June 10, 2025 • 26 mins
Are you searching for ways to ignite curiosity, character, and a love of learning in your homeschool? In this episode of the Schoolhouse Rocked Podcast, host Cindy West sits down with Jennifer Pepito, veteran homeschooler and author of "Mothering by the Book." Together, they explore the profound impact of living books on homeschool families—even if you don’t embrace a Charlotte Mason approach.
Jennifer shares her personal journey of overcoming fear through reading with her children, the importance of virtue in education, and practical tips for integrating rich literature—whether you're new to living books or a seasoned enthusiast. Learn how living books can transform reluctant readers, spark deep family conversations, and even make daunting subjects like history come alive.
✨ Topics covered:
- What are living books and why do they matter?
- Overcoming homeschool fears with great stories
- Making read-alouds a joyful daily habit (even with audiobooks)
- Building family culture and virtue through shared reading
Don’t miss actionable advice and book list recommendations for building aliterature-rich homeschool—plus tips and free resources for parents who feelnervous about reading aloud!
Recommended Resources:
Guides to delight-led learning
Listen to Jennifer's podcast here
Sponsors:
Apologia is a Christ-centered, award-winning homeschool curriculum provider. Our mission is to help homeschooling students and families learn, live, and defend the Christian faith through our print and digital curriculum and online classes.
BJU Press Homeschool is dedicated to providing homeschool families with academically strong curriculum rooted in a biblical worldview. They offer a complete curriculum from preschool through 12th grade, available in both traditional textbooks and video courses. By teaching through the lens of Christ’s power, they help students view the world through the transformative story of God’s creation
CTCMath specializes in providing online video tutorials that take a multi-sensory approach to learning. Creative graphics and animation, synchronized with the friendly voice of internationally acclaimed teacher, Pat Murray, make learning math easy and effective. Start your free trial today.
The Schoolhouse Rocked Podcast is a member of the Biblical Family Network. Our mission is to support and encourage the family by providing the very best podcasts on family, discipleship, marriage, parenting, worldview, culture, and education, all from a Biblical perspective. Visit the website for more great shows, like the Thinking Dad, Culture Proof, .css-j9qmi7{display:-webkit-box;display:-webkit-flex;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-webkit-flex-direction:row;-ms-flex-direction:row;flex-direction:row;font-weight:700;margin-bottom:1rem;margin-top:2.8rem;width:100%;-webkit-box-pack:start;-ms-flex-pack:start;-webkit-justify-content:start;justify-content:start;padding-left:5rem;}@media only screen and (max-width: 599px){.css-j9qmi7{padding-left:0;-webkit-box-pack:center;-ms-flex-pack:center;-webkit-justify-content:center;justify-content:center;}}.css-j9qmi7 svg{fill:#27292D;}.css-j9qmi7 .eagfbvw0{-webkit-align-items:center;-webkit-box-align:center;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;color:#27292D;}Mark as PlayedTranscript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
It's not rocket science. To read out loud.
To your children and and the. Beauty of it.
Is that we're being. Educated with our children.
The big ideas and the. Love for beauty that comes when.
You feed your. Children a rich diet of
literature and the and the. Books that we read.
And then talk. About together shape our.
Families, hey everyone, and welcome back to the Schoolhouse
(00:21):
Rock podcast. I am your host, Cindy West, and
I am very glad to be back with you again this week with
Jennifer Pepito. But first, I would like to
introduce you to this week's podcast sponsor, Apologia.
If you're looking for a trusted homeschool resource to support
your child's education with a strong biblical worldview, you
(00:41):
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They know that homeschooling isn't A1 size fits all thing.
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(01:02):
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They even offer audiobooks perfect for learning on the go.
Apologia will partner with you and your family's educational
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(01:24):
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Apologia, equipping families, inspiring learners and teaching
truth. All right, welcome to the
podcast, everybody, and welcome back Jennifer Pepito.
She and I chatted last time about habit training in your
(01:48):
home school. And today we're going to take a
little spin into books, living books.
I mentioned last time that she and I both come from an eclectic
Charlotte Mason style of education, but living Books, the
idea of living books isn't just for Charlotte Mason
homeschoolers. So we're going to chat about
(02:08):
that. Jennifer, welcome back.
I would like you to introduce yourself this time through the
lens of another book that you have written titled Mothering by
the Book. How did that one come to be?
Oh, thanks so much, Cindy. I'm so honored to be here.
And yes, I've been homeschoolingfor 27 years.
And mothering by the book was almost like my opus.
(02:31):
It was. About how?
Reading out loud. To my children over many years
of homeschooling helped me overcome fear, and each chapter
in that book features a different living book.
That I read aloud. With my children, we.
Read together and talked about and the ways.
That the. Examples in that.
Book helped. Me overcome a particular fear,
(02:51):
for instance. Reading the book.
Cheaper by the dozen About a family of. 12.
Children and how the father, whowas an efficiency expert,
trained habits in his children and helped me overcome the fear
that I couldn't manage my own growing family or reading a
book. Like Little.
House on the Prairie helped me overcome the fear of not having
(03:12):
enough. So these beautiful books.
Were all collected into this story of my life in so many ways
and the story. Of.
Just some of the fears that had plagued me as a young mom and
living. Books I I adore this.
Topic Cindy, because in our lastepisode we were talking about
virtue. And in my mind, wonderful books.
