Episode 114 - Shoot For The Sun (1986) - The Culture Swally

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
[Music]

(00:15):
Hello and welcome to the Culture Swally, a podcast dedicated to Scottish news and pop culture.
My name is Nicky and I'm joined as always by the man who's just had to throw away half his mince
because someone did a shite in it.
It's Greg! How are you today, buddy?
Yeah, I'm all right, I'm okay.
As you can see, I'm wearing my choose life t-shirt today.

(00:35):
I noticed that. I noticed that you've been choosing life today.
I've not been choosing life because I've been up since 3.45 am.
Oh, so I see my parents off to the airport and then I had to go to a conference
which is not my natural habitat because I just a judgey wanker.
[Laughs]
I didn't even think, I was just spoken about that.
You'd say, "You left it 4 this morning and I didn't even think because it's currently 8.45 pm

(01:00):
your time that we're recording this because we did stick to our original schedule because obviously your parents are alive.
Well, not much, I just feel like I've probably done it at the weekend and just beasted it.
But, well, we're here now.
It's right, it's out of the way.
I'd be looking forward to talking about our film today anyway.
But, you know, what I did was I got up, I saw them off.

(01:21):
I went for a run, so I ran, I did 7K this morning.
I came back, I got back about 20 past 5 and I'd been watching Doc Martin.
So, Jason Reitman.
Jason Reitman's made a film about the last 3 hours before they recorded the first episode of Saturday Night Live.
Oh, yes, yeah.
It's not called Saturday Night Live.

(01:44):
Yes, it's Saturday Night Live.
It's got one of our favourites in it, Ella Hunt.
Oh, yes, that's right, yeah.
She plays Gilda Radner and the guy who plays the riddler in Gotham plays Chevy Chase.
And there's one or two other actors that I recognise in there, but mostly it's unknowns, really.

(02:05):
And if we hadn't done anything in the apocalypse, I probably wouldn't have known Ella Hunt either.
But, I really enjoyed it.
It's really, really good.
It's really tight, so in 90 minutes.
And it's funny.
It's really funny.
And they're all, you know, they, whilst they might not look exactly like the people they're playing.
I think for the most part, this feels like they've got them down, you know, as they could see.

(02:29):
Nice.
So, I recommend that it's really, really good.
I will have to watch that.
I did know that was coming because I do like Jason Reitman.
And I think I follow an Instagram because of course the Ghostbusters Association.
And, yeah, I follow Ella Hunt and Instagram as well because I'm a pervert.
Yeah, I, yeah.
I know that was coming out.
But I love her.

(02:52):
Love's a strong work, but I do, yeah.
I had my own her work.
Yeah, very good.
Oh, yeah, I'll have to give that a viewing, that's fantastic.
Now my schedule's free.
Now Big Brothers finished.
I've got a lot more time on my hands.
I will say that the actor who plays John Belushi does bear quite a shriken resemblance.
But, yeah, no, it's good film.

(03:13):
I really enjoyed it.
So, yeah, I watched that.
Then I got my, I woke my daughter's up for school.
Went back to bed and I would be grabbed at maybe 45 minutes whilst they were getting ready for school and everything.
And then I got up and went to my fucking, my daughter's dishwasher conference.
Oh, very good.
Oh, well, thank you.
It's all right.

(03:34):
Thank you for getting me freebies.
I know just how they're fun.
So, he's not like...
Yeah, but then, the shite you would get anyway, you just end up clattering up the house.
So, in a way, what you're going to do with that pen and a key ring and a mug.
You cannot have too many pens.
You know, I mean, it's like, I know.
So, a bunch of you know, stock up on stationery, like notebooks and pens and things.
You know, many notebooks are filled during this podcast over the last four years.
Yeah, I did fill quite a few when we first started doing it.

(03:58):
But then, about 80 months ago, I went digital.
And, do you all mind what's in my iPad?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, that's what I should do.
I sometimes do do, but sometimes do do my notes on my phone.
But then I always end up sort of transcribing them and it's my notebook.
Okay.
Yeah.
That's all right.
I'm trying to save the trees.
I'm all school.
I'm all school.
That's okay.

(04:19):
I'm all along with that.
I'm a Renaissance man.
You're choosing life.
I'm choosing life.
What?
I'm choosing life.
Wonderful.
Oh, Keen.
I'm choosing life.
Well, since it is quite late, you're a time.
Let's get cracking.
Shall we have a look at what's been happening in Scotland over the last couple of weeks?
Here's the jingle.
Hello.
This is the Outdoor Heavard East Broadcasting Corporation.

(04:47):
And here is what's been going on in the new...
Okay, Greg.
What have you seen in Scotland over the last couple of weeks you'd like to share with me and
are lovely listeners?
Well, my... you both have new stories this week.
Concerned celebrities.
One who...
Who... I think will be known internationally this summer extent.

(05:08):
And one is probably just for the Brits.
But I'll start with my international celebrity.
So wouldn't... you know, at the time of recording Donald Trump has been reelected President
of the... of the US.
And a Scottish actor, near and dear to our hearts, Tommy Flanagan, has decided to quit his

(05:30):
life in the US after 20 years.
And returned to Scotland both in both to live and to work.
So renowned for roles in hit series in movies like Gladiator, Peaky Blinders and Sons of
Anarchy.
Tommy is among a group of Hollywood personalities looking to leave the USA.

(05:52):
At 59, Tommy disclosed his time to come home.
I just want to come back here, I've been away too long.
The elaborate doesn't unhit his intentions to return to Scottish life and work after spending
over two decades entrenched in the American film and TV industry.
He told the day they record, although the story comes from Glasgow live.

(06:13):
I think it's time to move back to school.
I've been in the US for over 25 years and it's time to come home, especially after Trump
getting back in the White House.
Marie Tadina, with whom she shares his 12 year old daughter, Aung Janu, I think I'm saying
it right.
Flanagan expressed a strong desire to transfer his personal and professional roots back to

(06:33):
Scotland.
Further, sharing his disapproval of the US political scene he commented, and based over
there, and my home is over there, but it's time to get away from that Trump.
I don't want to say I want to leave America because of him, but it's not made me want to
stay put it that way.
It's disgusting, so we'll see.
If I start talking about it, I'll go fucking mental.

(06:54):
You're saying that?
Yeah, but it's not good.
Tommy also reflected it on his connection to Scotland, despite his lengthy residence in
California.
He said, "I don't feel I've been gone that long to be honest with you, I really don't.
I'll go to California has been his base for an extensive period."
He mused, "Home is California at the moment and it has been over 25 years."

(07:16):
Despite this, the lure of his native land remains powerful.
With hopes to bring his daughter, who is Scottish by the scent, will borne in the US to experience
life in Scotland.
You imagine that, fucking California at Glasgow.
That's going to be one hell of a culture shock.
Why is the sky so low?

(07:37):
I was on my way back here, I was on my way back years ago, and then my daughter came along,
and she was born over there although she is Scottish, but I want to bring her over here.
Tommy who grew up in Glasgow's Easter house bears distinctive facial scars from a knife
attack outside a nightclub where he was DJing, after being assaulted by a gang attempt into
robin.
He was persuaded to try acting by his friend Robert Carlyle, when he was recovering in

(07:59):
hospital.
He gained fame in Mill Gibson's 1995 Braveheart and then Ramsey's rat catcher, which may
or may not be coming to the culture swell in 2025.
His mother's play in the Cicero, opposite Russell Crowe and Wachien Phoenix in Ridley Scots
2000 film Gladiator, his other roles include Garden Gardens.

(08:22):
Gardens of the Galaxy volume 2, Alien vs Predator, the game and Charlie Zangel's full throttle.
But he's perhaps best known for his role as Outlaw Biker, Flip Chibs Telford in the Crime
TV drama series Sons of Anarchy from 2008 to 2014.
After arriving in Glasgow over the weekend to resent his friends, casting director Des Hamilton

(08:44):
with an outstanding contribution to craft award at the star studded BAFTA Scotland Awards,
Flaregan revealed that he signed up to start filming Guy Richie's Rate Latest Project.
Richie, the director of Lockstalk and the gentlemen and tons of other films has recruited
him to join a star studded cast that includes Helen Marin, Pierce Brosnan and Tom Hardy for

(09:05):
the Associate of London-based Gangster series which will air on Parliament+.
Tommy enthused, I just got back to present an award to my best pal Des for outstanding contribution
to casting.
He's a phenomenal guy, he's been a friend of mine for the past 40 years and it's a pleasure
to be that and to be back in my hometown.

(09:26):
So that's Old Tommy Flanagan making a glorious return back to Ecos.
I mean, we make a lot of selfish reasons quite chuffed with that because he's going to start
being in some Scottish stuff, that's brilliant.
I do like Tommy Flanagan, he's a very distinctive, not just because of his scars but he's a distinctive
character actor and he's got a brilliant actor as well, always really liked him.

(09:50):
So yeah, I'm chuffed, you know, it's a shame that he's decided he's got a packet in and
it moved but it means we're going to probably see him in River City sometimes soon.
I hope they're not in River City, I'm sure you'll do more interesting stuff on that but
it's sort of adjacent to this, I did see a very short article about Peter Mullin complaining

(10:15):
about this sort of heft of Scottish drama of late, you know, which is quite ironic considering
that our film today is written by some very hefty Scottish writer, you know, of the 70s
and 80s.
Yeah, I know I would agree with that.
There have been some great shows over the last few years but not enough, I would say.

(10:39):
Yeah, there hasn't been enough fantastic Scottish output and I did think, I didn't read that
article but I saw the headline was, you know, complaining there wasn't enough like working
class kind of social stories.
You know, I did watch the first episode of the new series of Rebus the other week, I'm
not the chance to kind of plow on but now that my visitors have gone and that's the top

(11:01):
my list to get through.
And it was good, you know, it really wasn't what I expected, you know, at all, very, very
different to the other iterations of Rebus state.
But yeah, I sort of take his point really because you know, the orphans is very much about
a working class family coming to terms with the death of the mother and managing their grief

(11:22):
and stuff and he's obviously written and directed that and then Ned's again is at any working
class story.
So, you know, my name is Joe as well.
Of course, yeah, I mean, but he didn't write that, did he?
No.
But yeah, absolutely, you know, and I don't think, you know, Ken Moach hasn't made a film
in Scotland for quite a long time, I don't think.

(11:44):
He's been a bit speed 16 as a last one.
A fun guest perhaps after speed 16.
The angel share.
The angel share.
Probably the last one.
Yeah, and that's, yeah, that's okay.
But it's still old, though, it's not.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, yeah, I thought it would be good to see, yeah, Tomi back.
So, yeah, good luck to him and hope he enjoys his move, does daughter enjoys the move as

(12:04):
well.
Yeah, no.
At all.
What's a Catholic dad?
Anyway.
So, that's my first story this week.
What are you, what are you starting with?
My first story is from the Scottish son last week, Greg, and the headline reads, "Not
very wise."
Youngsters at a Scott's primary school were left terrified after a parent launched a

(12:28):
creepy prank.
The practical jokes saw kids at Lawrence's current primary school in Aberdeenshire,
frightened during pickup time on Thursday.
A parent dressed in a Halloween costume appears at a classroom window and startled children
in primary one and two.
So, come on, it's like five and six, you don't.
He petrified the youngsters while dressed as Pennywise the Clown from Stephen King's It.

