Anne Scripps and Scott Douglas

An heiress to the Scripps newspaper fortune, Anne Scripps had a privileged upbringing. When her first marriage ended in divorce she quickly met and married a new man, a house painter named Scott Douglas who was nine years younger than Anne. All Anne wanted was the simple life of a suburban housewife, doting on her children and giving them the warmth and love that she didn’t receive in her own childhood. But her new marriage quickly turned into a nightmare, with a tragic outcome that would reverberate for years to come.

Today's snack: Easy homemade biscuits

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Sources:

• https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5chme0
• https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3047747/Scripps-newspaper-heiress-24-saw-socialite-mother-hacked-death-claw-hammer-father-released-prison-drugs-telling-judge-lost-family-friends-pets-hope-future.html
• https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6033219/Scripps-heiress-Tori-Scripps-Carmody-arrested-stealing-adoptive-moms-car.html
• https://nymag.com/news/features/63034/
• https://www.crimelibrary.org/notorious_murders/family/anne_scripps/1.html
• Mangaliman, J. (1994, April 1). Cops: Case closed. Heiress’ husband jumped off bridge. Newsday, Page A4-5.
• Agus, C. (1994, Feb 6). Heiress tried to disinherit husband. Newsday, Page 4.
• Agus, C. (1994, Feb 24). The heiress & the house painter. Newsday, Page 68-70.
• Collins, T. (1994, Oct 12). Claim barred to slain wife’s estate. Newsday (Nassau Edition), Page A20.
• https://people.com/archive/heiress-to-misfortune-vol-41-no-5/ 

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hi, I'm rich and I'm tinAnd if there's one thing we've learned in
over twenty years of marriage, somedays you'll feel like killing your husband,
and some days you'll feel like killingyour wife. Welcome to love, Mary,
kill e Tina. Hey, Rich, how are you? I'm great?

(00:28):
How are you good? Well,you've been sick, so I don't
know how good you actually are.I have been a little sick, and
I'm getting a little sick and tiredof being sick. But I'm gonna I'm
hanging in there. I think youbrought me something to eat, and I
am a little hungry. I didbring you something, so I held you
cooking something. This is a veryrandom it's kind of a random snack today,
but it's just something I had kindof craving for. Bisy, I

(00:49):
made you some homemade biscuits. Well, they're lovely. Look really good,
don't they. Yeah, I'm excitedto try them. I brought some honey
and some some jam also in caseyou would like to put something on your
biscuits. I'm a little shocked rightnow. Was a little scared because last
time you made beignets the kit SoRich is he's a great chef, but

(01:14):
he's not the best cleaner. Andso last time you made the bignet's,
I was like, holy moly,everything was like covered in powdered sugar and
my bowls weren't clean. Oh,your kitchen is just fine. Trust Oh
it's just fine. Okay, Wellthe biscuits they look great. Yeah,
I'm not much of a bit.I don't really make biscuits. Which we
had biscuits last night with their fright, I know I had. This was

(01:34):
a something I had planned before.We decided to go to the gas station
and get chicken and biscuits. Peoplewe get okay, we have yeah,
who we do go to the talkabout the gas station chicken places. Well,
let me try this biscuit. Allright, we'll be right back.
Holy noly, you you're beautiful.Did you enjoy your biscuit? Olyness?

(01:57):
That was? That was so sogood? Was really good and hit the
spot. You know how. Idon't know how I came to decide I'm
making biscuits, but it started tolove a biscuit. Today's Today's episode is
set in New York and I waslooking for New York snacks or something,
and I was googling things that Icame across the cronut, which apparently was
invented in New York, the crossbetween a croissant and a donut. So

(02:20):
I was gonna make those. Butthen I looked at the recipe, and
we're going to make corona. Yeah, but I looked at the recipe.
I was like, oh no,I'm not making this way too way,
too complicated. So yeah, somehowI wound up from there to biscuits.
I don't know how well they areexcellent, and you did a fabulous job.
And I like the scallop edge.I think it's the cutter that we
have. It's a little scale upedge here, but fancy, fabulous.

(02:42):
Well you are the officially the biscuitmaker in our family. I have been
meaning to make croissants, but Imean, I bake a lot, but
I'm not the most I don't likea hard recipe. So yeah, maybe
we could tackle that together. Wecould collaborate on some croissants. All right,
yes, all right, what isthe story you're going to tell us
today? Well, first, beforeI get into that, today's case was

(03:04):
a recommendation from our listener Dorothy fromthe Long on the Go. So Dorothy,
I hope you're still listening. Ifyou are, thank you for the
recommendation. We do have a longlist of case recommendations and we're working our
way through them. Some of themweren't able to do because we can't find
enough information, but I'm glad thatyou were able to find enough information to

(03:25):
do the soon for Dorothy. Yeah, and if you would like to recommend
a case to us, email usat Lovemarykail at gmail dot com. Like
you just said, we can't promiseto get to every case, but we're
always interested to learn about new storiesthat we weren't aware of. Today,
we're going to tell you about thetragic story of An Scripts and her family,

(03:46):
an heiress to the Script's newspaper Fortune, and Scripts had a privileged upbringing,
attending private schools and coming out atdebutante balls in Vienna and New York.
She married a stockbroker in a lavishceremony with royalty and attendance, and
soon gave birth to two daughters.When her first marriage eventually ended in divorce,
she quickly met and fell in lovewith a new man, a house

(04:08):
painter named Scott Douglas, who wasnine years younger than Anne. After a
whirlwind romance, Anne and Scott married, and soon Anne gave birth to a
third daughter. All Anne wanted wasthe simple life of a suburban housewife,
doting on her children and giving themthe warmth and love that she didn't get
in her own childhood. But hernew marriage quickly turned into a nightmare,

(04:29):
with a tragic outcome that would reverberatefor years to come. Anne Script's story
is a reminder that wealth and privilegeare not safeguards against domestic violence. It's
also a reminder that domestic violence doesn'tjust affect one person, it can impact
entire families for generations to come.Very true. Just a warning that today's
episode contains descriptions of domestic abuse andsuicide that may be distressing, so please

(04:55):
listen with care. Anne Fraser Scriptswas born in nineteen forty six in Gross
Pointe, Michigan, one of thecountry's wealthiest suburbs. She was the first
of three children born to Captain JamesE. Scrips, the third, a
retired merchant marine, and his wifeAnne. Anne's great great grandfather was James
E. Scripps, who in eighteenseventy three launched the newspaper that became the

(05:18):
Detroit News. He had a radicalidea for its time that his reporters should
quote write like people talk unquote.His competitors called the News a cheap rag,
but the public loved it. It'sa good paper. Yeah. I
mean well, I will say growingup in the Detroit air there were and
there still are, two major newspapers, the Detroit News and the Detroit Free

(05:40):
Press. Your family was either likea news family or a free press family.
You couldn't be both, which waskind of weird. It was.
It was almost like there was alike this competition, like, well,
we subscribe to the Free Press,so you know, we don't like those
news people. Well, in Chicagoit's similar because you have the Chicago TRIBUNEA
and the Chicago Sun Times. Well, we were a free press family up