(03:34):
Is the best way to teach virtue to our?
Children, it's not just about will I give.
My kids a broader. Vocabulary than they would.
Get from workbooks. It's not just about.
Will I make homeschooling more interesting to my children than
I could through just giving them?
Workbooks. It's about virtue, because when
you. Read a story like.
(03:54):
Little britches where the. Father is just this.
Example of diligence and caring for his family and teaching his
son to be honest and. And I mean just.
The the virtue that that father.Showed in that book.
And you read. That that grips.
Our children and it gives them avision.
For how they could be and I I thought about about.
(04:14):
This even in in the light of my missionary journey because we
were missionaries in Mexico for four years and that.
Features big in the. Book mothering by the book.
But we would never. Have had the.
Confidence to be missionaries. If.
We had not been. Reading missionary biographies
and pioneer stories. Out loud to our.
Children. And so in my mind, a living book
(04:35):
shows your children what's possible.
It shows them what? Virtue looks like it shows them
what resilience looks like. It gives them models and heroes
to follow, and that's why I am extremely invested in helping
families choose good. Books because there's a.
Lot of twaddle. Out there unfortunately since.
(04:55):
You know, probably 2021 or so. A lot of modern books slip in
deviant social values that. Most of us as.
Christian families don't share. And and way before that, books
and movies. That were put out.
By more mainstream media or mainstream publishers.
Had values like disrespect for. Parents disrespect for adults.
(05:18):
Personal pleasure and personal satisfaction above the virtue of
loving, loving others or or loving God you know and.
So there's. Such an importance on what we
bring to our. Table to serve our.
Children in terms of. Ideas.
In terms of values. In terms of virtue.
And so you know. Choosing the best.
(05:39):
Books, living books. And there's a term that's often
used in Charlotte Mason. Circles that they.
Call some books twaddle and twaddle would refer to.
It's funny even CS. Lewis used that.
Book. I'm reading his.
Biography. Surprised by joy?
Right now, his autobiography. And he even used that word.
Twaddle. To refer.
(06:00):
To poor quality. Books.
Books that have. A lot of dialogue.
Books that do not. Exemplify virtue books that are
anti hero or. Lacking A redemptive storyline,
and sometimes it takes. Some practice to identify
twaddle. But I think it's really
important. For us as as.
Families to. Identify because our children.
(06:20):
They need to be given. Beautiful ideas like CS.
Lewis the way that. He was able to write such.
Deep and beautiful works. And you know, Mere Christianity
and the the out of the Silent Planet and the Narnia.
Series which we. Use in the kind Kingdom and the
peaceful press those kinds of. Books.
Came from him reading. All the classics.
(06:42):
Reading, you know, and, and and you know, reading deeply and
widely. And so then he was able to.
Produce those kinds of. Works.
I love it. I love it.
You know, if there is one thing,there are a couple of
foundational things that I standon in homeschooling, and one of
those is this idea of living books.
(07:04):
Today is not my day for testimony, but if I had a
testimony to give, I would testify about the change that
Living Books made in our home school.
The wonder that it brought, the the encouragement that it
brought, the academics that it brought.
And like you just mentioned, thecharacter training, the the
(07:26):
ability to believe in yourself, the ability to believe that you
can do big things. All of those things can come
easily through Living Books, andI'm so glad you mentioned that.
But I think we need to, we know we're not necessarily talking to
a Charlotte Mason audience today.
So how can we, how can we help folks who don't necessarily
(07:50):
continually incorporate Living Books into their curriculum?
How can we help them to maybe dothat here and there practically
so that they can experience the beauty and joy and awesomeness
of Living? Books.
Yeah, I think just making a readaloud habit in your family.
You know whether you. Homeschool Charlotte Mason or or
(08:13):
not? There are a lot of.
Studies that suggest and confirm.
That reading aloud as a family has.
Many benefits and so just makingit a habit you could read 1
chapter a day and if. You if you can't read out loud.
Just put. It on an audio book like if.
You as a family could make a commitment to just sit together
in the evenings or sit together in the morning.
Listen to 1. Chapter at a time of a living
(08:35):
book. There'd be so many benefits to
your children. Their vocabulary would expand.
My kids. All scored.
Really well on the SAT in that, in that area of learning.
Because of all the books we'd read out.
Loud and you can't. Get that through workbooks or
vocabulary studies you can't get.
That depth of ideas without. Books and so and and and
(08:56):
particularly good books. Quality books and.
You know, there's so many, there's so many lists.
Available. My website, The Peaceful.
Press.com I know Cindy. You have lists, I'm.
Sure, that schoolhouse rocked. Has amazing list and so you know
finding those. Lists to go through as a.
Family is just going to bring somuch connection, like a lot of
our family identity also comes from these books.
(09:18):
That we've shared, you know these stories that we've.
Shared I remember one day we were we we'd left my son to.
Babysit the two younger siblings.
He was, maybe. 14 and we came home and my husband didn't know
where they were. He he found them sitting in our
tree Fort and he. Was reading Tolstoy to.
His younger siblings and, you know, just the.
(09:41):
The big ideas. And the love for?
Beauty that comes when you feed your children a rich diet of
literature and the and the. Books that we read.
And then talk about. Together shape our families.
Yeah. So I love that whether you're
beginning to introduce the idea of living books or you're now
beginning to think about it, theidea of just putting on an audio
(10:05):
book, because some people are afraid to dive into these books.
