320 00:42:36,688.2401416 --> 00:42:37,958.2411416 We are never abandoned. 321 00:42:38,48.2411416 --> 00:42:53,97.0296505 I pray that your blessings will bring this war to an end and the people, the nation will be free also in the spiritual realm. 322 00:42:53,667.0286505 --> 00:43:00,507.0286505 They will also find this amazing peace that only your goodness brings. 323 00:43:00,797.0286505 --> 00:43:03,107.0286505 In Jesus name we pray. 324 00:43:03,437.0286505 --> 00:43:03,857.0286505 Amen. 325 00:43:04,130.7559232 --> 00:43:04,670.7559232 Amen. 326 00:43:05,95.7559232 --> 00:43:05,615.7559232 Thank you. 327 00:43:06,74.7559232 --> 00:43:07,114.7549232 Thank you so much. 328 00:43:08,659.8832027 --> 00:43:12,749.8832027 Well, I hope that you enjoyed this episode of the Lausanne Movement Podcast. 329 00:43:13,29.8832027 --> 00:43:18,959.8832027 If you did enjoy the show, I want to encourage you to leave us a rating and review and share it with a friend. 330 00:43:19,448.5057384 --> 00:43:20,248.5057384 Till next week. 331 00:43:20,618.5057384 --> 00:43:21,68.5057384 Cheers.
.105802428because of the, situation, people started to open their houses, their doors, their fridges, To like total strangers and started to take them in because there was no facility, no refugee camps, nothing like that. 2 00:00:15,793.502465853 --> 00:00:26,366.419085359 people felt compassion out of the injustice, like, how can you start a war without no reason? you are never alone when you are in the crisis. 3 00:00:26,451.431028441 --> 00:00:46,861.877300666 With the whole church you are all united and when one, piece of the body is, in the ill, in a situation, The rest of the body is taking care of it A very warm welcome to the Luanne Movement Podcast for those who have a passion to accelerate global mission together. 4 00:00:47,415.66956372 --> 00:01:04,95.66956372 My name is Jason Watson, and today on the podcast we have a moving interview lined up for you with Oliver Claw, a pastor from a church in Poland as we explore what it means to practice gospel hospitality in the midst of a humanitarian crisis. 5 00:01:04,458.036475879 --> 00:01:21,468.036475879 In our conversation, Oliver shares how his church and community responded to the war in Ukraine, welcoming refugees with open homes and open hearts, and how that outpouring of compassion has led to gospel proclamation and salvation among refugees. 6 00:01:22,158.036475879 --> 00:01:36,48.036475879 So if you've ever wondered what it truly looks like to be the hands and feet of Jesus in a time of war, I wanna invite you to grab your headphones and let's dive into today's interview with Oliver Clar. 7 00:01:38,245.30194433 --> 00:01:40,135.30194433 Well, Oliver, welcome to the podcast. 8 00:01:40,215.30194433 --> 00:01:41,355.30194433 It's great to have you with us. 9 00:01:41,572.97272071 --> 00:01:43,112.97272071 Thank you so much for having me. 10 00:01:43,390.43489244 --> 00:01:49,624.34525342 Yeah, I'm I'm really excited to have this conversation with you as we, we talk about, the Polish church. 11 00:01:49,674.34425342 --> 00:01:57,219.08915783 We talk about the Ukrainian crisis that has, uh, has really impacted a lot of, your ministry and you've got some stories to share. 12 00:01:57,229.08915783 --> 00:02:01,200.38282496 And so, I'm really excited to have this conversation with you. 13 00:02:01,770.38282496 --> 00:02:13,109.97851043 But to kick us off, could you share a bit about your own background with our listeners, how you came to faith and your role in the church and the broader Christian community in Poland? Yes, uh, with pleasure. 14 00:02:13,555.64559788 --> 00:02:16,515.64559788 been raised in a pastoral house. 15 00:02:16,598.53139202 --> 00:02:23,124.72387886 so my father was a pastor and, I think I'm the fourth generation of, of, Wow. 16 00:02:23,674.31856433 --> 00:02:27,744.8746575 in, my family, which I just count as a privilege. 17 00:02:27,824.8746575 --> 00:02:31,194.8746575 Not to, not to brag about myself. 18 00:02:31,714.8746575 --> 00:02:36,980.99264443 And, Since 2014, I became, ordained in the church. 19 00:02:37,60.99264443 --> 00:02:40,400.99264443 I, I started to become, uh, associate pastor. 20 00:02:41,10.99264443 --> 00:02:44,140.99264443 And since my childhood, I just loved the church. 21 00:02:44,340.99164443 --> 00:02:45,879.55957189 I loved, the ministry. 22 00:02:45,919.55957189 --> 00:02:52,378.69962067 And whenever I was, ready or whenever someone asked me to do, I was just willing to serve. 23 00:02:52,928.69962067 --> 00:03:06,537.60712361 And because I get some, some, experience in the church, after that I was able to start my work because I already have some experience through the church. 24 00:03:06,617.60712361 --> 00:03:10,346.16119603 So the church was always a big part of my, life. 25 00:03:11,351.16119603 --> 00:03:14,371.16119603 And I just wanted to give it back to the community. 26 00:03:14,841.16119603 --> 00:03:40,796.26610182 And, my personal, faith started when I was in, a position of, crisis when I felt that my life is empty and I was feeling like I am like a big bubble, is floating in the air and just one small item and I will blow up and, uh, uh, my life will be, you know, useless. 27 00:03:40,856.26610182 --> 00:03:45,599.92416496 So I felt that I just need Christ in my life. 28 00:03:45,934.92416496 --> 00:03:51,634.92416496 Not for 10 percent or 50%, but for the 100%. 29 00:03:51,644.92416496 --> 00:04:07,338.25749829 And when I committed, my life changed and I just became, whole, in a sense, that I, I know who I'm serving and that being in God's will is just for me the best place to be. 30 00:04:07,930.92416496 --> 00:04:19,489.01697933 So right now, what is your role? How are you serving, the kingdom in I'm serving as an associate pastor in a local church in Opole, which is in the south part of Poland. 