November 25, 2025 • 43 mins
What do you do when homeschooling gets HARD? In this candid episode of the Schoolhouse Rocked Podcast, Kristi Clover talks to veteran homeschool mom of seven, Rachael Carman, about finding balance and staying rooted in God’s sovereignty as a Christian homeschool mom.
Journey with these two seasoned homeschooling leaders as they discuss:
Managing home and homeschool when your kids need extra attention
Navigating big emotions (yours and theirs!) during difficult seasons
Building deeper connections with your kids when challenges arise
Handling those tough “I want to go to school!” conversations with grace, love, and confidence
With practical examples, spiritual encouragement, and lots of laughter, Kristi and Rachael will help you find hope and fresh ideas—no matter where you are in your homeschooling adventure.
Recommended Resources:
How to Have a HEART for Your Kids, by Rachael Carman
How Many Times Do I Have to Tell You? By Rachael Carman
More books from Rachael Carman
Let’s Talk Homeschool Podcast
Sanity Savers for Moms: Simple Solutions for a More Joy-filled Life, by Kristi Clover
Ultimate Homeschool Organization Course (Get a $30 Coupon Here)
See Rachael Carman in Schoolhouse Rocked: The Homeschool Revolution
More from Rachael Carman on the Schoolhouse Rocked Podcast
More from Kristi Clover on the Schoolhouse Rocked Podcast
We want to hear from you! Is there a guest you’d like to hear from or a subject you’d like us to discuss on the podcast? How can we be praying for you? Talk to us here.
Sponsors:
Apologia is a Christ-centered, award-winning homeschool curriculum provider. Our mission is to help homeschooling students and families learn, live, and defend the Christian faith through our print and digital curriculum and online classes.
BJU Press Homeschool is dedicated to providing homeschool families with academically strong curriculum rooted in a biblical worldview. They offer a complete curriculum from preschool through 12th grade, available in both traditional textbooks an
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
At some point, most homeschool parents have a child that will
potentially say, I want to go toschool, like, you know, for
whatever reason it is, but I want to go to school.
And So what do we do as homeschool families who are
committed to wanting to homeschool?
How do we tackle that? Hello sweet friends, and welcome
(00:24):
back to the Schoolhouse Rock podcast.
I'm Christy Clover and I'm so excited to be here host again
this week. And I have my sweet friend
Rachel Carvin back on with me this week.
So last week we tackled, well, should we say not having
balance, but having balance not to have a life out of kilter and
(00:44):
what that looks like for homeschooling moms.
But this week we are going to bediving into a new topic and
talking about just some of the challenges and maybe challenging
kids who are there. But before we jump into all of
that, I do want to encourage youto go and listen back to the
last episode that I did with Rachel.
But I also want to make sure that we take a moment to thank
(01:08):
our sponsors. And this week our sponsor is
Apologia. If you are looking for a trusted
homeschool resource to support your child's education with
strong biblical worldview, you'll find it through Apologia.
For decades, Apologia has been ago to source for Christian
homeschool curriculum designed to educate, inspire and build a
(01:29):
lifelong love of learning. They know that home schooling
isn't A1 size fits all. That's why they offer a growing
catalog of resources to fit yourfamily's needs.
So dive into self-paced online courses, join live classes led
by incredible instructors, or stream engaging video lessons
anytime, anywhere. They even offer audio books
(01:53):
perfect for learning on the go. We are using their newly updated
science curriculum this year andabsolutely loving it.
It's so beautiful and engaging and easy to teach when you
follow their suggested teaching schedule.
So swimming Creatures is definitely a favorite subject
this year for my daughter. But Apologia will partner with
you and your family's educational journey.
(02:14):
So explore the full lineup of Apologia homeschool resources
today at apologia.com and discover how they can help your
family thrive. Apologia, Equipping and
families, inspiring learners andteaching truth.
All right, my friends, I'm back again and I'm bringing back
Rachel Carmen on the show with me.
(02:34):
So welcome back to the show again, Rachel.
Thanks for having me. You and I have so much energy
for this time together. I'm not sure we can capture this
today. I love it.
This has been so fun. And today we are going to be
tackling something and what I love is I could pretty much
throw anything mom related, homeschool related at you and
(02:54):
you'll just take it. So we were giggling right
before. I'm like, just want to remember
what we're talking about at thispoint, but we're just we're
going to talk about it. So we were, you know, last last
week we were essentially we weretalking about juggling and how
to have kilter not not to fall off there.
But this week I wanted to talk about how to manage both home
(03:15):
school and home life when you have, you know, kids that might
need a little extra, you know, without labeling them is
challenging. So what is your encouragement
for moms who are trying to navigate that with some grace?
Yeah, that's, I mean, it's all hard, right?
It's hard to say, oh, well, that's really hard or that's
really hard. It's just all, and, and why
(03:36):
don't we take the word challenging and just apply it to
everything instead of just one kid, right?
The whole thing is challenging. I remember when we had, I think
it was #4 I was pretty confidentthat the, the laundry was
multiplying when I closed the door, right?
Because it was just like, where did all that come from?
I mean, how is it possible? And then you have a new baby and
(03:57):
then there's like a whole notherpile of laundry.
I'm like, how can this little bitty thing do that?
So there's, there's challenges at every turn.
You know, you just clean up breakfast and they want to eat
again. And then you've got to figure
out when you're going to do school.
And yeah, it's, it's a lot. And when you have a child or two
that just need extra time, they need extra of you, right?
(04:20):
They need extra attention. They need extra, maybe extra
reading time. They need extra character
training. Not that anybody else has any of
those, but they need, they need more of you than you feel like
you have available, right? I, I really, my experience was
in 26 years and I would say thatall seven of my children managed
(04:45):
to rotate through the, that child position.
Yes, at least once, right? Some of them just wanted to live
there. But, and a couple of them, you
know, that was kind of definitively who they were.
But even the other ones had phases where that's just where
they were at that time. And my experience in 26 years
(05:11):
was that God was very faithful for, for each one of those
things. And I don't mean, I mean he's
perfect. I am not.
But at each one of those times, it was as though God extended a
special grace to our family and to me and into all the nutsy
(05:34):
nutty and crazy and chaotic, beautiful chaos, I might add,
Just with everybody talking and,you know, Cheerios on the floor
and sticky floors and peanut butter walls and all of that.
God just, he knew, right? He knew what those kids needed
more than I did. He knew what I needed in terms
of rest and a break. And yet in his, in his
(05:57):
sovereignty and in his faithfulness, he would like give
me special time with those thosechildren or that child.
And he seemed to cover the otherchildren in a way that I cannot
account for. So I would feel this, this
tension that this, this child needs extra help infractions
(06:19):
like we can't go to the next lesson until we figure out this.
Yeah. And I would just be like, and I
would like sort of try to build it into the day and try and
we're just not progressing. And I just felt like and even
retrospectively, even the children who needed extra
lessons or extra time when it came to character quality.
(06:42):
I mean, statistically it's awesome when we get the kid that
is just born cooperative helpful, right that was.
Me and I was like, I, I wanted like all of my kids to be
exactly like that and. Yeah.
Did it work out that way? No, not at all.
No, sorry to hear that. I married that right.
(07:05):
And he's just, you know, Mr. Compliant, Mr. Helpful, Mr.
Considerate, all of those things.
And I was always the why person.So I wouldn't say that I was
belligerent, but I did want to understand.
And he was just like you said toso great.
I don't have to know why. All that to say, at different
times we would have a child thatneeded more discipline or more
(07:29):
character training. And I think again, we talked
about this a little bit last time, daring to actually notice
and see what's going on in our house.
Yes, it's kind of huge and acknowledging, OK, we're in a
place right now where this childneeds this and just
(07:49):
acknowledging it for what it is,inviting God into that.
I can remember many times, Christy, I would just pray to
God, God, this child needs things that I don't have.
This child needs more of me thanI can give.
And I mean, there were times when I would say, Lord, you sent
me all these kids, you know, I don't have, you know, I mean, I
would say that to him. That's how I love it.
(08:11):
And he always provided. It wasn't always in the way that
I thought it was going to be, but it was always faithful.
And I think it if when we acknowledge that we're in one of
those places with this specific child and this is the specific
need, I think our first stop is acknowledging it.
Our second stop, and arguably these two are the same, is
(08:32):
taking it to God, acknowledging it.
I really found that God gave me moments to build and to pour in
to sit with that particular child.
Sometimes it was let's go for a walk.
Sometimes it was let's run some errands.
Sometimes it was why don't you not take quiet time today?
(08:55):
Why don't we spend it together? But God always provided if I was
paying attention. And so I think a lot of it comes
back to that is our paying attention to what our kids are
needing and where they are, and then knowing that God is already
paying attention, trusting Him to know that already and then
(09:19):
paying attention. You know, there's 3 levels of
paying attention. Then paying attention for the
opportunities he gives us, the inside he gives us the resources
he gives to us. Because that was one of the
things that God did in really powerful ways.