They are full of such rich vocabulary that sometimes it's
difficult to just hand them overto a child who is learning to
read or not reading super well. And sometimes parents can be
very fearful of the idea of reading aloud.
So an audio book is a great place to start.
(10:26):
I can't tell you how many years you guys, we went with nothing
in our car on except the audio book that we were currently
listening to. Years and years and years.
And my kids have such good memories about that.
We don't, we don't regret those moments going to guitar lessons
and doctor's visits and all the places we go as homeschooling
(10:47):
families with a book in our ear.So but let's go to the idea of
we want to get beyond an audio book.
But mom is a little afraid. She or dad or whoever is
homeschooling, they are a littleafraid to actually read aloud.
They don't feel confident in it.What advice do you have for
them? Yeah, I think you just have to
make it a habit. And this should really.
(11:09):
Start with your preschoolers. Of just reading simple fun books
like Miss Rumpheus. Or Roxbox.
And some oxcart man, there's so many beautiful picture books and
when you've made it a practice in.
Early childhood with picture. Books and it's easy to
transition to reading chapter books, but I think you know.
Choose books that are. Interesting for.
You to read. Out loud and you know, in the
(11:29):
peaceful press curriculum. We choose.
Books that are. Fun to read out loud.
They they, yes, they teach virtue.
Yes, they have. Beautiful.
Characters, but they're not going to bore.
You to. Tears to read them, I think.
That's one thing that's maybe 'cause some people to.
Burn out on a Charlotte Mason style homeschooling or
literature based homeschooling is when they're trying to read.
The list that maybe? Was being read in the 1800s or
(11:52):
something and and. Those books are still valuable,
but there are. Some books that might be
slightly more engaging that can also teach those same concepts,
you know, there could be a. Geography textbook that you're.
Slogging your way through. Or you could read the.
The hauling Sea hauling. Books about you.
Know men of the. Mississippi about a turtle.
(12:12):
Going through the Mississippi River and all the the lakes and
experiences that he had, you know, you could.
Read even sometimes history. Textbooks like for instance.
A lot of people read story of the.
World or mystery? Of history.
Those are great history resources.
But you could just as easily read books about the.
Time, you know, read the count. Of boobasties or read.
(12:34):
Detectives and togas or read, you know, the Little House on
the Prairie if you're. Studying American pioneers Read
across 5. April's if you're studying this,
the civil. War.
Read The Freedom Train. There's so many, really.
Beautiful books that you could read.
And then do some timeline work or do some.
Geography work. To tie it together.
Instead of spending a lot of time reading things that.
(12:56):
That bore you to tears. Honestly, and even the.
Bible like if you're a. Christian family listening.
You should be reading the Bible to your children every day.
It's going to be more impactful for them if you have not.
Just read it to. Yourself, but also.
Read it to them and then you guys, you know, you can read it,
you can talk about it, but you don't even have to talk.
About just read it, let them. Absorb the content.
(13:18):
But you know, if you make these small simple.
Practices a simple practice of. Reading.
Even just a Bible verse or a Psalm, that's one of the things
that. I talk about inhabits for a
sacred home. The Benedictines read the.
Whole 150 Psalms. Every.
Week I think it was. It was like intense like many
(13:38):
psalms a day even. But as modern Christian families
just read 1 Psalm a day for yourchildren.
Just start small. But start because it's.
It's not. Rocket science to read.
Out loud to your children and and the beauty of it, Cindy, is
that we're being. Educated with our children.
You know, the holes in our education from not having a lot
(13:59):
of literature or not having, youknow, engaging stories, the
holes in. Our education is.
Overcome as we're reading out loud to our children.
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That's ctcmath.com. OK, so Jennifer, right before we
(15:25):
stopped you said the holes in our own education are being
filled as we read living books with our kids.
I want a million percent can attest to that.
I will also say that for years of growing up, I absolutely
hated the subject of history. I hated it.
(15:45):
I thought it was terrible. I thought it was boring.
And so I started reading living books in history to my children,
with my children. We were listening to some in the
car and all of a sudden I'm going, wowza.
History is a pretty cool thing. And it was the living books that
(16:06):
put me in the place and in the time to understand the
significance of what was happening and the order in which
it happened, where all of a sudden I was opened up to the
world. That history was not at all
boring. And it was very cool.
And it actually became one of mymore favorite subjects to teach
in all of my home schooling. Absolutely, yeah.
(16:28):
Same here and for. My children as well.
Because. When you teach history.
Through. Stories.
It comes alive. One of my son.
'S favorite books is. Unbroken.
And then he's. Also read Louis Zamperini's
autobiography. The devil at my.
Heels, which beautifully shows the.
Journey of. Faith that he took.
And so when you. Read books like that.
(16:49):
It it makes everything more vivid.
My son was interested then. To learn more about.
The Pacific theater during WorldWar 2.
And. To learn more about the events
and the characters and and who was in charge during that time.
But when you just. Read a textbook, it kind of
goes. In one ear, not the.
Other and so these. Stories, they really.
Make history come alive for us. You know, we're talking about
(17:12):
reading and incorporating some living books, even if it's just
15 minutes before bed or 15 minutes to start the day after
you have your Bible time or something.
I have found that reading and listening to good literature
translate incredibly well to writing.
(17:36):
Have you found that as well? Absolutely.
