May 16, 2025 • 13 mins
I spoke with Hilary Bowman, a healthcare attorney, who is the Founder of Querious, an application that facilitates virtual lawyer-client conversations using generative AI. We discussed how artificial intelligence can help legal professionals optimize client conversations, the value of real-time legal insights, and how the attorney-client relationship is evolving.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Welcome to Reinventing Professionals,a podcast hosted by industry analyst
Ari Kaplan, which shares ideas,guidance, and perspectives from market
leaders shaping the next generationof legal and professional services.
This is Ari Kaplan and I'm speakingtoday with Hillary Bowman, a
(00:23):
healthcare attorney who is the founderof Aquarius, an application that
facilitates virtual lawyer clientconversations with generative ai.
Hi Hillary, how are you?
I'm doing well.
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm looking forward to this conversation.
So tell us about your backgroundand the genesis of Aquarius.
I am a practicing healthcare attorney.
(00:45):
I practice for 12 years.
I spent half of my careerin large law firms.
The other half is in-house counsel atIBM Watson Health and Redesign Health.
One of the favorite parts ofpracticing law was talking to clients.
Just that interaction, buildinga relationship, providing
counsel when it really mattered.
And these conversations are at theheart of what it is to be a lawyer.
(01:07):
It's where you earn your client's trust.
It's where if you're in a firmyou're winning their business.
And I remember I was about a decade intomy career, I knew the privacy law, HIPAA
forwards and backwards, and technologyadoption was accelerating in healthcare.
And I started to encounter thesereally difficult questions.
(01:28):
They were privacy questions, butthey had different set of facts.
Maybe a different technology wasbeing applied to medical information.
For example, summarizingmedical records with ai.
These were novel issues.
They were hard questions, and I rememberthinking I wish I had technology to
help me navigate these conversations.
I wish that I could ask better questions.
(01:49):
Wouldn't it be great if questionswere popping up on the screen?
Jogging my memory, helping me brainstormin the moment when the conversation
just takes an unexpected turn, and thatreally became the genesis of Aquarius.
How does queries work?
It joins your virtual meeting.
It provides realtime legal insightsin your virtual meeting so that
you can maximize the adviceyou're providing to your client.
(02:12):
At a really practical level,Aquarius is a bot that joins your
meeting and when you're in thevirtual meeting, on Microsoft teams.
Zoom or Google meet, the bot appearsat the center of the screen and all
of the attendees in the conversationcan see that the bot is there.
However, the attorney who'sthe user of Aquarius can only
see a sidebar that highlights.
(02:35):
Issues, questions and relevant legalcontent during the conversation.
So the attorneys getting promptsabout those different topics while the
client conversation's taking place.
That's the functionalityin the virtual meeting.
After the meeting, there is a seriesof steps that kick off that help
support the attorney's admin workthat comes out of those conversations.
(02:58):
The attorney receives a summaryemail of the conversation.
Written in a way that can beeasily forwarded to a client in a
very transparent and timely way.
Here's what we covered.
I'm going to be workingon these closing issues.
1, 2, 3, and it's listed out.
Additionally, the attorney receivesa very detailed set of notes from the
conversation and a draft billing entry.
(03:20):
Attorney users love that feature, havingan auto drafted billing entry from every
meeting that they attend with Aquarius,and the point of those detailed notes
is to be able to keep track over time.
To acquire knowledge and document itabout a specific client and to also
support a partner handing off workto an associate or helping cross
sell matters to another colleague.
(03:44):
What problem or problemsdoes query solve for lawyers?
Right now in the legal industry
there's a bit of an existential crisisthat we are adopting technology that
uses AI that is focused on efficiencies.
There are tools that takelong, complicated tasks like.
(04:07):
Research, due diligence, and theydo them in a faster amount of time,
.But when you're in a billable hour model, if you do substantive work in a shorter
amount of time, that means less revenue.
So firms are really faced with, ifwe're going to adopt this technology.
How do we maintain our practice?
(04:27):
How do we grow our practice in the future?
And so Que is a solutionto grow your practice.
So if a corporate lawyer from a large lawfirm is using queries in their meeting.
