Welcome back to The Big Life! This episode dives into the rollercoaster of emotions experienced on senior night, as Jordyn reflects on the bittersweet moments and unexpected feelings that came with it. Join us as we explore the highs and lows of being a college athlete, the impact of roster decisions, and the changing landscape of college soccer.
We also discuss major news in women's soccer, including the NWSL's groundbreaking decision to eliminate the college draft. What does this mean for future players, and how will it reshape the path to professional soccer? Listen in as we analyze the potential impacts, from college athletes' decisions to turn pro to the future structure of women's soccer leagues.
Plus, get the latest updates on Michigan State's upcoming games and exciting matches in the Swedish Domos Vonsken league. Whether you're a college soccer enthusiast or curious about the evolving world of women's sports, this episode is packed with insights and stories you won't want to miss!
Remember to tune into Big Ten Plus, ESPN Plus, and other streaming networks for live college soccer action. Thanks for listening, and stay tuned for more from The Big Life!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
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Hi, everyone, and welcome back to The Big Life.
Jordan, the list of our topics are next to me right now, and I am so excited
(01:11):
to get into a dialogue about all of this, but my biggest question I think of
the day, how was senior night?
It was emotional. I think it was emotional for reasons that were expected and
some reasons that were unexpected.
You know, third game of the season, it is quite soon in the season to have a
(01:32):
senior night to kind of honor what's supposed to be the end.
But yeah, a lot of tears were shed between me and my mom. You know,
my whole family was there. So it was nice. It was a special night. It was very emotional.
It, you know, and I think we'll get into it a little bit later about maybe some
of the reasons it was emotional that were unexpected.
But my teammates, inspired by you and Iowa, they had written letters this year.
(01:57):
And I got through maybe three sentences of my first letter before I just turned
into a puddle before the game.
And I was like, okay, I need to save these.
So I couldn't read them until after the game. And.
It was the nicest thing ever, I think. And it was so amazing because to have
these people that I think just change your life and you so desperately are trying
(02:18):
to hang on to and just to have that gratitude and those expressions in words
and in writing that I get to keep forever,
I think was such a special moment. And I definitely shed a lot of tears over that.
And although it's not the end and I'm not saying goodbye yet,
it does kind of, you know, bring about those that sadness of the reality that
(02:38):
I'm eventually going to.
But I think that's may just be like one of the hardest things I'm going to have
to do because I think they, you know, this group of girls and these teammates
and my roommates and these friends and this life I created at Michigan State,
it may just be like the best thing that's ever happened to me.
And I'm even the idea of saying goodbye is so emotional.
So it was it was a moment I just yeah
(02:58):
no it makes total sense if anything I mean
hey if this podcast has done one thing I'm happy that that Iowa tradition
went to Michigan State because I remember opening my
letters and I still have them honestly
like I probably will bring them back to Sweden in January just
because like you said like you know your relationships
and you know in your heart but like when you have it written down
(03:20):
and people took time to do that for you
it hits hits different so I'm glad that you
got that experience because it definitely that's the biggest thing
I'll ever remember from my senior night oh yeah yeah
it was really nice and with that though there's
some big hits this weekend senior nights all over
but a couple other major things that happened in the big life so let's go to
(03:43):
big moments in the big life all right let's get it going with UCLA center back
Lily Real dribbling 85 yards to score the game winner for UCLA to win 1-0 against
Cal Poly. Jordan, have you seen this video?
I have. I've seen the clip. It's been posted everywhere, almost as much as the
next one we're going to talk about.
But I mean, as a left center back, I'm almost like more impressed that she like
(04:10):
didn't go and pass the ball.
Like she was driven to goal the entire time that girl was
determined it wasn't the prettiest goal I've ever seen but like
85 yards that is impressive I was
like I think I was more I know like as a center back sometimes those dribbling
windows just open and it almost feels like people don't see it coming and so
like it's oddly open because everyone else is marked but she just took it down
(04:34):
the middle and then I think the most impressive thing was it wasn't a glory
shot you know from From upper 90.
She gets tackled in the box. Gets back up and pulls a total forward move.
And gets her own rebound.
This clip was unreal. Obviously UCLA off to a good start. 4-0.
Everyone predicted big things out of them in the Big Ten this year.
But that was definitely something special.
(04:56):
To keep their win over Cal Poly. Who honestly is a very underrated team.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It was quite an impressive goal. Congrats to her and their team.
You know, I don't think there's, like you said, any much surprise that they're on the streak here.
They're definitely one of the teams everyone's looking at to make quite the run.
So yeah and speaking of runs
you know we have to do it I know you guys know
(05:18):
we're going to talk about it and I feel like since we are a news source that
covers women's soccer's week in and week out we have a right to talk about it
unlike maybe other news sources that don't cover women's soccer but love to
only publish when things like this happen but Rudd curse women's soccer let's talk about it.
Jordan, what was your reaction to the viral clip?
(05:40):
I mean, honestly, I kind of loved it.
Like, that was awesome. I think you see a lot of that like emotion and aggression
in men's sports or different things like that.
I don't know if I've ever really seen a fight in women's soccer.
And that was like, dirty.
I mean, we're grabbing hair, they were throwing punches. I mean,
(06:03):
there There was uppercuts. They were punching down at the girl at one point.
It was crazy. I want to know. I'm curious to see what the repercussions will
be for that. Obviously, red cards were given.
But going into, because this is the first time, like future repercussions,
what the team will do, how this will be handled.
Because it was not like, it wasn't an even fight. The girl was on the ground.
(06:26):
And she was getting kicked and punched and hair pulled and fighting for her life.
So it was crazy. crazy and there wasn't anything like it was an obvious foul,
they tried to do a quick restart, girl was in the way like it wasn't,
anything that would you know call for that sort
of aggression or anger so I'm curious to see what happened
prior to that if they were going at it all game or if there's some
(06:48):
sort of build up to that moment because the actual clip and
the actual foul that happened in that moment does
not call it doesn't it's not even on the girl that was fouled so it doesn't
even call for that to begin with so I'm just curious as to how how things got
so tense so quickly no honestly I think that's the question on everyone's mind
so if you've lived under a rock in the 35th minute of the Rutgers versus UMass game this Sunday.
(07:12):
There was a fistfight on the field between two players or a player on each team.
And yeah, I think I have a lot of different thoughts on this.
Like I said, I kind of already said the one.
I love how I woke up and it was like an ESPN notification.
And I think like as news sources that don't always focus on women's soccer,
we only focus on it when like things like this happen. And I think that's really unfortunate.
(07:34):
And that says a lot. And I think the other thing is like you said,
i don't obviously don't punch people like
that's a normal thing but we're not advocating for
that but there is a sense of the fact that
women's sports can be as aggressive as men's sports
and i feel like we expect women's sports to everyone to be friends and we all
have to love each other and you know like this is a totally different situation
(07:57):
but i had our rivalry game this weekend and our fans are chanting like you guys
are better the other team sucks like in swedish obviously but But,
you know, like they have all these chants about all this.
And the other team is like, we love everyone. No hate.
And there is this big article about like the different fan bases.
But I was like, that's honestly embarrassing to me. Like you would never be
(08:17):
at a men's game and be like, oh, my God, everyone is great. And we're all friends and we need to smile.
But there's an expectation that women's sports need to act that way.
And I think that's totally unfair and unprecedented.
And so obviously, I don't think people should get punched. But there is an aggressive
side of the sport. And I think it's about time we talk about it.
Absolutely. I'm interested in your take with the coverage because you can go
(08:37):
one of two ways. You can go like this is unfair.
You could go all coverage is good coverage. And when you look at like I think
my take on it, which may differ from yours, is when you look at the WNBA and
the explosion and you had the Caitlin Clark Angel Reese rivalry,
you had this type of, you know, going back and forth aggression with it.
Is that what we need as women's soccer to grow our sport.
(08:58):
Is this something where you look at and people like the aggression and they
like how emotional it gets and this helps to grow our sport further with the media coverage?
Or is this something where you think it's a bad look for the sport and for the program?
Yeah, that's a fair question. And I don't know, like, I definitely wouldn't
say it's a bad look or a bad, you know, bad face of the sport.
I just find it interesting that this is the headlines we get.
(09:20):
You know, even national championship, you
still see NCAA double a tournament yes of course angel reese
caitlin clark that was a whole new heights and that's a
heights i hope college soccer can get to and i
think we have the worth and the storylines and everything to get
there but it's when we have new sources and twitter and this is like when we
(09:40):
only talk about this perspective then this creates the perception to the average
person that isn't as invested that this is all it is we only care when stuff
like this happens like Like,
how many ESPN headlines has it been when men get in fistfights?
And we know that happens in men's college soccer all the time.
So why is it a thing when women do it? And that's where I see a really big disparity.
(10:02):
Gotcha. I think that makes sense. Yeah. I think it also raises a bigger question.
And I think this is a question going into the Big Ten is, Rutgers,
three seasons ago, my junior year, were a Final Four NCAA team.
Now they're starting off their season 1-1-1, and they have a loss to UMass,
which frankly is an overly and over highly rated women's college soccer program.
(10:24):
What do we think has happened to Rutgers in the last three years to get them
from the high of highs to where they're at maybe now? Yeah, I think.
I think this is just something you kind of naturally see sometimes in sports
where, was it something where they're in a low now, they've had a couple bad
recruiting classes, you have different sorts of funding,
(10:45):
maybe they're not able to keep up with the competition of NIL money,
things of that nature where we don't know necessarily.
I think NIL opened up a lot of questions in terms of how the recruiting process
works and what schools are able to compete and not.
I think you'd have to look at sort of the financials of things and the aspect
that we We don't have that information, too, but we can speculate on maybe it's
(11:06):
that or did three years ago.
They just got really lucky and they had some stars in there that they didn't
expect or maybe weren't supposed to be as good or decided to go to Rutgers.
You know, I think this is they're definitely better, I think,
and in better shape than Michigan is.
But same thing, Michigan won the Big Ten a couple of years ago and now they
are not doing so hot these past few years. So is it just like a natural turnover
(11:27):
rate where you have some bad recruiting classes, or is this something that they're
going to need to look at revamping this program?
Yeah, it's an interesting question. We've had the same coach there for a while
who's been there for so, so many highs.
I think he's a very high-level coach. And, you know, you still have their name-bearing players.
I mean, when they were a Final Four team, they have Amara Ali,
Gabby Provozano, Megan McClelland, who are all three professionals right now
(11:48):
playing in the U.S., two in the NWSL, one in the USL Super League.
But then you have Riley Tiernan, who was a freshman that year,
adding so much to that class.
And maybe I wonder if it's a question of they had so many stars that you couldn't
handle all of them in some regards.
And then in others, now you only have a Riley Tiernan, and that's their big
name. So you can focus on her in a scouting report.
(12:10):
And so there's definitely a lot of questions going on.
And I think that the very viral sensation of their last game will kind of put
a spotlight on them for the rest of the season and see kind of where the trajectory
goes from here. Thank you.
Absolutely. So with that, you say being 1-1-1, most teams have had three games thus far.
However, Indiana and Minnesota have only played two games.
(12:31):
Do we think this is good, bad, indifferent that they've had,
you know, one less game than everyone else, maybe two less games than everyone
else at this point in the season? Yeah, I think it's a really interesting move.
So for people who don't necessarily know, like obviously you have your conference
play, which typically starts around the second week of September,
let's just say around that mid-September timeframe.
(12:53):
And until then you have non-conference play. I have always seen it in my college
career personally until last year that we played eight games.
So it was four weeks, you played two games a week, and that was kind of how
it was. Last year was the first time we stepped it down to seven games.