(06:00):
in any case, James Scrips didpretty well for himself, but his little
brother, Edward W. Scripts dideven better. He started his own news
empire, acquiring twenty five different newspapersand starting the news service that became known
as United Press International or UPI.His media empire was called the E.
W. Scripts Company, also knownas Scrips Howard, and it's still around,

(06:24):
although now mostly focused on TV production. You may also know it as
the organizer of the US National SpellingBee, which started in nineteen twenty five.
Oh, I was going to askyou if you'd heard about the Spelling
Bee because it just wrapped up.Oh no, okay, good timing.
We'll save that for later. Okay. Together, the Scripts were known as
the first Family of American journalism.Anne grew up in a life of old

(06:46):
money privilege. She went to thebest private Catholic girls' schools. She had
nice clothes and other possessions, andshe got to take amazing vacations. But
what she didn't have were parents whowere there for her. Dad was away
much of the time, and hewas an alcoholic who wasn't heavily involved in
her life. Later in his life, he did get help for his alcohol

(07:06):
addiction and devoted the rest of hislife to helping other alcoholics as the director
of a treatment program for recovering alcoholicswho were unable to pay for their own
care. Nice Anne's mom was alsoonly partially present. She struggled with manic
depression, although it wasn't diagnosed untilmuch later in her life. Anne's grandmother,

(07:28):
Ruth ru ended up being a surrogateparent to Anne in many ways.
Ruth had been married to James E. Scripps Junior, who died while in
his twenties. She remarried a mannamed Lester Rue of gross Pointe Farms.
Ruth was a socialite who mingled withthe Ford family and other members of the
elite class. She introduced Anne tothe ways of high society. When Anne

(07:49):
was twelve, the family moved toupstate New York near Albany, where she
attended the all girls Sacred Heart Convent. She then moved to New York City
to attend the prestigious Dushane Residence School, a two year college for Catholic women.
Anne was a debutant who made herdebut at a ball in Vienna's Schwarzenburg
Palace and then in New York atthe debutant Cotillian and Christmas Ball It's Very

(08:13):
Fancy Wait. After graduating from theResidence School in nineteen sixty six, and
studied interior design at the New YorkSchool of Interior Design. Soon after finishing
school, Anne met and fell inlove with a bond trader named Anthony Xavier
Morrell. They married in nineteen sixtynine, when Anne was twenty three years

(08:33):
old. It was a lavish ceremonyat the luxurious Saint Regis Hotel in Manhattan
that included European royalty. Among herbridal attendants was Princess Immaculotta Habsburg of Vienna,
and one of the ushers was VictorEmmanuel Junior of the House of Savoy,
who was a direct descendant of theformer King of Italy. The wedding

(08:56):
was featured in a three page spreadin Town and Country magazine. After the
wedding, Anthony and Anne settled inthe affluent village of Bronxville, New York,
about fifteen miles north of midtown Manhattan. Anne had an idealized version of
life as a suburban housewife, greetingher man with the Martini when he came
home from work, dinner on thestove, children playing in the yard,

(09:20):
and for a time that vision seemedto be coming true. Less than two
years into the marriage, Anne gavebirth to a daughter, Alexandra, and
the following year she had another daughter, Anne. Alex and Annie were Anne's
pride and joy. She was determinedto give them the warmth and attention that
she hadn't gotten from her own parents. She spent as much time with her
girls as she could, making crafts, doing art projects, taking walks,

(09:45):
going to get ice cream. Oncethey'd started school, she would walk them
to school every day, come backand pick them up for lunch, then
return to walk them home from schoolat the end of the day. Her
entire life revolved around their children.Alex and Annie later recalled their childhood as
idyllic. They were spoiled by theirmother's love, and they lived in a

(10:05):
beautiful tree lined neighborhood and a sevenbedroom house that offered endless opportunities for exploration,
hide and seek, and sometimes evenroller skating down the hallways. Sounds
like a very nice childhood. Thetwo girls, just over a year a
part in age, grew up closemore like twins in many ways. Alex
was seen as the tougher of thetwo, more daring and with a biting

(10:28):
sense of humor. Annie was moresensitive and awkward, but also warmer and
more open hearted. But all fairytales eventually come to an end. While
Anne was a homebody who enjoyed thesimple life, Anthony was drawn to life
in the fast lane. He likedthe world of high finance and parties,

(10:48):
He drank a lot, and overtime Anne came to suspect that he was
having affairs. In nineteen eighty eight, after eighteen years of marriage, a
couple decided to divorce. Alex andAnnie, both in high school at the
time, stuck by their mom followingthe divorce, but by this point they
were both starting to brant out todo their own thing with their own friends,

(11:09):
and Anne found it hard being single. She was afraid of being alone,
but she wasn't alone for long whilethe inco on the divorce papers was
still drying. Anne met Scott Douglasat a Super Bowl party in late January
at nineteen eighty eight. Seemed alittle odd that Anne was going to a
super Bowl party. Everyone loves thesuper Bowl, I guess, so it's

(11:31):
just not a high society yet.Scott was thirty three years old, nine
years younger than Anne. Scott hada very different background and upbringing from Anne.
He grew up in the town ofRye, New York. His father
died when he was young, andhis mom struggled to get by as a
single mother. She eventually remarried,but Scott didn't get along with his stepdad.
He dropped out of high school andmoved out. When Scott was nineteen,

(11:54):
he moved in with a woman namedPhyllis Creighton. Phyllis was twelve years
older than Scott, divorced with twochildren. They lived together for three years
and remained close friends after that.A few years after moving out, Scott
got a job as a caretaker fora property in Portchester, New York,
living in a cottage on the propertyfrom nineteen eighty to nineteen eighty six.

(12:16):
Scott was somewhat of a mystery topeople who knew him. He was very
private. In three years living withPhyllis Creighton, he never once introduced her
to or even mentioned his mother.He was tall, good looking, charming,
and affable, but some people sawhim as standoffish and inarticulate. Philis
said he wouldn't hurt a fly.Literally. She said that he wouldn't kill

(12:39):
the flies or aunts if they werein their house. Instead, he would
take them outside, saying that everythinghad a right to live. At the
same time, his hobby was taxidermy. Well that's a little ironic. He
wouldn't kill a fly, but thenhe would stuff a beaver or whatever you
might find a dead raccoon or othervarmint and his freezer waiting to be stuffed.