So my kids often needed things that I didn't have, time I
didn't have, skills I didn't have, insights.
I didn't have my my oldest son came to the breakfast table at
(09:43):
the ripe old age of probably 14,asking what it meant to be
human. And I was like, are you serious?
I mean, yeah, I don't have a philosophical brain.
I can tell you what we're havingfor dinner.
I know. And would you just sit down?
I mean, you were like breakfast anyway.
(10:03):
And he, that was sort of his thing.
And I remember sitting there in that moment going, OK, God, I
really don't know how to do this.
I don't know. I mean, I know I'm a human.
I know he's a human. I know these that I don't know
how to have this conversation with him and just asking God,
these are needs that he has thatI have no idea where to begin to
meet. And God provided that, right?
(10:27):
He provided it when I acknowledged my own weakness and
my own lacking and acknowledgingmy son's need and actually
anticipating his faithful provision of that.
And then when he did provide it,not resenting it because it
wasn't me, not resenting it because it wasn't what I thought
it would be, but being grateful because it was God's provision
(10:49):
for him. I always want to checklist in a
schedule. I want to always everything to
line up the way I want it to line up.
I want it to look beautiful, right?
And it was just, it was generally just kind of messy and
just just walked the next step, the next thing, the next
provision, the next moment. But God always provided, and I
(11:12):
was always amazed at what he did.
Yeah, no, I love that you're talking about the intentionality
that we are called to have, you know, and it's either
intentionality and stopping and praying and admitting to the
Lord. I don't have this.
You've got to give me some either divine intervent, like
some divine discernment or bringsomeone in term in our lives
(11:34):
that can help with this moment. But I also really liked how you
were mentioning taking because Ialways think, oh, it needs to be
big gestures like because especially when you're spending
a lot of time with your with, you know, one or two kids that
are just needing more of you. And a lot of times that's the
babies and toddlers. And so it is like, it's just a
challenging season. But then I feel like I'm not
(11:57):
giving enough to my other kids. And I forget that like, you
know, that one-on-one time when I take them to the grocery store
or we do go for a walk. And I think it was Amy Roberts
of Raising Arrows who had this great thing that she does.
And it kind of stuck with me. She talked about how like, I
think it was Tuesday nights rotated it.
And so one kid got to stay up late and everybody else had to,
(12:21):
you know, they went to bed and said that one child got to pick
whatever they wanted to do that night.
So it could be, you know, watching a movie.
It could be playing the game that they want to play, you
know, but they had their night. And I thought that was really
neat. But I love that.
So thank you for reminding us ofjust slowing down and that it's
yet another area to pray. Yeah, and just be aware that
(12:45):
they're all so different. And so, you know, I like to
think that I'm going to be able to to adopt some sort of a
reward and give it to all of my kids equally.
But they don't all want the chocolate bar, you know what I'm
saying? If that was the reward, it means
something to all of them. And so to capitalize on
(13:07):
something we're all familiar with, but it's so applicable to
our parents is know your kids love languages.
Amen. Know what really means something
to them. And for some of your kids, it's
going to be a note. Some of it's going to be a walk,
some of it's going to be a thing.
So if it's going to be a scratchyour back and some of it's going
to be what did I miss? Well, cookies, words of
(13:29):
affirmation, words of affirmation.
So my sons, it was always a big meal, right, Because they always
it was always about the food. But I also had a son, it was
words and I could just write a little note and tuck it up under
his pillow and he would find it at night.
Some of the kids just needed longer conversations.
And so, and the kids generally really enjoyed those kind of,
(13:52):
you know, So what makes what means the most to you?
Anytime you're trying to get to know your kids, they're all
about that, right? So I developed this whole
favorites list. What's your favorite meal, your
favorite breakfast item, your favorite breakfast meat, your
favorite chocolate item, your favorite non chocolate item,
your favorite flavor of gum? I mean, you don't need my master
list, just this whole thing and doing that with your kids.
(14:16):
And then like keeping it in a file because I still have that
file and I've updated it some too.
But then when they graduate, youcan send them very meaningful
packages, right? And you can know what means
something to them because you want to roll all this knowledge
forward. I saw it was, we just visited
one of my youngest sons, A, as asenior in college.
How did that happen? And we went to visit him this
(14:39):
last weekend. And I always leave a card in my
wake and I was at the store and I saw this card with a turtle on
it. And I was like, I have to get
that. I don't know what it says, but I
have to get that because he's all about, he was always about
turtles. He had turtles when he's a
little kid. And I thought this will be
great. It'll be a great throwback, you
know, and I can write this. So get actually studying your
(15:01):
kids and getting to know them and what makes them tick.
And even when you have a child that is having their issue, you
know, character, discipline, academic friendship, you know,
whatever blank you want to fill in to what is their moment.
I think one of the things we should dare to consider as
parents is, is that actually, isthat actually something else?
(15:25):
Oh yeah, because sometimes there's stuff under the surface,
so. Sometimes there's something
else, something and I would say especially when it comes to the
discipline, often it's somethingelse.
Often it is something else and any kind of acting out, we need
to like step back and go, what else is this, right?
But again, I think studying our children, actually daring to get
(15:47):
to knowing them, listening to them, asking really good
questions of them, communicatingto them that I see you, I'm
paying attention to you, I've got your back and being
available, which sounds crazy because if you're a homeschool
mom, isn't that definitively what we are is available?
I mean, I'm with you people all the time, but as they get older,
(16:11):
and I'm sure you've seen this, as they get older, they need you
later at night. Yes.
Was that true for you? Oh my gosh, it's killing me.
And of course, as I get older, like this whole 10:00, now I
want to open up and talk and like, you know, just share all
the deepest thoughts. It's so hard.
But yeah. And when we had the mix of older
kids and then like little tiny kids, like, oh, so difficult.
(16:35):
But yeah. So that's I, I think that's like
the secret. Your teenagers will start
talking at 10 and it's so tiring.
Yeah. But I do want to because you
talked about one thing that's a perfect lead in to one of the
things that I want to talk aboutwhen we come back after this
break. But I want to take a quick break
and we'll be right back. Home schooling is a big
(16:55):
responsibility. With BJU Press, you can feel
equipped to give your children not just an education, but a
foundation for life. Children learn in different
ways, and BJU Press lets you adapt to their unique learning
styles. And you'll love the community of
other homeschool moms who use BJU Press.
They've been where you are, and they're full of advice,
(17:18):
encouragement, and practical tips.
And when you need even more help, there's the Homeschool
Hub, which keeps families organized with easy lesson
planning, calendars and even grading tools.
To learn more, visit bjupresshomeschool.com.
Have you tried CTC math yet withyour child?
(17:39):
Here's a testimonial from another happy homeschool mom.
Amber said. I'm absolutely thrilled with CTC
Math. It's a rare find that I've used
with my children for more than five years now.
I have six children using CTC Math and each child has found it
easy to navigate and very applicable.
Thank you so much for all that you are doing and providing
quality math lessons for my children.
(18:01):
If you're looking for a great online math program, visit
ctcmath.com. That's ctcmath.com.
OK, we are back with Rachel Carmen and we have been talking
about kind of how to do life. I mean, we're talking
homeschooling too, but really how to do life when there are
just difficult seasons that we have with kids and kind of
(18:24):
learning how to look under the surface.
Because I think that's a big thing.
I mean, that's really a parenting thing sometimes I
think and and taking a look at what's really happening, Like
are they acting out because it's, you know, foolishness?
Are they acting out because it'sdefiance or they acting out
because something else is going on completely?
And so that kind of brings me toanother area that I wanted to
(18:47):
talk to you about because I think at some point, most
homeschool parents have a child that will potentially say, I
want to go to school, like, you know, for whatever reason it is,
but I want to go to school. And So what do we do as
homeschool families who are committed to wanting to
homeschool? How do we tackle that?
(19:10):
Yeah, I think a really importantfirst thing is don't panic.
Amen. Just don't panic.
You're not the first one who's faced this and your child
deserves to be heard and listened to.
I think that's very valuable. It, it may actually just sort of
(19:30):
step back we were just talking about before the break, you need
to dare to sit with that and sort of pick at it and unpack it
and see, is this really their desire to go to school?
And if it actually is a desire to go to school, I think it
deserves more conversation as towhat's motivating that.
Is it possibly that everybody intheir peer group goes to school?
(19:52):
Or maybe they're their kids, their friends were homeschooled
and now they're going to school or maybe their best friend moved
away. I mean, really dare.
And when you dare to do that? It's not just so you understand
more. I mean, that's very valuable,
but it's actually helping your child to understand more too,
which is a real gift for them tobe able to really think it
(20:14):
through. Because it could be that it's
all up here in their head and itsounds like a great idea.
