April 1, 2024 • 43 mins
Join Barbara O'Brien as she chats with Laura Carter, a dog trainer and author, about the secrets to bonding with your dog, even during indoor downtime or when they're on rest. Laura shares practical tips for keeping your pup mentally engaged, including fun activities like scent work. They also debunk common myths about dog training, emphasizing the importance of kindness and personal interaction. Get ready for an enlightening conversation that will enhance your relationship with your best dog friend, especially during those times when they need extra care and attention!
https://www.empathetic-trainer.com/
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:14):
Hi, I'm Barbara O'Brien.
I'm an animal trainer andphotographer, and I'd like to
welcome you to the EmpatheticTrainer.
Hi, this is Barbara O'Brien andwelcome to the Empathetic
Trainer.
Today's guest is Laura Carter.
Laura is a dog trainer, petadvisor and author.
(00:34):
Her specialty is designingactivities for dogs that need
restricted exercise.
She wrote a book called the VetSays Rest.
Her passion for science-baseddog training that works in
real-life situations and herfriendly and understanding
approach provide the perfectlearning environment for both
dogs and humans.
Well, laura, that sounds like agood thing for dogs and humans.
I'm glad that you're here withus.
(00:54):
Thanks for being on the showtoday.
No problem, lovely to be withyou, and where are you?
I love listening to you.
I could listen to you all day,because anytime someone has a
different accent than WisconsinMidwest, it's always fun.
So if you wouldn't mind sharingwith us what part of the world
you're in and a little bit aboutthat.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yes, well, currently I'm living in Scotland, in the
UK, but I've only moved herelast June, so I haven't got a
Scottish accent at all.
I'm actually from down south ofsouthern England.
That's all wonderful to me.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Was that a?
Speaker 2 (01:29):
big transition.
It was, yes, yeah, it was amassive transition and I've had
to completely change my businessaround, but it was quite nice
because my brother's up here, soit's nice to be near a family.
Yeah, sure.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Oh sure, I understand that.
Okay, well, let's start withthat.
Then let's talk a little bitabout your business.
What is it that you do?
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Well, I help people when they can't get their dogs
out for a walk.
Or maybe they've got a dog thatdoesn't like going out for
walks, so perhaps they've gotanxiety or they're reactive, or
they can just be.
Sometimes the dogs that theowners find are a bit naughty, a
bit much of of a handful, andthey just want to have a day at
home doing bits and pieces, um,and it's a great way of
interacting with their dog in aslightly different way, which
(02:10):
actually overall improves thebond between them that makes
sense yeah, so there's a lot.
I mean, I've got two littlechihuahuas here and they hate
going out when it's cold and wet, so we always play games at
home with them.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Well, my Midwest United States audience and
Northern United States audienceare certainly going to relate to
this, and then anybody else.
In a cold climate in my case,because I have border collies,
of course they want to gooutside, but there's times when
I don't want to go outside.
So we have a farm farm, so Ialways go outside.
(02:45):
But for, like, people that arein the city and don't have to go
out and do chores, um, thissounds like a brilliant plan you
know, so let me start at thebeginning, though, because we
are going to talk about that.
But let's talk about you alittle bit, about, like, how did
this all start?
Were you always a dog person,or you know how to just tell me
from the beginning about littleLaura and how that went?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
um, yes, I've always been a dog person, always been
around animals, um, we didn'tget our first dog, our family
dog, until I was about 10 yearsold, um, but before that we had
cats, um, but it kind ofdeveloped from there.
And then I say my career I'vealways worked around dogs, so
I've worked in various kennels,um, and then I'd run a dog
(03:23):
walking business for a bit, um,and then the dog training kind
of developed.
As I say, I've got twins, twingirls, and when they were little
it worked really really wellrunning puppy training classes
in the evenings.
My mum used to look after thegirls, oh sure, and it meant I
could be with them all day, sothat worked really really well.
Um, I said, the twins are now17, so obviously looking after
(03:48):
them isn't a thing anymore, um,but yes, it's just really
developed from there and I justlove helping people with their
dogs, um, and I think this kindof business has developed, for
there being a real need forhelping people when they can't
get out with their dogs.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Yeah, you talked about different reasons and and
um for one, yes, whether but uh,also perhaps a dog that might
be healing from an injury, youknow, or?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
definitely.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, but another part, a big part, um, especially
for people in cities or morecrowded areas, is reactive dogs
and, um, as an animal actortrainer, um, we do auditions and
so we meet all kinds of dogs.
We'll see like 60, 70 dogs in aday and we have kind of a
pre-screening thing that we havepeople fill out before they
(04:33):
come and one of the questions isis your dog social and friendly
around humans?
Is your dog safe around otherdogs?
It doesn't have to be friendlyor play.
We don't need that, we don'tnecessarily want that but not
reactive.
So reactive dogs are strugglingwith anxiety, perhaps right,
and so they're certainly notgoing to be happy on set either.
(04:55):
No, no, definitely not.
So I'm sure some people wouldlove to learn more about how to
help their dog work through thedifferent anxieties so that they
are able to be less reactive.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yes, I mean I do more with the end.
So I kind of work on hand witha behaviorist.
So I don't actually do much ofthe reactivity side of it.
I give owners that chance tobreathe and do their own thing
with their dog, which doesn'tinvolve loads of training.
So I do a lot with people, kindof helping them at home, almost
(05:31):
kind of that stress-free period, which is why I say my clients
love working with me because I'mlike right, let's just stay in,
You'll be active dog.
The behaviorist deals with theoutside bit.
We deal with having fun insidecompletely stress-free.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
So you're actually building a relationship and what
we call attunement, and that'sthe first step.
Um, I work with horses and I'vebeen.
I have horses and I'm learninga lot more all the time,
especially when these coolpeople we have on the podcast.
But, like you, couldn't take auh, an anxious horse which is
reactive you know he's athousand thousand pounds
reacting to a new environmentunless he had built a trust
(06:07):
level that the horse feels thatyou're going to keep him safe,
because if you don't keep himsafe, he's going to keep himself
safe.
And so, working with the horseyou have at the moment, instead
of projecting what you want, andthen working in where he feels
safe.
So like, yes, we work withyoung horses around other horses
instead of taking them awayuntil they build up enough
confidence to go out of sight of, say, other horses, which
(06:30):
horses are herd animalsdifferent than dogs.
But I love the concept of wherewe're going to be in a safe
environment, a low stressenvironment, and we're going to
just build relationship.
So, like we call it.
Warwick Schiller is a famoushorse trainer.
He says relationship beforehorsemanship, so with in your
case it would be like you know,relationship before um, I don't
(06:51):
know what the word would be adogs but you know handling the
dog, yeah, yeah, in the biggerworld definitely, yeah, yeah,
and I'd say that's a big thingthat I find a lot of pet owners
struggle with.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Is they, for example, want to teach their dog to walk
nicely on the lead or come backwhen they call them, but trying
to get the message across thatactually just having fun and
building that relationship withyour dog, as you were saying,
means you've got a dog thatdoesn't want to leave you.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
I love that You've got a dog that doesn't want to
leave you.
You're much more appealing thananything else that's going on
around you.
Yes, and with dogs who, like umian dunbar says, as sniffing is
their world, you know thatyou've got to be pretty darn
appealing.
Yes definitely once so, um,maybe you can give us some
suggestions of what that lookslike um, what's the same?
Speaker 2 (07:40):
the sniffing example you gave.
There.
We do a lot of scent work withthe dogs okay, like you can do
this indoors yep, you can do itinside.
in fact, funnily enough, I say Iwas just doing some with my dog
in the kitchen because it's ahorrible day out there today.
Yeah, um, and you teach them togo out and find a specific
scent.
So we use a pacific sants umbrand of gun oil at the moment,
(08:01):
which is what I'm training mydogs on, and basically they have
to search for it, which is verynatural to dogs, and then when
they find it, they just puttheir nose on it, stay as still
as possible that we call thefreeze and then, once they
freeze on the gun oil, they thenearn treats for that.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Wow, so that's like rewarding a behavior they enjoy.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Yes, yeah, they absolutely love it and it's a
really great way of workingtogether with your dog and it
actually really mentally tiringthem as well.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
So I've got working yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Yeah so my little working cocker.
He'll run around in the woodsall day, but a scent game in the
kitchen.
I can actually tire him outquicker in the kitchen playing
scent work with him than runningabout huh, does it uh?
Speaker 1 (08:50):
and so you talk about how to do this in your book,
like you demonstrate how yeahlearn how to do it um yeah,
let's talk about your book alittle bit um the.
The book is titled um sorry.
The vetest Says Rest, which isgreat.
I haven't received a copy of ityet because of how long, how
far apart we are, oh yeah.
But if you have one handy,please hold it up so everyone
(09:13):
can see it.
Brilliant yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Good, good.
So I have, I've sat at my deskand I've got there, you go All
right.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Where can people find that?
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Amazon is the best place to get it.
Okay, great, I think they shipworldwide Okay.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
All right.
And then so say you have a dogthat, like a lot of people, some
people who do dog sports, a dogwill end up with a torn ACL or
something, you know somethingjust from the activity.
And so then they need to havean operation to surgery to
correct it, and then so theyhave to be unrestricted rest
where they can't literally runaround.
(09:54):
You know, do you havesuggestions then that might be
helpful for the dog that hasthat is slowly being rehabbed
for his brain.
To you know cause, if somebodyput me in it you know I broke my
pelvis a couple of years ago Um, a horse said no, and I wasn't,
I wasn't listening, which ispart of this whole journey,
cause it was like you know, okay, what happened before.
(10:16):
What happened, anyway, uh, Ihad to like literally not be as
moving around.
You know, I had to work oncrutches for like eight weeks
and it made me.
You know that was hard for me asa human being who can, like
read definitely so how do wemake it more comfortable for a
dog in that situation wherethey're slowly coming back to
physical health?
Speaker 2 (10:36):
we.
I say I mean I've got four kindof main areas that I work with
dogs doing stuff inside let's gothrough that, that's great yeah
, so the first section is kindof I call it trick stroke
training um, sorry, say it again.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Say again, please one more time trick.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
It's kind of either tricks or training tricks or
training okay training.
