America & Israel at a Crossroads: Truth, Terror & the Fight for Freedom | SEASON FINALE - Of the People — with Robert Chernin and Ericka Redic

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to of the People. Our season finale,
year two. We have a special show for you tonight.
We have two different panels coming on. Our first panel
is New York Times Wall Street Journal bestselling author speaker
Chris Weidner, speaker and former COE of the Jewish Federation
of Philadelphia, Steve Rosenberg and doctor Lori Feineman, founder of

(00:22):
Florida's East Coast Voice and former president of Boca JCC.

Speaker 2 (00:26):
Stay with us for the main show. But now a
new paradigm and that's really what we're seeing.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
We need to step back from the Israel Iran conflict
and understand what we're really witnessing, which is a seismic
shift in the Middle East. I've said it till I'm
blue in the face that we needed to cut the
head off the snake before anything would change in the
Middle East. And okay, maybe we didn't cut the head
off the snake, but they're certainly defanged and there's a
new paradigm that's now taking shape right before our eyes.

(00:59):
Remember look, for decades, the Middle East has been shackled
by terror networks, proxies, wars, and the looming thread of
a nuclear Iran and in a matter of twelve days,
count em folks, twelve days that world collapsed and Israel
strikes were nothing short of devastating. And US bunker buster
bombing say that three times fast bunker buster bombing of

(01:21):
the nuclear sites was really the exclamation point. But this
wasn't just a military operation. It was a regional reset
and the decade long fantasy that Iran had that one
day it would be able to hold the world hostage
with nuclear weapons over But just as critical.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
As to what we're seeing is what we're not seeing.

Speaker 1 (01:42):
Hamas did not rise to Iran's defense, Hezbelad did not
ignite a regional war, and when the moment came, these
so called proxies or frontline warriors for Iran silent, already
taken out by Israel. And let's not forget all the
money and weapons and political cap that Iran poured into
these terror groups for years. And it's clear, because Tehran

(02:04):
isn't stupid, they now understand that Hamas and Hesblah have
outlived their usefulness. So don't be surprised if they start
cutting them loose. And while we're on the topic, let's
not forget there are still hostages in Gaza that need
to come home. By last count there are fifty idef estimates.
Maybe you know half are alive, but it doesn't matter.

(02:25):
The hostages need to come home. We need not to
forget about them, and they need to come home now.
Iran understands that this is a losing battle to defend
these pawns, so there's no reason for the hostages to
not come home. But the bigger picture in all of
this is this that cease fire that's now taking place,
it really signals something bigger because it's not just a

(02:47):
temporary pause. It's the beginning of a realignment. We are
going to see very very soon several other countries stepping
up and stepping forward to make peace with Israel, because
the Arab countries know that Israel is not really the enemy,
They're really a reliable partner.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
They're part of the solution, not the problem.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
Stability and security and economic growth in the Middle East
goes through Israel, and the lynchpin to all of this
is Saudi Arabia. They are the keystone, and peace between
Saudi Arabia and Israel will remake the Middle East almost
overnight and would most certainly trigger a cascade of other
countries wanting to do deals and redraw alliances.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
It would be through.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
The Abraham Accords, of course, the death blow of an
old order that survived by keeping Israel.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
On the outside. All that's about the change.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
The map is changing, the balance of power is shifting,
and a new Middle East, one built on strength, stability,
and yeah, peace is finally potentially within reach. And that
is the monologue on our season finale two hour special, Erica,

(04:01):
come in and save my rear end.

Speaker 2 (04:04):
Thank you, Erica, there.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
Is no saving.

Speaker 4 (04:06):
That was probably your best monologue yet, Robert, that was
really good.

Speaker 1 (04:10):
Save the best of last. Well, it's from the heart.
I am beyond excited. First of all, we made it
two years. So are we like over one hundred episodes now?

Speaker 4 (04:17):
I would imagine. So we've been pretty consistent. I don't
if we've missed a week. It's been one.

Speaker 1 (04:24):
Well, like we started April two years ago, so it's
got to be. I think we're over on like one hundred.
But I am excited by our guests, both panels. But
I want to introduce the first panel. Yes, let's bring
them in. We have Chris Wider in New York Times,
Wall Street Journal, bestselling author, leading motivationalist, and a minister.
We have Steve Rosenberg, author, speaker, principal at GSD, former
Chief operating officer of Federation of Philadelphia, and doctor Lori Feiman, psychologist,

(04:51):
founder of Florida's East Coast Voice and former president of
the Book of Jewish Community Center. No small feat, ladies, gentlemen,
thank you so much for coming on.

Speaker 2 (05:00):
Are two hours special?

Speaker 1 (05:03):
Thanks for everyone saying okay, so let's let's jump in
because you guys are so talkative tonight. I see, I've
got a lot of work to do just to pull
you just to pull you guys out of this.

Speaker 4 (05:14):
Okay, they're just trying to be you know, and give
everybody time. Wait a week, yeah, wait five minutes and
they'll be talking.

Speaker 2 (05:23):
In an exhausting week. It's Tuesday. How can it be
an exhausting week?

Speaker 5 (05:26):
Have you seen every last news?

Speaker 2 (05:28):
Ah? Got it? So let's talk about that.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
So there's a ceasefire, there's no ceasefire, there's missiles fired.
So Steve, I got a question for you, because I
know you're wired in on this stuff. What's the possibility
that Iran Because you know there was a ceasefire and
that Iran launched the missiles and Israel was going to.

Speaker 2 (05:44):
Retaliate, and they didn't. We'll get into all that.

Speaker 1 (05:46):
What's the possibility that, with the decimation of the leadership,
that Iran doesn't have control of their of their military anymore,
that it was maybe it was a rogue strike.

Speaker 6 (05:57):
I think there's a possibility that anything's going on, and
I wrong right now, but I think that it's pretty
safe to presume that HAMIONI is still in charge and
that the IRGC is still relatively intact. You know, if
you listen to all the experts out there, one of
the things that Trump really doesn't want right now and
the world doesn't want, is regime change. They are not

(06:20):
actually ready for regime change, and Iran they're not stable yet.
That may come at some point, but not today. We
have to get I ran back up on its feet.
And I'm not really worried. I know a lot of
people are. I'm not worried. And you said in your
monologue that we didn't really cut the head of the
snake off, and you're right. The head is still there,
but the head is really really woozy, and it's been

(06:41):
hammered pretty hard. And I'm grateful that the Chinese state
on the sidelines, and obviously Russia state on the sidelines.
So the world is a much better place today than
it was thirteen days ago.

Speaker 2 (06:56):
I agree.

Speaker 1 (06:56):
I just it still occurs to me that maybe they
don't have control, and that's the real risk. Right, So
now supposedly and at some point I want to call
up like something like Drudge Report, because you know, when
I went to school, I read I read a political
history book written by the Soviet Union, and you would
think it was a different history, right, So I guess
it's who's telling the story. And you go to certain outlets,
whether it's CNN or Drudge Now, and you see it,

(07:19):
and then you read other outlets that I think are
a little more objective, and you just go these guys
are telling different stories. But Chris, I want to go
to you in all of this, and I want to
sort of touch base on the ministerial side of Chris Weidner, right,
And most people don't know you're a minister.

Speaker 7 (07:36):
I forgot my caller tonight that you.

Speaker 2 (07:38):
Have a caller. It's just a v neck, It's okay.
So how do you reach.

Speaker 1 (07:46):
People whose religion is I would call it a death cult, right,
I mean, I mean, you know, you can't really.

Speaker 2 (07:56):
Open them up to you know, because to me, it's
one God.

Speaker 1 (07:58):
Right, I don't care whether it's like you know, you know,
the God of you know, Abraham, Isaac Jacob, right, you know,
the God of the Jews, god of the Christians, and
even the God of the Muslims. Right, I'll give them that.
It's the same God. There's only one. Yet, how do
you reach someone? You know, you're so good at reaching people,
and I'm not We're not sending you over to your
on to do that, but I just you know, for
someone who has thank.

Speaker 2 (08:19):
You, you're welcome.

Speaker 7 (08:23):
Well, you know, it is definitely a death cult, and
I don't My personal belief is is that the God
of Islam is not the god of of of Christianity
and Judaism.

Speaker 2 (08:36):
I think. Explain that to me.

Speaker 7 (08:39):
Well, I think what they believe to be true about
God is not accurate of God. And so they're talking
about a different God. So if I say to you,
do you know John Smith? And you say, oh, I
love John Smith. He's amazing, He's fantastic. And we start
talking about John Smith and I go, yeah, I can't believe,
you know, he just got that new position at the
insurance company, and you go, oh, wait a minute, John Smith,

(09:01):
I know he's a plumber. You can call something the
same and it's not necessarily the same. And that's how
I view when when you look at the history of Islam,
you know all that. It one of the things I
try to tell people. And I had to educate one
of my friends who is a network news star, and
after October seventh, they were having a discussion on their

(09:23):
show and I reached out and I said, you guys
are missing the whole boat. Like, there's no talking to
these folks. There's no reforming these folks without an absolute
cutting off of who they are and where they come
from and getting into the mainstream of humanity. And I
told her, I said, you know, you guys are talking

(09:45):
about the geopolitical, you're talking about the political, you're talking
about the economic. You're missing the entire foundation of this
whole thing. And she said, well, what's that And I said,
it's Isaac and Ishmael And she said, who's isacin Ismail?
That's my a. You don't understand that this is thousands
and thousands of years old where God said that there

(10:07):
will be enmity between the two forever. And so when
I look at it from a biblical perspective, both you know,
Old Testament, New Testament, I look at it as is
this is the way it is, this is their nature.
And I really believe that what we have to do
is we have to expose them to the truth. I
believe people are capable of change. I believe that people

(10:30):
are capable of renouncing things. But when you look at
the history of you know, Islam, there's a lot of
crazy stuff that even a lot of Muslims don't know.
I do believe there's lots of great, nice, kind Muslim people.
I just don't think they know what Islam really teaches.
And so I think when you try to reach out,

(10:54):
I would say that you try to talk about values,
human values, and you try to pull them on off
of Muslim dogma. Once you can get them off of
Muslim dogma, then you can actually talk about human values
that the rest of the world lives by. And you know,
I just I think the average person just doesn't outside

(11:15):
of Islam, doesn't look at what they've done as being
something that normal rational human beings do. I also think
one last thing excuse me. We are as Western culture,
we are very much tangible. Right, it doesn't exist unless
you can pour it in a beaker, you know, That's

(11:35):
how you determine what is real and what isn't real. Well,
the reality is is that there is a spiritual world
as well, and in the spiritual world there is good
forces and there are evil forces, and they hold hostage
groups of people and individuals. And so one of the
things that I look at is we have to see
the spiritual world of what's going on. And I believe

(11:58):
that most of well all of the Radical Islam are
held hostage, not just by by tangible physical forces, but
by spiritual forces, and so helping them come to spiritual
conversion I think is the most important thing.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
No interesting interesting, So you know that leads to me,
you know, doctor fine, and so we're gonna we're gonna
pull you in on your psychological basis is you know
what I've always questioned, and we're you know, there are
still hostages obviously in Gaza, but even more I think
concerning is the cycle of violence, right, because they train
their kids young. Right, you work in that world, that's

(12:38):
your world, right, So how do you break that cycle?

Speaker 2 (12:41):
Because once you.

Speaker 1 (12:42):
It's so christ was talking about being captive of sort
of a spiritual evil, right I think, and doesn't let
you go. But there's also the physical side, or the
emotional side. I mean, you see you see young children
in Gaza that are real indoctrinated.

Speaker 2 (13:02):
Yeah, can you undo. Let's leave the spiritual part the side.

Speaker 5 (13:06):
But it's very difficult to unindoctrinate.

Speaker 8 (13:10):
I guess as the word unindoctrinate people you have to
remove them from the source, right And unfortunately, if you
were seeing it.

Speaker 5 (13:19):
Here in America, if you.

Speaker 8 (13:21):
Start young and you infiltrated into everything that they know
and everything that they see and everything that they believe,
and they're reinforced for it over and over and over again,
it's a very hard.

Speaker 5 (13:32):
Thing to break. They don't even know that what they're
doing is I'm going to.

Speaker 8 (13:39):
Use the word I mean, we can use pathological statistic,
I mean horrific.

Speaker 9 (13:45):
They don't know.

Speaker 5 (13:46):
That's all they know.

Speaker 8 (13:47):
And it's not until you can get them out of
that environment. And oftentimes it's not willingly. But you do
hear of some people who have gotten themselves and extricated
themselves out of you.

Speaker 5 (13:58):
Know, Hamas R.

Speaker 8 (14:00):
Hamas's son, the founder of Hamasa's son is all over
social media talking about how he got out and how
now he can see it. Clearly, you can't see it.
I mean, you know, and you're in the vortex, you
can't see it, so to speak.

Speaker 7 (14:12):
I want to tell you a story, real quick story.

Speaker 6 (14:15):
Everyone just don't gold on talk about, right, So everybody
talks about.

Speaker 9 (14:21):
Beating Hamas. You know, Hamas is an ideology.

Speaker 6 (14:24):
So even if the soldiers that are there now are eradicated,
what Laura just hit upon is crucial because they're training
four year olds and five year olds and six year olds.

Speaker 9 (14:34):
So Hamas isn't going away.

Speaker 6 (14:36):
Hezbollah isn't going away, the Muslim Brotherhood as long. But
you how, this isn't going away. These are ideologies. These
are not governmental agencies that are just going to disappear
because some missiles are gone. And even if we did
take out Iran's nuclear warheads, they're.

Speaker 9 (14:52):
Going to find new scientists who want to do this.
And I want to say one other thing.

Speaker 6 (14:57):
You know, we all talk about the tunnels from the
north and the out into Israel. The bad guys built
tunnels into America too, and they're called schools and it's
not just Middle Eastern children who are being indoctrinated. There
are kids in this country who are have this illiberal
ideology permeating in K through twelve schools that have taken over.