But when they're talking to you and you're going to be calm and
you're not going to be panicked and you're not going to guilt
them and you're not going to manipulate them and you're not
going to say no right off the bat because all of those things
shut them down. And because you want to
(20:36):
continually have open conversation because as the
parent, you've got the long gamein mind.
And it's not just this conversation, it's every
conversation for the rest of their life.
So don't throw the Switch and shut it off now, right?
So come over here and sit down. What's going on and actually
having the conversation. Let's talk.
(20:57):
I really want to understand what's going on.
I know your friend moved away. I know your best friend decided
to go to school to play soccer. I know that you you you've had a
really tough time at Co-op this year that really clicked, you
know, just daring to dig it out and have the conversation and
don't don't be allergic to more than one conversation.
(21:19):
You don't have to commit to anything when it first comes up,
but it does deserve a conversation.
And if you can't have it immediately because context and
timing matters, right? So if this is in the van and
you're 3 minutes from getting out and going into Co-op, you
know, I think it's really powerful to make eye contact and
look at your child and say, I really am so grateful that you
(21:44):
brought this to my attention. I had no idea that this was
something that what you were thinking about.
And I think this is such an important conversation for you
and I to have. We can't do it right now.
We need to go in here and fulfill our commitment to being
here today. But I am going to promise you
that we will have time later this afternoon.
We'll figure something out and you and I can go and have this
(22:07):
conversation because I really want to hear what's going on in
your heart. I love that.
You are communicating love to your child.
I see you. I care about you.
This is valid. I'm not panicked.
I'm not angry. I'm not manipulating.
I'm not frustrated. I love you and there's something
going on here that that deservesmy attention and our
(22:28):
conversation. Let's do that.
I think that that I mean, it maybe that after that only your kid
may say, I was just kidding. I'm good.
You know, I don't think that's going to happen.
But I'm just saying really prioritizing that conversation.
Do not blow it off. Do not panic.
(22:50):
Do not blow it off, do not try to manipulate it.
Don't shut it down. There's a long list of don'ts
here that need to be studied andmemorized and here to because
I've known a lot of people that just look at their child and
like, or we're not doing that. I don't know where that came
from, but we're not doing that. You can just put it out of your
mind and I'm just going to say that's the wrong response, that
(23:14):
you are engendering rebellion. You are engendering resentment.
You are engendering disobedience.
You are engendering all negativethings.
You are not building into your relationship.
You are not valuing that child. You are not communicating love.
Don't do that. And if in the moment you are
overwhelmed with emotion becauseyou have poured into this child
(23:36):
and it does hurt you, they don'tneed to know that right then.
That's important they. Don't need to know that you're
the parents. You need to hold your emotions
together. You need to hold it together.
Your child is not responsible for your emotions.
And I can appreciate that as homeschool mothers, we have a
lot invested in this, but we should not put our emotional
(24:00):
baggage and our emotional junk on our children.
They are not responsible for that.
Amen. We are responsible for that.
And so you need to hold it together.
And if you need to go to some closet and fall apart, then you
need to go do that, but you don't need to do that with your
child. And so I, I think that this is a
(24:21):
conversation that needs to be had that we need to dare to have
and again, to sit down with our child and then pack it and
listen to them and to go throughall of the reasons because my
bottom dollar bet is there is a valid reason why, right?
And, and we need to be willing to face that.
So we did not face this issue, Full disclosure, until COVID,
(24:46):
interestingly enough, we were flying.
It was great. But then we had our two youngest
at home. And I think it's tough when you
your kids, you have a big familyand your youngest is used to
having every all the chaos and all the crazy and all the
conversation and then everybody's gone.
(25:06):
It's hard to be a youngest. Yeah.
It's hard to be a youngest because everybody leaves you.
And so you've done all your timeand you've, you've gone to
everybody's thing and you've been there for everybody and now
everybody's gone. It's hard.
And our youngest it was, it was really tough.
His older brother, his best friend left his best friend that
(25:29):
he had homeschooled with. And surely we're going to
homeschool together our senior year.
No, he went to school. It was tough.
It was super tough. And unloading and unpacking that
question with him and having that conversation with him and
ultimately he did end up finishing and homeschooling.
But I will say to you, it was really, really tough.
(25:54):
I believe I'm going to go out ona limb and say that.
I believe that he would say now as a senior in college, it was
the right decision. I think that moment was hard all
the way around. I don't think going to school
was the answer. I don't think and is originally
in his mind. I think he thought that they
would go to school together and everything would be grand.
(26:16):
I don't think that's how it would have played out.
I think he knows that. I think it was just a tough
moment for all the way around. I don't think there was an easy
solution and there were other things going on in our lives at
the same thing. It was truly the perfect storm.
I don't think there was just an easy answer, full stop.
But I think the most meaningful thing was we didn't stop talking
about it. I do believe, and again, not
(26:39):
that we did it perfectly, but I think the most important thing
was the preservation of the relationship, not the issue
itself. And so we had so much
conversation around that, so much.
I see you, I'm listening to you,I care about you.
And I think that that, and you know, now four years later, he's
a senior in college. I'm, I'm grateful we still have
(27:01):
those conversations. And I think we could have very
easily shut it all down and justsaid, no, no, 1000 times no, but
that's not what we did. And so I think that is the most
important thing to remember as the parent is the preservation
of the relationship. It's it's not that necessarily
that issue, right, but that you dare to have that conversation
(27:24):
with that child. Now, all that said, what if No,
they're really serious. They really want to do this.
I mean, that's a legitimate question.
That is, Yeah, absolutely. I think you need to consider,
and I'm going to, I'm going to draw a pretty hard, probably
unpopular line. I think you need to decide.
So what is this about for you asthe parents?
(27:46):
So if we get to the bottom of itis it is actually for your
student. No, I'm serious.
I really want to go and I want to go because of whatever
reason, whatever reason that youcould both probably legit, both
agree is somewhat legitimate. So it could be friends, it could
be, I don't know if people wouldconsider sports legitimate.
(28:07):
It could be there's a class I want to take that we can't do
it. co-ops not going great, whatever that would be.
I think you have to circle back to what is the reason that you
as as a husband and wife decidedto homeschool in the 1st place,
Yes. So what is your?
Why? I think that's actually what it
comes down to. I think that's so important
(28:28):
because people don't, they forget, I think sometimes that
you actually get to be the parent and you ultimately are
making the decision. And that's that's a hard line to
have there. But I all, I think every single
homeschool conference I speak atevery single session, I leave
the audience with your homework is to write down your why.
(28:51):
Why do you homeschool? Because it is in these moments.
And I find, I don't know about you, but I do find it's around
high school that that starts popping up.
They start seeing what peers andwhat other people are doing.
And it feels like it's the wholeFOMO, like they fear of missing
out. Yeah, I don't.
Well, I think in addition exactly.
(29:12):
And they and they don't, I mean,they're they're not going to
have necessarily more friends there than they would at home,
though. I mean, that's this you're
chasing after the win, right? You're chasing something that
there's no guarantee of. I think in addition to your
encouragement, and it's great encouragement to write your why,
right? And you need to have a folder
that says bad day on it. And you put your mission in the
(29:34):
bad day folder. You put any nice words or notes
that your children have ever written you right in your bad
day folder. And you just pack that puppy.
And on your worst day, when you're crying and your kids are
crying, right, you take out yourbad day folder.
And you remember why you're doing this, right?
Not only do we need to ride our mission, we need to communicate
(29:55):
our mission to our children, yes, so that our children know
why we're doing it. And so in this situation, when
you've got a child coming and saying, I want to go to school
and you're daring to engage withthem maybe over multiple days
and multiple conversations, I think that would be ideal, Which
is maybe terrifying to some people.
But sometimes it takes that right to actually get down to
what's really going on and to come back and keep circling
(30:18):
around it and keep listening, right?
Some kids take a long time to process, process.
And so you're getting into this and then coming back to your
family. Why?
And I'm packing that and applying that.
This is what we do. We believe this is what God's
called us to do. This is why we believe He's
called us to do this. And at the end of the day, the
reality is there are things thatparents are called to and home
(30:42):
educating their children that frankly, children are not going
to understand and are probably going to be wildly popular with
their kids. But that doesn't mean that it's
any less right to do it that way.
That is my hard line stance. Again, I think that you can
communicate that and listen to your child and communicate love
(31:04):
and care to your child and strategize with your child.
I hear you. You're concerned about XY and Z.
Let's strategize about some waysthat we can meet those needs.
Let's strategize some ways that we can get you a pottery class,
that we can get you to the next level in soccer, that we can
expand your friend base. Let's strategize movie night for
(31:25):
your friends. Let's talk about ways to meet
these issues. Let's we're on the same team
here. A real key here is to make sure
that this issue of going to school does not come between you
and your child. It's got to always be.