So, yeah, it's littleactivities that you can do in
the house that are caters foryour dog's needs, so some of
them could be done lying down ifnecessary, if you've got a dog
that can't stand up for long.
Um, some of them you can evendo while the dog is confined to
a crate.
You can be on the outside ofthe crate doing things like, for
(11:15):
example, a nose touch, oh,which is where your dog touches
his nose onto your hand.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, no, that's.
That's brilliant, because, uh,crate rest is the hardest and
that's what you have to do inthe beginning.
You know when they'rerecovering from surgery.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Yeah, yeah.
So there's a lot of kind oftricks and things we can do
there.
Beautiful cat.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Blossom.
We don't need to see that.
There we go.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
So that's one side of it.
Another activity we do is whatI call equipment games, and this
is getting the dogs used tovarious different pieces of
equipment, so, for example,cones.
So you know, like the cone ofshame, that they may need Things
like a muzzle or a ramp orother pieces of equipment that
they might need in the future.
Ok, that's a good idea, sothey're not so stressed out,
(12:00):
when you actually have to use it.
No, no, that's the idea, becausenow you've made it a game, yes,
when you actually have to useit, no, no, that's the idea,
because now you've made it again.
Yes, exactly that's so.
We do a lot of games associatedwith them.
Then we also do a section.
I do a lot of sensory work withdogs.
So if you've got a dog thatcan't go out and sniff and
investigate the world, what wedo is we bring things in for the
(12:22):
dogs to investigate.
Oh okay, so, for example, whereyou say you've got your
beautiful cats there, you couldgo to a friend's house, take a
towel or something, rub it ontheir cat, take it home for your
dog on rest, and they've gotsomething really novel and new
to sniff and investigate.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Oh great, that's a really good idea.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Yeah, yeah, and you can do it with all sorts of
things.
So we do it with, like, sheep'sfleece or, again, being on a
farm, I think you've got allsorts of bits and pieces that
the dogs like to investigate, um, and we do it with all five of
their senses.
So there's different things youcan bring in for them to look.
We do taster plates ofdifferent things they can eat
(13:02):
and um, so yeah, explain thattaste, taste of plate a taster
plate.
So what we do is, when we do ataster plate, if we take like a
little shallow tin and in eachsection we put a very small
amount of a novel food that'ssafe for your dog to eat, okay,
so you could have, say, a littlebit of grated carrot in one
(13:25):
section, you could have somemashed potato in another section
, and it's really interesting towatch the dogs investigate the
different foods and try bits andpieces.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Okay, so does this not cause?
See, I'm thinking, I mean, thatsounds great, right, how fun.
But with some dogs, though,like I don't think they think
very hard about it's, like it isgone so fast you know, but
still, that was exciting, itwould be pretty exciting.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Yeah, I mean most dogs do.
Actually, they're slower ateating it than people think,
okay, so it's quite interestingto watch them do it.
I'm going to have to experiment.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
I think what happens with mine is there's three of
them, you know, and we put downthree dishes of whatever,
because they, you know, I feedthem whatever we're eating too,
and, um, you know, if it'sleftover and they're so
competitive.
I think there's a differentdynamic going on there.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
But if you're with your single dog.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
I can imagine that it would be much more.
Like you know, I mean cats haveto sniff everything before they
eat it.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
They do.
They're so fussy.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Cats have to really make sure like is it edible, or
a dog will eat a rock if you,you know, threw it.
Yeah, definitely Okay.
So we have the tricks andtraining, we have the work you
can do in a crate, we have thefood.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, the sensory stuff can do in a crate.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
We have the food yeah .
Speaker 2 (14:45):
One more time Sensory stuff and the sensory stuff.
So we have the trickstertraining, then we have the
equipment games, okay.
Then we have the sensory things, which are all five of the dog
senses, and it's just thinkingabout how we can enrich them in
the house while they can't goout.
And then the final S is thescent work.
So there's a lot of scent workgames you can do, like we were
(15:07):
discussing earlier, in the house, even with a dog lying down, so
you can start the process ofteaching them to stand, really
still ready to indicate what wecall on the scent, which is
where they show you where thescent is so we can go and get an
object that smells somethingdifferent.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Yep, yep, right, oh, it's true.
Actually, what you're saying isvery true, because when I meet
a new dog who hasn't met me andhe smells me, oh my goodness,
it's like a wonderful overload,because they're like wait, okay,
she's got dogs.
Wait, she's got cats.
One, two, three, four how manycats does she have?
Right?
And then she had, uh, she hadtoast for breakfast.
(15:48):
Wait, what's on her shoes?
I don't even know what thatanimal is, because they don't
know what sheep are, you know.
And they'll be like wait aminute, there's another animal.
And then you know, and thenthis, and it's like I'm this,
I'm this walking buffet offascinating smells to dogs and,
um, I let them sniff me all overand it's really, it's, you know
, I mean it's fun, but I knowwhat they're doing.
And then when I come home froman audition and I have like 60
(16:11):
different dog smells on me, mydogs go oh, you did it again,
didn't you?
Uh-huh, yeah, like, they'rejust like.
Yeah, we smell it.
Fine, you know, we weren'tthere, you weren't giving us
treats.
I think veterinarians or peoplewho work with animals have have
the same, you know, their dogs,yeah, like, yeah, uh huh.
Oh, I will say something funnythough, laura, because I have
horses, and I have one horsethat, um, uh, they're kind of
(16:32):
from the plains of montana outwest, so they grew up on the
range, they're morgan horses,which is kind of a working small
, um compact, sort of like yourbigger ponies over there, and
very clever, you know, like likeMustangs, if you can visualize,
and so she's very sensoryoriented because she worries
about what is happening on thehorizon there could be a bear,
(16:54):
it could be a coyote, it couldbe, you know, whatever and so
she's always watching.
So the way I connected with herto like get her to trust me
over time, was I let her smellme from head to toe.
I've never had a horse care somuch, but usually with horses
you're like no, get out of myface, this is dangerous.
You know, you don't want yournose there and you do have to
watch body language, you do notwant your nose bit off, but I I
(17:16):
was watching her body language,I can trust her, and she would
sniff me from head to toe, youknow.
And then I noticed that when Idid dogs somewhere else, came
home, she would spend like 15minutes because she had to like
sniff, all of that, you know,and that's how she calmed
herself, by deciding that I wasgoing to be safe with her, you
know.
So I think with a dog lettingthem, the sensory stuff sounds
(17:40):
really important.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
It is.
It's really important for them.
Yes, yeah, but I mean it's also.
It's not just the sense ofsmell, it's things like for a
dog on rest, giving themdifferent textures to walk on or
different areas to sleep,because some dogs on rest are
confined to a smaller area andthey may just have carpet and
their bed, but actually puttingthings like cooling mats down
(18:02):
which feel different and providedifferent temperatures for them
, just gives them differentoptions, yeah and different yeah
then would you recommenddifferent uh chewing text safe
chewing textured things, youknow yeah, yeah, definitely, yes
, definitely yeah.
Safe chewing tech.
Um, we do a bit of massage, abit of grooming on the dogs
(18:23):
because, again, if they've gotinjury, they may not be able to
reach particular parts of theirbody to groom themselves.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
So that's good.
Yeah, that makes sense.
Yeah, okay, uh, can yourecommend what kind of chew
things that you feel are fairlysafe for most dogs?
Speaker 2 (18:37):
um, I mean, I tend to use a lot of natural stuff with
my dogs.
Um, so they have kind of bonesfrom the butchers that we get,
um, just completely raw naturalbones.
They're great for cleaningtheir teeth.
They love things like tripesticks and we get like hooves.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Yeah, um oh my horse is always my horses, my horses,
my dogs will chew on the horsestrimming from the horses.
You know they love that.
They love that.
Yeah, they're good in smell,but they love it yeah, they love
it.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Yeah.
Anything smelly yeah, no,that's good.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Okay, huh, all right.
Well, so when we have a dogthat we're trying to work with
on rest, like this, when the vetsays rest or for whatever
reason, what are the bigmistakes that people make?
I mean, what if?
What if someone wasn't eventhinking about like, oh, my dog
might be really bored.
Now he's causing trouble, youknow, because, yes, he's anxious
or whatever's happening, orhasn't been out for several days
(19:30):
or whatever it is.
You know what?
What are the biggest mistakesthat people make that the things
that you talked about soundslike they can help rectify.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Yes, I mean one thing I find that a big mistake
people make is they kind ofalmost give the dogs lots of
chewy things to do, but a lot ofthese dogs, it's the one-to-one
connection with their owner iswhat they want.
Um, which is where the littletraining games and things that
we play involved.
It's all about getting them tointeract with their owner rather
than just a bit like a child.
(20:01):
The difference between playinga game with the child rather
than just putting them in thecorner watching television or
similar right.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
Oh yeah, I'd always rather rather have you, really
truly, I mean until they getolder and go like I don't want
to, you know, mom yeah, yeahdefinitely yeah, but when
they're young they definitelyenjoy, you know attention yeah,
yeah, yeah, so that's a reallyimportant thing.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Um, in fact, I mean, I'm working with a dog at the
moment who his owners work fromhome, so they're at home all day
with him, but they're obviouslyworking.
So there's a lot of kind ofwe're having a few behavioral
issues with him because he's notgetting the one to one time
that he craves, although hisowners are at home all day,
right, so they're like what elsedo you?
Speaker 1 (20:41):
want from us, because it's you know, yeah, yeah, I'm
sure they're lovely people too.
It's just we just don't know,you know, we just don't know,
like you know, what I mean.
So, um, I'm sure this is reallyhelpful.
That's a good idea.
Okay, I'm going to look at someof the questions that, uh, we
were going to ask you about.
Let's see, all right, so wetalk, oh, all right, let's talk
(21:02):
about wag without walks.
Is that the same thing we'retalking about right now?
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Yes, I mean, that's Wag Without Walks.
That will be a membership sitethat I'm going to be setting up
very soon, hopefully launchingbeginning of May, and that will
be something that then we getthe members in and they can then
come in and have a whole bankof videos and they'll have
access to me and there'll bemembers forums.