But I have never seen where the first two weeks of season, instead of playing
(13:13):
the typical four games where UCLA is 4-0, we now have Minnesota and Indiana who are 2-0 each.
I think the questions of this really come for me is there's a certain point of saving your legs.
And like I have been there, those late October legs, they can get you.
And I respect kind of like declining
those games to really focus on maybe what you see as your big ones.
(13:36):
But especially in a Minnesota case they have two
wins but they haven't necessarily played two highly ranked
opponents so if you're trying to build a resume that if you don't win the big
10 you're going for an at-large bid in the NCAA tournament having less games
played and those games played not necessarily being against big opponents I
think is a huge strike against you absolutely I think.
(14:00):
I can understand you doing three game style where you have your first game be
hard, kind of what we did, where your first game's hard, you have a week off
to your second game, and then you kind of get into those, you know,
two games a week type of schedule.
One, prep you for conference play. That's going to be Thursday, Sunday.
And two, if you're only playing these two games and you're focused on saving
(14:22):
these legs so much and putting such a large emphasis on it, I'm wondering what
their substitution rate is.
Like let's say you want just two
hard games throw in a third one that you know you
can win where you can see the depth of your roster and your program get
them game minutes get maybe some of these freshmen or newer players out
onto the field where you can actually see what they're capable of because training
(14:43):
is one thing but I mean you're never going to be able to replicate some of this
until you get into an actual game you know and there's some players who are
just game players you know and to be able to see what you're really capable
of as a roster as a school and as a program,
I think it's dangerous to not take advantage of all the time you have to really
get ready for conference season.
(15:04):
Yeah, I completely agree. And obviously, I would never want to speak this to
existence, but you never know when that player that's been playing all 90 minutes
might not be able to, whether it be injury, sickness, whatever happens.
And are you going to throw in someone that has no experience because you haven't
played the games where you're able to get them experience to then go in?
So I think you raise a great question in that and
(15:25):
we'll see if this risk reward that they're doing
pays off but it's definitely going to be something very interesting to track going
into Big Ten play as non-conference play is now halfway
over absolutely speaking of experienced and
big-time players you have Ohio State's with the first
half hat trick incredibly impressive she's
someone I actually got the opportunity to play against a lot growing up back
(15:46):
in my left outside back days I
got to mark her a lot and she's someone that you just kind of always watched and
you knew he was going to be a big name in college so honestly really
happy for her to see the success she's been having and I
don't think it comes as much of a surprise that she was able to pull this off
yeah I think she's unfortunately a player
that's kind of fallen to scheme of other big names around her whether it be
(16:08):
Kayla Fisher Emma Sears other big names that have been in the Ohio State program
so I think she's a very big threat and I think it's really good for her to finally
see some of her flowers that maybe she hasn't always gotten that recognition
for and I think it says a lot about the Ohio State program.
This is another program that I feel like always gets their way into the Big
Ten tournament, always somehow sneaks their way in there, you know,
(16:31):
does something to make it happen and always is an NCAA contender team.
So to see them off to a really great start already this year with some big time
players, it's going to be it's a program that I feel like isn't always talked
about, but it's always relevant somehow.
Yeah, absolutely. I definitely agree with that take. So yeah,
going to be a very, very interesting one.
And that is the big moments in the big life.
(16:53):
But Jordan, this week brought so many other news stories that we have got to cover.
And I know I've been dying to talk to you about all of this.
So let's hit it with the big news that dropped this week.
Okay. I mean, I think the biggest thing that everyone's looking at is the NWSL.
They they changed a bunch of their rules, but the big one being that they officially
(17:13):
got rid of the college draft.
You have everyone speculating what those potential impacts are going to be.
This was a huge thing for college students and college girls that they looked
forward to being able to enter their name and go into that draft.
And you kind of have this speculation of what is this going to look like and
how is this going to work in the future?
Yeah. So the new CBA has
(17:36):
officially been passed by the NWSL Players Association and
has been signed on by other members of the nwsl and with that brought a few
changes some of them being significantly that there is free agency when contracts
are expired players are supposed to be able to be notified and have a conversation
before trades happen there's supposed to be more.
(17:57):
Transparency and honoring of contracts which isn't always a thing in the nwsl
but one of the biggest headlines, as we know, is officially the NWSL college draft is gone.
And I woke up to this news and immediately started thinking about what this meant.
And I have a lot of different thoughts. And I think we are two very unique people
(18:17):
to have it as someone who is a senior in college and has someone who has just gone through the draft.
And yeah, I think my first initial reaction is honestly, thank God.
As someone who went through the draft process, I am extremely thankful for the
opportunities that I was blessed through it.
That being said, it was one of the worst and probably most unfair processes
(18:38):
that I've been through in my life.
And I don't think it is good for any party.
And so I think because of that, finally, the draft going away,
which I know is something that's been being pushed for a while, is a pretty good thing.
What was your instant reaction to this news, Jordan?
Jordan. Well, I would like to hear a little bit more about your thoughts on
(19:00):
why it was bad as someone who hasn't been through it and just an outside perspective
from always hasn't been watching soccer and kind of into that space.
I thought it was really exciting and a cool moment to get to share with your
friends and family and all that stuff.
And it was similar to all the other American sports we've seen where all these
big sports, you watch the basketball draft, you You watch the football draft.
(19:21):
Like that's the big thing. You watch these college players or players in general
enter the draft, enter their name and sign their pro careers.
So I am interested on your take as someone who has been through it and has been
watching as to why women's soccer would be different than any of the other sports
that already have a draft here.
Yeah. And I think that's a great point. And a great thing to note is that the
(19:43):
NWSL is officially the first major sporting league in the U.S.
That had a draft to then get rid of the draft. and I think it's creating a lot of conversation.
For me, I think the world's changed and I don't necessarily think that women's
soccer is different than the other sports.
I think I've seen a push for other sports to also get rid of their draft process,
especially when we have been professionalizing college sports more and more.
(20:07):
It feels weird to be professionalizing that avenue and then go through a draft process.
And here's the issue I have with the draft process. us.
As someone who went through it, and trust me, my moment of hearing my name called
and having that, I'm very, very grateful for it.
And I know if the draft wasn't there, I wouldn't have had that.
On the outside of the flashiness of it, and you get that big moment,
(20:32):
and you get everyone texting you, and you get your pictures taken and all this stuff,
I think there's a very big misconception on what that actually means and how things should work.
And what I mean by that is the NWSL at this moment, due to roster cap sizes,
you know, you could not have more than 26 members on a NWSL roster.
(20:55):
And a recent push, I would say, for the NWSL to really go after big international
players that have these big international careers and have been professional all their lives,
that creates less opportunities for college players to get drafted and then make the roster.
And I think a lot of people see that getting your drafted is means you're on
(21:16):
the team. And that is not the case at all.
And I know that, you know, I've talked about my own story and we know that that to be true.
But it's really hard to tell other people that. And I know people were like
in my family, like buying racing Louisville stuff. And I was like,
no, don't. I haven't made the team yet.
And that was a really big, like misunderstanding in that kind of regard.
I think with that, you draft 54 new people got drafted last year.
(21:39):
And I don't know the exact number. I'm not going to pretend like I do,
but I would venture to bet probably half actually are in the NWSL right now.
So why go through this process where you're drafting players,
claiming their rights into the NWSL, having some people not look into other
opportunities where they might actually play and develop and actually make a roster,
but we're going to claim these 50 players to go to the state where they may
(22:03):
not necessarily have chosen or see a fit for them and then cut them because
they don't have other options, but we own their rights.
And I think this is the inherent issue is right now there's not the space and
the NWSL to support for the draft class coming in.
And that hurts those that get
drafted. I think the also issue is you don't necessarily get to choose.
(22:25):
I'm very happy and very thankful for my time at Louisville, but who's to say
if I didn't get drafted somewhere else that my experience would have been different
or my outcome would have been different.
But I had no say in that manner. And I think that as an athlete,
it's the the same. It's going back to college recruiting. It's stocking rosters.
How many left backs do they have? Who do I want to learn under?
What coach do I have a relationship? Where is my in?
(22:47):
And I didn't have any chance to do that research myself.
And that gave me no say. And I think that that is where players feel like they're
pawns and they're numbers.
And I think getting rid of the draft takes away that part of an athlete being
a number and you're an athlete. And I think that gives a lot of power back to the players.
That's something I haven't really thought of, but I absolutely love that take.
(23:08):
And I think that the correlation between the professionalism of college soccer,
it does, this getting rid of the draft does lead to a smoother transition to
the NWSL because it's going to be a much similar process to what you already have been through.
In addition, I think a lot of the girls I've seen sign contracts in the NWSL were not drafted.
(23:30):
They got to go and they tried out for three, four different teams.
Games and, you know, do these different things with them.
And they ended up finding a home there versus people who got drafted,
had their rights, and then unfortunately didn't make that roster,
but had nowhere else to go.
I think the other thing this leads is the NWSL was set up for a lot of success
for the past four years with the COVID year, because any athlete who needed
(23:55):
to finish out their academics could do it now in four and a half years.
And then you would go and in the fall, you would enter the draft and you would
be done and go ahead and have that pro route.
Without that COVID year, the academic portion becomes you have to graduate in
three and a half years, which isn't always necessarily possible.
So you have girls either deciding to leave without a degree or you have the
(24:16):
semester where you finished out your degree and now what?
Because now the NWSL, that period is over. And where do you go?
You have to go overseas until the USL happen.
So my curiosity is how this will impact the USL as well.
If you don't have the NWSL draft, you have girls having these more options,
(24:37):
and you have the USL that's competing with the NWSL now, are girls going to
decide to finish out their degree in their four years?
And then the natural course would be to enter the USL instead of the NWSL because
that's the way your academic calendar falls.
And I'll be interested to see how that works out because I think the draft is
a big portion of why kids left early and they just entered their name into it
(25:00):
and were hoping to stay in America for it because the NWSL is a big thing.
Now you have kind of the option to do both even where you could go try out for
the NWSL if you don't make it, stay in school, and then do the USL.
Yeah. I actually didn't think of the academic portion. Naturally,
that part's way out of my brain. Why would I think about academics?
So I think you raise a really interesting point. And And I think what's going
(25:22):
to happen is you take your draft class last year, it was 54 people.
So let's just say 50 people.
I would venture to guess that we're going to see 12 to 15 max girls go straight to college to the NWSL.
And I think that the interesting thing that this is going to create is this
year, specifically, we have a double class.
(25:43):
Like you were just saying, this is the last year for fifth years.
Plus you have all the girls that don't have their fifth years, but only our seniors.
So you have a double class, and you're going to have less girls going to the NWSL than years before.
The interesting thing that I had thought of, but you completely almost proved
me wrong with the academic portion, is what are those girls going to do in December?
(26:04):
Because yes, the USL is around. I think it's a great another option to have
in the US, but they're going to be mid-season.
So are we going to see mass turnover rate in the USL rosters bringing in girls
from college that just got finished?
Are we going to see girls getting waived from USL rosters?
Or is there not going to be really spots for girls that are graduating in December
(26:25):
and looking for that next pro home in the USL either because they're only halfway
through their season and most of the rosters are all still around?
And I think it's going to overall create the USL a more competitive environment
to get that contract in the US in the next season of USL starting in August of next year.
But I think there's a lot of questions of what those players are going to do,
(26:45):
because I don't know realistically how many options are going to be open to the USL.
So is that still going to drive girls that want to play pro to go overseas?
Because my other thing is we have seen now two weekends of USL play.