You're fighting either back-to-back with your child, a
(31:45):
shared enemy, but you're standing back-to-back and you're
both fighting right. Or you're fighting shoulder to
shoulder facing your inner enemy, but your enemy is never
between you. And it's very easy for us to let
any number of things come between us, not just our kids,
but our marriage. And we'll talk about that
another time. But we've got to make sure that
(32:05):
our kids. So I see you and I'm on your
team and I've got your back. And you're right, this is a big
dog thing. And this is really important to
you. And you know what, since it's
important to you, it's importantto me.
Let's, let's not leave this, let's pray about this and let's
figure out how we can solve thistogether.
(32:25):
No, it's, it's so powerful because we we did have a dynamic
like with that, like that with and actually around the same
time as you, you're talking about it was around that COVID
time and I think just. You know, our world, even as
homeschoolers was narrowing down.
And so for us, we had our son goto another youth group.
So he was going to two youth groups.
And right now we actually do that currently, both of all
(32:47):
three of our kids at home. They have two youth groups that
they're a part of. They're great, wonderful
churches in our area. So it just increases that
friendship base and just more kids, more quality, awesome
kids. We're in a Co-op, so we're
looking for dynamics because that was kind of at the heart
for us and our family. But we had friends who, you
know, they're like, well, my, mydaughter really wants to have a
(33:09):
prom or she wants to go to prom.And so I'm like, well, let's
throw her a prom. Like you don't have to go to
school to do prom. So, you know, there's so many
creative options out there. So if you peel it back like
that. So that was it for one of my
friends. Is that that was the reason why
her daughter wanted to go to school, because she wanted to go
to prom. And so she's like, well, that's
easy. Like we can do, we can do prom.
(33:32):
So they control all their friends together.
Yeah. And actually, in this case,
there was another school. Like it was it was a small
Christian School. And so they had some friends
there. So they kind of planned to have
everybody be a part of it. And so they were able to go and
be a part of somebody else's little school dance because
really they just wanted to dressup and, you know, and have the
experience. And I I think they almost would
(33:54):
be disappointed if they saw likeit's not all it's cracked up to
be. And I think it's just such a a
great opportunity. Everything's always what you
make it right. And so we can make these
situations with our kids a moment of just what have we done
wrong and just panic and what are you thinking?
And do you remember who we are? I mean, I'm Kristy Clover.
(34:15):
I'm Rachel Carmen. What do you mean doesn't make
that? I mean, I, I will never forget
Deb Bell, who was one of my heroes.
And I'll keep this short, but Deb Bell got a contract to
write. She'd been trying to write the
book entitled The Ultimate Guideto Homeschooling.
She had been putting it in for years, this book idea.
(34:37):
And the day she received the book contract for The Ultimate
Guide to Homeschooling, her twinsons came to her and told her
they wanted to go to school. And she said the way she told
the story, it was just amazing. She said I'm looking at the
package and she goes, my sons had no idea.
Yeah, I'm looking at this package book contract sign here.
(35:00):
And I'm looking at my sons and I'm looking at the book
contract, book contract sign here.
And I the title ultimate guy to home school.
And she's like, is this really happening?
Yeah. And that's, you know, yes, it's
really happening. And she talked about this is an
opportunity. And I'm going to say all the
bumps in the road, unemployment,stepping back, graduation,
(35:22):
learning challenges, character issues, it's all an opportunity
to build into that relationship,to point them to God, for us to
lean into God, to trust him more.
It's all that if we dare to lookat it that way, right?
And like I said, the the theme of my life the last few years
intensely, like it's always beenthe thing, right?
(35:43):
But intensely for me the last three years is the sovereignty
of God, the sovereignty of God. And even today, I've had a
couple of those moments where I'm just like, you know, that's
not what I wanted to do, the sovereignty of God.
And so I invite you as a homeschool mother to lean into
the sovereignty of God. He's got it.
He's over it. He sees you.
He knows you. He knows your kids.
(36:03):
He loves them more than you do. He loves some of the ones you
don't even. Yeah, that.
He's got it. He's got it.
He does, he really does. He is so good.
And he's so like, I'd like, I think you said it in our first
talk that he is such a good Redeemer.
He brings everything around fullcircle and he's so good at
(36:24):
redeeming and healing. And these moments are bumps,
like it may feel earth shaking, earth shattering.
They are bumps in the road. And you know what, you're going
to get over the bump and you're going to keep going.
And so that is, I think what oneof the encouragements for
families listening, listening isthat don't panic, slow down,
(36:46):
take some time with the Lord. But I, I really think it's
important. What you mentioned is making
sure that our kids feel seen andheard as I think we have the
tendency. And I don't know if it's the
homeschool gusto that we have tohave to survive homeschooling
for as long as we do, but we tend to steamroll.
Nope, this is what we're doing. And sometimes we do have to slow
(37:06):
down and really listen and listen well and address those,
those different things that are going on in our, in our, like in
our poor children's arts and minds that, you know, we don't
tend to see because we're busy doing this and that and then
getting, you know, dinner going and, oh, laundry again, you
know, and all those things that our minds are buzzing.
And it is really important and kind of tying our, our two
(37:30):
discussions together to be intentional.
We really have to be intentionalwith our kids and our time
because as you and I both know, they really do lunch and life
looks really different. And oh, it's like I will never
regret our home schooling time and getting all that time.
But man oh man, it hurts when they launch so.
(37:51):
I'm still recovering. It's true.
I know. One of my sons sent me a picture
today, and it's just he and I sitting on the sofa snuggling.
He's 64185, He's in Colorado. And I look at this picture that
he sent me, and I was like, thatwas yesterday.
Yeah, it was yesterday and it's not, it wasn't yesterday.
(38:14):
And so, yeah, Mom, it goes fast.And there's just nothing like
when you dare to downshift and sit on the sofa and do that
lesson again, that fractions lesson again, Right.
And sit with your child or listen to your child or stay up
till 11:30 and have the conversation.
Those are the those are the moments that you're building
(38:36):
into them calling you. Yes, after they're launched and
say, mom, I need to tell you about my day-to-day or mom, what
do you think about this? You're building into that now
and, and how you're seeing them and listening to them and and
not rushing past what really matters to them.
And so do that mom and all the right, the laundry, I'm here to
(39:00):
tell you laundry's not going anywhere.
If you don't get it started today, it's not going to run to
the woods, right? It's still going to be there.
So they're not, and so just. Do that.
Well, thank you, Rachel. Thank you so much for your
encouragement and wisdom. This is so good.
And I do want to make sure that everybody knows exactly where to
find you and all of your amazingresources.
(39:22):
So you can find me over at apology.com and Davis and I do a
podcast. Let's talk home school and
there's other places, but that'swhat we'll go with for today.
I. Love it.
I'm like like Rachel carmen.com so.
Rachelcarbon.com is a thing. I mean, there's stuff over
there. It's like I've had to downshift
too. And so there's always more to do
(39:44):
than you can actually do. And Amen.
Yeah, again, those priorities. Everybody needs to go listen to
our first. Conversation so good.
Well, again, thank you for coming on the show.
I really appreciate you being here and please all of you
listeners know that all of the links for everything we talked
about are going to be found in the show notes.
So make sure you head over to schoolhouserock.com.
(40:07):
That's where you can stream the movie Schoolhouse Rock the
Homeschool Revolution for free and make sure that you are
subscribed to Schoolhouse Rock YouTube channel and follow on
your favorite podcast app. It has been a pleasure to be a
host for you this week on the Schoolhouse Rock podcast and
sweet friends, Before I go, I Want.
(40:28):
Want to make sure that you know about a few tools that I've
created to support you in your homeschool and mom life?
And 1st up is the Homeschool Reset.
It's a free three day mini course designed to help you
declutter your mind, reset your routines, and find more joy in
your homeschool days. So you can grab that anytime at
christyclover.com/reset. And that's also where you're
(40:50):
going to find the link to get a $30 off discount on my
incredible Ultimate Homeschool Organization organization
course. And I'm telling you, it's a
truly life changing course and Icannot recommend it enough.
I have LinkedIn there, all of myhomeschool tips and tricks and
resources. If you want to see all the
curriculum that I've used through the years, that's also
(41:11):
where you'll find links to that.But I am so thrilled to be a
part of your week and I hope that you enjoyed this
conversation. So make sure that you come back
next week for another exciting guest on the Schoolhouse Rock
podcast. Be sure to stay tuned to the and
to hear a preview of what's coming up next on the podcast.
(41:32):
Have a fabulous rest of your week, my friends, and thank you
again for tuning in. See you next time on the
Schoolhouse Rock podcast. You're listening to the Biblical
Family Network. Hey, I'm Miki and I'm Will and
we're the Co host of the CultureProof podcast.
We want to invite you to join usevery week as we discuss what's
(41:53):
happening in the world and then filter those happenings through
a decidedly biblical lens. There are many questions,
especially when we see what's happening in our culture today,
but the answers are found withinthe word of God.
So that's where we want to look.Amen.