Oh that's great.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
I'm on several horse ones like that and that's how,
because I'm so rural in my townhas 63 people.
You know, I don't have accessto a lot of trainers and I don't
haul my horses and so beingable to go on these forums, talk
to other people with similarproblems, communicate with
people like yourself that reallyhave kind of a system and
(21:48):
principles and and um laid outan educational way, you know?
Yeah, yep, yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
Watching.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
I'm a visual person.
I need to watch someone dosomething.
I can't just read it, you know.
So that's wonderful, uh, so, uh, this, this takes some time to
get out anyway.
So as soon as you have that upand ready, you know, be sure to
let us know.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
We'll add it to the show notes so that people can
brilliant, you know, brilliant,yeah, because again, it can
sorry, she really wants to bepart of this yes, because I'm
saying people, if they've got ananxious dog or a reactive dog
or the dog with an injury, itcan be quite isolating for them
because they can't get out tomeet other dog owners.
(22:32):
Even if they're in the biggestcity, you know they can't take
these dogs out.
So being able to connect andhave that community online is
important.
Oh, I think so.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yeah, that's good.
I have another thought, anotherwhat if somebody themselves is
not able physically to getoutside?
Maybe the little dog goes outon the patio for potty purpose,
but they can't get out and dothe world as easily perhaps.
So this would be a reallywonderful thing for them to
modify it as much as they needto to make it work for them and
(23:04):
their dog.
Yeah, definitely.
Yeah, I've got a client at themoment.
She's got agoraphobia.
So it as much as they need toto make it work for them and
their dog.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
you know, yeah, definitely, yeah, yeah, as I've
got a client at the moment um,she's got agoraphobia so can't
get out, um, and she's got alovely little dog that she's got
for her companionship, um, andwe do loads of work with them,
um, and it's made such adifference to both of their
lives because they can't go outfor walks but they've got all
these activities they can now doin her flat and they're both
(23:29):
quite happy about it, which islovely to see.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
I like that a lot.
That would be very comfortingif I was having different issues
.
To have a dog.
That was part of my healinginstead of causing more anxiety
for both of us.
Definitely.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Yeah, and also, I mean, I've had clients with all
sorts of injuries.
So when it's really icy, I hadsomebody that broke their foot
last year.
Um, and her dog walker wouldtake her dog out sometimes, but
it wasn't every single day.
So again, we adapted theexercises and I set her
activities to do with her dogthat she could do sitting on a
(24:03):
chair.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Um okay, well, let's, let's.
Let's uh talk about one or twothings.
What?
So I'm sitting in a chair.
Okay, well, let's, let's, let'stalk about one or two things.
So I'm sitting in my chaircause I broke my pelvis.
Okay, thank God, that was acouple of years ago and I'm fine
now.
But in my border collie youknow, it's a border collie Okay,
so, lovely dog, but what?
What could I be doing with withher that keeps her mind engaged
?
You know, while I'm sitting, Ican't, it's not easy for me to
(24:25):
get up at that point.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
No, no.
So one of my favorite games iswhat we call the left and right
hand game.
So the first step is youliterally give your dog a treat
from your left hand, then theyget a treat from your right hand
, then they get a treat fromyour left hand.
So they have got to keepswitching sides and they've got
to work out that if they hangaround by the hand they've just
(24:48):
had a treat from, they won't getanother one.
They've got to go around to theother hand.
So that's the basics of thestart of the game, and you could
do that sitting in a chair,just dropping the treats.
Yeah, because they're thinkingthey're thinking that.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
And then you're shaping a behavior which they
love.
They are yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
Getting a behavior which they love.
They are, yeah, yeah, getting areward for shaping a behavior,
definitely.
And then we add in things likewe'll have an object in front of
us.
So the dog has now got to goget a treat from your left hand,
go around the outside of theobject and then go to your right
hand and then back around theobject to your left hand.
Okay, um, and again, we canreally develop it while the
owner's sitting down and wecould do it quite a big distance
(25:29):
away if the dog's not onrestricted exercise, because
then it gets the dog runningaround while the owner is sat.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Still, sure so when you're uh, I imagine there's a
variation where you can hidesomething that they like to play
with and then you say find it,or something too, yep, yep I
used to do that you know, welittle toy that the dog loved
and you'd be like you'd hideunder a pillow or you had her a
cushion.
You know, you hide it indifferent spots.
Now, I wasn't restricted, I wasjust trying to watch tv and the
dog was bugging me, but it waslike you know, okay, go find it.
(26:00):
And then I always go like, oh,look how clever you are.
You know, because she'd likeburrow her nose or whatever it
is and pull it out and she wasso happy, like you know, look
how clever I am, I found it, youknow yep, brilliant.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
I used to play a similar game when my twins were
little and again when theweather was horrible or we
didn't want to go out if theyweren't very well.
Quite often I'd hide littleteddies around the garden for my
jack russell at the time tofind we'd stand in the kitchen.
He would run out in the garden,find all the teddies, bring
them back.
We stayed nice and dry and hewas tired afterwards.
(26:31):
So there you go.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
There you go I like yes, let's, let's talk about
your animals just for fun.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about all your animals that
you have?
Speaker 2 (26:40):
yes, well, we've got all sorts of they'll start off,
I've got four dogs.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Okay, let's talk about them, yeah, so we've got
two chihuahuas um.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
I've got a dalmatian and I've got four dogs.
Okay, let's talk about them.
Yeah, so we've got twochihuahuas, um, I've got a
dalmatian and I've got a rescueworking cocker.
So a real mixture of dogs yeah,they are.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
They are different, very different from each other
very different.
Um, and I compete at scent workwith the spaniel and the
dalmatian, and my daughtercompetes at scent work with one
of the chihuahuas oh, that'sbrilliant, because with one of
the chihuahuas, oh that'sbrilliant Because I mean most
chihuahuas I run across thinkI'm going to eat them I had to
learn to change my energybecause I was too much for those
(27:16):
poor chihuahuas, you know.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Yeah, they're quite nervous, little dogs.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
But if they're socialized properly and you know
they're wonderful, incrediblysmart and you know, they're
wonderful.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Incredibly smart.
Yes, really smart.
Yeah, yeah, no, really smart.
So, that's the dogs.
And then we've got three cats.
Two of them are quite elderly.
Now, again, one's a rescue.
So, yeah, we've got the cats.
Then we've got four alpacas.
Oh, those are wonderful animals.
Oh, they're lovely animals.
Yes, animals.
Yes, again, they're quitedifferent to the dogs, um,
(27:48):
because they're quite particularas to who they'll approach.
So they look nice and fluffyand cuddly, but they don't
really like being touched andhandled much yeah, they're
discerning.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
They're discerning.
Yes, that's what we call theyare yeah, um.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
so we've got them and we've got chickens.
I love my chickens, yeah yeah,chickens are great and the fresh
eggs are always a bonus.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
Always yeah, for sure they're fun to watch, they're
interesting.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
They're lovely to watch.
Yeah, they're really good.
Yeah, we've got two tortoises.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Now that's interesting.
Are they very old?
Sometimes tortoises can getpretty old.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yes, one pretty old.
Yes, one of them is 10 and theother one's about he's a rescue.
He's about 50 now, um, thatamazing, yes.
Um, what else have we got?
And then my daughter's gotquite a few different animals.
Um, she's got a bearded dragonand a leopard gecko.
She's kind of into the reptileswell, we have a.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
We have a, a reptile specialist that we're going to
be talking to, and she is aYouTube phenomenon when it comes
to education, with, with,reptiles and snake.
And, of course, the the name ofthat podcast is Can Lizards
Love?
Because you know, I'm just, I'mjust not into it.
I'm just like trying tounderstand, you know, and she
says they can.
So you know.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
Oh, okay, yeah, so I'm not really into the reptiles
, but my daughter's really intothem.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
I think that's great and the scent work is cool.
It's very popular growing sporthere.
The scent work yes, it's verymuch a growing sport.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
It's here as well.
Yeah yeah, but it's just sonatural to the dogs.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Well, I think any dog can do it.
You know any dog if yousocialize and doesn't mind being
in the environment where you go, I mean it's like the best game
ever.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
I mean, how fun for a dog, you know so yeah, and also
even on a lot of scent workclasses and certainly the
competitions.
They're actually even suitablefor reactive dogs, because you
only have one dog in the spaceat a time normally.
Oh, that's true, that's verytrue.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
They are really good yeah yeah, those sparky jack
russells don't have to be noseto nose.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
No, they don't um, yeah, and also it's a great
sport for dogs that, um, perhapshave been doing other sports
and then got injured or tooelderly or something that's
right, because it's not yeah,it's not terribly as physical,
as you know.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
No, no, no, but I've watched the dogs and they're so
proud of themselves.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Oh, they love it, absolutely love it.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Yeah, and then, of course, you know service dogs,
dogs that do this, for you knowbomb sniffing dogs or whatever.
Yeah, you know, we're just.
I mean, that's an amazing thingthey do, just right.
But the fact that science isstarting to understand how dogs,
a factory, works, their noseswork and how they're learning to
, you know, figure out he can.
(30:34):
The dogs can sniff out cancer.
The dogs can sniff out things,know when somebody's going to
have a seizure, you know, warnthem ahead of time, because
there's so much going on thatwe're not even aware of, and I
find that fascinating.
And then I I also because Ialways go back to horses, but I
found out, I just learned thisthat we're not even aware of,
and I find that fascinating.
And then I also, because Ialways go back to horses, but I
(30:55):
found out, I just learned thisyear.
And how old am I?
Horses have the same olfactorysystem as much nerve centers,
whatever to pick up as dogs.
I mean, their sense of smell isas good as a dog's, which is
why they can smell water.
They can smell water a longways away.
Nobody ever thought about it,but you could literally train
horses to do scent work.
If you took the time, you knowit's like you could.
I mean, I don't know why youwould, but you could, and so, uh
(31:18):
, I thought that was that's whymy horses you know, my horse
that loves to smell me is spendso much time doing it and
whatever.
So you know, and I want to know, like, can cats be trained to
do that?
You know, yeah, I don't know.
I mean, people have to go andwe'll have to ask a cat
scientist person, but yes yeah,okay, all right.