And if you analyze starting lineups, girls who are getting a lot of minutes
in the USL, it is heavily skewed towards girls who have been professional for
(27:07):
multiple years beyond girls that are just fresh out of college.
The girls that are fresh out of college are on the bench in a couple of cases
starting, don't get me wrong, but others, majority of the people have had pro
experience and are now staying in the USL or coming back home.
So I wonder if it's going to almost create the opposite of the intention and
(27:28):
require girls to go overseas, get that professional experience to then come
back home to either play in the NWSL or the USL.
And so I think overall, there's a couple of massive implications long term that
I really have no idea how they're going to pay out by the draft going away.
Yeah, I don't think the draft will necessarily impact that because the same
spots that were available will continue to be available.
(27:50):
Now you'll just have those people who originally were kind of stuck because
their rights were held that now have the option to go overseas and will have that ability to.
I don't necessarily think that more girls will.
If you wanted to go to the NWSL, that spot is still available to you.
You'll still have that option to try out and that roster spot that was available
will continue to be available but yeah I think this will be really interesting
(28:14):
and again with some of the other rules with it with the ability to have a conversation
before you go and get traded and things of that nature to see how that pans out.
But yeah I think there's a lot of changes and it'll be interesting to see how
this all pans out in addition to girls maybe going pro earlier versus how that
affects the age in which kids It's transitioned from either sometimes even high
(28:39):
school to pro or college to pro and what that kind of looks like for an age range,
especially with the way college athletics is going.
And we'll get someone on here to talk more in depth about the way college athletics
is changing because it is changing very dramatically and very quickly.
But with it going to more of a professional setup with roster limits at 28 for the college
(29:01):
level i think it'll it'll be
interesting to see how this all plays out with both landscapes
changing so much within this next year you know who's gonna have kind of hold
more power yeah it's a lot of new territory and i think you know with that i
think we've hit on the immediate impacts of the draft but i am immediately thinking
(29:23):
in long term you know and i think just getting rid
of this college draft, not necessarily that getting rid of the draft makes these
things possible, but I think it is going to skew what we see the NWSL really doing.
And I think my prediction is that we're going to shift our soccer to a more European style.
And I don't think that that's a bad thing at all. I think it's just going to
(29:45):
be very interesting to see what steps we take with our uniqueness and the world
of being really the only world where the college soccer is that stepping step.
And kind of what I mean by this is, as we know, and like you said,
we're going to talk more as we still even learn about the new changes going into college soccer.
But we have roster caps of 28 people and scholarships in moments like this are
(30:10):
also now funded by schools.
Schools so who's to say that if i'm
a professional scout and i have tabs on
joe schmoe in missouri i might
just have a certain college here's their scholarship money we're gonna have
them play for you for two years and then we're gonna have them sign pro to get
that development or how that scampage like i could see a world where college
(30:34):
almost becomes a feeder team to these professional professional environments
and kind of use that as a money funneling mechanism.
Because with NIL, with all these opportunities, nothing really is stopping them
from using college as a placement hold for the girls that they have their eyes
on that just need a couple more years or a couple more minutes or whatever that is.
(30:54):
And because of that, I feel like we're going to see certain universities get
those opportunities and maybe certain universities not.
And I think the inherent Transparent naiveness, maybe, of the draft is going
away of where everyone has a fair shot.
And everyone puts their name in and we're going to see what happens.
I know it wasn't exactly the world we lived in, but the draft was a place where
(31:16):
a girl that played at Iowa who never had anyone drafted could hear her name get called.
And I think that this officially means that we have moved away from that thinking in a lot of regards.
So you don't think that in the future, a school that doesn't historically turn
girls pro will have the option to turn girls pro anymore?
(31:37):
I think it's going to be a lot harder to get a direct funnel from pro to the NWSL.
I think it's going to open a lot of doors for either overseas or USL or things like that.
But my prediction is with this, I
could see professional professional schools really
looking at the certain schools that I
(31:58):
feel like we all can think of that you were your brain would immediately go to
because if I'm scouting players I'm scouting that school I'm
scouting the girls committing to that school more than I'm looking at you know
someone else down the street maybe and so I don't know that's just my prediction
of where I think that this can go but I feel like it is going to take away from
(32:18):
those maybe smaller schools where girls are trying to go pro.
I would have to, I think I agree with that, but not because of the NWSL legislation
changes, because of the college legislation changes and because college is going
to become more of a monopoly of those top teams and programs,
specifically the football teams.
Because I mean, you know, quickly, like schools that are buying into the media
(32:41):
rights have to pay their football players $24 million.
If a university doesn't have that money, which most, Most smaller schools,
D3, NAIA, they don't have – anyone without a good football team doesn't have that.
You're creating a monopoly of the top schools and the top programs with the
best football teams that are then going to funnel down into the rest of your sports.
(33:02):
With 28 scholarships available now, in theory, they still have to be Title IX
compliant, whereas the salary basis that you can pay players does not have to be.
Available that yes I think you can have feeder teams with
these schools and it will make sense for them to be starting to do
that and to do those things with those
kind of top schools that are going to start to separate from the rest and there's
(33:24):
going to be a lot bigger discrepancy between those top programs and the bottom
ones where prior everyone could have been on a semi equal playing field now
I don't even think you're going to get some of those smaller schools to be traveling
to go play some of the better schools to see where they stand because they can't
afford forward the travel budget,
because there will be a lot of budget cuts coming to, I think, everywhere.
(33:44):
Yeah, no, that's a good point. I think my other question with the NWSL draft
officially going away, too, is you kind of hit on it, but what age do we really
think that this is going to make college soccer players go pro?
And we've seen it more and more, you know, girls after their first or second
years entering their name in a draft.
But I feel like you're still looking at the draft pool, evaluating your odds,
(34:07):
evaluating different things, who's in your class, where's that draft going to
go, and there's a lot more unknown.
But if I'm a player and I can have an agent where.
My pro team is calling me directly saying that they want to offer me this money
and it's a lot more guaranteed versus the draft and I'm able to have a conversation with that team,
why wouldn't that leave at 18, at 19, after my first, second year of college
(34:31):
if I already have a pro team with a contract ready to go.
There's a lot less risk in girls leaving college early than there was.
I feel like the girls that left college early were only because they knew that
they were going to be the first or second draft pick.
And so I think that this is going to enable girls like who's to say,
oh, I have a pro offer on the table. My college team isn't doing great. I'm out.
(34:52):
I feel like those quick decisions are going to happen more too,
which is going to kind of just open up new terrain in a lot of regards.
Are you allowed to have an agent now? i'm not
sure but i think there's going to be a lot of underhand stuff
legal i think the biggest thing is
if they open it up because as of right now you're allowed to have an nil agent
(35:13):
i don't believe you're allowed to have an agent that advocates for your soccer
ability in any regard still if they open that up where you're allowed to have
an agent while playing collegiately absolutely i agree 100 that that will be
happening and with the you know the college landscape turning essentially pro level,
I do think there's a lot less emphasis on the academic portion where you are here for athletics,
(35:36):
you're here to play soccer, you're here to be a successful athlete rather than
a student athlete like it was before.
In with a lot less emphasis on the academics, you're going to have girls leaving
college a lot easier and a lot sooner because they don't really care about the
degree that's coming with their education.
Yeah, I completely agree. I think overall, the biggest thing that this is, is change.
(35:57):
And you hit the nail on the head and you said the college landscape is changing
and officially the pro landscape is too.
And so I hate to be like, oh, there's so much unknown. Like there is clearly
stuff we do know within this unknown, but I think the next couple of years,
We're going to see a massive shift in the soccer landscape in general.
You know, this is a long shot, but I wouldn't be surprised to start seeing NWSL
(36:18):
teams launch academies.
Why wouldn't they have a Kansas City Current Academy that they can grow?
And honestly, in some ways, we're seeing this.
I've seen on my social media, I'm not necessarily sure what exactly is going
on, but there's a bunch of youth players that went with Kansas City Current
to Spain and were playing like professional organizations in Spain,
and they were just bringing these youth players along. long.
(36:40):
There are pro teams right now that are scouting the 16, 17-year-olds before they go to college.
So what's stopping them from just creating an academy where they bring in their
own talent, they have their rights, they see their trajectory,
and it makes the pathway to signing pro without even having that college step a lot more feasible.
So if it's not official, a Kansas City Current or a Portland Thorns or whatever
(37:02):
it is, academy, I could see partnerships with club teams very much developing, if that makes sense.
Yeah, yeah, it does. And like you said, I think there's just so much unknown.
And as someone who is officially out of it, you know, your perspective,
I think, is unique and can be exciting to kind of watch as someone who is very
(37:23):
much still in this landscape.
I think it's been a bit terrifying and it's impacted, even though I'm on my
way out, it's impacted a lot of my decision making and my career thus far.
So So it's been a crazy couple
of years to watch as women's soccer has kind of taken off and grown and come
to this point where there's going to be so much change and it's going to look
(37:44):
so different by the time my sister's 10 years younger than me and by the time
she's going through all of this and she's looking at her future and even the
way it's trickled down into club levels and things of that nature,
it's really crazy to watch how quickly it is all changing.
Changing yeah and I feel like I was
in college soccer at such a unique age and I'm very very happy I was when I
(38:08):
am and it's just going to be interesting to watch this trajectory change but
I think we could all know that five years from now college soccer pro soccer
even youth soccer we're not going to have the same landscape absolutely.
Jordan, with that being said, a lot of news has dropped, but also a lot of stuff's
going on in our lives as college soccer players and in different aspects of that regard.
(38:33):
Let's talk a little bit more. How was senior night, and what else was some of
those unexpected emotions that you maybe had during senior night?
Yeah, yeah. So as we all know, I have struggled with a knee injury.
I tore my PCL a couple months ago and due to, I think, miscommunication with
my medical staff and just some unforeseen and unexpected setbacks, I was out for a while.
(39:00):
I'm fully healthy now, capable to play.
But a lot of the conversation I had around my coaching staff and in general,
There was a lot of uncertainty with me coming back and my return to play.
I sat the first two games. I did not see the field.
And going into my senior night, it was a conversation of whether or not I should
(39:22):
have, would have, could have redshirt.
In a very panicked text I sent to Sam Carey, I was like, what should I do?
I ultimately decided to play in my senior night.
I think I made that decision one out of
fear because we were talking so much about how the landscape is
changing with 28 person roster caps anywhere I would
go means someone would have to get cut for a school to take me
(39:44):
most likely with the way scholarships are changing you don't know how much money
a school is going to have a school doesn't know how much money they're going
to have to be able to offer scholarships to you know students and unless I go
back home to Ohio I am an out-of-state student which would be a huge financial
burden to take on in addition to figuring
out the academic portion of it and what that eligibility would look like as an engineering major,
(40:06):
credits don't really transfer, unfortunately.
So I would be a little bit stuck there. And there were so many moving aspects.
In any other year, I had begged the universe.
This is all I ever wanted was a fifth year.
I wanted an extra year in college to figure it out, to reach my potential.
I feel like I'm just starting to become the person and player I'm supposed to be.
(40:28):
And I'm not ready for it to end and to have such a huge setback in terms of
my health and to be out for so long and really kind of I feel like missed my shot for this season.
You know, any other year it would have been a no-brainer. But because of logistics
and the way the landscape is changing, I chose to play.
And I think some of the unexpected emotions that came from it was,
(40:48):
one, the gratitude of this program, what it's meant for me, what it's given for me.
All of those things that I expected to feel, but also the sadness of that this
wasn't supposed to be my story.
That this isn't how it was supposed to end for me.