And a privacy issue is raised.
It may be outside of that person'spractice area, but if query helps
flag that potential issue, even if thecorporate lawyer doesn't address it in
(04:50):
the conversation, they can send thatsummary, email those notes to their
colleague who's a privacy counsel.
And generate new matters, new issuesthat the firm can handle for that
client, and that issue may not have beenflagged without the use of technology.
This is a tool that can helpwith, high powered brainstorming.
(05:11):
Helping all of us think a little bitmore and a little bit faster in client
conversations that are filled withcritical details about our clients
and potential business opportunities.
Who are the ideal users of Aquarius?
This is a tool that can bebroadly applicable to attorneys
(05:32):
that practice in small firms,large firms, in-house counsel.
Our early users have represented eachone of these categories, and we've seen
it useful in different subject matterareas like corporate law, healthcare, ip.
The target early adopters of this toolis the small to medium sized law firms.
(05:53):
They're the firms thathave complex practices.
They deal with complex clients, butthey don't have the administrative
support and the resources to.
Do the things that larger firms cando, and so Aquarius really helps
them be more efficient in that it'sreducing the non-billable work.
(06:13):
Right through the summary email thedetailed notes, which unlocks time for
those attorneys to do more billable workthat Aquarius has helped them identify.
How does the use of queriesaffect attorney-client privilege?
At its core privilege is the protectionof communications between an attorney
(06:35):
and client in representation.
That's the blanket rule, andthere's different ways that.
Privilege can be waived.
And that includes if there wasn'tan expectation of privacy or
there's a third party involved.
So a lot of ethics opinions, whetherit's at the state level or the a BA level
over the years have asked the questionor address the question of whether
(06:59):
technology can waive privilege and.
We dealt with that with email can we putclient communications in email and still
expect that it's protected by privilege?
We came to the conclusion that yes,that is possible that we are comfortable
as long as the email service thevendor has adequate protections for
privacy and security safeguards.
(07:22):
Having a technology provider accessyour email does not waive privilege.
The next evolution of that was with allof the meetings going virtual during
COVID, we very quickly had to ask thequestion, can we have attorney client
conversations in a virtual meeting?
Does that waive privilege?
(07:42):
And we eventually concluded that.
Vendors like Microsoft Zoom Google,that those technology providers for
virtual meetings didn't waive privilege,they can hear your audio, they have
access to your conversations, but aslong as there's adequate privacy and
security standards, we're comfortable.
That privilege hasn't been waived.
(08:03):
So Aquarius is just one stepfarther in that evolution.
And we actually are built ina secure cloud environment.
We leverage large language models, butwe leverage private instances of those.
We don't use a public, API toleverage the large language models.
And for that reason.
We think given the ethical guidancethat has preceded us, that we
(08:28):
don't waive privilege because weare following the same privacy and
security standards that other tools do.
Query was part of a two companytie in the ninth Startup Alley
competition at the A VA Tech Show.
Congratulations.
(08:50):
Thank you.
How does that.
Accolade affect your developmentcycle or go to market strategy.
It's given us a boost in awareness.
That's the hardest challengeas a legal tech startup.
The legal tech space, isvery crowded right now.
(09:10):
However, we have created our owncategory of conversational intelligence.
There are lots of tools outthere that do research, contract
drafting, practice management.
But as far as I know and aswhat was confirmed at the a VA
Tech show, we are the only toolthat offers support real time.
(09:32):
Legal insights in an attorney-clientconversation, and so that
has really allowed us to.
Expand our reach.
A lot of state bar associations in awonderful way have taken an interest
in our tool and the support that itcan offer attorneys in their states.
Given the advantages you anticipate withcareer use, how do you see technology
(09:53):
like this affecting the practice of law?
I truly believe it willpositively transform the
attorney-client relationship.
We're focused on those, reallyimportant meetings between attorney
and client, where you earn theirtrust, you win their business.
So it will only deepenthose conversations.
(10:16):
You can think back to times where.
You were talking to your client,a new issue popped up, and maybe
it was outside of your practicearea . You punt it, you say?