(31:38):
Well, we're coming up on thepart of the show.
Um, bring these here so you cansee them.
We call this the snack break,the.
There's some cookies I made now.
Now, if you were here, I wouldbe sharing these beautiful, made
with real Wisconsin butter, twotypes of chocolate, chocolate
chip cookies, but since you'renot, I'll have to eat them all
myself later.
But this marks that we're goingto ask the questions, and what
(32:01):
I did was, in your intake form,I sent you a series of questions
that we, uh, borrowed from umtim ferris's book tribe of
mentors and there's anotherpodcaster who does this and so
we totally stole this idea,because I I just think it's fun
to ask these questions yeahdefinitely.
So I'm gonna ask some questionsand, uh, the first one is and
(32:23):
you picked these out of like 20that we sent um, there's just
five what?
I can't remember what I wrote,so nobody, nobody can, which
makes this fun for me, so it'salways a surprise uh, what book
would you recommend, and whybesides your own?
Of course we're gonna.
We're gonna look at yes, ofcourse.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Um, I mean it depends on, I say, kind of which situation.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Um I mean I'm a big fan of the stick, yeah I'm sorry
, it could be any subject, so itdoesn't have to necessarily be
dogs.
So oh any subject yeah, whatbook would you recommend?
Speaker 2 (32:59):
probably one of my favorite books out there, which
is quite an old one, is calledDon't Shoot the Dog.
It's a Karen Pryor book I'veheard of Karen Pryor.
Yeah, yeah, and it's a reallygood book because it talks about
all the principles of dogtraining, but it's applying it
to people.
It's a really interesting book,really good book, and it's
(33:20):
really well written.
Any it's really easy to read,quick to understand, um, and
just peels to so many differentpeople and it just shows how you
can use all the kind ofbehavior traits that we train
with dog trainers, with people,without with any animals.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Well, I do find that working with dogs and children
is very similar you have to findout what makes them happy and
keep them happy and motivated,because once they're unhappy,
it's done.
Nobody learns when they'reunhappy or scared or sad.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
So no, definitely not no.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, so that's Karen Pryor.
Don't shoot the dog.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
That's the dog.
Yeah, okay, it's quite an oldbook, but it's one I always go
back to.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
So, yeah, yeah, there's always lots of wisdom.
I mean, you know, yes, okay, um, what has been your biggest?
Speaker 2 (34:11):
failure, and how has it helped you?
Oh, I can't remember what Iwrote down for this one either
um, I mean, it would probably bethe fact that I was to say
quite a few or about 10 yearsago, I started a dog daycare
business, um, which originally Istarted.
I had a business partner that Iset it up with, um, but she
(34:32):
left quite quickly because shewas used to employed work and
she wasn't used to the fact thatwhen you start a new business,
it takes a long time before youtake home any money yeah, it
takes a while um, yeah, but thenthe business developed and it
got to the stage where I endedup having five staff that worked
for me, um, and we had um threeindustrial units that we ran
(34:56):
the business from oh goodnessum, but the problem was is I'm
an absolute rubbish manager.
I don't like working, I don'tlike organizing people.
So it was a bit of a failure,as in all I wanted to do was to
work with the dogs all day, notmanage people.
(35:17):
So I actually sold the businessin 2019, just before COVID.
Oh, that was wise.
It was very wise, yes, simplybecause I ended up creating a
business I absolutely hated,because it's all about managing
people rather than working withdogs.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Well, it doesn't sound like a failure, then it
sounds more like a life lesson,you know.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
But that's what you learned from it.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
You learned from it, yeah definitely so, yeah, I can
relate to that.
Um, that's why you know I uhmess up on time zones and things
like numbers, and you know soif I didn't have the help of my
good producer and my husband whoworks with me in our regular
business, which is animal actors, and I'm also a commercial
photographer.
Um, that, those organizationalthings you know, commercial
(36:05):
photographer, that thoseorganizational things you know I
can sell and I can do all thephysical stuff, but the
organization you know like well,I'm really grateful for my help
.
Yeah, definitely Shout out tomy producer, elizabeth, so
brilliant.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:19):
Okay.
Number three is if you couldsend a message to the world,
what would that be?
Or do you have a favorite quote, and why?
Speaker 2 (36:30):
I think the message to the world would just be be
kind, because there's so manypeople that get you know.
Whatever animal you're dealingwith, whether it be human, dog,
cat horse or anything human, dog, cat horse or anything um,
there's so many people that kindof almost try to use authority
to almost get power over animalsand other people.
Um, and it really shouldn't belike that.
(36:52):
Um, say kindness will alwaysget there in the end.
Um, and that's what you want todo when you're doing working
with animals, as you mentionedpreviously, you know if your
animal is scared or worried oranything.
They're not actually learning.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
No, you're right, so we can all use a little kindness
.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
Right, yeah, definitely I think it is.
It's be kind OK, I like I agree.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I agree.
All right, what is the worstadvice given in your profession
or bad idea that you hear of inyour field of expertise?
Speaker 2 (37:24):
you hear of in your field of expertise.
Probably the biggest or thekind of the worst thing I'll say
is that that always bugs me iswhen you've got a dog on
restricted exercise and thego-to advice is give them a Kong
.
That will sort it all out.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Okay, so for our audience that doesn't know what
a Kong is, could you describe?
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Yes.
So it's like a little redrubber toy that you can fill up
with food.
That's a great way of it's agreat activity for dogs, but if
you've got a dog.
So I spoke to a client thismorning whose dogs just had an
operation.
Um, and she's one week in afterthe operation and already she's
going.
The Kong isn't working anymore,you know I can't keep giving my
(38:02):
dog all this food, yeah, um, butit is kind of the go-to advice
for people on pet on um craterest is just give the dog
something to chew on orsomething to do like that um,
and that will solve all yourproblems.
And it's not as we were sayingearlier.
The dog wants to spend that one, that one to one time with you
(38:22):
doing those fun things, but it'sjust adapting the activity.
If walks can't go ahead, youcan do lots of other things with
your dog, which they just wantyour time.
You're right?
Speaker 1 (38:34):
No, that's it's very true, All right.
And then the last question whatdid you want to be as a child
and how close did you get tothat dream?
What?
Speaker 2 (38:42):
did you want to be as a child, and how close did you
get to that dream?
I remember the answer to thisone, as my mom will proudly tell
you.
When I was about two or three,I wanted to be a scarecrow.
When I grew up, that was mylife ambition yeah that's
wonderful.
(39:02):
Yeah, I don't know why, but thatwas my life ambition.
But I suppose it's beingoutside in all weathers.
You know being so.
I love being outside, obviouslyworking with the dogs.
So to some degree I've met,I've reached my goal.
I'm not stuck in an officesomewhere, which is what I'd
(39:23):
hate to do.
Speaker 1 (39:29):
Oh right, yeah.
Yeah, that's pretty sweet.
You're the first person that'sever said they wanted to be a
scarecrow, so I guess memorableand I love that.
Who doesn't mind a scarecrow?
They're fun, you know, I meanthey're fun yeah, yeah yeah, of
course the Wizard of Oz had youknow that really nice scarecrow.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
So you know definitely, yeah.
Yeah, I mean, I don't knowwhere that came from, but I say,
my mom will always proudly tellyou that when when laura was
little, she wanted to be ascarecrow.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
So that's brilliant.
I love it.
I love it okay.
Well then, why don't you pleasefill us in, um now?
This information will also beon the show notes, um, where you
, wherever people listen totheir podcasts or watch youtube,
but why don't you tell us howpeople can reach you and what if
they want to work with you?
You know how that works.
I don't know if that's onlylocal or as you get your wags to
.
I'm sorry, wag without walksprogram going, but let's talk
(40:17):
about how to find you.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Yep, so my brand at the moment is laura carter
canines, so I've got my website,uh, which is laura carter
caninescom, and I'm on facebook,I'm on instagram and I'm on
tiktok under that name.
Okay, um, and what most peopledo is, if they need to work with
me is to start with, we book aone-to-one zoom call for about
(40:41):
half an hour.
okay, it's completely free wowno charge for that at all, um,
and we can have a little chatand you can tell me about all
the problems you're having withyour dog or the situation that
you're in, and then I can kindof advise you as to how I can
help you and some kind of putacross some of the ideas and the
games that I think will be workfor you.
And then from there you canthen either book your one-to-one
(41:06):
sessions with me, and we dokind of one a week for as many
months as you want to.
So some people just book me forone month and we do a weekly
Zoom session and then they getlots of support in between, okay
, or, starting in May, you'll beable to just go on the slightly
lower priced membership whereyou don't get the one to one
help, but obviously I'd say it'sslightly lower priced.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
So the resources are there.
Yeah, no, that's yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:32):
The resources are there.
Yeah, yeah, I work with peopleall over the world, so most of
my clients aren't local to me.
So, as I said, a lot of thesepeople are stuck in their homes
with their dogs for whateverreason.
So actually it wouldn't bepractical to meet up face to
face, which is why it works sowell with the modern technology.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
Yeah, we're grateful.
We're grateful for that.
Speaker 2 (41:55):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
Yeah Well, the nice thing about dogs and any animal
is it's universal.
I mean, dogs all speak the samelanguage and dogs, dogs like
their owners, you know, nomatter what.
So there's always that basethat you can.
You know everyone can relateand you can communicate how to
help their dog.
So yes, definitely yes.
(42:16):
Okay, so um, let's hold up yourbook one more time for
everybody.
So we can, we can see it Okay.
The Vet Says Rest by LauraCarter, and you can find it
wherever books are sold, likeAmazon, things like that, and
she's going to have a reallycool program coming up, maybe by
the time this is out.
So just look at the notes, butthat's called Wag Without Walks
(42:38):
and in the meanwhile, you canreach out directly and the links
will be on all this info, info,and Laura can help you with
your pup.
So, Laura, thank you so muchfor coming today being on our
show.
Thank you for the time zonediscrepancy and being patient
with us.
I'm really going to work thatout.
(42:58):
Actually, I'm going to letElizabeth always be on top of it
, because she would be myproducer and I don't have to
worry about it because there'stoo much going on.