And then, honestly, the second I stepped foot on the field, a little bit of regret.
(41:08):
I wish hindsight, I think I should have taken my red shirt.
I did not realize quite how far I had fallen on our roster, which is hard because
one, I have three years of experience.
I feel like I've done so much and proven so much. And as a player who has always
played, you know, at most I've been the number three forward,
(41:30):
still getting good minutes.
And I've always been on the field.
You know, last year I started for most of our games. I've been,
I've had a successful career thus far.
I feel like I've proven a lot and I didn't realize, like I said,
quite how far I had fallen.
And it felt very much so like I got 14 kind of pity minutes on my senior night
(41:53):
in a game where, you know, Ohio is a good team, but a game where we were dominating
and we knew we were going to win and should win.
It became a realization that if I'm not playing against Ohio,
it's going going to be very hard for me to play anywhere else and to give
some more insight on it yes the season's long this is only our third game but
as someone who's been through the college landscape before just a way our schedule
(42:15):
works is mondays you're off day tuesday it depends how your coach does it and
how kind of hard your week was some days everyone trains on tuesdays and sometimes
it's a regen and a non-regen group so essentially all the players that had high
lows or good minutes for that week will go and do kind of an active recovery
cool down session while the bottom half of your roster the people who didn't
(42:37):
play you know according to the coaching staff will go and they'll train.
And then Wednesday's your pregame, Thursday's our game, Friday's regen,
non-regen, Saturday's pregame, Sunday's game, Monday's off.
So once you get through that preseason phase and you start getting in consistent
gameplay, you are never really on an equal playing field with the players who are playing.
(43:00):
You never really get an opportunity to prove yourself again because you're not
playing against them. You're not playing with your whole team, with your whole roster.
You're out of time almost. like it's it becomes very
very hard to work your way out of it
in addition to just from a player perspective like Mondays are
off and then your Thursday and Sundays are
(43:20):
off if you're not playing like you have to figure out a way to go
and run condition lift get on the ball
and do all the things that the team that is playing is doing on
those days because you're sitting on the bench like you have to figure out a
way to not only close that gap but just really try to prevent it from growing
every day and every week that you're not playing so with that I think you know
(43:43):
the realization hit me that that this isn't going to go the way I had hoped or expected and.
In the moment I think you know I've gone through so many
emotions since then where you're kind of you're sad you're mourning
it and it becomes a question of and I got a
question I guess for you you Sam at what point
does an athlete when I'm looking
(44:06):
at this I'm at what point
are you allowed to be sad at what point do you adjust the expectations for your
season and at what point do you like not necessarily give up but you have to
stop being devastated over where you stand and look at the facts that are presented
while it is only the third game knowing everything I know I I do feel like it's.
(44:29):
It's hard and I don't necessarily like want to give up, but if I'm continuing
to be sad over my career, every game, then at what point is that selfish of me? Yeah.
And does that all come out of being a bad teammate?
It's an amazing question. And first of all, I think you sharing this is a lot
because we pride ourselves on being authentic and talking about the highs and
(44:52):
lows of college soccer and there's highs and lows.
I think the thing that I also
am hearing from you without hearing from you knowing a college
experience is not only do you feel like it's game three
you also feel like your coaching staff has written you
off and it's a reality and it's a reality I saw time and time again in my college
(45:12):
career through other college careers your coaches are there to win games it's
a business and they care about you my college coach cared a lot about me I'm
not saying anything about that but it's also their job and their livelihood.
And with that being said, when they're choosing starting lineups,
when they're choosing minutes, they have to go with what they trust and they
(45:33):
trust the people that they're going in day in and day out with.
And not that they don't trust you as a human or anything else.
I don't want people to misunderstand that, but there is a business side of college athletics.
And I think a lot of coaches get into this site of when an athlete is no longer
beneficial to my goal, they get written off and there's no time for a comeback.
(45:56):
We all love a comeback story. We love the underdog story of the girl who sat
the bench and waited their time and their time came.
And frankly, it happens. There's a girl at Iowa who I'm so proud of that's doing
it right now, who's playing in my spot as a senior, who never really got a shot
and got her shot her senior year. And that's great.
But we also know the other stories
where you very much get written off and then the new blood comes in.
(46:18):
And why invest in the old blood when the new blood is going to be there for
four years and get them the experience to keep growing?
And even because you're old news now and that sounds so mean,
but it's true. And it's the ugly side of college talker.
I think to answer your question, you are now in a phase of your life where you proved it on Sunday.
(46:40):
You had your senior night. you have done
so much for your program whether it be on
the field off the field you know the impact you made to that program you
have proof of the impact you made to that program so
now you do get to be selfish because you have given yourself and there's a balance
there and what I mean by you get to be selfish is you get to do what's best
(47:03):
for you and what is going to make you happy at a certain point like I said I
know I can hear what you're saying in a lot of regards without hearing what
you're saying. You've been written off.
And with that fact comes a new place for you on your team.
It might not be the girl who scores the game-winning goal in the Penn State
game to win the Big Ten championship, and that sucks.
(47:26):
And you have every right to mourn that, to be sad about that,
and to process that emotionally.
And no one gets to take that away from you, no matter what.
You also have an opportunity because there is another side of the roster that you maybe haven't seen.
And that is the other girls that have been written off, that have been injured,
(47:48):
that are still writing their story and don't know how.
So now when you feel ready, you get to be a leader to them.
And I know it sounds like a pity role. I had this conversation with my college
roommate a lot, who was another girl that in a lot of regards got written off.
And a lot of that comes from what do you want your last year to be?
Because we're in your last year. And that sucks that it's a reality, but it's a reality.
(48:11):
So now how do we make the most of it? For her, she was the best goddamn cheerleader there was.
She was the best hype man. And that was her thing.
She got to be on the bench. Our coach traveled her everywhere because no one was louder than her.
And she made genuine friendships with people through that. People that she maybe
(48:31):
not have even talked to that much on the team because they weren't around each other.
And that was her thing. That might not be your thing.
Your thing might be that you're going to send and you're going to be the best
fight person in the pregame locker room and you're going to be the DJ and you're
going to be dancing and that's going to be your thing.
You have a right to have a thing. You have given enough to this program to get
(48:53):
your thing and get an ending, even if it's not the ending you want.
And to have an impact on the team, knowing you have an impact on the team your senior year.
And I think that's the biggest thing you hear all the time, everyone has a role,
everyone's role has value.
You now have an opportunity to prove to other people that everyone's role has
value, being someone who has now seen both sides.
(49:13):
And that's not going to be easy. And you're going to have to show true strength
and true leadership and true commitment to do that because that role kind of sucks. Let's be real.
But now you have a platform and an opportunity to do that.
And I a lot longer of an impact than scoring that goal against Penn State that's
a lifelong impact that you're going to make on your teammates in your program
(49:36):
that's not a one game impact yeah I think when you said like you know I'm obviously
a little emotional this isn't how I expected,
my senior year to go with such high hopes and expectations and you know you
have two sides of it where I am so happy for my team and we win and we do these
things and we do have a lot of those hero stories, like the people had me,
(49:58):
you know, I got to play over for so many years and now they're finally getting
their shot and opportunity and you have that excitement for them while still
being sad about your own ambitions, goals and careers and kind of starting to
mourn the death of something that isn't over yet.
And it's a very weird feeling because I'm still here showing up,
training and doing all these things while balancing the reality that it is not
(50:21):
going to go the way I wish it would.
You know, and I think my roommate put it best, who she said,
it's like it's it's like doing drugs.
Like the highs are so high and the lows are so low.
But once once you have that moment, like the lows are so devastating low because
you you tie your identity into it.
(50:42):
This is all I've ever known is to be an athlete, is to be a soccer player,
is to be someone who has an impact on the field.
And it's it's hard and when you
when you get that strip from you you know those lows where
you lose that sense of self and you lose that part of you
that you you love so much it was one of my favorite parts of
me was being an athlete and being a good one you know and you start to lose
(51:08):
that and you you chase these moments where i can still feel myself looking out
onto a sold out you know to Martin Stadium and scoring a goal and running over to those teams and,
you know, having them all hug me and getting to stand there and embrace it and
to really take in that moment.
Like the highs are so high and you chase them for the rest of your career trying to get to that.
(51:30):
And it's like doing drugs. And I feel like I'm going through like some severe withdrawals right now.
Like it's hard and it's sad. And it is something where I have to learn what
that new identity looks like,
you know because we are recording this on Tuesday Sunday was this kind of abrupt
realization of where I'm going to be so I haven't necessarily processed all
(51:53):
this or figured it out yet,
but it is it is the unfortunate reality
of college athletics it is not all you know sunshine and rainbows and as successful
as a career I have had like I'm I'm at a new point in it where I I unfortunately
am at one of those lows in my drug addiction of soccer and of being an athlete here.
(52:17):
Yeah, I think, you know, it opens itself to a bigger conversation about our identity as athletes.
And it's one that I know is happening more and more and thankfully at a younger and younger level.
But I think, you know, if I were to sit here and be on my high horse and say,
Jordan, you are so much more than an athlete and you have so many other,
(52:38):
you know, and I know you know this and if I can say it to you all you want,
but I'm going to be so honest if I were in the exact same situation with you
right now, I wouldn't be feeling any different.
You know, we like to all act like we're emotionally healthy and we can handle
all these things and we know everything and we know that we're more than an athlete.
And yes, in my brain, I know, but in my heart, I don't.
(52:58):
And we can think and we can say all these things, but until you truly know it, you don't, you don't.
And I am well aware that if I were in your shoes, I would be feeling the exact same way.
So I definitely do not want this to come off of like here's jordan How everything
you can do and now you can fix it and be happy because it's not And I think
the best part about this is how willing and open you're willing to be about
(53:19):
this And it's going to be documented.
I'm very sorry But other people are going to know the highs and the lows and
the process that this is because it is a process.
And it's a grieving and it's a morning and it's a high and it's a crash and
so So I think the best thing is we're going to ride out this season together
and it's going to be a journey no matter what it is.
(53:41):
And but I think the best thing that you have is the impact that you have on
the program and you have physical evidence of that.
So you've hit your legacy on the field, but what's your legacy off the field?
And that's now the question you get to answer. But it doesn't have to be answered this week.
It doesn't have to be answered this month.
You know, I think it's it's a journey for you in the next couple of weeks,
in the next month or months.
(54:02):
And we'll do it together. Yeah. Lucky you guys. We'll keep you updated on it.
Like I said, I definitely don't have it figured out yet.
And it is something that is, you know, I feel like I've hit every single aspect
you can hit in a career here at college.
You know, I think this is the last step.
Last chapter for me to close here so absolutely well
(54:24):
with that what does Michigan State have this week
what are we what what games do we have going on this week what
is our preview for all listeners as we should
tune into college soccer this weekend yeah well
I mean obviously our expectation as a team and as a program
is always to win so we plan
on doing that but we have another Thursday sign Thursday Sunday
(54:45):
lineup both at home with Ole Miss
and then Xavier so should be
a pretty good week here at times some big games going
out of Michigan State that'll be super exciting I'll definitely have to try
to tune into that Ole Miss one that'll be a fun little SEC Big Ten matchup going
into Swedish Domos Vonsken play I mean I know we all are keeping up with the
(55:06):
season and doing everything there we will travel down to Trelleborg which I
know you all know where it is and it just you know, check it off the map, duh, name recognition.
But no, we are currently still sitting fifth place in the league.
And as a team moving that table, unfortunately got the tie in the Derby this
last weekend, but we did get to play in front of around 6,000 fans.