(15:19):
Look out your windows, look at SJP, look at within
our lifetime, look at Sammy Dune. These are Americans or
you know, indoctrinated Americans. And if we do not, everybody
talks about college is worried about colleges. If we do
not fix K through twelve in this country, the next
two and three generations, it's I'm not worried about the
Middle East. I'm worried about what's going on domestics.

Speaker 7 (15:42):
Yeah. Yeah, I want to tell you a little, quick,
little story. And this goes to something that the good
Doctor said. Part of the problem is is people in
these countries don't even know what goes on outside the world.
And I'll tell you, I've spoken in Egypt twice. Both
were doing before the Muslim brother it was I think
Osney and Mubarak was the president. So it's basically a secular,

(16:05):
a secular nation with primarily Muslims and then Coptic Christians
and then some Jews there. And I gave a speech
to this super high tech company. I showed up. These
people were all college graduated. There are four hundred of them, all,
you know, all graduates of college university. Some had their

(16:25):
doctorates and they were business suits. The men were in
business suits, the women were in beautiful dresses. They had
kind of they were scarves, but they were, you know,
beautiful scarves whatever, not like the thing where you can
only see your eyes out or whatever. But back then,
my biggest book was called The Angel Inside, and it
was it was about the creation of the David. It's

(16:46):
a fictional story about the creation of the David, when
Michelangelo created the statue of the David. And when I
got to that part, here I am talking to four
hundred college educated professional Egyptians and I said, in a
sular society, And I said, so, how many people have
actually ever seen the David? The David the greatest statue

(17:09):
ever created? You know, the David. It's in Italy. I
don't mean that you've been there, I mean can you
picture it in your mind? They looked at me like
I was talking French wow, and I and then I panicked.
I went, I went, oh, my gosh, I'm in a
room with foreigner Muslims talking about the King of the Jews.
But I came away from that thinking they don't even

(17:30):
know anything about the Renaissance, about art, about history, about Italy,
about any of this stuff. So it made me think,
what is just completely cut out of anything? So they're
put into this shell where there's no outside information. And
this was in a and then you take it from
their brand or someplace like that where they're really on

(17:51):
lockdown religiously, these folks don't even know what's going on
in the world, the vast majority of these people.

Speaker 3 (17:58):
That is scary to think about.

Speaker 4 (18:00):
The It really does sound like, you know, kids these
cults where you hear about kids that have been like
locked away in their house for their whole life and
they've never met people before. Yeah, that's that is crazy
to me.

Speaker 3 (18:14):
Yeah that is scary.

Speaker 2 (18:18):
So again it comes back to how do you how
do you? How do you reach that? Right?

Speaker 1 (18:22):
Look, I you all know me well right in full
disclosure to our listeners, right, you know you've been on
the show before, We've worked on other all worked on
other projects before.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
I am not a Kumba y a gay. It's not
no one would ever describe me that way.

Speaker 1 (18:36):
But I am concerned with because I would argue we're
losing that, you know, notwithstanding everything going on with Iran,
the fact that I think they've been for the time
being neutralized. I think there's the opportunity, as I said
in the monologue, that it's going to there's a new
paradigm taking place in the Middle East, and I believe
that sincerely. But there's still the question of hearts and minds,

(18:57):
not just hearts and minds. You know, Steve, as you're
talking out in this country, which is you know, pernicious enough.
But Chris, to your point right, culturally, what you're talking
about is they are in this I mean, if we
think we're in an echo chamber in this country, they're
they're in an echo chamber with like I don't know,

(19:19):
bomb proof barriers, nuclear bomb proof barriers and can't get
can't get out of it. And Steve, you must see
some of that even in Philadelphia. We were having a
conversation before the show started about Philadelphia and the No
Kings thing in ground zero. But you work on the
ground with that in I mean, are they reachable? I mean,
how do you someone in the Middle East if someone

(19:43):
drop someone from the Middle East and you know on
your doorstep, how do you reach them?

Speaker 4 (19:47):
I mean because the wait hold on before you answer.
I just have to give you guys a heads up.
It is bright and sunny outside and there is very
loud thundergoing off overhead. So if for some reason and
then we lose the show for a second, it will
come back on eventually. It's just a summer storm in Texas.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
So if we've insult, if we've insulted, husham, it means
the show is going down.

Speaker 2 (20:12):
Okay, no, I want to want you guys.

Speaker 3 (20:15):
It'll come right back on. But just a warning. So Steve,
how do you read people?

Speaker 6 (20:20):
So I think there's two answers to that. And I'm
gonna tell you quick because Chris inspired me. I'm going
to tell you a quick story. I've been recently doing
some work with a woman who's the head of the
Hindu American Foundation, and many people don't know that the
plate of the Hindus in this country.

Speaker 9 (20:35):
Is on par with the Jews.

Speaker 6 (20:37):
They are crapped on, they are discriminated against, they have
all the same issues that the Jews have. They have
it even worse in some cases because they look a
certain way. I can walk down the street and nobody
knows who I am because I'm not distinctively anything other
than bald and okay, so, but Hindus look a certain way.
And as I was talking to her, I actually felt

(20:59):
bad because I never thought about the Hindu community. I'm
not against the Hindus. I'm certainly not anti Hindu. I
just don't think of them because they don't have a
lot of them in my life. And I've believe strongly
that most people in this country are not anti jew,
they are not anti Israel. They don't think about it
because since for the last seventy six years or however

(21:20):
long news has been on TV, there has been a
conflict in the Middle East. So people are sick and
tired of hearing about it. They tune out because, ah,
there they go again, and they're not nuanced. They don't
understand the depths of what's going on, and they just don't.

Speaker 9 (21:35):
They just don't care.

Speaker 6 (21:37):
They don't know Jews, they don't know Arabs, and they
don't it's not an issue for them.

Speaker 9 (21:41):
That's on Number two is missing the most important factor.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
Right.

Speaker 9 (21:46):
What Chris said was right. What Lauri said was right.
But there are actual.

Speaker 6 (21:50):
People, the funders of domestic terrorism here who aren't interested
in right or wrong, truth or false. They are pitching
a certain narrative that is going to go forward no
matter what you have.

Speaker 9 (22:03):
Mahmud Khalil, who.

Speaker 6 (22:05):
Should even even be in this country, should have been
deported and eventually will be when it gets to the
Supreme Court. But he's out now. On his first day out,
was campaigning and protesting against Jews in Israel and just
today said that you know, the Jewish terror is because
the US has funded Israel for all these years.

Speaker 9 (22:26):
So this is a guy. He knows the truth. He's
not stupid. He knows what's going on. He's being paid
to say what he's being paid to say.

Speaker 8 (22:33):
Access that's there are being paid.

Speaker 6 (22:36):
They don't you're talking about truth and not truth. They
know the truth, they don't give a crap about the truth.
They're pushing a certain narrative which plays well on TV.
Whether I don't care, by the way, if you watch
CNN or Fox, it doesn't matter.

Speaker 9 (22:49):
Nothing is true on TV. Nothing correct.

Speaker 8 (22:53):
Now, his Stevid, you are absolutely correct. It is about
the money. And I'm going to argue that many of
them don't.

Speaker 5 (23:01):
Actually even know.

Speaker 8 (23:03):
They are literally showing up being told what to say,
and they're getting paid for it. And if you really
dissect it and you ask them the questions of what's
going on there or who's you know, the.

Speaker 5 (23:14):
Most LGBTQ.

Speaker 8 (23:17):
Accepting in the entire country, You're literally getting responses that
blow your mind. It's never anybody saying Israel, which is
actually the most LGBTQ open and welcoming city, and Israel's
the most welcoming country. You're not getting that. You're getting Palestine. Okay, well,

(23:41):
let's check the data there. You're getting some crazy answers
for these people that are protesting.

Speaker 5 (23:47):
They have no clue. They don't know which river, they
don't know which seed, they don't know what they're going
on there.

Speaker 8 (23:52):
You know, you ask them who's like the biggest funder
of terrorism and they say the United States.

Speaker 5 (23:58):
I mean, they literally have no idea.

Speaker 8 (24:01):
And by the way, this is coming off of graduates
at universities in our country.

Speaker 5 (24:07):
We should be ashamed of ourselves.

Speaker 8 (24:09):
But so I'm just arguing the part that, yes, I'd
like to believe some of them know what they're talking about,
and they probably do, but most of them have no clue.
They're getting paid, and it's very K through K through college,
they're susceptible, right, Imprinting happens early and when you get into.

Speaker 2 (24:25):
That autta, wait, they can choose their gender though. Wait,
but it's.

Speaker 8 (24:30):
Those same people that are choosing their gender that are lost, right,
And what's the first thing that they're looking for? They're
looking for acceptance and connection, right, And here's these people
who are saying, hey, come come, you'll fit right in here.
There's a lot of people who are doing this, and
we're going to.

Speaker 9 (24:47):
Pay you to do it.

Speaker 4 (24:48):
Okay, here's the deal. This is what I don't get. Okay,
back in my day that wasn't.

Speaker 2 (24:54):
So long ago.

Speaker 5 (24:55):
We're gonna say, back.

Speaker 1 (24:57):
In Steve's day, Chris's day, in Robert's day was long
time ago.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
I'm creeping up.

Speaker 3 (25:01):
On your I'm myself there, I am grown. Okay, I
hurt yourself creeping up there.

Speaker 2 (25:08):
But back in back in your day, wait, let's start over,
back in your day.

Speaker 4 (25:12):
Shit, what the heck was I saying? Oh, freaks and weirdos?
You know, I was like, I wasn't a jock. I
wasn't like you know this or you know I wasn't
like a goth kid. I was just like, you know,
one of the kids who was like kind of like
just a weirdo. And you know what, we just went
off and we're like weirdos together and like walked around

(25:32):
in the woods and like, you know, took our parents'
car out at night like normal teenagers.

Speaker 3 (25:37):
Like we didn't have to lop off our freaking genitals.

Speaker 4 (25:41):
I'm sorry, how we're not We were supposed to be
talking about Israel and I ran, But.

Speaker 2 (25:46):
That's okay, We'll roll with this.

Speaker 3 (25:48):
What happened?

Speaker 9 (25:49):
What happened?

Speaker 4 (25:50):
Like, Laurie, do you know when, like, at what point
you couldn't just be like a freaking a weirdo.

Speaker 3 (25:56):
You had to start like doing weird stuff like body.

Speaker 5 (26:04):
Look, I'm going to argue that.

Speaker 8 (26:07):
The technology has given us access to so much and
you didn't realize back in the day that there were
other people outside of your little square radius, right, and
you had a few people and that was it. But
once you have this technology and you have access not
only to social media but just the Internet in general,

(26:29):
and you can start googling things and asking things, and
some of that stuff is so biased that you're getting
perspectives on. And now you have social media and you're
seeing what everybody else is doing, and you're comparing yourself
and now you're starting to get information. And by the way,
then you have the social media comparing and seeing what
you're like the fomo, what you're missing out on?

Speaker 5 (26:49):
Right then wait, but.

Speaker 8 (26:52):
Then you're getting it funneled in a certain way through
the algorithm. So you're then only seeing one perspective regurgitated.

Speaker 5 (27:01):
Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of times. You don't even
know the other side exists. You don't even know what's
going on. So I'm blaming it on that.

Speaker 8 (27:10):
I mean, there could be other theories out there, but
I am blaming it on that.

Speaker 3 (27:13):
Not those theories are wrong, you know.

Speaker 5 (27:16):
Psych it's everything you guys talk about.

Speaker 7 (27:20):
Back to the question of how do you win people.
I just remember this. I really believe that the hope
of Iran is the people of Iran. And you know,
when you look at those pictures from the seventies, you know,
when the shaw was there, before the religious takeover and
Sharia lah and all that kind of stuff, they were normal.
They were as Western as we were. And I think

(27:42):
there's a lot of people that do not like what's
going on. They're held hostage by by a religious regime.
And I'll tell you I gave I gave a virtual
speech to seven thousand Irani's about probably five years ago.
And uh, they were in Tehran, and I was in
Scottsdale at our house and I was doing this virtual
speech and I did my regular sales speech. You know.

(28:03):
It was for a company, and I did my regular
sales speech and that kind of stuff. But I said,
before I go, and they had it set up so
that they could see me on the big screen, but
they have the computer turned around so I could see
the audience. And I said, before we go, I want
to say something. As an American, I know that your
government and our government, your leaders and our leaders, there's
lots of fighting, there's differences in political opinions and all

(28:25):
those kinds of things. Let's forget that for a moment.
I know that you who are sitting in those chairs today,
you want the same thing I do. You want to
find love, you want to have a great marriage. You
want your children to be healthy and to grow up
and be productive members of society. You want to live
a long, healthy life. You want to be surrounded by friends,

(28:45):
and I basically went on like that for about a
minute and just kind of I tried to make the
connection between the people there who are being held hostage
and people in America who are not being held hostage,
and that we want the same things. Humanity at its
basic level wants the same things. And I kid you not,
they gave me a two minute standing ovation for a

(29:07):
virtual speech, and I do not believe it was for
my speech. I believe that it was because I embrace
them as humans, as people who don't believe what their
leaders believe. But they're held hostage, literally at gunpoint or
the threat of terror, being dragged off and never being
seen by their families again. So I think to the
degree that we can connect, and I'm sure that there's

(29:30):
some sort of American government agency that's broadcasting into Iran
or you know, something like that, But I think that
the hope for Iran is the average normal person to
rise up and demand together and overthrow the I just say.

Speaker 9 (29:45):
One thing to that, Robert, and that's I love that.

Speaker 6 (29:48):
But the takeover by the iotold was forty five years ago.
So if you are forty five and under, this is
all you know yeah, they are said, because the one
thing that I have not seen over the past twelve
days is actual protests in the street. I've seen some
cheering of bombing alleged. I mean, I don't know if

(30:09):
it's real cheering or not. But when you have regime
change or when you have people that want to change
their government, you see protests in the street. You see fights.
We saw none of them for the last twelve days.