I should just say this time,you know, this is it, uh, and I
wish I was in Scotland right nowbecause it sounds like a great
place to be, but, um, yes,scotland's lovely, I'm in snowy
Wisconsin instead.
Speaker 2 (43:16):
Um, thank you again so much for being here no
problem, no, lovely to have achat with you.
Hi, I'm Barbara O'Brien.
I'm an animal trainer andphotographer, and I'd like to
welcome you to the EmpatheticTrainer.
Hi, this is Barbara O'Brien andwelcome to the Empathetic
Trainer.
Today's guest is Laura Carter.
Laura is a dog trainer, petadvisor and author.
(00:34):
Her specialty is designingactivities for dogs that need
restricted exercise.
She wrote a book called the VetSays Rest.
Her passion for science-baseddog training that works in
real-life situations and herfriendly and understanding
approach provide the perfectlearning environment for both
dogs and humans.
Well, laura, that sounds like agood thing for dogs and humans.
I'm glad that you're here withus.
(00:54):
Thanks for being on the showtoday.
No problem, lovely to be withyou, and where are you?
I love listening to you.
I could listen to you all day,because anytime someone has a
different accent than WisconsinMidwest, it's always fun.
So if you wouldn't mind sharingwith us what part of the world
you're in and a little bit aboutthat.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yes, well, currently I'm living in Scotland, in the
UK, but I've only moved herelast June, so I haven't got a
Scottish accent at all.
I'm actually from down south ofsouthern England.
That's all wonderful to me.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Was that a?
Speaker 2 (01:29):
big transition.
It was, yes, yeah, it was amassive transition and I've had
to completely change my businessaround, but it was quite nice
because my brother's up here, soit's nice to be near a family.
Yeah, sure.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Oh sure, I understand that.
Okay, well, let's start withthat.
Then let's talk a little bitabout your business.
What is it that you do?
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Well, I help people when they can't get their dogs
out for a walk.
Or maybe they've got a dog thatdoesn't like going out for
walks, so perhaps they've gotanxiety or they're reactive, or
they can just be.
Sometimes the dogs that theowners find are a bit naughty, a
bit much of of a handful, andthey just want to have a day at
home doing bits and pieces, um,and it's a great way of
interacting with their dog in aslightly different way, which
(02:10):
actually overall improves thebond between them that makes
sense yeah, so there's a lot.
I mean, I've got two littlechihuahuas here and they hate
going out when it's cold and wet, so we always play games at
home with them.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Well, my Midwest United States audience and
Northern United States audienceare certainly going to relate to
this, and then anybody else.
In a cold climate in my case,because I have border collies,
of course they want to gooutside, but there's times when
I don't want to go outside.
So we have a farm farm, so Ialways go outside.
(02:45):
But for, like, people that arein the city and don't have to go
out and do chores, um, thissounds like a brilliant plan you
know, so let me start at thebeginning, though, because we
are going to talk about that.
But let's talk about you alittle bit, about, like, how did
this all start?
Were you always a dog person,or you know how to just tell me
from the beginning about littleLaura and how that went?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
um, yes, I've always been a dog person, always been
around animals, um, we didn'tget our first dog, our family
dog, until I was about 10 yearsold, um, but before that we had
cats, um, but it kind ofdeveloped from there.
And then I say my career I'vealways worked around dogs, so
I've worked in various kennels,um, and then I'd run a dog
(03:23):
walking business for a bit, um,and then the dog training kind
of developed.
As I say, I've got twins, twingirls, and when they were little
it worked really really wellrunning puppy training classes
in the evenings.
My mum used to look after thegirls, oh sure, and it meant I
could be with them all day, sothat worked really really well.
Um, I said, the twins are now17, so obviously looking after
(03:48):
them isn't a thing anymore, um,but yes, it's just really
developed from there and I justlove helping people with their
dogs, um, and I think this kindof business has developed, for
there being a real need forhelping people when they can't
get out with their dogs.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Yeah, you talked about different reasons and and
um for one, yes, whether but uh,also perhaps a dog that might
be healing from an injury, youknow, or?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
definitely.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, but another part, a big part, um, especially
for people in cities or morecrowded areas, is reactive dogs
and, um, as an animal actortrainer, um, we do auditions and
so we meet all kinds of dogs.
We'll see like 60, 70 dogs in aday and we have kind of a
pre-screening thing that we havepeople fill out before they
(04:33):
come and one of the questions isis your dog social and friendly
around humans?
Is your dog safe around otherdogs?
It doesn't have to be friendlyor play.
We don't need that, we don'tnecessarily want that but not
reactive.
So reactive dogs are strugglingwith anxiety, perhaps right,
and so they're certainly notgoing to be happy on set either.
(04:55):
No, no, definitely not.
So I'm sure some people wouldlove to learn more about how to
help their dog work through thedifferent anxieties so that they
are able to be less reactive.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yes, I mean I do more with the end.
So I kind of work on hand witha behaviorist.
So I don't actually do much ofthe reactivity side of it.
I give owners that chance tobreathe and do their own thing
with their dog, which doesn'tinvolve loads of training.
So I do a lot with people, kindof helping them at home, almost
(05:31):
kind of that stress-free period, which is why I say my clients
love working with me because I'mlike right, let's just stay in,
You'll be active dog.
The behaviorist deals with theoutside bit.
We deal with having fun insidecompletely stress-free.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
So you're actually building a relationship and what
we call attunement, and that'sthe first step.
Um, I work with horses and I'vebeen.
I have horses and I'm learninga lot more all the time,
especially when these coolpeople we have on the podcast.
But, like you, couldn't take auh, an anxious horse which is
reactive you know he's athousand thousand pounds
reacting to a new environmentunless he had built a trust
(06:07):
level that the horse feels thatyou're going to keep him safe,
because if you don't keep himsafe, he's going to keep himself
safe.
And so, working with the horseyou have at the moment, instead
of projecting what you want, andthen working in where he feels
safe.
So like, yes, we work withyoung horses around other horses
instead of taking them awayuntil they build up enough
confidence to go out of sight of, say, other horses, which
(06:30):
horses are herd animalsdifferent than dogs.
But I love the concept of wherewe're going to be in a safe
environment, a low stressenvironment, and we're going to
just build relationship.
So, like we call it.
Warwick Schiller is a famoushorse trainer.
He says relationship beforehorsemanship, so with in your
case it would be like you know,relationship before um, I don't
(06:51):
know what the word would be adogs but you know handling the
dog, yeah, yeah, in the biggerworld definitely, yeah, yeah,
and I'd say that's a big thingthat I find a lot of pet owners
struggle with.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Is they, for example, want to teach their dog to walk
nicely on the lead or come backwhen they call them, but trying
to get the message across thatactually just having fun and
building that relationship withyour dog, as you were saying,
means you've got a dog thatdoesn't want to leave you.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
I love that You've got a dog that doesn't want to
leave you.
You're much more appealing thananything else that's going on
around you.
Yes, and with dogs who, like umian dunbar says, as sniffing is
their world, you know thatyou've got to be pretty darn
appealing.
Yes definitely once so, um,maybe you can give us some
suggestions of what that lookslike um, what's the same?
Speaker 2 (07:40):
the sniffing example you gave.
There.
We do a lot of scent work withthe dogs okay, like you can do
this indoors yep, you can do itinside.
in fact, funnily enough, I say Iwas just doing some with my dog
in the kitchen because it's ahorrible day out there today.
Yeah, um, and you teach them togo out and find a specific
scent.
So we use a pacific sants umbrand of gun oil at the moment,
(08:01):
which is what I'm training mydogs on, and basically they have
to search for it, which is verynatural to dogs, and then when
they find it, they just puttheir nose on it, stay as still
as possible that we call thefreeze and then, once they
freeze on the gun oil, they thenearn treats for that.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Wow, so that's like rewarding a behavior they enjoy.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Yes, yeah, they absolutely love it and it's a
really great way of workingtogether with your dog and it
actually really mentally tiringthem as well.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
So I've got working yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Yeah so my little working cocker.
He'll run around in the woodsall day, but a scent game in the
kitchen.
I can actually tire him outquicker in the kitchen playing
scent work with him than runningabout huh, does it uh?
Speaker 1 (08:50):
and so you talk about how to do this in your book,
like you demonstrate how yeahlearn how to do it um yeah,
let's talk about your book alittle bit um the.
The book is titled um sorry.
The vetest Says Rest, which isgreat.
I haven't received a copy of ityet because of how long, how
far apart we are, oh yeah.
But if you have one handy,please hold it up so everyone
(09:13):
can see it.
Brilliant yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Good, good.
So I have, I've sat at my deskand I've got there, you go All
right.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Where can people find that?
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Amazon is the best place to get it.
Okay, great, I think they shipworldwide Okay.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
All right.
And then so say you have a dogthat, like a lot of people, some
people who do dog sports, a dogwill end up with a torn ACL or
something, you know somethingjust from the activity.
And so then they need to havean operation to surgery to
correct it, and then so theyhave to be unrestricted rest
where they can't literally runaround.
(09:54):
You know, do you havesuggestions then that might be
helpful for the dog that hasthat is slowly being rehabbed
for his brain.
To you know cause, if somebodyput me in it you know I broke my
pelvis a couple of years ago Um, a horse said no, and I wasn't,
I wasn't listening, which ispart of this whole journey,
cause it was like you know, okay, what happened before.
(10:16):
What happened, anyway, uh, Ihad to like literally not be as
moving around.
You know, I had to work oncrutches for like eight weeks
and it made me.
You know that was hard for me asa human being who can, like
read definitely so how do wemake it more comfortable for a
dog in that situation wherethey're slowly coming back to
physical health?
Speaker 2 (10:36):
we.
I say I mean I've got four kindof main areas that I work with
dogs doing stuff inside let's gothrough that, that's great yeah
, so the first section is kindof I call it trick stroke
training um, sorry, say it again.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Say again, please one more time trick.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
It's kind of either tricks or training tricks or
training okay training.
So, yeah, it's littleactivities that you can do in
the house that are caters foryour dog's needs, so some of
them could be done lying down ifnecessary, if you've got a dog
that can't stand up for long.
Um, some of them you can evendo while the dog is confined to
a crate.