(12:56):
The character is famous for the horror author's iconic tale of a group of kids battling a
demon, praying on the youngsters of their town who takes the form of a click.
Pennywise was betrayed by Tim Curry in the original film and then Bill Scarsgard brought
the red nose demon to life in the 2017 reeming.
Teachers had to quickly close the classroom blinds to shield the kids from the sight of

(13:17):
the sinister circus performer, but seeing the bone-chilling costume still left some children
extremely scared.
Staff at the school had to go outside and tell off the dad for his inappropriate prank.
Could you imagine the teacher's ifony coming out of it?
He's just standing in the playground dressed as Pennywise and his own.

(13:38):
This isn't funny, support had to be offered to some of the young pupils after the ill-judged
antics.
It is understood that the dad donned the mask while standing with other parents outside
the school, with some having to get their kids to look away to prevent them from being scared.
Some were believed to try and have warned the prankster against the Clownstown, one told
the P&J, he walked into the playground and I did think it was odd, because it's not Halloween

(14:01):
anymore.
It was definitely odd, and he was a bloody, scary-looking clown.
It was very creepy.
Others have slammed the prank with one saying that their child was petrified.
An Aberdeen-Shar council spokesperson said, "We're aware that a parent dressed in a Halloween
costume appeared at a classroom window at pickup time frightening the children."

(14:25):
Staff acted swiftly by pulling down the blinds and reassuring the pupils.
We emphasized to the parent this was very ill-judged and extremely appropriate behaviour.
The safety and wellbeing of our pupils is our utmost priority and we acted quickly to
resolve the situation.
So kids are fucked up.
What would you dress up as if you were going to a playground?
Sorry, what were you going to say?

(14:48):
Kids are just like, "Fucking soft."
Now, I had a conversation, I'd be very, very, very careful here, but I'm friends with
a couple here in Dubai.
You can British couple.
And they got a five-year-old.
Now, when I was five, I was born in 1978, so when I was five in 1983, I was fucking obsessed

(15:09):
with Star Wars.
I was obsessed with the Superman films of Christopher Reeves.
They wanted to live and let die.
The James Bond film.
It was first Bond film I'd ever seen.
They completely fascinated by it.
And then one night, I'm sure I mentioned this in the pod before, but my dad rented raiders

(15:30):
of the Lost Ark from the video shop.
My granny Papa walked up because they lived down the road from us in Colesayth, walked up
to watch the film.
We all watched the film.
Berna Mines that film ends with melting Nazis.
But, I mean, I'm absolutely fine.
So this wee boy is a fucking massive Star Wars film, right?

(15:50):
He's got lots of Star Wars Lego.
He's got other Star Wars toys.
The only one they've met him see is the Phantom Menace, which is not good.
Dora Smog gets cut in half, but he's not even a good film, right?
And apparently, it was breaking his heart when Liam Neeson took the old Anakin Skywalker

(16:11):
away from his mum, right?
So I said, "Look, you don't want me to watch the original Star Wars films, because they
will always be the best ones, right?"
I said that.
I said that absolutely fine.
So the wife hadn't watched the first Star Wars film for a long time, so she decided to vet
it.

(16:32):
And she sends me a picture of the charred bodies.
I knew you were going to like to say that.
Of the Skywalker's auntie and uncle.
She's like, "It's only the only living relative that he knows about, just being burnt to
death."
I was like, "Yeah, just what you guess was past that bit, you know?"
That's a very valid point.

(16:54):
Well, I'm the same as you.
Like my mum didn't really bother what I watched.
When I was five or so, it was like Ghostbusters and you, man, and the 18 was what I was into.
You know, and nobody died in 18, but it was so violent for a kid.
And TJ Hooker, I'd house the fucking love TJ Hooker.

(17:15):
Like street hawk and stuff.
Is it that you don't get those types of shows for kids?
I mean, those shows weren't really for kids, but they kind of were.
I mean, the 18, so definitely was, wasn't it?
Come on.
Yeah, I mean, all the marching dice and stuff.
But then it wasn't till I wasn't much older, I'd say maybe about eight, nine at the oldest,

(17:38):
and fucking loved Robocop.
And remember, playing Robocop in the playground.
And police academy.
Used to play police academy with my friends, like I used to want to be my honey.
Looking back now, I watched police academy.
It was wholly inappropriate for me to be watching it at that age, but it, I didn't bother
me or scar me or anything.
I've said before, and I remember going to visit my cousins when I was 11 and they're asking

(18:02):
me my favorite film and I said it was Childs Play.
Because at that time it genuinely was.
I think I was 12.
My mum bought me alien special edition for my birthday because I had like 18 minutes
more violence in it.
It was kind of fucking loved that stuff.
Hasn't scarved me at all, but I remember our mutual friend asking for film recommendations
that you could watch with his kids.

(18:23):
At this point, we're about eight and ten or something.
And everything we suggested, he's like, no, no, temple adoom.
And he's like, "Nicky, I got to get his heart ripped out in that."
And I'm like, "Okay."
You better see it.
Like the goonies?
No, no, there'd be too scared of sloths and stuff.
And I'm like, what?
What a goonie.
Really?
Like, I, so yeah.

(18:43):
I don't know, fucking what's the land before time or something.
Oh, well, Demy's always died.
That will, that will put his mum nice in the first act.
I don't know what to suggest then.
Yeah, I do wonder if kids are a bit soft now because they're not being exposed to this level.
Yeah.
I mean, we grew up watching, I mean, we didn't know at the time, but we grew up watching

(19:06):
like serial child sex predators.
I think presenting like, well, Saturday morning TV shows.
I was fucking out of joy.
But then even the public information films were fucking harrowing.
I know, we could dedicate a whole episode on them, for example.
Like, no, I fucking, I think my mum was a nurse.
Now remember, I come in home and I must have been really young because it was a moment I

(19:31):
were still together.
And she would be working in casual age.
She came home and told me that some kids had come in who'd been electrocuted.
And when they were cut on off, he's closed.
His skin was coming off as well.
Oh, Jesus.
I was even at school at that point, you know, I was never thinking, I mean, and did
all what I've always been very, very vigilant around electricity ever since he didn't know.

(19:52):
Well, there you go.
It worked.
Exactly.
Very, very vigilant, really.
Very, very vigilant around Nazis around arcs, magical arcs.
I mean, I got, I got, my mum, I'm a ticknate, see tempo, doing it at the cinema.
Now, what's that?
I could have been sex or something, just to me, and it should have made it to the, and

(20:15):
then I, I said she would old wouldn't get into the cinema to see a film like tempo, didn't
know?
No, it would be like a PG 13 or something or a 12 or something like that, you know.
Oh, well, there was a PG 13, well, it would probably be a 12A, but then they would let
a six year old in it, like if, as long as they were accompanied by an adult, oh, really.
Yeah, it'd have to be a 15 for them not to get in to see it, but you're right.

(20:35):
Right.
It's kind of building, you know, it's kind of building.
What is? Like, I can't think of anything that I, the only two things I can think of that
scared me when I was younger and ironically my favourite films is the library ghost from
Ghostbusters.
And I have to admit, Vigo, the Carpathian left a bit of a mark on me as a, right.

(20:58):
And as an eight year old when I saw that, that was a bit, yeah, whoo.
He was a skating motherfucker, but, um, yeah.
My mum did, my mum did, they may watch the first six or seven minutes of Halloween when
I was maybe like seven and then, and then a step that had to drive me over to my granny's
to stay there.
So, like, so, so they could watch the film.

(21:21):
Right.
And that, that absolutely fucking terrified me.
But now, I love Halloween.
It's, it's, it's, it's one of my favourites, Halloween, the first one.
Yeah.
Oh, it's fantastic film.
Yeah, you're right.
The first six or seven minutes is me.
Yeah.
I love it, especially when you're a little boy, you know what I mean?
Michael's sister there with her exposed breasts, brushing her hair, Michael with a kitchen

(21:42):
life.
Did they maybe do it for their own protection in case you were getting tips?
I think they maybe did it so they could have the flat to themselves because, you know,
just for context, it was a one bedroom flat.
Like, my, my mother and I shared a bedroom for years.
And I, when she started to see my stepdad, I would often wake up in the sofa.
So I think it was just so they could have the, the host of themselves, I think, well,

(22:07):
fuck, and put the shits up and we're Halloween, pack them off these grannies and then we can
have a, I love the romantic evening watching Halloween.
Very nice.
Oh, well, that's a, a lovely story, Greg.
Well, they're a good time.
And yeah, that is, like, the idea that somebody's unemployed, bad, just fucking, are we up
to the school?
Fuck.

(22:27):
It's up to the shits up the little bastards to fight in some play, but he wants my penny
wise question.
It's really theoretical.
I genuinely thought it must have been Halloween, but no, it was after Halloween.
If, if only there was a police woman we knew who lived in Lawrence Kirk, who could have
been on hand.
So that is, um, that is what our hero was up to at a primary school in Lawrence Kirk.

(22:49):
Uh, well, so if you've seen this week, Greg, ladies, this is why you make sure you always
leave a list of jobs to do.
If you leave your man at home for the day, you've got to keep a busy holiday.
This is, this is, yeah, something can happen.
Yeah, but on his list would have probably been pick up the barren from school and, okay,
Keltu Birds of One Story.

(23:12):
Oh, dear.
Right.
So my next story is another celebrity, not as internationally known as, is, um, Mr Flanagan,
but this is a star of Channel 4's Gogo Box.
So for anybody listening overseas, Gogo Box is a really weird program on Channel 4 where

(23:33):
basically they film the normal people watching programs that have been broadcast that week
and their reaction to it.
And it's a phenomenon.
It's often, it's often very funny against all of us.
And the celebrity one is particularly funny if they get good people on their, like Sean
might do in Bez.
Yes, definitely together.

(23:55):
Um, so this isn't a Gogo Box, the British, this is the normal Gogo Box, a Gogo Boxer, Lisa
Bags, who was blown away on her visit, the first ever visit to Edinburgh because of
one distinct difference that she found in the city's bars compared to her native England.