(55:28):
And so huge environment to be in very, very thankful to be getting pro minutes
here and playing and experiencing life in Sweden.
But yeah, a lot of big games, a lot of big matchups this weekend,
Again, Big Ten Plus is always where you can find Big Ten play,
but ESPN Plus as well as your streaming Big Ten network, SEC network,
ACC network, there's always college soccer games going on on Thursdays and Sundays,
(55:51):
and we very, very much encourage you guys to tune in and keep up with the conversation
and what's going on with college soccer. Thanks, guys.
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Hi, everyone, and welcome back to The Big Life.
Jordan, the list of our topics are next to me right now, and I am so excited
(01:11):
to get into a dialogue about all of this, but my biggest question I think of
the day, how was senior night?
It was emotional. I think it was emotional for reasons that were expected and
some reasons that were unexpected.
You know, third game of the season, it is quite soon in the season to have a
(01:32):
senior night to kind of honor what's supposed to be the end.
But yeah, a lot of tears were shed between me and my mom. You know,
my whole family was there. So it was nice. It was a special night. It was very emotional.
It, you know, and I think we'll get into it a little bit later about maybe some
of the reasons it was emotional that were unexpected.
But my teammates, inspired by you and Iowa, they had written letters this year.
(01:57):
And I got through maybe three sentences of my first letter before I just turned
into a puddle before the game.
And I was like, okay, I need to save these.
So I couldn't read them until after the game. And.
It was the nicest thing ever, I think. And it was so amazing because to have
these people that I think just change your life and you so desperately are trying
(02:18):
to hang on to and just to have that gratitude and those expressions in words
and in writing that I get to keep forever,
I think was such a special moment. And I definitely shed a lot of tears over that.
And although it's not the end and I'm not saying goodbye yet,
it does kind of, you know, bring about those that sadness of the reality that
(02:38):
I'm eventually going to.
But I think that's may just be like one of the hardest things I'm going to have
to do because I think they, you know, this group of girls and these teammates
and my roommates and these friends and this life I created at Michigan State,
it may just be like the best thing that's ever happened to me.
And I'm even the idea of saying goodbye is so emotional.
So it was it was a moment I just yeah
(02:58):
no it makes total sense if anything I mean
hey if this podcast has done one thing I'm happy that that Iowa tradition
went to Michigan State because I remember opening my
letters and I still have them honestly
like I probably will bring them back to Sweden in January just
because like you said like you know your relationships
and you know in your heart but like when you have it written down
(03:20):
and people took time to do that for you
it hits hits different so I'm glad that you
got that experience because it definitely that's the biggest thing
I'll ever remember from my senior night oh yeah yeah
it was really nice and with that though there's
some big hits this weekend senior nights all over
but a couple other major things that happened in the big life so let's go to
(03:43):
big moments in the big life all right let's get it going with UCLA center back
Lily Real dribbling 85 yards to score the game winner for UCLA to win 1-0 against
Cal Poly. Jordan, have you seen this video?
I have. I've seen the clip. It's been posted everywhere, almost as much as the
next one we're going to talk about.
But I mean, as a left center back, I'm almost like more impressed that she like
(04:10):
didn't go and pass the ball.
Like she was driven to goal the entire time that girl was
determined it wasn't the prettiest goal I've ever seen but like
85 yards that is impressive I was
like I think I was more I know like as a center back sometimes those dribbling
windows just open and it almost feels like people don't see it coming and so
like it's oddly open because everyone else is marked but she just took it down
(04:34):
the middle and then I think the most impressive thing was it wasn't a glory
shot you know from From upper 90.
She gets tackled in the box. Gets back up and pulls a total forward move.
And gets her own rebound.
This clip was unreal. Obviously UCLA off to a good start. 4-0.
Everyone predicted big things out of them in the Big Ten this year.
But that was definitely something special.
(04:56):
To keep their win over Cal Poly. Who honestly is a very underrated team.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It was quite an impressive goal. Congrats to her and their team.
You know, I don't think there's, like you said, any much surprise that they're on the streak here.
They're definitely one of the teams everyone's looking at to make quite the run.
So yeah and speaking of runs
you know we have to do it I know you guys know
(05:18):
we're going to talk about it and I feel like since we are a news source that
covers women's soccer's week in and week out we have a right to talk about it
unlike maybe other news sources that don't cover women's soccer but love to
only publish when things like this happen but Rudd curse women's soccer let's talk about it.
Jordan, what was your reaction to the viral clip?
(05:40):
I mean, honestly, I kind of loved it.
Like, that was awesome. I think you see a lot of that like emotion and aggression
in men's sports or different things like that.
I don't know if I've ever really seen a fight in women's soccer.
And that was like, dirty.
I mean, we're grabbing hair, they were throwing punches. I mean,
(06:03):
there There was uppercuts. They were punching down at the girl at one point.
It was crazy. I want to know. I'm curious to see what the repercussions will
be for that. Obviously, red cards were given.
But going into, because this is the first time, like future repercussions,
what the team will do, how this will be handled.
Because it was not like, it wasn't an even fight. The girl was on the ground.
(06:26):
And she was getting kicked and punched and hair pulled and fighting for her life.
So it was crazy. crazy and there wasn't anything like it was an obvious foul,
they tried to do a quick restart, girl was in the way like it wasn't,
anything that would you know call for that sort
of aggression or anger so I'm curious to see what happened
prior to that if they were going at it all game or if there's some
(06:48):
sort of build up to that moment because the actual clip and
the actual foul that happened in that moment does
not call it doesn't it's not even on the girl that was fouled so it doesn't
even call for that to begin with so I'm just curious as to how how things got
so tense so quickly no honestly I think that's the question on everyone's mind
so if you've lived under a rock in the 35th minute of the Rutgers versus UMass game this Sunday.
(07:12):
There was a fistfight on the field between two players or a player on each team.
And yeah, I think I have a lot of different thoughts on this.
Like I said, I kind of already said the one.
I love how I woke up and it was like an ESPN notification.
And I think like as news sources that don't always focus on women's soccer,
we only focus on it when like things like this happen. And I think that's really unfortunate.
(07:34):
And that says a lot. And I think the other thing is like you said,
i don't obviously don't punch people like
that's a normal thing but we're not advocating for
that but there is a sense of the fact that
women's sports can be as aggressive as men's sports
and i feel like we expect women's sports to everyone to be friends and we all
have to love each other and you know like this is a totally different situation
(07:57):
but i had our rivalry game this weekend and our fans are chanting like you guys
are better the other team sucks like in swedish obviously but But,
you know, like they have all these chants about all this.
And the other team is like, we love everyone. No hate.
And there is this big article about like the different fan bases.
But I was like, that's honestly embarrassing to me. Like you would never be
(08:17):
at a men's game and be like, oh, my God, everyone is great. And we're all friends and we need to smile.
But there's an expectation that women's sports need to act that way.
And I think that's totally unfair and unprecedented.
And so obviously, I don't think people should get punched. But there is an aggressive
side of the sport. And I think it's about time we talk about it.
Absolutely. I'm interested in your take with the coverage because you can go
(08:37):
one of two ways. You can go like this is unfair.
You could go all coverage is good coverage. And when you look at like I think
my take on it, which may differ from yours, is when you look at the WNBA and
the explosion and you had the Caitlin Clark Angel Reese rivalry,
you had this type of, you know, going back and forth aggression with it.
Is that what we need as women's soccer to grow our sport.
(08:58):
Is this something where you look at and people like the aggression and they
like how emotional it gets and this helps to grow our sport further with the media coverage?
Or is this something where you think it's a bad look for the sport and for the program?
Yeah, that's a fair question. And I don't know, like, I definitely wouldn't
say it's a bad look or a bad, you know, bad face of the sport.
I just find it interesting that this is the headlines we get.
(09:20):
You know, even national championship, you
still see NCAA double a tournament yes of course angel reese
caitlin clark that was a whole new heights and that's a
heights i hope college soccer can get to and i
think we have the worth and the storylines and everything to get
there but it's when we have new sources and twitter and this is like when we
(09:40):
only talk about this perspective then this creates the perception to the average
person that isn't as invested that this is all it is we only care when stuff
like this happens like Like,
how many ESPN headlines has it been when men get in fistfights?
And we know that happens in men's college soccer all the time.
So why is it a thing when women do it? And that's where I see a really big disparity.
(10:02):
Gotcha. I think that makes sense. Yeah. I think it also raises a bigger question.
And I think this is a question going into the Big Ten is, Rutgers,
three seasons ago, my junior year, were a Final Four NCAA team.
Now they're starting off their season 1-1-1, and they have a loss to UMass,
which frankly is an overly and over highly rated women's college soccer program.
(10:24):
What do we think has happened to Rutgers in the last three years to get them
from the high of highs to where they're at maybe now? Yeah, I think.
I think this is just something you kind of naturally see sometimes in sports
where, was it something where they're in a low now, they've had a couple bad
recruiting classes, you have different sorts of funding,
(10:45):
maybe they're not able to keep up with the competition of NIL money,
things of that nature where we don't know necessarily.
I think NIL opened up a lot of questions in terms of how the recruiting process
works and what schools are able to compete and not.
I think you'd have to look at sort of the financials of things and the aspect
that we We don't have that information, too, but we can speculate on maybe it's
(11:06):
that or did three years ago.
They just got really lucky and they had some stars in there that they didn't
expect or maybe weren't supposed to be as good or decided to go to Rutgers.
You know, I think this is they're definitely better, I think,
and in better shape than Michigan is.
But same thing, Michigan won the Big Ten a couple of years ago and now they
are not doing so hot these past few years. So is it just like a natural turnover
(11:27):
rate where you have some bad recruiting classes, or is this something that they're
going to need to look at revamping this program?
Yeah, it's an interesting question. We've had the same coach there for a while
who's been there for so, so many highs.
I think he's a very high-level coach. And, you know, you still have their name-bearing players.
I mean, when they were a Final Four team, they have Amara Ali,
Gabby Provozano, Megan McClelland, who are all three professionals right now
(11:48):
playing in the U.S., two in the NWSL, one in the USL Super League.
But then you have Riley Tiernan, who was a freshman that year,
adding so much to that class.
And maybe I wonder if it's a question of they had so many stars that you couldn't
handle all of them in some regards.
And then in others, now you only have a Riley Tiernan, and that's their big
name. So you can focus on her in a scouting report.
(12:10):
And so there's definitely a lot of questions going on.
And I think that the very viral sensation of their last game will kind of put
a spotlight on them for the rest of the season and see kind of where the trajectory
goes from here. Thank you.
Absolutely. So with that, you say being 1-1-1, most teams have had three games thus far.
However, Indiana and Minnesota have only played two games.
(12:31):
Do we think this is good, bad, indifferent that they've had,
you know, one less game than everyone else, maybe two less games than everyone
else at this point in the season? Yeah, I think it's a really interesting move.
So for people who don't necessarily know, like obviously you have your conference
play, which typically starts around the second week of September,
let's just say around that mid-September timeframe.
(12:53):
And until then you have non-conference play. I have always seen it in my college
career personally until last year that we played eight games.
So it was four weeks, you played two games a week, and that was kind of how
it was. Last year was the first time we stepped it down to seven games.
But I have never seen where the first two weeks of season, instead of playing
(13:13):
the typical four games where UCLA is 4-0, we now have Minnesota and Indiana who are 2-0 each.
I think the questions of this really come for me is there's a certain point of saving your legs.
And like I have been there, those late October legs, they can get you.
And I respect kind of like declining
those games to really focus on maybe what you see as your big ones.