(13:03):
One neighbor said he was quote aboy scout of a guy. But
at the same time, she saidthat he had a large light and a
dark side. He dated a lotof women. The man who owned the
property where Scott worked as a caretakerhad this to say about him. I
think before you read the quote,I think you have to read this with
a New York accent. So ifyou could do that, that would You're
so talented action you're accents, okay. Quote. There were a lot of

(13:26):
girls, and I heard a lotof fights. He was a woman chaser.
The gals he went around with werevery substantial, very beautiful. He
was an earth shaker, had apersonality to make movie stars look like a
bunch of bombs. Only close friendhe had was his brother. He'd never
marry a poor woman, told meI was a sucker. He used to

(13:46):
tell the girls this was his place. He'd entertain them at my pool.
He had no respect for women,said women are nothing but a bunch of
whores. He'd be fighting with oneof them inside with another waiting for him
outside. End quote. Oh tohe's the player. He fathered two children
out of wedlock before meeting Anne,something he never mentioned Anne, amongst other

(14:09):
secrets he had kept from her.Growing up where he did in the proximity
of a lot of wealthy people,Scott had ample opportunity to see how the
other half lived, and he wantedto be one of them. By the
time he met Anne at the SuperBowl party, Scott lived in a small
apartment in Greenwich, Connecticut, andwas making a living painting houses. Anne

(14:30):
saw Scott as someone who was hardworking and who valued family above all else,
just like she did. Anne's wealthyfriends and her daughters had a different
feeling, though. They saw Scottas standoffish, believing that he felt inferior,
having come from a lower class backgroundin their eyes. They tried to
be friendly to him, but hedidn't seem interested, although it's certainly possible

(14:52):
that they looked down on him andthat he sensed that he just didn't fit
in with the ultra rich country clubcrowd that Anne had grown up with.
This started a vicious cycle where hewould try to separate her from her friends,
which caused them to resent him,which made him even more determined to
build a wall between Anne and herfriends. Anne's daughter Alex later said that

(15:13):
he just didn't seem very bright orarticulate, and that she had nothing in
common with him. He was unsophisticated, and Alex and Annie worried from the
beginning that Scott was out to takeadvantage of their vulnerable mother. In any
case, Anne found him charming andattentive. After dating for only about six
months, Scott asked him to marryher, saying they had to get married

(15:33):
right now, and Anne agreed,that's not a red flag. No.
Her friends and family were taken abackwhen she told them of their plans to
get married only five days following hisproposal. One friend later said, quote,
we tried to talk her into waiting, but she was vulnerable, a
bit scared after her divorce. Howdo you put restraints on a grown woman?

(15:54):
Unquote How much time had passed betweenthe proposal and the divorce. It
was roughly a year, maybe alittle less. Okay, so that's pretty
quick, Yeah, really quick.Her family tried to talk Anne into having
Scott sign a prenup, but thatalso fell on deaf ears. The wedding
was held at Anne's home in Bronxville. It was small, with only twenty
people in attendance. Notable absences includedScott's mom, he had told Anne that

(16:18):
she was no longer living, andalso Anne's mother, brother, and sister.
She hadn't even invited them, knowingthat they wouldn't approve. Even those
who did attend the wedding were notnecessarily supportive. One guest later said about
Scott, quote, he was classless, a name dropper. You could see
that immediately. He was shifty,he had a slimy, weak handshake,

(16:40):
didn't look you straight in the eye, had no conversation, had nothing to
say. What could he talk abouthouse painting? He didn't speak our language.
Unquote. Well, I take offenseto that because my dad was a
painter. Yes, he was ahouse painter, a very successful house painter
who worked so hard. Yeah.I have no sympathy for Siks in this
story at all, but I do. It does seem like her friends were

(17:03):
a little bit bit thompus. Yeah. While Anne's friends and daughters may not
have liked Scott before the wedding,at least they saw that he seemed kind
and treated her with respect. Afterthe wedding, though, that changed suddenly.
He was quick to criticize Anne abouteverything. He said she had snobby
friends and that she spoiled her daughters. Alex later said, quote, he

(17:26):
got an attitude. He got verymean and controlling. Unquote. He lied
to Anne about many things. Aswe already mentioned, he told her his
mother was dead, even though shewas in fact living just twelve miles away
from them. He never mentioned thetwo children that he had but never saw.
He also had two sisters that henever mentioned, and for some reason,

(17:47):
he told Anne that he was Jewish, even though she later found out
he was Episcopalian. He also didn'tshare with Anne the fact that he drank
a lot, had bouts of depression, had been in therapy, and that
his painting business wasn't really all thatsuccessful. He was struggling to get by.
All of this would gradually become clearafter the wedding. After he moved

(18:07):
into Anne's house, he kept hisapartment in Greenwich. It was primarily an
office for his painting business, buthe would come and go regularly, and
he never mentioned to his local friendsor neighbors that he was now married.
They all assumed that he was stillsingle. Despite the growing issues in the
new marriage, Anne was anxious tohave another baby. Partly, she was

(18:29):
looking for a new life to takecare of now that her daughters were both
getting older and getting ready to gooff to college and a life of their
own, But partly she thought thathaving a baby would help fix things in
the marriage. It never does.About a year into the marriage, Anne
found out that she was pregnant.She gave birth to another girl, Victoria
Scrips Douglas, in June nineteen ninety. Everyone doated on little Victoria, more

(18:52):
commonly known as Tory. Anne lovedher and spent hours playing with her,
making up silly stories and saws anddances, just like she'd done with Alex
and Annie. Scott seemed to enjoybeing a dad as well. No one
doubted that he loved his new daughter. Now teenagers, Alex and Annie also
loved their new little sister, butit didn't take long before things deteriorated.

(19:15):
The dislike between Alex and Scott turnedinto outright hatred. She would call him
an uneducated dirt bag, and hestarted seeing both Alex and Annie as competition
for his wife's affection and probably forher money as well. He pushed Anne
to put pressure on Alex to moveout after she graduated from high school,
which she did. There were alsoincreasing fights about money. While Anne knew

(19:40):
that Scott wasn't wealthy, she probablyexpected that he would at least be able
to contribute to the family with hisincome. But it turned out that Anne
paid for everything. She paid allthe bills, the utilities, any expenses
for the children, She paid ifthey went out to dinner in a movie.
She even gave him money besides allthat, and in fact, he
would charge her if he did anywork around the house. A friend of

(20:03):
Anne's said, quote, she thoughthe would share in the cost of the
house, but he acted like ajigglow. She was used to being treated
like a lady unquote, but shehas a lot of money, right,
Yeah, for sure, But shejust wanted him to contribute something. I
think it's I think it's reasonable.Right. Smartly, Anne kept her money
completely separate from Scott, refusing togive him access to any bank accounts and

(20:26):
keeping him in the dark about herfinances. This rankled him, as did
her refusal to buy him a newBMW. At one point, he exploded
at her, saying, quote,I've gotten more from women I've dated for
two weeks than I got from youin two years unquote hikes. If Scott
thought that he was going to getrich by marrying a wealthy woman, he

(20:47):
must have gradually realized that he wasmistaken. In most old money families,
like the Scripts, the family fortuneis well protected in trusts that are designed
specifically to keep the money in thefamily. In fact, when Anne died,
her estate was only worth about amillion dollars. The rest of the
Scripps family's nine hundred million dollar fortunewas in a tightly controlled trust, with

(21:10):
interest from the trust used to supportgeneration after generation of direct errors. No
matter what happened, Scott was notgoing to get any of the trust fund
money. As things got worse inthe marriage, Anne updated her will to
ensure that Scott would get the minimumamount possible. By law, he was
entitled to one third of her estate, about three hundred thousand dollars, but

(21:33):
she had the will structured in away that he would get an initial payment
of ten thousand dollars followed by taxablepayments of just sixty five hundred dollars a
year for life. Wow. Thatwas pretty smart. Over time, Scott
became increasingly violent, especially When hewould come home drunk, he would throw
furniture across the room, smash glassesagainst the wall, and he started becoming