(24:16):
She paid a visit to the Scottish capital for a work trip and she told her experience,
driving the city is beautiful, but was blown away by one aspect.
The TV personality commented on the size of glatties of Persecutor and said, "Bars,
poor quotes, the biggest measures ever."
Comparing Edinburgh to London, taken back by the bargain price of the alcoholic beverage,

(24:40):
Lisa Joke that she might move to Edinburgh soon and encouraged her 300,000 TikTok followers
to pay the city a visit.
She said, "Guys, so have just come back from Edinburgh.
I was working there with Joke for a couple of days, don't know who Joke is.
It was absolutely beautiful.
The architecture, there's a castle, they've got Murryfield rugby stadium.
Everybody was so super nice, they had loads of lovely shops, the Christmas market, it was

(25:03):
amazing, but the best thing for me about it was when you go into a bar and you ask for
a Prosecco, it's not like London, they pour the biggest measures ever.
I mean, I was just blown away and it's such a bargain because you get a massive glass of
Prosecco for like six quid.
And do you know what?
I think it might be moving to Edinburgh soon because I was so blown away by it and everyone

(25:24):
was just so lovely, we had such a nice time.
So if you've never been go, I know what was freezing, so make sure you take all your nice
one quotes and everything.
Many were quick to take to the comments of the video to share their thoughts.
One person said, "I love Edinburgh and I'm going to see Robbie Williams there, I'm so excited.
I didn't know that Robbie Williams was playing Edinburgh soon."
I feel like June or July, 2025.

(25:46):
No, not soon then.
Yeah, so it's that short story there.
I mean, we were in Edinburgh, it's in the summer, but it's a bit harder.
I don't know how you found the pricies at the bar.
I mean, it's always going to be a bargain for me because I live in Dubai, which is one of

(26:06):
most expensive places ever for a fucking pint.
How did you find Edinburgh compared to Amsterdam when you were getting the beers in?
It was okay, I suppose.
It depends on...
It was the same as anywhere though.
It depended on which bar you went to Edinburgh.
Prices varied up here, but same as Amsterdam though.
If you're drinking in the city centre, it's more expensive than if you're drinking somewhere

(26:28):
just slightly outside, so the centre.
And I would find that if I'm drinking beer, it depends what they have on draft, but I
probably rather have a craft beer and a lot of the bars that will just come in a can.
But they're not hugely overpriced, I would say, maybe like 450 for a can of funky falcon.
Which should...

(26:48):
You'd buy that in the supermarket for like 250.
And how does 450 for a can of funky falcon compare to a pint of a craft?
Would you pay for a pint?
You'd probably pay...
Yeah, maybe about five or six euros.
See, that's as a fucking should be, right?
I was in a bar a few weeks ago and I went when you were here last time, and the draft beer

(27:11):
was off, it was all off, they had a problem with their system, right?
So we've only got bottled.
Bottles were the same fucking price as a pint, for half the volume.
I was like, you have no fucking laugh, but then I remembered, when I worked in bars in
the UK, bottles were often the same price as a pint.
You know, about the middle or fucking Budweiser or something, it would be the city, and
I could never understand why people would spend the whole night drinking bottles a beer.
And you could get a pint, for sometimes less, like a bit of tenants would cost you less than

(27:35):
a pint of some North American fish, you know what I mean?
Yeah, we'd actually, yeah, you're right, it's annoying.
It's so funny, because I know we had that conversation before we recorded last time, and I was
going to bring that up later on in the episode when we were discussing "Tute for the Sun"
because...
Well, we'll discuss it when we got on a shoot for the sun.

(27:56):
But yeah, you're right, no, that is true.
I thought the prices were okay, but then we were drinking pints, so it's tenets.
Of all pints.
Yes, almost exclusively.
Basically, yes.
I don't know if quite a few Guinnesses.
Yeah, I know.
A few pints, a few pints of El Haven as well.
But I think it depends on, well, we weren't drinking Prosecco, so I don't know, I don't

(28:20):
know, but I imagine in London you probably get it like in a Prosecco flute, whereas in
Pubs and N, Pruis, probably just in a wine glass.
I'm not a pint glass, I'm mulling.
So yeah, I guess it depends on the vessel itself, then I suppose, indeed.
Anyway, so if you haven't seen...
I was thinking myself, I wonder if America's got a Gogo box, because America usually picks

(28:44):
like good concepts from the UK and either does them really well or absolutely fucking destroys
them.
I don't think it would work in America, would it?
I don't know, it's funny you mentioned that because I was flicking through the TV the other
night and I think I stumbled across it was Gogo box and I was like, I do recognize this
family, but I used to watch Gogo box all the time.

(29:06):
I haven't watched it probably for about six months and I was like, I don't recognize this family
and then they all had Australian accents and I was like, oh, this is Gogo box Australia.
So they definitely have it in Australia.
I don't know if they have it in the US though.
No offense to Americans, but they would get too angry about stuff, you know what I mean?
And there's like pooping and hollering.

(29:27):
Yeah, and there's about 450, like, terrestrial channels there anyway.
So it's not the UK, but there's only a handful of terrestrial channels and you know, there's
sort of digital ones, the K-122 and they never, both at the ever cover anything on those
channels because it's basically repeats or cheap shit that some of those wins isn't it?
Yeah, it's the majority of stuff, although I think they do do quite a few net for

(29:50):
conflicts, shows and stuff.
Yeah, if it's about everything, I can be be reindeer, webel, show one.
Yeah, because that's why I did, I think I did kind of stop watching it because I found
that a lot of the stuff they were covering is stuff, you know what I'm like, it takes me
ages sometimes to watch stuff.
And they would cover something that I wanted to watch and hadn't seen and I'm like, oh,

(30:12):
great, I've got a fast forward with this bit because I don't want them to spoil something.
So yeah, so I often found, I was, ended up skipping half the episodes.
And stuff.
So anyway, that's Lisa Bags, is that our name?
I think it was.
Close to happening in our cheapest.
Yeah.
And so what is your second story this week?
This is from the daily record, today Greg and the headline reads, "Scots are best in

(30:37):
UK at detecting fake accents to guard against outsiders."
This is something that we've spoken about many times in the podcast.
So from Scotland are among the best identifying someone imitating their accent according
to a recent study all across the country are a wide range of different accents that each
have their own unique twang from Edinburgh to Shetland.

(31:00):
Every part of Scotland features a unique dialect.
According to news research carried out by the University of Cambridge, Scottish and Irish
people are the best at spotting a fake accent, meanwhile, Londoners were found to be the worst.
The study saw 12,000 participants from Scotland, England, Ireland, Northern Ireland, Essex,
London and Bristol, and they were played short audio clips of their native accent with

(31:22):
a Glasgow accent being used for Scotland.
They were then asked to identify whether they were real or fake.
While listening to their recordings, between 75 and 85% of participants from Scotland, the
northeast of England, Ireland and Northern Ireland, were able to tell their accents were
being faked.
On the other hand, only about 50% of people from London and Essex successfully identified

(31:43):
a fake accent.
These researchers, the results may be explained by how accents from those areas have evolved
over the years.
They say that people with these regions have experienced cases of between group cultural
tension and with a greater social cohesion in Belfast Dublin Glasgow and the northeast,
resulting in a more prominent fear of cultural dilution by outsiders.

(32:05):
I didn't realise this article was getting so heavy, actually, when I was in.
Responding author Dr Jonathan Goodman from Cambridge's Levar Hume Centre for Human Evolutionary
Studies commented, "We find a pretty pronounced difference in accents, cheater detection
between these areas.
We think the ability to detect, to detect, fake accents is linked to an area's cultural

(32:26):
homogeneity and a degree to which people hold similar cultural values.
I'm interested in the role played by trust in society and how trust forms.
One of the first judgments of personal will make about another person and when deciding
whether to trust them is how they speak.
Our humans learnt to trust one another, who may be interloper has been incredibly important
over our evolutionary history and it remains critical today."

(32:50):
So, we don't like outsiders, Greg.
Apparently, we can sniff them out with our fake accents.
Now, we've obviously discussed many times on this while, in terms of accents and how
actors who's good and who's bad at doing a Scottish accent or even a regional kind of accent
in any way.
Yeah, apparently our scots are very good at sniffing out someone doing a fake accent.

(33:11):
Well, on the old website, Bluehost, I think it was, I did a page, I sort of reckon around
the best Scottish accents in the things that we had covered in the suality, like for non-scotish
people.
Maybe I'll recreate it for our new, or not so new now, but our Squarespace website, because
Squarespace is much more intuitive than Bluehost, much easier to use, so much friendier,

(33:35):
who wants to throw us off, who wants to throw us some money than the podcast, who do we add
to, we add them bucks and I like adverts for them.
But yeah, I mean, I know, I spoke about it when we did Big Train Spotting in T2, but especially
there's a famous story about Johnny Lee Miller in Train Spotting is that none of the cast
realized that he wasn't Scottish until after they'd been told the premiere or something

(34:00):
like that, right, when they got together for the premiere, because his Scottish accent
is just really, really good.
I think there's a lot, I hear or read a lot of people that have seen actors, Scottish actors
in stuff that they've then seen them doing their normal accent, and they've been like,
I never realised he was Scottish.
So under if there is something about Scots being able to do different accents in terms of

(34:24):
being chameleon, like I mean, the two I can then cover off top, my head would be James McAvoy
and David Tennant.
Yes.
You know, I know that there's a lot of people that are like, I never realised he was Scottish.
And it's, yeah, it's quite bizarre when you think about that because we know them.
Yeah.
So it's all, it doesn't take me out when I see McAvoy doing a non-Scootish accent, for

(34:46):
example.
Yeah.
If that makes sense, because I know what his voice sounds like.
I saw a wee bit of the star of it's chapter two recently.
I mean, I've seen it, but I saw it when it came out, but I've not seen it for years, and
I hadn't seen McAvoy do it, I hadn't seen McAvoy do it on American accent for a while.
It did throw me for a second, you know what, I mean, just because I hadn't heard them do it for

(35:09):
ages.
But the first thing I ever saw James McAvoy in was shameless, and I never knew he was Scottish.
Because he was doing a Manchester accent and seeing them and anything, but it turned out
I had see them in band of brothers.
He's got a very small part in the band of brothers, but he plays in American soldiers, so he's
doing an American accent.
It's a tiny, tiny part, kind of blinking your miss it part, so.

(35:30):
Yeah, the one who's maybe not as good at it, or maybe who's maybe got a little bit better
over the years, I think, as you and McGregor, you know, his accent in those Star Wars films
is not good.
I mean, he's trying to do it out, getting his impression really.
I know, but it's not very good, sorry you.

(35:51):
No.
But the series of Fargo would he plays the twin brothers, though?
It's very good, isn't it?
Yes.
You actually, yeah, very true.
So there you go.
We are good at sniffing out fake accents in Scotland, apparently.
Yeah.
Have you seen anything else this week, Greg?
No, that's, that's all the news from me.
The only, this is all going to keep us very quick.

(36:13):
I did think about turning this into a purple tin game, but maybe I will actually, I could
give you a few guesses, maybe you haven't seen this new story.
I was a headline from the Scottish Sun last week.
You don't remember it.
Glasgow gets green light for a new statue of iconic figure in city centre.
Have you seen this article?
Do you know who this is about?
I don't think I've seen the article.

(36:33):
So if you were to have an iconic figure in Glasgow city centre, a statue of them, who do you
think that would be?
I can ask, I can get a clue.
Is living or dead?
Dead.
Right, a dead.
Glasgow region.
Oh no, they're not Glasgow region, Greg.
That's why I'm shocked at this.
So, can you, like, what's there are some links to the city?
They do have some links to the city.