(13:36):
But especially in a Minnesota case they have two
wins but they haven't necessarily played two highly ranked
opponents so if you're trying to build a resume that if you don't win the big
10 you're going for an at-large bid in the NCAA tournament having less games
played and those games played not necessarily being against big opponents I
think is a huge strike against you absolutely I think.
(14:00):
I can understand you doing three game style where you have your first game be
hard, kind of what we did, where your first game's hard, you have a week off
to your second game, and then you kind of get into those, you know,
two games a week type of schedule.
One, prep you for conference play. That's going to be Thursday, Sunday.
And two, if you're only playing these two games and you're focused on saving
(14:22):
these legs so much and putting such a large emphasis on it, I'm wondering what
their substitution rate is.
Like let's say you want just two
hard games throw in a third one that you know you
can win where you can see the depth of your roster and your program get
them game minutes get maybe some of these freshmen or newer players out
onto the field where you can actually see what they're capable of because training
(14:43):
is one thing but I mean you're never going to be able to replicate some of this
until you get into an actual game you know and there's some players who are
just game players you know and to be able to see what you're really capable
of as a roster as a school and as a program,
I think it's dangerous to not take advantage of all the time you have to really
get ready for conference season.
(15:04):
Yeah, I completely agree. And obviously, I would never want to speak this to
existence, but you never know when that player that's been playing all 90 minutes
might not be able to, whether it be injury, sickness, whatever happens.
And are you going to throw in someone that has no experience because you haven't
played the games where you're able to get them experience to then go in?
So I think you raise a great question in that and
(15:25):
we'll see if this risk reward that they're doing
pays off but it's definitely going to be something very interesting to track going
into Big Ten play as non-conference play is now halfway
over absolutely speaking of experienced and
big-time players you have Ohio State's with the first
half hat trick incredibly impressive she's
someone I actually got the opportunity to play against a lot growing up back
(15:46):
in my left outside back days I
got to mark her a lot and she's someone that you just kind of always watched and
you knew he was going to be a big name in college so honestly really
happy for her to see the success she's been having and I
don't think it comes as much of a surprise that she was able to pull this off
yeah I think she's unfortunately a player
that's kind of fallen to scheme of other big names around her whether it be
(16:08):
Kayla Fisher Emma Sears other big names that have been in the Ohio State program
so I think she's a very big threat and I think it's really good for her to finally
see some of her flowers that maybe she hasn't always gotten that recognition
for and I think it says a lot about the Ohio State program.
This is another program that I feel like always gets their way into the Big
Ten tournament, always somehow sneaks their way in there, you know,
(16:31):
does something to make it happen and always is an NCAA contender team.
So to see them off to a really great start already this year with some big time
players, it's going to be it's a program that I feel like isn't always talked
about, but it's always relevant somehow.
Yeah, absolutely. I definitely agree with that take. So yeah,
going to be a very, very interesting one.
And that is the big moments in the big life.
(16:53):
But Jordan, this week brought so many other news stories that we have got to cover.
And I know I've been dying to talk to you about all of this.
So let's hit it with the big news that dropped this week.
Okay. I mean, I think the biggest thing that everyone's looking at is the NWSL.
They they changed a bunch of their rules, but the big one being that they officially
(17:13):
got rid of the college draft.
You have everyone speculating what those potential impacts are going to be.
This was a huge thing for college students and college girls that they looked
forward to being able to enter their name and go into that draft.
And you kind of have this speculation of what is this going to look like and
how is this going to work in the future?
Yeah. So the new CBA has
(17:36):
officially been passed by the NWSL Players Association and
has been signed on by other members of the nwsl and with that brought a few
changes some of them being significantly that there is free agency when contracts
are expired players are supposed to be able to be notified and have a conversation
before trades happen there's supposed to be more.
(17:57):
Transparency and honoring of contracts which isn't always a thing in the nwsl
but one of the biggest headlines, as we know, is officially the NWSL college draft is gone.
And I woke up to this news and immediately started thinking about what this meant.
And I have a lot of different thoughts. And I think we are two very unique people
(18:17):
to have it as someone who is a senior in college and has someone who has just gone through the draft.
And yeah, I think my first initial reaction is honestly, thank God.
As someone who went through the draft process, I am extremely thankful for the
opportunities that I was blessed through it.
That being said, it was one of the worst and probably most unfair processes
(18:38):
that I've been through in my life.
And I don't think it is good for any party.
And so I think because of that, finally, the draft going away,
which I know is something that's been being pushed for a while, is a pretty good thing.
What was your instant reaction to this news, Jordan?
Jordan. Well, I would like to hear a little bit more about your thoughts on
(19:00):
why it was bad as someone who hasn't been through it and just an outside perspective
from always hasn't been watching soccer and kind of into that space.
I thought it was really exciting and a cool moment to get to share with your
friends and family and all that stuff.
And it was similar to all the other American sports we've seen where all these
big sports, you watch the basketball draft, you You watch the football draft.
(19:21):
Like that's the big thing. You watch these college players or players in general
enter the draft, enter their name and sign their pro careers.
So I am interested on your take as someone who has been through it and has been
watching as to why women's soccer would be different than any of the other sports
that already have a draft here.
Yeah. And I think that's a great point. And a great thing to note is that the
(19:43):
NWSL is officially the first major sporting league in the U.S.
That had a draft to then get rid of the draft. and I think it's creating a lot of conversation.
For me, I think the world's changed and I don't necessarily think that women's
soccer is different than the other sports.
I think I've seen a push for other sports to also get rid of their draft process,
especially when we have been professionalizing college sports more and more.
(20:07):
It feels weird to be professionalizing that avenue and then go through a draft process.
And here's the issue I have with the draft process. us.
As someone who went through it, and trust me, my moment of hearing my name called
and having that, I'm very, very grateful for it.
And I know if the draft wasn't there, I wouldn't have had that.
On the outside of the flashiness of it, and you get that big moment,
(20:32):
and you get everyone texting you, and you get your pictures taken and all this stuff,
I think there's a very big misconception on what that actually means and how things should work.
And what I mean by that is the NWSL at this moment, due to roster cap sizes,
you know, you could not have more than 26 members on a NWSL roster.
(20:55):
And a recent push, I would say, for the NWSL to really go after big international
players that have these big international careers and have been professional all their lives,
that creates less opportunities for college players to get drafted and then make the roster.
And I think a lot of people see that getting your drafted is means you're on
(21:16):
the team. And that is not the case at all.
And I know that, you know, I've talked about my own story and we know that that to be true.
But it's really hard to tell other people that. And I know people were like
in my family, like buying racing Louisville stuff. And I was like,
no, don't. I haven't made the team yet.
And that was a really big, like misunderstanding in that kind of regard.
I think with that, you draft 54 new people got drafted last year.
(21:39):
And I don't know the exact number. I'm not going to pretend like I do,
but I would venture to bet probably half actually are in the NWSL right now.
So why go through this process where you're drafting players,
claiming their rights into the NWSL, having some people not look into other
opportunities where they might actually play and develop and actually make a roster,
but we're going to claim these 50 players to go to the state where they may
(22:03):
not necessarily have chosen or see a fit for them and then cut them because
they don't have other options, but we own their rights.
And I think this is the inherent issue is right now there's not the space and
the NWSL to support for the draft class coming in.
And that hurts those that get
drafted. I think the also issue is you don't necessarily get to choose.
(22:25):
I'm very happy and very thankful for my time at Louisville, but who's to say
if I didn't get drafted somewhere else that my experience would have been different
or my outcome would have been different.
But I had no say in that manner. And I think that as an athlete,
it's the the same. It's going back to college recruiting. It's stocking rosters.
How many left backs do they have? Who do I want to learn under?
What coach do I have a relationship? Where is my in?
(22:47):
And I didn't have any chance to do that research myself.
And that gave me no say. And I think that that is where players feel like they're
pawns and they're numbers.
And I think getting rid of the draft takes away that part of an athlete being
a number and you're an athlete. And I think that gives a lot of power back to the players.
That's something I haven't really thought of, but I absolutely love that take.
(23:08):
And I think that the correlation between the professionalism of college soccer,
it does, this getting rid of the draft does lead to a smoother transition to
the NWSL because it's going to be a much similar process to what you already have been through.
In addition, I think a lot of the girls I've seen sign contracts in the NWSL were not drafted.
(23:30):
They got to go and they tried out for three, four different teams.
Games and, you know, do these different things with them.
And they ended up finding a home there versus people who got drafted,
had their rights, and then unfortunately didn't make that roster,
but had nowhere else to go.
I think the other thing this leads is the NWSL was set up for a lot of success
for the past four years with the COVID year, because any athlete who needed
(23:55):
to finish out their academics could do it now in four and a half years.
And then you would go and in the fall, you would enter the draft and you would
be done and go ahead and have that pro route.
Without that COVID year, the academic portion becomes you have to graduate in
three and a half years, which isn't always necessarily possible.
So you have girls either deciding to leave without a degree or you have the
(24:16):
semester where you finished out your degree and now what?
Because now the NWSL, that period is over. And where do you go?
You have to go overseas until the USL happen.
So my curiosity is how this will impact the USL as well.
If you don't have the NWSL draft, you have girls having these more options,
(24:37):
and you have the USL that's competing with the NWSL now, are girls going to
decide to finish out their degree in their four years?
And then the natural course would be to enter the USL instead of the NWSL because
that's the way your academic calendar falls.
And I'll be interested to see how that works out because I think the draft is
a big portion of why kids left early and they just entered their name into it
(25:00):
and were hoping to stay in America for it because the NWSL is a big thing.
Now you have kind of the option to do both even where you could go try out for
the NWSL if you don't make it, stay in school, and then do the USL.
Yeah. I actually didn't think of the academic portion. Naturally,
that part's way out of my brain. Why would I think about academics?
So I think you raise a really interesting point. And And I think what's going
(25:22):
to happen is you take your draft class last year, it was 54 people.
So let's just say 50 people.
I would venture to guess that we're going to see 12 to 15 max girls go straight to college to the NWSL.
And I think that the interesting thing that this is going to create is this
year, specifically, we have a double class.
(25:43):
Like you were just saying, this is the last year for fifth years.
Plus you have all the girls that don't have their fifth years, but only our seniors.
So you have a double class, and you're going to have less girls going to the NWSL than years before.
The interesting thing that I had thought of, but you completely almost proved
me wrong with the academic portion, is what are those girls going to do in December?
(26:04):
Because yes, the USL is around. I think it's a great another option to have
in the US, but they're going to be mid-season.
So are we going to see mass turnover rate in the USL rosters bringing in girls
from college that just got finished?
Are we going to see girls getting waived from USL rosters?
Or is there not going to be really spots for girls that are graduating in December
(26:25):
and looking for that next pro home in the USL either because they're only halfway
through their season and most of the rosters are all still around?
And I think it's going to overall create the USL a more competitive environment
to get that contract in the US in the next season of USL starting in August of next year.
But I think there's a lot of questions of what those players are going to do,
(26:45):
because I don't know realistically how many options are going to be open to the USL.
So is that still going to drive girls that want to play pro to go overseas?
Because my other thing is we have seen now two weekends of USL play.
And if you analyze starting lineups, girls who are getting a lot of minutes
in the USL, it is heavily skewed towards girls who have been professional for
(27:07):
multiple years beyond girls that are just fresh out of college.
The girls that are fresh out of college are on the bench in a couple of cases
starting, don't get me wrong, but others, majority of the people have had pro
experience and are now staying in the USL or coming back home.
So I wonder if it's going to almost create the opposite of the intention and
(27:28):
require girls to go overseas, get that professional experience to then come
back home to either play in the NWSL or the USL.