(21:57):
violent with Anne as well. Aftera dinner party, a friend of Anne's
saw him slam her against a stonewall near the driveway of the dinner party
hosts, in full view of otherguests. Another time, at a wedding,
he became enraged when Anne went outon the dance floor with her former
brother in law. He grabbed herarm and pulled her off the dance floor,

(22:17):
calling her a slut in front ofeveryone. On their second wedding anniversary,
Scott bought Anne a bathroom scale,saying, quote, you'd better use
this every day. I don't wantto see an inch of fat on you
unquote At the time, not thatit matters, but Anne weighed one hundred
and five pounds. The fights wouldget worse than Scott would apologize and promise
to change, then the cycle wouldstart all over again. He would get

(22:41):
paranoid and accuse Anne of having affairs, and he would get irritated and impatient
when she would take Tory for awalk or stop and chat with neighbors.
Anne started speaking in code to herfriends on the phone, believing that Scott
may have bugged the phone. Shehad code words to let her friends know
that Scott would lingering and that shecouldn't speak openly. He started spending more

(23:03):
time at his old apartment and businessoffice in Greenwich. He would party a
lot, and he would befriend manyof his female painting clients, never letting
on that he was married. Oh, hopefully you're getting the picture by now
that Scott is a real piece ofshit. In the spring of nineteen ninety
one, a petitioned the family Courtfor an order of protection against Scott,

(23:25):
saying that he had tried to pushher out of a moving car. She
packed her bags and took Toy withher to stay at Alex's apartment in Bronxville,
but Scott persuaded her to return home, promising again that he would quit
drinking and become a better husband.In December nineteen ninety three, and discovered
that Scott had taken Tory's birth certificateand other important papers from their home.

(23:48):
Fearing that Scott would kidnap Tory,she filed another court order preventing Scott from
harassing her and from taking Tory fromthe house. Anne then sought help from
the Coalition for Family Justice, nonprofitorganization in Westchester, New York. On
describing Scott's violence in detail, thechairperson of the coalition advised Anne to get
out of the house and offered upone of their shelters as a place for

(24:11):
her to stay in the near term. However, Anne's attorney advised her to
stay at home, otherwise it couldbe considered abandonment and it would weaken her
position in regards to custody of Tory. Oh, it's just those stories over
and over again. It's just reallyreally heartbreaking. As they talked about ending

(24:33):
the marriage, Scott said he wouldleave if she paid him a quarter of
a million dollars. Anne agreed,but only if it was done officially through
the court system. Otherwise she wasworried that Scott would come back and demand
more money, or that he wouldkidnap Tory, something he had threatened to
do many times. So this wasthe situation leading into the final week of
nineteen ninety three. Scott and Annewere both still living in the house,

(24:57):
both sleeping in separate bedrooms. Scottwould come and go without explanations, sometimes
staying out all night or leaving inthe middle of the night. He would
wake Anne up in the middle ofthe night, yelling at her, calling
her stupid or calling her a slut. She'd wake in his grip, unable
to move as he ranted at her. One time, he threatened to cut

(25:17):
her into little pieces and scatter herbody all over New York. She began
sleeping with a claw hammer under herpillow or next to her bed for protection.
On Christmas Eve, Anne met afriend for lunch. She had a
patch over one eye after a tripto the ar because her cornea had gotten
scratched in Scott's latest attack on her. She told her friend that he had
pushed her down the stairs, thrownher on the floor, kicked her,

(25:41):
and pulled her hair so hard shethought it was going to come right out
of her head, she said.She threw her hands up and told him,
quote, take anything you want,but don't hurt me any more.
I can't take it any more.End quote. That's horrible. A few
days after Christmas and before New Year'sScott gave Anne a black eye in another
fight, and she went to familycourt to seek an order of protection.

(26:04):
But it was the holiday season andthe family court judge was on vacation,
so she was told to come backafter the holidays. On New Year's Eve,
Alex now twenty three, was inVermont skiing with friends. Annie twenty
two, was home on break fromcollege, but she was planning to go
to a party while Anne was planningto stay home with Tory, who was

(26:25):
now three. As Annie was gettingready to go out, she found her
mom crying. Anne told her thatshe and Scott had been fighting again.
She said that Scott told her thatthe threats were over and something more had
to be done, implying that theviolence was going to escalate her, which
is really scary. Annie said shewas going to stay home, but Anne

(26:45):
said, no, go ahead andgo out have fun. It's just another
one of his threats. When Anniereturned home from the party at three thirty
am, she realized she had forgottenher key and the door to the house
was locked. It was freezing outside, so she pounded on the door,
the same time noticing that Scott's carwas not in the driveway where it usually
was. She was quickly alarmed whenthere was no answer, because she knew

(27:07):
that her mom was sleeping in herroom, which was right above the door.
A few hours earlier, just tenminutes into the new year, some
police officers out on patrol saw agray bmw idling in the middle of the
tap and Z Bridge, a cantileverbridge that spanned the Hudson River, twenty
five miles north of Midtown, Manhattanand about twenty two miles from Anne's home

(27:29):
in Bronxville. The car was atthe midpoint of the bridge, which was
three miles long and one hundred andforty feet above the water. There was
no one in the car, butsitting in the front seat was a bloody
claw hammer. After Annie had beenoutside pounding on the door of the family
home for about twenty minutes, thepolice showed up. We've heard differing reports

(27:49):
about how the police got the call. One report said that the neighbors heard
Annie pounding on the door and callthem up. Another said that Annie called
them herself. It's possible that shemay have had a cell phone at this
point, but we don't know.A third explanation we read is that at
some point, after finding Scott's caron the bridge, his brother called the
police because he was worried about Scott. Apparently, Scott had called him right

(28:11):
before midnight, saying quote, I'vedone something really bad this time end quote.
When Scott's brother couldn't reach him afterthat, he eventually called the police,
who showed up at Anne and Scott'shome around three fifty am to find
Annie standing outside the front door.In any case, after the police arrived,
firefighters were summoned to break into thehouse. As Annie and the officers

(28:33):
reached her bedroom, they were metwith a horrific sight. Anne was laying
on the bed, her head bloodiedand beaten, apparently by the same hammer
that she had been keeping nearby forprotection. The sheets were soaked in blood,
and the family's new puppy was snuggledup next to her. Anne was
breathing, but just barely. Here'sAnnie telling ABC News about that terrible moment.