And it's interesting. I like I said, I'm reading about
CS Lewis right now and in his last.
Few years of high. School that's.
All he did was. Read.
And then he was able to, you know, graduate.
With a triple. Degree from Oxford.
But what he was? Doing was reading, reading,
reading and then having to discuss.
It that. He had a tutor during those
(17:58):
years. Who was very.
Interested in making sure he knew what he believed and why.
And so he. Wasn't allowed to just say oh, I
thought the book. Was interesting, like he had to
sort of give an A case and. The book hero.
Education by Oliver DeMille. Talks a lot about this way of.
Teaching our children. Where we read books.
(18:18):
Together and we talk about it and as you are narrating,
that's. Just the art of.
Telling back what you. Read or writing down what was
read. To you as you do that as you.
Summarize and narrate and. Discuss what was read.
Then your writing skills improvebecause you're you're taking in
the. Best of.
Writing, and then you're expressing it yourself in your
(18:40):
own. Words you're you're summarizing,
you're rephrasing, but it's. Coming out with more vocabulary
and you're looking at like. I just read a book.
By Sarah Clarkson. Sally Clarkson's daughter who
was educated in the UKI think it's Saint Andrew's.
But her writing has so many. More words than a lot of modern
(19:01):
like Christian non fiction and you can tell.
That she both. Read a lot and then was in a
culture where where reading and and words were important.
So it's like the the broadness of vocabulary creates more depth
in in what you're learning. Absolutely.
I have found that so much that that books are actually how I
(19:21):
chose to teach my children how to write.
I had them watch over years and years, but then in particular
master authors and I had them just replicate.
And that replication often started through storytelling or
narration or oral telling of stories and then transitioned
right into writing. So you know, for folks who are
(19:44):
like, OK, maybe we'll read a little bit of of a living
literature. I hope that we have helped you
through this to understand that this is this is something that
could be pretty cool in to all different kinds of subject areas
if you will give good books a chance.
Have you found that reading books with your children?
(20:06):
I know you mentioned that it is something that your entire
family culture, everyone has memories around those.
I will say the same for my family.
Can you remember any times wherea book prompted some kind of
amazing discussion? That otherwise you might not
have had or you might have been.It might have felt a little
(20:29):
weird to have that discussion. Can you think of an example?
Absolutely. I mean, I especially can
remember when we were doing the kind Kingdom, which is.
The peaceful press. European history resource.
We read the Narnia. Books out loud.
And several times. Over that year.
We had amazing discussions. You know, reading the.
Last Battle. And at the same time, we were
(20:50):
studying the Cold War and communism and just seeing.
How there was? So many twisting of.
Ideas. And twisting of thoughts and and
so much duplicity and. Treachery.
Really. And you can see that both in the
culture of communism as well as in the book The Last Battle.
So, so many beautiful conversations came out of that.
(21:11):
And then reading the Voyage of the Dawn Treader and.
And there's the scene where I've.
Said this on several. Podcasts.
This the scene in the book. Where we be cheap.
Is saying like, even if my boat sinks, I will continue, you
know? Eastward towards Aslan like
there was this. Hunger and we.
Be cheap. Forgot basically.
And so. As we read that.
(21:31):
Our you know, our hearts were moved and.
Stirred. As well so our faith.
Was strengthened through these books we're reading and it was
interesting. Also in the CS Lewis book I'm
reading. How he?
Said he was. Turned off to God.
His heart had been hardened to God, but he.
Read a book. By George MacDonald And there
was. Just a spark of faith that that.
(21:52):
Then became the foundation, in some sense, of his renewal or
his probably. His.
First time with faith because I don't think he ever really had.
Faith as a child. Awesome.
I can tell you all the way from toddlers to teenagers living
books have sparked amazing discussions and amazing
opportunities to maybe highlightsome character flaws without
(22:14):
necessarily having to point out a character flaw, if you know
what I mean. You somebody to to notice
something in a book and go, oh wow, that's familiar.
Maybe I ought to think about that.
I've noticed that happened many times over to SO.
Anyway, Jennifer, thank you for being with us again.
Could you please remind us whereto find you and where to find
(22:35):
mothering by the book? Yes, if.
You go to the peaceful press dot.
Com you can find all my resources linked.
You can also connect with me more personally on my Instagram,
Jennifer. Pepito or the peaceful press?
OK, awesome. Thank you so much for joining
us. These have been excellent
discussions. If you had one book you wanted
(22:56):
to suggest or one author that you're like start with this one,
which one would you suggest? Yeah, it's really hard.
There's several that. Came through my head, you know,
for family. Just getting started with
reading aloud. I would say the.
Little House on the Prairie books or Barbara Cooney picture.
Books. If you.
Are you know, as a family wanting to deepen your faith.
The Chronicles of Narnia is a beautiful.
(23:16):
Series to read aloud. And then as a mother, books by
Elizabeth Gooch have really, really shaped my faith in many.
Ways and highlighted just. The beauty of holiness, The
beauty of. Of.
A life in Christ. Okay, awesome.
Jennifer and I both hope that you will go and start reading
some awesome living literature with your kids and you guys can
(23:38):
find me at ourjourneywestward.com.
I am also Missus Cindy of the NoSweat Nature Study podcast and
the No Sweat Nature Study science classes.
You can find me over there too. Thanks for joining us today.