And so I think overall, there's a couple of massive implications long term that
I really have no idea how they're going to pay out by the draft going away.
Yeah, I don't think the draft will necessarily impact that because the same
spots that were available will continue to be available.
(27:50):
Now you'll just have those people who originally were kind of stuck because
their rights were held that now have the option to go overseas and will have that ability to.
I don't necessarily think that more girls will.
If you wanted to go to the NWSL, that spot is still available to you.
You'll still have that option to try out and that roster spot that was available
will continue to be available but yeah I think this will be really interesting
(28:14):
and again with some of the other rules with it with the ability to have a conversation
before you go and get traded and things of that nature to see how that pans out.
But yeah I think there's a lot of changes and it'll be interesting to see how
this all pans out in addition to girls maybe going pro earlier versus how that
affects the age in which kids It's transitioned from either sometimes even high
(28:39):
school to pro or college to pro and what that kind of looks like for an age range,
especially with the way college athletics is going.
And we'll get someone on here to talk more in depth about the way college athletics
is changing because it is changing very dramatically and very quickly.
But with it going to more of a professional setup with roster limits at 28 for the college
(29:01):
level i think it'll it'll be
interesting to see how this all plays out with both landscapes
changing so much within this next year you know who's gonna have kind of hold
more power yeah it's a lot of new territory and i think you know with that i
think we've hit on the immediate impacts of the draft but i am immediately thinking
(29:23):
in long term you know and i think just getting rid
of this college draft, not necessarily that getting rid of the draft makes these
things possible, but I think it is going to skew what we see the NWSL really doing.
And I think my prediction is that we're going to shift our soccer to a more European style.
And I don't think that that's a bad thing at all. I think it's just going to
(29:45):
be very interesting to see what steps we take with our uniqueness and the world
of being really the only world where the college soccer is that stepping step.
And kind of what I mean by this is, as we know, and like you said,
we're going to talk more as we still even learn about the new changes going into college soccer.
But we have roster caps of 28 people and scholarships in moments like this are
(30:10):
also now funded by schools.
Schools so who's to say that if i'm
a professional scout and i have tabs on
joe schmoe in missouri i might
just have a certain college here's their scholarship money we're gonna have
them play for you for two years and then we're gonna have them sign pro to get
that development or how that scampage like i could see a world where college
(30:34):
almost becomes a feeder team to these professional professional environments
and kind of use that as a money funneling mechanism.
Because with NIL, with all these opportunities, nothing really is stopping them
from using college as a placement hold for the girls that they have their eyes
on that just need a couple more years or a couple more minutes or whatever that is.
(30:54):
And because of that, I feel like we're going to see certain universities get
those opportunities and maybe certain universities not.
And I think the inherent Transparent naiveness, maybe, of the draft is going
away of where everyone has a fair shot.
And everyone puts their name in and we're going to see what happens.
I know it wasn't exactly the world we lived in, but the draft was a place where
(31:16):
a girl that played at Iowa who never had anyone drafted could hear her name get called.
And I think that this officially means that we have moved away from that thinking in a lot of regards.
So you don't think that in the future, a school that doesn't historically turn
girls pro will have the option to turn girls pro anymore?
(31:37):
I think it's going to be a lot harder to get a direct funnel from pro to the NWSL.
I think it's going to open a lot of doors for either overseas or USL or things like that.
But my prediction is with this, I
could see professional professional schools really
looking at the certain schools that I
(31:58):
feel like we all can think of that you were your brain would immediately go to
because if I'm scouting players I'm scouting that school I'm
scouting the girls committing to that school more than I'm looking at you know
someone else down the street maybe and so I don't know that's just my prediction
of where I think that this can go but I feel like it is going to take away from
(32:18):
those maybe smaller schools where girls are trying to go pro.
I would have to, I think I agree with that, but not because of the NWSL legislation
changes, because of the college legislation changes and because college is going
to become more of a monopoly of those top teams and programs,
specifically the football teams.
Because I mean, you know, quickly, like schools that are buying into the media
(32:41):
rights have to pay their football players $24 million.
If a university doesn't have that money, which most, Most smaller schools,
D3, NAIA, they don't have – anyone without a good football team doesn't have that.
You're creating a monopoly of the top schools and the top programs with the
best football teams that are then going to funnel down into the rest of your sports.
(33:02):
With 28 scholarships available now, in theory, they still have to be Title IX
compliant, whereas the salary basis that you can pay players does not have to be.
Available that yes I think you can have feeder teams with
these schools and it will make sense for them to be starting to do
that and to do those things with those
kind of top schools that are going to start to separate from the rest and there's
(33:24):
going to be a lot bigger discrepancy between those top programs and the bottom
ones where prior everyone could have been on a semi equal playing field now
I don't even think you're going to get some of those smaller schools to be traveling
to go play some of the better schools to see where they stand because they can't
afford forward the travel budget,
because there will be a lot of budget cuts coming to, I think, everywhere.
(33:44):
Yeah, no, that's a good point. I think my other question with the NWSL draft
officially going away, too, is you kind of hit on it, but what age do we really
think that this is going to make college soccer players go pro?
And we've seen it more and more, you know, girls after their first or second
years entering their name in a draft.
But I feel like you're still looking at the draft pool, evaluating your odds,
(34:07):
evaluating different things, who's in your class, where's that draft going to
go, and there's a lot more unknown.
But if I'm a player and I can have an agent where.
My pro team is calling me directly saying that they want to offer me this money
and it's a lot more guaranteed versus the draft and I'm able to have a conversation with that team,
why wouldn't that leave at 18, at 19, after my first, second year of college
(34:31):
if I already have a pro team with a contract ready to go.
There's a lot less risk in girls leaving college early than there was.
I feel like the girls that left college early were only because they knew that
they were going to be the first or second draft pick.
And so I think that this is going to enable girls like who's to say,
oh, I have a pro offer on the table. My college team isn't doing great. I'm out.
(34:52):
I feel like those quick decisions are going to happen more too,
which is going to kind of just open up new terrain in a lot of regards.
Are you allowed to have an agent now? i'm not
sure but i think there's going to be a lot of underhand stuff
legal i think the biggest thing is
if they open it up because as of right now you're allowed to have an nil agent
(35:13):
i don't believe you're allowed to have an agent that advocates for your soccer
ability in any regard still if they open that up where you're allowed to have
an agent while playing collegiately absolutely i agree 100 that that will be
happening and with the you know the college landscape turning essentially pro level,
I do think there's a lot less emphasis on the academic portion where you are here for athletics,
(35:36):
you're here to play soccer, you're here to be a successful athlete rather than
a student athlete like it was before.
In with a lot less emphasis on the academics, you're going to have girls leaving
college a lot easier and a lot sooner because they don't really care about the
degree that's coming with their education.
Yeah, I completely agree. I think overall, the biggest thing that this is, is change.
(35:57):
And you hit the nail on the head and you said the college landscape is changing
and officially the pro landscape is too.
And so I hate to be like, oh, there's so much unknown. Like there is clearly
stuff we do know within this unknown, but I think the next couple of years,
We're going to see a massive shift in the soccer landscape in general.
You know, this is a long shot, but I wouldn't be surprised to start seeing NWSL
(36:18):
teams launch academies.
Why wouldn't they have a Kansas City Current Academy that they can grow?
And honestly, in some ways, we're seeing this.
I've seen on my social media, I'm not necessarily sure what exactly is going
on, but there's a bunch of youth players that went with Kansas City Current
to Spain and were playing like professional organizations in Spain,
and they were just bringing these youth players along. long.
(36:40):
There are pro teams right now that are scouting the 16, 17-year-olds before they go to college.
So what's stopping them from just creating an academy where they bring in their
own talent, they have their rights, they see their trajectory,
and it makes the pathway to signing pro without even having that college step a lot more feasible.
So if it's not official, a Kansas City Current or a Portland Thorns or whatever
(37:02):
it is, academy, I could see partnerships with club teams very much developing, if that makes sense.
Yeah, yeah, it does. And like you said, I think there's just so much unknown.
And as someone who is officially out of it, you know, your perspective,
I think, is unique and can be exciting to kind of watch as someone who is very
(37:23):
much still in this landscape.
I think it's been a bit terrifying and it's impacted, even though I'm on my
way out, it's impacted a lot of my decision making and my career thus far.
So So it's been a crazy couple
of years to watch as women's soccer has kind of taken off and grown and come
to this point where there's going to be so much change and it's going to look
(37:44):
so different by the time my sister's 10 years younger than me and by the time
she's going through all of this and she's looking at her future and even the
way it's trickled down into club levels and things of that nature,
it's really crazy to watch how quickly it is all changing.
Changing yeah and I feel like I was
in college soccer at such a unique age and I'm very very happy I was when I
(38:08):
am and it's just going to be interesting to watch this trajectory change but
I think we could all know that five years from now college soccer pro soccer
even youth soccer we're not going to have the same landscape absolutely.
Jordan, with that being said, a lot of news has dropped, but also a lot of stuff's
going on in our lives as college soccer players and in different aspects of that regard.
(38:33):
Let's talk a little bit more. How was senior night, and what else was some of
those unexpected emotions that you maybe had during senior night?
Yeah, yeah. So as we all know, I have struggled with a knee injury.
I tore my PCL a couple months ago and due to, I think, miscommunication with
my medical staff and just some unforeseen and unexpected setbacks, I was out for a while.
(39:00):
I'm fully healthy now, capable to play.
But a lot of the conversation I had around my coaching staff and in general,
There was a lot of uncertainty with me coming back and my return to play.
I sat the first two games. I did not see the field.
And going into my senior night, it was a conversation of whether or not I should
(39:22):
have, would have, could have redshirt.
In a very panicked text I sent to Sam Carey, I was like, what should I do?
I ultimately decided to play in my senior night.
I think I made that decision one out of
fear because we were talking so much about how the landscape is
changing with 28 person roster caps anywhere I would
go means someone would have to get cut for a school to take me
(39:44):
most likely with the way scholarships are changing you don't know how much money
a school is going to have a school doesn't know how much money they're going
to have to be able to offer scholarships to you know students and unless I go
back home to Ohio I am an out-of-state student which would be a huge financial
burden to take on in addition to figuring
out the academic portion of it and what that eligibility would look like as an engineering major,
(40:06):
credits don't really transfer, unfortunately.
So I would be a little bit stuck there. And there were so many moving aspects.
In any other year, I had begged the universe.
This is all I ever wanted was a fifth year.
I wanted an extra year in college to figure it out, to reach my potential.
I feel like I'm just starting to become the person and player I'm supposed to be.
(40:28):
And I'm not ready for it to end and to have such a huge setback in terms of
my health and to be out for so long and really kind of I feel like missed my shot for this season.
You know, any other year it would have been a no-brainer. But because of logistics
and the way the landscape is changing, I chose to play.
And I think some of the unexpected emotions that came from it was,
(40:48):
one, the gratitude of this program, what it's meant for me, what it's given for me.
All of those things that I expected to feel, but also the sadness of that this
wasn't supposed to be my story.
That this isn't how it was supposed to end for me.
And then, honestly, the second I stepped foot on the field, a little bit of regret.
(41:08):
I wish hindsight, I think I should have taken my red shirt.
I did not realize quite how far I had fallen on our roster, which is hard because
one, I have three years of experience.
I feel like I've done so much and proven so much. And as a player who has always
played, you know, at most I've been the number three forward,
(41:30):
still getting good minutes.
And I've always been on the field.
You know, last year I started for most of our games. I've been,
I've had a successful career thus far.