When we resist those cultural trends that rival the truth, we
remain culture proof. Hear people talking about the
(42:13):
things. That are really lacking in
today's youth and I know I always feel kind of like an old
lady when I say that like kids these days you know but it's
true and and because we're thereI have these three young.
Adult. Sons.
But then I still have this 15 year old and I cannot deny that
there is a difference in the world he's growing up in and the
(42:33):
world his older brothers grew upin.
So I would say when you look around you and say, what are the
things that are lacking and how can I, as a homeschool mom, I
have this blessing that I've gotmy kids at home around me all
day. How can I take advantage of this
opportunity to give them some ofthese traits that honestly are
going to make them stand out in the world when they go to apply
(42:56):
for a job, when they go to applyfor college, when they are, you
know, building relationships. Some really simple things will
make them stand out. If we can teach our kids to be
thoughtful, to give that eye contact, to be patient.
But I think that focusing on some of the things that God's
Word has to say about what really matters is going to
really be effective in the long run.
(43:17):
Maybe not in one day, but if youcontinue to do that, it does
make an impact.
At some point, most homeschool parents have a child that will
potentially say, I want to go toschool, like, you know, for
whatever reason it is, but I want to go to school.
And So what do we do as homeschool families who are
committed to wanting to homeschool?
How do we tackle that? Hello sweet friends, and welcome
(00:24):
back to the Schoolhouse Rock podcast.
I'm Christy Clover and I'm so excited to be here host again
this week. And I have my sweet friend
Rachel Carvin back on with me this week.
So last week we tackled, well, should we say not having
balance, but having balance not to have a life out of kilter and
(00:44):
what that looks like for homeschooling moms.
But this week we are going to bediving into a new topic and
talking about just some of the challenges and maybe challenging
kids who are there. But before we jump into all of
that, I do want to encourage youto go and listen back to the
last episode that I did with Rachel.
But I also want to make sure that we take a moment to thank
(01:08):
our sponsors. And this week our sponsor is
Apologia. If you are looking for a trusted
homeschool resource to support your child's education with
strong biblical worldview, you'll find it through Apologia.
For decades, Apologia has been ago to source for Christian
homeschool curriculum designed to educate, inspire and build a
(01:29):
lifelong love of learning. They know that home schooling
isn't A1 size fits all. That's why they offer a growing
catalog of resources to fit yourfamily's needs.
So dive into self-paced online courses, join live classes led
by incredible instructors, or stream engaging video lessons
anytime, anywhere. They even offer audio books
(01:53):
perfect for learning on the go. We are using their newly updated
science curriculum this year andabsolutely loving it.
It's so beautiful and engaging and easy to teach when you
follow their suggested teaching schedule.
So swimming Creatures is definitely a favorite subject
this year for my daughter. But Apologia will partner with
you and your family's educational journey.
(02:14):
So explore the full lineup of Apologia homeschool resources
today at apologia.com and discover how they can help your
family thrive. Apologia, Equipping and
families, inspiring learners andteaching truth.
All right, my friends, I'm back again and I'm bringing back
Rachel Carmen on the show with me.
(02:34):
So welcome back to the show again, Rachel.
Thanks for having me. You and I have so much energy
for this time together. I'm not sure we can capture this
today. I love it.
This has been so fun. And today we are going to be
tackling something and what I love is I could pretty much
throw anything mom related, homeschool related at you and
(02:54):
you'll just take it. So we were giggling right
before. I'm like, just want to remember
what we're talking about at thispoint, but we're just we're
going to talk about it. So we were, you know, last last
week we were essentially we weretalking about juggling and how
to have kilter not not to fall off there.
But this week I wanted to talk about how to manage both home
(03:15):
school and home life when you have, you know, kids that might
need a little extra, you know, without labeling them is
challenging. So what is your encouragement
for moms who are trying to navigate that with some grace?
Yeah, that's, I mean, it's all hard, right?
It's hard to say, oh, well, that's really hard or that's
really hard. It's just all, and, and why
(03:36):
don't we take the word challenging and just apply it to
everything instead of just one kid, right?
The whole thing is challenging. I remember when we had, I think
it was #4 I was pretty confidentthat the, the laundry was
multiplying when I closed the door, right?
Because it was just like, where did all that come from?
I mean, how is it possible? And then you have a new baby and
(03:57):
then there's like a whole notherpile of laundry.
I'm like, how can this little bitty thing do that?
So there's, there's challenges at every turn.
You know, you just clean up breakfast and they want to eat
again. And then you've got to figure
out when you're going to do school.
And yeah, it's, it's a lot. And when you have a child or two
that just need extra time, they need extra of you, right?
(04:20):
They need extra attention. They need extra, maybe extra
reading time. They need extra character
training. Not that anybody else has any of
those, but they need, they need more of you than you feel like
you have available, right? I, I really, my experience was
in 26 years and I would say thatall seven of my children managed
(04:45):
to rotate through the, that child position.
Yes, at least once, right? Some of them just wanted to live
there. But, and a couple of them, you
know, that was kind of definitively who they were.
But even the other ones had phases where that's just where
they were at that time. And my experience in 26 years
(05:11):
was that God was very faithful for, for each one of those
things. And I don't mean, I mean he's
perfect. I am not.
But at each one of those times, it was as though God extended a
special grace to our family and to me and into all the nutsy
(05:34):
nutty and crazy and chaotic, beautiful chaos, I might add,
Just with everybody talking and,you know, Cheerios on the floor
and sticky floors and peanut butter walls and all of that.
God just, he knew, right? He knew what those kids needed
more than I did. He knew what I needed in terms
of rest and a break. And yet in his, in his
(05:57):
sovereignty and in his faithfulness, he would like give
me special time with those thosechildren or that child.
And he seemed to cover the otherchildren in a way that I cannot
account for. So I would feel this, this
tension that this, this child needs extra help infractions
(06:19):
like we can't go to the next lesson until we figure out this.
Yeah. And I would just be like, and I
would like sort of try to build it into the day and try and
we're just not progressing. And I just felt like and even
retrospectively, even the children who needed extra
lessons or extra time when it came to character quality.
(06:42):
I mean, statistically it's awesome when we get the kid that
is just born cooperative helpful, right that was.
Me and I was like, I, I wanted like all of my kids to be
exactly like that and. Yeah.
Did it work out that way? No, not at all.
No, sorry to hear that. I married that right.
(07:05):
And he's just, you know, Mr. Compliant, Mr. Helpful, Mr.
Considerate, all of those things.
And I was always the why person.So I wouldn't say that I was
belligerent, but I did want to understand.
And he was just like you said toso great.
I don't have to know why. All that to say, at different
times we would have a child thatneeded more discipline or more
(07:29):
character training. And I think again, we talked
about this a little bit last time, daring to actually notice
and see what's going on in our house.
Yes, it's kind of huge and acknowledging, OK, we're in a
place right now where this childneeds this and just
(07:49):
acknowledging it for what it is,inviting God into that.
I can remember many times, Christy, I would just pray to
God, God, this child needs things that I don't have.
This child needs more of me thanI can give.
And I mean, there were times when I would say, Lord, you sent
me all these kids, you know, I don't have, you know, I mean, I
would say that to him. That's how I love it.
(08:11):
And he always provided. It wasn't always in the way that
I thought it was going to be, but it was always faithful.
And I think it if when we acknowledge that we're in one of
those places with this specific child and this is the specific
need, I think our first stop is acknowledging it.
Our second stop, and arguably these two are the same, is
(08:32):
taking it to God, acknowledging it.
I really found that God gave me moments to build and to pour in
to sit with that particular child.
Sometimes it was let's go for a walk.
Sometimes it was let's run some errands.
Sometimes it was why don't you not take quiet time today?
(08:55):
Why don't we spend it together? But God always provided if I was
paying attention. And so I think a lot of it comes
back to that is our paying attention to what our kids are
needing and where they are, and then knowing that God is already
paying attention, trusting Him to know that already and then
(09:19):
paying attention. You know, there's 3 levels of
paying attention. Then paying attention for the
opportunities he gives us, the inside he gives us the resources
he gives to us. Because that was one of the
things that God did in really powerful ways.
So my kids often needed things that I didn't have, time I
didn't have, skills I didn't have, insights.
I didn't have my my oldest son came to the breakfast table at
(09:43):
the ripe old age of probably 14,asking what it meant to be
human. And I was like, are you serious?
I mean, yeah, I don't have a philosophical brain.
I can tell you what we're havingfor dinner.
I know. And would you just sit down?
I mean, you were like breakfast anyway.
(10:03):
And he, that was sort of his thing.
And I remember sitting there in that moment going, OK, God, I
really don't know how to do this.
I don't know. I mean, I know I'm a human.
I know he's a human. I know these that I don't know
how to have this conversation with him and just asking God,
these are needs that he has thatI have no idea where to begin to
meet. And God provided that, right?
(10:27):
He provided it when I acknowledged my own weakness and
my own lacking and acknowledgingmy son's need and actually
anticipating his faithful provision of that.