I hope you'll TuneIn next week for another great episode of the
Schoolhouse Rocked podcast. You're listening to the Biblical
(24:04):
Family network. Hey, I'm Miki and I'm will and
we're the Co host of the cultureproof podcast.
We want to invite you to join usevery week as we discuss what's
happening in the world and then filter those happenings through
a decidedly biblical lens. There are many questions,
especially when we see what's happening in our culture today,
but the answers are found withinthe Word of God, so that's where
(24:25):
we want to look. Amen.
When we resist those cultural trends that rival the truth.
We remain culture proof. It feels like whiplash for
people because they're like wait, Greta's posting like
pictures of the Hummingbird in her backyard laying eggs and net
building her nest and then fightporn like what is?
Going on. With this woman.
(24:46):
But I think there's actually a really important lesson there
because what I try to encourage parents to do is to say that
pornography and talking to your kids about it shouldn't be this
big, looming, dark, overwhelmingthing that we have to sit down
and have this terribly frightening talk with our kids.
(25:08):
Instead, it should be like, hey,wow, look at this beautiful nest
that that this Hummingbird is making and that she's built it
with her beak. Like, isn't that incredible?
God's design? And wow, just like he designed
our bodies, every part of our bodies for a purpose, and our
bodies are made in his image. And Oh, yeah, remember we talked
(25:28):
about pornography, and it's something that is bad, and it
takes and distorts God's good things.
Well, yeah, I just want you to remember that.
So it sounds crazy to juxtapose those two things.
But really, when we normalize the conversation of pornography
with our kids, it becomes less scary.
It takes away the power of pornography and instead gives
(25:51):
the power back to God, which he has the power anyways, right?
It's not rocket science. To read out loud.
To your children and and the. Beauty of it.
Is that we're being. Educated with our children.
The big ideas and the. Love for beauty that comes when.
You feed your. Children a rich diet of
literature and the and the. Books that we read.
And then talk. About together shape our.
Families, hey everyone, and welcome back to the Schoolhouse
(00:21):
Rock podcast. I am your host, Cindy West, and
I am very glad to be back with you again this week with
Jennifer Pepito. But first, I would like to
introduce you to this week's podcast sponsor, Apologia.
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truth. All right, welcome to the
podcast, everybody, and welcome back Jennifer Pepito.
She and I chatted last time about habit training in your
(01:48):
home school. And today we're going to take a
little spin into books, living books.
I mentioned last time that she and I both come from an eclectic
Charlotte Mason style of education, but living Books, the
idea of living books isn't just for Charlotte Mason
homeschoolers. So we're going to chat about
(02:08):
that. Jennifer, welcome back.
I would like you to introduce yourself this time through the
lens of another book that you have written titled Mothering by
the Book. How did that one come to be?
Oh, thanks so much, Cindy. I'm so honored to be here.
And yes, I've been homeschoolingfor 27 years.
And mothering by the book was almost like my opus.
(02:31):
It was. About how?
Reading out loud. To my children over many years
of homeschooling helped me overcome fear, and each chapter
in that book features a different living book.
That I read aloud. With my children, we.
Read together and talked about and the ways.
That the. Examples in that.
Book helped. Me overcome a particular fear,
(02:51):
for instance. Reading the book.
Cheaper by the dozen About a family of. 12.
Children and how the father, whowas an efficiency expert,
trained habits in his children and helped me overcome the fear
that I couldn't manage my own growing family or reading a
book. Like Little.
House on the Prairie helped me overcome the fear of not having
(03:12):
enough. So these beautiful books.
Were all collected into this story of my life in so many ways
and the story. Of.
Just some of the fears that had plagued me as a young mom and
living. Books I I adore this.
Topic Cindy, because in our lastepisode we were talking about
virtue. And in my mind, wonderful books.
(03:34):
Is the best way to teach virtue to our?
Children, it's not just about will I give.
My kids a broader. Vocabulary than they would.
Get from workbooks. It's not just about.
Will I make homeschooling more interesting to my children than
I could through just giving them?
Workbooks. It's about virtue, because when
you. Read a story like.
(03:54):
Little britches where the. Father is just this.
Example of diligence and caring for his family and teaching his
son to be honest and. And I mean just.
The the virtue that that father.Showed in that book.
And you read. That that grips.
Our children and it gives them avision.
For how they could be and I I thought about about.
(04:14):
This even in in the light of my missionary journey because we
were missionaries in Mexico for four years and that.
Features big in the. Book mothering by the book.
But we would never. Have had the.
Confidence to be missionaries. If.
We had not been. Reading missionary biographies
and pioneer stories. Out loud to our.
Children. And so in my mind, a living book
(04:35):
shows your children what's possible.
It shows them what? Virtue looks like it shows them
what resilience looks like. It gives them models and heroes
to follow, and that's why I am extremely invested in helping
families choose good. Books because there's a.
Lot of twaddle. Out there unfortunately since.
(04:55):
You know, probably 2021 or so. A lot of modern books slip in
deviant social values that. Most of us as.
Christian families don't share. And and way before that, books
and movies. That were put out.
By more mainstream media or mainstream publishers.
Had values like disrespect for. Parents disrespect for adults.
(05:18):
Personal pleasure and personal satisfaction above the virtue of
loving, loving others or or loving God you know and.
So there's. Such an importance on what we
bring to our. Table to serve our.
Children in terms of. Ideas.