31 00:04:19,835.23773029 --> 00:04:30,617.02086459 It's a Pentecostal church and very happy to be in like a team of three pastors who are serving here. 32 00:04:31,37.02086459 --> 00:04:42,262.02086459 So, I, it's, this is my Like a perspective of the not very big city, but a pretty small city. 33 00:04:43,56.68753125 --> 00:04:51,569.2066867 So, those who have been listening to the podcast for a while will know that, whenever I hear that there is a generational blessing of, ministers. 34 00:04:51,579.2076867 --> 00:04:54,69.2076867 So you mentioned there's been four generations. 35 00:04:54,69.2076867 --> 00:04:56,829.2066867 You're the fourth generation of ministers of the gospel. 36 00:04:57,369.2076867 --> 00:05:03,213.58198303 I always stop and ask the question, how that came to be, you know, I think there's often this. 37 00:05:04,113.58198303 --> 00:05:09,913.58198303 misconception that pastors kids or minister kids always fall off the wagon, or they're always rebels. 38 00:05:09,913.58198303 --> 00:05:31,32.16171817 But you seem, I mean, you mentioned that you have a love for the church and, and I'll just be curious to hear from you before we dive in to, why you believe that is, what was it that your parents did that set you up to, to have a genuine love for Christ? Maybe I start with my grand because his story is very amazing. 39 00:05:31,32.16171817 --> 00:05:34,461.79289037 So he was raised in a Catholic family. 40 00:05:34,766.24775725 --> 00:05:38,751.77758418 And because, pre war he wanted to have a better life. 41 00:05:38,761.77858418 --> 00:05:46,480.43599195 So he migrated to United States to find a new land, a new, land of promise. 42 00:05:47,220.43599195 --> 00:05:47,770.43599195 And. 43 00:05:48,108.51734822 --> 00:05:55,960.56785327 be able to support his family, and he really finds something new, but in, in the faith sphere. 44 00:05:56,320.56685327 --> 00:06:18,781.32846257 So, he met with Christians from the Azusa Street, in New York, and he just, catch the fire of the Holy Spirit and started to move in this sphere and, and he just had the passion of, telling everyone about, Christ, about the Holy Spirit, about the God who is moving in our society. 45 00:06:19,67.79302458 --> 00:06:31,828.84513198 A few years later he, came back from the States to his own, country and, instead of bringing, lots of goods and money, he brought lots of books, Bibles and literature. 46 00:06:31,960.92876061 --> 00:06:35,575.51179865 for the church and for the people who would be interested. 47 00:06:35,688.24284151 --> 00:06:54,232.38820308 and his first way of preaching was to, go to the houses of their neighbors, go to those who had some family or relatives in the States and started to telling about their relatives and also started to tell about, about new faith. 48 00:06:54,991.66576497 --> 00:06:57,201.89097092 new, outpouring of the Holy Spirit. 49 00:06:57,531.89097092 --> 00:07:03,301.32599387 So, this was his way of, telling, Christ by visiting home by home. 50 00:07:03,301.32599387 --> 00:07:28,547.4314929 And for me this, story is very impactful because I can see that from the generation to generation God is faithful and God is moving us into new directions and I'm just trying to, see myself in this new way and try to, to find His purpose in my life. 51 00:07:29,67.4304929 --> 00:07:35,962.4314929 And the biggest blessing is that I feel at home when I'm doing his will. 52 00:07:36,882.4314929 --> 00:07:38,862.4314929 So this is the best place to be. 53 00:07:39,392.4314929 --> 00:07:42,362.4314929 And I just don't want to be anywhere else. 54 00:07:42,910.09815957 --> 00:07:43,420.09815957 That's wonderful. 55 00:07:43,430.09815957 --> 00:07:47,310.09815957 Thank you for going personal and just sharing a bit about that. 56 00:07:47,657.75798917 --> 00:07:55,712.15289069 so this conversation's all about, the Ukrainian war, but more specifically, the Polish church's response to, to the war. 57 00:07:56,82.15189069 --> 00:07:59,748.55224113 Now, for those who are listening in, we are recording this. 58 00:07:59,913.56513848 --> 00:08:07,811.33510778 on the 13th of February, 2025, and, uh, the Ukraine war officially broke out, in February, 2022. 59 00:08:07,841.33610778 --> 00:08:37,54.15276748 And so we, we sitting on just shy of three years, well, as we recording this three years of that happening, I'd be curious to hear from you, Oliver, what was your first response when the war in Ukraine broke out in February, 2022? And, and how did you and your church decide to step in? remember that I was so shocked about the aggression of Russians into Ukraine and, and I felt like very depressed. 60 00:08:37,84.15276748 --> 00:09:00,830.68338343 And at the beginning, everyone, not only Ukrainians, but Poles were thinking, what will happen next? Is it going to spread? Will the war go out? Should we pack also? Nothing was really clear, but, we knew that, that this aggression was, it, it, it wasn't, it wasn't fair. 61 00:09:00,907.95207349 --> 00:09:08,829.75220631 it was something that, nobody expected, but we wanted to step in and help in any way possible. 62 00:09:09,449.75220631 --> 00:09:14,482.13947259 In Poland the solidarity, word means a lot to us. 63 00:09:14,562.13947259 --> 00:09:22,592.60885704 So be solidar with those who are suffering and stay with, those who are, in oppression, in, in the need. 64 00:09:23,152.60885704 --> 00:09:34,28.99734818 So just, just before the war, in our pastoral team, we were thinking about the next, Next, uh, sermon sessions. 65 00:09:34,108.99734818 --> 00:09:37,688.99734818 And we all agreed that we need to talk about missions. 66 00:09:38,448.99734818 --> 00:09:43,724.17459268 We need to talk about missions, missions abroad, missions in, our city. 67 00:09:44,334.17459268 --> 00:09:59,814.17359268 And really, a few weeks after the war broke out, I realized that God was already preparing us for the missions, but not in a sense of going out, but the missions came to us. 68 00:10:00,314.17459268 --> 00:10:05,984.25306738 So our heart were already prepared to, to serve, to be helpful. 69 00:10:06,545.24706416 --> 00:10:10,175.24606416 so we, we just wanted to do any, anything. 70 00:10:10,365.24606416 --> 00:10:13,855.24606416 And we had this blessing of, of having a couple of families. 