(36:57):
They have the freedom of Glasgow city.
Who could it be?
Who likes going to Glasgow?
I don't know.
I have no idea.
Nelson Mandela.
Well, he's a way to go.
Square named after them.
I remember when that happened, did it fucking really annoy my dad?
It's going to be a statue of Nelson Mandela built in Glasgow city centre.

(37:20):
Yeah, very good.
So, there you go.
That's exciting.
Right.
The, uh, before we go on to what we're going to be talking about today, let's have a little
word from our sponsors.
And our sponsor is Dorick Skateboards, a skateboard brand created by Gary Kemp, whose main focus
is to explore the people and culture of Aberdeen and the north east of Scotland, creating

(37:42):
designs to reflect life in that wonderful area that I hail from.
Dorick Skateboards screen print their own decks in their new studio by Gary's Fairhand,
and they have produced some amazing designs over the years, including an anelonix inspire
board, a rubber at the Bruce Dick, and a plenty of pop dick inspired by the old Bonacorn
trucks that used to drive around Aberdeen delivering fizzy juice.

(38:03):
Dorick Skateboards also replicate these amazing designs onto their clothing, on 100% organic
cotton teas, hoodies and sweatshirts, and they also produce beanies, caps, mugs, pin badges
and stickers.
Gary regularly collaborates with local artists to ensure he brings the latest designs to
the market, but always with a Dorick twist, including the latest butt-ray design based on the famous

(38:25):
Aberdeen breakfast of champions, and the beautiful north field tower design, a love letter
to the Eiffel Tower of Aberdeen.
So check Dorick Skateboards out for yourself at DorickSkateboards.com and follow them on Instagram
@DorickSkateboards to see the amazing designs on offer, and we are delighted to be able to
offer you 15% off as listeners to this podcast.

(38:46):
All you need to do is head to dorkskateboards.com, have a look at all the amazing decks, stickers,
badges, hoodies and teas on offer, and enter the promo code "swally".
That's SWAL, same as this name as this podcast, all in block capitals, and get your 15% off.
That's dorkskateboards.com, link in the description of this episode.
Okay Greg, so it was your choice on today's episode of The Culture Swally, so why do you

(39:12):
tell us what we're going to be talking about today?
So we have covered a lot of Peter McDougal stuff on The Culture Swally, so much so that there's
only one play I can think of after we do today's film that we haven't done, and maybe we'll
do it next year.
So I chose the up until now elusive "Shoot for the Sun", written by Peter McDougal, released

(39:36):
in 1986 or 1987, depending on your source.
There's not a lot of information about this film in the online.
This stars the famous Scottish actor Jimmy Neill as Jordy, and Brian Cox is Dunnie,
two sort of low level heroine dealers, doing their bit for the 1980s Edinburgh Health Crisis,

(39:59):
written by Peter McDougal.
As I mentioned, we've covered a lot of his stuff in the podcast just another Saturday, just
a boys game, Elevenths Graveyard, to name but three classic bits of Scottish drama.
The film also features Billy McCall, who we had on the version of the slab boys that we covered
last year.

(40:20):
Say the Clee, Billy, Maccohenny and Bill Simpson, along with some other quite famous Scottish
actors and very, very small, but can you miss it, Rose?
It's classic Peter McDougal, focusing on social issues, Coothie Chat and Gallow's Humor.
There was a programme that Greg Hemphill made about Scottish drama quite a long time ago,

(40:44):
maybe even as long as 10 or 15 years ago, and they show the wee clip of this.
It's a clip of Jordy and Dunnie drinking wine up the graveyard, and I've never been able
to find it.
I've never seen it on DVD, and it's been very difficult to find online until recently,

(41:06):
where some hero uploaded it onto YouTube.
So, that's why I watched it as soon as you told me about it, which was a couple of months
ago now.
So, this was a second time I watched it for this pod, but I know it was your first viewing
for the pod, so what did you think of it?
Yeah, it was my first viewing, because obviously I must have only been five or six when this

(41:28):
first came out.
So, not that I wouldn't have been allowed to watch it, it just wouldn't have interested
me at the time, probably.
So, I had heard about it and read about it because obviously you'd mentioned it and have
been done research on Pyramid Dugel for other episodes we've covered.
And it's sounding great, because it's Brian Cox and it's Jimmy Nail.
I'll come on to Jimmy Nail later, because I loved it when I was younger.

(41:52):
Yeah, my first viewing, and wow, I loved this.
It's very Pyramid Dugel.
It's social issues in Edinburgh, and this was the height of Edinburgh being the
hero in capital of Europe.
It does the Pyramid Dugel part so well of covering a really serious subject, in tackling

(42:12):
something really serious, but then like a split second later you're just burst out laughing
some line or some ridiculous thing.
The perfect example of that is the blend so could you have the heart breaking scene with
Jordy and Bill Gavin, who's credited as an old man in lift, when he delivers that
line that just might be absolutely cracking me up.

(42:33):
You know he's talking about being robbed and then he's just like, and they did a shite in
my mint and I had to throw half of that up.
You think?
Should we let the ribos tear open?
Shocks on, shocks, terrible.
Then boys broke into my hose and fleeced.
We had pensioner D. I mean, and I'm one layer of my three bonnet men said, cook it up by

(42:59):
the rest of the week, but they were not half-edged, rude and I'm prondering my way of that
position.
You know what I did son?
I wanted to get a bastard that is shitting my mints.
I'm going to shitting my mints.
Like that's real hard, I'll wait.

(43:22):
Look, I was laughing at the shite in the mint so it's a tool as he's walking out the
lift.
I just, I just doubled over a laugh in a game.
It's really good.
And it adds in something else that I think McDougall does so well and it's like a double
act.
There's something about blending these two characters together and hey, it could be a testament

(43:45):
to their acting as well, but I'd say it's the writing that you really believe that Doney
and Jority have been friends for years and it reminds me very much of Dancer and Jake
from just the boys game.
And then even as Bunny and Jority and I know that's the first time they've met but they
know each other very well.
Yeah.
Elephant's graveyard.
There's something about his writing of being able to write to male characters as pals

(44:08):
that you just believe they've known each other for years and you totally get the, there's
something false or fake about it in a way.
Like I know that sounds maybe a bit bizarre but it's just completely believable and authentic.
This friendship and relationship and bond between these two characters.
Yeah, and the thing is is, you know, when the friendship becomes strained, you know, because

(44:29):
you can get the feeling, you know, for most of the film that Jority is the sort of dominant
half of the pair.
But Doney is the sort of intimidating one as well.
You know what I mean?
You know, they've seen in the toilets and stuff like that.
But then Doney becomes the sort of conscience where is Jority is determined just to press

(44:51):
on.
So it is a real, it's actually quite a complex character that Jimmy Neill and Peter McDougall
have created there because, you know, he doesn't really give a fuck who buys, who buys the
hero in whether it's, whether it's Johnson and his wife or whether it's wee boys at the

(45:11):
school, he just wants to get the money in and he's good to his mum, he's good to his mum
as well, you know what I mean?
He's, you know, he's patient with the old fellow in the lift and all that kind of thing, you
know what I mean?
He's got, you know, he's got this sort of silly sense of humour, but he's also kind of ruthless
where as Doney becomes, you know, he seems like that from the very beginning, you know, and

(45:35):
then he's, this softer side of him when he there is, that there's kids involved.
You see him playing pool with his son and his son's friends and, you know, they've seen
in the graveyard when he's drunk and he, you know, he has that sort of, he's a, he's a
moment about what they're doing.
You know, they get, they, they, they, they both carry it because by the end of the, you sort

(45:56):
of start off the film almost kind of, written for a Jordy is some extent, but then by, by
the end of the film, you know, you kind of, you kind of don't care what happens to him.
Yeah, I would agree with you on that and I, I wonder if it is because Doney has got
kids because he's playing pool with his son, his son's friend, Tony Cutton's second role.
That's right.

(46:16):
And it's like, yeah, this is littered as well with little people, you're like, oh my god.
Oh my god.
It's him, it's him.
It's, you're right.
I do believe that, that Jordy, I wonder, because it's handed upon as if they've done
stuff, so they're, obviously, they've been like armed robbers and they've done a few
stints in prison and you get the pressure they've been friends for years.
Yeah.

(46:36):
And there's, there's almost a throwaway line in the graveyard where Doney says it, like,
you know, I owe you for what you did in prison and it's, it's never touched upon again or
explained, really, you know, did he protect him from something, did he save his life, something,
something's happened and it's almost that Doney feels in debt to Jordy.
Yeah.
And he's trying to, to repay this by going along with this scheme, but all he wants to

(47:00):
go is to go back to robin armor trucks and it's, as you say, it's probably because he
has got a conscious and he's, he's not keen on this drugs malarkey.
No.
And especially when he find out that he's been selling it to kids, that's when he just
leases it and just wants nothing more to do with this.
He just wants to get back to some healthy plunder and, hi, exactly.

(47:23):
I guess there's more fun in that.
There really isn't there.
But yeah, the, the relationship between those two is brilliant and as I say, it's a testament
to the actors, I think, and, but also the writing.
But you do get the impression as well that Jordy is just, he's a bit delusional about the
risks involved because he keeps mentioning there's no risk, there's no risk in this at all.
But does he not realize that, you know, if he's caught with, like, even Johnson when he gets

(47:48):
drugs from Jordy and parkers and he's like, we need to go or I'm looking at a life sentence
for what I've got in my pocket.
Yeah, yeah.
It's like, you know, he must realize the risks involved, but he's just delusional about
it, I think.
You know, he seems sort of, he seems sort of aspirational as well, you know, I mean, like
that scene in parkers, you know, he's arranged, he's arranged this meeting in a, you know, the,

(48:12):
the first pub we see them in is the sort of pub you would expect to see guys like that,
and, right, you know, it's sort of working man's pub.
But then the, the kind of yuppie bar where he meets Sadie and Billy Neckle, you know, he
kind of wants to be part of that, but then he feels ignored by the waiter and blah, blah,
and then he just, he just rails against it, you know, there's that scene when he's trying

(48:34):
to fucking, he's trying to pull the palm tree down.
He should be tripped it.
You know, he's, you know, he's, he's, he's, he's got, he's got a cheap suit on and he's white
socks and they go from this yuppie, very typical 1980s bar to taking a bottle of wine each
and the, in a cemetery and setting in the snow, drinking it, you know, that palm tree scene in

(48:57):
Parker is as genius because it goes on for so long and you're like, can it's just going
to stop and it's test with the director that you're kind of like, okay, this is going on
for a bit long and then it, it's funny, then it stops being funny and then it becomes even
funny again.
And what makes it even funny and again is when it cuts to Dunny, who's just watching
the whole bar, not saying a word, not watching, to already batting the fuck out of this

(49:21):
palm tree, it's just watching the whole crowd and then just slowly walks out and absolutely
genius scene had me stitches.
Love to.
Yeah, fantastic.
The only, the better part really, it, well, the graveyard scene we'll talk about is the,
the first pub, you mentioned in terms of the proper working man's pub and there's a wake
on it.