You can be on the outside ofthe crate doing things like, for
(11:15):
example, a nose touch, oh,which is where your dog touches
his nose onto your hand.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, no, that's.
That's brilliant, because, uh,crate rest is the hardest and
that's what you have to do inthe beginning.
You know when they'rerecovering from surgery.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Yeah, yeah.
So there's a lot of kind oftricks and things we can do
there.
Beautiful cat.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Blossom.
We don't need to see that.
There we go.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
So that's one side of it.
Another activity we do is whatI call equipment games, and this
is getting the dogs used tovarious different pieces of
equipment, so, for example,cones.
So you know, like the cone ofshame, that they may need Things
like a muzzle or a ramp orother pieces of equipment that
they might need in the future.
Ok, that's a good idea, sothey're not so stressed out,
(12:00):
when you actually have to use it.
No, no, that's the idea, becausenow you've made it a game, yes,
when you actually have to useit, no, no, that's the idea,
because now you've made it again.
Yes, exactly that's so.
We do a lot of games associatedwith them.
Then we also do a section.
I do a lot of sensory work withdogs.
So if you've got a dog thatcan't go out and sniff and
investigate the world, what wedo is we bring things in for the
(12:22):
dogs to investigate.
Oh okay, so, for example, whereyou say you've got your
beautiful cats there, you couldgo to a friend's house, take a
towel or something, rub it ontheir cat, take it home for your
dog on rest, and they've gotsomething really novel and new
to sniff and investigate.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Oh great, that's a really good idea.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
Yeah, yeah, and you can do it with all sorts of
things.
So we do it with, like, sheep'sfleece or, again, being on a
farm, I think you've got allsorts of bits and pieces that
the dogs like to investigate, um, and we do it with all five of
their senses.
So there's different things youcan bring in for them to look.
We do taster plates ofdifferent things they can eat
(13:02):
and um, so yeah, explain thattaste, taste of plate a taster
plate.
So what we do is, when we do ataster plate, if we take like a
little shallow tin and in eachsection we put a very small
amount of a novel food that'ssafe for your dog to eat, okay,
so you could have, say, a littlebit of grated carrot in one
(13:25):
section, you could have somemashed potato in another section
, and it's really interesting towatch the dogs investigate the
different foods and try bits andpieces.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Okay, so does this not cause?
See, I'm thinking, I mean, thatsounds great, right, how fun.
But with some dogs, though,like I don't think they think
very hard about it's, like it isgone so fast you know, but
still, that was exciting, itwould be pretty exciting.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Yeah, I mean most dogs do.
Actually, they're slower ateating it than people think,
okay, so it's quite interestingto watch them do it.
I'm going to have to experiment.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
I think what happens with mine is there's three of
them, you know, and we put downthree dishes of whatever,
because they, you know, I feedthem whatever we're eating too,
and, um, you know, if it'sleftover and they're so
competitive.
I think there's a differentdynamic going on there.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
But if you're with your single dog.
Speaker 1 (14:19):
I can imagine that it would be much more.
Like you know, I mean cats haveto sniff everything before they
eat it.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
They do.
They're so fussy.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Cats have to really make sure like is it edible, or
a dog will eat a rock if you,you know, threw it.
Yeah, definitely Okay.
So we have the tricks andtraining, we have the work you
can do in a crate, we have thefood.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, the sensory stuff can do in a crate.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
We have the food yeah .
Speaker 2 (14:45):
One more time Sensory stuff and the sensory stuff.
So we have the trickstertraining, then we have the
equipment games, okay.
Then we have the sensory things, which are all five of the dog
senses, and it's just thinkingabout how we can enrich them in
the house while they can't goout.
And then the final S is thescent work.
So there's a lot of scent workgames you can do, like we were
(15:07):
discussing earlier, in the house, even with a dog lying down, so
you can start the process ofteaching them to stand, really
still ready to indicate what wecall on the scent, which is
where they show you where thescent is so we can go and get an
object that smells somethingdifferent.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Yep, yep, right, oh, it's true.
Actually, what you're saying isvery true, because when I meet
a new dog who hasn't met me andhe smells me, oh my goodness,
it's like a wonderful overload,because they're like wait, okay,
she's got dogs.
Wait, she's got cats.
One, two, three, four how manycats does she have?
Right?
And then she had, uh, she hadtoast for breakfast.
(15:48):
Wait, what's on her shoes?
I don't even know what thatanimal is, because they don't
know what sheep are, you know.
And they'll be like wait aminute, there's another animal.
And then you know, and thenthis, and it's like I'm this,
I'm this walking buffet offascinating smells to dogs and,
um, I let them sniff me all overand it's really, it's, you know
, I mean it's fun, but I knowwhat they're doing.
And then when I come home froman audition and I have like 60
(16:11):
different dog smells on me, mydogs go oh, you did it again,
didn't you?
Uh-huh, yeah, like, they'rejust like.
Yeah, we smell it.
Fine, you know, we weren'tthere, you weren't giving us
treats.
I think veterinarians or peoplewho work with animals have have
the same, you know, their dogs,yeah, like, yeah, uh huh.
Oh, I will say something funnythough, laura, because I have
horses, and I have one horsethat, um, uh, they're kind of
(16:32):
from the plains of montana outwest, so they grew up on the
range, they're morgan horses,which is kind of a working small
, um compact, sort of like yourbigger ponies over there, and
very clever, you know, like likeMustangs, if you can visualize,
and so she's very sensoryoriented because she worries
about what is happening on thehorizon there could be a bear,
(16:54):
it could be a coyote, it couldbe, you know, whatever and so
she's always watching.
So the way I connected with herto like get her to trust me
over time, was I let her smellme from head to toe.
I've never had a horse care somuch, but usually with horses
you're like no, get out of myface, this is dangerous.
You know, you don't want yournose there and you do have to
watch body language, you do notwant your nose bit off, but I I
(17:16):
was watching her body language,I can trust her, and she would
sniff me from head to toe, youknow.
And then I noticed that when Idid dogs somewhere else, came
home, she would spend like 15minutes because she had to like
sniff, all of that, you know,and that's how she calmed
herself, by deciding that I wasgoing to be safe with her, you
know.
So I think with a dog lettingthem, the sensory stuff sounds
(17:40):
really important.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
It is.
It's really important for them.
Yes, yeah, but I mean it's also.
It's not just the sense ofsmell, it's things like for a
dog on rest, giving themdifferent textures to walk on or
different areas to sleep,because some dogs on rest are
confined to a smaller area andthey may just have carpet and
their bed, but actually puttingthings like cooling mats down
(18:02):
which feel different and providedifferent temperatures for them
, just gives them differentoptions, yeah and different yeah
then would you recommenddifferent uh chewing text safe
chewing textured things, youknow yeah, yeah, definitely, yes
, definitely yeah.
Safe chewing tech.
Um, we do a bit of massage, abit of grooming on the dogs
(18:23):
because, again, if they've gotinjury, they may not be able to
reach particular parts of theirbody to groom themselves.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
So that's good.
Yeah, that makes sense.
Yeah, okay, uh, can yourecommend what kind of chew
things that you feel are fairlysafe for most dogs?
Speaker 2 (18:37):
um, I mean, I tend to use a lot of natural stuff with
my dogs.
Um, so they have kind of bonesfrom the butchers that we get,
um, just completely raw naturalbones.
They're great for cleaningtheir teeth.
They love things like tripesticks and we get like hooves.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
Yeah, um oh my horse is always my horses, my horses,
my dogs will chew on the horsestrimming from the horses.
You know they love that.
They love that.
Yeah, they're good in smell,but they love it yeah, they love
it.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Yeah.
Anything smelly yeah, no,that's good.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Okay, huh, all right.
Well, so when we have a dogthat we're trying to work with
on rest, like this, when the vetsays rest or for whatever
reason, what are the bigmistakes that people make?
I mean, what if?
What if someone wasn't eventhinking about like, oh, my dog
might be really bored.
Now he's causing trouble, youknow, because, yes, he's anxious
or whatever's happening, orhasn't been out for several days
(19:30):
or whatever it is.
You know what?
What are the biggest mistakesthat people make that the things
that you talked about soundslike they can help rectify.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Yes, I mean one thing I find that a big mistake
people make is they kind ofalmost give the dogs lots of
chewy things to do, but a lot ofthese dogs, it's the one-to-one
connection with their owner iswhat they want.
Um, which is where the littletraining games and things that
we play involved.
It's all about getting them tointeract with their owner rather
than just a bit like a child.
(20:01):
The difference between playinga game with the child rather
than just putting them in thecorner watching television or
similar right.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
Oh yeah, I'd always rather rather have you, really
truly, I mean until they getolder and go like I don't want
to, you know, mom yeah, yeahdefinitely yeah, but when
they're young they definitelyenjoy, you know attention yeah,
yeah, yeah, so that's a reallyimportant thing.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Um, in fact, I mean, I'm working with a dog at the
moment who his owners work fromhome, so they're at home all day
with him, but they're obviouslyworking.
So there's a lot of kind ofwe're having a few behavioral
issues with him because he's notgetting the one to one time
that he craves, although hisowners are at home all day,
right, so they're like what elsedo you?
Speaker 1 (20:41):
want from us, because it's you know, yeah, yeah, I'm
sure they're lovely people too.
It's just we just don't know,you know, we just don't know,
like you know, what I mean.
So, um, I'm sure this is reallyhelpful.
That's a good idea.
Okay, I'm going to look at someof the questions that, uh, we
were going to ask you about.
Let's see, all right, so wetalk, oh, all right, let's talk
(21:02):
about wag without walks.
Is that the same thing we'retalking about right now?
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Yes, I mean, that's Wag Without Walks.
That will be a membership sitethat I'm going to be setting up
very soon, hopefully launchingbeginning of May, and that will
be something that then we getthe members in and they can then
come in and have a whole bankof videos and they'll have
access to me and there'll bemembers forums.
Oh that's great.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
I'm on several horse ones like that and that's how,
because I'm so rural in my townhas 63 people.
You know, I don't have accessto a lot of trainers and I don't
haul my horses and so beingable to go on these forums, talk
to other people with similarproblems, communicate with
people like yourself that reallyhave kind of a system and
(21:48):
principles and and um laid outan educational way, you know?