And then when he did provide it,not resenting it because it
wasn't me, not resenting it because it wasn't what I thought
it would be, but being grateful because it was God's provision
(10:49):
for him. I always want to checklist in a
schedule. I want to always everything to
line up the way I want it to line up.
I want it to look beautiful, right?
And it was just, it was generally just kind of messy and
just just walked the next step, the next thing, the next
provision, the next moment. But God always provided, and I
(11:12):
was always amazed at what he did.
Yeah, no, I love that you're talking about the intentionality
that we are called to have, you know, and it's either
intentionality and stopping and praying and admitting to the
Lord. I don't have this.
You've got to give me some either divine intervent, like
some divine discernment or bringsomeone in term in our lives
(11:34):
that can help with this moment. But I also really liked how you
were mentioning taking because Ialways think, oh, it needs to be
big gestures like because especially when you're spending
a lot of time with your with, you know, one or two kids that
are just needing more of you. And a lot of times that's the
babies and toddlers. And so it is like, it's just a
challenging season. But then I feel like I'm not
(11:57):
giving enough to my other kids. And I forget that like, you
know, that one-on-one time when I take them to the grocery store
or we do go for a walk. And I think it was Amy Roberts
of Raising Arrows who had this great thing that she does.
And it kind of stuck with me. She talked about how like, I
think it was Tuesday nights rotated it.
And so one kid got to stay up late and everybody else had to,
(12:21):
you know, they went to bed and said that one child got to pick
whatever they wanted to do that night.
So it could be, you know, watching a movie.
It could be playing the game that they want to play, you
know, but they had their night. And I thought that was really
neat. But I love that.
So thank you for reminding us ofjust slowing down and that it's
yet another area to pray. Yeah, and just be aware that
(12:45):
they're all so different. And so, you know, I like to
think that I'm going to be able to to adopt some sort of a
reward and give it to all of my kids equally.
But they don't all want the chocolate bar, you know what I'm
saying? If that was the reward, it means
something to all of them. And so to capitalize on
(13:07):
something we're all familiar with, but it's so applicable to
our parents is know your kids love languages.
Amen. Know what really means something
to them. And for some of your kids, it's
going to be a note. Some of it's going to be a walk,
some of it's going to be a thing.
So if it's going to be a scratchyour back and some of it's going
to be what did I miss? Well, cookies, words of
(13:29):
affirmation, words of affirmation.
So my sons, it was always a big meal, right, Because they always
it was always about the food. But I also had a son, it was
words and I could just write a little note and tuck it up under
his pillow and he would find it at night.
Some of the kids just needed longer conversations.
And so, and the kids generally really enjoyed those kind of,
(13:52):
you know, So what makes what means the most to you?
Anytime you're trying to get to know your kids, they're all
about that, right? So I developed this whole
favorites list. What's your favorite meal, your
favorite breakfast item, your favorite breakfast meat, your
favorite chocolate item, your favorite non chocolate item,
your favorite flavor of gum? I mean, you don't need my master
list, just this whole thing and doing that with your kids.
(14:16):
And then like keeping it in a file because I still have that
file and I've updated it some too.
But then when they graduate, youcan send them very meaningful
packages, right? And you can know what means
something to them because you want to roll all this knowledge
forward. I saw it was, we just visited
one of my youngest sons, A, as asenior in college.
How did that happen? And we went to visit him this
(14:39):
last weekend. And I always leave a card in my
wake and I was at the store and I saw this card with a turtle on
it. And I was like, I have to get
that. I don't know what it says, but I
have to get that because he's all about, he was always about
turtles. He had turtles when he's a
little kid. And I thought this will be
great. It'll be a great throwback, you
know, and I can write this. So get actually studying your
(15:01):
kids and getting to know them and what makes them tick.
And even when you have a child that is having their issue, you
know, character, discipline, academic friendship, you know,
whatever blank you want to fill in to what is their moment.
I think one of the things we should dare to consider as
parents is, is that actually, isthat actually something else?
(15:25):
Oh yeah, because sometimes there's stuff under the surface,
so. Sometimes there's something
else, something and I would say especially when it comes to the
discipline, often it's somethingelse.
Often it is something else and any kind of acting out, we need
to like step back and go, what else is this, right?
But again, I think studying our children, actually daring to get
(15:47):
to knowing them, listening to them, asking really good
questions of them, communicatingto them that I see you, I'm
paying attention to you, I've got your back and being
available, which sounds crazy because if you're a homeschool
mom, isn't that definitively what we are is available?
I mean, I'm with you people all the time, but as they get older,
(16:11):
and I'm sure you've seen this, as they get older, they need you
later at night. Yes.
Was that true for you? Oh my gosh, it's killing me.
And of course, as I get older, like this whole 10:00, now I
want to open up and talk and like, you know, just share all
the deepest thoughts. It's so hard.
But yeah. And when we had the mix of older
kids and then like little tiny kids, like, oh, so difficult.
(16:35):
But yeah. So that's I, I think that's like
the secret. Your teenagers will start
talking at 10 and it's so tiring.
Yeah. But I do want to because you
talked about one thing that's a perfect lead in to one of the
things that I want to talk aboutwhen we come back after this
break. But I want to take a quick break
and we'll be right back. Home schooling is a big
(16:55):
responsibility. With BJU Press, you can feel
equipped to give your children not just an education, but a
foundation for life. Children learn in different
ways, and BJU Press lets you adapt to their unique learning
styles. And you'll love the community of
other homeschool moms who use BJU Press.
They've been where you are, and they're full of advice,
(17:18):
encouragement, and practical tips.
And when you need even more help, there's the Homeschool
Hub, which keeps families organized with easy lesson
planning, calendars and even grading tools.
To learn more, visit bjupresshomeschool.com.
Have you tried CTC math yet withyour child?
(17:39):
Here's a testimonial from another happy homeschool mom.
Amber said. I'm absolutely thrilled with CTC
Math. It's a rare find that I've used
with my children for more than five years now.
I have six children using CTC Math and each child has found it
easy to navigate and very applicable.
Thank you so much for all that you are doing and providing
quality math lessons for my children.
(18:01):
If you're looking for a great online math program, visit
ctcmath.com. That's ctcmath.com.
OK, we are back with Rachel Carmen and we have been talking
about kind of how to do life. I mean, we're talking
homeschooling too, but really how to do life when there are
just difficult seasons that we have with kids and kind of
(18:24):
learning how to look under the surface.
Because I think that's a big thing.
I mean, that's really a parenting thing sometimes I
think and and taking a look at what's really happening, Like
are they acting out because it's, you know, foolishness?
Are they acting out because it'sdefiance or they acting out
because something else is going on completely?
And so that kind of brings me toanother area that I wanted to
(18:47):
talk to you about because I think at some point, most
homeschool parents have a child that will potentially say, I
want to go to school, like, you know, for whatever reason it is,
but I want to go to school. And So what do we do as
homeschool families who are committed to wanting to
homeschool? How do we tackle that?
(19:10):
Yeah, I think a really importantfirst thing is don't panic.
Amen. Just don't panic.
You're not the first one who's faced this and your child
deserves to be heard and listened to.
I think that's very valuable. It, it may actually just sort of
(19:30):
step back we were just talking about before the break, you need
to dare to sit with that and sort of pick at it and unpack it
and see, is this really their desire to go to school?
And if it actually is a desire to go to school, I think it
deserves more conversation as towhat's motivating that.
Is it possibly that everybody intheir peer group goes to school?
(19:52):
Or maybe they're their kids, their friends were homeschooled
and now they're going to school or maybe their best friend moved
away. I mean, really dare.
And when you dare to do that? It's not just so you understand
more. I mean, that's very valuable,
but it's actually helping your child to understand more too,
which is a real gift for them tobe able to really think it
(20:14):
through. Because it could be that it's
all up here in their head and itsounds like a great idea.
But when they're talking to you and you're going to be calm and
you're not going to be panicked and you're not going to guilt
them and you're not going to manipulate them and you're not
going to say no right off the bat because all of those things
shut them down. And because you want to
(20:36):
continually have open conversation because as the
parent, you've got the long gamein mind.
And it's not just this conversation, it's every
conversation for the rest of their life.
So don't throw the Switch and shut it off now, right?
So come over here and sit down. What's going on and actually
having the conversation. Let's talk.
(20:57):
I really want to understand what's going on.
I know your friend moved away. I know your best friend decided
to go to school to play soccer. I know that you you you've had a
really tough time at Co-op this year that really clicked, you
know, just daring to dig it out and have the conversation and
don't don't be allergic to more than one conversation.
(21:19):
You don't have to commit to anything when it first comes up,
but it does deserve a conversation.
And if you can't have it immediately because context and
timing matters, right? So if this is in the van and
you're 3 minutes from getting out and going into Co-op, you
know, I think it's really powerful to make eye contact and
look at your child and say, I really am so grateful that you
(21:44):
brought this to my attention. I had no idea that this was
something that what you were thinking about.