(49:41):
All this whole host of bizarre characters, these two old women and this punk guy and just
everything's bizarre, the drunk at the jukebox, I forgot to check what it is, but it's said
they're divine, they were listening to you.
Yeah, I think it was said they're divine.
Yeah, it's crazy.
Oh, it was.
Guys crying on the jukebox.

(50:02):
But when they, the scene when they go to the toilet and that toilet looks fucking horrible
and running to John Murta's mob with the young Gilecrest state as well, like it's brilliant,
the tension in that seat as well and then daddy just rabbit putches and just his
bave.
It's like brilliant.
That's where you get the kind of volatile, the volatileness of these characters as well.

(50:27):
You never know what's going to happen next.
Yeah, I mean, that's, you know, it's, that's where you feel like Pete would go just, you
know, that's where he really excels and creating these scenes where you've got the main characters
and a lot of peripheral characters who are also like really carefully drawn, you know, they,

(50:48):
you know, they kind of pub scene at the beginning of just a boys game, you know what I mean?
When the hands on and chances arguing with the couple and all that sort of stuff, you know,
yeah.
He had last my board, seriously, you know what I said?
So he's just, it's like, even like the character who's at the bar when Donnie is at the bar

(51:11):
to begin with and he's like, oh, it's my brother's, it's my brother's wake, you know, what are
you drinking?
You know, he's got a bite everybody in the pub of drink that's there.
And even though, yeah, know everybody in the pub is there for the way.
Even then, you know what I mean?
But it's sort of convention dictates that he needs to stand his hand about his fucking heart
was breaking me and so on.
The busy, busy, the pub was, you know, fucking by every one of these concerts, right?

(51:37):
Yeah, it's a hell of a place, but you're right.
That is exactly what Medugal did in terms of creating these characters.
And it's every scene's fleshed out with all these different people there.
And not once do you think any of these characters is, is not integral to the plot.
I don't mean that, but they're, they're all used to a certain extent.
And they're all there.

(51:58):
They're all drunk at the jukebox, for example, and the guy's pulling it out and it's just
everything's going on.
And it's, I guess, to show because in so much stuff you watch, you would see a pub scene
like that and everyone would be quiet and mimeing and pretending to talk and not involved.
But you're getting, you feel like you're there.
You're in the pub.
You know, all the characters and, yeah, I think it's, it's wonderful the way that that's

(52:20):
been crafted and put down.
And as they're going about their business, Dunny and Jordy, there's these two mystery
men following them all the time.
And I really like the, the mystery that surrounds them because like I thought initially they're
cops.
Yeah, me too.
And, and you do think that, and that's intentional the way is done.
I think led to believe.
And then you realize that they aren't and they're kind of the, the opposition or trying to

(52:43):
muscle up territory.
Yeah.
But it's, it's wonderfully played in terms of the, you don't know what they're doing.
And even then, they're just credited as Fergie the driver and Mickey the boss.
And it's, yeah, I thought that was really well done as well.
And some of those scenes went on like when he's telling the joke about the Laurie driver,
like, that's a, anything you see nowadays or something, that'd be cut straight away.

(53:07):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Cause it goes on for a couple of minutes.
And it's not like he tells the joke quickly, but it's so well done and so well paced that
you don't mind any of that in this.
Like, there's nothing been put in there or left in there by mistake.
Everything's there for a reason.
Yeah.
And I thought that was, that was also really well done.
Yeah, I think it's just a style of drama at that time as well.

(53:29):
You know, I think, you know, as a sort of modern audience probably can't put up with long
scenes of dialogue, you know, but if you watch any of the plays for today, not just the
Scottish ones, there are long scenes of dialogue.
And every single one of them, and that's just because I guess it's that sort of transition
from a play on a stage before television.

(53:51):
And then the sort of 40, 50, 60 year evolution, whereas now scenes tend to be short.
I mean, I saw, I watched like maybe 20 minutes of the dark night last week.
So it was in the tele.
There was flicking through the channels.
And like all the scenes in the dark night are really fucking short and then really realized
before, you know what I mean?
But it can, it can obviously design to keep the film moving and the pace moving because

(54:15):
it is quite a long film too.
But the scenes are all really short, you know, I think like the longest scene is probably
the bank probably at the start.
Yeah.
But it's, yeah, I think it's, that's how people took their drama in those days, I guess.
And you know, what I like, you know, for us, we're sort of Peter McDougall, efficient ad
os now.
So we know what to expect when we sit down to something that he's written.

(54:38):
But I really liked how, sort of, because everything that we've watched with, you know, written
by McDougall has been filmed and set in Scotland and performed by a company of
the Scottish actors, you know, whereas the lead, you know, the second lead character in
this film is a, is an English actor, although the Jorodies are quite similar to the Scots

(55:01):
in a lot of ways.
But Jimmy Neill was really comfortable with the pattern, you know what I mean, they really
comfortable with it.
And it led me to, because I don't know, I've never really had any reason to research Jimmy
Neill.
I always knew him as always and I'll feed his own pet and then the stuff he did later
on like, spend their, and crop their shoes and stuff like that.

(55:23):
But when I was reading about him, like, seemingly he had never acted in anything before of
you the same pet.
He's a sister or someone, or he's girlfriend or something and encouraged them to go an audition
because it was like an open audition for, I guess, sort of guys who looked like the sort
of guys who would go and work, great tradesmen who would go to Europe and work in the 80s.

(55:45):
Yeah.
I mean, that was my first exposure, obviously, to him.
I'll be the same pet.
I remember watching an episode, it was the second series because they were in Spain and I,
I did, for some reason, I vividly remember just seeing this clip of this episode when I was
a youngster, obviously, when it was shown the first time.
And then I used to watch Spender with my mum and loved Spender.

(56:10):
She loved Spender as well.
I don't know if she fancy Jimmy Neill a little bit, maybe.
What's up, everybody?
How's your favourite, I think?
Yeah, I think so.
Yeah.
I think it seems a bit rough for India, just I suppose.
And then, I guess, "Ain't No Doubt" is probably, next kind of big thing.
And I vividly remember, it's funny, the little snapshots, yeah, the little snapshots you

(56:31):
remember of life.
But I remember getting ready in the kitchen for one of my first days at secondary school
and, like, you know, my mum hurrying me along to get ready and "Ain't No Doubt" playing
on the radio.
And I'll never forget, like, that era.
There's three songs I vividly remember from that kind of time period, and that was "Ain't
No Doubt" by Jimmy Neill.

(56:52):
Ebony's "A Good" by the Shaman.
Yeah.
And "The Undercover Cover" of Baker Street.
Right, yeah.
And they were all out around about that August September time of 1992.
And I'll just never forget, those three songs I just associate with going to starting
secondary school.
I had now 23, which had all those songs on it, also had, like, sleep and sataly.

(57:15):
Oh, "Tamson Arch" with "Oi To You" by Charles Nady, "Beggin in the Dirt" by Peter Gabriel.
Yeah, it was a good album.
Wonderful.
And then I remember, it must have been, like, 95 or something, channel four started re-showing
"A Vida Saint Pit" on a Saturday night, and I watched every episode.

(57:36):
Yeah.
I was too young to go out on a Saturday night at that point, and I fucking loved it.
And you know how much I love "A Vida Saint Pit" I've got it on DVD when I moved into my
new apartment.
I watched the whole five series of them from, like, I was petted out by the end of it, but
it's just fantastic.
But yeah, Jimmy Neill is great.

(57:57):
He's rough.
You know, you could see it in the first few episodes of "Vida Saint Pit" that he's not
an actor, and he's a bit rough.
But as the series develops, he definitely picks up.
And the role he's meant to play is just this lazy lay-about, hard-knocked, or, like, the
type of guy you do not want to get into a fight with in the pub, or you don't want to aggravate,

(58:18):
you kind of have to go up with him, but he's an annoying bastard.
And you could see he's definitely honed his craft a little bit when he comes around to play
in "Jordy" in this, because there are parts that he is very good and very believable,
and I think it does help that he's got someone like Cox to bounce off of most of the time
that he's on-screen.
Yeah.
And it's, you know, when you look at what, if you look at this sort of work, Brian Cox

(58:42):
was doing at the time.
Taking the character Donnie's quater was creating an unusual move, because this is a actor
if they had Hannibal Lecter, and then Hunter.
He's just done a Michael Mann film, and then he comes...
As we've said before, I think it was when we were doing "Flying Scotsman," this is what
Cox does, though.
Yeah.
You will go off to Hollywood and make a big film, and then you'll come back to Scotland

(59:03):
and do something small.
Yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
They come back and do...
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, and he's sort of...
I feel like he's having a good time in this, Brian Cox, because...
Yeah.
Yeah.
He's sort of famously from Donnie.
The Donnie accent and the Edinburgh accent...
Ha...
You know, they have quite a lot in common.

(59:23):
They sort of border-fife.
There's a lot of sort of, in some other inflection and stuff like that, in the accent.
And you just feel like he's...
I mean, he's the broadest of all the characters.
Yeah.
It's...
When...
When I run that, when I run this symmetry,
and Jody's late, he pissed.
And he's late.
My trussers...

(59:43):
Fuck you, baby.
I'm like...
(laughs)
I don't know if he pissed himself.
My trussers...
(laughs)
That graveyard scene is just an absolute masterpiece.
Cox is acting in that when he's pissed.
And he's...
I know.
I can't move.
I can only move my eyes.
(laughs)
I can't see him blind.

(01:00:03):
Yeah, that interchange of the other...
It looks so good.
You could see them from my side, you know?
It's fucking for real, yeah.
What you think?
I'm showing God's way, like, standing up.
(laughs)
Jesus, Jody, why is this stuff?
I can only move my eyes.
I'm a chiller.

(01:00:25):
Chicky little part of it, no, is it?
(laughs)
Was it set on the upper?
I never cared.
I'm blind, as well.
(sighs)
I still look bad.
It's a shit from my fucking side.
(laughs)
It's his facial expressions as well,

(01:00:47):
when he's acting pissed.
He's brilliant, absolutely fantastic.
But then Switches as well, when he says that,
you know, Johnson's selling them to Beirons,
from the school you'd have to a drag.
And that...
Yeah, even though he's pissed and he's meant to be,
I mean, a good time with his pal,
he's still upset and annoyed about this fact.
I mean, I know, I'm sure we've gone through it before,
but fucking, his TV career,

(01:01:10):
like forget the film career, right?
But his TV career is being in Minder,
he's been in Vandervolg, he's been in Red Wharf,
Inspector Morse, Deadwood, Doctor Who.
She's in Scotland, obviously Bob Servant,
which we've done before, which is just a sully favorite.
You know, I guess he's had this recent, huge,

(01:01:33):
a success in succession, you know,
which is just been an absolute,
the risk of using this in expression twice
in one episode of the podcast, "Fonominant",
it got all over the world.
Oh no, it certainly has been, but then he's...
Yeah, he just, he just,
I guess he just likes to work.
And he keeps...
Just keeps doing stuff.
And that's, again, a testament to him of, he's just finished,

(01:01:55):
you know, he finished wrapping up succession,
one of the biggest TV shows in the world.
And his next job was doing the radio show
of the Bob Servant Christmas Special that he might last year.
With Lulu, you know?
And he, like, he never forgets his roots.
And I think that's why I do love Brian Cox.
He does always come back and do something.
It's almost like he does, you know,

(01:02:16):
they say with directors and film studios,
they'll give you one for you, one for me.
Yeah, yeah.
That's the way you can do it.
Like that was, I think, with Christopher Nolan,
they, he said, "I'll do the Dark Knight."
I think it's like, "I'll do the Dark Knight
if I can do something else."
That's the afterwards.
And yeah, so he picked this little film,
except inception, they ended up
- Okay. - Yeah, shape film.
- Yeah, I don't like it.