In terms of values. In terms of virtue.
And so you know. Choosing the best.
(05:39):
Books, living books. And there's a term that's often
used in Charlotte Mason. Circles that they.
Call some books twaddle and twaddle would refer to.
It's funny even CS. Lewis used that.
Book. I'm reading his.
Biography. Surprised by joy?
Right now, his autobiography. And he even used that word.
Twaddle. To refer.
(06:00):
To poor quality. Books.
Books that have. A lot of dialogue.
Books that do not. Exemplify virtue books that are
anti hero or. Lacking A redemptive storyline,
and sometimes it takes. Some practice to identify
twaddle. But I think it's really
important. For us as as.
Families to. Identify because our children.
(06:20):
They need to be given. Beautiful ideas like CS.
Lewis the way that. He was able to write such.
Deep and beautiful works. And you know, Mere Christianity
and the the out of the Silent Planet and the Narnia.
Series which we. Use in the kind Kingdom and the
peaceful press those kinds of. Books.
Came from him reading. All the classics.
(06:42):
Reading, you know, and, and and you know, reading deeply and
widely. And so then he was able to.
Produce those kinds of. Works.
I love it. I love it.
You know, if there is one thing,there are a couple of
foundational things that I standon in homeschooling, and one of
those is this idea of living books.
(07:04):
Today is not my day for testimony, but if I had a
testimony to give, I would testify about the change that
Living Books made in our home school.
The wonder that it brought, the the encouragement that it
brought, the academics that it brought.
And like you just mentioned, thecharacter training, the the
(07:26):
ability to believe in yourself, the ability to believe that you
can do big things. All of those things can come
easily through Living Books, andI'm so glad you mentioned that.
But I think we need to, we know we're not necessarily talking to
a Charlotte Mason audience today.
So how can we, how can we help folks who don't necessarily
(07:50):
continually incorporate Living Books into their curriculum?
How can we help them to maybe dothat here and there practically
so that they can experience the beauty and joy and awesomeness
of Living? Books.
Yeah, I think just making a readaloud habit in your family.
You know whether you. Homeschool Charlotte Mason or or
(08:13):
not? There are a lot of.
Studies that suggest and confirm.
That reading aloud as a family has.
Many benefits and so just makingit a habit you could read 1
chapter a day and if. You if you can't read out loud.
Just put. It on an audio book like if.
You as a family could make a commitment to just sit together
in the evenings or sit together in the morning.
Listen to 1. Chapter at a time of a living
(08:35):
book. There'd be so many benefits to
your children. Their vocabulary would expand.
My kids. All scored.
Really well on the SAT in that, in that area of learning.
Because of all the books we'd read out.
Loud and you can't. Get that through workbooks or
vocabulary studies you can't get.
That depth of ideas without. Books and so and and and
(08:56):
particularly good books. Quality books and.
You know, there's so many, there's so many lists.
Available. My website, The Peaceful.
Press.com I know Cindy. You have lists, I'm.
Sure, that schoolhouse rocked. Has amazing list and so you know
finding those. Lists to go through as a.
Family is just going to bring somuch connection, like a lot of
our family identity also comes from these books.
(09:18):
That we've shared, you know these stories that we've.
Shared I remember one day we were we we'd left my son to.
Babysit the two younger siblings.
He was, maybe. 14 and we came home and my husband didn't know
where they were. He he found them sitting in our
tree Fort and he. Was reading Tolstoy to.
His younger siblings and, you know, just the.
(09:41):
The big ideas. And the love for?
Beauty that comes when you feed your children a rich diet of
literature and the and the. Books that we read.
And then talk about. Together shape our families.
Yeah. So I love that whether you're
beginning to introduce the idea of living books or you're now
beginning to think about it, theidea of just putting on an audio
(10:05):
book, because some people are afraid to dive into these books.
They are full of such rich vocabulary that sometimes it's
difficult to just hand them overto a child who is learning to
read or not reading super well. And sometimes parents can be
very fearful of the idea of reading aloud.
So an audio book is a great place to start.
(10:26):
I can't tell you how many years you guys, we went with nothing
in our car on except the audio book that we were currently
listening to. Years and years and years.
And my kids have such good memories about that.
We don't, we don't regret those moments going to guitar lessons
and doctor's visits and all the places we go as homeschooling
(10:47):
families with a book in our ear.So but let's go to the idea of
we want to get beyond an audio book.
But mom is a little afraid. She or dad or whoever is
homeschooling, they are a littleafraid to actually read aloud.
They don't feel confident in it.What advice do you have for
them? Yeah, I think you just have to
make it a habit. And this should really.
(11:09):
Start with your preschoolers. Of just reading simple fun books
like Miss Rumpheus. Or Roxbox.
And some oxcart man, there's so many beautiful picture books and
when you've made it a practice in.
Early childhood with picture. Books and it's easy to
transition to reading chapter books, but I think you know.
Choose books that are. Interesting for.
You to read. Out loud and you know, in the
(11:29):
peaceful press curriculum. We choose.
Books that are. Fun to read out loud.
They they, yes, they teach virtue.
Yes, they have. Beautiful.
Characters, but they're not going to bore.
You to. Tears to read them, I think.
That's one thing that's maybe 'cause some people to.
Burn out on a Charlotte Mason style homeschooling or
literature based homeschooling is when they're trying to read.