And I think this is such an important conversation for you
and I to have. We can't do it right now.
We need to go in here and fulfill our commitment to being
here today. But I am going to promise you
that we will have time later this afternoon.
We'll figure something out and you and I can go and have this
(22:07):
conversation because I really want to hear what's going on in
your heart. I love that.
You are communicating love to your child.
I see you. I care about you.
This is valid. I'm not panicked.
I'm not angry. I'm not manipulating.
I'm not frustrated. I love you and there's something
going on here that that deservesmy attention and our
(22:28):
conversation. Let's do that.
I think that that I mean, it maybe that after that only your kid
may say, I was just kidding. I'm good.
You know, I don't think that's going to happen.
But I'm just saying really prioritizing that conversation.
Do not blow it off. Do not panic.
(22:50):
Do not blow it off, do not try to manipulate it.
Don't shut it down. There's a long list of don'ts
here that need to be studied andmemorized and here to because
I've known a lot of people that just look at their child and
like, or we're not doing that. I don't know where that came
from, but we're not doing that. You can just put it out of your
mind and I'm just going to say that's the wrong response, that
(23:14):
you are engendering rebellion. You are engendering resentment.
You are engendering disobedience.
You are engendering all negativethings.
You are not building into your relationship.
You are not valuing that child. You are not communicating love.
Don't do that. And if in the moment you are
overwhelmed with emotion becauseyou have poured into this child
(23:36):
and it does hurt you, they don'tneed to know that right then.
That's important they. Don't need to know that you're
the parents. You need to hold your emotions
together. You need to hold it together.
Your child is not responsible for your emotions.
And I can appreciate that as homeschool mothers, we have a
lot invested in this, but we should not put our emotional
(24:00):
baggage and our emotional junk on our children.
They are not responsible for that.
Amen. We are responsible for that.
And so you need to hold it together.
And if you need to go to some closet and fall apart, then you
need to go do that, but you don't need to do that with your
child. And so I, I think that this is a
(24:21):
conversation that needs to be had that we need to dare to have
and again, to sit down with our child and then pack it and
listen to them and to go throughall of the reasons because my
bottom dollar bet is there is a valid reason why, right?
And, and we need to be willing to face that.
So we did not face this issue, Full disclosure, until COVID,
(24:46):
interestingly enough, we were flying.
It was great. But then we had our two youngest
at home. And I think it's tough when you
your kids, you have a big familyand your youngest is used to
having every all the chaos and all the crazy and all the
conversation and then everybody's gone.
(25:06):
It's hard to be a youngest. Yeah.
It's hard to be a youngest because everybody leaves you.
And so you've done all your timeand you've, you've gone to
everybody's thing and you've been there for everybody and now
everybody's gone. It's hard.
And our youngest it was, it was really tough.
His older brother, his best friend left his best friend that
(25:29):
he had homeschooled with. And surely we're going to
homeschool together our senior year.
No, he went to school. It was tough.
It was super tough. And unloading and unpacking that
question with him and having that conversation with him and
ultimately he did end up finishing and homeschooling.
But I will say to you, it was really, really tough.
(25:54):
I believe I'm going to go out ona limb and say that.
I believe that he would say now as a senior in college, it was
the right decision. I think that moment was hard all
the way around. I don't think going to school
was the answer. I don't think and is originally
in his mind. I think he thought that they
would go to school together and everything would be grand.
(26:16):
I don't think that's how it would have played out.
I think he knows that. I think it was just a tough
moment for all the way around. I don't think there was an easy
solution and there were other things going on in our lives at
the same thing. It was truly the perfect storm.
I don't think there was just an easy answer, full stop.
But I think the most meaningful thing was we didn't stop talking
about it. I do believe, and again, not
(26:39):
that we did it perfectly, but I think the most important thing
was the preservation of the relationship, not the issue
itself. And so we had so much
conversation around that, so much.
I see you, I'm listening to you,I care about you.
And I think that that, and you know, now four years later, he's
a senior in college. I'm, I'm grateful we still have
(27:01):
those conversations. And I think we could have very
easily shut it all down and justsaid, no, no, 1000 times no, but
that's not what we did. And so I think that is the most
important thing to remember as the parent is the preservation
of the relationship. It's it's not that necessarily
that issue, right, but that you dare to have that conversation
(27:24):
with that child. Now, all that said, what if No,
they're really serious. They really want to do this.
I mean, that's a legitimate question.
That is, Yeah, absolutely. I think you need to consider,
and I'm going to, I'm going to draw a pretty hard, probably
unpopular line. I think you need to decide.
So what is this about for you asthe parents?
(27:46):
So if we get to the bottom of itis it is actually for your
student. No, I'm serious.
I really want to go and I want to go because of whatever
reason, whatever reason that youcould both probably legit, both
agree is somewhat legitimate. So it could be friends, it could
be, I don't know if people wouldconsider sports legitimate.
(28:07):
It could be there's a class I want to take that we can't do
it. co-ops not going great, whatever that would be.
I think you have to circle back to what is the reason that you
as as a husband and wife decidedto homeschool in the 1st place,
Yes. So what is your?
Why? I think that's actually what it
comes down to. I think that's so important
(28:28):
because people don't, they forget, I think sometimes that
you actually get to be the parent and you ultimately are
making the decision. And that's that's a hard line to
have there. But I all, I think every single
homeschool conference I speak atevery single session, I leave
the audience with your homework is to write down your why.
(28:51):
Why do you homeschool? Because it is in these moments.
And I find, I don't know about you, but I do find it's around
high school that that starts popping up.
They start seeing what peers andwhat other people are doing.
And it feels like it's the wholeFOMO, like they fear of missing
out. Yeah, I don't.
Well, I think in addition exactly.
(29:12):
And they and they don't, I mean,they're they're not going to
have necessarily more friends there than they would at home,
though. I mean, that's this you're
chasing after the win, right? You're chasing something that
there's no guarantee of. I think in addition to your
encouragement, and it's great encouragement to write your why,
right? And you need to have a folder
that says bad day on it. And you put your mission in the
(29:34):
bad day folder. You put any nice words or notes
that your children have ever written you right in your bad
day folder. And you just pack that puppy.
And on your worst day, when you're crying and your kids are
crying, right, you take out yourbad day folder.
And you remember why you're doing this, right?
Not only do we need to ride our mission, we need to communicate
(29:55):
our mission to our children, yes, so that our children know
why we're doing it. And so in this situation, when
you've got a child coming and saying, I want to go to school
and you're daring to engage withthem maybe over multiple days
and multiple conversations, I think that would be ideal, Which
is maybe terrifying to some people.
But sometimes it takes that right to actually get down to
what's really going on and to come back and keep circling
(30:18):
around it and keep listening, right?
Some kids take a long time to process, process.
And so you're getting into this and then coming back to your
family. Why?
And I'm packing that and applying that.
This is what we do. We believe this is what God's
called us to do. This is why we believe He's
called us to do this. And at the end of the day, the
reality is there are things thatparents are called to and home
(30:42):
educating their children that frankly, children are not going
to understand and are probably going to be wildly popular with
their kids. But that doesn't mean that it's
any less right to do it that way.
That is my hard line stance. Again, I think that you can
communicate that and listen to your child and communicate love
(31:04):
and care to your child and strategize with your child.
I hear you. You're concerned about XY and Z.
Let's strategize about some waysthat we can meet those needs.
Let's strategize some ways that we can get you a pottery class,
that we can get you to the next level in soccer, that we can
expand your friend base. Let's strategize movie night for
(31:25):
your friends. Let's talk about ways to meet
these issues. Let's we're on the same team
here. A real key here is to make sure
that this issue of going to school does not come between you
and your child. It's got to always be.
You're fighting either back-to-back with your child, a
(31:45):
shared enemy, but you're standing back-to-back and you're
both fighting right. Or you're fighting shoulder to
shoulder facing your inner enemy, but your enemy is never
between you. And it's very easy for us to let
any number of things come between us, not just our kids,
but our marriage. And we'll talk about that
another time. But we've got to make sure that
(32:05):
our kids. So I see you and I'm on your
team and I've got your back. And you're right, this is a big
dog thing. And this is really important to
you. And you know what, since it's
important to you, it's importantto me.
Let's, let's not leave this, let's pray about this and let's
figure out how we can solve thistogether.
(32:25):
No, it's, it's so powerful because we we did have a dynamic
like with that, like that with and actually around the same
time as you, you're talking about it was around that COVID
time and I think just. You know, our world, even as
homeschoolers was narrowing down.
And so for us, we had our son goto another youth group.
So he was going to two youth groups.