(01:02:38):
- So that's the way, and I think Cox,
but way does the same.
Like in terms of, I'll go and do something,
but then I'll come home and do something, you know.
That's a bit more fun.
And you're right, you can tell he is enjoying himself in this.
Like it's just, because he's got such a great character
to work with, like they are the memorable scenes of him.
That's the kind of things that I seem to pick up
and punch in John Marta and the toilet.

(01:03:00):
In the graveyard, him standing watching as the crowd
as he's already punches the fuck out of this palm tree.
And then, just even the little bits that he has,
he's in the carpet shot, there's white at the end.
It's just, and his face expressions there
when the guys come up to him,
he's just, he's just having fun with this role.
- Yeah, for sure, for sure.

(01:03:21):
Another surprising thing that you did after a succession
was being a raider in taking eight,
a little kill.
- Wow, I bet you got paid very well for that.
- That's true, but of course he does the voice,
he does the voice in a video game nasty manhunt
from a reformative years, doesn't he?
- Yeah, no, I was just, he's just great in this.
And you know, this, kind of combining Brian Cox

(01:03:44):
with Peter McDougall, you know,
it's just a fucking stroke of genius
at the time and in hindsight.
- Yeah, yeah.
- Completely agree.
- We, the incidental music in this, I mean,
so there's sort of incidental music
every time somebody bangs up in this.
And it's, and I've written down, so we bit tag-arty.
- Oh, yeah, yeah, I guess.

(01:04:05):
- Go with that, I guess it was just the,
that was probably what the music library of the time
was pumping out.
So yeah, that would be,
- Yeah, now I think about it, you're right.
It is a little bit, it's kind of set in that to you.
- I guess well, every time someone's using or shooting up,
it's usually Johnson or Sadie.
- Yeah.
- Played by, you mentioned Billy McCall

(01:04:25):
and Sarah Clee or Sarah, I presume it's Sarah.
- Billy McCall is great in this as well.
- He's a big departure, I guess,
from what we've seen him in before in terms of slap boys,
for example, but he's really this desperate character.
- And it's a shame, obviously, you can tell
how much he loves Sadie.
- Yeah.

(01:04:46):
- I mean, not that much, he's offering,
or, you know, a fuck for a rap in the first scenes
that we see him in, which is a little bit uncomfortable,
but you can tell he really does love her,
but he's just hooked on the gear,
and well, so she obviously.
And the decline of her is heartbreaking as well.
Like when the scene with her and her mom,
and she effectively, you know, she says,

(01:05:07):
I only smoke it as if it's justification for,
it's not that bad, it's okay, I'm not shooting up.
And, you know, so her mom says, yeah, but he does,
and you will, you will do it,
and it's very true, it's a slip rate slow,
but I just find that quite heartbreaking, the desperation of that,
trying to justify it to her mom almost.
- And you're no feeding your cell, either.

(01:05:29):
You know, that desperate to get to the drugs
you can't settle your cell.
- I'm just tired.
- I, tired of living.
- Listen, Ma, I'll only smoke this stuff.
(door slams)

(01:05:51):
- But he doesn't.
So it's only a matter of time.
- Yeah, she's, she's good, though, she's not,
she's not a Scottish actor.
Not clean, you know what she is,
but a Scottish accent's not too bad.
But yeah, but, yeah, Billy and Nicol, I mean, he's,
who, his name is great my head,
who's the actor who Peter Mullham puts in all these films?

(01:06:14):
Like he plays, he plays the guy who hangs
himself at the end of my name is Joel.
- Dave McKay. - Dave McKay.
Yeah, there's something sort of reminiscent of Dave McKay
and Billy, Nicol's performance and this, you know what I mean?
It's sort of, it's a kind of combination of
kind of pathetic and sligh and earnest at times

(01:06:35):
and sort of confused and emotional, you know,
they can just go, oh, I'm going on, I would say.
- It even looks a bit like him in this because,
- Yeah, and maybe it was just the version of Watchturd
the one that's uploaded.
The very first scene you see is face,
it's kind of, it's dark or so.
It's just, it's a quick glance as he's crossing

(01:06:56):
and I wrote down on my notes, Dave McKay crossing them
and then it wasn't until see him in the stare
and I'm like, that's not Dave McKay.
I'm like, oh, it's Billy McCall.
And it was, yeah, so I totally get that with you.
It is very much like a Dave McKay performance
in terms of the, I know what you mean,
like the kind of dirty, desperate,
weasel-y kind of character trying to, yeah.

(01:07:19):
But you can tell it's kind of got a good heart
but then he doesn't really,
because he's selling smack to kids.
So, yeah, he's kind of, you know,
it's sort of like he, a small part of him wants to be,
that, the scene when he's talking,
when he's talking about how their wedding day was
just the best day, depending on what it was going to
marry the gang and all that kind of stuff,
like you kind of feel that in the moment,

(01:07:41):
he really, he does believe that, you know, in that moment.
But, you know, he's just, he's just had her injectum,
I think he can use food or something like that, right?
Because he's vain to, I guess, the suggestion
of his veins are all fucked.
And, you know, so he's having a bit of a reflective moment
as he's, as he's, as he's a gears settling in.
But then, you know, when he's, when,

(01:08:03):
Jordy threatens him at the kind of a villain thing,
toward the end of the film,
and he thinks he's got one over on him, you know?
But he doesn't, he'd be, you know, he thinks that he's,
sort of, criminal genius, but he doesn't realize
that Jordy's got him and he's pocketing out, he's fucked.
Yeah, you know what I mean?
And it's, it's just going to be more, more encounters

(01:08:24):
like that one getting worse and worse until he ends up
getting fun off a balcony or dropped on a stairway
or something like that, you know?
Yeah, completely right.
A very desperate character.
And you're right, he does think that he's got one over
when he's, you know, cutting up the baby powder
with the, the heroin he's, he's so convinced.
He'll never know and was it like 24 me, one for him?

(01:08:45):
And like, Jesus, you're really going out there.
So yeah, he does a, a good job of being, a desperate individual,
but you're right, there is a glimmer of, of,
I guess that's maybe that scene was put in
to kind of give him some sort of redeeming quality
because you are like, right, he's a junkie,
he's selling smack to kids, his boss is, you know,
kind of giving him an opportunity in a way now.

(01:09:07):
He's, he's doing probably the best he's done in a long time
in terms of he's making about a money, he's getting smack,
but he just gets greedy.
And you say it tries to fuck over Jordy who does warn them
that, you know, if you, if you cross me
all rip your face off.
I guess it's, I mean, I guess that seems layer to sort of,
because, you know, what I quite liked about this is that,

(01:09:28):
oh, you know, the, the people that are selling this smack too,
they're not the kind of archetypal sort of
of heroine users that we would expect to see
in something like this, you know?
Like some of them look quite, quite respectable,
you know, I think they seem toward the end when,
when the two gangsters are following Jordy
and he's just, he's just like sold to that quite respectable

(01:09:51):
looking women in, in the gardens, you know, I mean,
I think, I think not the two women from the pub earlier.
Well, maybe, yeah, possibly.
I didn't, I think I, I think so.
Yeah, I think so.
You know, we see Donnie selling some guys who get in a car
and drive away and, you know, they guess that's not the,
it's not the, the image of a heroine addict

(01:10:12):
that we've been sort of shown before, you know?
Think of a train spot and they're all like sort of man-k-shivering,
you know, like desperate, you know,
that they're more like Sadie, you know,
like the, the, the, the, the other characters that we see.
And I think, you know, that's seen to go back to that scene
you mentioned with Billy Nichol.
I think I, I sort of feel like Pete Madoog was wanting to say

(01:10:33):
that, you know, these, there's still people,
these people, just because they're addicted,
they're addicted to a class age rug.
It doesn't, they're still going to be parts of who they were
before they became addicts.
And, and those parts are going to come out
when their need to score has been stated by a fix, you know?
Yeah.
That's when you're going, that's when the elements are like,

(01:10:54):
I guess that's what he's trying to illustrate.
When, when, when, when he's talking about getting married,
he's talking about the wedding and all those speeches for us
and the dancing and, and she says, yeah, but, you know,
we're, we're not like that anymore.
Yeah, you know what I mean?
They work, they essentially, we're not those people anymore.
My, my mum liked you then.
Yeah.
And, you know, it's, it's actually they're quite an important

(01:11:15):
scene really when, when you think about it,
in terms of kind of humanizing, kind of drug users.
Yeah, it is.
Still kind of think he's scum of the earth
when he's preparing his smack in front of his kit.
Well, he is for sure.
Yeah, absolutely.
But then, in the flip side, when they are coming into money,
he is wanting to spend the money on the kit.

(01:11:36):
Yeah, yeah.
So, it's not like he's not completely, yeah, a bastard.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, but they're, they're, they're, they're, they're driven by,
he's driven by the need to take heroin.
90% of the time, but his actions are going to be a result
of addiction.
But in those quiet moments when he's high,
the nice guy that maybe was before, you know?

(01:11:57):
Yeah.
Jordi seems to run his operation from a long dread.
Do you think that's where the idea for Gus Fring's
meth lab that was under a long dread came from a breaking bad?
You think, but it could be, it could be maybe,
what's his name?
Vince Gilligan?
The Gilligan?
Yeah, Gilligan, I think.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, they'd be able to, they might,
we'll put it, it might do go some money.
And the thing, yeah.

(01:12:18):
That scene.
So, when the guy comes and meets them there with their stash
and Jordi can apprize his open the VHS tape and gets this,
they, they must be more, they tapes.
And just, so we bag that he takes out of there, right?
Yeah, it didn't look like a lot.
And it was obviously 12 grants work because the guys get 12

(01:12:39):
grants when they did the doom and in the train.
So, yeah, I would have hoped or you'd have thought
it must be more.
Yeah.
He's not going to have that big case with just one porn video
in it with drugstash to the site.
[LAUGHS]
We can laugh about it.
What's going to stop it?
So, you're a mew and you're transporting heroin to Scotland.

(01:12:59):
And you, you don't want anything about you to be suspicious
if stopped by a member of the British transport police.
So, I, I'll just have the hunters, a porn tape somewhere back
because that's not suspicious.
Yeah, you would think you would stash it in ET or something.
Yeah, I feel like.
ET pirates are, yeah.