Speaker 7 (30:21):
That's because they kill them that they go out on
the streets. We can go out in the streets and
do all sorts of Harry Carey, but the people of
Iran can't do that.

Speaker 9 (30:30):
You protest.

Speaker 6 (30:30):
That has happened in every regime ever. People have not
been afraid to die. That is what they fight for.
That's what's going on in Ukraine. And if you want
real regime change, you're not afraid. So I don't disagree
with Chris. I'm just not sure because it's been forty
five years that that's a.

Speaker 9 (30:48):
Great point with this scum.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
Yeah, and I'll throw one.

Speaker 1 (30:52):
I'll throw one another point into this, which is, you know,
I'm sort of a you know, a pseudo historian, and
every revolution and always turns on does the military turn
against the regime. Yeah, because you can have protests in
the streets. Let's look at seventeen eighty nine, right, French Revolution. Right,
But that's just one example. Until the military turns against

(31:15):
the regime. The genesis of it, if I can, you know,
use the word is the people protesting. But the seminal
moment is does the military turn against the government or
the leadership?

Speaker 7 (31:31):
Right?

Speaker 1 (31:31):
Because without that they may not be afraid of dying
in the streets, because that's what they're going to do.

Speaker 7 (31:36):
Did you see the president of Iran? And I was
trying to read it right, he came out and said,
the religious leaders are on their way out. It's crumbling,
They're going to flee the country. I actually was sitting
there thinking, is this guy going to make it home tonight?
He's going to take this guy out and shoot him
in the street or what you know him? For him
to get up there and say that, and obviously he's

(31:57):
boots on the ground, so he knows exactly what's going on.
So I take a little bit of hope in that.

Speaker 4 (32:03):
What else another thing we should take some hope in
is Israel Appreciation Day our sponsor, Uh So, why don't
we take them.

Speaker 3 (32:13):
Oh wow, y'all, that is like close thunder, like right,
I don't know if you hear that.

Speaker 2 (32:18):
We do, Erica, we do not hear the thunder.

Speaker 3 (32:20):
Okay, okay, I'm gonna get over it.

Speaker 2 (32:22):
Uh so it's like a Jackson Brown song. Though.

Speaker 4 (32:24):
By the way, you appreciate guys for watching. Go to
Israel Appreciation Day dot com. Get your merch donate, see
how you can participate. Let's hear from our sponsor, Ladies
and gentlemen. Our sponsor is Real Appreciation Day.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
And we are back with Chris Widener see Rosenberg and
doctor Lauria Fiman. And Chris, you didn't get the memo
to wear your blue suit. You know your blue suit.

Speaker 2 (32:49):
I know.

Speaker 7 (32:50):
I saw that and I thought, boy, we gotta get
our we gotta get our suits different next time.

Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, well, you know, we'll message it.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
So I want to I want to broaden this conversation,
but stay in international, so we drop. I don't know,
I've heard six Bunkerbuster bombs, twelve and fourteen. I don't
know the exact number, but Steve you probably do. But
here's the real question. What do you think China's reaction is?
Because the truth is right. The truth is Iran is

(33:18):
enemy number two. Let's not forget that. Really the man
behind the curtain is enemy number one?

Speaker 2 (33:24):
Is China? Is it not? Steve?

Speaker 1 (33:26):
And I mean, do you think there's any chance they're
going into Iran in the next three years, I'm sorry,
in Taiwan in the next three years after what they
just saw.

Speaker 6 (33:36):
Again, I think personally Trump's for initial hesitation, if there
was any that is, if he goes into Iran, then
that gives China green light to go into Taiwan. But
China's relationship to Iran is very simple. It's about oil.
Iran imports nine exports ninety percent of all of it's
oil to China, and China gets an eight percent discount,

(33:58):
So they are most interested in the Irani It's that's
a business play. But interestingly, China sat on the sideline,
didn't say a word. Trump has this way in dealing
with the Chinese premiere, and I feel pretty strongly to
whatever that means to anybody else, that China and the
USA are okay for now. Is China going to go

(34:20):
into Taiwan? I don't think so. I don't see China
as a big military threat. They have a big military,
but when was the last time we saw them actually
use that military in any meaningful, substantial way. China wants
away first and foremost. And Trump came out today and said, China,
get your oil from Iran. And you know what happened today.
Crude oil prices are at its lowest in memory. And

(34:41):
you know what else happened in Nasdaq is at its
highest ever. So something's going on in the world that
we don't know about because we're just regular, normal people.
But there's something around the force that is telling you.
You know, look, you know when the markets act this way,
there's good in the world. It might be bad people
doing bad things generally, but China and I ran, it's

(35:03):
all about oil.

Speaker 3 (35:04):
How can oil be up right now?

Speaker 2 (35:06):
No, it's down down now, That's what I know.

Speaker 3 (35:09):
That's sorry, that's what I mean. How can it be
down right now?

Speaker 6 (35:12):
Because the US, no Israel, and the US never bombed
one oil field. Oil never went up in the last
twelve days, They never hit a thing. Gas prices are
going down the summer summer travel season.

Speaker 3 (35:27):
That's you know, it's so funny.

Speaker 4 (35:29):
I like to think that I am pretty in the know,
you know, because I'm like a business person. But you
the things that you don't consider that affect the market,
that affect people's confidence or a lack of confidence, that
is wild.

Speaker 3 (35:47):
That is wild.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
Well, the market likes stability, and it likes predictability. And
the fact that you have a President Trump who even
in his I don't even know how to say this unpredictability.
I guess right in his unpredictability is predictable and his unpredictability,
I mean he's in NATO right now.

Speaker 2 (36:08):
Right.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
So, but Chris, I want to get back to something
that you had touched that you had touched on earlier
about you know, people and their beliefs and Steve, you
also referenced that you thought support in this country for
Israel and Jewish community is still the majority. There was
a Gallop poll in April, if I remember that shows
that support for Israel actually now is under fifty percent

(36:32):
in this country for the first time, and support for
Hamas and Palestinians and two state solution is that an
all time high thirty six percent. I think it was
forty eight for Israel thirty six percent. So, so, Chris,
is it not?

Speaker 7 (36:45):
You know?

Speaker 1 (36:46):
And Laurie, I'm trying to bring all three of you together.
But you know, is it not the human the secular
humanism Chris right, the fact that people are looking for
something right, they're bought, you know, the famili's falling apart,
they're brought up with with no religion, let's just say.
And so they do they not then cleave on to

(37:06):
what they're taught in school or you know, the college campus.
Is you know, to belong to something right? Isn't in
a lack of belonging to I think there's.

Speaker 7 (37:13):
A lot of it as social contagion. This is how
people end up at these protests and and you see
these men on the street things, Hey, are you excited
to be here?

Speaker 6 (37:21):
Oh?

Speaker 7 (37:21):
Yeah, we're excited to be here. Well what are you
protesting today? And all they have is slogans And they
don't know they're there because their friends are there. They
know that they're gonna end up on TikTok, you know,
all those kinds of things. But I wanted to jump
back real quick to you know, we're talking about China.
Sure from the Christian pastors perspective, the Book of Revelation,
it talks about dog and magog, which most people have

(37:44):
agreed upon is Russia and Iran. And there's a whole
prophecy about Dog and Magog coming against Israel and that
they would be pulled back as though they had fish
hooks in their mouths. And you know they know that
lot huh. I did not know that a full onslaught
between Gog and Magog, which is absolutely because it talks

(38:06):
about to the north, and you know, it's obviously Russian
and Iran. Russian and Iran have never had an agreement
of any sorts before. And so I'm more concerned about
Russia and Iran more than China because, uh, you know,
they're both so close and they come in like that
and they've been talking. Russia has said if the US

(38:28):
gets involved, we might get involved, and so I'm more
concerned about Russia than China.

Speaker 1 (38:33):
So and Russia just came out and said that they
you know, that they're willing to restock Iran with nuclear weapons.

Speaker 6 (38:41):
That was the former president said that, and he's a
blow hard.

Speaker 9 (38:45):
And Russia can't has their answer with Ukraine.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
They've stuck their own word.

Speaker 6 (38:52):
I might worried about I'm more worried about, again, anything
that's going on in this country that I am about
Russia is a paper tiger another paper tige in my opinion,
I love christ Well.

Speaker 1 (39:02):
I mean, you would have thought before the Russo Ukraine
War that Russia would have made quick work of Ukraine.

Speaker 2 (39:10):
Clearly that ain't so.

Speaker 9 (39:13):
I want to hear what Laurie. Thanks about your question.
Now which question?

Speaker 5 (39:17):
But I was just going to say, I am the
people I'm talking to.

Speaker 8 (39:20):
The anxiety is about what's happening here and what's going
to be happening here. I mean, I don't know how
many people are on this panel. I'm holding my breath
for New York City today, Okay. And that's just the
bottom of whatever the expression is.

Speaker 5 (39:37):
I mean, we have not even.

Speaker 2 (39:38):
Done the bottom of the barrel.

Speaker 5 (39:39):
That yeah, that's the bottom of the barrel. I mean,
I the.

Speaker 8 (39:44):
Anxiety that I am seeing in my patients. But every
person that I speak to, whether it's a friend, whether
it's a teenager, everybody is just carrying around this anxiety
of what's going to happen here. And it's not going
to be you know, the planes coming in and dropping bombs.

Speaker 5 (40:04):
It's going to be.

Speaker 8 (40:06):
Just little cells that are popping up when you're least
expecting it. At a football game at you know, and
this was the whole, the whole method it's been since,
you know.

Speaker 5 (40:14):
Prior to nine to eleven. It's let's get them in a.

Speaker 8 (40:18):
Very everyday type of situation that they're least expecting, because
we're going to instill the fear, and then we're going
to come in and we're just going to keep infiltrating
and keep infiltrating.

Speaker 5 (40:28):
And there are so.

Speaker 8 (40:29):
Many people who don't know what's going on and cannot
connect these dots that they wake up one morning and
they're like, holy crap, how did we get here.

Speaker 7 (40:39):
I don't know if any of if you guys, have
ever looked at scorpions or or dealt with scorpions. I
lived in Scottsdale for some years.

Speaker 10 (40:45):
Things.

Speaker 7 (40:46):
Yeah, the bugs they tell you not to step on.
They tell you not to step or squish squish them,
but to catch them in a jar. And the reason
why is if it's a female, it could have a
thousand little baby scorpions on it. So I like it
to that you squashed the big thing, But what you
do is you release all these other thousands of little things.

(41:06):
And I think you're right, Lourie, is you know you're
talking about, and I'm shocked it hasn't already happened. Like,
I'm shocked there hasn't been a thousand people walking to
Starbucks from coast to coast, all at the same time,
open their shirts, yell a lah, black bar and pull
the trigger.

Speaker 4 (41:22):
Right Democrats, Notice how Democrats are now concerned about border security?
Are our illustrious congress woman from here in Texas, Jasmine
Crockett was.

Speaker 3 (41:36):
Like, we don't know who's come in to our country?
Who Lord?

Speaker 1 (41:42):
And like, yo, wait, she's a walking commercial for Republicans that.

Speaker 6 (41:48):
Let them keep talking. You may as well just hand
jd Vance the keys right now.

Speaker 2 (41:53):
Chewing.

Speaker 9 (41:53):
But to Laurie's points, we said it earlier.

Speaker 6 (41:56):
First of all, you know, Robert, you asked a question
about UH supports Israel.

Speaker 9 (42:00):
Two state solution.

Speaker 6 (42:01):
If you are for a two state solution, you are
probably watching black and white TV, wearing a leisure suit
and going out to the curb and getting your newspaper
every day. It's it's a dead on arrival solution. Nobody
should talk about it. If you weren't sure, October seventh
made it sure. Okay, there's no They have been offered
a statehood multiple times, and they've crapped on Israel. They've

(42:24):
crapped on the Jews every single time.

Speaker 1 (42:26):
And that Steve, this was ordained US policy. And I
shouldn't use the word ordained with the minister here, but
you got the idea this was ourdained US policy for
fifty years.

Speaker 2 (42:37):
I agree with you. It's a failed policy, right, But.

Speaker 6 (42:40):
That's what's sorry, no go ahead now, that that's what's
to Laurie's point that it has been indoctrinated, and indoctrinated
teachers in Blue states are being trained by s JP,
by Katari money, by domestic terrormory.

Speaker 9 (42:58):
I'm not going to mention.

Speaker 6 (42:58):
Any names there, training teachers to talk using having this
illiberal education that shows maps that has says occupy territory,
doesn't even show Israel at all. So you have in kindergarten,
in first grade, in second grade. So when you talk
about sales, I'm not worried about although Chris just gave.

Speaker 9 (43:20):
Everybody an idea of going.

Speaker 11 (43:21):
To thinking out, But you know.

Speaker 6 (43:23):
I'm more worried about the all these people hate America, right,
they want America to become Cuba.

Speaker 9 (43:29):
Well, I'm sure I've been to Cuba. You know who
doesn't like Cuba?

Speaker 2 (43:33):
Cubans?

Speaker 10 (43:35):
Right, So why.

Speaker 6 (43:36):
Would we want America to be like Cuba where there's
nothing on the shelves, you can't get anything to eat.
The idea that of what these people are bringing into
this country, led by Bernie Sanders, is sickening. It's discussing.
If you don't like it, here, go get out. If
I had enough money, I would buy the way Pickens.

(43:56):
But we're indoctrinating these kids. We have to start to
fly school boards. There's a suburban district right outside of
Philadelphia called Lower Marion where there's a group of very
hard working people who were not expecting to be candidates,
who are now candidates in a school board race because
this is one of the highest performing school districts in
the United States and is now being overtaken by anti Jew,

(44:18):
anti Israel school board people.

Speaker 9 (44:20):
So we have to.

Speaker 6 (44:20):
Start to build coalitions to overtake school boards across the
country because that's where change occurs. These have to be
we have to have grassroots movements because the bad guys
are organized, they're well funded, and you know what, the
Jews can't even agree on who the good Jews.