71 00:10:14,215.24706416 --> 00:10:23,681.63635414 from Ukraine, before the war, who came to Opole, settled in, in the church, they started some businesses, and they were very lovely people. 72 00:10:23,681.63635414 --> 00:10:29,821.63635414 So, so they were the first one who, who started to, like, operate. 73 00:10:30,11.63635414 --> 00:10:45,157.01855283 What can we do? And because of the war, the first thing people started to fleet, from Ukraine, especially from the east side and the middle side, people were just trying to, find a shelter. 74 00:10:45,252.8058224 --> 00:10:51,146.27778949 and, it was really, really huge thing for the movement of people. 75 00:10:51,626.27778949 --> 00:10:55,951.27778949 So we decided to, to rent some buses, we decided to go to the. 76 00:10:56,541.27778949 --> 00:11:03,385.52244082 to the border, pick people up from the border and transport them into, our town. 77 00:11:03,675.52244082 --> 00:11:10,832.18810749 And, you know, try to find some shelter for them, try to locate them, make them, home. 78 00:11:11,162.18810749 --> 00:11:16,922.18910749 And people at the beginning of the war, especially Ukrainians, thought that they are migrating for a week. 79 00:11:17,142.18910749 --> 00:11:19,12.18910749 Or two, maybe a month. 80 00:11:19,52.18910749 --> 00:11:25,372.18910749 That, that was, that was the, the biggest period they, they thought they will be out of the country. 81 00:11:25,402.18910749 --> 00:11:28,635.52144082 But unfortunately, it wasn't the case. 82 00:11:28,845.52244082 --> 00:11:34,671.18053549 So, our small congregation, we, we had around, 200 members. 83 00:11:35,153.42272987 --> 00:11:41,583.42272987 we send buses to collect 650 people and, and transport them to Opole. 84 00:11:41,633.42272987 --> 00:12:08,441.1729937 And then, you know, on the fly you were calling to some offices, to some dormitories, to some universities where they could be put, where are some rooms to, to rent or, or to, give them so they, they will be able to sleep in, uh, Good conditions, especially because they, all of them were in distress, in a very bad shape. 85 00:12:08,501.1729937 --> 00:12:13,547.83966037 You know, you don't know what you're gonna have when you come back. 86 00:12:13,677.83966037 --> 00:12:23,977.83866037 If it's going, still be going to, to be like a house or it will it be destroyed? So people's mind were occupied with the stress and the crisis. 87 00:12:24,667.83966037 --> 00:12:32,474.83407153 So we needed to, find some, some shelter for them, at least to, to take care of the, the basic needs. 88 00:12:32,915.18099179 --> 00:12:37,446.96082333 I think it wasn't only the church that, helped at the beginning of the war. 89 00:12:37,736.95982333 --> 00:12:43,256.96082333 It's really worth mentioning that it was like a society upbringing. 90 00:12:43,736.96082333 --> 00:13:03,525.43237381 People, because of the, the situation, people started to open their houses, their doors, their fridges, To like total strangers and and started to you know, take them in because there was no facility, no refugee camps, nothing like that. 91 00:13:03,925.43237381 --> 00:13:12,185.43137381 So either you take a person or a family to your home or they will, you know, they will freeze. 92 00:13:12,325.43137381 --> 00:13:13,925.43137381 It's winter, it's cold. 93 00:13:14,295.43137381 --> 00:13:33,885.89907692 So what can you do? And, and people out of compassion, started to open their houses and, and start to, you know, bringing people into their, homes, feed them and give them shelter, even if they didn't understand anything that they were saying to them. 94 00:13:34,717.98953671 --> 00:13:43,728.92211115 maybe there are similarities between Polish language and Ukrainian or Russian, because they were speaking either Ukrainian or Russian. 95 00:13:44,278.92211115 --> 00:13:48,343.92211115 There are some similarities, but not Not so big. 96 00:13:49,93.92211115 --> 00:13:57,10.69992167 So the communication at the beginning was a huge barrier, but it, it doesn't matter. 97 00:13:57,230.69992167 --> 00:14:06,144.52814093 It doesn't matter where, where you have a compassion to me and you have a place to shelter someone, you just do it. 98 00:14:06,184.52814093 --> 00:14:08,70.02034471 And that was really great. 99 00:14:08,580.02034471 --> 00:14:11,800.02034471 So in the church, we had those families. 100 00:14:12,10.02034471 --> 00:14:24,597.54225023 That's, they just call to their relatives, they just call to their homes and say, Come, we'll pick you up from the border, we will accommodate you and you will, find a shelter here. 101 00:14:25,107.54325023 --> 00:14:33,228.51565381 So that was really, uh, huge blessings, that, we had those people and we just, you know, as a church supported them. 102 00:14:33,879.91104151 --> 00:14:58,773.65142907 at the beginning, we also were raising money and, and very soon, in the society, there was a lot of, help and, like a refugee center that wasn't, done by the government officials, but it was from the downward, from the bottom, uh, not from the, not from the officials, but from the, you know, people who wanted to help. 103 00:14:59,173.65242907 --> 00:15:10,918.07705188 So this, they started to organize some warehouses, sort food, sort, clothes, whatever was needed at that time. 104 00:15:11,355.55835318 --> 00:15:13,735.61214888 and they were trying to, give them something. 105 00:15:13,960.61314888 --> 00:15:16,800.61314888 For them to, to survive this first, uh, period. 106 00:15:17,239.78826295 --> 00:15:46,463.1881767 I'm still in awe that, Poles were willing to open up their doors, open up their homes and, and be so generous, you know, and I'm, I'm reflecting just in terms of my own culture, um, and where I find myself in the world and I, and I'm wondering what our response would be, not only as a society, but also as a church, you know, I would, I would hope to imagine that the church would be, you know, As open and as willing to, to open up their doors to, to refugees. 