(01:13:21):
Well, the Ben, Disney videos or something like that.
Yeah, you'd only be caught with that.
When he is getting the train back and he's in Waverly Station
and they're building up the tension because there's a suspicious guy.
I did like the, when the guy is picking up a magazine
as a copy of Mayfair, right?
Right next to the 35 millimeter photography magazine

(01:13:43):
he ends up buying.
But the guy that he thinks is suspicious
just casually picks up a copy of "Nave" and is flicking to that.
I don't think, I don't think to myself the top shells
for a lot of the work in the 1980s.
[LAUGHS]
Like, he thinks like, oh my way you got a train to want
and I'll buy a Scudmack.

(01:14:04):
Like, like, sit and read that.
Although that, the inner city.
I do remember when "Shoot Play" by Night Stolars Brothers
car and drove down the Staffordshire to go to V99.
We stopped off at "Services" on the way down
and I bought a copy of "Playboy"

(01:14:26):
because "Sable" was in it, the WWE F-rest there.
And I did remember we were driving down the motorway
and I was sitting reading "Playboy"
and I just, so I happened to look down and there was a car
passing, like driving alongside us basically
with these girls in it, like all looking round
in the seat of eating "Playboy" a bit horrified.

(01:14:47):
I was like, I'll put that away and read that later on.
But I mean, I remember when, I guess we must have been
driving down for the Colors Festival and we stopped,
so Elplates could put some petrol in his car in UK.
(laughs)
You're gonna get back to the car,
at least with a copy of "The Sunday Sport"

(01:15:10):
or "The Daily Sport" possibly one or two other publications.
(laughs)
A bit of light, we didn't.
We were even that far from Glasgow.
(laughs)
I think I do remember that, you're right.
Yeah, I do remember it, yes.
Yeah, I do remember it, yes.
Yeah, like finally there was publications.
(laughs)

(01:15:31):
Yeah, but you're right, it was just nice
seeing the John Men's season wavrely again
and was you say that the top shelf was a little bit lower
and the mags weren't in plastic,
the mags weren't in like sealed bags either.
No, definitely weren't, no,
so you could just flex through the copy and nave
that was just, so there.
(laughs)
You can see how this influenced something

(01:15:51):
like "Looking After Jojo", which we've been covered.
It's very, I mean obviously "Looking After Jojo"
is much broader and more expanded,
but can definitely see the influence
that this had on something like that.
Yeah, definitely.
I guess "Looking After Jojo" was a sort of natural,
can I compare and see these are a piece for this film,

(01:16:14):
for exactly the reasons that you see,
it sort of takes the knob of listen,
builds it into a bit of a family,
social saga, that was really good.
I enjoyed "Looking After Jojo" for the podcast.
- Yeah, it was brilliant. - Yeah, it was really good.
Brilliant.
Jordan's mum, there's a couple of good lines that she has,
I thought was great, especially when she's speaking about the,

(01:16:36):
again, social construct,
but it's speaking about the demise of everyone
that lives in that tower block,
and when she says that when the postman comes,
they call them the Messiah, because he delivers the gyros.
And I didn't particularly like when she takes a couple of
Jody's brown drinking vouchers.
I'll take a couple of your brown drinking vouchers.

(01:16:56):
(laughing)
Yeah, she was good.
And just, yeah, it's strange that we're always sitting by the window,
just watching, waiting for him to come back,
or I tell you what's gonna happen.
Who I thought was very good.
And only really has kind of one meter scene,
but she kind of makes the absolute most of it,

(01:17:18):
is June Watson, as I say these months.
- Yeah. - The view of you alluded to that scene earlier.
You know, like the wee-girro,
it's a good scene, like the wee-girro just sort of sitting there
tapping her feet on the breadbin or something like that.
- Yep. - And she doesn't say a word
about the little actor.
At all, she's got no lines whatsoever.
She's just kind of like a sort of silent observer
to all this drama that's going on around her.

(01:17:40):
But I thought June Watson was really, really good.
And I mean, there's a, I mean, that again,
that scene is the peak McDougal.
- Yeah. - When she breaks the plea
and everything, brilliant that move.
- Yeah, that's brilliant.
We've all been there, you know, kind of,
you've washed that twice,
and just thought, I won't need to brush it again.
- You just fucking smash it.
- That's the ultimate fuck you.

(01:18:02):
(laughs)
- That bad mood.
- Yeah, she's very good.
She's very good in that, I thought June Watson.
- There are some other great throwaway lines.
I did love the kind of the opposition guys
when they're sat in the car,
and he's watching the kid play marbles.
- He's like, that wee bastard's cheating.
(laughs)
(laughs)
- Get some, give some a clip round a ear.

(01:18:23):
(laughs)
- It's very good.
It's an excellent film in terms of building up tension
and then just breaking it with something
that you're gonna laugh at.
Until towards the end, then it's not quite so funny.
When obviously, Sadie gets a hot shot of them.
- And then or something like that, yeah.
- Yeah.
And then of course, yeah, Jordan,

(01:18:43):
the opposition are taken over.
He's retired.
He still wants to do something.
- Yeah, he's done his fucking foot to an on him.
- And though, I thought I said earlier
that you lose sympathy for him,
but I got to be honest,
in that very last moment,
that few moments, it does cut a bit of apathetic character.

(01:19:04):
And it's not so much what he says,
but he's kind of body of language, his expression,
you know, he's like, well, maybe I could do a job for you,
and then it cuts just as fairies.
But it's about way to slash him across the face, basically.
I guess that's what I warn them off
to make sure he knows his place.
- There's no need for that, surely.
Just make sure he's, you know,

(01:19:25):
give him a warning and then slash him next time
if he steps out of line, but that's the way it was done, I guess.
So...
(water splashing)
- That's right.
You're still squeezing through the boys' gate, son.
You've been sitting here by the people
that look on the tongue stills.
You want to take over, put a heavy investment into your business.

(01:19:47):
You have retired.
- Could do a job for you.
- Got somebody.
Dunnie.
But I'm connected.

(01:20:09):
I'm connected with London.
That connection's been severed.
Guess who they think, did it?
But I've said the law,
you know the rules.
- But yeah, they get that feel you, but sorry for them.
They are.
- Yeah.
- And again, there's something about,

(01:20:30):
I suppose, Jimmy Neill, for people like us,
and maybe people over a pay-dancy age who watched it,
he's always kind of going to be awesome.
To people like us, just because it's just such,
such unlovable, authentic character.
- Yeah.
- And there's obviously guys that he knew,

(01:20:51):
you know, kind of grown up, he sort of famously worked
as a, he worked in a factory and watched alongside guys like that.
Well, my pap aren't me.
His second name is StageNames because he stood in a nail once.
And I'll be, according to Wikipedia,
whether it's true or not.
But, you know, I think it's, you know,
I've really enjoyed watching them in this.
And I think a part of that enjoyment is because it is,

(01:21:14):
it did make it during the sort of,
of EriZeen Pet era.
- Mm-hmm.
- Yeah.
- And I like to spend there.
And I don't know if I ever watched the crocodile shoes.
I might have seen bits of it, I don't know.
It was, but it was massively,
it was really, really, really successful.
- It was, yeah, no, it was huge.
It was huge.
As I say, I obviously watched EriZeen Pet.

(01:21:37):
I loved Spender, but yeah, I don't,
I didn't watch crocodile shoes.
Yeah, I'm, it just kind of passed me by it,
it might have been because of the song was a bit annoying.
- It became a bit of a,
the sort of vocal, this school that we used to go to,
and it was sort of 17, it became a bit of a slowly,
so it did, - Oh really?
- Yeah.
- Going, have a bit of a slow dance with some girl

(01:21:57):
when you were for the cider to crocodile shoes.
- To crocodile shoes.
- Oh wow.
- Yeah, that would have, that would be the slow way.
And then they would, the vast song would be,
like, the walk of life by Bioshoets or something like that.
- Fucking hell.
(laughing)
- I mean, it was, it was literally the only game in town,
you know what I mean?
We lived in the countryside.
(laughing)

(01:22:18):
We couldn't get anywhere else.
- So yeah, that, that, that, that, that,
that's always, whenever I hear,
another I've heard of some crocodile shoes for,
fucking maybe 30 years, but whenever I heard it,
I always could always taste like,
case cider and smell like,
bambart and butter fags and rejection.
(laughing)
- Efficiency.
(laughing)
- Yeah, 'cause I did, I messaged you, you know,

(01:22:40):
I think it was just after I'd found this on YouTube
and I ended up watching the video for "Ain't No Doubt"
on YouTube and instantly transported back
to my kitchen in 1992.
And then I remember I was looking up in Wikipedia
and sent a new message,
and did you know that this was written by Guy Pratt?
'Cause I know how much you love Guy Pratt.
- Yeah, that's the most.

(01:23:01):
(laughing)
- I should say it was, it was cool written by Guy Pratt.
- Yeah, I listened to him and Gary Kemp,
and I'm viewing Pete Townsend
in his composer, wife, Rachel,
come on for a second, they're about their new project.
- Yeah, it is.
- I feel like they're noisy when people
can just ask a straight question.
They have to like ask the question
and then spend five minutes explaining why they ask

(01:23:23):
the question and examples of what the answer might be.
And they're just fucking, they really annoys me.
It's scribbious, Pip does it as well.
- Yeah, I know what you mean about that,
'cause it's funny, I don't know,
I listened to the one they did a couple of weeks ago,
it was Steve Jones.
And so, yeah, that's about you.
- There was a lot of rambling and stuff,
and then the hours up, and they're like,

(01:23:44):
right, thanks Steve, and Steve is like,
is that it?
Steve Jones was wanting to talk for another hour,
he's like, I feel bad, we've hardly talked about it
anything, it's not, but yeah.
They're like, no, no, no, no, we don't work,
you take out your time, and I'm like,
eh, Steve's just Steve Jones,
the fucking nothing to do, he's got a better,
he's got time.
(laughs)
- Exactly, sometimes they get them back on, don't they?

(01:24:06):
I feel like a second part, they go,
I listen to the David Gilmore one,
expect in some interesting Pink Floyd chat,
don't talk about anything that did with Pink Floyd,
it was fucking boring as fuck.
- I have to admit, the Steve Jones one,
there was a lot of, oh well, the first time I saw
this ex-pistols, oh, I remember going to a gig about this,
and you're like, right, you've just wasted three minutes here,
I wanna hear more about when Steve Jones, you know?