(28:59):
I couldn't believe it. I couldn'teven recognize my mother. Face was
so badly beaten and swollen, andshe had a huge oh on the side
of her face. Anne was rushedto the hospital. Three year old Victoria

(29:19):
was found physically unharmed, cowering inher bedroom next to the primary bedroom.
Apparently she either witnessed what happened orwent in to find her mom after it
happened. We've seen different versions ofwhat Tory supposedly said to her sister and
the police after they found Anne,but most are something along the lines of
quote, daddy was giving mommy somany bad booboos? Why does mommy have

(29:42):
paint all over her face? Endquote that's so we'll be back after a
break. Anne was in a comafighting for her life. She hung on
for six days, but her injurieswere just too severe, and she passed

(30:03):
away on January sixth, nineteen ninetyfour, without ever regaining consciousness. Coincidentally,
at the time that Anne was fightingfor her life, her first husband,
Anthony Morrel, was fighting for hisown life in the Veterans Affairs Medical
Center in Pittsburgh. He had beendiagnosed with cirrhosis of the liver resulting from
his fast paced, hard drinking lifestyle, and was given between six weeks and

(30:26):
six months to live. When heheard about what happened to Anne, he
left the hospital and came to NewYork to be by her side. Alex
and Annie decided that their mom wouldhave wanted to donate her liver to their
dad, so they gave the goahead for the transplant. Oh my goodness,
a family spokesperson said, quote,her daughters acted on what they knew

(30:47):
would be their mother's wishes. Anneleft this world the way she lived in
it, loving and giving unquote.The liver transplant ended up giving Anthony the
gift of another eleven years of life. He died in two thousand and five
of a heart attack. Well that'sso nice, I know, very nice.
If we divorce, I want youto have my lover too. If
oh, thanks, you're welcome,and vice versa. Oh thanks. New

(31:10):
Year's Day nineteen ninety four was thefirst day on the job for Westchester County
District Attorney Janine Piro. That soundsfamiliar, well before she had her Judge
Janine Puro TV show and before shewas a Fox News co host. She
was elected as the first female DAof Westchester County, New York. On
that first day, before she evenhad a chance to take her jacket off,

(31:32):
she was notified of a high profiledomestic violence and possibly murder case.
She was already known as a passionateprosecutor of domestic violence cases from her time
as assistant DA, and she raisedher profile further by appearing frequently in the
media to talk about the Anne scriptscase. Domestic violence would become a focal
point of her next twelve years inoffice. One substantial change was eventually made

(31:56):
in domestic violence procedures as a directresult of Anne's death. Remember that Anne
had sought out protection shortly before shewas killed, but the family court judge
had been on vacation, so shewas turned away. Now, if no
family court judge is available when needed, the criminal court judge who is on
twenty four hour duty can sign anorder of protection, which is really it's

(32:19):
amazing that it took this for thatchange to be made, because it just
seems obvious that people are going toneed protection at random times of the night
or holidays or things like that.But in any case, some good that
came out of it. While Scott'scar had been found idling in the middle
of the tappan Zee Bridge, fewpeople believed that he had actually jumped over

(32:40):
the side to end his life.Alex and Annie were firmly convinced that he
had faked his own suicide, andthey feared for their safety, even hiring
bodyguards for a time. Scott's formerboss, who owned the property where Scott
worked as a caretaker for six years, said quote, I'll tell you this,
he never jumped off that bridge.He hated cold water. He never

(33:00):
went in the pool one time inall the years. Said the water was
too cold. No way he jumpedinto that freezing cold January water. On
January second, the police visited Scott'sapartment in Greenwich. They spoke with a
neighbor who lived downstairs from Scott,who said that she hadn't seen him.
The next day, though she heardfootsteps in the apartment above and called the

(33:22):
police, But when they showed up, there was no sign of Scott at
his apartment. Whoever it was hadleft, but it reinforced the belief that
Scott was still alive. The investigationalso uncovered the fact that Scott maintained two
bank accounts under two different names andsocial security numbers, and that he was
in possession of two birth certificates withdifferent names. There was speculation that he

(33:45):
had fled to the Caribbean, possiblywith the help of a girlfriend. A
warrant was issued for Scott's arrest,and the family offered a reward for information
leading to his arrest. The rewardstarted at twenty five thousand dollars and was
raised in February to one hundred thousanddollars. The police did launch a search
of the river, but the currentsin the Hudson River are actually quite variable.

(34:07):
Unlike most rivers, the water inthe Hudson River can flow either north
or south depending on the tides,and the flow direction changes usually four times
a day. And while the HudsonRiver doesn't usually freeze over, the frigid
waters and scattered ice hindered the search. On March thirtieth, nineteen ninety four,

(34:28):
as things were thawing out, aMetro North Commuter railway worker found a
body on the river bank, notfar from the railway tracks. A day
later, dental records were used topositively identify the body as Scott. Apparently
he had jumped after all. Ohmy goodness, He had five hundred and
seven dollars in cash in his pocketand his watch was stopped at exactly twelve

(34:50):
o'clock, leading investigators to believe hejumped right at midnight, moments after calling
his brother and only ten minutes beforethey came upon his car. And Annie
were surprised, but relieved they nolonger had to worry about Scott coming after
them or Tory. Annie said,quote, it was a surprise, but
the nightmare is over. Unquote.Do you think when Scott jumped from the

(35:13):
bridge he intended to end his lifeor do you think he thought he could
reach the shore? I think hemust have intended to end his life because
the bridge is it's one hundred andforty feet above the water, and the
waters were frigid cold on January first, So I can't imagine a world where
he thought he would survive that,Okay. In a brazen and shameless move,

(35:34):
Scott's family tried to file a claimon Scott's shares of Anne's estate,
but in October nineteen ninety four,a judge denied the claim. The primary
reason it was denied was that Scottactually preceded anne and death. Although it's
hard to believe if she hadn't hungon for six days after the beating,
it's possible that his family might haveactually been entitled to part of her estate.

(35:55):
It just boggles my mind that thatwould even be a possibility. That
his family could just so icky toothat they wanted to do that. Although
Annie had said the nightmare was overafter Scott's body was found. Sadly that
was not the case. Initially,after her mom's death, Annie redirected her
grief into caring for her little sister, Tory, who wasn't able to get

(36:16):
to sleep by herself anymore. Anniebecame a substitute mom for Tory, and
for a time she wanted to adopther, but she was twenty two years
old and in no position to providea stable home for a traumatized three year
old. In the end, Torywas adopted by Anne's sister, Mary Scripps
and her husband, Robert Carmody,who raised Tory in Vermont. Even though

(36:38):
Annie and Alex remained in touch withTory after she was adopted by her aunt,
losing her was another blow to Annie'sfragile psyche. In nineteen ninety five,
Alex married a real estate investor namedJimmy Romeo, whom she had been
seeing at the time of her mother'smurder. In nineteen ninety six, Annie
married Jimmy's best friend, Paul Patrol, whose family owned a construction company.

(37:02):
Alex and Annie remained extremely close throughthe years, talking ten to fifteen times
a day and taking vacations together.The two couples lived fifteen minutes from one
another. Alex had a daughter,Alexa, and Annie had a son,
Michael, who were fifteen months ofpardon age, just like Alex and Annie
had been. They were more likesister and brother to each other than cousins,

(37:23):
but neither marriage lasted long. Alexgot divorced after three years of marriage
and Annie after four. As Alexlater said, the two girls were in
La La Land after their mother's murderand were having a hard time coping.
Annie was reportedly drinking a lot duringher marriage. Anne had to be hospitalized
more than once after passing out.Alex received intensive therapy and at help.