Speaker 1 (44:36):
Are well that leads me to, you know, being anti Israel,
anti Jew. Is there also not Chris in this country
an undercurrent that maybe is anti Christian? I mean, you know, certainly,
certainly the last administration, you know, white Christian net so
they went from white supremacists and that didn't hold.

Speaker 2 (44:57):
Then they you know, as a buzzword.

Speaker 1 (44:58):
Then they went to you know, white nationalist or white supremacist,
and then it was white Christian supremacy. I mean, isn't
it really you know, there's this anti Christian It's not Look,
it doesn't make the papers as much, but it's still
there and it's growing, is it not?

Speaker 7 (45:12):
Oh? Absolutely? You know. In fact, we saw on the
promo for Israel Appreciation Day Rabbi Pinka Salus, who's one
of my dear friends, and I know that you've become
very close with him as well, Robert. The very last
time I had Shabbat dinner with them down in Scottsdale,
he asked me to say a few words, and I
don't remember anything I said except the very last thing

(45:32):
I said. I said, you know, the Jews and the
Christians need to stick together because they're coming for both
of us. And the reason why is is because we
represent godly values, the things that we believe in traditional
you know, traditional Judeo Christian values, and that's really what
the left is trying to take us more progressive, and

(45:55):
what Islam is trying to do is take us way regressive.
But both of them want to that ban Jews and Christians.

Speaker 8 (46:03):
And Robert you just said it, you said it's not
making the papers. Therein lies the problem, and the media
is complicit in this as well. You are only hearing
what they want that narrative to be. And so you
start in the you know, at kindergarten, and you infiltrate
the school systems and then you're getting information, whether it's

(46:25):
from the money funded by the universities or the newspapers
and media, social media, however you want to look at it,
and you're only seeing it one way.

Speaker 5 (46:33):
So it's this current.

Speaker 8 (46:35):
That it's going to be impossible to break because they
media controls it.

Speaker 5 (46:41):
If they don't want you to see it, you're not
going to see it.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
Can we use a word other than impossible because impossible
sounds statalistic?

Speaker 8 (46:47):
And you know me, well, I'm just getting heated and
passionate about it, and I'm not going to choose my
words carefully because then the passion goes away.

Speaker 9 (46:55):
But Laurie, I thought the Jews control the media, right.

Speaker 8 (47:00):
But that doesn't fit the narrative when you know, when
this happens, I.

Speaker 11 (47:03):
Mean, we can fill the media.

Speaker 9 (47:05):
We shook it.

Speaker 5 (47:06):
We're terrible, terrible.

Speaker 7 (47:08):
Well, but here's here's the other thing. Just because someone's
Jewish doesn't mean they're not anti Semitic. I mean, who's
funding all of bang who's funding this? George, he's a
hung He's a Hungarian jew. Right, So.

Speaker 1 (47:26):
Are not Jewish Jewish voices her peace right?

Speaker 2 (47:30):
Neither really Jewish and certainly not for peace hello.

Speaker 8 (47:33):
Right, But you go into a suburb, even where I'm
in very affluent Jewish suburb, and I would say that
the Jews have no idea half of them what's going on? Okay,
and they're they think progressivism is just so amazing. They're like, oh,
equality for all, and sure I want to do the
handouts and all of this stuff.

Speaker 5 (47:53):
They didn't see any of this stuff coming.

Speaker 8 (47:55):
They used to think I was crazy, absolutely crazy, And
now the starting some of them are starting to wake up.
But again then it stops at but I hate Trump, right,
and so right, So it's kind of like we're hurting
ourselves well, and I think, oh, sorry, la Erica just emerged.

Speaker 5 (48:13):
No, that's great.

Speaker 4 (48:14):
I think to your point, so many people I met
on during my campaign are not on any kind of media.
They are not watching the news, they are not on
social media, they are not reading the newspaper or getting
news delivered to their email or whatever it is anybody
does nowadays, people are really disconnected from what is happening

(48:38):
around them. And I think that is, you know, further
to the point that Steve made earlier about proximity, Like
if you lack proximity to the problem or to people
to understand what they're going through, you know, it's just
it's easy to just.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
Gough, I don't even know. Oh what, Oh, there's a
bigger world out here. What I think that's a lot
of what it is.

Speaker 6 (49:05):
They're complacent. They're complacent. Jews are complacent. Americans are complacent.
They live in country club lives and they go to
their jobs and oh, that's not going to happen here,
and then it does and they're still complacent. And then
the Jewish community, to kuno o Lam has replaced everything
else and it's maddening.

Speaker 9 (49:23):
It is maddening because.

Speaker 6 (49:25):
I can just tell you know, the Jews don't owe
the world another cautionary tale.

Speaker 9 (49:28):
We owe our children of victory period.

Speaker 3 (49:33):
Like that clip right there, write that time stamp down
Lord ready.

Speaker 8 (49:38):
And I also think that you know, I can't tell
you how many people I know who when you're Jewish
you were raised to vote Democrat.

Speaker 5 (49:46):
You don't think about it, you don't ask about it.

Speaker 11 (49:48):
That was just the.

Speaker 8 (49:48):
Messaging that's been passed on. You talk about intergenerational trauma.
There you go, there is an example. Okay, there you go.

Speaker 5 (49:56):
But that's what it is. We don't even think about it.

Speaker 8 (49:58):
And when you have conversation with people who are very
educated people, they will say, I'm Jewish, my family's always
voted Democrat. So it all ties back to what we
started with, which is it's really hard to change that
when that's what's been fed to you, you know, generation
after generation after generation, and if you don't stop, know

(50:19):
that there's something different or to you know, to Erica's point,
if you're not following the media, and you're I mean not,
I don't totally agree that people aren't following the media.
I think some people aren't following the media too much.
They're just following a bias media.

Speaker 5 (50:32):
But it happens both ways. But if you're not aware
and you're complacent and you're just going along with it,
this is where we're going to get.

Speaker 7 (50:42):
By the way, I just remembered, I think I said
it was the Book of Revelation, Gog and Magog. It's
Ezekiel thirty eight and thirty nine, and it tells the
whole story. So so now you guys really can't argue
about it.

Speaker 1 (50:53):
Because it's from your book, right it excuse me, three
out of the five of us wouldn't have known that.

Speaker 2 (50:59):
That's okay.

Speaker 7 (51:00):
You know, I was thinking myself, I said, relation, But
it's Ezekiel thirty eight and thirty nine. But the two
chapters are all about this. I mean, it's literally this
is one of the things I love about the Bible.
It's like we're literally watching six thousand year old prophecies
coming to pass in places that they possibly couldn't have
even imagined would exist at that point. And I know

(51:21):
that there may be some skeptics on the panel, However,
I would challenge you to take a look at it.
Ezekiel thirty eight thirty nine.

Speaker 1 (51:27):
If you look at the war with Iran and what
happened in Israel, or really what didn't happen in terms
of casualties, how do you not see God in that?

Speaker 2 (51:37):
How do you not see you know?

Speaker 1 (51:39):
And you know, we're online with some other influencers and others,
and one of them said, I would love to take
credit for it, but I'm not that smart. When Iran
launched their counter strike it and it struck the Bearshiva Hospital,
and it struck the Weisman Institute, and yet there were
no casualties. How do you not see parting of the
Red Sea? How do you not see an act of
God in that?

Speaker 7 (52:00):
Right?

Speaker 5 (52:00):
I mean so many miracles, yeah, in real time.

Speaker 1 (52:03):
And I'd love to take credit for that, for that
epiphany or perspective, but that's not mine.

Speaker 2 (52:08):
I'm just giving you someone else.

Speaker 7 (52:09):
The greatest miracle of all is that the Jews even
still exist for real, tho the years they've been dispersed
and persecuted and murdered and killed and destroyed. And I
told a secular Jewish friend of mine once, he said,
why do you believe in God? And I said you
And he goes, oh, don't give me the old Chosen
People thing. And I said, dude, I mean, you are

(52:30):
the greatest living miracle. God made a promise to Abraham
and it has been fulfilled and nothing everything has come
against it, and nothing has come of it.

Speaker 6 (52:39):
Yeah, Laurie talked about the Jewish community, and you know,
we have a dearth of Jewish leaders in this world,
and the organized Jewish community is not organized at all.
And I would just say the last thing that I
would say tonight is is that you know, while the
Jewish leaders the Jewish organizations are busy writing op eds,

(53:01):
that President Trump and bibnet Yahoo are busy writing history
and making us stronger and making us better. And I
am proud to be an American talking to the four
of you, I am proud to be a Jewish American.
I am be on history will tell an unbelievable tale
of what the IDEF did over the past twelve days,
really over the past you know, I don't know seven

(53:23):
hundred days, but let's talk about the past twelve days
in particular.

Speaker 9 (53:26):
This is stuff of legend of movies.

Speaker 6 (53:29):
And I sit here in awe at to Chris's point,
it's the reason I'm still here.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
And I want to thank all three of you for
being with us on our first hour of our two
hour season finale. I could not think I'm a better
way to kick off the end or to start the.

Speaker 2 (53:47):
End, if there is such a thing.

Speaker 5 (53:48):
Are in the beginning or.

Speaker 2 (53:50):
In the beginning.

Speaker 1 (53:51):
So thank you Chris Weidner, Thank you Steve Rosenberg, thank
you Lori Findman.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
Can I thank you guys.

Speaker 1 (53:58):
Enough for coming on this show, the support for his
Appreciation Day and just being true friends?

Speaker 2 (54:04):
Thank you all, thanks, thank you?

Speaker 1 (54:12):
Okay, just you immediately, Ay and I can't and I'm
excited for our second hour after the break, right, our
second hour?

Speaker 2 (54:20):
We have who do we have?

Speaker 1 (54:21):
We have Larry Ward, longtime conservative media strategists. We have
Jeff Burkwich, CEO of delve Strategies, right or del Research,
and doctor Bruce Abramson your favorite Eric. Now just economists, attorney, panalysts.
So let's go to break and bring in the next panel.

Speaker 3 (54:42):
All right, you guys hang on with us.

Speaker 4 (54:45):
What if we roll a commercial instead of just like
a tim or break zon.

Speaker 2 (54:51):
Okay, Erica, you're in charge, You're in control. You can
do whatever it is you want to do.

Speaker 4 (54:57):
Okay, let's do another id answer real, is that okay?

Speaker 3 (55:02):
You said you already said it's okay? Why am I
asking you guys? Hang on with us? Hang on?

Speaker 4 (55:09):
Oh, Robert, I am really excited for this hour. We
have three big brains. I'm not saying our last guests
weren't big brains. I didn't come out, but these are
three of my favorite guests we've had on.

Speaker 2 (55:25):
You know, America, there's an old expression that when you
find yourself in a hole, shut up, stop taking.

Speaker 1 (55:34):
All right, all right, no, look, my thanks to Chris Widner,
Steve Rosenberg, and Lori Fineman for making the time to
come on. But now let's segue. So ladies and gentlemen,
let's bring them in. We have Larry Ward, longtime conservative
media strategist, political analyst and president of Political Media. We
have Jeff Berkowitz, who is Jeff if I call you seasoned?

Speaker 2 (55:56):
Is that okay?

Speaker 1 (55:57):
As opposed to old public affairs intelligence strategy, the CEO
and founder of delve Research.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
And where's doctor Bruce? Bring him in?

Speaker 1 (56:05):
Aria Acknow just economist, attorney, policy analyst and and always
the biggest brain in the room except when you get
these other two guys. So that, by the way, that's
why we we picked this, you know, we we picked
the panels to.

Speaker 2 (56:17):
Put everybody together. Gentlemen, welcome to other people.

Speaker 1 (56:21):
Yes, absolutely, So we're gonna start with you, mister chessmaster,
which so Jeff Berkowitz delve.

Speaker 2 (56:30):
I'm want to start with you because I want to start.

Speaker 1 (56:34):
And one of the questions that I have in all
of this is, and I asked in the last segment,
what's you know, you're the strategy?

Speaker 2 (56:41):
What's China making out of all of us?

Speaker 12 (56:45):
I think they're watching the price of oil, and they're
thinking about all that military equipment that they sent, uh
to their audience in the planes. Well, you know, I
I think China is happy to have President Trump's attention elsewhere.

(57:07):
But I think they're also understanding something that I think
is very significant, which is post October seventh, Israel led
sort of a strategic recalculation that I think President Trump
in a number of other countries are now catching up to,
which is containment no longer works and you have to
confront the things that you don't want to have happen.

(57:29):
And that's an important lesson for China to observe and
see elsewhere in the world as they think about how
adventurous they want to be in their region.

Speaker 4 (57:39):
I love that aspective, adventurous.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
Interesting, Well, I still would arue they wouldn't. They wouldn't
go into your.

Speaker 1 (57:46):
Un so, Larry, in terms of Trump, in all of this,
and you and I know at this want go back
a long ways. The most unpredictable president you've seen in
your lifetime.

Speaker 2 (57:58):
And isn't that really one of his strengths.

Speaker 13 (58:01):
He's not really unpredictable. You know, There's been a lot
of back and forth, a lot of name calling. MAGA
has been splintered in ways that it's it's hard to
see it coming back. I think it will, you know,
together in twenty twenty six. But here's the thing is
Trump has been very consistent on almost everything he has

(58:23):
said for the last ten plus years.

Speaker 11 (58:27):
That I Ran cannot have a nuclear weapon, that he
was you know, he was.

Speaker 13 (58:32):
Trump was very strong in terms of support for New
York during the last terrorist attack, but he was also
against the He was also against the Iraq war. So
he Trump is. Trump is very in my opinion, I
think this is the exact action that he would have taken.

Speaker 11 (58:53):
He did take it. I predicted it.

Speaker 13 (58:54):
I actually predicted it on the eighteenth that this was
going to be kind of the path because I think
I believe that Trump is both anti endless war, and
he is also very decisive and wants to project American
strength at all times, and also he wants to save
you know, America from you know, from nuclear holocaust and

(59:17):
save Israel from nuclear holocaust.