And right now we actually do that currently, both of all
(32:47):
three of our kids at home. They have two youth groups that
they're a part of. They're great, wonderful
churches in our area. So it just increases that
friendship base and just more kids, more quality, awesome
kids. We're in a Co-op, so we're
looking for dynamics because that was kind of at the heart
for us and our family. But we had friends who, you
know, they're like, well, my, mydaughter really wants to have a
(33:09):
prom or she wants to go to prom.And so I'm like, well, let's
throw her a prom. Like you don't have to go to
school to do prom. So, you know, there's so many
creative options out there. So if you peel it back like
that. So that was it for one of my
friends. Is that that was the reason why
her daughter wanted to go to school, because she wanted to go
to prom. And so she's like, well, that's
easy. Like we can do, we can do prom.
(33:32):
So they control all their friends together.
Yeah. And actually, in this case,
there was another school. Like it was it was a small
Christian School. And so they had some friends
there. So they kind of planned to have
everybody be a part of it. And so they were able to go and
be a part of somebody else's little school dance because
really they just wanted to dressup and, you know, and have the
experience. And I I think they almost would
(33:54):
be disappointed if they saw likeit's not all it's cracked up to
be. And I think it's just such a a
great opportunity. Everything's always what you
make it right. And so we can make these
situations with our kids a moment of just what have we done
wrong and just panic and what are you thinking?
And do you remember who we are? I mean, I'm Kristy Clover.
(34:15):
I'm Rachel Carmen. What do you mean doesn't make
that? I mean, I, I will never forget
Deb Bell, who was one of my heroes.
And I'll keep this short, but Deb Bell got a contract to
write. She'd been trying to write the
book entitled The Ultimate Guideto Homeschooling.
She had been putting it in for years, this book idea.
(34:37):
And the day she received the book contract for The Ultimate
Guide to Homeschooling, her twinsons came to her and told her
they wanted to go to school. And she said the way she told
the story, it was just amazing. She said I'm looking at the
package and she goes, my sons had no idea.
Yeah, I'm looking at this package book contract sign here.
(35:00):
And I'm looking at my sons and I'm looking at the book
contract, book contract sign here.
And I the title ultimate guy to home school.
And she's like, is this really happening?
Yeah. And that's, you know, yes, it's
really happening. And she talked about this is an
opportunity. And I'm going to say all the
bumps in the road, unemployment,stepping back, graduation,
(35:22):
learning challenges, character issues, it's all an opportunity
to build into that relationship,to point them to God, for us to
lean into God, to trust him more.
It's all that if we dare to lookat it that way, right?
And like I said, the the theme of my life the last few years
intensely, like it's always beenthe thing, right?
(35:43):
But intensely for me the last three years is the sovereignty
of God, the sovereignty of God. And even today, I've had a
couple of those moments where I'm just like, you know, that's
not what I wanted to do, the sovereignty of God.
And so I invite you as a homeschool mother to lean into
the sovereignty of God. He's got it.
He's over it. He sees you.
He knows you. He knows your kids.
(36:03):
He loves them more than you do. He loves some of the ones you
don't even. Yeah, that.
He's got it. He's got it.
He does, he really does. He is so good.
And he's so like, I'd like, I think you said it in our first
talk that he is such a good Redeemer.
He brings everything around fullcircle and he's so good at
(36:24):
redeeming and healing. And these moments are bumps,
like it may feel earth shaking, earth shattering.
They are bumps in the road. And you know what, you're going
to get over the bump and you're going to keep going.
And so that is, I think what oneof the encouragements for
families listening, listening isthat don't panic, slow down,
(36:46):
take some time with the Lord. But I, I really think it's
important. What you mentioned is making
sure that our kids feel seen andheard as I think we have the
tendency. And I don't know if it's the
homeschool gusto that we have tohave to survive homeschooling
for as long as we do, but we tend to steamroll.
Nope, this is what we're doing. And sometimes we do have to slow
(37:06):
down and really listen and listen well and address those,
those different things that are going on in our, in our, like in
our poor children's arts and minds that, you know, we don't
tend to see because we're busy doing this and that and then
getting, you know, dinner going and, oh, laundry again, you
know, and all those things that our minds are buzzing.
And it is really important and kind of tying our, our two
(37:30):
discussions together to be intentional.
We really have to be intentionalwith our kids and our time
because as you and I both know, they really do lunch and life
looks really different. And oh, it's like I will never
regret our home schooling time and getting all that time.
But man oh man, it hurts when they launch so.
(37:51):
I'm still recovering. It's true.
I know. One of my sons sent me a picture
today, and it's just he and I sitting on the sofa snuggling.
He's 64185, He's in Colorado. And I look at this picture that
he sent me, and I was like, thatwas yesterday.
Yeah, it was yesterday and it's not, it wasn't yesterday.
(38:14):
And so, yeah, Mom, it goes fast.And there's just nothing like
when you dare to downshift and sit on the sofa and do that
lesson again, that fractions lesson again, Right.
And sit with your child or listen to your child or stay up
till 11:30 and have the conversation.
Those are the those are the moments that you're building
(38:36):
into them calling you. Yes, after they're launched and
say, mom, I need to tell you about my day-to-day or mom, what
do you think about this? You're building into that now
and, and how you're seeing them and listening to them and and
not rushing past what really matters to them.
And so do that mom and all the right, the laundry, I'm here to
(39:00):
tell you laundry's not going anywhere.
If you don't get it started today, it's not going to run to
the woods, right? It's still going to be there.
So they're not, and so just. Do that.
Well, thank you, Rachel. Thank you so much for your
encouragement and wisdom. This is so good.
And I do want to make sure that everybody knows exactly where to
find you and all of your amazingresources.
(39:22):
So you can find me over at apology.com and Davis and I do a
podcast. Let's talk home school and
there's other places, but that'swhat we'll go with for today.
I. Love it.
I'm like like Rachel carmen.com so.
Rachelcarbon.com is a thing. I mean, there's stuff over
there. It's like I've had to downshift
too. And so there's always more to do
(39:44):
than you can actually do. And Amen.
Yeah, again, those priorities. Everybody needs to go listen to
our first. Conversation so good.
Well, again, thank you for coming on the show.
I really appreciate you being here and please all of you
listeners know that all of the links for everything we talked
about are going to be found in the show notes.
So make sure you head over to schoolhouserock.com.
(40:07):
That's where you can stream the movie Schoolhouse Rock the
Homeschool Revolution for free and make sure that you are
subscribed to Schoolhouse Rock YouTube channel and follow on
your favorite podcast app. It has been a pleasure to be a
host for you this week on the Schoolhouse Rock podcast and
sweet friends, Before I go, I Want.
(40:28):
Want to make sure that you know about a few tools that I've
created to support you in your homeschool and mom life?
And 1st up is the Homeschool Reset.
It's a free three day mini course designed to help you
declutter your mind, reset your routines, and find more joy in
your homeschool days. So you can grab that anytime at
christyclover.com/reset. And that's also where you're
(40:50):
going to find the link to get a $30 off discount on my
incredible Ultimate Homeschool Organization organization
course. And I'm telling you, it's a
truly life changing course and Icannot recommend it enough.
I have LinkedIn there, all of myhomeschool tips and tricks and
resources. If you want to see all the
curriculum that I've used through the years, that's also
(41:11):
where you'll find links to that.But I am so thrilled to be a
part of your week and I hope that you enjoyed this
conversation. So make sure that you come back
next week for another exciting guest on the Schoolhouse Rock
podcast. Be sure to stay tuned to the and
to hear a preview of what's coming up next on the podcast.
(41:32):
Have a fabulous rest of your week, my friends, and thank you
again for tuning in. See you next time on the
Schoolhouse Rock podcast. You're listening to the Biblical
Family Network. Hey, I'm Miki and I'm Will and
we're the Co host of the CultureProof podcast.
We want to invite you to join usevery week as we discuss what's
(41:53):
happening in the world and then filter those happenings through
a decidedly biblical lens. There are many questions,
especially when we see what's happening in our culture today,
but the answers are found withinthe word of God.
So that's where we want to look.Amen.
When we resist those cultural trends that rival the truth, we
remain culture proof. Hear people talking about the
(42:13):
things. That are really lacking in
today's youth and I know I always feel kind of like an old
lady when I say that like kids these days you know but it's
true and and because we're thereI have these three young.
Adult. Sons.
But then I still have this 15 year old and I cannot deny that
there is a difference in the world he's growing up in and the
(42:33):
world his older brothers grew upin.
So I would say when you look around you and say, what are the
things that are lacking and how can I, as a homeschool mom, I
have this blessing that I've gotmy kids at home around me all
day. How can I take advantage of this
opportunity to give them some ofthese traits that honestly are
going to make them stand out in the world when they go to apply
(42:56):
for a job, when they go to applyfor college, when they are, you
know, building relationships. Some really simple things will
make them stand out. If we can teach our kids to be
thoughtful, to give that eye contact, to be patient.
But I think that focusing on some of the things that God's
Word has to say about what really matters is going to
really be effective in the long run.
(43:17):
Maybe not in one day, but if youcontinue to do that, it does
make an impact.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.