(37:46):
She had always been the more resilientof the two girls, and she hadn't
been there that night to see hermom's horrific injuries. It was harder for
Annie. She saw a therapist fora time, but she couldn't get the
images of her brutally beaten, indying mom out of her head. She
felt guilty for not staying home thatnight, thinking she could have prevented what
happened, despite Alex and others tellingher that no Scott would have killed her

(38:10):
as well if she would have beenhome. Over time, Annie's trust fund
dwindled, she had problems managing hermoney, compounded by a drinking problem and
difficulty finding love. She and Alex, along with the Scripts family, sued
the state family Court and police fortwenty two million dollars, saying that Scott
should have been barred from Anne's housewhen she had petitioned the court in early

(38:32):
December, but the Sooths were eventuallydismissed. The court transcripts showed that Anne
hadn't actually asked for Scott to beevicted at the time, even though it
had been reported that way in themedia. In nineteen ninety seven, a
maid for TV dramatization of Anne's storywas made, called Our Mother's Murder.
It starred rox Anne Hart as Anne, Holly Marie Combs as Alex, Sarah

(38:55):
Chalk as Annie, and James Wilderas Scott. Alex and Annie both participated
in the making of the movie,which brought them some income but also served
as a reminder of their trauma everytime it aired. In two thousand,
was that a Lifetime movie? Idon't know who originally made it, but
I believe it. You can probablysee it on Lifetime in reruns now.

(39:15):
Yeah. In two thousand and one, the girl suffered another blow when their
uncle, George Morrell died in thenine to eleven terrorist attacks, and then
again in two thousand and five whentheir dad died of a heart attack.
To occupy her time, once herson Mikey started school, Annie got a
job working part time at a localnursing home. She was trying to help

(39:37):
herself by helping others, but itdidn't work. She got too close to
the nursing home residence and anytime someonedied she took it really hard. They
loved her at the nursing home,but it just wasn't going to work out.
She took other jobs as well,as a clerk at an antique store
working in an office cafeteria, butthe drinking interfered with her work and she
couldn't hold down a job. Herson, Mikey, became anxious being around

(40:00):
Annie when she was drinking and depressed. He loved her, but he started
having trouble in school. The schoolsuggested he might have to be held back
a year. Annie and her exhusband decided that it would be best for
Mikey to switch school systems, sohe moved in with his dad. It
was the best thing for him,but again it was another major blow to

(40:20):
Annie's already fragile mental state. Nighttimewhen she was home alone, was especially
hard for Annie. She'd call herfriends while walking her dogs, and sometimes
she would be in tears, talkingabout her inability to find a man to
love, or how she just missedher mother. Some nights, she would
drink too much and made calls thatcould be bitter or angry, but she
wouldn't remember even making those calls thenext day. One morning, around two

(40:45):
thousand and six, Annie called Alexand told her that she'd taken a bunch
of valume that she'd ordered on theinternet. Alex called for help and ended
up getting Annie committed to a treatmentfacility. While there, the doctors recommended
electroshock therapy, and Annie agreed,desperate for a solution to her struggles.
But after the treatment, Annie foundthat she was forgetting people's names and events

(41:07):
from her life, such as familyvacations, but she couldn't forget the one
thing that she really wanted to forget. In September of two thousand and nine,
thirteen year old Mikey was still livingprimarily at his dad's house. On
September twenty second. The Our Mother'sMurder docu drama aired on TV again two
days later, Thursday the twenty fourth. The day started as it normally did.

(41:30):
Alex called Annie and they had theirmorning coffee while chatting and laughing on
the phone. The sisters met forlunch, then got manicures and pedicures.
After that, they went to Annie'scondo and hung out until six pm,
when Alex left to go make dinnerat home. According to Alex, they
were talking and laughing about whatever,nothing out of the ordinary. After Alex

(41:52):
left, Annie went on Facebook andsent a quick message to a friend,
just asking what's up and saying shemissed her. At seven thirty, Annie
called Chris Smith, who was afriend and an on again, off again
boyfriend. She said something about beingat the gas station getting cigarettes, but
her signal was breaking up, sothe call ended quickly. Fifteen minutes later,

(42:14):
around seven forty five, Annie droveher BMW out to the middle of
the tappan Z Bridge, stopping atnearly the exact spot that her stepfather had
jumped from nearly sixteen years earlier.Witnesses saw Annie walk purposely from her car
to the railing of the bridge.She called Chris Smith again at seven forty
nine pm. This time all heheard was what he described as a loud

(42:36):
swishing sound, then nothing. Threedays later, Annie's body was found on
the riverbank a quarter mile north ofthe bridge. She was thirty eight years
old, the same age as ScottDouglas was when he jumped from the same
bridge. That's so horrible, Iknow. In her car was found a
note scribbled in pencil. The firstpart of the note was addressed to her

(42:57):
son. It said, quote,Michael, my angel. I loved you
more than life and will love youforever. I tried to give you everything
and always be there. I'm sosorry I let you down. I'll be
your guardian angel, and that's apromise. Be strong, my special son.
I love you. Daddy and Mimaslash Biba, which I think is
her husband's parents, will always bethere. You'll grow up to be strong

(43:21):
and caring. Always smile. Ilove you the day I loved you,
the day you were born. I'msorry I let you down. Further down
in the note, she addresses hersister and her niece, quote Alex and
Alexa, I love you so much. Thank you for the smiles. And
for never giving up unquote. Next, there's a bit of a cryptic message
to her half sister, Tory,quote Tory wish you loved us me and

(43:46):
I'm assuming she meant to say wehere Me certainly loved you. I always
missed you unquote. So I haven'tread anything about any conflicts between Tory and
her sister, so it's unclear whathe was referring to in the note.
Maybe Tory felt that she needed todistance herself from the alcoholism, and yeah,

(44:07):
that's possible. The note also includesa brief message to her friends Amy
and Chris, and she asks thatsomeone find a good home for her two
dogs and her cat. Written inthe middle of the note is a heartbreaking
plea to the spirit of her parents. Quote, Mommy and Daddy, please
find me unquote. All Annie wantedwas to live a normal life. She

(44:28):
wanted to find love and raise afamily, but she couldn't escape the demons
that haunted her since finding her motheron that New Year's morning in nineteen ninety
four. It's so sad because youknow that she loved her son and would
have done anything to be there forhim, but she just couldn't carry her
grief and depression any longer. Annie'sdeath hit Alex hard. The two girls
were best friends who talked ten tofifteen times a day. Alex was at

(44:52):
first in denial, then her denialturned to anger at Annie for leaving behind
her son, her sister, andher friends. Alex said that dealing with
Annie's death was ten times harder thananything she went through with her mother.
It's so so hard to lose someonethat's so close to you like that.
Yeah, just never recover and youmissed them horribly every day. Yeah.