The list that maybe? Was being read in the 1800s or
(11:52):
something and and. Those books are still valuable,
but there are. Some books that might be
slightly more engaging that can also teach those same concepts,
you know, there could be a. Geography textbook that you're.
Slogging your way through. Or you could read the.
The hauling Sea hauling. Books about you.
Know men of the. Mississippi about a turtle.
(12:12):
Going through the Mississippi River and all the the lakes and
experiences that he had, you know, you could.
Read even sometimes history. Textbooks like for instance.
A lot of people read story of the.
World or mystery? Of history.
Those are great history resources.
But you could just as easily read books about the.
Time, you know, read the count. Of boobasties or read.
(12:34):
Detectives and togas or read, you know, the Little House on
the Prairie if you're. Studying American pioneers Read
across 5. April's if you're studying this,
the civil. War.
Read The Freedom Train. There's so many, really.
Beautiful books that you could read.
And then do some timeline work or do some.
Geography work. To tie it together.
Instead of spending a lot of time reading things that.
(12:56):
That bore you to tears. Honestly, and even the.
Bible like if you're a. Christian family listening.
You should be reading the Bible to your children every day.
It's going to be more impactful for them if you have not.
Just read it to. Yourself, but also.
Read it to them and then you guys, you know, you can read it,
you can talk about it, but you don't even have to talk.
About just read it, let them. Absorb the content.
(13:18):
But you know, if you make these small simple.
Practices a simple practice of. Reading.
Even just a Bible verse or a Psalm, that's one of the things
that. I talk about inhabits for a
sacred home. The Benedictines read the.
Whole 150 Psalms. Every.
Week I think it was. It was like intense like many
(13:38):
psalms a day even. But as modern Christian families
just read 1 Psalm a day for yourchildren.
Just start small. But start because it's.
It's not. Rocket science to read.
Out loud to your children and and the beauty of it, Cindy, is
that we're being. Educated with our children.
You know, the holes in our education from not having a lot
(13:59):
of literature or not having, youknow, engaging stories, the
holes in. Our education is.
Overcome as we're reading out loud to our children.
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That's ctcmath.com. OK, so Jennifer, right before we
(15:25):
stopped you said the holes in our own education are being
filled as we read living books with our kids.
I want a million percent can attest to that.
I will also say that for years of growing up, I absolutely
hated the subject of history. I hated it.
(15:45):
I thought it was terrible. I thought it was boring.
And so I started reading living books in history to my children,
with my children. We were listening to some in the
car and all of a sudden I'm going, wowza.
History is a pretty cool thing. And it was the living books that
(16:06):
put me in the place and in the time to understand the
significance of what was happening and the order in which
it happened, where all of a sudden I was opened up to the
world. That history was not at all
boring. And it was very cool.
And it actually became one of mymore favorite subjects to teach
in all of my home schooling. Absolutely, yeah.
(16:28):
Same here and for. My children as well.
Because. When you teach history.
Through. Stories.
It comes alive. One of my son.
'S favorite books is. Unbroken.
And then he's. Also read Louis Zamperini's
autobiography. The devil at my.
Heels, which beautifully shows the.
Journey of. Faith that he took.
And so when you. Read books like that.
(16:49):
It it makes everything more vivid.
My son was interested then. To learn more about.
The Pacific theater during WorldWar 2.
And. To learn more about the events
and the characters and and who was in charge during that time.
But when you just. Read a textbook, it kind of
goes. In one ear, not the.
Other and so these. Stories, they really.
Make history come alive for us. You know, we're talking about
(17:12):
reading and incorporating some living books, even if it's just
15 minutes before bed or 15 minutes to start the day after
you have your Bible time or something.
I have found that reading and listening to good literature
translate incredibly well to writing.
(17:36):
Have you found that as well? Absolutely.
And it's interesting. I like I said, I'm reading about
CS Lewis right now and in his last.
Few years of high. School that's.
All he did was. Read.
And then he was able to, you know, graduate.
With a triple. Degree from Oxford.
But what he was? Doing was reading, reading,
reading and then having to discuss.
It that. He had a tutor during those
(17:58):
years. Who was very.
Interested in making sure he knew what he believed and why.
And so he. Wasn't allowed to just say oh, I
thought the book. Was interesting, like he had to
sort of give an A case and. The book hero.
Education by Oliver DeMille. Talks a lot about this way of.
Teaching our children. Where we read books.
(18:18):
Together and we talk about it and as you are narrating,
that's. Just the art of.
Telling back what you. Read or writing down what was
read. To you as you do that as you.
Summarize and narrate and. Discuss what was read.
Then your writing skills improvebecause you're you're taking in
the. Best of.
Writing, and then you're expressing it yourself in your
(18:40):
own. Words you're you're summarizing,
you're rephrasing, but it's. Coming out with more vocabulary
and you're looking at like. I just read a book.
By Sarah Clarkson. Sally Clarkson's daughter who
was educated in the UKI think it's Saint Andrew's.
But her writing has so many. More words than a lot of modern
(19:01):
like Christian non fiction and you can tell.
That she both. Read a lot and then was in a
culture where where reading and and words were important.
So it's like the the broadness of vocabulary creates more depth
in in what you're learning. Absolutely.
I have found that so much that that books are actually how I
(19:21):
chose to teach my children how to write.
I had them watch over years and years, but then in particular
master authors and I had them just replicate.