107 00:15:46,823.1881767 --> 00:15:51,931.95698268 Where do you think that comes from? you mentioned the word solidarity and, how that's important for Poles. 108 00:15:52,339.10408961 --> 00:15:59,413.10074966 where does that come from and why is that so important? I would say, it come from, like feeling the injustice. 109 00:15:59,937.14489177 --> 00:16:21,368.97857619 That people felt compassion out of the injustice, like, how can you start a war without no reason? How can you start bombarding houses where there are civilians? And how can you be so cruel? And we have a lot of history with, Like a negative history with Russians. 110 00:16:21,458.97857619 --> 00:16:37,268.46499899 So, you know, the it's like a common enemy So we thought that helping Ukrainians will be an act of Stopping the injustice and saying no to the oppressions. 111 00:16:37,813.21753289 --> 00:16:44,263.37363 So this, this was probably the, the one thing that, brought the society, together. 112 00:16:44,853.37363 --> 00:16:49,553.37363 And the second thing is that we are just brothers and sisters. 113 00:16:50,33.37363 --> 00:16:52,253.37363 And there are no barriers. 114 00:16:52,283.37363 --> 00:16:55,485.8220634 You know, the border is just a border, but. 115 00:16:55,957.9129837 --> 00:16:57,327.9129837 The same people live there. 116 00:16:57,767.9129837 --> 00:17:03,853.7296745 And because we, had Ukrainians, we, we love them, we respect them. 117 00:17:04,274.3377782 --> 00:17:14,679.5829876 we see a lot of benefits from them, how they serve in the church, how they, how they, operate, how they are praying for, for other people. 118 00:17:15,59.5829876 --> 00:17:16,249.5829876 It's just amazing. 119 00:17:16,259.5829876 --> 00:17:18,119.5829876 So they are wonderful people. 120 00:17:18,949.5829876 --> 00:17:31,590.5829876 And how can you not help them? And at the beginning of the war, they calculated that there were around two million people that crossed the border, Wow. 121 00:17:31,847.6391842 --> 00:17:35,407.6381842 the Polish border, not mentioning the other countries. 122 00:17:35,897.6391842 --> 00:17:43,318.7575027 So, you know, Such a huge crowd of people, you know, everybody need to, to help out. 123 00:17:43,693.0024909 --> 00:17:56,80.5791481 if anybody had like a empty house, or was renting a room, a flat, or, you know, any, anything that they could be, Sheltered. 124 00:17:57,300.5791481 --> 00:17:59,330.5791481 Why not? Why not? Use it. 125 00:17:59,370.5791481 --> 00:17:59,750.5791481 Use it. 126 00:17:59,780.5791481 --> 00:18:06,402.6120994 And, nobody will thank you, but, but, you know, you are doing this because you just want. 127 00:18:06,432.6110994 --> 00:18:18,610.2231548 And I think love of Christ was just outpouring and nobody was, you know, complaining feeling that he needs to earn something on this. 128 00:18:18,990.2231548 --> 00:18:28,909.0400378 No, it was just a huge, huge outpouring of God's love in a society that is getting, secular and secular. 129 00:18:29,424.0400378 --> 00:18:36,751.4244206 So, I think some people were seeing this like, uh, being decent. 130 00:18:36,861.9584163 --> 00:18:39,775.612022 it's like a test of your, humanity. 131 00:18:40,101.2774217 --> 00:18:49,687.5913205 And I'm proud of my, my country And I think you should be, and I think you should be proud of your church as well for opening up their doors and being so responsive. 132 00:18:50,167.5903205 --> 00:18:54,907.5913205 200 people to try and support 600 people is, is quite the feat. 133 00:18:55,257.5913205 --> 00:18:58,807.5913205 And then you multiply that by all the other churches that I'm sure there was a response from. 134 00:18:59,237.7913266 --> 00:19:02,577.7913266 so can, can you unpack this for me? So we, we're now sitting three years out. 135 00:19:02,577.7913266 --> 00:19:02,877.7913266 So. 136 00:19:04,97.7913266 --> 00:19:24,292.7913266 I'm speaking from a global perspective, you know, we would go on to the news sites and I mean there would be a daily countdown, day five of the war, day 70 of the war and then obviously with Israel Palestine, almost as if The Ukrainian situation kind of just disappeared from the global consciousness. 137 00:19:24,802.7913266 --> 00:19:27,452.7913266 And so I would love for you to, to unpack. 138 00:19:27,452.7913266 --> 00:19:35,412.7903266 And I mean, even the stories of, of the Poles opening up their homes, those are all part of the narrative that, that we were receiving. 139 00:19:35,516.1236599 --> 00:19:45,6.1226599 Can you unpack for us, like what happened from those early days of you opening up your homes? They thought they were going to be there for maybe a maximum a month. 140 00:19:45,556.1236599 --> 00:19:46,616.1231599 We're now three years out. 141 00:19:46,616.1231599 --> 00:20:02,270.9146257 So can you maybe bridge the gap for us so that we can hear a little bit more about what's happened within your own circumstances? Uh, at the beginning, there was prayer and, you know, support, had to be, uh, both legs on. 142 00:20:02,970.9146257 --> 00:20:10,270.9146257 So, so we were organizing transport and figure out how we gonna feed them. 143 00:20:10,337.1635907 --> 00:20:20,414.8312179 what are the needs and, and, uh, And since the beginning, we, we started a prayer, daily prayer, the masses of Ukraine's that were coming. 144 00:20:20,981.4498201 --> 00:20:23,415.9097961 They wanted to meet and they wanted to pray. 145 00:20:23,415.9097961 --> 00:20:25,595.9097961 And we joined the prayers. 146 00:20:26,165.9097961 --> 00:20:46,582.7112972 And every week, every sermon that we had, we started with a prayer for the Ukraines and we prayed in Polish, in Ukraine, and at the beginning we, you know, we just wanted to, you know, to host them and to make a safe place for them. 147 00:20:47,2.7112972 --> 00:20:55,992.7102972 But after some time you started to realize that this situation will be a permanent situation. 