(45:13):
Tory, whose thirty fourth birthday willbe June seventeenth of twenty twenty four,
has also struggled to deal with thetrauma and the loss that she's experienced in
her life. She's battled addiction sincea young age and has gotten into trouble
with the law several times over theyears. Her adoptive parents, Mary Scrips
and Robert Carmody, said that hertroubles started in her middle school years after

(45:35):
seeing a re airing of the OurMother's Murder docu drama, prompting her to
start asking questions about her past.Her older sister's suicide when Tory was nineteen
also exacerbated her issues. Before Toryturned eighteen, her adoptive parents went to
court, saying that she was notcapable of handling the seven figure inheritance that
she was due at that time.The court ruled in Tory's favor, and

(45:59):
she quickly spent the money that sheinherited. People took advantage of her,
knowing that she had money and alsoknowing about her addiction. Between the ages
of eighteen and twenty one, shewas arrested four times for drug related offenses
and twice for burglary. Then intwenty eleven, at age twenty one,
she was pulled over in Vermont andfound to be in possession of one hundred

(46:21):
and ninety three bags of heroin.She told the arresting officer that she had
a six bag a day heroin habit. She was subsequently charged with heroin and
cocaine distribution, and then another chargewas added later on that she was operating
a crack house. After this arrest, her adoptive parents refused to post her
ten thousand dollars bail, hoping thatshe would dry out by staying in jail.

(46:45):
Her mother, Mary Scripts, saidat the time quote were supporting her
every way we can. We loveher and will never stop loving her,
and will never stop trying to helpher. Unquote. Tory ended up pleading
guilty and was incarcerated for about amonth before being permitted to go to a
halfway house in Florida, but shewas thrown out of the halfway house for
violations and returned to jail. Shewas granted supervised release in twenty thirteen,

(47:10):
but again found herself in trouble afterviolating the terms of her probation. She
was back in court in twenty fifteen, where she delivered a ten page handwritten
letter to the judge apologizing for herbehavior and documenting a plan for successfully staying
sober, which included attending college,continuing to seek drug treatment, undergoing individual

(47:31):
counseling, and working on developing amore healthy lifestyle. In the letter,
she wrote, quote, throughout myaddiction, I have suffered so many consequences.
Every time I think things cannot possiblyget worse, they do. As
a result of my addiction. Ihave lost family, friends, hope,
for my future, my own valuesand beliefs, self esteem, pets,

(47:53):
educational opportunities, respect from others,and for myself, my freedom and the
list go. In twenty eighteen,Tory was again arrested for possession of stolen
property after pawning her adoptive mother's heirloomjewelry and stealing her car, and she
was arrested again in twenty twenty threein North Carolina on charges of second degree

(48:15):
trespass. In twenty nineteen, atage thirty, Tory was scheduled to receive
another two million dollars from her trust, and again her mom, Mary,
filed a motion that Tory not receivedthe distribution on the basis that she is
incapacitated as defined by the trust terms. It appears, at least based on

(48:36):
my reading of the case file,that this time Mary was successful in delaying
the payment, but I haven't beenable to find any more information about that.
In January twenty twenty four, Victoria'sestranged husband, Dewan Williams, was
sentenced to twelve years in prison asthe mastermind of a nationwide heroin, fentanyl,
methamphetamine, and cocaine distribution network.During his sentencing hearing, a recording

(49:00):
of a twenty nineteen call between Williamsand Victoria was played in which he threatened
Tory and her family. I dida little bit of Facebook stalking, and
I saw that Victoria's adoptive parents,Mary and Robert, posted a picture in
January twenty twenty three where they're embracingVictoria, who has a big smile on
her face in the picture. SoI'm hoping that with the love and support

(49:22):
of her parents, that she iskeeping herself on a good path. Wow,
that is a lot of generational trauma. I know, it's just so
really so sad. Like you alludedto at the top of the episode,
people think that money makes you happyand it can take all your problems away,
but that's not the case. No, definitely not the case. I

(49:45):
have a couple questions for you.One is, why do you think Annie
chose to end her life at thevery same spot that her mother's killer chose
to end his life. Well,the traumatic event never left her and she
was probably thinking of him when shedid it, and she knew that it
had worked for him, and itwas maybe a quick way to end her

(50:07):
life. Yeah, yeah, maybe, I think. You know, obviously,
her mother's death had such a hugeimpact on her life, and I
think it, you know, itjust was full circle at that moment for
her to end her life. Inthat way, her mom's death never left
her. It was always, youknow, at the forefront of her mind,
no matter what she did. Yeah, and it's so sad. It

(50:29):
really really a worry. I meanthat's devastating too. I know she was
really a baby when she saw hermom die. Yeah, and it never
left her either. And no amountof therapy and love from other people can
heal you sometimes, right, Ihave one other question for you, and
this this may sound like a littlebit more of a whimsical question, but

(50:50):
I'm really serious about it. Andthe question is if you were an heiress
with access to a family fortune,so you didn't you don't have to work,
you could do whatever you want,what would you do with your life?
Because I think in some ways thatcan actually be more of a challenge.
Like for Toy, for example,she didn't have to work, so
I think that in some ways itwas harder for her. But you know,
what would you how would you chooseto live your life if you didn't

(51:14):
have to work. I would giveall my money away, would you know?
I would give a lot of itaway. I would think, Well,
whenever we play the lottery, I'malways like, okay, if we
win we're going to give like halfto charity, right, but we haven't
won. No, we haven't won. Unfortunately, our podcast is doing you
know, we're donating what we canwith the podcast. But what would you

(51:36):
do with your time? Oh,with my time? Yeah, I mean
I don't know. I would definitelywant to travel and have a good time.
But yeah, I think I knowwhat you're getting at. And yes,
I think you do need a mission. You need something to work towards.
You need to do hard things foryour self esteem. Yeah, you
need to find some reason to tolive, really, to get out of

(52:00):
bed. Are you saying that Annieand Alex didn't have one toy? I
mean, I think I think Tory, especially like, it was hard for
I think Annie and Alex they bothhad a child fairly, you know,
early on after they got married.So I think that gives you, you
know, a reason, gives yousomething there. But I think it's hard

(52:21):
for all of them just having,you know, having too much freedom in
some ways is not a good thing. Well, that is the tragic story
of Anne Scripts and her three daughters. The key takeaways for me are as
I mentioned at the beginning of thestory, domestic violence and abuse affect so
many more people than just the immediatetarget of the abuse. Everyone deserves healthy

(52:43):
relationships. If you're in an abusivesituation, please get help by calling the
National Domestic Violence Hotline at one eighthundred seven nine to nine. Safe Safe.
Rest in peace, Anne and Annie, and best wishes to Alex and
Tory. I hope that they're doingokay. Do you have any update on
Mikey. I don't. I triedto find any information about him, but

(53:07):
I was not able to. ButI hope he is also doing well.
We worked really hard in the monthof May and we had two bonus episodes
and we had a lot of newlisteners and it was a good month.
We had a really good month,so thank you so much for listening.
But we were able to donate threehundred dollars to the Bride Again Foundation.