(01:24:27):
- Right, yeah.
- You know, David, by what you instruments and stuff?
Like, tell me more about that.
- Yeah, Shag Chrissy Haine.
(laughs)
- Did you really, Steve Jones, did he?
- Well, if the drama Pesto was anything to go by,
do you ever, you're a court like, did you?
I think it's on Disney Plus anymore, Pesto.
- It's okay, I'll find it, but yeah,
no, I didn't watch that, right,

(01:24:48):
it was on my list for ages, and I didn't get round to it,
I will have to watch that.
- In fact, I think I've got it.
- Um, so, right, I've got anything else
such as you for the songs, we've just spent the last two minutes
speaking about GuyPrap.
- No, so let's put, shoot for the sun through Swally Awards.
So, as always, the first award is the Bob in the Barman Award

(01:25:09):
for the best pub.
Got a choice of two here, I think of which one you're choosing.
(laughs)
- Well, I mean, you're not gonna choose Parker's,
'cause they don't sell pints.
- No, that's not what it is.
- And the pub with the wake, I don't know, it looked like fun.
You know, you kinda miss that when you're looking at a pub
and the first scene of them walking in
and it's just smoke filled.

(01:25:30):
- Yeah.
- I don't fancy the toilet, but I don't know that.
Yeah, it looked all right.
- Because of the bloody squirrels.
- Yes.
Yeah, very true.
But yeah, but you know what, I would, yeah,
I would totally pick that first pub.
- Yeah, Parker's anyway.
- Oh, bloody pub tree.
- Bloody UP bar.

(01:25:50):
- Next one then, Patron St of the Culture Swally.
James Cosmo Award for Being in Everything Scottish.
- I went with Bill Simpson, who plays Mickey DeBoss.
- Yeah. - True, because I mean, he was Doctor Finlay
for a 191 episodes, a Doctor Finlay.
And unfortunately, he passed before this came out.
- Right.
- This was the last thing that he made.

(01:26:10):
My other shout out though, will be John Martheau.
I've got John Martheau, but I've also bracketed
Gilly Gilchrist as well.
He was gonna be by third choice.
I thought I'd pick too much in,
but then he doesn't really say anything, does he?
- So he doesn't, he's there.
- You know, he's, you know, like both of those guys
are kinda sort of ubiquitous in Scottish drama

(01:26:31):
of a certain time period.
- Yeah.
- Next one then, Jake McQuillan, your T-Zoot Award.
I mean, for me, for its unexpectedness was Donnie
or rather Brian Cox, so a rabbit punch in John Martheau
to the, to the Pish-soaked pub for.
- That's exactly why I have, and it's the fact

(01:26:53):
that he punched him in there just the way he behave.
(laughs)
- He walks out to him.
But yeah, that's, that's why I've got as well.
- So next one then is the Yume Gregor Award
for Gratua Tish-Nurity.
So we do have, as we spoke about for maybe a few minutes,
too long, the Jazz Mags.
(laughs)

(01:27:14):
John Menzie's, but the one that sent it for me was
Jordy coming out into the sort of flat landings
in his briefs, nothing else.
I wondered if Jubydale had an obsession with that
because he spent a lot of a Vida Zane pair in Just Is Pants
and Roman around the heart.
And of course, they're always like pissed-stained

(01:27:37):
as well.
- That's a lot of stuff.
It's like stained wifers.
It's, it's very good, it's not very good,
but you know what I mean?
- That's a really 80s thing, that isn't it?
Just sort of, you know what I mean?
- We will, but go with that because I,
there's no no no no, you did,
- Why, did I say that?
I said, if there's no no no no, you did do that,
I could pick up on, so yeah.

(01:27:57):
- But it's a really 80s thing, that like,
sort of dad, sort of stretch and like a pair of wife
fronts for two days because they just,
you know, because back in those days,
dads just got washed in the bathroom sink
and had a bath like, be once or twice a week
if they'd been in a particularly dirty job.
(laughs)
- That's true.
- Otherwise it was just sort of top and tail at the sink.

(01:28:18):
- Yeah.
- My grandda used to get washed and shaved in the kitchen sink.
- No, no, and I'll never know the reason why
because there's nobody still alive
that might be able to enlighten me.
- Yeah.
- Wow.
- Okay.
- Random.
Okay, next then the Frances Begbe Award
for Good True to Swearing.
So there's a few F bombs in this.

(01:28:38):
What was your, what was your favorite swear?
- I mean, there are a lot, but because it was so unexpected,
I had to go with one of the dirty bastards
that I shite in my mind.
(laughs)
I had to, I had, you actually mentioned it earlier,
I had done it with exactly, really, with your day,
your eyes do look bad.
- You should see them, for the fucking side.

(01:28:59):
(laughs)
- Archetype with Scottish moment.
I went with a drunk guy singing Deacon Blue towards the end.
- I went, and I don't know if this is,
if this is something that happens another
to our countries, but the half and a half feels,
- Oh yes.
- It feels very Scottish that, you know,

(01:29:20):
like a half pain, a half guilt, a whiskey.
This is obviously before the change measures
to middle-leaders, half and a half,
there's something very Scottish about that.
- I did notice that and did think about that
like when they were, when they comes back from the bar
with the half and a half and I was like,
"Oh, brilliant."
And I think I did write that down,
and then the drunk started singing Deacon Blue
and I was like, "Ah, I'll go with that."

(01:29:40):
I can't wait until I'm old.
I don't have to get out of myself anymore.
And I can legitimately have a half an half,
(laughs)
without people looking at me strangely,
without being judged.
- Yeah, exactly.
- Just like, I was an old contest.
- That's what they drank in the 90s.
- Okay, and the last one then,
or Sean Connery Award, who's the winner,

(01:30:04):
who wins this one for you?
- I won for Brian Cox, the Jew.
- I couldn't split it between Cox and Jimmy Neill.
- Yeah.
- Great.
There's just something about,
I think you could say Neill's not range is such,
but he does deliver a bit more of a dramatic performance
for Cox.
I think it was maybe, maybe he has a bit too comedic at times,
but some of the facial expressions he pulls,

(01:30:25):
and I think it's the,
you do believe him when he's selling drugs to barons and stuff,
but I think it is the graveyard scene
that wins it for me in terms of his acting,
and just,
it's maybe a little bit too over the top,
but I thought, yeah, it was Cox,
the one that for me in my opinion.
- Okay, cool.
No, but if you want to watch Shoot for the Sun,
you can find it on YouTube.

(01:30:46):
Maybe you post a link to it on our X,
from the known as Twitter page.
You know, if easy for people, probably won't.
But I'll try to remember to do it.
- I will try and remember to put it in the description
of this podcast.
Anyway, so my choice was Shoot for the Sun.
I think I can hear Slay Bells on the roof,
which means that by the time we record the next episode,

(01:31:08):
it'll be December,
and then December,
we always like to do some Scottish seasonal programs,
like the crankies Christmas special,
for example, from 1983,
there it was.
- Thanks for, yeah.
- When Jimmy Cranky refers to a tiny little china man,
and pulls a corner of his slash her eyes up.
Different time.

(01:31:28):
Or Anna,
but Anna in the apocalypse,
the zombies,
Christmas zombie musical.
So what we're watching for our first December episodes
of the culture as well.
So this is a bit of a strange one, Greg,
'cause we're gonna be out of the timeline here,
because we've actually seen the first appearance
of this character.
And then we've watched the first series of this character.

(01:31:50):
But what we're gonna be talking about
actually predates the first series,
'cause this is like the pilot episode
of what we'll go on to become a very successful
and very long-running Scottish series.
So in the next episode,
we're going back to 1988 to catch up with the King of Gov'n,
as we look at, "Rab scene esbyts seasonal greet."

(01:32:10):
Now, I need to warn you,
I'm warning our listeners as well.
This episode is available on YouTube,
and it is definitely worth a watch,
because it features some of the most insane cameos
you will ever see.
And we're gonna have so much to talk about
of people that just pop up,
that maybe just don't have a line.
But there is one scene cut
from the version that's on YouTube.

(01:32:30):
But bizarrely,
that scene is available on YouTube.
And so I would recommend you watch the episode
and then you watch that scene.
You'll know where it fits in.
I don't wanna describe where it fits in.
Oh, well, I said, well,
once Rob punches the my-marxist,
then you should watch the next scene.
And the reason you should watch the next scene
is because it features a large cameo in this,

(01:32:53):
and it features a very certain,
elegantly-handed gentleman,
who may have been a time lord at one time.
So yeah, search "Rab scene esbyts seasonal greet."
And then you can search "Peter Capality" in "Rab scene esbyts"
and that'll, you can watch that all.
And that'll suffice.
So yeah, just a little warning that it's not the full episode.
There is a scene cut, but the scene is brilliant.

(01:33:14):
I watched Greg or Fisher being interviewed
on Sunday brunch on channel four,
by Tim Lovejoy and that other chef-cont,
his name is Katta member.
- Sibon Rumor, maybe.
'Cause he was, he's plugging in the new sitcom
that he's doing with Gary Tank Commander,

(01:33:34):
whose name is Greg McHugh.
Should remember his name, it's the same first name.
Only child, so he was doing the publicity for that.
And, well, it's sparkly the light he was on Sunday morning.
- Well, so you really, yeah he was, he was really good.
- Oh, good.
- I'll do you that.
Yeah, I'm looking forward to watching that.
I think I said to you, it's either gonna be really good
or really shit, but Greg,

(01:33:55):
if I show him Greg McHugh, I think it's gonna be pretty good.
I would hope.
- I would hope to.
- Yeah, definitely.
- Okay, thank you very much for listening everyone.
Hope you enjoyed the show.
If you'd like to get in touch with us,
you can, you can send us an email on cultureswalley@gmail.com.
You can send us any recommendations,
anything you've seen in the news,
or if you just want to get in touch and say hello.
You can follow us on Insta @cultureswalleypod,

(01:34:17):
or you can follow us on X,
formerly known as Twitter @swalleypod.
And you can visit our website as well, can you Greg?
- Can, you can visit us at cultureswalley.com
for links to other episodes
and some features on Scottish film and television.
And maybe over Christmas,
I will reinstate the Scottish accents page

(01:34:39):
from our blue host page,
onto our squares. - Fantastic.
- That'd be a lovely Christmas present, Greg.
That would be wonderful.
Great, well, thank you very much.
Let's get ready for Christmas, Greg.
- Let's get ready, can't wait.
I'll be in Scotland, of course, over Christmas.
- But I'll get all great to grab you for an hour or two,
'cause you'll be in Dubai before I go, something for the lot.
- Yeah, randomly.

(01:35:00):
I'll be there, we're gonna cross over,
but yeah, I think we have like a day.
- So we do. - Yeah, so.
- We'll sort it out.
But yeah, perfect.
- Okay. - That's amazing.
- Okay, well, what do we usually say?
Until next time.
'Til next time.
(upbeat music)
♪ She's lying ♪
♪ There won't be somebody else that's true ♪

(01:35:21):
♪ She's lying ♪
♪ There always been a friends we've done in ♪
♪ Why does she pretend ♪
♪ We don't doubt it's a thing to see ♪
♪ But when I keep talking ♪
(upbeat music)
♪ Oh, oh, oh ♪

(01:35:44):
♪ Oh, oh, oh, oh ♪
♪ Oh, oh, oh ♪

All Episodes

Episode 114 - Shoot For The Sun (1986)

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Dateline NBC

24/7 News: The Latest

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 114 - Shoot For The Sun (1986)