I don't have an answer,but let me get back to you
.What I have seen already is capable with que, is that maybe we don't
have to punt it so fast, right?
If that issue comes up, it's outsideof our practice area, but suddenly
(10:38):
we have content that's curated atour fingertips in the meeting to
say, here is the relevant law that.
That would apply to this scenario.
And actually now I canask a few more questions.
So here's an example about weuse this in our demo video.
This scenario is an attorney and clientdiscussing an engineer who has posted
(10:59):
sensitive product details online andin the conversation without anyone
mentioning intellectual property.
The Aquarius flagged inthe sidebar potential
misappropriation of trade secrets.
So if I'm a healthcare attorney andthat prompt comes up, it's outside of my
practice area, instead of having to wellit, the first possibility without Aquarius
(11:23):
is that I may have missed that issue.
I may have missed the IP issue.
The second possibility ismaybe I flagged the issue.
But I didn't know how tofollow up on that comment.
So with Aquarius, the benefit is thateven a healthcare attorney could ask
a few questions related to that beforethey go to their IP lawyer, they
could ask who owned that information?
(11:44):
What was the specific sensitiveinformation that was in the screenshots
that you took of those posts online?
And.
Were there any red flags or concernsthat you had about this engineer
before those disclosures were made?
Those were questions that I couldask even as a healthcare attorney
that may not have come to my mindwithout the benefit of Aquarius.
(12:07):
Do you have any plans tointroduce this in law schools?
Two law schools have already signed upfor a subscription with us and we have
plans to work with students, we wannastudy attorney-client conversations
without this tool, with this tool.
And then.
Observe how many questions were askedwhen the tool was used compared to
(12:29):
without the tool or how many issueswere flagged with and without the tool.
So there is a lot of interest fromlaw school professors, staying on
the cutting edge of legal tech.
This is Ari Kaplan speaking with HillaryBowman, a healthcare attorney who is
the founder of Aquarius, an applicationthat facilitates virtual lawyer client
conversations with generative ai.
(12:51):
Hillary, thanks so very much.
Thank you for having me.
I.
Thank you for listening to theReinventing Professionals Podcast.
Visit reinventing professionals.com orari kaplan advisors.com to learn more.
Welcome to Reinventing Professionals,a podcast hosted by industry analyst
Ari Kaplan, which shares ideas,guidance, and perspectives from market
leaders shaping the next generationof legal and professional services.
This is Ari Kaplan and I'm speakingtoday with Hillary Bowman, a
(00:23):
healthcare attorney who is the founderof Aquarius, an application that
facilitates virtual lawyer clientconversations with generative ai.
Hi Hillary, how are you?
I'm doing well.
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm looking forward to this conversation.
So tell us about your backgroundand the genesis of Aquarius.
I am a practicing healthcare attorney.
(00:45):
I practice for 12 years.
I spent half of my careerin large law firms.
The other half is in-house counsel atIBM Watson Health and Redesign Health.
One of the favorite parts ofpracticing law was talking to clients.
Just that interaction, buildinga relationship, providing
counsel when it really mattered.
And these conversations are at theheart of what it is to be a lawyer.
(01:07):
It's where you earn your client's trust.
It's where if you're in a firmyou're winning their business.
And I remember I was about a decade intomy career, I knew the privacy law, HIPAA
forwards and backwards, and technologyadoption was accelerating in healthcare.
And I started to encounter thesereally difficult questions.
(01:28):
They were privacy questions, butthey had different set of facts.
Maybe a different technology wasbeing applied to medical information.
For example, summarizingmedical records with ai.
These were novel issues.
They were hard questions, and I rememberthinking I wish I had technology to
help me navigate these conversations.
I wish that I could ask better questions.
(01:49):
Wouldn't it be great if questionswere popping up on the screen?
Jogging my memory, helping me brainstormin the moment when the conversation
just takes an unexpected turn, and thatreally became the genesis of Aquarius.
How does queries work?
It joins your virtual meeting.
It provides realtime legal insightsin your virtual meeting so that
you can maximize the adviceyou're providing to your client.