And that replication often started through storytelling or
narration or oral telling of stories and then transitioned
right into writing. So you know, for folks who are
(19:44):
like, OK, maybe we'll read a little bit of of a living
literature. I hope that we have helped you
through this to understand that this is this is something that
could be pretty cool in to all different kinds of subject areas
if you will give good books a chance.
Have you found that reading books with your children?
(20:06):
I know you mentioned that it is something that your entire
family culture, everyone has memories around those.
I will say the same for my family.
Can you remember any times wherea book prompted some kind of
amazing discussion? That otherwise you might not
have had or you might have been.It might have felt a little
(20:29):
weird to have that discussion. Can you think of an example?
Absolutely. I mean, I especially can
remember when we were doing the kind Kingdom, which is.
The peaceful press. European history resource.
We read the Narnia. Books out loud.
And several times. Over that year.
We had amazing discussions. You know, reading the.
Last Battle. And at the same time, we were
(20:50):
studying the Cold War and communism and just seeing.
How there was? So many twisting of.
Ideas. And twisting of thoughts and and
so much duplicity and. Treachery.
Really. And you can see that both in the
culture of communism as well as in the book The Last Battle.
So, so many beautiful conversations came out of that.
(21:11):
And then reading the Voyage of the Dawn Treader and.
And there's the scene where I've.
Said this on several. Podcasts.
This the scene in the book. Where we be cheap.
Is saying like, even if my boat sinks, I will continue, you
know? Eastward towards Aslan like
there was this. Hunger and we.
Be cheap. Forgot basically.
And so. As we read that.
(21:31):
Our you know, our hearts were moved and.
Stirred. As well so our faith.
Was strengthened through these books we're reading and it was
interesting. Also in the CS Lewis book I'm
reading. How he?
Said he was. Turned off to God.
His heart had been hardened to God, but he.
Read a book. By George MacDonald And there
was. Just a spark of faith that that.
(21:52):
Then became the foundation, in some sense, of his renewal or
his probably. His.
First time with faith because I don't think he ever really had.
Faith as a child. Awesome.
I can tell you all the way from toddlers to teenagers living
books have sparked amazing discussions and amazing
opportunities to maybe highlightsome character flaws without
(22:14):
necessarily having to point out a character flaw, if you know
what I mean. You somebody to to notice
something in a book and go, oh wow, that's familiar.
Maybe I ought to think about that.
I've noticed that happened many times over to SO.
Anyway, Jennifer, thank you for being with us again.
Could you please remind us whereto find you and where to find
(22:35):
mothering by the book? Yes, if.
You go to the peaceful press dot.
Com you can find all my resources linked.
You can also connect with me more personally on my Instagram,
Jennifer. Pepito or the peaceful press?
OK, awesome. Thank you so much for joining
us. These have been excellent
discussions. If you had one book you wanted
(22:56):
to suggest or one author that you're like start with this one,
which one would you suggest? Yeah, it's really hard.
There's several that. Came through my head, you know,
for family. Just getting started with
reading aloud. I would say the.
Little House on the Prairie books or Barbara Cooney picture.
Books. If you.
Are you know, as a family wanting to deepen your faith.
The Chronicles of Narnia is a beautiful.
(23:16):
Series to read aloud. And then as a mother, books by
Elizabeth Gooch have really, really shaped my faith in many.
Ways and highlighted just. The beauty of holiness, The
beauty of. Of.
A life in Christ. Okay, awesome.
Jennifer and I both hope that you will go and start reading
some awesome living literature with your kids and you guys can
(23:38):
find me at ourjourneywestward.com.
I am also Missus Cindy of the NoSweat Nature Study podcast and
the No Sweat Nature Study science classes.
You can find me over there too. Thanks for joining us today.
I hope you'll TuneIn next week for another great episode of the
Schoolhouse Rocked podcast. You're listening to the Biblical
(24:04):
Family network. Hey, I'm Miki and I'm will and
we're the Co host of the cultureproof podcast.
We want to invite you to join usevery week as we discuss what's
happening in the world and then filter those happenings through
a decidedly biblical lens. There are many questions,
especially when we see what's happening in our culture today,
but the answers are found withinthe Word of God, so that's where
(24:25):
we want to look. Amen.
When we resist those cultural trends that rival the truth.
We remain culture proof. It feels like whiplash for
people because they're like wait, Greta's posting like
pictures of the Hummingbird in her backyard laying eggs and net
building her nest and then fightporn like what is?
Going on. With this woman.
(24:46):
But I think there's actually a really important lesson there
because what I try to encourage parents to do is to say that
pornography and talking to your kids about it shouldn't be this
big, looming, dark, overwhelmingthing that we have to sit down
and have this terribly frightening talk with our kids.
(25:08):
Instead, it should be like, hey,wow, look at this beautiful nest
that that this Hummingbird is making and that she's built it
with her beak. Like, isn't that incredible?
God's design? And wow, just like he designed
our bodies, every part of our bodies for a purpose, and our
bodies are made in his image. And Oh, yeah, remember we talked
(25:28):
about pornography, and it's something that is bad, and it
takes and distorts God's good things.
Well, yeah, I just want you to remember that.
So it sounds crazy to juxtapose those two things.
But really, when we normalize the conversation of pornography
with our kids, it becomes less scary.
It takes away the power of pornography and instead gives
(25:51):
the power back to God, which he has the power anyways, right?
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