148 00:20:56,442.7112972 --> 00:20:59,798.3504772 So, months were passing by. 149 00:21:00,308.3504772 --> 00:21:23,910.9004648 And you start to think, okay, what's, what will be the next step? Will they stay? Will they go to school? Uh, will they start learning a language? And from, you know, the first response, team, we started to think about how to Help them navigate through life in the long term period. 150 00:21:24,720.9004648 --> 00:21:45,122.3236073 So there were like Polish classes helping out with accommodating them in in the schools because a lot of Ukrainians came Not not whole families But, rather, women with their children or the elder, uh, people. 151 00:21:45,598.4455273 --> 00:21:47,528.4465273 So, because the men were at the war. 152 00:21:48,40.310339 --> 00:21:49,620.309339 Men were, in the army. 153 00:21:50,240.310339 --> 00:22:01,240.2321368 They could not go, outside of the country, only if you had three or more children you were allowed at the beginning of the war to, to go through the border. 154 00:22:01,760.2321368 --> 00:22:24,599.2273997 So, you know, families displaced and how can we navigate that? And on top of that, our church was rebuilding, renovated, and instead of having like a big hall, we were squeezing in a small room and every week there was 100, 200 people more. 155 00:22:24,719.2283997 --> 00:22:28,754.2283997 So, you know, challenge is and challenge. 156 00:22:30,124.2283997 --> 00:22:32,804.2283997 But with the challenge comes the blessing. 157 00:22:33,44.2283997 --> 00:22:42,587.3273228 So we rented the bigger space for all of us to meet in a good condition and show our love and support. 158 00:22:43,343.5978913 --> 00:22:45,3.5978913 the church was very impacted. 159 00:22:45,503.5978913 --> 00:22:54,263.5978913 Even the way what to preach, how to communicate about war, how to tell about God's love. 160 00:22:54,928.5988913 --> 00:23:05,95.1181288 And how you, you know, keep the, the faith going and how to navigate them through the crisis. 161 00:23:05,645.1171288 --> 00:23:10,136.5120757 That was, I think, our big challenges for all of us. 162 00:23:10,486.5120757 --> 00:23:16,336.5120757 Should we say, everything is fine, you, you're gonna be okay. 163 00:23:16,376.5120757 --> 00:23:24,881.5120757 Or should we say, everything is fine, you, you're That God is in the midst of the crisis or, you know, that, that was the challenges. 164 00:23:24,891.5120757 --> 00:23:43,818.7346344 So, we started to, to have also this, long term, support in a sense of, uh, helping find jobs, teaching them Polish language, accommodating them in the schools, helping them out with some legal stuff, permits and, and so on. 165 00:23:44,558.4225954 --> 00:23:48,928.4215954 with this mindset that they are, they want to go back home. 166 00:23:49,518.4215954 --> 00:23:56,588.4225954 They are here for just a short period of time and they are always thinking about home. 167 00:23:56,758.4225954 --> 00:24:02,908.4225954 So this is their second place, but for some of them it became their home. 168 00:24:03,228.4225954 --> 00:24:03,778.4225954 actually. 169 00:24:04,578.4225954 --> 00:24:10,998.4225954 So they settle in, they start their work or their businesses. 170 00:24:11,628.4225954 --> 00:24:16,469.480163 They were, they are very hardworking people, so they didn't have huge problem with, that. 171 00:24:16,773.9391389 --> 00:24:28,131.7169188 And in the church we saw a huge blessing, because not only they were very grateful for the support, but they were also, you know, a huge blessing to us. 172 00:24:28,456.7169188 --> 00:24:42,633.3486818 And we started to see that we are all, equal members of the body of Christ and everybody is unique and have the unique gifts and we can all benefit from that. 173 00:24:43,213.3486818 --> 00:24:48,50.5707705 So incorporating them in the church was, the huge blessing. 174 00:24:48,180.5707705 --> 00:24:52,790.5707705 We, we were blessing them, but they were also blessing us at the same time. 175 00:24:53,443.5707705 --> 00:25:09,38.9993754 Could you share some stories, of some Ukrainian families or individuals who, may have even just given their lives to Christ because of the hospitality that you showed them? Yes, we have find out that, Ukrainians are very diverse group. 176 00:25:09,129.0003754 --> 00:25:21,394.9011867 So, at the beginning, nobody was asking what is your church background? What is your, denomination or, or what? and we soon find out that, they are from Poland. 177 00:25:21,774.9011867 --> 00:25:48,97.8689532 Totally different backgrounds and they found shelter here because somebody wanted to have them in the church And We always thought that The diversity is beautiful That we don't need to make everybody the same or make them believe the same thing, but we can, be united in the midst of our differences. 178 00:25:48,687.8679532 --> 00:25:57,339.201186 So there, there was this family of, mother and father and, and four, siblings who just look, look the same. 179 00:25:57,349.201186 --> 00:26:03,987.5273087 They very tall guys and, they were in, in their youth. 180 00:26:04,149.1311343 --> 00:26:04,549.1311343 age. 181 00:26:04,999.1311343 --> 00:26:10,879.1311343 And after a year and a half, they decided all to be baptized. 182 00:26:11,519.1311343 --> 00:26:21,833.7733798 So we had this privilege of baptizing all four brothers in the water and be joyful with their, you know, faith. 183 00:26:22,313.7743798 --> 00:26:25,33.7743798 And they all became part of the, church. 184 00:26:25,327.0687872 --> 00:26:29,717.0687872 started to be involved and it was such a beautiful thing. 185 00:26:30,247.0687872 --> 00:26:34,707.0687872 Just recently we had a baptismal of ten people. 186 00:26:35,174.5231636 --> 00:26:37,504.5221636 and six of them were Ukrainians. 187 00:26:37,711.5001086 --> 00:26:40,914.8334419 some of them from the, Orthodox Church. 188 00:26:41,181.2960327 --> 00:26:42,721.2960327 they found faith. 189 00:26:43,9.1804747 --> 00:27:05,646.2292202 one lady who at the beginning of the war was translating all the sermons to the other Ukrainians She was also from the orthodox church and she decided to to put her whole heart into Christ and because she saw that The God is bigger than only just a church. 