(02:12):
At a really practical level,Aquarius is a bot that joins your
meeting and when you're in thevirtual meeting, on Microsoft teams.
Zoom or Google meet, the bot appearsat the center of the screen and all
of the attendees in the conversationcan see that the bot is there.
However, the attorney who'sthe user of Aquarius can only
see a sidebar that highlights.
(02:35):
Issues, questions and relevant legalcontent during the conversation.
So the attorneys getting promptsabout those different topics while the
client conversation's taking place.
That's the functionalityin the virtual meeting.
After the meeting, there is a seriesof steps that kick off that help
support the attorney's admin workthat comes out of those conversations.
(02:58):
The attorney receives a summaryemail of the conversation.
Written in a way that can beeasily forwarded to a client in a
very transparent and timely way.
Here's what we covered.
I'm going to be workingon these closing issues.
1, 2, 3, and it's listed out.
Additionally, the attorney receivesa very detailed set of notes from the
conversation and a draft billing entry.
(03:20):
Attorney users love that feature, havingan auto drafted billing entry from every
meeting that they attend with Aquarius,and the point of those detailed notes
is to be able to keep track over time.
To acquire knowledge and document itabout a specific client and to also
support a partner handing off workto an associate or helping cross
sell matters to another colleague.
(03:44):
What problem or problemsdoes query solve for lawyers?
Right now in the legal industry
there's a bit of an existential crisisthat we are adopting technology that
uses AI that is focused on efficiencies.
There are tools that takelong, complicated tasks like.
(04:07):
Research, due diligence, and theydo them in a faster amount of time,
.But when you're in a billable hour model, if you do substantive work in a shorter
amount of time, that means less revenue.
So firms are really faced with, ifwe're going to adopt this technology.
How do we maintain our practice?
(04:27):
How do we grow our practice in the future?
And so Que is a solutionto grow your practice.
So if a corporate lawyer from a large lawfirm is using queries in their meeting.
And a privacy issue is raised.
It may be outside of that person'spractice area, but if query helps
flag that potential issue, even if thecorporate lawyer doesn't address it in
(04:50):
the conversation, they can send thatsummary, email those notes to their
colleague who's a privacy counsel.
And generate new matters, new issuesthat the firm can handle for that
client, and that issue may not have beenflagged without the use of technology.
This is a tool that can helpwith, high powered brainstorming.
(05:11):
Helping all of us think a little bitmore and a little bit faster in client
conversations that are filled withcritical details about our clients
and potential business opportunities.
Who are the ideal users of Aquarius?
This is a tool that can bebroadly applicable to attorneys
(05:32):
that practice in small firms,large firms, in-house counsel.
Our early users have represented eachone of these categories, and we've seen
it useful in different subject matterareas like corporate law, healthcare, ip.
The target early adopters of this toolis the small to medium sized law firms.
(05:53):
They're the firms thathave complex practices.
They deal with complex clients, butthey don't have the administrative
support and the resources to.
Do the things that larger firms cando, and so Aquarius really helps
them be more efficient in that it'sreducing the non-billable work.
(06:13):
Right through the summary email thedetailed notes, which unlocks time for
those attorneys to do more billable workthat Aquarius has helped them identify.
How does the use of queriesaffect attorney-client privilege?
At its core privilege is the protectionof communications between an attorney
(06:35):
and client in representation.
That's the blanket rule, andthere's different ways that.
Privilege can be waived.
And that includes if there wasn'tan expectation of privacy or
there's a third party involved.
So a lot of ethics opinions, whetherit's at the state level or the a BA level
over the years have asked the questionor address the question of whether
(06:59):
technology can waive privilege and.
We dealt with that with email can we putclient communications in email and still
expect that it's protected by privilege?
We came to the conclusion that yes,that is possible that we are comfortable
as long as the email service thevendor has adequate protections for
privacy and security safeguards.
(07:22):
Having a technology provider accessyour email does not waive privilege.
The next evolution of that was with allof the meetings going virtual during
COVID, we very quickly had to ask thequestion, can we have attorney client
conversations in a virtual meeting?
Does that waive privilege?