Yeah, yep, yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
Watching.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
I'm a visual person.
I need to watch someone dosomething.
I can't just read it, you know.
So that's wonderful, uh, so, uh, this, this takes some time to
get out anyway.
So as soon as you have that upand ready, you know, be sure to
let us know.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
We'll add it to the show notes so that people can
brilliant, you know, brilliant,yeah, because again, it can
sorry, she really wants to bepart of this yes, because I'm
saying people, if they've got ananxious dog or a reactive dog
or the dog with an injury, itcan be quite isolating for them
because they can't get out tomeet other dog owners.
(22:32):
Even if they're in the biggestcity, you know they can't take
these dogs out.
So being able to connect andhave that community online is
important.
Oh, I think so.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yeah, that's good.
I have another thought, anotherwhat if somebody themselves is
not able physically to getoutside?
Maybe the little dog goes outon the patio for potty purpose,
but they can't get out and dothe world as easily perhaps.
So this would be a reallywonderful thing for them to
modify it as much as they needto to make it work for them and
(23:04):
their dog.
Yeah, definitely.
Yeah, I've got a client at themoment.
She's got agoraphobia.
So it as much as they need toto make it work for them and
their dog.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
you know, yeah, definitely, yeah, yeah, as I've
got a client at the moment um,she's got agoraphobia so can't
get out, um, and she's got alovely little dog that she's got
for her companionship, um, andwe do loads of work with them,
um, and it's made such adifference to both of their
lives because they can't go outfor walks but they've got all
these activities they can now doin her flat and they're both
(23:29):
quite happy about it, which islovely to see.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
I like that a lot.
That would be very comfortingif I was having different issues
.
To have a dog.
That was part of my healinginstead of causing more anxiety
for both of us.
Definitely.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Yeah, and also, I mean, I've had clients with all
sorts of injuries.
So when it's really icy, I hadsomebody that broke their foot
last year.
Um, and her dog walker wouldtake her dog out sometimes, but
it wasn't every single day.
So again, we adapted theexercises and I set her
activities to do with her dogthat she could do sitting on a
(24:03):
chair.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Um okay, well, let's, let's.
Let's uh talk about one or twothings.
What?
So I'm sitting in a chair.
Okay, well, let's, let's, let'stalk about one or two things.
So I'm sitting in my chaircause I broke my pelvis.
Okay, thank God, that was acouple of years ago and I'm fine
now.
But in my border collie youknow, it's a border collie Okay,
so, lovely dog, but what?
What could I be doing with withher that keeps her mind engaged
?
You know, while I'm sitting, Ican't, it's not easy for me to
(24:25):
get up at that point.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
No, no.
So one of my favorite games iswhat we call the left and right
hand game.
So the first step is youliterally give your dog a treat
from your left hand, then theyget a treat from your right hand
, then they get a treat fromyour left hand.
So they have got to keepswitching sides and they've got
to work out that if they hangaround by the hand they've just
(24:48):
had a treat from, they won't getanother one.
They've got to go around to theother hand.
So that's the basics of thestart of the game, and you could
do that sitting in a chair,just dropping the treats.
Yeah, because they're thinkingthey're thinking that.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
And then you're shaping a behavior which they
love.
They are yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
Getting a behavior which they love.
They are, yeah, yeah, getting areward for shaping a behavior,
definitely.
And then we add in things likewe'll have an object in front of
us.
So the dog has now got to goget a treat from your left hand,
go around the outside of theobject and then go to your right
hand and then back around theobject to your left hand.
Okay, um, and again, we canreally develop it while the
owner's sitting down and wecould do it quite a big distance
(25:29):
away if the dog's not onrestricted exercise, because
then it gets the dog runningaround while the owner is sat.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Still, sure so when you're uh, I imagine there's a
variation where you can hidesomething that they like to play
with and then you say find it,or something too, yep, yep I
used to do that you know, welittle toy that the dog loved
and you'd be like you'd hideunder a pillow or you had her a
cushion.
You know, you hide it indifferent spots.
Now, I wasn't restricted, I wasjust trying to watch tv and the
dog was bugging me, but it waslike you know, okay, go find it.
(26:00):
And then I always go like, oh,look how clever you are.
You know, because she'd likeburrow her nose or whatever it
is and pull it out and she wasso happy, like you know, look
how clever I am, I found it, youknow yep, brilliant.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
I used to play a similar game when my twins were
little and again when theweather was horrible or we
didn't want to go out if theyweren't very well.
Quite often I'd hide littleteddies around the garden for my
jack russell at the time tofind we'd stand in the kitchen.
He would run out in the garden,find all the teddies, bring
them back.
We stayed nice and dry and hewas tired afterwards.
(26:31):
So there you go.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
There you go I like yes, let's, let's talk about
your animals just for fun.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about all your animals that
you have?
Speaker 2 (26:40):
yes, well, we've got all sorts of they'll start off,
I've got four dogs.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Okay, let's talk about them, yeah, so we've got
two chihuahuas um.
Speaker 2 (26:44):
I've got a dalmatian and I've got four dogs.
Okay, let's talk about them.
Yeah, so we've got twochihuahuas, um, I've got a
dalmatian and I've got a rescueworking cocker.
So a real mixture of dogs yeah,they are.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
They are different, very different from each other
very different.
Um, and I compete at scent workwith the spaniel and the
dalmatian, and my daughtercompetes at scent work with one
of the chihuahuas oh, that'sbrilliant, because with one of
the chihuahuas, oh that'sbrilliant Because I mean most
chihuahuas I run across thinkI'm going to eat them I had to
learn to change my energybecause I was too much for those
(27:16):
poor chihuahuas, you know.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Yeah, they're quite nervous, little dogs.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
But if they're socialized properly and you know
they're wonderful, incrediblysmart and you know, they're
wonderful.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Incredibly smart.
Yes, really smart.
Yeah, yeah, no, really smart.
So, that's the dogs.
And then we've got three cats.
Two of them are quite elderly.
Now, again, one's a rescue.
So, yeah, we've got the cats.
Then we've got four alpacas.
Oh, those are wonderful animals.
Oh, they're lovely animals.
Yes, animals.
Yes, again, they're quitedifferent to the dogs, um,
(27:48):
because they're quite particularas to who they'll approach.
So they look nice and fluffyand cuddly, but they don't
really like being touched andhandled much yeah, they're
discerning.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
They're discerning.
Yes, that's what we call theyare yeah, um.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
so we've got them and we've got chickens.
I love my chickens, yeah yeah,chickens are great and the fresh
eggs are always a bonus.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
Always yeah, for sure they're fun to watch, they're
interesting.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
They're lovely to watch.
Yeah, they're really good.
Yeah, we've got two tortoises.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Now that's interesting.
Are they very old?
Sometimes tortoises can getpretty old.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yes, one pretty old.
Yes, one of them is 10 and theother one's about he's a rescue.
He's about 50 now, um, thatamazing, yes.
Um, what else have we got?
And then my daughter's gotquite a few different animals.
Um, she's got a bearded dragonand a leopard gecko.
She's kind of into the reptileswell, we have a.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
We have a, a reptile specialist that we're going to
be talking to, and she is aYouTube phenomenon when it comes
to education, with, with,reptiles and snake.
And, of course, the the name ofthat podcast is Can Lizards
Love?
Because you know, I'm just, I'mjust not into it.
I'm just like trying tounderstand, you know, and she
says they can.
So you know.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
Oh, okay, yeah, so I'm not really into the reptiles
, but my daughter's really intothem.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
I think that's great and the scent work is cool.
It's very popular growing sporthere.
The scent work yes, it's verymuch a growing sport.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
It's here as well.
Yeah yeah, but it's just sonatural to the dogs.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Well, I think any dog can do it.
You know any dog if yousocialize and doesn't mind being
in the environment where you go, I mean it's like the best game
ever.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
I mean, how fun for a dog, you know so yeah, and also
even on a lot of scent workclasses and certainly the
competitions.
They're actually even suitablefor reactive dogs, because you
only have one dog in the spaceat a time normally.
Oh, that's true, that's verytrue.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
They are really good yeah yeah, those sparky jack
russells don't have to be noseto nose.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
No, they don't um, yeah, and also it's a great
sport for dogs that, um, perhapshave been doing other sports
and then got injured or tooelderly or something that's
right, because it's not yeah,it's not terribly as physical,
as you know.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
No, no, no, but I've watched the dogs and they're so
proud of themselves.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Oh, they love it, absolutely love it.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Yeah, and then, of course, you know service dogs,
dogs that do this, for you knowbomb sniffing dogs or whatever.
Yeah, you know, we're just.
I mean, that's an amazing thingthey do, just right.
But the fact that science isstarting to understand how dogs,
a factory, works, their noseswork and how they're learning to
, you know, figure out he can.
(30:34):
The dogs can sniff out cancer.
The dogs can sniff out things,know when somebody's going to
have a seizure, you know, warnthem ahead of time, because
there's so much going on thatwe're not even aware of, and I
find that fascinating.
And then I I also because Ialways go back to horses, but I
found out, I just learned thisthat we're not even aware of,
and I find that fascinating.
And then I also, because Ialways go back to horses, but I
(30:55):
found out, I just learned thisyear.
And how old am I?
Horses have the same olfactorysystem as much nerve centers,
whatever to pick up as dogs.
I mean, their sense of smell isas good as a dog's, which is
why they can smell water.
They can smell water a longways away.
Nobody ever thought about it,but you could literally train
horses to do scent work.
If you took the time, you knowit's like you could.
I mean, I don't know why youwould, but you could, and so, uh
(31:18):
, I thought that was that's whymy horses you know, my horse
that loves to smell me is spendso much time doing it and
whatever.
So you know, and I want to know, like, can cats be trained to
do that?
You know, yeah, I don't know.
I mean, people have to go andwe'll have to ask a cat
scientist person, but yes yeah,okay, all right.
(31:38):
Well, we're coming up on thepart of the show.
Um, bring these here so you cansee them.
We call this the snack break,the.
There's some cookies I made now.
Now, if you were here, I wouldbe sharing these beautiful, made
with real Wisconsin butter, twotypes of chocolate, chocolate
chip cookies, but since you'renot, I'll have to eat them all
myself later.