190 00:27:05,656.2282202 --> 00:27:09,626.2292202 That's You This is a community and this is relationships. 191 00:27:10,886.2292202 --> 00:27:21,776.2282202 So for her coming to new land was also coming to a new faith and and putting her faith in in Christ. 192 00:27:22,536.2282202 --> 00:27:40,83.4628194 I remember, One story, just at the beginning of the war, it was a story of salvation, but not in a faith manner, but real, like, salvation from the, from the issue that they were having. 193 00:27:40,93.4628194 --> 00:27:42,613.4638194 It was family of, four kids. 194 00:27:42,788.4638194 --> 00:27:53,978.7587834 So they were all six of them in a small car, in like a, um, six seat car, packed with all their goods that they could, bring. 195 00:27:54,908.7587834 --> 00:27:56,995.265925 And, their car broke out. 196 00:27:57,885.265925 --> 00:28:02,312.8733991 It, that, it, it, you know, they were not able to drive. 197 00:28:02,812.8733991 --> 00:28:05,542.8733991 They were trying to reach, uh, Poznań. 198 00:28:05,971.5314622 --> 00:28:08,601.5314622 But they were not able to, to reach it. 199 00:28:08,671.5314622 --> 00:28:11,327.4276603 So, didn't know anybody from Poland. 200 00:28:11,580.3126553 --> 00:28:12,955.6960322 but he was praying. 201 00:28:13,320.6960322 --> 00:28:16,950.6960322 that God would, you know, help in this situation. 202 00:28:17,120.6960322 --> 00:28:27,144.3540954 You know, you are in a different country, your car broke out, your whole family is here, it's beginning to be, night, and you don't know what to do. 203 00:28:28,24.3540954 --> 00:28:35,773.7857655 So he started to pray and, another friend from States had this sense of, I need to call this guy. 204 00:28:36,283.7857655 --> 00:28:37,293.7857655 I I know him. 205 00:28:37,403.7857655 --> 00:28:41,443.7857655 I need to call him and just ask if, if you are okay. 206 00:28:41,773.7847655 --> 00:28:49,678.7587273 So he called him and he said, thank you for calling because, I just, my car broke and I'm in Poland. 207 00:28:49,698.7597273 --> 00:28:51,238.7597273 I don't know anybody here. 208 00:28:51,608.7597273 --> 00:28:53,320.2828254 I don't have local money. 209 00:28:54,445.2828254 --> 00:28:56,5.2828254 I'm desperate in need. 210 00:28:56,355.2828254 --> 00:29:05,715.2818254 So this guy called another guy and this another guy called me and I was able to help because it was very close to my, my home. 211 00:29:06,355.2808254 --> 00:29:14,226.7962507 And I, in a matter of Minutes, I was able to call my friend in two cars. 212 00:29:14,256.7962507 --> 00:29:15,786.7962507 We drove to them. 213 00:29:15,836.7962507 --> 00:29:24,465.5430645 We, managed to, find some hotel for them and the owner of the hotel say, I won't charge them anything. 214 00:29:24,896.689193 --> 00:29:28,406.689193 they are free to stay here how long they want. 215 00:29:29,446.689193 --> 00:29:31,426.689193 Because I understand the situation. 216 00:29:32,476.689193 --> 00:29:36,896.689193 So we drove to this car, to this family. 217 00:29:36,976.689193 --> 00:29:39,256.689193 We drove them to the hotel. 218 00:29:39,626.689193 --> 00:29:58,355.8800676 We then take somebody from the hotel who actually was an engineer or mechanic and he was able to pick the car, fix it on his own cost and this family had More than enough. 219 00:29:58,375.6628143 --> 00:30:03,265.2155836 they were totally taken care of in the midst of, this crisis. 220 00:30:03,376.7141649 --> 00:30:08,336.7131649 and everywhere you ask, there were people willing to, to help. 221 00:30:08,626.7131649 --> 00:30:10,216.7131649 So, Yeah. 222 00:30:10,446.7141649 --> 00:30:11,386.7141649 God moments. 223 00:30:11,747.7141649 --> 00:30:12,207.7141649 Yeah. 224 00:30:12,207.7141649 --> 00:30:13,897.7141649 And thank you for sharing those. 225 00:30:13,927.7141649 --> 00:30:15,597.7141649 I think that it's so inspiring. 226 00:30:15,987.7131649 --> 00:30:27,533.6817704 I would love to, to begin to talk about this when we have a global audience listening to this podcast and, and I believe that, every church community has something to teach the global church. 227 00:30:27,563.6817704 --> 00:30:33,788.6817704 And as I'm, as I'm listening to the story of how, you know, The Polish church has responded to this crisis. 228 00:30:33,788.6817704 --> 00:30:36,718.6817704 I feel like there's some lessons that can be learned. 229 00:30:37,248.6817704 --> 00:30:39,568.6817704 And so I'd like to go there with you. 230 00:30:40,58.6817704 --> 00:30:42,758.6807704 But before we do, I'm curious to hear from you. 231 00:30:43,578.6817704 --> 00:31:12,174.4556618 In what ways has, has the war impacted your life? And if you had to look at Oliver three years ago, compared to Oliver today, how has God used what, what is this actually a terrible thing to, for his glory within your own life and ministry? my life was impacted in so many ways, especially in a, in a way of, that you are never alone when you are in the crisis. 232 00:31:12,631.7473985 --> 00:31:24,334.0143057 With the whole church you are all united and when one, one piece of the body is, in the ill, in a situation, The rest of the body is taking care of it. 233 00:31:24,774.0143057 --> 00:31:36,578.2322252 So we've worked with Ukrainians, those who are already in Opole, to help those who were staying in their homes in Ukraine. 234 00:31:37,98.2322252 --> 00:31:44,143.2322252 And whenever there was a need, we We prayed and the need was satisfied. 235 00:31:44,703.2322252 --> 00:31:55,896.255543 The, it, it was amazing that people from all around the world wanted to support, wanted to, to know how to pray. 236 00:31:56,156.255543 --> 00:31:57,876.255543 What to pray about. 237 00:31:58,207.2372507 --> 00:32:01,120.3008706 we were just, you know, unbelieve it. 238 00:32:01,250.3008706 --> 00:32:02,920.3008706 Uh, I couldn't believe it. 239 00:32:03,20.3008706 --> 00:32:08,110.1577894 Uh, you know, every week there was like a transport of goods, to Ukraine. 