(07:42):
And we eventually concluded that.
Vendors like Microsoft Zoom Google,that those technology providers for
virtual meetings didn't waive privilege,they can hear your audio, they have
access to your conversations, but aslong as there's adequate privacy and
security standards, we're comfortable.
That privilege hasn't been waived.
(08:03):
So Aquarius is just one stepfarther in that evolution.
And we actually are built ina secure cloud environment.
We leverage large language models, butwe leverage private instances of those.
We don't use a public, API toleverage the large language models.
And for that reason.
We think given the ethical guidancethat has preceded us, that we
(08:28):
don't waive privilege because weare following the same privacy and
security standards that other tools do.
Query was part of a two companytie in the ninth Startup Alley
competition at the A VA Tech Show.
Congratulations.
(08:50):
Thank you.
How does that.
Accolade affect your developmentcycle or go to market strategy.
It's given us a boost in awareness.
That's the hardest challengeas a legal tech startup.
The legal tech space, isvery crowded right now.
(09:10):
However, we have created our owncategory of conversational intelligence.
There are lots of tools outthere that do research, contract
drafting, practice management.
But as far as I know and aswhat was confirmed at the a VA
Tech show, we are the only toolthat offers support real time.
(09:32):
Legal insights in an attorney-clientconversation, and so that
has really allowed us to.
Expand our reach.
A lot of state bar associations in awonderful way have taken an interest
in our tool and the support that itcan offer attorneys in their states.
Given the advantages you anticipate withcareer use, how do you see technology
(09:53):
like this affecting the practice of law?
I truly believe it willpositively transform the
attorney-client relationship.
We're focused on those, reallyimportant meetings between attorney
and client, where you earn theirtrust, you win their business.
So it will only deepenthose conversations.
(10:16):
You can think back to times where.
You were talking to your client,a new issue popped up, and maybe
it was outside of your practicearea . You punt it, you say?
I don't have an answer,but let me get back to you
.What I have seen already is capable with que, is that maybe we don't
have to punt it so fast, right?
If that issue comes up, it's outsideof our practice area, but suddenly
(10:38):
we have content that's curated atour fingertips in the meeting to
say, here is the relevant law that.
That would apply to this scenario.
And actually now I canask a few more questions.
So here's an example about weuse this in our demo video.
This scenario is an attorney and clientdiscussing an engineer who has posted
(10:59):
sensitive product details online andin the conversation without anyone
mentioning intellectual property.
The Aquarius flagged inthe sidebar potential
misappropriation of trade secrets.
So if I'm a healthcare attorney andthat prompt comes up, it's outside of my
practice area, instead of having to wellit, the first possibility without Aquarius
(11:23):
is that I may have missed that issue.
I may have missed the IP issue.
The second possibility ismaybe I flagged the issue.
But I didn't know how tofollow up on that comment.
So with Aquarius, the benefit is thateven a healthcare attorney could ask
a few questions related to that beforethey go to their IP lawyer, they
could ask who owned that information?
(11:44):
What was the specific sensitiveinformation that was in the screenshots
that you took of those posts online?
And.
Were there any red flags or concernsthat you had about this engineer
before those disclosures were made?
Those were questions that I couldask even as a healthcare attorney
that may not have come to my mindwithout the benefit of Aquarius.
(12:07):
Do you have any plans tointroduce this in law schools?
Two law schools have already signed upfor a subscription with us and we have
plans to work with students, we wannastudy attorney-client conversations
without this tool, with this tool.
And then.
Observe how many questions were askedwhen the tool was used compared to
(12:29):
without the tool or how many issueswere flagged with and without the tool.
So there is a lot of interest fromlaw school professors, staying on
the cutting edge of legal tech.
This is Ari Kaplan speaking with HillaryBowman, a healthcare attorney who is
the founder of Aquarius, an applicationthat facilitates virtual lawyer client
conversations with generative ai.
(12:51):
Hillary, thanks so very much.
Thank you for having me.
I.
Thank you for listening to theReinventing Professionals Podcast.
Visit reinventing professionals.com orari kaplan advisors.com to learn more.
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