(53:30):
We had an episode earlier in themonth about Shana Gardner and Jared Bright Again,
and we said that we were goingto donate to their foundation. I'm
just going to redo something from theirwebsite. Kirst and Bridagin founded the Bride
Again Foundation in September twenty twenty twoafter the tragic murder of her husband Jared
earlier in twenty twenty two, Jaredwas ambushed and shot to death outside of

(53:52):
his vehicle on February sixteenth, whilehis two year old daughter, Bexley sat
strapped into her car seat. Forwitnessing this horrific act, Axley was taken
to the police station, where shenot only spent hours without either of her
parents, but she was also withoutbasic necessities for a toddler, such as
a sippy cup or the correct sizeddiapers. The officers did their best to

(54:14):
comfort Bexley, but she had theyhad limited supplies on hand. In an
effort to make children's experiences at policestations a little less traumatic and scary,
project Bexley Box was born. BexleyBox aims to provide comfort items and basic
necessities for children brought to police stationswithout their caregivers. So we're proud to

(54:35):
make a donation to the Bright AgainFoundation this month, and if you would
like to make a donation, justgo to Brtiganfoundation dot org and you can
easily donate there. And thank youall, And we really owe it to
all of our listeners for being ableto do that. And one more thing
I wanted to talk about. It'sa current news story that I thought would
be relevant. So we don't normallyget political here in the Love Mary Kill

(54:58):
Studios, but there is a abig political scandal in the news right now.
I thought we would be remiss ifwe didn't talk about it. Okay,
I'm talking, of course, aboutNew York City's rat hating Mayor Eric
Adams once again being ticketed for havingrats at his property in Brooklyn. Last
week, Mayor Adams announced plans forthe first ever National Urban rat Summit.

(55:22):
The summit, scheduled to take placethis coming September, will gather the best
rat experts from around the country totalk about ways of mitigating the growing rodent
problem in the Big Apple. Inannouncing the summit, Adams said New Yorkers
may not know this about him,but he quote hates rats unquote. I
think most of us hate rats.Don't go we I mean I don't.

(55:44):
I mean I can say I don'thate them because we don't have them.
If I lived in the city,I would probably hate them. So Adams
went on to say, quote withrat sightings down nearly fourteen percent in our
city's rat mitigation zones year over year, we continue to make progress, but
We're not stopping there. The bestway to defeat our enemy is to know
our enemy. That's why we're holdingthis inaugural summit. Rat Mitigation Zones,

(56:07):
by the way, they are areaswith high levels of rat activity where city
agencies focus resources to address rats andthe conditions that support them. Mayor Adams
says he hates rats so much thata few years ago, when he was
the Brooklyn Borough president, he helda press conference that featured a macab display
of dead rats killed by a newtype of rat trap he had installed in

(56:30):
the borough. Last year, Adamsappointed Kathleen Karate as the city's first ever
ratsar, tasked with coordinating across citygovernment agencies, community organizations, and the
private sector to reduce the rat populationin New York City. Despite his alleged
hatred for rats, however, MayorAdams has just been ticketed for a fifth

(56:52):
time for rats At a property heowns in Brooklyn. A health inspector observed
fresh rat droppings and a rat boroughnear the front staircase of the property.
Adams challenged the previous rat tickets thathe's received. Three of them were dismissed,
but he had to pay a threehundred dollars fine to settle the fourth
one. He said at the hearingthat he had spent seven thousand dollars on

(57:14):
rat mitigation at the property. Sofar this year, across all five New
York boroughs, there have been fifteen, eight hundred and eighty four complaints about
rat sightings, which kind of confusedme because every time I've been to New
York, I've seen rats, butI've never ever once thought to call and
report it. But apparently that's athing you can do. Not everyone is

(57:35):
happy about Mayor Adams and his waron rats. However, after his latest
comment about hating rats, PETA,the People for Ethical Treatment of Animals,
has sent Mayor Adams an empathy kit, including one of its popular Rats Have
Rights coffee mugs. PETA executive vicepresident Tracy Rieman said, quote, instead
of trash talking rats, Mayor Adamsshould focus on clearing New York's streets of

(57:59):
the massive heaps of garbage attracting themin the first place. Pet is calling
on atoms to stop villainizing rats fora problem created by humans and to address
this issue with respect and understanding.Unquote, I mean I can kind of
I think that's probably the better thingto do is to focus on you look
at the underlying cause yeah, yeahit is. I had a pet rat.

(58:22):
Oh really, yeah, well itwasn't really a pet rat. I
had an experimental psychology class, andin the experimental psychology class, you were
supposed to train the rat, okay, and I wasn't very good at it.
And my rat what I mean,I really didn't like the rat.
It was kind of a mean rat. I don't know if they all are,

(58:43):
but it bit me several times andI did not enjoy that very well.
What were you trying to train itto do? Oh? You know
what, I don't even remember.It was a long time ago, but
we did have like little sugar pelletsand you were trying to you know,
that was like the reward. Itwas the reward. Yeah, I mean
it was pretty much like a Pavlovsituation where I think I was probably just

(59:05):
trying to train it to like tapsomething to get the sugar pellet. Yeah.
The first time I ever went toa big city, I think it
was probably New York where I firstsaw a rat running around the street.
And it just it's such an icky. They're like so big, they're like
little tiny dogs. You don't knowif I've seen one in the wild ever.
Well, when I was in NewOrleans a couple of weeks ago,
I told you this, but Iwas walking down an alleyway at night to

(59:28):
get back to my hotel, andsuddenly I sensed that there was a lot
of movement around me in the alleyway. And I looked around and there was
like dozens of rats, like justscurrying everywhere. Well, what makes a
rat worse than a pigeon or yeah, a mouse. I mean, I
know they're big, and I knowthey you know, have pointy claws and
you know, teeth. Yeah,yeah, in reality, probably probably nothing.

(59:52):
Right because of our episode was aboutann scripts and the scripts National Spelling
Bee just wrapped up. I thinkwe'd be remiss not to talk about the
Spelling Bee for a second. Iknow we did this. I think we
did this. No, I wasgoing to give you a couple. I
believe the winner of the Spelling Beewas a twelve year old, which is

(01:00:15):
so young to you know, knowall those words. Yeah, tough words
too, Like I was going togive you some. I don't even know
how to spell any like, Imean, how to pronounce any of them.
I'll give you just a couple thatI know how to pronounce, desiccate
d e s s I c At e no no d e s I

(01:00:36):
c c A t e two c's. I never would have thought that.
Uh, there are some propernouns onthis this too. And if you're if,
if you're a patriot bringing up oldold words, ham trammick, am
trammick. That's a city in theDetroit area. Capital h A m t

(01:00:57):
r A m k h A mt r a m c k e k
is a city in Michigan where youcan get Poonski's on Fat Tuesday. You
can go there any time up.They're known for their Pooonske's to cannery.
C h I c A n er y. Hey, you got that
right, packet arm p A ch y d e r m those easy.

(01:01:22):
No, we did this on apatriot. I think we've already established
that I am an excellent spell you'rean excellent speller. You're excellent almost everything,
almost almost everything. Well, thankyou guys so much for listening and
hanging out with us today. Weappreciate it. Please rate, review,
follow, and subscribe. Find uson social media or send us an email

(01:01:45):
up Lovemrykill at gmail dot com andconsider supporting us on Patreon dot com slash
love Marykill. We have one tierfive dollars a month for early ad free
access and a monthly bonus episode untilnext time. Don't kill your you,
don't kill your wife. That's alittle ironic. He wouldn't kill a fly,

(01:02:47):
but then he would stuff a beaveror whatever it means. Why are
you laughing about stuff in a bvergs made me left h