240 00:32:08,230.1577894 --> 00:32:26,931.163913 Every week there was somebody coming in and, he, Very quickly was finding a place where was finding a, a solution to, his problems and, and accommodation and everything was, you know, working very, very smooth. 241 00:32:27,531.163913 --> 00:32:30,56.0640827 And I, my life was impacted. 242 00:32:30,571.0640827 --> 00:32:33,361.0640827 of how wonderful Ukrainians are. 243 00:32:33,721.0640827 --> 00:32:38,409.4859013 How wonderful those, Christians who really love their neighbors. 244 00:32:38,792.6923197 --> 00:32:45,38.2964963 it doesn't matter what denomination, what background, what city he was in. 245 00:32:45,48.2964963 --> 00:32:48,343.0642619 He was in and, everybody wanted to help him. 246 00:32:48,933.0642619 --> 00:33:01,285.1744589 So, I'm so grateful to, to God that, I met such a lovely people and I'm, very confident that, if something happened to us, God will take care of it through his people. 247 00:33:01,735.1734589 --> 00:33:11,266.3492742 So this, really big heart to others, it's what's, stand out in the whole crisis, in the whole situation. 248 00:33:11,686.784127 --> 00:33:16,88.660405 So, uh, you joined us, in Incheon last year in September. 249 00:33:16,164.387606 --> 00:33:21,804.7152319 you joined with the global church in just celebrating together, in declaring, displaying Christ together. 250 00:33:21,854.7152319 --> 00:33:22,824.7152319 That was the mandate. 251 00:33:23,126.9477744 --> 00:33:45,991.4288973 What key lessons do you believe the Polish church has to teach the global church when it comes to to facing crisis or supporting people in war? Do you feel like there is some, there's some value that, that you could add to our global community? of course, I was, so impactful by ICHEN and, and the whole Lausanne Congress. 252 00:33:46,591.4288973 --> 00:33:56,91.4288973 And I feel the community of people, with wholeheartedly loving Christ from different nations. 253 00:33:56,471.4288973 --> 00:33:58,151.4288973 And I felt like at home. 254 00:33:58,991.4288973 --> 00:34:03,781.4288973 I felt like I'm brothers and sisters with, with all of them. 255 00:34:04,261.4288973 --> 00:34:05,551.4288973 And there is no problem. 256 00:34:06,461.4288973 --> 00:34:10,941.4288973 There is a unity between us in a spiritual sense. 257 00:34:10,981.4288973 --> 00:34:20,577.5849409 Of course, we were very different in the way we dressed or how we looked, but, you could sense that, the neighbor is your brother. 258 00:34:20,827.5849409 --> 00:34:29,477.1549653 And I think what, the global church might, might, uh, learn from it that, never underestimate your neighbor. 259 00:34:30,342.1549653 --> 00:34:42,657.7056008 In a time of situation, in time of crisis, there is so much good in people, so much, love and so much, hope when you have each other. 260 00:34:42,967.8676593 --> 00:34:53,392.6067705 even in the secular society, or becoming more and more secular society, look for the, um, Opportunity to find good in others. 261 00:34:53,764.1332463 --> 00:35:03,859.5370375 in one of the refugee center where they distributed food and clothes and those basic supplies. 262 00:35:04,319.5360375 --> 00:35:07,219.5370375 I met a lady from Greece. 263 00:35:07,626.2037042 --> 00:35:20,305.0214889 Mariana and, she's not a believer yet, but, we had this amazing connection, because she wanted to help in the situation. 264 00:35:20,662.7874992 --> 00:35:22,682.7874992 And we wanted to help also. 265 00:35:22,962.7874992 --> 00:35:26,977.3581309 So we found each other and we were able to talk. 266 00:35:26,993.0664381 --> 00:35:30,134.8442159 we spent some time, we invited her to our home. 267 00:35:30,144.8442159 --> 00:35:39,534.8442159 We had some nice conversations talking about God, talking about why we do it and why she do it, understanding the perspective. 268 00:35:40,4.8442159 --> 00:35:41,974.8442159 And it connected us. 269 00:35:41,974.8442159 --> 00:35:46,879.3600768 so much, because we were just doing the same, the same thing, the same job. 270 00:35:47,199.3600768 --> 00:35:56,719.3600768 Maybe our perspective is a little bit different or the motivation, but, uh, I would say look for the good in other people. 271 00:35:56,849.3610768 --> 00:35:59,559.3590768 And this is something that connects us. 272 00:35:59,803.5333001 --> 00:36:01,23.5333001 one other thing is. 273 00:36:01,318.6951818 --> 00:36:19,61.1581675 maybe a little bit of, of challenge, because whenever you are dislocated, whenever you, you feel not at home, you have, there is two options, either to integrate or, become a part of. 274 00:36:19,436.1581675 --> 00:36:24,206.1581675 of something that is already there or start something on your own. 275 00:36:24,746.1581675 --> 00:36:30,136.1571675 So there, sometimes there was this challenge and also opportunities. 276 00:36:30,710.9038891 --> 00:36:39,650.9038891 how should believers from Ukraine find themselves in a new place? Should they start there? Ukrainian church. 277 00:36:39,860.9038891 --> 00:36:48,148.0218287 Should they join, already Polish churches? And, uh, in our case it was disintegration. 278 00:36:48,602.8563284 --> 00:36:55,722.8553284 so they, joined the church and we had to expand our mindset, our thinking. 279 00:36:55,860.8950132 --> 00:36:59,676.6097271 How to serve both Polish and, and the Ukrainians. 280 00:37:00,133.768904 --> 00:37:11,98.9608392 But in some cases, there was, you know, new churches, uh, Ukrainians, in Ukrainian language, and it all, it's all good. 281 00:37:11,278.9608392 --> 00:37:12,28.9608392 It's all good. 282 00:37:12,238.9608392 --> 00:37:26,804.1362671 So, you can, uh, start your own ministry or you can join someone's else ministry and, God is, you know, moving in both directions and we are just so blessed to have them. 283 00:37:27,191.8029338 --> 00:37:43,181.8029338 So as we begin to wrap up the conversation, I'm sure that there might be some on the other end of who are listening in who might say, I want to know how I can, I can contribute and participate in taking care of these refugees. 