But this marks that we're goingto ask the questions, and what
(32:01):
I did was, in your intake form,I sent you a series of questions
that we, uh, borrowed from umtim ferris's book tribe of
mentors and there's anotherpodcaster who does this and so
we totally stole this idea,because I I just think it's fun
to ask these questions yeahdefinitely.
So I'm gonna ask some questionsand, uh, the first one is and
(32:23):
you picked these out of like 20that we sent um, there's just
five what?
I can't remember what I wrote,so nobody, nobody can, which
makes this fun for me, so it'salways a surprise uh, what book
would you recommend, and whybesides your own?
Of course we're gonna.
We're gonna look at yes, ofcourse.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Um, I mean it depends on, I say, kind of which situation.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Um I mean I'm a big fan of the stick, yeah I'm sorry
, it could be any subject, so itdoesn't have to necessarily be
dogs.
So oh any subject yeah, whatbook would you recommend?
Speaker 2 (32:59):
probably one of my favorite books out there, which
is quite an old one, is calledDon't Shoot the Dog.
It's a Karen Pryor book I'veheard of Karen Pryor.
Yeah, yeah, and it's a reallygood book because it talks about
all the principles of dogtraining, but it's applying it
to people.
It's a really interesting book,really good book, and it's
(33:20):
really well written.
Any it's really easy to read,quick to understand, um, and
just peels to so many differentpeople and it just shows how you
can use all the kind ofbehavior traits that we train
with dog trainers, with people,without with any animals.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Well, I do find that working with dogs and children
is very similar you have to findout what makes them happy and
keep them happy and motivated,because once they're unhappy,
it's done.
Nobody learns when they'reunhappy or scared or sad.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
So no, definitely not no.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, so that's Karen Pryor.
Don't shoot the dog.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
That's the dog.
Yeah, okay, it's quite an oldbook, but it's one I always go
back to.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
So, yeah, yeah, there's always lots of wisdom.
I mean, you know, yes, okay, um, what has been your biggest?
Speaker 2 (34:11):
failure, and how has it helped you?
Oh, I can't remember what Iwrote down for this one either
um, I mean, it would probably bethe fact that I was to say
quite a few or about 10 yearsago, I started a dog daycare
business, um, which originally Istarted.
I had a business partner that Iset it up with, um, but she
(34:32):
left quite quickly because shewas used to employed work and
she wasn't used to the fact thatwhen you start a new business,
it takes a long time before youtake home any money yeah, it
takes a while um, yeah, but thenthe business developed and it
got to the stage where I endedup having five staff that worked
for me, um, and we had um threeindustrial units that we ran
(34:56):
the business from oh goodnessum, but the problem was is I'm
an absolute rubbish manager.
I don't like working, I don'tlike organizing people.
So it was a bit of a failure,as in all I wanted to do was to
work with the dogs all day, notmanage people.
(35:17):
So I actually sold the businessin 2019, just before COVID.
Oh, that was wise.
It was very wise, yes, simplybecause I ended up creating a
business I absolutely hated,because it's all about managing
people rather than working withdogs.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Well, it doesn't sound like a failure, then it
sounds more like a life lesson,you know.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
But that's what you learned from it.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
You learned from it, yeah definitely so, yeah, I can
relate to that.
Um, that's why you know I uhmess up on time zones and things
like numbers, and you know soif I didn't have the help of my
good producer and my husband whoworks with me in our regular
business, which is animal actors, and I'm also a commercial
photographer.
Um, that, those organizationalthings you know, commercial
(36:05):
photographer, that thoseorganizational things you know I
can sell and I can do all thephysical stuff, but the
organization you know like well,I'm really grateful for my help
.
Yeah, definitely Shout out tomy producer, elizabeth, so
brilliant.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:19):
Okay.
Number three is if you couldsend a message to the world,
what would that be?
Or do you have a favorite quote, and why?
Speaker 2 (36:30):
I think the message to the world would just be be
kind, because there's so manypeople that get you know.
Whatever animal you're dealingwith, whether it be human, dog,
cat horse or anything human, dog, cat horse or anything um,
there's so many people that kindof almost try to use authority
to almost get power over animalsand other people.
Um, and it really shouldn't belike that.
(36:52):
Um, say kindness will alwaysget there in the end.
Um, and that's what you want todo when you're doing working
with animals, as you mentionedpreviously, you know if your
animal is scared or worried oranything.
They're not actually learning.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
No, you're right, so we can all use a little kindness
.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
Right, yeah, definitely I think it is.
It's be kind OK, I like I agree.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I agree.
All right, what is the worstadvice given in your profession
or bad idea that you hear of inyour field of expertise?
Speaker 2 (37:24):
you hear of in your field of expertise.
Probably the biggest or thekind of the worst thing I'll say
is that that always bugs me iswhen you've got a dog on
restricted exercise and thego-to advice is give them a Kong
.
That will sort it all out.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Okay, so for our audience that doesn't know what
a Kong is, could you describe?
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Yes.
So it's like a little redrubber toy that you can fill up
with food.
That's a great way of it's agreat activity for dogs, but if
you've got a dog.
So I spoke to a client thismorning whose dogs just had an
operation.
Um, and she's one week in afterthe operation and already she's
going.
The Kong isn't working anymore,you know I can't keep giving my
(38:02):
dog all this food, yeah, um, butit is kind of the go-to advice
for people on pet on um craterest is just give the dog
something to chew on orsomething to do like that um,
and that will solve all yourproblems.
And it's not as we were sayingearlier.
The dog wants to spend that one, that one to one time with you
(38:22):
doing those fun things, but it'sjust adapting the activity.
If walks can't go ahead, youcan do lots of other things with
your dog, which they just wantyour time.
You're right?
Speaker 1 (38:34):
No, that's it's very true, All right.
And then the last question whatdid you want to be as a child
and how close did you get tothat dream?
What?
Speaker 2 (38:42):
did you want to be as a child, and how close did you
get to that dream?
I remember the answer to thisone, as my mom will proudly tell
you.
When I was about two or three,I wanted to be a scarecrow.
When I grew up, that was mylife ambition yeah that's
wonderful.
(39:02):
Yeah, I don't know why, but thatwas my life ambition.
But I suppose it's beingoutside in all weathers.
You know being so.
I love being outside, obviouslyworking with the dogs.
So to some degree I've met,I've reached my goal.
I'm not stuck in an officesomewhere, which is what I'd
(39:23):
hate to do.
Speaker 1 (39:29):
Oh right, yeah.
Yeah, that's pretty sweet.
You're the first person that'sever said they wanted to be a
scarecrow, so I guess memorableand I love that.
Who doesn't mind a scarecrow?
They're fun, you know, I meanthey're fun yeah, yeah yeah, of
course the Wizard of Oz had youknow that really nice scarecrow.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
So you know definitely, yeah.
Yeah, I mean, I don't knowwhere that came from, but I say,
my mom will always proudly tellyou that when when laura was
little, she wanted to be ascarecrow.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
So that's brilliant.
I love it.
I love it okay.
Well then, why don't you pleasefill us in, um now?
This information will also beon the show notes, um, where you
, wherever people listen totheir podcasts or watch youtube,
but why don't you tell us howpeople can reach you and what if
they want to work with you?
You know how that works.
I don't know if that's onlylocal or as you get your wags to
.
I'm sorry, wag without walksprogram going, but let's talk
(40:17):
about how to find you.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Yep, so my brand at the moment is laura carter
canines, so I've got my website,uh, which is laura carter
caninescom, and I'm on facebook,I'm on instagram and I'm on
tiktok under that name.
Okay, um, and what most peopledo is, if they need to work with
me is to start with, we book aone-to-one zoom call for about
(40:41):
half an hour.
okay, it's completely free wowno charge for that at all, um,
and we can have a little chatand you can tell me about all
the problems you're having withyour dog or the situation that
you're in, and then I can kindof advise you as to how I can
help you and some kind of putacross some of the ideas and the
games that I think will be workfor you.
And then from there you canthen either book your one-to-one
(41:06):
sessions with me, and we dokind of one a week for as many
months as you want to.
So some people just book me forone month and we do a weekly
Zoom session and then they getlots of support in between, okay
, or, starting in May, you'll beable to just go on the slightly
lower priced membership whereyou don't get the one to one
help, but obviously I'd say it'sslightly lower priced.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
So the resources are there.
Yeah, no, that's yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:32):
The resources are there.
Yeah, yeah, I work with peopleall over the world, so most of
my clients aren't local to me.
So, as I said, a lot of thesepeople are stuck in their homes
with their dogs for whateverreason.
So actually it wouldn't bepractical to meet up face to
face, which is why it works sowell with the modern technology.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
Yeah, we're grateful.
We're grateful for that.
Speaker 2 (41:55):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
Yeah Well, the nice thing about dogs and any animal
is it's universal.
I mean, dogs all speak the samelanguage and dogs, dogs like
their owners, you know, nomatter what.
So there's always that basethat you can.
You know everyone can relateand you can communicate how to
help their dog.
So yes, definitely yes.
(42:16):
Okay, so um, let's hold up yourbook one more time for
everybody.
So we can, we can see it Okay.
The Vet Says Rest by LauraCarter, and you can find it
wherever books are sold, likeAmazon, things like that, and
she's going to have a reallycool program coming up, maybe by
the time this is out.
So just look at the notes, butthat's called Wag Without Walks
(42:38):
and in the meanwhile, you canreach out directly and the links
will be on all this info, info,and Laura can help you with
your pup.
So, Laura, thank you so muchfor coming today being on our
show.
Thank you for the time zonediscrepancy and being patient
with us.
I'm really going to work thatout.
(42:58):
Actually, I'm going to letElizabeth always be on top of it
, because she would be myproducer and I don't have to
worry about it because there'stoo much going on.
I should just say this time,you know, this is it, uh, and I
wish I was in Scotland right nowbecause it sounds like a great
place to be, but, um, yes,scotland's lovely, I'm in snowy
Wisconsin instead.
Speaker 2 (43:16):
Um, thank you again so much for being here no
problem, no, lovely to have achat with you.
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