I feel like I've proven a lot and I didn't realize, like I said,
quite how far I had fallen.
And it felt very much so like I got 14 kind of pity minutes on my senior night
(41:53):
in a game where, you know, Ohio is a good team, but a game where we were dominating
and we knew we were going to win and should win.
It became a realization that if I'm not playing against Ohio,
it's going going to be very hard for me to play anywhere else and to give
some more insight on it yes the season's long this is only our third game but
as someone who's been through the college landscape before just a way our schedule
(42:15):
works is mondays you're off day tuesday it depends how your coach does it and
how kind of hard your week was some days everyone trains on tuesdays and sometimes
it's a regen and a non-regen group so essentially all the players that had high
lows or good minutes for that week will go and do kind of an active recovery
cool down session while the bottom half of your roster the people who didn't
(42:37):
play you know according to the coaching staff will go and they'll train.
And then Wednesday's your pregame, Thursday's our game, Friday's regen,
non-regen, Saturday's pregame, Sunday's game, Monday's off.
So once you get through that preseason phase and you start getting in consistent
gameplay, you are never really on an equal playing field with the players who are playing.
(43:00):
You never really get an opportunity to prove yourself again because you're not
playing against them. You're not playing with your whole team, with your whole roster.
You're out of time almost. like it's it becomes very
very hard to work your way out of it
in addition to just from a player perspective like Mondays are
off and then your Thursday and Sundays are
(43:20):
off if you're not playing like you have to figure out a way to go
and run condition lift get on the ball
and do all the things that the team that is playing is doing on
those days because you're sitting on the bench like you have to figure out a
way to not only close that gap but just really try to prevent it from growing
every day and every week that you're not playing so with that I think you know
(43:43):
the realization hit me that that this isn't going to go the way I had hoped or expected and.
In the moment I think you know I've gone through so many
emotions since then where you're kind of you're sad you're mourning
it and it becomes a question of and I got a
question I guess for you you Sam at what point
does an athlete when I'm looking
(44:06):
at this I'm at what point
are you allowed to be sad at what point do you adjust the expectations for your
season and at what point do you like not necessarily give up but you have to
stop being devastated over where you stand and look at the facts that are presented
while it is only the third game knowing everything I know I I do feel like it's.
(44:29):
It's hard and I don't necessarily like want to give up, but if I'm continuing
to be sad over my career, every game, then at what point is that selfish of me? Yeah.
And does that all come out of being a bad teammate?
It's an amazing question. And first of all, I think you sharing this is a lot
because we pride ourselves on being authentic and talking about the highs and
(44:52):
lows of college soccer and there's highs and lows.
I think the thing that I also
am hearing from you without hearing from you knowing a college
experience is not only do you feel like it's game three
you also feel like your coaching staff has written you
off and it's a reality and it's a reality I saw time and time again in my college
(45:12):
career through other college careers your coaches are there to win games it's
a business and they care about you my college coach cared a lot about me I'm
not saying anything about that but it's also their job and their livelihood.
And with that being said, when they're choosing starting lineups,
when they're choosing minutes, they have to go with what they trust and they
(45:33):
trust the people that they're going in day in and day out with.
And not that they don't trust you as a human or anything else.
I don't want people to misunderstand that, but there is a business side of college athletics.
And I think a lot of coaches get into this site of when an athlete is no longer
beneficial to my goal, they get written off and there's no time for a comeback.
(45:56):
We all love a comeback story. We love the underdog story of the girl who sat
the bench and waited their time and their time came.
And frankly, it happens. There's a girl at Iowa who I'm so proud of that's doing
it right now, who's playing in my spot as a senior, who never really got a shot
and got her shot her senior year. And that's great.
But we also know the other stories
where you very much get written off and then the new blood comes in.
(46:18):
And why invest in the old blood when the new blood is going to be there for
four years and get them the experience to keep growing?
And even because you're old news now and that sounds so mean,
but it's true. And it's the ugly side of college talker.
I think to answer your question, you are now in a phase of your life where you proved it on Sunday.
(46:40):
You had your senior night. you have done
so much for your program whether it be on
the field off the field you know the impact you made to that program you
have proof of the impact you made to that program so
now you do get to be selfish because you have given yourself and there's a balance
there and what I mean by you get to be selfish is you get to do what's best
(47:03):
for you and what is going to make you happy at a certain point like I said I
know I can hear what you're saying in a lot of regards without hearing what
you're saying. You've been written off.
And with that fact comes a new place for you on your team.
It might not be the girl who scores the game-winning goal in the Penn State
game to win the Big Ten championship, and that sucks.
(47:26):
And you have every right to mourn that, to be sad about that,
and to process that emotionally.
And no one gets to take that away from you, no matter what.
You also have an opportunity because there is another side of the roster that you maybe haven't seen.
And that is the other girls that have been written off, that have been injured,
(47:48):
that are still writing their story and don't know how.
So now when you feel ready, you get to be a leader to them.
And I know it sounds like a pity role. I had this conversation with my college
roommate a lot, who was another girl that in a lot of regards got written off.
And a lot of that comes from what do you want your last year to be?
Because we're in your last year. And that sucks that it's a reality, but it's a reality.
(48:11):
So now how do we make the most of it? For her, she was the best goddamn cheerleader there was.
She was the best hype man. And that was her thing.
She got to be on the bench. Our coach traveled her everywhere because no one was louder than her.
And she made genuine friendships with people through that. People that she maybe
(48:31):
not have even talked to that much on the team because they weren't around each other.
And that was her thing. That might not be your thing.
Your thing might be that you're going to send and you're going to be the best
fight person in the pregame locker room and you're going to be the DJ and you're
going to be dancing and that's going to be your thing.
You have a right to have a thing. You have given enough to this program to get
(48:53):
your thing and get an ending, even if it's not the ending you want.
And to have an impact on the team, knowing you have an impact on the team your senior year.
And I think that's the biggest thing you hear all the time, everyone has a role,
everyone's role has value.
You now have an opportunity to prove to other people that everyone's role has
value, being someone who has now seen both sides.
(49:13):
And that's not going to be easy. And you're going to have to show true strength
and true leadership and true commitment to do that because that role kind of sucks. Let's be real.
But now you have a platform and an opportunity to do that.
And I a lot longer of an impact than scoring that goal against Penn State that's
a lifelong impact that you're going to make on your teammates in your program
(49:36):
that's not a one game impact yeah I think when you said like you know I'm obviously
a little emotional this isn't how I expected,
my senior year to go with such high hopes and expectations and you know you
have two sides of it where I am so happy for my team and we win and we do these
things and we do have a lot of those hero stories, like the people had me,
(49:58):
you know, I got to play over for so many years and now they're finally getting
their shot and opportunity and you have that excitement for them while still
being sad about your own ambitions, goals and careers and kind of starting to
mourn the death of something that isn't over yet.
And it's a very weird feeling because I'm still here showing up,
training and doing all these things while balancing the reality that it is not
(50:21):
going to go the way I wish it would.
You know, and I think my roommate put it best, who she said,
it's like it's it's like doing drugs.
Like the highs are so high and the lows are so low.
But once once you have that moment, like the lows are so devastating low because
you you tie your identity into it.
(50:42):
This is all I've ever known is to be an athlete, is to be a soccer player,
is to be someone who has an impact on the field.
And it's it's hard and when you
when you get that strip from you you know those lows where
you lose that sense of self and you lose that part of you
that you you love so much it was one of my favorite parts of
me was being an athlete and being a good one you know and you start to lose
(51:08):
that and you you chase these moments where i can still feel myself looking out
onto a sold out you know to Martin Stadium and scoring a goal and running over to those teams and,
you know, having them all hug me and getting to stand there and embrace it and
to really take in that moment.
Like the highs are so high and you chase them for the rest of your career trying to get to that.
(51:30):
And it's like doing drugs. And I feel like I'm going through like some severe withdrawals right now.
Like it's hard and it's sad. And it is something where I have to learn what
that new identity looks like,
you know because we are recording this on Tuesday Sunday was this kind of abrupt
realization of where I'm going to be so I haven't necessarily processed all
(51:53):
this or figured it out yet,
but it is it is the unfortunate reality
of college athletics it is not all you know sunshine and rainbows and as successful
as a career I have had like I'm I'm at a new point in it where I I unfortunately
am at one of those lows in my drug addiction of soccer and of being an athlete here.
(52:17):
Yeah, I think, you know, it opens itself to a bigger conversation about our identity as athletes.
And it's one that I know is happening more and more and thankfully at a younger and younger level.
But I think, you know, if I were to sit here and be on my high horse and say,
Jordan, you are so much more than an athlete and you have so many other,
(52:38):
you know, and I know you know this and if I can say it to you all you want,
but I'm going to be so honest if I were in the exact same situation with you
right now, I wouldn't be feeling any different.
You know, we like to all act like we're emotionally healthy and we can handle
all these things and we know everything and we know that we're more than an athlete.
And yes, in my brain, I know, but in my heart, I don't.
(52:58):
And we can think and we can say all these things, but until you truly know it, you don't, you don't.
And I am well aware that if I were in your shoes, I would be feeling the exact same way.
So I definitely do not want this to come off of like here's jordan How everything
you can do and now you can fix it and be happy because it's not And I think
the best part about this is how willing and open you're willing to be about
(53:19):
this And it's going to be documented.
I'm very sorry But other people are going to know the highs and the lows and
the process that this is because it is a process.
And it's a grieving and it's a morning and it's a high and it's a crash and
so So I think the best thing is we're going to ride out this season together
and it's going to be a journey no matter what it is.
(53:41):
And but I think the best thing that you have is the impact that you have on
the program and you have physical evidence of that.
So you've hit your legacy on the field, but what's your legacy off the field?
And that's now the question you get to answer. But it doesn't have to be answered this week.
It doesn't have to be answered this month.
You know, I think it's it's a journey for you in the next couple of weeks,
in the next month or months.
(54:02):
And we'll do it together. Yeah. Lucky you guys. We'll keep you updated on it.
Like I said, I definitely don't have it figured out yet.
And it is something that is, you know, I feel like I've hit every single aspect
you can hit in a career here at college.
You know, I think this is the last step.
Last chapter for me to close here so absolutely well
(54:24):
with that what does Michigan State have this week
what are we what what games do we have going on this week what
is our preview for all listeners as we should
tune into college soccer this weekend yeah well
I mean obviously our expectation as a team and as a program
is always to win so we plan
on doing that but we have another Thursday sign Thursday Sunday
(54:45):
lineup both at home with Ole Miss
and then Xavier so should be
a pretty good week here at times some big games going
out of Michigan State that'll be super exciting I'll definitely have to try
to tune into that Ole Miss one that'll be a fun little SEC Big Ten matchup going
into Swedish Domos Vonsken play I mean I know we all are keeping up with the
(55:06):
season and doing everything there we will travel down to Trelleborg which I
know you all know where it is and it just you know, check it off the map, duh, name recognition.
But no, we are currently still sitting fifth place in the league.
And as a team moving that table, unfortunately got the tie in the Derby this
last weekend, but we did get to play in front of around 6,000 fans.
(55:28):
And so huge environment to be in very, very thankful to be getting pro minutes
here and playing and experiencing life in Sweden.
But yeah, a lot of big games, a lot of big matchups this weekend,
Again, Big Ten Plus is always where you can find Big Ten play,
but ESPN Plus as well as your streaming Big Ten network, SEC network,
ACC network, there's always college soccer games going on on Thursdays and Sundays,
(55:51):
and we very, very much encourage you guys to tune in and keep up with the conversation
and what's going on with college soccer. Thanks, guys.
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