284 00:37:43,603.8209284 --> 00:37:55,844.487595 As the war continues, what is still needed? How can Christians globally continue to pray for or support the work that's happening in Poland? think that the key is the prayer. 285 00:37:56,444.487595 --> 00:38:06,214.487595 And I would say the Romans 12, 15, this verse pops up, pops out of my mind whenever I think about it. 286 00:38:06,544.486595 --> 00:38:08,344.487595 Rejoice with those who rejoice. 287 00:38:08,909.487595 --> 00:38:10,799.487595 And weep with those who weep. 288 00:38:11,969.487595 --> 00:38:33,617.8539789 And I think this is, this is something that, we all need, to pray for the situation in Ukraine, to end this war and not become too accustomed to the war situation, not become too accustomed that this is something As it is. 289 00:38:33,845.9714862 --> 00:38:38,55.9714862 No, we, we want to bring peace to this nation. 290 00:38:38,135.9714862 --> 00:38:45,480.9755015 We want to bless this nation, bring them joy, bring them faith we don't want to forget, them. 291 00:38:45,970.9765015 --> 00:38:57,790.9755015 So it's been three years since the start of the war and in our church every Sunday we pray, we have a short time of prayer just for the Ukraine. 292 00:38:58,690.9755015 --> 00:39:04,23.4476085 So, we will be doing that till the war will end. 293 00:39:04,329.688178 --> 00:39:07,418.5833838 we want this country to be, touched by God. 294 00:39:07,918.5833838 --> 00:39:14,323.4181907 And we want this country to be rest with, uh, blessing and, and peace and hope. 295 00:39:14,853.4181907 --> 00:39:24,526.1806531 So, I pray that the whole church and ask the whole church to continue to pray, because the challenges are, you know, big. 296 00:39:25,147.2558038 --> 00:39:46,111.1687025 the families that were separated, children are raising up in without father, there are homes are, you know, only mothers, some, some struggles with, the young hood and adulthood and how to be part of society in other country. 297 00:39:47,171.1687025 --> 00:40:02,831.1677025 So there are some challenges in our country and in their country, but we all need to unite in prayer and and seek for God's right moment to bring peace and that's my hope. 298 00:40:02,831.2677025 --> 00:40:04,71.0110501 I Thanks, Oliver. 299 00:40:04,111.0110501 --> 00:40:12,492.4753363 And I think it'd be great for us to close this interview off with just inviting you to pray, for those who are affected and for the Ukrainians. 300 00:40:12,902.4753363 --> 00:40:25,829.3070172 But before we get there, as we close off, do you have any last thoughts that you, or words of encouragement that you'd like to leave with our listeners? last comment is that, challenge is always an opportunity. 301 00:40:26,29.2815331 --> 00:40:33,452.3187873 because, people are in a desperate need, they are looking for the things that matter. 302 00:40:33,824.0289395 --> 00:40:36,634.0279395 they are reaching out to the unknown. 303 00:40:37,79.0289395 --> 00:40:47,456.2306134 To the spiritual things and for many of people war became a blessing of, reconciliation with God. 304 00:40:48,156.2296134 --> 00:40:57,491.1977436 I know that's not for all of them, but, uh, yeah, something that, in the midst of, of crisis, in the midst of, evil. 305 00:40:58,266.1977436 --> 00:41:01,656.1977436 is still working and this is a great hope for us. 306 00:41:01,851.938549 --> 00:41:03,330.9433625 he doesn't stop there. 307 00:41:04,337.6707667 --> 00:41:08,207.6697667 using even evil to turn it into, into good. 308 00:41:08,417.6707667 --> 00:41:25,239.9965473 And just amazed our God is, wonderful and, and yeah, let's, be in his will and put our hands and mouth and, feet into action he will lead us. 309 00:41:27,43.2234448 --> 00:41:32,255.9395004 would you mind closing us off in prayer? Heavenly Father, thank you for this. 310 00:41:32,658.6591377 --> 00:41:38,311.7994689 Thank you for your, not ending help in all of our situation. 311 00:41:39,121.7994689 --> 00:41:42,575.890378 That, uh, you are not, away. 312 00:41:42,625.890378 --> 00:41:46,735.890378 You are still with us in this situation, in this crisis. 313 00:41:47,645.890378 --> 00:41:51,195.889378 I pray for the blessing of the Ukraine nation. 314 00:41:51,385.889378 --> 00:41:58,815.890378 I pray for, pray for peace that will come into their hearts and into their lands. 315 00:41:59,664.7267461 --> 00:42:04,804.7257461 I pray that the evil will stop and the righteousness will flourish. 316 00:42:05,351.9058988 --> 00:42:21,635.1937061 I pray for my brothers and sisters who came and find shelter in Poland and other countries, so they could be a part of the community, people of faith, united with you. 317 00:42:21,815.1937061 --> 00:42:30,360.1937061 And I'm so thankful that all of the circumstances, always blessing us. 318 00:42:30,370.1937061 --> 00:42:31,670.1937061 You were always there. 319 00:42:31,820.1937061 --> 00:42:36,478.2411416 You were always, with, with us and we are never abandoned. 320 00:42:36,688.2401416 --> 00:42:37,958.2411416 We are never abandoned. 321 00:42:38,48.2411416 --> 00:42:53,97.0296505 I pray that your blessings will bring this war to an end and the people, the nation will be free also in the spiritual realm. 322 00:42:53,667.0286505 --> 00:43:00,507.0286505 They will also find this amazing peace that only your goodness brings. 323 00:43:00,797.0286505 --> 00:43:03,107.0286505 In Jesus name we pray. 324 00:43:03,437.0286505 --> 00:43:03,857.0286505 Amen. 325 00:43:04,130.7559232 --> 00:43:04,670.7559232 Amen. 326 00:43:05,95.7559232 --> 00:43:05,615.7559232 Thank you. 327 00:43:06,74.7559232 --> 00:43:07,114.7549232 Thank you so much. 328 00:43:08,659.8832027 --> 00:43:12,749.8832027 Well, I hope that you enjoyed this episode of the Lausanne Movement Podcast. 329 00:43:13,29.8832027 --> 00:43:18,959.8832027 If you did enjoy the show, I want to encourage you to leave us a rating and review and share it with a friend. 330 00:43:19,448.5057384 --> 00:43:20,248.5057384 Till next week. 331 00:43:20,618.5057384 --> 00:43:21,68.5057384 Cheers.
Popular Podcasts
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.