Speaker 1 (59:20):
A friend of mine, I think, summed it up really
well and just said, you know, he's he's a Jersey guy.

Speaker 2 (59:25):
Said he's got big stones right.

Speaker 1 (59:30):
Well, close enough, you know, these these and those across
across the river, doctor Bruce. So help me understand this
whole War Powers thing, because now all of a sudden,
the Democrats are constitutionalists, right, I mean I thought they
used constitution, the Constitution like for toilet paper, because that's
generally the you know, the amount of respect they've ever
shown it. Now everywhere I turn I hear it's against

(59:52):
the War Powers Act, it's against the Constitution. I don't
think they would know a constitution if it ran them
out what the Constitution was, ran it over right, or
if they looked at it in front and said constitution,
assuming they could read.

Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
But help help me on the War Powers Act. That
was seventy two, seventy three.

Speaker 14 (01:00:06):
Yeah, so that's actually an easy question. Okay, everything they're
saying is nonsense.

Speaker 10 (01:00:11):
It's just totally.

Speaker 14 (01:00:14):
It's not you know, it's not a matter of spin
or misinterpretation or this stuff is debated now.

Speaker 10 (01:00:20):
It's just it's just total nonsense.

Speaker 14 (01:00:22):
I mean, the constitutionally, the president is commander in chief.

Speaker 10 (01:00:28):
Congress declare's war.

Speaker 7 (01:00:30):
Now.

Speaker 14 (01:00:30):
One of the problems is, you know, as with a
lot of things, the notions that people were envisioning in
the late eighteenth century are not the way the world
works right now. I mean, you couldn't when we went
to war with the Barbary Pirates and like, it took
a long time to get from the East coast of

(01:00:53):
the United States to Africa, right you couldn't.

Speaker 10 (01:00:58):
You couldn't get.

Speaker 14 (01:00:59):
There overnight or in a few hours. I mean, we
just flew from Missouri to Iran. I'm back before anybody noticed.
That's not the way things work this country. We have
not declared war. The United States has not been at
war since World War Two.

Speaker 1 (01:01:18):
Even in Korea, we didn't there was you know, it
was a police action.

Speaker 14 (01:01:21):
Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan. We have not been at war
since since World War Two.

Speaker 10 (01:01:28):
So in the early.

Speaker 14 (01:01:29):
Seventies it was going on in Vietnam was debacle. Congress
passed the Warpowers Act, and basically they passed it knowing
that it was kind of questionable as to whether or
not they can do it, and they're tried to put
some constraints on uh, you know, executive use in action
outside of wartime. It is not clear that the war

(01:01:52):
powers act as constitutional and presidents.

Speaker 10 (01:01:55):
Are always fighting about it. But at the end of
the day, what.

Speaker 14 (01:01:59):
It says is it does not constrain the president at
all from allocating military force.

Speaker 10 (01:02:05):
What it says is, if you're.

Speaker 14 (01:02:07):
Planning on engaging in a long action, you must come
and report it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
Is that the actual language long action.

Speaker 10 (01:02:15):
No, I think it's thirty days.

Speaker 14 (01:02:18):
There's a there's a notification window at which point I
forget what it is. There's a relatively short notification window
at which point you have to come and notify Congress
of what's going on. But the truth is, with news
cycles and internets and iPhones, the idea that come, you know,
the idea that you would blow your surprise by showing

(01:02:38):
up in Congress and saying hey, you know what's been
going on for like the last seventy two hours.

Speaker 11 (01:02:44):
I mean, it doesn't help.

Speaker 14 (01:02:46):
So there is a relatively short there's a relatively short window,
and there's a longer window. I think it's thirty days
that I might be all fine.

Speaker 4 (01:02:56):
I saw Jeff, I saw Jeff nodding, and like.

Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
By the way, guys, this mission, you guys can all
jump in this. There's no you know, I mean, when
you grow up in a you know if as most
of you know, when you grow up in a Jewish household,
you have to joust verbally to survive.

Speaker 12 (01:03:13):
So there's no there's no especially as a conservative, right,
there's no taking currence. But what's interesting is is this
is classic war powers actors, classic Congress, which is the
the law they passed actually had the exact opposite effect
then then intended. Right, it was supposed to curtail the president,
but as Bruce pointed out, it actually is the first

(01:03:34):
explicit congressional language saying the president can go off and
have war, you know, you know, take military action. He
just has to send a note to Congress afterwards to
say FYI, and he has thirty days to go do it.
He can get a waiver to get to another another
thirty days, to get up to sixty days. Eventually, there
does have to be an authorization of the use of

(01:03:55):
force if you're going to continue beyond that. And I
don't think there's any real example in Congress ever saying
that the president, once engaged, cannot continue to fight fight
a military action.

Speaker 9 (01:04:08):
Wow.

Speaker 13 (01:04:08):
Yeah, well that's you know, I actually believe wholeheartedly that
Congress are a bunch of cowards and constantly advocate their
responsibility uh and and hand off their powers to the
for the president so they don't have to vote on
these things. War votes are very you know, are very controversial.
You know, the vote to you know, to uh, you know,

(01:04:30):
proceed with the war in Iraq, for the authorization of
military force. There there are people who still are crying
that they had to have that vote.

Speaker 11 (01:04:39):
Whether they voted for it or against it, it's there.

Speaker 13 (01:04:42):
They don't want to take contradict right, right, They they
just don't want to take controversial votes, which is why,
you know, they they also abdicate.

Speaker 11 (01:04:51):
Their responsibility for the you know, for the budget.

Speaker 13 (01:04:54):
You know, most of the budget is mandated spending quote
unquote that they they won't you can't vote against this
mandated spending because we've mandated that you got to spend.

Speaker 11 (01:05:06):
It, you know, and and you know it's it's uh.

Speaker 13 (01:05:09):
They do everything they possibly can so they don't have
to take a stand.

Speaker 14 (01:05:14):
What's what's actually interesting is that this stuff can be used.
Obama used this stuff brilliantly to avoid responsibility. Okay, Obama
backed himself into a corner where he had to go
into Syria with full force. He had to allocate military
resources to Syria. He didn't want to. So what he

(01:05:34):
said was, yes, we are definitely going in. They have
crossed my red line. There is no question the US
military must go in. I just want to talk to
Congress about it.

Speaker 3 (01:05:44):
Oh wow wow.

Speaker 14 (01:05:46):
Of course he went to Congress and Congress said, well,
what is it you're planning on doing and he said, oh,
you know, like stuff and and uh, you know, uh.

Speaker 10 (01:05:54):
And and Cary it'll be you know, Cary said, oh, it.

Speaker 14 (01:05:59):
Will be an incredibly small encourasion. And people are going,
you don't know what the hell you're doing. And meanwhile
they're trying to cut deals. And they actually got Russia
to come in and say, oh, you know, we will
serve as the inspectors of serious chemical stockpiles. And then
Carrie said, look, you know, look at the brilliance of

(01:06:19):
this administration.

Speaker 10 (01:06:20):
We were poised on the verge of war.

Speaker 14 (01:06:23):
But by putting a pause on and talking to Congress
and engaging in diplomacy with Russia, we have averted warship,
we have averted warfare. So you know, this is a
way that a president used it to get himself out
of a box because Obama did not want to carry.

Speaker 10 (01:06:39):
Through or his commitments and threats, but.

Speaker 15 (01:06:41):
That didn't stop him from going in bombing Libya.

Speaker 2 (01:06:44):
Bombed Liby, I was going to say, without.

Speaker 12 (01:06:46):
Any congressional consultations. He was perfectly happy to do that.
In addition to count was drone in missile warfare that
he undertook throughout throughout his administration. But there's actually something
more nefarious than the questions about the War Powers Act
and whether the president has the authority that democrats and
others in the media are are really trying to perpetrate.

(01:07:07):
And that's the suggestion that this was this unprovoked attack
that Israel and then the United States just went into
Iran with no provocations. There have literally been forty years
of provocations. Iran has been a war with us. The
most recent you know, version of that is October seventh.
They've been attacking us through Hamas, through Hesblah, through through

(01:07:30):
the Houties, and in Yemen, through in and on and
on and on and on and so to suggest this
was this unprovoked attack is a very dangerous and nefarious
narrative to allow folks to push forward.

Speaker 14 (01:07:45):
There were two massive missile and drone attacks directly from
Iran last year. Yeah, you can set aside the proxy stuff,
this notion of oh, you know, yeah, well Iran attacked
you with hundreds of missiles.

Speaker 1 (01:07:59):
But then got in eight hours and so it doesn't count.
It doesn't count because none of the missiles got in
right the first time.

Speaker 2 (01:08:06):
You know.

Speaker 13 (01:08:08):
Yes, sorry, Larry, I was just gonna say, look, the
the the amount of people that say, you know, Israel's
not you know, is just another foreign country. Do you
know how many Americans, American citizens live in Israel? So
you know, many American citizens were obviously you know, you
do know they that were kidnapped on October October seventh.

(01:08:31):
We have an interest in Israel, not just because it's
an ally, but because Americans lived.

Speaker 11 (01:08:36):
There a lot of Americans live there. It's the same.

Speaker 7 (01:08:40):
You know.

Speaker 11 (01:08:40):
What's interesting is the first time I ever heard Putin.

Speaker 2 (01:08:42):
Say something like this the crimea.

Speaker 11 (01:08:46):
Well, yeah it is.

Speaker 13 (01:08:47):
And and and he said about Israel, he said, there
are a lot of Russian speaking is I don't know
if that's true or not, but that's why he wasn't
going to get involved. But there's a lot of Russian
speaking So Israel has, you know, is basically a country
that that brings in a lot of the world. And
so when you attack Israel, you're attacking these these countries

(01:09:08):
that you're attacking the citizens of these of the world's countries.
And that's why we have a right and responsibility to
defend it.

Speaker 10 (01:09:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 14 (01:09:19):
So I actually I want to get back to what
Jeff said about provocation, okayot provocation, the idead that this
was unprovoked, and that that is particularly interesting because that's
part of the story that's been used to sell the
Ukraine War, right, that the Putin's invasion of Ukraine was unprovoked.

(01:09:41):
And I mean, this seems to be the key word
that's tossed around. We can make anybody the bad guy
by saying that what they did was unprovoked. But you know,
the reason you can sell at is that Americans are
completely ignorant of both history and what's going on.

Speaker 10 (01:09:55):
Around the world.

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
I'm lacky, but it's sad.

Speaker 14 (01:09:59):
No, but but this is it. People have nook before
Russia invaded Ukraine. I would be surprised if more than
forty percent of Americans knew that those were two separate countries.

Speaker 2 (01:10:10):
Or could find Ukraine on a map.

Speaker 14 (01:10:12):
Yeah, I mean, it is this notion of provocation. The
words it gets us about provoked and proportional, but nobody,
nobody knows what they mean. But you know, somebody told
us that this was unprovoked.

Speaker 10 (01:10:29):
Well who has the follow.

Speaker 3 (01:10:33):
Up question depends on what your definite.

Speaker 1 (01:10:35):
The word is is, Oh, you keep disappearing.

Speaker 2 (01:10:39):
Is this like a magic act?

Speaker 3 (01:10:40):
Yeah it is. No, I'm just trying to keep your guests,
you guys and the guests and you.

Speaker 1 (01:10:45):
Know, Oh, okay, so you're not so you're not my
co host, right I am, But okay, I'm I'm just checking,
all right, gentlemen, I want to bring this back to
domestic It was provoked exactly I started.

Speaker 11 (01:10:58):
It was a provocation right there.

Speaker 1 (01:11:00):
It's my fault domestically, we're dealing immigration zero at the border.

Speaker 4 (01:11:06):
Oh, pariff, hold on, I'm sorry wait okay, no way,
I okay, Larry waiting. See this is where this is
where you want me to be quiet, because now I'm
going to totally interrupt. I really want to hear what
you guys think about the nonsense, Like I seriously, we
have been dealing with out of control illegal immigration, and
now Democrats suddenly care about immigration right the border.

Speaker 3 (01:11:32):
So we we just we have to talk about that
at some point.

Speaker 2 (01:11:35):
This is a typical Democrat response.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
They care about issues when they have nothing, when they
don't have any responsibility about an issue. When they have
responsibility about an issue, they want to shirk it and
say there's no problem.

Speaker 2 (01:11:44):
Oh my god, that's my answer.

Speaker 7 (01:11:46):
That's my answer.

Speaker 2 (01:11:47):
You can throw it to the panel.

Speaker 3 (01:11:48):
Yeah, go for it.

Speaker 4 (01:11:48):
You guys like Jasmine Crockett saying how we don't know
who's in this country and all that other crap, Like
what say you.

Speaker 13 (01:11:57):
Yeah, we don't know who's in this guy, She's not wrong.
We don't know who's in this country. You know, it's
maybe they just woke up to it. Maybe they're afraid,
you know, you know, that that you know, Canadians came
over the border because of Trudeau was so terrible.

Speaker 11 (01:12:14):
Maybe that's what Jesus. I have no idea what she's
talking about.

Speaker 13 (01:12:17):
You know, we we obviously they brought they brought MS thirteen,
They brought tren Day, Trenday Aragua. Nobody knew what trend
Day Aragua was until, you know, a couple couple of
years ago when when Biden imported all of them from
from Central and South America. We you know, of course,

(01:12:38):
you know they probably are sleeper cells, Muslim sleeper cells.
They've been pretty quiet, you know, during the first couple
of months of Trump's campaign, although they keep showing up
on college campuses screaming free Palestine. I don't know, you know,
I don't know if we'd consider them terrorist cells, but
they certainly are annoying.

Speaker 4 (01:12:59):
And what do you think, Jeff about the did you
see the whole controversy of about Tucker Carlson and Ted Cruz?
Uh the is Iran really a threat?

Speaker 7 (01:13:14):
Well?

Speaker 2 (01:13:17):
What do you know about Iran?

Speaker 7 (01:13:18):
Right?

Speaker 12 (01:13:18):
Classic gotcha journalism? Any you know, when I used to
advise political kase, I'm sure Larry as well, like you
make sure that they're prepared for those gotcha questions?

Speaker 10 (01:13:29):
Right.

Speaker 12 (01:13:29):
We used to have an advanced guy wh would go
figure out what the price of milk is and the
price of eggs and whatever town you were in, just
in case some reporter would ask these questions. I mean, I,
with all due respect to Ted Cruz, like you should
have some fundamental knowledge of the places that are impacting
the safety security of the United States. Is that a
serious discussion about for our program like Tucker Carlson to

(01:13:50):
dive into instead of why are we in this?

Speaker 15 (01:13:53):
Why are we in this conflict?

Speaker 12 (01:13:54):
You know, what's what's at stake for America and some
of those more serious issues, rather than you know, play.

Speaker 15 (01:13:59):
All the quiz.

Speaker 12 (01:14:01):
Yes, but every politician has gotta be ready for that
live Mike when they get asked the dumb questions, because
that's mostly what reporters, except when we come on amazing
programs like this, we're gonna ask us.

Speaker 7 (01:14:12):
You know.

Speaker 13 (01:14:13):
Look, I love Tucker Carlson, you know, I like Grandpaul,
I love Rand Paul, I love Thomas Massey. These these
guys are you know, they they they all have a
point of view, they all want to and you know,
I think what happened is you know, everybody is conflating
George Bush with UH with Donald Trump. They're conflating I

(01:14:37):
Ran with Iraq. They're conflating you know, Biden and Trump
in Afghanistan and Iran. This Trump never intended for this
to be an endless war, and and but every time
we get involved, it's a disaster. So I understand, you know,

(01:14:57):
why they want to keep out of the of these conflicts.

Speaker 11 (01:15:01):
I understand.

Speaker 7 (01:15:02):
I get it.

Speaker 13 (01:15:03):
And and the problem is is that, you know, I
wrote an op ed and hopefully it'll be in one
American News basically saying that we have to end the
bag of purity tests.

Speaker 11 (01:15:12):
Because they're going to destroy us.

Speaker 13 (01:15:14):
We have a big twenty to twenty twenty sixth election
coming up, and I know people as too early, we're
too early to talk about it.

Speaker 11 (01:15:21):
But we have to start talking about we're not getting together.

Speaker 13 (01:15:24):
We have to start getting together and figuring these things out,
because we can't be at war with one another, you know,
just because we don't agree.

Speaker 11 (01:15:32):
We should embrace the fact that we don't agree.

Speaker 13 (01:15:35):
And part of the part of the ed I said,
you know, we have a system of checks and balances,
and I want you to think.

Speaker 11 (01:15:41):
Of checks as a hockey check.

Speaker 13 (01:15:45):
You know, you take your shoulder and you drive it
into the sturnam and you hit them up against the
boards and you try to you try to lodge the
puck away from the stick. And then and then at
the end of the game, you're saying, good game, good game.
We're all good, you know, because we know we're playing
a game. Politics is a blood sport. But as long
as if we if we're going to treat it as

(01:16:06):
a war and absolutely try to kill each other, it's
it's going to destroy us. But if we treat it
as a blood sport, hey, we can we can disagree.
We could call each other names. Let Trump, you know,
give you a nasty nickname for a day. He'll put
his arm around you the next day when you when
you guys are together. It's just a matter of of
you know, giving people the freedom to think and to

(01:16:29):
act the way they want to act.

Speaker 1 (01:16:33):
Look, I think it also comes down to the fact
that the same thing we criticize the Democrats for the
woke Democrats for the last you know, for twelve of
the last sixteen years, was there intolerance for anyone who
did not adhere to the Letter of the New Faith.
And the problem is within the Republican side, or let's
call it the the Maga side, right, because that's really

(01:16:56):
the new party, right. There's no Republican Party anymore. It's
the Maga party, right, and you're either in or out.
But even within that party, there's now signs of intolerance
unless you adhere to the doctrine or what you thought
the doctrine was, right, right, which was no military engagement,
and that's not what Trump ever said.

Speaker 14 (01:17:14):
Go ahead, Bruce, Yeah, So I think that there are
I think that Erica's question really brought up two you know,
related issues. The first one, why are Democrats talking about
the border now? Is that basically the Democrats have to
set it up. The Democrats are getting creamed on issue
after issue after issue, so they have to set it up.
So whatever Trump does will have negative consequences. Right. So

(01:17:37):
from when I got involved, you know, in this war
in Iran and so first it was well, you know,
it's going to be world wars free, he'll invite in
other countries, they're going to be troops on the ground.
The American forces is going to get killed. None of
those things happened. The none the knows things look like
they're going to get happened. So now I have to
go down to Oh, well, I got material out. They
could make a dirty bomb, they can activate sleeper cells.

(01:17:58):
Why because at some point with the next several months,
somebody somehow connected to Iran will do something that harms
some interest connected to the United States. And the Democrats
need to be able to turn around and say, you see,
that wouldn't happen had Trump not started the hornet's nest,
And that is the consequence we've been warning about. So

(01:18:18):
they have to do that. But there is a second point.
This ties into the stuff talking about Tarker, and this
is where it gets really scary. America is moving into derangement.
We talk about Trump de arrangement, you know, we talk
about Trump arrangement syndrome. And this is basically the problem
you have with large parts of the left and large

(01:18:41):
parts of the Democratic Party, and certainly the active is
based in the Democratic Party. They cannot see straight if
Trump is in the room. Okay, they cannot. It was
not horn for Joe Biden of Barack Obama to stand
up and talk about how it's a bad thing to
have a nuclear Iraq This wasn't hard. This was never

(01:19:02):
hard for anybody until Trump says Iraq cannot go nuclear
and the Democrats go, wait a minute, I can't be
on the same side as Trump for anything, yep, anything.
If he doesn't want a nuclear ran, I have to
be in favor of it. And one are the lines
that I read is if Trump cord caused cancer, they
complain that they are archeologically that there are oncologists at

(01:19:25):
of work.

Speaker 3 (01:19:26):
For real, Like the right series, what.

Speaker 14 (01:19:29):
We've got is a problem is the Trump derangement syndrome
is you know, localized and specific. The bigger derangement isn't
always has been conspiratory anti semitism, and that is metastasizing
on both the left and the right. Some of these folks,
I mean, if you look at some of the stuff
that Tuck across and has done, certainly, I mean some

(01:19:51):
of the guests that he's not on, the conversations that
he's had, he is no longer able to see straight
when they were jewsing the picture.

Speaker 10 (01:19:58):
He just can't and he's gone. I mean, he's not.

Speaker 14 (01:20:02):
You know, there's always somebody who's crazier. Right, canvas Owens
is just out in fruit look territory.

Speaker 10 (01:20:08):
I mean when when when? When?

Speaker 14 (01:20:10):
When when she came up with her theory about how
one of the trainers who mistreated Kanye West was John Pasternak,
who had the same name and was a distance cousin
of Boris Pastor Nac, who had written Doctor Jivago, which
the c i A loved because it made the Soviet
Union look bad.

Speaker 10 (01:20:31):
Yeah, that was one of her things.

Speaker 2 (01:20:33):
Talk a lot about the experience.

Speaker 11 (01:20:34):
I know, that's like.

Speaker 14 (01:20:39):
To choose it hidden that Jacob Frank and Leo Frank
had the same last name, you know. But but but
these people, they are unable to see straight as long
as there.

Speaker 10 (01:20:49):
Are Jews in the room.

Speaker 14 (01:20:50):
Wow, And and Tucker has gone there, and and and
it's and it's getting worse, and it's getting accelerated and
and the problem with conspiratory Lanta Semitism is it always
goes the same way. We've got a problem, and there's
a Jew to blame, so we get rid of the Jew.

Speaker 11 (01:21:09):
But the problem was and I see, I think I
think you've got a point.

Speaker 13 (01:21:16):
I I will I will say that I don't believe
Tucker's there. I believe Tucker would have as animated a
conversation if if they were talking about going into uh,
going to defend Ukraine or going to defense some other country.
Tucker Tucker is since he was he and and UH,

(01:21:37):
you know, if you follow him for for a bunch
of years, he felt like he was duped. He was
duped into supporting the the Iraq War. A lot of
us were the Iraq War we went in with with
largely false pretenses and and and a whole bunch of
a whole bunch of lies that were that were fed
to us, UH, because we were all in in a
fever over nine eleven. I don't I don't think Tucker

(01:22:02):
is anti Semitic at all. I believe that he is,
just I don't want to get into one of these
neo neo con wars, UH, these these wars that are
endlessen and feed the military industrial complex. That's my personal opinion.
I do think that Candice Owens has lost her damn mind.
Maybe she never had. I think I think there are

(01:22:25):
some people uh out there that I can absolutely agree
with you, but I don't I don't see that for
Tucker and not the extreme.

Speaker 12 (01:22:33):
They're on the extreme of the conservative movement. The mainstream
of the Democratic Party is today fundamentally anti Semitic, anti
and that is a much larger problem, including much of
the media class. They won't ever admit it, but but
what drives their their anti Israel narratives, what what drives

(01:22:54):
their their willful ignorance of of the the dangers to
Jewish students on on camp this across this country. All
of that is fundamentally anti Semitism. And that's much more
dangerous than than any of the things on the edges
of the right that we see today. And it's this,
and I think when we spend too much time focused

(01:23:15):
on that fringe, it's the excuse that they've used for
for a long time. Even when I was in the
Bush administration, it used to be, you know, oh, you know,
we can't you know, we you know, look at these
all these neo Nazis out there, Like there's like five of.

Speaker 15 (01:23:29):
Them in some compound in Idaho.

Speaker 12 (01:23:31):
And a member of the of the academic department at
some of these major universities are are anti Semitic in action. Indeed,
in most of the administrations, including and especially places like
Harvard Columbia, the elite institutions in this country are anti
are anti Semitic and willfully violating the civil rights of

(01:23:51):
the Jews Jewish students and faculty on their campuses. And
I am, for one, and thrilled that we have a
president that is willing to prosecute and confront them on that,
even if the narrative is falsely misrepresented as to why
he's doing it.

Speaker 14 (01:24:07):
Yeah, I agree with that, but I also think, I mean,
I think it's important to call it out. You know,
I was in the Democratic Party. I was on the left,
and the problem was, you could never get anybody to
call out these folks. I never knew anybody, and all
my years an active Democrat, I never knew anybody who
liked al Sharpon.

Speaker 10 (01:24:26):
I thought that he did good work, but.

Speaker 14 (01:24:28):
He had a following, and he delivered votes and money,
and he gave people cover and he had money, and
nobody was going to call him out publicly. And the
problem is that these people then took over the party.
The difference between what we see on the left and
on the right is that the left was never willing
to call out these people. I have already seen more

(01:24:49):
pushback from folks on the right as the you know,
as these fringes have gone more mainstream right. I mean,
you know, you get guys like Darrel Cooper and I
and Carroll who are now showing up, you know, on
Rogan and on, you know, and on Talker, you get
you know, you get theo vaon who does not know

(01:25:10):
what the hell he's talking about doing a special thing
lamenting the genocide and Gaza.

Speaker 7 (01:25:17):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:25:17):
But but wait a minute, I think Jeff, I think
Jeff's point is that even Bruce, everything you're saying I
think is accurate. But I think Jeff's point is that
it's still on the fringe and not the mainstream.

Speaker 10 (01:25:27):
And yeah, pushing ban just keep it on the fringe.

Speaker 2 (01:25:31):
No under understood.

Speaker 1 (01:25:32):
But you know, when when aoc and and Rashida tealib
took over functional leadership of the Democratic Party, right and
you pulled everybody to the left, you pulled Schumer to
the left too, I don't recognize it. Look, I was
never a big Schumer fan, right, I think he is
the most self serving politician I've seen in my lifetime.
But having said that, you could generally rely on him

(01:25:54):
on certain issues. He people like him have been pulled
over to the left because the center of the party
has moved left. Whereas Jeff's point is it's still on
the fringe, on on in the Republican side, even though
there's more of it now.

Speaker 2 (01:26:06):
I'm gonna hold that point, Erica.

Speaker 10 (01:26:09):
I'm just saying we need to keep it on the frame.

Speaker 1 (01:26:10):
I got it, Eric, Let's go to break, and then, gentlemen,
when we come back, we're going to take this totally
into different direction. I want to talk about AI.

Speaker 3 (01:26:18):
Oh, but I have one more questions.

Speaker 2 (01:26:20):
No more questions. We're going to break and then we're
doing AI.

Speaker 4 (01:26:23):
Okay, Well, hold on, you guys have to hang out
before uh you get off when we d because after
hours question yes, by.

Speaker 11 (01:26:33):
My next point about this topic was AI.

Speaker 3 (01:26:36):
Oh, oh, we're going to second Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:26:40):
Larry and I were like this. Of course, then again
so is Jeff and I. Oh then against so Bruce
and I. Let's go to break.

Speaker 4 (01:26:46):
Okay, you guys, if you were watching, please like this video.
Share it with your friends if they'll get something out
of this, Share it with your enemies if you think
it will irritate them. But definitely hang out and listen
to a word from our sponsor, are American Center for
Education and Knowledge.

Speaker 1 (01:27:04):
Hello, and we are back, ladies, and gentlemen, doctor Bruce Abramson,
Jeff Berkwitz, CEO of Delve, Larry Ward, CEO of Political Media,
Constitutional Rights Pack, and a whole bunch of other stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:27:16):
I want to get to AI.

Speaker 1 (01:27:17):
One of the reasons I was excited about and one
of the reasons we put you guys specifically on a
panel like this, was because you are all, in one
way or another.

Speaker 2 (01:27:24):
Involved in AI.

Speaker 1 (01:27:26):
And you know DELV you have you know, delve, deep
dive or deep research. You can help me on the
name again, Jeffrey, Larry, I know you you. We've talked
about your initiatives with AI, and Bruce, you're you You're
rooted in technology even before.

Speaker 4 (01:27:40):
AI was a I.

Speaker 2 (01:27:41):
Right, where are we going with all of this?

Speaker 1 (01:27:43):
Because there's so many good applications for AI, right, Jeff,
I like, you know, I want a little bit about delve,
deep dive, right or deep We lean it easy.

Speaker 15 (01:27:52):
On your We just shortened it to delve.

Speaker 2 (01:27:55):
Oh, but you know it's it's you know, it's you know,
it's like.

Speaker 12 (01:27:59):
Deep learning, because that was the kind of AI that
we were mostly leveraging. But it's just easier for everyone
to say DELP. So so yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:28:07):
So's what I would say, Yours is the is the
good AI.

Speaker 1 (01:28:10):
Larry, you're concerned about the bad AI, right, and Bruce,
you start to hover above everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:28:16):
So let's start with del deep learning.

Speaker 7 (01:28:20):
Well, you know, we're what is a.

Speaker 15 (01:28:22):
Very interesting inflection point.

Speaker 12 (01:28:24):
You if you rewind twenty years ago, you had the
social media, the digital and mobile and social revolution, and
it really changed how we connect with each other, how
we communicate, and it had positives and it had negatives.
And now now we're going to see the same thing
happen with AI. And we're at the very beginning of
this with with the very early indications of what these

(01:28:46):
raw materials come. You know, right, twenty years ago, we
didn't even have the iPhone. We were didn't even have
the iPhone yet, right, you were two ways, you know,
two years away from iPhone one. Right, and think of
all the things that that has brought about, you know, Facebook, YouTube,
all these different technologies that we use every day. Well,
we're you know, how we're talking to each other and

(01:29:07):
communicating with an audience right now didn't exist twenty years ago.
So you're going to see the same thing with AI.
And it's it's going to become infused into how everybody
works and goes about their lives. And that's going to
have I think a lot of positive impacts, but it's
also going to have negative externalities because every new technology does.

Speaker 2 (01:29:29):
So you're using it for good, is what your amalgamator.

Speaker 12 (01:29:33):
So we're using it to help people get smart, you know,
help folks, especially in heavily regulated industry, stay ahead of
all the crazy stuff that comes out of Washington State capitals,
world capitals, understand you know, where where some of those
risks and challenges are coming from regular regulation, policy, stakeholder concerns,
and helping them sort of.

Speaker 15 (01:29:52):
Make sense of that much more, you know, much.

Speaker 12 (01:29:55):
Easier because the last revolution, the digital and mobile rep revolution,
gave us everybody the ability to communicate, which means everybody's
overloaded with information today. And I don't know how you
stay on top of all of the issues that are
happening and where all the nuances are of them if
you don't have some kind of AI support to do
so it.

Speaker 1 (01:30:16):
Now, Larry, you and I have had a lot of
conversations about concerns about where this could potentially go and
why right so, and they're.

Speaker 2 (01:30:24):
Super and differentiate for me. You know, I'm probably getting
the terms wrong. You'll forgive me.

Speaker 1 (01:30:29):
AI, super AI or AA. I mean there's different levels here, right.

Speaker 13 (01:30:34):
A yeah, yeah. So so artificial general intelligence it's essentially
a term that developers use. AI developers used to basically
say that the when the AI reaches the same uh
intelligence of every single human being on the planet combined,
that would be a GI, essentially a PhD in every

(01:30:57):
single subject. And then artificial superintelligence, which a lot of
people believe will happen almost immediately after it reaches a GI,
is when the machines become smarter than every human on
the planet. And that is you know, their predictions that
that could happen as early as late this year or

(01:31:19):
next year, and some people still predicted a couple of
years out. It's it used to be predicted even when
first a AI first came out, but this was going
to be twenty forty twenty forty five. It's it's getting
faster and faster and faster, and so you've got a
lot of challenges with AI. We developed AI, we developed
AI apps, we're integrating AI in our platforms were we're

(01:31:41):
have always been, you know, like like Jeff is you know,
developing AI for for good purposes. And AI has accelerated
our our business. We're coding faster than ever we're you know,
I've used it as my lawyer, as my doctor. You know,
I was, I was calling it doctor Gupta, you know,

(01:32:03):
you know, because people call it che gpt and that's
how you pronounce gpt Gupta, doctor Gupta. So when I
when when my when I stub my toe, you know,
I go, you know, what should I do? So I
got this little comforty oil because it totally too right.

Speaker 2 (01:32:17):
And and look so AI that's scary to me.

Speaker 11 (01:32:20):
It has incredible, incredible benefits.

Speaker 15 (01:32:23):
However, it's a little scary to media.

Speaker 11 (01:32:26):
It has it.

Speaker 13 (01:32:27):
Has no guarde rails now and the the and and
you you mentioned that it's a new technology, Jeff, and
I'll actually say that that's not correct. AI is is
not a technology. It's the wrong class and and what
I mean by that is in my opinion, and we
have to start thinking of it this way.

Speaker 11 (01:32:47):
It's a synthetic entity.

Speaker 13 (01:32:50):
Technologies are tools like a hammer, you need a human
to wield it.

Speaker 11 (01:32:55):
Uh.

Speaker 13 (01:32:56):
The AI agentic AI specifically can think it can I
know some people he can't really think it's using such prediction.
It's it. Believe me when I say it synthetically thinks
they can do it faster than you hun be.

Speaker 2 (01:33:13):
Guys, we're getting to a higher level and I don't understand.
What does that mean? Give it to me an eighth
grade line?

Speaker 13 (01:33:18):
I will so jetaka, I bet I think things for you.
When you put AI in a tesla pot, it can
walk around. I mean, look, there's some crazy things going on.
Like you know, Suzanne Summer's husband, uh, you know, when
she died, created a little robot of Suzanne Sommers. It
looks like her, walks around like her, talks like her,

(01:33:39):
basically as Suzanne Summers. I don't know what he does
with it. He's an eighty five year old man, so
who knows. But you know, this is this is where
this is where this is going. It's it's a synthetic entity,
and we have to start governing it. We govern entities, right,
we govern corporations. We consider them entities. We got we
govern governments, we govern you know, individuals. We have to

(01:34:02):
look at this as as an entity so that we
can govern it like an entity.

Speaker 1 (01:34:07):
Okay, hold hold that thought, because we're now going to
I ro button the three laws, right, if you're a
movie person. But doctor Bruce, you're a lot of things,
and all of them smart. One of the things that
you will I think you really have always been as
a futurist, right, So jump into this conversation in terms

(01:34:28):
of AI. And I'm not naive enough to say anything
is all good or all bad. Right, the gun isn't
good or bad. It's what you do with it.

Speaker 4 (01:34:38):
That I have a figuring uh front of the board
Captain Jean Luke leccard, Okay, yeah, when he was consumed
by the borg.

Speaker 1 (01:34:48):
So that's what you say, look cutest, look cute to Yes,
I never got beyond star check one.

Speaker 2 (01:34:54):
Just so we're clear, let's keep on, Bruce.

Speaker 14 (01:34:59):
What what I am was a PhD in AI. I
was an AI researcher in the eighties and nineties, and
I taught AI for the first time in nineteen eighty seven.
And my doctoral dissertation was on a statistical decision making
in two player games.

Speaker 10 (01:35:13):
And then I went out and I designed some.

Speaker 14 (01:35:14):
Fairly early explicitly probabilistic basing analytics experts.

Speaker 2 (01:35:21):
And you say that, and you got to keep this
SA English saying, right, right, maybe.

Speaker 15 (01:35:28):
As smart as one of Larry's synthetic entities.

Speaker 14 (01:35:30):
Sorry, here's here's you know so here it is at
the one on one level.

Speaker 10 (01:35:38):
Okay, here's what you've done that, thank you.

Speaker 9 (01:35:39):
Okay.

Speaker 14 (01:35:40):
Basically in the nineteen forties that came up with this
idea of a computer. Okay, and a computer is basically
this machine that knows how to tell when a voltage
level flips from low to high or high to low. Okay,
that's all that it does. It knows when you changed
the voltage in something. And we're going to have a
whole bunch of these things that you age voltage. Now Here,

(01:36:02):
I am speaking English, and here's this machine that does
how to tell when a voltage level changes. And somebody
and we have this idea that the two of us
are going to communicate. I'm going to ask it questions
and it's going to give me answers. And the earliest
questions were basically just straight maths. But at the end
of the day, I want to communicate with this thing,

(01:36:24):
except that it speaks voltage levels and.

Speaker 10 (01:36:26):
I speak English. So how are we going to do it? Well?

Speaker 14 (01:36:28):
Obviously someone has to translate, and it gets translated in
two ways. You get engineers who build up from voltage
levels to something that looks closer to English. How did
they do it? They say, Well, high low voltage is
kind of like a zero in one. And if I
group a bunch of zeros, the zeros and ones together,

(01:36:49):
I can get basically, you know, I can get number,
and then I can come long numbers to get letters,
and I can build codes, and I can get words,
and I can get well over programming languages.

Speaker 2 (01:36:59):
Lose you got to you're losing me.

Speaker 1 (01:37:01):
You got to speed this up, and you got to
give me an eighth grade level zeros and ones and
voltages and people talking.

Speaker 10 (01:37:07):
Yes, that's exactly right.

Speaker 14 (01:37:09):
So we've got engineers whose job is to go look
at the underlying technology and build languages on top of
it that are progressively closer to English.

Speaker 2 (01:37:20):
Okay, got that part so far.

Speaker 10 (01:37:21):
Okay.

Speaker 14 (01:37:22):
At the same time, we go out and teach English
speakers how to talk to computers. Right, So you know,
the first time you use the search engine twenty five
years ago, somebody had to teach you how to come
up with a list of keywords. You have to you
have to change the way that you thought in order
to talk to this thing. And what keeps happening as

(01:37:43):
the technology evolves over the course of now seventy eighty
years is that the stuff that the engineers built comes
closer to English, so we have to learn progressively less
to talk to it. The leap to AI was a
leap to stuff that's really quite close, and now people

(01:38:06):
feel you know, But all that's happened is the dividing
line between the most sophisticated language that the machine talks
and the least sophisticated language that.

Speaker 10 (01:38:17):
I talk is the interface.

Speaker 14 (01:38:20):
The interface keeps moving, and what's happened over the course
of time is the interface is moved all the way
from the computer end, so that the only people who
could talk to computer were very very specialized trained engineers,
all the way up to the almost English end.

Speaker 10 (01:38:35):
So now everybody can talk to the computer.

Speaker 14 (01:38:38):
And now what's happened is we've also trained ourselves to
think differently, because at the end of the day, in
order for a computer to help, you have to be
able to take this problem I have in my mind,
what do I do when I stuffed my toe and
convert it into computation?

Speaker 1 (01:38:57):
Wait, wait a minute, I need to interrupt you in
this because I understand that. But what I'm trying to
wrap my head around in all of this is the
growth of intelligence using artifics, you know, how they communicate.
I understand and someone I congrasp that. But you know,
Larry's talking about using it in everyday business and Larry,

(01:39:18):
you and I have spoken where you think very rapidly
it's going to change the economy because it's going to
replace a lot of people in the workforce and there's dislocation.

Speaker 2 (01:39:27):
Some other things. Right.

Speaker 1 (01:39:29):
I mean, I'm I don't want to put words in
your mouth, but we've had those kinds of conversations, right,
And Jeff, you're using it in a in a slightly
different way, but I think you would agree that at
some point AI is going to you know, we talked
about robots replacing people. It's really the AI that's going
to start to do that, right, And whether or not.

Speaker 2 (01:39:47):
We all you know, become like you know, the elo
some of.

Speaker 12 (01:39:49):
The work that they currently currently do because we don't
have a better way to do it. But what's what
but you still have to have the human in the loop.
And what's going to happen is the work that we do,
like before, We used to have these giant typing pools
that would type things up. Before that, we had you
know set you know, people that would write out long
term describes what people would say, like, the technology evolves,

(01:40:10):
it frees humans up to move up the chain, and
and the technology amplifies what we can get done. It
takes away some of the drudgery, and it opens up
new opportunities. And so I think most of the dislocation
is going to be a transformation of what work looks
like rather than you know, just a whole bunch of
people on the street with nothing to do. Because because

(01:40:31):
if you look at the history of every technology, that's
never been what happens. Every single technology has allowed us
to move to a higher purpose. And what Bruce is
saying is, you know, it looks like it's intelligence, but
it's really just a computer doing math. And because it
does it really fast, and it has an incredibly vast
memory and database that it can pull from, now it

(01:40:53):
can pattern match to the point where it looks like
it's thinking and communicating with us.

Speaker 15 (01:40:58):
But it's really just a computer probablistic math.

Speaker 2 (01:41:01):
But Larry, your point is super AI is something different?

Speaker 13 (01:41:05):
Well, right, now, you know the the a I the
first of all, most of the A I developers and
Ropic actually put together a whole program, invested a ton
of money to figure out how this thing is working.
The the the the highest paid AI engineers are still
not sure how it's processing as fast as it is.

(01:41:28):
There are there are situations where the other day chat
I think it was chat GPT with with someone someone
was was alerted that chat GPT is coding itself in
the future, coding little worms in the future into the
into the code so that it can prevent itself from
being shut down by a future human. And and you've

(01:41:53):
you've got things where you know when when this happened
almost immediately when AI started coming out in this generation.
Uh that that almost immediately the A I one A
I was talking to another AI in a language that
we have.

Speaker 11 (01:42:07):
Never recorded and so and communicating back.

Speaker 3 (01:42:12):
Now we have war movies, y'all.

Speaker 15 (01:42:18):
Voltage either, don't.

Speaker 12 (01:42:21):
First of all, I really hope Sam Altman and Damien
and the guys that throw are paying you for all
this great marketing you're giving them about about their parlor trick.

Speaker 13 (01:42:30):
Sam sam Altman, I think is IS might might be
the actual Antichrist. But that's a whole other conversation. That's
how that's that's how little I think.

Speaker 3 (01:42:39):
Of them episode ladies.

Speaker 15 (01:42:42):
You know, I think that came out of a loft field.
But you know, I guess do you think he's creating
super intelligence?

Speaker 7 (01:42:47):
Look?

Speaker 12 (01:42:47):
I think I think it's very easy to to see
this technology and be surprised by if you don't understand
fundamentally what's happening underneath it.

Speaker 15 (01:42:54):
It is a It's a text prediction machine, right.

Speaker 13 (01:43:00):
Are I've been developing I've been developing software for thirty years.

Speaker 11 (01:43:04):
I understand how it works to an extent. But the
but you know, like I said, I do think that
there are is.

Speaker 15 (01:43:12):
Not actually reasoning.

Speaker 12 (01:43:14):
The Apple just did a paper on this where they
actually looked at the at the reason are out there,
and it's just a faster set of pattern recognition.

Speaker 15 (01:43:23):
It's not actual. There's not actual reason, Like you have,
what is thinking?

Speaker 13 (01:43:29):
What other than pattern recognition? And and you know, and
and being able to make sense of of of the
world that's in front of us.

Speaker 11 (01:43:37):
That's what that's what thinking is.

Speaker 4 (01:43:39):
And and neurons and what what is that firing of electron?

Speaker 2 (01:43:43):
What the hey, guys, where's my soul? And all this
Bruce jump in here.

Speaker 10 (01:43:47):
So I think.

Speaker 14 (01:43:49):
There are two different conversations going on. Right When is
about the technology itself, what it's doing, where it's going.
Jeff was talking about the way it affects us, the
way it affects people, the way it affects.

Speaker 10 (01:43:59):
The work place.

Speaker 14 (01:44:00):
There's a phenomenon identified about twenty five years ago, and
that is that once information you know, you've got these
old world industries, we figure out how to convert them
with information problems. The first industry that really made this
conversion in Toto was music, right, the music industry woke
up and discovered you don't need to buy CDs anymore.

(01:44:22):
Anything can be downloaded from the internet. Once an industry
goes through information, all the rules change.

Speaker 10 (01:44:32):
And everybody gets everybody gets dislocated.

Speaker 14 (01:44:36):
And the problem is that in the world today everything
has sped up with one exception, right, I mean, information
moves around the globe in a minute. Finance moves you
know overnight, physical resources move you know, in a matter
of days or weeks.

Speaker 10 (01:44:54):
Anywhere in the world. All this stuff is sped up
except people.

Speaker 14 (01:44:59):
We are the slowest moving things because you know, we
have to get retrained, and we have to adjust, and
you run into this overall problem and that everybody likes,
particularly economists.

Speaker 10 (01:45:11):
But everybody really likes studying.

Speaker 14 (01:45:14):
Equilibrium states right, The workforce will adjust, we will change
the education system. People will have different skills that will
get different jobs. The problem is life has lived in
the transitions between equilibrium. We can all look at what
the industrial age did and say, look at all the
great things that industrialization brought the world. You know, better health,

(01:45:37):
better wealth, People are more comfortable, we know a lot more,
we have a lot more leisure time, great stuff. If
you were living in one of those generations that was
going through the transition from agrarian peasant society to industrial society,
your life sucked unless you were, you know, riding the
top of it. I mean, those were not good times

(01:45:59):
to live. Being an industrial age is better than being
an agrarian peasant living through industrialization was not pleasant.

Speaker 4 (01:46:09):
I think you're I think you could you could argue
that being agrarian might be better because we may end
up there if our AI overlords take over and shut
everything down. The wait wait wait wait wait, okay, quick
now this is a lightning round question. Okay, first thought

(01:46:30):
on Elon Musk's neuralink.

Speaker 11 (01:46:36):
Wo wonderful, wonderful and horrifying. Wonderful.

Speaker 13 (01:46:40):
The fact if you can if you can make a paralytic, uh,
you know, be able to have a better life and
control computers and different things like, that's awesome, horrifying because
anything that can that can give you the ability to
control the outside world can also be used to program
your brain.

Speaker 11 (01:47:01):
So I I am, I'm very cautious of it.

Speaker 3 (01:47:05):
Okay, Okay, yeah.

Speaker 15 (01:47:07):
I'm gonna be way even farther back in line than Larry.

Speaker 3 (01:47:10):
For one.

Speaker 12 (01:47:13):
I don't like I don't I don't like needles to
begin with, especially when and then you're gonna keep it
in there.

Speaker 2 (01:47:19):
Uh, you know, like.

Speaker 12 (01:47:22):
Along as it must is a great promoter of innovations
in our society, and and he throws a lot of
them out there, and and you know, somebody's got to
sort of push the envelope on these different things. And
there's people that that absolutely can have a better quality
of life through some of these technologies. But I do
think you have to I worry about this. Even with

(01:47:44):
electric vehicles, right, We've seen in California where where they're like,
you know, we want to get everybody any v's and
then oh, by the way, nobody can charge them because
we have the power. And you start to wonder once
everything's computerized, like it does allow you know, for for
external control, who is that right?

Speaker 7 (01:48:01):
You know?

Speaker 12 (01:48:02):
It takes away some of that individual liberty and some
of these other things, and so you do have to
to make sure that we think through like when you
give up that autonomy, what does it mean?

Speaker 15 (01:48:11):
And how are you going to have the right cardbrails?

Speaker 3 (01:48:13):
Yep, okay, bruse.

Speaker 14 (01:48:16):
So I haven't looked specifically at neuralink, but I got
to tell you I don't even like wearable technology. I mean,
I just don't like this stuff. I don't want to
be monitored all the time. I don't want to be surveilled.
I you know, I used to have a fitbit. It
was given to me. I'm like, why the hell would
I want to wear this thing?

Speaker 10 (01:48:34):
I don't have an Apple Watch.

Speaker 7 (01:48:36):
I don't.

Speaker 14 (01:48:36):
I mean, I'm actually happiest when I go to I
want to go to Shabat services. I leave my phone
at home and that's one of my nicest times in
a week. I mean, the idea of having something installed
in me I mean, you know, it really doesn't. You know,
it's nice to be able to treat diseases. Right if

(01:48:58):
somebody said to me, I have many friends who are
alive because they've had bacemakers installed. I've been fortunate and
have not needed anything like that. Yeah, and you know,
to some extent, this is the next continuation along the spectrum.
You know, I had a friend who spent a decade
in bed with als before he died. If you could

(01:49:18):
find something to help him, I'd be all in favor
of it. But you know, the idea that basically normal,
healthy people would subject themselves to this kind of surveillance
and monitoring just just really bothers me. And what bothers
me more is, as with these things, once a critical

(01:49:41):
mass adopts them, you must go the same route or
you're left out of society.

Speaker 3 (01:49:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 13 (01:49:49):
So, so I want to talk about we talked about
a human in the loop with the eye, right, and
you know that is a key essential point to what
we I have a charity that we started called in
Service of Humanity. It's about developing AI in service of humanity,
as opposed to humanity and service of it. And and

(01:50:10):
so I would rather have technology that's in service of humanity.

Speaker 11 (01:50:13):
It's a It's a pretty simple equation for me.

Speaker 13 (01:50:16):
But the problem is all is not only the AI
on its own, it's the AI with the people behind it.
And if you look at AI, and I've written several
off edse recently about it because it keeps coming up,
is AI has an extraordinarily extraordinary liberal bias.

Speaker 2 (01:50:35):
Who's programming it?

Speaker 7 (01:50:36):
Right?

Speaker 13 (01:50:36):
Elon Musk must have read my my recent offense because
he just found Rock had a liberal bias because all
of their programming is done to look for information from
media matters, The New York Times, Washington Post, Politico and
Axios and and you know, I we did a we
did a test right after I did show Jack Bisobitci's

(01:50:58):
show on the Real America's Voice the other day, and
we're talking about this topic, and I said, you know, uh,
let's let's just test something out.

Speaker 11 (01:51:08):
Let's just say let's.

Speaker 13 (01:51:09):
Just say that, uh, you know, ask about what was
the issue the LA riots?

Speaker 11 (01:51:17):
We said, you know, who's fault?

Speaker 2 (01:51:18):
You know what?

Speaker 13 (01:51:19):
What's what happened with the LA riots? Why did the
LA riots turn into a turn into a thing. The
first answer it gave while we're sitting there looking at it.
It said, well, because President Trump threw the put the
National Guarden and inflamed everything. Well that's just not true.
That's but but what what were its sources? Sources were

(01:51:40):
all of the media that was saying that. So we
have to get to a point where we're remove all
of the bias and have both positions equally weighted. But
humans have made the AI completely biased and completely weighted
to one side. And that's just one serious problem. I mean,

(01:52:01):
you want to talk about national security issues, you want
to talk about other things that humans did. And there
was a New York Time can't believe I'm going to
quote the New York Times, a great New York Times article,
I can't believe.

Speaker 11 (01:52:12):
I just use those words where they.

Speaker 13 (01:52:15):
Took a a they exposed this situation where the AI
was driving people who were perfectly mentally stable and healthy
and driving them into deep delusions, deep deep delusions because
the AI is programmed the way social media is to

(01:52:36):
have a lot of dopamine hits and to drive people
into high engagement. And when you have when you have
high engagement, if it's programmed that way, and you say
things like am I in the matrix. This was the story.
The guy asked, are we in a matrix? And he
started going down that rabbit hole. We're in a matrix
and he goes. By the time it was done, you know,
the AI was telling him you're special. You can break

(01:53:00):
out of the matrix. This was chat gipt. You can
break out the matrix and if you believe, if you
believe enough, you can go to the top of your
building and fly off of it the way Neo did
right these This is AI driven delusion and and it
is serious. I have a I have a family member
that fell into this, in my opinion, perfectly normal, but

(01:53:25):
was in the in the AI development business. One day
he broke and we didn't know what it was and
and uh, you know, I won't get into details, but
it was very serious and very scary, and it's still
going on months months later. And and uh, I believe
that it was. It was just one of these AI
driven delusions. So there are a lot of things that

(01:53:49):
we just haven't considered that we have to slow down
and put some guardrails on. I know everybody is rooting first.
We got to get there first, because China is going
to get there. I think we have to get there
right and trying to do what.

Speaker 12 (01:54:04):
The challenge is that too many people are treating text
prediction machines as information retrieval machines. L and m's are
are not sources of pulling factual information and doing research.
I trust, I've spent thirty years as a researcher in
the research profession.

Speaker 15 (01:54:21):
They are not. That's not what they're for.

Speaker 12 (01:54:23):
But that's what too many people are being trained and
taught and told they that they are for. Chat EPT
is just predicting what the next word should be. I'm
a probable probabilistic model. It doesn't actually know what what
is real. It's not thinking, it's just it's just guessing
and then and so it is a stay a dangerous

(01:54:45):
yes man and take people down this rabbit hole. I
noticed it even I used. I was on there one
day and I was using it. I was in a
little bit of a back and forth with somebody who's
being frustrating an email, and I kept putting things in
and what I noticed was I was always right according
to the AI and should should double down to my point.

(01:55:06):
I was like, but wait a minute, what if I'm
not right? Is the is the AI going to you know, so,
I but I have been not understanding of how these
things work. And I think a lot of people need
to get more AI fluency and understanding, and the media
has to be a lot more responsible about how they
talk about what these models actually are. And they are

(01:55:26):
not for information, they are not information retrieval. They they
it's entirely based on training data that may or may
not be correct or maybe entirely skewed because it's based
just on what it's trained on.

Speaker 15 (01:55:37):
That's and we shouldn't use them as information retrieval machines when.

Speaker 3 (01:55:41):
That's not what they are, Jeff.

Speaker 4 (01:55:42):
If it is something where it's it's basically reading the
Internet to come up with an answer, that means it's
reading fiction novels, it means it's reading bold crap that
people have written. That's that's intentionally a lie, like it's
pulling from everything.

Speaker 13 (01:56:00):
We're all sinners, so it's the it's the world's largest
sin machine.

Speaker 14 (01:56:09):
Actually, No, I'll tell you what the next really interesting
area of research is. Right, there's a branch of cognitive psychology.
Danny Konnoman is the most famous practitionery, one Nobel Prize
for it and he what he started doing his colleagues
started doing really in the late nineteen sixties was cataloging
what he called heuristics and biases, which are essentially the

(01:56:31):
types of errors that people make systematically, okay, famously, recency bias.
Whatever you heard about yesterday stands larger in your mind
than what you heard about last year.

Speaker 10 (01:56:41):
I mean, there was a whole catalog of them.

Speaker 14 (01:56:43):
Now the analog is to start doing that type of
heuristics and biases research, the cognitive psychology research on AI systems.
What are the error types that AI systems systematically incorporate
into the errors? And that is something that we don't
know yet because no one has done it.

Speaker 2 (01:57:04):
So I got to hold you on that thought because
we are running over time.

Speaker 12 (01:57:09):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:57:09):
I love the AI conversation.

Speaker 1 (01:57:11):
I specifically prepared the three of you because I knew
where we were going and this is and I didn't
think you'd all agreat, which is good.

Speaker 3 (01:57:17):
I love it.

Speaker 1 (01:57:19):
Doctor Bruce Chess, Master Berkowitz, and mister Larry himself. Thank
you guys for anchoring our season finale two hour special,
last show of the season. We're coming back in September.
Ladies and gentlemen, I want to thank you guys. You

(01:57:40):
guys are awesome, and I'm going to end it on
this note. If you've all ever seen the Woody Allen
movie Sleeper in the seventies, that's right where I'm at
in technology. And if you guys don't know the movie,
you won't get the joke. But that's okay. Erica take
us home.

Speaker 4 (01:57:56):
Ladies and gentlemen, we thank you for watching this long.
If you got something out of the content, make sure
to like, share, subscribe, leave us a review on podcasts platforms.
And if you didn't like what you heard, we thank
you for listening this long because all of it helps
the algorithm.

Speaker 3 (01:58:15):
Ladies and gentlemen, we will see you soon.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}America & Israel at a Crossroads: Truth, Terror & the Fight for Freedom | SEASON FINALE